Creating Authentic B2B Brand Communications with Jimi Gibson, VP at Thrive Agency

Episode Transcript
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Linda Fanaras (00:00):
Welcome to the B2B Brand 180 Podcast where we
will discuss branding andmarketing tools for business.
My goal today is to help youwith transformative, innovative
approaches that can help youmake 180 degree shift in your
marketing efforts, or actuallycomplete reversals in brand
strategy.
Hi, I am Linda Fanaras and I'mthe owner of Millennium Agency,

(00:21):
a branding and growth strategyfirm, and the host of the B2B
Brand 180 Podcast.
Today I am bringing in JimmyGibson from the Thrive Agency.
To give you a little bit ofbackground about Jimmy, Jimmy
has been helping businessesfigure out what to say and how
to say it so people actuallylisten and take action.

(00:41):
And he's the VP of BrandCommunications at Thrive Agency.
A TEDx speaker and a ForbesAgency council member.
And before all that, he was aprofessional magician.
So we'll get into some fun stufftoday.
So, which actually that makes aweird amount of sense once you
hear about how he thinks aboutmessaging.
So he created something calledthe Magic Script, which we'll

(01:03):
talk a little bit about today.
It's a framework that helps.
Brands connect with people inreal human way, and he's one of
those rare folks who can makemarketing feel less like noise
and make it feel more like aconversation worth having.
Jimmy also wrote a book calledHow to Move From the Magician to
the Marketer Out of the Box, andhe'll talk a little bit about
that later.

(01:24):
So welcome, Jimmy.
Thanks for joining me today.

Jimi Gibson (01:27):
Hi, Linda.
It's great to have

you.
Yeah, thank you.
Go ahead.

Thank you.
Yeah.

Absolutely looking forward to having you
teach us about marketing andsome of your magical acts here.
So, like we just talked about,you used to be a magician, so
I'd love for you to break downfor the audience how do you
actually break down a trick andwhat does that teach us about
building a message that actuallylands in business?

Yeah, well I think the best way to go about that is
to have a little experiential,exercise here.
So I'll just ask you a couple ofquestions and we'll see where it
goes.
Okay.
Is that fair?

That sounds like a plan.

Alright, so Linda, where are you located?
I'm in Charleston, SouthCarolina.
And I forgot where you are.

I'm in Boston.

Oh, Boston.
And so if I look at thebackground, are you in an
office?
Are you in your home office?
Where are you?

I am in a home.
Yeah.
Okay,

great.
And is this a condo?
Are you in a neighborhood?
Do you have streets that you'reable to get out and take a walk
on?

Well, just backing up a little bit, right
now I'm in New Hampshire, butI'm usually from Boston.
So, right.
I do have streets where I am andit is a home.
So I am in New

Hampshire.
Okay.
So in New Hampshire.
So we took a little time awayfrom the home and maybe a little
change of scenery.
Have you been able to take somewalks while you've been in New
Hampshire?

I do.
From time to time.
Not a lot.
Okay.

Well, let's take a little walk.
Maybe you have a route that youlike.
I'd like you to take a littlebit different route right now,
and maybe the audience listeningcan sort of picture in their
mind's eye a similar, walk intheir neighborhood or wherever
they are.
And I just want you to, now ifthe details are kind of fuzzy,
just kind of go with it.

(03:07):
But I want you to sort of walkout onto the ground floor and
choose a direction to go.
And we're gonna walk down thestreet where some houses are.
Have you got a location in mind?

I do.

