How Bad is The Batman?

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:03):
Hello, Kitties. It's your old pal, John,
the voice of.
The crib keeper
and you're listening to
the bottom shelf.
Alright, guys. 2 boxes down. Wait. Did did

(00:24):
did you guys catch that flash of light?
Works let's?
Oh, man.
What's happening with the wormhole hole? Alright. Everyone
check.
We're always wait.
Bam put... You don't need... Okay. When you
say hand check, you can put the tentacles
down a little bit.
But they don't they don't get as append.
They're not hands.

(00:44):
You sit hands. Oh, okay. Okay. Sorry. You
you ce pod.
Alright. We're safe from the llama with hats.
Well, you know what?
Weird things keep happening, like, for for real.
In my bedroom. It... I... My bed turned
into a baked potato. So that's the thing.
Was at least cooked all way through.

(01:04):
It was delicious. Warm fluffy. It was and
fully loaded.
Anyway,
maybe if we just keep going, s might
here. Maybe maybe happens. I got a box.
Let me over the box. Spit it up.
Why are were you watching this movie? I'm
very confused. What movie? It's called the Batman.

(01:25):
Why are we watching this movie? It's not
the movie you need.
It's the 1 you deserve. What did I
do?
Prepare yourself to discover a world of terrible
movies.
See little brass.

(02:16):
Hello, movie lovers and movie haters. And welcome
to the bottom shelf a part of the
Geek Versions podcast at a podcast network of
Da devoted Geek certified devoted to letting people
know they are alone their characters. If he'll
past this moment to this. We love you
who care about you. There's a plan and
purpose for your life. And if it... Do
you doubt it, Bryce can hug you with
all 8 of his arms for I've got
them to spare. Those are tentacles,

(02:37):
not arms. Oh, that's fair.
Alright, Ladies Jim. Welcome to the bottom shelf.
We typically review terrible movies, but we're stuck
in a time warp, and we're not dancing
through it. We're just kinda of falling. Let's
do the time warp
begin.
Time warp hard. I didn't say the wrong
thing. He anyways, by the way, ladies.

(02:59):
So we're watching good movies
because
debatable.
Okay. Well,
critically critically declared okay movies, but
So we've had AAA
fun time so far. We watched a deep
impact
recently.
And did. That was that was a fun

(03:19):
movie.
Was it? III recall thinking it was a
fun movie. No, must.
I mean, it was only, like, 20 minutes
ago that we talked about it. Yeah. I
mean, yeah. Totally.
And
then we... Before that we watched lady hawk.
Yeah. Now that's a good movie. Was it?
It was.
It really was.

(03:40):
So ladies and gentlemen,
we have opened up the next box, and
it is called
the bad.
I'm gonna start calling this the wormhole hole
of John hate because that's where that's what
really what it's starting to feel like.
I mean, at least, celeste was lucky enough
to get zap out of here, but not...
Okay. So for everybody at home who doesn't

(04:02):
understand why I am having issues. Like, I
have been avoiding this batman movie since it
came out. Like, even before it came out.
Like...
And and Dallas can testify to Like, when
they announced that Robert Patti was gonna be
playing
batman,
I made a meme with... No. Wait. It
wasn't... Robert Patti that I made the need
for. That was for Ban ben A. I

(04:24):
put not my batman. But he was still
same concept.
I was not bats. I was not into
sparkle bats. III
do not want a batman that women sw
for is what it came down to. So
I I would I was a little bit
upset about head Bruce Wayne, dude. That's exactly
what he is. It's not the... That's

(04:45):
it's Playboy millionaire Bruce Wayne.
Anyway. So
if but here we are,
I'm... I, a good sport, and I will
play the game. So
I'm so proud of you.
I lost the game.
I don't I don't.
I don't play that game. Why?
Why?

(05:07):
I've been reflecting on college lately lately.
So... Okay.
Right. So want you introduce the crowd to
the movie. Yes. Introduce them to the thing
that I've been running from.
Alright. The batman is the first Dc
free Dc film of the 20 twenties. It
is directed and written by a Clover filled

(05:28):
Lane and Paradox producer Matt Reeves. It stars
Robert Pat who transformed from a twilight vampire
into the Sparkle bat himself batman.
Joining him is the voice of Mary James,
zoe K, the first cat woman to go
from a brick,
House.
To a gritty got landscape.
Watch over Got as lieutenant James Gordon is

(05:50):
the voice of Marvel's the watcher,
Jeffrey Wright. And then the heavily transformed former
Bulls eye actor colin Farrell as the penguin.
Alright. I was wondering if you're gonna get
the the joke about the brick house. Oh,
yeah. I didn't get it. She was the
voice of cat woman in
Batman lego. I wouldn't know.

(06:11):
I didn't see that 1. It's okay.
Alright. Read the back of the box. Alright.
Alright. Back box says this egg killer targets
Sc elites.
Sending the batman on an investigation as evidence
mounts. He must forge new relationships un the
culprit and bring justice
amid

(06:31):
corruption. I gotta say, modern boxes kinda suck
with their epic Yeah. I'm like, that is
1 sentence.
Here's the thing. Like, you you you're tapping...
You're you're kinda
you're tapping on a hot button for me.
Movies do less and less to try to
impress their audiences with how they

(06:53):
advertise themselves. Mh.
The biggest tragedy, I think has been
movie
posters.
They all coming out the same now. They
don't make them, like they use do. They
used to they used to have, like, outright
paintings for movie builder. Yeah.
Like, it was a work of art. The
last good 1 that I saw You it

(07:14):
was a... It and it was intentionally a
throwback, but it was for a horror film
that came out in the 20 tens called
the Dr men,
and it looks like a 19 eighties horror.
And the the box art for it looks
like a 19 eighties horror film
movie poster. And it it made me wish
that they still did box art and movie
posters. Like they used to because they don't.
It used to be like, pun... Like, I'm

(07:37):
not intending this pun, but you can take
it if you want to, but there used
to be an art. It's to movie art.
Mh. Yeah. Yeah. III totally get it. I
keep thinking about the
the original artwork for the Star Wars poster.
At the.
Yeah. Mh.
Yeah. I mean, that kind of stuff is
like, it... It's stuff that looks like people

(07:58):
spent time on and... Even bad movies like
Beast master.
Was semester bath. I didn't enjoy it. It
won't haven't seen it in the long time.
I haven't seen in a very long time.
Coming soon to an episode near you.
But I digress.
I got some trivia for this being as
we're coming up on my segment here.

(08:20):
Speaking of colin farrell as the penguin.
He went to Starbucks to try out his
prosthetics
and makeup for the penguin. The... When he
had them on for the first time,
and nobody recognized him, and he got a
lot of stares from people for because he
looked a bit weird. Yeah. Marty he recognized
him in the movie.
I... You know? I I guess. I knew

(08:42):
it was Colin Farrell when I watched the
thing.
I I I've seen this before. But when
I when I first saw it, I knew
it was colin Farrell. Right. Right? And I
Jill didn't recognize him. He's... He's literally legitimately
a talented actor. And when you add in
the prosthetics, like, it's like completely different.
Person
altogether.
Apparently, this little bit o tribute was a

(09:04):
big thing because I did this is the
first time I've literally sparked a conversation with
tribute. Jesus.
Robert Patti,
when he was auditioning for the role, he
actually took a selfie in the bat suit
as a moment just in case it didn't
work out.

(09:25):
I respect that. This is actually the first
bat first version of Batman to address the
black eye makeup underneath the cow directly.
In previous films, the makeup just disappeared when
Bruce took his mask off.
Matt Reeves stated that he loved the idea
of... Taking off the mask and underneath, there
was just
sweating and tripping down of the makeup and

(09:48):
whatnot.
Sorta of looking like a, like, you know,
that's scoop. Yeah.
And he also stated that his version of
the riddle was partially inspired by the infamous
Zodiac killer,
for... Which was a
unidentified serial killer, who operated in Northern California
in the sixties,

(10:08):
who also used Cipher in his infamous letters
to the police,
which made Matt Reeves call him a real
life riddle.
Yeah. In the film, the riddle begins his
video saying, this is the riddle speaking,
and the Zodiac began his letter saying this
is the Zodiac speaking.
The Zodiac
also
murdered his victims. Well, wearing a leather suit

(10:30):
and a mask and classes over his mask
just like the riddle wears in this 1.
And then finally, Matt Reeves stated that call
and farrell L's version of the penguin takes
inspiration from the character F Cor own
from the Godfather,
in relation to the about that both Barrels
characters are under

(10:50):
underestimated by others but have huge potential. So
that's something that check out for me to
watch for when I watch this movie. Yeah.
Definitely I am beat. That I am being
forced to watch to be free from this
wormhole.
But that seems like a good segue to
get into our expectations. Yeah. Let's do it.
Indeed. And wants to start.

(11:13):
Bam.
Alright. And expectations. Like I said, I actually
saw this in theaters when it came out.
So I've seen it before.
I remember enjoying it. I remember there's a
lot about it that I that I had
fun with. So
I'm expecting to be entertained.
You know, I'd I enjoy superhero movies.

(11:36):
And from what I remember, I liked the
angle this 1 took on Batman.
So I'm I'm looking forward to it.
Dallas.
I I'm looking forward to this. As a
whole. I... I'm a Batman fan.
And
I I remember going to the theater and
watching this and thoroughly

(11:56):
enjoying it. So I'm looking forward to watching
it again.
I can tell you I am not looking
forward to this.
I have been at actively
avoiding this movie, but I circumstances
have
worked against me, which is fine. I can
play.

(12:17):
But I am a good sport, and I'll
sit through it, and I will give it
a fair shot because that's what this... That's
what this show is about
is,
taking movies that we otherwise wouldn't watch and
giving it a fair shot or maybe we
would. But it's the fair shot that's important
is is what I'm trying to say, my
my hope, John for you going into this

(12:38):
today. Is this
at speaking of giving a fair shot that
you give us fair shot,
as you did with the
Battlefield Earth? Yes.
Because over the years, you know, have having
multiple conversations about this movie in your absolute
stain of the idea of this film. Oh,

(13:00):
100 percent. IIIII
will be the first person who will openly
admit that I am being... I am 100
percent unreasonable when it comes to this movie.
Right. So I'm hoping that... That the idea
of it doesn't
override the experience of watching it for you.
You know me, dude. I'll, III can turn
off... I can turn off my biases to

(13:21):
watch a movie. That's how I ended up
enjoying...
Battlefield Earth,
and some other movies that everybody wondered what
movie I was watching.
But you know, I can only speak from
where I'm at with it. So...
Yep.
Anybody else got anything else they wanna say
before you go into the movie theater? You
please.

