April 3, 2025 • 21 mins
I'm so excited to welcome a former Southern Virginia University student to the podcast! Jen Carpenter is a writing star on the rise and she's not just the debut author of the romcom How to Slay a Lion, she's also a co-founder of a brand new bookstore in Buena Vista, Virginia. Her energy and enthusiasm for books, bookstores, and life will leave you smiling for days.
Buy Jen's book:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0990481077
Learn more about Jen:
https://www.amazon.com/stores/author/B0DJKY4ZK9/about
Follow Leaf and Lore on IG:
https://www.instagram.com/leafandlorestore/
Follow Leaf and Lore on FB:
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61573024493610
Learn more about Jason:
http://www.jasonfwright.com
About the book:
Amelia Anderson has always been the queen of the library, but when the town’s most historic building, her library, is threatened by a demolition order, she’s ready to become a heist mastermind. The target? A manila envelope containing the document that could save the library. The obstacle? Lucas Chernov—her high-school crush turned infuriatingly handsome billionaire contractor.
She wants her library. He wants to push it over. This. Is. War.
Lucas is no stranger to tough decisions, but Amelia is unlike any challenge he’s ever faced. As the eldest of ten brothers, each as enigmatic as the next, Lucas carries the weight of a family curse and the expectations of a town. But when Amelia, with her frizzy hair and fierce determination, stumbles into his life—or rather, his mansion—Lucas finds himself questioning more than just his building plans.
With a Newfoundland dog named Nemean at her side, Amelia is determined to save the library, even if it means facing down her old feelings for Lucas. What she doesn’t expect is for Lucas to be drawn to her quirky charm and a proposal that could change both of their lives forever.
In a town where everyone knows your business, can Amelia and Lucas find common ground—and maybe something more—before the wrecking ball swings?
How to Slay a Lion is a sweet, slow-burning, enemies-to-lovers, laugh-out-loud Hercules retelling about finding courage, love, and the unexpected places where you might discover both.
This podcast is brought to you by InkVeins, your source for book publicity, promo, press releases and more. Text 540-212-4095 for more information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hello, hello, hello, my friends, Welcome to the Book
Drop, Mike.
As always, so honored that yougive us a little bit of time.
As a reminder, this podcast isbrought to you by Inc Bain.
We are your source forpublicity promo, press releases
and publishing consulting.
That is a mouthful.
If you have a book to promoteor you're wanting to be seen in
the media with another project,reach out and let's talk about
(00:24):
working together.
Also, have you caught our otherepisodes?
We have talked about somereally wonderful books this year
and, even if they are no longerbrand new in the market, if you
haven't read it, it is new toyou.
So I invite you to go check outthose other episodes.
Okay, Our guest today is muchmore than a wonderful debut
author.
She is a dear friend of mine.
(00:45):
Her name is Jen Carpenter andwe are doing this interview from
her brand new bookstore.
Hello, Jen.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Hello, it's so nice to be here.
Thank you, it's so fun.
Is this your first podcast?
You can tell that fast.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
No, no, I'm just a little birdie.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Yes, it is my very first podcast.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Well, we're eight seconds in, but you're killing
it so far, Bless.
You Tell me we have to, so I'venever done anything like this
in a bookstore.
It's a brand new bookstore.
Take a minute and tell us aboutLeaf and Lore.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah, leaf and Lore is a small town bookstore.
We are located in Buena Vista,virginia, and we just we haven't
even technically had a grandopening yet.
It's a soft opening and it wasa group of fellow enthusiasts,
literary enthusiasts, who cametogether and actually who
(01:34):
spawned the idea is a dearfriend of mine.
I was volunteering on anon-profit, it's called Main
Street Buena Vista.
It's about local revitalizationefforts and she really has
always wanted to have a plantstudio and her and her daughter
had a great idea to do a plantstudio plus a bookstore, and so
(01:55):
it worked out that six of uscollaborated together and made
this space happen.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
And unless you have hired these customers that are
standing around us, there arereal people in this store right
now.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
They are the best kind of real people.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
So there are a handful of you that kind of
shared this dream.
Yeah, how often are those ofyou that are owners of the
enterprise?
How often are you in this store?
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Yeah, so we all basically take shifts, so we all
have a specific role within thebusiness, like a specialty, if
you will, and each of us takeabout eight hours or so and
volunteer at the shop.
So each of us basically dovolunteer hours.
It's run relatively like a coop and something else unique
about this store is we do newand used and we also want it to
(02:44):
be very experiential.
So we're really excited for allthe bookish plantish events
coming to Buena Vista.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
Well, it feels like the kind of place that you want
to come hang out for a while,and that's what you.
I mean, that's the goal ofevery indie bookstore, right?
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah, come and hang out.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Even if you don't buy a book this time, that's okay.
Yes, except for you.
You better buy a book this time, don't even feel pressure.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
He takes that back.
You feel pressure.
We are not editing this out.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
No Good things are happening.
I think you're diving into thisat the right time.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Yeah, I feel the same , and even if it's not, we're
doing it.
We're not even going to lookback, we're doing it.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
And you know there's a market there.
There are consumers for mybagels or my donuts or my
whatevers.
But when you start a businessthat comes from the passion of I
love books my name's JenCarpenter and I love books,
right Like you can't fake that.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Right and I'm afraid I don't fake one piece of it.
