March 18, 2025 • 36 mins
Welcome to another episode of Aging Unfiltered. In this episode, we have an important conversation about the intersection of aging, race, and representation. It was a privilege to welcome Raymond A. Jetson to the podcast to talk about this important subject. He’s a visionary leader, a changemaker, and the force behind Aging While Black and MetroMorphosis. Raymond has spent his life dedicated to empowering Black older adults and reshaping narratives around aging and equity. Tune in for an inspirational conversation.
Resources
AWB The Book | Aging While Black
Aging While Black | Raymond Jetson | TEDxScotlandville
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Gretchen (00:00):
Welcome to the Age Guide Perspectives on the Aging
Journey.
I'm your host, GretchenKnowlton, and this is Aging
Unfiltered, a series where weget real about ageism, how it
shapes our world, and what wecan do about it.
Today, we're having animportant conversation about the
(00:24):
intersection of aging, race,and representation.
And I can't think of a betterperson to guide us through it
than Raymond A.
Jetson.
He's a visionary leader, achangemaker, and the force
behind Aging While Black andmetamorphosis.
From his years as a LouisianaState Representative to his work
(00:47):
transforming communities,Raymond has spent his life
dedicated to empowering Blackolder adults and reshaping
narratives around aging andequity.
So how does ageism collide withracial inequalities?
Why does representation inaging matter?
And what can we do right now tobuild a society where Black
(01:11):
elders can age with dignity andjoy?
That's what we're diving intotoday.
Let's get started.
Thank you so much for beinghere with us today, Raymond.
Raymond (01:23):
Gretchen, it is a joy to share with you again.
And it is always a joy toconnect with the Age Guide
family.
I appreciate so much theimportant work that you guys do
in the lives that you touch, theorganizations that you support.
And so it's a joy to share withyou.
Gretchen (01:44):
Well, it's so mutual.
Thank you.
So Raymond, in your work, youreally explore the concept of
ageism in America.
You've been doing this a lotlonger than we've been talking
about it on our podcast forsure, especially in relation to
Black elders.
Could you share how you seeageism intersecting with the
(02:06):
racial inequities faced by Blackolder adults in America?
Are there particular ways inwhich both of these issues
compound each other?
Raymond (02:16):
Yes, there are a couple of phrases that are interesting
in their use and what theycommunicate.
And so, for example, one of thephrases that is used is double
jeopardy.
And it speaks to thisintersection of dealing with
(02:39):
both ageism and racism.
but one of the pioneers in theconversations around aging and
race actually coined the phrasetriple jeopardy of being aging,
(02:59):
black and female in America andthe complexities that are
associated with that.
What the phrases bring to bearare the realities of just the
ageist mindset that is sopredominant in American culture
(03:23):
and in the way that we go aboutthings.
combining that with thestructural barriers that persist
and intensify for BlackAmericans as they age in
America.
And it creates what, as we weresharing just in, before we
(03:45):
started the podcast, I've beenwriting a book and I describe it
as a toxic brew There are thesepoisonous systems and
structures that are persistentand firmly entrenched that serve
to create greater challenge forBlack elders to thrive in
(04:14):
America.
And it shows up in economicstability.
It shows up in healthcare.
It shows up in digitalempowerment.
It shows up in just so manyaspects of everyday life.
Gretchen (04:31):
Wow, well, that really highlights why this issue is so
critical.
I appreciate you setting thestage for this conversation so
well.
And I love...
that concept of thinking aboutall the different
intersectionalities that wehave.
It's not just about age andrace.
There's also gender, there'slanguage, all kinds of other
(04:52):
things could come into play withthat.
And it's just multiplying, likeyou said, that toxic brew.
One of the critical points inthe article that you wrote
recently for American Society onAging is the lack of
representation of Black eldersin aging-related research and of
of course, in the media.
(05:13):
We've talked about that with acouple of our other guests too,
but why is this so important, doyou think, for shifting those
societal attitudes and the wholenarrative around aging?
Raymond (05:24):
One of the great challenges we face, and
certainly in today's climate, adifficult conversation to
navigate is this tendency topresent aging as this race
(05:47):
neutral experiment orexperience.
After all, we are all aging,aren't we?
Well, yes we are, but there aredifferences.
You know, one of the importanttheories in aging is that both
advantage and disadvantage arecumulative.
(06:08):
and that they compound overtime.
And so if we live in a countrywhere in every major city in
America, you can basically tellwhere Black communities and
non-Black communities are by zipcodes and the outcomes
(06:32):
associated with those particularzip codes or geographic, you
know, the South side or theNorth, you know, there are these
realities that are associatedwith people's lived experiences
that are often correlated torage.
(06:53):
And it doesn't mean thateverybody in the world is a
racist and a horrible people andwake up every day speaking to
do horrible things to Blackpeople or other minoritized
communities.
But there are certain realitiesthat say that if you are a
(07:16):
young Black boy who grows up inthis neighborhood, then you are
less likely to have access tocertain resources that serve to,
in many ways, predetermine theexperiences and opportunities
that you have to thrive.
Well, if that's how you beginlife and if that's how you
(07:41):
experience life, then it isunrealistic to expect me to show
up in old age and all of asudden begin to thrive.
And so while we are all aging,as a dear, wonderful woman in
Atlanta said to me, aging is averb.
(08:01):
And so we all are aging, butthere are experiences that are
different that are oftentimescorrelated to race.
And so it's important that weshow these experiences so that
(08:22):
we are more sensitive to themand that we understand what are
the ways in which we need toaddress the practices, the
policies, the programs that weundertake.
How are, aging Black peopleshowing up in media.