(13:42):
Anybody?
I'm excited, and I need popcorn, and I
need taco.
And
taco machines. Okay. You guys saw that picture
I sent. Yeah? Yes.
Alright. Do you still have it? We should
probably post that to something years
We'll try to find it post up to
Instagram later.

(14:03):
The dream is reality everybody.
I don't suppose we got any community feedback
on this 1. Did we? Nope. Nope. We
did not get anything on back on this
1. Whoo
3 cheers for organization. Alright. Let's go ahead
and head into the
Theater. There we go.
Dear listeners.
This is your opportunity to escape. Our crew

(14:25):
has just entered into the media projection chamber.
What horrors and matters that their consume unknown?
Their mental state upon their attorneys is,
unknown. You have been warned.
I'm confused.
I thought we were supposed to be watching
the batman. This movie called Vengeance.

(14:48):
Oh, Branson.
Branson, you're the Branson.
Hey, somebody's gotta be. Might as well be
me. True story.
Alright. Gentlemen. Well, we just came out of
the theater. We watched
a film
together. Yes I I feel like we just
watched 17 films together.

(15:11):
Well, let's both.
Both in length and number of different movies
I could pop off that I literally feel
like I just watched.
It's fair. What, was let's talk about. Was
was going into our spoiler free
thoughts first.
I'm gonna kick it off by saying the

(15:31):
talk for you this was freaking beautiful.
There was a lot of really good shots
in this movie.
They...
They're go? I'm not I'm not I'm not
gonna state
when this was in the movie because this
is not the spoiler part. Mh.
And this isn't a spoiler for me to
describe this 1 camera shot. Mh. But there
is at 1 point in this movie,

(15:53):
where it's an overhead shot in a completely
dark and flooded arena. Mh.
Where we see batman
holding up a flare, leading a bunch of
people to safety.
I love that shot. So That shot
for real dude, like, for real real. Mh.
Like, when I saw that shot, I I

(16:15):
said to myself, that is a modern version
That is... Like, if you were to paint
that, that could be a modern... Oh take
on the extras, on on the exodus. Oh,
yeah.
Like, literally bat batman
plays such is such a mosaic character
in that shot. Mh. I'm just like, oh,

(16:35):
0, man. I love it shut so much.
I I'd like at Less
when we saw that originally I said, I
need this picture as a background somewhere because
it's such a beautiful
100 percent. Like, that would that would make,
like, the best
computer wallpaper. Oh my gosh. It's it's it's...
And part of it is because the whole
film has us noir fill to it, and

(16:56):
and they... I really really want
a black and white version of this just
to see how it play out.
Because I think it'll work.
Yeah. They do such a great job of
playing with lights and shadows.
Throughout the entirety of the film.
And and
they play well with, like, the kind of
lighting they do. That, yes It's a dark

(17:17):
film
but it it doesn't fill doctor. Does that
make sense? It's like... Mh. What was that
film we watched
last couple years ago that was... We were
all like, gosh. It was so dark. We
couldn't see a tag on things about the
entirety of the thing. I think it was
a, a Cooper film or something like that.
It was a space filled that we watched.
With with Frank's tomato. Oh, that was Dark

(17:38):
star. Dark dark dark dark stars is not
a dark movie. That wasn't but that wasn't
the 1. But visually, it was dark. Like,
I've had a hard time seeing it. Yeah.
Terms. But what Saying... What I'm saying visually
at what the dark stars is not a
dim movie visually.
I think I remember what you
I can't remember what movie it was. Right.
There were there's there were been a few
movies. There was...

(17:58):
I wanna say the first Le had a
couple moments where it was, like, that.
There were a few scenes in Gui.
Guy.
Guy was 1 that kept coming out. That's
that's the 1. Yeah. Yeah. The first guy.
The second 1 we're called during the daytime,
and you could see the... You could see
the
Zipper.
Yeah. Yeah.
We talked about that because that's that's 1
of the reasons the monsters actually looked decent

(18:20):
in the first movie because it was too
dark for you to see how bad the
costumes were, but it actually helped.
Right. Mh. But, yeah, with with this movie,
the focus is more on the lighting.
And it really doesn't matter what the color...
I mean, the color...
Makes... Color 100 percent. Mh. Yeah. But even
if you but even if you remove the
color, I think still just pure as a

(18:42):
pure value,
thing. It would be it would be enjoyable.
Oh, you talking about giving it the the
Zack snyder treatment and putting it in black
and white? Yeah. Going. This this movie does
play a lot like a film Noir movie.
Mh.
1 of my biggest grip having seen it
now. Is that this movie didn't need to
be a batman move to work. Oh, my

(19:03):
gosh. Yes. Yes. Yes. I wrote that down.
I wrote that down. There was... The entire
time I was watching this movie,
I did not feel like I was... It
needed to be a batman movie. In fact,
I felt like I would have enjoyed it
more
up until a certain point, I I need
to... Caveat this. I can't talk I can't
finish this thought in this section. But up

(19:27):
until a certain point, I feel like I
would have liked this movie more if it
wasn't a bat. Movie. Like, if they would
have made this purely a
Jim Gordon movie,
and I would have been 100 percent on
board with us. I don't I don't think
batman was necessary for this movie. Right. Or
take Batman's... Character and instead of making him

(19:47):
a vast vigilant, just make him a guy
who wants to drive around and beat up
criminals like leave Bruce Wayne
in his
motorcycle outfit that he was in least the
time. Just leave him in that, take away
the need to dress up like a bat.
And let him do the exact same thing.
Let him go and beat up criminals, let
him, you know, make him a private eye.

(20:09):
Right. That
Jim Gordon works with, and I think you
would have an excellent film door movie.
It there were elements in that that it
almost felt like they had to remind us
from time to time. By the way, this
is a batman movie.
You know what movie? You know you know
what what superhero
movie this felt like, And I'm gonna say
this, and I'm gonna watch both of you

(20:29):
go. Yes.
This felt like the movie version of the
Netflix version of Dared devil.
Yes. I can see that definitely. Yes.
Absolutely. Yeah. I I could I you could
remove Batman and insert Dared neville, and this
would work just... As well. Remove remove the
villain and re remove a Falcon and put
in king pin. U. Mh. Yeah. This But

(20:52):
because it's a very street level Yeah. Type
story. I think it's 1 the reasons why
I love this. And and, again, we're not
getting the spores with this, but
this
movie
encapsulated a lot of what I've been looking
for in a Batman story.
Mh. We... You go back and you look
at all the Batman movies we've hat from
Adam West to

(21:14):
to all the ones from the nineties of
2 thousands. Seems like 2 thousands. There was
a You know, they're that they they marketed
as this, like, gritty realism,
but even still there was a level that
wasn't there. This right here grounded things, but
it it focused just more on the detective
side of who Batman is. Yeah. And

(21:34):
again, why... The reason I love comics is
you have story... Different forms of storytelling,
and the
the characters are just the the vehicle for
those storytelling types.
And so the fact that this could be
a a movie without Batman
is awesome to me, But although love the
fact that Batman is the the...

(21:55):
The vehicle for this story itself. And I
have a couple of things
to speak to directly about that about why?
Things I think they could have done differently
to make Batman more of a necessary character.
Mh. To where it wouldn't work just as
a generic P, Film Noir movie.
I gotta get the spoilers to talk about
that. I. I get that. So

(22:17):
I'll say... I wanna say speaks to the
cost also. This. The cost of this film
was
in my opinion fantastic. You know, we we
talked about how
I mentioned interested ago. This, like, this feels
very grounded, far more grounded and than I
think than the the Nolan movies were. But
then they were also just... It was amazing
what they did. We talked earlier in the
in the pre in the opening to show
about Colin.

(22:37):
And how he was completely different.
Like, that it didn't make sense for him
to look
so not like him and it worked well.
Like, it didn't look like it was a
a prospect it was wearing. It was just
a different person together. And cat Woman
seemed the least cat woman. Of all the
capital. No.

(22:57):
Speaking of Ke one's costume. I was telling
Celeste. Like, I appreciate the fact that her
costume is,
She's is obviously very attractive, very sexy looking,
but she's not s looking. She's just very
su. And Right right. I appreciate that. They
they kept... It's a Pg 13 film. Again,
some people have issues with the fact that,
you know, why did they go for r?
They didn't have to? They didn't to. You

(23:19):
know,
Batman is a is kind of a youth
based property. You know, it's dark, but, I
mean, it's just like, you're gonna cut out
the majority of your audience if you go
for a hard are Right. Yeah.
Exactly. And so they they kinda kept that
bounce throughout the entire film. I mean, it's
a it's a dark. It's a violent film,
but never crossed the the the Pg 13

(23:41):
rating. No. And that included the characters that
they had.
It's
Cat Woman has always been the the sale
always been has has been portrayed for decades
as the eleventh interest for batman.
And but the way they did it, they
didn't do it in a way that I'm
just like, oh, you know? They weren't trying
to be tit. Yeah. Exactly.

(24:02):
And so I appreciate that they kept that
balance there.
The cost though. Sorry. What person? I was
actually gonna talk about the cost. Oh.
For.
Oh, I was just gonna say the
the her her outfit is 1 of the
things that I felt like was a... Oh,
yeah. By the way, this is a batman.
Because she spends most of her time with

(24:24):
her mask off. It's just her and her
cat suit. Yeah. And then every once in
a while, she puts on the mask, and
it's just this ski ask, but with the
little...
Sieve that stick out to make look like
cat. Mh. And it it almost felt like
a it almost felt like a nod or
so than it cost you.

