February 18, 2025 • 50 mins
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, welcome back to another episode of the Tech Exec
Wellness Podcast.
Today I'm delighted to haveJudy Selby on our first podcast
of 2025.
So she's our first guest.
This is going to be reallyexciting and I just want to give
the listeners a background onher.
As a certified performancecoach and former award-winning
attorney with 30 plus years ofbig law experience, judy
(00:22):
specializes in helping lawyersand other high achieving
professionals achieve next levelsuccess in their careers and
lives.
Her coaching blends practicalstrategies, a blue collar work
ethic, which we'll talk about ina bit, and insights from her
number one bestselling book, theUntold Secrets to Thrive as a
Lawyer even if you didn't go toHarvard or Yale, and that was
(00:45):
released in October of 2024.
Judy, welcome to the show.
You know that you're in the hotseat, so before we get started,
I want to talk to you aboutwhat you're listening to, what's
your favorite music genre andif you can share maybe a couple
of different concert experiencesfor our listeners.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Yeah, I'm a rocker, I'm definitely a rocker.
I guess, if you know I had topick a favorite band, it would
still be the Beatles.
I think they were sotransformative and you know I
learned how to play the guitarto the Beatles songs when I was
a kid.
So I would say that that was.
You know, they're sofoundational.
And then you know, I still I'mnot like a heavy metal rocker
(01:32):
but I like progressive rock andbut you know I'm also eclectic.
You know I'll put on like 40smusic sometimes or I love a
string quartet on a Sundaymorning.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
you know that type of thing.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
But yeah, yeah, and concerts.
Man, I haven't been to aconcert in a long time.
What, yeah?
I remember when I was in highschool I'm probably dating
myself my sister worked for abank in New York.
We were in college at the timeand one of the guys that came in
to make deposits every day intothe commercial account for the
(02:04):
company you work for you workfor Swan Songs, and so he used
to get us tickets to LedZeppelin concerts and things
like that.
So I remember going to thesixth row in the garden to see
Zeppelin and I couldn't hear fortwo days afterwards.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
I'm not kidding, I swear, I swear.
I was just going to ask you ifyou were into Led Zeppelin or
Iron Maiden, and I am so jealous.
Can you just talk about thatconcert?
Because I love Zeppelin, I grewup with them.
As a kid, my mother had the LPs, the eight tracks.
I'm dating myself too.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
It was phenomenal, you know, we were up so close.
You know, the one time, like Isaid, we were in the sixth row
and so we were right there,basically on the stage, so that
in and of itself was incredible.
You know he would always start,or they would always start with
been a long time you know,which is cool.
(02:57):
Robert Plant was so skinny, youknow, I never will forget that.
You know he was wearing likethis kind of silky buttoned down
shirt, mostly unbuttoned, andvery, very like kind of low cut
jeans, very, very tight jeans.
He had that great hair back inthe day, but he wouldn't do the
high notes.
He would go to a lower registerthan you know he would do on
(03:19):
the records.
So that was somewhatdisappointing.
But one thing I remember fromthat concert was there was a
drum solo that went on and onand on for a long time and you
saw, you know, because we wereso close, you could see Plant
like sitting on the side.
He was like sitting on a pianoor something, and he might have
been smoking a cigarette, Ican't swear to that.
(03:39):
And then it was almost like helooked at his watch and you saw
him.
We could only see it.
We could see it because we wereso close, kind of sneaking up
to the microphone to startsinging again, you know, in some
big dramatic moment.
But we kind of saw that and sothat was pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
You know, one of my favorite songs is Cashmere.
I think that such goodstorytellers.
I mean the music you just gotentrenched in it.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
I loved it.
Yes, definitely, and I wasnever like a like a pot smoking
kid or anything like that.
But, boy, you know, you wouldpractically feel like that just
from listening to that song, ohmy goodness, and you know, this
is just.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
I'm just so elated, like after.
I mean I've, I love a lot ofthe stuff that you post, and
this just really puts the icingon the cake here, because I love
Led Zeppelin, I love music.
I think it really does a lotfor the soul and it's just so
weird.
I was thinking Led Zeppelinwhen you were talking, so I'm
just this is such a privilege.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Likewise and you know I feel the same way about music
I have certain playlists that Iplay.
You know, I have one that'scalled Feel Good Playlist and
that just has like this bizarrecollection of songs across all
kinds of genres.
But you can't help but feelgood when you hear this
(04:57):
collection of songs, and I havea morning playlist that's very
like.
Come on, let's go you know likelittle.
I'm in there, you know that kindof thing.
So I'm a big believer inutilizing the power of music to
impact your state, because Ireally believe your state is
really everything.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
No, it really is.
I think I've mentioned this ona podcast recently, but you
really have to be careful whatyou consume and digest.
This on a podcast recently, butyou really have to be careful
what you consume and digest.
And the fact that you've gotcurated playlists that kind of
you know touch in and help youelevate, I think that's really
cool.
I'm excited to hear that youlike Eminem, led Zeppelin.
Anything else we should knowabout Judy that you that we
(05:38):
would be surprised to know.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Yeah, here's something that always shocks
people, okay, absolutely shockspeople, cause I'm not much of a
like a, um, a chef or a cook.
Um, I don't really do that typeof thing.
Um, I mean, I guess I could, Ican, if I need to, but I just
kind of don't.
But in any event, when I was inhigh school, um, I went to kind
(06:04):
of a weird high school inBrooklyn.
That was a series of individualbuildings and I got to school
early one day and it was pouringrain, pouring, pouring, pouring
, and my friend and I arestanding outside.
All the buildings are locked,you couldn't get in.
Then somebody else comes overand says there's one building
open but they're giving a testin there.
(06:24):
So if you go in you have totake the test.
So I'm like, what test?
And they're like Betty Crocker,homemaker of the Year.
Oh, goodness.
And I said I'm taking the testbecause I did not want to stand
outside in the rain.
So I go in this classroomsoaking wet and I sit down and
they hand me the exam andthere's a whole bunch of people
(06:45):
in there taking it.
It was a multiple choice and,melissa, I remember some of the
questions, like there were somelike childcare kind of questions
, some questions about cookingthings.
I remember one question inparticular about what do you
look for when you're hanging apicture on the wall, and that
was ingrained in my head with mydad the studs in the wall, and
(07:05):
I do remember that question.
So I take this test and I staydry, and that was the last I
thought about it.
And then about three months,four months later, I get a phone
call on a Saturday morning froma friend of mine.
She's laughing so hard she canhardly talk to me and I said
what is going on?
And she's like you won, mygoodness.
(07:25):
I said I won what she said youwon the Penny Crocker thing.
So that's like that's always ashock to people.
I can't do any better than thatwith a story.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
You know what?
This is the first we've been.
We've been going on sinceOctober 2023.
And this is the first.
So, judy, you have.
You have raised the barsignificantly for us.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
There you go.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
So, before we get into wellness and whatnot one of
the things that I read in yourbio as I was reading it can you
talk about the blue collar workethic?
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Yeah, yeah, I'd be happy to.
I'm.
I'm a, I'm from Brooklyn, youknow, and my family is very,
very blue collar.
And my dad worked on thewaterfront and he got that job.
It was a union job and he gotit through my mom's dad, who was
an Irish immigrant.
And so what they did was theywould sit on these cranes and
(08:21):
these big elevated booths way,way, way up in the air.
They would climb up a ladder toget there and they would unload
cargo from ships, and so it wasa very dirty job.
My dad started that job, as itwas called, the fireman, meaning
he was shoveling coal into thefurnace that would power the
(08:41):
crane up.
So this was the family I grew upin, you know.
But my mom in particular, butmy dad as well, wanted my sister
and me to go to college, and mysister was only one year older
than me, so we went to collegeand then but you know, I grew up
with this, you know this bluecollar work ethic.
I remember, you know, we liveda little over a mile away from
(09:04):
the closest subway and it didn'tmatter Rain, snow, sleet, hail
we walked the mile to the subway, took the subway, walked the
mile back at night, no matterthe weather, the time of day.
We just did it Like you nevereven thought about it.
You know, my mom had a lot ofhealth issues when I was growing
up and my sister and I were,you know, doing you know the
(09:25):
laundry, the cleaning hangingoutside of windows.
You know, cleaning, cleaningwindows.
I was always helping my dadfixing cars and mowing lawns and
going around making money,shoveling snow in the winter and
you know all of that kind ofstuff.
So that's just kind of how Iwas and all of that kind of
(09:46):
stuff.
So that's just kind of how Iwas.
And when I decided to go to lawschool, which was after my fifth
knee surgery and I had been atrainer like a fitness trainer
and a coach, and after my fifthknee surgery I was like man, I
really should sit down, I don'tknow.
I just decided I was going togo to law school, but I knew
nothing about it and I couldn'teven say those words out loud.
It didn't sound right comingout of my mouth.
But of course I went to lawschool and I was a young
(10:08):
associate, I was doing well.
We just finished a trial, a10-week trial that initially was
involving a lot of law firmsand then only three of us were
left at the end when the juryverdict came in and we actually
won.
So after that trial I got aphone call from this partner at
(10:30):
a very, very elite law firm inManhattan and he said, judy,
because we worked together onthat trial before his firm, you
know they settled out for hisclient.
But he called me and he saidJudy, you're a very talented
lawyer, I want you to come andwork with me.
And I said, oh, man.
(10:52):
And he said I want you to comein the office and meet some
people.
Um, but it's not an interview.
You can work here if you want.
I'll never forget it.
I'll never forget it.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
It's amazing.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
So I go in and I'm meeting a bunch of people and
you know, kind of picking up thevibe of the place, and then I
meet this one, one partner inparticular, and he had this
corner office and we were.
He had a little alcove in thiscorner where he had a chair like
a cushiony chair, a little loveseat, and there was a coffee
(11:25):
table right there, and so we'resitting down there and he said
to me you know, hey, judy, youknow how are you?
How are you going to feel aboutworking here, where you know,
where everybody else, you know,went to Harvard or Yale, you
know, and you didn't.
And so I don't know what cameover me, what possessed me.
(11:47):
I must've been on a real highbecause we had won that big
trial or something, cause I'mlike a third or fourth year
lawyer at the time.
And I say, doesn't there come atime where it doesn't matter
where you went to law school anddoesn't?
Doesn't what really isn't howyou work and what you do?
