October 28, 2022 • 25 mins
Carrie Huckeby, executive director of the Tennessee Broadband Association, joined the podcast to discuss the history of telecom cooperatives, broadband expansion across our state, and the importance of engaging the next generation to continue the legacy of cooperatives.
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Episode Transcript
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Karen Wilson:
Welcome to the BLC Connection Podcast. (00:02):
undefined
I'm Karen Wilson, your host for today.
Today's guest is Carrie Huckeby, director of the TennesseeBroadband Association, to discuss the evolution of cooperatives
into broadband providers.
Welcome to the BLC Connection Podcast, Carrie.
Carrie Huckeby: Thanks, Karen. (00:19):
undefined
Thanks for asking.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. All right. (00:21):
undefined
Well, let's get started.
Right now, we're recording this in October, which is cooperativemonth.
It'll probably air sometime end of October, first of November.
So, we kind of got started on this thought process because ofcooperative month.
But telecom cooperatives have evolved so much since most wereformed out of necessity during the rural
(00:46):
electrification years.
So what do you think was the catalyst in starting this evolutionfrom phone lines into fiber service?
Carrie Huckeby: Well, I think all those years ago, 70 years or more, that knock on the door from key community (00:55):
undefined
leaders or concerned citizens, to ask residents to become amember of a cooperative or to get a phone line.
That catalyst, I think, was about connectivity.
It was about safety, being able to stay connected with oneanother.
(01:20):
You know, and this question reminded me, I got a phone call afew weeks ago from a lady in a community here in Tennessee,
and she was asking me about getting broadband service.
She didn't have any, and she just had satellite.
And her question to me was, "Aren't we just as important outhere in the rural areas as the
(01:43):
people that live in the city and more populated towns?" And ofcourse, my answer was, "Well, of course you are." And I
think that 70 years or 80 years ago when they were going door todoor, they were saying, "Hey, you out here in the
country, as we call it, are just as important as everyone else."So years later, you know, the technology has
(02:07):
evolved and now we're talking broadband.
But it's still the same thing.
The catalyst is still connectivity.
It's connectivity to education, health services, precisionagriculture, emergency services,
all those things that drive that connectivity.
So even though the innovation and the technology has changed andour cooperative has changed, our companies have changed, that
(02:34):
catalyst is still about communication and connectivity, Ibelieve.
Karen Wilson: Well, even in those days, you know, most people stayed close to home. (02:39):
undefined
But you also had families that were beginning to move away, moveto larger cities where jobs were more
prevalent. So they wanted to, I guess, talk to their familiesthat were in.
I remember, like in my grandparents day, lots of people moved toMichigan because that's where the jobs were and stuff.
(03:01):
Well, you wanted to talk to your family.
And so a lot of these small rural farms did not have thatopportunity until the cooperatives were formed.
Carrie Huckeby: Exactly. I can remember my aunt and uncle, James and Overlin, that moved to Michigan. (03:11):
undefined
And, you know, they didn't get to come home very often, but theydefinitely wanted to keep up with their nieces and nephews and
their brothers and sisters to see how they were doing.
So the cooperatives and that getting that telephone line at thattime really played a role in
(03:34):
keeping families connected, as you said, when they were forcedto leave to get jobs somewhere else or they didn't want to stay
and work on the farm.
So that evolution and that progress and all that, just becausethe world was moving and there were other
things to do, did not mean you still didn't need thatconnectivity.
Karen Wilson: Right. Sometimes I think we think we're the only generation that has been moving and evolving. (03:54):
undefined
But, you know, it started with our pioneer fathers and mothers.
Carrie Huckeby: It did. It just looked a little different than it does today. (04:04):
undefined
But it's the same thing.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. So no doubt the availability of grants has sped up fiber builds and deployment. (04:08):
undefined
Do you feel these efforts will be sustained until every ruralTennessean has fiber to the home?
Carrie Huckeby: Well, there's no doubt the administrations, both federal and state, are evaluating and counting the number of (04:20):
undefined
homes and locations that do and do not have broadband service.
And they are allocating funds through multiple grant and loanprograms.
And that funding, you know, it's necessary.
(04:40):
We can't do it right now without it.
It's imperative that we have that to reach every location in ourstate.
Now, whether that happens in five years or whether that happensin ten years or longer, the fact is that there are
locations in our state that can cost hundreds of thousands ofdollars to reach.
(05:01):
One of our member company said a few weeks ago that it had causedover $80,000 to reach one home in a remote
area. So, you know, without this funding, it's very difficultfor a company to afford, you know, to
build that, because if it cost hundreds of thousands of dollars,you know, there's no way to justify a build like that sometimes
(05:24):
because it'll never be right side up on the balance sheet.
There's no rate of return for something like that.
And it's so important to connect as many Tennesseans as possiblewhile this funding is happening.
But the well will go dry at some point.
You know, it just will.
And we know that.
So that's why we are working as hard as we can.
(05:46):
The member companies are to get everybody connected.
