Robert Barnett, co-founder of the Modern Classrooms Project, explains how their innovative teaching model helps teachers effectively reach students with diverse learning needs through blended, self-paced, mastery-based learning. Traditional teaching methods struggling with different learning paces, gaps in knowledge, and absent students can be transformed with this approach that empowers both teachers and students.
• Traditional teaching models fail when teaching to the middle leaves advanced students bored and struggling students lost
• Modern Classrooms Project combines blended instruction, self-pacing, and mastery-based learning
• Teachers create short instructional videos that students can pause, rewind, and access anytime
• Students work at their own pace, ensuring they master concepts before moving on
• Teacher role shifts from lecturer to providing targeted one-on-one and small group support
• Research shows students feel more capable and develop stronger relationships with teachers
• Schools implementing the model have seen significant increases in test scores
• Teachers report greater job satisfaction and connection to why they entered teaching
• Free resources available through ModernClassrooms.org and InstaLesson.com
• Robert's book "Meet Every Learner's Needs" offers a step-by-step guide to implementation
Visit Insta-lesson.com to create your first blended, self-paced, mastery-based lesson and begin transforming your teaching approach today.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (00:01):
Imagine a classroom where every student
moves at their own pace, mastersconcepts completely before
moving on, and where teachersactually feel less stressed, not
more.
Sounds too good to be true?
Well, it's already happeningthrough something called the
Modern Classrooms Project.
Today we're talking with RobertBarnett, the co-founder, who's
helping make this approach areality.
Welcome to the brighter side ofeducation, research, innovation
(00:34):
and resources.
I'm your host, dr Lisa Hassler,here to enlighten and brighten
the classrooms in Americathrough focused conversation on
important topics in education.
In each episode, I discussproblems we as teachers and
parents are facing and whatpeople are doing in their
communities to fix it.
What are the variables and howcan we duplicate it to maximize
(00:54):
student outcomes In classroomsacross the country?
Teachers are facing anincreasingly complex challenge
how to effectively teachstudents who learn at different
paces, in different ways andneed different levels of support
.
The John Hopkins Study theModern Classrooms Project, a
review of research-based bestpractices determined
overwhelming positive supportfor the Modern Classrooms
(01:16):
Project from the perspective ofboth the students and the
teachers.
Benefits are reported formiddle and high school teachers
as well as student participants.
At the heart of thistransformation are three
innovative strategies.
First, blended instructionseamlessly weaving digital
technology into face-to-faceteaching, creating dynamic
learning experiences.
(01:37):
Second, self-pacing instruction, which empowers students to
progress at their optimal speed,ensuring that they truly grasp
concepts before moving forward.
And third, mastery-basedlearning, and that guarantees
that students develop realcompetency in each skill before
moving on until they're trulyready.
Now I'm thrilled to welcomesomeone who's been instrumental
(02:00):
in developing and implementingthese approaches Robert Barnett.
He is the co-founder of theModern Classrooms Project and
author of Meet Every Learner'sNeeds.
He's here today to share howthese research-backed strategies
are revitalizing education andcreating sustainable solutions
for teachers that really dosupport every student to success
.
Welcome to the show, robert.
(02:22):
Thank you Glad to be here.
Before we dive in, can you takeus back to the moment when you
realized that traditionalteaching methods were not
working for you, and what kindof sparked that creation of the
Modern Classrooms Project?
Robert Barnett (02:36):
Sure, yeah, I'm happy to share that.
You know I started my career asa teacher in independent
schools in Washington DC andthere I taught traditionally and
I had small classrooms andstudents were really motivated,
did a lot of work outside ofschool to make sure that they
could keep up.
And you know, I felt like Icould kind of get by teaching
(03:01):
one lesson per day from theboard and I knew I was teaching
to the middle.
Teaching one lesson per dayfrom the board and I knew I was
teaching to the middle.
I knew that some students wereahead and maybe a little bit
bored, or some students were alittle bit behind and lost, but
it was okay.
I then went to a public schoolwhere I taught big, big public
school classes and I realizedpretty soon that I would not be
(03:21):
able to do this anymore and thegaps between my learners were
just so much bigger.
There I had larger classes,students struggled with
attendance, Some students wereon grade level, some students
were six years behind and theydidn't have the same level of
support outside of school and soon an average day I might walk
into my class and I'd haveseveral students absent, so
(03:44):
they're missing out completely.
I had several students who werelike eager, really eager to
move on, and I had a lot ofstudents who had gaps in their
learning and they just weren'tprepared for grade level content
through no fault of their own.
School hadn't prepared them,and I realized, one lesson per
day, it's not going to meet anyof these learners' needs.
(04:04):
I'm going to teach to themiddle and I'm going to be
missing students on the high end, the low end and who aren't
there at all.
So I realized then that Ineeded to do something different
.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (04:13):
I would agree with you.
I think that that's one of thehardest things with teaching is
there's one of you and there'slike 30 of them, and everyone is
coming to the table withdifferent needs and those gaps,
and it's really hard to beeverything for everybody.
So what you're doing right nowis pretty amazing.
Your model revolves aroundthree key pillars, that's, the
(04:36):
blended learning, theself-pacing and the
mastery-based learning.
So can you tell us what atypical day would look like for
the student and the teacherusing those three pillars?
Robert Barnett (04:48):
Of course, yeah, and I will say that it's true
that you really need to teachlike this when you have 30
students, but even when you havea few students, you know
different young people alwayshave different needs, and so one
lesson is rarely going to meetthose needs all at once.
