August 4, 2025 • 63 mins
In this powerful episode of The Asset Mindset, host Daniel Fielding sits down with former Navy SEAL Mark Greene to explore the mental, emotional, and personal challenges of transitioning from elite military service to civilian life. Mark opens up about his experience in BUD/S training, confronting fear head-on, and how mastering mental resilience helped him navigate some of life’s most difficult moments.
They dive deep into the inspiration behind Mark’s book Unsealed, and how writing, gratitude, and mentorship became tools for healing and self-discovery. From the weight of feeling like a burden to finding renewed purpose, this episode is a raw, honest conversation about what it really takes to thrive after service.
👉 Whether you’re a veteran, aspiring author, or someone chasing personal growth — this episode is for you.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Good morning and Mark , it's great to have you on the
Asset Mindset podcast.
I love what you're doing.
I love when you talk about yourstories and your experience and
especially having a fellowauthor on with Unsealed.
I love that you're sharing yourstory of transitioning, because
I think people forget about thestruggle it is to transition
(00:29):
when you've done something andthat's been your life for years
and years and years.
And now there's this big changeand a lot of people struggle
with it and I think that alsocontributes to a lot of the
suicides that are going on orjust substance abuse that are
going on or just substance abuse.
But I love to have you here, Ifeel honored and it's always
nice to you know, go back andforth with a SEAL and Green
(00:50):
Berets and that wonderful littlerivalry we have.
But why don't you share alittle bit about yourself with
the audience?
Speaker 2 (00:56):
All right.
So I am, like you said, a20-year Navy SEAL and got to
work with the Green Berets overthe course of my career.
But I did a 20-year careerstart off as an enlisted guy, a
sled dog, which was a great wayto kind of break into special
(01:17):
operations as far as learningthe job, because in an officer
you really only have a limitedtime to actually do the cool guy
stuff before you start going onthe leadership track.
So I got the.
I think I got the best of bothworlds going enlisted in an
officer.
I got to get my lessons learned, my list of things not to do as
(01:37):
opposed to you know how to bestlead men like this into combat,
and it was really rewardingmuch more rewarding than I
thought.
And since then you know the upsand downs of retiring and not
being a cool guy anymore to theonly thing I'm shooting is
(01:58):
emails for a while, you know.
And then I got my dream job atthe University of Southern
California, did that for fouryears and then came back and now
currently work at DominionEnergy as cybersecurity and
intelligence.
So it's a really an interestingjourney that I've been on and
(02:19):
there's some TV shows that havehappened and speaking events
that are getting ready to comeup, so my plate is getting ready
to get full.
But whenever I see an invitefrom Danny, I I Roger up for
that because they're alwaysinteresting and it's always
great to meet new people.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Well, it's great to have you here.
So I'm going to start by askingwhat was the moment you first
realized you were mentallystronger than your circumstances
?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
was the moment you first realized you were mentally
stronger than yourcircumstances.
It, I think it when I got tobuds and actually got to the
actual challenge of it, becauseyou never know what you're gonna
expect and even though it wasthe hardest thing I've ever done
it wasn't I wasn't at the endof my, I didn't at 10, you know.
(03:06):
I didn't get into the red whereI couldn't continue.
And, um, once I realized thateven though the instructor staff
, as professionals they were,their job is to either
facilitate you graduating orfacilitate you leaving.
Um, and once I realized that ifI asked for help, they're going
to provide it and I wasphysically and mentally able to
(03:27):
do it.
Then I just took it into chunksthat I could manage, as opposed
to eating the entire elephant,the six month elephant.
I just took it off into threeor four hour chunks that I could
manage, which, every time mystomach growled, it was almost
time to eat and I realized theyhave to feed you.
So it was hey today, and Irealized they have to feed you,
so it was hey I.
Today's gonna be a hard day.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
However, these next three or four hours, not so bad,
do you have a special moment orstory um from buds that really,
when you look back, you're likethat defined buds, buds.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
for you, yes, so I had a heat injury, that was, it
was hot out and I was juststruggling, but I the
overwhelming need to not quit,even though even though I knew
something was going on.
So I finished the run and kindof, I just sat down.
(04:21):
You're not supposed to sit inin in training, so I just sit
down and the instructors areyelling at me, but I can't
understand English, so I dosomething was wrong.
And then, after I'm notresponding, they kind of think
something's wrong too, and sothey recover me and they send me
over to medical.
(04:43):
And because people make upexcuses to not continue on,
they're like he's probablytaking it.
So instead of getting mytemperature taken the
traditional way, they uh, go thenon-traditional way.
So so they, they positioned meand you know.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
What is the non-traditional way, mark?
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Um it's called, I guess, exit only Um, I don't
know it's for the listeners.
Yeah, yeah, it's a exit, onlysome backdoor action, you know,
um, all non-voluntary, so alittle sexual assault, but, um,
so they give me the, the probe,and I didn't flinch and they're
(05:34):
like, oh man, this guy's a mess.
So they realize that I'm hurtand they realize I had heat
exhaustion.
So, instructor, get like okay,green, I got in trouble because
you didn't drink your water.
So if I get in trouble, you getto get in trouble.
So every time I see you, you'regoing to drain your canteen and
(05:58):
you're going to go get wet.
You're going to be hydratedinside and out.
Okay, this is going to suck.
And he just kept showing up.
So you know I'm like okay, thisis going to suck.
And he just kept showing up.
So you know, I'm having toforce hydrate.
And there was a gentleman namedSenior Chief Mink, a plank owner
at the development group,legend, on the teams, and he
(06:18):
said hey, green, come on overhere.
And I was like yes, sir, senior, how you doing?
He's like look, look, you arealways given 100%.
He's like I don't know ifyou're just too dumb to throttle
it back when you don't need to.
But but I also understand thatyou don't.
You're not, you have aconfidence problem.
You're crushing everything, butyou're just not 100% sure of
(06:42):
yourself.
So he looked around and said ifyou tell anybody about this,
I'm gonna deny it.
And he picks up this thing,something called bullfrog, and
he's like everybody, I've giventhis bullfrog who's graduated.
And he handed it to me.
It's like now I'm giving it toyou.
And he handed it to me.
It's like and now I'm giving itto you.
(07:05):
It's like no, get your ass outof here and go graduate.
At that moment it was like oh,like the, the final thing of the
code of how to get through thisplace.
That finally hit me.
It was just that one act of notso much kindness, but like
confidence.
Hey, I'm confident, I seethings in you that you don't
(07:26):
quite see in yourself and you'regoing to make a great seal and
you just need this one littlepush.
And here it is.
And that was after that moment.
There was never any doubt on ifI was going to graduate.
I wasn't planning on gettingenrolled and I just started.
I mean, it went from hey, I wasthe gray man, I was just
(07:46):
surviving, to hey, I'm close tothe top of my class and, being
six foot two, 200 and somethingpounds.
That course is not designed forme, right?
I think the average feel isfive, nine, 165 pounds.
Dark hair, dark eyes.
It's like a factory, right?
Speaker 1 (08:15):
So but I just couldn't be stopped after that
moment.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
What a great story.
And Senior Chief Mink, after itwas all done, I went up to him.
I was like you that one daythat you gave me this bullfrog
completely changed my life.
And it did change my lifebecause it didn't only translate
to buds, it translated toeverything.
Now I can do everything.
(08:38):
That wall that so many of ushit, that you can't accomplish
something, that one momentcompletely demolished all that
and that was my defining moment.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Like I said, not only the buds, but in everything I
chose to pursue or things thatwere thrown on me that I didn't
quite want to do, that bullfrogand that moment was the defining
one.
That's great, that's powerfulright there, and it's incredible
when you have somebody thattakes you under their wing and
gives you a little pep talk oris just mentoring you.
Sometimes you don't pick up onit right away, but I'm sure you
now, years later, looking back,you realize how much more
mentorship that was.
You thought it was just alittle pep talk in the beginning
(09:25):
, probably.
You know, I know I would havegoing through selection or
whatever.
You have those moments withcadre or instructors and they
share something.
You're like, oh, okay.
But then you look back andyou're like, oh, I get that now
I see what you were doing, youwere leading me down the path.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
And not only that, it seemed like my perspective on
the instructor staff changedbecause, although they were
yelling and trying to get you onthe right mindset to either
stay or go, there was thislittle like I agree and keep it
up.
No, get out of here.
You stink and you're ruining mycheat, but get out of here.
(10:03):
So it was all at thesestrategic moments that
mentorship was happening andthat encouragement was happening
.
That instructor staff and theway that they developed BUDS and
took the instructor staff.
You don't understand it whileyou're going through it, but now
(10:27):
, looking back on it, it's likethey were ultimate professionals
and they really, if you wantedto be there, they wanted you to
stay absolutely, and it's.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
It's so incredible.
When you get to be with peoplelike that whether it's selection
, whether it's buds you reallyget to see.
Whether it's buds, you reallyget to see people being forged
and changed and shaped, orpeople have an awareness, like
you realized for yourself howpowerful you were there.
It took that bull frog andwhatnot, and you were trying to
(10:55):
prove yourself and doing allthese things and pushing so hard
, but also you need to know whento throttle back, because I was
almost a heat cat too.
We were doing the long run andI went through selection in June
.
They take a break at Braggbecause it does get too hot, but
I was the last class before thesummer break, so it was still
pretty damn hot and I just youknow you're doing the best you
(11:19):
can and you're like I got to getthe best time or I need to do
this because you don't know whatthe requirements are.
Like I got to get the best timeor I need to do this Cause you
don't know what the therequirements are like.
Am I going to make time?
So I'm going to push as hard asI can.
And I felt that same heat, likeall my cheeks were red and burn
.
It felt like a sunburn but Iwasn't burned.
My vision started and I'm likeno, you're going to throttle
back on this, you're going topass out.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
I went straight through that barrier, the flush
space and stuff was closing inand I could see the finish line.
So I couldn't stop.
Yeah, um, but had I?
I looked at it half a mileprior to.
That is when I should havestopped, um, but I was so
determined to finish.
You know, I thought that wasquitting if you didn't at least
(12:03):
finish.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Yeah, so many believe success requires talent or luck
, you know, to make it.
What is the real differencebetween people who win or people
who lose?
Do you think whether it's budsor life or business, whatever it
may be?
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I think they take the wrong approach.
I think they take the wrongperspective, as there is help
available and you either have toeither swallow your pride and
say, okay, look, I need helpwith this an entire event or an
(12:50):
entire process all in onesetting.
Like I said, taking even thoughbuds is 181 days, six months, I
didn't look at it as a sixmonth event.
I took it as a day at a time,four hours at a time, and when I
went to because I flunked outof college, finished college,
and then I went to because Iflunked out of college, finished
college, and then I went tograd school and I remember kind
of a lot of anxiety because Iwas looking at it as 18 months
(13:12):
balls to the wall and I'm like,yeah, I'm not going to survive
this one.
And then I thought back to it.
I was like, okay, go to yourprofessors if you're struggling.
You take this a week at a timeas opposed to a semester.
And I just took it in smalllittle chunks that I could
manage, because I knew thatthat's the way to solve the
(13:33):
problem.
I just got overwhelmed by itand didn't take my own advice.
I looked around like, wait,there are mentors everywhere
there's support, everywhere.
You have your professors, youhave the environment, you have
your classmates and everybodyjust comes together to help.
But if you don't ask for thathelp, they don't know you're
struggling.
(13:53):
So it was like, look, I'm in anew environment, I'm learning
business at the graduate levelafter flunking out and getting a
criminology degree, and now I'mlearning marketing and
statistics and finance and allthe overwhelming stuff that in
business.
But I'm learning it at thevarsity level without having
(14:14):
gone through freshman ball,peewee ball and JV.
It's like, hey, here you go,varsity don't suck, you know.
But but once I took it in manchunks, I could manage.
And then I kind of got settledin and asked for the help I need
.
I only needed that helpinitially and then, once I
(14:34):
figured it out, it's like, okay,I got it, and how I did that at
usc was the same thing, and howI did that at USC was the same
thing, and how I did that at mycurrent job was the same thing.
You're going into the unknown.
You have the attributes to besuccessful.
You just have to refocus it.
And hey, I know how to be agood employee Show up on time,
(15:00):
do what you're told, beproactive, manage up and learn
your industry so you can be asubject matter expert at some
point.
