Lost Without a Trace: What Happened to Amy Bradley?

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The mysterious vanishing of Amy Bradley haunts the cruise industry to this day. On March 24, 1998, the 23-year-old American woman disappeared from the Royal Caribbean ship Rhapsody of the Seas as it approached Curaçao, leaving behind only her sandals and a yellow shirt on the cabin balcony. The most chilling aspect? She vanished within a 20-30 minute window while her family slept just feet away.

We dive deep into the timeline and evidence surrounding Amy's disappearance, examining the critical moments before she vanished. The night prior, Amy had been enjoying the cruise's nightlife, even appearing in video footage dancing at a deck party. According to her brother, the last confirmed person to see her, Amy mentioned feeling unwell around 4:00 AM while sitting on their balcony smoking cigarettes. When her father briefly woke around 5:30 AM, he glimpsed what he believes were Amy's legs on a balcony chair. By 6:00 AM, she was gone.

What makes this case particularly perplexing is the presence of Amy's shoes left on the balcony. Would someone voluntarily leave a cruise ship barefoot? The timing also raises serious questions about popular trafficking theories - how could someone be abducted or convinced to leave in such a narrow timeframe? We consider alternative explanations, including the possibility that Amy, an enthusiastic photographer participating in the ship's photo contest, might have been attempting to capture the sunrise or port approach when she accidentally fell overboard. The reduced speed of the ship during port approach could explain why no splash was heard.

Despite numerous alleged sightings of Amy in the Caribbean over the years and extensive investigation, no definitive answers have emerged. The Bradley family has maintained remarkable unity in their decades-long search for their daughter, showing extraordinary resilience in the face of unimaginable grief. Whether you believe Amy met with foul play or suffered a tragic accident, her case reminds us of the devastating uncertainty that families of missing persons endure.

Join us as we examine this haunting disappearance and remember the vibrant young woman whose fate remains unknown. Have you heard of Amy Bradley's case before? What theory seems most plausible to you?

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:18):
Welcome all of you wine and true crime lovers.
I'm Brandi and I'm Chris andthis is texas wine and true
crime.
Thank you for being heretonight, friends, for this
week's episode the disappearanceof amy bradley.
Hey, chris hey brandy tonightwe are sipping on a little um
texas envy a 2022 vermentinofrom our friends over at

(00:43):
cristoval winery in cristovaltexas.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
We did a live show there not that long ago it was
seven months ago, six, sevenmore or less, yeah um such a
fine winery, such a fun event.

Speaker 1 (00:59):
We um beautiful, beautiful winery.
Oh my, my gosh.
So beautiful and um.
So yeah we are now.
We decided to take some wineback with us from the show, so
we are sipping on that tonight.

Speaker 2 (01:12):
Yes, nice and crisp and refreshing, a little
effervescent.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
Perfect for this nice , cool New Mexico night.

Speaker 2 (01:19):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (01:19):
I agree, love it All right.
So, um, chris, we are here totalk about the disappearance of
Amy Bradley.

Speaker 2 (01:29):
We are.

Speaker 1 (01:30):
Now, a documentary just came out on Netflix about
this case.
Yes, I've talked to you aboutthis case.

Speaker 2 (01:37):
We have talked.

Speaker 1 (01:38):
We've talked way before this documentary even
came out.
I mean, this happened back in1998.
So a long time.
You know, Amy was 23 when shewent missing on the Royal
Caribbean cruise that she wastaking with her family.
So the first thing I want tosay is we're not going to

(01:59):
summarize the documentary.
People should go watch it.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
I would agree.

Speaker 1 (02:04):
And form your own opinions about um what you see
here and we certainly have oursand we have ours, and I think it
.
These kind of cases are verydifficult because you and I also
want to recognize that, um, thefeeling and the look on the
bradley's faces in this, it'slike it happened for them

(02:25):
yesterday.

Speaker 2 (02:26):
I would agree.

Speaker 1 (02:28):
And, um, we know that pain well and I will just say
that you, you know, there's athing called hope.
We hold onto in life and andsometimes it's a defense
mechanism for our own minds tobe able to move on and process
life.
As we grieve, and everyone doesit differently and everybody,

(02:52):
you know, handles thingsdifferently.
But I will say that I hope youknow I'm glad the Bradleys are
still together.
Chris, you and I know losing achild, the odds are stacked
against you for many, manyreasons, but this couple has
stayed together.
Chris, you and I know losing achild, the odds are stacked
against you for many, manyreasons, but this couple of stay
together.
They continue to.
You know, you know their son,who you know.

(03:15):
They had another child at home.
I mean, you know these kids arewere in their 20s and when,
when they went on this cruise.
So you know, it doesn't matterhow old Amy was, it's, they
never came home with their babyand that's how they look at this
and feel and I just want to saythat it man just looking in

(03:39):
their faces.
They, they live with this stingand the not knowing every
single day.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
Yeah, and they keep up the fight too.

Speaker 1 (03:46):
They do.
And you know, and again, whoare we right?
When I say we, I mean thesleuths, the people on the
outside us watching the news, uswatching these documentaries,
not actually living this.
And then you have investigators, fbi people who have been
working this case, trying tofind answers for this family.

(04:08):
So you know, I hope that theyhave answers one day.
I do Whatever that might be, Ijust hope and wish them all
peace of mind.
Okay, so let's talk about whathappens on this Royal Caribbean
cruise.
March 24th 1998 is the timeshe's last seen and disappears.

(04:30):
So family is going on avacation.
The parents were given a trip,a cruise vacation.

Speaker 2 (04:38):
They won it through their company.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
Through their company , they're bringing the kids.
They're all excited they'regoing to be sharing one room Now
.
Chris, we have both been oncruises.
I love going on them.
You not so much.
You enjoyed it.
I would say you enjoyed thefirst one, the first one, I did,
yes, the second one.
You kind of were a little bitmore of like now.

(05:01):
I know why I don't come on Now.
I know why.

Speaker 2 (05:04):
The first, you know however long of years, I even
made the claim that I don't wantto travel anywhere unless it's
on a big ship.

Speaker 1 (05:12):
You did After the first one.

Speaker 2 (05:13):
Second one not so much.
Yeah, I'm not super hot onthose, it's just.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
You're just not.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
No, this isn't about cruises and what's good or bad

(05:50):
no-transcript that stuff.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
Now I did say to you after seeing this documentary I
don't know if cruise lines wouldstill do that today.
I feel like if this happenednow, in 2025, or at least I hope
, I hope after Amy's casemultiple cases that have
happened on cruise lines I hopethey would make an announcement
at seven o'clock in the morningand not worrying about

(06:17):
disturbing the others.
But they have a business to run, right, everybody has a
business to run, and so RoyalCaribbean, you know, they, they,
they, they had their positionon this.
The family had their positionand there has, you know, the
bradley's took them to court in1999.
Those records are open andpublic, so you can read about

(06:38):
what happened in these, thesecases.
But you had the family who wasvery upset that they would not
take action immediately, whichwell, I 100 agree right how many
people um go missing on acruise ship?