(24:45):
Like
like, you know, when you watch a movie,
you have a special cameo by somebody that's
a nod to something else. Mh.
It felt like that. It felt like
Like, the movie trivia was, oh, yeah. This
character was in spot, you know, if the
the writer of the movie said well, I
was inspired by this character by all the
batman comics are red where Cat woman would
show up. And so as a nod to

(25:05):
cat woman, she'd put on a ski mask
and that had little cat ears on it.
That more like a an homage than it
did. No. This is...
Cat woman. This is supposed to be Cat
woman. Yeah. I I definitely have some thoughts
on the on that cost,
that might kind of speak to that a
little bit, because I was looking at Batman's

(25:27):
cost specifically. Mh.
I'm a batman fan, but I'm a... I'm
more a fan of batman for his villains
than Batman himself. Mh.
But anyway, I... And I I have all
the Batman movies with the exception of Ben
A like in this 1. And I've taken
a really hard look at...
Batman

(25:48):
outfit.
And a lot of it was cut and
stitch with leather, but with love leather, I
can't talk tonight.
And
I think what the
direction was that they were trying to go
with cost in this 1, was they were
trying to make it look like... Costumes that
legitimate real people would have the capacity to

(26:08):
make. Mh. Yeah. You know what I'm saying?
Like, in the in the Nolan moved in
the nolan verse, you know, batman was ordering
parts for his stuff from China,
and stuff like that. And they don't even
talk about how Batman made his suits and
all the previous movies.
But, I mean, they were all
latex and Yeah. Nipples and

(26:31):
that was only Val forward. No it wasn't
didn't have bad nipples.
Fell K did either. It was 100 percent,
doctor Ross.
But anyway,
No, you're right. You're right.
With the bat Visa card. Belt Val K
was the 1 that introduced the bat butt.
Oh, was was there a bat butt on

(26:52):
his suit with when he puts on the
the prototype suit or whatever,
He... They they they do a shot of
his butt,
in the suit up sequence.
Gotcha.
At any rate. It's been a hot minute
since I've watched batman forever. But at a
at any rate. I think I think they
were just trying to go with the whole
Diy
outfit

(27:12):
aesthetic a little bit.
Obviously, Batman suits gonna be a little bit
better because he has access to better material
and better Yeah. You know, stuff. But
so I think they were trying to make
it feel a little bit more gritty
underground Diy.
Sure. Because even even even Batman's
Bat
wasn't as
Uber as all the the Nolan verse or

(27:35):
even or even the
I don't even I don't know what we
call the series with the 3 different Batman.
The nineties is Batman. Yeah. Sure. We'll go
through. Yeah. So reverse. I think they call
it the burton verse. Right. Except except Jerry
B did the last 2, but, you know,
Yeah whatever. You know, I'll I'll say this

(27:56):
to the cons with in that that world.
1 of the influences and it's undeniable, And
I I think there was an area interview
where we actually mentioned that is that he
heavily pulled from Batman Year 1 in Batman
year 2. And in Batman year 1, it's
it's the first year of batman. And they
said he's only been around for 2 years.
And
the great thing about Batman year 1 specifically

(28:17):
was the fact that it was super ground
level. Like, his cost wasn't perfect yet. And
Cat woman also was that way. She was
a ground level person. There's a lot of
things that they... And Won't get to spoiler
a little bit, but it's a lot of
aspects about the cat 1 character in this
film that comes directly from your 1. And
it's it's just like what you're saying. It's
this like, they're figuring it out. They're putting

(28:38):
stuff together and and try to figure out
what works and what doesn't work
as
vigilant and Villa.
Yes. So... And I think that's what makes
this movie great for me and fitting in
with that Noir field is that there's texture
to it. It's not the... The the slick
latex that Val has. It's, you know, there's

(29:00):
a there's a greatness. There's there's knicks and
and cuts and stitches in
his helmet the entire time. And maybe maybe
that's what's contributing to this whole idea of
me saying,
you could just as easily make this a...
A regular film Nor Pi movie as you
could a batman movie. Maybe part of it
is because the aesthetic is not overly comic

(29:20):
book, Mh. It's very, very grounded in realism.
Mh. You know, batman's mask. You you see
the stitches where he put it together. It's
not this hard carbon fiber.
Bat colored, you know, that thing. Of like
you said, Cat Woman's outfit is is it's
not designed to make her look like a
cat. It makes you look like a a
cat burglar, Mh. She just happened to have

(29:41):
cats around. His his bat
is just a soup up car. It's not
a... A boy howdy with a car. Yeah.
Oh, yeah. It was a great car. Don't
get me old.
But, like, if I saw that driving down
the road. I wouldn't think, Oh, there goes
the Bat like you would with, like Tim
Burton met
not same or just the effect. It's it
would just be something. Yeah. You and me

(30:03):
are riding the same wavelengths to me.
It I was just gonna say, it would
be some more closer to the effect of,
like, oh, man. That's a dope vehicle. Yeah.
Exactly. You think it would it would be
going to a car show or something. Right.
Yeah.
So... Can we get the spoilers?
At least.
I've got so much more I wanna say,

(30:23):
but I can't give it away. I'm sure
you do. I got spoiler free stuff yet.
Free.
Actually, this is my this is my final
spoiler free the thing. Is that this movie
was over long, But 100 percent. There was
a lot... There were there was plenty. They
could've have cut out of this movie, and
it would have made it a better movie.

(30:43):
There was a lot of long drawn out
shots that could have been reduced that didn't
need to be as long. For instance,
can't talk about that.
You see. But thriller,
but there were they're, like, literally,
When I was when when we were... When
I watched this movie, it was literally... I
was like, okay. So it's about to end

(31:04):
now, and then I looked at the status
of it, and it was only at an
hour and 40. Minutes in. I'm like, oh,
no. I've got an entire half of a
movie left.
And then I watched some. I'm like, okay.
It seems like it's it's wrapping up now.
Nope. Still had another hour left.
Okay. It's wrapping up now. Nope. Still got
another 30 minutes left. It I'm like, this

(31:26):
movie literally felt like it ended 5 times.
It's like they were trying to end this
movie in every movie that it was...
Don't know if I wanna say inspired by
or ripping off, but
III will say this to give a little
peek behind the curtain as as... As John
says sometimes,
when I watch this movie for the show.

(31:47):
This is the first movie in my entire
time on the bottom shelf. Where I actually
had to pause it and pick it up
the next day.
Like...
Because because I wanted to watch it enough
to where I could pay attention to it.
But it was getting late, and I was
falling asleep. It's a 3 hour movie. Yeah.

(32:07):
Yeah. It's it's a long movie. I'm not
gonna debate that. This movie is not lord
of the rings. It it I it can't
justify a lot or time that long. I
don't know about that. I think a, for
the difference that it is as a No
movie. And also I didn't find problem with
the pacing. Like, like,
like, yes. There are moments where the Story
arc was coming to a low. Like, it

(32:28):
was like, okay. We're wrap it up, but
then it rent back up, but to me
that went rent back up. It re engaged
me really well. I didn't want it. Dude.
It it like, it felt like it was
wrapping up. It felt good and it's just
like, okay. We're gonna do it again. It
sort of, like, it's sort like, when you're
running a fun run, you, like, A5K or
something thing and then then they're just like,
nope. You guys gotta go a little bit
longer and

(32:49):
I did. I was... I did think the
Well, that's spoilers. Right. There there was 1
point. I'll I'll say, oh, there was 1
point in the movie where I did feel
like, okay. You've major point. Come on. But
let's wrap this up, Let Batman do his
thing and let's just keep going.
This is honestly over with now. When it
when it gets like this...
More often than not. It's just whoever was

(33:11):
writing the movie
couldn't edit themselves. They had a lot of
ideas they wanted to cram in, and that's
not to say that any of these ideas
were bad ideas, but they had so many
ideas that they wanted to cram in,
that it caused the movie to blow out
a little bit. And honestly, I think if
they could've have they could have taken half
the ideas they crammed into this movie

(33:33):
and fleshed out the remaining ideas, and it
would have been great. And they would have
had enough ideas to make a second movie
that would have been great. If they would've
have flushed out the ideas they take... They
took they would have taken out of it.
So... Do you think if they made this
a 3 part
mini series?
Like, 3 hour long parts,
it would feel better. That could be digestible?

(33:55):
Maybe. I mean... See that. It's because there
is a lot of story in it. And
usually, if there's a lot of story in
1 movie, it would do better to stretch
it out, so you could spend more time
with... Each story.
Instead of trying to jam it all in
1 movie. Yeah. I mean, but but by
the time they were starting to resolve
narrative threads.

(34:16):
If...
To to be honest, because there was so
much going on in this movie that by
the time they started resolving narrative threads, it
literally felt like, they were checking off a
checklist. It's like, okay. We resolved this problem.
We resolved this 1.
Okay.
Now we gotta... But
they were intentional about. It it... But it

(34:37):
it felt intentional. Like, they did it in
such a way that it didn't kill the
pacing.
But, like, literally, it it... There was there
was too much going on. So here here's
my pushback. I don't think they could have...
I agree it's long. And there are certain
portions I'm like, okay. You could cut here
and you could picked up with a sequel
movie, make it 2 hour and a half

(34:57):
minute films. The problem is this,
when this movie came out.
We are on the back end, of, the
debacle of the Justice League movies.
We are on the back end of the
the death of the Dc
as a whole.
People are are screaming and cram and claiming,
like, we want the snyder cut. Right? That's

(35:17):
what's happening in the world. They had
1 shot to make a movie
that goes, this is what this world is.
And people like it. I don't think you
could cut this movie at a halfway marker
and gotten a sequel. I don't think that
there would have been a... It would have...
Satisfied. They would have to do a a
plethora
of of things to make that happen Don't

(35:40):
think it would it worked out. I think
this was, like, we got 1 shot
Here it is. Do you like it. And
clearly, people did. I mean, it it made
book boo of monies.
All the monies.
I mean,
I can only...
Maybe...
Look, her. Hold on. Let me let let
me back up because and I'll start talking
before I finished what I wanted just... Thinking

(36:01):
about what I wanted to say.
I don't...
That's fine to say that, but in the
same sense, I can only judge the movie
based off the movie, that's being presented to
me. I can take into the account of
the time period that it was made in
in in certain instances for instance, Like, if
we're... Well, like, when we talk about the
first Le recon movie, and I and I

(36:22):
have my rant in it that it's a
product of its time. You couldn't, you know,
but as as far as what's going on
with the production company during that time period,
I don't think that's a fair thing to
really bring in when you're... When your... Cri
a movie,
because,
yeah, that may be the reason why they
made certain
decisions why they did, Mh. But in the

(36:44):
same sense, I can only judge the movie
that's being put in front of me.
And so... Yeah.
That may be may have been their reasoning,
but it's gonna have an effect on the
viewer watching the movie. Mh.
Regardless. And for my perspective,
I was ready for this movie to be
done a couple times. Like... By the time,
I was done with the movie. I just

(37:05):
felt tired. Like, a emotion... Like, emotionally and
physically. I was just tired. You know, I'm
sydney here thinking about because John, you mentioned
to earlier Lord of the rings.
Mh. And I've got I've got the extended
additions of both.
Guide you too. I I thoroughly enjoy sitting
down and watching but, I will, I will
sit down start fellowship with the ring and

(37:26):
go all the way to Mori. I'll I'll
alberta a day watching all 3 back to
back. Then But I'm trying to think of
why I'm willing to do that. And I
think at least in part,
it is because I saw the theatrical.
Release. Mh. And knew there was more
and wanted
to
see what was missing behind it.

