TRENDING: "The Curious Case of Natalia Grace" is Back- Mega Mix Recap: Ep 1 (part 1)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I tried, I tried. I tried. I tried, I tried,
I tried, I tried. How spot on was that it
was good?

Speaker 2 (00:12):
Oh?

Speaker 3 (00:12):
That was good?

Speaker 1 (00:13):
I'm that is not I was not.

Speaker 4 (00:16):
I wasn't overreacting, you guys, It really isn't. That is
so fucked up.

Speaker 3 (00:23):
It's fucked up, so fucked up. It is just so
damn fuck up.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
That's fucked up.

Speaker 3 (00:37):
Hey, guys, welcome to That's So Fucked Up, a podcast
about things that make you say that's so fucked up,
like exploiting repeatedly women who have.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
Been victimized since they were children.

Speaker 4 (00:54):
What you guys are like? What the fuck are you
talking about?

Speaker 1 (00:58):
And who are you? I'm Ashley love it you.

Speaker 3 (01:00):
It's your host, and I'm talking about the Natalia Grace saga.
If y'all were around last year, shout out. We've been
together for at least a year, then you know that
I covered the documentary, if you can call it that,
the Curious Case of Natalia Grace, which was on ID
slash Max, and I did a binge or bust for

(01:22):
every single episode because it was the first time that
Natalia was being interviewed and being heard from publicly from
actually herself and not somebody else telling her fucking story.

Speaker 4 (01:33):
So, although I do not think in my opinion that.

Speaker 3 (01:37):
ID makes good documentaries or docuseries, I really wanted to
watch and recap that series because well that season, because
of course, they had to make her story into three seasons,
just like really capitalize on, you know, the I was
gonna say the tragedy, but I mean, I'm I think
more to capitalize on the mystery. You know, is she

(01:59):
she a little person who is evil and trying to
trick this nice family? Or is she a little girl
who was abandoned and neglected. It's b you guys, it's
fucking it's two. She was a child who was neglected
and mistreated and handed from one family to another, and
then the last few years of her life have just

(02:21):
been her being exploited by investigation Discovery. So last season,
at the end of episode six, they said.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
Next season on the Curious Case.

Speaker 3 (02:33):
And I was just like, are you fucking kidding me,
you goddamn hooligans. But I'm actually kind of glad that
they made a season three. I don't think as I
initially thought that they planned it to be three seasons
all along. I think something actually pretty crazy did come up,
and from what I can tell from season three, which

(02:54):
is out now, it seems like the production company might
have tried to do right by a Natalia. So I
really hope that's the truth. And because I had done
season two of the docu series and I didn't do
the first season because we had already done an episode
about it, which y'all will hear at the start of this,
I felt like I really needed to cover this last season.

Speaker 4 (03:13):
But I really really.

Speaker 3 (03:16):
Felt compelled and fucking fire under my ass. Premiering on
Hulu on March nineteenth, twenty twenty five, which will just
be a few days after after we've finished these the
show Good American Family will be coming out on Hulu,
and look, y'all, I'll let you decide for yourselves. I

(03:38):
will put the link to the trailer in the show notes,
but I can already tell it's going to be an
absolute fucking hit job. So in light of Good American
Family coming out, I thought that I would re release
all of our old Natalia content. So in this episode
you have the first episode that we did on Natalia,
which was an episode of of a season of TSFE Presents,

(04:02):
and then it goes into the bingerbust of The Curious
Case of Natalia Grace Season two, episode one, and then
it goes into season.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
Two episode two.

Speaker 3 (04:13):
This here episode that you're listening to now has actually
three episodes packed into it. Make sure you'll catch up
on this and then throughout the rest of the week,
we'll be putting out the recaps of episodes three through six,
and by the end of the.

Speaker 4 (04:28):
Week we'll have a recap of the.

Speaker 3 (04:31):
First episode of the newest and final season of The
Curious Case of Natalia Grace and hopefully we can get
some real and true information out there at the same
time that the world is being flooded with misinformation by Hulu.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
And in true.

Speaker 3 (04:48):
TSFU fashion, this episode episodes, we are joined by a
few different co hosts. We have Megan from Give Us
Morgue Schante Pitt one of our friends of the podcast,
former cult member and badass and Megan. If y'all don't
know Amazing too, go check out Give Us More.

Speaker 4 (05:09):
Then we have a former co host of mine, Ali.

Speaker 3 (05:12):
We hear a little bit from her, and then again
from Chantey, who joined us for the first episode and
who will be recapping the rest of this season with
me and get ready because at the end of this
week I have got some some.

Speaker 1 (05:28):
News for you.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
Before we jump into the episodes, I wanted to give you,
guys a quick little clarification. When you hear these noises,
that's fuck though, That means that one episode is done
and we're moving into the next one. And one more
side note to avoid any confusion, we did record these
episodes live on YouTube last year, and between the six

(05:52):
parter on Gypsy Rose and the six parter on Italian Grace,
we had a lot of episodes to edit at that time,
and we did minimal editing on them. So if you
hear us refer to an audience member or you know,
someone imaginary and you don't know who it is, it
would have been somebody that we were talking to during
the live All right, guys, strap in and enjoy.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
That's not though.

Speaker 3 (06:17):
I am joined by my lovely co host co host. Hi.

Speaker 1 (06:22):
Who are you? Hi?

Speaker 2 (06:23):
I'm Megan, I'm from Give us.

Speaker 1 (06:25):
More Megan Powell.

Speaker 2 (06:26):
Yeah. Meg. You know what, when I was younger, I
had to go to speech therapy because I stumble, trip,
wobble all over my words and my second name, my
own second name is one of those words. It just
feels like there's a brick in my mouth when I
try to say Powell. There's too many interesting Yeah, i'll
say it for you. Thank you.

Speaker 3 (06:44):
Okay, So I specifically told you not to google anything
about today, But what did you do? Like literally thirty
seconds before the show started.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
I may have googled just a name. That's it.