Speaker 2 (06:52):
very few, not missing .
I mean that you just somebody'snot where you think they are oh
well, that happens, that's whatI mean as far as announcements
so you know right, so you know Ican.

Speaker 1 (07:06):
And this is a huge ship.

Speaker 2 (07:08):
I think the yeah, I mean the.

Speaker 1 (07:10):
Bigger than normal ships, I would say.

Speaker 2 (07:12):
They should have.
But from that one perspectiveof this probably happens quite a
bit where somebody can't findother members of the party.
That's right.
They probably, you know, wantto give them opportunity.
I think they even told them, ifyou can go, look for them.
They did Because I mean let'sbe honest If somebody's missing
from a room, the firstinclination is that there's not

(07:33):
been any sort of foul play orsomething bad happen.
They might, just it's a bigship.

Speaker 1 (07:38):
Well, you have a lot of people and most I mean and
there's people walking aroundand they're going to notice some
things, especially if there'snefarious actions happening
outside of the rooms I'm nottalking about in the rooms, I'm
talking about outside, in thehallway there's always people.

Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah, because I was going to say even just from my
experience as well too, there'salways a lot of people.
People still move about untilpretty late at night.

Speaker 1 (08:04):
Wee hours of the morning.
Yeah, just because I know somewill sleep on the lawn chairs
outside until they make them goup.

Speaker 2 (08:12):
I think they finally showed up like five or 6.
Am 2,200 people or so on thiscruise.
So I mean it is a lot of people.
And so yeah, you are correct.

Speaker 1 (08:28):
All right.
So the Bradleys are on vacation.
They've been on the boat a fewdays.
Over those few days they havepartied, they've been going to
dinner, they've been doingeverything you do on a cruise
line, right?
Going to the shows, dancing,going to the parties at night.
I mean, you're rarely in yourroom on a cruise, so you're out
and about.
They've always got somethingfor you to do.
So along the way we have stopsto different ports.

(08:50):
Now, this is the reason youliked the first cruise is
because you're like, wow, we canget here, you know, to this
place in the Caribbean for veryquickly without having to deal
with any airports, right, so itis.
It is the um, the, the going tothe ports is a is a very big
piece of why people go oncruises, okay, and a lot of them

(09:12):
don't want to fly and mess withit.
So they they might dock in, youknow, they might go in Puerto
Rico, or they might go toFlorida, or they go out of
Galveston.
So, depending on where you livein, the easiest port to start
at is where is where peopleusually go.
So on this trip they are goingthrough Aruba and into Curacao,

(09:32):
going into the wee hours of themorning when Amy goes missing.
Okay, so Curacao is going to bethe next stop port.
Now there's one.
There's a few things that Ithought about.
When people, when the boats,are going into port, the first
thing I thought about is they'regoing much slower than they are
at night, because at nightthey're trying to get to the
next port, so they kind of hitthe gas a little bit at night

(09:54):
when people are trying, whenpeople go to sleep.
That's why you always feel therocking more at night.
You feel like you can feel theboat moving more at night.
So that means because when youwake up, like everyone did this
morning, you're going into port.
So this is what happens, so theboat slows down.
So that is the one thing I didwant to point out.
Now I don't know exactly wherethey were in the water.

(10:14):
I mean, we know by thedocumentary where the search
party and where they werelooking for Amy, which was
basically coming from Aruba intoCuracao.
But the boat is going a littlebit significantly slower.
Okay, so I will say that Nowshe goes missing between 5.30

(10:36):
and 6 am, and I'm just sayingthat because we have no reason
to believe that the father didnot see her that morning at 530.

Speaker 2 (10:49):
That is his claim.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
That is his claim.

Speaker 2 (10:51):
That he saw her legs Sitting on the deck, not deck,
I'm sorry, the balcony.

Speaker 1 (10:54):
The balcony and that she was safe.
You know he says that in thedocumentary.
He you know she was safe.

Speaker 2 (11:00):
He says he sees her legs.
That yes, he does.
We don't know.
I mean, I don't know how youcan ascertain somebody's safe,
but he does see her, at leastthere and present.

Speaker 1 (11:10):
That's right.
Yeah, he does, and these arehis own words, by the way, and
that's what he says in thedocumentary that he saw her legs
and thought she was safe and sohe didn't go out there.
Tell her to, you know, I I'msure there's a lot of thoughts
that's gone through his headover these years of what he
should have done, but there's noreason for us to believe he

(11:30):
didn't see her.
Okay.
So if he, if he saw hersomething wakes him up again
about right before six, I wouldsay okay.
So I'm to say 20 to 30 minutesafter the first initial time he
woke up.
Yeah, so okay, then we'retalking 20 minutes.
We're talking a very, very,very, very small timeline and I

(11:52):
think we need to remember thatin this case not only this case,
but all cases and what do wealways talk about?
What makes the most senseSometimes, sometimes it doesn't
make sense, but we need toconsider where they are, we need
to consider the timing, we needto consider what she says when

(12:13):
she's last seen we're going totalk about that when she was
sitting with her brother on thebalcony and in the fact that the
last known sighting is by thefather.
Now in the documentary the FBIagent said the last known
sighting was when the brotherwas sitting with her on the
balcony.
After that things get murky.

(12:34):
So I don't know from an FBI'sinvestigative perspective they
didn't elaborate on this Do theyquestion the sighting of the
father?

Speaker 2 (12:45):
Is there some reason for them to believe?

Speaker 1 (12:48):
that he didn't see her, or is there something?
Because that's not what theysay is the last time because he
saw a leg.

Speaker 2 (12:55):
He didn't see her and that may be why it gets murky
because he didn't lay eyes onher per se.
He laid eyes on a part of herbody and that may be why they're
just making that statement yeahbecause the only really
confirmed last sighting is theperson she was speaking with.
Is what I gathered from that.

Speaker 1 (13:13):
Yeah, that's what I gathered too.
So I thought that was animportant piece in the
documentary as well.
But again, the dad says he sawher.
No reason for us to believe hedidn't and that is once at 530
is when he sees her and thensomething else awakens him.

Speaker 2 (13:30):
And if he didn't see her, then the last time she
would have been seen was aboutclose to 4 am 4 am yeah.
So if he did make a mistake,then your timeline.

Speaker 1 (13:41):
Gets a little bit bigger, yes, but not Still short
.

Speaker 2 (13:44):
It's still a little small for me and these people,
like you said, are staying in astate room.
They're up very high on theboat.
They're all in the same room.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
I think we can pretty much eliminate the fact that we
think anybody went in the roomand did anything to her.
So let's get that one out ofthe way, and I also think even
exiting the room after the fact.

Speaker 2 (14:03):
that was one kind of stickler for me too.
Still, you could do it quiet,nobody would hear you.

