November 12, 2024 • 29 mins
Recorded live at Henry's Majestic, November 7th. Could a deadly mistake lead to an unsolved mystery that plagued a community for over a decade? On Thanksgiving Day 1985, a tragic bombing shattered the hopes of the Blount family, who had recently moved to Lake Worth, Texas. While they anticipated a warm holiday gathering, a mysterious black briefcase turned their lives upside down. Only the mother and son survived the catastrophic explosion, leaving investigators to grapple with questions of intent and identity. Was it a botched attempt on a different target, or did Joe Blount's past hold the key to understanding this senseless act?
Join us as we unravel the complex investigation that followed this heartbreaking event. Forensic experts initially considered alternative explanations, from propane accidents to drug-related mishaps, before confirming the briefcase held a deadly bomb. The lack of clear motives and evidence created significant hurdles for investigators, who were faced with a tangled web of possible suspects and theories. We scrutinize the controversial conviction and later exoneration of Michael Toney, whose life was forever changed by a justice system that faltered under the weight of scant and unreliable evidence.
Our episode also confronts the unsettling reality that the Blount family might have been innocent bystanders in a criminal plot gone awry. We explore theories involving a local jeweler and meth dealer, whose illicit dealings may have inadvertently drawn danger to an unsuspecting family's doorstep. This haunting case serves as a sobering reminder of life's uncertainties and the unexpected threats that can disrupt ordinary lives. With insights from surviving family members and seasoned investigators, we invite you to ponder the lingering questions that continue to overshadow this chilling unsolved mystery.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
All right, so since it's November, we're going to
first start out with an unsolvedThanksgiving day case, so we're
going to go back to November28th 1985.
Chris, I love, okay, if you areinto researching true crime or
really just into the historicalthings of maybe not true crime,
maybe more mafia stuff, maybethings in Dallas or Texas in
(00:40):
general that you like to knowabout.
Newspaperscom has everythingand I like to go back and look
at what was happening at thetime.
What were reporters saying,what were police saying about
these cases, because it kind ofgives you some light into the
feelings that people were havingabout these things.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
So this one in particular happened in Lake
Worth, which is right outside ofFort Worth, and in 1985,
november 28th, there was abombing so horrific at a trailer
park, one trailer park home,that it was the deadliest
bombing in the United States.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Yes, at the time.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
At the time, in 1985, which is kind of crazy to think
about, because actually, whatreignited this case?
Now, remember, all these caseswe're talking about tonight are
unsolved and it was not a methlab in the trailer park that's
right.
No, it was not drug.
Well, it could have been drugrelated.
We'll get into that.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
But they themselves yeah, this, this case in
particular too, I think, is justthe fact of the bombing um and
the nature of it is prettyheinous and very heinous so you
have a dad, joe blount.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
By the way, this family had just moved here from
seattle.
They had not even been in thisarea, chris, I think more than
just like a couple of months notvery long at all.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
The whole family came down looking for work.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The whole family came from seattle.
They didn't like what washappening in seattle.
They came to texas set uptrailer liberal huh I'm just
playing.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
What'd you say?
Speaker 1 (02:08):
I said too liberal too liberal, too rainy too.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
It rains a lot there yeah, it has to have their sad
lights when they're there sothis family just moved here.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
So you have to think this happens to this family.
Do they even?
Are they even here a longenough to acc any enemies?
And if you have enemies they'regoing to be more mafia style,
right?
If you're going to have somestuff come from Seattle
following you to Texas, thenthere's going to be a trail of
that.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
I mean, I don't know about the mafia per se.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
But extended over state lines, right?
So if you have a beef withsomeone in Seattle because
they're not from here and we'regoing to talk about this, but
people really didn't know whothey were, police had never
heard of them.
They were new in the trailerpark.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
I mean he had a bit of a checkered past.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
That they looked into .
Speaker 2 (02:57):
But yeah, I mean, they just were coming here and
looking for work.
They settled in Lake Worth anda trailer park and from our
understanding really didn't havemany belongings.
They kind of were settled,barely settled in, you know,
using boxes for tables andwhatnot.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
So yeah, yeah, they said, they hadn't even really
furnished the place.
So it's Thanksgiving, so thisfamily decides they're going to
have a Thanksgiving dinner.
Now the father, joe Blount, whowe're going to talk about, he
had a daughter, angela, and thenthere was a cousin that was in
town and he has a brother thatlives here.
So his brother I think his namewas Ray he's coming over for
(03:35):
Thanksgiving dinner.
So they think, okay, this isthe first time we can get
everyone together, we're all ina place, your brother can come,
and the cousin of the children,so their nephew, is going to
come from college.
He's 18 years old, you know,and I think about the mother, so
the mother of the 18-year-oldwho lives in Seattle.
Remember, the father lives here, so he's at school in Oklahoma
and he's, like you know what,I'm gonna go and visit my
(03:56):
relatives in Texas, His mom inSeattle says you know what?
North Texas, I think.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
Well, we are in North Texas.
No, north Texas UNT.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
No, I think he was in Oklahoma State.
I don't know, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
He was in college in one of these states.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
So his mom says you know, I don't think this is such
a good idea.
And he's like why I get to seemy dad, I get to see my extended
family, why isn't this a goodidea?
And I think of, like motherlyinstinct, right, where you feel
that and you're like you knowwhat that's not a good idea.
You're not going there tonight.
I think of Natalie Holloway'smother, right, everybody know
about Natalie, okay, so I metBeth Holloway.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
They were somewhat estranged as well too.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
They were estranged and so this was like a
connecting thing for them andthe mom's.
Like you know, I'm going tovisit with the family, so he did
.
Unfortunately, he loses hislife in this bombing.
So they have Thanksgivingdinner about five o'clock
Dinner's over.
Ray Blount goes home.
(04:55):
So that's the brother thebrother of the man who dies who
owns the trailer Right.
His son is the one who's killedin the bomb attack, but he
leaves and goes home, so we knowhe's home Police investigate
him after this and they do findthat he has an alibi,
corroborated that someone sawhim at the house, so he's
cleared.
So the dad, joe, the daughterAngela and the cousin, they all
(05:17):
go for beer and ice cream.
Is what my research said.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
They left to go to a convenience store.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Yeah, you want to get out of the house.
You've been in with family, yougo get some snacks at the
convenience store and you comeback.
So the mother stayed behind inthe trailer.
She hears a knock at the door.
She looks outside, chris, andshe sees nothing.
It's dark at that point.
She says so, she doesn't seeanything, she doesn't open the
door.
And you know, I think about thisbecause, by the way, she
survives this and I think tomyself gosh, you know, what
(05:46):
would she have done if she wouldhave opened the door and saw
what they saw coming back up tothe door from the convenience
store.
