April 28, 2025 • 39 mins
Defeating a trophy blacktail's senses requires extraordinary dedication and methodical preparation. In this deep-dive conversation, Aaron and Dave explore the critical components of entering a hunting set without alerting deer through their incredibly sensitive ears, eyes, and nose.
The hosts begin by shattering a common misconception: "You're never as quiet as you think you are." Dave shares his philosophy on trail preparation, recommending gradual habitat modifications spread across multiple visits rather than dramatic one-time changes that make deer wary. For those who only visit their hunting areas occasionally before season, strategic pruning with hand shears creates just enough clearance for quiet passage without establishing obvious human trails.
Equipment selection proves equally crucial, with Aaron and Dave examining how expensive modern hunting gear can sometimes work against you. They discuss waterproof rain jackets that make unnatural sounds against vegetation, metal components that create alarming clanks, and practical solutions for each challenge. Visual concealment strategies follow, including the use of screen vegetation as artificial visual barriers and proper headlamp discipline when approaching sets in darkness.
Perhaps most vital is their comprehensive approach to scent control. The hosts outline their meticulous process: traveling to hunting locations in base layers, changing into scent-free hunting clothes stored in sealed bags, applying field spray, and reversing the process when departing. This level of dedication isn't necessary for harvesting average deer but becomes essential when pursuing record-book blacktails that simply won't tolerate human odor.
The conversation culminates with fascinating insights into extreme tactics like sleeping overnight in stands, hiking significant distances to approach from favorable wind directions, and studying thermal patterns to time entries perfectly. As Aaron notes approaching his third year of hunting, these might seem like extraordinary measures, but they represent the mindset difference between casual hunters and those consistently harvesting mature blacktail bucks.
Ready to take your blacktail hunting to the next level? Visit blacktailcoach.com to discover our upcoming boot camps and training opportunities designed to help you consistently pursue trophy-class blacktails.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back to the Blacktail Coach Podcast.
I'm Aaron and I'm Dave, so thisweek we're talking about the
best way in, so thinking aboutwhen we're going into our set,
that whole process, and becauseI was kind of concerned with one
of my sets, with the ears, eyesand the nose and different
situations that I've been in inthe last couple of years since
I've started hunting, so I wantto talk to you about, you know,
(00:22):
what are some things that weshould be doing, and then stuff
you've already shared with me,but just to get some more ideas
out there and some just thingsthat we might not have been
thinking about, that we shouldbe considering, okay, so that
we're not bumping deer out ofour set permanently Right.
So, understanding they mightleave for a minute or an hour or
(00:42):
so, but come back, which isfine, but not they're
permanently gone, right?
So, first thing, we're going tostart off with ears.
The deer are going to hear us.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Yeah, I think it's kind of like the whole scent
thing.
I don't think that you're everas quiet as you think you are.
Yeah, you know the whole scentthing is you're never 100% scent
free and as long as you'rebreathing and whatnot, you can
never be 100% scent free.
But the same I would think asfar as the noise factor goes, is
you're never as quiet, as quietas you think you are, and
(01:15):
sometimes it's actuallybeneficial to make noise as
you're going in uh-huh so theyou know, just depending on the
situation, little tricks thatI've developed over the years
just to give them an idea thatyou're coming in.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
With this system that you put together, we're set
hunting and we're generally mostof the time we're right inside
real thick areas.
Well, I might have to walkthrough about 60 yards of real
thick stuff, but I'm only about20, 25 yards off a skidder road.
But walking through three, fourfoot five foot tall salal is
(01:50):
making a lot of racket right,and so you know we've we've
talked about cutting in trailsuh-huh so what's the idea behind
doing that if we're set hunting?
Speaker 2 (02:02):
so when I, when I have a set and I and I boy this,
I could go a couple differentways with this one here.
Um, we'll go both ways.
You know well, like today.
I was out scouting today, uh,some places in in oregon, and I
found one place and I thought,you know, and guys I see guys do
(02:23):
this too they'll put out acamera in a spot where they
think they're going to do a setthroughout.
You know, and they and they'llstart at early spring or early
summer and they want to watch it, monitor it throughout the
summer.
You know, and in Oregon you canbait, so guys will put out bait
and they'll go in there everyso often to replenish the bait.
If that is your scenario and youhave an opportunity where
(02:44):
you're going to go in multipletimes throughout the summer,
what I tell guys is this is thatdon't change everything at once
.
If you have the opportunity andthis is how the scenario goes
where you have multiple times,you're going to go in throughout
the summer before season takethe time to slowly transition
that trail to being quiet.
In other words, like when youdid the Salau and stuff.
(03:07):
Well, you decided you weregoing to do it one day.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
But you were not going to go back out there every
other day or or every weekthroughout the summer.
You just said I'm.
I might come back four timesthroughout the summer before
hunting season, you know.
And it's like okay, so that's aminimal amount of times.
No, take care of it then, buttake care of it as early as you
possibly can.
Yeah.
Get your trail cut so that youcan slip in and out nice and
(03:30):
quiet, because your entry andyour exit are every bit as
crucial and important to thehunt as the shot on the animal.
You know, because you got to getin and out quietly.
You've got to get in and outundetected.
You got to get in and outquietly.
You've got to get in and outundetected.
You've got to get in and outwithout being seen, preferably.
But if you're going in multipletimes throughout the summer
where you're going to put in youknow 10, 12 trips, you think,
(03:58):
throughout the summer take anddo it in phases and do it such
that you're not doing this bigchange all at once.
What I found is, if you havethe opportunity to do that, the
reluctance of those deer to comeinto that set is a lot less.
In other words, they'll reboundquicker on a set that is slowly
getting changed over the summerversus one that automatically.
He comes home and, man, all thefurniture has been cleaned out
(04:20):
of the living room.
You know what I mean.
And so if you've got the timeand you know you're going to be
in there multiple timesthroughout the summer, take and
and do it methodically.
Just, you know every time you goin and I've done this in new
areas where I've gone andwhatnot, and I've done this
throughout season why I alwayscarry a pair of little hand
shears yeah, pruning, and Ipicked up that habit too yeah,
(04:44):
and you just, it's not just forbeing in a tree, oh, I forgot
that limb, or you know, the windblew this over and now it's in
my way and I can cut it down andor hinge, cut it and get it out
of my way.
It's as I'm going in littlethings.
You know, this briar keepsgoing across the trail and it
catches my pant leg or whatnot,and my pant leg or whatnot, and
(05:09):
it's not a, it's not a normalsound that the deer hear as far
as when briars pull on yourclothes it's like velcro.
Yeah, you know what I mean andit tears your stuff and whatnot,
so just cut it.
I always just cut it, justenough for me to get by yeah,
you know yeah and when, like forcutting trails, it's not.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
we're not cutting a four-foot-wide swath through
there.
It might be a couple feet wide.
Right, right, just enough.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Honestly, the first 30 yards I leave untouched,
going into a set.
Yeah.
If I'm going in and it's a100-yard walk in to where the
set is, or maybe it's 200 yards,I don't even bother with the
first, you know 80 yards, youknow, depending on how far in it
is, because I just I don't wantthat to be disturbed at all.
(05:50):
I don't want to draw any moreattention to it.
We're not far past gates yeahyou know, we're not going in
miles and miles and miles.
These big bucks are thatwherever that habitat is.
And and when we find thathabitat, man, I just, I just
want to leave it untouched bythe road, because I worked hard
to find it.
I want to keep it, but there isthat throughout the summer I
(06:11):
pick it up and if I'm going togo in there multiple times, I'll
just take the hand shears andI'll clean it out by the time
season gets here, by the timethe end of summer, because I
don't start usually gettingserious till November.
But in the event that I've gota big buck, that's daily.
I'm never going to turn thatdown.
Yeah, yeah.
So it's like well, no it's openand it's ready to go.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
And I'm just thinking of different sets that I have.
I've always left that initial,but then I always follow either
a current game trail so it'sless change.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Or the path of least resistance.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Absolutely yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
So that I'm not cutting a lot.
So it's never a straight lineat all.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
It's always, they just wind through and it's
probably if it were a straightline it'd be half as long of a
walk than for cutting the paththrough.
But I know last.
Well, two years ago, my firstyear hunting, I cut.
Actually, I did it for Asha, itwas after season, I just kind
of walked in, but I cut in atrail a bit more of a trail for
(07:12):
her, I believe, because she wasgoing to come in and potentially
hunt that spot, but it was alot of that was to avoid and
this is also getting an eyes andnose aspect of it that we'll
talk about but it was so that Icould walk in to be more scent
free.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
Right.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
And where they wouldn't potentially see me.
So it was kind of creating aback door into my set as opposed
to walking through the frontdoor Right and I gotta be honest
, I'm more concerned about themseeing me than I am them hearing
me.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
You know, I always want to make a little bit of
sound when I go in and I thinkthat because I don't want
anything on the set when I getin there and with cell cameras I
can look in real time, see,okay, there's a buck on there.