And I think also I love fromthe economic development
perspective that if you want tosee change in your town, right
that you are, that change rightand books and literary pursuits
is something I just want in mylife for the rest of my life.
So I feel like it really alignsand I really want to empower
others to do the same.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
And if you're in the area, or if you're not in the
area and you ever come throughthe area, all you have to do is
be going up and down Interstate81.
You should dive in here and youmight see one of your kids,
which I think is kind of cool.
I think I've been here a coupleof times and I think both times
at least your son has been here, right?
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Yeah, yeah.
So we have five children andthey all are rolling up their
sleeves, if they want to or not,and are helping us out with
inventory with sweeping thefloor, learning about customer
service.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Love that.
What a great story in 10 years,15 years, 20 years for your
kids to say.
I grew up in a small townAmerica bookstore.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah, that's pretty dreamy.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Fingers crossed, that's pretty cool that their
mother helped to found and thatsells a thousand of her mother's
books.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
Oh, bless you.
But I also have to throw ashout out to my wonderful
husband.
He's also one of the owners, sowe're both committed.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
Yes, we're talking about Neil, right, we're talking
about right.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
None of the others, just only Neil.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Yes, Neil's a good guy, by the way.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
this podcast could be brought to you by Neil's how I
feel like with all things,especially with the bookstore
too absolutely, it's always theother half.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
It's always the other half.
So, okay, we know each otherbecause you took my writing
class at southern virginiauniversity.
Plug for the writing program atsouthern virginia university,
wonderful professors and then me.
But there's some great talentthat teaches creative writing in
english up on the hell bears,they say.
So we met in that class and youhave written, and I know that
you're already on to seven otherprojects.
(05:29):
But how to Slay a Lion, whichyou call a small-town rom-com,
tell us about this novel.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Okay, do you want me to tell you the background, how
it came to be, or do you want toactually know about?
Speaker 1 (05:38):
the book.
Let's test how much youremember about popular fiction
201 or whatever it was.
Give Test how much you rememberabout popular fiction 201 or
whatever it was.
Give us the elevator spiel.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
All right, I almost feel like we should pull out the
timer.
Agreed, see if I can do itwithin an elevator ride.
So the pitch is it's about asmall town librarian and about a
contractor who comes into townwho wants to push it over.
So it's enemies to lover.
Sweet small town rom-com.
And it's actually inspired byBuena Vista and some of the
revitalization efforts that Igot to see up close.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
We're not even at the top floor.
That was like three floors.
That's pretty good.
You have practiced that a lot,so tell me how much of this is
autobiographical?
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Okay, that's a great question.
I think there's probably somestronger underpinnings of
autobiography in it.
Is that even a word?
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Okay, it is now.
It's on a podcast.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I feel like that you've really encouraged us to
write what's going on in ourlife right now.
Okay, it's going to get heavyhere for a second.
My husband's mother wasdiagnosed with Balbar ALS, a
form of Parkinson's disease, andupon diagnosis they have about
two years of life expectancy,and so she had just recently
been diagnosed and just somedifferent family things working
(06:57):
through and vibes, and so in thebook it's one of the main
characters he's one of 12brothers and so I felt like a
lot of different family feelingsthat I was feeling I was really
able to express through there,and there also is a shout out to
a little bit of recognitionabout that disease as well.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Yeah, I love that.
Yeah, that's writing what youknow, which is an advice that I
invented.
Obviously, we were inelementary school and when we
said I don't know what to write,your teacher would say write
what you know.
What do you care about?
Right, I love that.
Sorry to hear about yourmother-in-law she's still with
us.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
She is, and I love her so much.
She's taught me so much and I'mso glad that I got to capture
that part of our life togetherin that book.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
And the great thing about that is, the book outlives
her and you and your kids Right.
You about.
That is, the book outlives herand you and your kids.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
You've created something that will be there
forever, and that's why I thinkeverybody should be a writer.
Jason, I feel like you made mesee that.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Everybody should be.
Everybody has a story to tell,even if it's just one and even
if it's only theirs.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
Agreed, and I actually I'm really interested
in it too.
I want to read it and I'll sellit here at the bookstore.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Yeah, that's awesome.
That's awesome.
You do have a gift forinspiring and encouraging other
people to maybe be better thanthey think they are right.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
That's really kind of you to say, and I really felt
like that's exactly what you didto me.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Well, you paid me.
One of the nicest complimentsthat I've always remembered and
that I don't always actually do,but I'm working on is that we
were texting back and forth lastsemester semester and I was
raving about somebody and howwonderful they were.
And you said well, you raveabout everybody and I thought
that's a lovely thing to say.
It's probably not always true.
There's probably someonelistening right now going.
(08:36):
I don't think Jason raves aboutme, but that's what I'm
aspiring to become as somebodythat genuinely sees the good in
everyone and promotes the good,because we tend to find the
flaws and invest in those.
We shouldn't do that.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Agreed and I completely agree and I feel like
you were such a great poster ofthat.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
Oh, you're very kind.
Thank you for that.
And when I asked you to saysome nice things about me in
exchange for some Venmo funds, Ididn't know you would take it
that far.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
But clearly I'm getting a Venmo request on this
thing.
All right.
Well then you better wait tillwe're all the way done to put in
any requests.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
then that's fair.
