Mental Health and Cognitive Decline: A Serious Discussion with Melissa Gainey

Episode Transcript
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(01:00):
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Welcome, nothingers, to theAll About Nothing podcast.
I am Barrett Gruber.
This is episode number 253.
And we are going to have thisweek my friend, licensed professional
counselor Melissa Gainey.

(01:20):
Welcome, Melissa.
Thank you.
We're going to be talkingabout cognitive decline.
I am going to be the subjectmatter because at some point during
this episode, I am going totake the same test that President
Donald Trump took.
So we're going to do that hereand Melissa's going to administer
it for me.
But we're going to also talkabout cognitive decline, basically

(01:43):
this test and specifically butlike what it is that people experience
as they go, age wise and someof the factors that take into that.
So we're going to talk aboutthat as well.
I want to thank real quickSarah Jane Byers for this month's
Common Sense with Sarah Jane Byers.
Before it's too late.
If it's too late, comes getout there and visit our national

(02:06):
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(02:48):
I see that.
All right.
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Okay, please subscribe andshare the show.
That's how we get new listeners.
Also, please considersupporting the show financially by

(03:09):
visitingtheallaboutnothing.com and becoming
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If you can't do that, pleasegive us a five star review.
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You can do all of that fromthe all about nothing dot com.
So today on this podcast,we're going to be diving into the

(03:30):
topic of cognitive declinewith Melissa Gainey.
She is a licensed professionalcounselor and founder of in the Garden
Counseling LLC In WestColumbia, S.C.
melissa brings over a decadeof experience in mental health field.
She has having both worked inthe private practice and in home
community care across westernNorth Carolina.
Asheville, right?

(03:50):
Asheville and surroundingareas, yes.
Do you like living in Columbiamore than Asheville?
No.
No.
Gotta be honest.
You know, the honest therapy.
Yeah.
No, it's.
It's definitely different.
Yeah.
You know, she.
You earned your undergraduatedegree at University of South Carolina
and your master's fromUniversity of Southwest.
In this episode, we're gonnabe talking to Melissa something that

(04:13):
isn't quite in her expertiseor in her experience.
What is it you normal.
What is.
What is it you normally practice?
I do a lot of trauma work.
I do a lot of PTSD with veterans.
I do a lot of family work asfar as parenting.
And I have a lot of teenagersthat I help to kind of, you know,
move through the adolescenceand the high school and then transitioning

(04:36):
on and that type of thing.
But my youngest client rightnow is 5 and my oldest is 81.
So I pretty much have a.
That's pretty broad.
What was it that got you intowanting to be a therapist or a counselor?
Because those.
Those are two different things.
My parents aren't watching my family.

(04:58):
You know, like, just coming from.
Most families have theirissues and I think that I didn't
understand a lot of thatgrowing up.
And as I got older, I reallywanted to kind of delve more into
that.
I have family too.
Yeah.
I'm sorry.
Yeah.
You know, a lot of.
A lot of mental illness,addiction and that kind of thing
in my family.

(05:19):
And that's is just the truth.
And as a child, I didn'tunderstand it, so I wanted to help
other children, you know, tokind of move through that, I guess.
That's interesting.
Yeah.
And.
And we've known each other forwhat, five, six years?
Something like that.
We played softball and Woody'sfor a little while and.
Well, for.
For most of that.
Or I would show up and Melissawould have work to do here in an

(05:42):
office.
I'm sorry.
I was helping people like whatever.
Barrett.
I will.
I will say this.
I will say this.
She.
She.
For.
Because we're about the same age.
I'm probably a little older,but you running around in left field
and catching the ball issomething that I can't do anymore.

(06:04):
So kudos, because having youin left field always made me feel
better as a pitcher.
Because I play an adult co ed softball.
It isn't about trying to getstrikes and getting people out.
It's about.
Basically about runningaround, putting the ball.
In play, and let your defense work.
We miss you as a pitch picture.
Well, thank you.
Oh, we truly do.

(06:24):
I miss you as a teammate.
Do y'all have a.
Do y'all have a pitcher?
That's okay.
Talk about that.
Okay.
Yeah.
Like, we do.
Yeah, of course we do.
Have you.
I always encouraged otherpeople if they wanted to try and
pitch.
Like, I don't mind playingfirst base.
I don't mind playing third base.
You were always very willingto move around.
Yeah.
But, like, you know, I justwanted to show up and somebody tell

(06:44):
me where to play.
Yeah.
You were a great softball.
We do miss you.
Well.
Oh, I'll.
I'll give you your money afterthis, so.
But what is.
What is one of the things.
Because you also, when you say you.
A lot of you work withteenagers and children, and a lot
of what you do.

(07:05):
I have my.
My stepson, we went through aperiod where he was very frustrating
or frustrated towards me.
Like, as his stepfather, heshowed a lot of anger.
He was very opposed tofollowing directions, but some of

(07:26):
that was going through andlearning that one.
He's slightly on the spectrum.
He also has ADHD that he'sbeen tested.
And after we sort of came tothat realization, we were, as a family
dynamic, we were able toapproach that.
I was able to look at itcompletely differently.

(07:47):
Right.
Yeah.
And it completely changed our relationship.
Right.
He's 19 now.
He is the assistant manager ata Little Caesars.
Awesome.
He has not made any plans forcollege, but it's something that
I don't see a need to push him towards.
Yeah.
You know, just kind of encouraging.
But it was.
It was finding out exactlywhat it was, how he learned or how

(08:12):
he expressed himself.
And learning for me, becauseit's not just.
It's not him just learning tocope with, you know, what it is that
his personality is, but it'salso the family learning, learning
how best to approach everything.
And it's not about making himlike a special case, but it is recognizing

(08:35):
that there are different waysto handle and it's worked out even,
like with my own brother.
My brother suffered fromsevere brain trauma because he Had
a brain tumor from the age of7 or 4 or 5 all the way up until
he still has the brain tumor.
But he had one seizure.
He had two seizure surgeriesand one brain surgery.

(08:56):
But it left a trauma that hemay always be well behind.
Mature.
Yeah.
And.
And so.
But the approach that Ilearned with my son or my stepson,
that.
That's something that carriedover even in my brother, and then

(09:17):
it even carries over intopeople that I work with because I
recognize some of the samebehavior patterns.
Yeah.
Yeah.
From your experience.
Yeah.
What?
Like, I.
You know, I assume some of thepeople that you see are sort of facing
the same situations, like.
And, like, changes in familydynamics and, like, blended families.

