Reclaiming Power in the Birthing Room - Ainslee Winter's birth story. - Tend and Befriend

Episode Transcript
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Deborah (00:06):
Hey Mamas, you're listening to Tend and Befriend,
a podcast about women's mentaland physical health.
This is Debra.
I'm a mom of two, a labor andbirth coach and birth advocate,
a health professional, and todayI'm your host.
Let's dive into today's episode.
Am your host.

(00:28):
Let's dive into today's episode.
Any information you hear orthat is suggested or recommended
on these episodes is notmedical advice.
Good morning mamas.
Welcome back to Tend and BeFriend.
I'm Debra, doula Debra, yourhost, and today I have something
really special for you.
We're welcoming Ainsley Winter,a beautiful new mama who's here
to share the story of herlittle one's arrival.

(00:49):
Every birth journey holds itsown magic and Ainsley's story is
filled with love, strength andthose unforgettable first
moments.
I'm so honored to have her herewith us and I'm really excited
to talk about the communityconnection that came together
for Ainsley's birth.
Hi, ainsley, thank you forbeing with me today, hi.

Ainslee Winter (01:09):
Debra, thanks for having me.
I'm super excited to be hereand so glad that we've been able
to connect.
Motherhood is something thatI've always had in one side of
my body as, yes, want to go thatway.
And then I had a whole anotherdirection as well where I would
have been okay not being amother, and I actually think

(01:30):
that we first met at a mama'scircle at your place at pelvic
love.
Yes, I remember, yeah, and Iremember sharing that within the
group, and I think it takessome people by surprise, but
it's been such an incredible,just like an awakening journey
on so many levels.
So I'm really excited that I'mhere to share my birth story and

(01:54):
just grounding in my intentionthat if my story can help one
person, that that's good enoughfor me.

Deborah (02:01):
That's your purpose for being here.
I actually remember that mama'scircle and I remember hearing
you say that and I have nevermet you at that time and you
were already pregnant.
Yes, you were already pregnantand I remember you saying I'm
not really sure if I want to bea mother yet or not, because
I've sat on the fence about thatfor years and here you were,

(02:23):
pregnant and getting ready forbirth.
So I'm really excited.
I want to know all of thedetails, but I want to start
with.
I want to start with how youprepared.
Yeah, because I think that aswomen, we were talking about
that, talk a lot like we'retalking about how to get ready
for birth and there's a lot ofcontroversy on what we do and

(02:45):
what should be done.
And some women are on this sideof the fence you don't need to
do anything, just show up andbirth happens.
And then we're on the otherside where we do all the things
and we get all the overwhelmabout getting ready, and there
has to be a happy medium.
But I think when we tell ourbirth stories, we need to talk
about it in a way that says thisis what I did to prepare.

(03:05):
Yeah, this is how my birth went.
So tell me about your pregnancy.
Obviously you went to a mama'scircle, and then tell me about
other things that you did.

I felt like I spent a lot of time preparing,
mostly mentally and emotionallyand spiritually, less physically
.
I did a variety of differentthings.
I went to a mama's circle.
I went to you for massage aswell, and, as all your clientele
can attest, you are just such awealth of information, so that

(03:36):
was very helpful.
And then I did a consciouschildbirth education course with
Rochelle, so just learning alittle bit more about what me
and my partner were embarking on.
We did hire a doula.
Yes, what we found to be reallyhelpful and useful for us was
having the doula was like a wayfor us to make decisions, and

(04:01):
not once did we feel that therewas a sense of judgment.
Actually, I had no idea how,because Rochelle is a mother of
three.
I had no idea how her birthswent.
I didn't even ask because Ididn't want it to influence my
decisions, and not once could Iever even tell what she did,
which I really appreciated.
We had the doula and that wasreally really, really helpful in

(04:25):
making empowered decisions andjust learning about some of the
different steps along the way.
Hashem and I we also that's mypartner, I'll reference him as
Hashem he and I did abreastfeeding course.
Yes as well, and we were toldto have the partners, the

(04:45):
husbands, come as well, and I'mso happy that we did, because
after you give birth your brainis a little bit foggy and you
want to just feel well supported.
We both went to a breastfeedingcourse together and that was
eye-opening and we both leftthere saying we would never look
at boobs the same I love that,yes, but it was so informative.

(05:06):
It was so informative and itjust it's a nice anchor into
preparing yourself for what's tocome and, yeah, being able to
hand express, like all those,certain things I was preparing
for prior to the baby evencoming, which is grounding and
helpful, especially as you'reabout to give birth.

(05:28):
But yeah, I also read Birthingfrom Within, which is a book I'd
love to chat further about it.
Really, I can't get over howprofound that book was for me.

Deborah (05:44):
Yeah.

It utilizes a lot of the art making process
and, with my background in arttherapy, that's very helpful for
me.
I'm a very visual learner, andnot only is it about the art
making pieces, but every chapter.
I think the chapters were maybeone or two pages, so every
night I would just read onechapter and I was surprised.

(06:08):
Every single chapter surprisedme.
I would see the title and I'dbe like, oh, I know what they're
gonna say.
And then they didn't and I wasjust like, wow, wow, I am being
mind blown right now.
So it was a very eye openingbook to read.
I read it from front to backand it has so much goodness in

(06:31):
there.

Deborah (06:31):
Yes, I think that book is one of the books that I read
myself on a regular basis, butI have had a lot of women who
I've lent it to and they broughtit back and said this is not
for me.
It does really take anindividual who really
understands that aspect ofbirthing and not just birth life

(06:53):
really to really understand andget the message in that book.
And it's not for everyone,which is fine too, but I really
love that you've read that book.
I didn't know that and thathelps me understand a little bit
more about what.
Where you were going for yourbirth.
Yeah, I love that you said thatabout the breastfeeding, because
here in Windsor and EssexCounty our breastfeeding rate is

(07:16):
only 12%.
What I'm seeing in the clinicand out in the doula community,
I'm pretty sure it's because oflack of support, which is really
interesting because right now Isee the most content in and
around my area and when I go outto expos and events in the
community I see a lot oflactation consultants and

(07:40):
international board certifiedlactation consultants and
lactation counselors.
But why isn't that showing upin our percentage?
So where is that disconnectthat is happening?
And I think that the classesthat you're talking about and
bringing your partner so thatyou're setting yourself up for
success is the first step, yeah.
So I love that you did that andyou brought Hesham.

