April 15, 2024 • 35 mins
In this enlightening episode of the "Musky Gear Monday" series on the Team Rhino Outdoors Musky Fishing Podcast, we are joined by fishing legend Steve 'Herbie' Herbeck. In our conversation, we dive deep into exploring the innovative new baits on the market - the Kraken and the Big Makk from Livingston Lures. Herbie shares his wisdom on fishing top-water baits and the extensive application of tube baits. This conversation promises to introduce you to undiscovered fishing nuances, irrespective of your fishing experience.
The focal point of this episode is the Kraken — it's unique drop style, and ability to change skirts colors, making it highly attractive for fishes. We discuss its versatility, durability, and its ability to serve as a throwback bait. The insights shared in this podcast equip listeners with practical knowledge on enhancing the functionality of a Kraken with diverse tail styles and choice of color.
We further discuss the Big Makk, a tail-rotating top-water bait renowned for its unique features and high durability. It maintains its balance at any speed due to its design and delivers an enticing look to the fish. The episode concludes with a thorough discussion of the Big Makk's built-in clicker and the ideal sound it should make.
In this episode, we also delve into topwater fishing, innovative strategies employing advanced technologies like the EBS (electronic bait fish sound), and certain retrieves that might not be commonly considered by anglers. We share an exciting trick called 'dead sticking', and various retrieve techniques to transform your style and level up your angling skill.
The podcast episode wraps up with a discussion on upcoming seasons and baits, hinting at a new anticipated addition to the market. Listeners are also guided on how to reach out for fishing advice and guide bookings. An empowering episode, this promises to enrich your knowledge about fishing gear and practices with insights from Herbie, a legend in the fishing world.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Music.
(00:05):
Welcome to another Muskie Gear Monday on the Team Rhino Outdoors Muskie Fishing Podcast.
This week I'm going to talk to Steve Herbeck. Many of you know him as Herbie.
We'll call him a legend in muskie fishing because I feel that's exactly what he is.
His wealth of knowledge has no problems taking a topic and just running with it.
And this week the topic would be some of the new baits that Herbie's been working on.
(00:27):
He's been working on the Kraken from Livingston Lures and also the Big Mac,
which is a new topwater bait from Livingston as well.
And so we're going to kind of profile that but then you
know herbie talks about you know some tips on how to work you
know tube baits because he he does a lot with red october tubes
as well i mean he's just because he's going to use a crack and
doesn't mean red october is out the window there's still a time and a place
(00:49):
for all these different baits and he's also got some unique approaches to fishing
topwaters and stuff that not many people think about doing so you know check
out this half hour podcast it's you know these podcasts are a lot shorter than
backlash backlash podcast that I do with, uh, Brad Hoppy with musky mayhem tackle.
And so far, I think this is probably like number four in a row.
I'm going to try to do these very regularly throughout the course of the fishing season.
(01:12):
I we're in, all we do is talk gear, you know, and it'll be interesting to talk
gear during the season to just see kind of what's working for people and,
and different areas and things like that.
So I appreciate you coming along for the ride.
If you haven't already subscribe on whatever platform it is that you're listening
to that That way, if for some reason we get a little irregular,
you can get notified when a new episode comes out.
(01:35):
I don't make any extra incentives or dollars off of any subscribers.
In fact, I make $0 off this podcast in general, unless somebody comes out and
supports Team Rhino Outdoors.
With that being said, that's where you can find all the gear that's talked about
in these podcasts. Go visit TeamRhinoOutdoors.com.
That's the space that you'll find everything that we talk about in this podcast
(01:55):
from rods to reels to nets to baits.
You got it covered there lots of cool gear for this year you know we'll tease
about some of it here in this podcast and we'll talk about some of it hopefully
by the time you hear this the new kraken from livingston will be available on
the website if not very shortly after and then make sure you get on our website use the,
(02:15):
Email us when available button. And that way you can sign up to get notified
when the new Big Mac from Livingston drops too.
Hopefully that's a, like a roughly a June 1st delivery.
So that's what we have going on this week. I want to thank everybody again for
their support of Team Rhino Outdoors.
We are a very family run business. We have no employees that are,
that do not have the same last name.
(02:36):
And my kids very much appreciate it. I know some of the kids,
they like to spend, we, we allow them, you know, some allowance from their hours.
They work in the shop and you know some of them but they do
need to save some of it we're trying to teach some values of that and you know
so my son Zach he likes he appreciates you keeping him
busy in the shop he likes to buy some little games and things like that and
so my older daughter she's looking to go to college and so that's what she's
(02:58):
using her funds for and the other two they just keep piling it up they're not
much for spending and but hopefully they'll be using it for college or something
important at some point maybe buying a car you know when they get around to it but But anyways,
we want to thank you for support of our family-run business.
With that being said, we're going to jump into the conversation I had this week with Steve Herbeck.
(03:21):
All right, my guest this week is Herbie, Steve Herbeck. And Herbie,
you know, I appreciate you taking time to talk to me on this podcast.
We've had you on the Backlash podcast, I don't even know how many times.
You're probably one of the more frequent guests that we've had.
And we very much thank you for your contributions there, as well as coming out to see us at shows.
Shows we've been you know we have you at most of the shows this year and it
(03:41):
was always great to have you around so very much appreciate that but herbie
let's break the ice a little bit we're talking musky gear on this podcast do
you remember back to your very first musky that you caught.
Like yesterday yeah it was me i was up with my old man did my dad big dan and
a couple of his buddies uh.
(04:04):
We always took some musky chips in the fall. I think I was only about 12 at that time.
We were at Squirrel Lake, you know, had an old 5500 Red Garcia,
a bull cue rod, and clipped on a black suick and never took it off the whole weekend.
(04:24):
And all of a sudden, a 44-incher smoked that sucker, came flying out of the water.
It was the only musky quad of
the group. And it was just a comedy back in those days, you know, a lot.
It wasn't, you know, stress so much, catch and release.
We're talking, you know, we're talking over 50 years ago now, you know what I mean?
(04:44):
I don't want to lead on just a whole lot of them, but my dad had one. My dad was a character.
He had one of these spring-loaded kind of gaffs that you opened up and you stabbed
the fish and it clapped shut in their gills. And he was stabbing at this fish,
and the thing wouldn't work.
And, you know, finally we gilled it, got it in the boat without getting hooked and everything.
(05:08):
But it was quite the deal. I will never, ever forget it.
And I still, when things are tough, I still clamp out, you know,
clip on a 12-inch black wooden suik and go to town with it.
Because it has saved the day for me, even to this day 50 years ago.
(05:29):
So then let me ask you, when you caught that first muskie, did you ever think
that it would lead you to where you are today?
No, no. I mean, it lit a fire, you know, it did for sure.
Once I actually got to working age, I was always trying to get out of work to go fishing.