Speaker 1 (14:12):
But just um, you know that time of the morning or did
the door close?
And that's what he heard andawoke him like that.
To me, something awoke him.
Was it a scream?
Was it a door closing?
Was it the wind?
Was it to me?
you wake up like that becausesomething you hear, something
well and he also saw the slidingglass door was also a jar he
did, which he says was right,and he had just been awake 20

(14:34):
minutes before that and the door, I assume, was closed.
So who opened it?
I mean you have to assume amyopened it right.
So okay, sorry before we,before we dive too far into that
, so let's just talk about.
You know, 24 hours before againgo watch the documentary, the

(14:55):
parents kind of hone in on, likeyou know, noticing that staff
is paying attention to her.
You know, I mean I this is justthe family's take on what their
perception was of how peopletreated Amy on this cruise.
But they thought that the staffwas very fond of her.
They thought people, you knowthere were certain people that
were paying more attention toher.

(15:15):
There were some photographsthat the parents talk about in
the documentary.
You know, you take pictures atthe formal night and with your
family and then they put themall on the wall and you go and
you know the mother says thatamy's pictures were missing.
You know that of that formalnight and you know did someone
like somebody, yeah, somebodyyou know, and I mean again, we

(15:37):
don't there.
It could.
That could very well be true,we just don't know, right?
So these are just things we'rejust mentioning that were
mentioned by the family, that wejust didn't know in in like
reading case, right, these arejust new things that the parents
have shared with the public.

Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, I think they do allude to a theory that there's
a lot of premeditation that hadgone on with this.
Yeah, I agree.

Speaker 1 (16:03):
Okay, so the night before the family had gone to
formal night, they had theformal dinner, they had taken
pictures, they had gone andchanged out of their clothes and
then they were going up to thebalcony party, which they called
, I think, like the party underthe stars.
So I would just consider itmore of like the rooftop of the

(16:24):
boat.
Everyone's hanging out.
It's busy.
This is where the parents areand amy and her brother.
But parents go to bed about oneo'clock.
They go to their room.
They tell the kids they'regoing back to the room.
Um, amy and brad hang out.
They're.
You know um dancing they're.

(16:46):
I think he said he won a limbocontest.
I mean they're just hanging out.
It's a cruise.
That's what people do.
You don't know each other.
You're just dancing around witha bunch.
A limbo contest, I mean they'rejust hanging out.
It's a cruise.
That's what people do.
You don't know each other.
You're just dancing around witha bunch of strangers.
I mean it's just have.
They're just having a good time.
They're all drinking alcohol,you know.
I mean they were having fun.
And Brad says you know, henotices that she's with a group
of people.

(17:06):
He notices that the bass player.
He mentions the bass player,alistair Douglas, which Yella
Yella his his nickname.
So you know Amy is seen and weknow this because the
documentary there there's a guywho's there and their company
had, like, sent all their bestsales people to this cruise, so

(17:29):
they're taking video footage ofthese people enjoying themselves
and Amy happens to be on one ofthe videos which again is in
the documentary.
So go watch it, you know.
So people saw her there.
Right, she was confirmed there.
But we also know that she wentback to her room around 3.50 in
the morning, okay, 3.48.

(17:49):
I don't remember that's my keycard that's when the key card
enters the room.
Okay, so there's a couple ofback pieces that um before we,
before we kind of talk about theday of her disappearance.
Um, we know now that amy hadcome out to her parents as as
being a lesbian.
Okay, she, in fact she had hadat least two girlfriends before

(18:15):
going on this cruise that shewas, I would say, in love with
um.
One of them she pretty muchgrew up with and, and in the
documentary one of the friendssaid it was very difficult for
her to tell her parents.
She didn't want to disappointthem.
She, you know, they were all avery close family and that is
incredibly difficult.

(18:35):
No matter who you are, no matterhow close your family is, it's
not always easy for people totell people in their lives about
this stuff.
Right?
So once you get in thedocumentary and you see the
message in the bottle and yousee Amy's exact words and how
she was feeling, I don't thinkthat she was like.
I think there was a littleturmoil there for her.

(18:57):
I think that she was havingmaybe she was young still, she
was just graduated, she wasgetting her own apartment, she
was kind.
You know, now you're out, youcan live the life you want to
live and people have to.
They either accept you or theydon't, right, and so I think
there was a piece of her thatwas ready to be like facing the
world, and this was the lasttrip and then she's going out.

(19:20):
So you know the whole likesuicide thing.
I mean I'm not buying that.
I don't perceive herpersonality in the way that she
was acting per se, that she'sjust going to wake up in a 20
minute span of her father seeingher and decide to jump off a

(19:45):
cruise ship.
I personally don't see that inher personality.
A cruise ship I personallydon't see that in her
personality.
In my opinion.
I know there are some people,even probably in her life, that
thought that it wasn't alwayspeaches and cream for her and
that some, when they heard thistheory, they did kind of think
about it a little bit.

Speaker 2 (20:06):
But I think they all stated that where she was in her
life.
That was not really right anoption, but because, that was an
unusual, but because she likedwomen.

Speaker 1 (20:15):
Are we going to believe that she went up and met
up with allister douglas?
Again, like I'm having a verydifficult time?
Okay, again, we're talkingabout a 20 to 30 minute timeline
, no cell phones.
Okay, no cell phones, noability to talk to one another.
Um, you are.
You are sleeping on a balcony,okay.

(20:39):
I mean, do we really thinkshe's going to leave the room
and go find allister douglas?

Speaker 2 (20:46):
I don't personally believe that because I think of
those things you said.
Um, she's gay, so she does notprobably have any sort of?
Um sexual interest.
She told her brother that shedidn't feel well.

Speaker 1 (21:02):
She also told her brother he, alistair Douglas,
hit on her.
Yeah, I mean and she, he did.
He said she didn't make a bigdeal about it when he told her
exactly, so she didn't.

Speaker 2 (21:11):
That doesn't seem like she was dancing with him
right and she said she didn'tfeel good, so the likelihood of
her going back out to you know,procure any more drinks or
whatever is I find highlyunlikely as well yeah, so no, I
don.
No, I don't.
I mean certainly a suspect,because he's on video dancing

(21:31):
with her and you know, but Idon't, I just don't know.
You know what that shows me,though I mean even the girls
that were drinking and said onthing and that they said that he
was walking with her.
There still is really noconfirmation of what time that
is.
They say it was much later, itcould have been earlier.
They claim the club was.
I mean, it's just, I don't know.

(21:52):
I don't see her being luredinto that.

Speaker 1 (21:55):
But you have to remember that.
Let me hold on.
We're going to let's talk about.
Let's talk about that for asecond.
Okay, because the night thatAmy comes in at 10 to four, we
know she had danced withAlistair Douglas that night
because we just said it wascaught on video.
But to me, chris, a woman-.

Speaker 2 (22:11):
But we also don't know who else she danced with.