Well, if the buck is on there,my target buck or smaller.
Sometimes I'll just leave themand wait for them to leave and
then go on.
But if it's like, well, I needto get in there because I know
(08:07):
my target buck has been showingup here in the land you know, I
got to get in there and leteverything settle down.
Yeah.
You know, that's when I'll snapa branch or something like that,
out of sight, where they can'tsee me, and just kind of bump
them off of it nice and easy.
I don't want to scare them.
And for anybody that's bearhunted over bait knows that when
a bear comes into a bait he'llsnap a branch or a twig or
(08:30):
something long before he getsthere.
And it's to warn the other bearsthat are there so that they're
not surprised.
Deer do the same thing on a set, whether there's bait there or
not when they come through,because they've smelled the
other deer.
They don't want to startle theother deer so they'll make noise
to keep that other deer.
So yeah, I've just kind ofpicked that up and that's what I
(08:50):
do.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Yeah, it was really interesting.
So last year at one point and Ibelieve it was two or three
days in a row, as I'm sittingand set at about 2 to 2.30, it
was the same time every day adeer and I never could see it
because it would come up behindme, somewhere behind me and off
to the right, but I'm in theground, blind, I can't see, and
(09:12):
I'm not going to go rip and opena window hey, what's up,
looking around, what's out there?
But it would have to come upand it has to move through that
really thick salow so it wouldmove and then it would stop and
I think kind of check things out, check things out.
And then it would move maybeanother 10 feet, stop, check
things out, and then it wouldget to the point where it got
into a more open or onto a trailand then it stopped making
(09:34):
noise and then I couldn't hearit at all.
But it kind of changed the wayof how I made noise coming in,
where I would walk in and Iwould stop.
I might do 10 feet If I wasbrushing up against something,
then I would stop.
And then I would walk maybe 10or 15 feet, and then I'd stop
Because I wanted to mimic asbest I could.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
What they were hearing.
But then do the you know,because you taught me about the
snapping a twig To do that,because often I was bumping
something off of my set.
Usually it was a doe, or a doeand a yearling.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
And it's okay if they get bumped off the set.
If they don't run off, ifthey're not greyhounding out of
there, if they just walk off fora few minutes out of sight,
they'll come back.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
And they always came back.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Yeah, I never worried about that.
So let's talk about the gear,like what kind of gear and
things related to us personallymaking unnatural noises, I would
say Well, what kind of gearExpensive.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
There's no such thing as cheap camo anymore.
But you've got to be educatedin two areas.
Number one educate yourself onwhat you want your camo to do.
That's number one.
Number one educate yourself onwhat you want, your camo to do.
That's number one.
Number two educate yourself inwhat the camo was designed to do
, and I say that because, withall of the microfibers and all
the synthetic fibers that are onthe market right now, we pay
(10:57):
high dollar for this camouflageright.
Yeah.
For these outfits and I sayoutfits because basically
they're sold as a a layeringsystem yeah well, you know, like
uh sitka has a cloudburst.
Well, that cloudburst isdesigned as a rain jacket to
keep you dry.
It is 100 windproof, 100waterproof.
(11:18):
It is not designed to be wornas you're going through, saulo
yeah or brushing up againsthemlock or furs or cedars,
because it's going to sound likea rain jacket brushing up
against that stuff, which istotally not natural.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Yeah, so it's avoiding the unnatural sounds.
So, if you're wearing, becausea lot of it, like I have, is
soft if you feel it Right.
Well, as you're walking throughsalal it make.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
The salal is making noise being brushed up against,
but my clothing isn't rightwhereas that would be the
clothing's making noiseabsolutely absolutely, and it's
like well, should you not buythat?
Well, no, you should buy that.
But you need to know when, whatit was intended for, and then
wear it at appropriate timesyeah so if you're trying to get
in during a rainstorm, get instand and then put that
(12:09):
cloudburst on you know, what Imean.
Or there's other stuff on themarket.
You've got First Light and Kuyuand Sitka, and all of these
make stuff that are 100%waterproof, and some have a
synthetic fiber cover over it.
Uh-huh you know, and it justmaybe it doesn't breathe very
well, but it keeps you dry.
(12:30):
Yeah, you know, and and granted, you don't want to sweat,
especially late season, but youhave to understand what, what it
was designed for, for whatsituation, for what scenario,
kind of thing yeah, and then thelast of this, avoiding the
clanking noise especially, and Ithink I'm laughing about this.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
So one of the things like with weapon I have my rifle
that I went in uh last year andyou suggested walking in with
it with a round in the chamberin case.
I walked up and saw somethingstanding in the trail as I'm
walking into my set.
Then, when I got to the bottomof the ladder stand, unload it
and then so you got to pull itup separately by the string and
(13:13):
all that to go up in the ladderstand.
Well, I would walk in with itaround chambered, but then you
got to unload it, but pulling itup against a metal ladder I
brought in a gun sock and I putit back in that.
It's quite a while goingthrough this whole process,
slowly, quietly, and then go upinto the stand and then you know
(13:35):
you got to reload it and it's alever action.
So you know you got to cock itand everything.
And one of the times it wasfairly early in the season as
I'm trying to load and lessonlearned don't hold all.
I would load it with fiverounds, but don't hold all five
rounds in your hand as you'reloading because one slipped out.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
It just started clanking down the ladder.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Every step of that ladder.
I swear all the way down clankclank, clank clank all the way
down and I'm like, yeah, okay,that's about right, yeah and it
doesn't sound natural.
You know no raindrop oranything like that makes that
kind of noise nothing, yeah, butit made me kind of wonder.
With a bow there's a lot ofhard material, so right, and if
(14:18):
you're going up into, say, atree stand, it seems like
there's a lot of chance of thatbanging up against it or
something.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
There's that and there's drawing the bow, taking
it from static position as faras the cam system goes and
bringing it to full draw andhaving a load on that, I mean on
the pulleys and all that stuff.
There's a lot of creaking thatcan happen there.
There's the arrow falling offthe rest hitting the riser,
which is some kind of machinedmetal, but when you're going in,
(14:47):
when you're going in.
Yeah, you got.
Well, there's a number, you getyour quiver.
Some guys will take a hipquiver.
Some guys have a quiver that'sattached to their bow and stuff
and they're pulling it throughthe salalau or they got you know
hidden branches and whatnot andit sounds, you know, like a
little untuned guitar, sometimeson the arrows in the quiver.
(15:07):
I don't know, maybe that's abad description of it, something
like that.
You know where.
It's just that.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
But they don't make something like a gun sock.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
They do make a quiver sock for the end to hide and
that's mostly to hide the veins,the color of the veins, you
know.
But it does serve a dualpurpose in that way.
But yeah, you just got to becareful, you know.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Yeah, and that is the most unnatural noise in the
woods.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
For me, what it was was the binos.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
Oh really.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Yeah, because I'm not a big guy, you know, and all
the bino harnesses on the marketwere always too big for me, you
know.
So if I was climbing the stand,it would climbing the climbing
sticks to get into the stand.
It would kind of thump againstthe climbing sticks every now
and then, or the one thing thatI do now that I didn't do for
the longest time.
I couldn't figure it out.
(16:01):
It was just, it was somethingthat was so simple.
As I take my release, I have atrigger release.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
And I spin it so that it's not in the palm of my hand
but on the back of my hand,because I would reach up and
grab the rung and that release,which is metal, would clang on
the metal climbing stick.
Yeah.
And so it was like and my handsare cold and everything, it's
like, how do I hold on to this?
And it was just as simple asrotating it to the back of my
hand and it was no worries.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
Yeah, okay.
So now let's move on to eyes.
A couple of things.
Here is when you're going intoyour blind or into your stand.
You don't want them spottingyou in those situations, so how
do you adjust so that they don'tactually see you?
Speaker 2 (16:44):
so this is really big in the midwest and back east
because they don't have theground cover that we have as far
as the foliage and whatnot, andwe are typically hunting in
very, very, very thick stuff,and so this is not as much a
problem very seldom is it as abig problem for guys over here
as it is back there.
But Jimmy, our pro staffer, wasrunning into it this year and
(17:07):
he asked me you know how do Iaddress that?
And, guys, if you go online anyof the food plot companies,
they will all have a screenvegetation, and a screen
vegetation is a vegetation thatgrows very fast and very tall
and very thick, and thatvegetation is sold with the sole
purpose of giving you aneasement into your spot.
(17:30):
And what it is is exactly whatit sounds like a screen
vegetation.
It's just something that grows,like I said, fast, thick and
tall and allows you a cover.
You plant it in the spring.
You can plant it in the middleof summer.
It takes very littlemaintenance, very, very low
maintenance.
You may only have to scratch theground and it grows up so fast
(17:53):
and it will create basically awall that you can walk behind to
get into your set, okay, and soit's really really easy, really
low maintenance, and I toldJimmy about it, you know, and
it's like no, you can buy a bagof that and run a strip of it 80
to 100 yards and there you go,that's your ticket into your set
.