(05:52):
I knew I had to do something or I'd be broke. So that's pretty much what kind of made that happen.
But from that moment on, I love to fish everything.
But muskies make me shake.
One of the few fish that make me shake a big jarpon jump and tarpon you know
(06:13):
30 feet off the end of the rod it'll do that to me too but and everything's
fun to catch but muskies really make me shake and that first fish was what indoctrinated
me into that feeling and i knew who was screwed.
That's it's kind of that way with a lot of us though i mean you
know i have people that ask ask me the same thing they're
(06:35):
like why do you fish for muskies and i'm like because i i never made a
i never met a bass or caught a bass that made me
you know that made that did anything to my heart rate you know i've
never done yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah all
right herbie we're talking gear and you're involved that you
know with a ton of musky companies i mean a lot of these baits that
come out you have your hand in them or have played with them
(06:56):
before they even hit the market but two of
them that are coming out or that you know one of them's out now it's the
uh kraken for livingston lures and they also have a
new top water bait out we're going to talk about that as well and we
might go down the road of the flipper too because that's you know those
those three baits are you know newer to to the livingston lineup but let's talk
a little bit about the crack and i know you had your hand in playing around
with this i had a chance to touch it last year you know what makes this one
(07:19):
new and different well you know in the last everybody thinks tubes are really new but But, you know,
we've been using red October tubes and water wolf tubes for 12, 15 years.
You know, it's just they've really hit mainstream in the last three or four with a lot of navelers.
And they catch fish. But, you know, one of the things is that,
(07:44):
you know, they're not real durable.
And so, you know, we came up with a hard-headed tube.
The most important thing that people, I don't think people realize,
what makes a bait that looks so phallic, like a tube, so effective,
is that it's not just its action.
(08:08):
There's something about the tube being hollow.
That can't be duplicated very easily with a hard-headed bait because the tube
being hollow and very flexible,
the water flows in and out of it as you're working the bait,
and it makes really weird vibrations and sounds.
(08:29):
Swooshing, sucking, different vibrations as the sides of that bait collapse
and kind of push the water back out through the tentacles, is almost like a
squid kind of propulsion type of thing,
as you will, only we're making the propulsion.
So it's very hard to duplicate that in a hard-headed bait.
(08:51):
Now, what we did to try and get that same type of deal with the Kraken is that
it is hollow, and it's able to take in water and expel water as you're working it.
It doesn't have quite the flex as the tube, but that
you know it doesn't have near the flexitude because it's hard
(09:12):
but it does the water does move in and out
of it another really neat advantage
of the kraken besides that
is obviously it has even though it's hollow the ebs chamber the electronic baitfish
chamber is sealed so that the water in going in and out of the head doesn't
(09:33):
you know affect the electronics of that that particular piece of machinery inside the bait.
The hard-headed factor makes it a very good hooker, makes it very durable,
and the fact that it has screw-in weights
make it very easy to change
(09:57):
the buoyancy or how the
bait actually works from a near type of a vertical type or horizontal type of
hanging type of presentation to a fast dropping nose first type of presentation or several in between,
(10:17):
depending upon how heavy a weight or not that you are using in the bait.
So it gives it some versatility. also the
weight is a little finer back than most
of your tubes are weighted most of your tubes are weighted you know there's
the shallow rigging which spreads out over you know half of the body that gives
(10:42):
a more of a horizontal and slowly sinking type of action but most of your heads
are are between shallow,
medium, and heavy, deep,
are way up near the nose, right at the tip of the nose.
And the drop is what makes the fish bite and why so many fish are caught real deep.
(11:08):
Because as the fish bait is dropping...
The fish intercept it head first, and that's why you get a lot of – if you're
working a bait really fast,
like a jerk bait, and it's going more hard than I'm jerking,
you'll get the slashing strikes and you'll hook them in the corner of the mouth
or the side of the gill plate, stuff like that.
(11:29):
But if you're working a tube pretty much what is the most effective way,
it's the drop that catches fish.
Now, and being a nose first, it drops nose first. Now, on the Kraken,
the weight is a little bit farther back, right behind the front hook.
So the drop is a little different. It's more of a gliding drop.
(11:52):
And I find that very, very effective, not only just working at,
you know, pretty much how we work tubes or in that fashion,
but then yet it has a little bit different type of a gliding type of a fall
rather than a plummeting fall, is that it makes it, for some reason,
a very deadly throwback bait.
(12:14):
A lot of the fish that I didn't get it until the end of August.
The first week I had a 53.5, a 53, and a 52 in the bone on it,
and we were only throwing one, and two of those three came fourth bait through.
So that told me that there was something to the bait, right?
So it's durability is a factor its
(12:34):
ability to change skirts colors is is a nice factor while using the same head
and if it doesn't get tore up you're just replacing a skirt not a whole bait
you know what i'm saying another thing is that coming up with that kraken shortly shortly,
is going to make it a very, very versatile bait in your box.
(12:59):
Because besides the skirt tails that are available that come as the Kraken,
there's going to be a paddle tail and there's going to be a big squirrely tail
that will just change on the back of that Kraken head.
So you essentially can have
(13:20):
either three baits set up differently or according
to what intel or your bite is the
fish are showing you you can make changes through the
course of the day or your trip to what bait the fish
seem to be preferring and and let's face it when it comes to rubber you know
that's pretty much most of it is the squirrely tail the paddle tail and the
(13:43):
tube so So you have the possibilities and availability of any and all.
So watch for those opportunities.
Adaptations to be available very soon not
very long at all you know before fishing season so
that makes a very very versatile bait and
(14:05):
the fact that since it's a hard head and you know jeff boggs is making some
really neat paint jobs you know for for mark with with you know with the with
the red october twos i think mark is even putting in a paint shop himself because
there's such a demand for the painted baits.
(14:26):
Although, really, when it comes to tubes, I use white, black, and brown.
I got all the painted ones, and I catch just as many fish on the other ones.
But they are cool to have.
And in your mind, you think that it is going to make a difference,
and that may make your fish better.
There may be times, you know, that it does make a difference,
but I haven't seen it too much.
(14:46):
But anyway, that factor of having a pretty bait
and different colors for different water varieties and depths and stuff and
times of the season and forage preferences on different lakes is very easily
attained with that hard head and paint jobs just like all your other harder
(15:06):
baits that are on the market now.
There's a lot of pluses to that Kraken.
It's also a very good hooker because it's got two hooks that are in the
Well, it's actually got three if you count the one at the back of the skirt
that you can either leave clean depending upon how you want the bait to glide
(15:31):
or pop it around with your rod tip at different angles sideways and stuff like that.
Or you can use it with different blades just like... Actually,
the blade, the full gunner deal that all baits nowadays...
