March 13, 2025 • 24 mins
The education landscape is in turmoil as schools cope with a teacher shortage that leaves over 400,000 positions unfilled. This episode tackles the pressing issue head-on, exploring how innovative education leaders are transforming staffing challenges into pathways for continuity and excellence in learning. We welcome Nicola Soares, the president of Kelly Education, to share her insights from her frontline experience in education. Discover how Kelly Education addresses staffing shortages through a commitment to training, competitive compensation, and strategic partnerships focused on enhancing the quality of substitute teaching.
Throughout the episode, we delve into the impact of substituting on student learning and well-being. Nicola discusses how frequent teacher absences can lead to significant learning disruptions, particularly for students needing consistent environments. With data showing that educational discontinuity can equate to a considerable loss of learning time, we highlight the necessity for strategic solutions that can improve retention rates among educators while enhancing the educational experience for all students.
• Discussing the staggering statistic regarding unfilled teaching positions
• Insights from Nicola Soares on improving staffing strategies
• Benefits of professional development for substitutes and support staff
• Exploring the impact of substitute teacher variability on student learning
• Evaluating the importance of pay raises and policy changes in education
• How to partner with organizations like Kelly Education for effective staffing solutions
If your school is facing staffing challenges or if you want to become a substitute, visit mykelly.com to explore innovative workforce solutions like those we've discussed today. Listen to Wake Up and Teach Podcast, hosted by Nicola to learn more!
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Trusted dental care for healthy smiles and stronger communities—building brighter futures daily.
If you have a story about what's working in your schools that you'd like to share, email me at lisa@drlisahassler.com or visit www.drlisahassler.com. Subscribe, tell a friend, and consider becoming a supporter by clicking the link: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2048018/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (00:00):
With over 406,000 teaching positions
either unfilled or staffed byeducators without full
certification, our children'seducation hangs in the balance.
Today, we're exploring howinnovative educators are
transforming these staffingchallenges into opportunities
for educational continuity andexcellence.
(00:21):
Welcome to the brighter side ofeducation, research, innovation
and resources.
I'm your host, dr Lisa Hassler,here to enlighten and brighten
the classrooms in Americathrough focused conversation on
(00:42):
important topics in education.
In each episode, I discussproblems we as teachers and
parents are facing and whatpeople are doing in their
communities to fix it.
What are these variables andhow can we duplicate it to
maximize student outcomes?
Today we're addressing achallenge that touches virtually
every school community acrossthe country preparing and
(01:04):
maintaining our educationworkforce, particularly
substitute teachers and supportstaff.
According to the Learning PolicyInstitute's August 2024 report,
approximately 406,000 teachingpositions nationwide are either
unfilled or filled with teacherswithout proper certification,
representing about one in eightof all teaching positions
(01:26):
nationally.
This staffing instabilitycreates educational
discontinuity where learningmomentum is repeatedly disrupted
, affecting student achievementand well-being.
Imagine a third grade classroomthat sees four different
substitute teachers in a singlemonth each, with different
classroom management styles,instructional approaches and
familiarity with the curriculum.
(01:47):
The impact on students issignificant.
Research published inEducational Evaluation and
Policy Analysis shows, studentsin classrooms with frequent
teacher absences can lose theequivalent of 20 to 25 days of
learning in a single academicyear.
For parents, this means yourchild's educational experience
can vary dramatically dependingon substitute quality and
(02:11):
preparation.
For students with learningdifferences.
Studies from the Center ofEducation data and research
reveal the negative impact isnearly twice as severe.
These students, who often relyon consistency and routine,
experience the greatestdisruption when faced with a
revolving door of differenteducators.
Red Rover's 2023 SubstituteTeacher Survey provides
(02:35):
additional insights into thesubstitute teacher workforce.
Nearly half of currentsubstitute teachers 44% are in
their first year and almost 50%desire more training in
trauma-informed teachingpractices.
And what's great is that 73% ofsubstitutes plan to continue in
their roles next year.
This presents a tremendousopportunity for schools to
(02:57):
invest in this workforce throughbetter preparation, support and
systems, especially as teachershortages continue to grow
nationwide.
In systems, especially asteacher shortages continue to
grow nationwide.
Today, I'm thrilled to welcomeNicola Soares, president of
Kelly Education, the nation'slargest education staffing
provider.
Nicola began her career as apublic school social studies
teacher before holdingleadership positions at
(03:18):
McGraw-Hill Education and NBCUniversal, where she helped
create the education initiativeNBCLearn.
She believes that education isthe bedrock of a thriving
society and that the talentedpeople who work in our schools,
colleges and universities arecrucial to powering the future
of learning and unlockingstudent potential.
(03:39):
Today, she'll share insights onsolving staffing challenges
through competitive pay,professional development and
innovative approaches to build aresilient workforce.
Welcome to the show, nicola.
Nicola Soares (03:51):
Thank you, Lisa.
Thank you for having me today.
I really looked forward to thisconversation.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (03:56):
Yeah, me too.
I'm excited to hear about KellyEducation and the services that
it provides to help schools out.
What exactly is your role withKelly Education and how has it
expanded under your leadership?
Nicola Soares (04:07):
Yeah, so my role at Kelly Education.
I like to think that I'm thehead learner of the organization
, but I am president of theorganization, so I've been with
Kelly for over 10 years andKelly Education is a specialty
division of Kelly Services.