(09:37):
I think, you know, it's alwayshard for kids, or not always hard,
but usually hard.
No matter what the shape ofthe family, you know, is you're a
new person in their lifethat's supposed to be a parental
figure.
And that feels odd, I think,in those developmental stages, and
I think it just takes that work.
It sounds like you're doingthat work, you know, to just, you

(09:57):
know, bond with them andunderstand them and figure out what
makes them tick and how to,you know, whether they're on the
spectrum or they're just, youknow, normal, which I don't believe
in that word.
No, I agree.
What is normal?
You know, it's different foreach person and each family.
So, you know, figuring out howhe is developing and how he is processing
emotions and trying to kind ofwork with him as a team, you know,

(10:19):
I think is a.
Is a big part of that.
Yeah, some of.
Because both of my daughters.
One daughter is slightly onthe spectrum as well, suffers from
adhd.
And we discussed.
She's got some OCD tendenciesgoing on.
My other daughter, who is lessadhd, adhd, copes very well, but

(10:43):
sometimes she has veryemotional outbursts that.
That, you know, and you.
You handle both of them differently.
Right.
It's.
As a.
As a parent and as, you know,a human being.
You just have to.
For me, I just have torecognize that you treat both with

(11:05):
as much care as you can whilerecognizing that one is gonna be
a different than the other.
Absolutely.
And I think a lot of that isstructure and routine, and no matter
what they're dealing with, itis like.
It's a superpower.
I always say to my kids, ADHDand autism, they're superpowers.

(11:25):
They're not handicaps.
You know, it is.
You can use those things andapply it, you know, but that means,
like, kind of behavioral interventions.
Where it's.
You help to create morestructure with.
With one, you may help toloosen up a little bit with the other
one.
You know, you kind of have tonavigate and bob and weave in that.
I have literally said the samething that I look at autism as being

(11:47):
some, like, if it's a child,that's their superpower.
In fact, I was.
It wasn't.
It wasn't my most recenthaircut, which I'm not super happy
with, but that's great.
Oh, thanks.
Ye.
But the haircut I gotpreviously, the.
The stylist that was cuttingmy hair, she was talking about her
son and.
And how he was.

(12:08):
How he had just been diagnosed as.
As on the spectrum and.
And.
And whatnot.
And we were having thisconversation about it, and I was
telling her about my children,and I told her.
I said.
I said, what is he good at?
Like, what is.
What is that one thing thathe's good at?
And.
And she said, well, he's.
He really, really likes to.
It seems like he's reallydrawn to animals or whatever.

(12:29):
And I said, encourage that.
I said, that's on that.
You know, like, whatever itis, they're going to be absolutely
wonderful at that thing thatthey're passionate about.
It might not be yourtraditional thing, like, oh, get
good grades or do chores well.
Or whatever, you know, but ifthey have that one thing, you know,
just make sure that youcelebrate that.

(12:50):
Very cool.
Well, I'm glad to finally geta professional to agree with me.
I'm not agreeing with you.
Let's talk out.
There's some other caveats,you know, but.
No, I think in general, yes,it could be.
It's a superpower.
And especially the young ones,you know, let's say 5 to 10 or 11,
if you can get them to embracethe superpower aspect of it.

(13:12):
Yeah, I think that that helpsthem later on.
Yeah.
To not feel so isolated in itand not feel so, like, you know,
ostracized.
Yeah, absolutely.
It's my adhd.
No, it's my adhd.
You know, I mean, like, itbecomes something to celebrate and
be ashamed of, I guess.
Did you know that that wassomething that.
That you were going to focuson when.
No, actually.
At all.

(13:33):
No.
But in working in westernNorth Carolina, we had a lot of rural
areas where there wasn't thebest educational resources.
Sure.
You know, so I think we cameupon a lot of undiagnosed children,
a lot of families that werenot able to get to the resources,
you know, they live.
I went to places that had noPlumbing, no electricity.
I mean, we went to thehollers, if you will.

(13:53):
It's a real thing.
Oh, yeah, it really is.
And no cell phone service,which is a little unnerving at times,
but you know me, I'm like, wegot this.
Did you ever have to yellacross the holler to get somebody
to bring.
To let down the drawbridge or.
No, nothing like that.
I may have yelled a few timeslike, help me with your child because

(14:13):
he is now on the river, orhe's riding a horse across a pasture.
And I'm like, is that.
No, I don't know.
That might not be okay.
An escape.
Yes.
Or just showing off.
And, like, I will jump onthis, you know, horse or donkey one
time, actually, and take off.
And I'm like, okay, you're six.
You're on the donkey, butyou're hanging on.
You're doing well.
Again, a superpower.
Right.

(14:34):
But no, you know, I'm workingin those areas.
I did start to become morefamiliar with ADHD and autism and
that kind of thing.
So I think one of the.
One of the things.
And you don't have to agreewith me if you don't want to, but
fuck you, Robert Kennedy Jr.
The idea.
I agree with that.
Okay, fair enough.
But some of the things that hesaid at his press conference a couple

(14:57):
weeks ago about how someonewho is autistic.
Well, first of all, thisbelief that autism sets in at 2 years
old if it's not taken care of.
The fact that his belief,without any scientific research at
all, is that someone who isautistic will never play baseball

(15:18):
or never pay taxes or never beable to use the bathroom unassisted.
And, like, these are.
These are atrocious claims tomake, and.
They'Re completely, like, unfounded.
They're like, not.
You know, there's nothing thatbacks that at all.
Right.
Actually, there's a lot moreinformation that backs otherwise.
Yeah.
You know, I mean, a lot of myclients that have XYZ are successful

(15:40):
doing all of those things.
Yeah.
You know, like I said we weretalking about before we started recording,
I work.
I work with a number of peoplethat after.
After seeing, you know,diagnosis of.
Of the spectrum and then adhd,I work with a number of people that.
I recognize that in them.
And they may not be diagnosed,but I recognize it in them.
And I.

(16:00):
I have learned how to adjustwhat I.
How I.
How I ask of them, your expectations.
The way that you present whatyou would like from them or, you
know, how.
How you interact.
Yeah.
And that's yeah, one of themin particular, I recognize when he
is, when he is overlyfrustrated, he becomes much more

(16:22):
difficult and much thingsbecome more difficult for him because
that frustration starts tobleed into his communication.
And then, and, and so, youknow, I will pull him aside and just
say, I've got your back.
I said, whatever.
Deep breathing, whatever youneed to do, you know, and if you
can't communicate, that addsto that frustration like tenfold.

(16:44):
Oh, absolutely.
If you're feeling it and youcan't communicate it, then of course
you're gonna act out with behaviors.
Yep.
And that's where parents comein and go, fix my kid.
He's hitting the walls.
But why is he hitting the walls?
He doesn't have the words orthe, you know, the ability to, or
coping skills to handle whathe's feeling.
And I think that's where parents.
The education around that isreally important.