Or a lot of baits are adapting and adapting onto the back of their baits.
(15:55):
And as one of the real, you know, mainstay presentations of tubes actually started
at my alma mater, Andy Myers Lodge,
about, it's probably 18, 15, 18 years ago now.
Now, one of my top guides at that time, Mikey Grant, was going to go over to
(16:16):
Lakewoods and fish the prestigious Nestor Cup tournament, one of the first or
second years that it was.
And he stuck that blade on the back of a tube and won the tournament with it.
And us at, you know, Andy Myers on Eagle, obviously all jumped right on it right away.
Way and it kind of kind of kept it to us for a
(16:38):
few years a little people fishing with us it got around and
the actual very first tail gunner
was a spinner with
a little tiny hook that jack clifton and i did back in 88 on north twin lake
on the back of our suckers and that was the start of what is now called the
(16:59):
tail gunner so there's a lot of history there with that tail gunner Then we
started using it in between the tails of the big joe.
Then we started using it off the back of bulldogs.
And then it's just gone on to tubes and other baits. So the tail gunner goes
quite a ways back, back to the late 80s.
(17:19):
But going back to that, I ramble. You know me, Jeff.
But on the Kraken,
I seem to prefer like a number five willow when I put a spinner on it,
because it really fits in with the kind of that gliding type of a drop that it has.
(17:42):
I i've had real good luck with that number five willow on the back of the kraken
whereas on the tubes i use the willow too but it seemed to do better most of
the time with a colorado on the back of a tube but i use them all i use them
all but on the kraken i definitely like the way,
it sounds like a really cool versatile bait i got to play around with
(18:03):
a little bit last fall i shot some underwater video of it and hopefully like
i said by the time you hear this podcast you can can come to team rhino outdoors.com and
you can order them from us and then i'll also have that video out
of the underwater action of it i got some video of it on the drop and things
like that it's just another versatile tool like you said herbie
to add to your tackle box i mean it's a long line of versatile tools
and you know each one has a time and place i'm sure that just
(18:25):
because you're using a crack and you won't stop using a red october tube i'd
imagine as well absolutely not absolutely not mark's taking good care of me
over the years i've caught a lot of big fish and and introduced a lot of big
fish to people and people to the tube.
Yeah, there's something about a tube that when the fishing's tough.
(18:49):
Particularly, that particular, whatever makes that tube do what it does with
that being soft-sided and the water going in and out, that you just simply, you know,
can't 100% duplicate with a hard-headed or solid rubber-headed bait. You know what I mean?
So, no, I will always have red October tubes in my arsenal for sure.
(19:17):
Definitely. Well, let's move on. You know, we kind of covered that one.
That one's, I mean, obviously a cool new tool.
Let's talk about the Big Mac. This one many people probably haven't heard about yet.
And Herbie, in fact, I didn't even know much about it until recently,
and you showed me some pictures of it. and it's a you know it's a tail rotating
top water bait but it definitely has some unique features why don't you talk
a little bit about that yeah it's uh.
(19:39):
It's got that bigger headed profile that has been popular in the last recent years.
Again, it is a plastic bait that holds its paint unlike a lot of your other
topwaters that people have a lot of trouble with.
(20:02):
The paint really stays on really good.
So that's a plus factor. or the paint that Livingston job that they're using
really stays intact very, very well.
It's got a mouth to it. I wanted to call it Big Mouth, but for some reason they called it Big Mac.
But it's got a mouth to it, and the mouth happens to serve several different purposes.
(20:28):
Number one, we found with that horizontal mouth going across the nose,
that you could not make that bait turnover.
No matter with an 8-to-1 reel as fast as you can reel it or trolling it behind a planter board.
Not that most times do you work topwaters that fast.
(20:52):
I actually work topwaters very slow because I find that I don't get fish blowing up behind them.
But there's times when I have caught fish trolling them or weed flats.
Sometimes people, whether they know it or not, are reeling the bait faster than I like to.
(21:12):
And I see baits turning over a lot. Anytime you've got a tail bait and you see
it rolling on you at all, you're definitely working that bait too fast.
This can't happen regardless of how fast you do start to work it.
It stabilizes the head. The water going into that slit of the mouth stabilizes it.
(21:34):
It also pushes the bottom lip of it down just a little bit.
So you get a little film of water that comes over the top of the bait,
which kind of has a hydrodynamic kind of look to it as it's going through the
water, which is always made in the past.
Some tailed topwaters that have more weight in their nose that have that property, very effective.
(22:00):
So that does that. It also helps the tail catch water better,
and between the hydrodynamic flow over the top and the flow catching the tail better,
you really get a real good consistent pop right from the first drop.
(22:20):
Quarter inch, the bait starts moving.
So also that water going into that horizontal mouth and then being pushed out
the sides of the edge of the mouth also produces some other different,
you know, I don't know what you call them,
(22:43):
sounds, vibrations, water flow that kind of just starts adding to anything and
anything that's swimming through the water.
You know, there's feet flapping, there's, you know, wings flapping,
there's paddling going on,
there's tails wiggling, there's all kinds of different things going on in natural
(23:04):
life, and this kind of just all adds to that.
The tail itself is not the big flat tail that is so common and on several different
types of baits that are available out there.
Now, they have been very successful, don't get me wrong, but they don't have
(23:25):
a lot of versatility, that flat tail, in adjustment.
It's either in tune or it's not, is what I found, with the flatter type of tails.
This has a tail that's like the old tallywhacker style of tail,
although per size per size of this bait,
(23:46):
comparably speaking in its size and the tail size versus if it was a smaller
bait it is between 15 and 20 percent taller.
So it has it has a very good deep and resonating type of sound to it the bait also has,
(24:10):
a built-in clicker that is a special stainless metal that we played with with
the type of metal of the tail to produce just the right kind of sound,
not overpowering bang, bang, bang, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick.
It's a subtle type of a tick that goes along with the popping of the tail that
(24:33):
makes it really an effective combo besides,
you know, the other water flowish properties, and everything else.
And then, all things aside, it's also got EBS in it, electronic bait fish sound,
which there's a lot going on.
I'm not so sure how much that sound the fish will actually pick up.
(24:58):
But there's a lot of different retrieves that I think people don't use when
it comes to topwaters, particularly side-to-side baits and tail baits.
And that is dead sticking a bait when you have a fish following it and it's
almost all the way to the boat, but yet it won't take the bait.
I've found stopping the bait and just letting it sit has caught me some tremendous
(25:24):
fish that I wanted to move it, I wanted to jerk it, I wanted to get the tail,
and I held on and held on, and then all of a sudden it's like a chicken nip
and they go and they and they grab it so it's
something that can be tried it doesn't
work all the time but it's not nothing works all
the time right so but it's another presentation that works but also what a lot
(25:47):
of people don't what a lot of people do and it works obviously is your steady
plopping retrieve with a tail bait depending upon how fast you're moving it
and the steady any type of retrieve,
but, you know, the old pause, pull, kind of snap, jerking,
(26:09):
creating, you know, a different type of action, pausing it and kind of jerking
it and pausing it, jerking it, and can be very effective at times.