You know, I have two kids andthey're two years apart and you
know they need different things,right, if we're reading, like
(05:09):
they need to be readingdifferent books or doing
different math problems, and soanytime you're trying to teach
multiple learners at once, Ithink there's a better approach
than giving them both or all ofthem, the same lesson at the
same time.
So let me explain what thatbetter approach is.
In my classroom, and now inthousands of other classrooms
around the world through myorganization, the Modern
(05:32):
Classrooms Project, teachersdeliver instruction basically as
follows Rather than standing atthe board delivering one lesson
to whoever happens to be inclass that day, the teacher
digitizes direct instruction,usually through a short, focused
instructional video, so I couldexplain something at the board.
My students would be bored orlost or not there.
(05:54):
I could create a five-minutevideo where I just record my
screen and explain that concept.
Now students can watch thevideo in class.
They can pause, they can rewind, they can watch at home and I'm
free during that time to goanswer their questions, to check
in on them.
It's much more comfortable thanme standing and trying to keep
(06:15):
them quiet.
They're all watching the videojust to get that new content
five or 10-minute videos.
After those videos, studentswill work through some kind of
practice together.
So they close the screens, theyget face-to-face, they're on
paper.
I was a math teacher so maybethey're doing math practice
problems together.
If you're a Spanish teacher,maybe you use a video for
(06:39):
students to learn new vocabulary.
They close the computer, theypractice using that vocabulary
in conversation.
If you're an English teacher,maybe you use a video to explain
how to write a topic sentenceand then students practice
writing topic sentences together.
So after the short video,students are working together
(07:01):
and they're doing this at theirown pace.
That means your advancedstudents might be speeding
through the practice.
Your students with learninggaps might take a little while
longer.
When a student comes in late,they pick up at the beginning
rather than being thrown intowherever you are in the class.
And then the final pillar youmentioned is mastery-based
learning.
That's the idea that school isreally valuable when students
(07:22):
actually understand what they'relearning.
So before a student goes fromlesson one to lesson two, they
should prove they understandlesson one.
You should give that student abrief assessment.
You should say show me youunderstand it.
If you understand lesson one,great, go to lesson two.
If not, hang on, go back to thevideo.
Go back and ask your classmatesTry again.
(07:43):
Let's make sure you understandlesson one before you go to
lesson two.
And because your instruction isdigital, because there's this
self-paced learning, it'spossible really to have a
mastery-based classroom whereyour advanced students are
racing ahead, working fast,super challenged, all the time.
Your students who need moresupport get that support and
(08:04):
your students who arechronically absent pick up where
they left off every day.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (08:08):
The system works in elementary and high
school levels.
Robert Barnett (08:12):
Absolutely.
I developed this myself as ahigh school teacher, but I've
seen it in kindergartenclassrooms and actually, in some
ways, elementary teachers taketo this approach better than
secondary teachers, becausethey're used to more small group
, self-paced, one-on-onelearning, as opposed to
secondary classrooms where it'ssometimes a real mindset shift
(08:33):
to go from one lesson at a timeto this more flexible learning
environment.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (08:37):
Yeah, we're used to centers and the movement
.
You know being able to meetthose students in grouping
abilities Absence students hasalways been a problem, so I love
that this addresses that issuewhere you know you have that gap
, and it's not just one studentmissing one day.
It could be one student missingfive days and another one
missing three, and then anotherone is only the afternoon, and
(08:58):
so it's just the variety, thebarrage of the amounts.
That really is what becomesoverwhelming for a teacher.
And then how long, would yousay for the younger ones, would
it take for students, teachers,to get used to being able to
perfect this method in their ownclassroom, like if they started
this in August?
I know, depending on age, ithas to do with you know a lot
(09:20):
with age, but is this somethingthat would normally take
teachers and students a coupleof weeks to get used to, or is
this something where you reallyhave to spend a lot of time
training your students?
Robert Barnett (09:32):
Yeah well, every learner is different, every
teacher is different, everyclassroom is different.
Sometimes it's harder, I think,to get an 11th or 12th grader
used to this because even thoughthey can understand directions
better, they're so used tolearning as being sit and get,
and this kind of learningobviously is more active.
It gives students more agency.
(09:53):
So that can be a bigger mindsetshift for an older student
versus a younger student who'sjust sort of I'm going to come
in and do what the teacher says.
I do think in general werecommend that teachers take the
time when they start doing thisto orient your students to this
approach, to explain how itwill be different.
The teacher's role shifts.
(10:14):
I mean, you've heard this amillion times from the sage on
the stage to the guide on theside, but so often it's become a
cliche.
But here it actually happensright, the teacher is not
delivering content from theboard anymore.
The teacher is one-on-one,small group support.
The student role shifts fromsit and listen to go out and
find knowledge and findclassmates to learn from and
(10:36):
demonstrate mastery.
So you need to explain that.
You need to give learners timeand in my experience some of my
students got this right away andthey said Mr Barnett, this is
great, I love learning like this.
I did it last year with ateacher or this really just
works for me.
I love watching videos in myspare time to learn, and some
students.
It might be November orDecember and it finally says,
(10:59):
okay, I finally get that I'mresponsible for my own learning.
It took a while, but that's thething.
Our learners are differentpeople and that's why we should
be teaching like this in thefirst place.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (11:09):
Yeah, you were talking about how teachers
would record their own lessons.
So you have something calledInstaLesson.