But I also knew that goingthrough those five steps takes
time and it's a process.
So when I was learning this newindustry, I just kind of
throttled it back and just tookit in steps that I could manage
(15:22):
hey, get in here, get here for ayear.
It back, and just took it insteps that I could manage.
Hey, get in here, get here fora year, figure out the industry
and slowly gain expertise onyour job.
Until one day, my second yearend, it's like hey, you have to
brief the senior VP on whatwe're doing.
Everybody else is gone, andinstead of like holy shit, I'm
(15:44):
not ready for this, I was like,okay, what are we briefing?
All right I'm ready to go.
I went over a little bit andthat's when I realized like, hey
, the day I showed up, I was anovice.
Two years into this, the seniorvp of the company is like hey,
we need, um, a briefing on thisbecause this is going up the ceo
.
And uh, I was the guy to do itand I answered every question.
I didn't even know I knew thisstuff, daniel.
(16:07):
Honestly, I was just like butas we start briefing it, it all
just starts coming to me andthen they ask questions and I
can go in depth and I was like,okay, this is not hard, just be
patient with yourself,understand your limitations,
understand your strengths andweaknesses, which I did.
So when I needed help.
You have a supervisor for areason like, hey, get your ass
(16:27):
over here, I need some help.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
And uh, and he did.
Yeah, I think that's powerful.
People are afraid sometimes toask for help because they don't
want to look vulnerable and havehumility in life.
Nobody knows everything.
Everybody's learned from otherpeople.
It's it's okay to ask for help,and I think this also stems a
little bit.
I think we're touching on fear.
I think people have a lot offear, afraid to do things.
Can you talk about overcomingfear?
(16:56):
Because, as a human being, weall face fear, right?
Speaker 2 (17:00):
So the time that I I feel the same fear as everybody
else, right.
And my first fear factor camewhen I lost my best friend in a
parachuting accident, had dinnerwith him two days prior to his
(17:28):
death and the fact thatskydiving is part of the Sierra
land, it's part of the sealedthing.
So I avoided going to free fallout of out of fear, right?
So, um, but one day my careercaught up to me and I had to go
to military free fall and it wasugly.
And so I'm like, ok, I'mjumping to my death and changing
(17:51):
my mind at the last 2,500 feet,right.
So I was like that's the wrongmindset.
Go into the wind tunnel, figurethis thing out, talk to the
subject matter experts andfigure out how to push through
the fear that you're feeling andyou're experiencing, because I
actually have a job to do inthis.
The fears are relevant.
(18:12):
You know I can still have it.
I still have respect for whatI'm doing.
However, the job is do your 25to 30 jumps, get free fall
qualified so you can go on tothis next job.
30 jumps, get free fallqualified, so you can go on and
do this next job.
But every time we got up everytime I started packing my chute,
you know, it just startedfeeling like man, this is.
I got about two and a halfhours of life left and we'd go
(18:36):
up in the twin otter, hit 12,000.
And every single time that thatjump master said jump, I jumped
and, uh, the fear wasoverwhelming for the first 10
jumps and then like, okay, 15,I'm starting to get the hang of
it, 20.
Like this is awesome, right,but he's still.
Every time I got up to 12,000,I was still nervous.
I'm like, hey, this could bethe last jump I ever do, but I
(19:00):
wanted to be successful and Ihad people that relied on me.
It wasn't just about me, it wasabout my teammates and the
mission and that overrode thatfear.
And there's a lot of things I dothat I'll start just so I'll
finish.
Because once, like my dad toldme my first day of football
practice, he said once you startsomething, there's no quitting.
(19:23):
So sometimes I'll startsomething that I don't want to
do just because once I start Ican't quit, and you know that
has translated throughout myentire life.
So now that, um, even though Ididn't want to go to free sport
once, I started that first day.
Okay, that part of the equationis done.
There's no quitting.
You have to figure this thingout.
(19:44):
And, um, you've gone to sniperschool or becoming an officer,
uh, going down range for thefirst time, you know you.
You you land at by app and youknow it's on.
At that point you know and youdon't.
Sometimes it's spicy out onroute irish, you know, um, but
(20:07):
you still have to take thatdrive.
So, uh, fear is there.
I think it's, it's necessary,but I think the mindset that you
need to overcome that fear andstill do the job, I think that's
what's more valuable absolutely, and I think fear gives us a
chance to demonstrate courageand bravery.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
That's what really defines, because, like you said,
everybody has fear.
Yeah, and my first jump out ofa plane, I was like this could
be the last thing I ever do,just like you.
And I learned a lot about life.
I learned a lot about me.
Am I at peace?
Have I lived the life I want tolive?
Am I going to change or what amI going to do?
And having that fear isactually a healthy thing.
(20:48):
I think people demonize feartoo much.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
I don't know if you'd agree with that, but I don't
think fear is this horrible,evil thing?
Speaker 1 (20:57):
It's there to learn, it's there to motivate sometimes
, and I think it's a chance togrow, because when you get to be
brave and courageous andaccomplish something that you
were scared of, I mean, how'dyou feel when you graduated?
You know, free fall, awesomeyeah.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Amazing, I did it.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
It's exactly so.
Any listeners out there, pleaserealize that you may have fear,
but face it.
This is your chance to be brave, be courageous, be like Mark,
be like all the other peoplethat have faced fear.
You're not alone.
You can do it.
You absolutely can overcomeyour fear with bravery and
courage, and you will be gladyou did Trust me.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
And, you know, I want to add one more thing to that,
because everything that I've hada healthy fear of, or even an
unhealthy fear of, there was alevel of respect for what I was
getting out of the experienceGoing through Buzz, I was like
this is going to be the hardestthing I ever do.
There was fear there, but it'slike, hey, man, you feared
because in my turn, itmanifested its respect for what
(22:03):
I was doing.
I feared being a parent.
Right, that was probably one ofmy biggest fears, because I had
no idea what I was doing, butit's because I respected the
role that I was going to take asa father.
And, you know, going intocombat, you respect the enemy
because they have a plan too.
So whenever I felt that fear, Iwas like, okay, there's fear
(22:25):
there, but there's also arespect for what I'm getting
ready to do Very well said so,let's transition a little bit.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Tell me about starting your book.
I know writing a book is a lotof work.
It takes a lot of time, ittakes some bravery and courage,
because you've got to put thingsout there and you're going out
in the world.
So share your story aboutbecoming an author and writing
unsealed.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
I.
My journey and unsealed startedwhen I was at the University of
Southern California.
I don't know if you didn'tthose gentlemen Michael Gervais,
he's uh, he's one of thosemindset gurus, real good guy.
So he was given a speech inclass and at the Q&A session one
of the students said hey, youknow what's it like for special
(23:10):
operators to what's theirmindset?
He's like funny, you should ask, we have one right here, he's
going to tell you all about it.
And I was like oh, that'sawesome.
There's another team guy orsomebody in here And's like mark
, after the break, go, come onand tell your story.
I was like you, motherfucker,um voluntold yeah.
(23:31):
So I went and told, I told mystory and it was quick but it
was uh, it was the catalyst.
And then later on I think itwas when kobe bryant was still
he could not make a speakingevent.
So my friend called like Mark,our guy canceled, will you come
out and speak to the class?
And I was like, ok, so I showup, do my event.
(23:54):
And I had such a great time.
And at the end of the semesterhe asked the students.
He said, hey, who is yourfavorite speaker of all the
people we've had, who is yourfavorite?
Like 85 percent of the classsaid we'd love to have Mark come
back.
I was like, really, so thatstarted an annual.
(24:14):
So every semester I did it.
And then when I left I stillcame back yearly.
And this gentleman I met, hisname is Bobby.
And this gentleman I met, hisname is Bobby, and he heard me
speak and he's like Mark, youhave to write a book.
And I was like no, I don't.
I think so many people havemuch more interesting story than
(24:34):
I have in the space.
You know, richard Devaney isout there, jocko was dominating
the space and Goggins, and I waslike their story seems to be
much more interesting than mine,and so I'm just going to hold
off, I'm going to do my speakingevents and just be the quiet
guy, the gray man in the corner.
And finally Bobby calls me upon Christmas break.
(24:58):
Coming up on Christmas break,and he said all right, I've had
enough of you telling me nobreak.
Coming up on Christmas break,and he said, all right, I've had
enough of you telling me no.
He's like I interviewed fiveghostwriters.
Interview them, pick one andwrite your book.
And he's like you have untilJuly.
And the 12 year old Mark saidwell, you're not the boss of me,
(25:21):
I'm not going to do anything.
I took it as wait a second.
And he was so enthusiastic andhe funded the whole thing and he
said just get your story andget it down.
Uh, because people need to hearit.
Like okay, huge fear, choppedup, because I wonder what I'm
going to write about.
Two, is it going to suck?
(25:42):
And three, I'm going to have topass the scrutiny of my
teammates.
Because I have to be veryauthentic, because as soon as
somebody reads it, then teamguys and our brothers are going
to call bullshit right away Fakestuff in a book.
You're going to get caught, yeah, yeah.
(26:02):
And then I reached out to JackCarr Carr, who was a classmate
of mine, because I saw a podcastand I was like Jack, I don't,
how do you write a book?
And in the podcast he saidalways find your theme of your
book and have everythingcentered around the theme.
And he said in Terminal List itwas revenge.
(26:23):
Everything in the story, everyaspect of that book, from the
protagonist, was a revenge.
So then, as I'm going throughthe process, it's like
transitioning is hard.
And one day I woke up and I waslike transition.
And then, once I had my theme,everything was written around
(26:47):
that theme.
And we go through transitions atall points, like I said, being
a parent getting married, goingto the military, loss of a
family member, loss of ateammate, going into combat,
leaving service, going intocombat, leaving service oh, when
your kids are at home and theygo to kindergarten for the first
(27:07):
time, that's a trend, I mean.
And then I start things likethere are transitions all over
the place.
So then I got the structuredown and then Shelby and I just
went about writing and refiningand I think the hardest thing
was I could write academically.
(27:28):
Here are the facts and here'swhat you're supposed to say.
And robot Mark writing a book,right?
She said well, mark, you'retalking at your audience.
I was like what the hell doesthat mean?
And she's like there's noemotion in here, there's no part
of you that's in this.
We're just giving facts.
And once I once that resonatedwith me.
(27:51):
I was like, okay, well, how doI do that?
So then we went through theprocess and she would, I'd write
a chapter and she's like thisis great, this sucks because I
can't feel anything.
So I was like do me a favor,what does right look like?
Because I'm failing and we'rewasting time.
We can go through this back andforth, or you can just show me
what right looks like.
(28:11):
I can get a picture in it andthen we can go from there.
So we had this exercise and shewrote a passage and then I was
just like got it.
I got it.
And I woke up one day and myfirst story I picked up my phone
and just dictated it into theto the phone, um, because I
(28:33):
didn't want to lose it it's twoin the morning and then, once I
wrote that chapter, sent it toher and she's like I'll go write
your book.
And that's how I learned how toexpress emotion.
Because in our line of work,emotion has no value.
It has no value on how you makedecisions.
(28:54):
Actually, it can be detrimentalto how you make decisions and
the selection process.
Part of that process is hey, weneed to beat the feelings out
of these guys so they can bestrategic, be logical.
Chaos is happening.
They need to rely on theirtraining and make the best
decision despite what's going on.
So 20 years of that, you losethat perspective on hey, how do
(29:17):
I feel about doing this roomentry?
Or how do I feel about going onthis target room entry?
Or or how do I feel about goingon this target?
That that's irrelevant.
So when I had to go back to um,tapping into that emotional
side, it took it was a herculeaneffort, because I just forgot
(29:38):
how to do it and I couldn't findthe point where it was relevant
anymore.
The facts are relevant.
Time on target, the planningprocess, the execution, all that
stuff that's relevant.
The emotional side of how Ifeel about it meaningless and so
(30:00):
tapping into that was really,really challenging.
I think to this day it's still.
I still have trouble with it,but I have three daughters.
I have to figure that emotionalstuff out Right.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
Absolutely.
I have two daughters too, so Ifeel you.
This morning I made thembreakfast.
We got some snuggles in becauseI told them I'm going to be
working and busy today doingrecordings and doing the podcast
in because I told him I'm goingto be working and busy today
doing recordings and doing thepodcast.
And speaking of podcast, pleasepause, go underneath and look at
the description.