Hardly anybody ever does that with a tail bait.
So there's a lot of different things that you can do with tail baits besides
just throwing them out and reeling them in.
(26:30):
Particularly when you got a fish following and it's humps
up right away and it's following them all the way to the boat now
you're 12 feet away you know i catch some fish on turns and figure eights and
taking the bait under in my opinion at the boat when you bring a tail bait in
if you haven't tried the the dead stick the pause pull type of triggering to
(26:52):
it and by the way that pause pull.
When I'm fishing structure up on shore, like trees and stuff like that,
heavy cover up on real heavy weeds up closer to shore and stuff,
a lot of times I'll throw a tail bait out there, and particularly in darker water.
And rather than just start the reel, I'll give it three, four pretty loud,
(27:16):
hard rips, and then go into the slow, steady, then he boop, boop,
boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, and then maybe after 10 feet,
give it a boop, boop, boop, boop.
But that two or three hard rips to start, there can be fish 10, 15, 20, 30 feet away.
Then it catches their attention, and I've seen wakes come right to the bait doing that.
(27:39):
So there's a lot of different things that you can do with tail baits to make
them more effective than just throwing them out and reeling them in.
There's another addition that I don't know if it'll make it in time to the initial
run of the bait but we got a double paddle tail type of addition,
to the rear of the of the
(28:02):
Big Mac that really looks a lot like
little duck's feet paddling behind the bait that I'm
hoping we can either get as an addition
that can be purchased to add
to the the bait or possibly if it's
done in time to be included in the package with the bait
but all in all i'm pretty excited about the
(28:24):
bait it's a very durable bait like i said it holds its paint very well it's
got a lot of things going for it a lot of different things going you know between
sounds and and water movement and and things like that i think it's going to
be a real winner and i think,
(28:45):
When it gets there, there's only going to be so many.
If your customers really want to get in on it, Jeff, I think they should be
calling you and getting on a list because the next batch that comes in is probably
going to be a month or two behind it. Once they're gone, they're gone.
I would highly suggest to people if they want to get in on this bait to give
(29:07):
you a call and get on a list.
Then once they hit your dock, you're ready to ship them out.
And i and we should have them in time you know
for the top water season this year i'm looking
for big things for it yeah it sounds like a you know late may june 1st is the
deadline i've kind of heard and if you're hearing this podcast right now you
(29:30):
can just go right on our website we have the big mac product built you can there's
an email us one available tab on there click that tab you can,
pull the drop down. If you want to select a certain color, I usually recommend
people select more than just one color, just in case, you know,
like, you know, maybe something's missing from an early shipment and we only
get five of six colors or whatever.
(29:52):
That way you definitely get in on there and you just enter in your email address
and away you go, you're, you're signed up.
And then, you know, just make sure that we're added, you know,
I think it's team rhino outdoors at hotmail.com is your safe sender.
I believe there's a note on there. So just so it doesn't end up in your spam folder.
Most of the time it doesn't, but occasionally spam filters will kick that out.
But anyways, just go on there and sign up. And you know, when a big Mac comes
(30:14):
in, you can get an email notification.
Of course you can pay attention to our social media. You can pay attention to our backlash podcast.
And then I'm assuming on this one here, I'll even mention that we have them
in stock when they're actually in stock.
Definitely a lot of cool new baits that are coming out, Herbie.
You know, it's, it's fun to, you know, I've even, I don't know if I've even
told you, but we have a, something new working on with the, one of the major
manufacturers and And I'll divulge details when we're off the air,
(30:37):
but we got something new that's working.
It's not, I wouldn't say groundbreaking, but definitely something that anglers
have been looking for for a while.
So we were talking about Donna Chicago.
Yeah, I believe so. Yeah. And we actually got to play with it.
Yep. I'm looking forward to having a couple of them in my hands,
especially fishing for big fish early in the season when normally we're using,
(30:58):
you know, either bigger baits than that or smaller baits than that.
And I think that's going to, that's going to be a big fish option when they
still like smaller baits, but yet it's got, you know, the bigger size to it.
That's about all I'm going to say.
Yeah. Well, Herbie, I'm pretty far ahead on this podcast, so you won't hear
this podcast until closer to the end of March.
(31:18):
I've been working ahead, you know, with, with the show season to try to get
this taken care of earlier, but you know, it's.
By the time you hear this podcast, the details are going to start to emerge
more on this bait that I've, I've teased a few times.
And just like I said, just pay attention to our social medias.
We'll be doing some podcasting on it. We'll be doing some talking on it.
And Herbie, I know you're, you're on my short list of guys.
(31:40):
You're going to definitely get some in your hands as soon as we can get them
to you. I know about the time you hear this podcast, we should have molds in hand, actually. Super.
Well, you know, Herbie, since I'm trying to keep these podcasts to about a half
an hour, of course, like you always do.
You fill the gaps perfect i have a whole list of bullet points i want to talk
about with both of those two baits top water tips you hit them all perfectly
(32:01):
amazing as usual you know for,
bullet points we miss we can do more of these right yeah and so you know like
i think i at some point we'll talk about the flipper but for the purpose of
this podcast we're about at the time limit i'd like to be at for people that
want to get in touch with you this year do you still You still have openings for trips?
Yeah, you know, actually, I got a few openings left in May for southern Wisconsin.
(32:25):
Not a lot, but I think four, three or four dates.
One of them, I think, is even on a weekend.
For some reason, I have that second or third, I don't have my calendar right in front of me.
I believe it's the third week in June. I got four days available for up in Vilas
(32:46):
County yet, and I can't believe it.
It's usually my first week full, and it comes off the full moon,
and it's just a – I think with this early type of spring that we're – apparently
it seems like we're going to have,
and I just think that June is going to be a dynamite month up north this year.
So that would be something to look at. I think I got one or two days left in November.
(33:14):
I got some two or three days going into the second week of December, central Wisconsin.
So I got a few days left that people that want to get in the boat and have a
good day and have some fun and share it with me.
If they get a hold of me, we should be able to get together.
Yeah, definitely. If people want to get in touch with you, what's the best way to do that?
(33:38):
Well, my phone number is 608-515-3416. No time's a bad time.
Like I always say, if you just want to talk fishing, don't be afraid to give
me a call. You got some questions.
I've had quite a few people actually taking advantage of that offer.
And I really feel good about it because they get back to me with a lot of appreciation.
(34:05):
And at this stage of the game in my life, it really is fulfilling.
