December 19, 2023 • 42 mins
Are you fully aware of the legal implications surrounding your business? Whether big or small, I promise you that this episode with Liku Amadi Esquire, Founder of Anasa Law Firm, will provide you with some invaluable knowledge. We debunk the myth that legal services are only exclusive for large-scale businesses and discuss how you can leverage your legal assets to scale your revenue and safeguard your business.
Liku opens up about her journey transitioning from corporate law to founding her purposeful law practice. Her passion for business advising and employment law led her down the path of entrepreneurship. Listen in as she shares her experiences - from relying on networking and referrals to pivot her business strategies amidst the pandemic to the importance of connecting with her community and making a real difference.
In our final segment, we delve into the trials and tribulations of entrepreneurship, particularly during these unprecedented times. Liku provides some fantastic insights on juggling multiple roles as a business owner and a mother. We also address some challenges entrepreneurs face, such as imposter syndrome and societal expectations, and emphasize the significance of adaptability and openness to change. So, whether you're an aspiring entrepreneur or a seasoned business owner, this episode is packed with insights and resources that will help you navigate your business journey.
Be sure to learn more about Liku's services here.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
You're listening to the Black Directory podcast,
where we focus on bringing blackentrepreneur experiences to the
forefront.
Each week, we will discuss thehighs, the lows and everything
in between.
I'm your host, diamond Young.
Let's dive in.
Hey everyone, it's your girl,diamond Young, founder of the
(00:26):
Black Directory and podcast.
Host of the Black Directorypodcast.
We are back with anotherepisode.
I have a very special guestwith me.
I am super excited.
Not only are you going to tapinto her story, but we're going
to learn.
Hey, bring out your notebooks.
Don't say I never told you guysanything.
Get ready to take some notes.
We're going to get some gems.
(00:46):
It's going to be on all thingslegal, which is super, super
important for your business.
This guest is Liku AmatiEsquire.
Put some respect on her name.
We love to see it over here.
She is the creator and founderof her own law firm, which we're
going to get into today, whichis the Nasa Law Firm.
Tell us a little bit more aboutyourself and your law firm.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Where do you want me to start?
First of all, thank you forhaving me.
I am an award-winning attorney.
I am licensed in California, thefounder of a Nasa Law Firm,
where I mainly work with coaches, consultants, strategists and
expert service providers to helpthem establish a solid legal
foundation for business.
(01:30):
That's via trademarks, contracts, which are my bread and butter,
and then just general legalstrategies to not only help
businesses protect themselves,but protect themselves for a
purpose.
What that means is realizingthe assets and the value that
they've created in theirbusiness and showing them how
they can leverage those thingsto make more money without
(01:52):
overworking themselves orputting in extra time, because,
as a business owner, we all wantthat time to frolic and be with
our loved ones and do whatmakes us happy, right, not keep
working all the time.
That is the purpose of a NasaLaw Firm.
We are heavy when it comes toeducation, so teaching our
clients about the legalessentials of doing business I'm
(02:15):
also a speaker in differentgroup coaching programs,
containers, cohorts, at variousevents.
I'm here on your podcast,diamond, and I just want people
to know what they can do when itcomes to the legal parts of
their business Again, not sothat they just avoid trouble,
but they see where theiradvantages lies and they can use
(02:36):
those advantages to have whatthey want.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
No, I'm just so happy about the work that you're
doing, I think, of course, withme being a business owner, and
even besides being a businessowner, just in the black
community, just to go deep for alittle bit.
But there's a gap, right,there's a gap as far as, when we
hear legal, what do we thinkabout?
Or is that misconceptionsometimes of, oh, I don't have
(03:00):
enough money for a lawyer,because I don't know if anyone
else has been through this,who's listening right now?
But it's a lot of times.
I'll see these videos onlineand they're like okay, if you
have a business, you got to havea financial advisor, a lawyer,
and it just sounds expensive andit sounds overwhelming and it
sounds like something that's noturgent.
(03:20):
It sounds like, okay, when Iget to this level in my business
, I'm going to then hire thesepeople and everything is going
to be good.
So let's talk about that for awhile.
Let's unpack that.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
For one are you familiar.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Have you heard of that before, where you're like,
okay, yeah, I know exactly Okay.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Most definitely and I know what you're talking about
and I get it right Becausepeople get into business to make
money.
They want the things that makethem money.
So when it comes to investingin their business, they're going
to go towards those things thatmake that money directly,
versus those things that keepthem good on the back end or
(04:01):
keep them tight, keep themoperationalized, keep them
protected.
You see the money first, right,which is why people will spend
thousands, tens of thousands, oncoaching, messaging, marketing,
branding all criticalcomponents of business but then
wait until they get to a certainpoint.
Whatever that is right, becausewe always move the goalpost,
(04:24):
whether it's been you know, I'vebeen in business, you know
seven years, or when I makeseven figures, or when this
product launches or this servicedoes that right.
At that point then we decideokay, it's time to get serious.
Hence accounting, finances,taxes, legal right, the scary
(04:45):
stuff, if you will, that we puton the back burner.
But I think that also justdepends on education too.
Again, as someone who startedtheir own business, like I get
it.
We got to make some money, likewe can't just be out here, you
know, playing around, especiallypost pandemic season, a lot of
people started businesses rightTo get that freedom to make
(05:06):
their own money, to not besubject to, you know, the
corporate, the golden handcuffsright and just be, let go like
that.
They wanted that power andcontrol.
So making money is a huge partof that.
But I say education is criticalbecause when you understand
like, oh, I have to getprotected, again protection for
(05:26):
a purpose, right, I have to getprotected for this reason, then
you might think a little bitdifferently about the legal
accounting, finances etc.
So education, it has to startthere.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
I think so too, because if you don't even
understand how serious certainthings are, because if you do,
you're naturally going to belike no, I have to prioritize
and make sure that I'm coveringmyself Versus like oh.
I'm a little company.
No one's going to come for me.
It doesn't really matter, likeit's like.
No, you have to look at yourstuff.
It's not about big or small,it's just about the foundation I
(06:03):
think of things.
So, yeah, that's what I'm justexcited about Our podcast today.
I think people are going towalk away just learning
something more of oh wow, I haveaccess to those things right
now.
Or these are things that areactionable steps that I can take
, or things I can start readingup on and we're going to get
into that a little later, likethe legal essentials.
(06:25):
But let's go back to you andyour story and just how you were
drawn to what you're doing nowand you were in corporate before
.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Right, or, yes, I was .
So I graduated 2017, got myfirst law firm job at a small to
mid-sized firm out here in SanFrancisco.
San Francisco is the spot youknow for business, like
(06:56):
financial decisions et ceterabut anyway, I got my first job
there.
I was killing it, got a lot ofcases, you know, doing all the
grind, work and what, and then Iwanted to transition to a
larger firm and do likeemployment law right, deal with
employment discrimination, thattype of thing and I finally
landed what I thought was mydream job.
(07:17):
After all this interviewing andsearching and then, literally a
week later, I didn't even getto decorate my office diamond.
A week later, we got the noticefrom the governor you know,
everybody's working from homesat down, covid hit.
So this was March 2020, right,and so we immediately transition
(07:39):
.
What a time.
We immediately transitionedinto working from home.
So for me, my experience wasn'tlike let me get acclimated to
the firm.
It's more so like I got a shiftwith everyone right and, of
course, the security that I waslooking for for a larger firm or
pay, more opportunity, morevisibility Like all of that got
(08:01):
called into question, becausenow people are also getting laid
off left and right due to thepandemic right.
So it was a very uncomfortableenvironment to be in working
from home, which is somethingthat I didn't naturally do.
You know I was always in theoffice on care how long I had to
stay.
So there was a lot of thingshappening at once and it was
(08:24):
impacting my quality of life.
To be honest with you the microaggressions, the disrespect
from not even colleagues butsupport staff who are supposed
to be helping me do things, andyou know just all of the
implications of being a blackwoman in corporate America.
And I just at some pointdecided like I don't have to do
this, like it's not worth itbeing in the pandemic and just
(08:48):
realizing Things can happen likethat right, whether it's
someone passes away or you loseyour job or there's no more
opportunities, relationships,whatever it is.
I just I want to live my bestlife.
I want it to be a quality life.
I was too young to be stressed.
I worked too hard, so I wantedit to be the way, I wanted it to
(09:09):
be right, and up at that pointI had always said I'm never
starting my own law firm Like,put me in somebody's desk and
give me a check.
I did not want the business ofrunning a law firm.
I was just like, let me just domy work.
Just let me do my work and I'llbe good if somebody gives me a
paycheck.
But at that point I was justlike I have nothing to lose.
(09:31):
If it doesn't work out, I canliterally always go do something
else.
I could go be a carpenter, Icould go be a teacher, like
there was literally, you know,endless options.
So I made the decision to go.
I still had six months at thefirm and I made an exit plan,
found out I was pregnant in themidst of my exit plan and that
was confirmation for me to leave, because I was like, oh yeah,
(09:56):
and it'll show you.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
So this was 2020.