(08:44):
How are they seen in research?
And that's part of this I'llshare.
You know, when you look at someof the really important
research that is happening inAmerica, and you look at the
clinical trials and theexclusionary criteria that is
(09:05):
outlined, and you look at someand it says, you know, people
with high blood pressure, peoplewith diabetes, people with
These things can't participatein this particular study.
Well, with a few strokes of thepen, you have basically
(09:27):
eliminated a huge portion of theAfrican-American community.
And if we are not participatingin the trials, then what
happens is we end up bringing tomarket therapeutics and
interventions without any degreeof certainty as to how they
(09:53):
interact with Black bodies.
And so these are reallyimportant conversations and
adjustments that we need tomake.
Gretchen (10:04):
Wow.
That is a really big shift inthinking.
around both how we talk aboutaging and that we're all aging
and how we look at things likerepresentation, both in media
and in research.
Like you said, I think we tryto create kind of a shared sense
(10:26):
of investment in aging.
when we say things like yousaid, we're all aging.
And that's something we say allthe time in Age Guide.
But how do we expand that thento say, yes, we're all aging,
but, and make sure that we'rebringing everybody along and
recognizing that there are somedifferences.
(10:48):
Is there a way that you wouldreframe that introduction?
Raymond (10:53):
Yes, and it is that very familiar way device of yes
and.
Yes, we are all aging.
And for some of us, there areother aspects that make that
(11:14):
aging journey somewhatdifferent.
And so if I live in aparticular environment or if I
am faced with a certain policydriven or societal enforced
disruptions, to my ability toaccess the life, that brings
(11:40):
into the discussion somedifferences.
Now we are all aging and we dohave that in common, but if we
are all going to age well, thenthat requires that we look at
those things that serve todisrupt the ability for
(12:03):
everybody to age well.
Gretchen (12:05):
That, you said that so well, that really resonates.
And that's something thatindividuals can think about in
reframing how they talk aboutthis.
That's really helpful.
Thank you for that.
The next thing I wanted to askyou about is as we look ahead,
How do you envision this societywhere Black elders can age with
(12:29):
what you said, with dignity,with security, and good health,
and hopefully some joy, despite,like you said, the fact that
these things can kind ofaccumulate over time, the
challenges that people inunderrepresented communities
face?
So what steps do you think weneed to take collectively to
(12:52):
reach your vision?
And how can the listeners tothis podcast advocate for that
change?
Raymond (12:59):
I think that there are a couple of really important
mindset shifts that need tohappen.
The first is that All Blackelders are not frail.
(13:19):
They are not suffering fromfrailty and loss and absent any
redeeming contributions to thewellbeing.
And beginning to recognize thatBlack elders actually have the
(13:39):
capacity to be active architectsin building a brighter future.
One of the things that we talkabout in Aging While Black is
leaning into Sankofa.
which is the third of our threepillars.
(13:59):
And Sankofa is this WestAfrican concept which speaks of
making benevolent use of thepast.
Some of the listeners to thepodcast may be familiar with the
Sankofa bird, where the bird islooking backwards while flying
forward with an egg in its beak,which represents this bringing
(14:23):
forward of the past in ways thatbenefit the future.
future, particularly in momentslike this in America's history.
Black elders are not seeingthis for the first time.
(14:45):
We've experienced this tenor ofpublic conversation and this
push in public policy, thisdramatic shift in people's
commitments to fairness.
(15:05):
We've seen all of this.
This pendulum swing is not afirst time experience.
And so there is a, a wisdom oflived experience that is
invaluable for those who arewilling to access.
(15:30):
And so I think that it isimportant that the mindset shift
from you know, this group ofpeople who need our care,
certainly there are some peoplewho are more at risk than
others, but even those who maybe in poor health may have much
(15:53):
to share, but through theirlived experience, through their
wisdom, through their abilitiesto communicate.
I also think that that as welive in this digital world, it's
really important that we movefrom a place of centering what
(16:21):
this preoccupation with thedigital divide and digital
literacy, I think digitalempowerment needs to be a
driving force.
Again, the second force, thesecond pillar of Aging While
Black is leaning into innovationand rapid change.
(16:43):
We live, Gretchen, in anamazingly rapidly changing world
that's deeply rooted intechnology.
And so the absence of digitalempowerment is not just a
digital literacy.
It is an equity crisis becauseyou have people who are unable
(17:07):
to thrive in the world thatsurrounds them.
They can't access criticalresources.
They can't manage theirfinances.
They are limited in socialconnectivity and family
connectedness through thisabsence of digital capacity and
(17:30):
so I think that there are thesemindset shifts that need to take
place and since I started atthe third pillar and went to the
second one I guess I should endon the first pillar which is
just recalibrating the villageand so So how do we, Gretchen,
(17:54):
become mindful of the ecosystemthat supports Black elders?
Is it culturally attuned?
You know, is it sensitive tothe realities of faith or family
traditions or other realitythat surround black life?
(18:19):
And so I think that thosemindset shifts are critical
drivers in transforming the wayAging While Black in America.
Gretchen (18:35):
That really underscores the importance of
seeing Black elders as leadersand not just as people in need
of care and making sure thateverything is tied in, like you
said, to the village and thatwe're bringing those voices to
the forefront.
Let
Raymond (18:55):
me just share one of the things.
Go ahead.
One of the chapters in the bookthat will be released later
this year, which is entitledAging While Black, a radical
re-imagining of aging and racein America.
And one of the chapters isentitled, From Advocacy to
(19:18):
Activism.
And what it posits is thatthere is an abundance of
advocacy on behalf of olderpeople generally and aging black
people specifically.