Speaker 1 (22:13):
That's right.
But the fact that she's dancingwith a man actually kind of
tells me she probably has a lotmore confidence in herself and
her comfortability in who she isthan to be able to do that.
Or she's so intoxicated thatshe's just dancing with a man.
But me, looking at that video,I see a girl just having a good

(22:36):
time on a cruise.

Speaker 2 (22:37):
But I mean how-.

Speaker 1 (22:38):
I don't see anything- .
That's not me that kind of goesover the line of wanting more.
How?

Speaker 2 (22:44):
intoxicated.
Do you really have to be tojust change your preference
sexually?
You know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (22:54):
Right.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
Like you know, was she drugged.
I mean well, I mean somebodysaw her.
It'd be different if she nevercame back.

Speaker 1 (23:00):
That's right.

Speaker 2 (23:01):
And then you last seen with him and then, like you
would think, you know.

Speaker 1 (23:06):
But and we know he entered the room about the same
time she did in his own, yes,his own room that's right.
And again, they didn't know andpeople left right.
There's no way to track ifyou've opened your door to leave
because you don't use a key, akey card, to exit.
So they don't know if he everleft, or if she ever.

Speaker 2 (23:23):
I mean I'm I'm quite sure that that people hook up
with cruise employees.

Speaker 1 (23:30):
Oh, I'm sure.

Speaker 2 (23:31):
But I imagine that is so highly frowned upon.

Speaker 1 (23:35):
Oh, it's more cruise line relationships, I would say,
than cruise line guestrelationships.

Speaker 2 (23:43):
That's not going to happen and the risk of being
seen going into a room.

Speaker 1 (23:50):
Well their job is to keep people happy and dancing
and having fun, like that,literally, is kind of their job,
to engage, to be at thoseparties.
I mean they taught.
I mean you've been, you've seen.
I mean people listening to thisare going to.
Some have been on cruises andthey know exactly what we're
talking about, so it's not.
I mean Some have been oncruises and they know exactly

(24:12):
what we're talking about, soit's not.
I mean, is it just bad forAlistair Douglas that he just
happens to be seen with Amy onvideo, like the guy said, wrong
place, wrong time, dancing withthe wrong girl, and this happens
?

Speaker 2 (24:22):
And, honestly, that was just one guy with one video
camera.
In this day and age, if youthink, if this was to occur with
people with cell phones, howmuch more video Cause?
I mean, I guess that's.
I found it kind of odd to Imean I don't know.
I mean, yes, she seemed to makean impression on people, but
they're, when they'reinterviewing the people,

(24:43):
everybody's like oh yeah, Iremember.
I don't like I remember seeingher on the thing and doing the
it's that I don't know I couldwe don't really know who saw her
.

Speaker 1 (24:52):
I mean, that's the whole thing.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
But some of the people like that the interview
that did see her that's rightlike, oh, yeah, she, you know.
Yeah, I recognize that girlwhen I saw the flyers and stuff
that she was missing and I justthink that, um, I can't remember
one face on the cruise as I'vebeen on so so I don't know.
You know it's like did theyactually see her?
I?

Speaker 1 (25:11):
mean, you know, right , I agree.

Speaker 2 (25:13):
I mean, people can see all kinds of stuff.
Sure, and we do hear about thisas this progresses down the
road about people eyewitnessaccounts and things like that
too, that it's no different thanyou know, looking at a cloud
and seeing a face.
The cloud's not a face, but Ican't think of the term for it.
Your brain can make you.

Speaker 1 (25:34):
Like photographic memory, Not at all.
It's just the way you look atrocks.
Oh perception, oh yourperception of something.

Speaker 2 (25:41):
There's a term for it , but it's no different.
When you look at clouds and yousee Abraham Lincoln Like, oh,
that looks just the cloud's notAbraham Lincoln like dead oh,
that looks just the clouds onAbraham Lincoln, but your brain
just interprets it that way.
So you know who knows Like.
I mean we can get delve intothat, but it's just um well,
because all we really can talkabout is who knows?

Speaker 1 (25:57):
because here's the thing at the end of the day, we
don't know what happened to her.
We can't, we don't have thatanswer.
The parents don't have thatanswer.

Speaker 2 (26:05):
They do not so.

Speaker 1 (26:07):
So this tonight's episode is really just about.
I really, again, it's abouttimeline, it's about possibility
and it's really just about youknow some of the, some of the
pieces of evidence that I thinkshould be kind of considered
more.
But, um, all right, so we'regoing to talk about that, but

(26:27):
all right, chris, night beforethey're having fun drinking, amy
enters about 10 to four aroundthe same time that Alistair
Douglas goes in his own room.
Amy's brother comes in the roomabout 10 minutes before she
does, so they both are on thebalcony having a cigarette
talking.
She tells him about AlistairDouglas making a pass at her.

(26:52):
Okay, um, her brother will saythat she didn't like act like it
was a huge deal or make a bigdeal of it.
She just mentioned it inpassing.
Um, so he goes to bed.
Um, at four, 30, I would say.
So he goes to bed at 4.30, Iwould say maybe between 4 and
4.30.
He's asleep, he's going to bed.

(27:13):
He leaves her on the balcony.
He tells her, you know, or shetells him she doesn't feel well
and that she likes the breeze.
And man, I get it.
I love laying out sitting onthe balcony.
That breeze feels good at night.
You're listening to the water,you're just laying out there.
So she doesn't feel well.
So we know she tells her brotherthat and he closes the door
behind him.
He says and he lays down andgoes to sleep.

(27:35):
So the next time she's seen iswhen the father wakes up about
530.
So he wakes up, says he seesher legs on a chair, you know,
or whatever, the lounge loungechair.
So she's like laying down, itlooks like.
So he says, okay, she's good,I'm gonna go back to bed.
Something wakes him up beforesix and he goes back outside and

(28:00):
he does not see his daughter.
Okay, we know, there was ayellow shirt that she had on the
night before that was sittingover a chair.
There were a pair of that shehad on the night before that was
sitting over a chair.

Speaker 2 (28:11):
There were a pair of sandals.

Speaker 1 (28:11):
Birkenstocks sitting on the balcony.
He says the balcony door isopen about 12 to 14 inches and
there is a table that had beenlike pushed up against.

Speaker 2 (28:25):
No, that was not them .
The FBI saw that table.
Okay, it looked like thing hadbeen kind of straightened up,
like the shoes were side by side.

Speaker 1 (28:33):
Yeah, like maybe the cleaning crew had gone out there
, okay, um, so they're butbasically I mean those, those
contents, and that's it, she'sand we don't know.
And again, like, by the time thefbi gets on the boat and they
start investigating this, they,the crew, had already cleaned
the boat and they startinvestigating this.
They, the crew, had alreadycleaned the room, which may or
may not make a difference, butit does make a difference for me

(28:55):
on the patio well, it does,it's and that's what the crew
does when you leave your room.
So I mean, don't you imagine thefbi has asked them if they put
the sandals together like thatand push the table over there?
You would think they have askedhim that question.
They can find out who cleanedthat room.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
They can find out who cleaned it, but the person can
say yes or no.

