September 12, 2024 • 32 mins
What if we could transform education to truly empower every student, regardless of their background? Join me, Dr. Lisa Hassler, and our inspiring guest, Dr. Emily Affolter, as we uncover the potential of building just and inclusive educational environments. Drawing from Paulo Freire's "Pedagogy of the Oppressed" and Jean Anyon's "Social Class in the Hidden Curriculum of Work," we explore how education can challenge social inequalities and become a tool for liberation.
In this episode, Dr. Affolter shares her journey from activism in Seattle to her pivotal role as the director of Prescott College's Sustainability Education PhD program. Her commitment to equity and inclusion is evident as she emphasizes the importance of culturally responsive teaching and equitable leadership. Discover how recognizing students as co-learners and moving beyond the traditional banking model of education creates spaces of dignity and respect. Emily shares inclusive assessment practices and the significance of making implicit expectations explicit to bridge educational gaps.
We also highlight real-world applications and success stories from Prescott University, illustrating how culturally responsive pedagogy empowers students. Hear about innovative projects, such as climate justice-related screenplays, that connect theory to practice. As we discuss the vital roles educators and parents play in fostering a culture of equity and justice, we encourage you to share your stories and support the mission of creating positive change in education. Let’s work together to dismantle inequitable power dynamics and champion a brighter, more inclusive future for all students.
Connect with Dr. Emily Affolter at eaffolter@prescott.edu.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (00:09):
Welcome to The Brighter Side of Education:
Research, Innovation andResources.
I'm your host, Dr.
Lisa Hassler, here to enlightenand brighten the classrooms in
America through focusedconversation on important topics
in education.
In each episode, I discussproblems we as teachers and
parents are facing and whatpeople are doing in their
communities to fix it.
(00:29):
What are the variables and howcan we duplicate it to maximize
student outcomes?
In this episode, we exploreways to build a just and
inclusive educationalenvironment for everyone.
But before we begin ourconversation, I'd like to
briefly highlight twofoundational works in
educational theory that arerelevant to our discussion today
Paulo Freire's Pedagogy of theOppressed, published in 1968,
(00:54):
and Jean Anyon's Social Class inthe Hidden Curriculum of Work,
published in 1980.
Freire advocated for liberatingthe working classes through a
just and equitable model ofeducation.
He argued that traditionalteaching methods often leave
marginalized groups powerless bytreating them as passive
recipients of knowledge.
Instead, he promoted activeparticipation, dialogue and
(01:17):
critical thinking betweeneducators and students, enabling
individuals to develop a senseof self, liberating themselves
from societal injustices andbecoming agents of change.
Jean Anyon's study explores howschools serving different
social classes provide distincttypes of education, preparing
students for specific societalroles.
Anyon found that the implicitlessons, which she called the
(01:41):
hidden curriculum, oftenreinforce social inequities.
For example, schools inwealthier areas might encourage
critical thinking and creativity, while those in poorer areas
might focus more on rotelearning and discipline.
These works highlight howeducation can either reinforce
or challenge social inequalities, providing a lens to understand
the impact of teachingpractices on different social
(02:03):
groups.
In today's discussion, we willexplore the relevance of these
ideas to current educationalpractices and how they can be
applied to address contemporarychallenges in equity and
inclusion.
As the director of PrescottCollege's Sustainability
Education PhD program and aleading authority in
equity-centered teaching,culturally responsive pedagogy
(02:24):
and equitable leadership, Dr.
Emily Affolter joins us todayto share her insights and
practical applications forcreating more equitable and
inclusive educationalenvironments.
Welcome, it is so wonderful tohave you here today.
Dr. Emily Affolter (02:39):
Thank you, Lisa, I'm delighted.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (02:42):
So, Emily, can you start by sharing a bit
about yourself, your backgroundand what inspired you to focus
on equity and inclusion ineducation?
Dr. Emily Affolter (02:52):
Well, yeah, my name's Emily Affolter and
currently I'm the director ofthe Sustainability Education PhD
at Prescott College and we lookat the convergence of social
and environmental justice asthey pertain to teaching,
learning and leading, and I, youknow, I always was interested
(03:13):
in issues of injustice.
I think it really started.
I grew up in the Seattle areaand I went to a public high
school that was really known foractivism.
It was the place of JimiHendrix and Quincy Jones, and we
had a lot of like Black Pantherlegacy, and so when I was a
young person, they had a programcalled Cultural Relations where
(03:36):
they would take a racialized,gendered quota of different
people, so maybe there were likea couple white young women and
then you know this whole racialstratification.
They looked at and built acadre of facilitators maybe a
hundred of us that were genderand racially diverse, and they
put us in a learning weekendthat was run by former Black
(04:00):
Panther activists to help us, asreally young people, think
about how we can disrupt issuesof injustice, and so they gave
us tools to think and talk aboutissues that pertain to
discrimination, oppression andprejudice, and then so we were
getting really empowered to doso and getting a lot of tools to
(04:21):
disrupt, and then the schoolwould shut down for a week and
we all got to facilitate.
Like, me and a co-facilitatorwho had a different
positionality would sit togetherin a room and we would talk
with our peers and facilitateconversations about racism,
homophobia, police brutality,and that was something that was
(04:43):
so strong in the culture of theplace that I was growing up, and
even though the place had realissues with these things, there
was also a tenacity to addressthem.
And so, even though you knowI'm a white cis woman, I also
always grew up with this sort ofI know it could be so much
(05:04):
better, and how can I in thisbody, continue to work towards
that?
And so I've carried that spiritalong with me throughout my
whole career, because it was acore value that not everything
is fair and power and privilegepermeate our world and our
epistemologies and oureducational spaces, and how can
(05:25):
we, in our own accountability,show up to try to make it a
better place?
So fast forward way far?