You can walk on the backside ofthat out of your target buck's
view and it grows so fast by thetime.
(18:14):
If you planted it now, by thetime season gets here, it's
going to be well over your head.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
I'm sitting here smiling because in my mind I'm
imagining someone would do thatwith bamboo.
It grows really fast and itkind of creates a wall.
But just the thought of you'rewalking through the woods and
all of a sudden you see this20-foot-long line of bamboo in
the middle of Pacific Northwest.
It's a lot like CRP.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
It grows thick like a CRP, which is really CRP, is
really big on east of themountains and the government,
like in North Dakota and SouthDakota, actually pays farmers
not to grow in those CRP fields,and so the whitetail would
always hide in those becauseit's so incredibly thick, and so
the whitetail would always hidein those sea urchins, because
it's so incredibly thick.
It's just like that, where itgrows up just thick like that
(19:01):
and tall, and so, yeah, it'sreally easy to cover your
entrance and your exit.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Okay, and so I know you like doing afternoon hunts
to avoid bumping anything earlyin the morning.
But sometimes you don't have achoice.
You've got to go in early forwhatever reason, and I have a
set that it actually lendsitself to or a couple of sets.
It might have to be earlymorning.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Right, right, they're just a morning set.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
So I was thinking about headlamp and last year I
know that I went in and I wouldhave the headlamp on just as not
full brightness but enoughwhere I could safely walk until
I got to the end of the trailthat I used cut in the last 80
yards, and then I would switchmy headlamp from the main white
light to one of the green lights.
(19:45):
So they always have a lot.
Of them will have a red lightand a green light on.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Right right.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
And I couldn't see anything with the red light or
see enough of anything.
But I would switch to the greenlight and walk to the back of
my ground blind with that greenlight and when I got behind the
ground, blind, you know again,stopping every 10 feet or so and
listening here to see what Icould hear or to kind of give
them an idea of just a bump offmy set.
(20:11):
But then I turned it offcompletely before opening up my
ground blind.
Because once you open that up,if you've got light behind it
now, whether it's green light oryou know- right right they can
still see this all of a suddenthey'll see a shade change.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Yeah, it won't.
It won't be like what you and Isee, but they will see a shade
change, yeah, yeah, you know,like you said, some sets are
just morning sets.
That buck just decides thatthat's the only time he's going
to visit that.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
So any other thoughts ?
As far as headlamp, of what Imean, if you're going in the
morning, should you shut it offand climb up.
If you're doing from ladderstand, tree stand in the dark, I
think when I did a ladder standI kept the light on or I turned
it to red light because, it wasup close when I climbed up into
the ladder stand.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Right, and I would say that everything that you
said is great.
As far as a tree stand goes, Iwant to have light, whether it's
green light or red light.
I mean, back when I started,they didn't have any such thing.
Everybody was just, you know,was all white and I would turn
it down to the lowest power andgo in that way.
But the green and red is great.
I'm never going to tell you toclimb up a tree, stand in the
(21:21):
dark as far as without any kindof light.
You want light there, buttypically, if that's the case
and I know that that buck'scoming in, I'm going to get in
there three hours before heshows up.
Yeah.
You know what I mean, because Ijust don't want that chance of
bumping him.
And for me, my biggest fear isthat they're going to see me in
the stand versus walking in.
I'm not so concerned about onthe ground walking in.
(21:43):
I feel like, if they see you inthe stand and this has been my
experience that if I get caughtin the stand, whether it's by
that buck or maybe it's thedominant doe that catches me in
that stand one time, that's it.
I'm done, because every timethey come into the set after
that, the first thing they'regoing to check is that stand.
And if they see me in it and Imay be camoed out and everything
(22:07):
, but I haven't been there fortwo or three days and then all
of a sudden I show up in there.
Even though they can't put asolid pattern to me, a solid
silhouette, there's stillsomething there that wasn't
there before and it makes themreal leery.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
But it's just going to put them on high alert.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
Exactly, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
So bumping them off in some way?
And I was going to ask youabout that because there were a
lot of times I would bump deerwalking in, and I mean not even
remotely close to my set.
And I and I never quite.
I never really worried aboutthat right now.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
If I saw one, sometimes they would just stand
there and keep looking at me,because all they see is
basically a white light right sodeer in the headlights yeah and
they would just stand there andI'd wait till they actually got
bored and walked off, whichcould take a few minutes yep,
and that's the best thing to do,though, yeah, is let them walk
off, instead of getting you knowthis closer and closer and
(23:01):
closer, and eventually you knowyou're like 15, 20 feet from
them.
Yeah.
And they bound off.
Well, you just let them walkoff, you know, and the same like
I've been trapped in stand atthe end of the day I don't know
how many times day, I don't knowhow many times.
Here it is 10, 11 at night, andit's like I'm sure that if any
game warden came, he'd probablythink I was poaching, you know.
(23:22):
But the reality is no.
I just got a deer on set.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
They've bedded down and I don't want them to see me
climbing out yeah I don't have aspotlight, so it's all cool so
yeah, and I mean yeah, best wayin is also best way out right,
right.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
So anymore I'll.
I'll take like a pocket ofpebbles, little rocks and
whatnot, and once it's pastshooting light, if I got a deer
in on the, I start tossing thosepebbles over by it yeah get
them nervous enough that theywalk off, and then I climb down
on a stand as quickly as I canand get out of there yeah okay,
so last part, and we talk aboutthis ad nauseum, but we that's
(23:56):
just because of how important itis, but their nose.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
So best way in, you're trying to beat their ears
, their eyes and now their nose.
So products in the process toreduce your scent.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
I think, man, there's so much products on the market
now.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Well, let's just actually just talk about what
you use specifically.
So you know, and there are alot so.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, there are, and they all carry weight.
I should say.
Our sponsor is dead down windand we use all of their products
, from the camel wash to thescent free bags to the field
spray, constantly using the windcheck to check our wind and
whatnot, and then we haveozonics in our all of those and
use them to the absolute 150thdegree.
(24:40):
You need to do everything youcan.
I cannot emphasize enough howimportant it is to deal with the
nose, and whenever, if I takesomebody out and they don't want
to address that issue, it'slike okay, this is going to be a
one and done.
You know I take you out one timebecause I'm beating my head
against the wall trying toaccomplish something for you.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
if you're not willing to address this, if you don't
take this part seriously, butit's always the same kind of the
same process and, from what youtaught me, last year we went
out and it's so.
First thing is we're drivingout basically in our underwear,
you know our long underwear,yeah, or sweats or something or
sweats over those.
(25:23):
But then we get out and in ourscent free bags all of our
clothes in the trunk right rightand or the bed of the truck or
wherever, and then it's get outon the side of the road by the
gate and then get dressed rightso that none of those clothes
have any odor to them.
But then it's taking the fieldspray and kind of spraying
ourselves down with that, whichis a kind of a it's like Febreze
(25:46):
and unscented Febreze.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Right.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
It gets rid of the odor and then going in from
there and we might do drags orwhat was the other one, the nose
jammer once we get in, orsomething like that.
But that is the whole process.
And then, when we leave, it'sthis reverse process where open
the trunk, open up thescent-free bag get undressed.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Yeah, it changed back at the car, back into what we
wore out there initially and Ineed to preface all of this to
say that this is not for killinga spike or a forked horn or a
three point, because I hear guyswell, I get my deer every year.
Well, that's fine, that's notthe caliber of deer I'm chasing.
The caliber deer I'm chasing isgoing to make the record books,
(26:29):
you know, and it's like everyyear we're on them, Every year
we've got five or six orwhatever that we're going after.
It's not these little bucks,and I don't want to sound
judgmental or critical of anyone.
If that's what you want toshoot, then, man, have at it.
It's your tag, enjoy yourself.
But the deer that I'm goingafter is not a deer that's going
(26:50):
to tolerate much of my scent atall, if any at all.
Yeah.
So it's a different animal.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
And it's putting together a lot of things to up
those odds.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
It's a lot of.
Maybe this is only 2% of theequation or 5%, but if you do
enough of those, you'veincreased your odds to and it
might be the most important 2%to 5% of the whole equation.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
Yeah.
I mean, when you really stopand think about it, I mean we're
dealing, we're trying to beat amagician, magician yeah, you
know what I mean.
Yeah, it's really, it's toughbut it's that same phrase.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
It just be methodical and everything.
And when you walk into your set, you're walking in the exact
same way, the exact same timesand the exact everything is the
exact same, so that the deer itbecomes familiar.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Right right, there's nothing unusual.
He's patterning you as much asyou're patterning him.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
And so the last one, and I got to thinking about this
and I've talked about myRiverside set quite often and
where I do or I did the mineralsthe last three years.
It's a place where you would dominerals but you wouldn't
necessarily.
It's not a good hunting spot.
It's not the bedroom door.
