July 31, 2025 • 53 mins
What’s the difference between truly belonging and just fitting in? In this raw and resonant episode of The Circle, Eric and Tim unpack the subtle (and not-so-subtle) ways we abandon ourselves in order to be accepted—and what it takes to stop. They explore how social conditioning, internalized fear, and curated identities shape our choices around how we show up in community, especially in queer spaces.
Eric shares his personal experience of feeling isolated during Bear Week in Provincetown, while Tim opens up about the cost of being too playful, too much, or too real. Together, they discuss the relationship between control, safety, and self-trust—and how embodiment practices, affirmation, and conscious spaces can help us come home to ourselves.
This is a must-listen for anyone navigating identity, authenticity, or the messy middle between self-protection and self-expression.
Timestamps:
00:00–04:20 — Intro: The difference between belonging and fitting in
04:21–14:10 — Tim’s fashion story: authenticity vs. curation
14:11–20:50 — Expertise vs. people-pleasing, and the role of intention
20:51–27:45 — The hidden cost of hiding parts of ourselves
27:46–36:10 — Embodied loneliness: fitting in but still feeling alone
36:11–44:30 — Tim’s story: playfulness, performance, and the pain of not being seen
44:31–52:40 — The illusion of belonging on Instagram; the craving for connection
52:41–59:00 — Embodiment and nervous system tools to anchor authenticity
59:01–1:05:10 — Safe spaces vs. performative ones: building real community
1:05:11–1:13:30 — Inner belonging, affirmations, and the challenge of loving all parts
1:13:31–1:22:00 — The need for community, checking in, and not feeling like a burden
1:22:01–End — Wrap-up: Sass, solitude, and the sacred work of showing up
Stay Connected with The Circle
- Instagram: @queermensembodiment
- YouTube: Queer Men’s Embodiment
- Website & Community: www.MyEmbodiment.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Eric Bomyea (00:06):
Welcome back to The Circle, a podcast where we go
all in on men's work, body manpractices, and personal growth
from our queer perspective. Ifyou're enjoying the show, please
be sure to share your favoriteepisode and leave us a review.
If you're curious about the workthat we do or the practices
we've mentioned on the show,head on over to myembodiment.com
to join our new community.Practice along with us and ask
(00:26):
us questions about anythingyou've heard us talk about. Now
on to today's show.
This episode, we're exploringwhat it means to truly belong
versus where and why we try tofit in, and what parts of
ourselves do we hide when we do.Kim, are you ready to go all in?
I'm ready. Let's do this. Solet's just start at the top.
Timothy Bish (00:44):
How do you define the difference between belonging
versus fitting in? Belongingwould be the ability to show up
as your authentic self withoutneed to edit or curate in any
way. And fitting in would be avery specific and conscious
(01:08):
decision to amplify certainaspects of ourselves that we
think are acceptable or wantedby whatever group we're in and
to pull back or diminish aspectsthat we think they're not going
to like. And therefore, curatingaspects of our own authentic
self so that whoever my observeris is gonna find me more
(01:31):
palatable. So it's really aboutfeeling into another person or
another group of people or asituation and deciding what what
you might think they want andthen trying to give that to
them.
And then, obviously, over time,getting clues, oh, they want
more of this, they want less ofthat, and making subtle shifts
(01:52):
to I'll I'll just keep givingthem what I think it is they
want. And my idea of what theywant might get clearer and
clearer based on evidence. Butin so doing, I will betray these
other parts of me that that maybe really valuable. Why do you
think
Eric Bomyea (02:07):
it is that we betray these parts of ourselves?
And do you think is underneaththat conscious or subconscious
desire to fit in?
Timothy Bish (02:15):
Well, know, we are social beings. We are designed
to exist in groups. And a lot ofour safety and survival was
based on being a welcomed andprotected member of of our
group. So it doesn't it isn'tsurprising that we have that
impulse. What's tricky, though,now is that we have all these
(02:37):
other pressures.
So it can be you know, if wethink about back in the day,
you're like, well, we're allprobably roughly wearing the
same thing, and we're allroughly doing the same thing.
You know? And now we have allthese different other things
that can separate us. And so Ithink it's heightened. What
outfit I wear can make adifference depending on who I'm
(03:01):
trying to appeal to.
How I speak, my word choices,how I choose to spend my free
time. Because we have so manymore options now, we can start
to get more and more particularabout what, like, what it is we
like or don't like, what we feelcomfortable around or what we
don't feel comfortable around.You know, as an example, I was
(03:22):
this is such a long time ago,but I was dating a fashion
stylist. You know, he had anincredible sense of fashion. He
would often, like, pick out myoutfits for me, which I love
because it's not a thing I careabout.
But not that I don't care aboutit, but I wasn't very good at
it. And so I'm like, oh, well,you know, I I could do this.
Anyway, I remember one timehaving dinner with a friend of
mine and her husband, a friendfrom high school, a middle
(03:42):
school, this person I knew very,very well. And she admitted she
was like, oh, we got reallynervous when we heard that your
boyfriend was a fashion stylistbecause we were like we became
self conscious about what wewere gonna wear or or if what we
had chosen to wear was goodenough. And I remember in that
moment thinking, oh, there was apressure because there's this
(04:03):
idea of what is fashion.
And you kind of know it or don'tknow it. And, you know, and so
it's an example of, well, whatif I'm just really comfortable
in this outfit and you don'tthink it's fashion? For some of
us, you're like, well, whocares? But for others, it might
be the thing that continues tokeep you in the
Eric Bomyea (04:20):
group or pushes you out of the group. Right. In this
case too, maybe there's a littlepart about they were wanting to
make an impression, they wantedthis person to like them. So I
do start to see that there isthat hyper awareness is that
they are presenting themselvesin an effort to fit in, or to
impress, or to make some sort ofimpression that is favorable
(04:43):
from another person. And sothat's actually a really great
example of the thing in.
I will put on a different outfitto impress somebody else. Versus
would be like, well, I'm goingto put on this outfit that I
want to wear and person acrossfrom me and have an opinion on
(05:06):
it or not, but I'm still
Timothy Bish (05:07):
gonna belong with them. And I think in this
example, belonging would alsolook like you know, because we
live in a world with, you know,social constructs. Right? So,
oh, I have to wear a suit tothis event because that is what
is expected in my industry and,you know, and I and I want and
choose to be a professional.Great.
(05:28):
So you wear a suit. But at thatpoint, it's like, but then if
you're when you're choosing yoursuit, are you choosing it
because it's the thing thatmakes you feel the best? Or I'm
choosing it because I think allthese other people are gonna
like it more or like me more init. And and I I do sort of wanna
talk about, especially when youdon't like, I don't have a great
(05:50):
fashion sense, and I I live inathletic wear most of the time.
Sometimes I'm like, I will askpeople's opinion because I'm
genuinely curious.
Like, I I I would like you tohelp me curate this thing, which
is very different than I'm gonnatry to make each choice based on
(06:10):
I think you'll like so thatyou'll like me. So, you know,
there's a little distinctionthere of maybe you don't maybe
you're not expert in somethingand you are looking to other
people. That's different thanI'm looking I'm gonna curate my
my behavior and my choices sothat you'll like me. Because I
do I do often want to look good,and I often am like, oh, I think
(06:33):
this looks good, but I don'treally know. Yeah.
Eric Bomyea (06:35):
But I'm curious. Like I like like when you look
at it, like what do you see?Right? Because I think that's
what we're getting at. So I meanthere's still a part that's
like, why are you lookingoutward?
And this isn't a criticism, thisis a game of sorts. Like looking
at it. So it's like, when youput something on, how does it
(06:56):
make you feel?
Timothy Bish (06:57):
Well, so this is the thing. I recognize that
there are different skill setsand art forms. And so I feel
like I recognize that fashionand color combinations are not
the thing that I excel at. So Iwill I will look when I look at
(07:20):
an outfit, I will mainly look atsort of fit. I'm also I tend to
keep it pretty low key.
You know, a buttoned on shirtand a pair of slacks, jeans and
a T shirt, you know, that kindof thing. I mean, like, this
shirt that I'm wearing right nowfeels, like, fashion y for me.
You know? Although I got this,like, I don't know, three
(07:40):
seasons ago. Anyway, I stillreally like it.
But it's pretty simple. If Ineed to get it if I need to be a
little bit more, then I then Iseek help. I I'd be willing to
wear whatever I wanted, I guess.I just feel like I don't know.
It's like even though, like,seeking help with how to look
good,
Eric Bomyea (08:01):
I think in a different context, could be
like, hey, I need your helpnavigating this social
situation, because I'm having ahard time navigating it. When I
try to do it on my own, itdoesn't feel like I'm being
accepted by the group. So I needa little bit of help to fit in.
