March 31, 2024 • 44 mins
As we gather in the Choir Room this Easter, a time of reflection and rejoicing unfolds through the power of choral music. The episode kicks off with a stirring reminder of Christ's sacrifice, captured in Kurt Carr's poignant composition, performed remotely during the 2020 pandemic by Greg Thomas and Misty Quinn, and we're transported through the rich history of Charles Wesley's "Christ the Lord is Risen Today." Co-host Dorian walks us through this hymn's deep scriptural roots, inviting both heavenly and earthly voices to celebrate the resurrection. It's a moment that intertwines personal hope with the timeless victory over death, offering a soul-stirring message that resonates with every note.
Navigating the intricate art of choir direction, we open up about the essential techniques for achieving that perfect vocal blend between meek singers and strong singers...where strength meets softness. Together with Mietta Stancil-Farrar and Coleman Smart, we delve into the roles of physicality and confidence. We share our personal thoughts and secrets to coaxing out stronger performances, all while preserving the unique vocal identities of each member. This is not just about hitting the right notes; it's about the collective journey towards harmonious excellence.
Closing on a note of community, Greg and Coleman emphasize the importance of stewardship and morale in leading a choir. It's about more than just guiding voices; it's about nurturing the spirit of our singers and ensuring the gospel's message remains paramount. As we explore the dilemmas faced by choir directors and navigate rehearsal atmospheres, we offer strategies for fostering a transformative experience. Whether you're a choir aficionado or just love the art of music, your thoughts are valuable to us. Join our conversation by reaching out on the Choir Room Facebook page or through email, and let's continue this journey together in the next episode.
Perpetuating and Promoting the Christian and Positive Idea Through the Medium of Music and Other Arts.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Choir Room.
This is episode 37 of the ChoirRoom Podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Welcome to the Choir.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Room.
I'm Greg Thomas, your host, andI am joined by my co-hosts,
dorian Johnson Welcome to theChoir Room Mieta Stanza-Farrar
and who we like to call thefourth wheel, coleman Smart.
This podcast exists to promoteand encourage to long time
traditions in our society thatseem to be dwindling away, and
(00:31):
that is choir and corporatesinging.
We hope to revive theexcitement and joy experience
with singing in a choir, as wellas inform and educate the
listener on all things singingand all things choir.
This podcast is a production ofMetro Music and Arts, whose
purpose is to perpetuate andpromote the Christian and
positive idea through the mediumof music and other arts.
(00:53):
If you haven't done so already,we ask that you subscribe to
this podcast by writing the wordsubscribe in the subject field
of an email and sending that tothe choir room at
metromusic-artscom.
And then do us a really bigfavor like the podcast, send us
your comments and then sharewith a friend or family member
or colleague and tell themyou're in the Choir Room.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
Welcome to the Choir Room.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Appropriate for this Easter week, where Christians
all over the world areacknowledging Holy Week and, of
course, resurrection Sunday, oras it is commonly known as
Easter Sunday.
I was reminded the other day ofthis song that we recorded
during the shutdown of 2020.
I'm in one location.
My dear friend Misty Quinn isin another location, a song
(01:39):
written by Kurt Carr and thatwe've done many, many times over
the years.
It was so necessary during thepandemic, as we were all
separated from each other.
You probably know how difficultit can be to record a song that
is rubato in its timing andtempo, but yet we managed to
pull it off.
Now.
We've shared it on this podcastbefore and we thought we'd
share it again during thisEaster week.
(01:59):
Here's Misty Quinn and yourstruly in two different locations
in 2020.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
The shed blood of Christ still has miraculous
power.
We can't forget God's sacrifice.
He saved this world with hisson's life.
(02:35):
God must have agonized andgrieved to watch his child
suffer and bleed, but he knewthe blood that his son spilled
there Would save the world fromher despair, so that two
thousand years ago God put hispower in the throne and the sin
(02:58):
of the world could not polluteit.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Seers at time could not delude it.
Jesus still washes, the bloodstill cleanses.
(03:27):
After all these years, theblood still has miraculous power
.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
Miraculous power.
So if you need healing for yourlife, you've tossed and turned
and prayed all night because thedoctor said to you that there
was nothing he could do.
My friend, no matter how youfeel, keep saying by his stripes
, I'm healed.
(04:11):
That's when the blood will takecontrol.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Let his healing virtues flow.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
Jesus, the Lord, is covering you Every sickness,
demon devil has to move, stillwashes.
Thank God, the blood stillcleanses.
(04:52):
After all these years, theblood still has miraculous power
.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Welcome to the choir.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Dorian has our Easter hymn for this week.
Thanks, Greg.
Speaker 5 (05:26):
This week's hymn of the week is Christ, the Lord is
Risen Today.
This hymn was written byCharles Wesley in 1739, which is
the year after his conversion,and was one of the over 6,500
hymns that he is credited withwriting.
After each line of the over6,500 hymns that he is credited
(05:48):
with writing, after each line ofthe hymn, there is a tag that
says Alleluia, and this tag wasactually added by an unknown
author in the 19th century,probably to fit the commonly
used hymn tune that this hymn issung to, which is called Easter
Hymn.
One might call this hymn theoriginal Matthew 28, which is
based on Matthew 28, verses 1through 10.
(06:11):
But all throughout the hymnthere is an underlying reference
to the very specific referencethat we see in verse 3, and that
is to 1 Corinthians 15, verse55, which says O death, where is
your victory?
O death, where is your sting?
The whole hymn is in presenttense, reminding us that Christ
(06:35):
being alive is just as truetoday as it was that first
resurrection Sunday.
This hymn begins with thedeclaration of Christ, the Lord
is risen today.
The second line says sons ofmen and angels, say, reminding
us that both men and angelstestify to our risen Lord, it
(06:56):
calls all to raise your joys andtriumphs high, and then to sing
ye, heavens and earth replyhigh.
And then to sing ye, heavensand earth, reply.
The second verse points us tothe vanity that came with the
stone and the watch and the sealthat sealed in christ in that
tomb.
It says vain, the stone, thewatch, the seal.
(07:18):
And it says christ has burnt.
Burst the gates of hell.
Death in vain forbids his rise.
Christ has opened paradise.
The third verse points us toour glorious King's living.
Forever, as it begins, livesagain, our glorious King.
(07:38):
And then that reference to 1Corinthians 15, 55, where O
death is now thy sting.
Once he died our souls to save,where thy victory, o brave.
And as Charles Wesley begins topoint us from not only the
(07:58):
resurrection but to our futurehope, we're told in verse 4, so
are we now where Christ hath led, following our exalted head,
made like him.
Like him, we rise ours, thecross, the grave, the skies,
reminding us that Christ's deathwas our death, his being buried
(08:20):
in the grave was our beingburied and his resurrection is
our resurrection.
And as we end this glorioushymn, we end once again with
praise.
Hail the Lord of earth andheaven.
Praise to thee by both.
Be given Thee we greettriumphant.
Now hail the resurrection thou.
(08:42):
Now hail the resurrection thou.
The one who said I am theresurrection and the life lives
forever.
And we, as the ones who havereceived the benefits of his
great sacrifice and thejustification that comes with
his resurrection, do indeed owehim all glory, all honor and all
(09:06):
praise, as we remember hisglorious resurrection all around
the world.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Thanks, dorian.
Always appropriate andcertainly, uh, particularly
appropriate for this easter week.
Now mietta has our crq thanks,greg.
Speaker 6 (09:22):
Here we are this week with our crq, and the CRQ this
evening is what do you do withsingers that won't sing out?
What do you do with singersthat won't sing out?
Well, I'll start it off briefly.
I thought about this questionand I'm like Coleman now.
And I'm like Coleman now.
Context is everything.
Speaker 7 (09:44):
I've made an impression on you guys.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Yes, a lasting impression.
We're going to run that contextbeing into the ground Right.
Speaker 6 (09:54):
I love it, though.
I do love it, and I thoughtabout it and I didn't want
whoever submitted this questionto think that when you sing out
or the louder you sing, the moreeffective you are, and that is
just false.
I have this saying that I'vehad for years now in my
(10:15):
rehearsals that sing what youweigh.
I might have made thisstatement sometime before Sing
what you weigh.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
I heard that the first time I heard it and I
thought well, just kind of sitwith that for a minute.