Speaker 3 (06:58):
That's a crazy impatient You couldn't wait just like one
more minute.

Speaker 2 (07:03):
No, because you mentioned a name and then I was like, oh,
fuck shit, is this something I'm supposed to know? And
then it wasn't. It was something I was not supposed
to know. So curiosity killed a cap.

Speaker 3 (07:13):
It's okay, do you know who an Italia Grace Barnett is.
Have you heard of this story?

Speaker 2 (07:18):
I've seen a movie that's about it.

Speaker 3 (07:20):
Okay, yeah, as I'll talk about a little bit later.
Her case has many times been compared to the two
thousand and nine film Orphan, very similar plot.

Speaker 2 (07:34):
That movie stresses me out.

Speaker 3 (07:36):
I've never seen it, but now I want to.

Speaker 2 (07:38):
Oh you should. It's very good from what I remember.

Speaker 3 (07:41):
Okay, So, yeah, we didn't want to fuck with y'all
too much this season because damn some bitches really do
be crazy.

Speaker 2 (07:52):
M hmm.

Speaker 3 (07:52):
And in this season we have seen that, and with
Carla Homolka and Catherine Knight, Oh, we just looked at
two of the worst ladies out there.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
Yeah, so we.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
Tried to keep it a little bit lighter with Lisa Nowak,
even though I still think that story is just like
more tragic than anything else it is. And then today,
depending on what you think is the outcome, like depending
on what side of the fence you land on, this
also could be a really tragic story or it could

(08:26):
be like one of horror movies. So you fucking tell me.
So are you ready to hear this crazy shit?

Speaker 2 (08:34):
I don't know. Since Sam Catherine Knight last week, I've
just that was at a little traumatizing, to be honest.
So yeah, you know what, I'm ready to hear something
completely different.

Speaker 3 (08:45):
This one is completely different because it's a mystery.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
Ooh, you know, Jenky's Megan. We've got a mystery to
solve today.

Speaker 2 (08:55):
Oh my, did you know that that was like an
actual like rock punk band that created the song for
Scooby Doo?

Speaker 3 (09:01):
No?

Speaker 1 (09:02):
I did not, did you know that?

Speaker 3 (09:04):
I'm ninety percent sure that Scooby Doo and Shaggy were
definitely stoners.

Speaker 2 (09:09):
Oh, one hundred percent in the real like Scooby Doo movie,
you know, the one way they had the actual actors.

Speaker 1 (09:15):
Okay, yeah, I didn't see it, but.

Speaker 2 (09:17):
Oh, so fucking good, get out of here. It's amazing.
Oh it's so good.

Speaker 1 (09:23):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (09:23):
So Shaggy and Scooby are on a plane. A woman
comes on and sits beside them and starts talking to them,
and she's like, oh, my name is Mary Jane, and
Shaggy's like, oh my god, that's like my favorite name.
So there's definitely they're definitely supposed to be stoners.

Speaker 3 (09:37):
Yeah, yeah, oh hey, you want to go get some
Scooby snacks?

Speaker 1 (09:42):
Whoa woo?

Speaker 3 (09:43):
Yeah, you guys aren't full in anybody.

Speaker 1 (09:47):
Did they also make up the word jinkies?

Speaker 3 (09:49):
Do you know?

Speaker 2 (09:50):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (09:51):
That's a saying of the time. I'm going to figure
that out.

Speaker 3 (09:54):
Another mystery, Another mystery to solve. Okay, speaking of let's
get into this one.

Speaker 1 (10:00):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (10:00):
So Natalia Grace Barnett was supposedly born in two thousand
and three in Ukraine. This is up for much debate,
which is a big part of the story.

Speaker 2 (10:12):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (10:13):
She was born with a rare form of Dwarfism called
spawdelopisphasial displasia. There's like twenty word letters in that word,
so anyways, it affects the bones, causes short stature and
skeletal abnormalities. It can actually result in difficulty breathing, early

(10:36):
onset arthritis, weak joint mobility, and problems with vision. Oh,
it comes with its whole own host of difficulties. She
was adopted by a New Hampshire family in two thousand
and eight, but was returned to US Social Services when
she injured another child. Natalia was quoted as saying, quote,

(10:57):
one of the boys, ME and him were really so
we wrestled almost, but I landed on his arm wrong,
so the mom thought I was trying to break his
arm end quote.

Speaker 2 (11:07):
Okay, well kids do that shit. You don't immediately think
she tried to break his arm. She must have been
either the mother had her own weird thoughts or Natalia
was her own thing.

Speaker 3 (11:19):
This tory is a fucking roller coaster and a mind fuck,
so just get ready. In twenty ten, Natalia was adopted
by Christine and Michael Barnett. They were highly religious and
experienced foster parents who ran a children's daycare from their
home in Westfield, Indiana. Christine had always wanted a larger family,

(11:43):
but she had severe complications in her pregnancies and was
unable to have more than the three children that they
already had. Three plus a fucking daycare and foster children sounds.

Speaker 1 (11:56):
Like plenty to me.

Speaker 3 (11:58):
Uh huh yeah, but she wasna, we got to get
some more kids up in here. So they had three sons, Jacob, Wes,
and Evan. Jacob was diagnosed with moderate to severe autism
at two years old. Doctors told Christiane and Michael that
Jacob would likely never talk, read, or be able to
independently manage basic activities like tying his shoes. Well, guess what, Megan,

(12:24):
He was a fucking physics genius. Oh my god, who
enrolled at Indiana University, Perdue University, Indianapolis.

Speaker 1 (12:35):
I up ui holy shit.

Speaker 4 (12:37):
Anyways, but at the age of ten.

Speaker 3 (12:40):
At the age of ten, ten years old, yeah, he
was enrolling in college.