So I'm sure many of ouraudience participants have heard
about Kelly Services, thetemporary staffing organization,
(04:29):
but really what we are is aglobal workforce solutions that
works across industries and allsorts of workforce solutions and
human capital strategies, butfor us it's really around
staffing primarily focused onK-12.
Us it's really around staffingprimarily focused on K-12.
We place substitute teachers,we do direct hire placement and
(04:53):
over the years we have growninto other service lines, like
in special needs, special edsthink of paraeducators.
We also supply therapistsphysical therapists,
occupational therapists, speech,behavior, mental health and
wellness kinds of services, andthen, last but not least, we
also do executive searchplacements especially focused on
public higher ed institutions.
So think of, like presidentsand chancellors and provosts and
(05:16):
academic deans.
So we have a really fullend-to-end service when it comes
to human capital or workforcesolutions.
I like to think that we have afront row seat to America's
institutions and public schooldistricts and that, of course,
spans over 40 states, and we'vebeen doing it probably close to
about 30 years.
(05:37):
But since the time I've beenhere, we've grown and obviously
have added all sorts of servicesthat I think you know.
In this time, I like to thinkthat what we do provide are
essential services.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (05:48):
Especially with over 400,000 vacancies in
teaching positions and a lot ofthose without certifications.
How do you address that kind ofbig challenge, even in remote
areas?
Nicola Soares (06:01):
So let me say this the fact that we do place
substitute teachers.
Every single state has aminimum set of requirements when
it comes to credentials, sofortunately, we're not placing
candidates that don't have anycredentials.
What we see there are somestates that might require a high
school diploma or X amount ofcollege credit hours, or you
(06:23):
might have states that mightrequire that you need to be a
four-year degree certifiedteacher in order to be a
substitute teacher.
So we do see the gamut of that,which is great, and if we do
convert talent into full-timepositions and that's part of the
benefit of our program thoseindividuals do need to have the
credential requirements in orderto be teachers.
(06:45):
I would say you know yourquestion, lisa around remote
areas, every single state,whether it be populous, and I
think also a lot of folks thinkthat the pandemic sort of
(07:07):
exacerbated or started thiswhole problem around teacher
shortages, but actually itstarted well before then.
For all the reasons that weknow, the pandemic did
exacerbate it to be even abigger problem and really fast
forward.
Today I characterize this as anational crisis that I think
every state, even at a federallevel, needs to put attention to
(07:29):
.
The need is pretty huge outthere for sure.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (07:32):
Yeah, I felt that pressing need.
While teaching in a privateschool, we had to secure our own
substitute teachers, which wasextremely difficult given our
small pool of candidates andmany times we were left with no
other alternatives, which thenbecame commonplace for teachers
to cover each other's classes,missing plan times and even
(07:52):
lunches.
So when I went to your websiteand I saw the phrase filling
classrooms at 5.30 AM, so youdon't have to that really
resonated deeply with me.
Why do you think principalsneed a mindset shift about
substitutes and how doespartnering with a staffing
service save schools time andmoney?
Nicola Soares (08:11):
Right, oh, wow, so really good questions.
Usually the mind shift forbuilding principals once they
hear about a program like oursand typically we contract it was
centrally with the schooldistrict administration so that
there is sort of the equitabledistribution of talent across
the board it takes themliterally a nanosecond to see
(08:32):
the benefit.
Because when you think about theadministrative benefit that we
provide to schools, especiallyto our building principals,
usually that burden either fallson A the principal, or B the
school secretary, if you will,and so you know the scramble for
last minute absences due toillness or even a long-term
absence due to maternity leaveor a scheduled professional
(08:52):
development day.
There is so much logisticallythat you have to coordinate on
that.
So if you have a program likeours that is actually building a
talent pool so that thosepeople are ready to go at any
given literally within minutes,is incredibly helpful and the
idea of that really allows abuilding principal and all of
the support staff there too toreally focus every day on what
(09:15):
they need to focus on, andthat's really around student
achievement.
And, from a financialperspective, a program like ours
, if we do it well, it reallydoes save a district or a school
money over time, because if youthink about all the hidden
costs of having to market andsource and recruit and to
advertise, but I think thebiggest cost impact, you know
(09:36):
sort of slash benefit is all ofthose lost student learning days
too, without having qualifiedtalent within the classroom.
So that continuity ofinstruction is really important
and I would say superintendents,chief financial officers, chief
HR officers and of course, ourbuilding instructional
leadership, they absolutely getthat value proposition to be
(09:58):
more efficient, more costeffective and then also having
the best talent.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (10:03):
Yeah, the educational discontinuity, with
frequent teacher absencesequating to 20 to 25 days of
lost learning time for studentsin a single academic year, was a
pretty impactful data pointthat was brought up in the
research intro.
What kind of impacts have youseen when schools do a more
comprehensive approach andexpand beyond a substitute
(10:26):
teacher, paraprofessionals,tutors, custodians, special
education staff, even nurses,when they can tap into a
resource like yours for a talentpool?
What kind of impacts are youseeing?
Nicola Soares (10:38):
Yeah, I think we're seeing a lot of positive
impacts.
So let me start with teachersand paraeducators.
You know, part of the valueproposition of a program such as
ours is that we get theopportunity for school districts
and building principals toexperience talent.