So this is all 2020.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
That was a crazy year for you 2020.
And then I left in March 2021.
Yeah, march 2021.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Oh, like the law firm you were working at, you're
saying by March, by thatfollowing March, Okay, so yeah,
it's, I don't even know where tostart.
You said so much.
I'm like, okay, I'm thinkingabout the pandemic and how that
was crazy, because I was in SanFrancisco at that time before I
moved to Houston.
So, yeah, I'm just like thepandemic was such a cultural
(10:33):
reset it was a reset in everyway you can think of and what
you had, the great resignationgoing on.
I know the corporate companieswere mad about that.
Like I think we all had so muchtime on our hands and we had
time to really reassess what doI want to do?
Am I really happy?
Like we all had too much?
Because when you're at work andyou're on the go, like when we
(10:56):
think about life before thepandemic, you don't even have a
chance to think that deepbecause you're adrenaline's
rushing, you have work, you haveresponsibilities and you're
trying to squeeze into sociallife, family life, you know
whatever.
And I'm sure I always thoughtthis was so funny.
I know corporations are justlike they have too much time on
their hands.
Like you know, we're like I canstart a business, I want to have
(11:18):
kids.
Like you know, it's just peoplereally had a lot to think about
whether it was decisions on thepersonal side of why I really
want to travel more, I want tospend time more with my family,
like I've poured in so much intowork.
Who am I, you know.
So I think it's alwaysinteresting for me when I meet
people that have had any kind oflike life change during that
(11:39):
pandemic window.
Even for us, we created BlackDirectory March 2020.
Like, it was a lot going on andI think it's all a good thing.
You know, of course you canlook back and you see where you
are now and it's like, okay, I'mon the right path.
And but were you afraid?
You know?
Like, of course you had that.
You know you were experiencingthose microaggressions.
But we've all kind of had thatlimbo game or that back and
(12:02):
forth of like okay, am I reallydoing this or am I just like, or
like pushing the date back ofwhen we leave?
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Like, okay, I'm gonna push it back a little bit more
Like did you go through?
that at all Surprisingly, Ididn't Like once it slipped in
my mind, you know cause we hadall that time to think.
So once that thought came intomy mind I was like, oh yeah,
it's do or die at this point,like it's just not worth it, I
don't have to be here, they needme, right.
So just this shift inperspective, exactly, I'm the
(12:32):
prize and it just again.
It wasn't worth it to me.
And when I found out that I gotpregnant, I was like I don't
want to be in this position whenI have kids, like I want to be
a specific type of mother.
I want to show up for myself, Iwant to show up for my children
, want to show up for my husband.
I don't want to be consumed inwork.
I want to build my quality oflife around what I want.
(12:54):
Right, and that time.
Building my business now isaround my quality of life,
versus in corporate, where myquality of life was depending on
what was going on in the job.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
So a question for you that I was just thinking about
this whole time.
There's so many different laneswith law.
You have entertainment law,corporate law.
We were talking about that.
Did you always knowspecifically what kind of law
you wanted to do?
Or how did you get to thatpoint of like you know what I
want to serve this group righthere consultants, coaches,
(13:27):
people that are providingservices.
Was that always clear, or didyou kind of think about other
lanes?
Or was it pretty clear?
Speaker 2 (13:35):
Yeah, it definitely was something that I had to
figure out.
So I never envisioned doingthis.
I really wanted to be incriminal law and so, fortunately
, law school gave me theopportunity to have various
internships.
One was with the publicdefender's office, another one
was with the prosecution'soffice, another one was with a
solo practitioner right who didvarious types of law.
(13:58):
So I did get that insight tosee someone running their own
firm.
So that was very insightfulversus government or law firm
jobs.
When I got out I did insurancedefense and that was for
landlord-tenant issues, so bothresidential and commercial.
On the commercial end I waslike you know what this
(14:19):
employment stuff looks?
Really interestingdiscrimination and harassment
and so I went that route.
And then I was working for thebig corporations and I was just
like I don't want to use myexpertise to help the billion
dollar companies, I want to useit for people who look like me.
I want to use it for people whoare trying to make a difference
(14:40):
in the community.
I don't want to defend largecorporations.
So I came into my own practice,still wanting to do some
employment law and businessadvising.
But once I started working withconsultants and coaches and I
just really appreciated thedifferent expertise that each of
them have.
I can get in my bag and talkabout legal stuff all day, so
(15:03):
when I see someone else get intheir bag and talk about mental
health or money, psychology orDEI practices, I love that, and
so I decided that I'm going tofocus specifically on those
people.
And because that industry is,for the most part, unregulated,
(15:23):
there's no rules, so all themore reason that people need a
legal foundation to operatetheir business from, so I love
it.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
No, and I can sense that, and it's amazing to feel
like you're doing purpose work.
I think we can all just we canget in where we fit in and just
get to the bag.
But it is cool when you get tothat point where you're like I
like what I'm doing, I like whoI'm serving, because we can like
what we're doing, but it's in acertain capacity or, like you
(15:53):
said, if it's under the bigcorporations, we're not in so
much control as far as clientsor who we're servicing or those
kind of things.
So it is cool, I think, on theentrepreneurship side, having
that freedom that you have now,like OK, I can choose my clients
, I can really do more or lessof the work that I want to do or
don't want to do.
So I'm excited just of whatyou're able to do now, this
(16:17):
newfound freedom.
But how has it been?
Ok?
So March 2021, you left.
You were still pregnant by then,right?
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Or you just had your.
Ok so how was the?
Speaker 1 (16:30):
I was leaving pregnant, oh my gosh.
Ok.
So how was that transition tolike OK, job is gone.
Now, Like, did you take timeoff in between?
Like before you were like OK,we're doing a law firm, or how
did?
How did all that go?
Speaker 2 (16:46):
I mean not really.
It was a pretty smoothtransition because I would work
in the daytime and actually myfirst trimester of pregnancy
kind of had me down because Iwas so fatigued.
So I would work as much as Icould, you know, at my job wise.
But then when I wasn't workingon that making a business plan
(17:07):
ooh, this idea, you know,working on my own law firm.
So when I left, coincidentallymy husband actually left his job
at the same time.
So we had a week, took a littlemini vacay, this real mini
vacay, and then hit the groundrunning.
He got into his new job and Iannounced that I was launching
my firm and people startedreaching out to me.
(17:29):
So it was a pretty smoothtransition from the corporate.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
That's a blessing, though, because I know
everyone's story is so differentwhen it comes to finding those
initial clients and it's like OK, like you know, do I have to do
ass?
Is it going to be word of mouthLike how was it for you?
Did you find that like, just byusing social media marketing,
that kind of flowed more?
Or was it a mix of word ofmouth that were in relationships
(17:55):
as well?
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Woo man, I mean definitely starting out
relationships right.
Like you said, whenpre-pandemic, I was always on
the go Networking event afternetworking event, you know,
trying to get out there meetpeople, and so I saw that the
fruits of that labor, you know,was me getting clients.
Or oh, you opened your own lawfirm.
(18:18):
I might need advice like thisand that.
So that's how that came in.
But I very much had to learn.
Number one outside was not openand I was pregnant, so we extra
inside right Just to stay outof the pandemic.
So all I had was online businessand marketing for the most part
.
So that's been something thatI've had to learn so I can speak
(18:41):
to the particular type ofclients that I want to speak to,
so I can find, you know, wherethey hang out.
My messaging, all of that hasbeen fine tuned and I'm really
proud of the work that I've donethere.
But that's been some work toois just that on a marketing
level.
But now that outside is backopen, definitely looking forward
(19:02):
to getting some more retreatsand events where I can meet
other business owners andpotential clients.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
That's really, really interesting.
And you're right now and I'mthinking about what that
timeframe was.
The world was in a differentplace.
We couldn't just go tonetworking events anymore.
And, yeah, it changes yourwhole strategy when it comes to
how do I let people know hey,I'm here and everyone's online.
You know, we all had this timeon our hands.
So you're still trying to likecut through the noise of like
(19:32):
hey, like I have something toannounce.
But it also shows, like, theimportance of your network.
If you weren't outside to beginwith beforehand, you know, just
building those relationships.
Those are those samerelationships that come around
later, of like, hey, I actuallyjust opened my law firm and
people are like, oh, okay, letme tell someone or I'm
interested.
So it just shows that power ofnetworking and you never know
(19:56):
when your network is gonna comein handy.
But it's cool to make those,it's important to make those
relationships all along the wayanyways.
But a last question about foryou, about, like the whole
corporate thing when you left,is there anything where you're
like dang, this is the stuffthat no one tells you about kind
of thing, like cause we are,you know, we get into the
(20:18):
business and if some things weexpect and if some things where
you're like whoa, I didn't knowit was gonna be like this.
Is there anything aboutentrepreneurship where you had
that moment of like oh, I didn'tknow it was gonna be like this?