(17:05):
So.
Well, I would tell people tolook up your practice to see.
But you all have a lot of clients.
I do have a lot of clients.
I would not say don't look upthe practice.
I would say look it up, checkit out.
And if you would like to geton the wait list, I have about a
two month wait list.
Right.
Okay.
So.
Okay.
And I am more than happy to,you know, where I can.

(17:26):
Sure.
And there's a, there's a goodpossibility that you will also be
up for Best of Columbia as faras Fingers crossed vote.
Yeah.
So this episode will come outbefore the voting starts, but we
will absolutely push for allof the friends of the podcast to.

(17:46):
I'll be pushing for you.
Yeah.
As well.
So.
Yeah, that works out.
Yeah.
So what I brought you ontonight for was because Donald Trump
recently took his, hisphysical, which includes, because
he is 78 years old, about toturn 79, a very specific cognitive

(18:07):
test.
And when I looked it up,because I had seen some of the things
reported in the news as far aswhat the test looked like and you
know, he talked about it asthough it was this test that he aced.
Flying colors.
Yeah, bigly.
It was.
So I wasn't entirely certainas to what something like this test

(18:30):
looked like because I've takenan IQ test when I was younger and
I've taken, you know, I'venever taken a cognitive test because.
For fear of judgment.
But I love your honesty.
I mean, you know, there'salways the potential this could go
very badly.
It really could.
But the fact that we have apresident that actually has to have

(18:56):
in order for.
Maybe it's not for Me?
Cause I don't know how well acognitive test actually does in determining
someone's level.
I mean, we talked about that alittle bit, but I don't know that
something like this actuallyreally defines what it is that's
going on.
How quickly are they gonnareact to important things?

(19:18):
And as the president in myopin, you have to have the ability
to respond in an intelligentway, or at least have the ability
to assess what's going on, togive a good, really.
Complex situation, like, youknow, war, or, you know, determining
what our country needs to moveforward and whatever that is.
But, like, this is a verysimple test.

(19:40):
And like you said, this is notmy forte.
This is not something I do awhole lot.
But when I saw it, I was like,wait, that's it?
That's all we gave him.
Like, and, you know, it's justsomething that you would give someone
that you were worried aboutdriving a car, possibly.
Or, you know, should they betaking care of themselves?

(20:01):
Yeah.
Yeah, that's fair.
That's even.
It is what he took to be able to.
Yes, I aced it, and I amrunning the country.
And it is disturbing a bit tome that this is what they gave him.
So it's.
It's the Montreal CognitiveAssessment, and this is what was
he was given.

(20:22):
It should also be noted thatthis is the same thing that Biden
was given all four years hewas in.
And.
And while I don't know whattheir scores were specifically, I
think that if Biden had notpassed it, that there would have
been something said.
I think.
I think it would have leaked,but it's not what I would call very

(20:44):
complicated.
And that's not really justcoming from me, whose IQ has been
tested before, and it's comeout decent.
And I don't know.
I guess I think one of thethings that I find to be a hindrance
sometimes, but I pride myselfon is my observational skills and

(21:06):
recognizing people's behaviorsand things like that and being able
to determine based on myactions, what the outcome is going
to be.
So I can.
I can.
I can stay ahead and recognizewhat is what.
What is the most probableoutcome based on my interaction with

(21:28):
somebody.
That's my.
I think that's my superpower,because I.
Can get you a cape.
Like, I am.
I'm gonna get you a cape.
But.
So, okay, so anyway, so.
But that's.
That's.
That's one of the things thatI pride myself on, and I think that
it makes me fairly cognitive,or at least my cognitive skills.

(21:52):
Are competent in those areas.
But, I mean, I don't know, Ifeel like this would be a lot more
intensive and address manymore things.
Yeah.
If we were assessing thecompetency of someone that can, you
know, push a button or cantake away our rights, you know, and
on and on.
But I would say that, youknow, it may be something more, more

(22:15):
comprehensive that you woulddo with that situation.
So, yeah, ultimately we'reasking Montreal Cognitive.
Whoever it is that comes up with.
This test, whoever's in Montreal.
Yeah.
Do better call us, like, because.
So cognitive decline isprevalent with age.

(22:36):
It is.
Two thirds of Americansexperience some sort of cognitive
impairment by the age of 70.
That encompasses both mild andsevere forms.
Dementia is obviouslysomething that we see a lot of cognitive
decline in.
Melissa was kind enough topull up some information and do some
research.
What were some of the thingsthat you found?

(22:58):
Well, well, I mean, I foundthe things that we probably all know,
which is dementia andAlzheimer's and loss of memory and,
you know, the things like youdon't recognize a family member or
you don't, you don't rememberan appointment and that type of thing.
But, you know, what I reallydidn't know is that 1 billion people
in the world are age 60 or over.

(23:20):
And that's in a 2020 study.
They say that by 2050, that's1.4 billion and that's going to be
1 in 6 people globally.
And when you look at all theother information that we're going
to, that we're discussing,it's like, wow, that's one in six
of us that are going to bedealing with this.
Yeah.
And going to have to take thisone page test.
I'm kidding.
It's probably going to bemore, it's going to be more thorough

(23:42):
for us.
But, you know, just, you know,the most common, this is very interesting
to me.
The most common mental healthconditions, cognitively and otherwise
for older adults aredepression and anxiety.
And I think that that comeswith the dementia and the Alzheimer's
and then the lack of resourcesand support and that kind of thing,
you know, which I did say, youknow, tongue in cheek, but not really.

(24:05):
I was like, depression andanxiety, which the current administration
has given me plenty of.
Yeah, that's fair.
You know, and I wish I had alittle bit of the memory loss so
that I could just forget thisis happening.
But unfortunately, this is what's.
What's happening.
Admittedly, I think that'spart of what's going on with some
of his supporters is thememory loss I really do.
I believe I agree with you, sir.
A quarter of the deathsglobally from suicide, which is 27%,

(24:29):
are among age people 60 or over.
Wow.
Who are experiencing thesetypes of things.
But you know what happens aswe age.
We all know that.
Cognitive decline.
Yeah, of course.
Like, you know, guess whatthat is.
You know, memory,concentration, brain function.
Set it up.
If there weren't an expirationtime to all of what this is, I don't.

(24:51):
I think that would make me alittle uncomfortable.
Like.
Right.
Yeah.
Like, we need to know, like,kind of.
Yeah.
Stories or, you know.
Yeah.
Like where it's.
You know.
You know, we all know.
Losing your train of thought,forgetting things, feeling overwhelmed.
A lot of.
I'm sure that people out therehave experienced people with Alzheimer's

(25:11):
being angry, aggressive, thattype of thing.
And then you take itpersonally a little bit.
You know.
Yeah.
When grandpa or whoever doesnot recognize you and you.
Or demand something and thenyou get.
You get emotional, you know,and it's like, it's hard not to.
But I think that's anotherpart of it, is just to remember that's
not.
That's not genuinely wherethey're coming from.