So think of us as sort of aprogram that also helps to
source talent as well that comeinto our employment.
(11:00):
You know, just trying to findis there an individual?
If we have an opening, theright fit, because retention is
a big issue we convert lots offolks that are qualified to
become full-time teachers.
It's an opportunity, it's apathway to do that.
I also think that when we thinkabout support staff like food
and nutrition services, schoolnursing, paraeducators, you name
(11:21):
it those folks consistently goto the same schools every single
day, so they're an extension ofthe workforce.
So I like to think a workforcemodel within a school district
or even a school, has evolved.
It's changed from what it was20 to 30 years ago, and so, with
school budgets especially beingpressed right now, labor coming
in in different kinds ofchannels is maybe more cost
(11:43):
effective for school districts,especially when enrollments are
sort of fluctuating anddepending on what the needs are
for resources that particularyear.
That's really helpful.
So an example like a speechtherapist or a physical
therapist, depending on theneeds of the school that year,
that can contract with a servicelike ours where they have
(12:04):
somebody dedicated for the yearand then comes back the
following year.
But you know, where a districtmight not necessarily be able to
afford a huge amount of staffor professionals on a full-time
basis as well.
So they are our employees andthat are contracted to the
schools.
The other thing, a lot of therelationships that are built.
This is an extension of theteam.
(12:25):
It takes a village to raise achild, as we say.
So many of our folks areemployees.
They're part of the team andthey're treated as such.
Our substitute teachers.
They'll go to faculty meetings,they're a part of professional
development trainings, just likethey would be considered to be
a full-time employee.
So that makes it very seamless.
I think so that there's no youknow, hopefully not a whole lot
of differentiation around that,and I think that's really
(12:49):
important for engagement withall stakeholders.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (12:52):
And you've got a lot of case studies also that
support the data on the impactsas well.
Nicola Soares (12:57):
Oh, absolutely.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (12:58):
Absolutely.
Nicola Soares (12:58):
Very positive.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (13:00):
I was seeing some of the case studies with
data that supported your fillrate and how it was impacting
student learning In Florida.
It seems to be like there's alot of districts that are going
your way, which is exciting.
What positions do you think youcould see yourself expanding
into next?
Nicola Soares (13:17):
Well, you know, I mean, we do a lot of positions
that are outsourced positions,from interim placements, of high
level positions, whiledistricts are seeking their next
full time appointment.
We do executive search.
We, you know, frominstructional and
non-instructional positions.
I really do think maybe thequestion would be, what sorts of
(13:37):
human capital services do weoffer?
And so, you know, I think aboutbeing a human capital
organization.
We do a lot of work and have alot of demand around being able
to do workshops for buildingprinciples, whether it's
leadership development or HRprofessionals, to give them the
latest and greatest about wageand hour compliance or anything
that might be relative to newlegislation, depending on the
(14:00):
state, and that is verycomplementary in our programming
as well.
You know, I can't think ofanything that we don't do today.
The only thing that we don't dois bus drivers.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (14:11):
I was about to say bus drivers.
Nicola Soares (14:14):
That's a whole unique industry unto itself.
That's not an area wespecialize in, don't have any
plans to specialize in that, butyou know, I think we're always
very happy to partner with ourdistricts to see how we can help
solve problems in partnershipsand just to elevate human
capital within our districts too, especially coming out of the
(14:34):
private sector, where theprivate sector tends to have the
latest and the greatest andwhere they can share that with
educators, I think is fantastic,and you touched on the
professional development.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (14:45):
I'm just thinking back to Red Rover
survey where they were sayingthat substitute teachers really
wanted more professionaldevelopment in trauma-informed
strategies, and you're talkingabout being able to provide
those professional developmentpathways.
How does Kelly Educationprovide those pathways?
And then could you share maybe,a success story about how that
(15:07):
kind of preparation transformedyour employees' effectiveness?
Nicola Soares (15:12):
Yeah.
So professional development isat the heart of everything that
we do.
At a minimum, somebody that'scoming into our employment
before they're even placed,after interview and onboarding
process, receives about fourhours of professional
development training, dependingon the criteria.
Sometimes there'sstate-specific requirements on
training but we give the minimumof four hours.
(15:34):
So when I think aboutprofessionals, we've seen an
interesting dynamic of, likehealthcare professionals, coming
in trying their hand atsubstitute teaching.
So, as an example, somebody wasan RN or an LPN or a PA that
might've gotten so burned outcoming out of the pandemic, but
I'm really I'm a care providerand I'm a purpose-driven
(15:54):
individual.
Substitute teaching is a greatway to try out a different kind
of a career.
But of course they come intoour employment.
Let's say an RN who's got awonderful credential profile of
having a STEM degree, right, abachelor's of science, and when
you think about those degreesand how they transfer into a
science classroom, into aspecial ed classroom physical
(16:15):
science, biology you know it'sgreat.
But what a service like oursdoes gives them all the other
additional wraparound thingsbest practices on classroom
management, lesson planning, youknow, think about all of those
kinds of things.
So if you have that on top ofyour credential, then you're
going to be well preparedentering into your first day.
(16:35):
Lot of examples of that andsomebody recently substituted
called Linda, out of Miami-Dadepublic schools, who did
something like that and as aresult, probably got hired into
full-time employment in terms ofthen getting the next level of
credential degrees so that theyare qualified to teach.
