August 18, 2025 • 59 mins
#gatormcalister #dutchmantell #iwamidsouth #gmbmpw
Welcome to Episode 12 of the Best Of jamesrockstreet Productions! Home to the Give Me Back My Pro Wrestling and Live and In Color with Wolfie D podcasts, Sheik's Shorts and more! So, sit back and enjoy as we bring you some of the very best stories, you'll never hear anywhere else! @GMBMPW @livewolfied @jamesrockstreet Everywhere!
Today we bring you the first half of episode 40 of Give Me Back My Pro Wrestling with Gator McAlister! We talk his start in the business, his early days, training with Dutch, working in IWA Mid South, being in the same locker room in Puerto Rico as Invader and so much more! Enjoy!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hey, this is Gator McAllister and you're listening to Give Me
Back My Pro Wrestling. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to
Give Me Back My Pro Wrestling. Hello, Said.
(00:43):
Oh, no, now you know, baby, thisis hot Rod Bigs, Jared, Jimmy
St. We're going to take them to the
limit One more time, baby. Right here.
Oh, give me back my pro wrestling.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome one more time to the Give Me
Back my Pro Wrestling podcast. And as always, I'm here with my
brother from the same father andmother, the Plastic Sheet, Jared
(01:05):
St. What's up brother?
How you doing? Not much man, just living life
and working and doing this man just love doing this with you.
Yeah. Are you in a repeat cycle
sometimes like me, Like I feel. Dude, sometimes I feel like life
just is like so crammed full of things I don't know what to.
(01:26):
I don't know if I have any time sometimes.
Yeah, like why do we do this to ourselves?
Why do we cram so much stuff? Yeah, in our lives.
But then if I didn't I would just be lazy or something.
So I mean. I know, I know.
Probably some of it's to do withthe kids and other parts of it's
just to do with work and things like that.
Yeah. Makes.
(01:46):
Sense it's summertime so you're going here, going there, stuff
like that so. Yeah, that's about it, man.
That's about it. So anyway, to kind of go to in a
totally different direction, we do have a cool guest today as
y'all saw on the promotional posts on our social media
platforms that we have the man Gator McAllister here.
(02:07):
And I, you know, I just can't wait to hear.
I mean, I've been researched andhis stuff and honestly, brothers
done a lot. I think we're going to have a
fun time with him. I I I really do.
Yeah, man, it's, it's a he's gota great name too, Gator
McAllister. I mean, like, I hope we get in
more of some of the the origins of that name and kind of learn
some of that and yeah, ask what we'll ask him about that and see
(02:28):
how that came about. But that's that's an awesome
name. That's you don't.
Sometimes you get some bland names, but you got something
like that's pretty. Yeah, yeah, I mean, you got
names like Hot Rod Biggs. I love that name, Gator
McAllister. You know what I'm saying?
Like a lot of these guys have some great names, but when it
(02:49):
comes down to it, you know, Gator might be one of the best.
Absolutely. You know that It's funny.
He's such a good dude, though. That's what's crazy is I just
remember every time, like, you know, he kind of looks like, you
know, like a like he would be gruff or have like a a gruff
demeanor. But honestly, when you.
Talk to him, he just like smilesand laughs and.
(03:09):
And just has a good time. He's just, it's just his
exterior. He's, he's actually a, you know,
a really funny, nice guy on the inside.
So anyway, Gator's going to be awesome.
I can't wait to have him on. I can't wait to talk all about
his career. Lots of cool stuff, man.
Seriously, part of my love of doing what we do is the research
(03:31):
on these guys and actually hearing the full story with
these dudes. Because, man, sometimes you
uncover like pearls you know, orgems you know.
Yeah, and there's always something we found out from
these guys that, you know, we didn't know.
I think it was Quentin was one. He's like, do y'all want to know
the full truth? We're like, yeah, we don't want
to know the full truth. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
(03:53):
We want to hear it. Yeah.
Being honest, yeah. So we always, we always seem to
dig up a Pearl somehow. And it's not even, it's not even
like kind of like we're even trying for them.
They just happen though, so. Yeah, yeah, that's true.
It's true. You know, Speaking of past guest
episodes, I like the segue seguethere.
Yeah, Yeah, it's nice. So First off, we had Doug
(04:14):
Markham, man, Doug's awesome number.
I mean, he's, I think he's already, he's already passed so
many people. If I'm not mistaken he's like
7th or 8th in the rankings now so.
Yeah, man, I mean he and I knew he.
A lot of the listeners would listen to him.
Of course, our normal listeners would listen, but I do believe
(04:34):
he pulled in some other people and that's very appreciative.
Thank you, Doug. I know you're listening,
brother. Super appreciative of that.
Your show's doing great. We're proud to have you on and
really, it means a lot. Yeah, man, it was great when I
enjoyed so much talking to Doug and I was going to give him a
shout out, man. You see him on Facebook, he's
sharing their stuff. He shares and and he supports
(04:55):
small businesses a lot. And that that's awesome.
I see on his Facebook you like, as always sharing stuff like
that. So that's always, that's always
killer to me when somebody's doing that because it, it shows
that they're, they're, they're adown, down home type of guy.
They and they like to help the little guy and that's, that's
always important. But man, yeah, he, he's such a
good guest and it's so many goodstories and it was great to hear
(05:18):
it. And man, I'm loving the plunky
and crawl episode, the special episode you had, you know, I
hate I couldn't be in on that. But it kind of worked out what
timing that I couldn't be in. And you know, it kind of made
more sense for it to just be 1 interviewer instead of 2 with
with him telling the story and everything like that.
But. Yeah, I mean, Crawl doesn't need
any other people talking. But now Crawl had such a story
(05:39):
to let out, and I appreciate that you enjoyed that one.
But Crawl had such a story to say.
I mean, it really felt like Plunky and I were interviewing
Crawl in a way, you know? And it was, but it was funny
because I wanted to hear Plunky perspective.
One of my favorite parts was going back and listening to the
Tracy Smothers excerpts when he was talking to Plunky about,
hey, man, you got to get ready. You know, these guys will eat
(06:01):
you alive if you let them. You know, just added such a
layer of reality to it that honestly, I think put it over
the edge for me. Of course, I'm friends with
Plunky. Was friends with him at the time
I was pulling for him. I remember it so vividly now,
how much it was so important andreally seemed like a really big
thing was happening. And so, you know, it was cool to
(06:22):
see that and relive that. Then to hear all the grimy
details from what happened and what went on from Kroll.
Kind of finalized the story a bit.
You know, it's just to me, man, I don't know, I'm glad that it
happened, but it seemed like it took almost more than it was
worth in a sense, you know, But that's the beauty of it is I
(06:45):
think when Crowell believes in something, Crowell will fight
for it. And that's that's proof right
there. That's proof that he will
absolutely fight for it. And yeah, man, I, you know, I do
know right now Crowell's in a bit of a battle for the
Nashville, the rights to his building in the Troubadour.
He's got that Coastal Championship Wrestling, which is
there's a Florida based promotion that's coming up to
(07:07):
Nashville and they had a venue and it fell through and they I
think they're going to be August18th and they're they're doing a
Friday night Coastal Championship Wrestling booked
the same building the 19th. So it's literally 2 nights of
wrestling. And if they're not related, it
just seems kind of dastardly. So he's got another fight on his
(07:29):
hands. Maybe that'll be a future
episode to hear the full story on that one.
But yeah, I don't know. But I'm glad you enjoyed that.
I've got some other ideas that we can do in the future that are
going to be fun. I've been talking to some of the
guys about possibilities on whatwe can do with that, those types
of episodes in the future. So if y'all enjoyed that, let us
(07:50):
know in the comments, you know, let us know on the socials.
But I think right now I think weneed to get old Gator McAllister
on here. What do you say?
Let's get it man, I can't wait. All right, we'll be right back
after these messages with more from Give Me Back My Pro
Wrestling. You a pro wrestling fan?
We'll stop by Captain's Corner where you can get autographed
(08:12):
photos, cards, magazines, and figures from all of your
favorite wrestling superstars ofthe past, present, and future.
You'll also be able to participate in live signings in
the weeks and months to come. Make sure to stop by Captain's
Corner on Facebook and give us aholler.
Remember, cheers to the working man.
(08:34):
All right, we are back with morefrom the Give Me Back My Pro
Wrestling podcast. And as promised, Jared, who do
we have today with my old buddy Gator McAllister.
Now, Gator is one of these guys that I guarantee you've seen
him. He's done everything.
He's had an amazing career and I'm excited to talk to him.
But as always, on every episode,we go to my brother, the plastic
(08:57):
Sheik for the very first question of the show.
Go ahead, Sheik. All right, Gator.
So this is the this is a question that I like to get out
of the way, let everybody know kind of your influences in
wrestling and just and just yourfandom in wrestling.
If you could list your top your,your Mount Rushmore, your top
four or five wrestlers all time that you're in your opinion,
what would that be? That one's a little hard,
(09:20):
honestly. I mean, where I grew up, grew up
on Memphis wrestling, I hadn't even seen or heard of WWF until
I was probably 12 years old. So I grew up on Memphis and I
grew up on the old N.W.A. So being my Mount Rushmore, my
top 4 would be Austin Idol. Yeah, I was a huge Austin Idol
(09:42):
fan. Dutch Mintel, of course.
Jerry Lawler and Rick, that's, you know, Ric Flair and an
honorable mention to Dusty Rose because those guys hate the
business. You know they take the way for
so many, so many. Wrestlers, absolutely.
Oh yeah, it's a great list. I mean, nobody can argue with
(10:04):
anything there. I mean absolutely when you when
you, when you, you could, you could tell your influence as
though your your area influencesand that and that's fine.
That's that's why we, that's whywe like to get these questions
out there and get it answered with, hey, you know, this is
this is this is what I was influenced by.
This is what I like to see. This is, you know, and some
(10:25):
people, you know, if we were talking to somebody in the
Northeast, they would be like, OK, well, Bruno, San Martino,
you know, this right here. And some.
Of those guys, yeah. Born and Adrian St.
Or not? Adrian St.
Adrian Adamus. Yeah, surely.
Portland Pass, you know. Yeah, maybe Lynn Denton or
somebody like that. And yeah, but Gator McAllister,
(10:47):
brother, how long has it been since we've seen each other?
I bet it's been 10 years. What are you up to these days,
brother? Actually I retired from
wrestling and got my CDL and went on the road as a big rig
truck driver. Yeah, dude, I thought I saw
that. And now I think you've done that
to take advantage of one thing, right?
(11:08):
Is you get to go to all these awesome conventions, right?
Absolutely. I, I spend a lot of my free time
going to like comic book conventions and horror
conventions and stuff like that.I'm just, I'm a big nerd, you
know? And yeah, we all.
And after spending any, after spending so many years on the
road wrestling the truck drivingis just natural because I'm on
(11:31):
the road, you know? Yeah, yeah.
It all kind of flows together. Dude, you're you're just born to
be a trucker because you're a wrestler.
Rick Reynolds does some of that,too.
I mean, it's everybody's riding.I love it.
So, yeah, that makes total sense.
Well, I tell you what. So we kind of talked about where
you are now and stuff. Let's go all the way back here.
So this is, you know, we get theMount Rushmore, then we talk a
(11:52):
little bit about what you're doing now.
But then we go all the way back to the very beginning, to the
days when you were just a littlebitty Gator.
OK, so in your younger days, where were you born?
Where were you born? Where did you go to high school?
I was actually born in a little small town just outside of
Evansville, IN called Linville. Was born there and literally the
(12:14):
next day was in Madisonville, KY.
So that's where I grew up, spentthe majority of my life in that
town and that little surroundingtowns around it.
Went to Madisonville N Hopkins High School which had like the
state football champions at one time and all that.
Got kicked out of public school and graduated from a private
(12:39):
Christian School of all places for me.
Yeah. So.
It wasn't. Bad, Yeah, it wasn't bad, you
know, and but I grew up watchingwrestling on TV and from I went
to my very first wrestling show when I was five years old, man
and it was at the local middle school there in Madisonville.
(13:00):
And the main event was Joel A Duke against Jerry Lawler.
OK, that tells me the time framethen.
OK, Yeah. Yeah.
And of. Course, Joe Leduc was doing the
gimmick back then where he wouldtie the straps around his arms,
pick 10 guys out of the crowd and have them try to separate
his arms and nobody ever could, you know?
(13:20):
But I'm I knew that night that that is what I wanted to do with
my life. I wanted to become a
professional wrestler. I didn't care how, I didn't care
where. I just knew that's what I wanted
to do. Yeah, yeah.