But I think that if they haven't been able to reach everyone,that they'll go back to the same principles that
they had before the grants and funding.
That they will examine every location, they'll examine everycommunity to see what's financially
(06:08):
feasible to get to.
And, you know, they'll do what, like I said, what they've alwaysdone.
They'll keep trying to move in the right direction.
But it will slow things down.
And I think that companies will not be able to look at thecommunity next door and go into that
(06:31):
area as quickly as they will today with funding.
Karen Wilson: That's true. Yeah, because that's what's, you know, in the underserved areas where their current provider has chosen not to (06:35):
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build there, the grants are enabling others to go in and build.
But I could see that, that probably will slow down.
Carrie Huckeby: Exactly. And it's like the lady I mentioned, her provider had decided or was not coming into her area to build. (06:50):
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So she was looking for someone else that has the expertise andthe funding that will come in and do it.
So many of our members have 100% fiber networks in their owncooperative territory, but now they're
(07:11):
taking that funding and their expertise, and they're going tothe community next door and providing it there.
So, you know, we hope the funding lasts a long time until everyTennessean is connected.
And I definitely think our administrations are.
That's their goal, if all possible.
Karen Wilson: Yes. It seems to be on their mind, and they talk about it so frequently that you know it's a top priority for (07:30):
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them. So Tennessee recently had a visit from FCC CommissionerBrendan Carr and Senator Marsha Blackburn with
a roundtable discussion with executives from independents andcooperatives.
So it's, you know, we're always honored to have people like thatcome give us a voice and to
(07:58):
see what our opinions are.
What was that discussion like?
How did that go?
Carrie Huckeby: Well, like you said, we were very honored that they reached out to, Senator Blackburn's office reached out to our government (08:02):
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affairs director, Lavoy Knowles, and said, "Hey, we're coming totown.
We'd really like to sit down and have some discussion and getyour feedback.
And then you hear from us as well about what's going to happenin the future, what's in the pipeline." So Commissioner Carr
(08:26):
started the day with DTC and he stopped in, was able to talk toChris Townson, the general manager.
But the more important part, he was able to go out into thecommunity and see the DTC employees putting up
fiber.
And he had never seen that before and really didn't know whatkind of work it takes and expertise it takes to make that
(08:49):
happen. So when he goes back to Washington and he's sitting atthe FCC conference table, you know, he will
have a much better, clearer picture of what it actually takes toget broadband into these rural communities.
So he was able to do that and start the day.
Then we came together in Nashville there with Senator Blackburn,and we were able to sit around the table and
(09:15):
when they had requested the meeting, they did ask for us tobring together companies that were offering broadband,
but they were doing it with different technologies.
So fiber broadband, or they were using fixed wireless or theymight be using a cable modem.
So we were all sitting around the table there having thediscussion.
(09:37):
And that conversation included things like mapping, you know, theaccuracy of mapping, which is so
important when it comes to the grants, who gets the funding, whois identified as underserved or served or not
served at all.
And, you know, it all comes from that mapping.
We talked about labor shortages because, as you know, there arepeople retiring.
(10:02):
From Ben Lomand Connect and all these other cooperatives andcommercial companies that as that expertise
retires, you know, where is the succession plan?
Where do we find the labor force?
Where are these students being exposed to the disciplines thatwe need to keep going?
(10:22):
So we talked about TCAT and college and high school courses.
We also talked about supply chain delays because that's a bigconversation.
I just returned from the KTA/TNBA Conference.
That's a big, that's a big discussion.
And when you have deadlines to complete a project in three yearsor five years, if you're not getting fiber, you know,
(10:44):
four or five years or three years, or you're not getting a truckfor three years, you know, that can cause those delays in
completing those projects.
And so that was very important for our member companies to talkto Senator Blackburn and the commissioner, FCC commissioner,
about that and say these are the things we're facing,environmental studies, the delay sometimes that it
(11:09):
causes in a fiber build...
Karen Wilson: Waiting on them to come and do the study. (11:11):
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Carrie Huckeby: Yes, it's laying on someone's desk, and it lays there for a while. (11:14):
undefined
And, you know, then it delays a project 12 months.
And so those were all things that were discussed around thetable.
And, you know, I've said this many times that even though theFCC commissioner and our senator, legislators hold these
(11:34):
very important positions and, you know, vote on all things thatare imperative to our state, they
cannot be an expert on every single subject.
You know, they have to have these discussions in our membercompanies and these
CEOs and these other people that are working in it every day toenlighten one another.
(12:02):
You know, they have to have that to take back to Washington D.C.
to make those decisions and to have all the info they need.
Karen Wilson: Yeah, I guess, you know, it's a proof of the grants and the money being put to good use. (12:09):
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The employment, seeing the employees out there working in thefield, I'm sure is an awesome thing to see the
jobs that it's creating.
But then also like the domino effect, as you said, of employeeshortages and supply chain shortages and how that
(12:34):
affects everyone in that process.