And what we at Aging Wild Blackbelieve is a critical shift is
(19:43):
moving from advocacy to whereolder black people become their
own activists.
When you think about whether itis the silent generation or
baby boomers, we have vastexperience with activism.
I mean, we've had to raise ourvoices to access the American
(20:08):
experiment in ways that fullyincluded us.
And we're at a point where wehave to do that again.
But that can occur simply withothers speaking on behalf of
Black elders.
A fundamental shift that needsto happen is how do we begin to
(20:29):
position Black elders to betheir own voices, to be their
own activists, to design anddeclare the world that they want
to live in.
Gretchen (20:43):
And how do we do that?
Raymond (20:46):
So there's a wonderful project that we at Aging While
Black have been partnering within Los Angeles that is called
the Sankofa Elders Project.
It is sponsored by theCalifornia Black Women's Health
Project and Sisters Aging withGrace and Elegance or SAGE.
(21:10):
It's funded by the StanFoundation California Health
Project.
Foundation, Metta Foundation.
Oh, wow.
And other big Cal.
Yeah, it is.
And it is that what theycreated were these echo or
(21:31):
community organizations acrossCalifornia.
And this one is in SouthCalifornia.
Los Angeles.
And what this amazing team ofpeople led by my dear friend,
Carlene Davis, has done is thatthey have mobilized over the
(21:53):
course of six to eight months,more than a hundred Black elders
who are known as ambassadors.
And what they have done is theyhave created a manifesto on
wellbeing for Black elders inSouth Los Angeles.
(22:16):
A manifesto, wow.
And now they are preparing topresent and become activists for
the execution of this manifestoin government, in
organizations, incommunity-based institutions.
(22:39):
And they are the creators, theowners, and the drivers of this
work.
And it is an amazing model andone that we at Aging While Black
are partnering with our dearfriends, Carlene and her team on
(23:04):
understanding the learnings sothat they might be replicated in
other communities.
But they have otherorganizations across this
country who basically elevateactivism in addition to
advocacy.
Gretchen (23:22):
Yeah, the two of them kind of go together, but you
have to take it another step toget to activism and get more
personal and get peopleinvolved, like you said, in
advocating for themselves, in asense, picking up that torch and
trying to make some change,right?
Would you say that's kind ofthe difference between advocacy
and activism?
Raymond (23:42):
Yeah, advocacy overdone can mute the voices of the
people we are advocating for.
And so we become their voices.
We become the articulators oftheir best interest and what
(24:04):
needs to happen.
Activism says, you have spacehere.
Your voice matters.
And Any strategy that isexecuted on your behalf should
be informed by yourperspectives.
Gretchen (24:27):
I'm pausing because I'm actually taking notes and I
keep thinking I'm just going tore-listen to this podcast over
and over until it all sinks inbecause you're saying so many
great powerful things that Iwant to remember.
Raymond, thank you for that.
Raymond (24:41):
But Gretchen, and thank you for your openness and for
the openness of the Age Guidefamily, broadly defined.
But these are things...
that we collectively need tosay over and over again, we need
(25:04):
to explore, we need to createvenues where we can ask
questions, where we can pushback when it doesn't feel right
for me and create these kinds ofspaces where we can have these
conversations.
It's part of what we are.
(25:24):
So the next big step for agingwhile blind is we are having the
audacity to invite people tojoin a national network.
And so we are going to belaunching in April, actually at
(25:45):
the American Society on AgingConference in Orlando, we are
going to be launching the AgingWhile Black Network.
And it is going to be anelectronic platform where people
can self-identify and connectwith, and we are going to be
(26:09):
weaving and mapping andconnecting people based on
geography, based upon size oforganization, based upon
population served, based uponinterest, affinities.
And so we see our work asnetwork weavers.
(26:31):
And so to invite people whilebeing consistent to what you do.
And so Age Guide, for example,could become a part of the Aging
While Black Network withoutchanging your mission, without
changing your population serve,but being true to what you do,
(26:53):
but also being open tounderstanding the three pillars
connecting with others who maybe similarly situated
organizations, but in otherparts of the country.
to be connected and to havesome peer learning and some
(27:14):
sharing, but also to beconnected with Black elders and
others who are geographicallydissimilar to you, who can
inform our collective learningand wisdom sharing.
Gretchen (27:32):
That is going to be a great opportunity.
I'm so excited.
And we, as soon as that'savailable, we'll share the link
in the show notes for thispodcast so that people can hear
your description of it and thenfollow through with getting
connected.
What a conversation this hasbeen.
I've learned so much.
You've given us a lot to thinkabout and that power of
(27:55):
representation and the realitiesof aging while Black and the
work that we all need to do tocreate this more just and
inclusive society, the way wetalk about things, the way we
either advocate or move a stepfurther into activism.
Lots, I know our listeners aregoing to walk away from this
(28:17):
feeling challenged and inspiredand maybe even seeing the world
a little bit differently.
I know I do after thisconversation.
So thank you for joining us,Raymond.
Are there any parting wordsthat you'd like to give to the
listeners?
Raymond (28:30):
Well, Gretchen, I Sincerely, I'll end where I
started.
It's a joy to share with you.
And I appreciate so greatly theopenness of the Age Guide
family to creating space forimportant conversations and
engagements.
And I do really appreciatethat.
(28:52):
I'll just end by saying AsianWhile Black is not a project for
me.
It is something that is deeplypersonal.
I grew up next door to my greatgrandmother and great
grandfather.
I have a picture in my study ofmy dad and my mom on the day
(29:13):
that my dad was sworn into theLouisiana House of
Representatives.