(25:31):
They're confused and they'rehaving cognitive distortion.
So, yeah, just a lot of, youknow, you know me, I'm like, I've
got pages.
Melissa pulled a lot of research.
The social support and I thinkthe community support and having
funding and having resourcesfor this kind of thing is important.
Unfortunately, that is exactlywhat our current administration is

(25:52):
abolishing.
So.
Yeah.
And I have a lot on that, too.
But we can just go on.
There's.
There.
I think one of the.
One of the.
One of the things I find themost disturbing is that most of the
people that are in theadministration currently are in and
around that age group of wherewe're going to start seeing the cognitive.

(26:13):
Where you potentially aregoing to see the cognitive decline.
Now, that's not going to say.
I'm not saying that they areall gonna suffer from it or that
any of them are suffering from it.
I certainly recognize somethings with Donald Trump.
One of the things that cameout today was he sat down with an
interview with a reporter fromABC that aired last night where they

(26:34):
were discussing the situationwith the man that was taken to El
Salvador.
And one of the things thatTrump brought up was that he has
the tattoos on his hand thatsay Ms.
13.
But what he couldn't get, whatthe reporter couldn't get Donald
Trump to understand was, isthat it was people, and it was Someone
in his administration that wasdefining or had basically defined

(26:58):
what the letters on his handmeant, because what he had on there
was like a marijuana plant onone, and then it was a skull or something
like.
And then a cross and thensomething else.
But, like, that someone hadmade some sort of crypto diagnosis
of what those letters meant,and he went with it.

(27:20):
Right.
But.
But what they had done wasthey above those.
They had photoshopped in theletter M s 13 above it so that it
could be easily.
So, so basically that was theproof that that's what those.
Those symbols mean and that weneeded to, you know.
Right.
And that's not.
Yeah.
But in the conversation thatthe reporter had with Donald Trump,

(27:43):
he could not get him tounderstand that the MS.13 was not
physically written as a tattooon his hand.
That.
That had Photoshopped and thatwas very similar to conversations
that I have had with someonein my family about similar things.
Is that there is this.
There is this.
And I think that's part of the cognitive.

(28:04):
A cognitive issue is that theyare so attached to something that
they want to believe that they.
They can't focus on anything else.
They will not let other.
Any other evidence come into play.
No room for any other type of.
Right.
It's not a conversation.
Right.
Statement.
And that's it.
Yeah.
That's the hardest thing withyour family members and people that

(28:26):
you care about that it's not a conversation.
They're not interested inactual factual information.
And it's.
Yeah, that's not Photoshopped.
That's real.
It's fake news.
If you say that it's Photoshopped.
And honestly, the fake news iscoming from their side.
Yes.
So it's.
You know.
Yeah, there's.
I think we're all exhaustedtrying to explain this.
Yeah.

(28:46):
I will not stop fighting forwhat's right.
I hope not.
I hope not.
Absolutely not.
I do look forward to vacationsfrom it.
Those little.
Little vacations, you know, aweekend here or there.
Yes.
Somebody not showing up at thedoor and just letting themselves
in.
You know, I know that soundsvery specific, because it is.
Obviously it is.

(29:08):
Do you need to come in for asession about that?
Because I'm.
I welcome you with open arms.
Do.
Do you use any of your sessions?
Do you use, like, physical, like.
Like muting of senses?
Like, I don't know.
Mallet to the head.
Yeah.
Okay.
That's fair.
You guys know, I don't.
Any.
Any clients right now watching this?
No, we do some tapping.

(29:28):
We do some.
We do EMDR type Of.
Oh, interesting.
But, no, we don't really muteany of the.
No, it's.
It's.
It's.
Let it out.
This is my.
My no judgment zone in my non.
That's fair sanctuary.
And so we just.
We go for it.
Masochists, welcome.
For the most part, you have to be.
You have to be, like, screenedfirst, but sure.

(29:50):
Yeah.
No, I just, you know, the pain.
The pain sort of takes awayfrom the reality.
You know, I mean, maybe Ishould incorporate that.
Add that on Psychology Today.
I also specialize in.
Here's here.
Right behind the chair is allof the mallets that are used to.
Really.
Now we have all differentsizes, shapes.

(30:14):
So cognitive decline.
To get us back on track, Ipulled up some information.
Cognitive decline can resultfrom various factors, including neurological
conditions like, you mentionedAlzheimer's, Parkinson's disease,
strokes, that sort of thing.
Right.
Chronic health issues, highblood pressure, diabetes, and sleep
apnea can also increase the risk.

(30:36):
Mental health, depression,chronic stress and anxiety are significant
contributors.
Lifestyle factors, poor diet,lack of physical activity, and smoking
can exacerbate declineMedication side effects, which if.
If you watch almost anyregular television and you watch
any of the commercials.

(30:57):
I almost get anxiety just fromhearing the side effects from things
that make it sound likethey're improving people's lives.
And then it's like.
It's comical, but it's also horrific.
Yeah.
You know, it's like, you mightbreathe better, but you've got to
kill your dog, eat it.
And like.
I'm sorry.
That's.
I was gonna say I was justgonna go as far as.

(31:18):
But now you have chronicdiarrhea, and.
I went that far.
Like, you could view your dogas a romantic partner.
Kill it, eat it.
And, you know.
No, it's.
It really is ridiculous,though, because it's like some of
our antidepressants and someof our things that are supposed to
help with.
Also the number one ispossible suicidal ideation.

(31:38):
Yeah.
Or thoughts.
And I'm like.
I'm trying not to go there.
And you know what?
I mean?
This could possibly.
If I were to.
My DNA, were to, you know,bond with this medication in a certain
way, that I could actuallywant to take my life forward.
And so many of those medications.
Yeah.
Especially with the elderly,include that as the number one.

(32:01):
Suicidal thoughts.
Well, I'm coming to you withsuicidal thoughts.
So, you know, but maybe not.
We're gonna gamble, right?
We're guinea pigs.
That is.
That is.
That is a little frightening.
It really is pretty.
Yeah.
Well, it's pretty prominent asfar as.
Those medications, there areblood pressure medications that destroy
people's kidneys.
Right.
You know, it's like, okay, socould you improve your life a little

(32:25):
better by being more activeand maybe paying more attention to
the food you're eating?
Or now you're on dialysis.
And now you're on dialysis,but your blood pressure is looking
great.
Yeah, I think one of the.
One of the.
One of the other things thatcomes up when it comes to cognitive

(32:46):
decline is judgment frompeople, and we may have talked a
little bit about that.
I think Donald Trump is veryprideful about what he wants people
to recognize him as, and I'msympathetic to that because this
is a man who ultimately wasbasically handed his entire life.