Carrie Huckeby: It does because it takes the workforce to get the supplies, you know, make the supplies. (12:37):
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It takes us, you know, we have to order them and, you know,they're manufactured and delivered.
But then also the expertise and experience you need from youremployees to work in everything from accounting, you know,
because you're doing the auditing and the reporting back to thegovernment on the grants that you're using it
(13:02):
properly. There's no misconduct or mishandling of that funding.
It's going exactly where it needs to be.
So you've got all these employees marketing, communications andall these employees that are needed working
in this field. So where do you find them?
You know, where are they being trained?
Where are they hearing about the careers that are available intelecom?
(13:26):
And so our legislators are just as concerned about that as weare, and they're here to help us
find ways to develop programs to train those people.
You know how far back in school do we talk about STEM andtechnology.
So it was a really good roundtable discussion.
(13:46):
It was an over an hour, hour and 15 minutes.
And again, we were thrilled that they were giving us that amountof time.
Karen Wilson: Yeah, that's good because, you know, thinking about kids and very few kids like, take their time to say (13:54):
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or give that thought process of like, I want to work in telecom,you know.
But we want to be there, and I'm surprised and that's great thatthat went back as far as even education
(14:15):
of our children in these rural schools.
Carrie Huckeby: Yeah, it all fits together. (14:18):
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I mean, it's one great big puzzle.
And then we started this conversation about cooperatives.
And I think that's part of it, too, that we have roles here oftalking about the disciplines that are
available and what a cooperative is.
Why would you want to work for a cooperative?
So kind of falling back on that.
(14:39):
But lots of great discussion.
So we were really glad that happened.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. Yeah. Always good to have a face in front of those affecting decisions on the national and state (14:43):
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level. So as someone who's had a successful career in thetelecom industry, what is the greatest source of pride amongst
cooperatives in Tennessee?
Carrie Huckeby: Well, I thought about this a little bit. (15:02):
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And again, I think we talked about the catalyst of connectivity.
I think the pride you know, I don't think the source of pridehas changed much.
I would think the same thing that drove the knock on the door tosign people up for phone service, drives cooperative boards and
(15:22):
employees today.
You know, that willingness to serve, to innovate, to educate, toinform, to be a great corporate citizen, to be
socially responsible, just show up every day to ensure thattheir cooperative stays strong
and their community is supported.
And for each cooperative that I worked for, I knew we played arole in the welfare and
(15:49):
the success of our community.
And I think it's that pride.
I know it was that pride that drove me while I was working intelecom.
And but I think it's that pride that drives employees to show upevery day.
You know, we laugh and say, of course, a paycheck is important,but you've got to have some reason that you put your feet on the
(16:10):
floor every morning, and you get dressed, and you go to work.
So I think it's really that seventh cooperative principle thatit's concern for community.
And I think that pride of helping everyone in the community andbeing a part, you know, just
being there for support is what that pride is.
(16:32):
You know, I think everybody's proud of that.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. And, you know, I hear installers and customer service people when they help (16:34):
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someone and that customer comes to them and says, thank you forconnecting or helping me with my Internet or
anything. My phone line was down, something like that.
They are, the customer, is so appreciative.
(16:58):
Most of them are.
And then the employee gets the gratification of thinking.
I made a difference in that person's day, week, month, how theirlife is exactly.
Carrie Huckeby: Because you don't know what's going on in their life. (17:09):
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I mean, you know, they need a phone call.
They need to call a doctor.
They need to check on their kids.
They need whatever.
So, you know, they need to do a college course and get an examin.
So when you're improving and enriching their quality of life,you know, that's just the pat on the back that you need to make
(17:31):
You go to work every day.
Karen Wilson: Yeah, that's true. (17:33):
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Paycheck is nice, but...
Carrie Huckeby: Paycheck pays the bills, but... (17:36):
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Karen Wilson: That's right. But there is something to be said about making a difference and the motivation to do that. (17:38):
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Carrie Huckeby: Exactly. (17:44):
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Karen Wilson: So do you see other future evolutions of the telecom cooperative model coming, or what do you think about that? (17:45):
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Carrie Huckeby: You know, I think the primary purpose of a cooperative, and we've talked about the principles a little bit, is that it's there to (17:53):
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serve the community in which it operates, where it operates.
And since co-ops are not-for-profit enterprises, you know, theprofit goes to fulfilling the
social and economic and cultural needs of the community.
(18:16):
And, you know, when a co-op does well, it benefits thecommunity.
And the cooperative model or the core values are based on thoseseven principles: voluntary and member
control, democratic member controlled, economic participation,autonomy and independence, education and
(18:37):
information, and cooperation among other cooperatives.
And, you know, like we said, number seven, concern forcommunity.
It's a good model now.
And personally, I can't visualize that the telecom modelchanging or evolving to look
(18:58):
differently than it does today.
It works. There's farmers co-ops.
There's small flower co-ops.
There's.
Karen Wilson: Food co-ops. (19:09):
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Carrie Huckeby: Food co-ops. And the electric co-ops. (19:10):
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And it's still working and cooperatives are still being formedtoday.