And it's such a beautifulpicture.
But I look at it now and Irealize that 177 days later, my
dad was dead of leukemia.
And my mom now, 41 years later,ambulates on a walker as a
(29:36):
91-year-old who fell and hit herhead and has cognitive decline
and other things.
And I am my mom's primarycaregiver.
I also, in just a few days,will be observing my 69th
birthday.
And so this isn't just aproject or an organization.
(30:04):
It's deeply personal.
And it is my lived experience.
Gretchen (30:10):
Wow.
Well, thank you so much forthat, Raymond.
Thank you for sharing yourpersonal perspective and being
open to passing on your wisdom.
Really appreciate having youhere.
Raymond (30:22):
Thank you.
To
Gretchen (30:25):
everyone listening, let's carry this forward.
Keep asking questions.
Keep challenging assumptionsand most of all, keep seeing and
celebrating the wisdom of ourelders.
Thank you for being here and Iwill see you next time on the
Age Guide Perspectives on theAging Journey.
Val (30:42):
Hello and welcome to your Medicare Minute.
My name is Val Guzman and I'mthe Benefit Access Specialist
here at Age Guide.
Today, we're going to learnways to avoid medical debt with
Abigail Rodriguez, patienthealth advocate at the DuPage
(31:06):
Health Coalition.
Stay tuned to learn more.
Abigail (31:12):
Hi, my name is Abigail Rodriguez and I am a patient
health advocate for DuPageHealth Coalition, also known as
Access DuPage.
We have a lot of programs thathelp with different situations
and one of those areas weadvocate in is medical debt.
Medical debt is growing everyyear and it can be incredibly
frustrating, especially when youlive on a fixed income and
can't afford any additionalbills.
(31:32):
My goal is to help reducestress and ease financial
burdens for older adults in ourcommunity, as well as providing
education so that they are ableto advocate for themselves Here
are some tips for the mostcommon situations that I have
been helping with.
So tip number one is alwaysreview your medical bills.
We're all humans and makemistakes and chances are someone
(31:55):
in the billing department maymake a mistake from time to
time.
So please make sure you ask foran itemized statement and call
to ask about any billingquestions or discrepancies that
you see.
I cannot stress enough that ifyou have a secondary insurance
like Medicaid, please confirmthe billing department has this
information.
I know that coming home fromthe hospital can be tiring and
you probably won't bother tothink about it until you get the
(32:18):
bill in the mail, but this isreally important.
Do not put off calling them assometimes insurance companies
cannot backdate coverage and youcan be left with the remaining
balance that could have beencovered.
Tip number two is know yourcoverage.
As we know, Medicare changesevery year and some plans are
added and others are dropped andwhat insurance covers can
change too.
(32:38):
So it is important tounderstand your co-pays,
deductibles, and out-of-networkcosts as these can slowly add up
depending on how often you usethem.
If you are someone who hasissues with coordination or
balance, perhaps it is not inyour best interest to get an
insurance with a $300 copaymentfor an ambulance ride.
That kind of leads me to thethird tip, which is speak to a
(33:01):
SHIP counselor.
Insurance coverage changesevery year, but so does your
health.
It's important to meet with aSHIP counselor every year if
possible to determine if thereare any changes you need to make
to your coverage.
SHIP counselors are availableto educate you about the
different types of Medicareplans available and help you
make educated decisionsregarding your coverage.
While you might be okay withthe plan you currently have,
(33:23):
perhaps there's a better optionout there for you that could
reduce your insurance or medicalexpenses Thank you.
Tip number four is medicationprograms.
One of the things I have helpedwith recently is lowering
medication costs or trying toreduce them.
This may be something smalllike calling your insurance to
verify who your preferredpharmacy is.
This can significantly affectthe cost of your medication.
(33:46):
Pharmacy X may be charging you$200 for your eye drops, but at
Pharmacy Y, your preferredpharmacy, it could cost you only
$30.
Your insurance can alsodetermine whether there are any
medication programs from thethat are available to you for
little to no cost.
They will send you theapplication via mail or email.
You'll have to fill out yourportion of the application and
(34:09):
your provider will need to fillout the rest and send it back.
These programs are renewableeach year and your medication
could be free or at a reallyreduced cost.
And tip number five is seekfinancial assistant programs.
While a $1,200 hospital billmay seem payable, your economic
situation could change.
Always apply for financialassistance assistance through
(34:30):
hospitals when possible.
Some hospitals have a 240 daylimit of when to file, so the
sooner you submit theapplication, the better.
There is financial assistanceeverywhere, not just at the
hospitals.
For example, LIHEAP, whichhelps with home energy costs and
SNAP benefits.
Even Medicare has additionalprograms like Extra Help or SLIB
(34:51):
that can help with MedicarePart B premiums, Medicare Part D
deductibles, and coinsuranceexpenses.
The medical world is such adifficult world to navigate.
Never be afraid to reach outand ask for clarification from
providers, insurance companies,pharmacies or organizations like
us.
You do not have to live a lifeof medical debt.
(35:12):
There are a lot of resourcesand programs available.
We just might have to asksomeone to help us find the
correct ones.
So I encourage you to take outthat shoebox filled with medical
bills and apply some of thesetips or reach out to me and I'll
be more than happy to help.
Val (35:26):
This was your Medicare Minute.
For more information about theDuPage Health Coalition and
medical debt, contact Abigail at331-716-7168.
Gretchen (35:39):
Thank you for listening to The Age Guide,
Perspectives on the AgingJourney.
Age Guide coordinates andadministers many services for
older adults in NortheasternIllinois.
Our specially trainedprofessionals are available to
answer questions and connect youwith local service providers
(36:02):
and resources.