Would you say like Joe Leduc wasa bit of an influence or was it
more Jerry Lawler? It was more Lawler, Yeah.
(13:41):
I mean, it was. It was.
Great, because I can see some ofhim in your latter days.
You know what I'm saying? So anyway, go ahead.
That I've gotten that from people.
It was more Lawler just the way that the crowd gravitated toward
him. Of course, at the time he was
the big Memphis babyface, you know?
Yeah, totally. Yeah, everybody, you know, in
(14:03):
the, just like, just like Ricky Morton, you know, the way Lawler
sold and his facial expressions and everything.
I believed every single move andevery single thing that happened
that night. And it just, it hit me and like
a ton of bricks. And I was like, this is what I'm
going to grow up to be one day. And, you know, and I, I just, I
(14:25):
never went away from that. You know, I still, I still
vividly remember the match. That's awesome.
That's awesome. That's.
Been 100 years. AGO 100, maybe at least 100,
yeah, maybe 101. But Jerry Lawler was magic and
that he had that crowd in the palm of his hand every time he
went out there and he's still magic.
You know, I definitely consider him one of the greatest of all
(14:47):
time and nobody can argue that with me.
You know, I'm an adoptee of Memphis.
I grew up the Mid-Atlantic, you know, and but honestly, I love
Memphis. As soon as I started watching
it, it's just a different kind of vibe.
OK, so you're growing up and you're living wrestling now.
Who was your influence on likingright?
Who let you go watch wrestling? My great grandmother and my
(15:12):
great uncle, they were brother and sister.
They lived together, took care of each other.
Huge, huge wrestling things. OK, so.
You know, my mom, it was a big Michael Hayes fan.
And if it, if it wasn't Michael Hayes, we weren't allowed to
watch it. But you know, Saturday mornings
(15:34):
I was on my bicycle riding all the way across town to my, to my
grandmother and uncle's house. And I'd step with them.
And of course, it was the old school.
You didn't stand up and get in front of the TV, get a cane
upside your head, stuff like that.
You know, absolutely. You're blocking the TV, son.
Don't get too excited. Exactly.
So you said you grew up loving wrestling and you ended up
(15:57):
trained by Dutch Mantel, am I correct?
Yes, yes. So I was the closest town to me
that held weekly wrestling was Evansville, IN.
Yeah, at the old Veteran Coliseum.
Downtown and Oh yeah, Oh yeah, that was.
A big Memphis, Memphis town. Big Memphis town.
I would go every Wednesday nightto Evansville and started going
(16:19):
when I was like 14 years old riding with friends and stuff.
We'd go to one night I bought a program and there was an ad in
it that said have you ever dreamed of becoming a
professional wrestler and all this kind of stuff?
Send some pictures and a little story about yourself to this PO
Box in Nashville. So I did and a couple weeks
(16:40):
later I get a letter back says be at the fairgrounds in
Nashville, which was a big Jaredspot on this particular Tuesday
morning at 8:00 AM. Don't be late, bring $50.00
with. So I get up early, I go down
there and there's like 15 other guys there and we're all
standing around talking amongst each other.
(17:03):
Hey, you know, And then a littlered Ford Escort pulls up, Dutch
Mintel steps out of it, and I was like, Oh my God, that's
Dutch Mintel. Because we had no idea who was
going to be there. I thought maybe it was Jared
going to do something with. Us.
Sure, because that was consistent.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
And so Dutch gets out and he walks up, introduces himself to
(17:25):
all of us, asks all of us if we had our money Hands.
Sticks his hand out. We all place money in his hand.
He goes. All right, guys, you see the
racetrack down there? Yeah.
You see that point over there? Yep.
He said start running and I'll tell you when to.
And he ran us around that entireparking lot for the fairgrounds
(17:47):
and all of us were falling out throwing up like literally.
And then he, he's like, all right, guys, y'all are all sick
to your stomachs. You're done for the day.
Be back Thursday morning, 8:00. Bring me another $50.
I'm like, oh, I see where this is going already, you know?
And yeah, so. Did he cut somebody that day?
(18:07):
Did he cut anybody the first day?
No, no, he didn't cut anything. Thursday morning rolled around
and it was me and one other guy showed up.
No one else shoved back up. Yeah.
Dutch says, all right, give me your money, start running, same
lap that you did last time. So me and the guys start running
and we run for about 30 minutes.We start throwing up.
(18:30):
Then Dutch has us doing Hindu squats and all of this whole
time outside it, you know, and it was hot.
It wasn't overly hot, but it washot.
So Dutch says all right, we're done for the day.
Be back Tuesday morning 8:00. I was the only one that showed
back up. Dutch goes, Now that we weeded
out the ones that aren't serious, we can start.
(18:50):
And that's when we went into thebuilding and started.
You started the training, you know.
Dude, that's magic. Now think about how smart Dutch
is. OK, First off, here's Dutch,
obviously legendary pro wrestler, OK?
Comes with a great reputation oftraining wrestlers.
And most guys would stretch the guys immediately, you know, and
(19:11):
get them in the ring, stretch them, you know, weed them out
that way. No, Dutch is so smart.
He didn't even touch y'all. He made you run Hindu and pay
$50. That's how he got rid of the
guys that didn't want to do it. That's another level of Dutchess
genius, you know? Yeah, and I say all the time
that Dutch and Jimmy Cornett areprobably the 2 greatest minds in
(19:36):
the wrestling industry period. Are not.
Wouldn't argue all that. Yeah.
And a lot of people just disputeit a little bit.
Dutch is probably the greatest Booker to ever be in the
business. And I mean, you know, everybody
says Dusty was, I think Dutch was.
Yeah, but I mean, we can argue that if, if if need be, but I, I
(19:57):
really don't want to. I think you're right, man.
I'm going to go with Dutch on that too, because I mean, dusty,
dusty kind of turned 1 trick pony a little bit in the end,
you know, that's the problem with guys.
They start to run out of ideas, you know?
But yeah, and again, I won't argue because I think, I think
Dutch, I think you're probably right on that.
So Gator, what was your after all this training and
(20:18):
everything, what was your first match?
My very first match was against a guy named Cokela Khan, Terry
Adonis. He worked in Memphis off and on.
He did like the green shadow gimmick in Memphis and all that
kind of stuff. We were in Bowling Green, KY for
(20:40):
Dell TNT Man, who is an old timer, old school guy, but.
He turned. The promoter and I, I was
showing up and helping set up the ring and all this kind of
stuff. I was paying my dues and had no
clue that I was going to work that night.
And somebody didn't show up. Terry went to Dale and said,
(21:00):
hey, I've got this kid. You know, I've been working with
him a little bit and let me workhim.
So they come to me and was like,hey, you're going to work
tonight, get dressed. And I was terrified, scared to
death. I mean, I was a kid, you know,
Dutch broke me in when I was 15 years old, so.
OK, OK. Wow.
(21:21):
I was, yeah, I was still a kid, lied to the athletic Commission
so that I could get a license towrestle in the state of
Kentucky. Which not the first, not the
last. Yeah, exactly. 15 years old, I
was £250, six foot three. OK, Yeah, I was a big kid
(21:41):
football player, you know, But Iget ready, my music hits, I take
off, run into the ring, jumped up on the side of the ring.
And he had, he didn't have a regular canvas.
He had one of those final. Oh.
Yeah, like, yeah. Yeah, and whoever it worked the
match beforehand had baby oil onand all that good stuff, so.
(22:03):
Oh. Man.
I hit the side of the ring and went straight to my back.
Oh man. And I was like, well, that's it.
My career's over. I'm done, you know.
Oh man, that's so funny. Having a really good match and
Dell liked me and he was like, you want to be back next week?
(22:25):
And I'm like absolutely. So that that was where it all
began. Maybe I missed it, Did you say
what promotion that was with? I'm trying to remember what the
name of his promotion was. It was like MWA or something.
Yeah, like Mountain Wrestling Association because he ran a lot
of shows in Eastern Kentucky over.
In the mountain, yeah. So I'm.
(22:46):
Thinking that's what it was, this mountain wrestling
Association. And Dale was pretty famous for
doing the kind of like Chris Michaels and taking characters
that were kind of famous and maybe sticking a last name on
the people and stuff. And you know, there's nothing
wrong with that, but whatever itis, but this is a question that
kind of. So what name were you going by
at that point, Peter? My very first match, I was
(23:09):
jumping Joe Hopkins because I didn't have my gimmick yet.
I didn't I didn't know what I was going to do and what I was
going to be. So for probably the first four
months, I I wrestled this Jumping Joe Hopkins and and then
I was like, yeah, I can't do that.
I want something that's catchy and flashy.
And that's when me and Dutch goton the phone and he gave me
(23:32):
advice on how to come up with mygimmick and all of that stuff.
So. And even though you are Joe,
you're definitely not a jumping Joe, man.
You're 63. You're a big kid.
That's dumb. I'm sorry.
You know what I mean? But you know what it is?
I mean exactly and that. Was the that that Dale Mann put
on me? So it just, it wasn't me.
(23:54):
It didn't work for me. I didn't do drop kicks, you
know, nothing. So there was no jumping other
than off the ring to the floor. That was about it.
Yeah, no jumping. So, okay, Gator McAllister, it's
a great wrestling now, man, I'vealways yeah, yeah, it is.
I've always thought that and ever since I've met you, I was
(24:16):
like, man, that is the best wrestling name ever.
So tell me, where did you come up with that?
How did that come up? Me and my first wife, 19.
I don't even remember what year it was.
Probably around 89, I guess. We're sitting around and and I'm
like, I have to come up with a wrestling gimmick, you know?
(24:38):
And we're brainstorming and brainstorming.
And I had the TV on. It was on TBS at the time and
the movie White Lightning came on, which is an old Burt
Reynolds movie where he's a moonshiner.
His name in the movie is Gator McCluskey.
That's right. And to this day, that's still
what build on D calls me but andI said what?
(25:03):
She said Gator. And I was like, well, I would
really like that, but I can't beat Gator McCluskey.
Everybody will associate it withthe movie, you know.
Yeah. And so she was like, OK, well,
we'll come up with something fora last name.
She was like, so just sit on andand think on that.
Think on the Gator thing. Well, that movie goes off and
still sitting around just piddling and a movie called Ode
(25:26):
to Billy Joel. Come on.
Which is an old poppy. It was based off of an old poppy
Gentry song. Yeah, I've got a kid named Billy
Joe McAllister. Yeah, and I went.
What do you think about that? She's like, what?
And I said McAllister, she goes,well, is it a common name for
Louisiana? Because I knew that I was going
(25:47):
to be from Louisiana, right? So I actually had a New Orleans
phone book because that was one of my favorite places in the
world to go to. And I got it.
And I started flipping through it because it was like 10 pages
of Mcallister's. Wow and.
But it was spelled MCCALLISTER. So it was like Mick Callister.
(26:12):
And I'm looking at it. And I told her, I said I want to
spell it differently. I want to be a little bit
different with it. And she said, OK, so I dropped
one of the C's and I dropped oneof the L's.
So it became instead of Mick Callister, it was Mick Allister.
Yeah, OK. Yeah.
I called Dutch up and I said Dutch.
I got it. I got the gimmick.
(26:33):
I got the name. He said, what is it?
And I told him and he said I really like the sound of it.
He said, where are you from? I said, I'm going to be from New
Orleans. He's like, do you know how many
GED wrestlers there are from NewOrleans?
You know how Dutch is? He started kind of spazzing up.
I said, OK, what a he said, are you related to Sherry Martel?
I said no. He said, then why be from Baton
(26:54):
Rouge? I'm like, OK, Dutch, where am I
going to be from? Dirt Texas or oil truck and he
said get a map of Louisiana. He said study the math.
He said scan every town that yousee and when you find the place
that sounds completely made-up, that's when you know where
(27:15):
you're going to be from. So I did and just just off the
coast of Louisiana is a NationalWildlife Refuge place and it's a
little island and it's called Marsh Island, Marsh Island
Wildlife Refuge. And I was like, that's it.
(27:36):
That is it. I'm Gator McAllister from Marsh
Island, Louisiana, and I ran with him.
You. Know and yeah.
Everything from that day forward, everything for me
changed his wrestling business. Dude that is awesome.
That makes so much sense too. I got a quick little story.