Speaker 1 (29:15):
I know, but I think that's important.

Speaker 2 (29:18):
I think they just said they gave the appearance
that things were straightened up, like I mean at that time.
I mean I think the room wasalready cleaned well before
authorities were probably evennotified.
I mean right.

Speaker 1 (29:33):
No, I mean they were notified.
Curious how police werenotified right as they went to
port.

Speaker 2 (29:39):
In order for that room to have been cleaned, the
family would have had to get outof the room.
They're not going to clean theroom if you're in there, right?

Speaker 1 (29:48):
We just know from the documentary the room got
cleaned're not going to cleanthe room if you're in there,
right?
We just know from thedocumentary.
The room got cleaned, yes, okay.
So shoes are found, doors foundopen.
Her father goes to look for herat 6 am.

Speaker 2 (30:00):
I'm just saying from the whole preservation of a
crime scene.
At that point I don't thinkthat they thought it was a crime
scene and then had it cleaned.
I think they just were doingtheir normal course of duty and
you know at that point.

Speaker 1 (30:14):
No, I don't think they purposely went in and
cleaned the scene.

Speaker 2 (30:17):
There was some suspicion within the documentary
.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
Yeah, well, I think it was just really Well.
I mean they could have justWell.
I mean I don't know, thereprobably could have been some
things they did that they wouldnot have allowed the crew member
to clean a room.

Speaker 2 (30:34):
No, no, if they would have done things a little bit,
I'm quite sure they did nothandle that well.
If they would have thoughtinitially they probably wouldn't
have let him in that room.
I'm just saying like at thatpoint.

Speaker 1 (30:41):
But if a girl disappears, was last seen?

Speaker 2 (30:46):
You kind of just make sure it's not accessible.
No, no, but at that point theydidn't know she had really
disappeared.
They were at in the port,they're looking for her.
They just could not find her.
They still, at that point, Ifeel like they didn't even know
if she had slipped off the boat,even though they called the
name.
I mean that maybe she, just youknow.

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(32:14):
All right, chris.
So that morning that her dadgoes out and she's gone, he
doesn't wake the mother up justyet.
Everybody's still asleep.
He goes out and he looks forher.
He comes back and he tells hiswife I've looked all over for
Amy and I can't find her.
This is when they notify theship and the director.

(32:36):
I'm not going to get into allof that.
They were not going to make aseven o'clock announcement.
This is a big boat.
They thought she was somewhere.
You can tell know.
Like you said, people justdon't miss, just disappear off
these boats.
They, this is a huge ship andthey thought she's probably
somewhere.
They encouraged the family togo look for a little longer and,

(32:58):
if they can't find her, to comeback.
Now.
The difficulty here like yousaid, chris, they're at port and
what does that mean?
People are ready to get offthis ship Now, at six in the
morning.
You're not getting off port.
We're not getting off port till8am.
Okay, 6am is when he goeslooking for her.
About seven is when he tellsthe director or the whatever he

(33:24):
was, says they're not making theannouncement.
Give me 30 more minutes, chris.
This is now 730, going intoeight o'clock within.
People are now getting ready togo downstairs and to get and to
go into Curacao, okay.
So, unfortunately, this is justa very bad timing.
You have a lot of people thatare ready to get off this boat.

(33:46):
You're out, you're about toopen the floodgates and let
people off and you have amissing girl.
And but they do.
They do pager, they do say hername and I, if I have my facts
right, they did this beforeletting people off the boat.
They asked her to come to thedesk or to check in and she did

(34:09):
not come.
So they end up doing a searchof this boat after port.
Now, chris, you and I both knownot everybody gets off the ship,
not everybody goes out to port.
There's a lot of people whowalk with canes, are in
wheelchairs.
There's lots of reasons whypeople don't go in.
Sometimes they want everyoneoff the boat and they just want

(34:31):
to enjoy everything on the boatthemselves, right, so you do
have an influx of people wantingto exit, but you also still
have people on.
So Royal Caribbean, they did asweep.
Now I could tell from thedocumentary that because the
Bradley's did not visually seethem searching the boat I think

(34:52):
you know you just there theywere told to wait in their rooms
Someone comes and says listen,we did a search of this boat and
your daughter is not on thisboat.
Okay, now am I to think theydidn't do their due diligence in
searching this boat?
They talk about this but wedon't know.
I mean we just don't know how.
I mean we can only assume thatRoyal Caribbean did what they

(35:15):
were supposed to do and searchthe entire boat.
And they said it takes an hour.
And I believe they havehundreds employees that are
actually participating to lookat every nook and cranny in this
place.
They said they did it.
That's what they say.
That's what they say.
I'm not so certain.
I'm not so certain.
The family believes that.
So you know how.

(35:39):
People getting off the boat, andyou have this family desperate
to find their daughter.
Now this is where things get alittle.
This is where, I think, thingsget a little murky.
You start having sightings ofher.
By the way, they don't find herin Curacao.
She's not on the boat, she'sofficially missing.
The FBI is then brought in andasked to come onto the boat.

(36:02):
The family I'm really glad theydid not go back into Puerto
Rico and dock because of all thenews and because of all the
coverage it had hit America bythis time that she was missing
from this cruise ship, by thistime that she was missing from
this cruise ship and someoneflew the family back to their
home, which I'm glad they didthat.

(36:23):
I think it would probably wouldhave been very difficult and a
lot more painful to even to evencontinue to be on you know to,
to continue to be on this tripand then having to go back into
port where where you knowthere's going to be reporters
and stuff waiting so they gohome without their daughter.
Now this has been since 1998,and there have been multiple

(36:48):
sightings.

Speaker 2 (36:49):
I think the first one was like four years after right
?

Speaker 1 (36:52):
No, actually I don't think it was or 2004.

Speaker 2 (36:55):
It's one or the other .
The gentleman that was therethat was diving.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
Okay, we'll have to go back, because I thought it
was very short.
I thought it was like sixmonths after she disappeared.
I thought the first sightingwas very short.

Speaker 2 (37:08):
The taxi driver.

Speaker 1 (37:10):
No, the taxi driver was when he told the father that
Amy tapped on his window.

Speaker 2 (37:16):
That was when they went back down there, so that
may be the first yeah, so thefirst sighting was really was
that with the father?

Speaker 1 (37:23):
but then you have the gentleman who was on the
documentary, who says he saw amy, and who he identified as
allister douglas that was theone that walking with her years
later.
I think it was the first one.
No, the one years later was theguy in the brothel bar.

Speaker 2 (37:39):
No, no, no, that was years and years later.
Yeah, then there was the womanwho was years and half a year
later.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
Right, which was actually the last sighting of
her, was the woman, the firstgentleman who helped?

Speaker 2 (37:50):
who ended up helping the family?

Speaker 1 (37:52):
later on down the road, yeah, but.