And we don't stop there.
So, lisa, what I can share toyou too we do continuous
(16:58):
education.
So our employees have theopportunity to literally choose
from 2000 continued educationmodules, and it could be in a
variety of things.
It could be the latest suite ofMicrosoft Office tools.
So if you think about all thosethings that classroom teachers
get to use and have the best inclass, they might have an intro
to AI, they might have anothercourse into something different
(17:22):
that might be complementary tothe discipline that they prefer
to teach in.
So training is, at our core,really, really important.
We also provide professionaldevelopment training for those
states that would want topurchase it for their substitute
teachers.
They don't even have to hire astaffing component of that.
I fundamentally believe thatsubstitute teachers do need to
receive a minimum of trainingbefore they're ever even placed
(17:44):
into the classroom.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (17:45):
Yeah, it makes it so that when they walk into
that classroom that first daythey feel good about what
they're doing and confident tobe successful with it.
So many school districts don'tprovide benefits or perks for
their substitutes.
How does addressingcompensation and benefits, as
well as that professional growth, help both your recruitment and
(18:05):
then the retention of thosehigh quality education
professionals?
Nicola Soares (18:09):
I think it's critical, especially if they
become an extension substituteteachers, generally speaking to
the over the workforce of ateacher at large.
I can tell you many districtsthat we partner with at a
minimum, if, let's say, asubstitute teacher is fulfilling
a long-term assignment, thatthey're paid an equivalent of an
annual salary of a full-timeteacher.
(18:29):
Meaning, as it translates tothe daily salary or daily wages,
that's really really critical,excellent.
An enormous amount of districtsincrease the wages of not only
substitute teachers butunderstanding they need to do
that for their full-timeteaching workforce too, to be
commensurate to other industries, that should be just as valued.
(18:49):
If substitute teachers comethrough our employment, we do
offer the opportunity for like401k or health benefits if they
choose to participate.
So we need to think about howpeople desire to work, because
there really has been a movement.
I mean about a third of theworkforce in the USA today I
mean Kelly does a lot ofresearch and a lot of thought
(19:10):
leadership around the space,freelances, and not because they
have to, because they choose to, because it's what we call work
life designers, the way thatwork needs to fit into people's
lives, and I think that's one ofthe sort of post-pandemic
lessons coming out, especiallyfor people, and then having an
opportunity to be a substituteteacher is really an opportunity
(19:33):
to earn income the way thatthey want to and how it fits
into their lives, if that makessense.
We do see many of ourindividuals in our talent pool.
They're taking maybe two, threedays assignments a week.
Might be doing something elsefor the remainder of the week,
so very, very interesting interms of workforce dynamics, I
think.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (19:53):
In the area regarding pay and substitute
salaries, aligning better withcredentials and experience.
I think it's really importantthat we're addressing that,
because school districts thatI've been in substitute teachers
might get $40 a day, and so youcould see where that could be a
little disheartening becauseyou're thinking really $40 for
(20:14):
the whole day.
Nicola Soares (20:15):
It's come a long way and I would say it's
somewhere between nationalaverage is $110, $120 maybe, so
we've seen it as high as over$200, depending on credentials
or where they are.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (20:25):
We've seen a lot of districts increase the
daily pay rate, which has beengreat because we needed to do
that, quite frankly, oh, yeah,if you wanted to be able to
attract qualified individuals tobe able to take on that role,
then I could see compensatingthem fairly would be a great
step in the right direction, andyou were talking about
legislation a little bit earlier.
What kind of policy challengesand opportunities do you believe
(20:49):
would have the greatestpositive impact on building a
sustainable education workforce?
Nicola Soares (20:55):
There are quite a few states that have had
increasing of teacher salarybills on the table.
There's been a lot of statesthat have since kind of passed
some very I think, excitinglegislation recognizing the fact
that we need to pay teachersdifferently.
So I suspect that that's goingto continue.
I mean, especially in light ofthe teacher shortages, we need
(21:17):
to do that.
So I think it's an opportunity.
I'm in the teaching profession.
I started my career as ateacher.
It's an exciting profession, soI'm hopeful that we will see
the average teacher salary go up.
It needs to.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:31):
Yes, fingers crossed, me too.
I hope so.
What's the best way for schoolleaders or potential educational
professionals to explorepartnerships with Kelly
Education?
Nicola Soares (21:42):
So I think the easiest and fastest way.
If they go to kellyeducationcom, they will be able to see a lot
of information on how toconnect with us and what are the
steps and how we go about.
You know the partnering process, so kellyeducationcom.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:58):
Well, thank you so much for joining us today
and telling us about your workat Kelly Education, transforming
what could be viewed simply asa staffing challenge into an
opportunity to enhance thequality of education through
well-prepared professionalsmaking a difference for schools,
educators and, most importantly, the students.
I appreciate you taking thetime to come and talk with me.
Nicola Soares (22:20):
I appreciate you taking the time to come and talk
with me.
Thank you, lisa.
It's been a pleasure being herewith you today, so I wish you a
very good week and thank youfor your podcast, because it is
valuable content, so thank youso much, thank you.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (22:31):
And yours as well.
So shout out to your podcast.
Wake Up and Teach.
Nicola Soares (22:35):
Wake Up and Teach .