So I'll talk about that in aminute, because you always think
like woulda, coulda, shoulda.
Right, she didn't open the door.
She hears the knock, she seesnothing.
But what we will find out isthere's something at the door.
There's actually a blackbriefcase sitting at the front
door of this trailer.
Now they three come home fromthe convenience store and they
(06:08):
see the shiny black briefcasesitting on their trailer park
step.
So I'm thinking of a family whojust moves here, who doesn't
have a lot of means andresources.
He had just found a job, chris.
I think at like a transmissionworkmission work.
Transmission work, and so theywere getting on their feet.
They didn't even havefurnishings.
(06:30):
I think they had like a littlecouch, because we will find out,
the daughter is the one wholaid the briefcase on the couch
but they.
So you see this on yourdoorstep and you think what if
somebody is gifting this?
What if somebody left this forus?
Speaker 2 (06:45):
this is 1980, but this is 1985.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Somebody leaving a black briefcase with money,
money or gifts, but you know,but I'm I guess I'm just
thinking like as a new family ina new area.
I don't know, but the younggirl who I believe was 15 at the
time of this, she's the onewho's like we have to open this
right.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
We have to open, I mean and we talked about this
driving in like, in this day andage, do would you open a black
briefcase?
Speaker 1 (07:10):
yeah, we did talk about this coming into henry's
today.
I don't know.
I mean, no, you don't open thebriefcase.
In 2024, in 1985, maybe openthe briefcase anthrax isn't a
thing yet right?
Speaker 2 (07:23):
curiosity may not always kill the cat.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
The poison is not really a thing in 1985.
I think that actually didn'thappen to like ninth, early
nineties.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
I think you mentioned anthrax, I mean I did because
it's a thing All right.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
So they see a black briefcase, they decide they're
going to pick it up and bring itin the house.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
Yeah, the daughter sees it and was like, um wow,
what's this?
Maybe?
Speaker 1 (07:46):
there's treasure.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
I think the father too just kind of played along
like, yeah sure, some it'streasure, you know, let's see
what's in it.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Because the wife will say my husband probably would
have never just opened that ifhe would have found it himself.
So she says this 10 years laterin a Dallas morning news
interview and I think about that.
And you're right, the kids wereenjoying it, it was something.
Whatever, let's open it.
The daughter, angela, sits onthe couch and has the briefcase
on her lap.
(08:15):
The son, the cousin, isbasically sitting next to her on
the couch.
Now her brother is also thereand he, he's standing Like by
the front door of the trailerand the father is just more by
the kitchen, so they'rebasically all just kind of
sitting in a circle.
The mother at this time hadalready gone to bed, so she was
actually in the back room of thetrailer.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
Which is why she ends up surviving this.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
She opens the briefcase and immediately it
explodes and you have the sonwho was thrown out of the
trailer through the front door.
Guys, the heat.
By the way, he lived, he's hadabout 20 reconstructive
surgeries from the burns, thefire and the heat from this.
(09:02):
And we'll talk about this bombbecause we talked about this on
the way up here and what itwould take to actually
manufacture that and leave it,and all of that.
But you have have.
It was so hot.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
His flip-flops melted to his skin on his feet which
means this is probably a verylarge, large bomb that's right.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
I mean enough to throw him out and melt the shoes
he has on to his skin and I maythink about that and he's not
even in the trailer anymore.
He was thrown out of that.
I mean, that's the briefcasebomb, I mean yeah who does that?
Speaker 2 (09:37):
that's something you see in the movies, you know I
mean and just the.
I mean from what I've readboston bombing the well I mean
the, the.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
That was different.
Well, that was a backpack.
That was a backpack that wasdetonated.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
This is a device that's triggered when you open
it.
The level of skill that itprobably takes, because I mean
that's why when the there's abomb or suspected, you know
you've got the people come inwith suits and they've got the
robot and all this stuff.
You know just even handlingthat thing ever laid it on the
porch.
I mean that's a brave person aswell too, because bombs are so
(10:10):
of that nature, are so finickyyeah you know, and I mean to
have a latch device that ignite.
You know it's.
That, to me, is what's sobizarre yeah I mean, that's like
a um, that's mafia that right.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
so let's.
I mean because we can'tdiscount any of this because
this is unsolved, so they don'tactually know who did this.
Um, but but well, there was anactual arrest and a conviction
and a death penalty conviction.
I mean because we can'tdiscount any of this because
this is unsolved, so they don'tactually know who did this, but
there was an actual arrest and aconviction and a death penalty
conviction at that.
So this thing explodes.
The mother immediately hearsthis and comes out of the room
and everything's on fire.
(10:44):
So she doesn't even, I mean tothis day well, I don't know if
to this day, but 10 years ago,so 1995, when she was
interviewed and she was, by theway, living in DFW Metroplex,
she said that she doesn't evenknow how she survived this.
She doesn't even reallyremember even having access to
the back doors.
She remembers seeing the flamesand knowing her instinct was to
(11:06):
just get out.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
She didn't see anyone else.
She didn't even know it was abomb initially.
That's right.
She didn't see anyone else.
Well, she didn't even know itwas a bomb initially.
That's right, she didn't.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
I think they lived next to an Air Force base.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Yeah, I guess they said B-52s used to fly overhead
and land, and so they would hear, I guess, the jets, perhaps
sonic beams from fighter jetsthat were landing back and forth
too.
So I think even she waswondering what it was initially.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
Well, she sees flames .
I think the trailer was like 12feet by 52 feet, it wasn't.
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
That's a single wide, okay so.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
I think, I mean I it seems pretty small when I think
of the dimensions of my head,but so so she immediately sees
this, gets out the back door bythe time she's out the back door
, people in the trailer park.
Okay, by the way, I did findout this trailer park is still
there.
They weren't sure about 1985,the amount of trailers there,
(11:58):
but now I heard this is like soinundated with trailers it would
be easily mistaken, Like if youwere to go up to one you might
be thinking you're going toanother.
That's what what's interestingabout that is.
This is kind of what policethink happened in this case.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Well, and police did not even.
I mean they didn't really knowit was a bomb at first.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
That's right, because .
Speaker 2 (12:18):
I think they even considered a lot of trailers use
propane and could somethinghave ignited from that initially
.
You know, of course, as theylook further, and they're not
thinking bomb.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Right?
It's Thanksgiving.
This is a family at home.
Maybe they were cooking aturkey.
Whoever thinks a bomb, though,in any of these cases I mean
Turkey fryers in 1985?
It's Lake Worth at a trailerpark.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
That's why I did say meth lab.
You know I mean something likethat.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
That's right Somebody's doing something you
know and I think probablyinvestigating, is that I don't
think they're walking andthinking, oh there's a bomb.
So the mother gets out.