Let me say your book is 4.8 outof 5 on amazon, which is
fantastic.
Um, on goodreads it is.
I just saw this 4.7 and itseems I mean you have your
lowest review is a three starand it's from someone who we are
(09:35):
not going to name them on theinternet.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Yes, and they're my dear friend, I'm so happy.
Yes, I'm so happy for thatthree.
I love that because it'sauthentic.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Yes, I love it.
How often did we talk in classabout the need to get feedback
from people who will tell youthe truth?
It's a gift.
It is seriously a gift you haveto have that, and I'm teasing
about the fact that you have athree-star review.
It's fantastic Again, if youever take a class or a workshop
(10:05):
or a seminar with me.
I talk about not just gettingthe truth from people, but
recognizing how subjective thisis.
I mean, my wife and I willwatch the same movie or read the
same book or see the same showand walk at it with very
different opinions aboutsomething.
That it doesn't mean it's notgood just because we have
different opinions of it, right?
So the fact that you have allof these wonderful five-star
reviews, those are authentic,real reviews from people who
(10:25):
responded differently than yourfriend that gave you the
three-star review.
Does it make one more valuablethan the other.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
I guess it depends where I'm at in my journey.
So I really want to grow.
So I think the real feedback isthe most helpful.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
If you're going to write for the rest of your life
and write novel after novelafter novel, then yeah, you need
to be responding to reviews.
Now, that doesn't mean thatevery time someone says
something negative that you'regoing to change the way you
approach the next novel.
But I do think that we have toremember, as writers, that we
work for our readers, which issomething else.
We talked a lot in class about.
Our boss is the one with thecredit card at the cash register
(10:59):
to my left who's buying thebook?
Right, and they will fire youif you stop writing things that
connect with them right.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Correct, absolutely correct, and I've had that
happen.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
I've had books that didn't perform well, where I
have felt like I have been laidoff for a period of time until
you're rehired with the nextthing.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Right and I actually love that you shared some of
those experiences in class thatreally bolstered me and just I
guess just seeing somebody elsedoing it and their perception of
failure just really helped mefeel more confident of like I
can do this.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
And failure is an art .
It is an art.
I'm a master I am.
If they give out like differentcolored belts for failure, I
would be whatever that blackbelt oh yeah, I have failed at
so many things, but it is as youknow.
It's the failure that makes usstronger.
It's the literal getting backup when the book isn't great and
we get some better views.
(11:49):
It's that getting back up thatstrengthens our muscles and
strengthens our emotionalresiliency and our creative
resiliency, which is prettyimportant too.
And you're going to writesomething in 10 years that
someone's still not going tolike.
You may win a Pulitzer, youmight be a 10-time New York
Times bestselling author andsomeone will say, wow, hated
this.
I hated Jen's 72nd book.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
It was awful.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Right, even though you've accomplished a lot
between now and then.
Right, but even just to get tothat number, yeah, right, even
though you've accomplished a lotbetween now and then.
Right, but even just good toget to that number.
Yeah, and you clearly will.
Oh well, I'm so grateful foryour confidence.
Well, on that note, what's nextfor you?
Speaker 2 (12:26):
yeah, you're gonna write 72 books.
What's number two?
Yeah, yeah, so, um, I'mcurrently working on three
projects, um, one of them is thenext uh book in this series of
how to slay a lion.
Um, and then I'm also workingon a magic realism book, and
then I'm also working on ahistorical fiction book of the
area ish, inspired with with afriend.
Yeah, she's like a historian,at least that's her pastime, so
(12:48):
is she?
Speaker 1 (12:48):
contributing?
Is she writing?
Is she consulting?
Is she just your, yourhistorical muse?
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Co-writing and all of the above.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Very cool.
Yeah, I love that.
So what is next, though, interms of, like, I will walk in
here and buy a copy of Like asfar as that next book goes, yeah
, probably a magic realism book.
Oh, Mm-hmm.
Release date of oh you justwanted to hear this on air,
didn't you?
Speaker 2 (13:13):
When is it?
Let's say by the end of thisyear?
On air, didn't you?
When is it?
Let's say by the end of thisyear, by the end of this year?
How does that feel?
Does that that?
You got that out of me?
Speaker 1 (13:19):
I love that.
And what's the age?
Speaker 2 (13:20):
range.
Yeah, so it'll be another likesweet rom-com.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Okay, so, but with some magic realism.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Yeah, yeah, I wanted to explore fantasy realism, um.
So I hear, especially whenyou're newer in your career,
that, um, just experimentingslightly with different genres
can be helpful.
Yeah, so you can reallyunderstand your own craft.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Yeah, uh, before I let you go, tell me about your
first book signing.
Um first book signing.
First time you sat down andsigned a book for somebody first
book signing.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
First time you sat down and signed a book for
somebody yeah, yeah, it probablywas for beta readers and that
was really cool to hold theproduct.
I don't think there's manythings that we can do in life
right, where we work really hardfor, and then it's something
not only tangible but you can,you can share with so many
others, and then it's a sharedexperience.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Yeah, because you didn't write it for yourself,
right?
I mean, we talk in writingabout how, the first time you
write a draft, you're tellingyourself the story, but you're
only doing that because you'rehoping to then tell someone else
the story and to bless theirlife, and that is very well said
.