Isn't that what really matters?
And I said I'm a really goodlawyer, I work very hard, and
(12:11):
yeah, so I didn't go to Harvardor Yale, but you know what?
I'm a blue collar lawyer.
I'm very good at what I do andI, and that's where that
expression came from.
It just, it just came right outof my mouth.
I'd never heard it before, I'venever heard anybody else say it
, but that's where that camefrom.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
I love that.
I got to tell you in just ashort moment that we've been
talking.
I just find you to be afascinating individual and
there's so many things thatyou're talking about that I can
relate to.
I grew up blue collar too, andI like that with your book and
everything.
I think people are so much morethan I worked at Google or I
(12:54):
worked at Apple or you know Idid this.
It's like what does a personbring?
You know what's the personality, the character, and I think,
when you talk about blue collar,my parents were factory workers
and I know one of the thingsthat I experienced as a kid was
I didn't take things for granted, I wasn't entitled, and I think
that's really helped me in life.
I mean, what are your thoughtsabout that?
Speaker 2 (13:17):
100%.
I was and I still am, you know,very, very grateful for the
opportunity.
You know I was in my early 30s.
I got loans to pay to go to lawschool.
I didn't know what I was doing.
I applied to the law schoolthat's closest to my house and
fortunately I got in.
I later learned that's not howyou apply to law school.
(13:40):
You know it should be a littlebit of a more thoughtful process
than that, but I felt so luckyto be there that I was able to
borrow money.
It was never like man, I haveto pay this back.
It was like I get to do this,you know, and that keeps you, I
think, from being complacent andjust like this attitude of
(14:02):
gratitude that I still have tothis day.
One of the things that reallydrives me is my coach.
I have a business coach and hetalks about he uses this term
the burn, like what is it?
That it's kind of deeper than awhy or purpose, that really you
know to do what you need to do,to be your best practice, your
disciplines, and day after dayafter day after day, and he
(14:24):
calls it a burn, and that's apretty good term, I think.
So mine is being grateful forthe opportunities I have.
You know there's a greatscripture that says you know to
whom much is given or to whommuch has been entrusted.
Much is required.
And when I think about all theopportunities I've been given,
(14:44):
you know my grandparents comingon over on a boat, my mom
surviving countless, countlesssurgeries when I was a kid you
know very, very serious thing.
My dad working outdoors, youknow, coming home at night hands
and feet cracking open becauseit was so cold, you know,
working in the cold on thewaterfront in New York, and so
you think I'm going to lay inbed and say, you know, not that
(15:07):
I ever set an alarm, but if Idid like push a snooze button,
you know, I mean it's like it'snot going to happen.
You know, and I've never lostthat, even even now.
You know, and I've never lostthat, even now.
You know, I've stepped awayfrom the practice of law.
That still has not left me.
I just feel like I'm veryprivileged and I connect with
this every single morning, everysingle morning.
(15:28):
I have things around the houseto remind me.
Even in my car I have thatlittle scripture on a little
piece of paper, like stuck in mylittle radio thing, and and I'm
just, I just constantly remindmyself, you know, and it works
for me and and I it's kind of my, my guiding push, you know, on
an everyday basis.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
This is going to be an amazing podcast for people to
listen to, and I say thatbecause you're talking about the
intent that you have when youstart your day and the intent
that you have for your life, andI think so many people dismiss
that and they don't expressgratitude and they don't know
what they're doing, and I lovethat you have that guidance in
(16:08):
the morning.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Yeah, I have.
In fact, I need to trim it down.
I think my morning kind ofprotocol has gotten a little bit
too long.
But you know, there's there'ssome devotionals I read, there's
prayers, there's gratitude.
I'm a huge believer in positiveself-talk and I am statement
and I just say these thingsevery day, and I have this hack.
In fact, it's going to come outsoon.
(16:30):
We're going to be.
I have a monthly well, it's abi-weekly actually newsletter
that I just started doing, andthis is actually going to be a
newsletter article that's comingout really soon.
I have this hack about that.
I use to keep my goals in frontof me all the time, and so I
read them multiple times a dayand it shows you, you know your,
(16:52):
what are your daily actions youneed to take to hit each of
your identified goals in sixareas of your life, and so
that's going to be a part of mynewsletter.
If people want to pop on mywebsite, they can sign up for it
.
It's free, and so you know Ikeep that in front of me.
I got it went on Amazon, I gotlike a $9 laminator thing and I
(17:13):
laminate it, I stick it insidemy planner and I read it two,
three, I don't know how manytimes a day, cause it's right
there, it's right there.
I'm a big believer in, you know, prayer, very intentional
reading, like you say, what youput into your head.
There's um two or three podcaststhat are very, very short.
(17:34):
They're great for the morning.
They're like two or threeminutes long and they're just,
like you know, like food foryour soul, you know, and your
mind.
So I listen to those.
I also.
I got this app a couple of yearsago.
That's really wonderful.
It's called the Heroic app andit's really really good because
(17:58):
the guy who set it up has this.
The way it works is you commitevery morning.
You log onto the app and youhave to, like, hold your finger
on it and commit to your dailyprotocols every day in three
different categories, and hiscategories are relationships,
work and health.
And then there are somepre-populated suggested things
(18:21):
that you do every day and whenyou do them, you swipe it.
You swipe left or right and youget a merit like a little thing
saying that you've done it, andthen you can add your own.
So for me, I added all kinds ofthings, like three things.
I'm grateful for my three mostimportant tasks of the day.
Three points of contact I'mgoing to make today, three
(18:42):
things I'm excited about today.
And then there's, like you know,the Bible reading.
Now I'm doing 75 hard, ofcourse.
So that's the exercise protocolfor now, and then you check in
at the end of the day and youknock it off, so you bookend it
and it's super helpful and oneof the things and I know this
(19:03):
has got to be an important issuefor your community dealing with
stress and dealing with burnoutand dealing with intense
pressure.
What I find is, the more stressyou're under, the more you have
to lean into your protocols, andthat's when people stop doing
(19:24):
it Most people stop doing it.
I'm tired, I don't feel like it.
I had a rough day.
I'm not going to go to the gym,I'm not going to do whatever.
I'll have a drink.
I'll watch 14 episodes ofsomething on Netflix.
Maybe, while I'm have a drink,I'll watch, you know, 14
episodes of something on Netflix.
You know, maybe while I'mhaving a drink.
(19:45):
You know, well, yeah, it's veryefficient, yeah.
So you know, the more you kindof keep to those your protocols
that keep you grounded, thatkeep you focused on the good,
and you know why you're doingcertain things.
You know, one of the things Ihave on my list for the
protocols is create a micromoment of awesome today, and so
(20:06):
that could be, you know, likejust a little conversation you
have with the cashier, you know,in the grocery store.
Or you know you drop a nicecomment on somebody's LinkedIn
post and they're really happyabout it.
So I think that you knowkeeping grounded in your
protocols when you're moststressed, focusing always on
(20:27):
preparation.
What I found in the law and youknow any type of lawyer really,
but certainly lawyers in thecyber space, you know,
especially if they're doing IRtype of work.
You know it's incrediblystressful.
You know keeping focused onthese protocols and your burn
(20:48):
and your why for why you'redoing what you're doing and not
getting too sucked into like avictim mentality.
You know, and a lot of thispresupposes you're not working
for.
You know sadists and horriblepeople.
You know, but I think a lot ofit is is really controllable and
having an attitude of service.
(21:10):
Have you, have you ever heardthe story about the three
bricklayers?
No, I have not.
This is, this is a great storyand I think this applies to any
profession at all.
Sure, so there's three bricklayers laying brick and somebody
walks over to the first one andsays what are you doing?
And he said I'm doing what Iwas told.
I'm laying brick.
I just put one brick on top ofthe other and this is what I do
(21:32):
all day long.
I go, okay.
Then he goes to the next guywhat are you doing?
And he said I'm building a wall.
This is how I support my family, my wife and my beautiful
children.
Okay, so a little bit of adifferent perspective there.
Then he gets to the thirdbricklayer.
What are you doing?
I'm building a magnificentcathedral where people from all
(21:54):
over the world are going to comeand marvel at how beautiful it
is, and they're going to worshipinside and give thanks to God
for their beautiful life and allthe gifts they've received.
So what keeps you going?
What keeps you going If you'rejust laying one brick on top of
another, you're responding toone incident after another, or
(22:17):
you're supporting your family,you're building a practice.
You're fulfilling a lifetimedream.
You're able to support yourselfand causes you believe in.
You know you're able to writechecks to whatever's important
to you.
You're able to take your familyon vacation.
You know you're able to sendyour kids to good schools,
whatever it may be.
If you can kind of keep thatperspective in place and never
(22:43):
lose sight of it, I think thatmakes such a difference, melissa
, in your approach to reallystressful situations.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
I agree with that and I'm so glad that you've shared
some good information and someinspiration here, and I
definitely want to ensure thatwe tell, or that I put the
website and the newsletterinformation out there, because a
lot of the people that arewriting me and talking about the
show is how the guests areimpacting them and how they're
(23:13):
thinking differently.
And I was sitting herelistening to you and when I've
come back to my spirituality andhaving that gratitude and
knowing that there's such aamazing world out there that we
can be a part of and cancontribute to, that really gets
me fired up and inspires me.
So I really appreciate youtalking about that.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
Thanks and, and you know, when I was deciding to go
into this coaching thing youknow it was it was a little
scary for me and I did.
I did, you know, some whatwould you call it?
Business intelligence research,you know, and I was looking at,
you know, what are othercoaches in this space saying and
(24:03):
what I noticed was so many, somany people and I'm sure there's
great coaches and I don't havemy finger on the pulse of every
coach out there, not at all butwhat I was seeing a lot of was I
will help you get out of yourcurrent role, I will help you
transition away and you know,open that bakery you've always
wanted to open or like, do thatkind of thing, and that's not
really always an option forpeople, you know, and it really
(24:26):
I don't believe it's oftentimeswhat they really even want, you
know.
I think what they want isrelief from the stress that
they're dealing with.
They don't know how to do it.
So they think they want toleave their job.
And so they're in this quandaryof you know, I got to get one
more kid through college.
You know I want to pay off themortgage and then I'll quit.
So they almost like sentencedthemselves to finishing their
(24:50):
career, which is really such asad way to go about it, you know
.