Filling so don't be afraid if you got some things you want to talk about
you can go message me off of facebook steve
herbeck you can go to steve herbeck fishing
my website has got all my contacts on there i'm easy to find yeah and obviously
(34:27):
you don't have any problems talking muskies that's that's very clear every time
we get you on the podcast i don't ever have to worry about how long this is
going to go i usually have to worry about only like trying to limit the amount
of of the the time that it goes.
So always a great, always a great time, Steve.
I really appreciate your time. I want to thank all the listeners again for coming
out and listening to another episode.
(34:48):
I know we're, you know, just we're fresh off refiring this podcast again.
Hopefully by the time you hear this, we'll have some momentum going.
And if you're looking for, you know, either of these two new options from Livingston
Lures, go check out teamrhinooutdoors.com and I'll work my hardest to make sure
that we have another episode for you again next week, Monday.
Music.
(00:05):
Welcome to another Muskie Gear Monday on the Team Rhino Outdoors Muskie Fishing Podcast.
This week I'm going to talk to Steve Herbeck. Many of you know him as Herbie.
We'll call him a legend in muskie fishing because I feel that's exactly what he is.
His wealth of knowledge has no problems taking a topic and just running with it.
And this week the topic would be some of the new baits that Herbie's been working on.
(00:27):
He's been working on the Kraken from Livingston Lures and also the Big Mac,
which is a new topwater bait from Livingston as well.
And so we're going to kind of profile that but then you
know herbie talks about you know some tips on how to work you
know tube baits because he he does a lot with red october tubes
as well i mean he's just because he's going to use a crack and
doesn't mean red october is out the window there's still a time and a place
(00:49):
for all these different baits and he's also got some unique approaches to fishing
topwaters and stuff that not many people think about doing so you know check
out this half hour podcast it's you know these podcasts are a lot shorter than
backlash backlash podcast that I do with, uh, Brad Hoppy with musky mayhem tackle.
And so far, I think this is probably like number four in a row.
I'm going to try to do these very regularly throughout the course of the fishing season.
(01:12):
I we're in, all we do is talk gear, you know, and it'll be interesting to talk
gear during the season to just see kind of what's working for people and,
and different areas and things like that.
So I appreciate you coming along for the ride.
If you haven't already subscribe on whatever platform it is that you're listening
to that That way, if for some reason we get a little irregular,
you can get notified when a new episode comes out.
(01:35):
I don't make any extra incentives or dollars off of any subscribers.
In fact, I make $0 off this podcast in general, unless somebody comes out and
supports Team Rhino Outdoors.
With that being said, that's where you can find all the gear that's talked about
in these podcasts. Go visit TeamRhinoOutdoors.com.
That's the space that you'll find everything that we talk about in this podcast
(01:55):
from rods to reels to nets to baits.
You got it covered there lots of cool gear for this year you know we'll tease
about some of it here in this podcast and we'll talk about some of it hopefully
by the time you hear this the new kraken from livingston will be available on
the website if not very shortly after and then make sure you get on our website use the,
(02:15):
Email us when available button. And that way you can sign up to get notified
when the new Big Mac from Livingston drops too.
Hopefully that's a, like a roughly a June 1st delivery.
So that's what we have going on this week. I want to thank everybody again for
their support of Team Rhino Outdoors.
We are a very family run business. We have no employees that are,
that do not have the same last name.
(02:36):
And my kids very much appreciate it. I know some of the kids,
they like to spend, we, we allow them, you know, some allowance from their hours.
They work in the shop and you know some of them but they do
need to save some of it we're trying to teach some values of that and you know
so my son Zach he likes he appreciates you keeping him
busy in the shop he likes to buy some little games and things like that and
so my older daughter she's looking to go to college and so that's what she's
(02:58):
using her funds for and the other two they just keep piling it up they're not
much for spending and but hopefully they'll be using it for college or something
important at some point maybe buying a car you know when they get around to it but But anyways,
we want to thank you for support of our family-run business.
With that being said, we're going to jump into the conversation I had this week with Steve Herbeck.
(03:21):
All right, my guest this week is Herbie, Steve Herbeck. And Herbie,
you know, I appreciate you taking time to talk to me on this podcast.
We've had you on the Backlash podcast, I don't even know how many times.
You're probably one of the more frequent guests that we've had.
And we very much thank you for your contributions there, as well as coming out to see us at shows.
Shows we've been you know we have you at most of the shows this year and it
(03:41):
was always great to have you around so very much appreciate that but herbie
let's break the ice a little bit we're talking musky gear on this podcast do
you remember back to your very first musky that you caught.
Like yesterday yeah it was me i was up with my old man did my dad big dan and
a couple of his buddies uh.
(04:04):
We always took some musky chips in the fall. I think I was only about 12 at that time.
We were at Squirrel Lake, you know, had an old 5500 Red Garcia,
a bull cue rod, and clipped on a black suick and never took it off the whole weekend.
(04:24):
And all of a sudden, a 44-incher smoked that sucker, came flying out of the water.
It was the only musky quad of
the group. And it was just a comedy back in those days, you know, a lot.
It wasn't, you know, stress so much, catch and release.
We're talking, you know, we're talking over 50 years ago now, you know what I mean?
(04:44):
I don't want to lead on just a whole lot of them, but my dad had one. My dad was a character.
He had one of these spring-loaded kind of gaffs that you opened up and you stabbed
the fish and it clapped shut in their gills. And he was stabbing at this fish,
and the thing wouldn't work.
And, you know, finally we gilled it, got it in the boat without getting hooked and everything.
(05:08):
But it was quite the deal. I will never, ever forget it.
And I still, when things are tough, I still clamp out, you know,
clip on a 12-inch black wooden suik and go to town with it.
Because it has saved the day for me, even to this day 50 years ago.
(05:29):
So then let me ask you, when you caught that first muskie, did you ever think
that it would lead you to where you are today?
No, no. I mean, it lit a fire, you know, it did for sure.
Once I actually got to working age, I was always trying to get out of work to go fishing.
(05:52):
I knew I had to do something or I'd be broke. So that's pretty much what kind of made that happen.
But from that moment on, I love to fish everything.
But muskies make me shake.
One of the few fish that make me shake a big jarpon jump and tarpon you know
(06:13):
30 feet off the end of the rod it'll do that to me too but and everything's
fun to catch but muskies really make me shake and that first fish was what indoctrinated
me into that feeling and i knew who was screwed.