I was doing the, I don't know ifyou Remember Me doing the Chic
(27:56):
Prince Omar gimmick at all, Joe,but but yeah, OK, I didn't know
if you'd remember that. Well, one day at a Bert show,
Dutch was working and Dutch looked me up and down and I was
wearing that gimmick and I I could tell he was, you know,
wheels were turning. He said, well, you know, you
just manage me. You're all right, but we got to
get you a different gimmick. There's not much going there
(28:18):
with a Caucasian Middle Easterner.
So he actually didn't come up with a new gimmick for me, but
he pushed me in that direction to just drop the gimmick and be
myself. So anyway, you know, got to give
Dutchess, like you said, he's one of the smartest guys in the
business and has has a great mind.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Promotional consideration paid
(28:39):
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(29:24):
So I was doing my research and this is crazy, man.
So we are from a little town called Lebanon, Virginia,
probably like 3000 population tops.
It's real close to Bristol, VA, Bristol, TN, whatever you want
to call it. But you actually worked at a
high school in Oakwood, VA, it'sGarden High School, and you
worked for Smoky Mountain there.Now again, I don't want to go
(29:46):
too far into that, but why don'tyou lead us up to going to Smoky
Mountain, if you don't mind? That was all Dutch I had.
I had. I knew about Smoky Mountain.
Yeah. And there they did a big show in
Knoxville called Fire on the Mountain.
Oh yeah, yeah. And it was pre, I guess it
(30:08):
wasn't pre pay-per-view, but if they would have done
pay-per-view, that would have been Smoky Mountains
WrestleMania, yeah. Exactly smoky.
Mountain Smoky Mountain was run by Jim Cornette and had the
Armstrongs and the Rock'n'roll and everybody there.
Well, Dutch had started a deal that he was doing called Ring of
Dreams and what it was you couldjust take normal people, give
(30:33):
them a crash course in, in wrestling for like 2 weeks and
then guaranteed him like a dark match, if you will.
So we had this, this professor from like New England somewhere,
like the guy was a professor at a big university up there and
he, he wanted to do it. It'd been a dream of his, but
(30:55):
he, he was, he wasn't a big guy,little scrawny fella, you know.
So that's brought him to my wrestling school that I was
actually had at the top and we crashed course enough to get him
through like a 6 minute match. And that says OK, you need to
come with me talking to me to fire on the mountain.
I said why? He said because that's where
(31:17):
we're going to do this match. I'm like, are you serious?
He goes yeah, I'm like OK, you know.
So we go and we do this this match and all of the boys come
out of the back. Jimmy Cornett comes out of the
back. At that time, Taz was working
for Cornett and Smoky Mountain Rd.
(31:37):
Dog was under a mask, you know, you know, all those guys were
there. So everybody comes out and
watches this match, sees the bumps that I'm taking and how
I'm eating this guy and making him shy, you know, and it was
recorded for me. And we get done.
We go towards the dressing room and they wouldn't let us go into
the actual dressing room where the boys were.
(31:58):
Well, all of them started comingover talking to me and Cornett
comes over to me and he goes, you did good kid.
And I was like, well, thank you,Mr. Cornett, you know, and he
goes interested. Been doing some TV shots for me
and I'm like, done. You just tell me when and where
I'll be there, you know, And so that that's how it came about.
(32:18):
And then like, I rode with Dutchquite a bit, doing Smoky
Mountain Towns, working with guys like Tracy Smothers,
working with Ron and Don Harris,Chris Candido, Brian Lee, Killer
Kyle. Got to work with all of the
James boys, Brad, Brian with Armstrong.
(32:40):
I worked with all of them. You know, it was, it was fun.
Ended up doing several shows forCornet that weren't televised.
I think we did. I think we did did four or five
televised and then did like a bunch of the spot shelves for
him. Yeah, yeah.
Well, this one specifically was in Oakwood, Virginia Garden High
(33:01):
School, which is so close to us,we could basically spit and lay.
It would land there. And of course, you worked three
matches in one day. It appears Killer Kyle Bruce
Brothers and Tracy Smothers for.I mean, how is it working three
matches in one day? We spread it out like the Tracy
(33:22):
match was the very first match that I worked and it was the
very first match of the night. So me and Tracy kind of set the
pace. Then it was probably an hour and
a half before I went back out. When I went back out, it was A
tag match against Ramadan Harris.
Which is intelligent because that gives you some more rest
(33:44):
and you know, you don't have to work the full match.
Yeah, right. Exactly.
And then the third match was is when they were doing the beat
the champ gimmick there and Killer Kyle was the champion at
the time for the beat the champ thing.
And they drew my name out of thehat.
So I had to go out and mark him.And out of the three matches I
(34:04):
love, Tracy Smothers, one of theone of the the best in ring guys
that I've ever been in the ring with.
But of all of those matches, thematch that I had with Killer
Kyle was my favorite. And it was because he actually
gave me a little shy. OK.
Tracy, I was just just out thereto make Tracy look good.
(34:24):
And of course, Ron and Don, you know, nobody got any kind of
shine with Ron and Don. You showed how well you can sell
with them. That's your shine with them,
Yeah. Exactly.
And like kill Kyle, he did. His gimmick was he was like this
mafioso hitman type guy, you know, carry the file in case
(34:44):
ring and all that stuff. And Mark was just so cool.
He was so nice to me. He was like, who broke you?
And I was like Dutch, he goes, oh, we're going out and have a
good match then, you know, and that was it.
And he went out and let me get my shine in on him.
And then he cut me off and took it home.
And so it mentalized and me and him ended up getting together
(35:06):
later a few years later in WCW and actually traveled.
Together. That's awesome.
That's awesome. Yeah.
Now with that being said, now, how much longer did you spend
working Smoky Mountain or did itkind of end there for you there?
Yeah, it pretty well did. It wasn't long after that that
went back to Puerto Rico and Smoky Smoky closed up.
(35:27):
So I went to work for Memphis after the Smoky Mountain thing,
and I wasn't, I wasn't doing Memphis TV, but they put me on
all of the house shows. Yeah, you know, so.
And this is USWA at the time, ofcourse.
Yeah. So yeah.
Yeah, yeah, USWA, which I was working for Bert Prentice and
Bert is the one that got me in the door with Memphis,
(35:50):
introduced me to Randy Handles and Guy Coffee and all of them.
And then I was working a lot of Memphis guys on Berts shows,
Brian Christopher, Jerry Lawler and all of them.
So yeah, yeah, it opened up. Bert opened up a lot of doors
from me. Gotcha.
That's awesome. Gator, did I see that you had
worked in in Puerto Rico some and I would maybe assume that
(36:13):
was with Dutch? Yes, yes, that Dutch was booking
in Puerto Rico and he called me up one night and, and out of the
blue, and he was like, man, I need some familiar faces over
here. He said, you want to come over
and work And I'm like done. And he's like, well, can't
guarantee any kind of major money and all this and all that.
(36:35):
He's like, but you'll be over here.
It'll be a good experience for you.
You know, I was like 2122 at thetime.
I'm like, yeah, you know, I'm. I'm down.
So which Puerto Rico? That's where I met Glenn Jacobs.
Worked him for the very first time.
Wow. Which I was scared to death
(36:56):
working with him. He's a monster.
You know, of course, nicest, gentlest guys I've ever been in
the ring with. And I got to meet and work with
Eddie Gilbert. I.
Grew up watching Eddie, you know?
So yeah, for sure. And he actually got really,
really, really close while I wason the island and he took care
(37:18):
of me. I was actually the last American
wrestler to work with Eddie before he passed away.
Man, so sad. We talk about it all the time.
Like what would he be doing now?I feel like somebody would he
might even have his own very famous promotion.
You know, he would, he would be,you know, unless he just decided
(37:39):
to leave it all alone and do something different.
But I just feel like somebody would be using him right now as
a, you know, a high level executive, you know, so.
No doubt, I have no doubt, you know.
Now, you didn't do any Icy Hot on anybody down there like
Wolfie did for Armadito, right? I couldn't.
(38:02):
I couldn't do all that. I was too scared.
You know, my first night at one of the shows, I Dutch tells me
he's like, you're going to be a babyface.
I don't want to put this much heat on you as a heel.
I said, OK, so he's like, your dressing room's over there.
I'm like, OK, I go over and I gointo the dressing room and
there's like 10 guys in there. I go in, I say hello to
(38:24):
everybody, I sit down and everybody gets up and walks out
of the dressing room except for Invader.
Gotcha. Anybody that knows anything
about the wrestling business knows who Invader is, right?
And so I'm in my mind, in my adolescent mind, I'm thinking,
this is the guy that killed Bruiser Brody.
(38:46):
He doesn't like America. He's going to kill me.
And it wasn't that long ago. That wasn't that long ago.
Exactly. And so I'm terrified that he
gets up and he's got this weird look in in his eyes and I'm
thinking here we go. You know, I have no knife on me.
I have no gun, nothing. I'm.
Just gonna say that, Brody, you know?
And he comes over, sticks his hand out, introduces himself to
(39:09):
me, sits down beside me, and we had a hell of a conversation.
He talked about when he wrestledin the States.
He knew exactly where I was from, ended up being a really
nice guy. I'm not sure what happened with
him and Brody. I wasn't there so I can't speak
on it, but he treated me very well and with a lot of respect
while I was on the island so. Yeah, yeah.
(39:31):
And with me and Jared, you'll never find 2 bigger Bruiser
Brody fans. I mean, honestly, we love him,
but we know that he could be hard headed.
We know that, you know. Yeah, absolutely.
And nobody knows truly what happened.
I mean, honestly, nobody. I mean, I know Dutch knows a lot
of it. I know Tony Falk was there.
I know Abdullah was there. I know Tony Atlas.
I know. So all these guys knew a little
bit about the deal and it probably more than anybody has
(39:53):
ever let on. But when it comes down to it,
nobody actually knows what happened in that locker room.
But you know, that's impressive.Two people know, and that was
Brody, an invader, and one of them can't talk about it.
One of them can't, one of the other one won't, you know.
So yeah. Exactly.
Yeah. So how long were you in Puerto
Rico? I.
(40:13):
Was in Puerto Rico for a couple months.
I flew back a few times and then, you know, over that couple
months period there I was kind of flying back and taking care
of things in in Kentucky and allof that.
But it was fun. It was, it was really good
learning experience. The first time I'd ever worked a
show where we had to call in riot squads to get the boys out
(40:36):
of the building. I mean, it was, it was wild,
very wild up. There, Yeah.
Now what was the famous hotel that everybody stayed at?
Motel or whatever it was called?Do you remember the?
I do not remember the name of itit.
Was heard a million times. Yeah, if I was scared, I'd be.
Like I said, that's the name, but I can't think of it.
(40:57):
Too many concussions. Really close to the airport.
It was like a block away from a Denny's where we all went to
eat. And across the street from the
Denny's was a bird fighting arena, a cock fighting arena.
And I asked Dutch one time, I said, hey, let's go to the go to
(41:18):
the chicken fights. He was like, no, we're not
going. No chicken fights neither they
will kill us in there. I'm like, OK, never mind, you
know? They don't want to die.
Let's know. Yeah.
But I mean, you know, you. I'm sorry.
You grew up in Kentucky. We grew up in Southwest
Virginia. Chicken fighting's a real
popular thing, man. You know, We won't know names,
guys, but, you know, may or may not have seen it ourselves.
(41:41):
Let's just say that we'll go with anyway.
I remember the first time my brother and I saw it, it was
just like, holy crap, man. Yeah, yeah.
But we're not going to admit anymore than anything else.
So, So OK, you come back from Puerto Rico and now I know you'd
(42:01):
worked in USWA prior to Puerto Rico, but you actually come back
and you, you actually worked forColorado kids.
So Bert was your connection. So he basically you took the
time to go to Puerto Rico and then you come back and work
USWA. Is that correct as well to go
back to Memphis? Yeah, yeah.
Went back, did some more from Memphis, did some more work for
Bert, and in between all of thatI was working for different
(42:26):
N.W.A territories. OK, Yeah.
Tell us about that. Oh, Lord, I've worked N.W.A
territories in Texas, West Virginia.
I worked for Dennis Carluzzo when he was running the N.W.A in
Jersey. Doug Gilbert actually set that
up for me. OK, I worked, Good Lord,
Chicago, there was an N.W.A territory that was up around
(42:49):
Chicago worked up there. Florida held multiple tag titles
in the N.W.A with different partners throughout the years.
It's awesome, It's awesome. Trying to think in just local
independent stuff like in Kentucky, Tennessee, Indiana,
Illinois area. I did a lot of that.
(43:11):
Yeah, yeah. So you're working USWA and I was
a big deal for you, I would imagine.
It was, it was a really big deal.