That's kind of what that soundslike to me. It's like I'm trying
(08:23):
to present a part of me that Ilike, but doesn't always fit the
theme or whatever it might be.
Right. And so I'm asking for alittle bit of support on how to
navigate this in a sense so thatI can be in that environment and
feel like I fit in.
Timothy Bish (08:40):
Right. Yeah, I think that's the thing. If I had
a fashion sense that I waschoosing not to present because
I was afraid people wouldn'tlike it, that feels very
different than I don't actuallyhave much of a fashion sense.
And so I'm looking for guidancebecause I'm, like, trying to
fill in a deficit, you know,that I have.
Eric Bomyea (09:01):
But what is that that deficit?
Timothy Bish (09:03):
I mean, what are you trying to accomplish with
curating an outfit? Well, Imean, I guess it depends on the
context and where you're going.But the idea would be I would
like to I almost always want tolook good and feel good in what
I'm wearing. And feel good inwhat I'm wearing is really
important for me, especially asa fitness yoga person. Right?
(09:27):
I want I want to look good andfeel good in what I'm wearing.
And then there are context when,oh, that but I don't I don't ask
people's opinions about what Iwear to teach fitness or yoga.
I'm like, this this is you know,it's pretty basic. It feels
good. It works.
Let's go. It's when I get to therealm of, oh, if if you were
(09:49):
gonna send me to the Met Gala.Oh, okay. I need a little
guidance. But because it's notmy it's not my medium.
Eric Bomyea (09:57):
But like the person that shows up to the Met Gala
wearing whatever they want towear, like might stick out.
Right? And in that sense, theymay not fit in. They're going to
stand out. Right?
So like Yeah, the Met Gala is abad example.
Timothy Bish (10:12):
Was trying to stand out.
Eric Bomyea (10:14):
Right. But I think like this is what I'm trying to
get at here is that like, youknow, based off of what we're
wearing, if we are outsourcingthe opinion of what it is that
we're wearing, why is it thatwe're doing that? And in what
effort? Is it to look good forothers, or is it to look good
for ourselves?
Timothy Bish (10:30):
Well, I mean, okay. So we this example, we are
looking to experts in areaswhere we're not expert. This
happens all the time. So peoplecome to me and ask me questions
about yoga. They ask mequestions about fitness.
They ask me questions about, youknow, Chinese medicine or
whatever because I am moreexpert than they are, chances
are, if they're asking me. Andand it it isn't as if they're
(10:54):
abandoning part of themselves inthat. They're like, well, you
know more, so I'm coming to you.And so in the fashion example,
it's like, well, you know more,so I'm coming to you, which is
very different than I knowexactly what I wanna wear or I
know exactly what I wanna do,and I choose not to because I'm
afraid you won't like it if Iwear that or do that. So when we
think about fitting in, fittingin is I'm gonna get a sense of
(11:17):
what I think you want me to looklike, you want me to sound like,
you want me to do, and then I'mgonna curate how I show up
consistent with that as opposedto I'm gonna I'm gonna do
whatever I want based on my owncompass.
So the fashion example is Idon't really have my own
compass. So looking for expertis not I don't I don't think
(11:40):
looking for expert advice,especially in areas of deficit,
is is trying to fit in versusbelonging. I think it's filling
a gap. Yeah. Mean, my cynicalbrain is like the fashion
industry is trying
Eric Bomyea (11:54):
to teach us how to fit in, how to mold ourselves so
that we ask these questions,that we hire people or go to
stores to buy things in aneffort to fit in, to follow a
trend, to follow whatever. Sothat's what I'm getting from it
versus we go to a doctor or afitness expert because we don't
(12:15):
have an understanding of how todo a certain thing, or we are
trying to fit a mold ofsomething else. Or maybe we're
trying to belong a little bitmore in our bodies. Maybe there
is a sense of like, oh, maybethere's a deficit inside of my
body, and I'm trying to figureout how to belong more in it. Or
maybe I'm trying to reshape mybody to better fit in someplace
(12:37):
else.
So I still think that a decisioncan be made consciously to seek
out expertise in something thatwe have a deficit of in an
attempt still to fit in.
Timothy Bish (12:47):
Yes. Yeah. Think that's accurate. I don't think
that's always true, but I thinkit is can be true, could be
true, is probably true in inmany instances. Yeah.
So like So but so fitting in ismaking conscious choices to
curate a part of you based onyour your understanding of the
(13:10):
expectations of your audience.Right? And belonging would be
just showing up, feeling feelingfree to show up as fully as you
can. So, yeah, I don't weshouldn't get too much deeper
into any one particular examplebecause we could fit in or try
to fit in in almost any aspectof our life. What do I, you
(13:33):
know, what do I choose to eat ornot eat?
What do I choose to do or notdo? What do I choose to wear or
not wear? What do I choose towatch or not watch? You know,
like, the potential for it iseverywhere. And and so it's
really about, I think, what isyour what is your personal
(14:42):
intention?
Like, how are you wanting toshow up? And also, do you feel
safe enough to be you? Do youfeel safe enough to show up and
say, oh, here's a part of me youmay not like, but it's it's so
valuable to me. I'm unwilling tolet it go. The difference
between outsourcing.
Eric Bomyea (14:59):
The opinion of self versus internally validating it.
Say like, I'm doing this thingand I believe in it, so I'm
going to do it, or I'm going towear it, it or might be. So
curious, what do you think makestrue belonging possible and true
(15:21):
ability to express authenticitypossible? What are those
conditions that make thatpossible for some people?
Timothy Bish (15:27):
I think that it's the person and the environment.
I think if, as we said, if youfeel safe enough, you can show
up fully. My personal experiencehas been that a lot of people
were all so accustomed to tryingto fit in. That really raw
(15:49):
authenticity and unapologeticbeing of self can feel very
unsettling, unfamiliar. So Ithink even really thoughtful,
loving, caring people sometimesdon't know how to handle just a
(16:10):
raw expression of authenticself.
I think that makes it harderthen for a person who's
interested in doing that to dothat when you see your friends
struggling to manage thatexperience. And and, you know, I
think we live in a world, and asyou said, the fashion industry,
I'm sorry, like the cosmeticindustry and the Supplemental
(16:32):
They are we we are beinginundated with messaging about
how it is we are supposed to be.And so it isn't surprising that
most of us are sort ofconditioned and trained to do
that. So so then when someonecan't meet you there, that feels
a little isolating. You know?
And I've and I've personally hadthis experience a lot where I
(16:54):
show up in a way and peopledon't people don't know what to
do. So especially now as anolder person and a a bigger sort
of muscle y sort of person,sometimes people are really
thrown when I demonstrate mysort of effulgent playfulness.
And I'm like, but that's reallya part of me. And I've I've
(17:17):
actually struggled with it inmoments when I can see almost a
flash of disappointment acrosssomeone's face, when I'm not
sort of showing up in a verystern mask for mask sort of
thing. Know?
I'm like, oh, I'll dance or I'llmake a joke or I'll laugh or,
you know, whatever. And and itcan that has a that has a
(17:38):
feeling that has a residue. Soeven even if I'm committed to my
authentic expression, I willsometimes have to metabolize,
oh, I I'm sensing that thatperson is uncomfortable with
this. And now person's theperson holding that means it
will be me. Or whatever personis trying to show up in whatever
(18:00):
they would the way they want.
What's interesting was, youknow, when I was in the
volleyball league, golf andvolleyball in New York City,
which I really, really loved andmade a lot of friends and spent
many, many seasons doing, I wasunbelievably competitive. We
might have talked about thisalready. I was unbelievably
competitive. I really wanted towin the point and I would like
scream something like, you know.And then I would do a high kick
(18:23):
and like and like a silly dance.
And people sometimes were reallyshocked that I would switch so
quickly. But it was all me. Itwas all authentic parts of me.
Like the I really wanna win thispoint. I want you to play well
and I wanna play well and then Iwanna beat you.
Because that's when it'll feelthe best. Right? And and then I
(18:47):
wanna celebrate and make myfriends laugh. And there'll be
times where people are justlike, I don't understand this
thing happening in front of me.And when you recognize, oh, this
person doesn't understand me,that can feel very isolating.
Eric Bomyea (19:02):
That that scenario of of bringing fullness, not
being accepted, and being like,oh, what about me? Like, don't
you like or isn't accepted? Andis that a part of me that I now
have to start hiding oradjusting or adapting? Do I have
to tune down thecompetitiveness? Do I have to
turn up the effulgence in moreplaces?