(37:48):
Sugar? If if if I'm if I'm understanding
you right, then, Bam, what you're suggesting is
that that maybe they should have done the
cut and then had a
extended cut. Yeah. I think that might have
that might have done it.
So that you have a version for casual
movie hours,
who, you know, are just... They're just going

(38:09):
to see the next Batman film.
But then you've got the director's cut that
for the real fans of the field that
1 us kinda sink their teeth into it
because I'm I'm I'm reflecting back and thinking
back on the movie and knowing that it
is a long movie.
Now when I watched it for the for
the show, I started too late at night.
That was my own decision. But knowing it's

(38:30):
a long movie if I wanna watch it.
I sit down prepared to see it in
its entirety. But I do that with Lord
of the rings too. I sit down knowing
this is gonna be an investment time. Right.
You know, if I want to enjoy this
for... It's the full experience and need to
plan to not have interruptions and things. So
Baby... Yeah, maybe this would benefit from having

(38:51):
a theatrical cut just to say here's the
movie and then have a director's cut and
the director's cut b,
what we watched.
I think I can speak... I think I
can... This that, you know, this this episode
is gonna go down in history. We're at
46 minutes and we haven't even gotten past
non spoilers.

(39:11):
But I think I think that... It's
I I think that I can answer your
question as far as what... What... What's the
difference between sitting down to watch the extended
cuts of Lord of the rings in this?
And ultimately is that
Lord of the rings isn't
nonstop,
dark or
nonstop gritty or whatever. Yeah. There there are

(39:32):
moments of bright and lever Levi, and you
go to R, and you go to... You
do you see what I'm saying? Like, yeah.
We're normally normally you get moments like that
in the Bruce Wayne scenes because he has
to pretend to be a playboy, but the
no Bruce Wayne scenes in this movie.
Yeah. That's what I was gonna say because
it's early in his career, he hasn't adopted

(39:53):
a persona for Bruce Wayne. So even when
he's Bruce Wayne, he's batman.
All the time. So there isn't a a
break. I'll tell you what... As I... Being
as I broke Taboo, let me do this
and we can continue this conversation.
Ladies gentlemen,
the sw section.

(40:16):
I just felt the tension and my shoulders
relax.
Alright. Let's get into this. I'm ready.
No Bruce Wayne scenes in this movie. And
well, let me rephrase that. There are a
couple,
when when it's just between him and Alfred,
which again, Andy Ce. Wow. Yes.

(40:37):
But
Even in those bruce Wayne scenes, he...
That's not my Bruce Wayne.
Yeah. Well, I I understand why they played
that the way they did though because this
is supposed to be Batman in his early
years.
This is Batman who...
Doesn't really care about the Wayne Fortune doesn't
really care about the Wayne name.

(40:58):
All he cares about is as it has
been... Said over and over and over and
over and over again, this movie. All he
cares about is vengeance.
Vengeance vengeance. To be fair. Couldn't you say
that that's how batman begins, started out too,
though? No. Because he still had his Bruce
Wayne persona because that got him into parties
where he could get information.

(41:19):
This batman isn't. Not Not. I'm I'm I'm
I'm talking about how Batman begins began,
because he was originally like, I'm gonna go
kill
it wasn't Falcon. It was the other Joe
chill. No. No the no. The other batman,
Mafia a guy, he met him down in
Hell's kitchen in the restaurant. Oh 0,

(41:40):
Be.
Yeah. Bo.
Mar. Brody. That was it. Yeah.
Yeah. Because they got... There's 2 different Mafia
guys, And I always get them mixed up.
There's Falcon
and Mar.
Phone, and
Yeah. And macaroni.
At jeez.
But I... Like I said, IIII could see

(42:01):
that though, because he he's still focused on
his
his ambition. And he hasn't quite figured out
how to use Bruce Wade as a tool
for that mission, even the scene John that
you're referencing, he he hasn't the Batman,
He's Bruce wayne with a with a pistol.
That's all he is. He goes off the
comes back man. It comes back. And and

(42:22):
and in that movie, in that movie verse,
He comes back
with focus and intention, and he knows how
he can use the Bruce Wayne persona Mh
to achieve his mission. In this version of
Batman,
He's not focused. He's brand new. It, you
know, the way Robert Patton played and he
looks like he could potentially be, like fresh
out of college age. Right. Like, this is
a mid twenties bruce swing. He hasn't developed

(42:44):
the Bruce wayne persona hasn't learned how to
use it to his advantage. All he cares
about is mission. That's why,
Alfred talks about there's a board meeting that
you weren't present for.
You know, you need to start showing up
to these things.
I get it. I get it. Oh, I
don't know. I'd... It's just...
I have so many mixed thoughts about this

(43:04):
movie.
Like the reason... Go ahead. There's like, there's
things that I liked about this movie and
there's things no 1 back. I guess, you
could say that about any. There's things I
liked there's things I didn't like.
But this...
And I I kind of alluded to this
in the spoiler free section, but this is
not my bat. This is not the batman
movie I I come to.

(43:25):
This didn't feel like it needed to be
a batman movie for the most part until
they... Until they blew out the flood walls
around the city. Once they did that, then
I was like, okay. Now this feels like
a batman movie because you got your flooding
in an entire city, which is
Okay. That needs a superhero.
Everybody's trapped inside

(43:47):
stadium,
which is which is going to be just...
Destroyed by the minions of the riddle.
Okay. I understand why that needs a superhero.
You know, it was at that point where
I was like, okay. This is why Batman...
This this
feels like Batman's necessary. But, I mean, you
could have really
prior...
I actually think I have a solution for

(44:08):
that, though. I think I know... What they
could have done that would have made this
cemented as a batman movie and not just
a film nor movie with the guy that
dresses up for the costume you. 1 of
the things that
1 of the premises that they kind of
hinted at promised at the beginning of the
movie, but never actually delivered all in. Do
you remember the seed where he's he's giving

(44:29):
his opening monologue,
and there's AAA
thug who
rob a convenience store.
And he runs out and he looks into
the the shadow of the tunnel. Mh. And
he's a and and and and bat it's
talking about how they don't know if I'm
there or not. Because I could be everywhere.
Right. And there's this

(44:50):
attitude of Batman could literally be behind every
quarter
I think if they dropped the
on yoga fresh. I don't know what I'm
doing yet. It just went into... No. This
is a batman who has established.
Himself and played that more. Like, take out
the... Don't take out the seed, but rework
the seed where he goes to visit the

(45:10):
penguin
by knocking on the front door of a
night nightclub in his bats suit. Have him
sneak in, it just appear in Pig woods
office.
When
when
he shows up to fight those
skull painted guys at the very beginning of
the movie. Instead of him just slowly walking
in
like, have him baked the lights go out

(45:30):
and do the the monster thing where guys
just vanish into the shadows. Like, play up
the
Batman is an urban legend thing. I
I am, I I gotta finish my thought.
Alright. Because because then,
He's this urban legend he's this myth, and
his intention is to strike fear.
But he doesn't care about

(45:51):
inspiring. Hope, all he cares about is striking
fear. He has his entire
interaction with Sully kyle. He has his whole
thing, you know, his his history ripped apart
by the Rid.
You have the moment
where
the the flood waters came in, and batman
stops worrying about stealth and being a monster
the night. Then he becomes a symbol of

(46:13):
hope. He cracks that flare out that that
very senior talking about where he cracks the
flare, holds it open. It leads people into
safety. And then he's standing in daylight, putting
people into stretchers,
and then at the end of the movie.
Instead of having him just riding off on
a motorcycle,
half him in his back cave working on

(46:33):
a new suit. In all the new suit,
you have the bat symbol with the yellow
oval behind.
Can I
throw out as even simpler suggestion on how
to fix this movie? It might be simpler,
but III love the idea of Hipaa.
It'll it'll be simpler.
Okay. And you'll like it better.

(46:56):
Okay. Take out batman,
put in the shadow.
That would work, but then it wouldn't be
a batman movie. I'm trying to make it
a batman movie.
I'm trying to make it a better movie.
No no. But see, have y'all read
what's it called? Justice Lee new here? Nope.
Yes. Have you seen those the animated movie?

(47:16):
Nope. Okay. In that movie,
there's a...
Seed where Superman is visiting batman of the
bat cave, and Robin is there. And Robin
like, oh, wow. You really know him. And
Batman is like, don't you have homework today
do It's a Robin one's runs off. And
Batman's costume is noticeably different.
And Superman makes the point says, what's with

(47:36):
you? You've got a kid side kick? You've
got a do look, What what's the deal?
And he says, I just realized that I
want to scare criminals,
not children.
Because earlier in the story, there's a situation
where Batman's is trying to rescue a child
from a cult.
And the child is just a scared of
him.
As he is of the bad guys and
have kidnapped lap him, and it sits with,

(47:58):
and it bothers of that children are scared
him, so he changes his costume
to be less scary and more more of
the vein of superman, more of a symbol
of hope type thing. Takes on Robin as
a side kick, and I think that is
a theme
they could've have explored this film. I'm glad
I didn't. Oh, whatever.
But bro, consider your audience, my dude. That

(48:20):
is not a John movie and you know
it. I know, but I still like that
idea because I don't like a batman with
a Robin, dude. I do not like that
A Robin. Don't don't have Robin then, but
but have have a story that shows him
transitioning from
the dark night of avenger. Don't to the
symbol of hope for Got. You can even

(48:42):
work in, like, don't introduce the bat signal
until the very end,
because it becomes a symbol of hope. It
is a symbol now. That... That's an entire
theme they could have explored
How old damn when you realized that you
were addicted to hope.
3, maybe. Hello.
What was that first sith? There's the superman

(49:03):
spider man? Worse things of Too, man. I
I always just... You you literally had said
hope at least 5 times in your response.
The simple is for my planet beads hope.
I don't know. For me,
different audiences, I guess, I don't know. Like,
for for me, I prefer the dark and
gritty, I do. I just don't prefer my

(49:24):
dark and gritty for 3 hours straight without
any break out of levi or sense of
anything, but dark and grit. You know I
know? So... Yeah. I get that.
There it again. I think that that's 1
of those things where... Instead of sending Selena
Kyle into the club as a as a...
What's the for plate. It's not a play.