I mean, that's what I grew up watching.
So I'm in the ring with all of my childhood heroes and my
influences, and I'm working the same buildings that I had seen
on TV, you know, like the Louisville Gardens.
(43:33):
I remember the first time I got to work there, first time I
worked the Evansville Coliseum, first time I worked the
Nashville Fairgrounds, you know,the first time I did the the Mid
South Coliseum and. The Blue Man, That's awesome.
Yeah. Exactly, Exactly.
It was doing like some of the little house shows around
Western Kentucky and Arkansas. And you know which for me, the
(43:57):
Louisville Gardens was my Madison Square Garden.
You know Gardens was bigger thanworked in the Mid South Coliseum
in Memphis. Yeah, yeah, which is funny.
You know, I'm the Co host of theWolfie D show.
I know all our listeners know that a million times over now.
But, you know, Wolfie always said that the Nashville
Fairgrounds was his Madison Square Garden, but, you know,
(44:17):
obviously working the Mid South Coliseum, but he actually liked
Louisville better than Mid Southand in in the terms of how well
the Louisville crowds were and how much they just love the
wrestling, you know, there and and.
Was the town, in my opinion, forMemphis, it really.
Was, yeah, it was a great town and such a legendary building.
(44:39):
I mean, the names that have beenin that building, it's just blow
your mind, you know? And now a word from our sponsor.
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(45:00):
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(45:24):
Gator, tell us about IWA Mid South.
Oh boy, oh boy. So when I worked for Burke
Prentice, me and Bull, pain got really close.
And Bull called me up one night and he was like, hey, I've got a
guy that's going to run Louisville.
(45:46):
He needs a promoter's license. I'm like, OK, he goes and a
ring. I said, OK, does does he have
anything? He's got some talent.
I said, OK, who is it? He said Ian Rotten.
I said from ECW he goes, yeah, he said he's actually got a
ring. He said, but something fell
(46:08):
through for tonight and he can'tget the ring.
Can you bring your ring and let him, you know, act like you're
the promoter for this show? And I was like, you know, I
guess what's what's the payoff on it, you know, because written
in the ring plus he my promoterslicense and am I going to be
booked on the show? Yeah, you're going to work.
(46:30):
I said, OK, so we work out a deal.
I go up I median rotten and he told me that night a guy named
Mike Golden who him and his dad built wrestling rings for a lot
of Tennessee and and Kentucky, West Virginia and Virginia
(46:50):
promotions. They built really good steel
rings and he did like the big cowboy game.
So me and him work and we get done, go to the back.
Ian Rotten's like, wow, you know, I was like, what?
He goes, dude, he's like, you just went out there and took
complete control of my show. I was like, no, I just went out
(47:12):
there and did what I do, you know?
Yeah. And he goes, you've got a job.
What is simple? You've got a job.
I want you to hear every single show that we run.
I'm like, OK, you know, And it, it works really good for a
while. And and Ian was bringing in all
these like top men guys, a lot of the ECW guys.
(47:32):
The Public Enemy 911 had Dutch working, Tommy Ridge, Doug
Gilbert and then some, some likehigh flying guys, reckless, huge
from up north. Yeah, hot on independence at the
time Ian was bringing them in, you know, And of course, anybody
that knows about IWA knows it was a blood and gut still, you
(47:56):
know, Mondo and Ian rotten out there in barbed wire and
thumbtacks and broken glass. I love Pondo.
What up Pondo and all of this kind of stuff.
And the athletic Commission started to really hammer down
South. They show up one night to the
show and tell us that me and Ianand my ex-wife, because the
(48:20):
promoter's license was at her name, had to go to Frankfort,
KY, to the offices of the athletic Commission for a
meeting. We're like, OK, so we go to the
meeting and they proceed to tellus that there's going to be no
more blood, no more this, no more that.
Don't do it again. They're going to strip me of my
license, my wrestling license, and they're going to take my
(48:43):
promoter's license away from me.So I told Ian.
I said, Ian, you've got to find somebody else to do the
promoter's license thing. I can't risk losing that.
He was like, no, I understand completely.
Like when you keep working for me, I said, yeah, I'll keep
working for you. So he ended up getting, I think
it was Rico Beatty who was one of his ring announcers.
(49:05):
I think she's the one that endedup getting a promoter's license.
And that's how they continued running after I pulled my
promoter's license away from thesituation.
Gotcha. OK, OK.
So I mean, we know Iwa Mid Southis legendary for a lot of
things. I mean, you know, definitely got
a hardcore vibe in there. But also, you know, like seeing
Punk, Samoa Joe, so many of these guys that are still
(49:26):
wrestling today got their start there because they were coming
down from the north. It was kind of like a media from
the North and the South, you know, and a lot of a lot of guys
came in there. I know you worked some guys like
Todd Mort and Tommy Rich Ox, Harley Madman Pondo in a big old
match with all bunch of guys there.
I guess the one I want to ask you about though is talk about
working Tommy Rich man. I love working with Tommy.
(49:49):
Tommy and Tommy is so much fun to work with.
One of the easiest guys I've ever been in the ring.
Everything was Tommy Float, you know?
I mean, it was just, it wasn't, I don't want to say it was
magic, but it flowed and it was so easy and it was flawless.
Like, I mean, there was no effort that you had to put into
(50:09):
it when you were in the ring with Tommy, right?
Right. That's.
I was over with Doug and Tommy because of Eddie Gilbert, right?
The first time I met Doug and Tommy was on the Memphis show
that we were doing in Arkansas. And I walked up and I introduced
myself to him and Doug stood straight up and he said, you're
(50:30):
the Gator that was in Puerto Rico with my brother.
And I said yes. And he gave me a hug.
And he said Eddie thought the world of you.
He said over with Eddie. You're over with me.
That's all I need. If you're over with Eddie and
you're over with Doug, you're over with me, Brother Wildfire,
you know? Yeah.
(50:50):
Exactly. Exactly.
So I mean, it was always, you know, like friends and and stuff
being in there with each other instead of a legend with some
green guy, you know. Right.
Yeah, dude, one time in the backat saw Gator.
It was so funny. I was standing there and, you
know, you're waiting to go out there and as you're standing
(51:11):
there to walk up the steps, to go down the ramp from the back,
I'm standing there and the music's playing and I'm an idiot
and I always start doing air guitar.
I carried a cane. I started doing air guitar.
And, you know, Tommy and Doug were there and Tommy looks over
and he like pokes Doug. And he says, I dug, I dug.
Oh, Shiki's playing the guitar. He told me we're up there for
(51:37):
yay and he he come over, he's like I said yeah, he said
Goldfire, you know wildfire, a bear.
I was like, Tommy, what time beer you want?
He's like hell. I don't care as long as you
start with Avi was like all. Right, he didn't care as long as
it started with AV. That is legendary.
(51:57):
God bless Tommy rich man. So, OK, so you work from Iwa Mid
South and you you keep working there and you work there for a
good amount of time, am I right?Yeah, I was probably a couple
years. Yeah, I had a, you know, some
phenomenal talent and had some great matches with people.
Had some really bad injuries there.
(52:20):
That's where I broke my back work.
Work with Tracy's mothers. It was one of those freak freak
things. It was a chair shot to the back
and shattered 2 vertebrae. Chair shot.
It was just one of those freak accidents that happened.
Tracy felt bad. Like, oh, I bet he felt
(52:42):
horrible, Yeah. Yeah, tears.
Tears flow. Just Me and Tracy had known each
other for years, you know, so hefelt really bad about that.
Tom Burton, dirty white boy, broke my neck.
Oh my God, Tom Burton. Talk about Tom, man, because
I've heard dirty white boy and Tom Dirty was not happy in that
tag team, I've heard. And Tom is, even though he may
(53:04):
not have showed it, he was definitely not happy in that tag
team now. Yeah, talk about Tom Burton.
Dirty white boy man, you. Know TomTom was Tom was one of
those guys. If he thought that he could get
something over on you, he would try it in the dressing room.
Super nice guy. I never had an issue with Tom at
(53:25):
all. Yeah.
Until that night. Yeah.
And, you know, he was with CandyDevine.
Candy always showed me a lot of respect, treated me nice.
Sweetheart, I've heard, I've heard she was a nice.
Yeah, yeah, she was. And Tom had always been really
good with me. And when he came to IWA, he
thought that he was in Japan andhe was having to do strong style
(53:46):
and shoot on guys. And.
He was known for doing like throws, German suplexes, all
that kind of stuff, right? Well, I was hurt from the week
before NIWA, and I told him, I said, Tom, we'll do anything you
want to do. I said, all I ask is please
don't give me any throws. I'm hurt.
(54:08):
Yeah. OK kid, whatever you say, right?
We get in the room, we lock up, and he immediately spins me
around and dumps me on top of myhead with a shoe.
Oh. My gosh, man.
I mean, very first thing right off the bat, boom and broke my
neck. It it broke my neck and I was
(54:28):
terrified. The impact of my head was so bad
I went blind while I was out there.
Wow. I backed myself into a corner
and it was actually a like a want to say a six man tag.
It was I believe madman Pondo, Tom Burton and Macho Warrior
Rick Hogan. Yes, again, me, Ian Rotten.
(54:52):
Gypsy Joe. No, it might have been Fox
Harley. I can't remember who the third
one was on our team, but I backed myself into a corner and
I grabbed Ian. I said, Ian, I'm blind.
I can't see and I'm hurt. Tom hurt me.
Ian's like just just sit right here.
Just sit right here. So Ian goes in, he gets Tom,
they go to the floor. Well, I feel around and I feel a
(55:14):
2 by 4 and I pick it up and I held it and anytime I felt like
somebody was coming near me, I swung it.
You know, I didn't know who was coming.
I, I just, I wasn't taking any chances.
We get to the. Full pain grabs hold of me and
he's like come with me. He lays me down on the floor,
does some feeling and stuff. He he wraps a towel around my
neck and tells me not to take itoff.
(55:37):
Ian comes in, hands me my envelope.
He said go to the hospital and go now.
So I end up going to the hospital, the CAT scans, X-rays,
all that. That's how we found out that my
neck was broken. I went back the next week.
I was in like Halo and all that stuff and I talked to Bull on
the phone. I'm like hurt and broke my neck,
you know. So Bull's like, OK, So I get to
(55:59):
the show the next week and Bull calls me inside and he goes, I'm
working time tonight. I'm like, OK, he goes, I'm
getting your receipt for you. I'm like, OK, why?
He's like because and bull pain went out there and I mean beat
the shit out of Burton was crying man his ass and Burton
(56:22):
was crying. And, well, you do that to me for
him. Oh, man.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
And I, I worked Tom a couple times after that and never felt
anything he did. And I guess it was because he
figured if he, if he shot you onme, you'd have to deal with
bull, you know? Yeah, yeah, man.
How long did it take you to healfrom that?
(56:45):
So my back, I was back in the ring in a month, OK.
My neck, I was out for three months and went back against
doctor's orders, but I couldn't take it no more.
Back in the ring. Yeah.
Right, of course. That's right, it's the talk of
(57:05):
Middle Tennessee, the channel you love to hate and the channel
you hate to love. It's Brian Turner from Brian
Turner's VHS Rehab and if you'relooking for matches from.
Wolfie D to Jerry Lawler to Dusty Rhodes and the team that
put a pimp before your eyes and a goatee put 2 in your thighs.
Booty KO and Athena go to lostwrestling.com.
See I made it easy for you. Brian Turner's VHS Rehab Booyah.
(57:30):
Hi, this is Mike Needham, host of the Reckless Abandoned
podcast with Mike Needham. We invite you to jump on your
favorite podcast platform and search for the Reckless
Abandoned podcast and give us a listen.
I'm sometimes joined by a part time podcaster, part time Co
host and full time wife Kidney in the cold.
We talk wrestling, we talk pop culture, we talk local events,
(57:52):
local happenings in West Tennessee, and a ton of other
stuff. But be sure to check out the
Reckless Abandoned Podcast, findus on Facebook.
Also look up the micro group Podcasting Family on Facebook
and see some of our other podcasts we have out there.
Until next time, make good choices and always remember, no
Dollar, no dice. Ladies and gentlemen, this is
(58:26):
Jimmy St. and that was episode 12 of the Best of James Rock St.
Productions with the first half of episode 40 of Gator
McAllister on Give Me Back My Pro Wrestling.
Gator's got some great stories and this episode is actually one
of our top ranked shows of all time.
You can hear the full episode and more over on at G MB, MPW or
Give Me Back My Pro Wrestling wherever you listen to podcasts
(58:47):
or simply click the link in the notes below.