She sees all the neighbors,everyone's already looking fire,
they've already been called.
So people come out and theyrealize well what she does.
What she tells her neighbors ismy family's inside.
Can you, can you try to getthem?
(13:03):
You know she's pleading forhelp and, um, her son is laying
there very injured and she justknows the rest of her family's
inside.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Yeah, I think even just the fire and the flames.
People were not even able to gojump inside and help.
No, they weren't.
No.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
So the three are lost the daughter, the cousin and
the father are lost in thisblast.
So police start investigatingthis as a targeted attack.
They eventually they find thebriefcase, they find the bomb,
they find the remnants of it inthe explosion.
They realize that the girl hadit on her lap sitting on the
(13:46):
couch.
There was someone sitting nextto her and I mean they kind of
just pieced it all together themother telling them there was a
knock at the door while theywere out at the convenience
store.
She didn't answer it, shedidn't see anything.
She didn't look down and seeanything at the door.
She said it was dark outsidethey don't have anything to go
(14:06):
on.
I mean, this is like what Ithink if you think about this
1985.
What Like I think if you thinkabout this 1985, remember what I
said this is then declared themost like deadly bombing in the
United States at this time.
And so this was a big deal.
Like this was a big deal.
This had just happened in Texas.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Yeah, because I mean really, like I said, it's a bomb
.
It's a bomb, this is notsomething just blowing up from
somebody fooling around.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
They bring the ATF in pretty quick.
They start bringing otherpeople in.
This is Lake Worth Police.
Fort Worth Police come on andhelp.
So they have a lot of lawenforcement involved in this.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Well, there's really two.
What's the motive?
Why would somebody target thisfamily?
They're new to town.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
They're new to town.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
They're new to town um said he did have a checkered
pass.
But who's gonna travel all theway from seattle to try to kill
this guy?
Speaker 1 (14:59):
and I mean like there was like a burglary on his
record, I think, and maybe, um,it wasn't significant enough to
think that there was any sort ofanimosity or anyone trying to
get them.
So it's kind of wild to thinkokay, so there is eventually an
arrest in this case.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
What they end up finding out hold on just to back
up yeah, yeah, go ahead, no goahead.
Wait a hold on, no go ahead uh,the wife too, yes, but the
insurance policy, I think onthis gentleman was like what?
Speaker 1 (15:31):
one or three grand, two grand barely enough to even
bury him.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
So I think she was quickly dismissed.
But I think that was you'reright I mean they always look at
the family.
But I think too, like onceagain, it's a, it's a, it's a
bomb.
Where would she even have themeans or hire somebody to do
this?
Speaker 1 (15:47):
you know yeah, and I think they quickly you know once
they like she was at the houseand she runs out and you always
look at the person that was inthe house last, which was her.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Well, and if you're going to bomb your family, you
don't go lay in the bedroom,because bombs can be, that's
right.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
Why would she stay in the trailer?
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Bombs are not always this precision, you know laser
guided thing, much less abriefcase bomb.
So that's another reason too.
I think it was quicklydismissed, because why would she
go lay in the bedroom and senda bomb in the front right?
Speaker 1 (16:16):
Makes no sense.
You may You'll leave it andleave the trailer.
You may be a victim of that.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Bomb yourself right.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Yeah, you're not going to know if you go lay in
Right, so it doesn't make anysense.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
I mean, there was the anarchist cookbook back then.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
but when did you find that?
We discussed this quite a bitat work, so it's a great book
Every.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
every high school kid in the early nineties had it.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
All right.
So eventually, 11 years later,okay Gosh, there is no leads in
this case.
Here's the problem with thiscase.
This family is new to town.
They can't find any, chris, anyinformation.
Hold on real quick.
Let me just finish my sentence.
Any information in theirbackground to saying that they
would have any enemies thatwould go to.
(17:01):
I mean, I want you to thinkabout this.
It was the biggest bombing inthe US, so they're thinking in
their minds.
They've got to be thinking bigpicture here.
For me, police are probablythinking mafia hit something in
this guy's background.
They probably extended it wayto Seattle, probably talked to
all of his friends back inSeattle.
This is 11 years before theyeven really get a name.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Well, and I think too , they start thinking as well.
Yes, sir, yeah, start thinkingas well is yes, sir, yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
So it was the most.
It was the deadliest and themost they.
There was a word they used forit.
It was like the way that itpenetrated in 1985 in 1985.
So at the time they said it wasand this was actually in the
paper that I read that that atthe time because this was 10
years later, they wrote thatarticle in 1985 it was
considered the most, thedeadliest and the most lethal, I
(17:55):
think the way it was madebombing in the usa at that time
in 1985.
We just didn't hear about thosethings.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
I feel well so I think they also pretty quickly
start to think was this theright house?
This was a trailer park thatthey did have drug dealers
living in.
And so there was anothergentleman too, who was a
methamphetamine dealer, also ajeweler that they did consider
like, was somebody trying totarget him?
I think another gentleman too,who was also a drug dealer that
(18:24):
lived somewhere around there.
So was this just kind of a caseof mistaken?
You know, identity, notidentity.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
But they didn't see a person mistaken trailer.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
Mistaken, mistaken trailer.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
Yeah, you know so there is one guy, chris, that
we'll talk about.
There were.
We're not going to get into allthe suspects in this case,
because there's really not a lotof information about the rest
of them there's one particular,I was gonna say too.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
They all pretty quickly got dismissed because
once again you start looking athow this bomb was made.
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Yeah, and that's why I think they were looking so far
away from that.
Like who would?
I even probably think at thattime maybe police thought, well,
are people going to go to thislinks just to kill a drug dealer
in the trailer park?
Like aren't there easier,different ways to do that than
actually building a bomb?
Like that is, you would thinkthey want to take out a lot of
(19:19):
people.
In my mind.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
Or send a message or send a message.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
So, yeah, great point on that.
All right, so they start,you're welcome.
So they start looking intopeople.
Again, we're not going to talkabout all the suspects because
nobody was really arrestedexcept one guy.
Now the reason his name comesup is a couple reasons.
One, we know he was living inthe area at the time with his
wife.
The other piece of it is he wasactually serving time in prison
(19:45):
and confided in an inmate thathe was actually responsible for
this bomb.
He actually says he was hiredfor $5,000 to kill a drug dealer
and he got the wrong trailer.
So those are the words thatwere used by the inmate.
Now we all know.
Per another inmate Per anotherinmate, but we all know that
(20:05):
when it comes to that, and itcomes to I mean, so this is well
one, they want this solvedright, this is a big case at the
time.
Two, you have an inmate notconfession, but an inmate.
Well, confession from theperson who supposedly did it,
and as police, you're like okay,do they want freedom?
(20:26):
What do they want?
Is this made up?