You'll find all kinds of stuffand information on Mark, links
where you can get his book,check him out for speaking and
(30:36):
whatnot.
And also don't forget to follow, like and subscribe the Asset
Mindset podcast.
And please share with anyoneyou think may need to hear this
because there's some really goodnuggets coming out.
Mark, you're doing a great jobhere, sharing your knowledge.
I can see why you were thefavorite speaker, thank you.
Thank you, you're welcome.
(30:56):
But so let's talk a little moreabout your book, because I
noticed you have like I believeit's six different things that
you talk about in transition andyou start off with like
isolation and what people gothrough.
So, if you want to key in onsome of those big things that
people like, you said your book,yeah, it's about transitioning,
but you transition in alldifferent parts of life, so
(31:18):
let's give the listeners some ofthat.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Okay.
So, do you want to just startoff with the isolation piece?
Sure, do it.
Okay.
So, and this is this is myprocess and it works for me
because, as an introvert, I needto be by myself, to work things
out.
So what I do is I, I, I engorgemyself on all the information
(31:42):
I'm going to need.
Right, like, where do I want tolive?
What do I want to do?
Um, what's my skillset?
What do I?
What do I need to learn to tothrive in this next endeavor?
And I take all and I what if it?
To death?
Right, so I'm just full ofinformation.
So then I just have to isolateit, be it for an hour, be it for
(32:04):
a week, and just like, okay,what does this look like?
My brain needs to figure thisout.
And as I start to figure it out, things just start to settle
out.
Hey, this doesn't make anysense to what you're planning on
doing next, so just go aheadand throw that away.
And then I come up with aframework of what are the top
(32:24):
five things that I need to do tothrive in whatever I'm doing
next.
Right, so I moved to LA.
So, ok, you have to learn LosAngeles.
You're going to work at auniversity.
There's no aggression on auniversity, so you have to throw
all that team guy stuff, allthat sniper stuff.
That's not going to work here.
You're going to have to learnhow to collaborate again.
(32:46):
You're going to have to be thenew guy again.
What does that look like andwhat's your five-year plan for
what this is going to look like?
But I had to engorge myself onthat information and then
isolate myself and then what Ilike to call cocooning happens.
(33:09):
So I take all that information,engorge myself on it and it's a
stressful thing.
Like, hey, I'm going to leaveeverything I know to go to LA.
I don't even like LA.
La is dirty and gritty and youknow I like Pasadena, where I
live.
Go to LA.
I don't even like LA.
La's dirty and gritty and youknow, I like Pasadena, where I
live, and I like USC.
But I wanted to carpet bomb therest of LA.
I was like, okay, well, that'snot going to work.
(33:31):
So I need to take in all thatinformation, isolate and then go
into this cocooning process toprocess it all, and at that
point I have to go through whatI consider a transformation from
Mark Green the SEAL to MarkGreen, the non-SEAL, who you're
(33:54):
not going to go back to thatlocker room ever again.
You're not going to be around.
99% of the people you work withare at the top of their game.
We're all focused, we're all onthe same mission.
You have that team to rely onand that infrastructure to rely
on.
All that's gone and as Iemerged from that cocooning
(34:17):
process, I come out a new person, ready to face what's next and
be prepared for what's next, butalso know that a lot of the
things that made me special haveatrophied.
Like, hey, you can do thisstuff on your own.
I haven't worked outside of ateam in 20 years.
I've not done anything for thelast 20 years since I was 10.
(34:41):
The first time I started playingfootball, you're on a, started
playing football.
You're on a football team, onthe basketball team, you know,
um, you're in a cohort inclasses in college.
I've done team stuff.
How do I do this as anindividual?
Those muscles have atrophied,right.
So then, um, how do I thrive?
Well, I'm gonna have to gothrough my, my basics.
(35:02):
I have to go to the subjectmatter experts and let them know
I need help and let them knowI'm struggling with not being a
team guy again.
Campus, other veterans andsurprisingly enough, it was
other athletes because, let'ssay, graduating seniors.
(35:27):
They're like I want to be aprofessional tennis player, I
want to go to the NFL, I want togo to the big leagues, I want
to do something at the highestlevel but realistically, you're
going to be a professional atsomething else because the
chances of making that level areminuscule.
So then they were transitioningand I had to talk them through
(35:52):
their transition and as I'mtalking through theirs, I'm
experiencing my own transitionthat we're helping each other
and I just sought help becauseone I needed it.
I knew I was a novice and Iknew I needed to get to subject
matter expertise and that's aprocess you know.
(36:12):
And finally, I think the mostprofound thing that ever
happened was I had to come togrips with the fact that I was
grieving the loss of that priorlife.
I was sad about not being aSEAL anymore.
I was sad about not having thecamaraderie and not having the
locker room again.
(36:32):
I love jumping on helicoptersand doing dumb shit, all the
cool stuff we do.
I had to say, okay, look,whatever's new is happening is
great, but that last 20 yearswas also great and unless you go
through the grieving process,you're not going to be able to
(36:54):
move forward and thrive.
But I didn't come to thatrealization until much later,
until I was almost suicidal,because you know, I tried to
keep my family together.
I was failing at that.
I was trying to learn this newjob.
I wasn't doing great at that.
(37:15):
And what do we as team guys doand special operators do when
it's going to get tough?
We pile on more stuff.
So I applied for graduate schoolagain and, as as I'm going
through grad school again, I'mnot a good student and I came to
the realization it's like whatif life is better if I'm not
(37:38):
around?
Because I felt like I was aburden.
And I hadn't felt like that.
I never felt like a burden, butI just seemed like I was a
burden on everything I touched,because I just wasn't able to
excel like I had before and Ijust wasn't getting it.
(37:58):
And one day I had that thought.
I was like man, what if I'mjust a burden?
And what if everything aroundme is better without me being
here?
Then I got a phone call from adear friend and it was out of
the blue and my phone wassupposed to be in sleep mode and
for some reason it rang,because she called twice and
(38:20):
then said hey, are you all right?
I was like, no, I am not doingwell at all.
Could you do me a favor?
I have guns in the house and Iknow that this is going to pass,
but I just need this one aspectof it to not even be an option.
And she was understandingbecause she had felt the same
(38:46):
way and actually made an attempt, survived it.
So she knew exactly what I wasgoing through and she said be
there in 30 minutes.
So I look at my apartment and Isee where the guns are.
Look at my apartment and I seewhere the guns are, so I take my
key and I just throw it as faras I could.
(39:08):
And then I just start walkingto Target, which was 15 minutes,
30-minute round trip, and Iknew that she'd be there in 30
minutes.
So I hit Target and then startwalking back.
And as I'm walking back, she'spulling up and she luckily had a
spare key and started walkingback.
And as I'm walking back, she'spulling up and she luckily had a
spare key and she just gave mea big hug and said hey, you know
(39:31):
we love you around here, right,and I was like You're going to
be fine, but let me know wherethe stuff is.
I told her where it was, shewalked upstairs, grabbed it,
grabbed the guns, put them inher car and she's like I'll see
you tomorrow.
I was like you will see metomorrow and it was at that
(39:55):
moment that and I realized I hadso much still to give and so
much to live for One.
I had four kids that neededtheir father around, even though
I wasn't going to be married totheir mother anymore.
My small team at USC needed me.
I needed to figure this thingout and I needed to heal and get
(40:15):
better.
And it was just that one momentand it only lasted for four
hours, two of which I was atwork, one I was on the train
home.
So really I just had that onehour to where I was just at the
low point.
But even though I was at thatlow point, I still was like, oh
man, my kids, I got to go to asoccer game coming up and
(40:38):
there's things I still had to do.
So I knew I was, I knew it wastemporary and just the one phone
call that should not have comethrough because I turned off all
my stuff.
Um, I realized that people careabout me and, um, they see what
I'm going through and they seemy potential and they know that
I'm going to be fine.
(40:58):
I just need a catalyst to getfrom where I was at my low point
to back to normal, and that wasit.
And once I got over that hurdle, I was fine in two hours and I
started a gratitude log at thatmoment Write down everything
(41:21):
you're grateful for.
And I thought it was going tobe like five or six different
things, like two pages of stuff,and I was like, well, I can't
leave all this behind.
And from that moment on, I justgot back into the mark that I
knew and loved.
And then sky was the one.
Wow, what a powerful story.
Speaker 1 (41:41):
I want to um ask you to share more on the burden,
because I think that issomething that a lot of guys or
people, anybody that's dealingwith these type of suicidal
ideology or thinking like theythey do feel they're a burden
and let's try and help peopleunderstand that burden part and
(42:04):
then how they are from otherones, which I think what you did
with the gratitude journal andthe woman that came and said,
hey, we love you, we care aboutyou.
Like, how do we help people getthrough that?
I'm a burden to know you are anasset or something positive and
people do care about you.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
I think one if you can not isolate yourself from.
Because I started to isolatemyself, which was abnormal for
me, and I think that's that wasthe first thing.
I wasn't reaching out tofriends anymore, I wasn't being
social anymore.
I was just going to work andcoming home and just kind of
(42:42):
sitting in.
I was halfway into my old lifeand I wasn't fully committed to
my new life, so I wasn'tthriving on either end of it.
And when you are at the top ofyour game whatever that game is,
you're an 18, or if you're aBravo or whatever you're doing
(43:04):
in the military or in school,you know you achieve a level of
expertise as you aretransitioning from one thing to
another.
It's so challenging to oneadmit you need help to
understand that you're mourningthe loss of your previous life.
(43:25):
Um, even if you know you couldsay, oh man, the army was a, I
was, it was a pain in the ass,rucking, sucked.
But then you start to look backon he's like man, there was so
much great in it and to realizethat you're not going to be able
to go back to that life again.
I think that's where it's easyto isolate yourself and forget
(43:46):
that you do have infrastructure,you do have people who care
about you and people who wouldbe absolutely heartbroken and
devastated if you were to not bearound.
But for me, once I startedrealizing what I was grateful
for, it just completely changedmy perspective because it's on
(44:08):
paper, I'm writing.
It's like I have my daughter'sjust starting college, my son is
thriving, I have a geniusdaughter and I get to go back
and visit them and I'm at thisgreat university and I have a
huge support network and I havenow, even though it's not a SEAL
(44:29):
team USC is its own little,it's its own city and it's got
its own culture and I waswelcomed with open arms into
that culture.
And because I was feeling like aburden, I didn't see all the
amazing things that were infront of me every single day and
(44:50):
I think you start to.
Once you start to feel likeyou're burdened, all those lines
start to blur and you don't getto see clearly how much of an
asset you are and how valuableyou still are.
How much of an asset you areand how valuable you still are,
even though you're not doing thejob that you trained and led
for, sometimes literally, orgave limbs for you're like, but
(45:13):
you're still valuable.
You have so many skills and somany things that translate into
what's next that I wish guyswould have a network to say hey,
man, you are so valuable towhat's next, you're so valuable
(45:34):
to me as a friend, you're sovaluable to your kids, and just
focus on what makes you specialand I lost sight of that I was
just so.
I was so sad about what I wasmissing.
I did not understand what I hadin front of me and then, when I
(45:58):
realized that I mean,everything changed.
You know, I realized that everytime I got off the train and
walked onto USC's campus, I hadthis big stupid smile on my face
because I was like this placeis awesome and I got to interact
with athletes again.
I had a mission that I couldget behind.
I had a new team that needed meand everybody else kept saying
(46:31):
Mark, we need your help.
I was talking to a thoracicsurgeon.
I said, hey, mark, I need yourperspective on this.
I was like what, why do youneed your perspective on this?
I was like what, why do youneed my perspective?
You know, I've not talked toanybody who has gone through a
selection course like that and Ineed to understand how you saw
(46:51):
the world and I need to hook youup to some electrodes and put
you through a stress test,because I need this information,
because I just didn't have itbefore.
I was just like, okay, you know, and I just started't have it
before.
I was just like, okay, you know, and I just started saying yes
to everything and just life wasso precious.
Everything gained its uh shineagain and I looked forward to
(47:18):
every day at work and and beforeI had that four-hour block to
where I felt like it was aburden all around that, even
though there was chaos andturmoil and things were not
happening the way I expected itto happen.
there were good things happeningall over the place and it took
(47:41):
that moment of clarity to say,say, for somebody from the
outside to say, hey, you'rereally valuable here and you
can't go around this campuswithout somebody saying, hey, do
you know, mark, great guy.