Speaker 2 (20:32):
I mean man you talking about last question we
could spend the rest of the time, you know, with these things
that I just had to learn.
So I think to just to puteverything you know under one
umbrella.
It's a journey, and what I meanby that is the personal growth
(20:53):
and development, the unlearningthat I've had to do.
Just add me as myself, right,in order to run a business, in
order for me to put myself outthere and say, hey, I'm an
attorney, I'm good at what I do,like this is me, this is how I
talk with my clients, right?
The imposter syndrome that Ihad to let go of, the confidence
(21:14):
that I had to gain the securityin being myself full fledged.
You know, first generationTanzanian, like mom, I had to
embrace all of that and it tooksome work, right?
Entrepreneurship is definitelylike a beast of personal work
for you to properly show up inyour business and serve people,
(21:37):
right?
So there's all of thesesocietal just expectations
placed on women, placed onmothers, microaggressions, you
know, stereotypes against blackwomen and what it means to be a
professional, what you thinkabout when you see an attorney.
Right, learning to unlearn andlet go of those things and
(22:00):
define what a lawyer is what amom is, what a woman is, what a
business owner is for yourself.
So that's been first.
Nobody was saying that.
On Instagram, right, they talkthem all, make $10,000 in 10
days and form your LLC, but like, that's the work of it, that is
the work of it and that youknow.
(22:21):
Nobody can tell you that.
You have to experience it foryourself.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
In my opinion, no, I totally agree and that's why I
asked, because I think everyonehas different moments where
you're like, whoa, that'ssomething even someone told you.
It's like you still have towalk through it to really see.
And it's not even like, oh,what happened one time?
I learned this thing we're doneis really ongoing.
You know revolver or yeah, andwe're wearing all these hats and
(22:50):
and we already have the wholeimposter syndrome thing going on
.
And then it's like you havesocietal norms playing.
So it's different.
Some of it is Internal pressureyou know that we put on
ourselves.
You know, can't blame it onanyone else.
Some stuff is societal and somethings are like oh, I've seen
(23:10):
leadership look like this when Iworked at these firms.
So some of it is kind of Tryingto like try it and other
people's weight.
You know the way that they didit or the way that we saw it.
And then it's like, oh, I don'tknow this really fits my
business.
Like I've tried this style andit may work for me, but that
doesn't mean it's gonna work forthe people I may bring on or my
team, and so I think it's veryinteresting.
(23:31):
And during that time you'rewearing a new hat as a mom too.
So it's like you got mom hatwife hat ball hat Marketer hat.
Like it's just a lot.
And it's like I see how peoplecould either lose themselves or
just go through such aTransformation when it comes to
(23:54):
who am I and how do I want to be, how do I want to lead, what
does that look like?
And realizing to that it's okayto make changes, because
sometimes I think we may pick,like, okay, this is the method,
this is my approach, this islike the way I'm going into it.
It's something that I've beensaying a lot this year is just
pivoting, and just the notion ofit's okay if the business isn't
(24:17):
what I thought it was gonna be,as far as like, oh, I may have
thought I was gonna for sureprovide these services, but it's
like, actually, people areasking me a lot for these
services.
Okay, that's not what Ienvisioned.
Or it's like, oh, I'm gonna belike a little bit more laid-back
and chill.
And it's like, oh wait, I thinkI need to be a little bit more
assertive, like I don't know.
I've dealt with that where I'mlike Okay, I don't know, this is
(24:39):
really in my personality, but Ithink I need to become this
person or kind of just be a moreadaptable and try different
things before I'm like, no, thisis me and I'm not gonna change.
It's like, okay, you may haveto Just let you try on different
shoes and see what's a good fit, and it may not be the shoe you
thought like, alright, that'sthe one you know.
But it's like, okay, that'ssomething I've been thinking
(25:01):
about a lot this year is just,you know, pivoting, like it's
okay to switch gears or changecourses.
Or sometimes you think youraudience is like okay, it's for
sure these people right herelike is that?
And it's some other peoplethat's like oh, no, I would love
.
Yeah, we need help, and it'slike that was not on my bingo
card.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
Yeah, I agree, and I think it like I talk about trial
and error a lot, like you justgot to keep, like you said,
seeing which shoe fits the bestright.
You may have wanted that's thelittle over there, but you know
it's those pumps that you got toput on for this season, or you
know it's a lot of Trustingyourself to figure that out too.
(25:43):
You know to guide yourself andrealize, you know what this may
not be working, or it doesn'thave to look like this.
So again, just a ton ofpersonal growth that goes.
That happens like when you'repursuing entrepreneurship.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
I'm not thinking embracing it, because I think
it's also you know.
You said oh, maybe this pumpworks better than this.
So what?
Oh, like it's at seasonsbecause that shoe may work for a
while.
Like it may have been like thatfirst show, first shoe you put
on, everything was flowing,working for a.
It could be a year.
You're gonna have two years,multiple years, but there's a
(26:18):
season for everything and it'slike okay.
Like, yes, this workedoriginally, but it doesn't mean
I have to cling to that, to whatwork, you know, and I think is
that goes into risk-taking andjust being, I think, outside of
our comfort zone of like it'sokay to try on some new shoes
and look around and see, youknow what makes sense, get new
perspectives and and things likethat.
(26:38):
But so for your business, likewhat?
What does growth look like?
For you say, to scale in thenext few years?
I think you were telling mebefore about a legal resource
program that you're working on,so it's more about that.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Yeah, it's funny, you're talking about like
seasons and you know, servingcertain people and whatnot.
So, with the way that I want toserve, the way I'm currently
serving people right now is on aone-on-one basis, right, taking
on clients, working with themon their contract or their
trademark needs.
And, like you said in thebeginning, you know, legal
(27:16):
services are expensive sometimesand I would say that, more than
just the, I would say that mineare not cheap, even though
cheap and expensive are relative.
But there's, I value the workthat I do and it certainly sets
my clients up for success.
And that's not alwaysaccessible to everyone, right?
And at the same time, youcannot serve everyone like you
(27:41):
just can't.
You have to find different waysto do it.
So one thing that I do is, likeI mentioned earlier, like teach
in group programs Cohortthere's a co-working space out
here in the Bay Area.
I've done several workshops forthem and that's just because
that's something that I love todo.
Right, that's part ofentrepreneurship is finding what
(28:01):
lights you up and it lights meup for me to teach about legal
stuff and doing business, andpeople go oh, that's what that
means, or that's what they weretalking about when they said
this right, like if finallyclick, it finally clicks.
So I love that.
The program that I'm building,however, is A middle ground
(28:23):
between you know, trying to DIYand piece everything together
yourself, and working with anattorney, one-on-one retainer.
You go to attorney for business, right?
That middle ground that I'mbuilding is what I'm calling the
holy grail for online coaches,consultants, strategists and
expert service providers tostart building that legal
(28:44):
foundation.
So that includes contracttemplates that are beyond fill
in the blank.
They're comprehensive, they'redetailed, they provide Context
right as to how to use them andwhat's going on in your business
.
It includes supplementalresources so that, if you have a
contract, you have a list ofconsiderations Right.
If it's a partnership agreement, for example, a list of
(29:06):
considerations about how toproperly enter a Partnership, or
some negotiating terms or whatyou do with your intellectual
property right.
Because when you have guidingthe principles or just guiding
factors like that, your, yourquestions with another partner
become different.
Right.
If we want to work together andwe're like you know what, yes,
(29:27):
it's good, but if I have a listof things to ask you and you
start answering them in a waywhere I'm like that's a red flag
, no, I don't want to work likethat, right, that might make me
change my mind.
So I want people to be able tomake informed decisions, and
then the third part of that ishaving the ability to ask
questions.
So, not give legal advice, butget that knowledge, that that
(29:49):
education for you to again makean informed business decision.
And I want people to have thatfoundation before working with
the lawyer one-on-one, becausewhen you do get to that point in
your business whenever that isfor you you don't want to have a
broken foundation where a tonof things either need to be
fixed or changed or becomesextra expensive.
(30:10):
Whole time you're elevatingyourself, you're protecting
yourself, you're settingyourself up for success and to
get there faster and easierbecause you have your legal
ducks in a row.
So that is the resource thatI'm building that's going to be
launching in the fall.
We're currently doing betatesting with people right now
who are testing out theseresources and giving us their
(30:32):
feedback.
Yeah, I really like this, orlike what about having this?
That would help, right, because,as an expert, I can tell you
hey, listen, you need these fivethings to run your business
right the contract, thetrademark, et cetera, et cetera.
But, as the person receivingthat, like, people receive
things different ways, right?
So this beta program is helpingme get the perspective of those
(30:56):
who are going to be receivingit so I can shape it in a way
that is a total package for them, if you will.
So I can talk about that too,on and on, but, in short, I'm
super excited about that and Iwant people to be empowered when
it comes to their business,because when you know you got
(31:16):
your stuff together, you show updifferent, you act different,
you go get more money.
You're not scared, right, andnot everybody's operating like
that.