Good.
Well, you know, sometimes whenyou take a walk, there's like
these houses that you alwayssee, but sometimes there's ones
where you're like, wow, I'vereally never noticed they
haven't cut their grass in awhile, or they've painted their
house.
Did they just paint it?
I didn't notice that.
I just want you to pick out oneof those houses that maybe
you're not as familiar with.
Have you got one?
Okay, so you're gonna standwhether you're in the street or

(03:42):
on a sidewalk, it doesn'tmatter.
You're gonna look at the frontdoor of that house and there's
interesting scene that's goingon.
I'm gonna give you a couple ofoptions to think about.
And the first option is that thefront door is wide open.
And as you look at the frontdoor, you can kind of peek
around and like, there's thisstick leaned up against the
wall, inside that front door,and you're thinking, that's kind

(04:03):
of weird.
it's not like a golf club.
it's kind of a stick, maybe likean old fashioned club that you
would use and you're thinking,wow, I hope nothing's wrong.
I hope nobody used that to bustin the door and they're being
robbed.
So think about that.
The next scenario is that frontdoor is open, but it's just kind

(04:23):
of a warm feeling that, you getthis idea that they're having a
get together with family andfriends and they've just left
the door open because you knowit's a safe neighborhood and
they know that the group that'scoming in is just gonna walk in
the door and head to the backporch and, they're gonna start
to enjoy refreshments andconversations.
So that's another option.

(04:43):
The next option is as you standthere and look, the front door
is open again, but there's thisshovel leaned up against a tree
and you look around and you seethese holes that have been dug
in the yard, and you're like,wow, that's really weird.
Either they're like a reallyfrantic gardener and they've
gone to get some plants to putin these holes.
Or there's something reallystrange going on.

(05:05):
I'm not sure what it is.
So that's the third option.
And then the last option is, youknow, this is a really cool time
of day.
They called it the golden hour,where the light is just in the
right place and you're sort oflooking in.
On that scene and the light issort of bouncing off that front
entryway.
The door is open again, and wow,that floor is just beautiful.

(05:28):
It's like sparkling likediamonds, and it just gives you
a cool feeling.
So there's four options for you.
It doesn't matter which one youpick, there's no wrong answer.
The first one is that stickleaning up against the wall.
The next one is, you know, thedoor is open, welcoming family
and friends.
The next one is the shovelleaned up against the tree, and
the next one is the floor isjust sparkling.

(05:50):
Did one of those kind ofresonate with you more than any
of the others?

Yeah, I would say so.
First one.

Oh, the first one with the stick leaned up against
the wall.
Yeah.
Well, you're kind of a curiousperson, and so you start to
approach that front porch andthere's actually 13 steps that
go from the ground up to thatfront porch.
Which step do you get to beforesomebody yells out, Hey, what
are you doing?

Probably the top step.

Oh, number 13.
Wow.
Okay, so you're a go-getter.
Well, I don't know if you sawthis or not, but behind me
there's been a deck of cardssitting on that table right
there.
And so if I bring this deck ofcards around and I start to

(06:38):
retell that story, there was astick, and I mentioned the word
club at one point.
That's a club.
The next one was a heart,because people were welcoming
family and friends.
The shovel leaned up against atree was the spade.

Right?

Another word for a shovel.
And then I mentioned that thefloor was sparkling like
diamonds.
And so diamonds obviously thediamond suit.
Now I said there were 13 stepsand if we use ace as one and you
said you got to the 13th step.
So that would be the last cardif we do ace is low, which would
be king.

(07:16):
So just through the process oftelling the story, you actually
didn't realize you were choosingthe King of Clubs.
And so, I actually did somethingkind of strange with this deck
of cards, and I'll keep it inview here.

(07:38):
I'll just run through thesecards.
Oh, almost at the end here,there appears to be one card
that's turned over.
And if I pulled that card out,made sure we were in focus.
That would be really weird ifthat was the King of Clubs.

That's interesting.
What a great trick.

So some of the audience may have been thinking
about a little bit differentstory.
They may have ended up on acompletely different step Or a
completely different scene.
And so when we talk about amarketing message, the illusion
that I just performed to you isthe exact structure of how we
should treat a marketingmessage.
Would you like to break thatdown?
I'd

love to hear that.

Okay.
So the first part of anymarketing message is that
connection point.
And so as we started to talk, Ijust was asking you questions.
I was genuinely curious aboutwhere you were.
We started out in Boston andthen we moved to New Hampshire.
We talked about an interestingstreet that you walk down.
You know, the Theater of theMind is a great place to

(08:48):
experience creativity.
And so, you were smiling alittle bit as you were talking,
I could see you were thinkingabout which road am I gonna turn
down?
That type of thing.
And so now I've opened up theopportunity, to move to the next
stage.
But when we're in that point ofconnection, that's actually a
release of oxytocin in thebrain.
And that release of oxytocin islike kind the feel good.