I was a Spanish educator and Ikept feeling like the curricula
that I was handed was superEurocentric and pretty
homogenous, and I just keptfeeling like there's got to be
more freedom, there's got to bemore freedom, and kept pursuing
(05:47):
further education to sort ofreinforce that questioning,
which, which you know, wasvalidating, and I ended with a
PhD in multicultural education,working under the guidance and
mentorship of the great DrGeneva Gay, who founded
Culturally Responsive Teaching,and she's really informed so
(06:09):
much of my research, teachingand scholarship for the last
dozen plus years, and so that'swhat I carry forward.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (06:16):
What an impactful background.
I can see where that reallymade a big impression and what
an inspiration you then becometo others.
So, when you're talking aboutworking underneath the guise of
Dr Geneva Gay, Geneva Gay, andthen she is the founder of
Culturally Responsive Teaching,yes, so what is Culturally
Responsive Teaching?
And then why should educatorsuse this approach?
Dr. Emily Affolter (06:39):
So Culturally Responsive Teaching
is again Dr Geneva Gay's baby.
It was sort of founded underthe umbrella of multicultural
education and it's really amethodology and a pedagogy that
looks at the importance ofplurality in learning spaces.
(06:59):
Students of color, just general, like the fact that we have
this incredibly diverse cadre ofstudents, ways of being.
They come with their ownstories and funds of knowledge
and languages and rich heritage.
And how do we take an honoringof that plurality and center it
(07:21):
in the way that we show up forour students from?
You know the content that wecurate so that it reflects the
students themselves, systems ofpower and privilege, in order to
(07:48):
change how power is dispersedand increase access and
opportunity, particularly forour students of color, but any
student that is disenfranchisedor minoritized.
How do we actually change theway that we think about teaching
so that it is reflecting thatheterogeneity of method of
approach that would then supporta heterogeneous group of
students and uplift them intheir assets?
Dr. Lisa Hassler (08:09):
Yeah, and you know, when I was reading about
you and about this subject, Iwas thinking about the theorist
and the author, paulo Freire,and he's Brazilian and he
published the Pedagogy of theOppressed in 1968.
And so when we think about thistype of education and how it's
(08:31):
not a new problem, even acrossdifferent countries, it exists.
It still exists today.
His focus was on how to achievefreedom and the importance of
becoming aware of those socialinjustices, and you had
collaborated with thepublication just last year and
it was Can we Be Free, anEngineer's Guide to Culturally
Responsive Teaching.
(08:52):
That theme of freedom witheducation rang out to me and I
wondered how do those ideasinfluence your work and how can
they help empower students,especially those from
marginalized backgrounds?
Dr. Emily Affolter (09:07):
Thank you for bringing up Freire.
Yes, freire's work has reallybeen.
It's informed a lot of the workthat I've done and many just
even the way that thisinstitution that I'm working for
approaches education PrescottCollege.
Freire talks about the bankingsystem of education as the
(09:27):
status quo, where we, you know,as educators who have power,
would deposit knowledge in thevessels of our students.
Right, and critiques that andreally horizontalizes the
approach to teaching andlearning.
What happens when we no longerconsider ourselves as the
educators, the holders of powerand the holders of finite
(09:48):
knowledge, and imagine thepossibility of everyone in the
room having something incrediblygenerative to offer and
co-learning, and so, in so manyways, that is a disruption of
the power structure of education.
Who gets to transmit knowledge?
And then how does thatreinforce how we feel about our
(10:11):
freedom, like you said, or ourpotential, or access and
opportunity and even efficacy?
Right, if we can horizontalizethat in our classrooms and we
come in with this deep, profoundhonoring and respect of all of
the students as holders ofknowledge or co-learners, then
all of a sudden, freedom ispossible because we get to
(10:34):
co-author this trajectorytogether out of a place of
dignity and respect.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (10:38):
Yeah, absolutely.
It just makes us think back toour teaching practices and why
it is that we want that criticalthinking and why it is that we
approach teaching as everyonehas something to teach each
other.
It's this conversation of ideasand it's this exchange of
intellect that allows us to growand then understand our own
(11:01):
potential, which is empowering.
Dr. Emily Affolter (11:03):
Absolutely, and then understand our own
potential, which is empowering.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (11:05):
Absolutely.
And then Jean Anion's researchshows how social class can
affect the type of educationthat students receive.
Can you talk about the impactof these differences and how
educators can bridge these gaps?
Dr. Emily Affolter (11:18):
Absolutely yeah.
First of all, I think that, asas an educator, I'm first always
thinking about my positionalityand that's sort of the layers
of what make me who I am, andsome of those might be social
identities, and of this we'reall made up, of these
(12:05):
intersecting identities thathave relationships to power and
privilege.
So if we think about how everyperson and every experience is
laden with sort of the politicsof positionality, informed by
our intersectional experiences,then all of a sudden we
recognize that some people arejust going to have more access
(12:30):
to what the dominant narrativeis in education and others much
less, and so dominant narrativereally leans on middle to upper
middle class folks who wouldhave sort of some basic literacy
and fluency around educationaltopics that might just be
(12:52):
implicitly woven into curriculaof culturally responsive
teaching, in my mind is explicitcommunication and transparency
around unveiling what thishidden curriculum could be.
So, when you're thinking aboutclasses, how can we create a
(13:13):
really common language aroundeconomizing the pathway for
students, the classes that theyneed to take, the skills that
they will garner in thoseclasses, students, the classes
that they need to take, theskills that they will garner in
those classes, how those skillsmight translate to the
professional sector, what youneed in order to go out and get
a job.
What does creating a CV looklike?
How could you move through thepublication process?
(13:37):
How might you get on the TEDxstage?
You know, like I know, I'mgetting a little esoteric in
higher ed, but you don't justjump from.
They're great leaps, right Forany, and we can think about it
in K-12 too.
They're great leaps to get toliteracy, you know, or great
leaps to get to algebra.