We hope you've enjoyed a look back in the archives of James
Rock St. Productions.
Check us out next week to see what else we have in store.
Until then, follow at G, MB, MPWand at James Rock St.
everywhere. Peace with a tear in my eye,
this. Is the greatest moment in my
(59:09):
life. This has been a James Rock St.
(59:40):
production.
Hey, this is Gator McAllister and you're listening to Give Me
Back My Pro Wrestling. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to
Give Me Back My Pro Wrestling. Hello, Said.
(00:43):
Oh, no, now you know, baby, thisis hot Rod Bigs, Jared, Jimmy
St. We're going to take them to the
limit One more time, baby. Right here.
Oh, give me back my pro wrestling.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome one more time to the Give Me
Back my Pro Wrestling podcast. And as always, I'm here with my
brother from the same father andmother, the Plastic Sheet, Jared
(01:05):
St. What's up brother?
How you doing? Not much man, just living life
and working and doing this man just love doing this with you.
Yeah. Are you in a repeat cycle
sometimes like me, Like I feel. Dude, sometimes I feel like life
just is like so crammed full of things I don't know what to.
(01:26):
I don't know if I have any time sometimes.
Yeah, like why do we do this to ourselves?
Why do we cram so much stuff? Yeah, in our lives.
But then if I didn't I would just be lazy or something.
So I mean. I know, I know.
Probably some of it's to do withthe kids and other parts of it's
just to do with work and things like that.
Yeah. Makes.
(01:46):
Sense it's summertime so you're going here, going there, stuff
like that so. Yeah, that's about it, man.
That's about it. So anyway, to kind of go to in a
totally different direction, we do have a cool guest today as
y'all saw on the promotional posts on our social media
platforms that we have the man Gator McAllister here.
(02:07):
And I, you know, I just can't wait to hear.
I mean, I've been researched andhis stuff and honestly, brothers
done a lot. I think we're going to have a
fun time with him. I I I really do.
Yeah, man, it's, it's a he's gota great name too, Gator
McAllister. I mean, like, I hope we get in
more of some of the the origins of that name and kind of learn
some of that and yeah, ask what we'll ask him about that and see
(02:28):
how that came about. But that's that's an awesome
name. That's you don't.
Sometimes you get some bland names, but you got something
like that's pretty. Yeah, yeah, I mean, you got
names like Hot Rod Biggs. I love that name, Gator
McAllister. You know what I'm saying?
Like a lot of these guys have some great names, but when it
(02:49):
comes down to it, you know, Gator might be one of the best.
Absolutely. You know that It's funny.
He's such a good dude, though. That's what's crazy is I just
remember every time, like, you know, he kind of looks like, you
know, like a like he would be gruff or have like a a gruff
demeanor. But honestly, when you.
Talk to him, he just like smilesand laughs and.
(03:09):
And just has a good time. He's just, it's just his
exterior. He's, he's actually a, you know,
a really funny, nice guy on the inside.
So anyway, Gator's going to be awesome.
I can't wait to have him on. I can't wait to talk all about
his career. Lots of cool stuff, man.
Seriously, part of my love of doing what we do is the research
(03:31):
on these guys and actually hearing the full story with
these dudes. Because, man, sometimes you
uncover like pearls you know, orgems you know.
Yeah, and there's always something we found out from
these guys that, you know, we didn't know.
I think it was Quentin was one. He's like, do y'all want to know
the full truth? We're like, yeah, we don't want
to know the full truth. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
(03:53):
We want to hear it. Yeah.
Being honest, yeah. So we always, we always seem to
dig up a Pearl somehow. And it's not even, it's not even
like kind of like we're even trying for them.
They just happen though, so. Yeah, yeah, that's true.
It's true. You know, Speaking of past guest
episodes, I like the segue seguethere.
Yeah, Yeah, it's nice. So First off, we had Doug
(04:14):
Markham, man, Doug's awesome number.
I mean, he's, I think he's already, he's already passed so
many people. If I'm not mistaken he's like
7th or 8th in the rankings now so.
Yeah, man, I mean he and I knew he.
A lot of the listeners would listen to him.
Of course, our normal listeners would listen, but I do believe
(04:34):
he pulled in some other people and that's very appreciative.
Thank you, Doug. I know you're listening,
brother. Super appreciative of that.
Your show's doing great. We're proud to have you on and
really, it means a lot. Yeah, man, it was great when I
enjoyed so much talking to Doug and I was going to give him a
shout out, man. You see him on Facebook, he's
sharing their stuff. He shares and and he supports
(04:55):
small businesses a lot. And that that's awesome.
I see on his Facebook you like, as always sharing stuff like
that. So that's always, that's always
killer to me when somebody's doing that because it, it shows
that they're, they're, they're adown, down home type of guy.
They and they like to help the little guy and that's, that's
always important. But man, yeah, he, he's such a
good guest and it's so many goodstories and it was great to hear
(05:18):
it. And man, I'm loving the plunky
and crawl episode, the special episode you had, you know, I
hate I couldn't be in on that. But it kind of worked out what
timing that I couldn't be in. And you know, it kind of made
more sense for it to just be 1 interviewer instead of 2 with
with him telling the story and everything like that.
But. Yeah, I mean, Crawl doesn't need
any other people talking. But now Crawl had such a story
(05:39):
to let out, and I appreciate that you enjoyed that one.
But Crawl had such a story to say.
I mean, it really felt like Plunky and I were interviewing
Crawl in a way, you know? And it was, but it was funny
because I wanted to hear Plunky perspective.
One of my favorite parts was going back and listening to the
Tracy Smothers excerpts when he was talking to Plunky about,
hey, man, you got to get ready. You know, these guys will eat
(06:01):
you alive if you let them. You know, just added such a
layer of reality to it that honestly, I think put it over
the edge for me. Of course, I'm friends with
Plunky. Was friends with him at the time
I was pulling for him. I remember it so vividly now,
how much it was so important andreally seemed like a really big
thing was happening. And so, you know, it was cool to
(06:22):
see that and relive that. Then to hear all the grimy
details from what happened and what went on from Kroll.
Kind of finalized the story a bit.
You know, it's just to me, man, I don't know, I'm glad that it
happened, but it seemed like it took almost more than it was
worth in a sense, you know, But that's the beauty of it is I
(06:45):
think when Crowell believes in something, Crowell will fight
for it. And that's that's proof right
there. That's proof that he will
absolutely fight for it. And yeah, man, I, you know, I do
know right now Crowell's in a bit of a battle for the
Nashville, the rights to his building in the Troubadour.
He's got that Coastal Championship Wrestling, which is
there's a Florida based promotion that's coming up to
(07:07):
Nashville and they had a venue and it fell through and they I
think they're going to be August18th and they're they're doing a
Friday night Coastal Championship Wrestling booked
the same building the 19th. So it's literally 2 nights of
wrestling. And if they're not related, it
just seems kind of dastardly. So he's got another fight on his
(07:29):
hands. Maybe that'll be a future
episode to hear the full story on that one.
But yeah, I don't know. But I'm glad you enjoyed that.
I've got some other ideas that we can do in the future that are
going to be fun. I've been talking to some of the
guys about possibilities on whatwe can do with that, those types
of episodes in the future. So if y'all enjoyed that, let us
(07:50):
know in the comments, you know, let us know on the socials.
But I think right now I think weneed to get old Gator McAllister
on here. What do you say?
Let's get it man, I can't wait. All right, we'll be right back
after these messages with more from Give Me Back My Pro
Wrestling. You a pro wrestling fan?
We'll stop by Captain's Corner where you can get autographed
(08:12):
photos, cards, magazines, and figures from all of your
favorite wrestling superstars ofthe past, present, and future.
You'll also be able to participate in live signings in
the weeks and months to come. Make sure to stop by Captain's
Corner on Facebook and give us aholler.
Remember, cheers to the working man.
(08:34):
All right, we are back with morefrom the Give Me Back My Pro
Wrestling podcast. And as promised, Jared, who do
we have today with my old buddy Gator McAllister.
Now, Gator is one of these guys that I guarantee you've seen
him. He's done everything.
He's had an amazing career and I'm excited to talk to him.
But as always, on every episode,we go to my brother, the plastic
(08:57):
Sheik for the very first question of the show.
Go ahead, Sheik. All right, Gator.
So this is the this is a question that I like to get out
of the way, let everybody know kind of your influences in
wrestling and just and just yourfandom in wrestling.
If you could list your top your,your Mount Rushmore, your top
four or five wrestlers all time that you're in your opinion,
what would that be? That one's a little hard,
(09:20):
honestly. I mean, where I grew up, grew up
on Memphis wrestling, I hadn't even seen or heard of WWF until
I was probably 12 years old. So I grew up on Memphis and I
grew up on the old N.W.A. So being my Mount Rushmore, my
top 4 would be Austin Idol. Yeah, I was a huge Austin Idol
(09:42):
fan. Dutch Mintel, of course.
Jerry Lawler and Rick, that's, you know, Ric Flair and an
honorable mention to Dusty Rose because those guys hate the
business. You know they take the way for
so many, so many. Wrestlers, absolutely.
Oh yeah, it's a great list. I mean, nobody can argue with
(10:04):
anything there. I mean absolutely when you when
you, when you, you could, you could tell your influence as
though your your area influencesand that and that's fine.
That's that's why we, that's whywe like to get these questions
out there and get it answered with, hey, you know, this is
this is this is what I was influenced by.
This is what I like to see. This is, you know, and some
(10:25):
people, you know, if we were talking to somebody in the
Northeast, they would be like, OK, well, Bruno, San Martino,
you know, this right here. And some.
Of those guys, yeah. Born and Adrian St.
Or not? Adrian St.
Adrian Adamus. Yeah, surely.
Portland Pass, you know. Yeah, maybe Lynn Denton or
somebody like that. And yeah, but Gator McAllister,
(10:47):
brother, how long has it been since we've seen each other?
I bet it's been 10 years. What are you up to these days,
brother? Actually I retired from
wrestling and got my CDL and went on the road as a big rig
truck driver. Yeah, dude, I thought I saw
that. And now I think you've done that
to take advantage of one thing, right?
(11:08):
Is you get to go to all these awesome conventions, right?
Absolutely. I, I spend a lot of my free time
going to like comic book conventions and horror
conventions and stuff like that.I'm just, I'm a big nerd, you
know? And yeah, we all.
And after spending any, after spending so many years on the
road wrestling the truck drivingis just natural because I'm on
(11:31):
the road, you know? Yeah, yeah.
It all kind of flows together. Dude, you're you're just born to
be a trucker because you're a wrestler.
Rick Reynolds does some of that,too.
I mean, it's everybody's riding.I love it.
So, yeah, that makes total sense.
Well, I tell you what. So we kind of talked about where
you are now and stuff. Let's go all the way back here.
So this is, you know, we get theMount Rushmore, then we talk a
(11:52):
little bit about what you're doing now.
But then we go all the way back to the very beginning, to the
days when you were just a littlebitty Gator.
OK, so in your younger days, where were you born?
Where were you born? Where did you go to high school?
I was actually born in a little small town just outside of
Evansville, IN called Linville. Was born there and literally the
(12:14):
next day was in Madisonville, KY.
So that's where I grew up, spentthe majority of my life in that
town and that little surroundingtowns around it.
Went to Madisonville N Hopkins High School which had like the
state football champions at one time and all that.
Got kicked out of public school and graduated from a private
(12:39):
Christian School of all places for me.
Yeah. So.
It wasn't. Bad, Yeah, it wasn't bad, you
know, and but I grew up watchingwrestling on TV and from I went
to my very first wrestling show when I was five years old, man
and it was at the local middle school there in Madisonville.
(13:00):
And the main event was Joel A Duke against Jerry Lawler.
OK, that tells me the time framethen.
OK, Yeah. Yeah.
And of. Course, Joe Leduc was doing the
gimmick back then where he wouldtie the straps around his arms,
pick 10 guys out of the crowd and have them try to separate
his arms and nobody ever could, you know?
(13:20):
But I'm I knew that night that that is what I wanted to do with
my life. I wanted to become a
professional wrestler. I didn't care how, I didn't care
where. I just knew that's what I wanted
to do. Yeah, yeah.
Would you say like Joe Leduc wasa bit of an influence or was it
more Jerry Lawler? It was more Lawler, Yeah.
(13:41):
I mean, it was. It was.
Great, because I can see some ofhim in your latter days.
You know what I'm saying? So anyway, go ahead.
That I've gotten that from people.