Do you want to talk a littlebit about how that could help
teachers with their preparationof these lessons, which I could
see may be a little bitoverwhelming for teachers to
have to take the lessons thathave been written on paper and
they are used to being able topull those resources and use the
(11:33):
chalkboard or the whiteboardand now they have to create a
digital lesson.
So how is that working withInstaLesson?
Robert Barnett (11:42):
Yeah, absolutely .
I mean, if you're listening tothis, one thing you might
reasonably be thinking is thisseems like a lot of work.
I know how to show up to myclass and give a lesson, but now
, if students are going to beall over the place on all
different things, I've got tocreate videos like.
That's a lot, and it's truethat if you're going to go all
(12:03):
the way to doing this, it isgoing to take work.
In my opinion, it's aninvestment of time that pays off
over time, because you're goingto be much happier once you're
teaching like this and once youhave your videos for everything.
You don't need to keeprepeating yourself.
Right, you can use those videosas long as you teach, but it
can sometimes be a big lift torecord that first video.
(12:25):
That can be hard.
So I'm working on a tool calledInstaLesson, which helps a
teacher put in a topic any topicyou want to teach and then uses
AI to generate a blended,self-paced, mastery-based lesson
that the teacher can edit,print and share, and I've
designed it to be really easy.
I think a lot of AI tools onthe market can be kind of
(12:48):
complicated.
They have so many features it'shard to know where to start.
But, more importantly, it's atool that's aligned to pedagogy,
to an instructional model.
It's not just more of the samecontent creation for content
creation sake.
It's a tool that really ismeant to support blended,
self-paced, mastery-basedlearning.
So you know, this is anexperimental thing, like I
(13:11):
created a couple months ago.
I'm testing it out, but thehope is that InstaLesson does
help teachers get started withthis model of instruction.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (13:25):
Yeah, and I saw that you were able to import
videos and I like how there's alittle rectangle that's on the
box, so the teacher's face is onthe screen and that the
children hear the teacher'svoice.
So it becomes more meaningful.
I like that personalized touchwith it and then the ease of
being able to use it, because Imight be at a loss to create
every video.
I think that that then goes tothe sustainability of this.
How does this model addressteacher burnout?
(13:47):
By making it more sustainableand then actually increasing
their wellbeing.
How are the teachers respondingto this?
Robert Barnett (13:54):
Yeah, I mean, teaching is so hard.
I was a teacher myself and Iknow how difficult it is all the
planning, all the work, all thecommitment and I think for me
the hardest part was feelinglike I was doing all this work
and I just wasn't seeing theresults in my classroom, like my
students came in so far behindand they left so far behind and
(14:14):
I couldn't meet their needs.
It was just really difficultand I felt like I had people
telling me teach this way, usethis curriculum, et cetera, et
cetera, but they didn't reallyunderstand the challenge that I
faced.
The fundamental challenge wasmy students needed different
things and I was unable to meetall of those needs when I was
teaching in this traditional way, I found that when I started
teaching in the modern classroommodel, a couple of things
(14:36):
changed.
One, even though I was workinghard to create my own videos, I
just felt like I was moreaffected.
Every day I felt like mystudents were more engaged.
I was not at the boardcontrolling behavior.
I was sitting down with mystudents.
I was building relationshipswith young people.
I was doing the things that Iwanted to do when I decided to
become a teacher.
So on a daily basis.
(14:58):
I felt more satisfied and thatmade the job feel more
sustainable Over time.
It also became really nicebecause once I had my video
lesson on a certain topicwhether that was my video or a
video that I found online that Ilike I didn't have to go in and
perform and repeat that lessonthree times a day.
I went in, my students watchedthe video.
(15:19):
If they had questions, Ianswered them.
I really felt like I'm going toshow up today and just help my
students learn, and it was aninvestment of time to get there,
but it really paid off.
I think as you start to getcomfortable with this method of
instruction that is morestudent-centered and less
teacher driven, you're going tosee that teaching becomes more
enjoyable and more sustainabletoo teacher-driven, you're going
(15:41):
to see that teaching becomesmore enjoyable and more
sustainable too.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (15:46):
John Hopkins did a study on your best
practices and the informationthey were getting back,
survey-wise, from the teachersand the students' responses to
this type of learningenvironment.
Can you share some specificexamples of how this classroom
and these methods end up shapingand impacting the student
learning experience, and whatkind of outcomes do they have?
Robert Barnett (16:04):
Of course, we have done a lot of surveys of
students, and students saythings like they feel more
capable of learning everything.
They enjoy learning more, andthis is comparing students in
modern classrooms to students intraditional classrooms.
They're more likely to agreethat they have close personal
relationships with their teacher, and that's not a surprise,
because the classroom isdesigned in such a way that
(16:26):
students spend more time withtheir teacher one-on-one or in
small groups and they feelcapable of learning everything,
because it's not like you got tobe here for these first 15
minutes of class when I explainit and, if not, good luck.
You can really learn anythingwhen your instruction is
digitized and you can access itanywhere and get your teacher's
help.
So those are survey results.
(16:46):
We have also seen in schools anddistricts where we've worked,
after we train them and theyimplement our model, test scores
have increased a lot.
We've seen that at many schools.
We've also seen schools wherewe try our best to compare.
Okay, here are the middleschool math students who are in
modern classrooms.
Here are the ones who are intraditionally taught classrooms.
In the districts where we'vebeen able to get this data,
(17:09):
we've seen increases in studentperformance as well, and you can
easily go to our website.