And so how do we make sure thatwe're not skipping steps that
(14:02):
are so often implicit, notexplicit, in our curriculum,
because those steps might feelexplicit in certain households,
with certain norms and decorum,and others not.
And so, first of all, it's justneutralizing that by making
sure that there are noassumptions around what our
(14:25):
learners do and don't haveaccess to in the home space, and
also not privileging the factthat some people might have
access to more literacy supports, more you know, math practice,
more sort of transference in thehome.
It seems so simple, but I thinkso often if we're in the
(14:47):
dominant, if we exist in thedominant paradigm and those
things seem second nature to us,that can really deeply further
stratify access and opportunitygaps for our learners.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (15:01):
Absolutely.
And when I think about thehidden curriculum, when it comes
to Jean Anion's study, howpowerful it was for me to see,
as an educator I just assumeeveryone gets the same as I had
right, because that's myexperience.
So I just think everyone hadwhat I had.
Everyone was taught the sameway, we were taught the same
(15:21):
things.
And then when I became aneducator and I went into the
schools and you're thinking,these are the standards, they're
the state standards, everychild gets those standards.
Fifth grade classes samestandards were taught very, very
(15:45):
differently.
How did we deliver that contentto them?
What were our expectations asan educator?
So when I think about thathidden curriculum, it really
makes me think what is it thatthe students are expected?
And are we challenging?
When we think about thecomplexity of our comprehension,
(16:06):
do we ask just for wrote back,because we think that's all they
can give us?
Or do we challenge them to becreative and to create something
because we feel that they havethe ability?
So so much is in our ownexpectations that they have the
ability.
So so much is in our ownexpectations.
(16:27):
But then also, I was surprisedby how often, like what I had
done, grew up in one area and Itaught in that area.
So my experience became then mystudents' experience, right,
how I was taught I was teaching.
In a sense, your expectationstransfer to the same and that
way it continues and you don'teven realize that we're
continuing these hittingcurriculum expectations of
(16:51):
inequalities.
Yeah, if you, if you've neverexperienced anything else, we
just perpetuate it withoutknowing it no-transcript, just
(17:49):
as siloing and myopic asanything else.
Dr. Emily Affolter (17:53):
And, of course, with the stats.
When we look at, you know,racial stratification in terms
of access and opportunity, basedon our educational systems and
who's teaching predominantly, wecan see how those patterns
would reinforce themselves if wedon't act to interrupt them.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (18:10):
Absolutely.
Yeah, it's understanding whereour blinders are.
You do some work withassessment as well, like how to
be able to assess for equity.
What kind of assessments do youdo with that?
Dr. Emily Affolter (18:22):
Oh yay.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (18:22):
I love assessment.
Dr. Emily Affolter (18:25):
I used to work as an evaluator for a
research team at the UW and Ijust love the potential for
really being reflective aboutoneself in order to act
differently.
I have found in my process thatthe most culturally responsive
assessment is formative, and so,as much as we can emphasize
(18:49):
formative assessment for ourstudents which meaning, you know
, for anyone who's not in theassessment world really the
action piece, the actioncompletion process over product,
if our students are in theprocess of engaging, if they're
tenacious, opposed to, it's doneand we look at the final
(19:11):
product and we give it asummative grade, right, you know
, I think that there's functionin summative assessment and it
can be done with nuance andfinesse.
But I've tried to take the workthat I do and create much more
of an emphasis on the scaffoldfrom an assessment angle.
So it's it's like if there's afinal assignment in a course and
(19:34):
it's, you know, you're creatingsome singular thing, how can
the scaffold of the process, soif you're creating something
that you're going to createmultiple metrics for students to
turn in and often that turn incould be to each other, to their
peers, to create trust inthemselves and in one another
(19:55):
and sort of recognize that it'snot just the instructor that is
going to be assessing, butthere's a deeper sense of
self-assessment.
You know I'm going to turn thisin and I know that because I did
the work, there's going to bevalue in it and then I'm going
to offer my insights for mypeers so that they can improve
(20:18):
upon it.
And then, all of a sudden, thenexus of power shifts and they
start to feel more agency andownership in themselves and in
the importance of process,knowing that if they emphasize
process with care and continuousjust diligence, that the
product will ensue as somethingthat is going to be satisfactory
(20:41):
.
I work with STEM teachers inK-12, and we found so many ways
to shift the way that assessmentis going down and then in
summative assessments.
Also, how can we shift some ofthose questions in summative
assessments so that they aren'tso singular?
You know, close ended.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:01):
Yes.
Dr. Emily Affolter (21:02):
But actually allowing for plural and
conditional possibilities, openended opportunities for students
to think creatively.
Those kinds of assessments canreally mitigate stereotype
threat, like allow students tobelieve in themselves and
imagine and think critically inways that are close-ended sort
(21:22):
of binary thinking norms.
Do not support.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:27):
I think that a lot of workplaces are even
going to those type ofevaluations where you do a
self-reflection, your peers areassessing your work and then
your boss, right, and so I thinkthat that's becoming more
calming and getting kids used tohow they feel about their work
(21:49):
and then how the people on theirteam feel about their work also
matters, and so it's not justI'm impressing this person,
who's the authority they havethe power to control my grade
but I also have to think aboutwhat does that learning look
like and mean to this communityas well?
(22:09):
And so that's powerful and thentake that type of feedback, look
at it constructively and sayhow can I keep getting better
and growing?
And so this positive feelingabout feedback instead of this
one and done.
And, like you're saying, withthose questions, when we think
about biases, sometimes the waythat we're wording questions,
(22:30):
we're just assuming everybodyhas the same background
knowledge and they don't, and sosomething as simple as the way
that a question is worded canthrow up a barrier with our
students that we're not evenaware of because we're just
assuming we all came to thetable with the same knowing.
Can you share some successfulexamples of how educators and
(22:51):
institutions have empoweredstudents through inclusive
practices and equity-centeredinitiatives?