Speaker 6 (10:34):
And I would often say to the women if you, if you
weigh 220 pounds, I need you tosing like you are 220 pounds.
Before we leave any service, Ineed them to have to renovate
the back wall.
That's what I want.
I want the girth, I want thevolume, I want all of that.
(10:55):
Now there are songs that willrequire that, but not every song
requires that.
So I wanted to preface this bysaying that just because you
sing loud doesn't necessarilymean that you're very effective
in doing so.
Um, when you, when you havesingers that are a little
lighter in vote in their vocal,um, the one mistake we often
(11:19):
make, we we put everyone inthese little categories.
So we'll put all the lightersinger ones in one place, all
the heavier one, heavy singingones in one place, like you
would usually put the heaviersinger ones or the louder signal
singing ones in the front rowand then you'll put the softer
singers behind them andhopefully it'll, you know,
(11:41):
balance out, but it reallydoesn't.
And hopefully it'll you know,balance out, but it really
doesn't.
I found that the best way to dothat is to mix it, and so if
you have the heavier singers,the singers with the most volume
, mix them in with the lightersingle ones.
It eventually it balances outbetter instead of separating
them that we have.
(12:01):
I've done.
I've even done it that way.
Then I sing it loud.
Put them behind you.
I need the big, the greatsingers, the loudest singers up
front, and I had to realize thatthat was just not the most
effective way to do it.
You needed to put the lightervoice next to the louder voice,
and what happens is the more youdo that, you will find that
there was a.
There's a very good balance ofsound when you do that, because
(12:25):
usually the louder voice willkind of balance out.
I am and I will say this, I am aum, a power singer.
I'm a power singer.
I, I love the lighter voice.
I, I like to sing a littlelighter, but for some reason it
always sounds like I'm eatingmacaroni and cheese and collard
greens, right, so it does itjust and I know it it always
(12:51):
sounds like there's gravy at theend of that.
I know it is, but and I wouldlove to do that and I found
studio work controls that for me, live singing is different.
Studio keeps that under control, so I've learned to balance
myself as it relates to that.
So it's not always the bestthing just because you have the
(13:13):
louder voice.
So please, listeners, pleasedon't think well.
They're not singing properly ifthey're not singing out, or
it's not effective if they'renot singing out.
That is so far from the truth.
The best way to get the bestsound, I believe mix it in.
Speaker 7 (13:30):
Mix the louder with the softer you know throughout
the entire choir and throughoutthe entire sections of the choir
.
So, fellas, what say you?
Well, mia, I'd love to know,before moving on from your
comments, if you have somebodyin the choir because you know,
nine times out of 10, you know,gospel music requires some guts
(13:51):
to it, right?
If someone walked up into yourchoir, who?
They were just quiet as a mouseand you're like come on, I got
to get some guts out of you.
Come on, what would you do, Imean, other than mixing them in
there?
How would you get a biggersound out of them?
(14:12):
I'm curious to know for areason, because I'd love to use
that knowledge myself.
No, I have other comments.
Speaker 5 (14:25):
But all of you guys, y'all, y'all, I don't know what?
Speaker 7 (14:29):
what do you say?
Speaker 6 (14:33):
well, you know, it's I.
I'm kind of hands-on, I reallyam, I'm kind of hands-on.
So I've I've been in contactwith not very many but a few
lighter voices and I'll get nextto them, you know, I'll let
them sing and then I will presson their stomach, press on them
a little bit, you know you're aman.
Don't just walk up to folks.
(14:55):
You got to be careful about that, but I will.
I will cause, you know, askthem sing this and then, and the
more I press in a little bit,it forces them to push out more.
It pushes out more.
And um, I had, I used to have ayoung lady who was she no
longer sings with me soprano.
She had an excellent sopranovoice and I love putting her
(15:19):
next to my sister who has alighter voice.
Cindy um has lighter voice.
I like putting her next to herbecause it forced Cindy to sing
a little more.
You know so when I so that'swhat I mean by mixing them.
You put them next to somebodywho really does have that
confidence and don't mindsinging out, and you'll be
(15:40):
surprised that they will startto adapt and start to work their
way.
Ok, I can do this.
I just got to be confident,because that's that's what most
of it is.
It's about confidence.
Some people don't think thatI'm I'm not confident enough to
do that, when in fact you reallyare.
You know, you really are, youknow, and that's that's one
that's a simple way for me toget what I need out of it.
Speaker 7 (16:03):
It always depends on where I am, how much I have to
beg people for their sound.
There have been some placeswhere I just walk right in these
folks Pentecostal they're likeliterally the walls are shaking
when they start singing.
And sometimes when I walk intoother settings it's like you
gotta be like all right now,come on, come on, help me now.
(16:25):
But that's what it takes.
Sometimes it takes the directorbeing clear about what you need
.
So sometimes when I'm directingI'll make jokes about myself
being like what's his name fromSesame Street that bangs an
animal?
Not Sesame Street, the Muppets,the.
Speaker 5 (16:46):
Muppets, one of those Muppets?
Speaker 3 (16:48):
Yeah, I'd be like animal from the Muppets like
coming at the choir like come on, y'all sing, let's go.
Speaker 7 (16:55):
Come on so sometimes it's like that, and if they like
start, I wish I could justvideo you into one of my choir
rehearsals sometimes, because itmakes more sense to see it than
me talking about it.
But but if they start singing,I'll be like hold up, hold up.
You know, come on now.
Y'all know what I'm looking for.
Don't make me beg.
(17:16):
And I'll say let's try thatagain, and then usually they'll
bring it the second time aroundaround.
But I also work with students alot who tend to be more shy
about singing out like that,just because they're still
(17:41):
discovering their voice.
Some of them it's just aself-confidence issue and
they're trying to figure outthat kind of thing.
Well, sometimes I'll do thisexercise with them about singing
from your core and I'll saylike hey you know, if you're
walking down the street andsomebody like takes your mom's
purse or something, you're notgonna be like hey, hey, give
(18:03):
that back.
Speaker 5 (18:04):
And I said how are you going to do?
Speaker 7 (18:05):
that and I'll like point to the diaphragm, the core
, and I'll be like you're goingto say, hey, you know, like that
kind of thing.
I'm like sometimes you know yougot to core and you know not
singing from your throat andproper breathing and breath
support and that kind of thing.
But it just kind of depends onthe singer that you're working
(18:42):
with why they sing lightly.
If it's, if it's confidence,build their confidence.
If they don't know how, teachthem how.
If, if, you know, that kind ofthing.
So what do you guys say?
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
Yeah, it was.
It was interesting sort ofhearing the question and then
some of the responses, becausethere there does come a time,
and usually it's with thesection, and then some of the
responses, because there theredoes come a time, and usually
it's with the section, and andit you can reach a point during
a rehearsal where you know that,like the section's being lazy
yeah and you, and you just gottatell them like, okay, get out
(19:21):
of your seats and stand up right, because you need.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
It's wednesday or thursday and it's yeah, it's
already a long week, you knowyeah, exactly, exactly.
Speaker 5 (19:30):
But that's just again about about knowing the people
and knowing, like, the choir aswell, and and and I think that's
the beauty of choral singing isthat you aren't going to have,
um, say, a hundred people upthere and all of them able to
produce the same volume, orsomething like that.
I mean, I, I'm an opera buffand so I think of like, like, uh
(19:56):
, choruses that sing in theopera you couldn't have like a
hundred of the main peoplesinging because that choir would
be so loud, can?
Speaker 1 (20:08):
you imagine the vibrato?
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 5 (20:12):
I mean, and so it's like there are people who are
suited for for a chorus and forchoir, and so it takes all kinds
.
So we we have to just becareful that that just because
someone doesn't sing aspowerfully as someone else, um
they they aren't saying exertingas much energy or giving as
(20:34):
much effort.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
but if we work with folks long enough, we can know
if they're not, and address thatand address that so yeah, I
think, uh, obviously I agreewith all of you.
Yeah, I think obviously I agreewith all of you, and I think
there's so many facets to theanswer for this question.
I don't think there's oneanswer because I'm going to try
(20:59):
and find a synonym for context,but I think you know what I mean
.
It depends on the situation,the scenario in which you're
asking people to sing loud andthen again, like Dorian said,
some people's voices are justnaturally soft.
To me, it's more important thatthey're on pitch and soft or
(21:20):
loud, so you can be loud and bepitchy, and then we've got a
different kind of problem, andthen we've got a different kind
of problem.