It's modernclassroomsorg slashimpacts and see the specifics
there.
You know the schools we'veworked with the districts, the
tests that were used, all ofthat that's what it's all about
is the student impacts, and sowe spend a lot of time and
effort making sure that thebenefits show up there.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (17:30):
It's nice to see such wonderful support,
saying things like I'll never goback to this other method.
This method makes me feel likewhy I came to the table of
teaching, and I think that somany teachers come to this
profession because they want tofeel that connection and they
want to feel that impact.
And you've written it all downwhich is amazing in your book,
(17:50):
and it is called Meet EveryLearner's Needs.
I have your digital, so I'vealready begun reading it.
What is the one thing that youhope that readers will take away
from it, and where can readersfind it?
Robert Barnett (18:01):
Thank you for mentioning the book.
Yeah, it's available everywherebooks are sold.
You can find it on Amazon.
You can find it on the ModernClassroom website.
There's actually a website forthe book which is just
meeteverylearnersneedsorgwebsite.
There's actually a website forthe book which is just
meeteverylearnersneedsorg.
As I was writing the book, Ireally thought what I want to do
(18:21):
is break down this model thatcan seem complex into the
simplest possible steps, and Ithought the best way to do that
was explain how I started usingthis model myself.
Because nowadays, modernClassroom Project has trained
thousands of teachers all overthe world, but the training
didn't exist when I was ateacher, so I just had to kind
of figure it out and I didn'tarrive at a transformed
(18:43):
classroom overnight.
It took me many months to dothat.
I just took simple steps.
First I made a video, and thevideo was not fancy.
I started a video call withmyself.
I hit record, I explainedsomething.
I hit stop recording.
That was my video, but it wasfine.
It worked for my students.
It was personal, they liked it.
And then, once I had the video,I thought, okay, well, what
(19:04):
should students do after thevideo?
Well, they should work together, they should collaborate.
That's so important forlearning.
So then I had to figure out howto support collaboration and
then, once students werewatching videos and working
together, I sort of said, rob,what are you going to do in
class all the time?
So I had to figure out how touse my time.
And then I had to figure outhow to assess student mastery
(19:25):
and track progress and organizemy classroom, organize my
learning management system,motivate students.
All these pieces sort of camepiece by piece, and so I call
the book 10% Memoir, that's metelling my story.
10% Manifesto, which is meexplaining what I believe, which
is that every student should beappropriately challenged and
(19:46):
appropriately supported everyday.
And 80% Educator Manual.
If you want to meet everylearner's needs tomorrow in your
classroom, here's where youshould start.
Here's the next thing youshould do.
Here's the next thing youshould do.
Here's how, in New York andNorth Carolina and California
and Australia and Sweden havedone it.
(20:06):
Go for it.
And so the book is really meantto take this model, make it as
simple as possible, asaccessible as possible and help
any teacher anywhere betterrespond to their learner's
diverse needs.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (20:17):
And you have an online class as well and a
community to support teachersgoing through this type of
training with mentors across theworld.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat?
Robert Barnett (20:29):
Yeah, of course.
So the book is one way to learnthis, but the organization that
I co-founded and helped leadModern Classrooms Project.
It's a nonprofit organizationwith a mission of supporting
educators, and so we make all ofour model and resources
available for free to anyonewho's interested.
We have a free course thatexplains how you can do
(20:50):
everything I've described andmore, and then we also have a
mentorship program where, if youare a middle school English
teacher somewhere in the worldyou want to learn this model, we
will pair you with one of oureducators who's a middle school
English teacher who uses thismodel effectively in their
classroom.
You'll work together, you'llget support adopting this in
your own classroom, and sothat's a program that we partner
(21:11):
with schools and districts andfoundations to provide.
So the book and the organizationall have the same mission,
which is giving teachersclassroom tested kind of
practices that work, and I knowthey work because they worked in
my classroom, they worked in mycolleagues' classrooms.
You know we've heard fromteachers all over the world.
I tried this approach.
It works for me, it works formy students, and this is how I
(21:34):
want to teach.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:35):
So is there any tips or suggestions you can
give a teacher what they coulddo today?
Robert Barnett (21:40):
Of course, and actually this is part of the
reason that I'm buildingInstaLesson, because people
always ask what's the easiestpossible, simplest way.
I'm a busy teacher, teach thisapproach in my own classroom and
my answer to that isInstaLesson and it, like the
course I just described, is acompletely free tool for
teachers.
So what I would recommend youdo is go to InstaLessoncom with
(22:05):
a dash Insta-Lessoncom, type insomething you want to teach your
students about and thengenerate a lesson for your
students.
That lesson is going to havethree parts.
It's going to have a video thatyour students will watch we
figured out a way to go onlineand find really high quality
videos for students to watch.
It's going to have practicequestions for students to work
(22:27):
on together and then it's goingto have a mastery check.
We're going to send you thatlesson in a Google Doc that is
fully editable.
So create your lesson, edit it,make it better, give it to your
students, see how they respond.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (22:39):
I think that's really a great way to begin
jumping into the ModernClassrooms Project.
So thank you for sharing all ofthis wonderful information and
for what you're doing ineducation to make it not only
sustainable but transforming theway that we teach and giving us
back that joy in the classroom.
So thank you so much for whatyou're doing.
Robert Barnett (23:00):
Thank you for having me here and hope that
teachers can transform theirclassrooms, but that begins with
really simple steps.