Yes, I will have to have youcome on in the future as well.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (22:40):
I would love to do that.
Thank you.
If your school is facingstaffing challenges or if you
want to become a substitute,visit mykellycom to explore
innovative workforce solutionslike those we've discussed today
.
The research is clearEducational continuity matters
tremendously for studentoutcomes.
If you have a story aboutwhat's working in your schools
that you'd like to share, youcan email me at lisa at
(23:02):
drlisahasslercom, or visit mywebsite at wwwdrlisahasslercom
and send me a message.
If you like this podcast,subscribe and tell a friend.
The more people that know, thebigger impact it will have.
And if you find value to thecontent in this podcast,
consider becoming a supporter byclicking on the supporter link
in the show notes.
(23:23):
It is the mission of thispodcast to shine light on the
good in education so that itspreads, affecting positive
change.
So let's keep working togetherto find solutions that focus on
our children's success.
With over 406,000 teaching positions
either unfilled or staffed byeducators without full
certification, our children'seducation hangs in the balance.
Today, we're exploring howinnovative educators are
transforming these staffingchallenges into opportunities
for educational continuity andexcellence.
(00:21):
Welcome to the brighter side ofeducation, research, innovation
and resources.
I'm your host, dr Lisa Hassler,here to enlighten and brighten
the classrooms in Americathrough focused conversation on
(00:42):
important topics in education.
In each episode, I discussproblems we as teachers and
parents are facing and whatpeople are doing in their
communities to fix it.
What are these variables andhow can we duplicate it to
maximize student outcomes?
Today we're addressing achallenge that touches virtually
every school community acrossthe country preparing and
(01:04):
maintaining our educationworkforce, particularly
substitute teachers and supportstaff.
According to the Learning PolicyInstitute's August 2024 report,
approximately 406,000 teachingpositions nationwide are either
unfilled or filled with teacherswithout proper certification,
representing about one in eightof all teaching positions
(01:26):
nationally.
This staffing instabilitycreates educational
discontinuity where learningmomentum is repeatedly disrupted
, affecting student achievementand well-being.
Imagine a third grade classroomthat sees four different
substitute teachers in a singlemonth each, with different
classroom management styles,instructional approaches and
familiarity with the curriculum.
(01:47):
The impact on students issignificant.
Research published inEducational Evaluation and
Policy Analysis shows, studentsin classrooms with frequent
teacher absences can lose theequivalent of 20 to 25 days of
learning in a single academicyear.
For parents, this means yourchild's educational experience
can vary dramatically dependingon substitute quality and
(02:11):
preparation.
For students with learningdifferences.
Studies from the Center ofEducation data and research
reveal the negative impact isnearly twice as severe.
These students, who often relyon consistency and routine,
experience the greatestdisruption when faced with a
revolving door of differenteducators.
Red Rover's 2023 SubstituteTeacher Survey provides
(02:35):
additional insights into thesubstitute teacher workforce.
Nearly half of currentsubstitute teachers 44% are in
their first year and almost 50%desire more training in
trauma-informed teachingpractices.
And what's great is that 73% ofsubstitutes plan to continue in
their roles next year.
This presents a tremendousopportunity for schools to
(02:57):
invest in this workforce throughbetter preparation, support and
systems, especially as teachershortages continue to grow
nationwide.
In systems, especially asteacher shortages continue to
grow nationwide.
Today, I'm thrilled to welcomeNicola Soares, president of
Kelly Education, the nation'slargest education staffing
provider.
Nicola began her career as apublic school social studies
teacher before holdingleadership positions at
(03:18):
McGraw-Hill Education and NBCUniversal, where she helped
create the education initiativeNBCLearn.
She believes that education isthe bedrock of a thriving
society and that the talentedpeople who work in our schools,
colleges and universities arecrucial to powering the future
of learning and unlockingstudent potential.
(03:39):
Today, she'll share insights onsolving staffing challenges
through competitive pay,professional development and
innovative approaches to build aresilient workforce.
Welcome to the show, nicola.
Nicola Soares (03:51):
Thank you, Lisa.
Thank you for having me today.
I really looked forward to thisconversation.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (03:56):
Yeah, me too.
I'm excited to hear about KellyEducation and the services that
it provides to help schools out.
What exactly is your role withKelly Education and how has it
expanded under your leadership?
Nicola Soares (04:07):
Yeah, so my role at Kelly Education.
I like to think that I'm thehead learner of the organization
, but I am president of theorganization, so I've been with
Kelly for over 10 years andKelly Education is a specialty
division of Kelly Services.
So I'm sure many of ouraudience participants have heard
about Kelly Services, thetemporary staffing organization,
(04:29):
but really what we are is aglobal workforce solutions that
works across industries and allsorts of workforce solutions and
human capital strategies, butfor us it's really around
staffing primarily focused onK-12.
Us it's really around staffingprimarily focused on K-12.
We place substitute teachers,we do direct hire placement and
(04:53):
over the years we have growninto other service lines, like
in special needs, special edsthink of paraeducators.
We also supply therapistsphysical therapists,
occupational therapists, speech,behavior, mental health and
wellness kinds of services, andthen, last but not least, we
also do executive searchplacements especially focused on
public higher ed institutions.
So think of, like presidentsand chancellors and provosts and
(05:16):
academic deans.
So we have a really fullend-to-end service when it comes
to human capital or workforcesolutions.