Speaker 2 (20:28):
Well, and I think too , and so they're considering
that, when it comes from this,guy I read this, the suspect as
as well was a self-describedjailhouse lawyer.
He would, you know, helpingpeople get out.
So like I think this guy was.
Basically he was giving him, Ithink, because he was serving
some pretty serious time andmaybe didn't see any um, you
know nothing on the horizon ofgetting getting out.
(20:49):
So I basically letting this guyuse his supposed confession to
lessen his sentence that's right.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
So it sounds weird, but it does sound weird.
And then the wife is questionedand she says, oh, we were
nowhere in the area duringthanksgiving.
And then she recants that andsays, once police tell her like
do you know how serious this is?
Your husband's name has come up.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
She got mad at him.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Yeah, we need to know if you know anything, because
you're going to be heldresponsible if you don't tell us
something.
So here's what she tells police.
She actually tells police.
They were there that night.
They were together in a car.
He exits the vehicle with abriefcase.
Now in my research I read thatshe would not have actually been
(21:39):
able to have that informationat that point to know it was an
actual briefcase.
So I can't determine whethershe gave that information more
up front, because this is 11years later right, she might
have gotten mad at him.
And at that time you think theywould know it's a briefcase.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
So I'm thinking maybe they read that in the paper
which by the way, especiallygiven the time frame that she
came forward with thisinformation.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
There's a lot of information about it and the
inmate ends up going oh, I madeit all up, we read it about it.
We knew there was you know thiswas trying to be solved, and we
figured we'd just work togetherto get at least one of us out
of here.
So then he recants his wholeentire statement and so now
they're left.
(22:23):
But guys, they don't care, okay.
So this goes back to what Chrisand I talk a lot about here,
and what we talk a lot about onour show is the fact that
sometimes unfortunately, by theway lawyers, doctors,
psychiatrists, mechanics they'renot all good people.
Police officers are one ofthose people.
(22:44):
They're not all good people andthey all shouldn't be serving
in a public servant role.
But here's also what I'm goingto say you always Like they want
to make the case.
They want to make the case, theywant to solve the case.
Well, and I think they want tosolve the renewed interest was
the oklahoma city bombing that'sright and I think that's which
was 1995, 1996, 1996.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Okay, I think that's kind of also too was to reopen,
not reopen it.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Well, this is kind of well, I mean so many years had
passed.
And then, when the oklahomacity bombing happening, they
thought, well, this, this iskind of well, I mean, it's so
many years had passed.
And then, when the Oklahomacity bombing happening, they
thought, well, this is the kindof bomb that was in our case, so
maybe we need to like reignitethis and look in this.
And this is when they startfinding out all of this it's
still a different kind of bomb.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
Cause, that's a detonated from strikes me
because who is going to jump ina car with somebody and ride
with a bomb in the trunk?
That's quite volatile, that'swhat even their, their her story
about being with him the nightof doesn't really make much
sense unless he didn't tell herso then you just put another
thought I got a bomb in thetrunk.
You know, are you gonna ridewith me?
Speaker 1 (23:47):
what if they didn't drive?
Though put that in the miata.
You just kind of put a thoughtin my head.
What if they didn't drive?
What if they actually lived inthe trailer park?
What if there was some You'reless likely to mistake in the
trailer?
Speaker 2 (24:02):
If you live there.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
Yes, because if you're not riding with a bomb in
the car, if it can be easilydetonated.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
If you live there, wouldn't you know which trailer
to bomb?
Speaker 1 (24:11):
But that's what I'm saying.
So maybe this was targeted, butit wasn't targeted enough and
there wasn't a trail enough toactually tell it was targeted by
someone who already had somesort of animosity or beef with
the family living there.
That is something to consider,Because maybe they weren't in a
car and by the way, hertestimony and his testimony he
(24:34):
says they didn't actually buythat truck until December 13th,
so there was no way she was inthat vehicle with him on
Thanksgiving.
And they end up finding outthat that's actually true.
You guys, he goes to trial.
They don't care about the factthat they've recanted these
statements.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
They take him to trial convict him and give him
the death penalty in this case,and I don't think we've said
this gentleman's name.
His name is Michael Tony.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Michael Tony is his name.
We've been calling him thesuspect.
Oh sorry.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
Michael Tony.
Yes, Very secretive.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
But you know what I mean.
They give him the death penalty, in this case on recanted
evidence.
That's what my point aboutsolving something just to solve
it.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
I think they said that some of the wiring that was
used the copper wire, thatthere was evidence that this was
found somewhere.
You know I mean because thisguy too, he really had no
history of bomb making skills,no, he just had a history of
like burglary and other randomstuff.
That sounds like somebody whomay have had a little military
(25:33):
time and knew a thing, or twoabout a thing or.
Two.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
So due process and the right to have all evidence
at your trial is a thing.
So if you are convicted ofsomething and you find that
there was significant evidenceleft out of your trial, you can
then appeal this, and this isexactly what this guy does Left
out of your trial.
You can then appeal this, andthis is exactly what this guy
does.
And they find out that thecourt and the case and the
attorneys really screwed up andthey completely dropped all
(26:00):
charges against this guy, lethim out and they are never going
to ever retry him again.
So if any of this is true, ifhe is involved, right, he'll
never be convicted for this.
And at this point you know Ialways say, well, he'll never be
convicted for this.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
and at this point you know I always say he won't be
never again, because he diedpretty shortly after in a car
crash yeah, he did so that's,either karma I know, I thought
about that too.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
We see that sometimes in cases, I mean even at the
time he was in jail for burglaryyou know's right I mean he
wasn't some contract hit man oranything like that, yeah.
So what police believe?
So what police believe even asof like five years ago is the
fact that they think whoeverplanted this bomb got the wrong
(26:46):
trailer.
And the reason they believethat is because of the lack of
evidence that they have pointingto anyone who had enough
animosity or any kind of wasupset with this family in any
way.
They just could find nothing ofit.
And because they could findnothing of it made them think
(27:07):
that, and because of thenefarious activity that happened
around this trailer, theybasically believed that they got
the wrong guy.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Yeah, I lean more towards perhaps that gentleman.
Was it Joe Tortella who was thejeweler and meth dealer?
Because, he probably wasdealing with some pretty sketchy
cats, Because I think even hewas thinking maybe this was
meant for me well, and I thinkthey even said something like he
(27:37):
so much about he was nevertried for any drug dealing, but
I think police it was kind ofcommon knowledge that he was
involved in that, but you know.
So I think at the time he wasdealing drugs, cheating uh, with
somebody's wife and stuff likethat.
So could a scorned husband orsomebody that he owed money to
or something like that, yeahWell, they've never had any
(27:58):
suspects in this case.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Chris, at this point I would say that it would just
be someone coming forward andtalking about this.