And I was like okay, so my, my,my journey is not done.
And I hate.
I hate that so many people withso much value take a permanent
(48:07):
solution to what's often atemporary problem.
Speaker 1 (48:08):
Well said, well said and I think it's so important.
I talk about being a pagemaster in my book and when I say
that it's to turn the page inyour mind, mentally, you know
you're stuck on being a burdenand oh, I used to be special, I
used to do this, I used to dothat Amazing things.
I was changing the world andnow you're in this transition,
(48:30):
so you're not doing all thosethings.
So that's why you feel like aburden or you feel loss or
you're lacking, but you'rereally not.
You're transitioning, like yousaid, and that's where I talk
about turn the page and youturned into gratitude, and
gratitude is a very powerfultool.
There are so many things.
If you're alive, you havesomething to be grateful for.
(48:50):
You just you do.
There's anything that you canlook around.
It can be a family member, itcan be a friend, it can be a job
, it can be the blue sky thatyou're looking at, even though
you're all alone, and be likewow, it's actually a really nice
sunny day.
So gratitude is a powerful tooland I try and teach people and
I think you're preaching thesame thing, because the truth is
(49:11):
the truth.
You've got to turn that page inyour head, stop being stuck and
reach out to others.
They'll tell you you're not aburden and then switch that role
where okay, say I did dosomething stupid and take a
permanent solution to somethingthat's temporary.
How would my daughter feel?
How would my friend feel?
(49:32):
How would people at work feel?
All the you know what?
You're not a burden to thesepeople.
You're really not.
You're more of a burden if youleave because now they got to
deal with all that stress, theloss and estate things, and I've
lost both my parents, andlosing someone is not easy.
So don't burden people withthat.
And you are loved.
(49:52):
So shift your mind, get offthat you're a burden and go to
gratitude, go to love, go tofriends and really change your
perspective.
It's so powerful and thank you,mark, for sharing that story.
It was a very emotional.
I felt it.
I got goosebumps a couple times.
I think I still do, but peopledon't understand that.
(50:15):
And more power to you.
I'm proud of you, brother, forbeing able to share that,
because a lot of people holdthat in, like you said, special
operators.
We'd love to shoulder theburden.
I'll just deal with it.
I don't even talk about myself,you know.
Yeah, I wrote the book theAsset Mindset on positivity and
thinking like an elite specialforces soldier.
(50:36):
But you know what?
I struggle at times.
I wake up tired or I'm achy andsore I tore.
At times I wake up tired or I'machy and sore.
I tore my shoulder.
We all have it.
It's part of the humancondition.
So suck it up, drive on andsurround yourself with good
people.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Yeah, because you know, when people feel like a
burden and they were highperformers they think because
they're not performing in thesame way with the same level of
expertise that they thinkthey're failing.
But you're, and the specialoperations community, you're 50,
(51:11):
as everybody else is 80 to 90.
You know, and they've taught usso much and our teammates have
taught us so much, and how weapproach life and approach
problems is so unique.
And just apply that to what'snext.
Because you're special, becausethe way you think is special,
(51:36):
they can teach anybody to dowhat we did.
The intangible was hey, how doyou solve this very specific
problem in dynamic ways thatsomebody else would be like I
never even thought about that?
It's like you didn't thinkabout that.
Why not?
You know, um, instead of youknow, if you're taking fire from
direct and like the marines,like charge that hill, special
(51:57):
operators were like why don't Ijust go around the back?
You know simple solution, butyou know you've trained and
thrived in that environment forso long that you just have to
redirect it, because solvingproblems is what we did,
dynamically solving problems andaccomplishing impossible tasks
(52:21):
was our normal.
So we just have to re-engageand say, okay, I need to refocus
this because I'm not goingdownrange anymore.
But my new downrange is thisnew job that I'm not a subject
matter expert at anymore.
Or I'm living in a part of thecountry that I wasn't planning
on living in and, like I said, Iliked the two aspects of Los
Angeles when I wasn't planningon living in and, like like I
(52:42):
said, I liked the two aspects ofLos Angeles when I first got
there and for the first year Iwas coming out on final approach
, coming back from Virginiaseeing my family, I was like God
back in LA and I just look atthe place.
I'm just like, okay, but thenafter a year I'm coming in on
final place.
I'm just like, okay, but thenafter a year I'm coming in on a
final approach and I'm like, ohman, I'm back and I'm like, wait
(53:06):
, no, I'm supposed to hate thisplace, I'm only here temporarily
, right.
And then once I started torealize how cool of a place it
was as weird as LA is it was theabsolute best place for me.
As weird as that sounds,because I wasn't in the
entertainment rat race, right, Iwas at a university, surrounded
by a bunch of cool people doinga bunch of cool stuff, and I
(53:28):
was right in the center of itand it was then.
Then the whole city juststarted to look differently and
the way I approached it lookeddifferent because I was grateful
for where I was and everythingabout me just always comes back
to gratitude.
Right, I was in buds and, ashard as each day was, I'd look
around.
It's like I'm in San Diego, thesun's bright and I'm going
(53:54):
through the toughest training inthe world, but what's the
better part of that?
I'm working out on the beachwith my best friends.
I was like, huh, okay, well,that's easy and that was, that
was my mindset.
And going through with, likeSean, uh, andy stump, you know,
jack, car, Like.
These are all my buddies andI'm on the beach working out in
(54:16):
San Diego with my boys.
What could be better than that?
Speaker 1 (54:19):
You know, with my boys, what could be better than
that?
You know absolutely as a youngman that's like that's an
ultimate highlight.
Yeah, it sucks, but look whoI'm with.
Speaker 2 (54:26):
Look to my left and my right.
Yeah, we're all miserable, butwe all find something to laugh
about.
I mean the fact that most 90percent of the class you're in,
I think you're going throughselection.
There's always something funnyhappening in the midst of all
the chaos.
Somebody's doing something orsomebody's getting caught doing
something, and it's the funniestshit.
(54:48):
And those of us who make it, wejust have this weird sense of
humor and we turn this shittysituation into something funny
and enjoyable.
That you know periods of ofembracing the suck, but for the
most part of of embracing thesuck, but for the most part
you're embracing the stuff withyour boys.
What could be better?
Speaker 1 (55:06):
than that.
And I think another thing weshould touch on real quick here
too, and this applies totransitions and like going
through selection, going throughbuds, going to school, any
there's seasons in life.
Don't beat yourself up whenseasons in your life change.
Do you get mad at winterbecause winter comes and it's
going to be cold?
(55:26):
Do you get mad, you know, atspring showers, like it's just a
part of life?
There's seasons in your life asa human being.
Understand that.
Speaker 2 (55:37):
And prep for it.
You don't show up in summerclothes in the wintertime.
You're like, well, it's ourfall, I've got to pull out my
fall line up of boots andthicker jeans and flannels.
You prep for life.
That's happening and thetransitions and the changes, and
being seasonal is the samething.
It's like, okay, I can't dresslike in Minnesota in December,
(56:00):
like I am at the beach right now.
And and June prep for lifebecause you know what you need
to do.
Just just prepare yourself forit in any way you can.
Speaker 1 (56:09):
That's wonderful and I love how you said prep.
So, before we wrap it up,because this has been a great
episode and I can't get over, anhour has already gone by,
that's when you know we're,we're vibing brother.
It's real and I know listenershear that.
Right, you all know out therewhat we're saying is real and
(56:30):
it's the truth, and please don'tforget to go in and like and
subscribe and share.
But before we go, I'm going toask you if you could pass on
just one mindset principle tosomeone who feels completely
lost right now.
What would it be and why theprinciple?
Speaker 2 (56:47):
I would pass on is that you have the attributes to
succeed.
You just now have to look andsay, okay, how do I build upon
what I have so I can continue tobe successful?
Is that listen to a podcast?
(57:07):
Is that researching?
It's like, hey, hey, I am, Iwas great at this one thing.
What can I do to one?
Translate that into what's next?
And then, how do I translatethat into the language of where
I'm going?
Like I could say I was a sniperfor most of my career.
(57:30):
I can't go on a job interviewand say, and by the way, I was a
sniper and they're like that'sgreat.
However, you know you're taskoriented, you work well alone
and you work in teams well, yousee the big picture and you know
how to collaborate.
Fortune 500 company likes thoseattributes.
(57:53):
So, even though you're saying,even though sniper doesn't
really translate everything ittook to become a sniper does so,
whatever your next endeavor is,if it's sports, if it's school
or going into the military,those experiences just bring out
those attributes.
You go to boot camp.
(58:14):
You may have never had to bedisciplined your whole life, but
they're going to get it out ofyou.
You know, and they're going toget it out of you.
You know, and they're going tochange your mindset and you're
going to break through barriersthat you didn't think that you,
or you're going to discoverthings about yourself that you
didn't think were there.
They're just.
They're there, they're justlatent.
You just need the rightopportunity or the right
environment to bring thosethings out.
(58:35):
So you know, prep for whatyou're doing, understand the
(58:58):
environment, what you're goinginto and just be prepared for it
, because you're going to buds,going to college, whatever
you're doing, you know there'ssomething that preps you to say,
okay, hey, you've earned theright to do this, so now take
advantage of your opportunityand prepare yourself for what's
next.
(59:20):
You know we had 166 guys whostarted our class.
Everybody had what it took toget there, but either people
didn't prepare themselves forwhat they were getting
themselves into or they let thesituation overwhelm them and the
guys who made it throughfigured out a way to let the
(59:42):
environment bring out theattributes that helped them to
succeed.
And for some people, buds wasthe wrong environment to pull
out those attributes.
But something else you'reinterested in, having gone
through that experience andmaybe you didn't pass it, but
you discover things in yourself,yourself and you're like, wow,
I didn't even know I could dothat.
(01:00:02):
But now I can translate thatinto what's coming up next, be
it whatever it is.
And you know, rich Devaneywrote that book, the Attributes
and you have so manycapabilities that we rarely tap
into and you and I got toexperience that at some of the
highest levels because we madethat choice.
But, um, now just findsomething you love and just go
(01:00:27):
all in, um, but don't go in byyourself because, um, your team
may be a team of two or a teamof ten.
Every day at buds, I relied onsomebody else to help me get
through that course.
Be a senior Chief, mink or someguy who ran in front of me when
I was Jonas Kelsall ran infront of me because I was having
(01:00:50):
a bad day, right, and I wasn'tsmiling that day, and he's like
dude, what's the matter?
I was like Jonas, I suck.
Today we have afour-mile-a-half stand time
running.
I'm not going to make it.
So he said, okay, here's whatwe're going to do.
I was 25, he was 18.
He's like here's what we'regoing to do.
You're going to run right behindme and the way I'm going to
step in the sand.
(01:01:11):
I'm going to make it a littlebit easier for you to run.
He's like don't even look up.
And here this 18-year-old kidwas like hey, mark, I got you
and I didn't look up for fourmiles.
I just ran wherever he steppedand all of a sudden I was done
with it and I knew I couldn'tmake it.
(01:01:31):
I just didn't have it that dayand I just relied on a teammate
and I didn't even ask him.
He just saw that something waswrong and he's like you know,
here's how we're going to getyou through this today.
18-year-old kid, he taught me ahuge lesson that day that, no
matter your age, when you needhelp and you're in the right
(01:01:54):
environment, you know help isgoing to show up and it's going
to help you thrive.
So if you have that a choicelike that where somebody's
helped you which, looking backon life, somebody has, you know,
just pay it forward, you know,and help somebody out who's
struggling, which I think thispodcast is doing your book is
(01:02:16):
done, denny does.
Hopefully my book is doing andDenny does, hopefully my book is
doing, because you have peoplewho genuinely care about you as
an individual and you as acontributor to society.
Speaker 1 (01:02:35):
And just as a human, you know, I see remarkable
people every day.
Well said, and I'm just goingto add a little to that Surround
yourself with good people ingood environments.
I'm just going to add a littleto that.
Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
Surround yourself with good people in good
environments.
Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
It's so important.
And please check out MarkGreen's Unsealed book, A Navy
Seal's Guide to Mastering Life'sTransitions Great book, a lot
of stuff.
And if you're out there, you'regoing to transition in life
because you're a human being andwe all do it.
The struggle is real.
Embrace the suck.