I like to think that we have afront row seat to America's
institutions and public schooldistricts and that, of course,
spans over 40 states, and we'vebeen doing it probably close to
about 30 years.
(05:37):
But since the time I've beenhere, we've grown and obviously
have added all sorts of servicesthat I think you know.
In this time, I like to thinkthat what we do provide are
essential services.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (05:48):
Especially with over 400,000 vacancies in
teaching positions and a lot ofthose without certifications.
How do you address that kind ofbig challenge, even in remote
areas?
Nicola Soares (06:01):
So let me say this the fact that we do place
substitute teachers.
Every single state has aminimum set of requirements when
it comes to credentials, sofortunately, we're not placing
candidates that don't have anycredentials.
What we see there are somestates that might require a high
school diploma or X amount ofcollege credit hours, or you
(06:23):
might have states that mightrequire that you need to be a
four-year degree certifiedteacher in order to be a
substitute teacher.
So we do see the gamut of that,which is great, and if we do
convert talent into full-timepositions and that's part of the
benefit of our program thoseindividuals do need to have the
credential requirements in orderto be teachers.
(06:45):
I would say you know yourquestion, lisa around remote
areas, every single state,whether it be populous, and I
think also a lot of folks thinkthat the pandemic sort of
(07:07):
exacerbated or started thiswhole problem around teacher
shortages, but actually itstarted well before then.
For all the reasons that weknow, the pandemic did
exacerbate it to be even abigger problem and really fast
forward.
Today I characterize this as anational crisis that I think
every state, even at a federallevel, needs to put attention to
(07:29):
.
The need is pretty huge outthere for sure.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (07:32):
Yeah, I felt that pressing need.
While teaching in a privateschool, we had to secure our own
substitute teachers, which wasextremely difficult given our
small pool of candidates andmany times we were left with no
other alternatives, which thenbecame commonplace for teachers
to cover each other's classes,missing plan times and even
(07:52):
lunches.
So when I went to your websiteand I saw the phrase filling
classrooms at 5.30 AM, so youdon't have to that really
resonated deeply with me.
Why do you think principalsneed a mindset shift about
substitutes and how doespartnering with a staffing
service save schools time andmoney?
Nicola Soares (08:11):
Right, oh, wow, so really good questions.
Usually the mind shift forbuilding principals once they
hear about a program like oursand typically we contract it was
centrally with the schooldistrict administration so that
there is sort of the equitabledistribution of talent across
the board it takes themliterally a nanosecond to see
(08:32):
the benefit.
Because when you think about theadministrative benefit that we
provide to schools, especiallyto our building principals,
usually that burden either fallson A the principal, or B the
school secretary, if you will,and so you know the scramble for
last minute absences due toillness or even a long-term
absence due to maternity leaveor a scheduled professional
(08:52):
development day.
There is so much logisticallythat you have to coordinate on
that.
So if you have a program likeours that is actually building a
talent pool so that thosepeople are ready to go at any
given literally within minutes,is incredibly helpful and the
idea of that really allows abuilding principal and all of
the support staff there too toreally focus every day on what
(09:15):
they need to focus on, andthat's really around student
achievement.
And, from a financialperspective, a program like ours
, if we do it well, it reallydoes save a district or a school
money over time, because if youthink about all the hidden
costs of having to market andsource and recruit and to
advertise, but I think thebiggest cost impact, you know
(09:36):
sort of slash benefit is all ofthose lost student learning days
too, without having qualifiedtalent within the classroom.
So that continuity ofinstruction is really important
and I would say superintendents,chief financial officers, chief
HR officers and of course, ourbuilding instructional
leadership, they absolutely getthat value proposition to be
(09:58):
more efficient, more costeffective and then also having
the best talent.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (10:03):
Yeah, the educational discontinuity, with
frequent teacher absencesequating to 20 to 25 days of
lost learning time for studentsin a single academic year, was a
pretty impactful data pointthat was brought up in the
research intro.
What kind of impacts have youseen when schools do a more
comprehensive approach andexpand beyond a substitute
(10:26):
teacher, paraprofessionals,tutors, custodians, special
education staff, even nurses,when they can tap into a
resource like yours for a talentpool?
What kind of impacts are youseeing?
Nicola Soares (10:38):
Yeah, I think we're seeing a lot of positive
impacts.
So let me start with teachersand paraeducators.
You know, part of the valueproposition of a program such as
ours is that we get theopportunity for school districts
and building principals toexperience talent.
So think of us as sort of aprogram that also helps to
source talent as well that comeinto our employment.
(11:00):
You know, just trying to findis there an individual?
If we have an opening, theright fit, because retention is
a big issue we convert lots offolks that are qualified to
become full-time teachers.
It's an opportunity, it's apathway to do that.
I also think that when we thinkabout support staff like food
and nutrition services, schoolnursing, paraeducators, you name
(11:21):
it those folks consistently goto the same schools every single
day, so they're an extension ofthe workforce.
So I like to think a workforcemodel within a school district
or even a school, has evolved.
It's changed from what it was20 to 30 years ago, and so, with
school budgets especially beingpressed right now, labor coming
in in different kinds ofchannels is maybe more cost
(11:43):
effective for school districts,especially when enrollments are
sort of fluctuating anddepending on what the needs are
for resources that particularyear.
