Aging Unfiltered: Let's Talk About Ageism – with Dr Tracey Gendron - The Age Guide: Perspectives on the Aging Journey

Episode Transcript
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Gretchen (00:00):
Welcome to the Age Guide podcast, Perspectives on
the Aging Journey.
This is our first episode inour new series entitled Aging
Unfiltered.
Through this podcast series, weare spreading the word about
ageism, and we're kicking it offintentionally on Ageism
Awareness Day.
Ageism is about stereotypes andhow we think and feel and act

(00:23):
towards others and ourselvesbased on age.
This podcast series willexplore effective strategies to
to change our own and society'sperspective on aging.
By focusing on these topics andengaging in discussions with a
diverse range of voices, we hopeto raise awareness about ageism
and inspire action towardsbuilding a more inclusive world

(00:46):
for all ages.
We have a very special guesttoday.
I think she's our first guestwho has done a TEDx talk, and I
have to say I am fangirling alittle bit over here.
She is really the perfectthought leader to kick off our
ageism series.
Dr.
Tracy Gendron is the author ofAgeism Unmasked, Exploring Age

(01:09):
Bias and How to End It, and sheserves as chair for the Virginia
Commonwealth UniversityDepartment of Gerontology and as
director for the VirginiaCenter on Aging.
Listen in as we discuss how wecan work together to impact
ageism awareness, not only onAgeism Awareness Day, but all
throughout our lives.

(01:30):
Welcome, Dr.
Gendron.
Thank you so much for havingme.
Well, it is such a pleasure.
I'd love for you to share a bitabout yourself and what sparked
your interest in gerontology.

Tracey (01:44):
Oh, such a good question.
So I'm Tracy, and I'm agerontologist.
And that means I have amaster's degree in gerontology.
And, you know, I think whatwhat got me interested was a
couple of different things.
I always I like to tell thisthat I was a terrible student in

(02:06):
high school, because I was aterrible student in high school.
And if I have, if one of myhigh school teachers was
listening to this today, theywould be shocked knowing that I
actually went on for a PhD, butI did.
So they did something right.
But when I was a senior in highschool, despite the fact I
wasn't interested, I did take apsychology class that I loved.
And in this psychology class,the instructor was talking about

(02:31):
the growing demographic ofolder people and then introduced
me to this word gerontology,which I had never heard before
and which very few people hadheard.
And I was like, Oh, that's athing.
And she said, yeah, you know,you can actually like think
about this as a career becausethere's going to be more and
more older people.
So that immediately kind ofcaught my attention.

(02:52):
And I knew then that it wassomething that I wanted to look
into.
When you couple that with avery, very strong relationship
with my grandparents growing up,I had personal role models for
aging that were very powerfulfor me.
That makes sense.
I was

Gretchen (03:08):
going to ask you if you had some personal connection
to

Tracey (03:13):
older adults.
older people and saw it assomething to look forward to and
look up to, which is so verypowerful.
So you put the personal and theprofessional together and it

(03:33):
set off my interest in the fieldas a whole.

Gretchen (03:36):
That is awesome.
And you've been able to havesuch an impact.
I think you talked aboutageism.
It's a term that is becomingmore recognized, but not
everyone fully understands it.
We've got a lot of isms in ourculture.
Can you help us define whatageism is and explain how it

(03:56):
manifests in different areas oflife, like the workplace, the
health care, the media?

Tracey (04:02):
Yeah.
How long do you have?
Because talk about this.
Right.
So, yeah, there are a lot ofisms and they are all important
and they all build upon eachother.
Ageism is interesting becauseaging is the one universal thing
that we all have in common.
Every one of us is aging everymoment of our lives.

(04:22):
So ageism is something thatapplies to every one of us.
And it's so normative.
It's so accepted within ourculture that it's practically
invisible.
So we have made great stridesover the Right.

(04:44):
understand what I'm talkingabout.

(05:13):
Just based on somebody's age,that's discriminatory.
You know, that's leading intolike, I'm making a judgment
about you and I don't knowanything about you.
So, ageism is other directed inthat way.
But ageism is also internallydirected.
So that's how we feel aboutourselves as aging individuals.

(05:33):
Do we carry around fear, shame,dread about our own aging?
Do we want to disassociate withbeing aging?
Don't call me old.
I'm not old.
That's internalized ageism.
Do we put limits on ourself onwhat we think we can do?
No, I'm too old to be able todo that.
And that has actual, you know,real consequences for our health

(05:58):
and for our happiness and evenfor our longevity.
So it's externally, it'sinternal.
And then it lives within ourrelationships and the way that
we communicate and talk to eachother.
A lot of those littlecompliments that we give to each
other that are reallymicroaggressions.
So that haircut makes you lookyounger.
That outfit makes you lookyounger.