Speaker 2 (37:54):
I believe the taxi driver, when the family went
back down, was the first one tonotify the brother that you know
.
Tell them if he was looking forwhich neighborhoods to go into.

Speaker 1 (38:05):
Right.

Speaker 2 (38:06):
Because that's when they went with the Coast Guard,
the Curacao Coast Guard.
Yeah, officer.

Speaker 1 (38:11):
Well, and I think too that you know, I guess at that
point you believe that she hasgotten off the boat, right?
I mean you, you know.
Again, we don't know.

Speaker 2 (38:25):
Well, they feel like she was taken off how the mind
shifts Right, so let's just talkabout.

Speaker 1 (38:31):
So we know Amy has never been found.
Okay, we know from thedocumentary that trafficking is
a.

Speaker 2 (38:40):
Well, and they searched the water.
They claim they searched thewaters about, I think, 15 miles
off the coast.
They did have a grid as theboat was approaching.
They used.

Speaker 1 (38:53):
They did.

Speaker 2 (38:53):
Essentially current maps and things like that.
It also is Curacao.
They did say they enlisted thehelp of the venezuelan coast
guard.
We have no idea what thatsearch tell.
I mean, all you'd hear is thecoast guard.

Speaker 1 (39:06):
Oh, if she would have fallen off, she would have come
to shore right, well, we don'tknow that there are sharks in
the water.

Speaker 2 (39:11):
And he's like oh well , you know, they would just buy
an arm, they would just buy likeI mean, nobody knows, I mean
people could never come to shore.
There's no doubt there'sstronger currents that are
coming there, but how thoroughwas that search?
But I think that's why, youknow they said they searched the
water and it just seems like itwas given up.
You know, like how much timewas actually dedicated that?

Speaker 1 (39:34):
yeah, I could not find anywhere that there was
extensive water search.
Um, I mean, I don't know.
I mean, how long do you searchthe water?

Speaker 2 (39:44):
I think they said they saw the helicopters and the
boats for like a day or two,where?
They would see them becausethey weren't there very long.
They stayed in curacao, Ibelieve the ship probably just
they didn't keep the ship inport, correct?

Speaker 1 (39:57):
no, no, they eventually have to go back.

Speaker 2 (40:00):
No, the, the boat leaves and goes back I mean the
boat continues on with thepassengers on the cruise.
That's right so they that onlyhappened, they only they
mentioned that they were on theboat when they actually saw them
searching the water I justdon't think there was any
extensive search of water weeksafterwards.
And again it's like a day ortwo and you're in the ocean.

Speaker 1 (40:20):
So, but I don't know Natalie Holloway.
There was a lot of search forher.
They had a lot of money when itcomes to so I don't know, like
that's like that, and I didn'teven really think about that.
You know, was the perceptionvery early on that there was
trafficking involved or she wasabducted and there was, and they

(40:40):
never thought she went in thewater.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
You know, again, we're not there we don't know
how slow they were going.
We don't know exactly what theywere.
I thought one or two things.
Somehow she got off the boat.
I'm talking about not thefamily, right, but I think they
think she ever got got off theboat, got in in trouble or fell
off, even though they neverrecovered the body.
That's still a possibility,sure, okay.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
So they go into Curacao.
They are, you know, they can'tfind Amy.
They end up going home.
The father will go back, right,he goes back because he doesn't
know what to do.
He's still looking for theirchild and they've done so many

(41:29):
interviews over the years.
There have been so many theoriesabout what happened to her.
There's been multiple sightings.
Again, we don't have to talkabout each one of them.
We know one was seen was on thebeach, her walking.
This person says he alsoidentifies Alistair Douglas from
a picture as the guy walkingwith her.

(41:51):
He gives him an angry face, shekind of walks away.
Then you have a sighting of herlike in a bar I would just say
like more of a brothel bar froma military person who is going
to be into retirement soon.
That's why he says he doesn'tcome forward.
But Amy tells him that he thatshe got off the boat got in some

(42:17):
trouble, had exited the boat toget drugs.
Now this is what's so.
Now I want to talk.
I want to hone in on thissighting for a second, because
her parents never believed thatshe would have got off the boat
for drugs.
Okay, they say that drugs Amywas more of a beer cigarette
girl Drugs were not somethingthat she that really was any

(42:40):
part of her life.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
Or we thought right, what?
Does one jump off a boat at7.30 in the morning in Curacao,
in a country that they'llprobably chop your hands off if
you are caught?
With drugs and just know whereto go get drugs at that time.

Speaker 1 (42:55):
She doesn't, but it's believed that she could have
asked people like AlistairDouglas or people working on the
boat that might have beenfamiliar with Curacao and be
able to find her drugs.
So it wasn't that she justwalked off and decided to go do
this on her own.
She would have met up with somepeople on the boat.

Speaker 2 (43:14):
I think she seemed to say that she wanted to get for
her and her brother.

Speaker 1 (43:17):
That's what I'm saying.
There's different stories aboutthis.

Speaker 2 (43:20):
I feel like if her brother was into that too.

Speaker 1 (43:22):
He would have known they were like best friends.

Speaker 2 (43:24):
But even like you don't go get drugs for somebody
who probably has never donedrugs.
So if he does drugs too, thatwould be the first place they'd
start looking Like come clean.
That would be the first placethey'd start looking like come
clean.

Speaker 1 (43:39):
oh, yeah, maybe she's all good.
I mean then that way they wouldscour the island more.
But I never believed like in,but based on her parents
reactions that this was actuallya viable we just know that she
was an athlete.

Speaker 2 (43:47):
That doesn't necessarily mean you don't do
drugs plenty of athletesprobably do drugs it just didn't
seem.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
Once again, you know, who knows, maybe she was asking
, but I mean, I don't know, is ayoung girl going to get off a
boat and go find drugs and Imean, this girl isn't a dummy.
I'm gonna say no.
I'm gonna say well, and theanswer is no.

Speaker 2 (44:06):
And not only that, she didn't just leave her family
to wonder where the hell she isI also don't think that I mean
because we had asked some of thepeople on the ship like they're
not supposed to get off theseboats.

Speaker 1 (44:19):
No, they can't.
They have to get approval and,depending on their schedule,
they can't.

Speaker 2 (44:23):
No, it depends on what visa status and what
country they come from.

Speaker 1 (44:26):
That's absolutely you know 100%.

Speaker 2 (44:29):
Not just everybody can get off, no, they don't.
Also the notion that somebodywould have smuggled her off as
we've.

Speaker 1 (44:36):
Yeah, I kind of am going to put the kibosh on that.
In my opinion, we've both beenoff ships.

Speaker 2 (44:40):
That just seems more than difficult.
Well, first of all, you'regoing to have to drug her
because you want her alive.

Speaker 1 (44:45):
We have to assume she's alive at this point,
because if you're trying totraffic her, you're not killing
her.