So I think about this question, I think it's not broke.
Why try to fix it?
So I could totally be wrong, but I just think the cooperativemodel works so.
Karen Wilson: Well, it seems like society has a renewed appreciation of cooperatives. (19:27):
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You are seeing our young people participate in more, like wesaid, food cooperatives and things like that, and they're
thinking more about it.
And when they think about those things, it makes them thinkabout their providers, their telecom service.
And so I think we're going to see a resurgence in thatappreciation of the cooperative model.
Carrie Huckeby: Well, it's their company, you know, their members, they're stockholders in that company. (19:52):
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So they have a vote, you know, they can choose their board of directors, and they can help
direct the company as they see fit and, you know, be informed.
And so, you know, that's a model that works well in smallercommunities, too.
(20:17):
And and then I think also they, in our communities, we see thecooperatives are able to put that sign in
the ballpark, and they're able to do a scholarship, and they'reable to touch a whole lot of lives in
ways that...
Karen Wilson: They give back because they're supported by the community. (20:35):
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Carrie Huckeby: That's exactly right. They give back, and they play an important role. (20:39):
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So hopefully younger people are seeing the benefits of that andunderstand what a cooperative is.
Karen Wilson: Yeah, well, with it being cooperative month, we will encourage everybody to come to their annual meetings of their cooperatives (20:49):
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in their area. You know, take an interest and participate in thedemocratic voting of their board members and things like that,
because that's how you have a say in what happens in yourcooperative.
Carrie Huckeby: Yeah, and I totally agree. (21:09):
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And I'm really, and I meant to say this, that I'm really happythat we still celebrate cooperatives in October, that that month
is dedicated to it because I think it does give us anopportunity to have these discussions and remind everyone what a
cooperative is and the importance of them.
Karen Wilson: Right. So what do you think those who started the telecom cooperatives would think of their current legacy? (21:28):
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Carrie Huckeby: Well, I've worked, like I said, in cooperatives throughout my career with them and for them and still working for them and (21:37):
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commercial companies.
And I thought about those people that went house to house andtalked about the benefits of having a telephone
connection and starting a cooperative.
And I don't think they were looking too far into the future atthat time or imagining all the things that would
(22:04):
evolve after they knocked on that door.
You know, they didn't see four party lines changing into twoparty or then change into private phone lines.
Or the addition of, you know, features like call waiting andcaller ID.
You and I worked together.
You remember how exciting caller ID was and voice mail.
Karen Wilson: You beeped over, and there was another person I know. (22:26):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby: Right? I know. Conference calling. (22:29):
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Yeah, you could do that.
And then there was voice mail.
You either loved it, or you hated it.
And then came along the internet.
So they just wanted the connectivity and to take care of theircommunity.
But I can't imagine any of those people would be unhappy withthe direction their
(22:52):
cooperative or the evolution of the phone line to fiberbroadband.
I can't imagine.
I mean, you and I certainly would not be sitting here andtalking about this evolution if they had not knocked
on those doors and built that foundation and started with anidea.
Now, granted, they might not be too crazy about social media andhow we use that connectivity, but the fact is that
(23:19):
they, you know, they kicked it off.
And we are here today with a vision to continue to connect ruralcommunities with
broadband. So, you know, they started a whole lot.
And so I can't imagine they would be unhappy with theconnectivity or the legacy that came out of
(23:42):
that single knock on someone's door.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. Who would have thought, you know, 75, 84, some getting close to maybe 100 years, that the (23:44):
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cooperative that they started is still thriving.
It hasn't had to sell out to another company, and they're juststill in that connectivity, just in a different
way.
Carrie Huckeby: Exactly. So you almost wish you were around then to knock on that door and make that first connection and talk people into being a (24:03):
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part of the cooperative.
But of course, we still do that today in some way, knocking ondoors and say, you know, how would you like broadband service?
Karen Wilson: Yeah, I know we've struggled with thinking about that. (24:18):
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You know, door knocking is something that people don't do, butit's another touch to the customer.
Hey, a reminder that we're here.
We're always soft sellers and not somebody that's forcing you totake anything like that.
But it's a good connection with the customer.
Carrie Huckeby: I definitely agree. (24:37):
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So I think it's an outstanding legacy that they started manyyears ago.
Karen Wilson: I agree. Lots of good things came from that. (24:44):
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Think of all the people that have been employed by cooperativesin our rural areas, the families that have been raised because of
the jobs and cooperatives and then all the connectivity that hascome from it.
It's a great source of pride, I would think.
Carrie Huckeby: I think so, too. I mean, I've been retired a little while, but I still carry that little cooperative pride and telecom pride and (25:01):
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all that around with me.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you. (25:09):
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Carrie Huckeby, the director of the Tennessee BroadbandAssociation, for joining us on the BLC Connection Podcast.
Great to have you come join us today.