(08:03):
I love that Hesham was involvedin every single step and that is
typical for birth partners now,but I love that he did that.
Yeah, the fact that you'llnever look at breasts the same
way again I totally hear himsaying that.
I think that is the first step.
I love that you did thosethings and you did a prenatal
class.
Even though you're veryintuitive and very spiritual and

(08:25):
very emotionally evolved, youstill did the classes, knowing
that.
Okay, I trust my body and Itrust my instinct and I trust my
guides.
I'm not going to go into thisexperience with just that.
I also need a little bit more.

Yeah, and especially for me.
This is my first time beingpregnant, so I honestly didn't
know what to expect, and evenall the stories that you hear
growing up, typically they'rescary or you just it's dramatic.
Everyone has such an intenseexperience.
I would say it's something thatpeople want to talk about and

(09:02):
share about.
Having never experienced it, Ihad no idea what to expect.
So something that was reallyhelpful for me was reminding
myself that our bodies werebuilt for this.
This is a natural thing.
So often we just hear all ofthe stories about this happened
and it totally takes you out ofyour body and so just having

(09:22):
that reminder to come back intothe body, my body would know
what to do, starting to cycleinto those thoughts of fear or
what if this happens?
What if that happens?
That the anxiousness or theworry I would just come back to.
That grounded thought andanchor of my body knows what to
do.

(09:42):
It will do what it needs to do.
So I have really helpful andthen some other helpful analogy
Also in that in that course wewatched birth like in a variety
of different ways, whether itwas natural, at the hospital,
all those sorts of things thatwas hard for Hesham to watch.
It was hard for me to watch too.
I had never seen prior to thatbut, obviously I had to, cause I

(10:04):
was about to do that.
So, looking away for me towatch too, I had never seen
prior to that, but obviously Ihad to because I was about to do
that.
So looking away for me, for him, he did want to look away, but
yeah, it was.
That was really helpful.
And then also the analogy.
I don't know if you've heard ofthis, but Rochelle spoke about
the mountain analogy.
Yeah, well, we have, we're allgoing to the other side of the

(10:26):
mountain.
How we get there is our choice.
So we choose to climb themountain and really strenuous
process.
Or you can choose to have acompletely different experience
and ride the gondola above andlook down, and your experience
will be a little bit different.
You're going to be up and lookdown and your experience will be
a little bit different.
You're going to be up andlooking down, like dipping your

(10:46):
toes into the experience a bit.
And that was really helpful forme as well, and I definitely we
chose the gondola.

Deborah (10:57):
Always choose the gondola, if you can.

Yeah, for my first one, we're going to do the
gondola.
I like to dip my toes.
I'm not someone who just jumpsin.
I really like to feel thingsout, what's gonna happen.
Yeah, basically, the gondolawas more like we decided to have
our birth in a hospital with anepidural Because my I have very
bad pain management.

Deborah (11:21):
Okay.

Just my like.
When I get my eyebrows threaded, I feel like I could vomit.
I don't know how that will workwhen I'm giving birth.
I know I can, I know I can doit and then but at that point
and still I have no regrets Iwas just like this is what I
want for my first experience.
I'm going to take the gondola,I'd like an epidural and it will

(11:43):
be in the hospital, but I wantto be surrounded by support.
So we really made sure that wewere supported by, with our
doula, having my partnerinvolved in as much as possible.
My mom came to the hospital aswell and then you have been
really helpful as well, as youwere really good friends with my
sister-in-law and friend, andso we were able to connect as

(12:06):
well prior to the birth, andconnecting with you and your
expertise was very helpful forboth myself and Haysham in
regards to advocacy andconnecting with our own sense of
power, because oftentimes whenyou're going into the hospital,
you are told what to do.
Opposed to that, we can askquestions and ask about the

(12:29):
risks and ask how we can bestsupport ourselves on this
journey, and it made for a moreempowering experience where we
all felt more safe andcomfortable going into it, just
knowing that information, goinginto it, just knowing that
information.
So there were a few times in myduring my birth process where
we've we utilized, just likeadvocating for ourselves and

(12:51):
just knowing some of thisinformation ahead of time.
I think it did reallypositively impact our birth.

Deborah (12:59):
We had yeah, I want to go back on a couple of things
that you brought up.
First of all, talking aboutyour pain tolerance, and I think
it's really important that,first of all, women understand
that it's not just physical.
Birth is not just physical.
It takes a lot of mental andstamina and strength to really

(13:21):
give birth in any way.
Whatever way that is that youchoose, you want to feel
supported and choose a birthteam that actually supports that
, not someone who's youshouldn't be getting the
epidural.
That's not kind to women.
And I think understanding inthe beginning, like I'm not the
type to do birth naturally in abirth tub in the middle of my
living room, I want all thebells and whistles and the

(13:44):
hospitals right, like I want togo in that is going to help me
with the flow of my oxytocin sothat my body can do what it
needs to do.
And I think that's where a lotof the information that's being
told to women or taught to womenis that this is your only
choice or this is your onlychoice and if you don't choose

(14:06):
this, then I'm not the supporterfor you, or don't give birth
here.
I have seen incredible andamazingly profound births in the
hospital with an epidural andI've supported that.
It's whatever you want.
I already had my births and mychoices and my experiences and I
think that the fact that youunderstood your pain tolerance,

(14:27):
knowing that you have difficultywith eyebrow threading, puts
you in a place to say this is myplan.
I know myself, I know my body,I know my own strength.
I don't know birth because I'venever done it before, but I
know that I'm going to make apain management plan that fits
with what I know about myself.

(14:47):
Yeah, so profound that you didthat.
I think that women, if theycould take that first step in
not necessarily planning forbirth, because, as you can make
a plan till the cows come homeon that day, anything can change
that plan.
But talking about how you'regoing to manage certain
situations, because you chose togive birth in a hospital,

(15:08):
there's lots of policies.
The nurses have a job, thedoctors have a job and their
primary position is to protectthe policies and procedures of
the birthing center that you'vechosen.
That means that they have a wayof doing things and if you go
in not knowing how to advocatefor yourself and how to maintain
autonomy, then you're going tofollow a birth that is right for

(15:32):
them, and you talked about that, advocating asking questions
instead of just following theirprotocol, and there's nothing
wrong with asking questions inthat moment.
If you feel that you can't aska question, then that's a big
red flag and if you're okay withit, great, go for it.
And if there's anything wrongwith your baby or yourself, go

(15:52):
with what they're saying,because that's what they're
trained to do.
But going in not knowing how toadvocate for yourself typically
leads to coming home and feelinglike what just happened?
What just happened.
I love that.
You took a childbirth class, aprenatal class.
You worked with two doulas,with two different aspects of

(16:14):
how to approach doula care, andyou went in, you and your birth
partner, knowing that you hadall the tools and that showed up
for you.
Yeah, so did you labor at home?