Okay, now, where the bedroomdoor, I'm thinking more about
(28:11):
kind of and we're wrapping upwith this as far as thinking of
when I go in and thinking aboutlike thermals and not
necessarily winds.
I mean, you'll want to knowwhich way the wind is blowing,
but let's talk about just kindof real quick here, the thermals
.
Now, if you're going in at, say, sun up is 6 am and so you want
(28:36):
to come in a couple hoursbefore that, well, it's still
dark out, it's cold, not a lotof wind, not a lot of thermals
at that point.
So everything's very still.
Now, let's say, 10 o'clock, thethermals are going and that
might blow you out.
And I'm thinking about this formy Riverside set because of
where I have to go in.
I think that might end upbecoming an issue where, even if
it's an afternoon hunt, the waythat and I'm not as worried
(28:58):
about once I'm inset because Ican turn on the ozonics and have
that adjusted to cover my scentand block it, but when I go in
I can't be going in if thermalsor wind is going to push my
scent in a direction that Ican't control and I can't adjust
for Like I can cover for myscent.
(29:19):
So is I mean, have you been inthat situation where you might
have to adjust, or what do youthink about like having to
adjust to that point?
Speaker 2 (29:27):
So I had a set that we called the barnyard.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
And we called it the barnyard because there was so
much activity on that set thatit smelled like a barnyard just
everything that was going onthere, and the bedroom was
exactly east of where my treestand was, and the wind the
prevailing wind was alwaysblowing from west to east, right
into the bedroom.
And boy I used to.
(29:53):
It was really, really difficult.
It was near impossible for meto get a shot opportunity on
anything because they wouldalways come with the wind in
their face.
And then I got an Ozonics andthat set right.
There is the one set that mademe a believer.
Not only did I get shots afterthat, but there was one occasion
where I spent 45 minutes withanimals all around me and the
(30:17):
wind swirling everywhere and Inever once got winded and they
just kind of fed on by up intothis meadow above me and
everything and everything wasreally cool and that was an elk
situation there.
But yeah, prior to that, priorto getting an Ozonics, if you
don't have that man, it's such agame changer.
Your thought process has to betotally different.
(30:39):
If the wind is bad, the wind isbad.
You don't hunt it, yeah, youjust don't.
You don't hunt it yeah, youjust don't.
Yeah.
You know, I don't know how youovercome that.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
Yeah, and that's my.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
And I was in a.
I was at a tree stand.
We've talked about wind beingin layers and stuff and I was
still getting blown out.
I'd take it up as high as Icould.
(31:08):
Little tree you were in, but itwas another one off to.
If you're standing therelooking at the barnyard, there
was another big, taller red furoff to the left that was.
There was three of them clumpedtogether and it had great
backdrop and I was able to getup 25 30 feet in that and it
didn't make a difference.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
I remember that little clump.
Maybe that's some reason Ithought you weren't up that high
.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
I remember the one you're thinking about?
I wasn't.
Oh okay, that one was about 15and that was another little
clump.
Yes, that you were yeah,because it was.
Speaker 1 (31:32):
I think that was the first time I'd seen a tree stand
and I was kind of impressedlike wow, you're on just this
little cubby of branches and Ikilled I don't know how many
bulls out of that at 15 feetwith that Ozonics.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
I don't know how many bulls I killed coming into the
barnyard there over the years.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
But as you're walking in, I mean the Ozonics is great
once you're in set.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Once you're in set, as I was walking in, I mean,
there's times where I have goneliterally hundreds of yards out
of the way, quarter mile, halfmile out of the way to get the
wind in my favor to walk in.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
Yeah, and it's just you know.
It also applies to how you huntthat set.
If your wind isn't allowing you, your prevailing wind isn't
allowing, it's always going togive you away.
I mean, maybe you just maybeyou don't like ground blinds,
but the only places you can gois a ground blind.
Yeah, that doesn't get youblown out.
Yeah, or you know you don'tlike heights.
(32:32):
Well, you and I yesterday setup a stand for boot camp.
That was how far off the ground.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
Maybe seven feet six and a half to seven.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Yeah, it was just over the top of my head and
there's no way anybody could seethat.
No, and I mean you could stand10 feet from it and not know
that.
That is there.
Speaker 1 (32:47):
Yeah, we were prepping for boot camp and it's
kind of this little anexcitement on both our parts
Like how well did we hide both aground blind and a tree stand,
and they're both right off theskidder road and we don't think
anybody will see them.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
What did it take us 30 minutes?
Speaker 1 (33:04):
oh, probably an hour to do both, to do both, yeah,
yeah it doesn't.
Speaker 2 (33:08):
If the wind, if you, that's what you got to do to get
the wind in your favor.
Yeah, you do what you got to do.
But yeah you got to hunt out ofsomething you're not
particularly fond of, or huntaway that you're fond of.
You know if you want that buck.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
That's what you got to do or go in like I was
thinking like before, before thethermals, thermals and before
you can get in there and getyour ozonics going, and when
they switch you're just totallyundetected and that's what I'm
thinking is when I finally getto the point where I'm going to
hunt that set and I believe I'mgoing to hunt halfway this year,
so I think I'm a couple yearsoff from hunting Riverside,
(33:43):
which gives me some more time toexplore and everything like
that but I think I wanted to.
Well, I know I need it for mybackup in case we come across
like we might have anopportunity to host a hunt for
someone and so that we have aspot for them.
But it's that and one of yourcatchphrases if you want what
you've never had, you have to dothe things that you've never
(34:04):
done yeah.
And so that might mean going inat midnight.
I've actually, because I'llprobably do ground blind.
I was thinking about this whenyou told me that how you went
and you slept in your tree standand kind of roped or tied
yourself into it one night, tiedyourself into it one night.
(34:25):
But I was like, okay, but if Ihad the chance to get two times
that really nice buck who couldbe even better this year like
would I be willing to go in at11 o'clock at night the night
before and just go to sleep onthe floor of this tree on this
ground, blind, to wake up andnot worry about the scent.
Yeah.
Yeah, is he worth that, and I'mlike that might be what has to
(34:46):
happen.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
Okay, so this is huge because this is only year three
for Aaron Year three and I'mactually contemplating he's
already Doing these crazy thingsof like okay, maybe I'm going
to go just sleep in the woods.
But that's just it.
And see, that's what I love.
That's what makes it excitingfor me is the fact that somebody
can get so passionate about itthat that's what they're willing
to do.
I've done that.
I told you about that.
(35:10):
My wife wasn't too excited.
I've done it three or fourtimes where I've slept in the
stand all night to be there forthat.
But I've also gone in beforedaylight, like you're saying, to
beat the thermals, get in thereand then when they switch I'm
already in there and I'm inundetected.
They have no idea.
I've done that several times.
Yeah.
But yeah, that passion to andyou start weighing that Do I
(35:34):
really want.
Is this buck worth going after?
That.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
Or this bull that was also why I and I mentioned this
with you I was contemplatingjust grabbing a camp chair or a
ground blind chair and walkingup and looking for the bedroom
door, plopping that chair downsometime this summer and go in
it.
Like you know, once I find thebedroom door, but go in before
(35:57):
daybreak, plop this chair downand sit in it all day, checking
wind non-stop to find out whendid the thermal switch?
right right and going to thatextreme to just figure out okay,
do I need to come in at fouro'clock in the morning to hunt?
This spot right or can I comein at 10 o'clock in the morning
if it's an afternoon hunt, andit could be that the deer are
(36:19):
coming out at eight in themorning, so it doesn't matter, I
still have to come in at 4.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
What's funny is that you start talking this way about
elk, and it's totally normal.
Yeah.
Well, we got a two-mile pack inor a six-mile hike in.
We got to get on the trail by11 or 11.30 or something like
that.
Get in there well beforedaylight.
But when you start talking thisway about deer, people start
thinking you're nuts.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Just, but when you start talking this way about
deer people start thinkingyou're nuts.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
Just drive out to the clear cut and look.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
They're all standing there.
But you know and I know a lotof our listeners because I've
shared the picture of two timeswhen I first discovered him last
year, he was a four by threeand I couldn't tell if he had
eye guards.
But he came back this year.
Now he's a really nice four byfour with eye guards.
Next year he'll be five and ahalf years old.
You know, aging him.
(37:06):
He could be even bigger, hecould be an even more impressive
four by four.
And then there's anotherup-and-coming one that's like a
year younger than him that Idiscovered this year.
But okay, so how many people geta shot at that buck or a shot
of that quality of a buck?
Right, right, that's what'sdriving this.
This is why and our listenersand the guys who've gone to our
(37:28):
class, I think, can relate tothis they want that buck and I
know a lot of you guys are likewe're.
I'm presenting this, thesescenarios, especially as a new
hunter, so that maybe you guysare considering this.
Should I be doing somethinglike this and now you're okay?
Speaker 2 (37:45):
I, is this normal?
Yeah, do other guys think likewell let me just tell you right
now, that's not normal, butthat's for the general
population.
It's not normal but that's whatseparates us from the general
population.