Speaker 2 (12:44):
Oh casually, yeah, super cash. No, at ten, I was
excited that I could have a big mac instead of
just like a happy meal. That's that's what I was
doing at ten.

Speaker 1 (12:53):
Probably so going to go get a big macwh.

Speaker 2 (12:55):
Do it get that extra cheese?

Speaker 3 (12:57):
I feel like a disgusting human admin it out loud
to all these people, all thousand of our listeners. What's
up you guys?

Speaker 2 (13:05):
Hi?

Speaker 1 (13:05):
Anyways, whatever, don't shame me.

Speaker 2 (13:07):
No, It's the best food out there.

Speaker 3 (13:09):
In twenty thirteen, Christine actually wrote a book called The Spark,
A Mother's Story of Nurturing Genius, which, honestly, if you
ask me, it sounds a little bit like.

Speaker 2 (13:21):
I'm going to profit off of my son's amazing.

Speaker 4 (13:24):
It just sounds like great, a little bit of a
big old pat on the back.

Speaker 1 (13:28):
Okay, it's like all right to herself. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (13:30):
Yeah, And this was a memoir about her and Jacob's
relationship and her journey of educating him and giving him
the tools he needed for success. Yeah. Now even more,
I'm just like, so, I'm not gonna lie. I'm not
a huge fan of Christine.

Speaker 2 (13:45):
Ooh drama.

Speaker 1 (13:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (13:47):
I've just heard some things along the way that I
think Michael sounds all right, but Christine sounds I don't know,
But everybody sounds I don't know. So I'm just gonna
keep going, okay. Christine also said that she had a
very privileged life and if she had the ability to
help another person in the world, then she wanted to

(14:08):
do that. So her and Michael decided that they wanted
to adopt a little girl, but not just any little girl.

Speaker 1 (14:14):
They wanted somebody.

Speaker 3 (14:16):
Who possibly was foreign, or had special needs, or potentially
somebody with behavioral issues that would otherwise get overlooked. They
wanted somebody that other people wouldn't want. Okay, So they
were going to adopt a girl from Haiti, and they
did all the home visits and all the shit that

(14:37):
you're supposed to do when a formal adoption happens. But
then a hurricane hit and like everything just got super
fucked up. So that poor little girl thought she was
going to get adopted and go to America and then
had a devastating hurricane hit her country instead.

Speaker 2 (14:55):
Just like Jesus, that's awful. That would obviously just place
her even more.

Speaker 1 (14:59):
He's the real fucking victim of this story.

Speaker 3 (15:01):
Yeah, so they randomly got contacted by this sketchy adoption
agency in a strip mall in Florida.

Speaker 2 (15:10):
Oh legit.

Speaker 3 (15:11):
Apparently it's pretty rare to get cold called by adoption
agencies like, hey, we got a kid for you. Oh,
but they get this call out of the blue and
the agency said that they had researched them and their
petition for a little girl with needs, and they said
that they had the perfect child for them, and they
didn't do a home inspection, like nothing beyond reading the

(15:35):
paperwork or whatever.

Speaker 2 (15:36):
So no, don't like that.

Speaker 3 (15:38):
That fucking sketch, right, yeah, I think we can both
agree on that. So they were given just twenty four
hours to complete this apparent emergency adoption.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
They got very few details.

Speaker 3 (15:52):
On her background. They said that she had been in
the US for two years. Her Ukrainian birth certificate said
that she was six years old. She obviously did have
some form of Dwarfism, but they didn't know how severe.
And they were told that she needed a home immediately
because her previous adoptive parents had suddenly given her up

(16:14):
for quote undisclosed reason, and if they didn't adopt her,
she would immediately go back into the foster system.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
I don't like this, No, no, no no.

Speaker 3 (16:24):
They had about less than ten minutes to meet her.
She came in super bubbly, which was really weird for
a six year old girl who had just gotten like
fucking ghosted by her adoptive family and immediately called the
mommy and daddy.

Speaker 2 (16:40):
Oh, if we're airing on the side that she's a
six year old in desperate need of help. If we're
airing on that side for a second, maybe she's just
like immediately accepting. I don't know, just.

Speaker 1 (16:49):
Wanted to be loved. Yeah, we don't know. And after seeing.

Speaker 3 (16:54):
This like super cute little girl who obviously really needed
their help, they were like, all right, fuck it, y'ollo,
let's take her. They didn't get to know her, had
no idea how debilitating her dwarfism was, and they noticed
pretty much immediately in the parking lot after they left
the adoption agency that she could.

Speaker 1 (17:12):
Like barely walk on her own.

Speaker 3 (17:14):
They were like, oh, fuck, this is much more severe
than they just closed obviously, And very shortly after they
became suspicious of Natalia's age. Christine went to give Natalia
a bath and found that she had full pubic care,
so they pulled the adoption agency. They're like, what the fuck,

(17:34):
and the adoption agency refused to give any further details
because it had been a closed adoption, so they're.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
Like, yeah, well it's on you.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
We don't know what to Talia. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (17:44):
Yeah, so Ukrainian adoption agency in a strip mall in Florida.

Speaker 1 (17:50):
Yeah, come on.

Speaker 2 (17:51):
Right, Yeah, it is very weird. It's giving like time share.
Do you want to buy a time.

Speaker 3 (17:55):
Share timeshare vibe? Yeah, and that's not good. I'm sure
some people out there have a great deal on their
time share, but like Airbnb, you know, yeah, I think
now is time to take a quick commercial break and
everybody can ponder on that pubic hair situation and we'll
bear it back.

Speaker 2 (18:18):
Hi, this is give us more. I'm me H'm Megan,
and this is our super casual promo. We are a
true crime podcast here to make you laugh your tits off.
Fuck you. She's a fairy.

Speaker 5 (18:34):
It's night time, right and next thing you just see
a glowing dick.