And that's a huge component ofbeing in business is being able
to show up and say with yourchest that you can help someone
without looking over yourshoulder thinking I don't know
(31:37):
about this contract, but we'lltake a risk and see Right, that
is so real, like you just wantto have that confidence.
Speaker 1 (31:45):
No, I'm totally with you and I just see how important
this program is going to be, soI'm excited to see how it
develops.
You already know we're going tobe supporting you because, like
I said, I've used.
You know we've all heard ofLegalZoom and we're trying to
find fill-in-the-blank templatesonline, like most of us have
probably been there.
So it's.
But when you say comprehensivejust the way you're describing
(32:07):
it I'm like, oh yeah, that's agap, like we need something
where we're actually learningand not you're helping me fill
in the blanks and I have no cluewhat.
I still can't read it to reallyunderstand what it is that this
is saying.
I just know I have the contractnow, so we're good, and it's
like what is my, what does mycontract say that I'm giving to
someone else, you know?
(32:27):
So I think it is just a hugeeducational opportunity.
So I'm just excited about it,especially just in the black
community.
I think that we're still we maybe the first entrepreneur in our
family and we're trying tofigure it out, because sometimes
we have the skill and thetalent and we just want to zone
in on whatever that is and thebusiness part seems overwhelming
(32:50):
.
The legal part definitely seemslike okay, I don't even know
what's happening.
Is this really necessary?
It's like something that youdon't want to do but you need to
do so.
I think it's cool Having theseconversations, because I'm
hoping that it shifts ourmindset to like no, let's make
sure all of our business is inorder.
But something I wanted to askyou is, like you know, I know
(33:12):
you're doing your beta testingand just with different clients
when it comes to black businessowners, is there any trends that
you're seeing where you're likeoh, I'm noticing this common
mistake or this one thing thateveryone's kind of like either
it was a misconception or maybea trend and like okay,
everyone's missing the same kindof maybe legal documentation.
(33:32):
Is there anything that you'vebeen seeing?
Speaker 2 (33:36):
with the black business owners in particular?
No, but just generally, like inthe online business space in
particular.
Yes, seeing a few things likewhen is the right time to get
your LLC right after you've madea lot of money, or when you get
(33:57):
us to a certain point in yourbusiness, versus understanding
why it's supposed to be therefor protection, contract
templates definitely, like yousaid, you can fill in the blank,
but if you don't know, if youdon't know what it's doing for
you, right and you wanna give itto a client to sign, like
that's a huge red flag.
(34:17):
And I'll also say that Iappreciate that people do seek
out contract templates, nomatter how bad they might be,
because at least they know likeI need to get some stuff in
order, right.
So that's a great first step.
Exactly, that's a great firststep.
And I'll also say, justfollowing, there's a lot of
business coaches or likebusiness influencers and because
(34:41):
they've made a lot of money orhave had a lot of success people
you know they're influencers,they listen to them and so
sometimes we're.
I've seen oftentimes like a lotof that information is
incorrect or it just doesn'tapply to people who are starting
out their business versussomeone who's been in business
(35:01):
you know seven, 10 years and hasmaybe figured out like some
loopholes or just someworkarounds.
So I think there's also just alot of misinformation on that
part too, which is why, again,education is so critical,
because if you know what thesethings do to protect your
business and how they impactyour business or may impact it
(35:22):
negatively, how you can takeadvantage, right like if you
know all of those things, youmake different decisions.
So I would say those are someof the things that I'm noticing
just in the online businessspace.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
Yeah, no, that's good to know.
I definitely want to at leastask that way we can, as people
are hearing it, they're probablylike, oh, I've done that or
okay, yeah, I think so and I dothink that overall we are.
It's a blessing and a curse.
It's online space.
It's a way like I feel like Ilearned so much on TikTok I'm on
TikTok more than Google, likeit's just, but technically, if
(35:55):
that's not your lane, no matterwhat it is, it could be starting
a vending machine business,like it's a little bit of
everything online and you reallydon't know what's what, because
sometimes people will saywhoever's making the video will
say whatever they're saying.
I'm a comment girl.
I'm going to the comments.
And it's always a few peoplethat's like no, that's not
correct what they're saying,because my dad owns 10,.
(36:19):
Like they're saying, you couldmake this amount of money with
one vending machine, but reallyit takes about 10 to really see
a profit.
And you're like, ooh, becausethey want you to get the ebook.
They like that's their hustle.
So it is kind of like usingthat discernment to know, like,
okay, I'm hearing hisinformation, but let me and I
think that's just us buildingthat muscle of like y'all, it's
(36:40):
okay to do our own research too.
Like we can hear something, itdoesn't matter who is from, but
we need to start educatingourselves, like if it's terms
that they're saying that wedon't know, or just starting to
create new habits in that way, Ithink.
But I don't know.
I'm just excited overall forwhat you're going to be
providing soon.
I think it's so necessary foreveryone because, like you said,
(37:03):
by the time you hire a lawyer,you're not starting from like
basic basics.
You're like all right, Ialready have this and that in
place.
I feel good about the LC or this.
Okay, I'm ready for this nextlevel of things that I want to
implement.
Speaker 2 (37:16):
Yeah, yeah, most definitely.
And just to add to what you'resaying about like people doing
their own research, I thinkTikTok seem to have everything.
Number one like oh, it's TikTokis crazy, but I think that is.
You know, social media is easyto look for stuff and find it,
especially in the business realm, and you don't know what's
(37:38):
right or wrong, and so I thinkat that point, like you do have
to go talk to that expert.
So I tell people like you don'tneed to pay an attorney $10,000
, $5,000 to have a conversationwith them.
A lot of attorneys have, youknow, free consultations or paid
consultations that are like $50, $100, you know a few hundred
dollars.
(37:58):
So it kind of depends on youknow how much you, how important
that information is to you, andyou can certainly find an
attorney.
There are law schools thatprovide business clinics, where
they have law students, you know, advising people under the
supervision of licensedattorneys.
Right, there's resources outthere.
So if you live not too far froma law school, see if they have
(38:19):
a business clinic.
Sometimes they even have familylaw clinics or clinics for
veterans.
Those are the three clinicsthat we had at my law school.
There's legal aid programs in,sometimes, you know your chamber
of commerce has legal resources.
So there are ways to go andfind an attorney to talk to,
(38:40):
just like you can find anaccountant or, you know,
financial professional, likewhoever you need to talk to if
it is a vending machine person,like, book a call with them, ask
your questions so that you doknow, like, how to move forward
versus just taking informationat face value and trying to
(39:01):
figure it out yourself right.
So I just wanted to say that'savailable as an option.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
No, and that's good to know.
Like even I'm learningsomething and all I keep
thinking about as you weretalking is like you know me
doing some research, gettingwith you and just putting
together a list of what stuffthat's out here that people just
don't know that's out here,because I think that's what gets
everything started.
It's like okay, like I do haveresources at my fingertips and
this is I don't have to shy awayfrom legal things, because in
(39:31):
my mind is you know, I hope thiswhat everyone listens to, this
podcast.
I hope what you're taking awayis that you don't have to put
down half your mortgage, likeyou don't have to do all this
stuff just to get someinformation and to learn a few
things and kind of get point ina direction.
There are a lot of resourcesout here.
That's what I'm taking away fromthis, which is a good thing.
(39:53):
It's a good feeling of okay,like I don't have to put this
off until my business is supersuccessful just to make sure
that I'm taking proper steps toprotect myself, my brand.
You know, some people haveproducts.
You may need some trademarks.
Like you just need differentthings in place to make sure you
can enjoy your business withoutlooking over your shoulder,
like you know something's notdone correctly.
(40:15):
So that'll keep you up at night, right?
Speaker 2 (40:19):
exactly.
We don't want that stress tobusiness owners.
We want to be free right,stress free.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
So yeah, exactly Right, we want to make sure
we're good, but thank you somuch.
This has been like an amazing,amazing episode.
Like I'm happy I learned a lotabout you.
I'm sure everyone else is like,okay, I didn't know this, I
didn't know that.
So I'm just so appreciative ofyou being able to come on, share
your story, share your journeyand telling us what's next.
(40:48):
But I guess, before we go, telleveryone where they can find
you, how they can support, howthey can maybe learn more about
the program.
I know you said this while Ibelieve, but just yeah, how can
we support you?
Speaker 2 (41:02):
Yeah, follow me on LinkedIn.
I'm heavy on LinkedIn, I loveLinkedIn, so you can find me
there.
If you put in Liku Tiamati, I'mthe only one who will pop up,
so you can follow me on LinkedIn.
Also on Instagram, atlawyerliku but less active at
the moment as I've been heavy onLinkedIn and then you can
(41:26):
subscribe to and I'll send youthe link diamond, but subscribe
to be on the waitlist for thisprogram that I'm launching.
In the fall it's in a fewmonths, but with the wait time
it's fine.
It's gonna be right around thecorner, so we might have an
opportunity for additional betatesters.