(49:46):
Here plant. It is a plant Okay. I
thought those was are work. Instead of city
Kyle there. The... That would have been a
useful place for Bruce Wade, playboy persona to
come in. And then you can have him
like laugh at a making jokes and getting
information as he talks. And that would... But
see even that, it's this... Underground club where
people are there that aren't supposed to be
there, and it...

(50:08):
You know... I don't know. I I like,
you could've been joe matches if you did
that, though. It's That's true. But see even
then, Joe Matches is
you could play it in a comic way.
He could've he could've have been like, Hey,
you know, Joe Ba he out. Anyone get
wanna do a game of dice. It it
could have had about an ability to bring
in that levi. But instead because it's Sal

(50:30):
Kyle and S Kyle has this whole issue
with her dad and her ball, it made
it it kept it of the dark. So
to speak. Even been kinda quiet, Dallas. Don't
you got anything? This was your movie. My
dude? I mean, you guys have been talking
about.
I've there was no place for me to
jump in. It's like Playing Hops with with
the the flash year.

(50:50):
I mean, Bam was too busy trying to
fix a movie that he liked, which was
just confusing me. I
Well, the hot take.
I fell asleep during the lord of the
rings. I don't like those movies. I think
they're boring. You heard feeling down. And I
can handle this being a longer movie than
I can the Lord of the rings.
The only time I'm I'm really up for

(51:11):
watching little rings is when my wife is
feel like, hey, We watch Little rings. Yeah.
Sure. I'll watch it with my wife,
because they're boring to me.
They're slow. And
to quote, quote, my friend Paul Jay Powers,
it's slow and boring.
This, though, the action keeps going, things keep
moving in again.
Let me ask... Alright. I know you've fred

(51:33):
no man's land. But how much batman have
you actually read john and Branson? I I
don't know you're talking about with no man's
land. So... You've you've mentioned... Oh, you've mentioned
not no amazon. You've you've read the... Or
you know about
the... You've the... Oh, gosh. What is it
god? Nightfall?
Nightfall. He knows what Nightfall. Not no. I

(51:53):
have... I have all 3 nightfall.
Right.
I've read the novel normalization of of a,
no man's land. I've not read the comics.
Right. So besides that, John, and, Brian, how
much Batman have you guys? How much of
red?
How much how many comics have I read
or how much of the narrative am I...
Do I know?

(52:13):
I feel like red would be a better
way of of consuming it, but narrative works
too. I know I know quite a bit
about the narrative. Mh.
As far as what I've actually read, it's
pretty much limited to
the nightfall series,
my cousin
has
a lot of golden age and silver age

(52:35):
stuff, and I've poked through that quite a
bit. Mh.
Have you read you
or long Halloween by intense?
I was just about to get there. As
far as specific series though. Like, if you're
if you're gonna talk about multi book arcs.
Mh.
Then you're looking pretty much at the at
nightfall because I... Don't like the majority of

(52:58):
the superheroes on Dc, so I stay away
from crossover stuff or justice league. Sure. I
I've read nightfall.
I've read
ear 1. I've read Long Halloween.
I've read...
Now when you say nightfall, are you talking
about all 3 arc, of nightfall fall or
just. Okay. Yes.
Batman breaking John Paul Valley is Batman and

(53:20):
then Bruce Wayne coming back. Because back. Mh.
I've read that whole thing. Oh, I've read
I've read second chances was is with it's
Jason Todd became Robin, a red, a lily
place dying, which is win tim Drake. Became
Robin.
Like I said a red, Long Halloween and
a red you're 1,
Red Robin year 1.

(53:42):
What was the 1 that happened
right before the long Halloween. Was that your
1?
No.
You're 1 separate. It's the...
Well, I mean, you could. I mean, it
is it is there, but you're thinking darker
victory probably.
I've read dark victory. Or, dark comes after,
long halloween. Okay. Then it comes after. I
I knew there was 1 besides long Halloween.

(54:04):
I've read dark victory.
When new 52 came out, I followed the
series there for a little bit. Mh.
I read the court of valves.
A beautiful series.
I I enjoyed that 1. That was 1
of the 2 things...
Well actually, there's was a lot about the
do 52.
So, yeah, I've I've I've read quite a

(54:26):
bit of that bad colleagues. Right. So here's
deal. The the long Halloween
dark victory.
Year 1. Those are
those are... How do I put those? How
do I put this?
I feel like you guys are viewing this
through the lens of the stereotype of superhero
movies

(54:46):
and what the Stereotype what Batman is.
Which is often
looked at the lens of A
and threes and all those type of things,
whereas
when I viewed this film,
I'm viewing it through the lens of the
long Halloween,
year 1, where it's it's not

(55:06):
that goes in and gets all bash and,
you know, beats up, you know, does the
superhero thing. He has been
a ground level hero
for decades.
But the ground hero story
Don't get us, don't make movies.
Whereas this was the ground hero

(55:28):
that batman has always been, but he's not
been put out. So I feel like that's
part of the the disconnect that maybe you're
having or like, oh. He here's kind with
superior until the very end. No. Because he's
not necessarily a superhero.
He's a vigilant... That that that was that
was the point I was trying to make
earlier was if you're gonna have him become
the superhero at the end. To do it

(55:48):
on purpose.
I think that you don't. The whole point
at the front end of it was Murray
opening words was I am the shadows. He
was a myth, the legend. People were scared
because in the first 2 years,
in the first couple years of the Batman
lore. He is the shadow. He is the
the thing in the dark, and people didn't
know where he would come out of, which

(56:09):
is why there was fear all the time.
But at the end, he goes published shadow,
he becomes the light leading people out of
darkness.
Okay. I I get that. And and that
was the purpose I thought they were going
with, and I was excited because I would
love to see that. Mh. But then he
casually waltz us into the middle of a
gang fight, and they're not scared of. They

(56:29):
think he's funny.
When he goes to confront Oswald cobb pot,
he knocks on the front door of the
club. Mh. He doesn't sneak in. He knocks
on the front door the club
when
he
tries to solve the riddle question before the
bulb,
they take him to a police station. And
and how he is laying unconscious in that

(56:50):
police station and a room pool of cops
that hate him and his mask is still
on, makes 0 sense to me. Mh. And
then,
see by the it... So by the end
of the movie,
like, for for a Batman who has built
this persona of but here you're so afraid
they'll see me in the shadows, there's spent
a lot of time not sneaking around. Right.
But he he does.

(57:11):
Again, this is still the new... He's still
becoming the batman. There's So if you go
back go back to year 1, he still
freaking the stuff out. And he still is
unsure of himself. He hasn't built everything. There's
only pockets that know.
There's rumors.
So that the the the the group of
thugs, they're young kids who are just, you
know, they're out kicks. And They see him,

(57:32):
And,
you know, the 1 kid though, he sees
the bat symbol, and there's fear. Like, he's
gripped by the fear of the symbol itself
in the sky. He goes, this isn't right.
And then
that might comes in kicks butt. So again,
we're still at the sc level with him
becoming who he's supposed to be. Jump forward
to the whole thing about,
you brought the whole thing with him punching
into the the

(57:54):
the the go after the penguin in the
lair. Again, that was that young batman, what
you said front end. Like, he doesn't know
who he is yet. He hasn't figured our
thing out, but he's learning about fear and
intimidation at the same time. So I guess
what I guess what I'm saying is if
if you're gonna play the young angle and
he's just starting out, then I don't think
that he...

(58:15):
Would have had enough time to make himself
enough of an urban legend that people would
be afraid of seeing him in the shadows.
Like I I guess that's what it is
is the 2 ideas are conflicting.
Either he's been around long enough that people
are afraid of him, or he's so brand
new that legend of the batman hasn't become
a thing yet. But it seems like they
tried to do both in the movie, and
it feels like the 2 ideas were fighting

(58:36):
each jesse see. I don't think so. Again,
he's been around for 2 years doing this.
I mean, in 2... 2 years span. There's
time for things to reach out and remember,
Got massive.
Got is not S, Louisiana. It's not spokane.
It it is
it is smoke.
Sp spokane. It is literally
New York City.

(58:58):
Brought into the space. And is so compact.
And, again, he's in the darkness. He's in
the... He's at at nighttime and he can't
be... And he says that I can't be
everywhere. And so he has to choose where
he does go. Yeah. And so the legends
be beginning to grow there, but he's not
there. Now. The the scene with the cops.
That scene is explained to me for me
because of the fact that half the cut

(59:19):
force
and you see this in the comics, they're
like, we're with Gordon. This is a good
guy. We're not gonna check with them. But
then there's the other half that's like, we're
on top Cohen payroll.
Right. And then you had those like, and
we don't see him minute it, but Bullock,
Mh who... He's just a good cop, but
he does... He's, like, he's like, visualize his
period. U. And so

(59:40):
And so III see that as working at
myself personally. Maybe it's just a maybe it's
just a difference in storytelling style. You but
like it to be black and white. You
want to be, like, bam. Here... He's a
he's a sludge. But now he is hope.
And and John's just like, he's
Gun Gritty superhero who's beating up everybody, and

(01:00:02):
I'm trying to go like, but he's a
ground level dude who's figuring life out still.
Yeah. I guess. I I guess
III guess that makes sense. I just... I
don't know. Like I said, I I thought
it was a missed opportunity to... Sure. To...
I like your idea. I like the idea
of him working those suit and becoming... It's
the 1 with the the yellow on it.