So I'd rather you be on pitchand your timing be well and I
can work with the volume and,like Dorian said, we mix you or,
like Mietta said, we can thenmix you in the choir and that
person still then needs to beable to.
We have the responsibility ofmaking sure that they still feel
(21:45):
like they are an asset to theoverall singing aggregation.
Right, not because their voiceis as loud as the next person,
but they do contribute as a body.
They do contribute with pitch.
The person who's loud may needto stand to the person who's on
pitch and not as loud, becausethen they make their praise or
their worship or their singingcomparable to the person next to
(22:08):
them.
So that's a key thing that Ilike to teach all the time is
that when you're in choir, youhave to make your singing
comparable to the overall soundof the choir.
The choir director'sresponsibility is to look for
that, so if he hears an altosticking out over there, she can
be blowing it away, man, andjust be really on fire.
So if he hears an alto stickingout over there, she can be
(22:29):
blowing it away, man, and justbe really on fire.
But it's still his or herresponsibility to make sure that
they understand your singing isnot comparable to the overall
sound, and so, as a choirdirector, this is what we're
looking for, so we have to belooking for that necessary blend
from the softer singers and thelouder singers.
Part of that qualification,then, is making sure that we are
sensitive to all of thosethings.
(22:51):
The person who sings soft is notjust soft, but perhaps they're
on pitch, but if they're not onpitch, thank God that they're
soft and work with that, and ifthey are loud and they're pitchy
, then you got to stand themaround, people who hold the
pitch, and so I think it's acombination of things.
(23:12):
How do you deal with singerswho won't sing out?
I think it depends on yoursituation, but I always say, at
the end of the day, you dealwith everybody with gentle hands
gentle hands, absolutely.
Speaker 6 (23:26):
And it's funny because you're talking about a
softer singer singing out.
Oftentimes I find myselfchallenged with the louder
singer singing softer, so theydon't know how to pull it.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
They don't know how to yeah.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
That requires a lot of control, that requires skill.
That requires a lot of control.
Speaker 6 (23:48):
That requires skill.
That's a lot of control and Ifind that because in our
churches and I have to say thatin our Black churches in
particular we were taught andtrained in our music departments
just sing out, We'll work withit, you know we'll figure it out
in the end, you know we'll comein, we'll figure it out.
Whenever the end, you knowwe'll come in, we'll figure out
whatever's needed but that wasbefore everybody was recording
(24:11):
right and zooming in right theyfound out like uh-oh we have a
problem.
So now we have singers who weretrained to do it that way and
now we're in an era or a spacewhere we don't need as much and
they find it difficult to pullsome of that back, and you
(24:32):
constantly have to do thingslike you know, bring it down.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
You know, james Cleveland Right right and all
the Cleveland moves.
Speaker 6 (24:43):
You know have to do stuff like that.
So that is becoming more of achallenge these days that I'm
listening to than the softer,trying to sing louder or getting
the softer.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
You know, all the more reason to get our choirs
singing hymns in the church,because then there you have to
have a little more control.
The hymns are not always blurtedout, so you start getting into
some more hymns and choruses andsome more spirituals.
Perhaps where the dynamics arebig See gospel choir songs the
(25:14):
dynamics are just, they're justbig.
You know, every now and thenyou either have soft or you have
loud.
There's nothing in between forthe most part.
But when you get to hymns andyou start talking four and part,
you know three and four partharmonies and you get into some
of the spirituals that requirethose vocal dynamics.
So you start, even if you don'tsing them in your church or in
(25:34):
your services or in your events.
Start doing them in rehearsals,because that's a very good way
to start exercising and uh yourchoir and training your choir
and greg, that's such a goodidea that I've been doing that
lately myself.
Speaker 7 (25:48):
I started with because y'all know I've been
building a choir at my churchand everything.
I started with the heavy stuff,like the singing hard and that
kind of thing.
Well, about a month ago I said,okay, I've been working with
you guys on this and singing outand that kind of thing.
Now it's time to take all ofthat and bring it in and put
(26:21):
some polish on it and reallydevelop our blend, develop our
listening to one another, oursound, all of that.
So I pulled I don't know ify'all know this song, but I
pulled out the majesty and gloryof your name.
Majesty and glory of your nameand it.
It has been such an incredibleexercise for us because it's on
the total opposite end of thespectrum, but it's making us
better in those bigger momentstoo, because we're actually
concerned about blend and notjust like going for broke and
(26:46):
not listening to each other.
But yes, yes, yes, I agree ithelps you with your control and
blend and all of that.
Yes, so good.
Speaker 6 (26:57):
It's good exercise for the choir director team.
It is, and that's that'sprobably something that I should
have done earlier on is donefor hymns to to do that.
But we didn't.
We didn't, I didn't start thatway.
I just started out with just awhole bunch of hollering and
screaming.
And here we are.
Listen Greg knows my voice.
(27:18):
He's known my voice for decades.
He knows what it's like.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
It's naturally big, it's big.
He's too kind well, I think, atthe end of the day, what we're
saying is that, uh, to deal, ifyou, if you are looking, and I'm
assuming, let me just do thisreal quick.
My assumption was that this wasfrom a choir director.
(27:48):
How do you deal with singersthat won't sing out Because
choir members are not supposedto deal with that?
That's the choir director'sresponsibility.
So my assumption and if you'renot a choir director, then you
deal with it by going to yourchoir director.
That's how you deal with it.
(28:10):
But for that choir director, whomay be new at it or who may be
just maybe, this is just notsomething that he or she has
experienced before.
We gave you a plethora ofoptions.
You've got to approach it withgentle hands and find out what
it is that makes this personsing soft.
Is it the natural timbre oftheir voice or is it a
confidence issue?
Are they afraid?
(28:30):
Or maybe they're just lookingfor an opportunity to get a
one-on-one with you and thenshow you what they really mean
of you know, there's that Allright.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
I like it either way.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
(29:07):
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
(29:27):
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
I walked around here, there, Isearched around here, there, I
turned around here.
There, there's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
(29:48):
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
I walked around here, there, Isearched around here, there, I
(30:13):
turned around here.
There, there's no one.
There's no one like him.
I walked around here, there, Isearched around here and there,
there's no.
Here, there, I searched aroundhere, there, I turned around
(31:02):
here and there, there's no one.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
There's no one like him.
All right, let's get our secondCRQ in.
Speaker 6 (31:13):
In what ways can we make rehearsal fun and not
always so businesslike?
What ways can we make rehearsalfun and not so businesslike?
Speaker 7 (31:24):
Confetti cannons.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
Smoke machines, all of that.
I'm just curious.
I'm just curious, what makesrehearsal business like?
Or do they mean like, hey,let's just take care of business
, let's, let's get the songslearned.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 6 (31:44):
Or this is an interesting question because
I've been on the other end ofthis question like, come to
rehearsals and, um, all of asudden, they wanted, they want
to take care of business,business matters like dues.
I mean, if you if you're stilldoing that, I don't know would
actually do that right?
I know norian is like are youkidding me?
(32:04):
It used to happen.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
But it used to happen .
Speaker 6 (32:11):
Oh yeah, I know, you know dues, or?
Speaker 1 (32:14):
How do you think they pay for those robes?
Speaker 6 (32:18):
You know dues perhaps .
Maybe they talk about stufflike oh gosh, what you got
appointments that we need to goon in terms of elections?
Speaker 7 (32:33):
Oh not, not in my choir.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
Choir choir president , choir choir president, choir
vice president choir.
Speaker 7 (32:40):
Ain't no election, Treasurer choir, chaplain choir
democracy.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
This was before appointments.
Speaker 7 (32:49):
This is a theocracy right.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (32:55):
This question was almost very familiar to me.
There were times where I'veactually sat in those kind of
choir rehearsals where thosethings were talked about or
people wanted to air grievances.
You know, you know that, youknow stuff like that.
So I got this question.
To a degree I understand it alittle bit.
(33:16):
You guys probably don't have aclue as to what this question is
all about, but I really gotthis one and I would say don't
do business in choir rehearsalsEasy, just leave that for an
actual business meeting.
Because I believe when it comesto choir rehearsal, you need to
(33:38):
come and do choir rehearsalthings like singing and you know
getting your parts together anddo things like that.