There aren't many things thatyou put that much work into and
also you can't recreate thatmoment, the first time that you
open a box from Ingram orwhomever has published you, and
(14:29):
you see that book with your nameon the front, with a cover and
it's exactly how you pictured it, at the right trim size, and
the paper feels great.
There's nothing quite like thatbirthing of a book.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Right, I completely agree, and I feel like the
journey to birthing the firstone for me was life-changing,
absolutely life-changing, and Iwould love to share it.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Please do.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
Okay, you ready?
Okay, I think I've only alludedto this a little bit to you in
a card one time.
But a little bit of backstory.
And we used to live in Utah andmy husband was finishing up his
doctorate degree and I feltlike our life could begin after
he completed his dissertation.
Like our life could begin afterhe completed his dissertation.
Right, and we have fivechildren, we have fun, different
(15:12):
side adventures along the way,and the day he defends his
dissertation, I'm just on like Icannot wait for my life to
begin after this moment.
So he calls me on his way homefrom defending his dissertation
and he says, jen, I passed.
And then his next sentenceswe're moving to Virginia.
I pulled over on the side of theroad and I just wept.
(15:33):
I wept because I just was soexcited for us we had built, we
had made it to a home and alifestyle that we'd worked hard
for.
I had a side hustle that wasgrowing and just really excited
to explore the next season oflife there where we were at.
So he told me he says, jen, youknow what?
Southern Virginia University,there are writing classes.
(15:54):
And he knew that I've tried towrite a novel for years.
And he's like when we get thereI'll support you taking those
classes.
So that was my dangling carrotacross the entire United States,
across the moving truck,breaking down, across a leaky
roof, across all of the crazythings that can happen when you
transplant across the country.
And so I needed to take prereqsand I really enjoyed the
(16:17):
different classes I got to take.
But I was specifically reallyexcited to take a specific
course from an author, and atthe time I worked at SVU.
I was at a university fair and Isat up next to the writing
center and I was telling IanHaver how excited I was to be in
this writing class from anauthor and he told me he said,
(16:39):
jen, nobody's told you yet.
And I said told me what he'slike.
That author's retired, there'sretired.
And I ran out of that fair andI cried in the bathroom and I
left my booth and I just criedand when I walked back out and
it's because up to that point inmy life I felt like I had an
issue of blood, if you will,with writing a novel right that
I just needed to feel the hem ofa master's you know who's,
(17:03):
somebody who had gone through itbefore, somebody who knew I
needed a mentor.
I just felt like that and Ifelt like that was my only
opportunity and I had been sucha good attitude through all of
the transitions, just to be toldthat.
And so I'm like, okay, I'm goingto drop out, there's no use for
me, you know, for this tocontinue on right, because it's
taking time away from my family.
(17:24):
But I walked out of there andJoe Buschel saw me and he could
see I was not okay and he toldme it's going to be okay, jason
Wright is going to be theteacher.
And he's like do you know JasonWright?
I didn't know Jason Wright atthe time.
I'd read a few of his books, afew of your books Sorry, I'm
talking in third person now andthen so the next day I went to
(17:46):
class with probably an attitudeit's because I didn't know if
this was going to be for me ornot.
But quite frankly, I feel liketaking your classes changed my
life.
It really helped me write anovel, right?
I feel like that you were thatmentor that helped me get to the
next step.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Well, thank you, that is unbelievably kind.
And let's be transparent here.
They invited me to come fill invery late for that good man
because I'm close and they knewthat I could probably, in my
schedule, make it work to driveto and from.
But I'm guessing that they hada wish list and I was probably
(18:22):
not very high on that wish list.
Oh, I highly doubt that.
I will take geography as thereason that I landed this gig,
and I do love it and it haschanged me for the better as
well.
The relationships that are themost important thing in my life,
far beyond books and writingand process and podcasts, are
the people that we meet, and Ido think that heaven has a way
(18:43):
of bringing people into ourlives for a reason and not as a
transaction, but so that we canbless one another's lives, and
you and the other students inthese classes I've taught have
been huge blessings in my lifeand I consider you friends
forever, and I say that in classand all the students look at me
and roll their eyes and thenwhen I see them a year and a
half later and I stop and givethem a hug on the sidewalk and
(19:04):
buy them ice cream, they're likeoh, you meant it when you said
that we could never get rid ofyou.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Right, I'm so glad for it.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
Well, you're a gem.
I cannot wait to see what isnext from you.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
This book is fantastic.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
It was fun to see it come together.
I'm so proud of you for thisaccomplishment and that you
didn't rush this out, that youtook the time to do it right.
The cover art is beautiful.
Do you want to give a shout outto your designer?
Speaker 2 (19:30):
I would love to.
Allie Haney is amazing.
She actually graduated from SVUand I really like.
I'm all about shop local right,so I really wanted to empower a
local illustrator and she wasfantastic to work with.
Speaker 1 (19:44):
And it fits all of the vibes of that genre right
now and that kind ofcontemporary romance.
If you go through the Amazonbestseller list in your
categories, all of the bestcovers look so much like yours,
even the palette and just thedesign.
It's very, very well done andof course people can see the
link to the book and the cover.
Jen's lovely photo Links to allthe good things Jen is doing in
(20:06):
the world will be in the shownotes, including a link to the
shop website right Great,because that's up, it's about to
be live.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
It's about to be live .