Okay, good question.
So I had a feeling that ourbaby would be born on the
harvest moon and the eclipse wasat the same time, so we went
for a nice walk and that night Igot some cramping and noticed
that there was some blood and Idecided that it might be best

(16:49):
just to go in to make sure thateverything was okay.
And so we went to triage andthe nurse couldn't really tell
if my water had broke or if mymembrane had been ruptured, and
so I had even taken a picture Ishowed wasn't sure.
And then, after waiting therefor probably three hours, I saw

(17:10):
the OB, because September is avery busy time.
Basically.
He said he didn't really knowwhat to do with me Because he
wasn't sure if my membrane wasruptured and I think,
technically, if it had been,they're not supposed to
discharge me.
However, I was advocating formyself to go home because I did
not want to start laboring there.

(17:32):
I was, I didn't know what toexpect, but I definitely wasn't
having contractions like soon tocome, so I was like we're not
going to do this, so I advocatedto go home, and then we made a
safety plan, myself and the OBand he let me go home,
thankfully, so I could go homeand take a bath and you said

(17:54):
make sure you sleep and rest asmuch as you can.
So I went home, I slept a lotof the day and then did a few
walks here and there and then mycontractions started that
evening.
So maybe like less than 24hours later they were getting
more intense.
So I started tracking thosecontractions and became more

(18:16):
intense.
I was getting the backcontractions that were going
down my legs and my sisters hadcome over to help support me
because Haysham was with me atthe hospital all night prior and
we were just all trying to likerest as much as we could and
take turns supporting oneanother.

Deborah (18:36):
I love that so much.
That gives me such communityvibes Let the husband rest while
mom does a few things with hercommunity.
I just love that.
And it was still a hospitalbirth.
People don't understand that.
That is incredibly profoundjust supporting the mom in

(18:56):
whatever way that she needsduring labor and birth.

Yeah, and then utilizing some of those tools
that I learned with my doula,because I had planned that my
doula would come during activelabor.
So this was more of what is itcalled early labor.
Is that what it?

Deborah (19:13):
is yes.

Yeah, so the early labor, just doing some of
the massage, things, like havingall these different things
ready to go and then educatingmy sister in between
contractions.
Yes, like this, no, like this Idid and like I told you, my
pain management is not great andmental, like you said, mental
as well.
I was very squirmy, like Ilooked like, yeah, like my

(19:37):
chicken, like a chicken withtheir head cut off a little bit.
Every time a contraction wouldcome, I'd start running around
the house and she'd have to runafter me and start doing the
massaging.

Deborah (19:49):
Oh God, that's funny.
I don't know what it felt like,so anyway, that wasn't exactly
how, but I understand whatyou're saying and that's how you
felt in that moment.
I'm sure your sisters were likeblown away, yeah.

Yeah, my sister who was giving me massages in
that moment.
She's now pregnant, so I can'twait to offer her the same
support, and that's howcommunity works.
Yeah, it is so yeah.
So then I ended up going backto the hospital around 1am the
next day and that was the samenurse and I love the nurse.
Oh my gosh, she was amazingshe's.

(20:22):
Does it feel a little differentthis time?
I'm like, yes, get me theepidural now.
I love that.
It was like night and day, itwas so funny.
So then she checked me and Iwas still only like literally
two centimeters, two to threecentimeters, and so she said I,
if I can, because I was clearlyin a lot of pain uh walk, yeah,

(20:46):
the hospital halls, um, andwhich I did walk, but then she
noticed I was having the backcontractions and the lower pain
in the back.
She suggested I do thesespecific.
There was like three exercisesI forget what it's called, but
there was a name for it but oneof them was like you're walking

(21:09):
sideways up the stairs yeah andthen the other one is like
downward dog, but you had to dothese things for 20 minutes,
each 20 minutes and then 20minutes, I think, walking I
forget what the third one was Idon't know what the three of
them are called together, butcurb walking is what you're
doing on the stairs.

Deborah (21:26):
Yeah, yeah, curb walking you were doing.
I look sounds like you weredoing a crawl of some sort it
was, I would just get in the bed.

I was in like a downward dog position and then.
But every time I contracted Ihad to be standing, like I could
.

Deborah (21:42):
It was like really yeah, oh, she was doing probably
some of the spinning babies.
It sounds like babies, okay,yeah, so that's forward leaning
inversion.
Yes, okay, yeah, okay.
So she was doing that to getthe baby rocking down and then
an hour later I felt it boom,like fall.

I could feel it and I was like, wow, thank you
for those suggestions.
That was really helpful.
Yeah, and then she checked meand I was finally four
centimeters.
So this is finally go and getthe epidural that I've been
planning for that.
I really felt like I neededyeah, because I was spiraling a
little bit like time of thecontractions and the pain and

(22:23):
just trying to manage andespecially if I were to go back
now, I would want a doula duringthe early labor because
mentally I think I needed somesupport yeah, I think that is a
lot of times we don't understandthe difference.

Deborah (22:39):
We, yeah, getting to active labor is one of the
hardest things.
Yeah, they're being told aboutpositionings to ease that, being
told like I can see that you'restruggling, it's time to rest,
let's use the water, let's dothis, let's do that, and I think
that a lot of the doulas allover the world they offer just

(23:01):
active labor because it's ashorter time that they have to
be with you.
Yeah, and that just means thatdoulas need to raise their
prices so that they give you theoptions.
This is what it would be if Iam coming early in labor.
This would what is for foractive labor and also working
with other doulas.
This is something that we'rereally working on right now.
Is there can be a new doulawho's experienced with early

(23:24):
labor?
Right, that that can come for adiscounted price or do one on
one work with you and yoursisters?
I do a lot of this work where Iwork with the birth team.
If you don't want me to show upto active labor, then I need a
one on one with your partner.
Yeah, yeah, we can, and thatwe're just doing texting or
something like that.

(23:45):
So I love that.
So after you got the epidural,we're resting easy.
I remember that text message.