(19:24):
Do I have to tune that down?Like, what I mean, yeah. The
mental processing that takes,like I've been there, and I will
say too, the times that I havefelt more lonely is when I've
actually done everything in mybrain correctly to fit in. I've
(19:44):
worn the right outfit. I've saidthe right things.
I'm hanging out with the rightpeople. I feel so alone because
I'm not myself. Yeah. So I feellonely with myself. Yeah.
Even if I so I might fit in. Ifit in with
Timothy Bish (19:58):
the group. I feel incredibly alone. Yeah. Because
because you're aware of theparts that you didn't bring to
the party with you. Yeah.
I mean, the some of the darkestand most despondent moments of
my life have been when I've beenin that feeling that my true
authentic self just isn'twelcome here. You know? And I've
(20:20):
said this. I've said I'm like,oh, there are moments when I
feel like I just don't belonghere. Because whatever it is
that I am, whatever combinationof factors that I am, seems to
be really hard for most peopleto want, like, or invite.
That is unbelievably sad. And Ithink a lot of people probably
(20:41):
can relate to that, except wedon't really talk about it,
which is why I have felt thatway. I have felt like that all
by myself. And I'm assuming mostpeople who are feeling that way
also are doing it all bythemselves. Because you're like,
oh, there isn't there aren'tmany places where I feel like I
truly belong.
And so therefore, well, what'sthe matter with me? And then you
(21:02):
look around the world and, youknow, of course, we're all doing
this sort of showmanship sort ofInstagram style life thing where
you're like, well, it looks likeeveryone else is belonging just
fine. And not even justbelonging fine. They are
arriving. You're like, you'reliving the greatest life.
Everyone loves you, And and I'mover here like a weirdo that
(21:22):
like, you know, I do thinkthat's probably a more common
experience.
Eric Bomyea (21:27):
And it's, you know, it's sad to it's sad to mention
at times because it isunbelievably isolating.
Isolating and then like the feelI have felt that I could not
bring that feeling of isolationor fear of extra not belonging
oh I'd rather hide parts ofmyself to fit in, wear the
(21:50):
outfit to fit in, say the thingto fit in, and sit with this
feeling of isolation than revealthe fact that I'm feeling
isolated and alone. Because thatis scary. Yeah. So it's like
layers of fear happening withthis concept of fitting in, what
it is that we sacrifice andleave behind to fit in.
(22:13):
It's like so many fear layers.
Timothy Bish (22:15):
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think there has been one
gay man in my entire life that Ifeel like not only wanted my
whole authentic self andexpression, celebrated it, one
person in my entire life. Andso, you know, obviously, this
(22:39):
was like a very dear friend ofmine, but you think, okay. And
then and then then then I hearthese things be like, know,
Brene Brown and Oprah.
Like, if you just have onereally good friend, like,
that's, you know, that's that'sgood. And so but there are
moments when in a whole world ofpeople, there's only one person
where I feel like this. I can beyou know? There are moments when
(23:03):
that feels lonely, especiallywhen you can't always be with
that person. They can't alwaysthey can't always give you that
boost.
Right? So then I guess we haveto start cultivating it in
ourselves. But that's easiersaid
Eric Bomyea (23:16):
than done. It's really challenging too if it's
just one person. And you see onInstagram people consistently
are like, oh my gosh, the squadis running deep today. And it's
like, there's like six of themrunning together all the time.
It's like, yeah, that's mycynicism too.
I'm like, much of this isreality. Are you all actually
(23:38):
friends? And all that stuff thatgoes through my head that then
continues to talk about
Timothy Bish (23:42):
this They might all be trying to fit in.
Eric Bomyea (23:44):
Right. This also goes back to our conversation
with a mere judgment is lessabout keeping me from you. So it
really is my opportunity to belike, what? Okay. Like, cynical
Eric, angsty teenage Eric, like,what's going on here?
Yeah. What's what jealousy isunderneath the surface right
now? What are we trying tostrive for?
Timothy Bish (24:01):
I mean, we all want to feel loved. We all want
to feel connected. We all wantto feel safe, and we all want to
feel included. And we all wantto feel like we belong, and we
want that so badly. I want us Iwant that so badly that
sometimes I'm willing to fit inas a as a a way of getting that
feeling.
(24:22):
So when we think about this and,like, why is men's work
important? Why is yogic shamanicembodiment practices important?
It's to help us continue toconnect with our own authentic
experience in any given momentso we have a clearer
understanding of it and so thatwe can at least at least the
process would begin by noticingwhen whatever I'm doing feels
(24:46):
incongruent to my full self. Andand a lot of
Eric Bomyea (24:50):
the times, I get those signals from my body. It
helps us move away from, like,how do I need to be right now to
fit into like, what's true forme right now? Tapping into the
authenticity, like what is mytruth right now? What is it I'm
feeling? And was it that I wantto do?
Is it that I'm desiring? Justreally connecting with that and
(25:13):
owning that. But that takes timeand space. So curious about how
do we intentionally createspaces that invite belonging
rather than this demanding ofconformity?
Timothy Bish (25:25):
Well, I I mean, great question. When we figure
out the answer, you know, Iguess we'll we'll start to do
it. I I think we need to startspaces where we're having
different kinds of dialoguebecause how are you actually
doing isn't a question I feellike I hear or receive very
(25:47):
frequently. So a lot of like,what's up? How are you?
Like, yeah. I get it. But am Igenuinely interested in your
internal experience, your feltsense? You you know, I don't
hear that very much. And socreating spaces, well, how are
you doing?
Are are you are you feelingrelaxed and at ease? Do you feel
(26:09):
safe right now? Do you feelaccepted? Do you feel seen? Do
you feel heard?
These are not questions that I'mhearing frequently. Out in
public. Yeah. And and thenespecially in, like, gay male
spaces, we're not that isn't theconversation. Conversation is
something else.
And so creating spaces wherethat is part of the
(26:32):
conversation, I think, is reallypowerful. And, you know, that's
why we I created the embodimentcircle here and why you and I
are creating the space and whatwe're doing. So there is a
place. Because because here'sthe thing. When you want to
share something that isn'tpretty, that isn't fun, or that
(26:52):
isn't gonna get lots of likes onInstagram, but you need to share
it because it's in service toyour to your mental health or
your highest good, you need aplace where you're allowed to be
a little messy, a little ugly,or where you don't feel the
pressure to have to be superentertaining or charismatic all
the time.
(27:12):
So do you have a place where youcan legitimately have a bad day
and feel safe in saying, I Idon't feel great today. Or I
don't I don't feel seen or heardright now. I feel I feel really
othered. I feel like
Eric Bomyea (27:24):
I don't belong. In order to actually do that, you
would need safe container andprobably trusted people that you
know could hold that. Like, Iwill love you anyway even when
you're not beautiful inparticular ways that our culture
wants us. Holding it is soimportant. I was with a dear
(27:45):
friend yesterday, and I wasgoing through it.
I was having a hard time. It'sBear Week in town, y'all, and
there's just something in theenergy that has shifted for me
so much of like, I do not feellike I belong. I feel so
othered, so alienated, I don'tknow what it is. Still working
on it. Again, when we find theanswers, we will tell everyone.
(28:05):
But I am going through it. I hada very dear friend who, we've
been able to have conversationsin the past about our feelings
and our emotions, and we'rewalking down the street and he
asked, what are you doing? And Ilet it out. He got really
uncomfortable. And he triedchanging the subject several
times, and I love him dearly.
But in that moment, he could nothold it. He's been able to hold
(28:28):
it in other ways, and in othertimes, in other spaces. But
yesterday, he was not able to.And I was able to get out what I
needed to get out to be able tothen be as present with him as
possible without stewing in mystuff. So it was in service
enough, but I was still, hadsome things still going on.
Timothy Bish (28:47):
Well, mean, I think one of the things I'm
hearing in that story, thatexample, is this idea of the
healing power of being seen andheard. Because I think another
thing that happens is thisdesire to wanna fix. Right? So,
oh, you are you're saying you'reuncomfortable. You're unhappy,
whatever the thing is.
And now I wanna try to, like,offer you some solutions. And in
reality, you are you live inProvincetown right now during
(29:10):
Bear Wee. The solution is tolook at yourself and how you
engage because you're not you'renot stopping Bear Week until
it's over.
Eric Bomyea (29:18):
That's right. Right?
Timothy Bish (29:19):
And so sometimes wanna stop it either.
Eric Bomyea (29:21):
No. Of course.