So thank you for giving me thechance to share those steps.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (23:12):
Positive change in education starts with
one classroom, one teacher andone student at a time.
Education works best when welearn from each other to create
the schools our children deserve.
If you have a story aboutwhat's working in your schools
that you'd like to share, youcan email me at lisa at
(23:47):
drlisahasslercom, or visit mywebsite at wwwdrlisahasslercom.
Thank you.
It is the mission of thispodcast to shine light on the
good in education so that itspreads, affecting positive
change.
So let's keep working togetherto find solutions that focus on
our children's success.
Imagine a classroom where every student
moves at their own pace, mastersconcepts completely before
moving on, and where teachersactually feel less stressed, not
more.
Sounds too good to be true?
Well, it's already happeningthrough something called the
Modern Classrooms Project.
Today we're talking with RobertBarnett, the co-founder, who's
helping make this approach areality.
Welcome to the brighter side ofeducation, research, innovation
(00:34):
and resources.
I'm your host, dr Lisa Hassler,here to enlighten and brighten
the classrooms in Americathrough focused conversation on
important topics in education.
In each episode, I discussproblems we as teachers and
parents are facing and whatpeople are doing in their
communities to fix it.
What are the variables and howcan we duplicate it to maximize
(00:54):
student outcomes In classroomsacross the country?
Teachers are facing anincreasingly complex challenge
how to effectively teachstudents who learn at different
paces, in different ways andneed different levels of support
.
The John Hopkins Study theModern Classrooms Project, a
review of research-based bestpractices determined
overwhelming positive supportfor the Modern Classrooms
(01:16):
Project from the perspective ofboth the students and the
teachers.
Benefits are reported formiddle and high school teachers
as well as student participants.
At the heart of thistransformation are three
innovative strategies.
First, blended instructionseamlessly weaving digital
technology into face-to-faceteaching, creating dynamic
learning experiences.
(01:37):
Second, self-pacing instruction, which empowers students to
progress at their optimal speed,ensuring that they truly grasp
concepts before moving forward.
And third, mastery-basedlearning, and that guarantees
that students develop realcompetency in each skill before
moving on until they're trulyready.
Now I'm thrilled to welcomesomeone who's been instrumental
(02:00):
in developing and implementingthese approaches Robert Barnett.
He is the co-founder of theModern Classrooms Project and
author of Meet Every Learner'sNeeds.
He's here today to share howthese research-backed strategies
are revitalizing education andcreating sustainable solutions
for teachers that really dosupport every student to success
.
Welcome to the show, robert.
(02:22):
Thank you Glad to be here.
Before we dive in, can you takeus back to the moment when you
realized that traditionalteaching methods were not
working for you, and what kindof sparked that creation of the
Modern Classrooms Project?
Robert Barnett (02:36):
Sure, yeah, I'm happy to share that.
You know I started my career asa teacher in independent
schools in Washington DC andthere I taught traditionally and
I had small classrooms andstudents were really motivated,
did a lot of work outside ofschool to make sure that they
could keep up.
And you know, I felt like Icould kind of get by teaching
(03:01):
one lesson per day from theboard and I knew I was teaching
to the middle.
Teaching one lesson per dayfrom the board and I knew I was
teaching to the middle.
I knew that some students wereahead and maybe a little bit
bored, or some students were alittle bit behind and lost, but
it was okay.
I then went to a public schoolwhere I taught big, big public
school classes and I realizedpretty soon that I would not be
(03:21):
able to do this anymore and thegaps between my learners were
just so much bigger.
There I had larger classes,students struggled with
attendance, Some students wereon grade level, some students
were six years behind and theydidn't have the same level of
support outside of school and soon an average day I might walk
into my class and I'd haveseveral students absent, so
(03:44):
they're missing out completely.
I had several students who werelike eager, really eager to
move on, and I had a lot ofstudents who had gaps in their
learning and they just weren'tprepared for grade level content
through no fault of their own.
School hadn't prepared them,and I realized, one lesson per
day, it's not going to meet anyof these learners' needs.
(04:04):
I'm going to teach to themiddle and I'm going to be
missing students on the high end, the low end and who aren't
there at all.
So I realized then that Ineeded to do something different
.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (04:13):
I would agree with you.
I think that that's one of thehardest things with teaching is
there's one of you and there'slike 30 of them, and everyone is
coming to the table withdifferent needs and those gaps,
and it's really hard to beeverything for everybody.
So what you're doing right nowis pretty amazing.
Your model revolves aroundthree key pillars, that's, the
(04:36):
blended learning, theself-pacing and the
mastery-based learning.
So can you tell us what atypical day would look like for
the student and the teacherusing those three pillars?
Robert Barnett (04:48):
Of course, yeah, and I will say that it's true
that you really need to teachlike this when you have 30
students, but even when you havea few students, you know
different young people alwayshave different needs, and so one
lesson is rarely going to meetthose needs all at once.
You know, I have two kids andthey're two years apart and you
know they need different things,right, if we're reading, like
(05:09):
they need to be readingdifferent books or doing
different math problems, and soanytime you're trying to teach
multiple learners at once, Ithink there's a better approach
than giving them both or all ofthem, the same lesson at the
same time.
So let me explain what thatbetter approach is.
In my classroom, and now inthousands of other classrooms
around the world through myorganization, the Modern
(05:32):
Classrooms Project, teachersdeliver instruction basically as
follows Rather than standing atthe board delivering one lesson
to whoever happens to be inclass that day, the teacher
digitizes direct instruction,usually through a short, focused
instructional video, so I couldexplain something at the board.