(33:06):
Like, he's never.
There's never really been alot of work that he had to do to
get where he's at.
Not saying he didn't do any.
I'm just saying that, youknow, he was.
He had a very lavish childhood.
He was, you know, the bestschools were available to him.
And as far as the businessesthat he did build, you get behind

(33:32):
those or you get into thebackstory on those, then you learn
that it was mostly his namethat carried through those, rather
than the actual work that wasdone for them.
So when it comes to peoplemaking a judgment or assessing his
cognitive decline, and what Ithink I recognize as being some of

(33:53):
the issues that he is probablyexperiencing with repeating.
He repeats himself a lot.
He uses.
He will.
He will get off task or offsubject of what it is that they're
talking about very easily.
So with.
With some of.
With recognizing some of thoseas being part of what the cognitive
decline is, I think that Ialso see that he is very prideful,

(34:20):
which I think also sort oflends into some of the Alzheimer's
and the dementia is that.
That he is very quick to angerwhen it's brought up.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
So less.
Less likely to takeaccountability or to be able to converse
about that.
Whatever he's presented with,I think he just instantly gets.

(34:41):
That's nonsense or fake newsor, you know, or just leave me alone.
Yes.
And that is verycharacteristic of Alzheimer's or
some sort of dementia.
Yeah.
Or cognitive decline in general.
Yeah.
Or maybe he's just, you know,not willing to address it because
the truth would be reallyuncomfortable for his.
For his platform.
Yeah.

(35:03):
If.
And again, knowing that it'snot in the.
It's not a lot.
It's not involved in your practice.
But I assume, you know,counselors know each other, you know,
people that that are.
That treat or maybe do sort ofassessments on that sort of thing.
Yeah.

(35:23):
Especially with a lot of myfriends at the VA or that, you know,
that do a lot of work with veterans.
The VA is a little limited asfar as.
Sure.
So with certain insurances,these veterans can go and see some
of my friends that are inprivate practice, and they do deal
with a lot of this.
And then, of course, on top ofthat being a lot of TBIs, a lot of,

(35:45):
you know, a lot of trauma andPTSD from what they went through.
So that becomes just kind of astew of different things that are
contributing to the naturalcognitive decline, you know, as they
age.
Yeah, yeah.
With veterans, I have toassume that it's.
It's both emotional andphysical trauma that probably really
play a role.

(36:06):
Veterans that I work with andthat my colleagues work with are
dealing with, let's say,missing a leg, having a TBI, having
a titanium plate or 15 of them.
And also the PTSD and also the.
Just the mental health aspectof it.
So.
Yeah, that becomes verymultidimensional, and then we don't
have the resources to address it.

(36:27):
Wow.
Especially here in SouthCarolina, you would think.
You would think at this dayand time that, I mean, with.
With advancements intechnology and the ability to.
To really streamline some ofwhat could be available services,
like, because it's notnecessarily that everyone's going

(36:48):
to get fixed just because.
Available resources, but tohave those resources available.
I mean, we did an episode acouple of years ago with two service
members, one of them active,one of them medically discharged,
that both had very similarstories of the trauma that they went
through when they were inAfghanistan during the.

(37:12):
I guess it was the mid 2000s,so 2007, 2008.
And we also had Taylor, who isa therapist as well, usc, who works
with veterans and just talkingabout some of the trauma that they
experienced.

(37:32):
But I mean, one of my friends,he has no use of basically the one
side of his face because ofthe shrapnel and things from an IED
or IED that.
I think that's the right wordor the right letters.
Incendiary, explosive device.
But.
But, you know, so.

(37:53):
And all of what he had to gothrough to basically build back his
life after.
After being discharged fromthe military and then the change
in life from not being in themilitary to now being.
Civilian, it's all just so,you know, it's.
And then not having resourcesthat are able to help these folks

(38:15):
to.
Yeah, you know, come back to,let's say, Just normal life, you
know what I mean?
Like, with their families, youknow, just.
Just to be able to function inthat way.
Never mind the mental health,possibly meds, physical stuff that
they're going through, Justall of it, you know, it just.
It.
We don't have.
We don't have that.
Yeah.
You know, we don't have thatfor them to access.
And so that's where we look atthe alarming statistics around suicide

(38:38):
when it comes to veterans herein South Carolina.
But that's something we canaddress on another podcast.
Yeah, sorry.
I find when I talk a lotsometimes that my throat gets dry.
So we'll edit that out.
All right.
So one of the reasons that Ihad you here, which was the one that

(38:59):
I think would probably be themost entertaining for people, is
for me to go through and dothe Montreal cognitive assessment.
I really hope you pass, Barrett.
I do.
I did not bring over a pen ora pencil.
That's one of the things I forgot.
I could grab one of those.
Oh, sure.

(39:20):
Okay.
So.
Excuse me.
Goodness.
Would you like one as well as myself?
What is that?
Would you like one as well as.
Myself or a pencil?
Do we both need one?
I don't.
I.
I think.
I think we can.
I think it's up to you.

(39:41):
If I give you a pencil, youcan't erase it.
I promise I'm gonna be watching.
That is.
That is one of the skills thatI definitely did not develop as a
child is the ability to erase.
I missed out.
I missed out on those instructions.
See if that works.
All right, perfect.
Your first test is to see ifyour pen works.

(40:03):
Do I know how to use a pen?
Oh, goodness.
See the glasses?
I can run for president.
If so, that would be fun, right?
I really would.
Wait a second.
At this point, how far have wehad to go down?
Okay, so the first part ofthis is.

(40:23):
What do they call this?
The alternating trail making.
Yeah.
So essentially what it is isyou have letters and numbers, and
you begin on this one with thenumber, and you.
You basically move.
So the example is that theygive is you start with 1 and move
to A, and then you go to 2,and then you would go to B.

(40:44):
So I'm going to draw the line.
So I'm gonna say 1, A, 2, B.
You're getting ahead of the examiner.
Oh, I'm sorry.
Now who's in cognitive decline?
I have cast it bigly.
Bigly.
No one's done this better.
Are you ready ever?
Yes.
Okay.
I'm also blind.

(41:04):
Please draw a line going froma number To a letter in an ascending
order.
Begin here.
I'm going to point to one, andI'm going to draw a line.
I want you to draw a line.
Right, We've already got that.
From 1 to A, A to 2.
I'd like you to continue that,please, Barrett.
All right, so I assume I'm notbeing timed, but I'm gonna.

(41:27):
I'm gonna.
In order, for audio purposes,I'm going to tell you what I'm doing.
So I'm gonna go 1 to A, A to2, 2 to B, B to 3, 3, 4 to D, D to
5, and then 5 to E, where itsays end.