But to me this is so isolatedand has absolutely nothing to do
with this family, which meansthey will never find the
evidence.
I mean, you don't know where tolook, you don't know who to
start with.
I mean you just don't know.
And so they really focus theirefforts on looking into their
(28:22):
background and trying to findsomething.
And because of the lack of whatthey found, that's why they
believe this family was justlike an innocent bystanders from
the spawn, which is so crazy.
Like you think, you go home oneday and I mean imagine just
being killed and you weren'teven the target.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
I mean that's so the lesson is don't open black
briefcases.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
We'll definitely don't do that.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
But I must say, unless someone tells you it's on
its way, that's a good bit justto go put a empty black
briefcase on somebody's porchand you know leaning forward.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
All right, y'all no-transcript.
All right, so since it's November, we're going to
first start out with an unsolvedThanksgiving day case, so we're
going to go back to November28th 1985.
Chris, I love, okay, if you areinto researching true crime or
really just into the historicalthings of maybe not true crime,
maybe more mafia stuff, maybethings in Dallas or Texas in
(00:40):
general that you like to knowabout.
Newspaperscom has everythingand I like to go back and look
at what was happening at thetime.
What were reporters saying,what were police saying about
these cases, because it kind ofgives you some light into the
feelings that people were havingabout these things.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
So this one in particular happened in Lake
Worth, which is right outside ofFort Worth, and in 1985,
november 28th, there was abombing so horrific at a trailer
park, one trailer park home,that it was the deadliest
bombing in the United States.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Yes, at the time.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
At the time, in 1985, which is kind of crazy to think
about, because actually, whatreignited this case?
Now, remember, all these caseswe're talking about tonight are
unsolved and it was not a methlab in the trailer park that's
right.
No, it was not drug.
Well, it could have been drugrelated.
We'll get into that.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
But they themselves yeah, this, this case in
particular too, I think, is justthe fact of the bombing um and
the nature of it is prettyheinous and very heinous so you
have a dad, joe blount.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
By the way, this family had just moved here from
seattle.
They had not even been in thisarea, chris, I think more than
just like a couple of months notvery long at all.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
The whole family came down looking for work.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The whole family came from seattle.
They didn't like what washappening in seattle.
They came to texas set uptrailer liberal huh I'm just
playing.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
What'd you say?
Speaker 1 (02:08):
I said too liberal too liberal, too rainy too.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
It rains a lot there yeah, it has to have their sad
lights when they're there sothis family just moved here.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
So you have to think this happens to this family.
Do they even?
Are they even here a longenough to acc any enemies?
And if you have enemies they'regoing to be more mafia style,
right?
If you're going to have somestuff come from Seattle
following you to Texas, thenthere's going to be a trail of
that.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
I mean, I don't know about the mafia per se.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
But extended over state lines, right?
So if you have a beef withsomeone in Seattle because
they're not from here and we'regoing to talk about this, but
people really didn't know whothey were, police had never
heard of them.
They were new in the trailerpark.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
I mean he had a bit of a checkered past.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
That they looked into .
Speaker 2 (02:57):
But yeah, I mean, they just were coming here and
looking for work.
They settled in Lake Worth anda trailer park and from our
understanding really didn't havemany belongings.
They kind of were settled,barely settled in, you know,
using boxes for tables andwhatnot.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
So yeah, yeah, they said, they hadn't even really
furnished the place.
So it's Thanksgiving, so thisfamily decides they're going to
have a Thanksgiving dinner.
Now the father, joe Blount, whowe're going to talk about, he
had a daughter, angela, and thenthere was a cousin that was in
town and he has a brother thatlives here.
So his brother I think his namewas Ray he's coming over for
(03:35):
Thanksgiving dinner.
So they think, okay, this isthe first time we can get
everyone together, we're all ina place, your brother can come,
and the cousin of the children,so their nephew, is going to
come from college.
He's 18 years old, you know,and I think about the mother, so
the mother of the 18-year-oldwho lives in Seattle.
Remember, the father lives here, so he's at school in Oklahoma
and he's, like you know what,I'm gonna go and visit my
(03:56):
relatives in Texas, His mom inSeattle says you know what?
North Texas, I think.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
Well, we are in North Texas.
No, north Texas UNT.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
No, I think he was in Oklahoma State.
I don't know, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
He was in college in one of these states.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
So his mom says you know, I don't think this is such
a good idea.
And he's like why I get to seemy dad, I get to see my extended
family, why isn't this a goodidea?
And I think of, like motherlyinstinct, right, where you feel
that and you're like you knowwhat that's not a good idea.
You're not going there tonight.
I think of Natalie Holloway'smother, right, everybody know
about Natalie, okay, so I metBeth Holloway.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
They were somewhat estranged as well too.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
They were estranged and so this was like a
connecting thing for them andthe mom's.
Like you know, I'm going tovisit with the family, so he did
.
Unfortunately, he loses hislife in this bombing.
So they have Thanksgivingdinner about five o'clock
Dinner's over.
Ray Blount goes home.
(04:55):
So that's the brother thebrother of the man who dies who
owns the trailer Right.
His son is the one who's killedin the bomb attack, but he
leaves and goes home, so we knowhe's home Police investigate
him after this and they do findthat he has an alibi,
corroborated that someone sawhim at the house, so he's
cleared.
So the dad, joe, the daughterAngela and the cousin, they all
(05:17):
go for beer and ice cream.
Is what my research said.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
They left to go to a convenience store.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Yeah, you want to get out of the house.
You've been in with family, yougo get some snacks at the
convenience store and you comeback.
So the mother stayed behind inthe trailer.
She hears a knock at the door.
She looks outside, chris, andshe sees nothing.
It's dark at that point.
She says so, she doesn't seeanything, she doesn't open the
door.
And you know, I think about thisbecause, by the way, she
survives this and I think tomyself gosh, you know, what
(05:46):
would she have done if she wouldhave opened the door and saw
what they saw coming back up tothe door from the convenience
store.
So I'll talk about that in aminute, because you always think
like woulda, coulda, shoulda.
Right, she didn't open the door.
She hears the knock, she seesnothing.
But what we will find out isthere's something at the door.
There's actually a blackbriefcase sitting at the front
door of this trailer.
Now they three come home fromthe convenience store and they
(06:08):
see the shiny black briefcasesitting on their trailer park
step.
So I'm thinking of a family whojust moves here, who doesn't
have a lot of means andresources.
He had just found a job, chris.
I think at like a transmissionworkmission work.
Transmission work, and so theywere getting on their feet.
They didn't even havefurnishings.
(06:30):
I think they had like a littlecouch, because we will find out,
the daughter is the one wholaid the briefcase on the couch
but they.
So you see this on yourdoorstep and you think what if
somebody is gifting this?