It was more Lawler just the way that the crowd gravitated toward
him. Of course, at the time he was
the big Memphis babyface, you know?
Yeah, totally. Yeah, everybody, you know, in
(14:03):
the, just like, just like Ricky Morton, you know, the way Lawler
sold and his facial expressions and everything.
I believed every single move andevery single thing that happened
that night. And it just, it hit me and like
a ton of bricks. And I was like, this is what I'm
going to grow up to be one day. And, you know, and I, I just, I
(14:25):
never went away from that. You know, I still, I still
vividly remember the match. That's awesome.
That's awesome. That's.
Been 100 years. AGO 100, maybe at least 100,
yeah, maybe 101. But Jerry Lawler was magic and
that he had that crowd in the palm of his hand every time he
went out there and he's still magic.
You know, I definitely consider him one of the greatest of all
(14:47):
time and nobody can argue that with me.
You know, I'm an adoptee of Memphis.
I grew up the Mid-Atlantic, you know, and but honestly, I love
Memphis. As soon as I started watching
it, it's just a different kind of vibe.
OK, so you're growing up and you're living wrestling now.
Who was your influence on likingright?
Who let you go watch wrestling? My great grandmother and my
(15:12):
great uncle, they were brother and sister.
They lived together, took care of each other.
Huge, huge wrestling things. OK, so.
You know, my mom, it was a big Michael Hayes fan.
And if it, if it wasn't Michael Hayes, we weren't allowed to
watch it. But you know, Saturday mornings
(15:34):
I was on my bicycle riding all the way across town to my, to my
grandmother and uncle's house. And I'd step with them.
And of course, it was the old school.
You didn't stand up and get in front of the TV, get a cane
upside your head, stuff like that.
You know, absolutely. You're blocking the TV, son.
Don't get too excited. Exactly.
So you said you grew up loving wrestling and you ended up
(15:57):
trained by Dutch Mantel, am I correct?
Yes, yes. So I was the closest town to me
that held weekly wrestling was Evansville, IN.
Yeah, at the old Veteran Coliseum.
Downtown and Oh yeah, Oh yeah, that was.
A big Memphis, Memphis town. Big Memphis town.
I would go every Wednesday nightto Evansville and started going
(16:19):
when I was like 14 years old riding with friends and stuff.
We'd go to one night I bought a program and there was an ad in
it that said have you ever dreamed of becoming a
professional wrestler and all this kind of stuff?
Send some pictures and a little story about yourself to this PO
Box in Nashville. So I did and a couple weeks
(16:40):
later I get a letter back says be at the fairgrounds in
Nashville, which was a big Jaredspot on this particular Tuesday
morning at 8:00 AM. Don't be late, bring $50.00
with. So I get up early, I go down
there and there's like 15 other guys there and we're all
standing around talking amongst each other.
(17:03):
Hey, you know, And then a littlered Ford Escort pulls up, Dutch
Mintel steps out of it, and I was like, Oh my God, that's
Dutch Mintel. Because we had no idea who was
going to be there. I thought maybe it was Jared
going to do something with. Us.
Sure, because that was consistent.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
And so Dutch gets out and he walks up, introduces himself to
(17:25):
all of us, asks all of us if we had our money Hands.
Sticks his hand out. We all place money in his hand.
He goes. All right, guys, you see the
racetrack down there? Yeah.
You see that point over there? Yep.
He said start running and I'll tell you when to.
And he ran us around that entireparking lot for the fairgrounds
(17:47):
and all of us were falling out throwing up like literally.
And then he, he's like, all right, guys, y'all are all sick
to your stomachs. You're done for the day.
Be back Thursday morning, 8:00. Bring me another $50.
I'm like, oh, I see where this is going already, you know?
And yeah, so. Did he cut somebody that day?
(18:07):
Did he cut anybody the first day?
No, no, he didn't cut anything. Thursday morning rolled around
and it was me and one other guy showed up.
No one else shoved back up. Yeah.
Dutch says, all right, give me your money, start running, same
lap that you did last time. So me and the guys start running
and we run for about 30 minutes.We start throwing up.
(18:30):
Then Dutch has us doing Hindu squats and all of this whole
time outside it, you know, and it was hot.
It wasn't overly hot, but it washot.
So Dutch says all right, we're done for the day.
Be back Tuesday morning 8:00. I was the only one that showed
back up. Dutch goes, Now that we weeded
out the ones that aren't serious, we can start.
(18:50):
And that's when we went into thebuilding and started.
You started the training, you know.
Dude, that's magic. Now think about how smart Dutch
is. OK, First off, here's Dutch,
obviously legendary pro wrestler, OK?
Comes with a great reputation oftraining wrestlers.
And most guys would stretch the guys immediately, you know, and
(19:11):
get them in the ring, stretch them, you know, weed them out
that way. No, Dutch is so smart.
He didn't even touch y'all. He made you run Hindu and pay
$50. That's how he got rid of the
guys that didn't want to do it. That's another level of Dutchess
genius, you know? Yeah, and I say all the time
that Dutch and Jimmy Cornett areprobably the 2 greatest minds in
(19:36):
the wrestling industry period. Are not.
Wouldn't argue all that. Yeah.
And a lot of people just disputeit a little bit.
Dutch is probably the greatest Booker to ever be in the
business. And I mean, you know, everybody
says Dusty was, I think Dutch was.
Yeah, but I mean, we can argue that if, if if need be, but I, I
(19:57):
really don't want to. I think you're right, man.
I'm going to go with Dutch on that too, because I mean, dusty,
dusty kind of turned 1 trick pony a little bit in the end,
you know, that's the problem with guys.
They start to run out of ideas, you know?
But yeah, and again, I won't argue because I think, I think
Dutch, I think you're probably right on that.
So Gator, what was your after all this training and
(20:18):
everything, what was your first match?
My very first match was against a guy named Cokela Khan, Terry
Adonis. He worked in Memphis off and on.
He did like the green shadow gimmick in Memphis and all that
kind of stuff. We were in Bowling Green, KY for
(20:40):
Dell TNT Man, who is an old timer, old school guy, but.
He turned. The promoter and I, I was
showing up and helping set up the ring and all this kind of
stuff. I was paying my dues and had no
clue that I was going to work that night.
And somebody didn't show up. Terry went to Dale and said,
(21:00):
hey, I've got this kid. You know, I've been working with
him a little bit and let me workhim.
So they come to me and was like,hey, you're going to work
tonight, get dressed. And I was terrified, scared to
death. I mean, I was a kid, you know,
Dutch broke me in when I was 15 years old, so.
OK, OK. Wow.
(21:21):
I was, yeah, I was still a kid, lied to the athletic Commission
so that I could get a license towrestle in the state of
Kentucky. Which not the first, not the
last. Yeah, exactly. 15 years old, I
was £250, six foot three. OK, Yeah, I was a big kid
(21:41):
football player, you know, But Iget ready, my music hits, I take
off, run into the ring, jumped up on the side of the ring.
And he had, he didn't have a regular canvas.
He had one of those final. Oh.
Yeah, like, yeah. Yeah, and whoever it worked the
match beforehand had baby oil onand all that good stuff, so.
(22:03):
Oh. Man.
I hit the side of the ring and went straight to my back.
Oh man. And I was like, well, that's it.
My career's over. I'm done, you know.
Oh man, that's so funny. Having a really good match and
Dell liked me and he was like, you want to be back next week?
(22:25):
And I'm like absolutely. So that that was where it all
began. Maybe I missed it, Did you say
what promotion that was with? I'm trying to remember what the
name of his promotion was. It was like MWA or something.
Yeah, like Mountain Wrestling Association because he ran a lot
of shows in Eastern Kentucky over.
In the mountain, yeah. So I'm.
(22:46):
Thinking that's what it was, this mountain wrestling
Association. And Dale was pretty famous for
doing the kind of like Chris Michaels and taking characters
that were kind of famous and maybe sticking a last name on
the people and stuff. And you know, there's nothing
wrong with that, but whatever itis, but this is a question that
kind of. So what name were you going by
at that point, Peter? My very first match, I was
(23:09):
jumping Joe Hopkins because I didn't have my gimmick yet.
I didn't I didn't know what I was going to do and what I was
going to be. So for probably the first four
months, I I wrestled this Jumping Joe Hopkins and and then
I was like, yeah, I can't do that.
I want something that's catchy and flashy.
And that's when me and Dutch goton the phone and he gave me
(23:32):
advice on how to come up with mygimmick and all of that stuff.
So. And even though you are Joe,
you're definitely not a jumping Joe, man.
You're 63. You're a big kid.
That's dumb. I'm sorry.
You know what I mean? But you know what it is?
I mean exactly and that. Was the that that Dale Mann put
on me? So it just, it wasn't me.
(23:54):
It didn't work for me. I didn't do drop kicks, you
know, nothing. So there was no jumping other
than off the ring to the floor. That was about it.
Yeah, no jumping. So, okay, Gator McAllister, it's
a great wrestling now, man, I'vealways yeah, yeah, it is.
I've always thought that and ever since I've met you, I was
(24:16):
like, man, that is the best wrestling name ever.
So tell me, where did you come up with that?
How did that come up? Me and my first wife, 19.
I don't even remember what year it was.
Probably around 89, I guess. We're sitting around and and I'm
like, I have to come up with a wrestling gimmick, you know?
(24:38):
And we're brainstorming and brainstorming.
And I had the TV on. It was on TBS at the time and
the movie White Lightning came on, which is an old Burt
Reynolds movie where he's a moonshiner.
His name in the movie is Gator McCluskey.
That's right. And to this day, that's still
what build on D calls me but andI said what?
(25:03):
She said Gator. And I was like, well, I would
really like that, but I can't beat Gator McCluskey.
Everybody will associate it withthe movie, you know.
Yeah. And so she was like, OK, well,
we'll come up with something fora last name.
She was like, so just sit on andand think on that.
Think on the Gator thing. Well, that movie goes off and
still sitting around just piddling and a movie called Ode
(25:26):
to Billy Joel. Come on.
Which is an old poppy. It was based off of an old poppy
Gentry song. Yeah, I've got a kid named Billy
Joe McAllister. Yeah, and I went.
What do you think about that? She's like, what?
And I said McAllister, she goes,well, is it a common name for
Louisiana? Because I knew that I was going
(25:47):
to be from Louisiana, right? So I actually had a New Orleans
phone book because that was one of my favorite places in the
world to go to. And I got it.
And I started flipping through it because it was like 10 pages
of Mcallister's. Wow and.
But it was spelled MCCALLISTER. So it was like Mick Callister.
(26:12):
And I'm looking at it. And I told her, I said I want to
spell it differently. I want to be a little bit
different with it. And she said, OK, so I dropped
one of the C's and I dropped oneof the L's.
So it became instead of Mick Callister, it was Mick Allister.
Yeah, OK. Yeah.
I called Dutch up and I said Dutch.
I got it. I got the gimmick.
(26:33):
I got the name. He said, what is it?
And I told him and he said I really like the sound of it.
He said, where are you from? I said, I'm going to be from New
Orleans. He's like, do you know how many
GED wrestlers there are from NewOrleans?
You know how Dutch is? He started kind of spazzing up.
I said, OK, what a he said, are you related to Sherry Martel?
I said no. He said, then why be from Baton
(26:54):
Rouge? I'm like, OK, Dutch, where am I
going to be from? Dirt Texas or oil truck and he
said get a map of Louisiana. He said study the math.
He said scan every town that yousee and when you find the place
that sounds completely made-up, that's when you know where
(27:15):
you're going to be from. So I did and just just off the
coast of Louisiana is a NationalWildlife Refuge place and it's a
little island and it's called Marsh Island, Marsh Island
Wildlife Refuge. And I was like, that's it.
(27:36):
That is it. I'm Gator McAllister from Marsh
Island, Louisiana, and I ran with him.
You. Know and yeah.
Everything from that day forward, everything for me
changed his wrestling business. Dude that is awesome.
That makes so much sense too. I got a quick little story.
I was doing the, I don't know ifyou Remember Me doing the Chic
(27:56):
Prince Omar gimmick at all, Joe,but but yeah, OK, I didn't know
if you'd remember that. Well, one day at a Bert show,
Dutch was working and Dutch looked me up and down and I was
wearing that gimmick and I I could tell he was, you know,
wheels were turning. He said, well, you know, you
just manage me. You're all right, but we got to
get you a different gimmick. There's not much going there
(28:18):
with a Caucasian Middle Easterner.