Speaker 1 (37:58):
Yeah, trophy blacktail hunters.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
It is normal yes, it's exactly right.
So it's a sickness that gets inyou.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
But that passion is in a lot of the guys.
Speaker 2 (38:08):
It is.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
Our last locating field day.
You could just tell it.
Well, all of our classes, allof our field days, you can just
tell that from all of the guys.
And thank you for coming tothose classes.
But it's very apparent, you areall invested in.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
They're very serious.
Speaker 1 (38:24):
In this, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:25):
This is not just a hobby.
This is something that they'redriven by.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
So it's fun to talk about these crazy situations
with all of you because, yeah,we found a good audience for
talking about our crazy Grouptherapy.
Yeah, you know my newfoundcrazy Dave's long-term crazy.
Yeah, there you go.
So anyway, so I think that kindof covers it about ears and
eyes and nose and getting in andgetting out of your set.
(38:52):
So until next week.
Welcome back to the Blacktail Coach Podcast.
I'm Aaron and I'm Dave, so thisweek we're talking about the
best way in, so thinking aboutwhen we're going into our set,
that whole process, and becauseI was kind of concerned with one
of my sets, with the ears, eyesand the nose and different
situations that I've been in inthe last couple of years since
I've started hunting, so I wantto talk to you about, you know,
(00:22):
what are some things that weshould be doing, and then stuff
you've already shared with me,but just to get some more ideas
out there and some just thingsthat we might not have been
thinking about, that we shouldbe considering, okay, so that
we're not bumping deer out ofour set permanently Right.
So, understanding they mightleave for a minute or an hour or
(00:42):
so, but come back, which isfine, but not they're
permanently gone, right?
So, first thing, we're going tostart off with ears.
The deer are going to hear us.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Yeah, I think it's kind of like the whole scent
thing.
I don't think that you're everas quiet as you think you are.
Yeah, you know the whole scentthing is you're never 100% scent
free and as long as you'rebreathing and whatnot, you can
never be 100% scent free.
But the same I would think asfar as the noise factor goes, is
you're never as quiet, as quietas you think you are, and
(01:15):
sometimes it's actuallybeneficial to make noise as
you're going in uh-huh so theyou know, just depending on the
situation, little tricks thatI've developed over the years
just to give them an idea thatyou're coming in.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
With this system that you put together, we're set
hunting and we're generally mostof the time we're right inside
real thick areas.
Well, I might have to walkthrough about 60 yards of real
thick stuff, but I'm only about20, 25 yards off a skidder road.
But walking through three, fourfoot five foot tall salal is
(01:50):
making a lot of racket right,and so you know we've we've
talked about cutting in trailsuh-huh so what's the idea behind
doing that if we're set hunting?
Speaker 2 (02:02):
so when I, when I have a set and I and I boy this,
I could go a couple differentways with this one here.
Um, we'll go both ways.
You know well, like today.
I was out scouting today, uh,some places in in oregon, and I
found one place and I thought,you know, and guys I see guys do
(02:23):
this too they'll put out acamera in a spot where they
think they're going to do a setthroughout.
You know, and they and they'llstart at early spring or early
summer and they want to watch it, monitor it throughout the
summer.
You know, and in Oregon you canbait, so guys will put out bait
and they'll go in there everyso often to replenish the bait.
If that is your scenario and youhave an opportunity where
(02:44):
you're going to go in multipletimes throughout the summer,
what I tell guys is this is thatdon't change everything at once
.
If you have the opportunity andthis is how the scenario goes
where you have multiple times,you're going to go in throughout
the summer before season takethe time to slowly transition
that trail to being quiet.
In other words, like when youdid the Salau and stuff.
(03:07):
Well, you decided you weregoing to do it one day.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
But you were not going to go back out there every
other day or or every weekthroughout the summer.
You just said I'm.
I might come back four timesthroughout the summer before
hunting season, you know.
And it's like okay, so that's aminimal amount of times.
No, take care of it then, buttake care of it as early as you
possibly can.
Yeah.
Get your trail cut so that youcan slip in and out nice and
(03:30):
quiet, because your entry andyour exit are every bit as
crucial and important to thehunt as the shot on the animal.
You know, because you got to getin and out quietly.
You've got to get in and outundetected.
You got to get in and outquietly.
You've got to get in and outundetected.
You've got to get in and outwithout being seen, preferably.
But if you're going in multipletimes throughout the summer
where you're going to put in youknow 10, 12 trips, you think,
(03:58):
throughout the summer take anddo it in phases and do it such
that you're not doing this bigchange all at once.
What I found is, if you havethe opportunity to do that, the
reluctance of those deer to comeinto that set is a lot less.
In other words, they'll reboundquicker on a set that is slowly
getting changed over the summerversus one that automatically.
He comes home and, man, all thefurniture has been cleaned out
(04:20):
of the living room.
You know what I mean.
And so if you've got the timeand you know you're going to be
in there multiple timesthroughout the summer, take and
and do it methodically.
Just, you know every time you goin and I've done this in new
areas where I've gone andwhatnot, and I've done this
throughout season why I alwayscarry a pair of little hand
shears yeah, pruning, and Ipicked up that habit too yeah,
(04:44):
and you just, it's not just forbeing in a tree, oh, I forgot
that limb, or you know, the windblew this over and now it's in
my way and I can cut it down andor hinge, cut it and get it out
of my way.
It's as I'm going in littlethings.
You know, this briar keepsgoing across the trail and it
catches my pant leg or whatnot,and my pant leg or whatnot, and
(05:09):
it's not a, it's not a normalsound that the deer hear as far
as when briars pull on yourclothes it's like velcro.
Yeah, you know what I mean andit tears your stuff and whatnot,
so just cut it.
I always just cut it, justenough for me to get by yeah,
you know yeah and when, like forcutting trails, it's not.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
we're not cutting a four-foot-wide swath through
there.
It might be a couple feet wide.
Right, right, just enough.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Honestly, the first 30 yards I leave untouched,
going into a set.
Yeah.
If I'm going in and it's a100-yard walk in to where the
set is, or maybe it's 200 yards,I don't even bother with the
first, you know 80 yards, youknow, depending on how far in it
is, because I just I don't wantthat to be disturbed at all.
(05:50):
I don't want to draw any moreattention to it.
We're not far past gates yeahyou know, we're not going in
miles and miles and miles.
These big bucks are thatwherever that habitat is.
And and when we find thathabitat, man, I just, I just
want to leave it untouched bythe road, because I worked hard
to find it.
I want to keep it, but there isthat throughout the summer I
(06:11):
pick it up and if I'm going togo in there multiple times, I'll
just take the hand shears andI'll clean it out by the time
season gets here, by the timethe end of summer, because I
don't start usually gettingserious till November.
But in the event that I've gota big buck, that's daily.
I'm never going to turn thatdown.
Yeah, yeah.
So it's like well, no it's openand it's ready to go.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
And I'm just thinking of different sets that I have.
I've always left that initial,but then I always follow either
a current game trail so it'sless change.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Or the path of least resistance.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Absolutely yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
So that I'm not cutting a lot.
So it's never a straight lineat all.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
It's always, they just wind through and it's
probably if it were a straightline it'd be half as long of a
walk than for cutting the paththrough.
But I know last.
Well, two years ago, my firstyear hunting, I cut.
Actually, I did it for Asha, itwas after season, I just kind
of walked in, but I cut in atrail a bit more of a trail for
(07:12):
her, I believe, because she wasgoing to come in and potentially
hunt that spot, but it was alot of that was to avoid and
this is also getting an eyes andnose aspect of it that we'll
talk about but it was so that Icould walk in to be more scent
free.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
Right.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
And where they wouldn't potentially see me.
So it was kind of creating aback door into my set as opposed
to walking through the frontdoor Right and I gotta be honest
, I'm more concerned about themseeing me than I am them hearing
me.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
You know, I always want to make a little bit of
sound when I go in and I thinkthat because I don't want
anything on the set when I getin there and with cell cameras I
can look in real time, see,okay, there's a buck on there.
Well, if the buck is on there,my target buck or smaller.
Sometimes I'll just leave themand wait for them to leave and
then go on.
But if it's like, well, I needto get in there because I know
(08:07):
my target buck has been showingup here in the land you know, I
got to get in there and leteverything settle down.
Yeah.
You know, that's when I'll snapa branch or something like that,
out of sight, where they can'tsee me, and just kind of bump
them off of it nice and easy.
I don't want to scare them.
And for anybody that's bearhunted over bait knows that when
a bear comes into a bait he'llsnap a branch or a twig or
(08:30):
something long before he getsthere.
And it's to warn the other bearsthat are there so that they're
not surprised.
Deer do the same thing on a set, whether there's bait there or
not when they come through,because they've smelled the
other deer.
They don't want to startle theother deer so they'll make noise
to keep that other deer.
So yeah, I've just kind ofpicked that up and that's what I
(08:50):
do.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Yeah, it was really interesting.