What if somebody left this forus?
Speaker 2 (06:45):
this is 1980, but this is 1985.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Somebody leaving a black briefcase with money,
money or gifts, but you know,but I'm I guess I'm just
thinking like as a new family ina new area.
I don't know, but the younggirl who I believe was 15 at the
time of this, she's the onewho's like we have to open this
right.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
We have to open, I mean and we talked about this
driving in like, in this day andage, do would you open a black
briefcase?
Speaker 1 (07:10):
yeah, we did talk about this coming into henry's
today.
I don't know.
I mean, no, you don't open thebriefcase.
In 2024, in 1985, maybe openthe briefcase anthrax isn't a
thing yet right?
Speaker 2 (07:23):
curiosity may not always kill the cat.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
The poison is not really a thing in 1985.
I think that actually didn'thappen to like ninth, early
nineties.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
I think you mentioned anthrax, I mean I did because
it's a thing All right.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
So they see a black briefcase, they decide they're
going to pick it up and bring itin the house.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
Yeah, the daughter sees it and was like, um wow,
what's this?
Maybe?
Speaker 1 (07:46):
there's treasure.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
I think the father too just kind of played along
like, yeah sure, some it'streasure, you know, let's see
what's in it.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Because the wife will say my husband probably would
have never just opened that ifhe would have found it himself.
So she says this 10 years laterin a Dallas morning news
interview and I think about that.
And you're right, the kids wereenjoying it, it was something.
Whatever, let's open it.
The daughter, angela, sits onthe couch and has the briefcase
on her lap.
(08:15):
The son, the cousin, isbasically sitting next to her on
the couch.
Now her brother is also thereand he, he's standing Like by
the front door of the trailerand the father is just more by
the kitchen, so they'rebasically all just kind of
sitting in a circle.
The mother at this time hadalready gone to bed, so she was
actually in the back room of thetrailer.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
Which is why she ends up surviving this.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
She opens the briefcase and immediately it
explodes and you have the sonwho was thrown out of the
trailer through the front door.
Guys, the heat.
By the way, he lived, he's hadabout 20 reconstructive
surgeries from the burns, thefire and the heat from this.
(09:02):
And we'll talk about this bombbecause we talked about this on
the way up here and what itwould take to actually
manufacture that and leave it,and all of that.
But you have have.
It was so hot.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
His flip-flops melted to his skin on his feet which
means this is probably a verylarge, large bomb that's right.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
I mean enough to throw him out and melt the shoes
he has on to his skin and I maythink about that and he's not
even in the trailer anymore.
He was thrown out of that.
I mean, that's the briefcasebomb, I mean yeah who does that?
Speaker 2 (09:37):
that's something you see in the movies, you know I
mean and just the.
I mean from what I've readboston bombing the well I mean
the, the.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
That was different.
Well, that was a backpack.
That was a backpack that wasdetonated.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
This is a device that's triggered when you open
it.
The level of skill that itprobably takes, because I mean
that's why when the there's abomb or suspected, you know
you've got the people come inwith suits and they've got the
robot and all this stuff.
You know just even handlingthat thing ever laid it on the
porch.
I mean that's a brave person aswell too, because bombs are so
(10:10):
of that nature, are so finickyyeah you know, and I mean to
have a latch device that ignite.
You know it's.
That, to me, is what's sobizarre yeah I mean, that's like
a um, that's mafia that right.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
so let's.
I mean because we can'tdiscount any of this because
this is unsolved, so they don'tactually know who did this.
Um, but but well, there was anactual arrest and a conviction
and a death penalty conviction.
I mean because we can'tdiscount any of this because
this is unsolved, so they don'tactually know who did this, but
there was an actual arrest and aconviction and a death penalty
conviction at that.
So this thing explodes.
The mother immediately hearsthis and comes out of the room
and everything's on fire.
(10:44):
So she doesn't even, I mean tothis day well, I don't know if
to this day, but 10 years ago,so 1995, when she was
interviewed and she was, by theway, living in DFW Metroplex,
she said that she doesn't evenknow how she survived this.
She doesn't even reallyremember even having access to
the back doors.
She remembers seeing the flamesand knowing her instinct was to
(11:06):
just get out.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
She didn't see anyone else.
She didn't even know it was abomb initially.
That's right.
She didn't see anyone else.
Well, she didn't even know itwas a bomb initially.
That's right, she didn't.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
I think they lived next to an Air Force base.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Yeah, I guess they said B-52s used to fly overhead
and land, and so they would hear, I guess, the jets, perhaps
sonic beams from fighter jetsthat were landing back and forth
too.
So I think even she waswondering what it was initially.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
Well, she sees flames .
I think the trailer was like 12feet by 52 feet, it wasn't.
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
That's a single wide, okay so.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
I think, I mean I it seems pretty small when I think
of the dimensions of my head,but so so she immediately sees
this, gets out the back door bythe time she's out the back door
, people in the trailer park.
Okay, by the way, I did findout this trailer park is still
there.
They weren't sure about 1985,the amount of trailers there,
(11:58):
but now I heard this is like soinundated with trailers it would
be easily mistaken, Like if youwere to go up to one you might
be thinking you're going toanother.
That's what what's interestingabout that is.
This is kind of what policethink happened in this case.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Well, and police did not even.
I mean they didn't really knowit was a bomb at first.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
That's right, because .
Speaker 2 (12:18):
I think they even considered a lot of trailers use
propane and could somethinghave ignited from that initially
.
You know, of course, as theylook further, and they're not
thinking bomb.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Right?
It's Thanksgiving.
This is a family at home.
Maybe they were cooking aturkey.
Whoever thinks a bomb, though,in any of these cases I mean
Turkey fryers in 1985?
It's Lake Worth at a trailerpark.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
That's why I did say meth lab.
You know I mean something likethat.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
That's right Somebody's doing something you
know and I think probablyinvestigating, is that I don't
think they're walking andthinking, oh there's a bomb.
So the mother gets out.
She sees all the neighbors,everyone's already looking fire,
they've already been called.
So people come out and theyrealize well what she does.
What she tells her neighbors ismy family's inside.
Can you, can you try to getthem?
(13:03):
You know she's pleading forhelp and, um, her son is laying
there very injured and she justknows the rest of her family's
inside.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Yeah, I think even just the fire and the flames.
People were not even able to gojump inside and help.
No, they weren't.
No.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
So the three are lost the daughter, the cousin and
the father are lost in thisblast.
So police start investigatingthis as a targeted attack.
They eventually they find thebriefcase, they find the bomb,
they find the remnants of it inthe explosion.
They realize that the girl hadit on her lap sitting on the
(13:46):
couch.
There was someone sitting nextto her and I mean they kind of
just pieced it all together themother telling them there was a
knock at the door while theywere out at the convenience
store.