(06:18):
Every time we put kind of avalue judgment on young versus
old or old versus young, we'refeeding into that narrative of
ageism.
And the truth is that it existseverywhere.
It's not only within us and ourrelationships, but it's in our
institutions.
So as you said, it happens atwork.
It happens when somebody'spassed over for a promotion

(06:41):
because of their age, why it'sharder for older people over 50
to find new jobs.
It's in the assumptions we makeabout old people can't use
technology because they weren'tborn with it.
All of those things happen inthe institutional space.
And then it's in our culture.
So it lives everywhere.

(07:03):
The most obvious example is thefact that we have an anti-aging
industry.
Think about that for a second.
It is a billion dollar industrythat tells us that we should
feel shame and dread aboutaging.
We should be anti-aging.
Anti-aging is death.
We're all

Gretchen (07:24):
aging.

Tracey (07:26):
That's a good point.
Yes.
So it exists everywhere, whichis what makes it so complicated.

Gretchen (07:34):
So even in greeting cards, in advertisements,
anywhere you look in the media,you're seeing negative
stereotypes depicted andreinforced.
And then that reinforces it forus.
When do you think that biasbegins?
I've heard

Tracey (07:52):
it starts very young.
I mean, children as early asthree years old start to learn
ageism, start to internalizeageism.
So if you look at some of theearly literature or even movies

(08:14):
and you look at the depictionsof like, you know, the old hag
versus the young princess, youngis beautiful, old is ugly and
scary.
When you think about kind ofthe way that older people can be
portrayed as caricatures, oneof my biggest pet peeves is how
many people celebrate thehundredth day of school by

(08:35):
dressing this a hundred yearold, right.
Or, you know, we are, we'remaking fun of old people.
So from a very, very young age,and then it's, you know, the
way we talk about ourselves.
So if you have a parent who'smodeling for you, like, I don't
look old, I don't feel old.
I will do, you know, whatever Ican to not be old.

(08:56):
That's also another way we'relearning about it.

Speaker 03 (08:59):
So

Tracey (09:00):
it starts at a very, very young age and it's just
conditioned over time.
Yes.

Gretchen (09:06):
And we're all kind of stuck in a rut of repeating
these things, even if we'rebecoming more aware of it.

Tracey (09:13):
Yes.

Gretchen (09:14):
I know in your book, you explore strategies for
creating a society that kind ofdoes the opposite of what you've
been talking about, that valuespeople of all ages.
Can you share some insightsinto how we can move toward a
more age inclusive world?
How do we change how we talkabout this and what we say to
ourselves and to others?

(09:35):
Are there some key actions wecan take?

Tracey (09:37):
Yeah, absolutely.
So, you know, I think this is agreat beginning.
First, we just have to be awarethat ageism is a thing and we
can start reflecting on how wefeel about our own aging.
That's just number one, isrecognize that we are all aging.
This isn't about other people.
This isn't about old people.
This is about all of us.

(09:58):
So number one, we're all aging.
Number two, we can actuallystart to educate ourselves on
what aging actually means.
We have a view of aging as aprocess of decline.
We talk about aging as beingover the hill, but the truth is
aging is something that happensin our bodies.
It's also something thathappens in our minds, in the

(10:21):
social space, to a sense ofspirituality.
In gerontology, we call it thebiopsychosocial spiritual
process of aging.
So that means aging is not onlyabout decline.
It's also about growth.
We continue to grow and evolveand become new versions of
ourselves.
So when we start to see agingas the holistic process of

(10:46):
change and how we live overtime, it becomes a little bit
less scary.
Definitely.
We do have decline.
We do have loss, although thatcan happen at any point in our
life.
But most older people actuallyfeel a real sense of comfort and
freedom being who they arebecause they've worked really

(11:09):
hard.
If you look back and thinkabout a past version of yourself
from five years ago, 10 yearsago, even two years ago, and you
think about something you'veworked hard to accomplish,
whether that be a fear youovercame, whether it to be a
skill that you have, whatever itis, And you realize like, hey,
I'm actually pretty proud ofmyself that I've gotten to this

(11:33):
place.
And we recognize that's a partof our aging.
It actually recontextualizesaging.

Gretchen (11:39):
That really does.
I've accomplished this becauseI've moved forward in my life.
I've aged.