You guys do a lot of that atyour campus.
I went onto your website and,even though we are not in the
same community, I wished I couldgo to your school.
What a positive feeling that Igot just from going to your
(23:11):
website.
The college really has done agreat job of making you feel
very included and invited andwelcoming, even from someone
doing a virtual tour.
So you guys are doing somegreat things on that campus.
Can you talk about that andsome of the impact that it's had
on your school community?
Dr. Emily Affolter (23:28):
Absolutely.
Thank you for all the accolades.
I'm so fuzzied by it and it'syou know, I'm so proud of what
we do pedagogically here,because I do think that it we
really the classroom to you knowthe just the encounters that
happen outside of the classroomso frequently In terms of every
student has a unique fund ofknowledge and unique goals and
curiosities and skills, and allof our classrooms are sort of
(24:22):
built around the sense that ourstudents are exceptional, and I
mean that, and I would extendthat to any human, but I just
mean so that is true though thatwe feel like such an honor to
get to co-learn with them, andwe want them to let their
expertise, their purpose andtheir goals inform the way that
(24:44):
they approach the content.
So if we're doing a course inculturally responsive pedagogy
and we're saying let's create apedagogical model based on all
this literature aroundculturally responsive pedagogy,
and we're saying let's create apedagogical model based on all
this literature aroundculturally responsive pedagogy,
how might you in the bankingsector let your workplace and
your values around financialequity permeate and enmesh with
(25:09):
this theory?
The same is true for, you know,one of one.
It's so exciting to see what'sgoing to unfurl because it comes
(25:35):
from a place of care, curiosityand respect for the unique
gifts that every person, nomatter who, brings to the table.
And I think the other thing isthat we really value a
connection between theory andpractice.
So if there is an opportunityto operationalize anything that
you're learning in yourcommunity, we encourage it and
(25:59):
we promote it.
You know and so I'm justthinking of one of our students
is a theater leader like, owns atheater and company and was
able to take all of this work invarious classes around climate
justice and create culturallyresponsive, climate
justice-related screenplays forcommunities in Latin America,
(26:21):
and it ended in a beautifulFulbright and all these other
things.
But the truth is it's such athrill for us because the
students come in with so manygreat ideas and skills and we
just wonder together how mightthese skills be put into
practice and where?
(26:41):
And so the how and theapplication piece is, if at
least as, if not more importantthan the theoretical
underpinnings, and I think thatthat, with the tenets of social
and environmental justice, sortof fueling those thrusts right,
(27:01):
and so how exciting is that?
I mean, and it sounds so simple, but it really is intentionally
dexterous.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (27:09):
Educators can get stuck Like every year I
teach the same things, but Ifeel like when you come at it
with the way that you weretalking about culturally
responsive teaching and abouthaving that impact or an
influence on the students beingable to contribute, every year
is different because you arecreating with the student how
(27:31):
you're going to move forward inthis and the content kind of
just gets enriched Absolutely.
Dr. Emily Affolter (27:38):
I love that and I think about.
We think about process overproduct in so many ways in
culturally responsive teaching.
But if we think about whatwe're delivering as 50%, like
what we pre-plan as educators is50%, and that 50% will emerge
based on the constellation ofwho's in the room and what
(28:01):
curiosities, inquiry, gifts,positionalities they're bringing
in, how exciting is that?
And that comes back to, youknow, windows and mirrors, like
we were talking, they're goingto look different.
And how exciting to remaincurious and humbled by that,
because that is the process ofrelationality and
(28:22):
horizontalizing the classroom.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (28:24):
So, when you think of the future now, what is
your hope for equity andinclusion in education, and how
can parents and educatorscontribute to that?
Dr. Emily Affolter (28:35):
Thank you.
I think that one of the bigprinciples that I would wish we
all really adhered to is thenotion of the asset pedagogy,
the strengths of our students,and opposed to the deficit
pedagogy like the student didn'tdo well on the test, it's on
(28:57):
them.
Because, like we've talkedabout in this conversation, if
we get really curious and werethink the way that we
structure assessment or westructure our courses
methodologically and content,and we emphasize the assets of
all of us, especially thestudents and the systemically
(29:19):
minoritized folks in the room,then we can see the tables turn
quickly, the onus on theeducator to get curious about
the system and wonder how thesystem has a relationship to
reinforcing inequitable powerdynamics and then look for ways
(29:42):
to change and dismantle thoseareas that reinforce inequity.
Then all of a sudden the assetsof all of us and all of our
students become the core focusand I think that is the key to
equitable futures in oureducational realms.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (30:01):
Well, I think that's hopeful and I look
forward to that future.
Thank you so much for thisamazing conversation on equity
and inclusion in the classroom.
I learned a lot from you, sothank you for all that you're
doing in your university andcontributing to the classroom.
I learned a lot from you, sothank you for all that you're
doing in your university andcontributing to the literature.
How would someone get ahold ofyou if they wanted to reach out?
Dr. Emily Affolter (30:19):
Thank you.
Well, they could email eaffolter@prescott.
edu.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (30:28):
Your university, Prescott University.
And your university, PrescottUniversity.
Dr. Emily Affolter (30:34):
And where are you located?
We're on Yavapai lands inPrescott, Arizona, so this is
Northern Arizona PrescottCollege.
We can hear the cicadas hummingin the background and it's a
lovely place.
So if you're ever in the area,please hit me up and we just
yeah, we love you can hit up thePrescott College website and
we'd love to hear from you andjust continue to build our
(30:54):
epistemological community.
I'm so happy we got to talk.
Lisa and I have such incrediblerespect for you and the work
you're doing in the world.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (31:03):
Thank you.
Thank you.
As educators and parents.
We each have a role to play infostering a culture of equity
and justice.