Speaker 2 (18:41):
She switched the pails in the bottle. I would so
bully him. Why are you kidding on your hit map.
It's gonna kill my husband for the life of churance money. Bye.
You're going to break out a death row in me
for a canoe because Cuthmates would call him third boy.

Speaker 1 (19:00):
If that interests you, make sure to check us out
wherever you listen to your podcasts.

Speaker 2 (19:06):
I know it's fine, super.

Speaker 3 (19:08):
Kind nailed it. Okay, we are back full bush and
ready to continue. So they took her to Peyton Manning
Children's Hospital and had her age assessed, and they said

(19:29):
that she was eight years old. So they're like, okay,
well she's not six, but she is eight. But things
continued to make them suspicious, the fact that she spoke
perfect English with no accent, and when Christine set up
a date with another lady with the Ukrainian kid, Natalia
refused to speak in Ukrainian with the other child, so

(19:52):
she was like, oh, I don't even think.

Speaker 1 (19:54):
This bee can fucking speak Ukrainian.

Speaker 2 (19:58):
Okay. Well, if to be fair again Devil's advocate, if
she was with another American family beforehand, maybe she was
super young when they took her and they just like
didn't know any fucking Ukrainian. So she was never taught
any you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (20:11):
Yeah, yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
It's all in the air, all Scooby snacks to me,
my friend. Also, Natalia hated being dressed like a child.
She spoke much more like a teenager than a child.
She had a pretty advanced vocabulary in regards.

Speaker 1 (20:29):
To the school that Christine ran.

Speaker 3 (20:31):
Natalia once said to her, quote, these children are exhausting.

Speaker 1 (20:35):
I don't know how you do it, and quote.

Speaker 2 (20:38):
Oh, okay, Natalia, you know what, I'm self aware? All right?

Speaker 1 (20:41):
Are you a child?

Speaker 2 (20:45):
Fucking hell?

Speaker 5 (20:45):
She didn't want to play with doys, dois of tools.
She didn't want to play with dolls or toys. So
they got another test in twenty twelve, again a pating
man in hospital, and it again that she was a child.
So they were like, okay, but what the fuck? She
had adult.

Speaker 1 (21:05):
Teeth and signs of.

Speaker 3 (21:07):
What seemed like a period. There would be period bloodstains
in her underwear and Christine would find them stuffed in
the trash can, as if Natalia was trying to conceal
the evidence. Oh and Christine claims that Natalian never grew
a single inch in the time that they were together, so,

(21:28):
and even children with dwarfism do grow. So Christine was
kind of like, all right, well, if you want to
be treated more like an adult, I will do that.

Speaker 2 (21:40):
Sure.

Speaker 3 (21:40):
Natalia wanted to play with makeup and talk about boys
and yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:45):
You know, not child things.

Speaker 3 (21:48):
And this is when Natalia's behavior shifted drastically and not
for the good. Oh, so the Barnetts or Christine, especially
of war seems to be between Christine and Natalia start
to feel threatened by Natalia. Christine said that one day
she walked down the stairs to find that there were

(22:10):
clear thumbtacks faced up. She said she also found a
knife under Natalia's bed, and apparently one night Natalia appeared
in their room with the knife in her hand, just
like standing at their bed.

Speaker 2 (22:26):
Absolutely fucking not at this stage, just like return to Sander,
bring her back to the strip. Mall fuck that, back.

Speaker 3 (22:33):
To the strip, mall you come, which is what you
would think, right, because let me continue. Christine also claims
that Natalia once grabbed six year old Ethan's toy and
threw it into traffic during a trip into the city,
and one asked why Natalia did this. Apparently she said, quote,
I'm trying to kill the boys.

Speaker 2 (22:55):
Oh.

Speaker 3 (22:55):
Christine also said that she caught Natalia trying to poison
her coffee, but Natalia said that this was a misunderstanding.
She was grabbing for the bleach or the cleaner or whatever,
and it was right near Christine's coffee, so Christine assumed
that she was trying to poison her, but Christine Christine

(23:19):
Christina alleges that she said, what are you doing, and
Natalia said, I'm trying to poison you. It also kind
of feels like, if this person is actively trying to
like murder you and your family, you would think return
to sender, right, But.

Speaker 2 (23:36):
It's so funny about how she's choosing to be honest
about how I'm trying to violently fucking kill you and
the rest of your family. But I'm gonna lie to
you about my age, even though she's probably only a
couple of years older than what, well everybody thinks she.

Speaker 1 (23:50):
Is maybe or she's like thirty.

Speaker 3 (23:53):
We don't know.

Speaker 1 (23:54):
So, like I said, this story.

Speaker 3 (23:56):
Is a mind fucking a half. I didn't even know
what was happening. Apparently, one day they also took a
family trip to the fucking petting zoo or something, and
Natalia went to sit down on the grass next to
an electric fence and fucking Christine went to sit next
to her or whatever, and Christine said that when they

(24:18):
went to get up, Natalia tried to push her into
the electric fence. But a family that had fostered Natalia
in two thousand and nine said that with Natalia's rare
form of Dwarfism, she wouldn't even be able to do that,
she wouldn't have the mobility.

Speaker 2 (24:36):
To do so.

Speaker 3 (24:37):
They also said that their experience with her was like
that of a normal child. So they really went to
bat for an Italia lator and were like, this all
sounds okay, some bullshit.

Speaker 2 (24:48):
All right, so Christine is a little liar?

Speaker 1 (24:50):
Maybe who who is the lions? Yeah.

Speaker 3 (24:56):
In January twenty twelve, just eighteen months after they had
adopted Natalia, they committed her to a long term psychiatric
hospital to figure out what the fuck was wrong with her,
apparently while she was there. But also this confuses me
because I'm pretty sure that if you go to a

(25:17):
psych hospital, like your records are sealed. They can't just
tell anybody and everybody. But if I guess, if she
was entered as a child, then they would disclose to
the parents their findings whatever. So they said that Natalia
had drawn pictures of the family members dead and rolled

(25:38):
up in carpets or left out in the cold.