Yeah, so once I look okay.
So before I got the epidural Igot to four centimeters, but
then the rooms were full and Iwasn able to transition over.
So I had to wait and she feltthe nurse felt so bad because of
how much pain I was in and shethat's one of the things that I
utilized, like some of theeducational work prior was she's

(24:13):
like all I can do on this sideis offer you a shot of morphine.
Yes, and I just knew for myselfI did not want that.
So it was just like already,just no, I'm gonna deal with the
pain.
I didn't want it affecting mybaby's heart rate and things
like that.
I just held in there and then,luckily, 20 minutes later, a
room opened up and we had to run.

(24:33):
So I'm running.
It was great.
As soon as I got into the roomI sat on the bed and the
anesthesiologist was therewaiting for me and it was just
like immediate epidural.
Yeah, I was.
It was like night and dayexperience, um, but I know
there's a lot of fear around theepidural as well and from my

(24:56):
experience, it did not hurt atall, like zero, and especially
in comparison to thecontractions, I was feeling like
I literally didn't feelanything and then, yeah, it just
it wasn't this scary, fearfulthing that that I think
sometimes it can be portrayed asyeah knowing that there are

(25:19):
risks as well.
But and not everyone'sexperience is the same, but for
me it was just very quick.
And then, and you werepain-free?

Deborah (25:28):
yeah, was it.
Were you fully pain-free?

like it worked really well for you it worked
exactly how I wanted it to stillfeel my legs, yeah, so move my
legs I could.
I felt like still like I had asense of control I could.
I felt like still like I had asense of control, like I could
still feel I wasn't completelynumbed out, but I was able to
now relax a little bit and justallow the process to unfold

(25:50):
without me resisting as much.
I rest literally before havingto, whether it's push or towards
the end, the final violationyeah, I was really feeling it.
Then the epidural was notworking the same anymore, or
obviously, and that's when Istarted to again utilize some of
the tools that I had beenpreparing with.

(26:12):
There was like a spiral breathwork in birthing from within
that I kept coming back to, andthen I would start to squirm and
immediately my doula and thenurse in the room, they grounded
me and reminded me againmentally right, you do your
breath work, do your breathing.
And I had to.
I used my hand.
So with every inhale I wouldlike move my hand up and with

(26:36):
every exhale I would move myhand down.
So it was a way for me to comeback to my body, because
breathing in itself I felt likeI could have got lost in my
thoughts, and so, by matching mybreath with my hand movements,
I was able to focus, I was ableto ground and just get through
those really challengingcontractions.

Deborah (26:57):
That's actually a technique called rhythmic
breathing, designed by PennySimkin.

It really helped me.
There's videos of me doing it,I and then, all prior, I had my
music, I had playlists ready togo, but as soon as I was getting
to these final moments, themusic was off.
I was overstimulated the wholetime and then I was just, yeah,
stimulated my clothes the wholetime and then I was just, yeah,

(27:24):
moving my hand and breathing and, yeah, having my support team.

Deborah (27:26):
I love that.
So I think what you're talkingabout there having the music off
, like that's called being inyour primal brain.
There's sinking brain andprimal brain and we call it
labor land or labor brain,whatever.
There's lots of language aroundthat.
But in order for you to stay inyour primal brain, you need to
either connect to your body orhave something that grounds you

(27:49):
and because the thinking brainjust puts you into like tensing
up around your body.
And I think that you made a veryvalid point about the epidural
being portrayed in a way that'snot kind and also very
unforgiving to women who'vechosen that path, and I think
that is so wrong in so many ways, because the epidural is a

(28:12):
great tool for labor and birth.
If that is your choice andunderstanding that, the birth
team that you have.
Sometimes, even though youdon't want the epidural,
sometimes it's a necessity andyour birth team can usually tell
when you're not coping thatsquirming and running around
like a chicken, like that, isnot well coping.

(28:34):
And if you're doing that,chances are your body is not
just welcoming the wave of thecontraction.
Now, early labor, you can dowhatever you want Some people
run, some people walk, somewhatever, and so maybe in that
moment it wasn't as imperativethat you get into your primal
brain.
But in active labor it is soimportant that you get there,

(28:54):
and if you can't, the epiduralis almost always the answer.
It takes away the pain enoughfor you to regroup, decide on
how you're going to manage whentransition hits or pushing hits,
and to give you that rest andto slow your body down.
I love that you did that.
I love the breath work that youuse and I love that you picked

(29:15):
little pieces from basically allover the world birthing, birth
work all over the world.
It sounds like, even though youmight not have known what you
were doing in that moment, likeit's been taught for 25 years.
It's cool.

It was and it felt really good.
I, I, after coming out of thisexperience, I am like elated to
share my birth story and to talkabout it, because I had such a
great experience.
It was like an experience thatfelt so profound in so many ways

(29:48):
, more than just the physical.
It was just a very empoweringexperience and that's why I hope
to share and like I just don'twant people to be fearful,
scared, going into birth andjust also prepare as best as
possible.
Or, yeah, just have some ofthese conversations around

(30:08):
preparing in different ways.

Deborah (30:09):
Yeah, Knowing that not every birth looks the same way
and the way that you prepare canbe right for you, and the more
stories that you hear that arepositive, you're like, ok, I
wouldn't mind doing that, Idon't want this, but I wouldn't
mind doing that, yeah, yeah.
So obviously the epidural was abeautiful epidural that you
were got to rest and then, astransition hit, you started to

(30:32):
feel, because epidurals, nomatter how wonderful and great
they are, they don't always takeaway the pressure part and
sometimes that can be confusedin labor as pain, but it's
pressure your baby's got to movedown through your body yeah and
sounds like during transitionyou were feeling some of those
things.

So yeah, yeah, oh yes, it was like but even
that it was still great, like Iwas happy to feel it in
communication with the nurse.
Because now the nurse isstarting to feel and notice,
like telling me when I need tostart pushing and all those
sorts of things, and I'd be like, okay, the contract, it's
happening, it's happening.
She's like wait, just wait onesecond, wait a little bit longer

(31:10):
, and then once it was likereally like contracting, then I
would push.
My nurse was so great at makingsure that I wasn't wasting the
energy, which was helpful.
We did wait once I was fullydilated.