Timothy Bish (29:21):
But, like, the idea being then that, well, the
I'm not looking for solutions.I'm not looking for
distractions. I'm looking forsomeone to see me in this
feeling right now.
Eric Bomyea (29:32):
Because I feel so lonely and alone this week that
feels like such a communityevent of belonging, and I feel
so alone in it. That's been partof the beautiful thing about the
Bear community, the first barsthat I went to were Bear bars,
where I felt that for a timethat sense of belonging. Now I
(29:54):
just feel like something hasshifted in me that I feel
incredibly lonely in.
Timothy Bish (30:01):
Well, we to recognize that for as much as we
love Provincetown and what itoffers and the open safe space
that it creates, especially inthis moment in time for gay
people and queer people to cometogether and, you know, do the
things, It is a resort town. Andso people come people come with
(30:22):
vacation resort agenda. This isreally true. I believe it to be
true. And so the comments we'remaking right now about Bear Week
aren't necessarily, like,directly specific to the Bear
community, but rather any groupof people that are coming to be
like, I I am on vacation agenda,and I wanna check all the boxes.
(30:43):
And I think that's reallydifferent because I have I have
felt like the bear community,but also the leather so many
communities. The leathercommunity, the bear community,
very accepting, very open. Butbut it's different when you're
like, but it's heightened. We'reon a we're on a seven day sprint
of fun. Right?
We are we are sprinting throughthis experience to do all the
(31:03):
things. So the bear cruise, thebeach, the parties, the pool
party
Eric Bomyea (31:09):
The shows.
Timothy Bish (31:09):
The shows, like, you know, whatever. And nothing
wrong with it, but there is anintensity to it, especially if
you're not on vacation. So,like, if you know, in the P
there's this P town joke about,I'm not on your vacation. You're
on your vacation, but I'm not onyour vaca I'm here with you, but
I'm at work. Right?
And so just wanting to honor youthat I think one of the
(31:30):
challenges is you're a P towniewho's working while other
people, and especially whenthese theme weeks, are having
very intense vacations, whichthey are totally welcome to
have. But the problem with Ptown is you can't you can't
entirely not observe ithappening around you because
it's small and you see it. Imean And it's hard not to
(31:53):
compare. So hard not to compare.
Eric Bomyea (31:56):
See this is the thing, if town floods to a
100,000 people, 75,000 peopleare engaging in a certain way,
I'm not one of those 75,000. Ifeel, I'm like what am I doing
wrong? I don't have like the thenervous system built up to be
able to say like, oh, they cando whatever they want, and I can
(32:17):
do whatever I want. I just amnot there yet. I look at I look
at that, and I'm like, what am Idoing wrong?
Right. What is wrong with me?
Timothy Bish (32:23):
Well, so I was on the bear cruise yesterday, as
you know. And and this idea, youknow, looking around, and I
ultimately had a fairly goodtime, I would say. There were at
least two or three moments,though, where I was like, I'm
feeling a little overwhelmed.And I wish I could get off this
boat. You know, those momentspassed, but I was, like, looking
(32:46):
around and thinking everyonehere looks like they're having
so much fun.
And there are these momentswhere I was not having fun. I
still largely had fun. But andthose are moments where it feels
really hard to be what's wrongwith me? Why don't why am I why
don't I belong here? It lookslike everyone else is super
(33:08):
comfortable and they belong, andI don't feel that way.
It's really tricky.
Eric Bomyea (33:13):
What if it isn't something that we find? What's
something that we like build?
Timothy Bish (33:17):
Well, okay. So, yes. A, yes. Let's build it.
And, you know, from my ownpersonal experience, the the
short time I've lived inProvincetown, I'm working on
three and a half years of livinghere.
I feel like I have worked hardto build spaces that that I find
nourishing, that I think are addvalue. But there can that can be
(33:42):
fatiguing. And there can bemoments when you I just want to
I just want to step into someoneelse's container or have a place
that I can go that I don't haveto also create. So, yes, we
should all work hard to createthese spaces, and sometimes it's
nice to oh, I which is why whenyou started leading the circle,
(34:02):
both the embodiment circle andthe sharing circle, one of the
reasons I was so happy aboutthat in addition to the fact
that you were a member of theteam and, you know, we were
building a thing was that Icould step in and for once be
the participant in the spacethat I was otherwise always
leading. So so nice.
(34:23):
So, yes, we have to create thosespaces, but sometimes it's nice
to have a space already so thatwe can fill our tank.
Eric Bomyea (34:30):
What about building our internal spaces? I mean, we
talked about this with sacreddrala, the episode on sacred
drala where drala is a conceptthat can be applied both
externally and internally. Sowhat about building the space
within ourselves to feel like webelong, just conform us with
ourselves, then be able to buildmore spaces externally? Sure.
Timothy Bish (34:53):
Well, I mean, I'm gonna, right back to you. I
mean, I still I still strugglewith feeling, like, othered and
like I don't belong. So, yes, Iwould love to do that. I think
that these practices help me dothat, and these spaces help me
do that. When I'm teaching yoga,for example, in those moments, I
(35:16):
have found that the world feelslike it falls away, and I get I
get really focused and connectedto what is happening in that
moment.
And there's a real lovelinessin, like, oh, there's like, I
can be me here fully, and thatfeels really, really good. And
so, yeah, the idea of glimpsingthose moments and then starting
(35:38):
to try to figure out how tobring them more frequently, I
think, is really, reallyhelpful. I mean, I can't be
teaching yoga all day long toavoid feeling othered or
isolated, but but recognizing ifI if I
Eric Bomyea (35:50):
can tap into it there, then maybe I can start
tapping into it at other places.Recognizing for me it's like the
safety that I feel. So how can Iremind myself that I am safe,
first and foremost? Because alot of the times that's the
anxiety and the nerves that getbuilt up, is that like, I don't
(36:12):
feel like I belong myself,right? So I'm like inside myself
saying like, I don't belong.
This is me. And I'm notaccepting certain parts of me.
Because I'm afraid that theywon't be accepted. So a lot of
my work has been, how do Iaccept these parts of me? How do
I accept the stern, stoic, hardparts of myself, and the
(36:37):
playful, expressive parts ofmyself as well?
To then rest in my own safety,my own built space of safety
inside of myself where all partsof me are welcome, to then be
able to bring that out into theworld regardless if I fit in.
Well, do you do that? I do thatwith a lot of affirmations at
(36:59):
this point, and sometimes theywork and sometimes they don't.
But it really is the constantreminder of like, your system is
telling me I am not safe.There's a siren going off
somewhere, and it's the comingback of like, I am safe, I am
safe, I am safe.
Recognizing when I'm truly notsafe, which is very
infrequently. Truly, in my life,there are very few moments that
(37:21):
I am not safe. Sometimes bikingdown commercial Street is very
unsafe. Physically. But likethere are very few moments that
I'm very fortunate to be able tosay that currently in my life,
there
Timothy Bish (37:30):
are very few moments that I'm actually not
safe. Well, it's it'sinteresting now I'm picking up,
for me at least, my ability tobelong feels like it is deeply
connected to my level of controlor competency. So one of the
reasons I think yoga is a placewhere I can I feel very
(37:52):
confident there, and I am incontrol there? And I think the
moments when I don't feel like Ibelong, like the few moments on
the bear cruise and, you know,countless moments in in this gay
community, are are those where Ifeel like I have very little
control. And so for me, this isjust me.
Without without a sense ofcontrol, then I start to
(38:13):
question my safety. And withouta sense of safety, it's hard to
then make bold choices about howit is you wanna be. I'm working
through this now in real time,but maybe understanding ways
that I can feel more in controlof my own self in moments like
this, in moments where inmoments where I'm not the one
(38:37):
leading the class or you know?So I don't have an I don't have
an answer except that I'm gonnaI'm gonna start thinking about
that. Okay.
How can I how can I inject alittle bit more of control for
myself in this moment so that Idon't feel like I'm at the mercy
of a moving crowd?
Eric Bomyea (38:58):
It's like, what bold choice can I make right now
to belong with myself, mypurpose, my higher power, all
that good stuff, so that I amless inclined? I have less of an
impulse, less of a desire to fitin.
Timothy Bish (39:15):
You know, we've talked about this on two
occasions. I oh, I don't we'vetalked about this, but on two
occasions, my teacher, AmirKalighi, has asked me to do sort
of an improvisationalinterpretive dance as part of a
ceremony. And I realized thefirst time I did that, I got a
(39:36):
little nervous when he firstasked me, I'm like, yeah. I'm
down for that. And then I didit.