Tracey (11:46):
Exactly.
And it's because of my agingthat I am who I am.
So I think, you know, inpersonal ways, those are the
first things we can do is startto see it differently.
And then outwardly, we canstart to recognize the bias that
we may have when we make anassumption about someone based
on their age and try and catchthat bias and instead say, I

(12:08):
don't know anything about thisperson Let me ask.
Let me find out more aboutthem.
Let me not be driven by anassumption based on age.
And then we can think about ourlanguage and, you know, kind of
how we say things and usethings.
But I think that personalreflection is really the key
piece.

Gretchen (12:25):
It's really recognizing it, right?
Yes.
Yes.
That's so powerful to thinkabout our language.
are aging in terms of thechanges that we see and the
progress that we make.
I just love that.
That is a really importantmessage that you have to share.
Do you have some tools orstrategies for reminding

(12:47):
ourselves of these things orinternalizing that message?

Tracey (12:51):
I think to, you know, read as much about it as you can
to be actually, you know,thinking about journaling,
thinking through your ownthoughts, remembering that
wherever you are today is fine.
You know, I don't want anyoneto feel a sense of I do things
that are that are ageist, I saythings or think things, that's

(13:12):
okay, we can't do better untilwe know better.
But once we start kind Catchyourself.
And try again.

Gretchen (13:46):
Good, good.
I think you should put out ajournal with some props for us.
I think that would be a greatnext project for you.
Great idea.
I would buy that.
Okay.
are hearing this and reallythinking about it in a new way
for the first time.

(14:06):
They maybe want to make adifference.
What are some other practicalsteps that they could take today
to combat ageism in maybe inthe wider arena, in their
community, in the places wherethey work?
How can each of us contributetowards shifting that?
I mean, you talked a lot aboutwhat we can do personally, but
is there a way to get thismessage out there?

Tracey (14:27):
Yeah, I think one of the most powerful ways things that
I can think of is recognizingthat every one of us is a role
model for aging.
Every one of us, because it'swhat we're all doing.
So what you say about itmatters because you as an
individual are teaching it androle modeling it for other
people.
So the way that you talk topeople younger than you, your

(14:50):
own kids, the people that youwork with really matters.
The way you talk about your ownaging, the way that we talk to
older people matters.
So if you are in, you work at aAAA, if you are working with
older people, there are lots ofstrategies that we can use.
We can start to think about,you know, how we communicate
with older people.

(15:10):
Do we talk about future selvesand goals and purpose and
possibilities, or are we kind offocused on the past?
Instead of talking about whosomebody used to be, do we talk
about who you are and who youare becoming, right?
What is it that brings you joy?
We can take the deficit to thestrengths.

(15:31):
Some of that is just thinkingabout elderhood as a life stage,
right?
Right now when we talk to olderpeople, a lot of them will
introduce themselves and saythey're retired.
Retirement is a socialinstitution.
Retirement is not a life stage.
Retirement tells me that youused to work, but it doesn't
tell me who you are.
Who are you now?

(15:52):
So we can like start to reallyhave strengths based purpose
driven conversations withpeople.
So I think there are, you know,kind of inward and outward
things that we can do.

Gretchen (16:06):
I love that idea.
And I'm even thinking aboutlike when we have events, we
have forms that you have to fillout to register for an event.
And we always put down, youknow, what's your organization
and what's your role there.
And we often get peoplereplying retired because we have
a lot of older adults who areparticipating in our events.
But is there a different waythat we could ask that question

(16:28):
that would encourage people totell us who they are?
Maybe we just say, who are you?

Tracey (16:32):
Yeah, exactly.
Or, you know, what, What isyour purpose or goal or
motivation for wanting to behere and to join?
It's not you're retired.
It's because you want to learnsomething new.
It's because you want to giveback.
It's because you want tocontribute, participate.
Yes, exactly.

Gretchen (16:50):
The information that we're really trying to gather is
sort of like what sector of ourspace are you from?
Who do you represent?
Why do you want to attend thisevent?
So there's other ways we couldask that instead of what's your
title in your organization.
And we could do that in a lotof different areas of the field
of aging.

Tracey (17:09):
That's so beautiful.
And so you answered your ownquestion.
That's something so small thatyou can do to communicate
something with purpose, to takesomething that was potentially
limiting in terms of age andcracking it open.
Yeah.
You just need to like have

Gretchen (17:30):
that aha moment of going, oh,

Tracey (17:38):
yeah, we could do this

Gretchen (17:43):
a different way.
for ASA, the American Societyon Aging, and they are doing an
Ageism Awareness Day toolkitthat our listeners might be

(18:05):
interested in.
Are you familiar with that?
Would you be able to share alittle bit about that toolkit?