Speaker 1 (25:40):
She told a psychiatrist that she.

Speaker 3 (25:42):
Wanted to kill the whole family and felt no remorse
for it. She also said that she was eighteen. While
she was there, she was diagnosed with sociopathic and psychopathic disorders,
which actually can't be diagnosed in a child. So it
seems that would give her that diagnosis if she had

(26:03):
admitted to them that she was in fact an adult.

Speaker 2 (26:06):
Yeah, if she admitted to them that she was an adult,
then how did the parents know about this?

Speaker 1 (26:10):
It's all very confusing.

Speaker 2 (26:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (26:12):
At some point apparently they asked their GP, their general practitioner,
to do a bone density and dental record to try
to get it proved that she was an adult, but
they did not share with him that a Payton Manning
hospital tests had already shown her to be a child.
So the GP, Andrew McClaren, said that Natalia's birth year

(26:38):
on her Ukrainian birth certificate was quote clearly inaccurate, and
that quote over time, it has become increasingly apparent that
this patient is substantially older than she claimed to be
end quote. So it's like different tests are showing that
she's an adult, different ones are showing that she's a child.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
But then GP is like your family GP, so he
probably knows the family for like a super long time.
He's probably more inclined to agree and pursh listen to
what they're saying.

Speaker 3 (27:09):
Yeah, definitely, definitely, but Natalia does deny all claims of
trying to harm or kill the Barnets. The Barnets filed
the motion with the Marion County Superior Court to have
the date on Natalia's birth certificate change from two thousand
and three to nineteen eighty nine, changing her from nine

(27:29):
years old to twenty two, and this was supposedly so
that she would be able to get the proper care
for an adult that she needed. At no time in
this process did the court appoint legal counsel to represent
Natalia's legal interests or present her defense against the petition,
and the motion was granted, so Natalia's age was legally

(27:51):
changed to twenty two. That's fuck though, it is because
I don't even know where that fucking number came from.
Because different tests, you know, are being done, bone density tests,
dental records, you know, blood tests, psychiatric tests, and they're
all showing her at different ages. And the thing is,

(28:12):
with the form of severe Dwarfism that she has, it
makes it really hard to tell what's accurate. Also, somebody's
lying somewhere, you know, So there's that too.

Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (28:23):
Absolutely, and I think that's probably a good time to
take another quick commercial break. And on that note, we'll
be right back. Okay, we are back. So when Natalia
was discharged from psychiatric care, they refused to pick her up.

Speaker 2 (28:41):
That's just plain mean, I know.

Speaker 3 (28:43):
Because they're like, well, she's an adult who's been trying
to kill our family. But they did set her up
with a Social Security number and helped her apply for benefits,
food stamps, and an ID. They also paid rent on
an apartment in a Fire Indiana for her to live alone.

Speaker 2 (29:03):
So they did all this, but they drew the fucking
line of picking her up from the hospital.

Speaker 1 (29:06):
Yeah, they didn't pick her up, which it's all just
so weird, dude, Just yeah, I mean, I can't.

Speaker 3 (29:14):
So they paid rent on an apartment and Aspire, Indiana
so that she could live alone, and apparently when she
caused problems and was evicted, they stepped in again to
prevent her from homelessness and paid a year's rent on
a new apartment for her in Lafayette, Tippy Canoe County.

Speaker 2 (29:32):
And sorry, yes, I am super curious to know what
fucking problems she caused, Like, was she just noisy? Was
she throwing parties? Did she have animals? I'm trying to know.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
I actually don't know.

Speaker 2 (29:49):
God she's having Well, I'm twenty two, now, let me
get drunk.

Speaker 1 (29:51):
And I hate my last questions and I don't know
the answer.

Speaker 2 (29:55):
I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

Speaker 3 (29:58):
Christine said that she commuting daily with Natalia and even
came up with a plan for her to enroll in
college to get her high school diploma and study cosmatology,
but it was also later said that Christine allegedly had
said that she was going to leave her in a
white trash town where no one would notice her.

Speaker 2 (30:18):
Ooh, oh, you know sometimes you think your mom is bad. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
Also, though, it's just so confusing.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
If this is a conniving little person who has threatened
to kill your family, why are you helping her? But
if she is, I can also see where you'd be
like fuck this chick, you know, yeah, and maybe be like,
but she's obviously got some severe issues and maybe we'll

(30:46):
help her out to an extent. Christine said quote, I
co signed the lease and paid for the rent upfront
for a year. I did everything you would do when
you send your child off to college. I helped her
with groceries and bought furniture at Target for her.

Speaker 1 (31:00):
So at this point, the whole family moves.

Speaker 3 (31:02):
To Canada without Natalia. And this is because Jake was
going to study at the prestigious Perimeter Institute for Theoretical
Physics in Waterloo, Ontario.

Speaker 2 (31:16):
Yeah. I have no idea what any of that.

Speaker 3 (31:18):
I don't know what even was that sentence I caught Ontario,
Like that's in Canada.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
Yeah, those fucking context clues, really, you know.

Speaker 3 (31:27):
Natalia said that during this time quote, as an eight
year old, she lived on canned food that the Barnetts
left for her. Christine claimed that after the family moved
to Canada, Natalia stopped returning her calls and was no
longer able to get in touch with her, and she
was worried that Natalia was again pretending to be a

(31:49):
child and scamming another family. She said, quote, I would
have forced her back into treatment, but I couldn't do
that any longer because she was an adult.

Speaker 2 (31:58):
Because you made her one. If that's the case, right.

Speaker 3 (32:01):
Christine got a letter in the mail stating that Natalia
had changed the beneficiary for her Social Security income from
Michael to someone else that they didn't know Christine said, quote,
I did not abandon anyone. I went to Canada to
further my son's education. These accusations are absolutely devastating end quote.