So he actually didn't come up with a new gimmick for me, but
he pushed me in that direction to just drop the gimmick and be
myself. So anyway, you know, got to give
Dutchess, like you said, he's one of the smartest guys in the
business and has has a great mind.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Promotional consideration paid
(28:39):
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(29:24):
So I was doing my research and this is crazy, man.
So we are from a little town called Lebanon, Virginia,
probably like 3000 population tops.
It's real close to Bristol, VA, Bristol, TN, whatever you want
to call it. But you actually worked at a
high school in Oakwood, VA, it'sGarden High School, and you
worked for Smoky Mountain there.Now again, I don't want to go
(29:46):
too far into that, but why don'tyou lead us up to going to Smoky
Mountain, if you don't mind? That was all Dutch I had.
I had. I knew about Smoky Mountain.
Yeah. And there they did a big show in
Knoxville called Fire on the Mountain.
Oh yeah, yeah. And it was pre, I guess it
(30:08):
wasn't pre pay-per-view, but if they would have done
pay-per-view, that would have been Smoky Mountains
WrestleMania, yeah. Exactly smoky.
Mountain Smoky Mountain was run by Jim Cornette and had the
Armstrongs and the Rock'n'roll and everybody there.
Well, Dutch had started a deal that he was doing called Ring of
Dreams and what it was you couldjust take normal people, give
(30:33):
them a crash course in, in wrestling for like 2 weeks and
then guaranteed him like a dark match, if you will.
So we had this, this professor from like New England somewhere,
like the guy was a professor at a big university up there and
he, he wanted to do it. It'd been a dream of his, but
(30:55):
he, he was, he wasn't a big guy,little scrawny fella, you know.
So that's brought him to my wrestling school that I was
actually had at the top and we crashed course enough to get him
through like a 6 minute match. And that says OK, you need to
come with me talking to me to fire on the mountain.
I said why? He said because that's where
(31:17):
we're going to do this match. I'm like, are you serious?
He goes yeah, I'm like OK, you know.
So we go and we do this this match and all of the boys come
out of the back. Jimmy Cornett comes out of the
back. At that time, Taz was working
for Cornett and Smoky Mountain Rd.
(31:37):
Dog was under a mask, you know, you know, all those guys were
there. So everybody comes out and
watches this match, sees the bumps that I'm taking and how
I'm eating this guy and making him shy, you know, and it was
recorded for me. And we get done.
We go towards the dressing room and they wouldn't let us go into
the actual dressing room where the boys were.
(31:58):
Well, all of them started comingover talking to me and Cornett
comes over to me and he goes, you did good kid.
And I was like, well, thank you,Mr. Cornett, you know, and he
goes interested. Been doing some TV shots for me
and I'm like, done. You just tell me when and where
I'll be there, you know, And so that that's how it came about.
(32:18):
And then like, I rode with Dutchquite a bit, doing Smoky
Mountain Towns, working with guys like Tracy Smothers,
working with Ron and Don Harris,Chris Candido, Brian Lee, Killer
Kyle. Got to work with all of the
James boys, Brad, Brian with Armstrong.
(32:40):
I worked with all of them. You know, it was, it was fun.
Ended up doing several shows forCornet that weren't televised.
I think we did. I think we did did four or five
televised and then did like a bunch of the spot shelves for
him. Yeah, yeah.
Well, this one specifically was in Oakwood, Virginia Garden High
(33:01):
School, which is so close to us,we could basically spit and lay.
It would land there. And of course, you worked three
matches in one day. It appears Killer Kyle Bruce
Brothers and Tracy Smothers for.I mean, how is it working three
matches in one day? We spread it out like the Tracy
(33:22):
match was the very first match that I worked and it was the
very first match of the night. So me and Tracy kind of set the
pace. Then it was probably an hour and
a half before I went back out. When I went back out, it was A
tag match against Ramadan Harris.
Which is intelligent because that gives you some more rest
(33:44):
and you know, you don't have to work the full match.
Yeah, right. Exactly.
And then the third match was is when they were doing the beat
the champ gimmick there and Killer Kyle was the champion at
the time for the beat the champ thing.
And they drew my name out of thehat.
So I had to go out and mark him.And out of the three matches I
(34:04):
love, Tracy Smothers, one of theone of the the best in ring guys
that I've ever been in the ring with.
But of all of those matches, thematch that I had with Killer
Kyle was my favorite. And it was because he actually
gave me a little shy. OK.
Tracy, I was just just out thereto make Tracy look good.
(34:24):
And of course, Ron and Don, you know, nobody got any kind of
shine with Ron and Don. You showed how well you can sell
with them. That's your shine with them,
Yeah. Exactly.
And like kill Kyle, he did. His gimmick was he was like this
mafioso hitman type guy, you know, carry the file in case
(34:44):
ring and all that stuff. And Mark was just so cool.
He was so nice to me. He was like, who broke you?
And I was like Dutch, he goes, oh, we're going out and have a
good match then, you know, and that was it.
And he went out and let me get my shine in on him.
And then he cut me off and took it home.
And so it mentalized and me and him ended up getting together
(35:06):
later a few years later in WCW and actually traveled.
Together. That's awesome.
That's awesome. Yeah.
Now with that being said, now, how much longer did you spend
working Smoky Mountain or did itkind of end there for you there?
Yeah, it pretty well did. It wasn't long after that that
went back to Puerto Rico and Smoky Smoky closed up.
(35:27):
So I went to work for Memphis after the Smoky Mountain thing,
and I wasn't, I wasn't doing Memphis TV, but they put me on
all of the house shows. Yeah, you know, so.
And this is USWA at the time, ofcourse.
Yeah. So yeah.
Yeah, yeah, USWA, which I was working for Bert Prentice and
Bert is the one that got me in the door with Memphis,
(35:50):
introduced me to Randy Handles and Guy Coffee and all of them.
And then I was working a lot of Memphis guys on Berts shows,
Brian Christopher, Jerry Lawler and all of them.
So yeah, yeah, it opened up. Bert opened up a lot of doors
from me. Gotcha.
That's awesome. Gator, did I see that you had
worked in in Puerto Rico some and I would maybe assume that
(36:13):
was with Dutch? Yes, yes, that Dutch was booking
in Puerto Rico and he called me up one night and, and out of the
blue, and he was like, man, I need some familiar faces over
here. He said, you want to come over
and work And I'm like done. And he's like, well, can't
guarantee any kind of major money and all this and all that.
(36:35):
He's like, but you'll be over here.
It'll be a good experience for you.
You know, I was like 2122 at thetime.
I'm like, yeah, you know, I'm. I'm down.
So which Puerto Rico? That's where I met Glenn Jacobs.
Worked him for the very first time.
Wow. Which I was scared to death
(36:56):
working with him. He's a monster.
You know, of course, nicest, gentlest guys I've ever been in
the ring with. And I got to meet and work with
Eddie Gilbert. I.
Grew up watching Eddie, you know?
So yeah, for sure. And he actually got really,
really, really close while I wason the island and he took care
(37:18):
of me. I was actually the last American
wrestler to work with Eddie before he passed away.
Man, so sad. We talk about it all the time.
Like what would he be doing now?I feel like somebody would he
might even have his own very famous promotion.
You know, he would, he would be,you know, unless he just decided
(37:39):
to leave it all alone and do something different.
But I just feel like somebody would be using him right now as
a, you know, a high level executive, you know, so.
No doubt, I have no doubt, you know.
Now, you didn't do any Icy Hot on anybody down there like
Wolfie did for Armadito, right? I couldn't.
(38:02):
I couldn't do all that. I was too scared.
You know, my first night at one of the shows, I Dutch tells me
he's like, you're going to be a babyface.
I don't want to put this much heat on you as a heel.
I said, OK, so he's like, your dressing room's over there.
I'm like, OK, I go over and I gointo the dressing room and
there's like 10 guys in there. I go in, I say hello to
(38:24):
everybody, I sit down and everybody gets up and walks out
of the dressing room except for Invader.
Gotcha. Anybody that knows anything
about the wrestling business knows who Invader is, right?
And so I'm in my mind, in my adolescent mind, I'm thinking,
this is the guy that killed Bruiser Brody.
(38:46):
He doesn't like America. He's going to kill me.
And it wasn't that long ago. That wasn't that long ago.
Exactly. And so I'm terrified that he
gets up and he's got this weird look in in his eyes and I'm
thinking here we go. You know, I have no knife on me.
I have no gun, nothing. I'm.
Just gonna say that, Brody, you know?
And he comes over, sticks his hand out, introduces himself to
(39:09):
me, sits down beside me, and we had a hell of a conversation.
He talked about when he wrestledin the States.
He knew exactly where I was from, ended up being a really
nice guy. I'm not sure what happened with
him and Brody. I wasn't there so I can't speak
on it, but he treated me very well and with a lot of respect
while I was on the island so. Yeah, yeah.
(39:31):
And with me and Jared, you'll never find 2 bigger Bruiser
Brody fans. I mean, honestly, we love him,
but we know that he could be hard headed.
We know that, you know. Yeah, absolutely.
And nobody knows truly what happened.
I mean, honestly, nobody. I mean, I know Dutch knows a lot
of it. I know Tony Falk was there.
I know Abdullah was there. I know Tony Atlas.
I know. So all these guys knew a little
bit about the deal and it probably more than anybody has
(39:53):
ever let on. But when it comes down to it,
nobody actually knows what happened in that locker room.
But you know, that's impressive.Two people know, and that was
Brody, an invader, and one of them can't talk about it.
One of them can't, one of the other one won't, you know.
So yeah. Exactly.
Yeah. So how long were you in Puerto
Rico? I.
(40:13):
Was in Puerto Rico for a couple months.
I flew back a few times and then, you know, over that couple
months period there I was kind of flying back and taking care
of things in in Kentucky and allof that.
But it was fun. It was, it was really good
learning experience. The first time I'd ever worked a
show where we had to call in riot squads to get the boys out
(40:36):
of the building. I mean, it was, it was wild,
very wild up. There, Yeah.
Now what was the famous hotel that everybody stayed at?
Motel or whatever it was called?Do you remember the?
I do not remember the name of itit.
Was heard a million times. Yeah, if I was scared, I'd be.
Like I said, that's the name, but I can't think of it.
(40:57):
Too many concussions. Really close to the airport.
It was like a block away from a Denny's where we all went to
eat. And across the street from the
Denny's was a bird fighting arena, a cock fighting arena.
And I asked Dutch one time, I said, hey, let's go to the go to
(41:18):
the chicken fights. He was like, no, we're not
going. No chicken fights neither they
will kill us in there. I'm like, OK, never mind, you
know? They don't want to die.
Let's know. Yeah.
But I mean, you know, you. I'm sorry.
You grew up in Kentucky. We grew up in Southwest
Virginia. Chicken fighting's a real
popular thing, man. You know, We won't know names,
guys, but, you know, may or may not have seen it ourselves.
(41:41):
Let's just say that we'll go with anyway.
I remember the first time my brother and I saw it, it was
just like, holy crap, man. Yeah, yeah.
But we're not going to admit anymore than anything else.
So, So OK, you come back from Puerto Rico and now I know you'd
(42:01):
worked in USWA prior to Puerto Rico, but you actually come back
and you, you actually worked forColorado kids.
So Bert was your connection. So he basically you took the
time to go to Puerto Rico and then you come back and work
USWA. Is that correct as well to go
back to Memphis? Yeah, yeah.
Went back, did some more from Memphis, did some more work for
Bert, and in between all of thatI was working for different
(42:26):
N.W.A territories. OK, Yeah.
Tell us about that. Oh, Lord, I've worked N.W.A
territories in Texas, West Virginia.
I worked for Dennis Carluzzo when he was running the N.W.A in
Jersey. Doug Gilbert actually set that
up for me. OK, I worked, Good Lord,
Chicago, there was an N.W.A territory that was up around
(42:49):
Chicago worked up there. Florida held multiple tag titles
in the N.W.A with different partners throughout the years.
It's awesome, It's awesome. Trying to think in just local
independent stuff like in Kentucky, Tennessee, Indiana,
Illinois area. I did a lot of that.
(43:11):
Yeah, yeah. So you're working USWA and I was
a big deal for you, I would imagine.
It was, it was a really big deal.
I mean, that's what I grew up watching.
So I'm in the ring with all of my childhood heroes and my
influences, and I'm working the same buildings that I had seen
on TV, you know, like the Louisville Gardens.
(43:33):
I remember the first time I got to work there, first time I
worked the Evansville Coliseum, first time I worked the
Nashville Fairgrounds, you know,the first time I did the the Mid
South Coliseum and. The Blue Man, That's awesome.