Now I make it fun becausesometimes the choir will come to
rehearsal thinking that we'rehaving rehearsal and I'll switch
up and say, nope, we're notgoing to have rehearsal, we're
just going to have, we're goingto talk to each other.
Today.
(33:59):
Fellowship, Just some fellowshipyou know, and my sister would
love that because she brings acup of coffee to every choir
rehearsal.
And my sister would love thatbecause she brings a cup of
coffee to every choir rehearsal.
She comes in with her coffee,ready to socialize.
And then there's some timewhere I have done that and, like
(34:20):
today, we're not going to doany singing tonight, we're just
going to y'all, just let me haveit, let me know how you're
feeling, because sometimes youneed to talk to them a little
bit to see how their day is andhow their lives are going, for
that matter.
Because if you're, if you'retogether with a group of people
for an extensive time in yearsand things of that nature, you
get to know each other on a realpersonal level after a while.
And sometimes they don't reallyhave the the vocal ability to
(34:43):
do anything, but they just wantto just talk, you know, and and
and just laugh a little bitbecause the day had been kind of
heavy, you know, and so thatjust makes people feel a little
more at ease about coming.
It's not always singing, youknow.
Your choir director, whoeverthe leaders are, are concerned
about you.
Overall your total being and Ifound that to be pretty good.
(35:07):
It's been effective.
It worked for me.
What say you?
Speaker 5 (35:13):
that's interesting.
I I didn't even take thebusiness me either of it that
way, I mean I, I thought Ithought they were saying oh, we
just come in and rehearse andand and that's and that's it.
And because I can't ever thinkof any choir context that I've
(35:34):
been in whether it was like thehigh school choir, church choir
or being like helping to run therehearsal or whatever where it
wasn't totally business.
You know, there was like somelaughter involved.
I mean it wasn't somethingwhere everyone just came in and
we pounded out notes and partsand everything else.
(35:56):
So I don't know, I mean, I, Imaybe it is that that whole
business aspect that they'retalking about that, because I,
yeah, that's, and that was partof the reason why I found this
question like hard to hard tounderstand, because I mean, yes,
you do have to come in and youdo have to do a measure of
singing and and going overthings and going over parts, and
(36:19):
that takes time.
But I always found that therewas a certain measure of
laughter and not completebusiness, like nature to even
the most demanding ones.
Speaker 6 (36:34):
There's some rehearsals I've been in that
were quite sterile in businesslife.
You know, yeah, it's like wow,this is it, okay, okay.
Speaker 5 (36:46):
Was that a professional choir or was that?
No, it wasn't.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
It was a church choir , church choir.
Speaker 6 (36:54):
And I'm sitting there like okay, all right, well,
well, they're gonna sing thesenotes and we're out of here,
we're done.
No laughter or anything oh wow,yeah, I mean I've I wonder,
though.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
I wonder if we're not missing something else here.
I think so because, again, weall and I say I think I this
every week we are coming from achurch choir perspective for the
most part, but maybe thisquestion didn't come from a
church choir person.
Maybe it came from somebodywho's in a professional choir or
(37:29):
who's in a concert hall choiror something, and in my
experience, it's business.
Oh yeah, because they don'thave the fellowship as we would
have in the church.
They don't have therelationships with each other as
we would have in the church.
Again and I shared this withyou in the podcast several
months ago is that that'sbusiness for them.
These are professional singers.
(37:50):
They come in to do their thing,so the choir director or the
choir master is all aboutgetting these songs learned.
There's a deadline, let's getthem learned.
Let's make sure your dynamicsare right, your words are right,
your pronunciation is correctand that's all they do.
They pay you to come and learnthis music and get it perfect,
(38:10):
because now we have to sync youup with the orchestra later and
we have no time for laughter.
So they may be coming from thatperspective.
However, like Mietta, I've beenon the other side as well and
I've seen the church businesschoir meetings as well, and I'm
(38:31):
not even going to rehash it, shesaid it all.
But just know that there aresituations where traditional,
traditional church situationswhere choirs have choir business
meetings and I think that'sbeen a large problem with that's
contributed to a lot of whatchurch choir as we know it has
you know, has become it's.
(38:52):
It's in a lot of circles, hasbecome an island unto itself.
It's a church within the church, and that's because they get to
have meetings.
Yeah right, that's really comefrom under the leadership of the
church, ironically, but that'sa whole nother subject.
That's a whole nother CRQ rightthere, that I think, rehearsals
(39:14):
, choir people who especiallyvolunteers they need to be able
to come to rehearsal and leavesaying it was good to have been
there.
That's part of ourresponsibility to make sure that
they're not just giving theirtime.
They're getting off subways andbuses and they're coming from
work and they're thinking aboutgetting dinner ready or they've
(39:38):
outsourced dinner to some other,somebody else, so that they
could be in rehearsal.
We, I think we have aresponsibility as choir
directors to show them that, hey, we're going to make the best
use of your time, we're going tomaximize your time.
Yes, we're going to be just asconcerned with your physical,
spiritual, mental, financial,relational well-being.
(40:01):
But we're also going to getsome singing done and you're
going to get a release, andsometimes rehearsal is just
singing and it's not learninganything new.
Sometimes we're just going oversongs because it's a heavy night
.
People just came in heavy songs.
Because it's a heavy night,people just came in heavy and,
mieta, I think you hit on it.
We have to be sensitive enoughto know that what's happening in
(40:22):
that moment, what's happeningwith this group in this moment,
and are we sensitive enough thatwe can put our finger on the
pulse I like to call it a pulsecheck and put our finger on the
pulse of what's happening withthe group tonight and ask God to
show us what they need.
You know, do they need mepounding them about certain
notes, and you know addictionand articulation or do they need
(40:43):
just a plethora of songs, justa concert?
in their own hearts tonightwhere we just sing 15 songs and
then we're out of here we're notlearning anything, but then
we're out.
See, to me that's leavingsaying it was good to have been
here, and I think every choirmember needs that experience to
say that it was good to havebeen here.
(41:04):
Fun, yes, sometimes it may befun.
Sometimes you may do a I don'tknow a choir rehearsal name,
that tune you know, just startplaying a few bars of a song and
see what is it.
You know, cause that alsothat's teaching.
At the same time, especiallywhen you you know, if you do
choir the way I do it, theynever know what they're going to
(41:24):
sing at any given point.
So we don't get, I don't sendthem a list, you know for for.
Sunday this week, sunday I'mgoing to play and when I start
playing you're supposed to knowthat introduction and get to a
(41:46):
mic really fast Period, becausethat sharpens them and that
keeps them locked into theservice as well, locked into
what's happening, that they knowthe music just as much as they
know the notes and the diction,how to rock and sway and all
that stuff.
They know the music as well.
Speaker 7 (42:00):
Yeah, well, I can say that I'm.
I've never been in a churchchoir business meeting and I
think I'm glad for that.
So because of that, I mean, mycontextual background with choir
is completely different, so Iinterpreted the question
differently.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
Wait, wait, did you just switch up the word
contextual?
Yeah, my contextual background.
Speaker 7 (42:28):
I did.
Speaker 5 (42:29):
I did.
I've got to use a differentphrase every now and then I
heard it.
Speaker 2 (42:34):
My contextual experience.
Speaker 7 (42:36):
It's almost like a suffix on that word anyway, so I
interpreted it kind of more,like dorian did like uh, people
just like coming in banging outthe notes.
Go home, you know.
Speaker 5 (42:50):
No, no fun here you know, just we're gonna sing sing
and go.
Speaker 7 (42:54):
I don't love that set up.
For my choir rehearsals I tryto start by bringing things
together with like worship andthen take natural breaks
throughout, like about halfwaythrough.
I'll give us a break and we'lllaugh a little bit.
Do some announcements.
I'll say something funny.
Let them laugh at me, you knowlike or something.
(43:23):
I'll get them talking to eachother, have like a 90 second,
like little thing for them totalk to, you know, just to a
break, a natural break, and thenat the end we'll wrap up with a
devotion, because I always wantpeople to feel like, okay, yeah
, we got, we had a productivetime, but I also, like Greg said
, enjoyed myself and um, andthen, from my perspective, I
want people to leave um withsomething of eternal value
(43:48):
deposited in their life.
Um, that it's not just I've toldmy choir a million times it's
not just about the music.
The music, uh, is a as a meansto an end.