(09:10):
Hey, this is going well.
I kinda like this conversation.
And that starts to open up thattrust.
But now we need to move intocuriosity because we want to
have people lean in.
Like in a theater, you talkabout sitting on the edge of
your seat, right?
So that's a theatrical termbecause you're not checking your
phone, you're not talking to theperson beside you.

(09:31):
You're genuinely curious aboutwhat's gonna happen.
And so, when I started to takeyou down that street And
describe those differentscenarios.
It probably was a little bitstrange.
Tell me what you were feeling aswe were going through those
various scenarios.

Yeah.
No, I was walking down thestreet as trying to determine
like what home to choose and

Right.

Sort of the setting of that home an the
persona that it has and maybe.

And then as I started to talk through like the
door opened Yeah.
Club and

yeah, it could be any one of those scenarios
depending on the home that Ipicked.
Almost from a sense.

Yeah.
But you were engaged and youwere sort of thinking through
the options and Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.
So, that's all about curiosity,right?
Right.
And so that's actually a releaseof dopamine.
And so we hear about dopaminewith social media addiction.
It's not actually the addictionto social media, it's the
expectation of a reward.

And

so when you post something on social media,
you're looking for somebody tolike it, to share it, to comment
on it.
Right.
And so as I was going throughthose different scenarios, and
the folks who were listening mayhave experienced that as well,
you're like.
What is this crazy guy talkingabout?
This is like really strange.
And so there's a point wherethat can stretch out too long
and you get bored, right?

(10:44):
Because there's no closure,right?
So I have to kind of gauge andread the room and know, okay,
I've gotta move to theconclusion here.
And so that dopamine requiresthe reward of the climax of the
trick.
And so now I need to bring itall together.
Reveal the fact that you didn'teven know you were picking a

(11:05):
card.
Right?
And then when I turn the cardover and it happens to match the
one that you had selectedunknowingly, then that's a
release of serotonin, which islike, Oh my gosh.
Okay.
This all makes sense.
Everything is right with theworld, and that's the call to
action or the conversion thathappens, right?
Right.
And so those three stages ofconnection, curiosity, and

(11:28):
conversion

are

simply mimicked.
From a magic trick that I justperformed into a marketing
message.
Okay.
If we skip any of those, then itdoesn't feel complete, right?
We've probably all beeninvolved, especially on
LinkedIn, where somebody wantsto connect with you.
Interesting that they call thata connection request.
And then you go, okay, well I'lllook at their background a

(11:50):
little bit.
And I go, sure.
And then immediately you're gethit with a sales pitch, right?
And so, right.
They have not respected theconnection to the point Where
you feel comfortable, they havenot elicited any curiosity.
And they immediately go for theconversion of the close, and
that's very repelling.

(12:11):
And so, it's good to have thissequence in your head and it
typically needs to happen inthis order.
And it doesn't matter if it's asocial media post, if it's a
sales conversation, if it's theway you answer the phone.
That's the way it should be.
And yeah, so hopefully that wasclear enough.
That's helpful.
No, explains the sequence.
Yeah,

Now that makes sense.
I think the sequence of eventsmakes it simple and it makes it
clear and understandable, sothat's great.
So I did have a question.
So in the past you've said thatmost speakers and marketers lose
the audience in the first 10seconds, and we just chatted
about that a little bit.
If you get distracted, what is abusiness version of a strong,
like opening a line that mightresonate?

(12:52):
Maybe it's a homepage, it couldbe a pitch deck, it could be
just introducing yourself in acold call meeting.
How would you think about thatparticular moment?

Yeah, so it's typically, the person speaking
about themselves or theirproduct or their service, and
they think that's what peoplewant to hear, but what they
actually want to hear is.
Do you know who I am?
Do you know what my pain?
Do you know what my problem is?
Do you know what I'm seeking?
Because we all love to have thatconnection and to be able to

(13:22):
talk about ourselves and to knowthat person hears us and
understands us, and that's thebiggest thing that we see in any
type of communication.