And I remember thinking, oh,well, years ago, I would have
been so nervous about this,especially basically doing this
interpretive dance, you know, infront of a bunch of straight
guys. You know, what are theygonna think? And and I remember
thinking, oh, I wasn't thatnervous about it. I I still
wanted it to go well, obviously,but I wasn't that nervous. And
(39:57):
now I realize, I'm like, yeah,but I'm also in charge.
All of these men know me as,like, the guy who's calling the
shots. And so it never reallyoccurred to me until right now
to be like, oh, I was able to dosomething that was really
authentically me, but alsoeveryone here knew that I'm I'm
like, there was a level ofcontrol that wasn't specific to
(40:19):
that moment. Right? Like, theywere all seated and I was doing
this thing. Right?
But there was control in the inthe arc of the whole retreat.
And it never occurred to meuntil right now. Oh, maybe
that's why I was able to relax alittle bit because I had that
level of control. Now I have tostart to think about, okay so
the next episode is gonna beabout control. Control.
Eric Bomyea (40:39):
Stay tuned next week when Tim learns how to.
Timothy Bish (40:42):
Either like consciously direct my control or
relinquish the need for it attimes, which I think probably
both. But control as connectedto safety. If I feel safe in
your love for me, if I feel safein your commitment to keep me in
your life even in the momentswhere I'm not my best, I can
(41:06):
probably show up more fully,more authentically. If I am
uncertain that you actually loveme, then I'm probably gonna have
a harder time not thinking aboutwhat it is I need to do to make
you love me. And, like, we couldgo into, like, all kinds of
childhood trauma about, youknow, what parents have said or
(41:27):
not said that needed to be said,shown up or not shown up, you
know, all that sort of stuff.
But bottom line is it's reallyhard for some people, myself
included, to feel like I cantrust that. And so, obviously,
moments you have, you do trustthat, feel so good that you're
(41:49):
then, like, incentivized to tryto find them again and again and
again, which is why peopletrying to fit in is not at all
surprising. It feels terriblewhen I don't feel like I belong,
and it feels unbelievable when Ido. So I'm probably gonna be
willing to go to great lengthsto get that feeling. When you
don't fit in, you're leftbehind.
Eric Bomyea (42:11):
And what used to happen if you got left behind?
You eaten by wolves. You want tofit in so badly. Yeah. It would
be great if we belonged.
It would be great if we fullycould be ourselves in it. And I
really do hope, I sincerely hopethat we can all continue to do
the work that we're all doing.
Timothy Bish (42:31):
Well, think we need to be mindful. If now we're
talking about the gay maleexperience or the queer
experience, we have to bemindful when we are regularly
putting ourselves inenvironments where everybody is
adhering to group think. Becausebecause then we're gonna have
this giant current of ofengagement and thought. And it's
(42:55):
gonna be contrary to actualbelonging. Like, oh, now when I
think about, like, theseparties, for example, like the
one we just referred to, they'relike, okay.
Well, there are 600 of us here.And 90 something percent of us
have all agreed on this sort ofmanner of engagement. So then if
(43:16):
you're there and really beyourself and belong, that can be
really tricky. It's a it's ait's tough current to fight. And
so one of the reasons why Ithink these conscious spaces and
why in yoga they talk aboutsatsang and the importance of
conscious community with peoplewith like minded manners of
engagement are so important,it's because the current is
(43:40):
working with you and you arebeing lovingly reminded and kind
of constantly folded back in.
You know, my teacher Amir usesthis phrase of, like, bringing
them back into the center of theboat. Like, bring them back into
the boat. Sort of constantlydrawing people back in. Hey,
brother. Hey, brother.
How are you? And so so thatenvironment is so important, and
(44:05):
we have to create thoseenvironments. I've created some
of them. You've created some ofthem. But it sounds like it
feels like we need a lot more.
Eric Bomyea (44:12):
So again, like for me, the environment has to start
with me. I have to do thatenvironmental work on myself. I
need to check-in with myself.Hey brother, how are you doing?
You belong here, you are safe.
Timothy Bish (44:26):
So I'm hearing a personal check-in, hearing
affirmations.
Eric Bomyea (44:31):
Like because if I don't feel like I believe, if me
myself, I don't belong withmyself, how the hell am I gonna
belong somewhere else? Okay. Butlike seriously though, because a
lot of this is like I do notlove all the parts of myself. I
do not fully love all the partsof myself. Sure.
And I've hid parts of them.Yeah. You know. And so now, I
(44:55):
think my work is to help allthose parts feel like they
belong, so that I can go intoany room anywhere, still feel
like I belong, because I belongwith myself.
Timothy Bish (45:06):
Yeah. I hear that, and I agree with you.
Operational. I just mean I Ijust exactly. I just wanna point
out that that is a long process,and you're referencing parts
work.
Right? So I can let the I canhonor the angry part. I can
honor the effulgent part. I canhonor the goofy part. I can
honor the sexy part.
I can you know? But that isn't Iwanna make sure that we're being
(45:27):
really clear that, you know,feeling safe with myself isn't a
thing I can just decide.Totally. Yeah. And so that is
also a process and thinking,okay.
Well, there might be a momentwhen even through that practice,
it doesn't feel like it's goingvery well. And I wanna normalize
that. You know you know, my yogapractice, but even my practice
(45:48):
of, you know, ballet or moderndance, sometimes you walk in and
you have a killer class and youfeel I remember sometimes I
would leave dance class drivingback from Downtown Pittsburgh
with my friend Andrea and belike, oh my god. Like, that
class was amazing. And othertimes, you're like, that didn't
that didn't go well, and I'mnever gonna make it.
(46:09):
Like, this you know? And thoseclasses where you feel not great
are equally important as we'reputting in the reps. We're
coming we're coming back overand over and over. I come back.
I come back.
I come back. I come back. So ifyou're in the process now of
trying to create a safe spacefor yourself and start loving
parts of yourself, recognizethat some days that's gonna feel
(46:31):
really good and other daysyou're likely gonna feel like
you're not doing it as well. Andthat's not gonna feel good, and
you may have to then it'llimpact maybe some of the choices
you make. If you're in thatspace and you go into that other
environment.
Maybe today's not
Eric Bomyea (46:47):
the day. Rewind to me yesterday. Like, I'm not
saying that it is a switch.Yeah. I am actively going
through it every single day.
Well, and thank
Timothy Bish (46:57):
you for modeling it because I think that's the
thing. And then this is why thecommunity is so important so
that you you can have a personwhere you say, hey, I'm
practicing this self love thing,and today is not going great.
Because, you know, it's funnywhen when it is going great, you
often, I'll speak for myself, Ioften don't need a lot of
support when I'm like, I'm kindakilling it right now. Like, I'm
(47:18):
feeling really good and, like,very, you know, like it's the
moments when I'm not, when Ineed it. The moments when I feel
ugly and messy and, you know,like a lot you know, am I gonna
be too much for I mean, I can'ttell you how many times in the
last two and a half years whereI have wanted to call a friend
(47:39):
and then been like, I can't callthem and cry again.
I just that's all I do. Right?Because you're like, I'm a
burden. I'm too much. This isyou know?
So having people that will watchit over and over is a big part
Eric Bomyea (47:56):
of it. I I can like turn on my sassy dial. Can turn
that way up. And like I can tryto tell myself because I've been
in those positions of like, oh,I don't want be too much. My
sassy dial turns up, and thenI'm like, well, if you think I'm
too much, go find less.
And that's my way of saying, I'mgoing to accept me as this quote
unquote too much person. Youcan't accept that that's on you,
(48:19):
girl. And so saying that, I cansay that jokingly. Do I feel it
100%? No.
But I can relate to you when yousay, oh, I don't want to be too
much. In those moments, it is myhope, my prayer, my wish for
myself, for you, for everyone.We don't have that dialogue. You
(48:40):
can just be you, and if somebodycan't handle your too muchness,
they can go find less.
Timothy Bish (48:45):
Yeah. But that okay. Yes. Sassy dial is up. I
hear you.
I love it. I hear you. But, youknow, we have to recognize that
if if that's the idea, if I'mtoo much for you, you go find
less. And if that person wouldbe like, okay. Then the person
who felt like potentially toomuch but was gonna adhere to
(49:05):
their authentic expression isstanding alone in that moment.
Right? So it's like there isstill sometimes a cost to things
that have to be considered. Iremember telling a story in
sharing circle last week abouthaving to have a conversation I
didn't wanna have. And, youknow, one of the reflections
(49:27):
was, can I ask a clarifyingquestion? I said, yes.