That's it's kind of that way with a lot of us though i mean you
know i have people that ask ask me the same thing they're
(06:35):
like why do you fish for muskies and i'm like because i i never made a
i never met a bass or caught a bass that made me
you know that made that did anything to my heart rate you know i've
never done yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah all
right herbie we're talking gear and you're involved that you
know with a ton of musky companies i mean a lot of these baits that
come out you have your hand in them or have played with them
(06:56):
before they even hit the market but two of
them that are coming out or that you know one of them's out now it's the
uh kraken for livingston lures and they also have a
new top water bait out we're going to talk about that as well and we
might go down the road of the flipper too because that's you know those
those three baits are you know newer to to the livingston lineup but let's talk
a little bit about the crack and i know you had your hand in playing around
with this i had a chance to touch it last year you know what makes this one
(07:19):
new and different well you know in the last everybody thinks tubes are really new but But, you know,
we've been using red October tubes and water wolf tubes for 12, 15 years.
You know, it's just they've really hit mainstream in the last three or four with a lot of navelers.
And they catch fish. But, you know, one of the things is that,
(07:44):
you know, they're not real durable.
And so, you know, we came up with a hard-headed tube.
The most important thing that people, I don't think people realize,
what makes a bait that looks so phallic, like a tube, so effective,
is that it's not just its action.
(08:08):
There's something about the tube being hollow.
That can't be duplicated very easily with a hard-headed bait because the tube
being hollow and very flexible,
the water flows in and out of it as you're working the bait,
and it makes really weird vibrations and sounds.
(08:29):
Swooshing, sucking, different vibrations as the sides of that bait collapse
and kind of push the water back out through the tentacles, is almost like a
squid kind of propulsion type of thing,
as you will, only we're making the propulsion.
So it's very hard to duplicate that in a hard-headed bait.
(08:51):
Now, what we did to try and get that same type of deal with the Kraken is that
it is hollow, and it's able to take in water and expel water as you're working it.
It doesn't have quite the flex as the tube, but that
you know it doesn't have near the flexitude because it's hard
(09:12):
but it does the water does move in and out
of it another really neat advantage
of the kraken besides that
is obviously it has even though it's hollow the ebs chamber the electronic baitfish
chamber is sealed so that the water in going in and out of the head doesn't
(09:33):
you know affect the electronics of that that particular piece of machinery inside the bait.
The hard-headed factor makes it a very good hooker, makes it very durable,
and the fact that it has screw-in weights
make it very easy to change
(09:57):
the buoyancy or how the
bait actually works from a near type of a vertical type or horizontal type of
hanging type of presentation to a fast dropping nose first type of presentation or several in between,
(10:17):
depending upon how heavy a weight or not that you are using in the bait.
So it gives it some versatility. also the
weight is a little finer back than most
of your tubes are weighted most of your tubes are weighted you know there's
the shallow rigging which spreads out over you know half of the body that gives
(10:42):
a more of a horizontal and slowly sinking type of action but most of your heads
are are between shallow,
medium, and heavy, deep,
are way up near the nose, right at the tip of the nose.
And the drop is what makes the fish bite and why so many fish are caught real deep.
(11:08):
Because as the fish bait is dropping...
The fish intercept it head first, and that's why you get a lot of – if you're
working a bait really fast,
like a jerk bait, and it's going more hard than I'm jerking,
you'll get the slashing strikes and you'll hook them in the corner of the mouth
or the side of the gill plate, stuff like that.
(11:29):
But if you're working a tube pretty much what is the most effective way,
it's the drop that catches fish.
Now, and being a nose first, it drops nose first. Now, on the Kraken,
the weight is a little bit farther back, right behind the front hook.
So the drop is a little different. It's more of a gliding drop.
(11:52):
And I find that very, very effective, not only just working at,
you know, pretty much how we work tubes or in that fashion,
but then yet it has a little bit different type of a gliding type of a fall
rather than a plummeting fall, is that it makes it, for some reason,
a very deadly throwback bait.
(12:14):
A lot of the fish that I didn't get it until the end of August.
The first week I had a 53.5, a 53, and a 52 in the bone on it,
and we were only throwing one, and two of those three came fourth bait through.
So that told me that there was something to the bait, right?
So it's durability is a factor its
(12:34):
ability to change skirts colors is is a nice factor while using the same head
and if it doesn't get tore up you're just replacing a skirt not a whole bait
you know what i'm saying another thing is that coming up with that kraken shortly shortly,
is going to make it a very, very versatile bait in your box.
(12:59):
Because besides the skirt tails that are available that come as the Kraken,
there's going to be a paddle tail and there's going to be a big squirrely tail
that will just change on the back of that Kraken head.
So you essentially can have
(13:20):
either three baits set up differently or according
to what intel or your bite is the
fish are showing you you can make changes through the
course of the day or your trip to what bait the fish
seem to be preferring and and let's face it when it comes to rubber you know
that's pretty much most of it is the squirrely tail the paddle tail and the
(13:43):
tube so So you have the possibilities and availability of any and all.
So watch for those opportunities.
Adaptations to be available very soon not
very long at all you know before fishing season so
that makes a very very versatile bait and
(14:05):
the fact that since it's a hard head and you know jeff boggs is making some
really neat paint jobs you know for for mark with with you know with the with
the red october twos i think mark is even putting in a paint shop himself because
there's such a demand for the painted baits.
(14:26):
Although, really, when it comes to tubes, I use white, black, and brown.
I got all the painted ones, and I catch just as many fish on the other ones.
But they are cool to have.
And in your mind, you think that it is going to make a difference,
and that may make your fish better.
There may be times, you know, that it does make a difference,
but I haven't seen it too much.
(14:46):
But anyway, that factor of having a pretty bait
and different colors for different water varieties and depths and stuff and
times of the season and forage preferences on different lakes is very easily
attained with that hard head and paint jobs just like all your other harder
(15:06):
baits that are on the market now.
There's a lot of pluses to that Kraken.
It's also a very good hooker because it's got two hooks that are in the
Well, it's actually got three if you count the one at the back of the skirt
that you can either leave clean depending upon how you want the bait to glide
(15:31):
or pop it around with your rod tip at different angles sideways and stuff like that.
Or you can use it with different blades just like... Actually,
the blade, the full gunner deal that all baits nowadays...
Or a lot of baits are adapting and adapting onto the back of their baits.
(15:55):
And as one of the real, you know, mainstay presentations of tubes actually started
at my alma mater, Andy Myers Lodge,
about, it's probably 18, 15, 18 years ago now.
Now, one of my top guides at that time, Mikey Grant, was going to go over to
(16:16):
Lakewoods and fish the prestigious Nestor Cup tournament, one of the first or
second years that it was.
And he stuck that blade on the back of a tube and won the tournament with it.
And us at, you know, Andy Myers on Eagle, obviously all jumped right on it right away.
Way and it kind of kind of kept it to us for a
(16:38):
few years a little people fishing with us it got around and
the actual very first tail gunner
was a spinner with
a little tiny hook that jack clifton and i did back in 88 on north twin lake
on the back of our suckers and that was the start of what is now called the
(16:59):
tail gunner so there's a lot of history there with that tail gunner Then we
started using it in between the tails of the big joe.