Thank you again, Mark, forcoming on the Asset Mindset
(01:03:04):
podcast.
It's been an absolute pleasure.
I thank you for sharing yourstories.
You're a great man.
Keep doing the great work thatyou're doing.
Super appreciate it and, ofcourse, all of you out there
listening.
Don't forget to like, subscribeand share this with someone you
think needs to hear it and,more than anything else, make
sure you own your power.
Good morning and Mark , it's great to have you on the
Asset Mindset podcast.
I love what you're doing.
I love when you talk about yourstories and your experience and
especially having a fellowauthor on with Unsealed.
I love that you're sharing yourstory of transitioning, because
I think people forget about thestruggle it is to transition
(00:29):
when you've done something andthat's been your life for years
and years and years.
And now there's this big changeand a lot of people struggle
with it and I think that alsocontributes to a lot of the
suicides that are going on orjust substance abuse that are
going on or just substance abuse.
But I love to have you here, Ifeel honored and it's always
nice to you know, go back andforth with a SEAL and Green
(00:50):
Berets and that wonderful littlerivalry we have.
But why don't you share alittle bit about yourself with
the audience?
Speaker 2 (00:56):
All right.
So I am, like you said, a20-year Navy SEAL and got to
work with the Green Berets overthe course of my career.
But I did a 20-year careerstart off as an enlisted guy, a
sled dog, which was a great wayto kind of break into special
(01:17):
operations as far as learningthe job, because in an officer
you really only have a limitedtime to actually do the cool guy
stuff before you start going onthe leadership track.
So I got the.
I think I got the best of bothworlds going enlisted in an
officer.
I got to get my lessons learned, my list of things not to do as
(01:37):
opposed to you know how to bestlead men like this into combat,
and it was really rewardingmuch more rewarding than I
thought.
And since then you know the upsand downs of retiring and not
being a cool guy anymore to theonly thing I'm shooting is
(01:58):
emails for a while, you know.
And then I got my dream job atthe University of Southern
California, did that for fouryears and then came back and now
currently work at DominionEnergy as cybersecurity and
intelligence.
So it's a really an interestingjourney that I've been on and
(02:19):
there's some TV shows that havehappened and speaking events
that are getting ready to comeup, so my plate is getting ready
to get full.
But whenever I see an invitefrom Danny, I I Roger up for
that because they're alwaysinteresting and it's always
great to meet new people.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Well, it's great to have you here.
So I'm going to start by askingwhat was the moment you first
realized you were mentallystronger than your circumstances
?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
was the moment you first realized you were mentally
stronger than yourcircumstances.
It, I think it when I got tobuds and actually got to the
actual challenge of it, becauseyou never know what you're gonna
expect and even though it wasthe hardest thing I've ever done
it wasn't I wasn't at the endof my, I didn't at 10, you know.
(03:06):
I didn't get into the red whereI couldn't continue.
And, um, once I realized thateven though the instructor staff
, as professionals they were,their job is to either
facilitate you graduating orfacilitate you leaving.
Um, and once I realized that ifI asked for help, they're going
to provide it and I wasphysically and mentally able to
(03:27):
do it.
Then I just took it into chunksthat I could manage, as opposed
to eating the entire elephant,the six month elephant.
I just took it off into threeor four hour chunks that I could
manage, which, every time mystomach growled, it was almost
time to eat and I realized theyhave to feed you.
So it was hey today, and Irealized they have to feed you,
so it was hey I.
Today's gonna be a hard day.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
However, these next three or four hours, not so bad,
do you have a special moment orstory um from buds that really,
when you look back, you're likethat defined buds, buds.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
for you, yes, so I had a heat injury, that was, it
was hot out and I was juststruggling, but I the
overwhelming need to not quit,even though even though I knew
something was going on.
So I finished the run and kindof, I just sat down.
(04:21):
You're not supposed to sit inin in training, so I just sit
down and the instructors areyelling at me, but I can't
understand English, so I dosomething was wrong.
And then, after I'm notresponding, they kind of think
something's wrong too, and sothey recover me and they send me
over to medical.
(04:43):
And because people make upexcuses to not continue on,
they're like he's probablytaking it.
So instead of getting mytemperature taken the
traditional way, they uh, go thenon-traditional way.
So so they, they positioned meand you know.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
What is the non-traditional way, mark?
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Um it's called, I guess, exit only Um, I don't
know it's for the listeners.
Yeah, yeah, it's a exit, onlysome backdoor action, you know,
um, all non-voluntary, so alittle sexual assault, but, um,
so they give me the, the probe,and I didn't flinch and they're
(05:34):
like, oh man, this guy's a mess.
So they realize that I'm hurtand they realize I had heat
exhaustion.
So, instructor, get like okay,green, I got in trouble because
you didn't drink your water.
So if I get in trouble, you getto get in trouble.
So every time I see you, you'regoing to drain your canteen and
(05:58):
you're going to go get wet.
You're going to be hydratedinside and out.
Okay, this is going to suck.
And he just kept showing up.
So you know I'm like okay, thisis going to suck.
And he just kept showing up.
So you know, I'm having toforce hydrate.
And there was a gentleman namedSenior Chief Mink, a plank owner
at the development group,legend, on the teams, and he
(06:18):
said hey, green, come on overhere.
And I was like yes, sir, senior, how you doing?
He's like look, look, you arealways given 100%.
He's like I don't know ifyou're just too dumb to throttle
it back when you don't need to.
But but I also understand thatyou don't.
You're not, you have aconfidence problem.
You're crushing everything, butyou're just not 100% sure of
(06:42):
yourself.
So he looked around and said ifyou tell anybody about this,
I'm gonna deny it.
And he picks up this thing,something called bullfrog, and
he's like everybody, I've giventhis bullfrog who's graduated.
And he handed it to me.
It's like now I'm giving it toyou.
And he handed it to me.
It's like and now I'm giving itto you.
(07:05):
It's like no, get your ass outof here and go graduate.
At that moment it was like oh,like the, the final thing of the
code of how to get through thisplace.
That finally hit me.
It was just that one act of notso much kindness, but like
confidence.
Hey, I'm confident, I seethings in you that you don't
(07:26):
quite see in yourself and you'regoing to make a great seal and
you just need this one littlepush.
And here it is.
And that was after that moment.
There was never any doubt on ifI was going to graduate.
I wasn't planning on gettingenrolled and I just started.
I mean, it went from hey, I wasthe gray man, I was just
(07:46):
surviving, to hey, I'm close tothe top of my class and, being
six foot two, 200 and somethingpounds.
That course is not designed forme, right?
I think the average feel isfive, nine, 165 pounds.
Dark hair, dark eyes.
It's like a factory, right?
Speaker 1 (08:15):
So but I just couldn't be stopped after that
moment.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
What a great story.
And Senior Chief Mink, after itwas all done, I went up to him.
I was like you that one daythat you gave me this bullfrog
completely changed my life.
And it did change my lifebecause it didn't only translate
to buds, it translated toeverything.
Now I can do everything.
(08:38):
That wall that so many of ushit, that you can't accomplish
something, that one momentcompletely demolished all that
and that was my defining moment.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Like I said, not only the buds, but in everything I
chose to pursue or things thatwere thrown on me that I didn't
quite want to do, that bullfrogand that moment was the defining
one.
That's great, that's powerfulright there, and it's incredible
when you have somebody thattakes you under their wing and
gives you a little pep talk oris just mentoring you.
Sometimes you don't pick up onit right away, but I'm sure you
now, years later, looking back,you realize how much more
mentorship that was.
You thought it was just alittle pep talk in the beginning
(09:25):
, probably.
You know, I know I would havegoing through selection or
whatever.
You have those moments withcadre or instructors and they
share something.
You're like, oh, okay.
But then you look back andyou're like, oh, I get that now
I see what you were doing, youwere leading me down the path.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
And not only that, it seemed like my perspective on
the instructor staff changedbecause, although they were
yelling and trying to get you onthe right mindset to either
stay or go, there was thislittle like I agree and keep it
up.
No, get out of here.
You stink and you're ruining mycheat, but get out of here.
(10:03):
So it was all at thesestrategic moments that
mentorship was happening andthat encouragement was happening
.
That instructor staff and theway that they developed BUDS and
took the instructor staff.
You don't understand it whileyou're going through it, but now
(10:27):
, looking back on it, it's likethey were ultimate professionals
and they really, if you wantedto be there, they wanted you to
stay absolutely, and it's.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
It's so incredible.
When you get to be with peoplelike that whether it's selection
, whether it's buds you reallyget to see.
Whether it's buds, you reallyget to see people being forged
and changed and shaped, orpeople have an awareness, like
you realized for yourself howpowerful you were there.
It took that bull frog andwhatnot, and you were trying to
(10:55):
prove yourself and doing allthese things and pushing so hard
, but also you need to know whento throttle back, because I was
almost a heat cat too.
We were doing the long run andI went through selection in June
.
They take a break at Braggbecause it does get too hot, but
I was the last class before thesummer break, so it was still
pretty damn hot and I just youknow you're doing the best you
(11:19):
can and you're like I got to getthe best time or I need to do
this because you don't know whatthe requirements are.
Like I got to get the best timeor I need to do this Cause you
don't know what the therequirements are like.
Am I going to make time?
So I'm going to push as hard asI can.
And I felt that same heat, likeall my cheeks were red and burn
.
It felt like a sunburn but Iwasn't burned.
My vision started and I'm likeno, you're going to throttle
back on this, you're going topass out.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
I went straight through that barrier, the flush
space and stuff was closing inand I could see the finish line.
So I couldn't stop.
Yeah, um, but had I?
I looked at it half a mileprior to.
That is when I should havestopped, um, but I was so
determined to finish.
You know, I thought that wasquitting if you didn't at least
(12:03):
finish.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Yeah, so many believe success requires talent or luck
, you know, to make it.
What is the real differencebetween people who win or people
who lose?
Do you think whether it's budsor life or business, whatever it
may be?
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I think they take the wrong approach.
I think they take the wrongperspective, as there is help
available and you either have toeither swallow your pride and
say, okay, look, I need helpwith this an entire event or an
(12:50):
entire process all in onesetting.
Like I said, taking even thoughbuds is 181 days, six months, I
didn't look at it as a sixmonth event.
I took it as a day at a time,four hours at a time, and when I
went to because I flunked outof college, finished college,
and then I went to because Iflunked out of college, finished
college, and then I went tograd school and I remember kind
of a lot of anxiety because Iwas looking at it as 18 months
(13:12):
balls to the wall and I'm like,yeah, I'm not going to survive
this one.
And then I thought back to it.
I was like, okay, go to yourprofessors if you're struggling.
You take this a week at a timeas opposed to a semester.
And I just took it in smalllittle chunks that I could
manage, because I knew thatthat's the way to solve the
(13:33):
problem.
I just got overwhelmed by itand didn't take my own advice.
I looked around like, wait,there are mentors everywhere
there's support, everywhere.
You have your professors, youhave the environment, you have
your classmates and everybodyjust comes together to help.
But if you don't ask for thathelp, they don't know you're
struggling.
(13:53):
So it was like, look, I'm in anew environment, I'm learning
business at the graduate levelafter flunking out and getting a
criminology degree, and now I'mlearning marketing and
statistics and finance and allthe overwhelming stuff that in
business.
But I'm learning it at thevarsity level without having
(14:14):
gone through freshman ball,peewee ball and JV.
It's like, hey, here you go,varsity don't suck, you know.
But but once I took it in manchunks, I could manage.
And then I kind of got settledin and asked for the help I need
.
I only needed that helpinitially and then, once I
(14:34):
figured it out, it's like, okay,I got it, and how I did that at
usc was the same thing, and howI did that at USC was the same
thing, and how I did that at mycurrent job was the same thing.
You're going into the unknown.
You have the attributes to besuccessful.
You just have to refocus it.
And hey, I know how to be agood employee Show up on time,
(15:00):
do what you're told, beproactive, manage up and learn
your industry so you can be asubject matter expert at some
point.
But I also knew that goingthrough those five steps takes
time and it's a process.
So when I was learning this newindustry, I just kind of
throttled it back and just tookit in steps that I could manage
(15:22):
hey, get in here, get here for ayear.
It back, and just took it insteps that I could manage.
Hey, get in here, get here fora year, figure out the industry
and slowly gain expertise onyour job.