My students would be bored orlost or not there.
(05:54):
I could create a five-minutevideo where I just record my
screen and explain that concept.
Now students can watch thevideo in class.
They can pause, they can rewind, they can watch at home and I'm
free during that time to goanswer their questions, to check
in on them.
It's much more comfortable thanme standing and trying to keep
(06:15):
them quiet.
They're all watching the videojust to get that new content
five or 10-minute videos.
After those videos, studentswill work through some kind of
practice together.
So they close the screens, theyget face-to-face, they're on
paper.
I was a math teacher so maybethey're doing math practice
problems together.
If you're a Spanish teacher,maybe you use a video for
(06:39):
students to learn new vocabulary.
They close the computer, theypractice using that vocabulary
in conversation.
If you're an English teacher,maybe you use a video to explain
how to write a topic sentenceand then students practice
writing topic sentences together.
So after the short video,students are working together
(07:01):
and they're doing this at theirown pace.
That means your advancedstudents might be speeding
through the practice.
Your students with learninggaps might take a little while
longer.
When a student comes in late,they pick up at the beginning
rather than being thrown intowherever you are in the class.
And then the final pillar youmentioned is mastery-based
learning.
That's the idea that school isreally valuable when students
(07:22):
actually understand what they'relearning.
So before a student goes fromlesson one to lesson two, they
should prove they understandlesson one.
You should give that student abrief assessment.
You should say show me youunderstand it.
If you understand lesson one,great, go to lesson two.
If not, hang on, go back to thevideo.
Go back and ask your classmatesTry again.
(07:43):
Let's make sure you understandlesson one before you go to
lesson two.
And because your instruction isdigital, because there's this
self-paced learning, it'spossible really to have a
mastery-based classroom whereyour advanced students are
racing ahead, working fast,super challenged, all the time.
Your students who need moresupport get that support and
(08:04):
your students who arechronically absent pick up where
they left off every day.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (08:08):
The system works in elementary and high
school levels.
Robert Barnett (08:12):
Absolutely.
I developed this myself as ahigh school teacher, but I've
seen it in kindergartenclassrooms and actually, in some
ways, elementary teachers taketo this approach better than
secondary teachers, becausethey're used to more small group
, self-paced, one-on-onelearning, as opposed to
secondary classrooms where it'ssometimes a real mindset shift
(08:33):
to go from one lesson at a timeto this more flexible learning
environment.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (08:37):
Yeah, we're used to centers and the movement
.
You know being able to meetthose students in grouping
abilities Absence students hasalways been a problem, so I love
that this addresses that issuewhere you know you have that gap
, and it's not just one studentmissing one day.
It could be one student missingfive days and another one
missing three, and then anotherone is only the afternoon, and
(08:58):
so it's just the variety, thebarrage of the amounts.
That really is what becomesoverwhelming for a teacher.
And then how long, would yousay for the younger ones, would
it take for students, teachers,to get used to being able to
perfect this method in their ownclassroom, like if they started
this in August?
I know, depending on age, ithas to do with you know a lot
(09:20):
with age, but is this somethingthat would normally take
teachers and students a coupleof weeks to get used to, or is
this something where you reallyhave to spend a lot of time
training your students?
Robert Barnett (09:32):
Yeah well, every learner is different, every
teacher is different, everyclassroom is different.
Sometimes it's harder, I think,to get an 11th or 12th grader
used to this because even thoughthey can understand directions
better, they're so used tolearning as being sit and get,
and this kind of learningobviously is more active.
It gives students more agency.
(09:53):
So that can be a bigger mindsetshift for an older student
versus a younger student who'sjust sort of I'm going to come
in and do what the teacher says.
I do think in general werecommend that teachers take the
time when they start doing thisto orient your students to this
approach, to explain how itwill be different.
The teacher's role shifts.
(10:14):
I mean, you've heard this amillion times from the sage on
the stage to the guide on theside, but so often it's become a
cliche.
But here it actually happensright, the teacher is not
delivering content from theboard anymore.
The teacher is one-on-one,small group support.
The student role shifts fromsit and listen to go out and
find knowledge and findclassmates to learn from and
(10:36):
demonstrate mastery.
So you need to explain that.
You need to give learners timeand in my experience some of my
students got this right away andthey said Mr Barnett, this is
great, I love learning like this.
I did it last year with ateacher or this really just
works for me.
I love watching videos in myspare time to learn, and some
students.
It might be November orDecember and it finally says,
(10:59):
okay, I finally get that I'mresponsible for my own learning.
It took a while, but that's thething.
Our learners are differentpeople and that's why we should
be teaching like this in thefirst place.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (11:09):
Yeah, you were talking about how teachers
would record their own lessons.
So you have something calledInstaLesson.
Do you want to talk a littlebit about how that could help
teachers with their preparationof these lessons, which I could
see may be a little bitoverwhelming for teachers to
have to take the lessons thathave been written on paper and
they are used to being able topull those resources and use the
(11:33):
chalkboard or the whiteboardand now they have to create a
digital lesson.
So how is that working withInstaLesson?
Robert Barnett (11:42):
Yeah, absolutely .
I mean, if you're listening tothis, one thing you might
reasonably be thinking is thisseems like a lot of work.
I know how to show up to myclass and give a lesson, but now
, if students are going to beall over the place on all
different things, I've got tocreate videos like.