Deborah (31:21):
We waited some time for the baby to drop a bit and
yeah, thing you had told meabout as well, when you have the
epidural and you don't havethis overwhelming urge to push,
just hold that back just alittle bit so that you're not
pushing for two or three hours.
Sounds like your nurse wasincredible.
Helped you do that likemindfully, let the baby do the

(31:43):
big work and come down, yeah, sothat you're pushing was in less
time than had you startedpushing right as soon as you
felt the urge and I'm not sayingpeople who feel the urge
shouldn't push.
That's up to them, that's yourchoice, but in that moment
that's what was right for you,and also how what your labor
looks like.
Laboring through the night isvery different than laboring

(32:04):
through the day.
If you're not rested, so tellme about your pushing.
Okay, so my pushing.

Oh my gosh, it was so funny.
So my pushing I just know thatmy doula, Rochelle, she was on
one side of me holding my legand my hand, and then Hesham was
on the other side of me holdingmy leg and my hand.
Hesham, oh man, he needed somehelp and guidance with how to do
it.
He's like I was not preparedfor this and I was just like
Hesham, just hold my leg and myhand, that's all you have to do.

(32:33):
I'm the one.
So, yeah, it was 40 minutes ofpushing, which was, yeah,
Incredible.
So yeah, it was 40 minutes ofpushing, which was yeah,
incredible.
It was great.
So 40 minutes of pushing.
She did give me a bit of whatis it, pitocin?
Yeah, she had the very end,just because she said that my
window is really long in betweenthe contractions, or a bit

(32:56):
longer than she would ideallywant.
So it was just a bend just toget the baby going than she
would ideally want.
So it's just an end just to getthe baby going.
But yeah, I just pushed for 40minutes and it was easier.
The pushing was easier than theend of the opening.

Deborah (33:12):
Yeah, the transition.
I talk about this a lot, Ithink, in our minds, because
we're doing something againstthe pain and the pressure.
Yes, like the pushing feelslike.
Yes, I finally get to dosomething, like it's an action
that we take against the painhow I like to describe it, yeah,
and then my mind is focused onsomething like that.

It's not just more passively, like letting
things ride where, yeah, theaction is really helpful.

Deborah (33:42):
Was your mom with you at the same time Was your mom
there.

Yeah, my mom was there holding space.
So she was present because Ifind that if I'm distressed or
when things go not great likeshe would be the person that I
would really like feel safe with.
She was also there to supportHesham if he needed any
additional support.
But it was honestly great.
One of my final pushes had themade the mistake of answering a

(34:07):
phone call.
During pushing process I yelledat Hesham like get over here.
And then that's when I just didmy like monster roar push and
the nurse was like whoa, thatreally helped.
That really worked.
And then all of a sudden we'regetting the doctors over because

(34:28):
baby's about to like fly rightout of me.

Deborah (34:32):
Oh, I love that Not balancing in the moment right.
Like you have a strongcommunity, you have a strong
support system.
People know you're in labor.
Strong community, you have astrong support system.
People know you're in labor andthe partner is usually the
person that's in charge ofcommunicating with, like people
outside.

And it's really hard to navigate that because
there are people that you dowant to be involved in knowing
everything and I know yoursister-in-law, so I know she was
one of those oh yeah,absolutely, and, to be honest,
like I had been off my phone forprobably two days, like I could
not even think about holding it, messaging like I just wasn't

(35:09):
all there, like in it, as in myprocess yeah, protecting your
space, protecting your mindset,yeah, yeah, exactly him
answering the phone gave you alittle bit of yeah, I got that
in me?
I definitely have that in me.
So, yeah, the baby came withthat nice big push and then we
called the doctors and then Ihad shared with you before

(35:32):
already.
They said okay, we're going toget the doctor now.
So just hold it here and I'mlike, okay, the doctor's coming.
And then the nurse is okay, nowyou're going to show the doctor
your big push, just how we justhave been practicing.
I was like, okay, here we go,I'm expecting another like 30 to
40 minutes of pushing with thedoctor, and then I do my push
and there he is.

(35:53):
I'm just like what?
Like just one push and then thebaby comes out.
I could not believe it.
I was in such shock which, liketo me like that would be
something I would want to knowgoing into it again, or for
somebody who's never done itbefore, because I was not ready
for the baby, like mentally, Ithought I was still gonna be

(36:14):
pushing for a while.
I didn't, and I didn't know howmy pushing was going.
I know you can bring a mirrorin sometimes and look, would do
that maybe next time.
Yeah, I had no idea how faralong and part of me didn't even
want to ask because I didn'twant to be disappointed if it
wasn't far enough, like thingslike that.
But yeah, so when the doctorcame and all of a sudden the
baby is out, I just rememberseeing limbs all over the place

(36:40):
and it being like plopped on mybelly and I'm like, oh my gosh.
I was so shocked and in my headI had this moment of because we
had a few different names thatwe were considering.
It's like oh, when the baby'sborn, I'll know, I'll look into
his eyes and I'll just know.
It was not like that at all.
It was very like wow's limbs,now it's on my belly Now.

(37:01):
Now I can't actually see thebaby actually either, because my
, my chin doesn't move that fardown, so I couldn't really long,
and typically the first timemom can push for hours sometimes

(37:24):
, but that laboring down partwas really beneficial for you.

Deborah (37:28):
That's what helps that .
First of all, it sounds like Iwasn't there, but sounds like
that birthing down really helpedyou.
And also, when you're pushingeffectively and you can feel it,
sometimes that happens, that'swhat happened.
But you're right In a lot ofways, not knowing is beneficial
for your mindset.
So if the nurse said to youhold back on your pushing for a

(37:49):
little bit, right, that meansthat they didn't want you to
push until the OB had showed up,which is really hard to do, by
the way, because you have thatoverwhelming urge to push and
there's a lot about that.
I don't necessarily I'm likeurge to push, yeah, and there's
a lot about that.
I don't necessarily I'm like,oh, don't tell mom not to push.
She wants to push.
But also in that moment, ifit's right for you, it's right
for you and everybody was safe.
You were safe, your baby wassafe.

(38:11):
So it sounds like you weresurprised that the baby was here
, which happens quite often.
Actually, when the baby's onyou, it's wait a second.
Did that just happen?
And in one perfect push, right,yeah, right.
You're also so tired in thatmoment, like it is like an
overwhelming emotional sensation, like baby's here and it's put
on you and you're like I did it,and it's really hard to look at

(38:33):
the whole picture.
I remember that and I see thatin mama's eyes.
It's like they're just notmissing it, obviously, but like
just taking a moment.
Yeah, I was in shock.
I was in shock, yeah, taking amoment like holy macaroni yes,
yes, how much did he weigh.