If that's something that you'reinterested in, then you can
definitely reach out about that,but otherwise, that's the best
(41:49):
way to stay connected with meand figure out what's going on.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Awesome.
So for everyone that'slistening, I will make sure to
put all of this in the shownotes.
That way you can just click thelinks to her socials and for
the waitlist as well.
And yeah, I'm just, I'm superexcited.
So thank you so much for comingon.
The Black Directory podcast.
Thank you for having me, ofcourse.
(42:15):
Thank you for spending sometime with us Enjoying the show.
Be sure to subscribe and leaveus a rating and review Until
next time.
You're listening to the Black Directory podcast,
where we focus on bringing blackentrepreneur experiences to the
forefront.
Each week, we will discuss thehighs, the lows and everything
in between.
I'm your host, diamond Young.
Let's dive in.
Hey everyone, it's your girl,diamond Young, founder of the
(00:26):
Black Directory and podcast.
Host of the Black Directorypodcast.
We are back with anotherepisode.
I have a very special guestwith me.
I am super excited.
Not only are you going to tapinto her story, but we're going
to learn.
Hey, bring out your notebooks.
Don't say I never told you guysanything.
Get ready to take some notes.
We're going to get some gems.
(00:46):
It's going to be on all thingslegal, which is super, super
important for your business.
This guest is Liku AmatiEsquire.
Put some respect on her name.
We love to see it over here.
She is the creator and founderof her own law firm, which we're
going to get into today, whichis the Nasa Law Firm.
Tell us a little bit more aboutyourself and your law firm.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Where do you want me to start?
First of all, thank you forhaving me.
I am an award-winning attorney.
I am licensed in California, thefounder of a Nasa Law Firm,
where I mainly work with coaches, consultants, strategists and
expert service providers to helpthem establish a solid legal
foundation for business.
(01:30):
That's via trademarks, contracts, which are my bread and butter,
and then just general legalstrategies to not only help
businesses protect themselves,but protect themselves for a
purpose.
What that means is realizingthe assets and the value that
they've created in theirbusiness and showing them how
they can leverage those thingsto make more money without
(01:52):
overworking themselves orputting in extra time, because,
as a business owner, we all wantthat time to frolic and be with
our loved ones and do whatmakes us happy, right, not keep
working all the time.
That is the purpose of a NasaLaw Firm.
We are heavy when it comes toeducation, so teaching our
clients about the legalessentials of doing business I'm
(02:15):
also a speaker in differentgroup coaching programs,
containers, cohorts, at variousevents.
I'm here on your podcast,diamond, and I just want people
to know what they can do when itcomes to the legal parts of
their business Again, not sothat they just avoid trouble,
but they see where theiradvantages lies and they can use
(02:36):
those advantages to have whatthey want.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
No, I'm just so happy about the work that you're
doing, I think, of course, withme being a business owner, and
even besides being a businessowner, just in the black
community, just to go deep for alittle bit.
But there's a gap, right,there's a gap as far as, when we
hear legal, what do we thinkabout?
Or is that misconceptionsometimes of, oh, I don't have
(03:00):
enough money for a lawyer,because I don't know if anyone
else has been through this,who's listening right now?
But it's a lot of times.
I'll see these videos onlineand they're like okay, if you
have a business, you got to havea financial advisor, a lawyer,
and it just sounds expensive andit sounds overwhelming and it
sounds like something that's noturgent.
(03:20):
It sounds like, okay, when Iget to this level in my business
, I'm going to then hire thesepeople and everything is going
to be good.
So let's talk about that for awhile.
Let's unpack that.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
For one are you familiar.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Have you heard of that before, where you're like,
okay, yeah, I know exactly Okay.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Most definitely and I know what you're talking about
and I get it right Becausepeople get into business to make
money.
They want the things that makethem money.
So when it comes to investingin their business, they're going
to go towards those things thatmake that money directly,
versus those things that keepthem good on the back end or
(04:01):
keep them tight, keep themoperationalized, keep them
protected.
You see the money first, right,which is why people will spend
thousands, tens of thousands, oncoaching, messaging, marketing,
branding all criticalcomponents of business but then
wait until they get to a certainpoint.
Whatever that is right, becausewe always move the goalpost,
(04:24):
whether it's been you know, I'vebeen in business, you know
seven years, or when I makeseven figures, or when this
product launches or this servicedoes that right.
At that point then we decideokay, it's time to get serious.
Hence accounting, finances,taxes, legal right, the scary
(04:45):
stuff, if you will, that we puton the back burner.
But I think that also justdepends on education too.
Again, as someone who startedtheir own business, like I get
it.
We got to make some money, likewe can't just be out here, you
know, playing around, especiallypost pandemic season, a lot of
people started businesses rightTo get that freedom to make
(05:06):
their own money, to not besubject to, you know, the
corporate, the golden handcuffsright and just be, let go like
that.
They wanted that power andcontrol.
So making money is a huge partof that.
But I say education is criticalbecause when you understand
like, oh, I have to getprotected, again protection for
(05:26):
a purpose, right, I have to getprotected for this reason, then
you might think a little bitdifferently about the legal
accounting, finances etc.
So education, it has to startthere.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
I think so too, because if you don't even
understand how serious certainthings are, because if you do,
you're naturally going to belike no, I have to prioritize
and make sure that I'm coveringmyself Versus like oh.
I'm a little company.
No one's going to come for me.
It doesn't really matter, likeit's like.
No, you have to look at yourstuff.
It's not about big or small,it's just about the foundation I
(06:03):
think of things.
So, yeah, that's what I'm justexcited about Our podcast today.
I think people are going towalk away just learning
something more of oh wow, I haveaccess to those things right
now.
Or these are things that areactionable steps that I can take
, or things I can start readingup on and we're going to get
into that a little later, likethe legal essentials.
(06:25):
But let's go back to you andyour story and just how you were
drawn to what you're doing nowand you were in corporate before
.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Right, or, yes, I was .
So I graduated 2017, got myfirst law firm job at a small to
mid-sized firm out here in SanFrancisco.
San Francisco is the spot youknow for business, like
(06:56):
financial decisions et ceterabut anyway, I got my first job
there.
I was killing it, got a lot ofcases, you know, doing all the
grind, work and what, and then Iwanted to transition to a
larger firm and do likeemployment law right, deal with
employment discrimination, thattype of thing and I finally
landed what I thought was mydream job.
(07:17):
After all this interviewing andsearching and then, literally a
week later, I didn't even getto decorate my office diamond.
A week later, we got the noticefrom the governor you know,
everybody's working from homesat down, covid hit.
So this was March 2020, right,and so we immediately transition
(07:39):
.
What a time.
We immediately transitionedinto working from home.
So for me, my experience wasn'tlike let me get acclimated to
the firm.
It's more so like I got a shiftwith everyone right and, of
course, the security that I waslooking for for a larger firm or
pay, more opportunity, morevisibility Like all of that got
(08:01):
called into question, becausenow people are also getting laid
off left and right due to thepandemic right.
So it was a very uncomfortableenvironment to be in working
from home, which is somethingthat I didn't naturally do.
You know I was always in theoffice on care how long I had to
stay.
So there was a lot of thingshappening at once and it was
(08:24):
impacting my quality of life.
To be honest with you the microaggressions, the disrespect
from not even colleagues butsupport staff who are supposed
to be helping me do things, andyou know just all of the
implications of being a blackwoman in corporate America.
And I just at some pointdecided like I don't have to do
this, like it's not worth itbeing in the pandemic and just
(08:48):
realizing Things can happen likethat right, whether it's
someone passes away or you loseyour job or there's no more
opportunities, relationships,whatever it is.
I just I want to live my bestlife.
I want it to be a quality life.
I was too young to be stressed.
I worked too hard, so I wantedit to be the way, I wanted it to
(09:09):
be right, and up at that pointI had always said I'm never
starting my own law firm Like,put me in somebody's desk and
give me a check.
I did not want the business ofrunning a law firm.
I was just like, let me just domy work.
Just let me do my work and I'llbe good if somebody gives me a
paycheck.
But at that point I was justlike I have nothing to lose.
(09:31):
If it doesn't work out, I canliterally always go do something
else.
I could go be a carpenter, Icould go be a teacher, like
there was literally, you know,endless options.
So I made the decision to go.
I still had six months at thefirm and I made an exit plan,
found out I was pregnant in themidst of my exit plan and that
was confirmation for me to leave, because I was like, oh yeah,
(09:56):
and it'll show you.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
So this was 2020.
So this is all 2020.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
That was a crazy year for you 2020.
And then I left in March 2021.
Yeah, march 2021.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Oh, like the law firm you were working at, you're
saying by March, by thatfollowing March, Okay, so yeah,
it's, I don't even know where tostart.
You said so much.
I'm like, okay, I'm thinkingabout the pandemic and how that
was crazy, because I was in SanFrancisco at that time before I
moved to Houston.
So, yeah, I'm just like thepandemic was such a cultural
(10:33):
reset it was a reset in everyway you can think of and what
you had, the great resignationgoing on.