I hope today's discussioninspired you to reflect and
consider how you can contributeto fostering equity, whether
it's through adopting culturallyresponsive teaching practices,
challenging the hiddencurriculum or simply engaging in
conversations about inclusion,Every action counts.
(31:25):
If you have a story aboutwhat's working in your schools
that you'd like to share, youcan email me at lisa@
drlisarhassler.
com, or visit my website at www.
drlisarhassler.
com and send me a message.
If you like this podcast,subscribe and tell a friend.
The more people that know, thebigger impact it will have.
And if you find value to thecontent in this podcast,
(31:47):
consider becoming a supporter byclicking on the supporter link
in the show notes.
It is the mission of thispodcast to shine light on the
good in education so that itspreads, affecting positive
change.
So let's keep working togetherto find solutions that focus on
our children's success.
Welcome to The Brighter Side of Education:
Research, Innovation andResources.
I'm your host, Dr.
Lisa Hassler, here to enlightenand brighten the classrooms in
America through focusedconversation on important topics
in education.
In each episode, I discussproblems we as teachers and
parents are facing and whatpeople are doing in their
communities to fix it.
(00:29):
What are the variables and howcan we duplicate it to maximize
student outcomes?
In this episode, we exploreways to build a just and
inclusive educationalenvironment for everyone.
But before we begin ourconversation, I'd like to
briefly highlight twofoundational works in
educational theory that arerelevant to our discussion today
Paulo Freire's Pedagogy of theOppressed, published in 1968,
(00:54):
and Jean Anyon's Social Class inthe Hidden Curriculum of Work,
published in 1980.
Freire advocated for liberatingthe working classes through a
just and equitable model ofeducation.
He argued that traditionalteaching methods often leave
marginalized groups powerless bytreating them as passive
recipients of knowledge.
Instead, he promoted activeparticipation, dialogue and
(01:17):
critical thinking betweeneducators and students, enabling
individuals to develop a senseof self, liberating themselves
from societal injustices andbecoming agents of change.
Jean Anyon's study explores howschools serving different
social classes provide distincttypes of education, preparing
students for specific societalroles.
Anyon found that the implicitlessons, which she called the
(01:41):
hidden curriculum, oftenreinforce social inequities.
For example, schools inwealthier areas might encourage
critical thinking and creativity, while those in poorer areas
might focus more on rotelearning and discipline.
These works highlight howeducation can either reinforce
or challenge social inequalities, providing a lens to understand
the impact of teachingpractices on different social
(02:03):
groups.
In today's discussion, we willexplore the relevance of these
ideas to current educationalpractices and how they can be
applied to address contemporarychallenges in equity and
inclusion.
As the director of PrescottCollege's Sustainability
Education PhD program and aleading authority in
equity-centered teaching,culturally responsive pedagogy
(02:24):
and equitable leadership, Dr.
Emily Affolter joins us todayto share her insights and
practical applications forcreating more equitable and
inclusive educationalenvironments.
Welcome, it is so wonderful tohave you here today.
Dr. Emily Affolter (02:39):
Thank you, Lisa, I'm delighted.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (02:42):
So, Emily, can you start by sharing a bit
about yourself, your backgroundand what inspired you to focus
on equity and inclusion ineducation?
Dr. Emily Affolter (02:52):
Well, yeah, my name's Emily Affolter and
currently I'm the director ofthe Sustainability Education PhD
at Prescott College and we lookat the convergence of social
and environmental justice asthey pertain to teaching,
learning and leading, and I, youknow, I always was interested
(03:13):
in issues of injustice.
I think it really started.
I grew up in the Seattle areaand I went to a public high
school that was really known foractivism.
It was the place of JimiHendrix and Quincy Jones, and we
had a lot of like Black Pantherlegacy, and so when I was a
young person, they had a programcalled Cultural Relations where
(03:36):
they would take a racialized,gendered quota of different
people, so maybe there were likea couple white young women and
then you know this whole racialstratification.
They looked at and built acadre of facilitators maybe a
hundred of us that were genderand racially diverse, and they
put us in a learning weekendthat was run by former Black
(04:00):
Panther activists to help us, asreally young people, think
about how we can disrupt issuesof injustice, and so they gave
us tools to think and talk aboutissues that pertain to
discrimination, oppression andprejudice, and then so we were
getting really empowered to doso and getting a lot of tools to
(04:21):
disrupt, and then the schoolwould shut down for a week and
we all got to facilitate.
Like, me and a co-facilitatorwho had a different
positionality would sit togetherin a room and we would talk
with our peers and facilitateconversations about racism,
homophobia, police brutality,and that was something that was
(04:43):
so strong in the culture of theplace that I was growing up, and
even though the place had realissues with these things, there
was also a tenacity to addressthem.
And so, even though you knowI'm a white cis woman, I also
always grew up with this sort ofI know it could be so much
(05:04):
better, and how can I in thisbody, continue to work towards
that?
And so I've carried that spiritalong with me throughout my
whole career, because it was acore value that not everything
is fair and power and privilegepermeate our world and our
epistemologies and oureducational spaces, and how can
(05:25):
we, in our own accountability,show up to try to make it a
better place?
So fast forward way far?
I was a Spanish educator and Ikept feeling like the curricula
that I was handed was superEurocentric and pretty
homogenous, and I just keptfeeling like there's got to be
more freedom, there's got to bemore freedom, and kept pursuing
(05:47):
further education to sort ofreinforce that questioning,
which, which you know, wasvalidating, and I ended with a
PhD in multicultural education,working under the guidance and
mentorship of the great DrGeneva Gay, who founded
Culturally Responsive Teaching,and she's really informed so
(06:09):
much of my research, teachingand scholarship for the last
dozen plus years, and so that'swhat I carry forward.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (06:16):
What an impactful background.
I can see where that reallymade a big impression and what
an inspiration you then becometo others.
So, when you're talking aboutworking underneath the guise of
Dr Geneva Gay, Geneva Gay, andthen she is the founder of
Culturally Responsive Teaching,yes, so what is Culturally
Responsive Teaching?