That's a lot, and it's truethat if you're going to go all
(12:03):
the way to doing this, it isgoing to take work.
In my opinion, it's aninvestment of time that pays off
over time, because you're goingto be much happier once you're
teaching like this and once youhave your videos for everything.
You don't need to keeprepeating yourself.
Right, you can use those videosas long as you teach, but it
can sometimes be a big lift torecord that first video.
(12:25):
That can be hard.
So I'm working on a tool calledInstaLesson, which helps a
teacher put in a topic any topicyou want to teach and then uses
AI to generate a blended,self-paced, mastery-based lesson
that the teacher can edit,print and share, and I've
designed it to be really easy.
I think a lot of AI tools onthe market can be kind of
(12:48):
complicated.
They have so many features it'shard to know where to start.
But, more importantly, it's atool that's aligned to pedagogy,
to an instructional model.
It's not just more of the samecontent creation for content
creation sake.
It's a tool that really ismeant to support blended,
self-paced, mastery-basedlearning.
So you know, this is anexperimental thing, like I
(13:11):
created a couple months ago.
I'm testing it out, but thehope is that InstaLesson does
help teachers get started withthis model of instruction.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (13:25):
Yeah, and I saw that you were able to import
videos and I like how there's alittle rectangle that's on the
box, so the teacher's face is onthe screen and that the
children hear the teacher'svoice.
So it becomes more meaningful.
I like that personalized touchwith it and then the ease of
being able to use it, because Imight be at a loss to create
every video.
I think that that then goes tothe sustainability of this.
How does this model addressteacher burnout?
(13:47):
By making it more sustainableand then actually increasing
their wellbeing.
How are the teachers respondingto this?
Robert Barnett (13:54):
Yeah, I mean, teaching is so hard.
I was a teacher myself and Iknow how difficult it is all the
planning, all the work, all thecommitment and I think for me
the hardest part was feelinglike I was doing all this work
and I just wasn't seeing theresults in my classroom, like my
students came in so far behindand they left so far behind and
(14:14):
I couldn't meet their needs.
It was just really difficultand I felt like I had people
telling me teach this way, usethis curriculum, et cetera, et
cetera, but they didn't reallyunderstand the challenge that I
faced.
The fundamental challenge wasmy students needed different
things and I was unable to meetall of those needs when I was
teaching in this traditional way, I found that when I started
teaching in the modern classroommodel, a couple of things
(14:36):
changed.
One, even though I was workinghard to create my own videos, I
just felt like I was moreaffected.
Every day I felt like mystudents were more engaged.
I was not at the boardcontrolling behavior.
I was sitting down with mystudents.
I was building relationshipswith young people.
I was doing the things that Iwanted to do when I decided to
become a teacher.
So on a daily basis.
(14:58):
I felt more satisfied and thatmade the job feel more
sustainable Over time.
It also became really nicebecause once I had my video
lesson on a certain topicwhether that was my video or a
video that I found online that Ilike I didn't have to go in and
perform and repeat that lessonthree times a day.
I went in, my students watchedthe video.
(15:19):
If they had questions, Ianswered them.
I really felt like I'm going toshow up today and just help my
students learn, and it was aninvestment of time to get there,
but it really paid off.
I think as you start to getcomfortable with this method of
instruction that is morestudent-centered and less
teacher driven, you're going tosee that teaching becomes more
enjoyable and more sustainabletoo teacher-driven, you're going
(15:41):
to see that teaching becomesmore enjoyable and more
sustainable too.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (15:46):
John Hopkins did a study on your best
practices and the informationthey were getting back,
survey-wise, from the teachersand the students' responses to
this type of learningenvironment.
Can you share some specificexamples of how this classroom
and these methods end up shapingand impacting the student
learning experience, and whatkind of outcomes do they have?
Robert Barnett (16:04):
Of course, we have done a lot of surveys of
students, and students saythings like they feel more
capable of learning everything.
They enjoy learning more, andthis is comparing students in
modern classrooms to students intraditional classrooms.
They're more likely to agreethat they have close personal
relationships with their teacher, and that's not a surprise,
because the classroom isdesigned in such a way that
(16:26):
students spend more time withtheir teacher one-on-one or in
small groups and they feelcapable of learning everything,
because it's not like you got tobe here for these first 15
minutes of class when I explainit and, if not, good luck.
You can really learn anythingwhen your instruction is
digitized and you can access itanywhere and get your teacher's
help.
So those are survey results.
(16:46):
We have also seen in schools anddistricts where we've worked,
after we train them and theyimplement our model, test scores
have increased a lot.
We've seen that at many schools.
We've also seen schools wherewe try our best to compare.
Okay, here are the middleschool math students who are in
modern classrooms.
Here are the ones who are intraditionally taught classrooms.
In the districts where we'vebeen able to get this data,
(17:09):
we've seen increases in studentperformance as well, and you can
easily go to our website.
It's modernclassroomsorg slashimpacts and see the specifics
there.
You know the schools we'veworked with the districts, the
tests that were used, all ofthat that's what it's all about
is the student impacts, and sowe spend a lot of time and
effort making sure that thebenefits show up there.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (17:30):
It's nice to see such wonderful support,
saying things like I'll never goback to this other method.
This method makes me feel likewhy I came to the table of
teaching, and I think that somany teachers come to this
profession because they want tofeel that connection and they
want to feel that impact.
And you've written it all downwhich is amazing in your book,
(17:50):
and it is called Meet EveryLearner's Needs.