Right.
That's good.
So with magic, there's alwaysthat big reveal.
So do you try to create thatsame level of curiosity in the
sales process or campaign, andthen how do you do that in
coming up with that sort of bigreveal at the end without really
giving things away too soon?
Yeah.
Is there a strategy that youuse?

Yeah, and I think, the most direct relationship to
that would be like a productlaunch or a new service launch,
because that has a naturalfeeling of a reveal, right?
But I think it can happen in asoft way or it can happen in a
bold way.
So let me just use a plumbingexample.
So a plumbing example, insteadof leading with, Hey, we've got
a$99 inspection coupon, call usup and schedule an appointment.

(14:13):
Okay?
That's what everybody's saying.
Instead you say, Hey, we knowplumbing problems always happen
when you're trying to run outthe door, or when family is
visiting for the weekend, andyou go, wow, yeah, that's
happened to me.
What if I could guarantee thatyou would never have to deal
with a plumbing problem again?
Right.
Okay.
So I've opened up curiosity.

(14:34):
I'm going, how is that possible?
Are you gonna have someonesitting on my front porch?

Well,

actually we have a 20 point pipe inspection that we
will come out.
We will inspect a guarantee thatif we do this regular checkup,
you will not have any plumbingproblems.
Would you like to come out anddo our 20 point inspection?
Well, that's a very soft, bigreveal.
Right, right, right.
I've made a connection.
I've gotten you curious about apotential solution that you

(14:59):
didn't think about before, andthen I've naturally led into
inviting myself into your home.
In a way that is like a bigreveal.
Right?
Right.
And so again, we go back to thatsequence of events.

So that's also trying to keep the attention of
there.
I mean, it seems like whenyou're integrating them into the
story.
Absolutely.
Obviously in that case, that'swhen you're able to keep them
through that entire process,like guiding them through that
process and keeping themengaged.

Absolutely.

Are there any other tactics that you might use
around that?

I would say the more you know about your
particular client or idealtarget market, we hear the term
ICP or Ideal Client Profile.
The more directly you're gonnabe able to speak to them and
know them,

right?

And so.
I'm sitting with you right nowand I'm looking across a screen
and I see the background and soforth, and so there's some
contextual clues, but if youdon't have those and you're
putting something out withoutthe ability to see them, you
should know what their painsare, what keeps them up late at
night, and be able to speakspecifically to them without
jargon as if you're sittingacross the table enjoying a cup

(16:07):
of coffee.

Yeah.
No, that's good.
That's good.
So you've got this thing calledthe Magic Script.
Is that what that is?
Or is that the breakdown thatyou provided, is there more
detail that you can share aroundthat Magic Script?

Sure.
Yeah.
And I basically demonstratedwhat that looks like.
But the missing component thatwe didn't talk about was if you
boil down every magic trick.
It basically comes to 13 effectsthat you can create.
Okay.
So you can make somethingvanish, you can make something
appear, you can make somethingtransform into another object,

(16:41):
that type of thing, mindreading.
And so you have to be clear onwhat magic you want to perform
for your customer.

And I've

tried to break it and I can't figure out any
situation where one of those 13doesn't apply to something that
you're trying to do for youraudience.
And I think what happens is whenyou decide what it is you want
to do Then that focuses yourconversation on one thing.
And so, right.
The example of the plumber, alot of plumbers would use

(17:13):
vanish.
Right.
I'm gonna help your cloggeddrain disappear.
Right.
But I actually reframed it intoa predicting the future.
Right.
I'm saying I'm predicting in thefuture that you're never gonna
have any clogged drains anymore.
And that completely flips thescript.
And because what are peopleworried about?
They can't see their pipes.
They don't know if a clog iscoming today, tomorrow, or next

(17:35):
week.
And so if I can get that comfortto know that I don't have to
worry about what the futureholds, and I have this person
who's predicting that it's nevergonna be a disaster, that's a
totally different place to havea conversation with a prospect
or a client.