And then why should educatorsuse this approach?
Dr. Emily Affolter (06:39):
So Culturally Responsive Teaching
is again Dr Geneva Gay's baby.
It was sort of founded underthe umbrella of multicultural
education and it's really amethodology and a pedagogy that
looks at the importance ofplurality in learning spaces.
(06:59):
Students of color, just general, like the fact that we have
this incredibly diverse cadre ofstudents, ways of being.
They come with their ownstories and funds of knowledge
and languages and rich heritage.
And how do we take an honoringof that plurality and center it
(07:21):
in the way that we show up forour students from?
You know the content that wecurate so that it reflects the
students themselves, systems ofpower and privilege, in order to
(07:48):
change how power is dispersedand increase access and
opportunity, particularly forour students of color, but any
student that is disenfranchisedor minoritized.
How do we actually change theway that we think about teaching
so that it is reflecting thatheterogeneity of method of
approach that would then supporta heterogeneous group of
students and uplift them intheir assets?
Dr. Lisa Hassler (08:09):
Yeah, and you know, when I was reading about
you and about this subject, Iwas thinking about the theorist
and the author, paulo Freire,and he's Brazilian and he
published the Pedagogy of theOppressed in 1968.
And so when we think about thistype of education and how it's
(08:31):
not a new problem, even acrossdifferent countries, it exists.
It still exists today.
His focus was on how to achievefreedom and the importance of
becoming aware of those socialinjustices, and you had
collaborated with thepublication just last year and
it was Can we Be Free, anEngineer's Guide to Culturally
Responsive Teaching.
(08:52):
That theme of freedom witheducation rang out to me and I
wondered how do those ideasinfluence your work and how can
they help empower students,especially those from
marginalized backgrounds?
Dr. Emily Affolter (09:07):
Thank you for bringing up Freire.
Yes, freire's work has reallybeen.
It's informed a lot of the workthat I've done and many just
even the way that thisinstitution that I'm working for
approaches education PrescottCollege.
Freire talks about the bankingsystem of education as the
(09:27):
status quo, where we, you know,as educators who have power,
would deposit knowledge in thevessels of our students.
Right, and critiques that andreally horizontalizes the
approach to teaching andlearning.
What happens when we no longerconsider ourselves as the
educators, the holders of powerand the holders of finite
(09:48):
knowledge, and imagine thepossibility of everyone in the
room having something incrediblygenerative to offer and
co-learning, and so, in so manyways, that is a disruption of
the power structure of education.
Who gets to transmit knowledge?
And then how does thatreinforce how we feel about our
(10:11):
freedom, like you said, or ourpotential, or access and
opportunity and even efficacy?
Right, if we can horizontalizethat in our classrooms and we
come in with this deep, profoundhonoring and respect of all of
the students as holders ofknowledge or co-learners, then
all of a sudden, freedom ispossible because we get to
(10:34):
co-author this trajectorytogether out of a place of
dignity and respect.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (10:38):
Yeah, absolutely.
It just makes us think back toour teaching practices and why
it is that we want that criticalthinking and why it is that we
approach teaching as everyonehas something to teach each
other.
It's this conversation of ideasand it's this exchange of
intellect that allows us to growand then understand our own
(11:01):
potential, which is empowering.
Dr. Emily Affolter (11:03):
Absolutely, and then understand our own
potential, which is empowering.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (11:05):
Absolutely.
And then Jean Anion's researchshows how social class can
affect the type of educationthat students receive.
Can you talk about the impactof these differences and how
educators can bridge these gaps?
Dr. Emily Affolter (11:18):
Absolutely yeah.
First of all, I think that, asas an educator, I'm first always
thinking about my positionalityand that's sort of the layers
of what make me who I am, andsome of those might be social
identities, and of this we'reall made up, of these
(12:05):
intersecting identities thathave relationships to power and
privilege.
So if we think about how everyperson and every experience is
laden with sort of the politicsof positionality, informed by
our intersectional experiences,then all of a sudden we
recognize that some people arejust going to have more access
(12:30):
to what the dominant narrativeis in education and others much
less, and so dominant narrativereally leans on middle to upper
middle class folks who wouldhave sort of some basic literacy
and fluency around educationaltopics that might just be
(12:52):
implicitly woven into curriculaof culturally responsive
teaching, in my mind is explicitcommunication and transparency
around unveiling what thishidden curriculum could be.
So, when you're thinking aboutclasses, how can we create a
(13:13):
really common language aroundeconomizing the pathway for
students, the classes that theyneed to take, the skills that
they will garner in thoseclasses, students, the classes
that they need to take, theskills that they will garner in
those classes, how those skillsmight translate to the
professional sector, what youneed in order to go out and get
a job.
What does creating a CV looklike?
How could you move through thepublication process?
(13:37):
How might you get on the TEDxstage?
You know, like I know, I'mgetting a little esoteric in
higher ed, but you don't justjump from.
They're great leaps, right Forany, and we can think about it
in K-12 too.
They're great leaps to get toliteracy, you know, or great
leaps to get to algebra.
And so how do we make sure thatwe're not skipping steps that
(14:02):
are so often implicit, notexplicit, in our curriculum,
because those steps might feelexplicit in certain households,
with certain norms and decorum,and others not.
And so, first of all, it's justneutralizing that by making
sure that there are noassumptions around what our
(14:25):
learners do and don't haveaccess to in the home space, and
also not privileging the factthat some people might have
access to more literacy supports, more you know, math practice,
more sort of transference in thehome.
It seems so simple, but I thinkso often if we're in the
(14:47):
dominant, if we exist in thedominant paradigm and those
things seem second nature to us,that can really deeply further
stratify access and opportunitygaps for our learners.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (15:01):
Absolutely.