And, like, well, why didn't youwhy didn't you say that you
didn't wanna talk about that?And I said, oh, because there's
a cost. There's a social cost tothat in this moment. And I
recognized that it exists, and Ihad to decide if I was willing
to pay that or not. And so,yeah, I I mean, I love the idea
(49:49):
of, like, if I'm too much, gofind less as, like, a broad, but
then honoring Well, at timesthen that means you're standing
you're standing alone whilesomeone walks away from you
because they can't hold you.
And that's still their problem,but then that's gonna be your
experience.
Eric Bomyea (50:05):
And their hope then is that you belong so much with
yourself. Yes, it does hurt. Butyou you don't have a desire to
fit in. And I think like that'sthe aspiration. Yeah.
Again, very aspirational. Not alight switch. This is not like
this is gonna happen tomorrow.Yeah. But like, aspirationally,
like, be yourself.
(50:25):
I wanna be able to be myself somuch, and then if that person
does leave, I'm okay withmyself.
Timothy Bish (50:31):
Well, I think that I think that we are getting to
this is clearly gonna be thefirst of many because I want
that. I want to feel socomfortable and safe and like I
belong with myself that thesethings don't have a huge impact
on me, and I am currently notthere. Currently, it's tough for
(50:53):
me when people I care aboutcan't meet me, and I feel the
emotional aftermath of that. AndI feel it in, like, a pretty
intense way. I feel itemotionally and mentally and
intellectually and physically,like, all kinds of things.
So let's keep talking about itbecause I think you're
absolutely right. The idea if Ifelt so certain that I belonged
(51:18):
with myself, then maybe it wouldall change. And, you know, I
recognize I grew up IrishCatholic and my grandmother in
particular, like, it was justeverything was about what other
people thought. So I have lotsof rewiring to do. Yeah.
It's layers. So this
Eric Bomyea (51:35):
is it's layers of fear Yeah. That makes this very
challenging. But worth doing.Totally worth doing. Like like,
I don't want it to just be mysassy self that says that.
I just want that to be me.
Timothy Bish (51:47):
I mean, you finally did something sassy.
You've been talking about yoursassy dial for what, the last
five minutes, and then I waslike, when are you gonna give me
like a like a thing? And so Ijust got the I just got the arm.
So feeling pretty happy aboutthat because I've been waiting
for some some, you know,demonstration of sass. You gave
it.
Thank you. I think that's agreat way to wrap up this
(52:10):
episode with some sass.
Eric Bomyea (52:12):
I feel like all parts of me are feeling very
belonging right now.
Timothy Bish (52:15):
Your sassy part is I think also
Eric Bomyea (52:19):
that, yeah, you said this is probably the first
of a couple of around thistopic. It's a really important
And I'm working through everyday. You're working through
Timothy Bish (52:29):
it every day. I feel complete. So let's close
our eyes. Take a deep inhalethrough the nose. Soft exhale
through the mouth.
And it is with deep appreciationand gratitude for any insights,
awarenesses, or understandingsthat were gained here in this
shared sacred space ofbrotherhood that we now release
the archetypes and the spiritsthat we called in. And as we
(52:52):
leave here, I wish everyonesafety, community, and love.
With these words, our containersopen but not broken.
Welcome back to The Circle, a podcast where we go
all in on men's work, body manpractices, and personal growth
from our queer perspective. Ifyou're enjoying the show, please
be sure to share your favoriteepisode and leave us a review.
If you're curious about the workthat we do or the practices
we've mentioned on the show,head on over to myembodiment.com
to join our new community.Practice along with us and ask
(00:26):
us questions about anythingyou've heard us talk about. Now
on to today's show.
This episode, we're exploringwhat it means to truly belong
versus where and why we try tofit in, and what parts of
ourselves do we hide when we do.Kim, are you ready to go all in?
I'm ready. Let's do this. Solet's just start at the top.
Timothy Bish (00:44):
How do you define the difference between belonging
versus fitting in? Belongingwould be the ability to show up
as your authentic self withoutneed to edit or curate in any
way. And fitting in would be avery specific and conscious
(01:08):
decision to amplify certainaspects of ourselves that we
think are acceptable or wantedby whatever group we're in and
to pull back or diminish aspectsthat we think they're not going
to like. And therefore, curatingaspects of our own authentic
self so that whoever my observeris is gonna find me more
(01:31):
palatable. So it's really aboutfeeling into another person or
another group of people or asituation and deciding what what
you might think they want andthen trying to give that to
them.
And then, obviously, over time,getting clues, oh, they want
more of this, they want less ofthat, and making subtle shifts
(01:52):
to I'll I'll just keep givingthem what I think it is they
want. And my idea of what theywant might get clearer and
clearer based on evidence. Butin so doing, I will betray these
other parts of me that that maybe really valuable. Why do you
think
Eric Bomyea (02:07):
it is that we betray these parts of ourselves?
And do you think is underneaththat conscious or subconscious
desire to fit in?
Timothy Bish (02:15):
Well, know, we are social beings. We are designed
to exist in groups. And a lot ofour safety and survival was
based on being a welcomed andprotected member of of our
group. So it doesn't it isn'tsurprising that we have that
impulse. What's tricky, though,now is that we have all these
(02:37):
other pressures.
So it can be you know, if wethink about back in the day,
you're like, well, we're allprobably roughly wearing the
same thing, and we're allroughly doing the same thing.
You know? And now we have allthese different other things
that can separate us. And so Ithink it's heightened. What
outfit I wear can make adifference depending on who I'm
(03:01):
trying to appeal to.
How I speak, my word choices,how I choose to spend my free
time. Because we have so manymore options now, we can start
to get more and more particularabout what, like, what it is we
like or don't like, what we feelcomfortable around or what we
don't feel comfortable around.You know, as an example, I was
(03:22):
this is such a long time ago,but I was dating a fashion
stylist. You know, he had anincredible sense of fashion. He
would often, like, pick out myoutfits for me, which I love
because it's not a thing I careabout.
But not that I don't care aboutit, but I wasn't very good at
it. And so I'm like, oh, well,you know, I I could do this.
Anyway, I remember one timehaving dinner with a friend of
mine and her husband, a friendfrom high school, a middle
(03:42):
school, this person I knew very,very well. And she admitted she
was like, oh, we got reallynervous when we heard that your
boyfriend was a fashion stylistbecause we were like we became
self conscious about what wewere gonna wear or or if what we
had chosen to wear was goodenough. And I remember in that
moment thinking, oh, there was apressure because there's this
(04:03):
idea of what is fashion.
And you kind of know it or don'tknow it. And, you know, and so
it's an example of, well, whatif I'm just really comfortable
in this outfit and you don'tthink it's fashion? For some of
us, you're like, well, whocares? But for others, it might
be the thing that continues tokeep you in the
Eric Bomyea (04:20):
group or pushes you out of the group. Right. In this
case too, maybe there's a littlepart about they were wanting to
make an impression, they wantedthis person to like them. So I
do start to see that there isthat hyper awareness is that
they are presenting themselvesin an effort to fit in, or to
impress, or to make some sort ofimpression that is favorable
(04:43):
from another person. And sothat's actually a really great
example of the thing in.
I will put on a different outfitto impress somebody else. Versus
would be like, well, I'm goingto put on this outfit that I
want to wear and person acrossfrom me and have an opinion on
(05:06):
it or not, but I'm still
Timothy Bish (05:07):
gonna belong with them. And I think in this
example, belonging would alsolook like you know, because we
live in a world with, you know,social constructs. Right? So,
oh, I have to wear a suit tothis event because that is what
is expected in my industry and,you know, and I and I want and
choose to be a professional.Great.
(05:28):
So you wear a suit. But at thatpoint, it's like, but then if
you're when you're choosing yoursuit, are you choosing it
because it's the thing thatmakes you feel the best? Or I'm
choosing it because I think allthese other people are gonna
like it more or like me more init. And and I I do sort of wanna
talk about, especially when youdon't like, I don't have a great
(05:50):
fashion sense, and I I live inathletic wear most of the time.
Sometimes I'm like, I will askpeople's opinion because I'm
genuinely curious.
Like, I I I would like you tohelp me curate this thing, which
is very different than I'm gonnatry to make each choice based on
(06:10):
I think you'll like so thatyou'll like me. So, you know,
there's a little distinctionthere of maybe you don't maybe
you're not expert in somethingand you are looking to other
people. That's different thanI'm looking I'm gonna curate my
my behavior and my choices sothat you'll like me. Because I
do I do often want to look good,and I often am like, oh, I think
(06:33):
this looks good, but I don'treally know. Yeah.
Eric Bomyea (06:35):
But I'm curious. Like I like like when you look
at it, like what do you see?Right? Because I think that's
what we're getting at. So I meanthere's still a part that's
like, why are you lookingoutward?