Carrie Huckeby: Thanks, Karen. Thanks for asking. (25:21):
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Karen Wilson: We invite our listeners to tune in for future episodes and share this content with other businesses. (25:23):
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Until next time, this is your BLC Connection.
undefined
I'm Karen Wilson, your host for today.
Today's guest is Carrie Huckeby, director of the TennesseeBroadband Association, to discuss the evolution of cooperatives
into broadband providers.
Welcome to the BLC Connection Podcast, Carrie.
Carrie Huckeby: Thanks, Karen. (00:19):
undefined
Thanks for asking.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. All right. (00:21):
undefined
Well, let's get started.
Right now, we're recording this in October, which is cooperativemonth.
It'll probably air sometime end of October, first of November.
So, we kind of got started on this thought process because ofcooperative month.
But telecom cooperatives have evolved so much since most wereformed out of necessity during the rural
(00:46):
electrification years.
So what do you think was the catalyst in starting this evolutionfrom phone lines into fiber service?
Carrie Huckeby: Well, I think all those years ago, 70 years or more, that knock on the door from key community (00:55):
undefined
leaders or concerned citizens, to ask residents to become amember of a cooperative or to get a phone line.
That catalyst, I think, was about connectivity.
It was about safety, being able to stay connected with oneanother.
(01:20):
You know, and this question reminded me, I got a phone call afew weeks ago from a lady in a community here in Tennessee,
and she was asking me about getting broadband service.
She didn't have any, and she just had satellite.
And her question to me was, "Aren't we just as important outhere in the rural areas as the
(01:43):
people that live in the city and more populated towns?" And ofcourse, my answer was, "Well, of course you are." And I
think that 70 years or 80 years ago when they were going door todoor, they were saying, "Hey, you out here in the
country, as we call it, are just as important as everyone else."So years later, you know, the technology has
(02:07):
evolved and now we're talking broadband.
But it's still the same thing.
The catalyst is still connectivity.
It's connectivity to education, health services, precisionagriculture, emergency services,
all those things that drive that connectivity.
So even though the innovation and the technology has changed andour cooperative has changed, our companies have changed, that
(02:34):
catalyst is still about communication and connectivity, Ibelieve.
Karen Wilson: Well, even in those days, you know, most people stayed close to home. (02:39):
undefined
But you also had families that were beginning to move away, moveto larger cities where jobs were more
prevalent. So they wanted to, I guess, talk to their familiesthat were in.
I remember, like in my grandparents day, lots of people moved toMichigan because that's where the jobs were and stuff.
(03:01):
Well, you wanted to talk to your family.
And so a lot of these small rural farms did not have thatopportunity until the cooperatives were formed.
Carrie Huckeby: Exactly. I can remember my aunt and uncle, James and Overlin, that moved to Michigan. (03:11):
undefined
And, you know, they didn't get to come home very often, but theydefinitely wanted to keep up with their nieces and nephews and
their brothers and sisters to see how they were doing.
So the cooperatives and that getting that telephone line at thattime really played a role in
(03:34):
keeping families connected, as you said, when they were forcedto leave to get jobs somewhere else or they didn't want to stay
and work on the farm.
So that evolution and that progress and all that, just becausethe world was moving and there were other
things to do, did not mean you still didn't need thatconnectivity.
Karen Wilson: Right. Sometimes I think we think we're the only generation that has been moving and evolving. (03:54):
undefined
But, you know, it started with our pioneer fathers and mothers.
Carrie Huckeby: It did. It just looked a little different than it does today. (04:04):
undefined
But it's the same thing.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. So no doubt the availability of grants has sped up fiber builds and deployment. (04:08):
undefined
Do you feel these efforts will be sustained until every ruralTennessean has fiber to the home?
Carrie Huckeby: Well, there's no doubt the administrations, both federal and state, are evaluating and counting the number of (04:20):
undefined
homes and locations that do and do not have broadband service.
And they are allocating funds through multiple grant and loanprograms.
And that funding, you know, it's necessary.
(04:40):
We can't do it right now without it.
It's imperative that we have that to reach every location in ourstate.
Now, whether that happens in five years or whether that happensin ten years or longer, the fact is that there are
locations in our state that can cost hundreds of thousands ofdollars to reach.
(05:01):
One of our member company said a few weeks ago that it had causedover $80,000 to reach one home in a remote
area. So, you know, without this funding, it's very difficultfor a company to afford, you know, to
build that, because if it cost hundreds of thousands of dollars,you know, there's no way to justify a build like that sometimes
(05:24):
because it'll never be right side up on the balance sheet.
There's no rate of return for something like that.
And it's so important to connect as many Tennesseans as possiblewhile this funding is happening.
But the well will go dry at some point.
You know, it just will.
And we know that.
So that's why we are working as hard as we can.
(05:46):
The member companies are to get everybody connected.
But I think that if they haven't been able to reach everyone,that they'll go back to the same principles that
they had before the grants and funding.
That they will examine every location, they'll examine everycommunity to see what's financially
(06:08):
feasible to get to.
And, you know, they'll do what, like I said, what they've alwaysdone.