And when I think about thehidden curriculum, when it comes
to Jean Anion's study, howpowerful it was for me to see,
as an educator I just assumeeveryone gets the same as I had
right, because that's myexperience.
So I just think everyone hadwhat I had.
Everyone was taught the sameway, we were taught the same
(15:21):
things.
And then when I became aneducator and I went into the
schools and you're thinking,these are the standards, they're
the state standards, everychild gets those standards.
Fifth grade classes samestandards were taught very, very
(15:45):
differently.
How did we deliver that contentto them?
What were our expectations asan educator?
So when I think about thathidden curriculum, it really
makes me think what is it thatthe students are expected?
And are we challenging?
When we think about thecomplexity of our comprehension,
(16:06):
do we ask just for wrote back,because we think that's all they
can give us?
Or do we challenge them to becreative and to create something
because we feel that they havethe ability?
So so much is in our ownexpectations that they have the
ability.
So so much is in our ownexpectations.
(16:27):
But then also, I was surprisedby how often, like what I had
done, grew up in one area and Itaught in that area.
So my experience became then mystudents' experience, right,
how I was taught I was teaching.
In a sense, your expectationstransfer to the same and that
way it continues and you don'teven realize that we're
continuing these hittingcurriculum expectations of
(16:51):
inequalities.
Yeah, if you, if you've neverexperienced anything else, we
just perpetuate it withoutknowing it no-transcript, just
(17:49):
as siloing and myopic asanything else.
Dr. Emily Affolter (17:53):
And, of course, with the stats.
When we look at, you know,racial stratification in terms
of access and opportunity, basedon our educational systems and
who's teaching predominantly, wecan see how those patterns
would reinforce themselves if wedon't act to interrupt them.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (18:10):
Absolutely.
Yeah, it's understanding whereour blinders are.
You do some work withassessment as well, like how to
be able to assess for equity.
What kind of assessments do youdo with that?
Dr. Emily Affolter (18:22):
Oh yay.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (18:22):
I love assessment.
Dr. Emily Affolter (18:25):
I used to work as an evaluator for a
research team at the UW and Ijust love the potential for
really being reflective aboutoneself in order to act
differently.
I have found in my process thatthe most culturally responsive
assessment is formative, and so,as much as we can emphasize
(18:49):
formative assessment for ourstudents which meaning, you know
, for anyone who's not in theassessment world really the
action piece, the actioncompletion process over product,
if our students are in theprocess of engaging, if they're
tenacious, opposed to, it's doneand we look at the final
(19:11):
product and we give it asummative grade, right, you know
, I think that there's functionin summative assessment and it
can be done with nuance andfinesse.
But I've tried to take the workthat I do and create much more
of an emphasis on the scaffoldfrom an assessment angle.
So it's it's like if there's afinal assignment in a course and
(19:34):
it's, you know, you're creatingsome singular thing, how can
the scaffold of the process, soif you're creating something
that you're going to createmultiple metrics for students to
turn in and often that turn incould be to each other, to their
peers, to create trust inthemselves and in one another
(19:55):
and sort of recognize that it'snot just the instructor that is
going to be assessing, butthere's a deeper sense of
self-assessment.
You know I'm going to turn thisin and I know that because I did
the work, there's going to bevalue in it and then I'm going
to offer my insights for mypeers so that they can improve
(20:18):
upon it.
And then, all of a sudden, thenexus of power shifts and they
start to feel more agency andownership in themselves and in
the importance of process,knowing that if they emphasize
process with care and continuousjust diligence, that the
product will ensue as somethingthat is going to be satisfactory
(20:41):
.
I work with STEM teachers inK-12, and we found so many ways
to shift the way that assessmentis going down and then in
summative assessments.
Also, how can we shift some ofthose questions in summative
assessments so that they aren'tso singular?
You know, close ended.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:01):
Yes.
Dr. Emily Affolter (21:02):
But actually allowing for plural and
conditional possibilities, openended opportunities for students
to think creatively.
Those kinds of assessments canreally mitigate stereotype
threat, like allow students tobelieve in themselves and
imagine and think critically inways that are close-ended sort
(21:22):
of binary thinking norms.
Do not support.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:27):
I think that a lot of workplaces are even
going to those type ofevaluations where you do a
self-reflection, your peers areassessing your work and then
your boss, right, and so I thinkthat that's becoming more
calming and getting kids used tohow they feel about their work
(21:49):
and then how the people on theirteam feel about their work also
matters, and so it's not justI'm impressing this person,
who's the authority they havethe power to control my grade
but I also have to think aboutwhat does that learning look
like and mean to this communityas well?
(22:09):
And so that's powerful and thentake that type of feedback, look
at it constructively and sayhow can I keep getting better
and growing?
And so this positive feelingabout feedback instead of this
one and done.
And, like you're saying, withthose questions, when we think
about biases, sometimes the waythat we're wording questions,
(22:30):
we're just assuming everybodyhas the same background
knowledge and they don't, and sosomething as simple as the way
that a question is worded canthrow up a barrier with our
students that we're not evenaware of because we're just
assuming we all came to thetable with the same knowing.
Can you share some successfulexamples of how educators and
(22:51):
institutions have empoweredstudents through inclusive
practices and equity-centeredinitiatives?
You guys do a lot of that atyour campus.
I went onto your website and,even though we are not in the
same community, I wished I couldgo to your school.
What a positive feeling that Igot just from going to your
(23:11):
website.
The college really has done agreat job of making you feel
very included and invited andwelcoming, even from someone
doing a virtual tour.
So you guys are doing somegreat things on that campus.
Can you talk about that andsome of the impact that it's had
on your school community?
Dr. Emily Affolter (23:28):
Absolutely.
Thank you for all the accolades.