Um, I mean told my choir amillion times it's not just
about the music.
The music is a means to an end.
I mean, it's a means that weall love and enjoy and that kind
of thing.
But I just feel like we aregood stewards when, like you
(44:09):
said, we keep the pulse check onthere and we can tell like,
okay, do they need a lift rightnow?
Do I need to lift the morale?
Do I need, you know, that kindof thing I mean.
So basically, yeah, I agreewith all of you.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
Well, that is our opinion on those two matters.
You can leave your comments andquestions for us to add to the
CRQ in the coming podcast at theChoir Room Facebook page, or
you can send it to thechoirroomat metromusic-artscom.
And again, remember, if ever weput the messenger before the
message, we have failed topresent an unblemished gospel.
I'm Greg Thomas.
(44:45):
Join us again next week righthere in the Choir Room.
Welcome to the Choir Room.
This is episode 37 of the ChoirRoom Podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Welcome to the Choir.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Room.
I'm Greg Thomas, your host, andI am joined by my co-hosts,
dorian Johnson Welcome to theChoir Room Mieta Stanza-Farrar
and who we like to call thefourth wheel, coleman Smart.
This podcast exists to promoteand encourage to long time
traditions in our society thatseem to be dwindling away, and
(00:31):
that is choir and corporatesinging.
We hope to revive theexcitement and joy experience
with singing in a choir, as wellas inform and educate the
listener on all things singingand all things choir.
This podcast is a production ofMetro Music and Arts, whose
purpose is to perpetuate andpromote the Christian and
positive idea through the mediumof music and other arts.
(00:53):
If you haven't done so already,we ask that you subscribe to
this podcast by writing the wordsubscribe in the subject field
of an email and sending that tothe choir room at
metromusic-artscom.
And then do us a really bigfavor like the podcast, send us
your comments and then sharewith a friend or family member
or colleague and tell themyou're in the Choir Room.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
Welcome to the Choir Room.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Appropriate for this Easter week, where Christians
all over the world areacknowledging Holy Week and, of
course, resurrection Sunday, oras it is commonly known as
Easter Sunday.
I was reminded the other day ofthis song that we recorded
during the shutdown of 2020.
I'm in one location.
My dear friend Misty Quinn isin another location, a song
(01:39):
written by Kurt Carr and thatwe've done many, many times over
the years.
It was so necessary during thepandemic, as we were all
separated from each other.
You probably know how difficultit can be to record a song that
is rubato in its timing andtempo, but yet we managed to
pull it off.
Now.
We've shared it on this podcastbefore and we thought we'd
share it again during thisEaster week.
(01:59):
Here's Misty Quinn and yourstruly in two different locations
in 2020.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
The shed blood of Christ still has miraculous
power.
We can't forget God's sacrifice.
He saved this world with hisson's life.
(02:35):
God must have agonized andgrieved to watch his child
suffer and bleed, but he knewthe blood that his son spilled
there Would save the world fromher despair, so that two
thousand years ago God put hispower in the throne and the sin
(02:58):
of the world could not polluteit.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Seers at time could not delude it.
Jesus still washes, the bloodstill cleanses.
(03:27):
After all these years, theblood still has miraculous power
.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
Miraculous power.
So if you need healing for yourlife, you've tossed and turned
and prayed all night because thedoctor said to you that there
was nothing he could do.
My friend, no matter how youfeel, keep saying by his stripes
, I'm healed.
(04:11):
That's when the blood will takecontrol.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Let his healing virtues flow.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
Jesus, the Lord, is covering you Every sickness,
demon devil has to move, stillwashes.
Thank God, the blood stillcleanses.
(04:52):
After all these years, theblood still has miraculous power
.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Welcome to the choir.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Dorian has our Easter hymn for this week.
Thanks, Greg.
Speaker 5 (05:26):
This week's hymn of the week is Christ, the Lord is
Risen Today.
This hymn was written byCharles Wesley in 1739, which is
the year after his conversion,and was one of the over 6,500
hymns that he is credited withwriting.
After each line of the over6,500 hymns that he is credited
(05:48):
with writing, after each line ofthe hymn, there is a tag that
says Alleluia, and this tag wasactually added by an unknown
author in the 19th century,probably to fit the commonly
used hymn tune that this hymn issung to, which is called Easter
Hymn.
One might call this hymn theoriginal Matthew 28, which is
based on Matthew 28, verses 1through 10.
(06:11):
But all throughout the hymnthere is an underlying reference
to the very specific referencethat we see in verse 3, and that
is to 1 Corinthians 15, verse55, which says O death, where is
your victory?
O death, where is your sting?
The whole hymn is in presenttense, reminding us that Christ
(06:35):
being alive is just as truetoday as it was that first
resurrection Sunday.
This hymn begins with thedeclaration of Christ, the Lord
is risen today.
The second line says sons ofmen and angels, say, reminding
us that both men and angelstestify to our risen Lord, it
(06:56):
calls all to raise your joys andtriumphs high, and then to sing
ye, heavens and earth replyhigh.
And then to sing ye, heavensand earth, reply.
The second verse points us tothe vanity that came with the
stone and the watch and the sealthat sealed in christ in that
tomb.
It says vain, the stone, thewatch, the seal.
(07:18):
And it says christ has burnt.
Burst the gates of hell.
Death in vain forbids his rise.
Christ has opened paradise.
The third verse points us toour glorious King's living.
Forever, as it begins, livesagain, our glorious King.
(07:38):
And then that reference to 1Corinthians 15, 55, where O
death is now thy sting.
Once he died our souls to save,where thy victory, o brave.
And as Charles Wesley begins topoint us from not only the
(07:58):
resurrection but to our futurehope, we're told in verse 4, so
are we now where Christ hath led, following our exalted head,
made like him.
Like him, we rise ours, thecross, the grave, the skies,
reminding us that Christ's deathwas our death, his being buried
(08:20):
in the grave was our beingburied and his resurrection is
our resurrection.
And as we end this glorioushymn, we end once again with
praise.
Hail the Lord of earth andheaven.
Praise to thee by both.
Be given Thee we greettriumphant.
Now hail the resurrection thou.
(08:42):
Now hail the resurrection thou.
The one who said I am theresurrection and the life lives
forever.
And we, as the ones who havereceived the benefits of his
great sacrifice and thejustification that comes with
his resurrection, do indeed owehim all glory, all honor and all
(09:06):
praise, as we remember hisglorious resurrection all around
the world.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Thanks, dorian.
Always appropriate andcertainly, uh, particularly
appropriate for this easter week.
Now mietta has our crq thanks,greg.
Speaker 6 (09:22):
Here we are this week with our crq, and the CRQ this
evening is what do you do withsingers that won't sing out?
What do you do with singersthat won't sing out?
Well, I'll start it off briefly.
I thought about this questionand I'm like Coleman now.
And I'm like Coleman now.
Context is everything.
Speaker 7 (09:44):
I've made an impression on you guys.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Yes, a lasting impression.
We're going to run that contextbeing into the ground Right.
Speaker 6 (09:54):
I love it, though.
I do love it, and I thoughtabout it and I didn't want
whoever submitted this questionto think that when you sing out
or the louder you sing, the moreeffective you are, and that is
just false.
I have this saying that I'vehad for years now in my
(10:15):
rehearsals that sing what youweigh.
I might have made thisstatement sometime before Sing
what you weigh.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
I heard that the first time I heard it and I
thought well, just kind of sitwith that for a minute.
Speaker 6 (10:34):
And I would often say to the women if you, if you
weigh 220 pounds, I need you tosing like you are 220 pounds.
Before we leave any service, Ineed them to have to renovate
the back wall.
That's what I want.
I want the girth, I want thevolume, I want all of that.
(10:55):
Now there are songs that willrequire that, but not every song
requires that.
So I wanted to preface this bysaying that just because you
sing loud doesn't necessarilymean that you're very effective
in doing so.
Um, when you, when you havesingers that are a little
lighter in vote in their vocal,um, the one mistake we often
(11:19):
make, we we put everyone inthese little categories.
So we'll put all the lightersinger ones in one place, all
the heavier one, heavy singingones in one place, like you
would usually put the heaviersinger ones or the louder signal
singing ones in the front rowand then you'll put the softer
singers behind them andhopefully it'll, you know,
(11:41):
balance out, but it reallydoesn't.