Speaker 1 (20:16):
Yes, but we will tease that anyway.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
A link to social media.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
Yes, we'll put all your handles in the show notes.
Great and, if you haven't heardyet, the Christmas Jars cookbook
is available for pre-order onAmazon.
You've heard me talk about howimportant it is for authors that
if you know you're going to buythe book, pre-order it.
It tells the publisher, it's ademonstration to the publisher
and to retailers of whether ornot there's energy behind a
(20:42):
title.
So for me, for Jen, for anyother writer out there, if you
have a writer that you love andfollow and you think I'm
probably going to end up buyingthis book, pre-order it.
It makes a huge difference andwe always appreciate when you do
that.
All right, jen Carpenter,you're a gem.
That's our time for today.
Thank you so much for lettingme break into your bookstore for
this conversation.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
That's so great.
Anytime, I think everybodyshould buy your books and I
think everybody should take allyour writing classes you ever
have in the entire world.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
You're very, very kind and I think I am going to
do all the rest of my podcastinterviews in this bookstore.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Amen, I'll save the cord for you.
How about that?
Hello, hello, hello, my friends, Welcome to the Book
Drop, Mike.
As always, so honored that yougive us a little bit of time.
As a reminder, this podcast isbrought to you by Inc Bain.
We are your source forpublicity promo, press releases
and publishing consulting.
That is a mouthful.
If you have a book to promoteor you're wanting to be seen in
the media with another project,reach out and let's talk about
(00:24):
working together.
Also, have you caught our otherepisodes?
We have talked about somereally wonderful books this year
and, even if they are no longerbrand new in the market, if you
haven't read it, it is new toyou.
So I invite you to go check outthose other episodes.
Okay, Our guest today is muchmore than a wonderful debut
author.
She is a dear friend of mine.
(00:45):
Her name is Jen Carpenter andwe are doing this interview from
her brand new bookstore.
Hello, Jen.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Hello, it's so nice to be here.
Thank you, it's so fun.
Is this your first podcast?
You can tell that fast.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
No, no, I'm just a little birdie.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Yes, it is my very first podcast.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Well, we're eight seconds in, but you're killing
it so far, Bless.
You Tell me we have to, so I'venever done anything like this
in a bookstore.
It's a brand new bookstore.
Take a minute and tell us aboutLeaf and Lore.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah, leaf and Lore is a small town bookstore.
We are located in Buena Vista,virginia, and we just we haven't
even technically had a grandopening yet.
It's a soft opening and it wasa group of fellow enthusiasts,
literary enthusiasts, who cametogether and actually who
(01:34):
spawned the idea is a dearfriend of mine.
I was volunteering on anon-profit, it's called Main
Street Buena Vista.
It's about local revitalizationefforts and she really has
always wanted to have a plantstudio and her and her daughter
had a great idea to do a plantstudio plus a bookstore, and so
(01:55):
it worked out that six of uscollaborated together and made
this space happen.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
And unless you have hired these customers that are
standing around us, there arereal people in this store right
now.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
They are the best kind of real people.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
So there are a handful of you that kind of
shared this dream.
Yeah, how often are those ofyou that are owners of the
enterprise?
How often are you in this store?
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Yeah, so we all basically take shifts, so we all
have a specific role within thebusiness, like a specialty, if
you will, and each of us takeabout eight hours or so and
volunteer at the shop.
So each of us basically dovolunteer hours.
It's run relatively like a coop and something else unique
about this store is we do newand used and we also want it to
(02:44):
be very experiential.
So we're really excited for allthe bookish plantish events
coming to Buena Vista.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
Well, it feels like the kind of place that you want
to come hang out for a while,and that's what you.
I mean, that's the goal ofevery indie bookstore, right?
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah, come and hang out.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Even if you don't buy a book this time, that's okay.
Yes, except for you.
You better buy a book this time, don't even feel pressure.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
He takes that back.
You feel pressure.
We are not editing this out.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
No Good things are happening.
I think you're diving into thisat the right time.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Yeah, I feel the same , and even if it's not, we're
doing it.
We're not even going to lookback, we're doing it.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
And you know there's a market there.
There are consumers for mybagels or my donuts or my
whatevers.
But when you start a businessthat comes from the passion of I
love books my name's JenCarpenter and I love books,
right Like you can't fake that.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Right and I'm afraid I don't fake one piece of it.
And I think also I love fromthe economic development
perspective that if you want tosee change in your town, right
that you are, that change rightand books and literary pursuits
is something I just want in mylife for the rest of my life.
So I feel like it really alignsand I really want to empower
others to do the same.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
And if you're in the area, or if you're not in the
area and you ever come throughthe area, all you have to do is
be going up and down Interstate81.
You should dive in here and youmight see one of your kids,
which I think is kind of cool.
I think I've been here a coupleof times and I think both times
at least your son has been here, right?
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Yeah, yeah.
So we have five children andthey all are rolling up their
sleeves, if they want to or not,and are helping us out with
inventory with sweeping thefloor, learning about customer
service.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Love that.
What a great story in 10 years,15 years, 20 years for your
kids to say.
I grew up in a small townAmerica bookstore.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah, that's pretty dreamy.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Fingers crossed, that's pretty cool that their
mother helped to found and thatsells a thousand of her mother's
books.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
Oh, bless you.
But I also have to throw ashout out to my wonderful
husband.