So last year at one point and Ibelieve it was two or three
days in a row, as I'm sittingand set at about 2 to 2.30, it
was the same time every day adeer and I never could see it
because it would come up behindme, somewhere behind me and off
to the right, but I'm in theground, blind, I can't see, and
(09:12):
I'm not going to go rip and opena window hey, what's up,
looking around, what's out there?
But it would have to come upand it has to move through that
really thick salow so it wouldmove and then it would stop and
I think kind of check things out, check things out.
And then it would move maybeanother 10 feet, stop, check
things out, and then it wouldget to the point where it got
into a more open or onto a trailand then it stopped making
(09:34):
noise and then I couldn't hearit at all.
But it kind of changed the wayof how I made noise coming in,
where I would walk in and Iwould stop.
I might do 10 feet If I wasbrushing up against something,
then I would stop.
And then I would walk maybe 10or 15 feet, and then I'd stop
Because I wanted to mimic asbest I could.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
What they were hearing.
But then do the you know,because you taught me about the
snapping a twig To do that,because often I was bumping
something off of my set.
Usually it was a doe, or a doeand a yearling.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
And it's okay if they get bumped off the set.
If they don't run off, ifthey're not greyhounding out of
there, if they just walk off fora few minutes out of sight,
they'll come back.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
And they always came back.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Yeah, I never worried about that.
So let's talk about the gear,like what kind of gear and
things related to us personallymaking unnatural noises, I would
say Well, what kind of gearExpensive.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
There's no such thing as cheap camo anymore.
But you've got to be educatedin two areas.
Number one educate yourself onwhat you want your camo to do.
That's number one.
Number one educate yourself onwhat you want, your camo to do.
That's number one.
Number two educate yourself inwhat the camo was designed to do
, and I say that because, withall of the microfibers and all
the synthetic fibers that are onthe market right now, we pay
(10:57):
high dollar for this camouflageright.
Yeah.
For these outfits and I sayoutfits because basically
they're sold as a a layeringsystem yeah well, you know, like
uh sitka has a cloudburst.
Well, that cloudburst isdesigned as a rain jacket to
keep you dry.
It is 100 windproof, 100waterproof.
(11:18):
It is not designed to be wornas you're going through, saulo
yeah or brushing up againsthemlock or furs or cedars,
because it's going to sound likea rain jacket brushing up
against that stuff, which istotally not natural.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Yeah, so it's avoiding the unnatural sounds.
So, if you're wearing, becausea lot of it, like I have, is
soft if you feel it Right.
Well, as you're walking throughsalal it make.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
The salal is making noise being brushed up against,
but my clothing isn't rightwhereas that would be the
clothing's making noiseabsolutely absolutely, and it's
like well, should you not buythat?
Well, no, you should buy that.
But you need to know when, whatit was intended for, and then
wear it at appropriate timesyeah so if you're trying to get
in during a rainstorm, get instand and then put that
(12:09):
cloudburst on you know, what Imean.
Or there's other stuff on themarket.
You've got First Light and Kuyuand Sitka, and all of these
make stuff that are 100%waterproof, and some have a
synthetic fiber cover over it.
Uh-huh you know, and it justmaybe it doesn't breathe very
well, but it keeps you dry.
(12:30):
Yeah, you know, and and granted, you don't want to sweat,
especially late season, but youhave to understand what, what it
was designed for, for whatsituation, for what scenario,
kind of thing yeah, and then thelast of this, avoiding the
clanking noise especially, and Ithink I'm laughing about this.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
So one of the things like with weapon I have my rifle
that I went in uh last year andyou suggested walking in with
it with a round in the chamberin case.
I walked up and saw somethingstanding in the trail as I'm
walking into my set.
Then, when I got to the bottomof the ladder stand, unload it
and then so you got to pull itup separately by the string and
(13:13):
all that to go up in the ladderstand.
Well, I would walk in with itaround chambered, but then you
got to unload it, but pulling itup against a metal ladder I
brought in a gun sock and I putit back in that.
It's quite a while goingthrough this whole process,
slowly, quietly, and then go upinto the stand and then you know
(13:35):
you got to reload it and it's alever action.
So you know you got to cock itand everything.
And one of the times it wasfairly early in the season as
I'm trying to load and lessonlearned don't hold all.
I would load it with fiverounds, but don't hold all five
rounds in your hand as you'reloading because one slipped out.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
It just started clanking down the ladder.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Every step of that ladder.
I swear all the way down clankclank, clank clank all the way
down and I'm like, yeah, okay,that's about right, yeah and it
doesn't sound natural.
You know no raindrop oranything like that makes that
kind of noise nothing, yeah, butit made me kind of wonder.
With a bow there's a lot ofhard material, so right, and if
(14:18):
you're going up into, say, atree stand, it seems like
there's a lot of chance of thatbanging up against it or
something.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
There's that and there's drawing the bow, taking
it from static position as faras the cam system goes and
bringing it to full draw andhaving a load on that, I mean on
the pulleys and all that stuff.
There's a lot of creaking thatcan happen there.
There's the arrow falling offthe rest hitting the riser,
which is some kind of machinedmetal, but when you're going in,
(14:47):
when you're going in.
Yeah, you got.
Well, there's a number, you getyour quiver.
Some guys will take a hipquiver.
Some guys have a quiver that'sattached to their bow and stuff
and they're pulling it throughthe salalau or they got you know
hidden branches and whatnot andit sounds, you know, like a
little untuned guitar, sometimeson the arrows in the quiver.
(15:07):
I don't know, maybe that's abad description of it, something
like that.
You know where.
It's just that.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
But they don't make something like a gun sock.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
They do make a quiver sock for the end to hide and
that's mostly to hide the veins,the color of the veins, you
know.
But it does serve a dualpurpose in that way.
But yeah, you just got to becareful, you know.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Yeah, and that is the most unnatural noise in the
woods.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
For me, what it was was the binos.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
Oh really.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Yeah, because I'm not a big guy, you know, and all
the bino harnesses on the marketwere always too big for me, you
know.
So if I was climbing the stand,it would climbing the climbing
sticks to get into the stand.
It would kind of thump againstthe climbing sticks every now
and then, or the one thing thatI do now that I didn't do for
the longest time.
I couldn't figure it out.
(16:01):
It was just, it was somethingthat was so simple.
As I take my release, I have atrigger release.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
And I spin it so that it's not in the palm of my hand
but on the back of my hand,because I would reach up and
grab the rung and that release,which is metal, would clang on
the metal climbing stick.
Yeah.
And so it was like and my handsare cold and everything, it's
like, how do I hold on to this?
And it was just as simple asrotating it to the back of my
hand and it was no worries.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
Yeah, okay.
So now let's move on to eyes.
A couple of things.
Here is when you're going intoyour blind or into your stand.
You don't want them spottingyou in those situations, so how
do you adjust so that they don'tactually see you?
Speaker 2 (16:44):
so this is really big in the midwest and back east
because they don't have theground cover that we have as far
as the foliage and whatnot, andwe are typically hunting in
very, very, very thick stuff,and so this is not as much a
problem very seldom is it as abig problem for guys over here
as it is back there.
But Jimmy, our pro staffer, wasrunning into it this year and
(17:07):
he asked me you know how do Iaddress that?
And, guys, if you go online anyof the food plot companies,
they will all have a screenvegetation, and a screen
vegetation is a vegetation thatgrows very fast and very tall
and very thick, and thatvegetation is sold with the sole
purpose of giving you aneasement into your spot.
(17:30):
And what it is is exactly whatit sounds like a screen
vegetation.
It's just something that grows,like I said, fast, thick and
tall and allows you a cover.
You plant it in the spring.
You can plant it in the middleof summer.
It takes very littlemaintenance, very, very low
maintenance.
You may only have to scratch theground and it grows up so fast
(17:53):
and it will create basically awall that you can walk behind to
get into your set, okay, and soit's really really easy, really
low maintenance, and I toldJimmy about it, you know, and
it's like no, you can buy a bagof that and run a strip of it 80
to 100 yards and there you go,that's your ticket into your set
.
You can walk on the backside ofthat out of your target buck's
view and it grows so fast by thetime.
(18:14):
If you planted it now, by thetime season gets here, it's
going to be well over your head.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
I'm sitting here smiling because in my mind I'm
imagining someone would do thatwith bamboo.
It grows really fast and itkind of creates a wall.
But just the thought of you'rewalking through the woods and
all of a sudden you see this20-foot-long line of bamboo in
the middle of Pacific Northwest.
It's a lot like CRP.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
It grows thick like a CRP, which is really CRP, is
really big on east of themountains and the government,
like in North Dakota and SouthDakota, actually pays farmers
not to grow in those CRP fields,and so the whitetail would
always hide in those becauseit's so incredibly thick, and so
the whitetail would always hidein those sea urchins, because
it's so incredibly thick.