And hopefully it'll you know,balance out, but it really
doesn't.
I found that the best way to dothat is to mix it, and so if
you have the heavier singers,the singers with the most volume
, mix them in with the lightersingle ones.
It eventually it balances outbetter instead of separating
them that we have.
(12:01):
I've done.
I've even done it that way.
Then I sing it loud.
Put them behind you.
I need the big, the greatsingers, the loudest singers up
front, and I had to realize thatthat was just not the most
effective way to do it.
You needed to put the lightervoice next to the louder voice,
and what happens is the more youdo that, you will find that
there was a.
There's a very good balance ofsound when you do that, because
(12:25):
usually the louder voice willkind of balance out.
I am and I will say this, I am aum, a power singer.
I'm a power singer.
I, I love the lighter voice.
I, I like to sing a littlelighter, but for some reason it
always sounds like I'm eatingmacaroni and cheese and collard
greens, right, so it does itjust and I know it it always
(12:51):
sounds like there's gravy at theend of that.
I know it is, but and I wouldlove to do that and I found
studio work controls that for me, live singing is different.
Studio keeps that under control, so I've learned to balance
myself as it relates to that.
So it's not always the bestthing just because you have the
(13:13):
louder voice.
So please, listeners, pleasedon't think well.
They're not singing properly ifthey're not singing out, or
it's not effective if they'renot singing out.
That is so far from the truth.
The best way to get the bestsound, I believe mix it in.
Speaker 7 (13:30):
Mix the louder with the softer you know throughout
the entire choir and throughoutthe entire sections of the choir
.
So, fellas, what say you?
Well, mia, I'd love to know,before moving on from your
comments, if you have somebodyin the choir because you know,
nine times out of 10, you know,gospel music requires some guts
(13:51):
to it, right?
If someone walked up into yourchoir, who?
They were just quiet as a mouseand you're like come on, I got
to get some guts out of you.
Come on, what would you do, Imean, other than mixing them in
there?
How would you get a biggersound out of them?
(14:12):
I'm curious to know for areason, because I'd love to use
that knowledge myself.
No, I have other comments.
Speaker 5 (14:25):
But all of you guys, y'all, y'all, I don't know what?
Speaker 7 (14:29):
what do you say?
Speaker 6 (14:33):
well, you know, it's I.
I'm kind of hands-on, I reallyam, I'm kind of hands-on.
So I've I've been in contactwith not very many but a few
lighter voices and I'll get nextto them, you know, I'll let
them sing and then I will presson their stomach, press on them
a little bit, you know you're aman.
Don't just walk up to folks.
(14:55):
You got to be careful about that, but I will.
I will cause, you know, askthem sing this and then, and the
more I press in a little bit,it forces them to push out more.
It pushes out more.
And um, I had, I used to have ayoung lady who was she no
longer sings with me soprano.
She had an excellent sopranovoice and I love putting her
(15:19):
next to my sister who has alighter voice.
Cindy um has lighter voice.
I like putting her next to herbecause it forced Cindy to sing
a little more.
You know so when I so that'swhat I mean by mixing them.
You put them next to somebodywho really does have that
confidence and don't mindsinging out, and you'll be
(15:40):
surprised that they will startto adapt and start to work their
way.
Ok, I can do this.
I just got to be confident,because that's that's what most
of it is.
It's about confidence.
Some people don't think thatI'm I'm not confident enough to
do that, when in fact you reallyare.
You know, you really are, youknow, and that's that's one
that's a simple way for me toget what I need out of it.
Speaker 7 (16:03):
It always depends on where I am, how much I have to
beg people for their sound.
There have been some placeswhere I just walk right in these
folks Pentecostal they're likeliterally the walls are shaking
when they start singing.
And sometimes when I walk intoother settings it's like you
gotta be like all right now,come on, come on, help me now.
(16:25):
But that's what it takes.
Sometimes it takes the directorbeing clear about what you need
.
So sometimes when I'm directingI'll make jokes about myself
being like what's his name fromSesame Street that bangs an
animal?
Not Sesame Street, the Muppets,the.
Speaker 5 (16:46):
Muppets, one of those Muppets?
Speaker 3 (16:48):
Yeah, I'd be like animal from the Muppets like
coming at the choir like come on, y'all sing, let's go.
Speaker 7 (16:55):
Come on so sometimes it's like that, and if they like
start, I wish I could justvideo you into one of my choir
rehearsals sometimes, because itmakes more sense to see it than
me talking about it.
But but if they start singing,I'll be like hold up, hold up.
You know, come on now.
Y'all know what I'm looking for.
Don't make me beg.
(17:16):
And I'll say let's try thatagain, and then usually they'll
bring it the second time aroundaround.
But I also work with students alot who tend to be more shy
about singing out like that,just because they're still
(17:41):
discovering their voice.
Some of them it's just aself-confidence issue and
they're trying to figure outthat kind of thing.
Well, sometimes I'll do thisexercise with them about singing
from your core and I'll saylike hey you know, if you're
walking down the street andsomebody like takes your mom's
purse or something, you're notgonna be like hey, hey, give
(18:03):
that back.
Speaker 5 (18:04):
And I said how are you going to do?
Speaker 7 (18:05):
that and I'll like point to the diaphragm, the core
, and I'll be like you're goingto say, hey, you know, like that
kind of thing.
I'm like sometimes you know yougot to core and you know not
singing from your throat andproper breathing and breath
support and that kind of thing.
But it just kind of depends onthe singer that you're working
(18:42):
with why they sing lightly.
If it's, if it's confidence,build their confidence.
If they don't know how, teachthem how.
If, if, you know, that kind ofthing.
So what do you guys say?
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
Yeah, it was.
It was interesting sort ofhearing the question and then
some of the responses, becausethere there does come a time,
and usually it's with thesection, and then some of the
responses, because there theredoes come a time, and usually
it's with the section, and andit you can reach a point during
a rehearsal where you know that,like the section's being lazy
yeah and you, and you just gottatell them like, okay, get out
(19:21):
of your seats and stand up right, because you need.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
It's wednesday or thursday and it's yeah, it's
already a long week, you knowyeah, exactly, exactly.
Speaker 5 (19:30):
But that's just again about about knowing the people
and knowing, like, the choir aswell, and and and I think that's
the beauty of choral singing isthat you aren't going to have,
um, say, a hundred people upthere and all of them able to
produce the same volume, orsomething like that.
I mean, I, I'm an opera buffand so I think of like, like, uh
(19:56):
, choruses that sing in theopera you couldn't have like a
hundred of the main peoplesinging because that choir would
be so loud, can?
Speaker 1 (20:08):
you imagine the vibrato?
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 5 (20:12):
I mean, and so it's like there are people who are
suited for for a chorus and forchoir, and so it takes all kinds
.
So we we have to just becareful that that just because
someone doesn't sing aspowerfully as someone else, um
they they aren't saying exertingas much energy or giving as
(20:34):
much effort.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
but if we work with folks long enough, we can know
if they're not, and address thatand address that so yeah, I
think, uh, obviously I agreewith all of you.
Yeah, I think obviously I agreewith all of you, and I think
there's so many facets to theanswer for this question.
I don't think there's oneanswer because I'm going to try
(20:59):
and find a synonym for context,but I think you know what I mean
.
It depends on the situation,the scenario in which you're
asking people to sing loud andthen again, like Dorian said,
some people's voices are justnaturally soft.
To me, it's more important thatthey're on pitch and soft or
(21:20):
loud, so you can be loud and bepitchy, and then we've got a
different kind of problem, andthen we've got a different kind
of problem.
So I'd rather you be on pitchand your timing be well and I
can work with the volume and,like Dorian said, we mix you or,
like Mietta said, we can thenmix you in the choir and that
person still then needs to beable to.
We have the responsibility ofmaking sure that they still feel
(21:45):
like they are an asset to theoverall singing aggregation.
Right, not because their voiceis as loud as the next person,
but they do contribute as a body.
They do contribute with pitch.
The person who's loud may needto stand to the person who's on
pitch and not as loud, becausethen they make their praise or
their worship or their singingcomparable to the person next to
(22:08):
them.
So that's a key thing that Ilike to teach all the time is
that when you're in choir, youhave to make your singing
comparable to the overall soundof the choir.
The choir director'sresponsibility is to look for
that, so if he hears an altosticking out over there, she can
be blowing it away, man, andjust be really on fire.