And this isn't a criticism, thisis a game of sorts. Like looking
at it. So it's like, when youput something on, how does it
(06:56):
make you feel?
Timothy Bish (06:57):
Well, so this is the thing. I recognize that
there are different skill setsand art forms. And so I feel
like I recognize that fashionand color combinations are not
the thing that I excel at. So Iwill I will look when I look at
(07:20):
an outfit, I will mainly look atsort of fit. I'm also I tend to
keep it pretty low key.
You know, a buttoned on shirtand a pair of slacks, jeans and
a T shirt, you know, that kindof thing. I mean, like, this
shirt that I'm wearing right nowfeels, like, fashion y for me.
You know? Although I got this,like, I don't know, three
(07:40):
seasons ago. Anyway, I stillreally like it.
But it's pretty simple. If Ineed to get it if I need to be a
little bit more, then I then Iseek help. I I'd be willing to
wear whatever I wanted, I guess.I just feel like I don't know.
It's like even though, like,seeking help with how to look
good,
Eric Bomyea (08:01):
I think in a different context, could be
like, hey, I need your helpnavigating this social
situation, because I'm having ahard time navigating it. When I
try to do it on my own, itdoesn't feel like I'm being
accepted by the group. So I needa little bit of help to fit in.
That's kind of what that soundslike to me. It's like I'm trying
(08:23):
to present a part of me that Ilike, but doesn't always fit the
theme or whatever it might be.
Right. And so I'm asking for alittle bit of support on how to
navigate this in a sense so thatI can be in that environment and
feel like I fit in.
Timothy Bish (08:40):
Right. Yeah, I think that's the thing. If I had
a fashion sense that I waschoosing not to present because
I was afraid people wouldn'tlike it, that feels very
different than I don't actuallyhave much of a fashion sense.
And so I'm looking for guidancebecause I'm, like, trying to
fill in a deficit, you know,that I have.
Eric Bomyea (09:01):
But what is that that deficit?
Timothy Bish (09:03):
I mean, what are you trying to accomplish with
curating an outfit? Well, Imean, I guess it depends on the
context and where you're going.But the idea would be I would
like to I almost always want tolook good and feel good in what
I'm wearing. And feel good inwhat I'm wearing is really
important for me, especially asa fitness yoga person. Right?
(09:27):
I want I want to look good andfeel good in what I'm wearing.
And then there are context when,oh, that but I don't I don't ask
people's opinions about what Iwear to teach fitness or yoga.
I'm like, this this is you know,it's pretty basic. It feels
good. It works.
Let's go. It's when I get to therealm of, oh, if if you were
(09:49):
gonna send me to the Met Gala.Oh, okay. I need a little
guidance. But because it's notmy it's not my medium.
Eric Bomyea (09:57):
But like the person that shows up to the Met Gala
wearing whatever they want towear, like might stick out.
Right? And in that sense, theymay not fit in. They're going to
stand out. Right?
So like Yeah, the Met Gala is abad example.
Timothy Bish (10:12):
Was trying to stand out.
Eric Bomyea (10:14):
Right. But I think like this is what I'm trying to
get at here is that like, youknow, based off of what we're
wearing, if we are outsourcingthe opinion of what it is that
we're wearing, why is it thatwe're doing that? And in what
effort? Is it to look good forothers, or is it to look good
for ourselves?
Timothy Bish (10:30):
Well, I mean, okay. So we this example, we are
looking to experts in areaswhere we're not expert. This
happens all the time. So peoplecome to me and ask me questions
about yoga. They ask mequestions about fitness.
They ask me questions about, youknow, Chinese medicine or
whatever because I am moreexpert than they are, chances
are, if they're asking me. Andand it it isn't as if they're
(10:54):
abandoning part of themselves inthat. They're like, well, you
know more, so I'm coming to you.And so in the fashion example,
it's like, well, you know more,so I'm coming to you, which is
very different than I knowexactly what I wanna wear or I
know exactly what I wanna do,and I choose not to because I'm
afraid you won't like it if Iwear that or do that. So when we
think about fitting in, fittingin is I'm gonna get a sense of
(11:17):
what I think you want me to looklike, you want me to sound like,
you want me to do, and then I'mgonna curate how I show up
consistent with that as opposedto I'm gonna I'm gonna do
whatever I want based on my owncompass.
So the fashion example is Idon't really have my own
compass. So looking for expertis not I don't I don't think
(11:40):
looking for expert advice,especially in areas of deficit,
is is trying to fit in versusbelonging. I think it's filling
a gap. Yeah. Mean, my cynicalbrain is like the fashion
industry is trying
Eric Bomyea (11:54):
to teach us how to fit in, how to mold ourselves so
that we ask these questions,that we hire people or go to
stores to buy things in aneffort to fit in, to follow a
trend, to follow whatever. Sothat's what I'm getting from it
versus we go to a doctor or afitness expert because we don't
(12:15):
have an understanding of how todo a certain thing, or we are
trying to fit a mold ofsomething else. Or maybe we're
trying to belong a little bitmore in our bodies. Maybe there
is a sense of like, oh, maybethere's a deficit inside of my
body, and I'm trying to figureout how to belong more in it. Or
maybe I'm trying to reshape mybody to better fit in someplace
(12:37):
else.
So I still think that a decisioncan be made consciously to seek
out expertise in something thatwe have a deficit of in an
attempt still to fit in.
Timothy Bish (12:47):
Yes. Yeah. Think that's accurate. I don't think
that's always true, but I thinkit is can be true, could be
true, is probably true in inmany instances. Yeah.
So like So but so fitting in ismaking conscious choices to
curate a part of you based onyour your understanding of the
(13:10):
expectations of your audience.Right? And belonging would be
just showing up, feeling feelingfree to show up as fully as you
can. So, yeah, I don't weshouldn't get too much deeper
into any one particular examplebecause we could fit in or try
to fit in in almost any aspectof our life. What do I, you
(13:33):
know, what do I choose to eat ornot eat?
What do I choose to do or notdo? What do I choose to wear or
not wear? What do I choose towatch or not watch? You know,
like, the potential for it iseverywhere. And and so it's
really about, I think, what isyour what is your personal
(14:42):
intention?
Like, how are you wanting toshow up? And also, do you feel
safe enough to be you? Do youfeel safe enough to show up and
say, oh, here's a part of me youmay not like, but it's it's so
valuable to me. I'm unwilling tolet it go. The difference
between outsourcing.
Eric Bomyea (14:59):
The opinion of self versus internally validating it.
Say like, I'm doing this thingand I believe in it, so I'm
going to do it, or I'm going towear it, it or might be. So
curious, what do you think makestrue belonging possible and true
(15:21):
ability to express authenticitypossible? What are those
conditions that make thatpossible for some people?
Timothy Bish (15:27):
I think that it's the person and the environment.
I think if, as we said, if youfeel safe enough, you can show
up fully. My personal experiencehas been that a lot of people
were all so accustomed to tryingto fit in. That really raw
(15:49):
authenticity and unapologeticbeing of self can feel very
unsettling, unfamiliar. So Ithink even really thoughtful,
loving, caring people sometimesdon't know how to handle just a
(16:10):
raw expression of authenticself.
I think that makes it harderthen for a person who's
interested in doing that to dothat when you see your friends
struggling to manage thatexperience. And and, you know, I
think we live in a world, and asyou said, the fashion industry,
I'm sorry, like the cosmeticindustry and the Supplemental
(16:32):
They are we we are beinginundated with messaging about
how it is we are supposed to be.And so it isn't surprising that
most of us are sort ofconditioned and trained to do
that. So so then when someonecan't meet you there, that feels
a little isolating. You know?
And I've and I've personally hadthis experience a lot where I
(16:54):
show up in a way and peopledon't people don't know what to
do. So especially now as anolder person and a a bigger sort
of muscle y sort of person,sometimes people are really
thrown when I demonstrate mysort of effulgent playfulness.
And I'm like, but that's reallya part of me. And I've I've
(17:17):
actually struggled with it inmoments when I can see almost a
flash of disappointment acrosssomeone's face, when I'm not
sort of showing up in a verystern mask for mask sort of
thing. Know?
I'm like, oh, I'll dance or I'llmake a joke or I'll laugh or,
you know, whatever. And and itcan that has a that has a
(17:38):
feeling that has a residue. Soeven even if I'm committed to my
authentic expression, I willsometimes have to metabolize,
oh, I I'm sensing that thatperson is uncomfortable with
this. And now person's theperson holding that means it
will be me. Or whatever personis trying to show up in whatever
(18:00):
they would the way they want.