It's just like that, where itgrows up just thick like that
(19:01):
and tall, and so, yeah, it'sreally easy to cover your
entrance and your exit.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Okay, and so I know you like doing afternoon hunts
to avoid bumping anything earlyin the morning.
But sometimes you don't have achoice.
You've got to go in early forwhatever reason, and I have a
set that it actually lendsitself to or a couple of sets.
It might have to be earlymorning.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Right, right, they're just a morning set.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
So I was thinking about headlamp and last year I
know that I went in and I wouldhave the headlamp on just as not
full brightness but enoughwhere I could safely walk until
I got to the end of the trailthat I used cut in the last 80
yards, and then I would switchmy headlamp from the main white
light to one of the green lights.
(19:45):
So they always have a lot.
Of them will have a red lightand a green light on.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Right right.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
And I couldn't see anything with the red light or
see enough of anything.
But I would switch to the greenlight and walk to the back of
my ground blind with that greenlight and when I got behind the
ground, blind, you know again,stopping every 10 feet or so and
listening here to see what Icould hear or to kind of give
them an idea of just a bump offmy set.
(20:11):
But then I turned it offcompletely before opening up my
ground blind.
Because once you open that up,if you've got light behind it
now, whether it's green light oryou know- right right they can
still see this all of a suddenthey'll see a shade change.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Yeah, it won't.
It won't be like what you and Isee, but they will see a shade
change, yeah, yeah, you know,like you said, some sets are
just morning sets.
That buck just decides thatthat's the only time he's going
to visit that.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
So any other thoughts ?
As far as headlamp, of what Imean, if you're going in the
morning, should you shut it offand climb up.
If you're doing from ladderstand, tree stand in the dark, I
think when I did a ladder standI kept the light on or I turned
it to red light because, it wasup close when I climbed up into
the ladder stand.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Right, and I would say that everything that you
said is great.
As far as a tree stand goes, Iwant to have light, whether it's
green light or red light.
I mean, back when I started,they didn't have any such thing.
Everybody was just, you know,was all white and I would turn
it down to the lowest power andgo in that way.
But the green and red is great.
I'm never going to tell you toclimb up a tree, stand in the
(21:21):
dark as far as without any kindof light.
You want light there, buttypically, if that's the case
and I know that that buck'scoming in, I'm going to get in
there three hours before heshows up.
Yeah.
You know what I mean, because Ijust don't want that chance of
bumping him.
And for me, my biggest fear isthat they're going to see me in
the stand versus walking in.
I'm not so concerned about onthe ground walking in.
(21:43):
I feel like, if they see you inthe stand and this has been my
experience that if I get caughtin the stand, whether it's by
that buck or maybe it's thedominant doe that catches me in
that stand one time, that's it.
I'm done, because every timethey come into the set after
that, the first thing they'regoing to check is that stand.
And if they see me in it and Imay be camoed out and everything
(22:07):
, but I haven't been there fortwo or three days and then all
of a sudden I show up in there.
Even though they can't put asolid pattern to me, a solid
silhouette, there's stillsomething there that wasn't
there before and it makes themreal leery.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
But it's just going to put them on high alert.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
Exactly, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
So bumping them off in some way?
And I was going to ask youabout that because there were a
lot of times I would bump deerwalking in, and I mean not even
remotely close to my set.
And I and I never quite.
I never really worried aboutthat right now.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
If I saw one, sometimes they would just stand
there and keep looking at me,because all they see is
basically a white light right sodeer in the headlights yeah and
they would just stand there andI'd wait till they actually got
bored and walked off, whichcould take a few minutes yep,
and that's the best thing to do,though, yeah, is let them walk
off, instead of getting you knowthis closer and closer and
(23:01):
closer, and eventually you knowyou're like 15, 20 feet from
them.
Yeah.
And they bound off.
Well, you just let them walkoff, you know, and the same like
I've been trapped in stand atthe end of the day I don't know
how many times day, I don't knowhow many times.
Here it is 10, 11 at night, andit's like I'm sure that if any
game warden came, he'd probablythink I was poaching, you know.
(23:22):
But the reality is no.
I just got a deer on set.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
They've bedded down and I don't want them to see me
climbing out yeah I don't have aspotlight, so it's all cool so
yeah, and I mean yeah, best wayin is also best way out right,
right.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
So anymore I'll.
I'll take like a pocket ofpebbles, little rocks and
whatnot, and once it's pastshooting light, if I got a deer
in on the, I start tossing thosepebbles over by it yeah get
them nervous enough that theywalk off, and then I climb down
on a stand as quickly as I canand get out of there yeah okay,
so last part, and we talk aboutthis ad nauseum, but we that's
(23:56):
just because of how important itis, but their nose.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
So best way in, you're trying to beat their ears
, their eyes and now their nose.
So products in the process toreduce your scent.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
I think, man, there's so much products on the market
now.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Well, let's just actually just talk about what
you use specifically.
So you know, and there are alot so.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, there are, and they all carry weight.
I should say.
Our sponsor is dead down windand we use all of their products
, from the camel wash to thescent free bags to the field
spray, constantly using the windcheck to check our wind and
whatnot, and then we haveozonics in our all of those and
use them to the absolute 150thdegree.
(24:40):
You need to do everything youcan.
I cannot emphasize enough howimportant it is to deal with the
nose, and whenever, if I takesomebody out and they don't want
to address that issue, it'slike okay, this is going to be a
one and done.
You know I take you out one timebecause I'm beating my head
against the wall trying toaccomplish something for you.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
if you're not willing to address this, if you don't
take this part seriously, butit's always the same kind of the
same process and, from what youtaught me, last year we went
out and it's so.
First thing is we're drivingout basically in our underwear,
you know our long underwear,yeah, or sweats or something or
sweats over those.
(25:23):
But then we get out and in ourscent free bags all of our
clothes in the trunk right rightand or the bed of the truck or
wherever, and then it's get outon the side of the road by the
gate and then get dressed rightso that none of those clothes
have any odor to them.
But then it's taking the fieldspray and kind of spraying
ourselves down with that, whichis a kind of a it's like Febreze
(25:46):
and unscented Febreze.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Right.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
It gets rid of the odor and then going in from
there and we might do drags orwhat was the other one, the nose
jammer once we get in, orsomething like that.
But that is the whole process.
And then, when we leave, it'sthis reverse process where open
the trunk, open up thescent-free bag get undressed.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Yeah, it changed back at the car, back into what we
wore out there initially and Ineed to preface all of this to
say that this is not for killinga spike or a forked horn or a
three point, because I hear guyswell, I get my deer every year.
Well, that's fine, that's notthe caliber of deer I'm chasing.
The caliber deer I'm chasing isgoing to make the record books,
(26:29):
you know, and it's like everyyear we're on them, Every year
we've got five or six orwhatever that we're going after.
It's not these little bucks,and I don't want to sound
judgmental or critical of anyone.
If that's what you want toshoot, then, man, have at it.
It's your tag, enjoy yourself.
But the deer that I'm goingafter is not a deer that's going
(26:50):
to tolerate much of my scent atall, if any at all.
Yeah.
So it's a different animal.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
And it's putting together a lot of things to up
those odds.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
It's a lot of.
Maybe this is only 2% of theequation or 5%, but if you do
enough of those, you'veincreased your odds to and it
might be the most important 2%to 5% of the whole equation.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
Yeah.
I mean, when you really stopand think about it, I mean we're
dealing, we're trying to beat amagician, magician yeah, you
know what I mean.
Yeah, it's really, it's toughbut it's that same phrase.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
It just be methodical and everything.
And when you walk into your set, you're walking in the exact
same way, the exact same timesand the exact everything is the
exact same, so that the deer itbecomes familiar.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Right right, there's nothing unusual.
He's patterning you as much asyou're patterning him.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
And so the last one, and I got to thinking about this
and I've talked about myRiverside set quite often and
where I do or I did the mineralsthe last three years.
It's a place where you would dominerals but you wouldn't
necessarily.
It's not a good hunting spot.
It's not the bedroom door.
Okay, now, where the bedroomdoor, I'm thinking more about
(28:11):
kind of and we're wrapping upwith this as far as thinking of
when I go in and thinking aboutlike thermals and not
necessarily winds.
I mean, you'll want to knowwhich way the wind is blowing,
but let's talk about just kindof real quick here, the thermals
.
Now, if you're going in at, say, sun up is 6 am and so you want
(28:36):
to come in a couple hoursbefore that, well, it's still
dark out, it's cold, not a lotof wind, not a lot of thermals
at that point.
So everything's very still.
Now, let's say, 10 o'clock, thethermals are going and that
might blow you out.
And I'm thinking about this formy Riverside set because of
where I have to go in.
I think that might end upbecoming an issue where, even if
it's an afternoon hunt, the waythat and I'm not as worried
(28:58):
about once I'm inset because Ican turn on the ozonics and have
that adjusted to cover my scentand block it, but when I go in
I can't be going in if thermalsor wind is going to push my
scent in a direction that Ican't control and I can't adjust
for Like I can cover for myscent.