I'm so fuzzied by it and it'syou know, I'm so proud of what
we do pedagogically here,because I do think that it we
really the classroom to you knowthe just the encounters that
happen outside of the classroomso frequently In terms of every
student has a unique fund ofknowledge and unique goals and
curiosities and skills, and allof our classrooms are sort of
(24:22):
built around the sense that ourstudents are exceptional, and I
mean that, and I would extendthat to any human, but I just
mean so that is true though thatwe feel like such an honor to
get to co-learn with them, andwe want them to let their
expertise, their purpose andtheir goals inform the way that
(24:44):
they approach the content.
So if we're doing a course inculturally responsive pedagogy
and we're saying let's create apedagogical model based on all
this literature aroundculturally responsive pedagogy,
and we're saying let's create apedagogical model based on all
this literature aroundculturally responsive pedagogy,
how might you in the bankingsector let your workplace and
your values around financialequity permeate and enmesh with
(25:09):
this theory?
The same is true for, you know,one of one.
It's so exciting to see what'sgoing to unfurl because it comes
(25:35):
from a place of care, curiosityand respect for the unique
gifts that every person, nomatter who, brings to the table.
And I think the other thing isthat we really value a
connection between theory andpractice.
So if there is an opportunityto operationalize anything that
you're learning in yourcommunity, we encourage it and
(25:59):
we promote it.
You know and so I'm justthinking of one of our students
is a theater leader like, owns atheater and company and was
able to take all of this work invarious classes around climate
justice and create culturallyresponsive, climate
justice-related screenplays forcommunities in Latin America,
(26:21):
and it ended in a beautifulFulbright and all these other
things.
But the truth is it's such athrill for us because the
students come in with so manygreat ideas and skills and we
just wonder together how mightthese skills be put into
practice and where?
(26:41):
And so the how and theapplication piece is, if at
least as, if not more importantthan the theoretical
underpinnings, and I think thatthat, with the tenets of social
and environmental justice, sortof fueling those thrusts right,
(27:01):
and so how exciting is that?
I mean, and it sounds so simple, but it really is intentionally
dexterous.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (27:09):
Educators can get stuck Like every year I
teach the same things, but Ifeel like when you come at it
with the way that you weretalking about culturally
responsive teaching and abouthaving that impact or an
influence on the students beingable to contribute, every year
is different because you arecreating with the student how
(27:31):
you're going to move forward inthis and the content kind of
just gets enriched Absolutely.
Dr. Emily Affolter (27:38):
I love that and I think about.
We think about process overproduct in so many ways in
culturally responsive teaching.
But if we think about whatwe're delivering as 50%, like
what we pre-plan as educators is50%, and that 50% will emerge
based on the constellation ofwho's in the room and what
(28:01):
curiosities, inquiry, gifts,positionalities they're bringing
in, how exciting is that?
And that comes back to, youknow, windows and mirrors, like
we were talking, they're goingto look different.
And how exciting to remaincurious and humbled by that,
because that is the process ofrelationality and
(28:22):
horizontalizing the classroom.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (28:24):
So, when you think of the future now, what is
your hope for equity andinclusion in education, and how
can parents and educatorscontribute to that?
Dr. Emily Affolter (28:35):
Thank you.
I think that one of the bigprinciples that I would wish we
all really adhered to is thenotion of the asset pedagogy,
the strengths of our students,and opposed to the deficit
pedagogy like the student didn'tdo well on the test, it's on
(28:57):
them.
Because, like we've talkedabout in this conversation, if
we get really curious and werethink the way that we
structure assessment or westructure our courses
methodologically and content,and we emphasize the assets of
all of us, especially thestudents and the systemically
(29:19):
minoritized folks in the room,then we can see the tables turn
quickly, the onus on theeducator to get curious about
the system and wonder how thesystem has a relationship to
reinforcing inequitable powerdynamics and then look for ways
(29:42):
to change and dismantle thoseareas that reinforce inequity.
Then all of a sudden the assetsof all of us and all of our
students become the core focusand I think that is the key to
equitable futures in oureducational realms.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (30:01):
Well, I think that's hopeful and I look
forward to that future.
Thank you so much for thisamazing conversation on equity
and inclusion in the classroom.
I learned a lot from you, sothank you for all that you're
doing in your university andcontributing to the classroom.
I learned a lot from you, sothank you for all that you're
doing in your university andcontributing to the literature.
How would someone get ahold ofyou if they wanted to reach out?
Dr. Emily Affolter (30:19):
Thank you.
Well, they could email eaffolter@prescott.
edu.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (30:28):
Your university, Prescott University.
And your university, PrescottUniversity.
Dr. Emily Affolter (30:34):
And where are you located?
We're on Yavapai lands inPrescott, Arizona, so this is
Northern Arizona PrescottCollege.
We can hear the cicadas hummingin the background and it's a
lovely place.
So if you're ever in the area,please hit me up and we just
yeah, we love you can hit up thePrescott College website and
we'd love to hear from you andjust continue to build our
(30:54):
epistemological community.
I'm so happy we got to talk.
Lisa and I have such incrediblerespect for you and the work
you're doing in the world.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (31:03):
Thank you.
Thank you.
As educators and parents.
We each have a role to play infostering a culture of equity
and justice.
I hope today's discussioninspired you to reflect and
consider how you can contributeto fostering equity, whether
it's through adopting culturallyresponsive teaching practices,
challenging the hiddencurriculum or simply engaging in
conversations about inclusion,Every action counts.
(31:25):
If you have a story aboutwhat's working in your schools
that you'd like to share, youcan email me at lisa@
drlisarhassler.
com, or visit my website at www.
drlisarhassler.
com and send me a message.
If you like this podcast,subscribe and tell a friend.
The more people that know, thebigger impact it will have.
And if you find value to thecontent in this podcast,
(31:47):
consider becoming a supporter byclicking on the supporter link
in the show notes.
It is the mission of thispodcast to shine light on the
good in education so that itspreads, affecting positive
change.
So let's keep working togetherto find solutions that focus on
our children's success.
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