If you are interested in theseservices or want to learn more,
go to our website atageguide.org or call our offices
at 630-293-5990.
Please follow our podcast soyou can be notified in your
streaming account.
Thank you and we will see younext time on The Age Guide.
(36:25):
Guide podcast.
Welcome to the Age Guide Perspectives on the Aging
Journey.
I'm your host, GretchenKnowlton, and this is Aging
Unfiltered, a series where weget real about ageism, how it
shapes our world, and what wecan do about it.
Today, we're having animportant conversation about the
(00:24):
intersection of aging, race,and representation.
And I can't think of a betterperson to guide us through it
than Raymond A.
Jetson.
He's a visionary leader, achangemaker, and the force
behind Aging While Black andmetamorphosis.
From his years as a LouisianaState Representative to his work
(00:47):
transforming communities,Raymond has spent his life
dedicated to empowering Blackolder adults and reshaping
narratives around aging andequity.
So how does ageism collide withracial inequalities?
Why does representation inaging matter?
And what can we do right now tobuild a society where Black
(01:11):
elders can age with dignity andjoy?
That's what we're diving intotoday.
Let's get started.
Thank you so much for beinghere with us today, Raymond.
Raymond (01:23):
Gretchen, it is a joy to share with you again.
And it is always a joy toconnect with the Age Guide
family.
I appreciate so much theimportant work that you guys do
in the lives that you touch, theorganizations that you support.
And so it's a joy to share withyou.
Gretchen (01:44):
Well, it's so mutual.
Thank you.
So Raymond, in your work, youreally explore the concept of
ageism in America.
You've been doing this a lotlonger than we've been talking
about it on our podcast forsure, especially in relation to
Black elders.
Could you share how you seeageism intersecting with the
(02:06):
racial inequities faced by Blackolder adults in America?
Are there particular ways inwhich both of these issues
compound each other?
Raymond (02:16):
Yes, there are a couple of phrases that are interesting
in their use and what theycommunicate.
And so, for example, one of thephrases that is used is double
jeopardy.
And it speaks to thisintersection of dealing with
(02:39):
both ageism and racism.
but one of the pioneers in theconversations around aging and
race actually coined the phrasetriple jeopardy of being aging,
(02:59):
black and female in America andthe complexities that are
associated with that.
What the phrases bring to bearare the realities of just the
ageist mindset that is sopredominant in American culture
(03:23):
and in the way that we go aboutthings.
combining that with thestructural barriers that persist
and intensify for BlackAmericans as they age in
America.
And it creates what, as we weresharing just in, before we
(03:45):
started the podcast, I've beenwriting a book and I describe it
as a toxic brew There are thesepoisonous systems and
structures that are persistentand firmly entrenched that serve
to create greater challenge forBlack elders to thrive in
(04:14):
America.
And it shows up in economicstability.
It shows up in healthcare.
It shows up in digitalempowerment.
It shows up in just so manyaspects of everyday life.
Gretchen (04:31):
Wow, well, that really highlights why this issue is so
critical.
I appreciate you setting thestage for this conversation so
well.
And I love...
that concept of thinking aboutall the different
intersectionalities that wehave.
It's not just about age andrace.
There's also gender, there'slanguage, all kinds of other
(04:52):
things could come into play withthat.
And it's just multiplying, likeyou said, that toxic brew.
One of the critical points inthe article that you wrote
recently for American Society onAging is the lack of
representation of Black eldersin aging-related research and of
of course, in the media.
(05:13):
We've talked about that with acouple of our other guests too,
but why is this so important, doyou think, for shifting those
societal attitudes and the wholenarrative around aging?
Raymond (05:24):
One of the great challenges we face, and
certainly in today's climate, adifficult conversation to
navigate is this tendency topresent aging as this race
(05:47):
neutral experiment orexperience.
After all, we are all aging,aren't we?
Well, yes we are, but there aredifferences.
You know, one of the importanttheories in aging is that both
advantage and disadvantage arecumulative.
(06:08):
and that they compound overtime.
And so if we live in a countrywhere in every major city in
America, you can basically tellwhere Black communities and
non-Black communities are by zipcodes and the outcomes
(06:32):
associated with those particularzip codes or geographic, you
know, the South side or theNorth, you know, there are these
realities that are associatedwith people's lived experiences
that are often correlated torage.
(06:53):
And it doesn't mean thateverybody in the world is a
racist and a horrible people andwake up every day speaking to
do horrible things to Blackpeople or other minoritized
communities.
But there are certain realitiesthat say that if you are a
(07:16):
young Black boy who grows up inthis neighborhood, then you are
less likely to have access tocertain resources that serve to,
in many ways, predetermine theexperiences and opportunities
that you have to thrive.
Well, if that's how you beginlife and if that's how you
(07:41):
experience life, then it isunrealistic to expect me to show
up in old age and all of asudden begin to thrive.
And so while we are all aging,as a dear, wonderful woman in
Atlanta said to me, aging is averb.
(08:01):
And so we all are aging, butthere are experiences that are
different that are oftentimescorrelated to race.
And so it's important that weshow these experiences so that
(08:22):
we are more sensitive to themand that we understand what are
the ways in which we need toaddress the practices, the
policies, the programs that weundertake.
How are, aging Black peopleshowing up in media.
(08:44):
How are they seen in research?
And that's part of this I'llshare.
You know, when you look at someof the really important
research that is happening inAmerica, and you look at the
clinical trials and theexclusionary criteria that is
(09:05):
outlined, and you look at someand it says, you know, people
with high blood pressure, peoplewith diabetes, people with
These things can't participatein this particular study.