Or they do leave, and I have tothink many of them have regret
after they leave, you know,because it probably wasn't like
this burning hatred for whatthey were doing.
They were probably just, youknow, needed a healthier
approach and protocols andsystems for dealing with.
(25:11):
You know, the inevitable stressthat, by the way, you get in
any profession you go into, notjust tech, not just white collar
professional stuff, it'severywhere.
And so learning how to dealwith it, and especially now,
because you know, ourcompetition is it's not the kid
who sat next to you again incollege, it's some kid around
(25:33):
the world who's a lot hungrierthan you are, probably
physically and metaphorically aswell, you know.
And so everybody is under thesetypes of pressures.
But falling back on, you know,the mindset, the gratitude, the
physical health, all of thesethings, I think it just makes
such a massive difference.
(25:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
I want to ask you something before we get into the
75 hard challenge.
Let me know what you thinkabout this, because when I was
doing some research and kind ofreinventing myself, one of the
things that I found myself doingand I just thought of it when
you were talking about theperson that's hungrier, that's
around the world I think what Isee is that there's a lack
(26:15):
mindset.
I think people because I seethis on LinkedIn, that's the
only social I think I have atthis time I see that a lot.
No, there's not this, there'snot that, and if you really just
dive deep into manifestationand into creating and whatnot,
it really I don't know how we'reconditioned to believe that,
(26:36):
but I find it astonishing thatyou can change your mindset and
truly create what's meant foryou and not worry about the
outside noise.
What do you think about that?
Speaker 2 (26:45):
I agree 100%.
It's so important to knowwhat's within your control and
what's not within your control,and that also eliminates a lot
of problems.
I stopped watching the newsalmost a decade ago.
A lot of problems, you know,like I stopped watching the news
almost a decade ago, I stillknow what's going on.
You know you can't help butfind these things out, right,
(27:06):
but you know so.
I don't watch the news on TV.
I used to watch way too earlyevery morning at the gym and
then transition into Morning Joeand I was living and dying with
every tweet that anybody sentand I was like this is so stupid
, like this has got to stop.
And so I did.
And you know I'll still votethe way I think I should vote
and I'll give money where Ithink I should give money, but I
(27:28):
don't have to be, you know,immersed in it.
And that's the same thing withpolitics in your office, in your
HOA.
Everybody in my neighborhood ison, like this Facebook thing,
and they're always complainingabout something.
And they're like Judy, what doyou think about the fact that
so-and-so parked his car here?
I said I'm not on Facebook.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
I'm happy as can be.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
I'm walking my dog down the street.
I don't care who's parked where, but yeah, so I think we have
to control those externals.
Externals, and you know, therewas an article I read just this
morning that was reallyfascinating.
And um, did you read that book?
Grit by um, oh, I forget hername the um professor out in
(28:11):
California.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
And it's all about having a growth mindset.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
There's yeah, it's a really great book I'm sorry I
can't think of.
I think the name of the book isGrit and it's about how, when
you have kids, you complimentthem trying hard, and you
compliment them the process morethan the results.
Because people with a fixedmindset are like, well, I can
(28:41):
never be good at this because Idon't have that gene, you know.
And so they don't seek toimprove and they don't deal well
with any type of rejection or,you know, bad review or any type
of hardship.
You know they don't feel likethey can improve.
So I don't know if it's aninfluence from that type of
thinking, but there was anarticle posted this morning I
(29:04):
can't remember what publicationand it was saying how there's a
real disconnect betweenmanagement and companies and
young employees, because theythink that they should be
rewarded for effort even thoughthey're not getting results.
Yeah, that's not how it works,not how it works.
And so I think you know I'm notgoing to get political and I
(29:26):
don't- think it's a politicalissue really, but the way we've
kind of been lately of on bothsides of the aisle, of not
wanting to hear anybody whodisagrees with us, you know
we've gotten very polarized inour own little sectors and
attribute horrible motives topeople on the other side, and
(29:48):
all of these things, I think,weakens us as a culture.
And then you show up at workand I have some stories in my
book of you know, even when itcomes down to things like dress
code.
You know some young womanhaving an absolute meltdown at
an insurance company.
They have a dress code which,you'll be shocked to hear, does
not include sparkly sneakers,and she just was like this is
(30:11):
how I express my identity, thisis how I show the world who I am
.
They're like.
Well, you're going to have toshow it after work.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
My goodness, I want to ask you this.
Geez, I could talk to you allday, but one of the things is, I
think, iphones and iPads, Ithink that's ruined a lot, and
you're seeing things right fromall over the world and people
are coming out there.
They're like, well, I'm goingto do this, I'm going to do this
, I'm going to do that.
You know what my advice is foreverybody?
Get outside and touch somegrass, get some vitamin D, walk
it off.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
If you hear that, that's me clapping for you.
Thank you.
In the first chapter of my bookI focus on that quite a bit
because you know, and I feel badfor the younger generation,
there are a lot of latchkey kidsand they grew up texting, not
talking, and then they put onbig noise canceling headphones
(31:05):
and so they don't communicate.
And then when they show up atthe workplace they're supposed
to interview well, they'resupposed to make small talk and
if they do get the job, they'resupposed to know how to interact
that way.
And so there's.
I have a lot of tips in thefirst chapter of the book of how
you know people.
(31:26):
You know lean into, lean intoyour strengths.
You know if you're a digitalnative, lean into that.
You know you get aroundpartners like me in a law firm
and we're like you can do mytechnology, you can do my
e-discovery, me in a law firmand we're like you can do my
technology, you can do mye-discovery.
You're hired.
But you know I have like tips inthere, like put your phone in
your pocket and go to Starbucks.
You know, chat it up with somestranger on the line.
(31:51):
You know, make small talk withthe barista, learn how to
interact verbally, a little eyecontact, and not be so proud of
the fact that.
You know I don't do small talk.
You know you're going to haveto do small talk.
People won't hire you unlessthey like you.
You know, and so I agree withyou.
It's kind of sad I was.
(32:11):
I was in the city the other dayand I saw this couple walking
down the street together.
They were both on their phoneslooking down, oh my goodness,
and they both had the noisecanceling headphones on.
Speaker 1 (32:24):
What a great relationship.
That's what.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
I was thinking.
That's what I was thinking, andthey were probably texting each
other.
No, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (32:31):
I mean we text each other in the house, but you know
we live in Texas and you knowit's not like our small place in
Illinois, but we'll text eachother.
But we don't do that.
It's just crazy.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, yeah, it was like man.
And then you know what do somepeople do for fun Virtual
reality.
Then they just put a thing overtheir eyes and they're
literally someplace else.
So, yeah, I think these thingsare not conducive to you know
building and conducive to youknow building and you know the
pandemic didn't help any of thisby the way, no, no.
And I found and there's somestories in the book around this
(33:04):
too, a lot of stories actuallyhow I learned so much just from
being in the office with seniorpartners and other people who
would just I call it accidentalmentoring.
They would just see you andcomment about this or that,
sometimes good, maybe not good,you know, but you would just
learn like that.
You don't have thoseopportunities and you know you
(33:25):
can't blame it all on the, youknow, on their junior people,
because I know, trying to getyou know senior people you know
in, like in New York, forexample.
You know if you're, if you liveout on the island or you're up
in Connecticut like I'm notcoming in the office.
(33:46):
You know people got verycomfortable and we got.
We got a little soft, I hate tosay it, because these are
things we did without eventhinking about.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Yeah, I remember back in the day when I lived in
Chicago and I was taking thetrain to work and I was going in
the office and it was like abig you know my girlfriend's at
work We'd go see.
And I was going in the officeand it was like a big you know
my girlfriends at work we'd gosee.
I think it was gladiator afterwork.
I mean, it was a really greatsocial environment.
Not only were you working andlearning technology, but you
were hey, let's go.
You know, sex in the city wasbig back then.
Let's go have um, or thosethings called cosmopolitans.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
Oh, yeah, yeah, the pink drinks.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Yeah, and you don't see that anymore.
Everybody you know drives longdistances or they're remote and
it's weird like you know, youcould.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
Apparently a bunch of employees sent him a petition
about against remote work andhe's like I don't care about
your blankety blank petition,everybody gets into the office.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
Well, let's talk about this.
We're talking about theprotocol and everything that
you're doing, and I love thatand I I'm taking notes over here
.
So I've got my pink stickiesand I'm like okay, I'm writing
this down, Tell me about how.
How did you find it, why areyou doing it and what's your
overall?
I mean, are you loving it orwhat?
Speaker 2 (35:05):
You mean 75 hard.
Yes, yeah, yeah, Uh.
I you know.
I don't remember how I found it, probably because I was
listening to Ed Milet.
I don't listen to Andy Frisellathat much, although I do think
he gives great entrepreneurialadvice.
I'm not big on cursing andthere's a lot of F-bombs.
Speaker 1 (35:25):
I don't curse anymore In the Navy I did, but nah,
I've totally failed.
Maybe Dan makes as bad as itgets.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
But you know it's great business.
You know entrepreneurial advice, so maybe I heard it from him,
maybe some friends were doing it, but you know it's a.
It's a great program.
I'm really enjoying it and, um,you know it's easier now that
I'm not full-time at the lawfirm.
Um, especially because the daysare short and one of the one of
(35:51):
the workouts has to be outdoors.
And, uh, I'm doing it with acouple of friends of mine.
So we're, you know we're onWhatsApp, you know, sending
pictures of ourselves, you know,with a ruck on and the you know
like the three degrees, youknow, and I'm like why did we
start this on January 1?
We should have started this, youknow, maybe in May, but yeah,
(36:13):
so there's a lot ofaccountability and I like it.
I like it a lot.
In some ways it's not thatdifferent from my daily
lifestyle, cause I do read.
You know you have to.
You have to read 10 pagesminimum of a of a nonfiction
book, and so I would kind of dothat anyway.
The hardest part for me isdrinking a gallon of water a day
.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
That's tough.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
That's a lot of water .
So, yeah, that's my leastfavorite part of it.
There's the two 45-minuteworkouts that have to be three
hours apart.
They can both be outdoors.
I'm a little limited.
I've had, I think, 11 kneesurgeries and I had my ankle
reconstructed two years ago.
Good grief, I know so, but I'mtelling you, these knees, man, I
(36:58):
have the knees of atwo-year-old because they're
titanium.
But I don't run anymore.
So I'm kind of limited in whatI can do outside.