She didn't answer it, shedidn't see anything.
She didn't look down and seeanything at the door.
She said it was dark outsidethey don't have anything to go
(14:06):
on.
I mean, this is like what Ithink if you think about this
1985.
What Like I think if you thinkabout this 1985, remember what I
said this is then declared themost like deadly bombing in the
United States at this time.
And so this was a big deal.
Like this was a big deal.
This had just happened in Texas.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Yeah, because I mean really, like I said, it's a bomb
.
It's a bomb, this is notsomething just blowing up from
somebody fooling around.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
They bring the ATF in pretty quick.
They start bringing otherpeople in.
This is Lake Worth Police.
Fort Worth Police come on andhelp.
So they have a lot of lawenforcement involved in this.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Well, there's really two.
What's the motive?
Why would somebody target thisfamily?
They're new to town.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
They're new to town.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
They're new to town um said he did have a checkered
pass.
But who's gonna travel all theway from seattle to try to kill
this guy?
Speaker 1 (14:59):
and I mean like there was like a burglary on his
record, I think, and maybe, um,it wasn't significant enough to
think that there was any sort ofanimosity or anyone trying to
get them.
So it's kind of wild to thinkokay, so there is eventually an
arrest in this case.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
What they end up finding out hold on just to back
up yeah, yeah, go ahead, no goahead.
Wait a hold on, no go ahead uh,the wife too, yes, but the
insurance policy, I think onthis gentleman was like what?
Speaker 1 (15:31):
one or three grand, two grand barely enough to even
bury him.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
So I think she was quickly dismissed.
But I think that was you'reright I mean they always look at
the family.
But I think too, like onceagain, it's a, it's a, it's a
bomb.
Where would she even have themeans or hire somebody to do
this?
Speaker 1 (15:47):
you know yeah, and I think they quickly you know once
they like she was at the houseand she runs out and you always
look at the person that was inthe house last, which was her.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Well, and if you're going to bomb your family, you
don't go lay in the bedroom,because bombs can be, that's
right.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
Why would she stay in the trailer?
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Bombs are not always this precision, you know laser
guided thing, much less abriefcase bomb.
So that's another reason too.
I think it was quicklydismissed, because why would she
go lay in the bedroom and senda bomb in the front right?
Speaker 1 (16:16):
Makes no sense.
You may You'll leave it andleave the trailer.
You may be a victim of that.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Bomb yourself right.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Yeah, you're not going to know if you go lay in
Right, so it doesn't make anysense.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
I mean, there was the anarchist cookbook back then.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
but when did you find that?
We discussed this quite a bitat work, so it's a great book
Every.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
every high school kid in the early nineties had it.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
All right.
So eventually, 11 years later,okay Gosh, there is no leads in
this case.
Here's the problem with thiscase.
This family is new to town.
They can't find any, chris, anyinformation.
Hold on real quick.
Let me just finish my sentence.
Any information in theirbackground to saying that they
would have any enemies thatwould go to.
(17:01):
I mean, I want you to thinkabout this.
It was the biggest bombing inthe US, so they're thinking in
their minds.
They've got to be thinking bigpicture here.
For me, police are probablythinking mafia hit something in
this guy's background.
They probably extended it wayto Seattle, probably talked to
all of his friends back inSeattle.
This is 11 years before theyeven really get a name.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Well, and I think too , they start thinking as well.
Yes, sir, yeah, start thinkingas well is yes, sir, yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
So it was the most.
It was the deadliest and themost they.
There was a word they used forit.
It was like the way that itpenetrated in 1985 in 1985.
So at the time they said it wasand this was actually in the
paper that I read that that atthe time because this was 10
years later, they wrote thatarticle in 1985 it was
considered the most, thedeadliest and the most lethal, I
(17:55):
think the way it was madebombing in the usa at that time
in 1985.
We just didn't hear about thosethings.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
I feel well so I think they also pretty quickly
start to think was this theright house?
This was a trailer park thatthey did have drug dealers
living in.
And so there was anothergentleman too, who was a
methamphetamine dealer, also ajeweler that they did consider
like, was somebody trying totarget him?
I think another gentleman too,who was also a drug dealer that
(18:24):
lived somewhere around there.
So was this just kind of a caseof mistaken?
You know, identity, notidentity.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
But they didn't see a person mistaken trailer.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
Mistaken, mistaken trailer.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
Yeah, you know so there is one guy, chris, that
we'll talk about.
There were.
We're not going to get into allthe suspects in this case,
because there's really not a lotof information about the rest
of them there's one particular,I was gonna say too.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
They all pretty quickly got dismissed because
once again you start looking athow this bomb was made.
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Yeah, and that's why I think they were looking so far
away from that.
Like who would?
I even probably think at thattime maybe police thought, well,
are people going to go to thislinks just to kill a drug dealer
in the trailer park?
Like aren't there easier,different ways to do that than
actually building a bomb?
Like that is, you would thinkthey want to take out a lot of
(19:19):
people.
In my mind.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
Or send a message or send a message.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
So, yeah, great point on that.
All right, so they start,you're welcome.
So they start looking intopeople.
Again, we're not going to talkabout all the suspects because
nobody was really arrestedexcept one guy.
Now the reason his name comesup is a couple reasons.
One, we know he was living inthe area at the time with his
wife.
The other piece of it is he wasactually serving time in prison
(19:45):
and confided in an inmate thathe was actually responsible for
this bomb.
He actually says he was hiredfor $5,000 to kill a drug dealer
and he got the wrong trailer.
So those are the words thatwere used by the inmate.
Now we all know.
Per another inmate Per anotherinmate, but we all know that
(20:05):
when it comes to that, and itcomes to I mean, so this is well
one, they want this solvedright, this is a big case at the
time.
Two, you have an inmate notconfession, but an inmate.
Well, confession from theperson who supposedly did it,
and as police, you're like okay,do they want freedom?
(20:26):
What do they want?
Is this made up?
Speaker 2 (20:28):
Well, and I think too , and so they're considering
that, when it comes from this,guy I read this, the suspect as
as well was a self-describedjailhouse lawyer.
He would, you know, helpingpeople get out.
So like I think this guy was.
Basically he was giving him, Ithink, because he was serving
some pretty serious time andmaybe didn't see any um, you
know nothing on the horizon ofgetting getting out.
(20:49):
So I basically letting this guyuse his supposed confession to
lessen his sentence that's right.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
So it sounds weird, but it does sound weird.
And then the wife is questionedand she says, oh, we were
nowhere in the area duringthanksgiving.
And then she recants that andsays, once police tell her like
do you know how serious this is?
Your husband's name has come up.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
She got mad at him.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Yeah, we need to know if you know anything, because
you're going to be heldresponsible if you don't tell us
something.