Then we started using it off the back of bulldogs.
And then it's just gone on to tubes and other baits. So the tail gunner goes
quite a ways back, back to the late 80s.
(17:19):
But going back to that, I ramble. You know me, Jeff.
But on the Kraken,
I seem to prefer like a number five willow when I put a spinner on it,
because it really fits in with the kind of that gliding type of a drop that it has.
(17:42):
I i've had real good luck with that number five willow on the back of the kraken
whereas on the tubes i use the willow too but it seemed to do better most of
the time with a colorado on the back of a tube but i use them all i use them
all but on the kraken i definitely like the way,
it sounds like a really cool versatile bait i got to play around with
(18:03):
a little bit last fall i shot some underwater video of it and hopefully like
i said by the time you hear this podcast you can can come to team rhino outdoors.com and
you can order them from us and then i'll also have that video out
of the underwater action of it i got some video of it on the drop and things
like that it's just another versatile tool like you said herbie
to add to your tackle box i mean it's a long line of versatile tools
and you know each one has a time and place i'm sure that just
(18:25):
because you're using a crack and you won't stop using a red october tube i'd
imagine as well absolutely not absolutely not mark's taking good care of me
over the years i've caught a lot of big fish and and introduced a lot of big
fish to people and people to the tube.
Yeah, there's something about a tube that when the fishing's tough.
(18:49):
Particularly, that particular, whatever makes that tube do what it does with
that being soft-sided and the water going in and out, that you just simply, you know,
can't 100% duplicate with a hard-headed or solid rubber-headed bait. You know what I mean?
So, no, I will always have red October tubes in my arsenal for sure.
(19:17):
Definitely. Well, let's move on. You know, we kind of covered that one.
That one's, I mean, obviously a cool new tool.
Let's talk about the Big Mac. This one many people probably haven't heard about yet.
And Herbie, in fact, I didn't even know much about it until recently,
and you showed me some pictures of it. and it's a you know it's a tail rotating
top water bait but it definitely has some unique features why don't you talk
a little bit about that yeah it's uh.
(19:39):
It's got that bigger headed profile that has been popular in the last recent years.
Again, it is a plastic bait that holds its paint unlike a lot of your other
topwaters that people have a lot of trouble with.
(20:02):
The paint really stays on really good.
So that's a plus factor. or the paint that Livingston job that they're using
really stays intact very, very well.
It's got a mouth to it. I wanted to call it Big Mouth, but for some reason they called it Big Mac.
But it's got a mouth to it, and the mouth happens to serve several different purposes.
(20:28):
Number one, we found with that horizontal mouth going across the nose,
that you could not make that bait turnover.
No matter with an 8-to-1 reel as fast as you can reel it or trolling it behind a planter board.
Not that most times do you work topwaters that fast.
(20:52):
I actually work topwaters very slow because I find that I don't get fish blowing up behind them.
But there's times when I have caught fish trolling them or weed flats.
Sometimes people, whether they know it or not, are reeling the bait faster than I like to.
(21:12):
And I see baits turning over a lot. Anytime you've got a tail bait and you see
it rolling on you at all, you're definitely working that bait too fast.
This can't happen regardless of how fast you do start to work it.
It stabilizes the head. The water going into that slit of the mouth stabilizes it.
(21:34):
It also pushes the bottom lip of it down just a little bit.
So you get a little film of water that comes over the top of the bait,
which kind of has a hydrodynamic kind of look to it as it's going through the
water, which is always made in the past.
Some tailed topwaters that have more weight in their nose that have that property, very effective.
(22:00):
So that does that. It also helps the tail catch water better,
and between the hydrodynamic flow over the top and the flow catching the tail better,
you really get a real good consistent pop right from the first drop.
(22:20):
Quarter inch, the bait starts moving.
So also that water going into that horizontal mouth and then being pushed out
the sides of the edge of the mouth also produces some other different,
you know, I don't know what you call them,
(22:43):
sounds, vibrations, water flow that kind of just starts adding to anything and
anything that's swimming through the water.
You know, there's feet flapping, there's, you know, wings flapping,
there's paddling going on,
there's tails wiggling, there's all kinds of different things going on in natural
(23:04):
life, and this kind of just all adds to that.
The tail itself is not the big flat tail that is so common and on several different
types of baits that are available out there.
Now, they have been very successful, don't get me wrong, but they don't have
(23:25):
a lot of versatility, that flat tail, in adjustment.
It's either in tune or it's not, is what I found, with the flatter type of tails.
This has a tail that's like the old tallywhacker style of tail,
although per size per size of this bait,
(23:46):
comparably speaking in its size and the tail size versus if it was a smaller
bait it is between 15 and 20 percent taller.
So it has it has a very good deep and resonating type of sound to it the bait also has,
(24:10):
a built-in clicker that is a special stainless metal that we played with with
the type of metal of the tail to produce just the right kind of sound,
not overpowering bang, bang, bang, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick.
It's a subtle type of a tick that goes along with the popping of the tail that
(24:33):
makes it really an effective combo besides,
you know, the other water flowish properties, and everything else.
And then, all things aside, it's also got EBS in it, electronic bait fish sound,
which there's a lot going on.
I'm not so sure how much that sound the fish will actually pick up.
(24:58):
But there's a lot of different retrieves that I think people don't use when
it comes to topwaters, particularly side-to-side baits and tail baits.
And that is dead sticking a bait when you have a fish following it and it's
almost all the way to the boat, but yet it won't take the bait.
I've found stopping the bait and just letting it sit has caught me some tremendous
(25:24):
fish that I wanted to move it, I wanted to jerk it, I wanted to get the tail,
and I held on and held on, and then all of a sudden it's like a chicken nip
and they go and they and they grab it so it's
something that can be tried it doesn't
work all the time but it's not nothing works all
the time right so but it's another presentation that works but also what a lot
(25:47):
of people don't what a lot of people do and it works obviously is your steady
plopping retrieve with a tail bait depending upon how fast you're moving it
and the steady any type of retrieve,
but, you know, the old pause, pull, kind of snap, jerking,
(26:09):
creating, you know, a different type of action, pausing it and kind of jerking
it and pausing it, jerking it, and can be very effective at times.
Hardly anybody ever does that with a tail bait.
So there's a lot of different things that you can do with tail baits besides
just throwing them out and reeling them in.
(26:30):
Particularly when you got a fish following and it's humps
up right away and it's following them all the way to the boat now
you're 12 feet away you know i catch some fish on turns and figure eights and
taking the bait under in my opinion at the boat when you bring a tail bait in
if you haven't tried the the dead stick the pause pull type of triggering to
(26:52):
it and by the way that pause pull.