Until one day, my second yearend, it's like hey, you have to
brief the senior VP on whatwe're doing.
Everybody else is gone, andinstead of like holy shit, I'm
(15:44):
not ready for this, I was like,okay, what are we briefing?
All right I'm ready to go.
I went over a little bit andthat's when I realized like, hey
, the day I showed up, I was anovice.
Two years into this, the seniorvp of the company is like hey,
we need, um, a briefing on thisbecause this is going up the ceo
.
And uh, I was the guy to do itand I answered every question.
I didn't even know I knew thisstuff, daniel.
(16:07):
Honestly, I was just like butas we start briefing it, it all
just starts coming to me andthen they ask questions and I
can go in depth and I was like,okay, this is not hard, just be
patient with yourself,understand your limitations,
understand your strengths andweaknesses, which I did.
So when I needed help.
You have a supervisor for areason like, hey, get your ass
(16:27):
over here, I need some help.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
And uh, and he did.
Yeah, I think that's powerful.
People are afraid sometimes toask for help because they don't
want to look vulnerable and havehumility in life.
Nobody knows everything.
Everybody's learned from otherpeople.
It's it's okay to ask for help,and I think this also stems a
little bit.
I think we're touching on fear.
I think people have a lot offear, afraid to do things.
Can you talk about overcomingfear?
(16:56):
Because, as a human being, weall face fear, right?
Speaker 2 (17:00):
So the time that I I feel the same fear as everybody
else, right.
And my first fear factor camewhen I lost my best friend in a
parachuting accident, had dinnerwith him two days prior to his
(17:28):
death and the fact thatskydiving is part of the Sierra
land, it's part of the sealedthing.
So I avoided going to free fallout of out of fear, right?
So, um, but one day my careercaught up to me and I had to go
to military free fall and it wasugly.
And so I'm like, ok, I'mjumping to my death and changing
(17:51):
my mind at the last 2,500 feet,right.
So I was like that's the wrongmindset.
Go into the wind tunnel, figurethis thing out, talk to the
subject matter experts andfigure out how to push through
the fear that you're feeling andyou're experiencing, because I
actually have a job to do inthis.
The fears are relevant.
(18:12):
You know I can still have it.
I still have respect for whatI'm doing.
However, the job is do your 25to 30 jumps, get free fall
qualified so you can go on tothis next job.
30 jumps, get free fallqualified, so you can go on and
do this next job.
But every time we got up everytime I started packing my chute,
you know, it just startedfeeling like man, this is.
I got about two and a halfhours of life left and we'd go
(18:36):
up in the twin otter, hit 12,000.
And every single time that thatjump master said jump, I jumped
and, uh, the fear wasoverwhelming for the first 10
jumps and then like, okay, 15,I'm starting to get the hang of
it, 20.
Like this is awesome, right,but he's still.
Every time I got up to 12,000,I was still nervous.
I'm like, hey, this could bethe last jump I ever do, but I
(19:00):
wanted to be successful and Ihad people that relied on me.
It wasn't just about me, it wasabout my teammates and the
mission and that overrode thatfear.
And there's a lot of things I dothat I'll start just so I'll
finish.
Because once, like my dad toldme my first day of football
practice, he said once you startsomething, there's no quitting.
(19:23):
So sometimes I'll startsomething that I don't want to
do just because once I start Ican't quit, and you know that
has translated throughout myentire life.
So now that, um, even though Ididn't want to go to free sport
once, I started that first day.
Okay, that part of the equationis done.
There's no quitting.
You have to figure this thingout.
(19:44):
And, um, you've gone to sniperschool or becoming an officer,
uh, going down range for thefirst time, you know you.
You you land at by app and youknow it's on.
At that point you know and youdon't.
Sometimes it's spicy out onroute irish, you know, um, but
(20:07):
you still have to take thatdrive.
So, uh, fear is there.
I think it's, it's necessary,but I think the mindset that you
need to overcome that fear andstill do the job, I think that's
what's more valuable absolutely, and I think fear gives us a
chance to demonstrate courageand bravery.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
That's what really defines, because, like you said,
everybody has fear.
Yeah, and my first jump out ofa plane, I was like this could
be the last thing I ever do,just like you.
And I learned a lot about life.
I learned a lot about me.
Am I at peace?
Have I lived the life I want tolive?
Am I going to change or what amI going to do?
And having that fear isactually a healthy thing.
(20:48):
I think people demonize feartoo much.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
I don't know if you'd agree with that, but I don't
think fear is this horrible,evil thing?
Speaker 1 (20:57):
It's there to learn, it's there to motivate sometimes
, and I think it's a chance togrow, because when you get to be
brave and courageous andaccomplish something that you
were scared of, I mean, how'dyou feel when you graduated?
You know, free fall, awesomeyeah.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Amazing, I did it.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
It's exactly so.
Any listeners out there, pleaserealize that you may have fear,
but face it.
This is your chance to be brave, be courageous, be like Mark,
be like all the other peoplethat have faced fear.
You're not alone.
You can do it.
You absolutely can overcomeyour fear with bravery and
courage, and you will be gladyou did Trust me.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
And, you know, I want to add one more thing to that,
because everything that I've hada healthy fear of, or even an
unhealthy fear of, there was alevel of respect for what I was
getting out of the experienceGoing through Buzz, I was like
this is going to be the hardestthing I ever do.
There was fear there, but it'slike, hey, man, you feared
because in my turn, itmanifested its respect for what
(22:03):
I was doing.
I feared being a parent.
Right, that was probably one ofmy biggest fears, because I had
no idea what I was doing, butit's because I respected the
role that I was going to take asa father.
And, you know, going intocombat, you respect the enemy
because they have a plan too.
So whenever I felt that fear, Iwas like, okay, there's fear
(22:25):
there, but there's also arespect for what I'm getting
ready to do Very well said so,let's transition a little bit.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Tell me about starting your book.
I know writing a book is a lotof work.
It takes a lot of time, ittakes some bravery and courage,
because you've got to put thingsout there and you're going out
in the world.
So share your story aboutbecoming an author and writing
unsealed.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
I.
My journey and unsealed startedwhen I was at the University of
Southern California.
I don't know if you didn'tthose gentlemen Michael Gervais,
he's uh, he's one of thosemindset gurus, real good guy.
So he was given a speech inclass and at the Q&A session one
of the students said hey, youknow what's it like for special
(23:10):
operators to what's theirmindset?
He's like funny, you should ask, we have one right here, he's
going to tell you all about it.
And I was like oh, that'sawesome.
There's another team guy orsomebody in here And's like mark
, after the break, go, come onand tell your story.
I was like you, motherfucker,um voluntold yeah.
(23:31):
So I went and told, I told mystory and it was quick but it
was uh, it was the catalyst.
And then later on I think itwas when kobe bryant was still
he could not make a speakingevent.
So my friend called like Mark,our guy canceled, will you come
out and speak to the class?
And I was like, ok, so I showup, do my event.
(23:54):
And I had such a great time.
And at the end of the semesterhe asked the students.
He said, hey, who is yourfavorite speaker of all the
people we've had, who is yourfavorite?
Like 85 percent of the classsaid we'd love to have Mark come
back.
I was like, really, so thatstarted an annual.
(24:14):
So every semester I did it.
And then when I left I stillcame back yearly.
And this gentleman I met, hisname is Bobby.
And this gentleman I met, hisname is Bobby, and he heard me
speak and he's like Mark, youhave to write a book.
And I was like no, I don't.
I think so many people havemuch more interesting story than
(24:34):
I have in the space.
You know, richard Devaney isout there, jocko was dominating
the space and Goggins, and I waslike their story seems to be
much more interesting than mine,and so I'm just going to hold
off, I'm going to do my speakingevents and just be the quiet
guy, the gray man in the corner.
And finally Bobby calls me upon Christmas break.
(24:58):
Coming up on Christmas break,and he said all right, I've had
enough of you telling me nobreak.
Coming up on Christmas break,and he said, all right, I've had
enough of you telling me no.
He's like I interviewed fiveghostwriters.
Interview them, pick one andwrite your book.
And he's like you have untilJuly.
And the 12 year old Mark saidwell, you're not the boss of me,
(25:21):
I'm not going to do anything.
I took it as wait a second.
And he was so enthusiastic andhe funded the whole thing and he
said just get your story andget it down.
Uh, because people need to hearit.
Like okay, huge fear, choppedup, because I wonder what I'm
going to write about.
Two, is it going to suck?
(25:42):
And three, I'm going to have topass the scrutiny of my
teammates.
Because I have to be veryauthentic, because as soon as
somebody reads it, then teamguys and our brothers are going
to call bullshit right away Fakestuff in a book.
You're going to get caught, yeah, yeah.
(26:02):
And then I reached out to JackCarr Carr, who was a classmate
of mine, because I saw a podcastand I was like Jack, I don't,
how do you write a book?
And in the podcast he saidalways find your theme of your
book and have everythingcentered around the theme.
And he said in Terminal List itwas revenge.
(26:23):
Everything in the story, everyaspect of that book, from the
protagonist, was a revenge.
So then, as I'm going throughthe process, it's like
transitioning is hard.
And one day I woke up and I waslike transition.
And then, once I had my theme,everything was written around
(26:47):
that theme.
And we go through transitions atall points, like I said, being
a parent getting married, goingto the military, loss of a
family member, loss of ateammate, going into combat,
leaving service, going intocombat, leaving service oh, when
your kids are at home and theygo to kindergarten for the first
(27:07):
time, that's a trend, I mean.
And then I start things likethere are transitions all over
the place.
So then I got the structuredown and then Shelby and I just
went about writing and refiningand I think the hardest thing
was I could write academically.
(27:28):
Here are the facts and here'swhat you're supposed to say.
And robot Mark writing a book,right?
She said well, mark, you'retalking at your audience.
I was like what the hell doesthat mean?
And she's like there's noemotion in here, there's no part
of you that's in this.
We're just giving facts.
And once I once that resonatedwith me.
(27:51):
I was like, okay, well, how doI do that?
So then we went through theprocess and she would, I'd write
a chapter and she's like thisis great, this sucks because I
can't feel anything.
So I was like do me a favor,what does right look like?
Because I'm failing and we'rewasting time.
We can go through this back andforth, or you can just show me
what right looks like.
(28:11):
I can get a picture in it andthen we can go from there.
So we had this exercise and shewrote a passage and then I was
just like got it.
I got it.
And I woke up one day and myfirst story I picked up my phone
and just dictated it into theto the phone, um, because I
(28:33):
didn't want to lose it it's twoin the morning and then, once I
wrote that chapter, sent it toher and she's like I'll go write
your book.
And that's how I learned how toexpress emotion.
Because in our line of work,emotion has no value.
It has no value on how you makedecisions.
(28:54):
Actually, it can be detrimentalto how you make decisions and
the selection process.
Part of that process is hey, weneed to beat the feelings out
of these guys so they can bestrategic, be logical.
Chaos is happening.
They need to rely on theirtraining and make the best
decision despite what's going on.
So 20 years of that, you losethat perspective on hey, how do
(29:17):
I feel about doing this roomentry?
Or how do I feel about going onthis target room entry?
Or or how do I feel about goingon this target?
That that's irrelevant.
So when I had to go back to um,tapping into that emotional
side, it took it was a herculeaneffort, because I just forgot
(29:38):
how to do it and I couldn't findthe point where it was relevant
anymore.
The facts are relevant.
Time on target, the planningprocess, the execution, all that
stuff that's relevant.
The emotional side of how Ifeel about it meaningless and so
(30:00):
tapping into that was really,really challenging.
I think to this day it's still.
I still have trouble with it,but I have three daughters.
I have to figure that emotionalstuff out Right.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
Absolutely.
I have two daughters too, so Ifeel you.
This morning I made thembreakfast.
We got some snuggles in becauseI told them I'm going to be
working and busy today doingrecordings and doing the podcast
in because I told him I'm goingto be working and busy today
doing recordings and doing thepodcast.
And speaking of podcast, pleasepause, go underneath and look at
the description.
You'll find all kinds of stuffand information on Mark, links
where you can get his book,check him out for speaking and
(30:36):
whatnot.
And also don't forget to follow, like and subscribe the Asset
Mindset podcast.
And please share with anyoneyou think may need to hear this
because there's some really goodnuggets coming out.
Mark, you're doing a great jobhere, sharing your knowledge.