Speaker 2 (44:49):
And if one person is walking off the boat with her,
that works on the boat doesn'tlook a little odd if you're
dragging a big, uh, steamertrunk behind you with a body in
it or a suitcase.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Well, and not only that her friends say that she
would have put up a fight.
So we know that somebody justdidn't abduct her and like, keep
her quiet as she's exiting thisboat.
I just don't see that.
Listen, there could be peoplelistening to us right now, chris
, that are going.
Nope, she was traffic.
She trafficked.
Okay, if that's what it,everybody can just assume their

(45:20):
own theories based on your ownresearch.
Watch the documentary, hearwhat people are saying, but I'm
gonna.
I, I come from a place of beinga female, being a young female.
Thinking about how Amy had justcome into her own right,
talking about her sexuality,being more comfortable with

(45:42):
herself, getting an apartment,getting a job, starting a new
life, like this girl is a littlebit, shows a little confidence,
in my opinion.
And her mother said her mothereven said on this documentary,
if Amy was gone for more than 10or 15 minutes, she would have
left us a note, she would havetold us where she was going and
I and that sticks with mebecause I think, more than
anything, we know our kids andif her mother didn't believe

(46:05):
that, she would have walked offthat ship.
And here's another thing, chris, I told you this so many times
and I go back to this.
Were there any other shoesmissing?
Because she would not.
I don't even think she wouldhave gone and got coffee
barefoot on a cruise ship.
I love being barefoot.
I ain't walking around barefooton a cruise ship.

(46:26):
I'm not leaving my room with noshoes on and I'm sure as hell
not leaving my room with noshoes on and going in a Curacao.
So I want to know their othershoes gone.
And if there weren't golly tome that evidence right there,
I'm not so certain.
She left that balcony on foot.

(46:49):
I guess I can't get past theshoes.
I don't know.
Maybe there's another pairmissing.
That is in the police reportthat they just didn't talk about
.
But gosh, that is one thing Iwould like to know.
Did she put on another pair ofshoes?
The shoes bother me.
I'm not sure if I'm going to gowalk out, even to get coffee

(47:12):
with no shoes on.
Maybe, but maybe not.
Okay, so she is.
So the family is back home.
They are continuing to look forher.
They are getting multiple.
Chris, I want to go back to thatsighting we just talked about,
because he says in thisdocumentary well, I don't know

(47:33):
if you believe me or not, butthe FBI believed me and they
gave me a polygraph.
So, chris, what if he I'm goingto assume he passes this
polygraph?
You know, these are the.
These are the things that Istruggle with this in this case,
because it's like is he beingcredible?
Did he actually?
Is he telling the truth?
And if he is telling the truth,how did she end up off of this

(47:57):
boat?
But then I think to myself youknow sightings, right, I?
I think, chris, the lastsighting of her was like in 2000
.
I mean, I could be so wrongabout this, but I think it was
like 2005.
I mean, it's been a long timesince somebody has claimed to

(48:18):
have seen her.

Speaker 2 (48:19):
Okay, I almost think it's been that long.
I just think to the um thatthat country relies on tourism
that's right you know, like tothink that I'm not saying sex
trafficking people.

Speaker 1 (48:37):
I mean you have to think, oh, it's a problem
everywhere.

Speaker 2 (48:39):
We're not saying it's not, please, thank you, it's.
I mean, I just think you people, who probably are quote unquote
sex traffickers, probablytarget specific types of people.
This person was on a boat withher whole family.

(49:00):
If somebody's watching on thisboat, they clearly see she's
with a whole family who's goingto miss her a whole lot.
Right, it's a stink.
She's American, and to thinkthat somebody who's from that
country or to you know becauselet's just say there was any
evidence that she was actualevidence, she was done, that was
happened.

(49:20):
I mean like, for instance, 90hot Natalie Holloway people
didn't go to Aruba for a longtime.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
That's right.

Speaker 2 (49:27):
It killed their tourism and they wanted to.
You know, they want to findthat and and solve that crap and
no different there, if theyknew some of their citizens were
doing.
I mean, when we went to Cancunand we were talking about, you
know, taking the ferry towhatever was across the way, and
we were asking, guys, it's safe?
He's like, oh yeah, safe foryou, not for me.

(49:49):
He's like nothing's going tohappen to you guys.
He's like we rely on you cominghere.

Speaker 1 (49:53):
That's right.
That's exactly what he told us.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
I just think that's such a penalty for somebody
there that was doing that.
It's great Not saying that tothem.
It's not worth the risk.
But there's probably a lot ofgirls on that island.
I mean, if somebody was goingto do that that they could
potentially lure.
I'm not saying it's a goodthing, I'm just saying much

(50:14):
easier targets than to go aftersomething like that.
I mean, in my opinion.
I mean I'm like you, I don'tthink she'd have left the
balcony.
We know those balconies arevery high and you've got to
really work to get over thatsucker.
But my scenario is she feltsick and maybe leaned up and
stood on top of that thing andwanted to barf over the edge and
it was a very sheer edge andleaned out far and so it didn't

(50:36):
hit anybody or anything.
So the person upstairs wouldn'tlook and figure out where that
came from, or what's your theorythat you seem to say?

Speaker 1 (50:46):
So we know that she, we know that she was taking
pictures for a picture contestand they had showed some of
these on the documentary andthey were beautiful.
Now they were going into portand my theory is that if the
table that was outside was upagainst the balcony whether it

(51:11):
was at six o'clock in themorning I don't know, but I'm
just let's just say it was Ithink she might have just kind
of sat on the rail and took apicture of Curacao.
I think she might have beensnapping pictures and tried to
get a view and taken a goodpicture of Port and may have
just fallen.

(51:31):
I mean again, we know nobodywent in the room.
If we assume that she was inCuracao and was trafficked, then
she would have had beenphysically taken off of that
boat.
We would have had to assume, inthat 20-minute timeline from
the time her father saw her legson that balcony to the time he
woke up again and she was gonethat there would have been some

(51:56):
reason or some thought, like shewas just going to wake up and
go meet someone.
I'm not really buying that.

Speaker 2 (52:02):
Yeah, because that's the reason the sliding glass
door could have been open andshe went inside to get her
camera.

Speaker 1 (52:07):
I know.
You know, and I think she tookher shirt off because she came
inside and they said that shehad the white tank top or
whatever.

Speaker 2 (52:18):
It's a sunrise you know as they're heading in there
and so, yeah, I mean, I think,regardless of taking a picture
or throwing up I mean I'll know,I just was riffing on that
cause she said she didn't feelgood or felt sick or whatever
from probably drinking.
But yeah, I don't feel like sheever left about.
I think she left the balconyover the balcony, and that's

(52:41):
just my opinion.