So here's what she tells police.
She actually tells police.
They were there that night.
They were together in a car.
He exits the vehicle with abriefcase.
Now in my research I read thatshe would not have actually been
(21:39):
able to have that informationat that point to know it was an
actual briefcase.
So I can't determine whethershe gave that information more
up front, because this is 11years later right, she might
have gotten mad at him.
And at that time you think theywould know it's a briefcase.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
So I'm thinking maybe they read that in the paper
which by the way, especiallygiven the time frame that she
came forward with thisinformation.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
There's a lot of information about it and the
inmate ends up going oh, I madeit all up, we read it about it.
We knew there was you know thiswas trying to be solved, and we
figured we'd just work togetherto get at least one of us out
of here.
So then he recants his wholeentire statement and so now
they're left.
(22:23):
But guys, they don't care, okay.
So this goes back to what Chrisand I talk a lot about here,
and what we talk a lot about onour show is the fact that
sometimes unfortunately, by theway lawyers, doctors,
psychiatrists, mechanics they'renot all good people.
Police officers are one ofthose people.
(22:44):
They're not all good people andthey all shouldn't be serving
in a public servant role.
But here's also what I'm goingto say you always Like they want
to make the case.
They want to make the case, theywant to solve the case.
Well, and I think they want tosolve the renewed interest was
the oklahoma city bombing that'sright and I think that's which
was 1995, 1996, 1996.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Okay, I think that's kind of also too was to reopen,
not reopen it.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Well, this is kind of well, I mean so many years had
passed.
And then, when the oklahomacity bombing happening, they
thought, well, this, this iskind of well, I mean, it's so
many years had passed.
And then, when the Oklahomacity bombing happening, they
thought, well, this is the kindof bomb that was in our case, so
maybe we need to like reignitethis and look in this.
And this is when they startfinding out all of this it's
still a different kind of bomb.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
Cause, that's a detonated from strikes me
because who is going to jump ina car with somebody and ride
with a bomb in the trunk?
That's quite volatile, that'swhat even their, their her story
about being with him the nightof doesn't really make much
sense unless he didn't tell herso then you just put another
thought I got a bomb in thetrunk.
You know, are you gonna ridewith me?
Speaker 1 (23:47):
what if they didn't drive?
Though put that in the miata.
You just kind of put a thoughtin my head.
What if they didn't drive?
What if they actually lived inthe trailer park?
What if there was some You'reless likely to mistake in the
trailer?
Speaker 2 (24:02):
If you live there.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
Yes, because if you're not riding with a bomb in
the car, if it can be easilydetonated.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
If you live there, wouldn't you know which trailer
to bomb?
Speaker 1 (24:11):
But that's what I'm saying.
So maybe this was targeted, butit wasn't targeted enough and
there wasn't a trail enough toactually tell it was targeted by
someone who already had somesort of animosity or beef with
the family living there.
That is something to consider,Because maybe they weren't in a
car and by the way, hertestimony and his testimony he
(24:34):
says they didn't actually buythat truck until December 13th,
so there was no way she was inthat vehicle with him on
Thanksgiving.
And they end up finding outthat that's actually true.
You guys, he goes to trial.
They don't care about the factthat they've recanted these
statements.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
They take him to trial convict him and give him
the death penalty in this case,and I don't think we've said
this gentleman's name.
His name is Michael Tony.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Michael Tony is his name.
We've been calling him thesuspect.
Oh sorry.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
Michael Tony.
Yes, Very secretive.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
But you know what I mean.
They give him the death penalty, in this case on recanted
evidence.
That's what my point aboutsolving something just to solve
it.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
I think they said that some of the wiring that was
used the copper wire, thatthere was evidence that this was
found somewhere.
You know I mean because thisguy too, he really had no
history of bomb making skills,no, he just had a history of
like burglary and other randomstuff.
That sounds like somebody whomay have had a little military
(25:33):
time and knew a thing, or twoabout a thing or.
Two.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
So due process and the right to have all evidence
at your trial is a thing.
So if you are convicted ofsomething and you find that
there was significant evidenceleft out of your trial, you can
then appeal this, and this isexactly what this guy does Left
out of your trial.
You can then appeal this, andthis is exactly what this guy
does.
And they find out that thecourt and the case and the
attorneys really screwed up andthey completely dropped all
(26:00):
charges against this guy, lethim out and they are never going
to ever retry him again.
So if any of this is true, ifhe is involved, right, he'll
never be convicted for this.
And at this point you know Ialways say, well, he'll never be
convicted for this.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
and at this point you know I always say he won't be
never again, because he diedpretty shortly after in a car
crash yeah, he did so that's,either karma I know, I thought
about that too.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
We see that sometimes in cases, I mean even at the
time he was in jail for burglaryyou know's right I mean he
wasn't some contract hit man oranything like that, yeah.
So what police believe?
So what police believe even asof like five years ago is the
fact that they think whoeverplanted this bomb got the wrong
(26:46):
trailer.
And the reason they believethat is because of the lack of
evidence that they have pointingto anyone who had enough
animosity or any kind of wasupset with this family in any
way.
They just could find nothing ofit.
And because they could findnothing of it made them think
(27:07):
that, and because of thenefarious activity that happened
around this trailer, theybasically believed that they got
the wrong guy.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Yeah, I lean more towards perhaps that gentleman.
Was it Joe Tortella who was thejeweler and meth dealer?
Because, he probably wasdealing with some pretty sketchy
cats, Because I think even hewas thinking maybe this was
meant for me well, and I thinkthey even said something like he
(27:37):
so much about he was nevertried for any drug dealing, but
I think police it was kind ofcommon knowledge that he was
involved in that, but you know.
So I think at the time he wasdealing drugs, cheating uh, with
somebody's wife and stuff likethat.
So could a scorned husband orsomebody that he owed money to
or something like that, yeahWell, they've never had any
(27:58):
suspects in this case.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Chris, at this point I would say that it would just
be someone coming forward andtalking about this.
But to me this is so isolatedand has absolutely nothing to do
with this family, which meansthey will never find the
evidence.
I mean, you don't know where tolook, you don't know who to
start with.
I mean you just don't know.
And so they really focus theirefforts on looking into their
(28:22):
background and trying to findsomething.
And because of the lack of whatthey found, that's why they
believe this family was justlike an innocent bystanders from
the spawn, which is so crazy.
Like you think, you go home oneday and I mean imagine just
being killed and you weren'teven the target.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
I mean that's so the lesson is don't open black
briefcases.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
We'll definitely don't do that.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
But I must say, unless someone tells you it's on
its way, that's a good bit justto go put a empty black
briefcase on somebody's porchand you know leaning forward.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
All right, y'all no-transcript.
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