(32:22):
So Cynthia and Antwine Mans try to adopt Natalia in
twenty fifteen, but are told that it wasn't legal because
she was an adult and Michael's like ah hell Na.
So he went to court to prove that Natalia was
an adult, showed all the documentation that they had, and

(32:43):
the judge ruled against the Mans. In twenty nineteen, Natalia
was still living with the Mans, who believed her to
be sixteen years old. They said that during their time
with her, she progressed from a child to a teen
and that she had never posed any harm to their family.

(33:03):
So in September of twenty nineteen, Indiana State Police went
to arrest Michael, and on September eighteenth, he surrendered to
Tippy Canoe Jail in Lafayette and was immediately released after
having his mugshot taken and posting five thousand dollars bail.

Speaker 2 (33:21):
Why did they arrest him?

Speaker 1 (33:22):
I'll get to that.

Speaker 3 (33:23):
The next day, September nineteen, Christine surrendered to authorities and
was also released. After posting a five and a half
thousand dollars bail. At some point during all of this,
they got divorced because a lot of people do that,
and I think there was a okay, pretty big strain
on their marriage from everything. So they were both charged

(33:45):
with felony neglect of a dependent based on age at
this point, and medical records show that Michael Barnett allegedly
admitted to police on September fifth, twenty nineteen, that he
and Christine knew doctors at Peyton Manning Children's Hospital determined
Natalia as a child, and that he believed Natalia was

(34:09):
a minor when the family relocated to Canada. Really yes,
But his lawyer disputes these details, saying that Michael quote
never said he knew Natalia was a child, and that
the avidated was quote very selective about which medical reports
it cited.

Speaker 2 (34:27):
Quote.

Speaker 3 (34:28):
Police knocked on Michael's door and he spoke to them
for three hours without an attorney. President The statements he
gave were clearly taken out of context, but Michael also
does say that he doesn't believe Natalia has ever been
truthful about her age. On September twenty seventh, the Barnetts
pleaded not guilty to the charges of felony neglect of

(34:49):
a dependent, and The Daily Mail in the UK found
a Ukrainian woman who claimed to be Natalia's birth mother.

Speaker 2 (34:58):
Oh sure, the Daily right.

Speaker 3 (35:01):
Apparently blood tests were done that you know proved this,
but I don't know if those results were ever.

Speaker 2 (35:08):
Actually officially published.

Speaker 3 (35:11):
Yeah, And on November seventh, Natalia and the man's family
went on Doctor Phil to speak out. Natalia denied she
as a scam artist and maintained that she was now
sixteen years old, the age that corresponds with her Ukrainian
birth certificate. She said that she initially felt loved by

(35:31):
the Barnets and was happy when they first adopted her,
but claimed that things started going downhill after she underwent
a surgery related to her dwarfism quote everything started happening
after that one moment, and it was actually shown later
that the Barnets were aware of a surgery schedule that

(35:53):
Natalia needed to stick to. There was very specific surgeries
that needed to be done at specific times because of
her Dwarfism, and if she didn't get these surgeries at
the right time, it could cause her severe discomfort to pain,
and they didn't get the scheduled surgeries, and they knew

(36:16):
that Natalia was in pain because of it.

Speaker 2 (36:18):
Oh so that's terrible, that's bad.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:22):
The Mans and Natalia also claim that Natalia, although sixteen,
still hadn't had her Menstreul cycle and that she seemed,
like I said, just like a normal child progressing to
a teen in the time that they had been with her.
And actually, if you look at photos, she does look
a lot younger, like a lot younger when she's with

(36:44):
the Barnetts, then when you see her talking with the Mans.
In December twenty twenty one, Christine and Michael are found
not guilty of neglect because of Natalia's legal age, which
they had changed that made her an adult.

Speaker 2 (36:58):
Yeah, so this is very confused to me. How are
they ever charged if legally she was twenty two or
whatever over twenty one.

Speaker 3 (37:06):
So late October twenty twenty two, although the charges of
neglect of a dependent were dismissed due to Natalia's legal age,
the state still proceeded with charges of neglect of a
dependent on the premise that she is severely disabled. One
they didn't get the scheduled surgeries. Two her form of

(37:27):
Dwarfism causes her skeleton to be malformed, which causes pain
and arthritis. She had limited functions and movement of her arms, elbows, legs, shoulders, feet, neck,
and hands, therefore making it very hard for her to
do simple things such as bathe and cook for herself.
And she has a severely curved spine and a tilted pelvis,

(37:50):
combined with her permanently bent knees and contracted ankles, this
makes it very difficult for her to walk and she
cannot put her feet flat on the floor, so she
walks on her tiptoes. Also, her limited mobility causes difficulty
with everyday items and structures that one would find in
a typical apartment, So things that would be hard would

(38:12):
be things such as reaching items on a shelf, using
a top loading clothing washer, using a stove with the
control knobs out of reach, a freezer that was at
the top half instead of like side by side would
be useless. And A report dated October eighteenth, twenty twenty
two so very recently actually alleges that Michael did believe

(38:35):
Natalia was a child, that he told authorities that he
and Natalia both were coached by Christine to tell people
she was twenty two, and on that note, I will
not got off, but I will go on a quick
commercial break.

Speaker 1 (38:50):
We'll be right back. Okay, we're back.

Speaker 4 (38:55):
I know.

Speaker 1 (38:56):
I'm just fucking your mind, right, Like, what is happening?

Speaker 2 (38:59):
Honestly, like my brain is split. It has no idea
where it's going.

Speaker 1 (39:03):
No, I know, I know.

Speaker 3 (39:04):
So two days later, on October twenty fourth, his case
begins its first day of trial, But during trial, jurors
were not told that Michael and Christine adopted Natalia in
twenty ten, when she was not quite seven according to
her birth records. The Barnets believed that Natalia was an
adult and the adoption was a fraud, or that the

(39:25):
Barnets legally changed Natalia's birth year through a court order.