(41:49):
And if that were A.
If what.
What are the.
What are the ink blots?
A Warsaw test.
Then what do you see there?
I don't know.
It's a messed up number two, maybe.
That's.
That's what I got.

(42:11):
All right, I'm gonna writethat down.
I'm gonna be assessing you.
Like, I'm gonna send you yourmental health assessment.
Probably a good idea.
I would turn that into theauthorities, too.
Right.
So the scoring.
I could wait on the scoring.
Sure, yeah.
I mean, I could score you.
You get an A plus.
Oh, good.
Great.
I'm gonna put my check mark.
Very good.
Okay, so the visio.

(42:31):
Constructional skills.
Okay, so the next one is thechair, but it says bed.
Yeah, so my test is a littledifferent than.
Yeah, so the test that I have is.
It just says copy the bed.
Okay.

(42:51):
One point is allocated for acorrectly executed drawing.
Okay.
So we hope you get one.
It must be three dimensional.
All lines are drawn.
Okay.
For this bed here, it sayschair, but all lines meet with little
or no space.
No line is added.
Okay.
Right.
Lines are relatively paralleland their length is similar.

(43:13):
The bed's orientation andspace must be preserved.
Okay, go.
Oh, goodness.
I was gonna say.
That felt.
That felt weird.
All right, so I am.
I am not the artist in my family.
My mother is.
So I'm gonna.
I'm gonna do this as mommy issues.

(43:34):
You're not supposed to do thisduring the test, Trump.
Barrett.
I'm sorry.
I'm sorry.
Let's see.
So I am.
I think that I have.
I think I've mastered that.
What do you think?
I mean, I'll let you knowafter the.
Okay.
She's gonna assess it.

(43:54):
It's.
It's not.
It's not quite as pretty, butit seems like it.
It does hit most of the.
It's three dimensional.
The lines are drawn.
Yeah.
No line is at.
You didn't Add a line, Right.
I don't think so.
Like a sheet or a bed skirt?
Like, no, I definitely didn'tput anybody laying on it either.
Right.
I was gonna say, like.
Okay, we didn't get pervertedwith it.

(44:15):
That's great.
That's right.
All right, so visioconstructional skills.
This is the next thing.
Oh, goodness.
This looks.
Wait.
Oh, okay.
Do you know what time it is?
All right, so this is drawinga clock.
Yeah.
Okay, I would like you to drawa clock, put in all of the numbers.

(44:41):
Okay.
I want you to set the time toten past nine.
Okay.
All right.
So mine says five past ten,but I'll do it ten past nine, so
I can do that.
So why did you print this outfor me?
Are you trying to.
Are you actually testing my.
Testing your cognitive ability?
Whatever yours says.

(45:02):
Okay.
How about that?
Okay, so what does yours say?
It says five past 10.
So it wants me to draw a clockwith all the numbers.
This one looks more like astop sign, but that's close enough.
So I am.
I am labeling the numbers sothat they are evenly spaced, because

(45:26):
that is what a clock looks like.
Unless it's that droopy clockfrom one of those paintings.
Yeah, yeah.
And in order to make it fivepast 10, I'm going to say.
So the little hand is going tobe pretty much towards the 10, and

(45:48):
the big hand is going to bepointed towards the one.
So did I need to put the dotin the middle to indicate.
Oh, is that.
We're going to talk about this.
Oh, no.
You're almost ready to ruleour country.
But just like, hold on.
We got to keep going.

(46:09):
Now, this is going to besomething that I'm.
I'm hoping that you can hear.
This is beginning on the left,and we have three animals here.
I'm going to point to eachfinger and I'm going to ask you to
tell me the name of this animal.
Okay.
Would you like to show them yours?

(46:29):
Yeah, I'll show.
And I'll look at yours.
So I'm going to start here.
And I'd like you to tell me.
The name of this animal thatis a horse.
I would like you to tell me.
The name of this animal thatis a tiger.
And I would like to take youto tell me the name of this.
Animal that is a duck.
I'm gonna check.

(46:50):
I believe I got those right.
Acedat.
Okay.
You sound just like him.
Okay, this is actually really interesting.
This is the test.
Yeah.
I mean, it is.
And when you presented this tome, I was like, okay.
And I printed out some thingsand I was like, this is going to

(47:10):
be timely.
It's going to take some time.
We need to be here for a while.
And you were like, no,actually, it should take about 10
minutes.
I sneezed and got most of this.
Right, right.
All right.
Memory.
All right.
Okay.
Now, just so you know, knowingthat that's what this section is.
I have not looked at the.

(47:31):
I thought you were going torecited these.
No, no, no.
I have not looked at the fivewords I remember from Donald Trump's
thing that he did with the guyfrom Fox News that it was like man,
chair, television, woman,doorknob or something.
And if that is what this is,then you have cheated.
But I don't think it is.
Okay, that's fair.

(47:52):
No.
Okay, this is a memory testI'm giving.
I'm going to read a list ofwords that you will have to remember
and later on repeat.
Listen carefully.
Wait.
Tell me how many words you can remember.
Hold on.
This is like.

(48:13):
Wait, hold on.
Sorry.
No, you're good.
Sorry, guys.
Where is the.
It's there.
They.
They put them.
They put them above.
Oh, I have to go back to the sheet.
Over.
All right.
Leg, cotton, school, tomato, white.

(48:35):
I would like you to repeatthose words again, please.
Go.
Did I get them right?
Oh, okay.
That's for the therapist.
Oh, I'm sorry.
Yes.
You did great.

(48:56):
You did great.
I got a little paranoid, right?
I could think, you know, weshould do like a parody of this.
Yeah.
You know what I mean?
Like, Nazi, racist, you know,and like, just.
See, you know, I mean, I justthink it could be fun, like golf
course, you know, Sexualassault and victim.

(49:19):
Victim.
And he'd be like.
He could rattle those off.
That's pretty.
Yeah, probably.
All right, next one is attention.
Okay, wait, see, I see it.
Blindness is my thing.
Read the list of digits.
Okay.
You have to report them in aforward order.
And that would be 2, 4, 8, 1 5.

(49:42):
2, 4, 8, 1 five.
So I have to repeat them backto you.
2, 4, 8, one five.
Yes.
Okay, and the second one isrepeat them.
Repeat those in a backward order.
Okay.
Repeat those backwards.
2, 4, 8, 15 in a backward order.
All right.
2, 4, 8, 15 5, 1, 8, 4, 2.

(50:09):
Very good.
Oh, okay.
I'm not supposed to tell youall that.
I'm sorry.
It's the immediategratification of having it completed
successfully that really.
You did great.
Okay, let's see.
I should have definitely blownthis Up.
This therapist needs glasses.