So I just walk as fast as I canwith my dog and we walk up and
down the same hills all the time, up and down, up and down, to
try to get the hills in, andhe's like crying and pulling me
(37:19):
the other way.
I'm like listen, man, I toldyou you didn't have to come, but
it's, it's been, it's been,it's been great.
I've noticed changes, like inmy body.
I've noticed you just, I don'tknow, it was just, it's almost
hard to describe.
You know, it's a real sense ofaccomplishment.
Now I had started it a couple ofyears ago and got up to day 37
(37:42):
and my ankle rolled and I had abig fall and yeah.
So I went to the ankle doctorand you know, I ended up having
the ankle reconstructed.
Turns out I had a torn ligamentand the tendon was behind the
ankle, not on the side, you know, which is not conducive to
standing up and walkingvertically.
(38:03):
So I got those things fixed, sothat was a blessing in disguise
.
Actually, that fall didn't doit.
That fall exposed it, so thatwas all good.
So now I think we're on day 44today.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
Oh, that's great, that's great.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
That's great.
Yeah, I have to drink some morewater and then do my indoor
workout.
I might do a second outdoor one, we'll see.
We had nine inches of snow overthe past two days and it's 60
degrees today, so it's a bit ofa swamp out there.
But I may go out and do anotherone of those while I can.
But it's great.
(38:40):
I do recommend it.
It's not a prescriptive diet,but it has to be like a healthy
diet and you decide no alcoholfor the 75 days and no cheat
meals.
He calls it.
So you know.
I had company last week and Ilive in Virginia now.
I moved down from New York andmy company was like, hey, you
(39:01):
have that great fried chickendown here.
I was like, yeah, I won't behaving that.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
But here's the thing I don't know about you, but
digestively speaking, I can'tconsume those types of things
anymore, and if I do, I'musually paying for it Like, oh,
I just shouldn't have that pizzaor that sushi.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
Yeah, it's true, it's true, and I don't eat meat.
I gave up meat decades ago.
But I do eat chicken and turkeyand fish.
But yeah, and that was it.
I was so poor in law schoolthat I couldn't even afford.
You know, I did eat meat backthen, but I couldn't really
afford it and on the rare timesI would have it, like at my
(39:41):
parents' house, it would be veryhard to digest.
And so it wasn't a massivesacrifice to kind of walk away
from it.
And then you know, then youhave to find your protein in
other places, so yeah, that's Idon't know.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
I mean this is.
I think a lot of people aregoing to really enjoy this
podcast episode because wecovered a lot and I think, from
my opinion, from what I'm seeingout there, people are looking
for guidance, they're lookingfor focus, they're looking for
inspiration, and I think we canbe part of the movement or sit
(40:16):
back and let it happen withoutyour participation.
But I think we're on a goodtrajectory, at least from what
I'm seeing.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
I think so too, and it's really amazing to me.
Sometimes I'll just get youknow random messages from people
saying people I don't knowwe're not connected online.
I've never seen them interactwith my content online and
they're like I love your content, it's so great, and I'm
actually starting to write asecond book now based on a
(40:46):
concept in the first book.
Some of the feedback I got onthe first book was this is not
just for lawyers, despite thetitle, and the last chapter of
the book is kind of like a Iguess like a personal
development-y kind of chapter,with some of my hacks that I use
for myself that work well, andone of those hacks I've gotten
(41:08):
such good feedback that that'sgoing to be the basis of my new
book that I'm going to start.
You know have a pretty robustoutline and I'll have to get
that thing in shape pretty soon,but the concept is well.
I'll tell you the story of howit happened this way before I
went to law school, I was, I hada job and this guy I was
working with used to come intowork every single day and we
(41:30):
were working in retail.
I think I was in college and sowe were working in retail and
you would do different shifts.
You would work, sometimes you'dopen, sometimes you would close
, you know.
So that's, you know, can behard physically, but every day
this guy would come in and he'dsay I'm so tired, I'm so tired.
And every day you'd be like hey, how are you?
And like, oh, I'm so tired.
(41:51):
And he used to call me.
He used to call me, he used tocall me, miss Udy, miss Udy, I'm
so tired, I'm so tired.
And then, but you know, after,like, after a few weeks, you're
like man, you know, and so, butthen, you know, before you know
it, everybody else is yawning.
(42:15):
And so one day I just said tomyself that is it.
I will never, ever, ever saythe words I'm tired again.
And that started quiteunintentionally.
My never say it list and someof the other things I might
never say, at least you know I'mtired is number one on the list
.
I don't feel like it is numbertwo on the list because you
never say I don't feel like itwhen you're like, you know, I'm
going to sit down and write thatreport, you know.
(42:36):
Or I mean, I mean when you're,when you're going to go watch
Netflix or something.
It's only when you're doingsomething you should do.
You know, like I should writethat report, I should go to the
gym, but I don't feel like it,you know.
And so I took certain certainphrases out of my vocabulary.
The other day, a couple ofweeks ago.
I was thinking you know, isthere is this just me, or is
(42:58):
there any science that actuallybacks this up?
And there, there's quite a bitof science that backs it up.
So that's going to be the themeof the new book all around.
Yeah, what you're saying, whatyou're not saying, the science
behind it, the scripture behindit and some hacks I use.
Like I have an article comingout soon on this, a little post
(43:19):
or whatever it is.
Like if you say I'm not good atyou, know whatever, like I'm
not good at Excel.
So if you want to stop sayingthese things, bad things about
yourself, there's two hacks, oneadd at the end of that sentence
yet the word, yet I'm not goodat Excel.
Yet it's a whole different vibe.
You feel a little bit moreempowered, you know, right,
(43:41):
right.
Or if you really want to shakeyourself up, you say at the end
of the sentence and that's justthe way I want it.
So you try, you try, say, say,think of something that you're,
you know you wish you were goodat, or good, but you're not, and
then put that at the end.
Speaker 1 (43:58):
Okay Now, good at, but you're not.
And then put that at the end.
Okay, now I'm trying to thinkwhat am I not good?
at.
I need to be good at.
You're nothing.
Everything, you're good ateverything.
I want to say this, though whenwe go back to talking about the
blue collar work ethic andmyself being in the military, I
really think that you get thatconditioning, because, judy, all
(44:18):
throughout this conversation,it's never, you know, there's I
have not heard you once say,well, I had difficulty doing
this, or this happened to me.
It's quite the opposite.
It's quite like hey, this ishow I endured, this is what
happened, this is how I stayempowered, and I think that's
what needs to happen right nowwith a lot of the younger folks,
is that they need to beempowered, and not, oh, it's
(44:41):
okay, well, let's you know,let's rub the dirt off and let's
keep going.
Speaker 2 (44:47):
Yeah, yeah, the, the kind of victim, the poor me,
poor us, type of thing.
Like you know, I mentioned theknees, you know, and the I've
had, like the you've had theknees, the shoulder is replaced.
All from overuse.
It's all overuse and people say,oh, judy, that's awful.
I say, what do you mean?
(45:08):
That's awful?
Lives dedicated to this so thatthey could come in and do this
for me.
There were amazing engineersthat thought how am I going to
invent a reverse shoulderimplant for someone whose
rotator cuff is gone?
(45:29):
That is, you know, that will befunctional for them.
Well, who's sitting here?
Remember I said gratitude,beneficiary of other things,
sacrifices people have made forme.
Who am I to complain?
You know, absolutely.
And so I think that thatapproach and this, this took
some work.
You know, this, this took somework because, you know, I grew
(45:50):
up in an Irish Catholic familywhere, you know, a lot of people
got a lot of, you know,attention for being the worst
off Right, like you were reallylucky if they put the word poor
before your name, like poorMelissa.
Oh my gosh, you can't believewhat she's going through.
Speaker 1 (46:09):
Goodness, I can't wait to.
I'm going to check out yourbook and then, please, I need to
know when that newsletterlaunches.
And I love that you havesomething coming out with hacks,
because I think if we haveguidance for them me, I'm doing
this podcast, you're writing,we're helping the collective
right, so I think you'recontributing to people that
(46:29):
really need this right now.
They need guidance.
Speaker 2 (46:32):
And that's the thing you know.
It doesn't have to be like this, because you only get one life.
You only get one life and whenyou focus on the things you can
control and not get distractedby everything else going on in
the world I'm not saying to bean irresponsible citizen or
(46:52):
anything like that but focus onwhat you can control and focus
on what is right and how you canbe of service to others.
You know, there's a greatsaying by a very old-fashioned
speaker named Zig Ziglar and hesaid if you don't want to be of
service just because it feelslike the right thing to do, he
always says you get what youwant in life if you just give
(47:15):
enough other people what theywant.
Yeah, and think about it.
It's true From your client toyour boss, to your parents, to
your girlfriend, to yourboyfriend, to your whatever.
You know, it's the way theworld works, and so when you
adopt that certain, that mindsetof service looking to give, not
(47:37):
get you actually do get, youactually do get.
Ooh wow.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
This was.
This was an incredible episode.
Like I've got to go edit ittonight.
So I go, let's do it, cause youreally threw out a ton of great
information and hacks.
I'm so privileged that you cameto the show.
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (47:56):
I am so happy and I love the fact that you're taking
this on as like a like a socialresponsibility to you know, to
uplift your listeners, and itreally makes their lives better.
So I'm thrilled to you.
Know, you and I I think wefound ourselves on LinkedIn
because we're kind of aligned inthat way and I'm very grateful
(48:17):
for the opportunity to you knowto share these things that you
know, have worked for me, youknow, have worked and worked for
my clients.
I know they work and I've seenwhat happens when people act
differently.
And I see like I've seen thelawyers in the fetal position on
the floor in their offices.
(48:37):
You know, I've seen the lawyerseither blowing up and screaming
, rages.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
Yeah, there's got to be more to life than that, right
.
Speaker 2 (48:45):
Yeah, and so a lot of it is just like learning.
You know these tactics, hacksand mindset approaches to deal
better with the inevitablestresses, and you know
difficulties we all have.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
Judy, thank you so much.
I mean, I think we're going tohave to have a part two.
There's so many of our guestswhere people are like are they
going to come back on anytimesoon?
So yeah, I definitely have toput you on that list.
But thank you so much forcoming.
Please remember to subscribe toour podcast on various
platforms, including Apple,spotify, iheartradio and many
more.
Thank you for tuning in andtake care.