Speaker 1 (39:29):
Meaning she would be in her twenties.

Speaker 3 (39:31):
So basically, during the trial, they can't talk about her
age at all because that's not what's being looked at here. Now,
what's being looked at is did they take on a
dependent regardless of age and then abandon them.

Speaker 2 (39:45):
Yeah, I get it, though, I do get it.

Speaker 1 (39:47):
I know, yeah, I mean, I mean, you've just.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
Gone through the whole dictionary of noises you can make
like affirmative noises you can make there. That was great.

Speaker 1 (39:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (40:01):
So Michael's attorney used every opportunity to paint Natalia as
an adult, claiming she wanted an independent life and that
her needs caused by her severe dwarfism were quote just
the hand she was dull end quote.

Speaker 2 (40:18):
Okay, all right, let's see how you could.

Speaker 3 (40:21):
Handle coming from a fully body like, fully able bodied person.

Speaker 1 (40:26):
Okay, Terrence, Yeah, Terrence.

Speaker 3 (40:28):
He also pointed out that the neglect charges were all
within the timeframe of twenty fourteen through twenty sixteen, while
most of the testimony they were hearing was for moving
Natalia into a Westfield apartment in twenty twelve and to
Lafayette in twenty thirteen. On October twenty seventh, before the verdict,
Michael was served with a subpoena to testify during Christine's trial,

(40:52):
which will take place next year twenty twenty three. So,
in Michael's trial, jurors deliberated for just over two hours
before acquitting him on four counts of neglect, which was
neglect of a dependent, of a dependent resulting in bodily injury,
neglect of a dependent resulting in serious bodily injury and

(41:13):
conspiracy to commit neglect of a dependent. Michael sobbed quietly
as the jury's verdicts were read out, and while he
did that, Natalia left the courtroom as soon as the
trial officially closed. Okay, a gag order has been put
in place because this ship became like a real media circus,

(41:35):
so no one gave a statement. Charges against Christine are
still pending and her trial will take place the day
before Valentine's Day, February thirteen, twenty twenty three. The Mans
were never able to get any government funds to help
take care of her during their time of doing so

(41:56):
because of the age thing. Sure, but her whereabouts as
of now are unknown.

Speaker 1 (42:02):
As you may think.

Speaker 3 (42:05):
Her age still remains the subject of very much debate.

Speaker 1 (42:09):
That was a fucking mic drop.

Speaker 2 (42:11):
But that's a wild ride.

Speaker 1 (42:12):
Yeah, what just happened, right, Your fucking head is spinning.

Speaker 2 (42:15):
Yeah, we still like because we still don't know what
the final outcome is.

Speaker 1 (42:19):
No, No, we don't know, we don't know.

Speaker 2 (42:22):
I'm so confused. And with Christine's trial next year, I
thought so because they're divorced. Now, is that why he's
able to testify at her trial because I thought, you
can't testify if it's your husband or wife.

Speaker 3 (42:35):
Oh I think that might be true, and that's probably Yeah,
he can testify, but.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
Like, I'm so curious if he's gonna be like, yeah,
like I knew she was a kid, and my wife
just didn't fucking like her. She just thought, oh my god,
we've taken on way more than we can chew. So
let's make some bullshit up and rent at an apartment
for her. We all moved to Canada, and yeah, we're
just gonna abandon this kid. How do you feel about that?
And he was just like, who you know?

Speaker 3 (43:01):
Yeah, but like I don't know, why would you go
through all the trouble of like adopting somebody and do
all the things that they did if she was a theory?

Speaker 1 (43:11):
I just I don't know.

Speaker 2 (43:12):
I don't know I have a theory.

Speaker 1 (43:14):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (43:14):
What So their son was born with autism. They were
told like, oh, he's never going to be able to
like do anything ever. But here he is a fucking genius,
and they're like, she wrote a book about it because
she just fucking wants to eat herself. She's so happy
over the fact that she was able quote she was
liable to nailed it. Yeah, exactly, and then they were like,

(43:35):
you know what, we're gonna find somebody else that's like
desperately in need and we're just amazing people and anything
can be done with God's love. So we'll just fix
her ride up, We'll fix the kid ride up, send
them on their way, make another genius. And then when
they couldn't do that, she didn't want to blame herself,
so she's like, you know fucking what this kid is
like thirty, she wants to kill our family. She's not.

Speaker 3 (43:58):
Keep in mind, this is right after that movie Orphan
came out, and let me tell you, or let me
tell the audience a little bit about the movie Orphan,
because Christine specifically referenced the film Orphan, saying, quote, the
movie Orphan is exactly what happened to them. So it's like,

(44:20):
is it or did you steal the plot to make
your story credible?

Speaker 2 (44:25):
So.

Speaker 3 (44:25):
Orfan is a two thousand and nine movie about a
couple who adopts a nine year old Estonian girl. They
immediately fall in love with Esther, a well educated orphan.
Their son Daniel is hostile to Esther, but their deaf
and mute daughter, Max is enchanted with her. Eventually, Kate
begins to sense that something is wrong and notices that

(44:48):
Esther is manipulative and possibly psychologically damaged. John, like every
fucking dude in a horror movie, won't listen to his
wife when she points this out, and Kate just overs
that Esther has a strange and mysterious past. So she
delves in to find out exactly what's wrong with her,

(45:08):
and it turns.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
Out that Esther is fucking oldest shit.

Speaker 3 (45:13):
She just pretends to be young so that she can
get taken care of by families, right.

Speaker 2 (45:18):
I think, so, I think that's kind of the main premise.
Or she wants to get in there and get with
the dad and like seduce him and I think become
like his wife or something.

Speaker 3 (45:27):
Okay, So I don't think that was going on here.
But the movie Orphan was inspired by Barbara Scrillava, a
woman who was discovered posing as a thirteen year old
boy in Norway in two thousand and seven. When six
people were charged with the violent abuse of young children

(45:50):
in the Czech Republic, one of the three children rescued,
quote Adam, turned out to be thirty four year old
Barbara's squirrellow.