(50:31):
You don't have reading glasses.
I don't.
I have far, far away glasses.
And then my reading glassesare at my desk, so.
If you had brought the reading glasses.
Yeah.
You probably could have used them.
All right, let's see.
Attention is the next.
Or is that.
Yes, attention.
No, we just did that.
Read.
List of letters.
The subject must tap with hishand at each letter A.

(50:54):
So is that.
So is that me reading the letters?
I'm reading the letters.
Oh, you're reading the letters.
Okay.
Every time the letter A comesup, I need you to tap.
Okay.
All right, you ready?
I'm ready.
Now I have to count on yougetting these letters right, too.
Okay.
You ready?
Yep.
Okay.
F, B, A, C, M, N.

(51:17):
Oh, I got.
I got too quick.
Yeah, that was.
That was a.
That was a bad one.
Okay.
Not supposed to repeat.
I'm just supposed to keepgoing from where I was.
Sure.
A, A, J, K, L, B, A, F, A, K,D, E, A, A, A, J, A, M, O, F, A,

(51:43):
A, B.
All right, there's that.
That's just weird, isn't it?
Like.
I'm sorry.
It is not weird.
Like, this is a scientific.
You know, this is somethingthat's been put out there that.
Yeah, but it is.
It is.
This is what.

(52:04):
Yeah.
Administered.
Is.
Is interesting.
And again, it's interesting.
Is he.
Is he taking it the same waywe're taking it?
Like, is there.
Is it.
Is it.
Does it feel like a joke to him?
I think most of this feelslike a joke to him.
Well, that's fair.
But, yes, I think thisprobably was.
He was laughing at most of yes.

(52:24):
And he.
And then.
Oh, I aced it.
Flying colors.
Yeah.
Kind of thing.
Although a part of me wants toreally know what the score was.
Yeah.
You know, acing is.
It feels like there's.
There.
There's interpretation to acing.
You know, who knows?
Yeah.
Okay.
All right.

(52:44):
Serial subtraction.
Oh.
Ew.
See, I would do terribly atthis, which I'm not trying to run
the country, but.
We're starting at 60.
Okay.
We're starting at 60.
Starting at 60.
Okay.
Subtraction.
All right.
60 minus 53.
Well, okay, so the way I readthat was.

(53:06):
Is that.
Oh, by seven.
Yeah.
Subtracting, subtracting.
So it's starting at 60.
I'm subtracting by seven.
How many.
How many.
How far back do I go?
Okay, so 60.
You go subtract by seven andthen keep going.
Okay, so 60 minus seven is 53.
53 minus seven is 46.

(53:28):
25 minus seven is.
That's eight.
18.
Oh.
As far as it goes.
But I wanted to see if youcould just end it.
But like, that.
And that's great.
But, like, I almost messed you up.

(53:49):
You know what I mean?
I thought it meant, like,start at 60 and then minus 53, minus
30, you know.
Oh, well, you know, I wasgonna say 53.
60.
53.
Okay.
Okay.
Secretary of Defense, here I come.
Okay, now, language.
I should have brought my.
My magnifying glass for this.

(54:11):
Like, that would have beenprobably good.
Or like, you know.
All right.
So abstract.
Let's see.
We have a little bit more.
I think it's.
We're going to do fine.
Okay.
Language.
Hold on.
Maybe that was right before that.
Oh, I didn't.
I didn't look at that section.
Language.
Oh, man.
Yeah, it's verbal.
Okay.
Verbal fluence.

(54:34):
I think it's a repeating thing again.
Repeat after me.
Yeah, I think it's a repeatingthing again.
Okay.
Okay.
Are you ready?
I am.
The child walked his dog inthe park after midnight.
The child walked his dog inthe park after midnight.

(54:57):
Oh, goodness.
You make faces that make itseem like I got it wrong.
Are you ready?
Yep.
Okay.
The artist finished hispainting at the right moment for
the exhibition.
The artist finished hispainting at the right moment for
the exhibition.
Did I mess that one up?
Oh.

(55:19):
That'S funny.
I'm getting you with that face.
All right, let's see.
Oh, gosh.
Name maximum number of wordsin one minute.
Oh, hold on.
Whoa.
That's timed.
So we're.
This one is.
Let's name the maximum numberof words in one minute that begin

(55:41):
with the letter.
Okay.
I can't tell you that.
Okay.
Oh.
Because then I'll startthinking about it.
Right.
Exactly.
If you haven't already cheated.
You haven't.
Right.
I haven't.
Okay, good trump.
Now, even.
Even.
Even if.
Wow.
Even.
Even.
Even if it was.
Even if it was a letter, like,and I knew what letter it was.
Yeah.

(56:01):
You could.
You could obviously changethat letter and say it has to be
a different letter.
Okay.
Unless it's.
Oh, I actually could.
Unless it's, like, the letterX or something.
Because then I got, like, two words.
We're not going to do that for you.
We're not going to do that to you.
Okay.
So let's see.
Can we.
I don't know.
You want me to get my.
I'm going to say wheneveryou're ready?
I'll.

(56:21):
All right, hold on.
Let's see.
It would be one minute in length.
Okay.
Name the maximum number ofwords in one minute that begin with
the letter be.
All right.
And starting right now.
Book.
Biplane.
Barnacle.
Bishop.

(56:43):
Borat.
Byzantine.
Barclay.
Breakdown.
Goodness.
This isn't.
This isn't that easy to do.
Bible.

(57:05):
I.
I don't.
That.
This is actually not that easybecause I'm trying to picture things
in my head.
Bat ball, Baseball ball.
Cap.
I'm just saying the same word now.

(57:27):
It works, though.
That's.
Yeah, that's.
That's not.
That isn't very.
In my minutes.
About a minute's up.
Okay.
Did I get.
I didn't.
I don't think I got.
11, 12.
Oh, 13.
Wow.
Okay.
Well, I was waiting for Bigly.
I feel.
I feel like that's a.
I feel like that's an assaulton the English language, though,

(57:48):
isn't it?
It's not a word.
Yeah.
Okay.
You did great with that, actually.
I'm glad.
Awesome.
Okay, so we're down to thelast two things.
So here we go.
This is about abstraction,which is similarity between two things.

(58:10):
Okay.
Okay.
So similarity between anorange and a banana would be.
They're fruit.
Except I don't think a bananais really a fruit.
I think a banana is a berry.
I know, but they say it's a fruit.
Sure.
Okay.
Ready?
Yep.
Hammer and screwdriver tools.

(58:31):
Last one is going to bematches and lamp.
Matches and lamp.
The source of light, I mean.
Or when they're off, they're useless.
That was a cool way to put it, actually.
I like that.
All right.
Okay.
Delayed recall is the next.