(01:00:23):
I I love that idea legitimately.
That would require the Robin though in my
opinion, the raw figure. I don't want or
robin.
That's okay. We do. Okay. So I...
I was so... I was so terrified that
they were gonna make the
mayor's
kid
become Robin. No I was that was actually
a bee. That was, like, so many he

(01:00:44):
beeps.
That way I wouldn't be and then injustice
as to the robin character as a whole.
There's no
there's no robin that that could fit in
at all.
Dick Grayson when it fit in, Drake when
it fit in,
Todd wouldn't work in. Carrie would not work
in. I mean, none of it works Yeah.
Certainly not Damien.
So,

(01:01:04):
that would be a uttered justice. So hot
take, and, and may get the steak for
Balance for this. I actually like Robin as
a character,
better than Batman.
I can see you that I at.
That checks for you.
I mean, Actually, I I have a collection
of...
All
of the issues, now when you say Robin

(01:01:27):
or do you mean night wing? He probably
Robin. Robin, like specifically Robin.
Because
each Robin
has his own
flare, his own story that I that I
found interesting. Yeah. I find it he's he's
a legacy character
without being a legacy character. Mh. Like, every

(01:01:47):
every character.
Becomes Robin, and that's their introduction into the
superhero world, and then they eventually grow out
of the role and become their own person,
but Robin is the way they step in.
And that it is an idea if I
find interesting. The only person that stopped being
Robin, that I hated that they stopped me
Robin because it never really became anything else
was Tim drake. Like, yeah. He became. Drake

(01:02:08):
became Red Robin, which is just... It's still
Robin. I think that that was a a
decision made because they realized we can't age
ages people too much. Yeah. I mean, Todd
is a,
I mean, a psycho path, but
You know he died. He came back. He's
got some Ptsd going on. Yeah. He doesn't

(01:02:28):
let clowns anymore. And so he's got very.
You know, he... He is the... And... But
that same time, like, what I love about
the different Robins though is that they all
are different... Aspects of who Batman is. Yes.
It Drake is the is the detective.
Todd is the

(01:02:48):
the... What do you call it? He is
the
the the the gruesome,
the hard edge,
the
I'm here to just hit everyone in the
face.
Whereas Dick is the, I care about people.
Aspect of Who bruce is, Damian, though,
he's the he's the the Wow card because

(01:03:09):
we're not really sure. He's still growing into
his personality. He's this heart ninja who was
raised by his his grandmother... Ours grandfather
to to hate the world, but now he's
learning to accept this new role as,
as a wan in trying to figure out
what that means for him. And III really
find his character be fascinating
altogether

(01:03:29):
Tim Drake is my a favorite Robin because
wood, he figures out who batman is. Hey,
guys. Yeah. Can we talk about the movie
we actually watched instead of just
Alright. Alright. We'll we'll we'll we'll save that
conversation for a comm talk. We'll have a
special Robin edition Comm talk.
I do wanna to say though,
go back to the idea of batman the

(01:03:51):
detective.
When
I realized that he was wearing,
recording lenses,
Mh. And him being at the crime scene
just looking around and taking everything in, and
then he find out after the fact, he's
doing that so he can go back and
review the footage.
And actually like investigate. Mh. I thought was
next level genius. Oh, yeah. Like, when I

(01:04:13):
when I first saw that theaters, I actually
did, like, Oh, no way.
Because I thought that was a bit... Because
he he looked at it him I and
he he's this stoic figure in the room
just kinda taken everything in. Mh. And then
you're like, you know, what's what's the deal
he's just staying there. And then you realize
that he's deliberately looking at everything.
So that he can't investigate in that he

(01:04:33):
can look into it. Mh. And I thought
that was a meat, modern take on the
detective batman. Yeah. That you've got a little
bit of that modern technology, but it's still
the old school detective work. Yeah. But at
the same time, he's still z, like, he's
the 1 that saw the the hatching of...
The tool and he's, like, he's picking out
small details as he goes.

(01:04:55):
I was gonna say something and I completely
lost my train I thought. It's calm. Okay.
Never mind then.
I have a thought. Oh, yeah. Certainly. It's
coli.
The this
1 thought that came to me when I
was watching this movie, after they laid everything
out, they whole they completely wholesale ripped off
the narrative from the telltale game. The first
telltale game. So Haven't finished that 1 yet.

(01:05:17):
I've haven't enjoyed it. I haven't finished it.
But It's same story. All they did was
add Riddle,
Yeah. Adding in the the Falcon
connection there. You're right. I forgot about that.
Exact... There's a lot it's the exact same
story. There's a lot of stuff that they're
pulling. I mean, the whole thing with selena
and
in
the girl, Annie, which was... Her name was

(01:05:38):
Angel in the comic. It's the same thing.
The connection was for this? Well, in year
1, it was...
Yeah, you meet Selena. And she has a
there's a young girl that she works with
name, named Angel. And there's a... This this
kind of, like, care,
in the comics that plays out more of
a of a big sister type situation caring

(01:06:00):
for, and she ends up getting hurt, in
that also. And then
there's also the connection with falcon ko, which
you see play out in year 1. At
you're 1. I'm sorry. And the long Halloween
where she actually goes off to to investigate
that in a separate book called
something Rome. I forgot what was called. Wait.

(01:06:20):
Now doesn't Falcon become the black mask though.
It's sun incident it? It was supposed to
be falcon. I thought. I'm gonna Google it
because I remember. The black we asked is
1 of the Italian families, but I thought
it was the son of 1 of the
monsters.
Me watching the 2 the 2
actual comic book nerds, just go to town
on their computers after I just dropped out

(01:06:42):
on. They're, like, It's a Roman Cia. Robert
Cia. So it's not any of that. Mh.
Famous chrome. At least tested to the new
52.
So Alt you go, yep, Row sail that's
how he across board. Mh. Ion was it...
That that was right now now I'm remembering.
Mh.
So I pulled that back.
I was like,
I mean, because again, the think about... What...

(01:07:04):
This is part of the reason why I
love this so much is this wasn't. He's
finding the penguin. It's not well, yes. He's
fighting the brother, but it's not it's not
the riddle yet. He's not fighting the joker.
He's fighting
Falcon. He's you know, on the back end
of dealing with Moron,
This is a street level detective he's dealing
with thugs and and the mob and stuff

(01:07:24):
like that. I like this version this version
of the penguin as the organized criminal who
runs the the night club. That's my favorite
version of the penguin. I'll tell you this
much. I enjoy this penguin so much more
than Danny Da penguin. Oh, sure. Yeah. Yeah.
Absolutely. That's not hard. That... And that's not
a dig against Danny Devi. He acted his
butt off. He he he took what he

(01:07:45):
was handed and he did with the best
with what he could. Yeah. That's speaking of
which did you know that he actually ate
that fish?
Raw. Like did That that that was wisely.
That was 100 percent. Really did. Wow.
Kudos to him for being so dedicated. I...
Yeah. It... For for the listeners at home,
the look on bam face right now. 100

(01:08:07):
percent priceless.
Yeah. The the whole thing with him being
so penguin like. That was purely
Burton design in that whole that whole movie.
And again, it's... The the early nineties
movies as much as I love them for
nostalgia reasons. They got away so much from
the source Material became 2

(01:08:27):
they became characters of themselves and... Became too
comic book. Yeah. But even not but even
not really like the comic books themselves.
You know, 1 of the reasons why I
love Jack Nicholson as the joker is not
just because he is
my first joker.
But because he was the last person to
play the joker that was

(01:08:47):
legitimately sadistic
and an actual mobs or crime boss. Yes.
Ledger was cute. Ledger was a cool character,
but with
flat the
I'm gonna get flat for this. The only
reason people think he was the greatest is
because he died. I.
I disagree. He was a good character.
He did a great job playing sadistic, but

(01:09:08):
he was not
a good... He was not the end all
of the joker.
What wasn't?
What is the Joker title? He is the
cloud prince of crime. The cloud prince of
crime.
Jack Nicholson joker was actually a criminal. Heath
fled joker was a psycho path. He was
an ana artist. Yeah. He was an ana.

(01:09:29):
So if we wanna hold to the joker
origins,
then you've got to have some kind of
a criminal element. He's gotta what like, the
the joker... The classic joker would torch mountain
in and full of bunny just for the
heck of it. Mh.
Hang on. Let let let let's let's let's
walk... Let's walk that back a little bit.

(01:09:51):
Me not being as versed in the older
comics
the comics I've read that have had the
joker in there. He has been a sadistic
psycho path. Mh.
So I'm not sure where the whole mafia
bit comes from as far as the joker
is concerned,
admit. Like I said,
well, not... I don't even need to feel
bad about this. There is so much batman

(01:10:12):
out there that I can't. Yeah. But but
the joker that I'm aware of from the
comics has always been the heath ledger joker.
I think that the heath blood joker was
a... Or rather or rather a form of
the heath leather. It was a form of
the heath fled joker. He was Heath heath
fled let basically took the joker that I'm

(01:10:32):
familiar with and took it out to the
nth degree, basically.
So here... Here's where I... Where... How I
will place everything out. The heath ledger joker
is a great character of the
the sadistic side of who he was.
There was always a level of him being
organized criminal
in,
before

(01:10:53):
things got weird in the mid nineties.
They
or say else.
The comma code did some interesting things. Branson
will
proudly show the comma code tattoo on his
left butt shake if you want. Ask him
to. Because he loves it. But I I
don't I don't love what it became. I
love the idea behind it. The but that's

(01:11:15):
the thing. What it became. What it became,
caused a the the stories to become...
Well, they, like, the Adam West of of
everything. Yeah. Adam West was.
Yeah.
Adam West is batman,
the... What the people realizing out the entire
undertone was,
look, This is the common code. This is

(01:11:36):
how things are.
Type of thing. They're pulling up the Hilarious
of it. And so
because Comp that was the the view that
the general audience had,
they introduced more of that silliness
into the comics
as time progressed. On the flip side of
that, Burton comes out with

(01:11:58):
the batman or with Batman, and we see
get a return
to
the the mobs criminal
joker that he was beforehand.
Okay. Alright. And I guess that I guess
I'm just not familiar with pre comic code
joker. Yeah. And so and that's fine. And
and so there was this back and forth
between the 2

(01:12:19):
throughout the nineties and 2 thousands
of the
the sadistic and the the criminal element. He
Ledger comes out
and with his batman.
And again, or here's a joker. Again, not
a bad joker. Hear me out. I'm not
saying that don't come at me, but he's
not the best joker because he's not as
well rounded as

(01:12:41):
as... I'm. Now. I want you I'm gonna
say... Senator to the moon. Who? The, what's...
Was the Walking Phoenix? No. What's his name.
Oh, the the lead singer of 30 seconds
to mars.
What was that man's name? I can't remember.
The guy that was walking joker in Joker.
Joaquin Phoenix was the Joker and Joker. He's

(01:13:02):
talking about guy that was in Jared Lit.
That's who it was suicide squad. Joaquin Phoenix
Joker was actually pretty interesting, especially the way
they played that with him being
where you... We weren't sure if he was
ever sane or not. Where that was all
dream. But Jared Joker was absolute just
dog water, and needs to be thrown away.
I never saw it.