Speaker 1 (52:44):
Yeah, I, I, you know again, there there is there's a
lot of people who think a wholelot of different things.
I'm sure in this case, and I'msure that even the FBI and maybe
the family don't agree on whathappened.
I'm sure Royal Caribbean andthe family don't agree on things
and I'm sure that there is a.
There's a lot of sensitivity tothis and there is a lot of pain

(53:07):
and suffering and just notknowing.
But I have a very difficulttime with this timeline and it
is very small to me and I thinkthe shoes bother me, the fact
that the dad goes looking forher at 6am, knowing probably

(53:29):
Chris, where the coffee stationis closest to them, knowing his
daughter is probably around.
So you know again, you would,she would have 20 minutes to
leave the balcony, go getabducted, something happening to
her?
I don't, like you said, I don'tbelieve she left.
We know she didn't.
I mean, if the father'ssighting is a sighting of her

(53:50):
legs, she was on the balcony,she wasn't with him between 5
and 6 am, that these twoeyewitnesses say that she saw
him and they saw her andAlistair.
So you know, and again, he goeson to work with the cruise line
.
They didn't find anything, I'massuming enough to arrest him or
bring him in.

(54:10):
I know the FBI said theycouldn't, because you know this
is international water?
Yeah, they can't.
It's international waters, youknow, which is a problem they
probably should have.
Maybe they could have unraveledanymore, you know.
And then at the end of thisdocumentary, chris, they have,
they started tracing people thatvisited the Amy Bradley website

(54:31):
, right, and wanted to see.
Now there was a little bit ofinteresting.
You know what do you call it.

Speaker 2 (54:40):
They were tracking, tracking IP addresses, the IP
addresses in Barbados, and thataround the times of holidays
that there would.

Speaker 1 (54:48):
Right, because that is the last known sighting was
in the Barbados bathroom by thatwoman.

Speaker 2 (54:51):
There would be hits on the website that would last
for a minute.

Speaker 1 (54:54):
I think that's so coincidental, but that's well,
no, some the pages will be openfor like 45 minutes, though like
of the family.

Speaker 2 (55:01):
She said that's one minute at a time right, but then
longer than like clickingthrough, like longer than like
clicking through.

Speaker 1 (55:07):
Yeah so you know, I mean, is there something to that
?
I don't know, that's very I'mnot, that's not my forte, and
looking in that technology, andwhy, if you just leave something
open, does it then count thetime?
I'm not, I don't know anythingabout that, but, um, I know.
Again, that's a lot of hope andit gives them hope that she's
alive.
And you know what if?

(55:27):
If they have been able to pullthis off after all these years?
You know, I just have a problemwith the sightings being in I
think, curacao.
Why do you keep her in curacao?
You're walking along a beachwith her.
Do you think, chris a girl whois so confident and an athlete
and described by her friends theway she's described, that she's

(55:49):
just gonna let this happen?
That's my problem with thesesightings of her.
It's like I mean a 200 drugdebt, like you knocking on a
taxi window.
This girl was an american.
I think she would have gone tothe, to the tried to find where
the first embassy was, or shewas alone, remember the taxi

(56:10):
driver said she's alone.

Speaker 2 (56:11):
So many tourists over the all of that time and all
the opportunity, because theywere like, well, they could have
been threatening her family.
I mean I can with this girl.
Will they believe that someCuracaoans are going to go to
the United States?

Speaker 1 (56:25):
I think she would have done anything to get home.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
That's what I mean, like all of the tourists At
least in the beginning.
I'm just saying all theopportunities and all the tours
that come through there thatcross her path, and not one time
to reach out other than thesetwo accounts.
Even there's only one accountthat she asks for help because,
like the girl, that she sees inthe bathroom.

(56:48):
She doesn't ask her to help her.
No, she doesn't.
And you know even the taxidriver.
And I mean I don't know.
You know, like I said, it's I'mnot saying these people are
lying.
I think they believe they didso.
If they believe it, they're notlying about it.
It's not like it's some sort ofpublicity stunt, but just the
likelihood, because I mean Ijust can't imagine you would

(57:11):
pass all these American andEuropean tourists and you never
once would say you've beenkidnapped, you need help.

Speaker 1 (57:16):
And that's the tech, and that's the thing, chris, the
taxi driver that was when thedad went back down to Curacao a
few weeks after they returned tothe back to the house.
So you're saying so.
That taxi driver said he sawher alone, you know, tapping on
the window asking for a phone.

Speaker 2 (57:32):
He sent them to some of the crummiest neighborhoods.
So, who knows, he could havetried to set them up for a
robbery.
I mean, you never know.

Speaker 1 (57:43):
I mean, why don't you ask the taxi driver to take you
to the embassy?
I guess I thinking as a youngwoman if I'm in the streets of
Curacao, especially walkingalone.
I'm going to find out where canI get a hold of somebody
American.

Speaker 2 (57:55):
It's kind of like the IP address.
After all these years, if youhave access to a computer, you I
mean you know more a lot aboutthat than I do.

Speaker 1 (58:04):
I mean, you can probably spend a whole episode
talking about this IP address.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
We won't do that but I'm just saying like, if you
have access to a computer tobrowse a website with your
family's photos on it, you damnsure can call somebody or send
an email or something.

Speaker 1 (58:17):
And they talk about that.
I mean, there is not some.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
Uh, I mean, they have technology there too.
It's been there forever.
I mean, granted, this happenedin the in the late nineties, but
I mean like it, just that'swhat makes me so um unsure of
all the sightings, yeah unsureof all the sightings.

Speaker 1 (58:37):
Yeah Well, again, I'm sure people are going to, you
know, come up with their ownthoughts about this case Again,
those that you know.
I would say for me it's thatshort timeline.
You know the creepy guy nextdoor.
We saw him in the documentary,I don't know, they went to his
cabin, honestly pretty close toafter she went missing, and you

(59:02):
know, the other neighbor next tohim said the music was really
loud, but, chris, I think shewould have put up a fight with
him and I think he would havebeen showing some scratches and
defense wounds of some sort.
In my opinion, I don't thinkshe's going to scale the wall
and try to go to the other side.
Again, we're talking about 20minutes.
So she just going to wake upand this guy's like looking over

(59:24):
and goes, hey, come on over,and then she's going to scale
the wall over the ocean.
Seems a little bit dairy to meand not something she would do.
Why not just come out of yourcabin and go next door to his?
Seems a little strange.
So do I think she scaled thewall next door?
No, do I think he's creepy?
Sure, but the shoes, the shorttimeline, the, the, the shirt

(59:49):
being on the chair, the fact herdad can't find her at six
o'clock in the morning, whenthey there is not a lot of
people walking around at sixo'clock in the morning, cruise
ships, people are sleeping, um,and he he wasn't able to find
her and I'm sure he looked veryextensively.
And so, um, because of that,and because of just her love of

(01:00:11):
taking the pictures and we knowthat she was excited about
earning this contest I somethingjust tells me that, like you
said, she wasn't feeling well.
Did she get sick, lean over toofar and did she use that little
table to maybe sit up on therail?
They were going slow into portand did she take a picture and

(01:00:32):
accidentally fall off?
Bye.