Well, with a few strokes of thepen, you have basically
(09:27):
eliminated a huge portion of theAfrican-American community.
And if we are not participatingin the trials, then what
happens is we end up bringing tomarket therapeutics and
interventions without any degreeof certainty as to how they
(09:53):
interact with Black bodies.
And so these are reallyimportant conversations and
adjustments that we need tomake.
Gretchen (10:04):
Wow.
That is a really big shift inthinking.
around both how we talk aboutaging and that we're all aging
and how we look at things likerepresentation, both in media
and in research.
Like you said, I think we tryto create kind of a shared sense
(10:26):
of investment in aging.
when we say things like yousaid, we're all aging.
And that's something we say allthe time in Age Guide.
But how do we expand that thento say, yes, we're all aging,
but, and make sure that we'rebringing everybody along and
recognizing that there are somedifferences.
(10:48):
Is there a way that you wouldreframe that introduction?
Raymond (10:53):
Yes, and it is that very familiar way device of yes
and.
Yes, we are all aging.
And for some of us, there areother aspects that make that
(11:14):
aging journey somewhatdifferent.
And so if I live in aparticular environment or if I
am faced with a certain policydriven or societal enforced
disruptions, to my ability toaccess the life, that brings
(11:40):
into the discussion somedifferences.
Now we are all aging and we dohave that in common, but if we
are all going to age well, thenthat requires that we look at
those things that serve todisrupt the ability for
(12:03):
everybody to age well.
Gretchen (12:05):
That, you said that so well, that really resonates.
And that's something thatindividuals can think about in
reframing how they talk aboutthis.
That's really helpful.
Thank you for that.
The next thing I wanted to askyou about is as we look ahead,
How do you envision this societywhere Black elders can age with
(12:29):
what you said, with dignity,with security, and good health,
and hopefully some joy, despite,like you said, the fact that
these things can kind ofaccumulate over time, the
challenges that people inunderrepresented communities
face?
So what steps do you think weneed to take collectively to
(12:52):
reach your vision?
And how can the listeners tothis podcast advocate for that
change?
Raymond (12:59):
I think that there are a couple of really important
mindset shifts that need tohappen.
The first is that All Blackelders are not frail.
(13:19):
They are not suffering fromfrailty and loss and absent any
redeeming contributions to thewellbeing.
And beginning to recognize thatBlack elders actually have the
(13:39):
capacity to be active architectsin building a brighter future.
One of the things that we talkabout in Aging While Black is
leaning into Sankofa.
which is the third of our threepillars.
(13:59):
And Sankofa is this WestAfrican concept which speaks of
making benevolent use of thepast.
Some of the listeners to thepodcast may be familiar with the
Sankofa bird, where the bird islooking backwards while flying
forward with an egg in its beak,which represents this bringing
(14:23):
forward of the past in ways thatbenefit the future.
future, particularly in momentslike this in America's history.
Black elders are not seeingthis for the first time.
(14:45):
We've experienced this tenor ofpublic conversation and this
push in public policy, thisdramatic shift in people's
commitments to fairness.
(15:05):
We've seen all of this.
This pendulum swing is not afirst time experience.
And so there is a, a wisdom oflived experience that is
invaluable for those who arewilling to access.
(15:30):
And so I think that it isimportant that the mindset shift
from you know, this group ofpeople who need our care,
certainly there are some peoplewho are more at risk than
others, but even those who maybe in poor health may have much
(15:53):
to share, but through theirlived experience, through their
wisdom, through their abilitiesto communicate.
I also think that that as welive in this digital world, it's
really important that we movefrom a place of centering what
(16:21):
this preoccupation with thedigital divide and digital
literacy, I think digitalempowerment needs to be a
driving force.
Again, the second force, thesecond pillar of Aging While
Black is leaning into innovationand rapid change.
(16:43):
We live, Gretchen, in anamazingly rapidly changing world
that's deeply rooted intechnology.
And so the absence of digitalempowerment is not just a
digital literacy.
It is an equity crisis becauseyou have people who are unable
(17:07):
to thrive in the world thatsurrounds them.
They can't access criticalresources.
They can't manage theirfinances.
They are limited in socialconnectivity and family
connectedness through thisabsence of digital capacity and
(17:30):
so I think that there are thesemindset shifts that need to take
place and since I started atthe third pillar and went to the
second one I guess I should endon the first pillar which is
just recalibrating the villageand so So how do we, Gretchen,
(17:54):
become mindful of the ecosystemthat supports Black elders?
Is it culturally attuned?
You know, is it sensitive tothe realities of faith or family
traditions or other realitythat surround black life?
(18:19):
And so I think that thosemindset shifts are critical
drivers in transforming the wayAging While Black in America.
Gretchen (18:35):
That really underscores the importance of
seeing Black elders as leadersand not just as people in need
of care and making sure thateverything is tied in, like you
said, to the village and thatwe're bringing those voices to
the forefront.
Let
Raymond (18:55):
me just share one of the things.
Go ahead.
One of the chapters in the bookthat will be released later
this year, which is entitledAging While Black, a radical
re-imagining of aging and racein America.
And one of the chapters isentitled, From Advocacy to
(19:18):
Activism.
And what it posits is thatthere is an abundance of
advocacy on behalf of olderpeople generally and aging black
people specifically.
And what we at Aging Wild Blackbelieve is a critical shift is
(19:43):
moving from advocacy to whereolder black people become their
own activists.
When you think about whether itis the silent generation or
baby boomers, we have vastexperience with activism.
I mean, we've had to raise ourvoices to access the American
(20:08):
experiment in ways that fullyincluded us.