Hi, welcome back to another episode of the Tech Exec
Wellness Podcast.
Today I'm delighted to haveJudy Selby on our first podcast
of 2025.
So she's our first guest.
This is going to be reallyexciting and I just want to give
the listeners a background onher.
As a certified performancecoach and former award-winning
attorney with 30 plus years ofbig law experience, judy
(00:22):
specializes in helping lawyersand other high achieving
professionals achieve next levelsuccess in their careers and
lives.
Her coaching blends practicalstrategies, a blue collar work
ethic, which we'll talk about ina bit, and insights from her
number one bestselling book, theUntold Secrets to Thrive as a
Lawyer even if you didn't go toHarvard or Yale, and that was
(00:45):
released in October of 2024.
Judy, welcome to the show.
You know that you're in the hotseat, so before we get started,
I want to talk to you aboutwhat you're listening to, what's
your favorite music genre andif you can share maybe a couple
of different concert experiencesfor our listeners.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Yeah, I'm a rocker, I'm definitely a rocker.
I guess, if you know I had topick a favorite band, it would
still be the Beatles.
I think they were sotransformative and you know I
learned how to play the guitarto the Beatles songs when I was
a kid.
So I would say that that was.
You know, they're sofoundational.
And then you know, I still I'mnot like a heavy metal rocker
(01:32):
but I like progressive rock andbut you know I'm also eclectic.
You know I'll put on like 40smusic sometimes or I love a
string quartet on a Sundaymorning.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
you know that type of thing.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
But yeah, yeah, and concerts.
Man, I haven't been to aconcert in a long time.
What, yeah?
I remember when I was in highschool I'm probably dating
myself my sister worked for abank in New York.
We were in college at the timeand one of the guys that came in
to make deposits every day intothe commercial account for the
(02:04):
company you work for you workfor Swan Songs, and so he used
to get us tickets to LedZeppelin concerts and things
like that.
So I remember going to thesixth row in the garden to see
Zeppelin and I couldn't hear fortwo days afterwards.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
I'm not kidding, I swear, I swear.
I was just going to ask you ifyou were into Led Zeppelin or
Iron Maiden, and I am so jealous.
Can you just talk about thatconcert?
Because I love Zeppelin, I grewup with them.
As a kid, my mother had the LPs, the eight tracks.
I'm dating myself too.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
It was phenomenal, you know, we were up so close.
You know, the one time, like Isaid, we were in the sixth row
and so we were right there,basically on the stage, so that
in and of itself was incredible.
You know he would always start,or they would always start with
been a long time you know,which is cool.
(02:57):
Robert Plant was so skinny, youknow, I never will forget that.
You know he was wearing likethis kind of silky buttoned down
shirt, mostly unbuttoned, andvery, very like kind of low cut
jeans, very, very tight jeans.
He had that great hair back inthe day, but he wouldn't do the
high notes.
He would go to a lower registerthan you know he would do on
(03:19):
the records.
So that was somewhatdisappointing.
But one thing I remember fromthat concert was there was a
drum solo that went on and onand on for a long time and you
saw, you know, because we wereso close, you could see Plant
like sitting on the side.
He was like sitting on a pianoor something, and he might have
been smoking a cigarette, Ican't swear to that.
(03:39):
And then it was almost like helooked at his watch and you saw
him.
We could only see it.
We could see it because we wereso close, kind of sneaking up
to the microphone to startsinging again, you know, in some
big dramatic moment.
But we kind of saw that and sothat was pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
You know, one of my favorite songs is Cashmere.
I think that such goodstorytellers.
I mean the music you just gotentrenched in it.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
I loved it.
Yes, definitely, and I wasnever like a like a pot smoking
kid or anything like that.
But, boy, you know, you wouldpractically feel like that just
from listening to that song, ohmy goodness, and you know, this
is just.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
I'm just so elated, like after.
I mean I've, I love a lot ofthe stuff that you post, and
this just really puts the icingon the cake here, because I love
Led Zeppelin, I love music.
I think it really does a lotfor the soul and it's just so
weird.
I was thinking Led Zeppelinwhen you were talking, so I'm
just this is such a privilege.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Likewise and you know I feel the same way about music
I have certain playlists that Iplay.
You know, I have one that'scalled Feel Good Playlist and
that just has like this bizarrecollection of songs across all
kinds of genres.
But you can't help but feelgood when you hear this
(04:57):
collection of songs, and I havea morning playlist that's very
like.
Come on, let's go you know likelittle.
I'm in there, you know that kindof thing.
So I'm a big believer inutilizing the power of music to
impact your state, because Ireally believe your state is
really everything.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
No, it really is.
I think I've mentioned this ona podcast recently, but you
really have to be careful whatyou consume and digest.
This on a podcast recently, butyou really have to be careful
what you consume and digest.
And the fact that you've gotcurated playlists that kind of
you know touch in and help youelevate, I think that's really
cool.
I'm excited to hear that youlike Eminem, led Zeppelin.
Anything else we should knowabout Judy that you that we
(05:38):
would be surprised to know.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Yeah, here's something that always shocks
people, okay, absolutely shockspeople, cause I'm not much of a
like a, um, a chef or a cook.
Um, I don't really do that typeof thing.
Um, I mean, I guess I could, Ican, if I need to, but I just
kind of don't.
But in any event, when I was inhigh school, um, I went to kind
(06:04):
of a weird high school inBrooklyn.
That was a series of individualbuildings and I got to school
early one day and it was pouringrain, pouring, pouring, pouring
, and my friend and I arestanding outside.
All the buildings are locked,you couldn't get in.
Then somebody else comes overand says there's one building
open but they're giving a testin there.
(06:24):
So if you go in you have totake the test.
So I'm like, what test?
And they're like Betty Crocker,homemaker of the Year.
Oh, goodness.
And I said I'm taking the testbecause I did not want to stand
outside in the rain.
So I go in this classroomsoaking wet and I sit down and
they hand me the exam andthere's a whole bunch of people
(06:45):
in there taking it.
It was a multiple choice and,melissa, I remember some of the
questions, like there were somelike childcare kind of questions
, some questions about cookingthings.
I remember one question inparticular about what do you
look for when you're hanging apicture on the wall, and that
was ingrained in my head with mydad the studs in the wall, and
(07:05):
I do remember that question.
So I take this test and I staydry, and that was the last I
thought about it.
And then about three months,four months later, I get a phone
call on a Saturday morning froma friend of mine.
She's laughing so hard she canhardly talk to me and I said
what is going on?
And she's like you won, mygoodness.
(07:25):
I said I won what she said youwon the Penny Crocker thing.
So that's like that's always ashock to people.
I can't do any better than thatwith a story.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
You know what?
This is the first we've been.
We've been going on sinceOctober 2023.
And this is the first.
So, judy, you have.
You have raised the barsignificantly for us.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
There you go.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
So, before we get into wellness and whatnot one of
the things that I read in yourbio as I was reading it can you
talk about the blue collar workethic?
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Yeah, yeah, I'd be happy to.
I'm.
I'm a, I'm from Brooklyn, youknow, and my family is very,
very blue collar.
And my dad worked on thewaterfront and he got that job.
It was a union job and he gotit through my mom's dad, who was
an Irish immigrant.
And so what they did was theywould sit on these cranes and
(08:21):
these big elevated booths way,way, way up in the air.
They would climb up a ladder toget there and they would unload
cargo from ships, and so it wasa very dirty job.
My dad started that job, as itwas called, the fireman, meaning
he was shoveling coal into thefurnace that would power the
(08:41):
crane up.
So this was the family I grew upin, you know.
But my mom in particular, butmy dad as well, wanted my sister
and me to go to college, and mysister was only one year older
than me, so we went to collegeand then but you know, I grew up
with this, you know this bluecollar work ethic.
I remember, you know, we liveda little over a mile away from
(09:04):
the closest subway and it didn'tmatter Rain, snow, sleet, hail
we walked the mile to the subway, took the subway, walked the
mile back at night, no matterthe weather, the time of day.
We just did it Like you nevereven thought about it.
You know, my mom had a lot ofhealth issues when I was growing
up and my sister and I were,you know, doing you know the
(09:25):
laundry, the cleaning hangingoutside of windows.
You know, cleaning, cleaningwindows.
I was always helping my dadfixing cars and mowing lawns and
going around making money,shoveling snow in the winter and
you know all of that kind ofstuff.
So that's just kind of how Iwas and all of that kind of
(09:46):
stuff.
So that's just kind of how Iwas.
And when I decided to go to lawschool, which was after my fifth
knee surgery and I had been atrainer like a fitness trainer
and a coach, and after my fifthknee surgery I was like man, I
really should sit down, I don'tknow.
I just decided I was going togo to law school, but I knew
nothing about it and I couldn'teven say those words out loud.
It didn't sound right comingout of my mouth.
But of course I went to lawschool and I was a young
(10:08):
associate, I was doing well.
We just finished a trial, a10-week trial that initially was
involving a lot of law firmsand then only three of us were
left at the end when the juryverdict came in and we actually
won.
So after that trial I got aphone call from this partner at
(10:30):
a very, very elite law firm inManhattan and he said, judy,
because we worked together onthat trial before his firm, you
know they settled out for hisclient.
But he called me and he saidJudy, you're a very talented
lawyer, I want you to come andwork with me.
And I said, oh, man.
(10:52):
And he said I want you to comein the office and meet some
people.
Um, but it's not an interview.
You can work here if you want.
I'll never forget it.
I'll never forget it.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
It's amazing.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
So I go in and I'm meeting a bunch of people and
you know, kind of picking up thevibe of the place, and then I
meet this one, one partner inparticular, and he had this
corner office and we were.
He had a little alcove in thiscorner where he had a chair like
a cushiony chair, a little loveseat, and there was a coffee
(11:25):
table right there, and so we'resitting down there and he said
to me you know, hey, judy, youknow how are you?
How are you going to feel aboutworking here, where you know,
where everybody else, you know,went to Harvard or Yale, you
know, and you didn't.
And so I don't know what cameover me, what possessed me.
(11:47):
I must've been on a real highbecause we had won that big
trial or something, cause I'mlike a third or fourth year
lawyer at the time.
And I say, doesn't there come atime where it doesn't matter
where you went to law school anddoesn't?
Doesn't what really isn't howyou work and what you do?
Isn't that what really matters?