I can see why you were thefavorite speaker, thank you.
Thank you, you're welcome.
(30:56):
But so let's talk a little moreabout your book, because I
noticed you have like I believeit's six different things that
you talk about in transition andyou start off with like
isolation and what people gothrough.
So, if you want to key in onsome of those big things that
people like, you said your book,yeah, it's about transitioning,
but you transition in alldifferent parts of life, so
(31:18):
let's give the listeners some ofthat.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Okay.
So, do you want to just startoff with the isolation piece?
Sure, do it.
Okay.
So, and this is this is myprocess and it works for me
because, as an introvert, I needto be by myself, to work things
out.
So what I do is I, I, I engorgemyself on all the information
(31:42):
I'm going to need.
Right, like, where do I want tolive?
What do I want to do?
Um, what's my skillset?
What do I?
What do I need to learn to tothrive in this next endeavor?
And I take all and I what if it?
To death?
Right, so I'm just full ofinformation.
So then I just have to isolateit, be it for an hour, be it for
(32:04):
a week, and just like, okay,what does this look like?
My brain needs to figure thisout.
And as I start to figure it out, things just start to settle
out.
Hey, this doesn't make anysense to what you're planning on
doing next, so just go aheadand throw that away.
And then I come up with aframework of what are the top
(32:24):
five things that I need to do tothrive in whatever I'm doing
next.
Right, so I moved to LA.
So, ok, you have to learn LosAngeles.
You're going to work at auniversity.
There's no aggression on auniversity, so you have to throw
all that team guy stuff, allthat sniper stuff.
That's not going to work here.
You're going to have to learnhow to collaborate again.
(32:46):
You're going to have to be thenew guy again.
What does that look like andwhat's your five-year plan for
what this is going to look like?
But I had to engorge myself onthat information and then
isolate myself and then what Ilike to call cocooning happens.
(33:09):
So I take all that information,engorge myself on it and it's a
stressful thing.
Like, hey, I'm going to leaveeverything I know to go to LA.
I don't even like LA.
La is dirty and gritty and youknow I like Pasadena, where I
live.
Go to LA.
I don't even like LA.
La's dirty and gritty and youknow, I like Pasadena, where I
live, and I like USC.
But I wanted to carpet bomb therest of LA.
I was like, okay, well, that'snot going to work.
(33:31):
So I need to take in all thatinformation, isolate and then go
into this cocooning process toprocess it all, and at that
point I have to go through whatI consider a transformation from
Mark Green the SEAL to MarkGreen, the non-SEAL, who you're
(33:54):
not going to go back to thatlocker room ever again.
You're not going to be around.
99% of the people you work withare at the top of their game.
We're all focused, we're all onthe same mission.
You have that team to rely onand that infrastructure to rely
on.
All that's gone and as Iemerged from that cocooning
(34:17):
process, I come out a new person, ready to face what's next and
be prepared for what's next, butalso know that a lot of the
things that made me special haveatrophied.
Like, hey, you can do thisstuff on your own.
I haven't worked outside of ateam in 20 years.
I've not done anything for thelast 20 years since I was 10.
(34:41):
The first time I started playingfootball, you're on a, started
playing football.
You're on a football team, onthe basketball team, you know,
um, you're in a cohort inclasses in college.
I've done team stuff.
How do I do this as anindividual?
Those muscles have atrophied,right.
So then, um, how do I thrive?
Well, I'm gonna have to gothrough my, my basics.
(35:02):
I have to go to the subjectmatter experts and let them know
I need help and let them knowI'm struggling with not being a
team guy again.
Campus, other veterans andsurprisingly enough, it was
other athletes because, let'ssay, graduating seniors.
(35:27):
They're like I want to be aprofessional tennis player, I
want to go to the NFL, I want togo to the big leagues, I want
to do something at the highestlevel but realistically, you're
going to be a professional atsomething else because the
chances of making that level areminuscule.
So then they were transitioningand I had to talk them through
(35:52):
their transition and as I'mtalking through theirs, I'm
experiencing my own transitionthat we're helping each other
and I just sought help becauseone I needed it.
I knew I was a novice and Iknew I needed to get to subject
matter expertise and that's aprocess you know.
(36:12):
And finally, I think the mostprofound thing that ever
happened was I had to come togrips with the fact that I was
grieving the loss of that priorlife.
I was sad about not being aSEAL anymore.
I was sad about not having thecamaraderie and not having the
locker room again.
(36:32):
I love jumping on helicoptersand doing dumb shit, all the
cool stuff we do.
I had to say, okay, look,whatever's new is happening is
great, but that last 20 yearswas also great and unless you go
through the grieving process,you're not going to be able to
(36:54):
move forward and thrive.
But I didn't come to thatrealization until much later,
until I was almost suicidal,because you know, I tried to
keep my family together.
I was failing at that.
I was trying to learn this newjob.
I wasn't doing great at that.
(37:15):
And what do we as team guys doand special operators do when
it's going to get tough?
We pile on more stuff.
So I applied for graduate schoolagain and, as as I'm going
through grad school again, I'mnot a good student and I came to
the realization it's like whatif life is better if I'm not
(37:38):
around?
Because I felt like I was aburden.
And I hadn't felt like that.
I never felt like a burden, butI just seemed like I was a
burden on everything I touched,because I just wasn't able to
excel like I had before and Ijust wasn't getting it.
(37:58):
And one day I had that thought.
I was like man, what if I'mjust a burden?
And what if everything aroundme is better without me being
here?
Then I got a phone call from adear friend and it was out of
the blue and my phone wassupposed to be in sleep mode and
for some reason it rang,because she called twice and
(38:20):
then said hey, are you all right?
I was like, no, I am not doingwell at all.
Could you do me a favor?
I have guns in the house and Iknow that this is going to pass,
but I just need this one aspectof it to not even be an option.
And she was understandingbecause she had felt the same
(38:46):
way and actually made an attempt, survived it.
So she knew exactly what I wasgoing through and she said be
there in 30 minutes.
So I look at my apartment and Isee where the guns are.
Look at my apartment and I seewhere the guns are, so I take my
key and I just throw it as faras I could.
(39:08):
And then I just start walkingto Target, which was 15 minutes,
30-minute round trip, and Iknew that she'd be there in 30
minutes.
So I hit Target and then startwalking back.
And as I'm walking back, she'spulling up and she luckily had a
spare key and started walkingback.
And as I'm walking back, she'spulling up and she luckily had a
spare key and she just gave mea big hug and said hey, you know
(39:31):
we love you around here, right,and I was like You're going to
be fine, but let me know wherethe stuff is.
I told her where it was, shewalked upstairs, grabbed it,
grabbed the guns, put them inher car and she's like I'll see
you tomorrow.
I was like you will see metomorrow and it was at that
(39:55):
moment that and I realized I hadso much still to give and so
much to live for One.
I had four kids that neededtheir father around, even though
I wasn't going to be married totheir mother anymore.
My small team at USC needed me.
I needed to figure this thingout and I needed to heal and get
(40:15):
better.
And it was just that one momentand it only lasted for four
hours, two of which I was atwork, one I was on the train
home.
So really I just had that onehour to where I was just at the
low point.
But even though I was at thatlow point, I still was like, oh
man, my kids, I got to go to asoccer game coming up and
(40:38):
there's things I still had to do.
So I knew I was, I knew it wastemporary and just the one phone
call that should not have comethrough because I turned off all
my stuff.
Um, I realized that people careabout me and, um, they see what
I'm going through and they seemy potential and they know that
I'm going to be fine.
(40:58):
I just need a catalyst to getfrom where I was at my low point
to back to normal, and that wasit.
And once I got over that hurdle, I was fine in two hours and I
started a gratitude log at thatmoment Write down everything
(41:21):
you're grateful for.
And I thought it was going tobe like five or six different
things, like two pages of stuff,and I was like, well, I can't
leave all this behind.
And from that moment on, I justgot back into the mark that I
knew and loved.
And then sky was the one.
Wow, what a powerful story.
Speaker 1 (41:41):
I want to um ask you to share more on the burden,
because I think that issomething that a lot of guys or
people, anybody that's dealingwith these type of suicidal
ideology or thinking like theythey do feel they're a burden
and let's try and help peopleunderstand that burden part and
(42:04):
then how they are from otherones, which I think what you did
with the gratitude journal andthe woman that came and said,
hey, we love you, we care aboutyou.
Like, how do we help people getthrough that?
I'm a burden to know you are anasset or something positive and
people do care about you.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
I think one if you can not isolate yourself from.
Because I started to isolatemyself, which was abnormal for
me, and I think that's that wasthe first thing.
I wasn't reaching out tofriends anymore, I wasn't being
social anymore.
I was just going to work andcoming home and just kind of
(42:42):
sitting in.
I was halfway into my old lifeand I wasn't fully committed to
my new life, so I wasn'tthriving on either end of it.
And when you are at the top ofyour game whatever that game is,
you're an 18, or if you're aBravo or whatever you're doing
(43:04):
in the military or in school,you know you achieve a level of
expertise as you aretransitioning from one thing to
another.
It's so challenging to oneadmit you need help to
understand that you're mourningthe loss of your previous life.
(43:25):
Um, even if you know you couldsay, oh man, the army was a, I
was, it was a pain in the ass,rucking, sucked.
But then you start to look backon he's like man, there was so
much great in it and to realizethat you're not going to be able
to go back to that life again.
I think that's where it's easyto isolate yourself and forget
(43:46):
that you do have infrastructure,you do have people who care
about you and people who wouldbe absolutely heartbroken and
devastated if you were to not bearound.
But for me, once I startedrealizing what I was grateful
for, it just completely changedmy perspective because it's on
(44:08):
paper, I'm writing.
It's like I have my daughter'sjust starting college, my son is
thriving, I have a geniusdaughter and I get to go back
and visit them and I'm at thisgreat university and I have a
huge support network and I havenow, even though it's not a SEAL
(44:29):
team USC is its own little,it's its own city and it's got
its own culture and I waswelcomed with open arms into
that culture.
And because I was feeling like aburden, I didn't see all the
amazing things that were infront of me every single day and
(44:50):
I think you start to.
Once you start to feel likeyou're burdened, all those lines
start to blur and you don't getto see clearly how much of an
asset you are and how valuableyou still are.
How much of an asset you areand how valuable you still are,
even though you're not doing thejob that you trained and led
for, sometimes literally, orgave limbs for you're like, but
(45:13):
you're still valuable.
You have so many skills and somany things that translate into
what's next that I wish guyswould have a network to say hey,
man, you are so valuable towhat's next, you're so valuable
(45:34):
to me as a friend, you're sovaluable to your kids, and just
focus on what makes you specialand I lost sight of that I was
just so.
I was so sad about what I wasmissing.
I did not understand what I hadin front of me and then, when I
(45:58):
realized that I mean,everything changed.
You know, I realized that everytime I got off the train and
walked onto USC's campus, I hadthis big stupid smile on my face
because I was like this placeis awesome and I got to interact
with athletes again.
I had a mission that I couldget behind.
I had a new team that needed meand everybody else kept saying
(46:31):
Mark, we need your help.
I was talking to a thoracicsurgeon.
I said, hey, mark, I need yourperspective on this.
I was like what, why do youneed your perspective on this?
I was like what, why do youneed my perspective?
You know, I've not talked toanybody who has gone through a
selection course like that and Ineed to understand how you saw
(46:51):
the world and I need to hook youup to some electrodes and put
you through a stress test,because I need this information,
because I just didn't have itbefore.
I was just like, okay, you know, and I just started't have it
before.
I was just like, okay, you know, and I just started saying yes
to everything and just life wasso precious.
Everything gained its uh shineagain and I looked forward to
(47:18):
every day at work and and beforeI had that four-hour block to
where I felt like it was aburden all around that, even
though there was chaos andturmoil and things were not
happening the way I expected itto happen.
there were good things happeningall over the place and it took
(47:41):
that moment of clarity to say,say, for somebody from the
outside to say, hey, you'rereally valuable here and you
can't go around this campuswithout somebody saying, hey, do
you know, mark, great guy.
And I was like okay, so my, my,my journey is not done.
And I hate.
I hate that so many people withso much value take a permanent
(48:07):
solution to what's often atemporary problem.
Speaker 1 (48:08):
Well said, well said and I think it's so important.