And we're at a point where wehave to do that again.
But that can occur simply withothers speaking on behalf of
Black elders.
A fundamental shift that needsto happen is how do we begin to
(20:29):
position Black elders to betheir own voices, to be their
own activists, to design anddeclare the world that they want
to live in.
Gretchen (20:43):
And how do we do that?
Raymond (20:46):
So there's a wonderful project that we at Aging While
Black have been partnering within Los Angeles that is called
the Sankofa Elders Project.
It is sponsored by theCalifornia Black Women's Health
Project and Sisters Aging withGrace and Elegance or SAGE.
(21:10):
It's funded by the StanFoundation California Health
Project.
Foundation, Metta Foundation.
Oh, wow.
And other big Cal.
Yeah, it is.
And it is that what theycreated were these echo or
(21:31):
community organizations acrossCalifornia.
And this one is in SouthCalifornia.
Los Angeles.
And what this amazing team ofpeople led by my dear friend,
Carlene Davis, has done is thatthey have mobilized over the
(21:53):
course of six to eight months,more than a hundred Black elders
who are known as ambassadors.
And what they have done is theyhave created a manifesto on
wellbeing for Black elders inSouth Los Angeles.
(22:16):
A manifesto, wow.
And now they are preparing topresent and become activists for
the execution of this manifestoin government, in
organizations, incommunity-based institutions.
(22:39):
And they are the creators, theowners, and the drivers of this
work.
And it is an amazing model andone that we at Aging While Black
are partnering with our dearfriends, Carlene and her team on
(23:04):
understanding the learnings sothat they might be replicated in
other communities.
But they have otherorganizations across this
country who basically elevateactivism in addition to
advocacy.
Gretchen (23:22):
Yeah, the two of them kind of go together, but you
have to take it another step toget to activism and get more
personal and get peopleinvolved, like you said, in
advocating for themselves, in asense, picking up that torch and
trying to make some change,right?
Would you say that's kind ofthe difference between advocacy
and activism?
Raymond (23:42):
Yeah, advocacy overdone can mute the voices of the
people we are advocating for.
And so we become their voices.
We become the articulators oftheir best interest and what
(24:04):
needs to happen.
Activism says, you have spacehere.
Your voice matters.
And Any strategy that isexecuted on your behalf should
be informed by yourperspectives.
Gretchen (24:27):
I'm pausing because I'm actually taking notes and I
keep thinking I'm just going tore-listen to this podcast over
and over until it all sinks inbecause you're saying so many
great powerful things that Iwant to remember.
Raymond, thank you for that.
Raymond (24:41):
But Gretchen, and thank you for your openness and for
the openness of the Age Guidefamily, broadly defined.
But these are things...
that we collectively need tosay over and over again, we need
(25:04):
to explore, we need to createvenues where we can ask
questions, where we can pushback when it doesn't feel right
for me and create these kinds ofspaces where we can have these
conversations.
It's part of what we are.
(25:24):
So the next big step for agingwhile blind is we are having the
audacity to invite people tojoin a national network.
And so we are going to belaunching in April, actually at
(25:45):
the American Society on AgingConference in Orlando, we are
going to be launching the AgingWhile Black Network.
And it is going to be anelectronic platform where people
can self-identify and connectwith, and we are going to be
(26:09):
weaving and mapping andconnecting people based on
geography, based upon size oforganization, based upon
population served, based uponinterest, affinities.
And so we see our work asnetwork weavers.
(26:31):
And so to invite people whilebeing consistent to what you do.
And so Age Guide, for example,could become a part of the Aging
While Black Network withoutchanging your mission, without
changing your population serve,but being true to what you do,
(26:53):
but also being open tounderstanding the three pillars
connecting with others who maybe similarly situated
organizations, but in otherparts of the country.
to be connected and to havesome peer learning and some
(27:14):
sharing, but also to beconnected with Black elders and
others who are geographicallydissimilar to you, who can
inform our collective learningand wisdom sharing.
Gretchen (27:32):
That is going to be a great opportunity.
I'm so excited.
And we, as soon as that'savailable, we'll share the link
in the show notes for thispodcast so that people can hear
your description of it and thenfollow through with getting
connected.
What a conversation this hasbeen.
I've learned so much.
You've given us a lot to thinkabout and that power of
(27:55):
representation and the realitiesof aging while Black and the
work that we all need to do tocreate this more just and
inclusive society, the way wetalk about things, the way we
either advocate or move a stepfurther into activism.
Lots, I know our listeners aregoing to walk away from this
(28:17):
feeling challenged and inspiredand maybe even seeing the world
a little bit differently.
I know I do after thisconversation.
So thank you for joining us,Raymond.
Are there any parting wordsthat you'd like to give to the
listeners?
Raymond (28:30):
Well, Gretchen, I Sincerely, I'll end where I
started.
It's a joy to share with you.
And I appreciate so greatly theopenness of the Age Guide
family to creating space forimportant conversations and
engagements.
And I do really appreciatethat.
(28:52):
I'll just end by saying AsianWhile Black is not a project for
me.
It is something that is deeplypersonal.
I grew up next door to my greatgrandmother and great
grandfather.
I have a picture in my study ofmy dad and my mom on the day
(29:13):
that my dad was sworn into theLouisiana House of
Representatives.
And it's such a beautifulpicture.
But I look at it now and Irealize that 177 days later, my
dad was dead of leukemia.
And my mom now, 41 years later,ambulates on a walker as a
(29:36):
91-year-old who fell and hit herhead and has cognitive decline
and other things.
And I am my mom's primarycaregiver.