I know the corporate companieswere mad about that.
Like I think we all had so muchtime on our hands and we had
time to really reassess what doI want to do?
Am I really happy?
Like we all had too much?
Because when you're at work andyou're on the go, like when we
(10:56):
think about life before thepandemic, you don't even have a
chance to think that deepbecause you're adrenaline's
rushing, you have work, you haveresponsibilities and you're
trying to squeeze into sociallife, family life, you know
whatever.
And I'm sure I always thoughtthis was so funny.
I know corporations are justlike they have too much time on
their hands.
Like you know, we're like I canstart a business, I want to have
(11:18):
kids.
Like you know, it's just peoplereally had a lot to think about
whether it was decisions on thepersonal side of why I really
want to travel more, I want tospend time more with my family,
like I've poured in so much intowork.
Who am I, you know.
So I think it's alwaysinteresting for me when I meet
people that have had any kind oflike life change during that
(11:39):
pandemic window.
Even for us, we created BlackDirectory March 2020.
Like, it was a lot going on andI think it's all a good thing.
You know, of course you canlook back and you see where you
are now and it's like, okay, I'mon the right path.
And but were you afraid?
You know?
Like, of course you had that.
You know you were experiencingthose microaggressions.
But we've all kind of had thatlimbo game or that back and
(12:02):
forth of like okay, am I reallydoing this or am I just like, or
like pushing the date back ofwhen we leave?
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Like, okay, I'm gonna push it back a little bit more
Like did you go through?
that at all Surprisingly, Ididn't Like once it slipped in
my mind, you know cause we hadall that time to think.
So once that thought came intomy mind I was like, oh yeah,
it's do or die at this point,like it's just not worth it, I
don't have to be here, they needme, right.
So just this shift inperspective, exactly, I'm the
(12:32):
prize and it just again.
It wasn't worth it to me.
And when I found out that I gotpregnant, I was like I don't
want to be in this position whenI have kids, like I want to be
a specific type of mother.
I want to show up for myself, Iwant to show up for my children
, want to show up for my husband.
I don't want to be consumed inwork.
I want to build my quality oflife around what I want.
(12:54):
Right, and that time.
Building my business now isaround my quality of life,
versus in corporate, where myquality of life was depending on
what was going on in the job.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
So a question for you that I was just thinking about
this whole time.
There's so many different laneswith law.
You have entertainment law,corporate law.
We were talking about that.
Did you always knowspecifically what kind of law
you wanted to do?
Or how did you get to thatpoint of like you know what I
want to serve this group righthere consultants, coaches,
(13:27):
people that are providingservices.
Was that always clear, or didyou kind of think about other
lanes?
Or was it pretty clear?
Speaker 2 (13:35):
Yeah, it definitely was something that I had to
figure out.
So I never envisioned doingthis.
I really wanted to be incriminal law and so, fortunately
, law school gave me theopportunity to have various
internships.
One was with the publicdefender's office, another one
was with the prosecution'soffice, another one was with a
solo practitioner right who didvarious types of law.
(13:58):
So I did get that insight tosee someone running their own
firm.
So that was very insightfulversus government or law firm
jobs.
When I got out I did insurancedefense and that was for
landlord-tenant issues, so bothresidential and commercial.
On the commercial end I waslike you know what this
(14:19):
employment stuff looks?
Really interestingdiscrimination and harassment
and so I went that route.
And then I was working for thebig corporations and I was just
like I don't want to use myexpertise to help the billion
dollar companies, I want to useit for people who look like me.
I want to use it for people whoare trying to make a difference
(14:40):
in the community.
I don't want to defend largecorporations.
So I came into my own practice,still wanting to do some
employment law and businessadvising.
But once I started working withconsultants and coaches and I
just really appreciated thedifferent expertise that each of
them have.
I can get in my bag and talkabout legal stuff all day, so
(15:03):
when I see someone else get intheir bag and talk about mental
health or money, psychology orDEI practices, I love that, and
so I decided that I'm going tofocus specifically on those
people.
And because that industry is,for the most part, unregulated,
(15:23):
there's no rules, so all themore reason that people need a
legal foundation to operatetheir business from, so I love
it.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
No, and I can sense that, and it's amazing to feel
like you're doing purpose work.
I think we can all just we canget in where we fit in and just
get to the bag.
But it is cool when you get tothat point where you're like I
like what I'm doing, I like whoI'm serving, because we can like
what we're doing, but it's in acertain capacity or, like you
(15:53):
said, if it's under the bigcorporations, we're not in so
much control as far as clientsor who we're servicing or those
kind of things.
So it is cool, I think, on theentrepreneurship side, having
that freedom that you have now,like OK, I can choose my clients
, I can really do more or lessof the work that I want to do or
don't want to do.
So I'm excited just of whatyou're able to do now, this
(16:17):
newfound freedom.
But how has it been?
Ok?
So March 2021, you left.
You were still pregnant by then,right?
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Or you just had your.
Ok so how was the?
Speaker 1 (16:30):
I was leaving pregnant, oh my gosh.
Ok.
So how was that transition tolike OK, job is gone.
Now, Like, did you take timeoff in between?
Like before you were like OK,we're doing a law firm, or how
did?
How did all that go?
Speaker 2 (16:46):
I mean not really.
It was a pretty smoothtransition because I would work
in the daytime and actually myfirst trimester of pregnancy
kind of had me down because Iwas so fatigued.
So I would work as much as Icould, you know, at my job wise.
But then when I wasn't workingon that making a business plan
(17:07):
ooh, this idea, you know,working on my own law firm.
So when I left, coincidentallymy husband actually left his job
at the same time.
So we had a week, took a littlemini vacay, this real mini
vacay, and then hit the groundrunning.
He got into his new job and Iannounced that I was launching
my firm and people startedreaching out to me.
(17:29):
So it was a pretty smoothtransition from the corporate.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
That's a blessing, though, because I know
everyone's story is so differentwhen it comes to finding those
initial clients and it's like OK, like you know, do I have to do
ass?
Is it going to be word of mouthLike how was it for you?
Did you find that like, just byusing social media marketing,
that kind of flowed more?
Or was it a mix of word ofmouth that were in relationships
(17:55):
as well?
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Woo man, I mean definitely starting out
relationships right.
Like you said, whenpre-pandemic, I was always on
the go Networking event afternetworking event, you know,
trying to get out there meetpeople, and so I saw that the
fruits of that labor, you know,was me getting clients.
Or oh, you opened your own lawfirm.
(18:18):
I might need advice like thisand that.
So that's how that came in.
But I very much had to learn.
Number one outside was not openand I was pregnant, so we extra
inside right Just to stay outof the pandemic.
So all I had was online businessand marketing for the most part
.
So that's been something thatI've had to learn so I can speak
(18:41):
to the particular type ofclients that I want to speak to,
so I can find, you know, wherethey hang out.
My messaging, all of that hasbeen fine tuned and I'm really
proud of the work that I've donethere.
But that's been some work toois just that on a marketing
level.
But now that outside is backopen, definitely looking forward
(19:02):
to getting some more retreatsand events where I can meet
other business owners andpotential clients.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
That's really, really interesting.
And you're right now and I'mthinking about what that
timeframe was.
The world was in a differentplace.
We couldn't just go tonetworking events anymore.
And, yeah, it changes yourwhole strategy when it comes to
how do I let people know hey,I'm here and everyone's online.
You know, we all had this timeon our hands.
So you're still trying to likecut through the noise of like
(19:32):
hey, like I have something toannounce.
But it also shows, like, theimportance of your network.
If you weren't outside to beginwith beforehand, you know, just
building those relationships.
Those are those samerelationships that come around
later, of like, hey, I actuallyjust opened my law firm and
people are like, oh, okay, letme tell someone or I'm
interested.
So it just shows that power ofnetworking and you never know
(19:56):
when your network is gonna comein handy.
But it's cool to make those,it's important to make those
relationships all along the wayanyways.
But a last question about foryou, about, like the whole
corporate thing when you left,is there anything where you're
like dang, this is the stuffthat no one tells you about kind
of thing, like cause we are,you know, we get into the
(20:18):
business and if some things weexpect and if some things where
you're like whoa, I didn't knowit was gonna be like this.
Is there anything aboutentrepreneurship where you had
that moment of like oh, I didn'tknow it was gonna be like this?
Speaker 2 (20:32):
I mean man you talking about last question we
could spend the rest of the time, you know, with these things
that I just had to learn.
So I think to just to puteverything you know under one
umbrella.
It's a journey, and what I meanby that is the personal growth
(20:53):
and development, the unlearningthat I've had to do.
Just add me as myself, right,in order to run a business, in
order for me to put myself outthere and say, hey, I'm an
attorney, I'm good at what I do,like this is me, this is how I
talk with my clients, right?
The imposter syndrome that Ihad to let go of, the confidence
(21:14):
that I had to gain the securityin being myself full fledged.