Yep, yep.
No, that's great.
That's helpful.
So as far as marketers areconcerned, what's one mistake
you see marketers make all thetime that a magician would
actually never make on stage?
And how do you think they couldfix it?
Is it about timing, attention,trying too hard?

Wow, those are all good ones.
I would say marketing is alittle bit of a performance.
You have to do things backstageand often you ruin it by showing
too much about what's backstage.

And

you sort of lose the mystery of what's going on.
A customer doesn't wanna knowhow you get to the final
solution.
All they wanna know is what isthe fastest, most frictionless
way that I can get from my painto wow.

Right.

And if you can simplify your message, be clear,
not clever, and not feel likeyou have to tell them
everything, you're gonna have amuch better and a smoother path
to a conversion.

Great.
Awesome.
I guess my last question is, whydo you think magic is such a
good teacher for marketers?

Well, you know, it's kind of that cliche thing.
Can't you just wave your wandand make it all disappear?
Can't you just pull that outtayour hat like a rabbit?
There's a lot of metaphors and Ithink we all are curious and
amazed at something.
That happens without any waythat it's possible to happen in
the physical world.

Right.

And, when you get into delivering a service or
having a product that's amazing.
I mean, obviously the firstrenditions of a lot of the Apple
products seem like magic.
Right.
if you can provide that wonderand amazement, it can boost your
referrals.
If you have customer service andyou want a magical customer
service experience wheneverybody else is just dialing

(19:46):
it in with a frowny face, youcan just go a little bit above
that, it feels like magicbecause you feel important.
You feel like you are on a stageand you're like, why am I so
special?
This is amazing.
And then what are you gonna do?
Yeah.
You're gonna leave thatexperience.
You're gonna go, you're notgonna believe what just happened
at this place.

Right.

I think if we can get ourselves in the mind of joy
and wonder, then that's a greatplace as a filter for how we
wanna deliver service or createproducts.

Yeah.
No, that's great.
And you've actually written abook, I believe it's called
Chasing Carrots.
Is that correct?
I have.

Yep.
You wanna share a little bit

about that?
Yeah, go ahead.
So the

book is called Chasing Carrots
Your Purpose If You Were Born toLove Bananas, and it's really
about this monkey who got sobusy chasing carrots that he
forgot.
He was a monkey.
And he actually stars in a magicshow as the rabbit.
He wears little rabbit ears andhe chased so many carrots.
He forgot that he was actually amonkey.

(20:45):
And so it's sort of an allegoryabout how you can try to please
the world, but if you ownexactly who you are, you should
be proud of that.
And you should immerse yourselfin exactly what your quirks are,
what your personality is.
Then you're gonna be successful.
You're gonna draw the clientsthat you want, you're going to

(21:07):
have a happier life.
And so there are seven lessonsin there and they involve, how
important is your name?
Do you have a good reputation, abad reputation?
What is your relationship withtime?
What are the things that, ifit's not about the money that
you would be pursuing?
Right.
And so, yeah, it's kind of thelessons of my life and, just

(21:28):
wanted to pass those on in astory format.

That's awesome.
That's great.
Well, thank you.
So thanks Jimmy.
I appreciate your time and forsharing all your insights with
our audience.
I'd love for you to share howpeople can get in touch with
you.

Yeah, so I'm on LinkedIn.
I post something every day and,would love for people to connect
with me there and comment and,send me a message if you wanna
chat about something.
And then ThriveAgency.com is thewebsite for Thrive Internet
Marketing Agency, and, lots ofresources there.
I write a blog every month,followed with a 20 minute video

(22:02):
about some concept in marketing.
And, yeah.
So, if anybody wants to connectand has any questions about
Thrive Agency, I'd be happy tohelp them out.

Great.
Okay, so you heard it right fromJimmy.
If you wanna connect with himdirectly, feel free to reach
out.
And I just wanna thank you forlistening in today.
My name is Linda Fanaras and Iam the host of the B2B Brand 180
Podcast.
And thank you again forlistening.

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