He's also one of the owners, sowe're both committed.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
Yes, we're talking about Neil, right, we're talking
about right.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
None of the others, just only Neil.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Yes, Neil's a good guy, by the way.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
this podcast could be brought to you by Neil's how I
feel like with all things,especially with the bookstore
too absolutely, it's always theother half.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
It's always the other half.
So, okay, we know each otherbecause you took my writing
class at southern virginiauniversity.
Plug for the writing program atsouthern virginia university,
wonderful professors and then me.
But there's some great talentthat teaches creative writing in
english up on the hell bears,they say.
So we met in that class and youhave written, and I know that
you're already on to seven otherprojects.
(05:29):
But how to Slay a Lion, whichyou call a small-town rom-com,
tell us about this novel.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Okay, do you want me to tell you the background, how
it came to be, or do you want toactually know about?
Speaker 1 (05:38):
the book.
Let's test how much youremember about popular fiction
201 or whatever it was.
Give Test how much you rememberabout popular fiction 201 or
whatever it was.
Give us the elevator spiel.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
All right, I almost feel like we should pull out the
timer.
Agreed, see if I can do itwithin an elevator ride.
So the pitch is it's about asmall town librarian and about a
contractor who comes into townwho wants to push it over.
So it's enemies to lover.
Sweet small town rom-com.
And it's actually inspired byBuena Vista and some of the
revitalization efforts that Igot to see up close.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
We're not even at the top floor.
That was like three floors.
That's pretty good.
You have practiced that a lot,so tell me how much of this is
autobiographical?
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Okay, that's a great question.
I think there's probably somestronger underpinnings of
autobiography in it.
Is that even a word?
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Okay, it is now.
It's on a podcast.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I feel like that you've really encouraged us to
write what's going on in ourlife right now.
Okay, it's going to get heavyhere for a second.
My husband's mother wasdiagnosed with Balbar ALS, a
form of Parkinson's disease, andupon diagnosis they have about
two years of life expectancy,and so she had just recently
been diagnosed and just somedifferent family things working
(06:57):
through and vibes, and so in thebook it's one of the main
characters he's one of 12brothers and so I felt like a
lot of different family feelingsthat I was feeling I was really
able to express through there,and there also is a shout out to
a little bit of recognitionabout that disease as well.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Yeah, I love that.
Yeah, that's writing what youknow, which is an advice that I
invented.
Obviously, we were inelementary school and when we
said I don't know what to write,your teacher would say write
what you know.
What do you care about?
Right, I love that.
Sorry to hear about yourmother-in-law she's still with
us.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
She is, and I love her so much.
She's taught me so much and I'mso glad that I got to capture
that part of our life togetherin that book.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
And the great thing about that is, the book outlives
her and you and your kids Right.
You about.
That is, the book outlives herand you and your kids.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
You've created something that will be there
forever, and that's why I thinkeverybody should be a writer.
Jason, I feel like you made mesee that.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Everybody should be.
Everybody has a story to tell,even if it's just one and even
if it's only theirs.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
Agreed, and I actually I'm really interested
in it too.
I want to read it and I'll sellit here at the bookstore.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Yeah, that's awesome.
That's awesome.
You do have a gift forinspiring and encouraging other
people to maybe be better thanthey think they are right.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
That's really kind of you to say, and I really felt
like that's exactly what you didto me.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Well, you paid me.
One of the nicest complimentsthat I've always remembered and
that I don't always actually do,but I'm working on is that we
were texting back and forth lastsemester semester and I was
raving about somebody and howwonderful they were.
And you said well, you raveabout everybody and I thought
that's a lovely thing to say.
It's probably not always true.
There's probably someonelistening right now going.
(08:36):
I don't think Jason raves aboutme, but that's what I'm
aspiring to become as somebodythat genuinely sees the good in
everyone and promotes the good,because we tend to find the
flaws and invest in those.
We shouldn't do that.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Agreed and I completely agree and I feel like
you were such a great poster ofthat.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
Oh, you're very kind.
Thank you for that.
And when I asked you to saysome nice things about me in
exchange for some Venmo funds, Ididn't know you would take it
that far.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
But clearly I'm getting a Venmo request on this
thing.
All right.
Well then you better wait tillwe're all the way done to put in
any requests.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
then that's fair.
Let me say your book is 4.8 outof 5 on amazon, which is
fantastic.
Um, on goodreads it is.
I just saw this 4.7 and itseems I mean you have your
lowest review is a three starand it's from someone who we are
(09:35):
not going to name them on theinternet.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Yes, and they're my dear friend, I'm so happy.
Yes, I'm so happy for thatthree.
I love that because it'sauthentic.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Yes, I love it.
How often did we talk in classabout the need to get feedback
from people who will tell youthe truth?
It's a gift.
It is seriously a gift you haveto have that, and I'm teasing
about the fact that you have athree-star review.
It's fantastic Again, if youever take a class or a workshop
(10:05):
or a seminar with me.
I talk about not just gettingthe truth from people, but
recognizing how subjective thisis.
I mean, my wife and I willwatch the same movie or read the
same book or see the same showand walk at it with very
different opinions aboutsomething.
That it doesn't mean it's notgood just because we have
different opinions of it, right?
So the fact that you have allof these wonderful five-star
reviews, those are authentic,real reviews from people who
(10:25):
responded differently than yourfriend that gave you the
three-star review.