You know, first generationTanzanian, like mom, I had to
embrace all of that and it tooksome work, right?
Entrepreneurship is definitelylike a beast of personal work
for you to properly show up inyour business and serve people,
(21:37):
right?
So there's all of thesesocietal just expectations
placed on women, placed onmothers, microaggressions, you
know, stereotypes against blackwomen and what it means to be a
professional, what you thinkabout when you see an attorney.
Right, learning to unlearn andlet go of those things and
(22:00):
define what a lawyer is what amom is, what a woman is, what a
business owner is for yourself.
So that's been first.
Nobody was saying that.
On Instagram, right, they talkthem all, make $10,000 in 10
days and form your LLC, but like, that's the work of it, that is
the work of it and that youknow.
(22:21):
Nobody can tell you that.
You have to experience it foryourself.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
In my opinion, no, I totally agree and that's why I
asked, because I think everyonehas different moments where
you're like, whoa, that'ssomething even someone told you.
It's like you still have towalk through it to really see.
And it's not even like, oh,what happened one time?
I learned this thing we're doneis really ongoing.
You know revolver or yeah, andwe're wearing all these hats and
(22:50):
and we already have the wholeimposter syndrome thing going on
.
And then it's like you havesocietal norms playing.
So it's different.
Some of it is Internal pressureyou know that we put on
ourselves.
You know, can't blame it onanyone else.
Some stuff is societal and somethings are like oh, I've seen
(23:10):
leadership look like this when Iworked at these firms.
So some of it is kind of Tryingto like try it and other
people's weight.
You know the way that they didit or the way that we saw it.
And then it's like, oh, I don'tknow this really fits my
business.
Like I've tried this style andit may work for me, but that
doesn't mean it's gonna work forthe people I may bring on or my
team, and so I think it's veryinteresting.
(23:31):
And during that time you'rewearing a new hat as a mom too.
So it's like you got mom hatwife hat ball hat Marketer hat.
Like it's just a lot.
And it's like I see how peoplecould either lose themselves or
just go through such aTransformation when it comes to
(23:54):
who am I and how do I want to be, how do I want to lead, what
does that look like?
And realizing to that it's okayto make changes, because
sometimes I think we may pick,like, okay, this is the method,
this is my approach, this islike the way I'm going into it.
It's something that I've beensaying a lot this year is just
pivoting, and just the notion ofit's okay if the business isn't
(24:17):
what I thought it was gonna be,as far as like, oh, I may have
thought I was gonna for sureprovide these services, but it's
like, actually, people areasking me a lot for these
services.
Okay, that's not what Ienvisioned.
Or it's like, oh, I'm gonna belike a little bit more laid-back
and chill.
And it's like, oh wait, I thinkI need to be a little bit more
assertive, like I don't know.
I've dealt with that where I'mlike Okay, I don't know, this is
(24:39):
really in my personality, but Ithink I need to become this
person or kind of just be a moreadaptable and try different
things before I'm like, no, thisis me and I'm not gonna change.
It's like, okay, you may haveto Just let you try on different
shoes and see what's a good fit, and it may not be the shoe you
thought like, alright, that'sthe one you know.
But it's like, okay, that'ssomething I've been thinking
(25:01):
about a lot this year is just,you know, pivoting, like it's
okay to switch gears or changecourses.
Or sometimes you think youraudience is like okay, it's for
sure these people right herelike is that?
And it's some other peoplethat's like oh, no, I would love
.
Yeah, we need help, and it'slike that was not on my bingo
card.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
Yeah, I agree, and I think it like I talk about trial
and error a lot, like you justgot to keep, like you said,
seeing which shoe fits the bestright.
You may have wanted that's thelittle over there, but you know
it's those pumps that you got toput on for this season, or you
know it's a lot of Trustingyourself to figure that out too.
(25:43):
You know to guide yourself andrealize, you know what this may
not be working, or it doesn'thave to look like this.
So again, just a ton ofpersonal growth that goes.
That happens like when you'repursuing entrepreneurship.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
I'm not thinking embracing it, because I think
it's also you know.
You said oh, maybe this pumpworks better than this.
So what?
Oh, like it's at seasonsbecause that shoe may work for a
while.
Like it may have been like thatfirst show, first shoe you put
on, everything was flowing,working for a.
It could be a year.
You're gonna have two years,multiple years, but there's a
(26:18):
season for everything and it'slike okay.
Like, yes, this workedoriginally, but it doesn't mean
I have to cling to that, to whatwork, you know, and I think is
that goes into risk-taking andjust being, I think, outside of
our comfort zone of like it'sokay to try on some new shoes
and look around and see, youknow what makes sense, get new
perspectives and and things likethat.
(26:38):
But so for your business, likewhat?
What does growth look like?
For you say, to scale in thenext few years?
I think you were telling mebefore about a legal resource
program that you're working on,so it's more about that.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Yeah, it's funny, you're talking about like
seasons and you know, servingcertain people and whatnot.
So, with the way that I want toserve, the way I'm currently
serving people right now is on aone-on-one basis, right, taking
on clients, working with themon their contract or their
trademark needs.
And, like you said in thebeginning, you know, legal
(27:16):
services are expensive sometimesand I would say that, more than
just the, I would say that mineare not cheap, even though
cheap and expensive are relative.
But there's, I value the workthat I do and it certainly sets
my clients up for success.
And that's not alwaysaccessible to everyone, right?
And at the same time, youcannot serve everyone like you
(27:41):
just can't.
You have to find different waysto do it.
So one thing that I do is, likeI mentioned earlier, like teach
in group programs Cohortthere's a co-working space out
here in the Bay Area.
I've done several workshops forthem and that's just because
that's something that I love todo.
Right, that's part ofentrepreneurship is finding what
(28:01):
lights you up and it lights meup for me to teach about legal
stuff and doing business, andpeople go oh, that's what that
means, or that's what they weretalking about when they said
this right, like if finallyclick, it finally clicks.
So I love that.
The program that I'm building,however, is A middle ground
(28:23):
between you know, trying to DIYand piece everything together
yourself, and working with anattorney, one-on-one retainer.
You go to attorney for business, right?
That middle ground that I'mbuilding is what I'm calling the
holy grail for online coaches,consultants, strategists and
expert service providers tostart building that legal
(28:44):
foundation.
So that includes contracttemplates that are beyond fill
in the blank.
They're comprehensive, they'redetailed, they provide Context
right as to how to use them andwhat's going on in your business
.
It includes supplementalresources so that, if you have a
contract, you have a list ofconsiderations Right.
If it's a partnership agreement, for example, a list of
(29:06):
considerations about how toproperly enter a Partnership, or
some negotiating terms or whatyou do with your intellectual
property right.
Because when you have guidingthe principles or just guiding
factors like that, your, yourquestions with another partner
become different.
Right.
If we want to work together andwe're like you know what, yes,
(29:27):
it's good, but if I have a listof things to ask you and you
start answering them in a waywhere I'm like that's a red flag
, no, I don't want to work likethat, right, that might make me
change my mind.
So I want people to be able tomake informed decisions, and
then the third part of that ishaving the ability to ask
questions.
So, not give legal advice, butget that knowledge, that that
(29:49):
education for you to again makean informed business decision.
And I want people to have thatfoundation before working with
the lawyer one-on-one, becausewhen you do get to that point in
your business whenever that isfor you you don't want to have a
broken foundation where a tonof things either need to be
fixed or changed or becomesextra expensive.
(30:10):
Whole time you're elevatingyourself, you're protecting
yourself, you're settingyourself up for success and to
get there faster and easierbecause you have your legal
ducks in a row.
So that is the resource thatI'm building that's going to be
launching in the fall.
We're currently doing betatesting with people right now
who are testing out theseresources and giving us their
(30:32):
feedback.
Yeah, I really like this, orlike what about having this?
That would help, right, because,as an expert, I can tell you
hey, listen, you need these fivethings to run your business
right the contract, thetrademark, et cetera, et cetera.
But, as the person receivingthat, like, people receive
things different ways, right?
So this beta program is helpingme get the perspective of those
(30:56):
who are going to be receivingit so I can shape it in a way
that is a total package for them, if you will.
So I can talk about that too,on and on, but, in short, I'm
super excited about that and Iwant people to be empowered when
it comes to their business,because when you know you got
(31:16):
your stuff together, you show updifferent, you act different,
you go get more money.
You're not scared, right, andnot everybody's operating like
that.
And that's a huge component ofbeing in business is being able
to show up and say with yourchest that you can help someone
without looking over yourshoulder thinking I don't know
(31:37):
about this contract, but we'lltake a risk and see Right, that
is so real, like you just wantto have that confidence.
Speaker 1 (31:45):
No, I'm totally with you and I just see how important
this program is going to be, soI'm excited to see how it
develops.
You already know we're going tobe supporting you because, like
I said, I've used.
You know we've all heard ofLegalZoom and we're trying to
find fill-in-the-blank templatesonline, like most of us have
probably been there.
So it's.