He was seven pounds, seven ounces.
Oh gosh yeah my little nuggetso cute.
And then one of the things thatI would probably do differently
next time is I was so excited toshare the baby with our close
family members.
However, just how quickly itwent from being on my belly to

(39:16):
me being in a wheelchair, goingto the recovery room with baby,
and suddenly there's peoplethere waiting for me.
It's a hard transition whenyou've just gone through
something like that.
It was my decision, though,Like it wasn't forced upon us.
You know we wanted people thereand we were so excited, but
even in our birth orbreastfeeding classes, they were

(39:39):
really encouraging you to makesure you rest a lot in the first
24 hours, because it's normallyafter that where the baby will
be meeting you, and even thoughyou have all this adrenaline
still from the birth, try torest all those things that I
didn't listen to.
More space for just myself,partner and baby in the future

(40:01):
for just myself partner and babyin the future.

Deborah (40:04):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think that's a part of in that
moment you're excited to sharethis beautiful gift that you've
just created in birth, right,yeah, and that was right for
your family at this time andthat first 24 hours.
There's so much that happens,but you're right, you're on a
high.
You're on such a high I know100% that women could probably
lift cars in those 24 hours andthere is that sense of pride

(40:26):
that you want to share.
Also, this is anothergeneration that you're sharing
with your community and yourfamily.
I think that's also reallyimportant.
But the next day is usually thehardest day, the 24 hours old to
48 hours.
And I really am a strongadvocate for the five, five,
five days, five days in bed,five days on bed, five days

(40:48):
around the bed.
And if you just took those twoweeks really to just get a
pattern going at home and I'mnot talking about a
breastfeeding, sleeping pattern,I'm talking about just a
pattern for you and your partnerand your baby I find that it
sets you up for success a littlebit better.
And also like days five, sixand seven is when the strongest

(41:11):
hormone drop happens and that iswhen you're at the highest risk
, right For all those pre andperinatal mood disorders.
So yeah, like I love that, youdon't regret that, but you know
that you don't want that foryour next child and your next
birth.

Yeah, yeah, we were so excited to share in the
excitement and like with ourfamily.
It's a connecting experienceand that, to me, is so
nourishing and also making surethat I have the appropriate
space and I was saying thisduring my pregnancy was that it

(41:47):
feels like I'm training for amarathon, which is the first,
but then this is so bad to saybut then I'm going to complete
the marathon and then I'm goingto get hit by a bus is what it
was going to happen, because nowI have a baby, and then what do
I do?
Hit by a bus is what it wasgoing to happen, cause now I
have a baby, and then what do Ido?
I spent nine months or howeverlong, preparing for this birth,

(42:08):
but then you have a baby and Ihad a baby before, and it's not
like I can prepare foreverything and all of that.
But I think that an area that Iwould get into more is the
postpartum as well, especiallyeven with my body, I was able to
, thankfully, work out the wholetime I was pregnant and it was

(42:29):
an important part for myphysical, mental, especially
health.
But then, postpartum, obviouslyyou're resting for a good chunk
of time, but I just wasn't.
I also wasn't prepared for justthe changes in body when you're
breastfeeding, the changes likemy appetite was wild.
I wasn't prepared for that, Ihad no idea.

(42:52):
So next time I would want tohave like good, nourishing
postpartum snacks ready to go,because I would make a tray of
brownies every other day.
Brownie like nonstop, yeah.

Deborah (43:08):
Easy and simple.
I love, I love, actually, and Iknow you think I heard you say
that this is bad to say, but Ithink that is a perfect way to
describe it.
You're training for themarathon.
You've probably seen some of mycontent on Instagram.
You should put as much workinto your postpartum journey as
you do for your baby shower yeah, same amount of work and for

(43:30):
your nursery, because you knowhow many hours people put into
that.
You should put into yourpostpartum journey the first.
I say 20 days.
20 days but it is true, right,like you train and you train for
the marathon, you go throughthe marathon.
But recovery from a marathon foranybody who runs, it's very
specific.
We don't come home and just goback to running the next day.

(43:53):
We take days off and refuelproperly, we rerate properly, we
recover properly yeah, but wedon't do that for a baby's birth
.
I also feel like a lot of thatis about talking about it.
Who's the breastfeeding like?
How do I do that and what timedo I do that at?
What week is the best week?

(44:15):
And I was very similar to you,like I would get up in the
middle of the night to feed andI would scarf food like bowls
and bowls of cereal, like incontainers, like a normal cup
size bowl.
I was just starving duringbreastfeeding during pregnancy
too, I was, I know I did notlimit my calories at all, and I

(44:36):
found that I also wasn'tprepared.
I did some of the same thingsand I think that is how you
learn right.
That's how you learn the nexttime you do it differently.
Yeah, and I also think that wewant to do all the things right.
We want to visit with our mom.
We want to visit with oursisters.
We want to visit with ourmother-in-law, our sister-in-law
.
We want to have brownies bakedfor whoever wants them when they

(44:56):
come over, obviously baked forwhoever wants them when they
come over, obviously.
That's not always feasiblebecause you're recovering.
You have to recover emotionally, mentally, physically, and then
you have this whole person tocare for and they have no way of
communicating.
Really, you learn theircommunication, but in the first
few days you don't learn theircries.
Yeah, did you have difficultywith breastfeeding at all?
Thankfully, yeah.

Yeah, it was very natural and he latched
easily and he gained a lot ofweight when we went for our
checkup a few days afterwards.
And I love breastfeeding, yeah,like I and again, no judgment,
I was just going into thisexperience being I will do
whatever I can to keep this babyalive.

(45:37):
If I will try my hardest tobreastfeed, because that's what
I would like to do, and if Ican't, I'm not gonna, you know,
feel bad about having to do itin another way.
As long as the baby is alive,then that's that's great, right.
So, but I was surprised I saidto Haysham recently, I was like
saying how I think my favoritepart of motherhood is

(46:01):
breastfeeding.
That's hard, yeah, and he'slike, really, because he sees it
as a task, something I have todo, almost like something that
has to get done.
Yeah, but I find it to be justvery.
There's nothing that feelsbetter than being able to ease
your child who needs something.
So it just looks so regulating,like it regulates my system, it

(46:22):
regulates his system, it's justvery connecting.