(29:19):
So is I mean, have you been inthat situation where you might
have to adjust, or what do youthink about like having to
adjust to that point?
Speaker 2 (29:27):
So I had a set that we called the barnyard.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
And we called it the barnyard because there was so
much activity on that set thatit smelled like a barnyard just
everything that was going onthere, and the bedroom was
exactly east of where my treestand was, and the wind the
prevailing wind was alwaysblowing from west to east, right
into the bedroom.
And boy I used to.
(29:53):
It was really, really difficult.
It was near impossible for meto get a shot opportunity on
anything because they wouldalways come with the wind in
their face.
And then I got an Ozonics andthat set right.
There is the one set that mademe a believer.
Not only did I get shots afterthat, but there was one occasion
where I spent 45 minutes withanimals all around me and the
(30:17):
wind swirling everywhere and Inever once got winded and they
just kind of fed on by up intothis meadow above me and
everything and everything wasreally cool and that was an elk
situation there.
But yeah, prior to that, priorto getting an Ozonics, if you
don't have that man, it's such agame changer.
Your thought process has to betotally different.
(30:39):
If the wind is bad, the wind isbad.
You don't hunt it, yeah, youjust don't.
You don't hunt it yeah, youjust don't.
Yeah.
You know, I don't know how youovercome that.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
Yeah, and that's my.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
And I was in a.
I was at a tree stand.
We've talked about wind beingin layers and stuff and I was
still getting blown out.
I'd take it up as high as Icould.
(31:08):
Little tree you were in, but itwas another one off to.
If you're standing therelooking at the barnyard, there
was another big, taller red furoff to the left that was.
There was three of them clumpedtogether and it had great
backdrop and I was able to getup 25 30 feet in that and it
didn't make a difference.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
I remember that little clump.
Maybe that's some reason Ithought you weren't up that high
.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
I remember the one you're thinking about?
I wasn't.
Oh okay, that one was about 15and that was another little
clump.
Yes, that you were yeah,because it was.
Speaker 1 (31:32):
I think that was the first time I'd seen a tree stand
and I was kind of impressedlike wow, you're on just this
little cubby of branches and Ikilled I don't know how many
bulls out of that at 15 feetwith that Ozonics.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
I don't know how many bulls I killed coming into the
barnyard there over the years.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
But as you're walking in, I mean the Ozonics is great
once you're in set.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Once you're in set, as I was walking in, I mean,
there's times where I have goneliterally hundreds of yards out
of the way, quarter mile, halfmile out of the way to get the
wind in my favor to walk in.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
Yeah, and it's just you know.
It also applies to how you huntthat set.
If your wind isn't allowing you, your prevailing wind isn't
allowing, it's always going togive you away.
I mean, maybe you just maybeyou don't like ground blinds,
but the only places you can gois a ground blind.
Yeah, that doesn't get youblown out.
Yeah, or you know you don'tlike heights.
(32:32):
Well, you and I yesterday setup a stand for boot camp.
That was how far off the ground.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
Maybe seven feet six and a half to seven.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Yeah, it was just over the top of my head and
there's no way anybody could seethat.
No, and I mean you could stand10 feet from it and not know
that.
That is there.
Speaker 1 (32:47):
Yeah, we were prepping for boot camp and it's
kind of this little anexcitement on both our parts
Like how well did we hide both aground blind and a tree stand,
and they're both right off theskidder road and we don't think
anybody will see them.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
What did it take us 30 minutes?
Speaker 1 (33:04):
oh, probably an hour to do both, to do both, yeah,
yeah it doesn't.
Speaker 2 (33:08):
If the wind, if you, that's what you got to do to get
the wind in your favor.
Yeah, you do what you got to do.
But yeah you got to hunt out ofsomething you're not
particularly fond of, or huntaway that you're fond of.
You know if you want that buck.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
That's what you got to do or go in like I was
thinking like before, before thethermals, thermals and before
you can get in there and getyour ozonics going, and when
they switch you're just totallyundetected and that's what I'm
thinking is when I finally getto the point where I'm going to
hunt that set and I believe I'mgoing to hunt halfway this year,
so I think I'm a couple yearsoff from hunting Riverside,
(33:43):
which gives me some more time toexplore and everything like
that but I think I wanted to.
Well, I know I need it for mybackup in case we come across
like we might have anopportunity to host a hunt for
someone and so that we have aspot for them.
But it's that and one of yourcatchphrases if you want what
you've never had, you have to dothe things that you've never
(34:04):
done yeah.
And so that might mean going inat midnight.
I've actually, because I'llprobably do ground blind.
I was thinking about this whenyou told me that how you went
and you slept in your tree standand kind of roped or tied
yourself into it one night, tiedyourself into it one night.
(34:25):
But I was like, okay, but if Ihad the chance to get two times
that really nice buck who couldbe even better this year like
would I be willing to go in at11 o'clock at night the night
before and just go to sleep onthe floor of this tree on this
ground, blind, to wake up andnot worry about the scent.
Yeah.
Yeah, is he worth that, and I'mlike that might be what has to
(34:46):
happen.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
Okay, so this is huge because this is only year three
for Aaron Year three and I'mactually contemplating he's
already Doing these crazy thingsof like okay, maybe I'm going
to go just sleep in the woods.
But that's just it.
And see, that's what I love.
That's what makes it excitingfor me is the fact that somebody
can get so passionate about itthat that's what they're willing
to do.
I've done that.
I told you about that.
(35:10):
My wife wasn't too excited.
I've done it three or fourtimes where I've slept in the
stand all night to be there forthat.
But I've also gone in beforedaylight, like you're saying, to
beat the thermals, get in thereand then when they switch I'm
already in there and I'm inundetected.
They have no idea.
I've done that several times.
Yeah.
But yeah, that passion to andyou start weighing that Do I
(35:34):
really want.
Is this buck worth going after?
That.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
Or this bull that was also why I and I mentioned this
with you I was contemplatingjust grabbing a camp chair or a
ground blind chair and walkingup and looking for the bedroom
door, plopping that chair downsometime this summer and go in
it.
Like you know, once I find thebedroom door, but go in before
(35:57):
daybreak, plop this chair downand sit in it all day, checking
wind non-stop to find out whendid the thermal switch?
right right and going to thatextreme to just figure out okay,
do I need to come in at fouro'clock in the morning to hunt?
This spot right or can I comein at 10 o'clock in the morning
if it's an afternoon hunt, andit could be that the deer are
(36:19):
coming out at eight in themorning, so it doesn't matter, I
still have to come in at 4.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
What's funny is that you start talking this way about
elk, and it's totally normal.
Yeah.
Well, we got a two-mile pack inor a six-mile hike in.
We got to get on the trail by11 or 11.30 or something like
that.
Get in there well beforedaylight.
But when you start talking thisway about deer, people start
thinking you're nuts.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Just, but when you start talking this way about
deer people start thinkingyou're nuts.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
Just drive out to the clear cut and look.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
They're all standing there.
But you know and I know a lotof our listeners because I've
shared the picture of two timeswhen I first discovered him last
year, he was a four by threeand I couldn't tell if he had
eye guards.
But he came back this year.
Now he's a really nice four byfour with eye guards.
Next year he'll be five and ahalf years old.
You know, aging him.
(37:06):
He could be even bigger, hecould be an even more impressive
four by four.
And then there's anotherup-and-coming one that's like a
year younger than him that Idiscovered this year.
But okay, so how many people geta shot at that buck or a shot
of that quality of a buck?
Right, right, that's what'sdriving this.
This is why and our listenersand the guys who've gone to our
(37:28):
class, I think, can relate tothis they want that buck and I
know a lot of you guys are likewe're.
I'm presenting this, thesescenarios, especially as a new
hunter, so that maybe you guysare considering this.
Should I be doing somethinglike this and now you're okay?
Speaker 2 (37:45):
I, is this normal?
Yeah, do other guys think likewell let me just tell you right
now, that's not normal, butthat's for the general
population.
It's not normal but that's whatseparates us from the general
population.
Speaker 1 (37:58):
Yeah, trophy blacktail hunters.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
It is normal yes, it's exactly right.
So it's a sickness that gets inyou.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
But that passion is in a lot of the guys.
Speaker 2 (38:08):
It is.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
Our last locating field day.
You could just tell it.
Well, all of our classes, allof our field days, you can just
tell that from all of the guys.
And thank you for coming tothose classes.
But it's very apparent, you areall invested in.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
They're very serious.
Speaker 1 (38:24):
In this, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:25):
This is not just a hobby.
This is something that they'redriven by.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
So it's fun to talk about these crazy situations
with all of you because, yeah,we found a good audience for
talking about our crazy Grouptherapy.
Yeah, you know my newfoundcrazy Dave's long-term crazy.
Yeah, there you go.
So anyway, so I think that kindof covers it about ears and
eyes and nose and getting in andgetting out of your set.
(38:52):
So until next week.
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