I have your digital, so I'vealready begun reading it.
What is the one thing that youhope that readers will take away
from it, and where can readersfind it?
Robert Barnett (18:01):
Thank you for mentioning the book.
Yeah, it's available everywherebooks are sold.
You can find it on Amazon.
You can find it on the ModernClassroom website.
There's actually a website forthe book which is just
meeteverylearnersneedsorgwebsite.
There's actually a website forthe book which is just
meeteverylearnersneedsorg.
As I was writing the book, Ireally thought what I want to do
(18:21):
is break down this model thatcan seem complex into the
simplest possible steps, and Ithought the best way to do that
was explain how I started usingthis model myself.
Because nowadays, modernClassroom Project has trained
thousands of teachers all overthe world, but the training
didn't exist when I was ateacher, so I just had to kind
of figure it out and I didn'tarrive at a transformed
(18:43):
classroom overnight.
It took me many months to dothat.
I just took simple steps.
First I made a video, and thevideo was not fancy.
I started a video call withmyself.
I hit record, I explainedsomething.
I hit stop recording.
That was my video, but it wasfine.
It worked for my students.
It was personal, they liked it.
And then, once I had the video,I thought, okay, well, what
(19:04):
should students do after thevideo?
Well, they should work together, they should collaborate.
That's so important forlearning.
So then I had to figure out howto support collaboration and
then, once students werewatching videos and working
together, I sort of said, rob,what are you going to do in
class all the time?
So I had to figure out how touse my time.
And then I had to figure outhow to assess student mastery
(19:25):
and track progress and organizemy classroom, organize my
learning management system,motivate students.
All these pieces sort of camepiece by piece, and so I call
the book 10% Memoir, that's metelling my story.
10% Manifesto, which is meexplaining what I believe, which
is that every student should beappropriately challenged and
(19:46):
appropriately supported everyday.
And 80% Educator Manual.
If you want to meet everylearner's needs tomorrow in your
classroom, here's where youshould start.
Here's the next thing youshould do.
Here's the next thing youshould do.
Here's how, in New York andNorth Carolina and California
and Australia and Sweden havedone it.
(20:06):
Go for it.
And so the book is really meantto take this model, make it as
simple as possible, asaccessible as possible and help
any teacher anywhere betterrespond to their learner's
diverse needs.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (20:17):
And you have an online class as well and a
community to support teachersgoing through this type of
training with mentors across theworld.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat?
Robert Barnett (20:29):
Yeah, of course.
So the book is one way to learnthis, but the organization that
I co-founded and helped leadModern Classrooms Project.
It's a nonprofit organizationwith a mission of supporting
educators, and so we make all ofour model and resources
available for free to anyonewho's interested.
We have a free course thatexplains how you can do
(20:50):
everything I've described andmore, and then we also have a
mentorship program where, if youare a middle school English
teacher somewhere in the worldyou want to learn this model, we
will pair you with one of oureducators who's a middle school
English teacher who uses thismodel effectively in their
classroom.
You'll work together, you'llget support adopting this in
your own classroom, and sothat's a program that we partner
(21:11):
with schools and districts andfoundations to provide.
So the book and the organizationall have the same mission,
which is giving teachersclassroom tested kind of
practices that work, and I knowthey work because they worked in
my classroom, they worked in mycolleagues' classrooms.
You know we've heard fromteachers all over the world.
I tried this approach.
It works for me, it works formy students, and this is how I
(21:34):
want to teach.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (21:35):
So is there any tips or suggestions you can
give a teacher what they coulddo today?
Robert Barnett (21:40):
Of course, and actually this is part of the
reason that I'm buildingInstaLesson, because people
always ask what's the easiestpossible, simplest way.
I'm a busy teacher, teach thisapproach in my own classroom and
my answer to that isInstaLesson and it, like the
course I just described, is acompletely free tool for
teachers.
So what I would recommend youdo is go to InstaLessoncom with
(22:05):
a dash Insta-Lessoncom, type insomething you want to teach your
students about and thengenerate a lesson for your
students.
That lesson is going to havethree parts.
It's going to have a video thatyour students will watch we
figured out a way to go onlineand find really high quality
videos for students to watch.
It's going to have practicequestions for students to work
(22:27):
on together and then it's goingto have a mastery check.
We're going to send you thatlesson in a Google Doc that is
fully editable.
So create your lesson, edit it,make it better, give it to your
students, see how they respond.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (22:39):
I think that's really a great way to begin
jumping into the ModernClassrooms Project.
So thank you for sharing all ofthis wonderful information and
for what you're doing ineducation to make it not only
sustainable but transforming theway that we teach and giving us
back that joy in the classroom.
So thank you so much for whatyou're doing.
Robert Barnett (23:00):
Thank you for having me here and hope that
teachers can transform theirclassrooms, but that begins with
really simple steps.
So thank you for giving me thechance to share those steps.
Dr. Lisa Hassler (23:12):
Positive change in education starts with
one classroom, one teacher andone student at a time.
Education works best when welearn from each other to create
the schools our children deserve.
If you have a story aboutwhat's working in your schools
that you'd like to share, youcan email me at lisa at
(23:47):
drlisahasslercom, or visit mywebsite at wwwdrlisahasslercom.
Thank you.
It is the mission of thispodcast to shine light on the
good in education so that itspreads, affecting positive
change.
So let's keep working togetherto find solutions that focus on
our children's success.
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