Deborah (46:25):
So I was really surprised at that you have no
choice of being present, yeah,yeah, and also giving your baby
something that it needs, thatyour body creates yeah, yeah,
that's cool too.

I can't, I couldn't wrap my mind around
that either.
It's like I can't believe oneday there was no, maybe there
was milk, but I wasn't havingmilk coming out of here, and now
I have a ridiculous amount ofmilk coming out.
So this is wild.
Yes, it's just amazing, yeah.

Deborah (46:54):
So I guess with that I want to ask this question,
because I do really find thatwomen really struggle with this
Do you look at your bodydifferently now that you've been
pregnant and gave birth andbreastfed?

Wow, what a good question.
Yeah, I definitely look at itdifferently.
I appreciate it.
There's I think sometimesthere's judgment to the changing
body, but I just feel likethere's just this amazement in
our body and what it's capableof and just its ability to move

(47:29):
in so many different ways, evenlike how I was when I was
pregnant, compared to what I amright now.
I'm just like in awe at itsability to shape, shift and do
what's needed for what's bestfor our health and, yeah, I'm
amazed it is changing.
I do think that a lot of peoplestruggle, but I try to keep a

(47:52):
healthy mindset around it and Ilove my body for giving me this
and like just trying to reallyanchor into the appreciation of
all the different aspects.

Deborah (48:05):
I think that when we talk about a lot of negative
feelings around body, it's aboutbody image instead of looking
at what our bodies are capableof.
And I always like to remindwomen pregnancy is not always
fun and you don't have to loveit or hate it.
It's whatever you feel isvalidating, and I will validate

(48:27):
it for you, and then for birththe same thing, and then for
feeding the same thing.
But when you look back at it,our bodies are profound.
We grew a whole human being andwe have a system like the
uterus is incredible.
I could talk about that all daylong.
But what it does at the end,during labor and before labor,

(48:48):
and all of the mechanics of that, the anatomy of it, and then we
get this baby out with onepowerful push, in your case, and
then our body kicks in anddevelops food for it In most
cases.
I'm not saying that it comesquite like that for every single
person, and I know peoplestruggle with getting pregnant
and I know people struggle withbirth.

(49:08):
I know people struggle withpregnancy or with breastfeeding,
but when you look back at itit's like damn, how did we ever
feel that we weren't enough?
Yeah, that's such a good point.
It just blows my mind.
I have a special portal thatcreates human life.

I know, yeah, and it comes back to me when you
say that is just like comingback to our sense of power and
like so many systems, have takenit away from us.
I think that the work that youdo, and along with other doulas
and a variety of differentservice providers, is just
reminding us that we do havethis power.
This is innate within us andthat's why this process of

(49:51):
entering into motherhood hasbeen so profound is because it
is more than just having a baby.
It's reconnecting to all theseother parts of you.
And what is motherhood and Icould talk about that for a very
long time Motherhood is noteven remotely what I thought it
would be Like.
There's so much strength.

(50:11):
I always thought motherhood wasoh, I'll be a more nurturing,
compassionate.
It felt very like soft, but nowI'm connecting with that, like
more sense of like mother bear,like the power.
And there's this whole otherside that I had totally just I
knew it was there, probablylogically, but I've really been

(50:32):
feeling into that and that'ssomething that is.
I'm grateful for it and I thinkit's going to show up in many
other aspects of my life.

Deborah (50:42):
Okay.
So since you brought that up, Iwant to say this first, I love
how, at the beginning of thisconversation we were talking
about, you were pregnant and youreally didn't know if you want
to be a mother, and many timesduring this conversation you
talked about my next birth, mynext baby, and you brought up
the mama bear thing, and Ireally feel that happens to us

(51:04):
as mothers.
We want to make changes, right.
We want to make changes when wehave this perfect human life
and it's like how can I now dothat in my community?
And that we haven't talkedabout yet is what you do for a
living, what you do as you're,besides being a mother and a
wife.
Do you think that mama bearthing that showed up is
impacting your business and theway that you show up in your

(51:28):
community?
Because I know what you do andI would love for you to share
that with my audience and thentalk about, maybe, if that is
impacting how you're movingforward in your clinical
practice that is impacting howyou're moving forward in your
clinical practice.

So my background's in art therapy, the
form of psychotherapy thatutilizes the creative process to
explore different themes basedon what the client's needs and
goals are.
So, as I said, I've been a veryvisual learner and I find for
myself sometimes we don't havethe words to express some of the
challenging things that we'regoing through, whether it's

(52:05):
birth related or completelyoutside of the birthing world,
based on trauma, loss, grief,just mental illness, stress, and
so we utilize the creativeprocess as a means for healing.
Oftentimes I hear from peopledo you have to be creative?
Do you have to be an artist inorder to go for art therapy?

(52:28):
Do you just analyze people'sartwork and all the answers?
No.
For those questions, I trulythink that anybody can be
creative, and whether you deemyourself creative or not, it
doesn't matter, because the good, the bad and the ugly are all
parts of life.
So, even if you were creative,it's not like I would be
encouraging you to come in andcreate a perfect piece of

(52:49):
artwork.
What we're doing is more sotaking what's inside of the body
, your own experiences.
Maybe you see them as certainsymbols or metaphors, and then
we put them onto paper.
So, instead of talking back andforth face to face, we now have
a means to communicate in adifferent way, and it's all
about being curious.

(53:09):
I like to be curious aboutwhat's coming up for them,
opposed to assuming or judgingand analyzing those sorts of
things.
So it's really client centeredand the mother bear energy shows
up in the sense that I think,just as a on a personal level,
I've been taking part in my ownart therapy with the world we're

(53:31):
living in right now.
I envision and I would like formy son to live in a world he
wants to live in and he wants tobe here.
I will do whatever I can tomake sure that we cultivate a
world that he feels like hewants to live in.
There's a lot going on rightnow, so I will do my best.

(53:53):
It grounds me and roots me andmakes me feel more motivated and
determined to make sure I'mholding myself accountable to
create these changes.
How do I do that?
For me it's I can help on anindividual level, like seeing
clients one on one.
When we begin to work withclients individually, they begin

(54:14):
to transform and then, withthat spider ripple effect, right
Like it's just getting toexpand.
When they make changes, how isthat going to impact their
family unit?
How will that impact ourcommunity?
So I do find that the job thatI have working with clients is
really impactful and powerful,and also just working within the
community setting and withdifferent organizations.