That's really helpful.
So an example like a speechtherapist or a physical
therapist, depending on theneeds of the school that year,
that can contract with a servicelike ours where they have
(12:04):
somebody dedicated for the yearand then comes back the
following year.
But you know, where a districtmight not necessarily be able to
afford a huge amount of staffor professionals on a full-time
basis as well.
So they are our employees andthat are contracted to the
schools.
The other thing, a lot of therelationships that are built.
This is an extension of theteam.
(12:25):
It takes a village to raise achild, as we say.
So many of our folks areemployees.
They're part of the team andthey're treated as such.
Our substitute teachers.
They'll go to faculty meetings,they're a part of professional
development trainings, just likethey would be considered to be
a full-time employee.
So that makes it very seamless.
I think so that there's no youknow, hopefully not a whole lot
of differentiation around that,and I think that's really
(12:49):
important for engagement withall stakeholders.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (12:52):
And you've got a lot of case studies also that
support the data on the impactsas well.
Nicola Soares (12:57):
Oh, absolutely.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (12:58):
Absolutely.
Nicola Soares (12:58):
Very positive.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (13:00):
I was seeing some of the case studies with
data that supported your fillrate and how it was impacting
student learning In Florida.
It seems to be like there's alot of districts that are going
your way, which is exciting.
What positions do you think youcould see yourself expanding
into next?
Nicola Soares (13:17):
Well, you know, I mean, we do a lot of positions
that are outsourced positions,from interim placements, of high
level positions, whiledistricts are seeking their next
full time appointment.
We do executive search.
We, you know, frominstructional and
non-instructional positions.
I really do think maybe thequestion would be, what sorts of
(13:37):
human capital services do weoffer?
And so, you know, I think aboutbeing a human capital
organization.
We do a lot of work and have alot of demand around being able
to do workshops for buildingprinciples, whether it's
leadership development or HRprofessionals, to give them the
latest and greatest about wageand hour compliance or anything
that might be relative to newlegislation, depending on the
(14:00):
state, and that is verycomplementary in our programming
as well.
You know, I can't think ofanything that we don't do today.
The only thing that we don't dois bus drivers.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (14:11):
I was about to say bus drivers.
Nicola Soares (14:14):
That's a whole unique industry unto itself.
That's not an area wespecialize in, don't have any
plans to specialize in that, butyou know, I think we're always
very happy to partner with ourdistricts to see how we can help
solve problems in partnershipsand just to elevate human
capital within our districts too, especially coming out of the
(14:34):
private sector, where theprivate sector tends to have the
latest and the greatest andwhere they can share that with
educators, I think is fantastic,and you touched on the
professional development.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (14:45):
I'm just thinking back to Red Rover
survey where they were sayingthat substitute teachers really
wanted more professionaldevelopment in trauma-informed
strategies, and you're talkingabout being able to provide
those professional developmentpathways.
How does Kelly Educationprovide those pathways?
And then could you share maybe,a success story about how that
(15:07):
kind of preparation transformedyour employees' effectiveness?
Nicola Soares (15:12):
Yeah.
So professional development isat the heart of everything that
we do.
At a minimum, somebody that'scoming into our employment
before they're even placed,after interview and onboarding
process, receives about fourhours of professional
development training, dependingon the criteria.
Sometimes there'sstate-specific requirements on
training but we give the minimumof four hours.
(15:34):
So when I think aboutprofessionals, we've seen an
interesting dynamic of, likehealthcare professionals, coming
in trying their hand atsubstitute teaching.
So, as an example, somebody wasan RN or an LPN or a PA that
might've gotten so burned outcoming out of the pandemic, but
I'm really I'm a care providerand I'm a purpose-driven
(15:54):
individual.
Substitute teaching is a greatway to try out a different kind
of a career.
But of course they come intoour employment.
Let's say an RN who's got awonderful credential profile of
having a STEM degree, right, abachelor's of science, and when
you think about those degreesand how they transfer into a
science classroom, into aspecial ed classroom physical
(16:15):
science, biology you know it'sgreat.
But what a service like oursdoes gives them all the other
additional wraparound thingsbest practices on classroom
management, lesson planning, youknow, think about all of those
kinds of things.
So if you have that on top ofyour credential, then you're
going to be well preparedentering into your first day.
(16:35):
Lot of examples of that andsomebody recently substituted
called Linda, out of Miami-Dadepublic schools, who did
something like that and as aresult, probably got hired into
full-time employment in terms ofthen getting the next level of
credential degrees so that theyare qualified to teach.
And we don't stop there.
So, lisa, what I can share toyou too we do continuous
(16:58):
education.
So our employees have theopportunity to literally choose
from 2000 continued educationmodules, and it could be in a
variety of things.
It could be the latest suite ofMicrosoft Office tools.
So if you think about all thosethings that classroom teachers
get to use and have the best inclass, they might have an intro
to AI, they might have anothercourse into something different
(17:22):
that might be complementary tothe discipline that they prefer
to teach in.
So training is, at our core,really, really important.
We also provide professionaldevelopment training for those
states that would want topurchase it for their substitute
teachers.
They don't even have to hire astaffing component of that.
I fundamentally believe thatsubstitute teachers do need to
receive a minimum of trainingbefore they're ever even placed
(17:44):
into the classroom.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (17:45):
Yeah, it makes it so that when they walk into
that classroom that first daythey feel good about what
they're doing and confident tobe successful with it.