And I said I'm a really goodlawyer, I work very hard, and
(12:11):
yeah, so I didn't go to Harvardor Yale, but you know what?
I'm a blue collar lawyer.
I'm very good at what I do andI, and that's where that
expression came from.
It just, it just came right outof my mouth.
I'd never heard it before, I'venever heard anybody else say it
, but that's where that camefrom.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
I love that.
I got to tell you in just ashort moment that we've been
talking.
I just find you to be afascinating individual and
there's so many things thatyou're talking about that I can
relate to.
I grew up blue collar too, andI like that with your book and
everything.
I think people are so much morethan I worked at Google or I
(12:54):
worked at Apple or you know Idid this.
It's like what does a personbring?
You know what's the personality, the character, and I think,
when you talk about blue collar,my parents were factory workers
and I know one of the thingsthat I experienced as a kid was
I didn't take things for granted, I wasn't entitled, and I think
that's really helped me in life.
I mean, what are your thoughtsabout that?
Speaker 2 (13:17):
100%.
I was and I still am, you know,very, very grateful for the
opportunity.
You know I was in my early 30s.
I got loans to pay to go to lawschool.
I didn't know what I was doing.
I applied to the law schoolthat's closest to my house and
fortunately I got in.
I later learned that's not howyou apply to law school.
(13:40):
You know it should be a littlebit of a more thoughtful process
than that, but I felt so luckyto be there that I was able to
borrow money.
It was never like man, I haveto pay this back.
It was like I get to do this,you know, and that keeps you, I
think, from being complacent andjust like this attitude of
(14:02):
gratitude that I still have tothis day.
One of the things that reallydrives me is my coach.
I have a business coach and hetalks about he uses this term
the burn, like what is it?
That it's kind of deeper than awhy or purpose, that really you
know to do what you need to do,to be your best practice, your
disciplines, and day after dayafter day after day, and he
(14:24):
calls it a burn, and that's apretty good term, I think.
So mine is being grateful forthe opportunities I have.
You know there's a greatscripture that says you know to
whom much is given or to whommuch has been entrusted.
Much is required.
And when I think about all theopportunities I've been given,
(14:44):
you know my grandparents comingon over on a boat, my mom
surviving countless, countlesssurgeries when I was a kid you
know very, very serious thing.
My dad working outdoors, youknow, coming home at night hands
and feet cracking open becauseit was so cold, you know,
working in the cold on thewaterfront in New York, and so
you think I'm going to lay inbed and say, you know, not that
(15:07):
I ever set an alarm, but if Idid like push a snooze button,
you know, I mean it's like it'snot going to happen.
You know, and I've never lostthat, even even now.
You know, and I've never lostthat, even now.
You know, I've stepped awayfrom the practice of law.
That still has not left me.
I just feel like I'm veryprivileged and I connect with
this every single morning, everysingle morning.
(15:28):
I have things around the houseto remind me.
Even in my car I have thatlittle scripture on a little
piece of paper, like stuck in mylittle radio thing, and and I'm
just, I just constantly remindmyself, you know, and it works
for me and and I it's kind of my, my guiding push, you know, on
an everyday basis.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
This is going to be an amazing podcast for people to
listen to, and I say thatbecause you're talking about the
intent that you have when youstart your day and the intent
that you have for your life, andI think so many people dismiss
that and they don't expressgratitude and they don't know
what they're doing, and I lovethat you have that guidance in
(16:08):
the morning.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Yeah, I have.
In fact, I need to trim it down.
I think my morning kind ofprotocol has gotten a little bit
too long.
But you know, there's there'ssome devotionals I read, there's
prayers, there's gratitude.
I'm a huge believer in positiveself-talk and I am statement
and I just say these thingsevery day, and I have this hack.
In fact, it's going to come outsoon.
(16:30):
We're going to be.
I have a monthly well, it's abi-weekly actually newsletter
that I just started doing, andthis is actually going to be a
newsletter article that's comingout really soon.
I have this hack about that.
I use to keep my goals in frontof me all the time, and so I
read them multiple times a dayand it shows you, you know your,
(16:52):
what are your daily actions youneed to take to hit each of
your identified goals in sixareas of your life, and so
that's going to be a part of mynewsletter.
If people want to pop on mywebsite, they can sign up for it
.
It's free, and so you know Ikeep that in front of me.
I got it went on Amazon, I gotlike a $9 laminator thing and I
(17:13):
laminate it, I stick it insidemy planner and I read it two,
three, I don't know how manytimes a day, cause it's right
there, it's right there.
I'm a big believer in, you know, prayer, very intentional
reading, like you say, what youput into your head.
There's um two or three podcaststhat are very, very short.
(17:34):
They're great for the morning.
They're like two or threeminutes long and they're just,
like you know, like food foryour soul, you know, and your
mind.
So I listen to those.
I also.
I got this app a couple of yearsago.
That's really wonderful.
It's called the Heroic app andit's really really good because
(17:58):
the guy who set it up has this.
The way it works is you commitevery morning.
You log onto the app and youhave to, like, hold your finger
on it and commit to your dailyprotocols every day in three
different categories, and hiscategories are relationships,
work and health.
And then there are somepre-populated suggested things
(18:21):
that you do every day and whenyou do them, you swipe it.
You swipe left or right and youget a merit like a little thing
saying that you've done it, andthen you can add your own.
So for me, I added all kinds ofthings, like three things.
I'm grateful for my three mostimportant tasks of the day.
Three points of contact I'mgoing to make today, three
(18:42):
things I'm excited about today.
And then there's, like you know,the Bible reading.
Now I'm doing 75 hard, ofcourse.
So that's the exercise protocolfor now, and then you check in
at the end of the day and youknock it off, so you bookend it
and it's super helpful and oneof the things and I know this
(19:03):
has got to be an important issuefor your community dealing with
stress and dealing with burnoutand dealing with intense
pressure.
What I find is, the more stressyou're under, the more you have
to lean into your protocols, andthat's when people stop doing
(19:24):
it Most people stop doing it.
I'm tired, I don't feel like it.
I had a rough day.
I'm not going to go to the gym,I'm not going to do whatever.
I'll have a drink.
I'll watch 14 episodes ofsomething on Netflix.
Maybe, while I'm have a drink,I'll watch, you know, 14
episodes of something on Netflix.
You know, maybe while I'mhaving a drink.
(19:45):
You know, well, yeah, it's veryefficient, yeah.
So you know, the more you kindof keep to those your protocols
that keep you grounded, thatkeep you focused on the good,
and you know why you're doingcertain things.
You know, one of the things Ihave on my list for the
protocols is create a micromoment of awesome today, and so
(20:06):
that could be, you know, likejust a little conversation you
have with the cashier, you know,in the grocery store.
Or you know you drop a nicecomment on somebody's LinkedIn
post and they're really happyabout it.
So I think that you knowkeeping grounded in your
protocols when you're moststressed, focusing always on
(20:27):
preparation.
What I found in the law and youknow any type of lawyer really,
but certainly lawyers in thecyber space, you know,
especially if they're doing IRtype of work.
You know it's incrediblystressful.
You know keeping focused onthese protocols and your burn
(20:48):
and your why for why you'redoing what you're doing and not
getting too sucked into like avictim mentality.
You know, and a lot of thispresupposes you're not working
for.
You know sadists and horriblepeople.
You know, but I think a lot ofit is is really controllable and
having an attitude of service.
(21:10):
Have you, have you ever heardthe story about the three
bricklayers?
No, I have not.
This is, this is a great storyand I think this applies to any
profession at all.
Sure, so there's three bricklayers laying brick and somebody
walks over to the first one andsays what are you doing?
And he said I'm doing what Iwas told.
I'm laying brick.
I just put one brick on top ofthe other and this is what I do
(21:32):
all day long.
I go, okay.
Then he goes to the next guywhat are you doing?
And he said I'm building a wall.
This is how I support my family, my wife and my beautiful
children.
Okay, so a little bit of adifferent perspective there.
Then he gets to the thirdbricklayer.
What are you doing?
I'm building a magnificentcathedral where people from all
(21:54):
over the world are going to comeand marvel at how beautiful it
is, and they're going to worshipinside and give thanks to God
for their beautiful life and allthe gifts they've received.
So what keeps you going?
What keeps you going If you'rejust laying one brick on top of
another, you're responding toone incident after another, or
(22:17):
you're supporting your family,you're building a practice.
You're fulfilling a lifetimedream.
You're able to support yourselfand causes you believe in.
You know you're able to writechecks to whatever's important
to you.
You're able to take your familyon vacation.
You know you're able to sendyour kids to good schools,
whatever it may be.
If you can kind of keep thatperspective in place and never
(22:43):
lose sight of it, I think thatmakes such a difference, melissa
, in your approach to reallystressful situations.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
I agree with that and I'm so glad that you've shared
some good information and someinspiration here, and I
definitely want to ensure thatwe tell, or that I put the
website and the newsletterinformation out there, because a
lot of the people that arewriting me and talking about the
show is how the guests areimpacting them and how they're
(23:13):
thinking differently.
And I was sitting herelistening to you and when I've
come back to my spirituality andhaving that gratitude and
knowing that there's such aamazing world out there that we
can be a part of and cancontribute to, that really gets
me fired up and inspires me.
So I really appreciate youtalking about that.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
Thanks and, and you know, when I was deciding to go
into this coaching thing youknow it was it was a little
scary for me and I did.
I did, you know, some whatwould you call it?
Business intelligence research,you know, and I was looking at,
you know, what are othercoaches in this space saying and
(24:03):
what I noticed was so many, somany people and I'm sure there's
great coaches and I don't havemy finger on the pulse of every
coach out there, not at all butwhat I was seeing a lot of was I
will help you get out of yourcurrent role, I will help you
transition away and you know,open that bakery you've always
wanted to open or like, do thatkind of thing, and that's not
really always an option forpeople, you know, and it really
(24:26):
I don't believe it's oftentimeswhat they really even want, you
know.
I think what they want isrelief from the stress that
they're dealing with.
They don't know how to do it.
So they think they want toleave their job.
And so they're in this quandaryof you know, I got to get one
more kid through college.
You know I want to pay off themortgage and then I'll quit.
So they almost like sentencedthemselves to finishing their
(24:50):
career, which is really such asad way to go about it, you know
.