(01:13:23):
The joker or or or Jared let. Yes.
Okay.
So
Yeah.
They're making a second joker, though. They are.
And it's gonna be in black and white.
And, apparently it's gonna be a musical. It
has my attention.
I... Here you here's the thing. I like
things. I like my villains to be un
unchanged. And and and that's that's what drew
me to batman to begin with. I like

(01:13:45):
my I like my villains
un unchanged. I like them being unpredictable. I
like them be. I like, I like my
evil to be evil.
Please, and thank you.
I don't... And this is something that me
and a lot of other Christian content creators
will will often come to logger heads over
It's just because I I believe if you're

(01:14:06):
if you're gonna write evil, you shouldn't candy
c evil. Evil should be rep
when it's when it's looked upon. So, like,
when when when... Like, there's a lot of
people who object to some of the stuff
that's like, in the movie, the ex assist.
And they're like, oh, they should've toned that
down. I'm like, why? If it's a demon,
they're not gonna wanna tear... They don't they're
not gonna wanna tone it down.

(01:14:26):
So, like, for me, when you got someone
like, the joker who's
from my perspective is a psycho path, yes,
I want them to be sinister and a
moral as possible.
And I think my issue with the villain
in this movie with
the Riddle is it just wasn't my riddle.
They shouldn't have called up the Riddle if

(01:14:47):
they wanted Batman versus the Zodiac killer, they
should have done that. And yeah. Yeah. And
I mean, don't get me wrong. I enjoyed
the character. It just wasn't the riddle.
I felt that too.
That was that kinda of played into
the whole idea of they had to remind
us every once in a while, this was
a batman. And 1 of them was the

(01:15:07):
regular, like the symbol of a question mark.
They kept throwing it in there just to
remind you, hey, This is the riddle by
the way that were not for the question
mark symbol, and the colleague of the Riddle.
I wouldn't have recognized him as the red.
I would have liked like you said I
would've have thought it would be like a
just a generic serial killer, which
the original batman,

(01:15:28):
especially Golden age batman,
pre Robin
would have fought a generic serial killer. That's
something that batman would have... That's a case
that batman would have taken on. Oh, so...
Yeah. Yeah, I thought it was cool.
But I mean, our our... We all know
about the the new Batman movie that's coming
soon. Right?

(01:15:49):
Batman, Noir. You Batman door. Yes.
You guys don't know about Batman Noir. This
is news to me. Bro. You're in front
of a computer type it in. I need
your reaction to this.
I'm not seeing it about Noir movie. I
see the comic?
Nope. There's a movie coming. I keep seeing
things about it. There's was Batman 2 coming
out. Was it Batman Noir Maybe it was

(01:16:12):
Spider Man Noir. Now that I'm thinking about
it. Spider spider Noir coming out. Spider a
bit horse coming out. Yeah. My bad with
them. God. State for industrial lakes reflects my
emotions.
John's over you're playing with Matt Moses. Oh
appreciate that.
So...
Yeah. Well, I think we've all landed in
different places here with this movie.

(01:16:33):
Actually, to be perfectly honest, I have been
going out of my way to hide my
actual opinion about this movie. III have stated
my thoughts, but I don't think any I
don't think either of you can really state
how I feel about this movie. I have
my suspicions, but now that you've said that
it's making be second guess every
That's what I do. I'm... I I am
a Dm.

(01:16:54):
I am a Dm, 100 percent of the
time.
Until I play my hand, you will never
know what game I'm playing. Indeed. So I'll
put this out there before we we go
until that aspect of what we actually think.
Just the influences of this film.
There were a lot of great
great noir styled,

(01:17:14):
cape styled movies at this movie call pulled
from. But for... Those of you who are
like, hey, what should I read?
You should read batman in your 1? You
should read the long halloween,
and you should read no man's land
to understand some of the the major things
are pulled for this movie.
I would say, also, if you wanted... The
costume influence, I think Crowley came from, Batman,

(01:17:37):
the white knight, which was a kind of
alternate future where the joker
heals himself, and he's no longer the joker,
and all of a sudden, he's... People like
him. He's a normal human being. He's running
for air. And he helps organize,
legit the vigilant entities and batman like, nope.
I don't trust you, and it all goes

(01:17:58):
to crap.
But that does have latitude.
I figured it would.
I figured it would. And then,
no man's land was a
huge story arc
that took place where,
Got, all the bridges to Got were
destroyed, and Got was literally...
Portions were flooded, but it was an island.
And the government... The the country had to

(01:18:21):
shut down the city, and it became a
no man's land and the gangs begin to
form factions which is really what basically was
happening at the end of this movie, and
I kind of hope. The second movie plays
more with that. Actually read the novel mobilization
and I didn't read the comics by I
an organization that was really interesting. I think
that would actually make a really neat video
game. Mh. I think played a little bit

(01:18:42):
with it with
Ark City. Yeah. Ark City. They played a
little bit with it. Not much, but they
they teased it. Well, go ahead and and
bake it a full fledged they
and or
do that, but then make it to where
you can influence
how things turn out based on which factions
you help and support? Okay. But my brain's

(01:19:05):
running off.
Your rocks steady instead of giving us this
crappy Vr game that you're putting out there
own quest, give us the game, Bright thick
enough.
You will make money.
Well, here's the thing. It's not Rock dead
call. It's it's W Montreal.
Everyday.
Isn't it w?
Mh. Rocks city dipped the

(01:19:26):
stuff, though.
Anymore? Rock their owned... Rock study is owned
by Warner brothers. Oh, I see what you're
saying now.
I see what you're saying now. So
that's the reason why they had to make,
justice league kills...
Not just league kills. Suicide squad kills the
justice league. Which bombed and is already shutting

(01:19:47):
down their servers.
Not even out a year and people were
like, yep. We're sitting down.
It was trash. It was trash. It was
a money grab. They it paid 0 respect
to the source material. Yeah. It they made
people mad and Warner brothers was, like, what
happened.
But this isn't a video game podcast. It's
a movie podcast. So let's get to our
final... Let's get to our final ratings because

(01:20:08):
we're
flounder.
We here at the bottom shelf review
movies on a 4 tier rating system.
Starting with top shelf, this movie is fantastic,
I must own it and everybody should watch
it.
Then we have the middle shelf, which is...

(01:20:29):
It's okay. If it's on Tv, I might
watch it or maybe I might buy a
copy and watch it every couple years or
so.
Bottom shelf is, I didn't enjoy this movie.
It might be okay for you, but I
don't wanna watch it again. And then there's
the dumpster fire, which is where we are
going to go out of our way to
keep people from watching it. And as far
as we are concerned, the movie has been

(01:20:51):
erased from existence.
So with that being said, I'm gonna go
last because I'm the big question mark on
this 1.
But what's that a red alert pod?
It wasn't, but I will pretend like it
was.
But Dallas.
Yeah. So
for me,
I'm putting this on the top shelf. It

(01:21:13):
is 1 of my favorite batman films of
all time,
partially because it's so different from
any other superhero movie that's coming out at
the time and is coming out currently,
and
I love the Know fill things.
And I love the text side of things.
There is a
personal project I've had in my head for

(01:21:35):
years I've wanted to do and this kinda
tapped into a little bit. So I'm digging
it. Cool.
Well, bam,
I will say that listening to you on
this episode has been interesting to me because
you came in hot and head before it,
and then you began to argue with Dallas
about this movie. In the meantime, I just
sat back and watched.
Well, part of that is because

(01:21:55):
I wouldn't saw this in the theaters. And
when I saw it in the theaters, I
loved it.
Watching it a second time with a more
critical eye, there were some things that stood
out that kinda of maybe scratch my head
a little bit.
I think the movie is a net positive
I think it has more going forward than
has against it.

(01:22:16):
I think that the issues I have with
the movie I have because I was watching
it with critical eye I was actually watching
it too critique it. If I were to
watch it again, and just watch it just
for the fun of it. I think I
would enjoy it. Oh,
I can't
give it a top shelf rating
because
I don't have a desire to go buy

(01:22:37):
it.
But I did enjoy the movie. I had
a good time watching it.
I had a good... I had a good
time thinking about ways I would have written
the story slightly different.
And I think that's that's that's neat that
a that a movie could make you think
about well, how how would I tell that
story.
So I'm gonna put this on a

(01:22:59):
very
high middle shelf. Not quite top shelf, but
High enough that I would be a embarrassed
to recommend to other people. No. There. Alright.
Now I... Before I go into my review,
I am super curious. I wanna know what
you guys think where you where you think
I'm in a land? I'm I'm taking bets
now.
I'm gonna say you're on the top shelf.
Got a middle shelf. Alright? He plot twist.

(01:23:21):
He goes
dumpster fire. While I'm I doing this. I
hate you Dallas. I'll give you off the
show. No. IIII can promise you, Dallas. I'm
not gonna dumpster fire this movie.
I came in this movie, and III did.
I pushed my biases aside, and I watched
it with an open mind because
know, if I'm gonna put 1 of my
favorite movies

(01:23:42):
forward, I would hope that somebody would do
the same... Give me the same
respect.
Because I'm legitimately
sharing
something that's important to me. Sure. So I
wanna do that too. So I went into
it. And
for me, it wasn't a batman movie. I
think I've I I think I've stated that.
Mh.
It didn't bring anything that I like about

(01:24:05):
batman movies until the final act of the
movie,
but it brought other things that I enjoy
about other movies.
I saw a lot of other movies in
this at at certain points. I felt like
I was watching the movie 7.
Yeah. At other points, I felt like I
was watching the movie Zodiac. And if you

(01:24:25):
haven't seen that movie I highly recommend it,
everybody.
Especially if you like this movie, Go see
Zodiac.
Oh, and if you're over
18, that movie rated our. So... Yes. It
is.
Let's see here. What else was there. I
mean, there there there was a lot in
here. It was over long

(01:24:46):
but there was a cast of characters, and
everybody who is in this movie acted their
butt off.
I honestly think I would have enjoyed this
a lot more if this was a shadow
movie over it being a batman movie. I
think I think the setting would have made
more sense.
As well as
the the whole detective work,

(01:25:08):
it would have made more sense to me,
but I didn't hate this movie.
There were times. I I legitimately found myself
in enjoying what was going on on the
on the screens.
I feel like the car chase between the
penguin and batman could have been taken out
of this movie and it would have been
a better movie that was probably the most
boring car chase I've ever seen.