They'll keep trying to move in the right direction.
But it will slow things down.
And I think that companies will not be able to look at thecommunity next door and go into that
(06:31):
area as quickly as they will today with funding.
Karen Wilson: That's true. Yeah, because that's what's, you know, in the underserved areas where their current provider has chosen not to (06:35):
undefined
build there, the grants are enabling others to go in and build.
But I could see that, that probably will slow down.
Carrie Huckeby: Exactly. And it's like the lady I mentioned, her provider had decided or was not coming into her area to build. (06:50):
undefined
So she was looking for someone else that has the expertise andthe funding that will come in and do it.
So many of our members have 100% fiber networks in their owncooperative territory, but now they're
(07:11):
taking that funding and their expertise, and they're going tothe community next door and providing it there.
So, you know, we hope the funding lasts a long time until everyTennessean is connected.
And I definitely think our administrations are.
That's their goal, if all possible.
Karen Wilson: Yes. It seems to be on their mind, and they talk about it so frequently that you know it's a top priority for (07:30):
undefined
them. So Tennessee recently had a visit from FCC CommissionerBrendan Carr and Senator Marsha Blackburn with
a roundtable discussion with executives from independents andcooperatives.
So it's, you know, we're always honored to have people like thatcome give us a voice and to
(07:58):
see what our opinions are.
What was that discussion like?
How did that go?
Carrie Huckeby: Well, like you said, we were very honored that they reached out to, Senator Blackburn's office reached out to our government (08:02):
undefined
affairs director, Lavoy Knowles, and said, "Hey, we're coming totown.
We'd really like to sit down and have some discussion and getyour feedback.
And then you hear from us as well about what's going to happenin the future, what's in the pipeline." So Commissioner Carr
(08:26):
started the day with DTC and he stopped in, was able to talk toChris Townson, the general manager.
But the more important part, he was able to go out into thecommunity and see the DTC employees putting up
fiber.
And he had never seen that before and really didn't know whatkind of work it takes and expertise it takes to make that
(08:49):
happen. So when he goes back to Washington and he's sitting atthe FCC conference table, you know, he will
have a much better, clearer picture of what it actually takes toget broadband into these rural communities.
So he was able to do that and start the day.
Then we came together in Nashville there with Senator Blackburn,and we were able to sit around the table and
(09:15):
when they had requested the meeting, they did ask for us tobring together companies that were offering broadband,
but they were doing it with different technologies.
So fiber broadband, or they were using fixed wireless or theymight be using a cable modem.
So we were all sitting around the table there having thediscussion.
(09:37):
And that conversation included things like mapping, you know, theaccuracy of mapping, which is so
important when it comes to the grants, who gets the funding, whois identified as underserved or served or not
served at all.
And, you know, it all comes from that mapping.
We talked about labor shortages because, as you know, there arepeople retiring.
(10:02):
From Ben Lomand Connect and all these other cooperatives andcommercial companies that as that expertise
retires, you know, where is the succession plan?
Where do we find the labor force?
Where are these students being exposed to the disciplines thatwe need to keep going?
(10:22):
So we talked about TCAT and college and high school courses.
We also talked about supply chain delays because that's a bigconversation.
I just returned from the KTA/TNBA Conference.
That's a big, that's a big discussion.
And when you have deadlines to complete a project in three yearsor five years, if you're not getting fiber, you know,
(10:44):
four or five years or three years, or you're not getting a truckfor three years, you know, that can cause those delays in
completing those projects.
And so that was very important for our member companies to talkto Senator Blackburn and the commissioner, FCC commissioner,
about that and say these are the things we're facing,environmental studies, the delay sometimes that it
(11:09):
causes in a fiber build...
Karen Wilson: Waiting on them to come and do the study. (11:11):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby: Yes, it's laying on someone's desk, and it lays there for a while. (11:14):
undefined
And, you know, then it delays a project 12 months.
And so those were all things that were discussed around thetable.
And, you know, I've said this many times that even though theFCC commissioner and our senator, legislators hold these
(11:34):
very important positions and, you know, vote on all things thatare imperative to our state, they
cannot be an expert on every single subject.
You know, they have to have these discussions in our membercompanies and these
CEOs and these other people that are working in it every day toenlighten one another.
(12:02):
You know, they have to have that to take back to Washington D.C.
to make those decisions and to have all the info they need.
Karen Wilson: Yeah, I guess, you know, it's a proof of the grants and the money being put to good use. (12:09):
undefined
The employment, seeing the employees out there working in thefield, I'm sure is an awesome thing to see the
jobs that it's creating.
But then also like the domino effect, as you said, of employeeshortages and supply chain shortages and how that
(12:34):
affects everyone in that process.
Carrie Huckeby: It does because it takes the workforce to get the supplies, you know, make the supplies. (12:37):
undefined
It takes us, you know, we have to order them and, you know,they're manufactured and delivered.