Or they do leave, and I have tothink many of them have regret
after they leave, you know,because it probably wasn't like
this burning hatred for whatthey were doing.
They were probably just, youknow, needed a healthier
approach and protocols andsystems for dealing with.
(25:11):
You know, the inevitable stressthat, by the way, you get in
any profession you go into, notjust tech, not just white collar
professional stuff, it'severywhere.
And so learning how to dealwith it, and especially now,
because you know, ourcompetition is it's not the kid
who sat next to you again incollege, it's some kid around
(25:33):
the world who's a lot hungrierthan you are, probably
physically and metaphorically aswell, you know.
And so everybody is under thesetypes of pressures.
But falling back on, you know,the mindset, the gratitude, the
physical health, all of thesethings, I think it just makes
such a massive difference.
(25:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
I want to ask you something before we get into the
75 hard challenge.
Let me know what you thinkabout this, because when I was
doing some research and kind ofreinventing myself, one of the
things that I found myself doingand I just thought of it when
you were talking about theperson that's hungrier, that's
around the world I think what Isee is that there's a lack
(26:15):
mindset.
I think people because I seethis on LinkedIn, that's the
only social I think I have atthis time I see that a lot.
No, there's not this, there'snot that, and if you really just
dive deep into manifestationand into creating and whatnot,
it really I don't know how we'reconditioned to believe that,
(26:36):
but I find it astonishing thatyou can change your mindset and
truly create what's meant foryou and not worry about the
outside noise.
What do you think about that?
Speaker 2 (26:45):
I agree 100%.
It's so important to knowwhat's within your control and
what's not within your control,and that also eliminates a lot
of problems.
I stopped watching the newsalmost a decade ago.
A lot of problems, you know,like I stopped watching the news
almost a decade ago, I stillknow what's going on.
You know you can't help butfind these things out, right,
(27:06):
but you know so.
I don't watch the news on TV.
I used to watch way too earlyevery morning at the gym and
then transition into Morning Joeand I was living and dying with
every tweet that anybody sentand I was like this is so stupid
, like this has got to stop.
And so I did.
And you know I'll still votethe way I think I should vote
and I'll give money where Ithink I should give money, but I
(27:28):
don't have to be, you know,immersed in it.
And that's the same thing withpolitics in your office, in your
HOA.
Everybody in my neighborhood ison, like this Facebook thing,
and they're always complainingabout something.
And they're like Judy, what doyou think about the fact that
so-and-so parked his car here?
I said I'm not on Facebook.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
I'm happy as can be.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
I'm walking my dog down the street.
I don't care who's parked where, but yeah, so I think we have
to control those externals.
Externals, and you know, therewas an article I read just this
morning that was reallyfascinating.
And um, did you read that book?
Grit by um, oh, I forget hername the um professor out in
(28:11):
California.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
And it's all about having a growth mindset.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
There's yeah, it's a really great book I'm sorry I
can't think of.
I think the name of the book isGrit and it's about how, when
you have kids, you complimentthem trying hard, and you
compliment them the process morethan the results.
Because people with a fixedmindset are like, well, I can
(28:41):
never be good at this because Idon't have that gene, you know.
And so they don't seek toimprove and they don't deal well
with any type of rejection or,you know, bad review or any type
of hardship.
You know they don't feel likethey can improve.
So I don't know if it's aninfluence from that type of
thinking, but there was anarticle posted this morning I
(29:04):
can't remember what publicationand it was saying how there's a
real disconnect betweenmanagement and companies and
young employees, because theythink that they should be
rewarded for effort even thoughthey're not getting results.
Yeah, that's not how it works,not how it works.
And so I think you know I'm notgoing to get political and I
(29:26):
don't- think it's a politicalissue really, but the way we've
kind of been lately of on bothsides of the aisle, of not
wanting to hear anybody whodisagrees with us, you know
we've gotten very polarized inour own little sectors and
attribute horrible motives topeople on the other side, and
(29:48):
all of these things, I think,weakens us as a culture.
And then you show up at workand I have some stories in my
book of you know, even when itcomes down to things like dress
code.
You know some young womanhaving an absolute meltdown at
an insurance company.
They have a dress code which,you'll be shocked to hear, does
not include sparkly sneakers,and she just was like this is
(30:11):
how I express my identity, thisis how I show the world who I am
.
They're like.
Well, you're going to have toshow it after work.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
My goodness, I want to ask you this.
Geez, I could talk to you allday, but one of the things is, I
think, iphones and iPads, Ithink that's ruined a lot, and
you're seeing things right fromall over the world and people
are coming out there.
They're like, well, I'm goingto do this, I'm going to do this
, I'm going to do that.
You know what my advice is foreverybody?
Get outside and touch somegrass, get some vitamin D, walk
it off.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
If you hear that, that's me clapping for you.
Thank you.
In the first chapter of my bookI focus on that quite a bit
because you know, and I feel badfor the younger generation,
there are a lot of latchkey kidsand they grew up texting, not
talking, and then they put onbig noise canceling headphones
(31:05):
and so they don't communicate.
And then when they show up atthe workplace they're supposed
to interview well, they'resupposed to make small talk and
if they do get the job, they'resupposed to know how to interact
that way.
And so there's.
I have a lot of tips in thefirst chapter of the book of how
you know people.
(31:26):
You know lean into, lean intoyour strengths.
You know if you're a digitalnative, lean into that.
You know you get aroundpartners like me in a law firm
and we're like you can do mytechnology, you can do my
e-discovery, me in a law firmand we're like you can do my
technology, you can do mye-discovery.
You're hired.
But you know I have like tips inthere, like put your phone in
your pocket and go to Starbucks.
You know, chat it up with somestranger on the line.
(31:51):
You know, make small talk withthe barista, learn how to
interact verbally, a little eyecontact, and not be so proud of
the fact that.
You know I don't do small talk.
You know you're going to haveto do small talk.
People won't hire you unlessthey like you.
You know, and so I agree withyou.
It's kind of sad I was.
(32:11):
I was in the city the other dayand I saw this couple walking
down the street together.
They were both on their phoneslooking down, oh my goodness,
and they both had the noisecanceling headphones on.
Speaker 1 (32:24):
What a great relationship.
That's what.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
I was thinking.
That's what I was thinking, andthey were probably texting each
other.
No, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (32:31):
I mean we text each other in the house, but you know
we live in Texas and you knowit's not like our small place in
Illinois, but we'll text eachother.
But we don't do that.
It's just crazy.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, yeah, it was like man.
And then you know what do somepeople do for fun Virtual
reality.
Then they just put a thing overtheir eyes and they're
literally someplace else.
So, yeah, I think these thingsare not conducive to you know
building and conducive to youknow building and you know the
pandemic didn't help any of thisby the way, no, no.
And I found and there's somestories in the book around this
(33:04):
too, a lot of stories actuallyhow I learned so much just from
being in the office with seniorpartners and other people who
would just I call it accidentalmentoring.
They would just see you andcomment about this or that,
sometimes good, maybe not good,you know, but you would just
learn like that.
You don't have thoseopportunities and you know you
(33:25):
can't blame it all on the, youknow, on their junior people,
because I know, trying to getyou know senior people you know
in, like in New York, forexample.
You know if you're, if you liveout on the island or you're up
in Connecticut like I'm notcoming in the office.
(33:46):
You know people got verycomfortable and we got.
We got a little soft, I hate tosay it, because these are
things we did without eventhinking about.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Yeah, I remember back in the day when I lived in
Chicago and I was taking thetrain to work and I was going in
the office and it was like abig you know my girlfriend's at
work We'd go see.
And I was going in the officeand it was like a big you know
my girlfriends at work we'd gosee.
I think it was gladiator afterwork.
I mean, it was a really greatsocial environment.
Not only were you working andlearning technology, but you
were hey, let's go.
You know, sex in the city wasbig back then.
Let's go have um, or thosethings called cosmopolitans.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
Oh, yeah, yeah, the pink drinks.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Yeah, and you don't see that anymore.
Everybody you know drives longdistances or they're remote and
it's weird like you know, youcould.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
Apparently a bunch of employees sent him a petition
about against remote work andhe's like I don't care about
your blankety blank petition,everybody gets into the office.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
Well, let's talk about this.
We're talking about theprotocol and everything that
you're doing, and I love thatand I I'm taking notes over here
.
So I've got my pink stickiesand I'm like okay, I'm writing
this down, Tell me about how.
How did you find it, why areyou doing it and what's your
overall?
I mean, are you loving it orwhat?
Speaker 2 (35:05):
You mean 75 hard.
Yes, yeah, yeah, Uh.
I you know.
I don't remember how I found it, probably because I was
listening to Ed Milet.
I don't listen to Andy Frisellathat much, although I do think
he gives great entrepreneurialadvice.
I'm not big on cursing andthere's a lot of F-bombs.
Speaker 1 (35:25):
I don't curse anymore In the Navy I did, but nah,
I've totally failed.
Maybe Dan makes as bad as itgets.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
But you know it's great business.
You know entrepreneurial advice, so maybe I heard it from him,
maybe some friends were doing it, but you know it's a.
It's a great program.
I'm really enjoying it and, um,you know it's easier now that
I'm not full-time at the lawfirm.
Um, especially because the daysare short and one of the one of
(35:51):
the workouts has to be outdoors.
And, uh, I'm doing it with acouple of friends of mine.
So we're, you know we're onWhatsApp, you know, sending
pictures of ourselves, you know,with a ruck on and the you know
like the three degrees, youknow, and I'm like why did we
start this on January 1?
We should have started this, youknow, maybe in May, but yeah,
(36:13):
so there's a lot ofaccountability and I like it.
I like it a lot.
In some ways it's not thatdifferent from my daily
lifestyle, cause I do read.
You know you have to.
You have to read 10 pagesminimum of a of a nonfiction
book, and so I would kind of dothat anyway.
The hardest part for me isdrinking a gallon of water a day
.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
That's tough.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
That's a lot of water .
So, yeah, that's my leastfavorite part of it.
There's the two 45-minuteworkouts that have to be three
hours apart.
They can both be outdoors.
I'm a little limited.
I've had, I think, 11 kneesurgeries and I had my ankle
reconstructed two years ago.
Good grief, I know so, but I'mtelling you, these knees, man, I
(36:58):
have the knees of atwo-year-old because they're
titanium.
But I don't run anymore.
So I'm kind of limited in whatI can do outside.