So if he hears an alto stickingout over there, she can be
(22:29):
blowing it away, man, and justbe really on fire.
But it's still his or herresponsibility to make sure that
they understand your singing isnot comparable to the overall
sound, and so, as a choirdirector, this is what we're
looking for, so we have to belooking for that necessary blend
from the softer singers and thelouder singers.
Part of that qualification,then, is making sure that we are
sensitive to all of thosethings.
(22:51):
The person who sings soft is notjust soft, but perhaps they're
on pitch, but if they're not onpitch, thank God that they're
soft and work with that, and ifthey are loud and they're pitchy
, then you got to stand themaround, people who hold the
pitch, and so I think it's acombination of things.
(23:12):
How do you deal with singerswho won't sing out?
I think it depends on yoursituation, but I always say, at
the end of the day, you dealwith everybody with gentle hands
gentle hands, absolutely.
Speaker 6 (23:26):
And it's funny because you're talking about a
softer singer singing out.
Oftentimes I find myselfchallenged with the louder
singer singing softer, so theydon't know how to pull it.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
They don't know how to yeah.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
That requires a lot of control, that requires skill.
That requires a lot of control.
Speaker 6 (23:48):
That requires skill.
That's a lot of control and Ifind that because in our
churches and I have to say thatin our Black churches in
particular we were taught andtrained in our music departments
just sing out, We'll work withit, you know we'll figure it out
in the end, you know we'll comein, we'll figure it out.
Whenever the end, you knowwe'll come in, we'll figure out
whatever's needed but that wasbefore everybody was recording
(24:11):
right and zooming in right theyfound out like uh-oh we have a
problem.
So now we have singers who weretrained to do it that way and
now we're in an era or a spacewhere we don't need as much and
they find it difficult to pullsome of that back, and you
(24:32):
constantly have to do thingslike you know, bring it down.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
You know, james Cleveland Right right and all
the Cleveland moves.
Speaker 6 (24:43):
You know have to do stuff like that.
So that is becoming more of achallenge these days that I'm
listening to than the softer,trying to sing louder or getting
the softer.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
You know, all the more reason to get our choirs
singing hymns in the church,because then there you have to
have a little more control.
The hymns are not always blurtedout, so you start getting into
some more hymns and choruses andsome more spirituals.
Perhaps where the dynamics arebig See gospel choir songs the
(25:14):
dynamics are just, they're justbig.
You know, every now and thenyou either have soft or you have
loud.
There's nothing in between forthe most part.
But when you get to hymns andyou start talking four and part,
you know three and four partharmonies and you get into some
of the spirituals that requirethose vocal dynamics.
So you start, even if you don'tsing them in your church or in
(25:34):
your services or in your events.
Start doing them in rehearsals,because that's a very good way
to start exercising and uh yourchoir and training your choir
and greg, that's such a goodidea that I've been doing that
lately myself.
Speaker 7 (25:48):
I started with because y'all know I've been
building a choir at my churchand everything.
I started with the heavy stuff,like the singing hard and that
kind of thing.
Well, about a month ago I said,okay, I've been working with
you guys on this and singing outand that kind of thing.
Now it's time to take all ofthat and bring it in and put
(26:21):
some polish on it and reallydevelop our blend, develop our
listening to one another, oursound, all of that.
So I pulled I don't know ify'all know this song, but I
pulled out the majesty and gloryof your name.
Majesty and glory of your nameand it.
It has been such an incredibleexercise for us because it's on
the total opposite end of thespectrum, but it's making us
better in those bigger momentstoo, because we're actually
concerned about blend and notjust like going for broke and
(26:46):
not listening to each other.
But yes, yes, yes, I agree ithelps you with your control and
blend and all of that.
Yes, so good.
Speaker 6 (26:57):
It's good exercise for the choir director team.
It is, and that's that'sprobably something that I should
have done earlier on is donefor hymns to to do that.
But we didn't.
We didn't, I didn't start thatway.
I just started out with just awhole bunch of hollering and
screaming.
And here we are.
Listen Greg knows my voice.
(27:18):
He's known my voice for decades.
He knows what it's like.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
It's naturally big, it's big.
He's too kind well, I think, atthe end of the day, what we're
saying is that, uh, to deal, ifyou, if you are looking, and I'm
assuming, let me just do thisreal quick.
My assumption was that this wasfrom a choir director.
(27:48):
How do you deal with singersthat won't sing out Because
choir members are not supposedto deal with that?
That's the choir director'sresponsibility.
So my assumption and if you'renot a choir director, then you
deal with it by going to yourchoir director.
That's how you deal with it.
(28:10):
But for that choir director, whomay be new at it or who may be
just maybe, this is just notsomething that he or she has
experienced before.
We gave you a plethora ofoptions.
You've got to approach it withgentle hands and find out what
it is that makes this personsing soft.
Is it the natural timbre oftheir voice or is it a
confidence issue?
Are they afraid?
(28:30):
Or maybe they're just lookingfor an opportunity to get a
one-on-one with you and thenshow you what they really mean
of you know, there's that Allright.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
I like it either way.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
(29:07):
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
(29:27):
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
I walked around here, there, Isearched around here, there, I
turned around here.
There, there's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
(29:48):
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
There's no one.
There's no one like Jesus.
There's no one.
There's no one like Him.
I walked around here, there, Isearched around here, there, I
(30:13):
turned around here.
There, there's no one.
There's no one like him.
I walked around here, there, Isearched around here and there,
there's no.
Here, there, I searched aroundhere, there, I turned around
(31:02):
here and there, there's no one.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
There's no one like him.
All right, let's get our secondCRQ in.
Speaker 6 (31:13):
In what ways can we make rehearsal fun and not
always so businesslike?
What ways can we make rehearsalfun and not so businesslike?
Speaker 7 (31:24):
Confetti cannons.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
Smoke machines, all of that.
I'm just curious.
I'm just curious, what makesrehearsal business like?
Or do they mean like, hey,let's just take care of business
, let's, let's get the songslearned.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 6 (31:44):
Or this is an interesting question because
I've been on the other end ofthis question like, come to
rehearsals and, um, all of asudden, they wanted, they want
to take care of business,business matters like dues.
I mean, if you if you're stilldoing that, I don't know would
actually do that right?
I know norian is like are youkidding me?
(32:04):
It used to happen.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
But it used to happen .
Speaker 6 (32:11):
Oh yeah, I know, you know dues, or?
Speaker 1 (32:14):
How do you think they pay for those robes?
Speaker 6 (32:18):
You know dues perhaps .
Maybe they talk about stufflike oh gosh, what you got
appointments that we need to goon in terms of elections?
Speaker 7 (32:33):
Oh not, not in my choir.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
Choir choir president , choir choir president, choir
vice president choir.
Speaker 7 (32:40):
Ain't no election, Treasurer choir, chaplain choir
democracy.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
This was before appointments.
Speaker 7 (32:49):
This is a theocracy right.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (32:55):
This question was almost very familiar to me.
There were times where I'veactually sat in those kind of
choir rehearsals where thosethings were talked about or
people wanted to air grievances.
You know, you know that, youknow stuff like that.
So I got this question.
To a degree I understand it alittle bit.
(33:16):
You guys probably don't have aclue as to what this question is
all about, but I really gotthis one and I would say don't
do business in choir rehearsalsEasy, just leave that for an
actual business meeting.
Because I believe when it comesto choir rehearsal, you need to
(33:38):
come and do choir rehearsalthings like singing and you know
getting your parts together anddo things like that.
Now I make it fun becausesometimes the choir will come to
rehearsal thinking that we'rehaving rehearsal and I'll switch
up and say, nope, we're notgoing to have rehearsal, we're
just going to have, we're goingto talk to each other.
Today.
(33:59):
Fellowship, Just some fellowshipyou know, and my sister would
love that because she brings acup of coffee to every choir
rehearsal.
And my sister would love thatbecause she brings a cup of
coffee to every choir rehearsal.
She comes in with her coffee,ready to socialize.
And then there's some timewhere I have done that and, like
(34:20):
today, we're not going to doany singing tonight, we're just
going to y'all, just let me haveit, let me know how you're
feeling, because sometimes youneed to talk to them a little
bit to see how their day is andhow their lives are going, for
that matter.
Because if you're, if you'retogether with a group of people
for an extensive time in yearsand things of that nature, you
get to know each other on a realpersonal level after a while.