Speaker 2 (46:00):
Barbara, what are you doing?

Speaker 3 (46:02):
And she was found to be one of the abusers
of her two younger quote brothers, Andre and Jacob.

Speaker 1 (46:11):
The fuck weird? Yeah what?

Speaker 3 (46:14):
I just like rereading that because I'm like, what, so
she got into this? I don't know. Six people were
charged though, Like was it a big family living together
and they were all abusing the kids.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
Or I don't know, ring or cult?

Speaker 3 (46:28):
Yeah, I don't know. Now I want to look more
into this story. But yeah, she was a thirty four
year old lady pretending to be a thirteen year old
boy and she was just up in there like abusing kids.
The fuck Well, there's a fucking rabbit hole to go down.
Barbaras are bananas.

Speaker 2 (46:47):
I do not know a single Barbara that is just
normal and fine.

Speaker 1 (46:51):
I don't think I know any Barbaras Barbara. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (46:53):
Really, they're like, like every old lady is Barbara.

Speaker 3 (46:56):
You know, there's probably like a fucking listener in Barbara
who I talked to regularly or something who's like.

Speaker 2 (47:03):
Dude, the fuck hello, I have the worst memory.

Speaker 1 (47:05):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 3 (47:07):
So well, basically, doctor Phil was like, I don't think
she is like a full adult.

Speaker 1 (47:14):
But I also don't think how old she is. But
also I don't give a fart.

Speaker 3 (47:18):
About doctor Phil's opinions because he's not a real doctor.

Speaker 2 (47:21):
So no, he's not.

Speaker 1 (47:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (47:24):
So either she is a conniving little person who's possibly
thirty fucking years old who's just been out there scamming,
or she is I think probably more likely a little
girl who probably had a host of issues and has

(47:46):
had it rough. I don't know, though, honestly it could
go either way. Still, to me, it's still a toss up.

Speaker 2 (47:52):
Hm, I agree it's fifty to fifty for me.

Speaker 3 (47:54):
I would say it's sixty forty for me in her favor. Really,
that she's not the plot the movie Orphan.

Speaker 2 (48:01):
Well, I mean, I don't believe much of it.

Speaker 3 (48:03):
Is hearsay from Christine. It's like, oh, well, Christine alleges
that she tried to murder her in the family a bunch.
It's like, but none of that is like proven. And
then the fucking tests for how old you are was
is we're like all over the fucking place exactly.

Speaker 2 (48:19):
That's what's getting me more is like her physical details,
so the pubic hair and blowed in her underwear, although
that could have been anything.

Speaker 1 (48:26):
Really that also could have been a lie.

Speaker 2 (48:28):
It could have been no.

Speaker 4 (48:29):
A lot of that is.

Speaker 3 (48:30):
Just Christine's story, And you know, I don't know that
I love Christine.

Speaker 2 (48:35):
So you know when you see a movie, like you
go to the cinema, you sit down, you watch the
fucking movie and you just love it, and you walk
out and you're like, I am going to take on
the personality of my favorite character of that movie. I'm
going to become I want my life to be like this.
Do you ever get that feeling?

Speaker 3 (48:50):
I don't feel like so much from movies, but I
feel like when I've read books, all of a sudden,
what I'm not reading I'll start talking in my head
as the fucking like Maine.

Speaker 2 (49:01):
Yes exactly.

Speaker 1 (49:03):
I'm like, oh so I'm this person now, okay.

Speaker 2 (49:06):
Exactly why I don't know, why do I have a
vision of you reading some old timey book like the
fucking Bible.

Speaker 3 (49:13):
Or in my head like old I will like describe
what I'm doing in my head and like and then
she gracefully picked up the novel and flipped through the
pages mindlessly.

Speaker 1 (49:24):
Is she thought about the clouds go bye? You know,
I get all poetic or something.

Speaker 2 (49:28):
I don't know, fully romanticizing your life. I love it, Yeah,
do it. But I feel like that's what Christine did.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
What did she do?

Speaker 2 (49:36):
She watched the movie Orphan and was like, I fucking
love this movie. This is the best movie I've ever seen.
And you know what I have. I have a kid
that I adopted from another country, beginning with I was
gonna say, Ukraine began with a knee. It doesn't begin
with me, but from a different country. And you know
what I'm gonna I'm gonna do.

Speaker 3 (49:51):
This or shit started to pop off in whatever way
with Natalia and then she saw this movie Orphan and
it was like, uh, bingo, perfect, my god, Oh, to
be a fly on the wall. To be a fly,
you know I hate flies, but yeah, I mean yeah,

(50:11):
to be on the wall in that room.

Speaker 2 (50:14):
Yeah, oh god, I'm so intrigued.

Speaker 3 (50:18):
I really hope that this gets conclusively figured out at
some point. I hope this isn't another fucking John Bennet
or yeah, what's the other one that I like, really need.

Speaker 2 (50:29):
Salt Madelon McCann.

Speaker 3 (50:30):
No, I mean sure, yeah, but like fuck, there's one
that drives me crazy. I don't know but like I
want to know. I want yeah, no, no, what fucking
happened here?

Speaker 4 (50:41):
I know?

Speaker 2 (50:41):
I want to know where she went because after being
on like Doctor Phil and stuff, I'm sure like she
was like very much in demand by journalists and stuff.
How does she just disappear?

Speaker 3 (50:51):
I think they were trying to like respect that gag
order or whatever, but the Barnetts had already said so
much to the media that the media was already like
so on their side that finally they were like, fuck,
we'll go on Doctor Phil and just give our side
of the story.

Speaker 1 (51:06):
Yeah, and then I don't know, like where is she now?

Speaker 2 (51:10):
That stucked up

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