So many school districts don'tprovide benefits or perks for
their substitutes.
How does addressingcompensation and benefits, as
well as that professional growth, help both your recruitment and
(18:05):
then the retention of thosehigh quality education
professionals?
Nicola Soares (18:09):
I think it's critical, especially if they
become an extension substituteteachers, generally speaking to
the over the workforce of ateacher at large.
I can tell you many districtsthat we partner with at a
minimum, if, let's say, asubstitute teacher is fulfilling
a long-term assignment, thatthey're paid an equivalent of an
annual salary of a full-timeteacher.
(18:29):
Meaning, as it translates tothe daily salary or daily wages,
that's really really critical,excellent.
An enormous amount of districtsincrease the wages of not only
substitute teachers butunderstanding they need to do
that for their full-timeteaching workforce too, to be
commensurate to other industries, that should be just as valued.
(18:49):
If substitute teachers comethrough our employment, we do
offer the opportunity for like401k or health benefits if they
choose to participate.
So we need to think about howpeople desire to work, because
there really has been a movement.
I mean about a third of theworkforce in the USA today I
mean Kelly does a lot ofresearch and a lot of thought
(19:10):
leadership around the space,freelances, and not because they
have to, because they choose to, because it's what we call work
life designers, the way thatwork needs to fit into people's
lives, and I think that's one ofthe sort of post-pandemic
lessons coming out, especiallyfor people, and then having an
opportunity to be a substituteteacher is really an opportunity
(19:33):
to earn income the way thatthey want to and how it fits
into their lives, if that makessense.
We do see many of ourindividuals in our talent pool.
They're taking maybe two, threedays assignments a week.
Might be doing something elsefor the remainder of the week,
so very, very interesting interms of workforce dynamics, I
think.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (19:53):
In the area regarding pay and substitute
salaries, aligning better withcredentials and experience.
I think it's really importantthat we're addressing that,
because school districts thatI've been in substitute teachers
might get $40 a day, and so youcould see where that could be a
little disheartening becauseyou're thinking really $40 for
(20:14):
the whole day.
Nicola Soares (20:15):
It's come a long way and I would say it's
somewhere between nationalaverage is $110, $120 maybe, so
we've seen it as high as over$200, depending on credentials
or where they are.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (20:25):
We've seen a lot of districts increase the
daily pay rate, which has beengreat because we needed to do
that, quite frankly, oh, yeah,if you wanted to be able to
attract qualified individuals tobe able to take on that role,
then I could see compensatingthem fairly would be a great
step in the right direction, andyou were talking about
legislation a little bit earlier.
What kind of policy challengesand opportunities do you believe
(20:49):
would have the greatestpositive impact on building a
sustainable education workforce?
Nicola Soares (20:55):
There are quite a few states that have had
increasing of teacher salarybills on the table.
There's been a lot of statesthat have since kind of passed
some very I think, excitinglegislation recognizing the fact
that we need to pay teachersdifferently.
So I suspect that that's goingto continue.
I mean, especially in light ofthe teacher shortages, we need
(21:17):
to do that.
So I think it's an opportunity.
I'm in the teaching profession.
I started my career as ateacher.
It's an exciting profession, soI'm hopeful that we will see
the average teacher salary go up.
It needs to.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:31):
Yes, fingers crossed, me too.
I hope so.
What's the best way for schoolleaders or potential educational
professionals to explorepartnerships with Kelly
Education?
Nicola Soares (21:42):
So I think the easiest and fastest way.
If they go to kellyeducationcom, they will be able to see a lot
of information on how toconnect with us and what are the
steps and how we go about.
You know the partnering process, so kellyeducationcom.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:58):
Well, thank you so much for joining us today
and telling us about your workat Kelly Education, transforming
what could be viewed simply asa staffing challenge into an
opportunity to enhance thequality of education through
well-prepared professionalsmaking a difference for schools,
educators and, most importantly, the students.
I appreciate you taking thetime to come and talk with me.
Nicola Soares (22:20):
I appreciate you taking the time to come and talk
with me.
Thank you, lisa.
It's been a pleasure being herewith you today, so I wish you a
very good week and thank youfor your podcast, because it is
valuable content, so thank youso much, thank you.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (22:31):
And yours as well.
So shout out to your podcast.
Wake Up and Teach.
Nicola Soares (22:35):
Wake Up and Teach .
Yes, I will have to have youcome on in the future as well.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (22:40):
I would love to do that.
Thank you.
If your school is facingstaffing challenges or if you
want to become a substitute,visit mykellycom to explore
innovative workforce solutionslike those we've discussed today
.
The research is clearEducational continuity matters
tremendously for studentoutcomes.
If you have a story aboutwhat's working in your schools
that you'd like to share, youcan email me at lisa at
(23:02):
drlisahasslercom, or visit mywebsite at wwwdrlisahasslercom
and send me a message.
If you like this podcast,subscribe and tell a friend.
The more people that know, thebigger impact it will have.
And if you find value to thecontent in this podcast,
consider becoming a supporter byclicking on the supporter link
in the show notes.
(23:23):
It is the mission of thispodcast to shine light on the
good in education so that itspreads, affecting positive
change.
So let's keep working togetherto find solutions that focus on
our children's success.
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