And sometimes they don't reallyhave the the vocal ability to
(34:43):
do anything, but they just wantto just talk, you know, and and
and just laugh a little bitbecause the day had been kind of
heavy, you know, and so thatjust makes people feel a little
more at ease about coming.
It's not always singing, youknow.
Your choir director, whoeverthe leaders are, are concerned
about you.
Overall your total being and Ifound that to be pretty good.
(35:07):
It's been effective.
It worked for me.
What say you?
Speaker 5 (35:13):
that's interesting.
I I didn't even take thebusiness me either of it that
way, I mean I, I thought Ithought they were saying oh, we
just come in and rehearse andand and that's and that's it.
And because I can't ever thinkof any choir context that I've
(35:34):
been in whether it was like thehigh school choir, church choir
or being like helping to run therehearsal or whatever where it
wasn't totally business.
You know, there was like somelaughter involved.
I mean it wasn't somethingwhere everyone just came in and
we pounded out notes and partsand everything else.
(35:56):
So I don't know, I mean, I, Imaybe it is that that whole
business aspect that they'retalking about that, because I,
yeah, that's, and that was partof the reason why I found this
question like hard to hard tounderstand, because I mean, yes,
you do have to come in and youdo have to do a measure of
singing and and going overthings and going over parts, and
(36:19):
that takes time.
But I always found that therewas a certain measure of
laughter and not completebusiness, like nature to even
the most demanding ones.
Speaker 6 (36:34):
There's some rehearsals I've been in that
were quite sterile in businesslife.
You know, yeah, it's like wow,this is it, okay, okay.
Speaker 5 (36:46):
Was that a professional choir or was that?
No, it wasn't.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
It was a church choir , church choir.
Speaker 6 (36:54):
And I'm sitting there like okay, all right, well,
well, they're gonna sing thesenotes and we're out of here,
we're done.
No laughter or anything oh wow,yeah, I mean I've I wonder,
though.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
I wonder if we're not missing something else here.
I think so because, again, weall and I say I think I this
every week we are coming from achurch choir perspective for the
most part, but maybe thisquestion didn't come from a
church choir person.
Maybe it came from somebodywho's in a professional choir or
(37:29):
who's in a concert hall choiror something, and in my
experience, it's business.
Oh yeah, because they don'thave the fellowship as we would
have in the church.
They don't have therelationships with each other as
we would have in the church.
Again and I shared this withyou in the podcast several
months ago is that that'sbusiness for them.
These are professional singers.
(37:50):
They come in to do their thing,so the choir director or the
choir master is all aboutgetting these songs learned.
There's a deadline, let's getthem learned.
Let's make sure your dynamicsare right, your words are right,
your pronunciation is correctand that's all they do.
They pay you to come and learnthis music and get it perfect,
(38:10):
because now we have to sync youup with the orchestra later and
we have no time for laughter.
So they may be coming from thatperspective.
However, like Mietta, I've beenon the other side as well and
I've seen the church businesschoir meetings as well, and I'm
(38:31):
not even going to rehash it, shesaid it all.
But just know that there aresituations where traditional,
traditional church situationswhere choirs have choir business
meetings and I think that'sbeen a large problem with that's
contributed to a lot of whatchurch choir as we know it has
you know, has become it's.
(38:52):
It's in a lot of circles, hasbecome an island unto itself.
It's a church within the church, and that's because they get to
have meetings.
Yeah right, that's really comefrom under the leadership of the
church, ironically, but that'sa whole nother subject.
That's a whole nother CRQ rightthere, that I think, rehearsals
(39:14):
, choir people who especiallyvolunteers they need to be able
to come to rehearsal and leavesaying it was good to have been
there.
That's part of ourresponsibility to make sure that
they're not just giving theirtime.
They're getting off subways andbuses and they're coming from
work and they're thinking aboutgetting dinner ready or they've
(39:38):
outsourced dinner to some other,somebody else, so that they
could be in rehearsal.
We, I think we have aresponsibility as choir
directors to show them that, hey, we're going to make the best
use of your time, we're going tomaximize your time.
Yes, we're going to be just asconcerned with your physical,
spiritual, mental, financial,relational well-being.
(40:01):
But we're also going to getsome singing done and you're
going to get a release, andsometimes rehearsal is just
singing and it's not learninganything new.
Sometimes we're just going oversongs because it's a heavy night
.
People just came in heavy songs.
Because it's a heavy night,people just came in heavy and,
mieta, I think you hit on it.
We have to be sensitive enoughto know that what's happening in
(40:22):
that moment, what's happeningwith this group in this moment,
and are we sensitive enough thatwe can put our finger on the
pulse I like to call it a pulsecheck and put our finger on the
pulse of what's happening withthe group tonight and ask God to
show us what they need.
You know, do they need mepounding them about certain
notes, and you know addictionand articulation or do they need
(40:43):
just a plethora of songs, justa concert?
in their own hearts tonightwhere we just sing 15 songs and
then we're out of here we're notlearning anything, but then
we're out.
See, to me that's leavingsaying it was good to have been
here, and I think every choirmember needs that experience to
say that it was good to havebeen here.
(41:04):
Fun, yes, sometimes it may befun.
Sometimes you may do a I don'tknow a choir rehearsal name,
that tune you know, just startplaying a few bars of a song and
see what is it.
You know, cause that alsothat's teaching.
At the same time, especiallywhen you you know, if you do
choir the way I do it, theynever know what they're going to
(41:24):
sing at any given point.
So we don't get, I don't sendthem a list, you know for for.
Sunday this week, sunday I'mgoing to play and when I start
playing you're supposed to knowthat introduction and get to a
(41:46):
mic really fast Period, becausethat sharpens them and that
keeps them locked into theservice as well, locked into
what's happening, that they knowthe music just as much as they
know the notes and the diction,how to rock and sway and all
that stuff.
They know the music as well.
Speaker 7 (42:00):
Yeah, well, I can say that I'm.
I've never been in a churchchoir business meeting and I
think I'm glad for that.
So because of that, I mean, mycontextual background with choir
is completely different, so Iinterpreted the question
differently.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
Wait, wait, did you just switch up the word
contextual?
Yeah, my contextual background.
Speaker 7 (42:28):
I did.
Speaker 5 (42:29):
I did.
I've got to use a differentphrase every now and then I
heard it.
Speaker 2 (42:34):
My contextual experience.
Speaker 7 (42:36):
It's almost like a suffix on that word anyway, so I
interpreted it kind of more,like dorian did like uh, people
just like coming in banging outthe notes.
Go home, you know.
Speaker 5 (42:50):
No, no fun here you know, just we're gonna sing sing
and go.
Speaker 7 (42:54):
I don't love that set up.
For my choir rehearsals I tryto start by bringing things
together with like worship andthen take natural breaks
throughout, like about halfwaythrough.
I'll give us a break and we'lllaugh a little bit.
Do some announcements.
I'll say something funny.
Let them laugh at me, you knowlike or something.
(43:23):
I'll get them talking to eachother, have like a 90 second,
like little thing for them totalk to, you know, just to a
break, a natural break, and thenat the end we'll wrap up with a
devotion, because I always wantpeople to feel like, okay, yeah
, we got, we had a productivetime, but I also, like Greg said
, enjoyed myself and um, andthen, from my perspective, I
want people to leave um withsomething of eternal value
(43:48):
deposited in their life.
Um, that it's not just I've toldmy choir a million times it's
not just about the music.
The music, uh, is a as a meansto an end.
Um, I mean told my choir amillion times it's not just
about the music.
The music is a means to an end.
I mean, it's a means that weall love and enjoy and that kind
of thing.
But I just feel like we aregood stewards when, like you
(44:09):
said, we keep the pulse check onthere and we can tell like,
okay, do they need a lift rightnow?
Do I need to lift the morale?
Do I need, you know, that kindof thing I mean.
So basically, yeah, I agreewith all of you.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
Well, that is our opinion on those two matters.
You can leave your comments andquestions for us to add to the
CRQ in the coming podcast at theChoir Room Facebook page, or
you can send it to thechoirroomat metromusic-artscom.
And again, remember, if ever weput the messenger before the
message, we have failed topresent an unblemished gospel.
I'm Greg Thomas.
(44:45):
Join us again next week righthere in the Choir Room.
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