But when you say comprehensivejust the way you're describing
(32:07):
it I'm like, oh yeah, that's agap, like we need something
where we're actually learningand not you're helping me fill
in the blanks and I have no cluewhat.
I still can't read it to reallyunderstand what it is that this
is saying.
I just know I have the contractnow, so we're good, and it's
like what is my, what does mycontract say that I'm giving to
someone else, you know?
(32:27):
So I think it is just a hugeeducational opportunity.
So I'm just excited about it,especially just in the black
community.
I think that we're still we maybe the first entrepreneur in our
family and we're trying tofigure it out, because sometimes
we have the skill and thetalent and we just want to zone
in on whatever that is and thebusiness part seems overwhelming
(32:50):
.
The legal part definitely seemslike okay, I don't even know
what's happening.
Is this really necessary?
It's like something that youdon't want to do but you need to
do so.
I think it's cool Having theseconversations, because I'm
hoping that it shifts ourmindset to like no, let's make
sure all of our business is inorder.
But something I wanted to askyou is, like you know, I know
(33:12):
you're doing your beta testingand just with different clients
when it comes to black businessowners, is there any trends that
you're seeing where you're likeoh, I'm noticing this common
mistake or this one thing thateveryone's kind of like either
it was a misconception or maybea trend and like okay,
everyone's missing the same kindof maybe legal documentation.
(33:32):
Is there anything that you'vebeen seeing?
Speaker 2 (33:36):
with the black business owners in particular?
No, but just generally, like inthe online business space in
particular.
Yes, seeing a few things likewhen is the right time to get
your LLC right after you've madea lot of money, or when you get
(33:57):
us to a certain point in yourbusiness, versus understanding
why it's supposed to be therefor protection, contract
templates definitely, like yousaid, you can fill in the blank,
but if you don't know, if youdon't know what it's doing for
you, right and you wanna give itto a client to sign, like
that's a huge red flag.
(34:17):
And I'll also say that Iappreciate that people do seek
out contract templates, nomatter how bad they might be,
because at least they know likeI need to get some stuff in
order, right.
So that's a great first step.
Exactly, that's a great firststep.
And I'll also say, justfollowing, there's a lot of
business coaches or likebusiness influencers and because
(34:41):
they've made a lot of money orhave had a lot of success people
you know they're influencers,they listen to them and so
sometimes we're.
I've seen oftentimes like a lotof that information is
incorrect or it just doesn'tapply to people who are starting
out their business versussomeone who's been in business
(35:01):
you know seven, 10 years and hasmaybe figured out like some
loopholes or just someworkarounds.
So I think there's also just alot of misinformation on that
part too, which is why, again,education is so critical,
because if you know what thesethings do to protect your
business and how they impactyour business or may impact it
(35:22):
negatively, how you can takeadvantage, right like if you
know all of those things, youmake different decisions.
So I would say those are someof the things that I'm noticing
just in the online businessspace.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
Yeah, no, that's good to know.
I definitely want to at leastask that way we can, as people
are hearing it, they're probablylike, oh, I've done that or
okay, yeah, I think so and I dothink that overall we are.
It's a blessing and a curse.
It's online space.
It's a way like I feel like Ilearned so much on TikTok I'm on
TikTok more than Google, likeit's just, but technically, if
(35:55):
that's not your lane, no matterwhat it is, it could be starting
a vending machine business,like it's a little bit of
everything online and you reallydon't know what's what, because
sometimes people will saywhoever's making the video will
say whatever they're saying.
I'm a comment girl.
I'm going to the comments.
And it's always a few peoplethat's like no, that's not
correct what they're saying,because my dad owns 10,.
(36:19):
Like they're saying, you couldmake this amount of money with
one vending machine, but reallyit takes about 10 to really see
a profit.
And you're like, ooh, becausethey want you to get the ebook.
They like that's their hustle.
So it is kind of like usingthat discernment to know, like,
okay, I'm hearing hisinformation, but let me and I
think that's just us buildingthat muscle of like y'all, it's
(36:40):
okay to do our own research too.
Like we can hear something, itdoesn't matter who is from, but
we need to start educatingourselves, like if it's terms
that they're saying that wedon't know, or just starting to
create new habits in that way, Ithink.
But I don't know.
I'm just excited overall forwhat you're going to be
providing soon.
I think it's so necessary foreveryone because, like you said,
(37:03):
by the time you hire a lawyer,you're not starting from like
basic basics.
You're like all right, Ialready have this and that in
place.
I feel good about the LC or this.
Okay, I'm ready for this nextlevel of things that I want to
implement.
Speaker 2 (37:16):
Yeah, yeah, most definitely.
And just to add to what you'resaying about like people doing
their own research, I thinkTikTok seem to have everything.
Number one like oh, it's TikTokis crazy, but I think that is.
You know, social media is easyto look for stuff and find it,
especially in the business realm, and you don't know what's
(37:38):
right or wrong, and so I thinkat that point, like you do have
to go talk to that expert.
So I tell people like you don'tneed to pay an attorney $10,000
, $5,000 to have a conversationwith them.
A lot of attorneys have, youknow, free consultations or paid
consultations that are like $50, $100, you know a few hundred
dollars.
(37:58):
So it kind of depends on youknow how much you, how important
that information is to you, andyou can certainly find an
attorney.
There are law schools thatprovide business clinics, where
they have law students, you know, advising people under the
supervision of licensedattorneys.
Right, there's resources outthere.
So if you live not too far froma law school, see if they have
(38:19):
a business clinic.
Sometimes they even have familylaw clinics or clinics for
veterans.
Those are the three clinicsthat we had at my law school.
There's legal aid programs in,sometimes, you know your chamber
of commerce has legal resources.
So there are ways to go andfind an attorney to talk to,
(38:40):
just like you can find anaccountant or, you know,
financial professional, likewhoever you need to talk to if
it is a vending machine person,like, book a call with them, ask
your questions so that you doknow, like, how to move forward
versus just taking informationat face value and trying to
(39:01):
figure it out yourself right.
So I just wanted to say that'savailable as an option.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
No, and that's good to know.
Like even I'm learningsomething and all I keep
thinking about as you weretalking is like you know me
doing some research, gettingwith you and just putting
together a list of what stuffthat's out here that people just
don't know that's out here,because I think that's what gets
everything started.
It's like okay, like I do haveresources at my fingertips and
this is I don't have to shy awayfrom legal things, because in
(39:31):
my mind is you know, I hope thiswhat everyone listens to, this
podcast.
I hope what you're taking awayis that you don't have to put
down half your mortgage, likeyou don't have to do all this
stuff just to get someinformation and to learn a few
things and kind of get point ina direction.
There are a lot of resourcesout here.
That's what I'm taking away fromthis, which is a good thing.
(39:53):
It's a good feeling of okay,like I don't have to put this
off until my business is supersuccessful just to make sure
that I'm taking proper steps toprotect myself, my brand.
You know, some people haveproducts.
You may need some trademarks.
Like you just need differentthings in place to make sure you
can enjoy your business withoutlooking over your shoulder,
like you know something's notdone correctly.
(40:15):
So that'll keep you up at night, right?
Speaker 2 (40:19):
exactly.
We don't want that stress tobusiness owners.
We want to be free right,stress free.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
So yeah, exactly Right, we want to make sure
we're good, but thank you somuch.
This has been like an amazing,amazing episode.
Like I'm happy I learned a lotabout you.
I'm sure everyone else is like,okay, I didn't know this, I
didn't know that.
So I'm just so appreciative ofyou being able to come on, share
your story, share your journeyand telling us what's next.
(40:48):
But I guess, before we go, telleveryone where they can find
you, how they can support, howthey can maybe learn more about
the program.
I know you said this while Ibelieve, but just yeah, how can
we support you?
Speaker 2 (41:02):
Yeah, follow me on LinkedIn.
I'm heavy on LinkedIn, I loveLinkedIn, so you can find me
there.
If you put in Liku Tiamati, I'mthe only one who will pop up,
so you can follow me on LinkedIn.
Also on Instagram, atlawyerliku but less active at
the moment as I've been heavy onLinkedIn and then you can
(41:26):
subscribe to and I'll send youthe link diamond, but subscribe
to be on the waitlist for thisprogram that I'm launching.
In the fall it's in a fewmonths, but with the wait time
it's fine.
It's gonna be right around thecorner, so we might have an
opportunity for additional betatesters.
If that's something that you'reinterested in, then you can
definitely reach out about that,but otherwise, that's the best
(41:49):
way to stay connected with meand figure out what's going on.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Awesome.
So for everyone that'slistening, I will make sure to
put all of this in the shownotes.
That way you can just click thelinks to her socials and for
the waitlist as well.
And yeah, I'm just, I'm superexcited.
So thank you so much for comingon.
The Black Directory podcast.
Thank you for having me, ofcourse.
(42:15):
Thank you for spending sometime with us Enjoying the show.
Be sure to subscribe and leaveus a rating and review Until
next time.
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