(58:54):
Okay.
All right, hold on.
You have to recall words withno cue.
This is the part where youhave to go back and remember those
five words from before.
Oh.
Oh, okay.
What are they?

(59:16):
Wow.
Let's see.
I don't know if I could do that.
Let's see.
Leg cotton.
White was one of them.
I'm really.
I don't.
I'm sure they're listed rightin front of me.
White was leg cotton.

(59:39):
White was one of them.
That's it.
That's all I can remember.
So the three.
Okay.
What were they?
Oh, school and tomato.
Yeah, I wasn't gonna remember those.
That's okay.
I would not have.
That was surprising to me.

(01:00:00):
That was probably one of the ones.
I would be like, okay, Trump,if you pass that.
Well, maybe you are.
Okay, well, remember he sat.
He.
He stood in front of a camera.
It was like TV camera, man, woman.
Yeah.
Wow.
Okay, so the last one is orientation.
So what is the date today isApril 30th, 2025.

(01:00:24):
Okay, got those three right.
All right.
What is the day of the week?
Today is Wednesday.
Where are you?
I am in your office in, like, regionally.
West Columbia, South Carolina.
United States of America,Southeast, Northern hemisphere.
What city?
West Columbia.

(01:00:45):
You already said that.
Okay.
And I'm pretty sure that we are.
We're done here.
Is that it?
I think that's it.
Honestly, I.
I don't.
I don't.
I don't even know that itreally needs to be scored unless
you really feel like you want to.
I mean, I'm pretty sure youaced it.
Other.
Other than.
I'm gonna say other than just that.

(01:01:06):
That absolute, like, recallfrom before, but I really feel like.
Well, I mean, we are, youknow, like, I don't think I would
have retained that unless Iknew I needed to retain it.
So let me.
Let me.
Let me see if I can do it now,because knowing that it was school
and tomato that I missedbefore, it was leg and white and
cotton.

(01:01:27):
Was it not white?
Right.
Well, does it.
Oh, does it want you toremember that order?
You have to recall with no cueas far as, like, the order.
So it was leg, cotton, school,tomato, white.
Was that right in the order?
Absolutely.
Melissa, you get faces thatmake me feel like I got it wrong.
I know.
I like that.

(01:01:47):
It just messes with.
You know, it's just like, you.
You really did.
I mean, you aced it.
You aced it bigly.
I mean, it.
You knew what a horse was.
I mean, the duck didn't giveyou paws like you.
You drew the bed.
Well, it.
I mean, you really did.
I mean, you got.

(01:02:07):
I would say.
I mean, honestly, I would say29 out of 30.
Just because you didn't do therecall without.
But I think that's.
Anybody that's not prepared to.
Yeah.
You didn't, like, insert thatinto your recall space because you
didn't know it was going to be.
No.
And.
And they were.
Those are just random words asfar as I recognize, like.

(01:02:28):
Like 29 out of 30.
I wouldn't.
I wouldn't be able, like, if.
Leg.
You know, if.
So if I was.
If I was in a situation whereI was trying to put those words into
some sort of a context in thisroom, I could say, like, okay, your
leg.
I could say the cotton.
The wool.
Cotton over there.

(01:02:49):
I could say that there's aschool nearby, because whatever.
You know, I don't.
That bowl could hold tomatoesand then.
And then it's all about white people.
Is that right?
Did you grow up in South Carolina?
Should I, Should I.
I'm gonna start assessing you.
Let's do it.

(01:03:09):
Next time you bring me in assessment.
Well, I guess on thatbombshell, we'll wrap up the podcast.
But I appreciate you sittingthrough this with me and putting
up with this.
This is fun.
Yeah.
This feels absurd is reallywhat it feels like.
And the fact that DonaldTrump's cognitive ability is being

(01:03:33):
assessed by this and thelikelihood is that situation was
probably similar, that he wasbeing assessed by someone that is
a friendly, not just a medicaldoctor that that is, is giving him
this test.
And I think that's ultimatelywhat I take away from it is as easy
as this was, I think that it'salso made easier by the environment

(01:03:56):
that he's in.
Let Mitch McConnell take this test.
I think that it would be.
Yeah, well, he, he, he felldown the stairs going to the cafeteria
one day and then.
But, you know, I mean, I agreewith you that this is, I don't feel
like this is anything close towhat we should be administering to

(01:04:18):
someone who's in charge of thecountry things.
Yeah.
Well, again, Melissa, thankyou very much.
Melissa, of course, is one ofthe co founders because you and your
partner co founded the.
It is the in the GardenCounseling llc.
I love you, Kendall, but no.

(01:04:38):
Oh, you just did it just.
It's just me.
Yeah.
But she actually, she and Ijust lease the space together.
Her office is back that wayand she's amazing.
That is Renew CounselingServices and she's also open for
business, but we just, weshare the space.
We don't.
I'm going to say individual llc.
I'm going to say all thatagain, but differently.
Okay.
I want to thank Melissa Gaineyfor being on the podcast.

(01:05:01):
I'm going to leave it in, butI'm going to say it again.
She is the founder of in theGarden Counseling llc, based here
in Columbia, South Carolina.
I really appreciate it.
And links to her practice aregoing to be found in the show notes.
So, you know, there is about atwo month waiting period.
She has a lot of.

(01:05:21):
She's busy.
I will say that she is busy.
I was, I was very happy thatshe was able to work this in.
In very short notice, too.
I was able to do it.
And we're gonna have mycomfort zone a bit.
Yeah.
Like, this is something I'mreally excited to learn more about,
honestly.
But we're gonna have Melissaon again because you also a lot of
what you work with DSSchildren, that sort of thing.

(01:05:45):
I, I think that that is as, aswe have discussed, how child services
are being handled in SouthCarolina is not, it is a detriment
to the children, especiallythe ones that are involved.
But that is a subject that weare definitely be talking about very
soon because even Sarah JaneByers, who is, who does a segment

(01:06:08):
on our podcast every monthcalled Common Sense with Sarah Jane
Byers.
She is an arbitrator for the11th or the, the district out of
Lexington for child services.
Okay.
Juvenile services.
So, so she's, and she also has44 years of experience as a high

(01:06:28):
school teacher.
And, and so, you know, she's been.
In it for a while.
Yeah.
So we need to put more energy,funding and you know, resources toward
our families and our children.
Yeah.
That are.
Yeah.
Experiencing this type of thing.
But to be continued.
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, thank you again, Melissafor being on the show that is going
to do it.
For episode number 253, linksto all of our past episodes, podcast

(01:06:50):
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(01:07:12):
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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Mental Health and Cognitive Decline: A Serious Discussion with Melissa Gainey