Yeah. Exactly, Exactly.
It was doing like some of the little house shows around
Western Kentucky and Arkansas. And you know which for me, the
(43:57):
Louisville Gardens was my Madison Square Garden.
You know Gardens was bigger thanworked in the Mid South Coliseum
in Memphis. Yeah, yeah, which is funny.
You know, I'm the Co host of theWolfie D show.
I know all our listeners know that a million times over now.
But, you know, Wolfie always said that the Nashville
Fairgrounds was his Madison Square Garden, but, you know,
(44:17):
obviously working the Mid South Coliseum, but he actually liked
Louisville better than Mid Southand in in the terms of how well
the Louisville crowds were and how much they just love the
wrestling, you know, there and and.
Was the town, in my opinion, forMemphis, it really.
Was, yeah, it was a great town and such a legendary building.
(44:39):
I mean, the names that have beenin that building, it's just blow
your mind, you know? And now a word from our sponsor.
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(45:00):
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(45:24):
Gator, tell us about IWA Mid South.
Oh boy, oh boy. So when I worked for Burke
Prentice, me and Bull, pain got really close.
And Bull called me up one night and he was like, hey, I've got a
guy that's going to run Louisville.
(45:46):
He needs a promoter's license. I'm like, OK, he goes and a
ring. I said, OK, does does he have
anything? He's got some talent.
I said, OK, who is it? He said Ian Rotten.
I said from ECW he goes, yeah, he said he's actually got a
ring. He said, but something fell
(46:08):
through for tonight and he can'tget the ring.
Can you bring your ring and let him, you know, act like you're
the promoter for this show? And I was like, you know, I
guess what's what's the payoff on it, you know, because written
in the ring plus he my promoterslicense and am I going to be
booked on the show? Yeah, you're going to work.
(46:30):
I said, OK, so we work out a deal.
I go up I median rotten and he told me that night a guy named
Mike Golden who him and his dad built wrestling rings for a lot
of Tennessee and and Kentucky, West Virginia and Virginia
(46:50):
promotions. They built really good steel
rings and he did like the big cowboy game.
So me and him work and we get done, go to the back.
Ian Rotten's like, wow, you know, I was like, what?
He goes, dude, he's like, you just went out there and took
complete control of my show. I was like, no, I just went out
(47:12):
there and did what I do, you know?
Yeah. And he goes, you've got a job.
What is simple? You've got a job.
I want you to hear every single show that we run.
I'm like, OK, you know, And it, it works really good for a
while. And and Ian was bringing in all
these like top men guys, a lot of the ECW guys.
(47:32):
The Public Enemy 911 had Dutch working, Tommy Ridge, Doug
Gilbert and then some, some likehigh flying guys, reckless, huge
from up north. Yeah, hot on independence at the
time Ian was bringing them in, you know, And of course, anybody
that knows about IWA knows it was a blood and gut still, you
(47:56):
know, Mondo and Ian rotten out there in barbed wire and
thumbtacks and broken glass. I love Pondo.
What up Pondo and all of this kind of stuff.
And the athletic Commission started to really hammer down
South. They show up one night to the
show and tell us that me and Ianand my ex-wife, because the
(48:20):
promoter's license was at her name, had to go to Frankfort,
KY, to the offices of the athletic Commission for a
meeting. We're like, OK, so we go to the
meeting and they proceed to tellus that there's going to be no
more blood, no more this, no more that.
Don't do it again. They're going to strip me of my
license, my wrestling license, and they're going to take my
(48:43):
promoter's license away from me.So I told Ian.
I said, Ian, you've got to find somebody else to do the
promoter's license thing. I can't risk losing that.
He was like, no, I understand completely.
Like when you keep working for me, I said, yeah, I'll keep
working for you. So he ended up getting, I think
it was Rico Beatty who was one of his ring announcers.
(49:05):
I think she's the one that endedup getting a promoter's license.
And that's how they continued running after I pulled my
promoter's license away from thesituation.
Gotcha. OK, OK.
So I mean, we know Iwa Mid Southis legendary for a lot of
things. I mean, you know, definitely got
a hardcore vibe in there. But also, you know, like seeing
Punk, Samoa Joe, so many of these guys that are still
(49:26):
wrestling today got their start there because they were coming
down from the north. It was kind of like a media from
the North and the South, you know, and a lot of a lot of guys
came in there. I know you worked some guys like
Todd Mort and Tommy Rich Ox, Harley Madman Pondo in a big old
match with all bunch of guys there.
I guess the one I want to ask you about though is talk about
working Tommy Rich man. I love working with Tommy.
(49:49):
Tommy and Tommy is so much fun to work with.
One of the easiest guys I've ever been in the ring.
Everything was Tommy Float, you know?
I mean, it was just, it wasn't, I don't want to say it was
magic, but it flowed and it was so easy and it was flawless.
Like, I mean, there was no effort that you had to put into
(50:09):
it when you were in the ring with Tommy, right?
Right. That's.
I was over with Doug and Tommy because of Eddie Gilbert, right?
The first time I met Doug and Tommy was on the Memphis show
that we were doing in Arkansas. And I walked up and I introduced
myself to him and Doug stood straight up and he said, you're
(50:30):
the Gator that was in Puerto Rico with my brother.
And I said yes. And he gave me a hug.
And he said Eddie thought the world of you.
He said over with Eddie. You're over with me.
That's all I need. If you're over with Eddie and
you're over with Doug, you're over with me, Brother Wildfire,
you know? Yeah.
(50:50):
Exactly. Exactly.
So I mean, it was always, you know, like friends and and stuff
being in there with each other instead of a legend with some
green guy, you know. Right.
Yeah, dude, one time in the backat saw Gator.
It was so funny. I was standing there and, you
know, you're waiting to go out there and as you're standing
(51:11):
there to walk up the steps, to go down the ramp from the back,
I'm standing there and the music's playing and I'm an idiot
and I always start doing air guitar.
I carried a cane. I started doing air guitar.
And, you know, Tommy and Doug were there and Tommy looks over
and he like pokes Doug. And he says, I dug, I dug.
Oh, Shiki's playing the guitar. He told me we're up there for
(51:37):
yay and he he come over, he's like I said yeah, he said
Goldfire, you know wildfire, a bear.
I was like, Tommy, what time beer you want?
He's like hell. I don't care as long as you
start with Avi was like all. Right, he didn't care as long as
it started with AV. That is legendary.
(51:57):
God bless Tommy rich man. So, OK, so you work from Iwa Mid
South and you you keep working there and you work there for a
good amount of time, am I right?Yeah, I was probably a couple
years. Yeah, I had a, you know, some
phenomenal talent and had some great matches with people.
Had some really bad injuries there.
(52:20):
That's where I broke my back work.
Work with Tracy's mothers. It was one of those freak freak
things. It was a chair shot to the back
and shattered 2 vertebrae. Chair shot.
It was just one of those freak accidents that happened.
Tracy felt bad. Like, oh, I bet he felt
(52:42):
horrible, Yeah. Yeah, tears.
Tears flow. Just Me and Tracy had known each
other for years, you know, so hefelt really bad about that.
Tom Burton, dirty white boy, broke my neck.
Oh my God, Tom Burton. Talk about Tom, man, because
I've heard dirty white boy and Tom Dirty was not happy in that
tag team, I've heard. And Tom is, even though he may
(53:04):
not have showed it, he was definitely not happy in that tag
team now. Yeah, talk about Tom Burton.
Dirty white boy man, you. Know TomTom was Tom was one of
those guys. If he thought that he could get
something over on you, he would try it in the dressing room.
Super nice guy. I never had an issue with Tom at
(53:25):
all. Yeah.
Until that night. Yeah.
And, you know, he was with CandyDevine.
Candy always showed me a lot of respect, treated me nice.
Sweetheart, I've heard, I've heard she was a nice.
Yeah, yeah, she was. And Tom had always been really
good with me. And when he came to IWA, he
thought that he was in Japan andhe was having to do strong style
(53:46):
and shoot on guys. And.
He was known for doing like throws, German suplexes, all
that kind of stuff, right? Well, I was hurt from the week
before NIWA, and I told him, I said, Tom, we'll do anything you
want to do. I said, all I ask is please
don't give me any throws. I'm hurt.
(54:08):
Yeah. OK kid, whatever you say, right?
We get in the room, we lock up, and he immediately spins me
around and dumps me on top of myhead with a shoe.
Oh. My gosh, man.
I mean, very first thing right off the bat, boom and broke my
neck. It it broke my neck and I was
(54:28):
terrified. The impact of my head was so bad
I went blind while I was out there.
Wow. I backed myself into a corner
and it was actually a like a want to say a six man tag.
It was I believe madman Pondo, Tom Burton and Macho Warrior
Rick Hogan. Yes, again, me, Ian Rotten.
(54:52):
Gypsy Joe. No, it might have been Fox
Harley. I can't remember who the third
one was on our team, but I backed myself into a corner and
I grabbed Ian. I said, Ian, I'm blind.
I can't see and I'm hurt. Tom hurt me.
Ian's like just just sit right here.
Just sit right here. So Ian goes in, he gets Tom,
they go to the floor. Well, I feel around and I feel a
(55:14):
2 by 4 and I pick it up and I held it and anytime I felt like
somebody was coming near me, I swung it.
You know, I didn't know who was coming.
I, I just, I wasn't taking any chances.
We get to the. Full pain grabs hold of me and
he's like come with me. He lays me down on the floor,
does some feeling and stuff. He he wraps a towel around my
neck and tells me not to take itoff.
(55:37):
Ian comes in, hands me my envelope.
He said go to the hospital and go now.
So I end up going to the hospital, the CAT scans, X-rays,
all that. That's how we found out that my
neck was broken. I went back the next week.
I was in like Halo and all that stuff and I talked to Bull on
the phone. I'm like hurt and broke my neck,
you know. So Bull's like, OK, So I get to
(55:59):
the show the next week and Bull calls me inside and he goes, I'm
working time tonight. I'm like, OK, he goes, I'm
getting your receipt for you. I'm like, OK, why?
He's like because and bull pain went out there and I mean beat
the shit out of Burton was crying man his ass and Burton
(56:22):
was crying. And, well, you do that to me for
him. Oh, man.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
And I, I worked Tom a couple times after that and never felt
anything he did. And I guess it was because he
figured if he, if he shot you onme, you'd have to deal with
bull, you know? Yeah, yeah, man.
How long did it take you to healfrom that?
(56:45):
So my back, I was back in the ring in a month, OK.
My neck, I was out for three months and went back against
doctor's orders, but I couldn't take it no more.
Back in the ring. Yeah.
Right, of course. That's right, it's the talk of
(57:05):
Middle Tennessee, the channel you love to hate and the channel
you hate to love. It's Brian Turner from Brian
Turner's VHS Rehab and if you'relooking for matches from.
Wolfie D to Jerry Lawler to Dusty Rhodes and the team that
put a pimp before your eyes and a goatee put 2 in your thighs.
Booty KO and Athena go to lostwrestling.com.
See I made it easy for you. Brian Turner's VHS Rehab Booyah.
(57:30):
Hi, this is Mike Needham, host of the Reckless Abandoned
podcast with Mike Needham. We invite you to jump on your
favorite podcast platform and search for the Reckless
Abandoned podcast and give us a listen.
I'm sometimes joined by a part time podcaster, part time Co
host and full time wife Kidney in the cold.
We talk wrestling, we talk pop culture, we talk local events,
(57:52):
local happenings in West Tennessee, and a ton of other
stuff. But be sure to check out the
Reckless Abandoned Podcast, findus on Facebook.
Also look up the micro group Podcasting Family on Facebook
and see some of our other podcasts we have out there.
Until next time, make good choices and always remember, no
Dollar, no dice. Ladies and gentlemen, this is
(58:26):
Jimmy St. and that was episode 12 of the Best of James Rock St.
Productions with the first half of episode 40 of Gator
McAllister on Give Me Back My Pro Wrestling.
Gator's got some great stories and this episode is actually one
of our top ranked shows of all time.
You can hear the full episode and more over on at G MB, MPW or
Give Me Back My Pro Wrestling wherever you listen to podcasts
(58:47):
or simply click the link in the notes below.
We hope you've enjoyed a look back in the archives of James
Rock St. Productions.
Check us out next week to see what else we have in store.
Until then, follow at G, MB, MPWand at James Rock St.
everywhere. Peace with a tear in my eye,
this. Is the greatest moment in my
(59:09):
life. This has been a James Rock St.
(59:40):
production.
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