Tracey (18:11):
Yeah, absolutely.
Please feel free to go to theASA website, Ageism Awareness
Day.
I think this is our third yearthat ASA has really put some
effort behind raising awarenessof ageism.
And having a day is such awonderful start to give people
the opportunity to say, okay,wait, what is ageism and why

(18:33):
should I care about this?
So there's fact sheets that youcan go look if you want any
statistics about ageism.
If you want to know about theimpact of ageism, there's chock
full of research on these factsheets that we have.
Going back to the 100th day ofschool, there's something on
that as well as alternatives ofhow we can engage with our

(18:54):
school districts.
I love that.
That's one of my favoritethings.
Because if you have kids in

Gretchen (19:00):
school, you're going to get hit with the 100th day
celebration and dress like anolder adult, unfortunately.
And this is a way to advocate.

Tracey (19:07):
Exactly.
A way to say, hey, there'sother ways of doing it.
There's resources on there thatI think, you know, are some of
those things we were talkingabout.
How do I start to think aboutthis?
How do I start to talk aboutthis?
So the toolkit is just awonderful way to start if you're
either dipping your toe intoageism or anti how ageism work
for the first time, or you'reseasoned in it and you just want

(19:29):
more resources.
I think there's something foreveryone.

Gretchen (19:32):
And it's to use throughout the year.
It's not just for ageismawareness day, right?
These are tools that you coulduse anytime.

Tracey (19:39):
This is every day.
Yes.
I mean, we have opportunitiesto role model every single day.
guess

Gretchen (19:47):
yeah so the actual day is a great time to celebrate
and to kick it off and to helpbuild some awareness and we are
doing a lot of social media andpromotion of the awareness day
itself but these tools andresources are there for folks
and we'll be sure to link tothose resources in our show
notes and we'll be supporting iton social media as well

(20:10):
excellent yeah thanks forsharing about that and for all
of the work that you do I'mreally excited that we got to
talk today and to be able toshare your voice and your ideas
with our listeners.
Dr.
Gendron, thank you so much forbeing here.
Oh,

Tracey (20:26):
thank you for having me.
It's been a pleasure.
I appreciate that you're givingsome thought to this.
I appreciate that you're makingit a priority for you because
it's really important.
It is.
It makes the difference in howwe see ourselves in our own
future and how we interact withpeople.
And just, yeah, I'm grateful

Gretchen (20:46):
Thank you for being here.
Do you have any more TED Talksplanned?
Not in the near future, but younever know.
Maybe someday.
It was an excellent talk.
And we will also link to yourTED Talk because it gives such a
great overview.
Thank you so much.
Thank you for being here.

Val (21:09):
Hello and welcome to your Medicare Minute.
My name is Val Guzman and I'mthe Benefit Access Specialist
here at AgeGuide.
Today we are answering aquestion about Medicare
enrollment.
When is the annual enrollmentperiod?
And does that mean my Medicareis changing next year?
Medicare's annual enrollmentperiod is going on from October

(21:32):
15th to December 7th and yourcoverage could be changing so
it's important to stay informed.
Many Medicare health and drugplans change their costs every
year, so while your current planmay have higher prices, there
could be new plans that costless.
It's important to compare yourplan options every year to be

(21:53):
sure that you have the best planthat covers what you need and
saves you money.
A big change for 2025 is thatthere will be an annual cap of
$2,000 on the cost of yourprescriptions.
So that means after you reachthis limit, the plan will pay
100%.
Also, if you have expensivemedications, you'll have the

(22:14):
option to spread out the costover several months instead of
having to pay all at once.
Your pharmacy will offer youthese spread out payments the
next time you refill yourprescriptions.
So a lot of improvements havebeen made to Medicare, and you
can visit the Age Guide websiteat ageguide.org to get connected
with a SHIP counselor and get abetter idea of how Medicare

(22:37):
will work for you in 2025.
Thank

Gretchen (22:42):
you for listening to The Age Guide, Perspectives on
the Aging Journey.
Age Guide coordinates andadministers many services for
older adults in northeasternIllinois.
Our specially trainedprofessionals are available to
answer questions and connect youwith local service providers
and resources.
If you are interested in theseservices or want to learn more,

(23:05):
go to our website atageguide.org or call our offices
at 630-293-5990.
Please follow our podcast soyou can be notified in your
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Thank you, and we will see younext time on the Age Guide
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Aging Unfiltered: Let's Talk About Ageism – with Dr Tracey Gendron

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Aging Unfiltered: Let's Talk About Ageism – with Dr Tracey Gendron