(54:36):
And how can we cultivatedifferent events, healing events
for individuals using thecreative process?
How can it be connected tosocial change as well?
How can we elevate voices thatneed to be heard?
How can we create opportunitiesfor the community to come
together and learn in adifferent way?

(54:57):
How can we build empathythrough creativity?
These are all things that Ithink about and that my son is
really rooting me in, and, yeah,I will stay on the battlefield
until the day I die, essentiallytrying to make the world a
better place.

Deborah (55:13):
Yeah, I love that.
I love one of the things thatyou said about elevating voices
that need to be heard.

Yeah.

Deborah (55:20):
And I think that is really important, because we
might not be directly on thebattlefield all the things at
this time and we can only dowhatever's in our zone of genius
, right.
We can only do one mother at atime for me, you, one client at
a time, or a mother, whateverthat is and hope that the ripple
effect is strong enough to makea big change, and I love that

(55:45):
so much.
That is really resonating withme.
Elevate voices that need to beheard and I think that your work
is really important.
I really feel drawn to it forchildren myself and I don't know
what it is about that Like whenmy kids were struggling, they
didn't want to sit with atherapist, they didn't want to
do that one to one back andforth, and I also think that

(56:08):
being taught at a certain agethat this is okay through
whatever kind of therapy, butfor my kids, art therapy is
something that they did and theydidn't feel like they were
doing therapy.
But I don't think that it'sjust necessarily for children.
I honestly think my husbandwould probably enjoy art therapy
more than couples therapy.
He would get more out of that.

Yeah, it's more than just kids.
Oftentimes people do this forkids.
I actually only work with aclientele age nine and up, just
because my expertise isn't theyounger children, but yeah, it's
for literally anybody, and Iwork with a lot of adults
specifically who are maybemoving through, trying to work

(56:52):
around their traumas or anxiety,depression, and just being able
to support individuals throughthis process, and that is why,
obviously, I connected withbirthing from within.
I am such a visual person andwe're constantly being
surrounded by images and bysymbols, right.
Utilizing them and letting themguide your therapeutic process

(57:17):
is sometimes really impactfuland powerful.
One of the things I love to dois almost like a scavenger hunt
or like just having an intentionand then taking.
I have a bunch of NationalGeographic's magazines, so there
are lots of symbols, right,lots of images.
That's part of our primal brain.
It connects image with senseand all those sorts of things

(57:40):
being able to just flip throughthe magazine and pull out, rip
out things that are resonatingand you might not be sure as to
why they are.
But it's just more of anintuitive process because I find
sometimes our brains get in theway.
We create stories all the timeand it gets in the way of our
healing.
So I find the art makingprocess can be something where

(58:02):
we can take a step back, allowthings to flow through, and then
we can begin to discuss andmake reason with what's coming
up.

Deborah (58:12):
I think that is so cool.
I also think about that.
I think about how people dressright.
Like people dress a lot of thetime.
You choose a lot of the samethings, like, for me, big
earrings, flashy, that's.
I like to stand out, notnecessarily for other people,
but for myself.
That makes me feel strong andpowerful and I think we're

(58:36):
attracted to all of the samethings, whether that's in
clothing or decorating your home, like whatever it is that
resonates with you, and I'venever thought about it like that
before.
I really love that.
You explained that.
Even when you think aboutchildren, like when you said the
National Geographic, I'm like,oh my god.

(58:56):
Like my daughter, lily lovedthat whatever.
Whatever reason she was drawnto that, I don't know, and
obviously she didn't use thatkind of therapy, but I love that
so much.
I think that could be reallyhelpful and I think you're right
A lot of times we can'tarticulate how we feel because
we don't understand.
So if we don't understand them,how can we articulate that?

Yeah, no, exactly how do you articulate it
, and sometimes there aren'twords for it, there's, it's just
sensation feels like heavy oractually postpartum.
It was probably during my drop,the five to seven days so low.
I was feeling good and I didn't.
I haven't struggled withfeeling that way throughout, but
there was like a specific day Iopened my sketchbook, which I

(59:39):
had as a resource throughout myentire process.
I opened my sketchbook and Ijust went through my magazines
and I would rip out images thatjust stood out to how I was
feeling in that moment.
I showed my mom after, actuallydays later, cause if I told her
in that moment I probably wouldhave started crying, just
because it was such a heavyemotional feeling but it was all
these like dark images in thecave.

(01:00:02):
There was like all this stuffthat was coming through that,
but it felt good to be able toget it out of my body and just
give it space into my sketchbook.
I was able to represent it morevisually and still, to this day
, I couldn't tell you.
If you asked me how did youfeel in that moment and show you
this picture like this is how Ifelt, like I can't tell you.
If you asked me how did youfeel in that moment and show you
this picture like this is how Ifelt, like I can't tell you how

(01:00:22):
I felt.
And then I was able toincorporate elements of strength
and adding supports to it if Iwanted to.
So I like really connect withdifferent animal energies as
well.
So I was adding certain animalsinto it as a reminder that you
can get through this.
You can persevere.
You've done it in the past.
Like hard things, yeah.

Deborah (01:00:44):
I love that so much and I'm definitely going to use
that when describing yourservices about how people can
find you.

Ainslee Winter (01:00:52):
Yeah, so I have a website.
It's revivalthruhandscom, okay,and then you can also find me
on Instagram, also, it's revivalthrough hands, and then you can
find more information aboutbooking, whether it's art,
therapy services or just some ofthe work I do in the community
and I'd love to connect further.

Deborah (01:01:14):
Amazing.
So you heard it, guys.
That's Revival Through Handswith Ainsley Winter and if you
see Ainsley out in the communitydoing all the things, please
say hi and thank her for herbirth story today, because it
was incredible.
Thank you, ainsley, for beingwith me.
I love your birth story.
I love that I have a personalconnection with you and I feel

(01:01:38):
so grateful for your story today.

Thank you.
Thank you so much for having meon here, debra, and thank you
to anyone who listens, and Ireally hope that it helps in
whatever way it's needed.

Deborah (01:01:53):
Amazing.
Thank you, I love you.

Love you too.
Thank you for being a part ofmy journey.
This has been incredible.

Deborah (01:01:59):
Okay, bye, bye.
This has been incredible.
Okay, bye, bye.
Talk to you soon.
Okay, let's talk soon.

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Reclaiming Power in the Birthing Room - Ainslee Winter's birth story.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Reclaiming Power in the Birthing Room - Ainslee Winter's birth story.