So I just walk as fast as I canwith my dog and we walk up and
down the same hills all the time, up and down, up and down, to
try to get the hills in, andhe's like crying and pulling me
(37:19):
the other way.
I'm like listen, man, I toldyou you didn't have to come, but
it's, it's been, it's been,it's been great.
I've noticed changes, like inmy body.
I've noticed you just, I don'tknow, it was just, it's almost
hard to describe.
You know, it's a real sense ofaccomplishment.
Now I had started it a couple ofyears ago and got up to day 37
(37:42):
and my ankle rolled and I had abig fall and yeah.
So I went to the ankle doctorand you know, I ended up having
the ankle reconstructed.
Turns out I had a torn ligamentand the tendon was behind the
ankle, not on the side, you know, which is not conducive to
standing up and walkingvertically.
(38:03):
So I got those things fixed, sothat was a blessing in disguise
.
Actually, that fall didn't doit.
That fall exposed it, so thatwas all good.
So now I think we're on day 44today.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
Oh, that's great, that's great.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
That's great.
Yeah, I have to drink some morewater and then do my indoor
workout.
I might do a second outdoor one, we'll see.
We had nine inches of snow overthe past two days and it's 60
degrees today, so it's a bit ofa swamp out there.
But I may go out and do anotherone of those while I can.
But it's great.
(38:40):
I do recommend it.
It's not a prescriptive diet,but it has to be like a healthy
diet and you decide no alcoholfor the 75 days and no cheat
meals.
He calls it.
So you know.
I had company last week and Ilive in Virginia now.
I moved down from New York andmy company was like, hey, you
(39:01):
have that great fried chickendown here.
I was like, yeah, I won't behaving that.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
But here's the thing I don't know about you, but
digestively speaking, I can'tconsume those types of things
anymore, and if I do, I'musually paying for it Like, oh,
I just shouldn't have that pizzaor that sushi.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
Yeah, it's true, it's true, and I don't eat meat.
I gave up meat decades ago.
But I do eat chicken and turkeyand fish.
But yeah, and that was it.
I was so poor in law schoolthat I couldn't even afford.
You know, I did eat meat backthen, but I couldn't really
afford it and on the rare timesI would have it, like at my
(39:41):
parents' house, it would be veryhard to digest.
And so it wasn't a massivesacrifice to kind of walk away
from it.
And then you know, then youhave to find your protein in
other places, so yeah, that's Idon't know.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
I mean this is.
I think a lot of people aregoing to really enjoy this
podcast episode because wecovered a lot and I think, from
my opinion, from what I'm seeingout there, people are looking
for guidance, they're lookingfor focus, they're looking for
inspiration, and I think we canbe part of the movement or sit
(40:16):
back and let it happen withoutyour participation.
But I think we're on a goodtrajectory, at least from what
I'm seeing.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
I think so too, and it's really amazing to me.
Sometimes I'll just get youknow random messages from people
saying people I don't knowwe're not connected online.
I've never seen them interactwith my content online and
they're like I love your content, it's so great, and I'm
actually starting to write asecond book now based on a
(40:46):
concept in the first book.
Some of the feedback I got onthe first book was this is not
just for lawyers, despite thetitle, and the last chapter of
the book is kind of like a Iguess like a personal
development-y kind of chapter,with some of my hacks that I use
for myself that work well, andone of those hacks I've gotten
(41:08):
such good feedback that that'sgoing to be the basis of my new
book that I'm going to start.
You know have a pretty robustoutline and I'll have to get
that thing in shape pretty soon,but the concept is well.
I'll tell you the story of howit happened this way before I
went to law school, I was, I hada job and this guy I was
working with used to come intowork every single day and we
(41:30):
were working in retail.
I think I was in college and sowe were working in retail and
you would do different shifts.
You would work, sometimes you'dopen, sometimes you would close
, you know.
So that's, you know, can behard physically, but every day
this guy would come in and he'dsay I'm so tired, I'm so tired.
And every day you'd be like hey, how are you?
And like, oh, I'm so tired.
(41:51):
And he used to call me.
He used to call me, he used tocall me, miss Udy, miss Udy, I'm
so tired, I'm so tired.
And then, but you know, after,like, after a few weeks, you're
like man, you know, and so, butthen, you know, before you know
it, everybody else is yawning.
(42:15):
And so one day I just said tomyself that is it.
I will never, ever, ever saythe words I'm tired again.
And that started quiteunintentionally.
My never say it list and someof the other things I might
never say, at least you know I'mtired is number one on the list
.
I don't feel like it is numbertwo on the list because you
never say I don't feel like itwhen you're like, you know, I'm
going to sit down and write thatreport, you know.
(42:36):
Or I mean, I mean when you're,when you're going to go watch
Netflix or something.
It's only when you're doingsomething you should do.
You know, like I should writethat report, I should go to the
gym, but I don't feel like it,you know.
And so I took certain certainphrases out of my vocabulary.
The other day, a couple ofweeks ago.
I was thinking you know, isthere is this just me, or is
(42:58):
there any science that actuallybacks this up?
And there, there's quite a bitof science that backs it up.
So that's going to be the themeof the new book all around.
Yeah, what you're saying, whatyou're not saying, the science
behind it, the scripture behindit and some hacks I use.
Like I have an article comingout soon on this, a little post
(43:19):
or whatever it is.
Like if you say I'm not good atyou, know whatever, like I'm
not good at Excel.
So if you want to stop sayingthese things, bad things about
yourself, there's two hacks, oneadd at the end of that sentence
yet the word, yet I'm not goodat Excel.
Yet it's a whole different vibe.
You feel a little bit moreempowered, you know, right,
(43:41):
right.
Or if you really want to shakeyourself up, you say at the end
of the sentence and that's justthe way I want it.
So you try, you try, say, say,think of something that you're,
you know you wish you were goodat, or good, but you're not, and
then put that at the end.
Speaker 1 (43:58):
Okay Now, good at, but you're not.
And then put that at the end.
Okay, now I'm trying to thinkwhat am I not good?
at.
I need to be good at.
You're nothing.
Everything, you're good ateverything.
I want to say this, though whenwe go back to talking about the
blue collar work ethic andmyself being in the military, I
really think that you get thatconditioning, because, judy, all
(44:18):
throughout this conversation,it's never, you know, there's I
have not heard you once say,well, I had difficulty doing
this, or this happened to me.
It's quite the opposite.
It's quite like hey, this ishow I endured, this is what
happened, this is how I stayempowered, and I think that's
what needs to happen right nowwith a lot of the younger folks,
is that they need to beempowered, and not, oh, it's
(44:41):
okay, well, let's you know,let's rub the dirt off and let's
keep going.
Speaker 2 (44:47):
Yeah, yeah, the, the kind of victim, the poor me,
poor us, type of thing.
Like you know, I mentioned theknees, you know, and the I've
had, like the you've had theknees, the shoulder is replaced.
All from overuse.
It's all overuse and people say,oh, judy, that's awful.
I say, what do you mean?
(45:08):
That's awful?
Lives dedicated to this so thatthey could come in and do this
for me.
There were amazing engineersthat thought how am I going to
invent a reverse shoulderimplant for someone whose
rotator cuff is gone?
(45:29):
That is, you know, that will befunctional for them.
Well, who's sitting here?
Remember I said gratitude,beneficiary of other things,
sacrifices people have made forme.
Who am I to complain?
You know, absolutely.
And so I think that thatapproach and this, this took
some work.
You know, this, this took somework because, you know, I grew
(45:50):
up in an Irish Catholic familywhere, you know, a lot of people
got a lot of, you know,attention for being the worst
off Right, like you were reallylucky if they put the word poor
before your name, like poorMelissa.
Oh my gosh, you can't believewhat she's going through.
Speaker 1 (46:09):
Goodness, I can't wait to.
I'm going to check out yourbook and then, please, I need to
know when that newsletterlaunches.
And I love that you havesomething coming out with hacks,
because I think if we haveguidance for them me, I'm doing
this podcast, you're writing,we're helping the collective
right, so I think you'recontributing to people that
(46:29):
really need this right now.
They need guidance.
Speaker 2 (46:32):
And that's the thing you know.
It doesn't have to be like this, because you only get one life.
You only get one life and whenyou focus on the things you can
control and not get distractedby everything else going on in
the world I'm not saying to bean irresponsible citizen or
(46:52):
anything like that but focus onwhat you can control and focus
on what is right and how you canbe of service to others.
You know, there's a greatsaying by a very old-fashioned
speaker named Zig Ziglar and hesaid if you don't want to be of
service just because it feelslike the right thing to do, he
always says you get what youwant in life if you just give
(47:15):
enough other people what theywant.
Yeah, and think about it.
It's true From your client toyour boss, to your parents, to
your girlfriend, to yourboyfriend, to your whatever.
You know, it's the way theworld works, and so when you
adopt that certain, that mindsetof service looking to give, not
(47:37):
get you actually do get, youactually do get.
Ooh wow.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
This was.
This was an incredible episode.
Like I've got to go edit ittonight.
So I go, let's do it, cause youreally threw out a ton of great
information and hacks.
I'm so privileged that you cameto the show.
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (47:56):
I am so happy and I love the fact that you're taking
this on as like a like a socialresponsibility to you know, to
uplift your listeners, and itreally makes their lives better.
So I'm thrilled to you.
Know, you and I I think wefound ourselves on LinkedIn
because we're kind of aligned inthat way and I'm very grateful
(48:17):
for the opportunity to you knowto share these things that you
know, have worked for me, youknow, have worked and worked for
my clients.
I know they work and I've seenwhat happens when people act
differently.
And I see like I've seen thelawyers in the fetal position on
the floor in their offices.
(48:37):
You know, I've seen the lawyerseither blowing up and screaming
, rages.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
Yeah, there's got to be more to life than that, right
.
Speaker 2 (48:45):
Yeah, and so a lot of it is just like learning.
You know these tactics, hacksand mindset approaches to deal
better with the inevitablestresses, and you know
difficulties we all have.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
Judy, thank you so much.
I mean, I think we're going tohave to have a part two.
There's so many of our guestswhere people are like are they
going to come back on anytimesoon?
So yeah, I definitely have toput you on that list.
But thank you so much forcoming.
Please remember to subscribe toour podcast on various
platforms, including Apple,spotify, iheartradio and many
more.
Thank you for tuning in andtake care.
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