(01:25:31):
And the reason why I say so is
because the rain effects that they had going
during this
blur the visuals for me, so
bad that I felt like I was watching
a fight scene in the transformers movies.
You know what I mean? Yeah.
So...
But with that being said, like I said
I didn't hate it, and I'm gonna end
up watching it again because I honestly believe

(01:25:53):
that my wife will this movie more than
I did because my wife super into Tv
shows like Csi
and criminal minds,
and let's face it this kind of what
this this movie is.
So with that said, I'm gonna put it
on the middle shelf.
Alright. So bam 1 that 1. Yay. I
win.

(01:26:16):
Alright. So let's go ahead and move on
to
jeez. We're we're at an hour and a
half and we're still not on. Weak connections
everybody.
This is a weak
connection
Pastor Dallas.
Via the the the microphone is yours.
Welcome to the weak connections a portion of
the podcast where we Take the film that

(01:26:36):
we watch good bad or not. Yeah, we
bring us something of value that is encouraging,
inspiring to your soul.
Points you to Jesus.
So,
real quick, show hands who has
AAA
weak connection. Right chicken his head. Josh. I
I literally I literally watched this movie today.

(01:26:57):
I didn't have
I And I watched it while I was
at work.
I mean, so that was a John's job
that did not affect his productivity in any
way whatsoever. Oh, no. It didn't. My my
productivity was actually high today. So really? There
you go. When you're good at your job,
you can do things like that. I mean,

(01:27:19):
that's fair. That's fair. Alright. So for me
then,
what talking about this film.
By the way, if you go to geek
oceans
dot com, we do have a
devotion based off of this film that I
did when it came out 2 years ago.
But that's not what I'm doing. I'm actually
talking about something different. He was talking about...

(01:27:39):
The entire time he's, like,
he's talking about how he's vengeance. He's vision.
Everything like that. And there's this whole thing
with Selena where
she discovers at Falcon her dad, and she's
angry about it, and she's raised to just,
you know,
awesome. And
he's like no Don't do that. You've suffered...
You've paid too much for this already, But
she's holding on his business. She's holding on
to his anger. And it was driving her

(01:28:00):
legitimately to
homicide. To cross the line, and he said
over and over don't do this, you'll become
just like him, and it's a really interesting
scene that takes place because he's just genuinely
trying to protect her from cross light. To
the point she's been a a cat criminal,
you know, our cat Burglar Right? She hasn't
necessarily done anything terribly

(01:28:22):
You know, she hasn't crossed that line it's
a. She hasn't committed a mortal.
Yeah. So he's trying to protect her from
going too far. And
But there's this bitterness.
There's
unforgiveness. There's this anger that is walled up
inside of her. And now she's been pushed
in the end, and she's ready to just
to cross that line
and do the very thing

(01:28:43):
that the man she hates
did did to her, basically.
And
You know, the bible talks about is of
Lord. And
some people look at that and they're... They
kinda scratch. Like, what does that mean that
Is is Lord. That means that god's gonna
take care of things.
And
really, for...
There's a lot of people who have love
her. They've been through some stupid stuff. And

(01:29:05):
it's not right. It's inappropriate. The things that
have happened to you. They shouldn't have happened.
And
I can I can set stand here for
and not place of all the guys here
on the show, we're sorry that it happens?
That's inappropriate.
But
if you hold on
the bitterness.
And you don't let go, you don't forgive.
What takes place is not the person who

(01:29:28):
offended you getting hurt.
But you're allowing yourself to be victim optimized
by them over
and over and over again. That's what happens
when we don't
forgive when we don't let go. It doesn't
let go and forgiving doesn't mean that you're
validating that person. You're not not saying that,
okay. It's no big deal what they did
to you. Letting go means you're no longer

(01:29:49):
gonna allow yourself to be their victim. And
honestly, again, they may never know. Your hard
looks at them. Your your biting lip, that's
not doing anything to them. It's just hurting
you.
And so
What Batman doing in this thing. He's like,
he's like, let me handle this appropriately. Let
me bring justice now. We all know how

(01:30:09):
that ended in very well.
But
God's not batman.
God's not superman. He's not a man at
all. God is divine. And God has ultimate
justice.
And whether it's in this life or when
they stand before the throne in judgment.
God will bring righteous judgment.

(01:30:30):
Somehow.
And we had to put our trust in
faith in that and let him bring the
human let him take care of us. It's
hard. It's sucks. It genuinely is a terrible
process to walk through to let go of
the pain.
I
I have lived the life where I've been
through some stupid stuff. And I've seen things.

(01:30:50):
I wish I had never seen and people
have hurt me in ways that I don't
care to think about on a regular basis.
But I've had to let go and I've
had to forgive them. 1 of the hardest
things Ever had do in my life was
I had to genuinely call the person who
hurt me in a very real way and
tell them I forgive them. Like, I had
to. Inside of me. I was like, I've

(01:31:11):
got to let this go and I had
to tell them I forgive you of what
you've done to me into my family. And
that was hard. But once I did that,
there was a release, there was a... There
was something that took place in my spirit
that I was no longer a slave to
it anymore. I was now free to live
my life the way that I needed to
be. And so I'm not asking you guys

(01:31:31):
to do anything that I'm I'm wouldn't do.
And some of you, you've you've been through
horrific things far worse than what I could
ever imagine, I'm sure, but holding on to
the bitterness.
Holding it onto to that pain. Like I
said, that doesn't hurt them, it only hurts
you. It is a chain that will weigh
you down. And if you do not release
it,
it will taint every relationship going forward. It

(01:31:51):
will be the... You will see life through
the lens
of that pain. You'll see life through the
lens of that bitterness.
And any anytime a person says anything that
is even the a fragrance of what has
been happened before, you will instantly respond away
that is
too far. In a way that you're trying
to protect yourself legitimately,
but instead of protecting yourself, you're hurting yourself

(01:32:13):
because you're keeping the opportunity for people to
care about you from taking place.
So that is my weak connection for you
guys for,
this show film, the batman. Hey, Babe. Hey
man.
You guys wanna add anything to it? You
know, I was actually having a conversation with
my bolt. About

(01:32:35):
revenge.
She was talking in her bible study about
that concept. And something they said in that
bible study I thought was really profound. They
said, God says Vi is my... Because justice
is up to him. Mh.
Sometimes
justice
is Jesus.
Yeah. Sometimes the justice that he puts out
on the center of the person who is

(01:32:56):
wrong this is
Jesus dying on the cross for their sense.
Mh. And
that's humbling because
I love to talk about what Jesus died
for my. Mh. But to think about that
Jesus died for the sins of the person
who hurt me. Yeah. And that blood that
covers my scent, covers that sent to.

(01:33:16):
And if I'm gonna
say God's praises about how he covered my
sin, I need to recognize that he also
covered that person as well. Yeah. Definitely. That...
And that's a hard thing to realize that,
you know, he he does that we. III
remember years ago, it was
I starting with on un Acquaintance, and we
were talking about just the goodness of that.

(01:33:38):
The the god's gracious. You know, it's it's
unbelievable that God would forgive us
I mean, it is a is a miracle
that God gives us. And I was talking
with him, you know, the god's grace is
so great that
you know, the... We're all familiar with the
funny Mustache man who couldn't speak German very
well, but he led a whole nation.

(01:33:59):
And
he did atrocious evil to despicable with things
that are unspeakable.
To this date though we has done anything
near as bad, and it is terrifying to
think the people analyze him and some duty
analyze him today. But in those final moments
when he was by himself bleeding out if
if I'm not saying he did, but if

(01:34:20):
he had a revelation of Christ in that
moment, and he genuinely repent.
Because God is faithful and true, he would
have forgiven that man, and we would see
him in heaven. And matt is at is
starting to think about. And,
my friend, they kinda freaked out on me
because
they... And what Bowl down to was if
Guy could forgive that man. And Guy could

(01:34:40):
forgive the person that I've used them when
they were younger. And they didn't want that.
They couldn't handle idea of seeing that person
in heaven with them. And that is the
that is the shocking thing about it.
About god's grace is that it's there. And
he's okay with us struggling with that. But
that's is where we had to God's grace
covered us, it will cover everyone. Awkward
silence.

(01:35:02):
Don't worry, John. I'll take care of that.
Yep.
He won't. He's lead in there.
Oh, man. Alright. Well, I think we've covered
everything, guys. Alright. Well
that being said,
let's
let's go ahead and exploit our position and
advertise for a brief moment.

(01:35:23):
Come check me out at, playing games of
strangers. That's all long I'm gonna say Dallas
where can people find you. Geek devotion dot
com where... Geek devotion dot com.
Yes. Where you can find devotion, articles,
reviews,
podcasts, including this podcast right here.
And also, most recently, a free

(01:35:44):
curriculum that you can download as a 6
week curriculum to go along with a Mario
kart tournament.
That you can do with your youth group
and community.
But wait, there's more. Like Listen soon. Yes.
Tell us what you're doing.
What am I doing I don't know. You
you you y'all got anything you wanna... You
don't got anything you wanna promote my dude?
Not at the moment. Though. Alright.

(01:36:07):
Alright. Well, with that being said, thanks so
much for listening.
We certainly hope you've enjoyed this. Please engage
with us on the discord in the face
space and all the other socials that are
just destroying the moral fabric of society.
And goes.
According geo.

(01:36:28):
But that being said, thanks so much for
listening.
State devoted.
Love.

(01:37:01):
Copyright infringement.
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