Does it make one more valuablethan the other.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
I guess it depends where I'm at in my journey.
So I really want to grow.
So I think the real feedback isthe most helpful.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
If you're going to write for the rest of your life
and write novel after novelafter novel, then yeah, you need
to be responding to reviews.
Now, that doesn't mean thatevery time someone says
something negative that you'regoing to change the way you
approach the next novel.
But I do think that we have toremember, as writers, that we
work for our readers, which issomething else.
We talked a lot in class about.
Our boss is the one with thecredit card at the cash register
(10:59):
to my left who's buying thebook?
Right, and they will fire youif you stop writing things that
connect with them right.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Correct, absolutely correct, and I've had that
happen.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
I've had books that didn't perform well, where I
have felt like I have been laidoff for a period of time until
you're rehired with the nextthing.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Right and I actually love that you shared some of
those experiences in class thatreally bolstered me and just I
guess just seeing somebody elsedoing it and their perception of
failure just really helped mefeel more confident of like I
can do this.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
And failure is an art .
It is an art.
I'm a master I am.
If they give out like differentcolored belts for failure, I
would be whatever that blackbelt oh yeah, I have failed at
so many things, but it is as youknow.
It's the failure that makes usstronger.
It's the literal getting backup when the book isn't great and
we get some better views.
(11:49):
It's that getting back up thatstrengthens our muscles and
strengthens our emotionalresiliency and our creative
resiliency, which is prettyimportant too.
And you're going to writesomething in 10 years that
someone's still not going tolike.
You may win a Pulitzer, youmight be a 10-time New York
Times bestselling author andsomeone will say, wow, hated
this.
I hated Jen's 72nd book.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
It was awful.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Right, even though you've accomplished a lot
between now and then.
Right, but even just to get tothat number, yeah, right, even
though you've accomplished a lotbetween now and then.
Right, but even just good toget to that number.
Yeah, and you clearly will.
Oh well, I'm so grateful foryour confidence.
Well, on that note, what's nextfor you?
Speaker 2 (12:26):
yeah, you're gonna write 72 books.
What's number two?
Yeah, yeah, so, um, I'mcurrently working on three
projects, um, one of them is thenext uh book in this series of
how to slay a lion.
Um, and then I'm also workingon a magic realism book, and
then I'm also working on ahistorical fiction book of the
area ish, inspired with with afriend.
Yeah, she's like a historian,at least that's her pastime, so
(12:48):
is she?
Speaker 1 (12:48):
contributing?
Is she writing?
Is she consulting?
Is she just your, yourhistorical muse?
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Co-writing and all of the above.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Very cool.
Yeah, I love that.
So what is next, though, interms of, like, I will walk in
here and buy a copy of Like asfar as that next book goes, yeah
, probably a magic realism book.
Oh, Mm-hmm.
Release date of oh you justwanted to hear this on air,
didn't you?
Speaker 2 (13:13):
When is it?
Let's say by the end of thisyear?
On air, didn't you?
When is it?
Let's say by the end of thisyear, by the end of this year?
How does that feel?
Does that that?
You got that out of me?
Speaker 1 (13:19):
I love that.
And what's the age?
Speaker 2 (13:20):
range.
Yeah, so it'll be another likesweet rom-com.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Okay, so, but with some magic realism.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Yeah, yeah, I wanted to explore fantasy realism, um.
So I hear, especially whenyou're newer in your career,
that, um, just experimentingslightly with different genres
can be helpful.
Yeah, so you can reallyunderstand your own craft.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Yeah, uh, before I let you go, tell me about your
first book signing.
Um first book signing.
First time you sat down andsigned a book for somebody first
book signing.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
First time you sat down and signed a book for
somebody yeah, yeah, it probablywas for beta readers and that
was really cool to hold theproduct.
I don't think there's manythings that we can do in life
right, where we work really hardfor, and then it's something
not only tangible but you can,you can share with so many
others, and then it's a sharedexperience.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Yeah, because you didn't write it for yourself,
right?
I mean, we talk in writingabout how, the first time you
write a draft, you're tellingyourself the story, but you're
only doing that because you'rehoping to then tell someone else
the story and to bless theirlife, and that is very well said
.
There aren't many things thatyou put that much work into and
also you can't recreate thatmoment, the first time that you
open a box from Ingram orwhomever has published you, and
(14:29):
you see that book with your nameon the front, with a cover and
it's exactly how you pictured it, at the right trim size, and
the paper feels great.
There's nothing quite like thatbirthing of a book.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Right, I completely agree, and I feel like the
journey to birthing the firstone for me was life-changing,
absolutely life-changing, and Iwould love to share it.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Please do.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
Okay, you ready?
Okay, I think I've only alludedto this a little bit to you in
a card one time.
But a little bit of backstory.
And we used to live in Utah andmy husband was finishing up his
doctorate degree and I feltlike our life could begin after
he completed his dissertation.
Like our life could begin afterhe completed his dissertation.
Right, and we have fivechildren, we have fun, different
(15:12):
side adventures along the way,and the day he defends his
dissertation, I'm just on like Icannot wait for my life to
begin after this moment.
So he calls me on his way homefrom defending his dissertation
and he says, jen, I passed.
And then his next sentenceswe're moving to Virginia.
I pulled over on the side of theroad and I just wept.