I talk about being a pagemaster in my book and when I say
that it's to turn the page inyour mind, mentally, you know
you're stuck on being a burdenand oh, I used to be special, I
used to do this, I used to dothat Amazing things.
I was changing the world andnow you're in this transition,
(48:30):
so you're not doing all thosethings.
So that's why you feel like aburden or you feel loss or
you're lacking, but you'rereally not.
You're transitioning, like yousaid, and that's where I talk
about turn the page and youturned into gratitude, and
gratitude is a very powerfultool.
There are so many things.
If you're alive, you havesomething to be grateful for.
(48:50):
You just you do.
There's anything that you canlook around.
It can be a family member, itcan be a friend, it can be a job
, it can be the blue sky thatyou're looking at, even though
you're all alone, and be likewow, it's actually a really nice
sunny day.
So gratitude is a powerful tooland I try and teach people and
I think you're preaching thesame thing, because the truth is
(49:11):
the truth.
You've got to turn that page inyour head, stop being stuck and
reach out to others.
They'll tell you you're not aburden and then switch that role
where okay, say I did dosomething stupid and take a
permanent solution to somethingthat's temporary.
How would my daughter feel?
How would my friend feel?
(49:32):
How would people at work feel?
All the you know what?
You're not a burden to thesepeople.
You're really not.
You're more of a burden if youleave because now they got to
deal with all that stress, theloss and estate things, and I've
lost both my parents, andlosing someone is not easy.
So don't burden people withthat.
And you are loved.
(49:52):
So shift your mind, get offthat you're a burden and go to
gratitude, go to love, go tofriends and really change your
perspective.
It's so powerful and thank you,mark, for sharing that story.
It was a very emotional.
I felt it.
I got goosebumps a couple times.
I think I still do, but peopledon't understand that.
(50:15):
And more power to you.
I'm proud of you, brother, forbeing able to share that,
because a lot of people holdthat in, like you said, special
operators.
We'd love to shoulder theburden.
I'll just deal with it.
I don't even talk about myself,you know.
Yeah, I wrote the book theAsset Mindset on positivity and
thinking like an elite specialforces soldier.
(50:36):
But you know what?
I struggle at times.
I wake up tired or I'm achy andsore I tore.
At times I wake up tired or I'machy and sore.
I tore my shoulder.
We all have it.
It's part of the humancondition.
So suck it up, drive on andsurround yourself with good
people.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Yeah, because you know, when people feel like a
burden and they were highperformers they think because
they're not performing in thesame way with the same level of
expertise that they thinkthey're failing.
But you're, and the specialoperations community, you're 50,
(51:11):
as everybody else is 80 to 90.
You know, and they've taught usso much and our teammates have
taught us so much, and how weapproach life and approach
problems is so unique.
And just apply that to what'snext.
Because you're special, becausethe way you think is special,
(51:36):
they can teach anybody to dowhat we did.
The intangible was hey, how doyou solve this very specific
problem in dynamic ways thatsomebody else would be like I
never even thought about that?
It's like you didn't thinkabout that.
Why not?
You know, um, instead of youknow, if you're taking fire from
direct and like the marines,like charge that hill, special
(51:57):
operators were like why don't Ijust go around the back?
You know simple solution, butyou know you've trained and
thrived in that environment forso long that you just have to
redirect it, because solvingproblems is what we did,
dynamically solving problems andaccomplishing impossible tasks
(52:21):
was our normal.
So we just have to re-engageand say, okay, I need to refocus
this because I'm not goingdownrange anymore.
But my new downrange is thisnew job that I'm not a subject
matter expert at anymore.
Or I'm living in a part of thecountry that I wasn't planning
on living in and, like I said, Iliked the two aspects of Los
Angeles when I wasn't planningon living in and, like like I
(52:42):
said, I liked the two aspects ofLos Angeles when I first got
there and for the first year Iwas coming out on final approach
, coming back from Virginiaseeing my family, I was like God
back in LA and I just look atthe place.
I'm just like, okay, but thenafter a year I'm coming in on
final place.
I'm just like, okay, but thenafter a year I'm coming in on a
final approach and I'm like, ohman, I'm back and I'm like, wait
(53:06):
, no, I'm supposed to hate thisplace, I'm only here temporarily
, right.
And then once I started torealize how cool of a place it
was as weird as LA is it was theabsolute best place for me.
As weird as that sounds,because I wasn't in the
entertainment rat race, right, Iwas at a university, surrounded
by a bunch of cool people doinga bunch of cool stuff, and I
(53:28):
was right in the center of itand it was then.
Then the whole city juststarted to look differently and
the way I approached it lookeddifferent because I was grateful
for where I was and everythingabout me just always comes back
to gratitude.
Right, I was in buds and, ashard as each day was, I'd look
around.
It's like I'm in San Diego, thesun's bright and I'm going
(53:54):
through the toughest training inthe world, but what's the
better part of that?
I'm working out on the beachwith my best friends.
I was like, huh, okay, well,that's easy and that was, that
was my mindset.
And going through with, likeSean, uh, andy stump, you know,
jack, car, Like.
These are all my buddies andI'm on the beach working out in
(54:16):
San Diego with my boys.
What could be better than that?
Speaker 1 (54:19):
You know, with my boys, what could be better than
that?
You know absolutely as a youngman that's like that's an
ultimate highlight.
Yeah, it sucks, but look whoI'm with.
Speaker 2 (54:26):
Look to my left and my right.
Yeah, we're all miserable, butwe all find something to laugh
about.
I mean the fact that most 90percent of the class you're in,
I think you're going throughselection.
There's always something funnyhappening in the midst of all
the chaos.
Somebody's doing something orsomebody's getting caught doing
something, and it's the funniestshit.
(54:48):
And those of us who make it, wejust have this weird sense of
humor and we turn this shittysituation into something funny
and enjoyable.
That you know periods of ofembracing the suck, but for the
most part of of embracing thesuck, but for the most part
you're embracing the stuff withyour boys.
What could be better?
Speaker 1 (55:06):
than that.
And I think another thing weshould touch on real quick here
too, and this applies totransitions and like going
through selection, going throughbuds, going to school, any
there's seasons in life.
Don't beat yourself up whenseasons in your life change.
Do you get mad at winterbecause winter comes and it's
going to be cold?
(55:26):
Do you get mad, you know, atspring showers, like it's just a
part of life?
There's seasons in your life asa human being.
Understand that.
Speaker 2 (55:37):
And prep for it.
You don't show up in summerclothes in the wintertime.
You're like, well, it's ourfall, I've got to pull out my
fall line up of boots andthicker jeans and flannels.
You prep for life.
That's happening and thetransitions and the changes, and
being seasonal is the samething.
It's like, okay, I can't dresslike in Minnesota in December,
(56:00):
like I am at the beach right now.
And and June prep for lifebecause you know what you need
to do.
Just just prepare yourself forit in any way you can.
Speaker 1 (56:09):
That's wonderful and I love how you said prep.
So, before we wrap it up,because this has been a great
episode and I can't get over, anhour has already gone by,
that's when you know we're,we're vibing brother.
It's real and I know listenershear that.
Right, you all know out therewhat we're saying is real and
(56:30):
it's the truth, and please don'tforget to go in and like and
subscribe and share.
But before we go, I'm going toask you if you could pass on
just one mindset principle tosomeone who feels completely
lost right now.
What would it be and why theprinciple?
Speaker 2 (56:47):
I would pass on is that you have the attributes to
succeed.
You just now have to look andsay, okay, how do I build upon
what I have so I can continue tobe successful?
Is that listen to a podcast?
(57:07):
Is that researching?
It's like, hey, hey, I am, Iwas great at this one thing.
What can I do to one?
Translate that into what's next?
And then, how do I translatethat into the language of where
I'm going?
Like I could say I was a sniperfor most of my career.
(57:30):
I can't go on a job interviewand say, and by the way, I was a
sniper and they're like that'sgreat.
However, you know you're taskoriented, you work well alone
and you work in teams well, yousee the big picture and you know
how to collaborate.
Fortune 500 company likes thoseattributes.
(57:53):
So, even though you're saying,even though sniper doesn't
really translate everything ittook to become a sniper does so,
whatever your next endeavor is,if it's sports, if it's school
or going into the military,those experiences just bring out
those attributes.
You go to boot camp.
(58:14):
You may have never had to bedisciplined your whole life, but
they're going to get it out ofyou.
You know, and they're going toget it out of you.
You know, and they're going tochange your mindset and you're
going to break through barriersthat you didn't think that you,
or you're going to discoverthings about yourself that you
didn't think were there.
They're just.
They're there, they're justlatent.
You just need the rightopportunity or the right
environment to bring thosethings out.
(58:35):
So you know, prep for whatyou're doing, understand the
(58:58):
environment, what you're goinginto and just be prepared for it
, because you're going to buds,going to college, whatever
you're doing, you know there'ssomething that preps you to say,
okay, hey, you've earned theright to do this, so now take
advantage of your opportunityand prepare yourself for what's
next.
(59:20):
You know we had 166 guys whostarted our class.
Everybody had what it took toget there, but either people
didn't prepare themselves forwhat they were getting
themselves into or they let thesituation overwhelm them and the
guys who made it throughfigured out a way to let the
(59:42):
environment bring out theattributes that helped them to
succeed.
And for some people, buds wasthe wrong environment to pull
out those attributes.
But something else you'reinterested in, having gone
through that experience andmaybe you didn't pass it, but
you discover things in yourself,yourself and you're like, wow,
I didn't even know I could dothat.
(01:00:02):
But now I can translate thatinto what's coming up next, be
it whatever it is.
And you know, rich Devaneywrote that book, the Attributes
and you have so manycapabilities that we rarely tap
into and you and I got toexperience that at some of the
highest levels because we madethat choice.
But, um, now just findsomething you love and just go
(01:00:27):
all in, um, but don't go in byyourself because, um, your team
may be a team of two or a teamof ten.
Every day at buds, I relied onsomebody else to help me get
through that course.
Be a senior Chief, mink or someguy who ran in front of me when
I was Jonas Kelsall ran infront of me because I was having
(01:00:50):
a bad day, right, and I wasn'tsmiling that day, and he's like
dude, what's the matter?
I was like Jonas, I suck.
Today we have afour-mile-a-half stand time
running.
I'm not going to make it.
So he said, okay, here's whatwe're going to do.
I was 25, he was 18.
He's like here's what we'regoing to do.
You're going to run right behindme and the way I'm going to
step in the sand.
(01:01:11):
I'm going to make it a littlebit easier for you to run.
He's like don't even look up.
And here this 18-year-old kidwas like hey, mark, I got you
and I didn't look up for fourmiles.
I just ran wherever he steppedand all of a sudden I was done
with it and I knew I couldn'tmake it.
(01:01:31):
I just didn't have it that dayand I just relied on a teammate
and I didn't even ask him.
He just saw that something waswrong and he's like you know,
here's how we're going to getyou through this today.
18-year-old kid, he taught me ahuge lesson that day that, no
matter your age, when you needhelp and you're in the right
(01:01:54):
environment, you know help isgoing to show up and it's going
to help you thrive.
So if you have that a choicelike that where somebody's
helped you which, looking backon life, somebody has, you know,
just pay it forward, you know,and help somebody out who's
struggling, which I think thispodcast is doing your book is
(01:02:16):
done, denny does.
Hopefully my book is doing andDenny does, hopefully my book is
doing, because you have peoplewho genuinely care about you as
an individual and you as acontributor to society.
Speaker 1 (01:02:35):
And just as a human, you know, I see remarkable
people every day.
Well said, and I'm just goingto add a little to that Surround
yourself with good people ingood environments.
I'm just going to add a littleto that.
Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
Surround yourself with good people in good
environments.
Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
It's so important.
And please check out MarkGreen's Unsealed book, A Navy
Seal's Guide to Mastering Life'sTransitions Great book, a lot
of stuff.
And if you're out there, you'regoing to transition in life
because you're a human being andwe all do it.
The struggle is real.
Embrace the suck.
Thank you again, Mark, forcoming on the Asset Mindset
(01:03:04):
podcast.
It's been an absolute pleasure.
I thank you for sharing yourstories.
You're a great man.
Keep doing the great work thatyou're doing.
Super appreciate it and, ofcourse, all of you out there
listening.
Don't forget to like, subscribeand share this with someone you
think needs to hear it and,more than anything else, make
sure you own your power.
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