I also, in just a few days,will be observing my 69th
birthday.
And so this isn't just aproject or an organization.
(30:04):
It's deeply personal.
And it is my lived experience.
Gretchen (30:10):
Wow.
Well, thank you so much forthat, Raymond.
Thank you for sharing yourpersonal perspective and being
open to passing on your wisdom.
Really appreciate having youhere.
Raymond (30:22):
Thank you.
To
Gretchen (30:25):
everyone listening, let's carry this forward.
Keep asking questions.
Keep challenging assumptionsand most of all, keep seeing and
celebrating the wisdom of ourelders.
Thank you for being here and Iwill see you next time on the
Age Guide Perspectives on theAging Journey.
Val (30:42):
Hello and welcome to your Medicare Minute.
My name is Val Guzman and I'mthe Benefit Access Specialist
here at Age Guide.
Today, we're going to learnways to avoid medical debt with
Abigail Rodriguez, patienthealth advocate at the DuPage
(31:06):
Health Coalition.
Stay tuned to learn more.
Abigail (31:12):
Hi, my name is Abigail Rodriguez and I am a patient
health advocate for DuPageHealth Coalition, also known as
Access DuPage.
We have a lot of programs thathelp with different situations
and one of those areas weadvocate in is medical debt.
Medical debt is growing everyyear and it can be incredibly
frustrating, especially when youlive on a fixed income and
can't afford any additionalbills.
(31:32):
My goal is to help reducestress and ease financial
burdens for older adults in ourcommunity, as well as providing
education so that they are ableto advocate for themselves Here
are some tips for the mostcommon situations that I have
been helping with.
So tip number one is alwaysreview your medical bills.
We're all humans and makemistakes and chances are someone
(31:55):
in the billing department maymake a mistake from time to
time.
So please make sure you ask foran itemized statement and call
to ask about any billingquestions or discrepancies that
you see.
I cannot stress enough that ifyou have a secondary insurance
like Medicaid, please confirmthe billing department has this
information.
I know that coming home fromthe hospital can be tiring and
you probably won't bother tothink about it until you get the
(32:18):
bill in the mail, but this isreally important.
Do not put off calling them assometimes insurance companies
cannot backdate coverage and youcan be left with the remaining
balance that could have beencovered.
Tip number two is know yourcoverage.
As we know, Medicare changesevery year and some plans are
added and others are dropped andwhat insurance covers can
change too.
(32:38):
So it is important tounderstand your co-pays,
deductibles, and out-of-networkcosts as these can slowly add up
depending on how often you usethem.
If you are someone who hasissues with coordination or
balance, perhaps it is not inyour best interest to get an
insurance with a $300 copaymentfor an ambulance ride.
That kind of leads me to thethird tip, which is speak to a
(33:01):
SHIP counselor.
Insurance coverage changesevery year, but so does your
health.
It's important to meet with aSHIP counselor every year if
possible to determine if thereare any changes you need to make
to your coverage.
SHIP counselors are availableto educate you about the
different types of Medicareplans available and help you
make educated decisionsregarding your coverage.
While you might be okay withthe plan you currently have,
(33:23):
perhaps there's a better optionout there for you that could
reduce your insurance or medicalexpenses Thank you.
Tip number four is medicationprograms.
One of the things I have helpedwith recently is lowering
medication costs or trying toreduce them.
This may be something smalllike calling your insurance to
verify who your preferredpharmacy is.
This can significantly affectthe cost of your medication.
(33:46):
Pharmacy X may be charging you$200 for your eye drops, but at
Pharmacy Y, your preferredpharmacy, it could cost you only
$30.
Your insurance can alsodetermine whether there are any
medication programs from thethat are available to you for
little to no cost.
They will send you theapplication via mail or email.
You'll have to fill out yourportion of the application and
(34:09):
your provider will need to fillout the rest and send it back.
These programs are renewableeach year and your medication
could be free or at a reallyreduced cost.
And tip number five is seekfinancial assistant programs.
While a $1,200 hospital billmay seem payable, your economic
situation could change.
Always apply for financialassistance assistance through
(34:30):
hospitals when possible.
Some hospitals have a 240 daylimit of when to file, so the
sooner you submit theapplication, the better.
There is financial assistanceeverywhere, not just at the
hospitals.
For example, LIHEAP, whichhelps with home energy costs and
SNAP benefits.
Even Medicare has additionalprograms like Extra Help or SLIB
(34:51):
that can help with MedicarePart B premiums, Medicare Part D
deductibles, and coinsuranceexpenses.
The medical world is such adifficult world to navigate.
Never be afraid to reach outand ask for clarification from
providers, insurance companies,pharmacies or organizations like
us.
You do not have to live a lifeof medical debt.
(35:12):
There are a lot of resourcesand programs available.
We just might have to asksomeone to help us find the
correct ones.
So I encourage you to take outthat shoebox filled with medical
bills and apply some of thesetips or reach out to me and I'll
be more than happy to help.
Val (35:26):
This was your Medicare Minute.
For more information about theDuPage Health Coalition and
medical debt, contact Abigail at331-716-7168.
Gretchen (35:39):
Thank you for listening to The Age Guide,
Perspectives on the AgingJourney.
Age Guide coordinates andadministers many services for
older adults in NortheasternIllinois.
Our specially trainedprofessionals are available to
answer questions and connect youwith local service providers
(36:02):
and resources.
If you are interested in theseservices or want to learn more,
go to our website atageguide.org or call our offices
at 630-293-5990.
Please follow our podcast soyou can be notified in your
streaming account.
Thank you and we will see younext time on The Age Guide.
(36:25):
Guide podcast.
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