(15:33):
I wept because I just was soexcited for us we had built, we
had made it to a home and alifestyle that we'd worked hard
for.
I had a side hustle that wasgrowing and just really excited
to explore the next season oflife there where we were at.
So he told me he says, jen, youknow what?
Southern Virginia University,there are writing classes.
(15:54):
And he knew that I've tried towrite a novel for years.
And he's like when we get thereI'll support you taking those
classes.
So that was my dangling carrotacross the entire United States,
across the moving truck,breaking down, across a leaky
roof, across all of the crazythings that can happen when you
transplant across the country.
And so I needed to take prereqsand I really enjoyed the
(16:17):
different classes I got to take.
But I was specifically reallyexcited to take a specific
course from an author, and atthe time I worked at SVU.
I was at a university fair and Isat up next to the writing
center and I was telling IanHaver how excited I was to be in
this writing class from anauthor and he told me he said,
(16:39):
jen, nobody's told you yet.
And I said told me what he'slike.
That author's retired, there'sretired.
And I ran out of that fair andI cried in the bathroom and I
left my booth and I just criedand when I walked back out and
it's because up to that point inmy life I felt like I had an
issue of blood, if you will,with writing a novel right that
I just needed to feel the hem ofa master's you know who's,
(17:03):
somebody who had gone through itbefore, somebody who knew I
needed a mentor.
I just felt like that and Ifelt like that was my only
opportunity and I had been sucha good attitude through all of
the transitions, just to be toldthat.
And so I'm like, okay, I'm goingto drop out, there's no use for
me, you know, for this tocontinue on right, because it's
taking time away from my family.
(17:24):
But I walked out of there andJoe Buschel saw me and he could
see I was not okay and he toldme it's going to be okay, jason
Wright is going to be theteacher.
And he's like do you know JasonWright?
I didn't know Jason Wright atthe time.
I'd read a few of his books, afew of your books Sorry, I'm
talking in third person now andthen so the next day I went to
(17:46):
class with probably an attitudeit's because I didn't know if
this was going to be for me ornot.
But quite frankly, I feel liketaking your classes changed my
life.
It really helped me write anovel, right?
I feel like that you were thatmentor that helped me get to the
next step.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Well, thank you, that is unbelievably kind.
And let's be transparent here.
They invited me to come fill invery late for that good man
because I'm close and they knewthat I could probably, in my
schedule, make it work to driveto and from.
But I'm guessing that they hada wish list and I was probably
(18:22):
not very high on that wish list.
Oh, I highly doubt that.
I will take geography as thereason that I landed this gig,
and I do love it and it haschanged me for the better as
well.
The relationships that are themost important thing in my life,
far beyond books and writingand process and podcasts, are
the people that we meet, and Ido think that heaven has a way
(18:43):
of bringing people into ourlives for a reason and not as a
transaction, but so that we canbless one another's lives, and
you and the other students inthese classes I've taught have
been huge blessings in my lifeand I consider you friends
forever, and I say that in classand all the students look at me
and roll their eyes and thenwhen I see them a year and a
half later and I stop and givethem a hug on the sidewalk and
(19:04):
buy them ice cream, they're likeoh, you meant it when you said
that we could never get rid ofyou.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Right, I'm so glad for it.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
Well, you're a gem.
I cannot wait to see what isnext from you.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
This book is fantastic.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
It was fun to see it come together.
I'm so proud of you for thisaccomplishment and that you
didn't rush this out, that youtook the time to do it right.
The cover art is beautiful.
Do you want to give a shout outto your designer?
Speaker 2 (19:30):
I would love to.
Allie Haney is amazing.
She actually graduated from SVUand I really like.
I'm all about shop local right,so I really wanted to empower a
local illustrator and she wasfantastic to work with.
Speaker 1 (19:44):
And it fits all of the vibes of that genre right
now and that kind ofcontemporary romance.
If you go through the Amazonbestseller list in your
categories, all of the bestcovers look so much like yours,
even the palette and just thedesign.
It's very, very well done andof course people can see the
link to the book and the cover.
Jen's lovely photo Links to allthe good things Jen is doing in
(20:06):
the world will be in the shownotes, including a link to the
shop website right Great,because that's up, it's about to
be live.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
It's about to be live .
Speaker 1 (20:16):
Yes, but we will tease that anyway.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
A link to social media.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
Yes, we'll put all your handles in the show notes.
Great and, if you haven't heardyet, the Christmas Jars cookbook
is available for pre-order onAmazon.
You've heard me talk about howimportant it is for authors that
if you know you're going to buythe book, pre-order it.
It tells the publisher, it's ademonstration to the publisher
and to retailers of whether ornot there's energy behind a
(20:42):
title.
So for me, for Jen, for anyother writer out there, if you
have a writer that you love andfollow and you think I'm
probably going to end up buyingthis book, pre-order it.
It makes a huge difference andwe always appreciate when you do
that.
All right, jen Carpenter,you're a gem.
That's our time for today.
Thank you so much for lettingme break into your bookstore for
this conversation.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
That's so great.
Anytime, I think everybodyshould buy your books and I
think everybody should take allyour writing classes you ever
have in the entire world.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
You're very, very kind and I think I am going to
do all the rest of my podcastinterviews in this bookstore.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Amen, I'll save the cord for you.
How about that?
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