When I'm fishing structure up on shore, like trees and stuff like that,
heavy cover up on real heavy weeds up closer to shore and stuff,
a lot of times I'll throw a tail bait out there, and particularly in darker water.
And rather than just start the reel, I'll give it three, four pretty loud,
(27:16):
hard rips, and then go into the slow, steady, then he boop, boop,
boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, and then maybe after 10 feet,
give it a boop, boop, boop, boop.
But that two or three hard rips to start, there can be fish 10, 15, 20, 30 feet away.
Then it catches their attention, and I've seen wakes come right to the bait doing that.
(27:39):
So there's a lot of different things that you can do with tail baits to make
them more effective than just throwing them out and reeling them in.
There's another addition that I don't know if it'll make it in time to the initial
run of the bait but we got a double paddle tail type of addition,
to the rear of the of the
(28:02):
Big Mac that really looks a lot like
little duck's feet paddling behind the bait that I'm
hoping we can either get as an addition
that can be purchased to add
to the the bait or possibly if it's
done in time to be included in the package with the bait
but all in all i'm pretty excited about the
(28:24):
bait it's a very durable bait like i said it holds its paint very well it's
got a lot of things going for it a lot of different things going you know between
sounds and and water movement and and things like that i think it's going to
be a real winner and i think,
(28:45):
When it gets there, there's only going to be so many.
If your customers really want to get in on it, Jeff, I think they should be
calling you and getting on a list because the next batch that comes in is probably
going to be a month or two behind it. Once they're gone, they're gone.
I would highly suggest to people if they want to get in on this bait to give
(29:07):
you a call and get on a list.
Then once they hit your dock, you're ready to ship them out.
And i and we should have them in time you know
for the top water season this year i'm looking
for big things for it yeah it sounds like a you know late may june 1st is the
deadline i've kind of heard and if you're hearing this podcast right now you
(29:30):
can just go right on our website we have the big mac product built you can there's
an email us one available tab on there click that tab you can,
pull the drop down. If you want to select a certain color, I usually recommend
people select more than just one color, just in case, you know,
like, you know, maybe something's missing from an early shipment and we only
get five of six colors or whatever.
(29:52):
That way you definitely get in on there and you just enter in your email address
and away you go, you're, you're signed up.
And then, you know, just make sure that we're added, you know,
I think it's team rhino outdoors at hotmail.com is your safe sender.
I believe there's a note on there. So just so it doesn't end up in your spam folder.
Most of the time it doesn't, but occasionally spam filters will kick that out.
But anyways, just go on there and sign up. And you know, when a big Mac comes
(30:14):
in, you can get an email notification.
Of course you can pay attention to our social media. You can pay attention to our backlash podcast.
And then I'm assuming on this one here, I'll even mention that we have them
in stock when they're actually in stock.
Definitely a lot of cool new baits that are coming out, Herbie.
You know, it's, it's fun to, you know, I've even, I don't know if I've even
told you, but we have a, something new working on with the, one of the major
manufacturers and And I'll divulge details when we're off the air,
(30:37):
but we got something new that's working.
It's not, I wouldn't say groundbreaking, but definitely something that anglers
have been looking for for a while.
So we were talking about Donna Chicago.
Yeah, I believe so. Yeah. And we actually got to play with it.
Yep. I'm looking forward to having a couple of them in my hands,
especially fishing for big fish early in the season when normally we're using,
(30:58):
you know, either bigger baits than that or smaller baits than that.
And I think that's going to, that's going to be a big fish option when they
still like smaller baits, but yet it's got, you know, the bigger size to it.
That's about all I'm going to say.
Yeah. Well, Herbie, I'm pretty far ahead on this podcast, so you won't hear
this podcast until closer to the end of March.
(31:18):
I've been working ahead, you know, with, with the show season to try to get
this taken care of earlier, but you know, it's.
By the time you hear this podcast, the details are going to start to emerge
more on this bait that I've, I've teased a few times.
And just like I said, just pay attention to our social medias.
We'll be doing some podcasting on it. We'll be doing some talking on it.
And Herbie, I know you're, you're on my short list of guys.
(31:40):
You're going to definitely get some in your hands as soon as we can get them
to you. I know about the time you hear this podcast, we should have molds in hand, actually. Super.
Well, you know, Herbie, since I'm trying to keep these podcasts to about a half
an hour, of course, like you always do.
You fill the gaps perfect i have a whole list of bullet points i want to talk
about with both of those two baits top water tips you hit them all perfectly
(32:01):
amazing as usual you know for,
bullet points we miss we can do more of these right yeah and so you know like
i think i at some point we'll talk about the flipper but for the purpose of
this podcast we're about at the time limit i'd like to be at for people that
want to get in touch with you this year do you still You still have openings for trips?
Yeah, you know, actually, I got a few openings left in May for southern Wisconsin.
(32:25):
Not a lot, but I think four, three or four dates.
One of them, I think, is even on a weekend.
For some reason, I have that second or third, I don't have my calendar right in front of me.
I believe it's the third week in June. I got four days available for up in Vilas
(32:46):
County yet, and I can't believe it.
It's usually my first week full, and it comes off the full moon,
and it's just a – I think with this early type of spring that we're – apparently
it seems like we're going to have,
and I just think that June is going to be a dynamite month up north this year.
So that would be something to look at. I think I got one or two days left in November.
(33:14):
I got some two or three days going into the second week of December, central Wisconsin.
So I got a few days left that people that want to get in the boat and have a
good day and have some fun and share it with me.
If they get a hold of me, we should be able to get together.
Yeah, definitely. If people want to get in touch with you, what's the best way to do that?
(33:38):
Well, my phone number is 608-515-3416. No time's a bad time.
Like I always say, if you just want to talk fishing, don't be afraid to give
me a call. You got some questions.
I've had quite a few people actually taking advantage of that offer.
And I really feel good about it because they get back to me with a lot of appreciation.
(34:05):
And at this stage of the game in my life, it really is fulfilling.
Filling so don't be afraid if you got some things you want to talk about
you can go message me off of facebook steve
herbeck you can go to steve herbeck fishing
my website has got all my contacts on there i'm easy to find yeah and obviously
(34:27):
you don't have any problems talking muskies that's that's very clear every time
we get you on the podcast i don't ever have to worry about how long this is
going to go i usually have to worry about only like trying to limit the amount
of of the the time that it goes.
So always a great, always a great time, Steve.
I really appreciate your time. I want to thank all the listeners again for coming
out and listening to another episode.
(34:48):
I know we're, you know, just we're fresh off refiring this podcast again.
Hopefully by the time you hear this, we'll have some momentum going.
And if you're looking for, you know, either of these two new options from Livingston
Lures, go check out teamrhinooutdoors.com and I'll work my hardest to make sure
that we have another episode for you again next week, Monday.
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