But then also the expertise and experience you need from youremployees to work in everything from accounting, you know,
because you're doing the auditing and the reporting back to thegovernment on the grants that you're using it
(13:02):
properly. There's no misconduct or mishandling of that funding.
It's going exactly where it needs to be.
So you've got all these employees marketing, communications andall these employees that are needed working
in this field. So where do you find them?
You know, where are they being trained?
Where are they hearing about the careers that are available intelecom?
(13:26):
And so our legislators are just as concerned about that as weare, and they're here to help us
find ways to develop programs to train those people.
You know how far back in school do we talk about STEM andtechnology.
So it was a really good roundtable discussion.
(13:46):
It was an over an hour, hour and 15 minutes.
And again, we were thrilled that they were giving us that amountof time.
Karen Wilson: Yeah, that's good because, you know, thinking about kids and very few kids like, take their time to say (13:54):
undefined
or give that thought process of like, I want to work in telecom,you know.
But we want to be there, and I'm surprised and that's great thatthat went back as far as even education
(14:15):
of our children in these rural schools.
Carrie Huckeby: Yeah, it all fits together. (14:18):
undefined
I mean, it's one great big puzzle.
And then we started this conversation about cooperatives.
And I think that's part of it, too, that we have roles here oftalking about the disciplines that are
available and what a cooperative is.
Why would you want to work for a cooperative?
So kind of falling back on that.
(14:39):
But lots of great discussion.
So we were really glad that happened.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. Yeah. Always good to have a face in front of those affecting decisions on the national and state (14:43):
undefined
level. So as someone who's had a successful career in thetelecom industry, what is the greatest source of pride amongst
cooperatives in Tennessee?
Carrie Huckeby: Well, I thought about this a little bit. (15:02):
undefined
And again, I think we talked about the catalyst of connectivity.
I think the pride you know, I don't think the source of pridehas changed much.
I would think the same thing that drove the knock on the door tosign people up for phone service, drives cooperative boards and
(15:22):
employees today.
You know, that willingness to serve, to innovate, to educate, toinform, to be a great corporate citizen, to be
socially responsible, just show up every day to ensure thattheir cooperative stays strong
and their community is supported.
And for each cooperative that I worked for, I knew we played arole in the welfare and
(15:49):
the success of our community.
And I think it's that pride.
I know it was that pride that drove me while I was working intelecom.
And but I think it's that pride that drives employees to show upevery day.
You know, we laugh and say, of course, a paycheck is important,but you've got to have some reason that you put your feet on the
(16:10):
floor every morning, and you get dressed, and you go to work.
So I think it's really that seventh cooperative principle thatit's concern for community.
And I think that pride of helping everyone in the community andbeing a part, you know, just
being there for support is what that pride is.
(16:32):
You know, I think everybody's proud of that.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. And, you know, I hear installers and customer service people when they help (16:34):
undefined
someone and that customer comes to them and says, thank you forconnecting or helping me with my Internet or
anything. My phone line was down, something like that.
They are, the customer, is so appreciative.
(16:58):
Most of them are.
And then the employee gets the gratification of thinking.
I made a difference in that person's day, week, month, how theirlife is exactly.
Carrie Huckeby: Because you don't know what's going on in their life. (17:09):
undefined
I mean, you know, they need a phone call.
They need to call a doctor.
They need to check on their kids.
They need whatever.
So, you know, they need to do a college course and get an examin.
So when you're improving and enriching their quality of life,you know, that's just the pat on the back that you need to make
(17:31):
You go to work every day.
Karen Wilson: Yeah, that's true. (17:33):
undefined
Paycheck is nice, but...
Carrie Huckeby: Paycheck pays the bills, but... (17:36):
undefined
Karen Wilson: That's right. But there is something to be said about making a difference and the motivation to do that. (17:38):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby: Exactly. (17:44):
undefined
Karen Wilson: So do you see other future evolutions of the telecom cooperative model coming, or what do you think about that? (17:45):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby: You know, I think the primary purpose of a cooperative, and we've talked about the principles a little bit, is that it's there to (17:53):
undefined
serve the community in which it operates, where it operates.
And since co-ops are not-for-profit enterprises, you know, theprofit goes to fulfilling the
social and economic and cultural needs of the community.
(18:16):
And, you know, when a co-op does well, it benefits thecommunity.
And the cooperative model or the core values are based on thoseseven principles: voluntary and member
control, democratic member controlled, economic participation,autonomy and independence, education and
(18:37):
information, and cooperation among other cooperatives.
And, you know, like we said, number seven, concern forcommunity.
It's a good model now.
And personally, I can't visualize that the telecom modelchanging or evolving to look
(18:58):
differently than it does today.
It works. There's farmers co-ops.
There's small flower co-ops.
There's.
Karen Wilson: Food co-ops. (19:09):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby: Food co-ops. And the electric co-ops. (19:10):
undefined
And it's still working and cooperatives are still being formedtoday.
So I think about this question, I think it's not broke.
Why try to fix it?
So I could totally be wrong, but I just think the cooperativemodel works so.
Karen Wilson: Well, it seems like society has a renewed appreciation of cooperatives. (19:27):
undefined
You are seeing our young people participate in more, like wesaid, food cooperatives and things like that, and they're
thinking more about it.
And when they think about those things, it makes them thinkabout their providers, their telecom service.
And so I think we're going to see a resurgence in thatappreciation of the cooperative model.
Carrie Huckeby: Well, it's their company, you know, their members, they're stockholders in that company. (19:52):
undefined
So they have a vote, you know, they can choose their board of directors, and they can help
direct the company as they see fit and, you know, be informed.
And so, you know, that's a model that works well in smallercommunities, too.
(20:17):
And and then I think also they, in our communities, we see thecooperatives are able to put that sign in
the ballpark, and they're able to do a scholarship, and they'reable to touch a whole lot of lives in
ways that...
Karen Wilson: They give back because they're supported by the community. (20:35):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby: That's exactly right. They give back, and they play an important role. (20:39):
undefined
So hopefully younger people are seeing the benefits of that andunderstand what a cooperative is.
Karen Wilson: Yeah, well, with it being cooperative month, we will encourage everybody to come to their annual meetings of their cooperatives (20:49):
undefined
in their area. You know, take an interest and participate in thedemocratic voting of their board members and things like that,
because that's how you have a say in what happens in yourcooperative.
Carrie Huckeby: Yeah, and I totally agree. (21:09):
undefined
And I'm really, and I meant to say this, that I'm really happythat we still celebrate cooperatives in October, that that month
is dedicated to it because I think it does give us anopportunity to have these discussions and remind everyone what a
cooperative is and the importance of them.
Karen Wilson: Right. So what do you think those who started the telecom cooperatives would think of their current legacy? (21:28):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby: Well, I've worked, like I said, in cooperatives throughout my career with them and for them and still working for them and (21:37):
undefined
commercial companies.
And I thought about those people that went house to house andtalked about the benefits of having a telephone
connection and starting a cooperative.
And I don't think they were looking too far into the future atthat time or imagining all the things that would
(22:04):
evolve after they knocked on that door.
You know, they didn't see four party lines changing into twoparty or then change into private phone lines.
Or the addition of, you know, features like call waiting andcaller ID.
You and I worked together.
You remember how exciting caller ID was and voice mail.
Karen Wilson: You beeped over, and there was another person I know. (22:26):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby: Right? I know. Conference calling. (22:29):
undefined
Yeah, you could do that.
And then there was voice mail.
You either loved it, or you hated it.
And then came along the internet.
So they just wanted the connectivity and to take care of theircommunity.
But I can't imagine any of those people would be unhappy withthe direction their
(22:52):
cooperative or the evolution of the phone line to fiberbroadband.
I can't imagine.
I mean, you and I certainly would not be sitting here andtalking about this evolution if they had not knocked
on those doors and built that foundation and started with anidea.
Now, granted, they might not be too crazy about social media andhow we use that connectivity, but the fact is that
(23:19):
they, you know, they kicked it off.
And we are here today with a vision to continue to connect ruralcommunities with
broadband. So, you know, they started a whole lot.
And so I can't imagine they would be unhappy with theconnectivity or the legacy that came out of
(23:42):
that single knock on someone's door.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. Who would have thought, you know, 75, 84, some getting close to maybe 100 years, that the (23:44):
undefined
cooperative that they started is still thriving.
It hasn't had to sell out to another company, and they're juststill in that connectivity, just in a different
way.
Carrie Huckeby: Exactly. So you almost wish you were around then to knock on that door and make that first connection and talk people into being a (24:03):
undefined
part of the cooperative.
But of course, we still do that today in some way, knocking ondoors and say, you know, how would you like broadband service?
Karen Wilson: Yeah, I know we've struggled with thinking about that. (24:18):
undefined
You know, door knocking is something that people don't do, butit's another touch to the customer.
Hey, a reminder that we're here.
We're always soft sellers and not somebody that's forcing you totake anything like that.
But it's a good connection with the customer.
Carrie Huckeby: I definitely agree. (24:37):
undefined
So I think it's an outstanding legacy that they started manyyears ago.
Karen Wilson: I agree. Lots of good things came from that. (24:44):
undefined
Think of all the people that have been employed by cooperativesin our rural areas, the families that have been raised because of
the jobs and cooperatives and then all the connectivity that hascome from it.
It's a great source of pride, I would think.
Carrie Huckeby: I think so, too. I mean, I've been retired a little while, but I still carry that little cooperative pride and telecom pride and (25:01):
undefined
all that around with me.
Karen Wilson: Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you. (25:09):
undefined
Carrie Huckeby, the director of the Tennessee BroadbandAssociation, for joining us on the BLC Connection Podcast.
Great to have you come join us today.
Carrie Huckeby: Thanks, Karen. Thanks for asking. (25:21):
undefined
Karen Wilson: We invite our listeners to tune in for future episodes and share this content with other businesses. (25:23):
undefined
Until next time, this is your BLC Connection.
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