What's interesting was, youknow, when I was in the
volleyball league, golf andvolleyball in New York City,
which I really, really loved andmade a lot of friends and spent
many, many seasons doing, I wasunbelievably competitive. We
might have talked about thisalready. I was unbelievably
competitive. I really wanted towin the point and I would like
scream something like, you know.And then I would do a high kick
(18:23):
and like and like a silly dance.
And people sometimes were reallyshocked that I would switch so
quickly. But it was all me. Itwas all authentic parts of me.
Like the I really wanna win thispoint. I want you to play well
and I wanna play well and then Iwanna beat you.
Because that's when it'll feelthe best. Right? And and then I
(18:47):
wanna celebrate and make myfriends laugh. And there'll be
times where people are justlike, I don't understand this
thing happening in front of me.And when you recognize, oh, this
person doesn't understand me,that can feel very isolating.
Eric Bomyea (19:02):
That that scenario of of bringing fullness, not
being accepted, and being like,oh, what about me? Like, don't
you like or isn't accepted? Andis that a part of me that I now
have to start hiding oradjusting or adapting? Do I have
to tune down thecompetitiveness? Do I have to
turn up the effulgence in moreplaces?
(19:24):
Do I have to tune that down?Like, what I mean, yeah. The
mental processing that takes,like I've been there, and I will
say too, the times that I havefelt more lonely is when I've
actually done everything in mybrain correctly to fit in. I've
(19:44):
worn the right outfit. I've saidthe right things.
I'm hanging out with the rightpeople. I feel so alone because
I'm not myself. Yeah. So I feellonely with myself. Yeah.
Even if I so I might fit in. Ifit in with
Timothy Bish (19:58):
the group. I feel incredibly alone. Yeah. Because
because you're aware of theparts that you didn't bring to
the party with you. Yeah.
I mean, the some of the darkestand most despondent moments of
my life have been when I've beenin that feeling that my true
authentic self just isn'twelcome here. You know? And I've
(20:20):
said this. I've said I'm like,oh, there are moments when I
feel like I just don't belonghere. Because whatever it is
that I am, whatever combinationof factors that I am, seems to
be really hard for most peopleto want, like, or invite.
That is unbelievably sad. And Ithink a lot of people probably
(20:41):
can relate to that, except wedon't really talk about it,
which is why I have felt thatway. I have felt like that all
by myself. And I'm assuming mostpeople who are feeling that way
also are doing it all bythemselves. Because you're like,
oh, there isn't there aren'tmany places where I feel like I
truly belong.
And so therefore, well, what'sthe matter with me? And then you
(21:02):
look around the world and, youknow, of course, we're all doing
this sort of showmanship sort ofInstagram style life thing where
you're like, well, it looks likeeveryone else is belonging just
fine. And not even justbelonging fine. They are
arriving. You're like, you'reliving the greatest life.
Everyone loves you, And and I'mover here like a weirdo that
(21:22):
like, you know, I do thinkthat's probably a more common
experience.
Eric Bomyea (21:27):
And it's, you know, it's sad to it's sad to mention
at times because it isunbelievably isolating.
Isolating and then like the feelI have felt that I could not
bring that feeling of isolationor fear of extra not belonging
oh I'd rather hide parts ofmyself to fit in, wear the
(21:50):
outfit to fit in, say the thingto fit in, and sit with this
feeling of isolation than revealthe fact that I'm feeling
isolated and alone. Because thatis scary. Yeah. So it's like
layers of fear happening withthis concept of fitting in, what
it is that we sacrifice andleave behind to fit in.
(22:13):
It's like so many fear layers.
Timothy Bish (22:15):
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think there has been one
gay man in my entire life that Ifeel like not only wanted my
whole authentic self andexpression, celebrated it, one
person in my entire life. Andso, you know, obviously, this
(22:39):
was like a very dear friend ofmine, but you think, okay. And
then and then then then I hearthese things be like, know,
Brene Brown and Oprah.
Like, if you just have onereally good friend, like,
that's, you know, that's that'sgood. And so but there are
moments when in a whole world ofpeople, there's only one person
where I feel like this. I can beyou know? There are moments when
(23:03):
that feels lonely, especiallywhen you can't always be with
that person. They can't alwaysthey can't always give you that
boost.
Right? So then I guess we haveto start cultivating it in
ourselves. But that's easiersaid
Eric Bomyea (23:16):
than done. It's really challenging too if it's
just one person. And you see onInstagram people consistently
are like, oh my gosh, the squadis running deep today. And it's
like, there's like six of themrunning together all the time.
It's like, yeah, that's mycynicism too.
I'm like, much of this isreality. Are you all actually
(23:38):
friends? And all that stuff thatgoes through my head that then
continues to talk about
Timothy Bish (23:42):
this They might all be trying to fit in.
Eric Bomyea (23:44):
Right. This also goes back to our conversation
with a mere judgment is lessabout keeping me from you. So it
really is my opportunity to belike, what? Okay. Like, cynical
Eric, angsty teenage Eric, like,what's going on here?
Yeah. What's what jealousy isunderneath the surface right
now? What are we trying tostrive for?
Timothy Bish (24:01):
I mean, we all want to feel loved. We all want
to feel connected. We all wantto feel safe, and we all want to
feel included. And we all wantto feel like we belong, and we
want that so badly. I want us Iwant that so badly that
sometimes I'm willing to fit inas a as a a way of getting that
feeling.
(24:22):
So when we think about this and,like, why is men's work
important? Why is yogic shamanicembodiment practices important?
It's to help us continue toconnect with our own authentic
experience in any given momentso we have a clearer
understanding of it and so thatwe can at least at least the
process would begin by noticingwhen whatever I'm doing feels
(24:46):
incongruent to my full self. Andand a lot of
Eric Bomyea (24:50):
the times, I get those signals from my body. It
helps us move away from, like,how do I need to be right now to
fit into like, what's true forme right now? Tapping into the
authenticity, like what is mytruth right now? What is it I'm
feeling? And was it that I wantto do?
Is it that I'm desiring? Justreally connecting with that and
(25:13):
owning that. But that takes timeand space. So curious about how
do we intentionally createspaces that invite belonging
rather than this demanding ofconformity?
Timothy Bish (25:25):
Well, I I mean, great question. When we figure
out the answer, you know, Iguess we'll we'll start to do
it. I I think we need to startspaces where we're having
different kinds of dialoguebecause how are you actually
doing isn't a question I feellike I hear or receive very
(25:47):
frequently. So a lot of like,what's up? How are you?
Like, yeah. I get it. But am Igenuinely interested in your
internal experience, your feltsense? You you know, I don't
hear that very much. And socreating spaces, well, how are
you doing?
Are are you are you feelingrelaxed and at ease? Do you feel
(26:09):
safe right now? Do you feelaccepted? Do you feel seen? Do
you feel heard?
These are not questions that I'mhearing frequently. Out in
public. Yeah. And and thenespecially in, like, gay male
spaces, we're not that isn't theconversation. Conversation is
something else.
And so creating spaces wherethat is part of the
(26:32):
conversation, I think, is reallypowerful. And, you know, that's
why we I created the embodimentcircle here and why you and I
are creating the space and whatwe're doing. So there is a
place. Because because here'sthe thing. When you want to
share something that isn'tpretty, that isn't fun, or that
(26:52):
isn't gonna get lots of likes onInstagram, but you need to share
it because it's in service toyour to your mental health or
your highest good, you need aplace where you're allowed to be
a little messy, a little ugly,or where you don't feel the
pressure to have to be superentertaining or charismatic all
the time.
(27:12):
So do you have a place where youcan legitimately have a bad day
and feel safe in saying, I Idon't feel great today. Or I
don't I don't feel seen or heardright now. I feel I feel really
othered. I feel like
Eric Bomyea (27:24):
I don't belong. In order to actually do that, you
would need safe container andprobably trusted people that you
know could hold that. Like, Iwill love you anyway even when
you're not beautiful inparticular ways that our culture
wants us. Holding it is soimportant. I was with a dear
(27:45):
friend yesterday, and I wasgoing through it.
I was having a hard time. It'sBear Week in town, y'all, and
there's just something in theenergy that has shifted for me
so much of like, I do not feellike I belong. I feel so
othered, so alienated, I don'tknow what it is. Still working
on it. Again, when we find theanswers, we will tell everyone.
(28:05):
But I am going through it. I hada very dear friend who, we've
been able to have conversationsin the past about our feelings
and our emotions, and we'rewalking down the street and he
asked, what are you doing? And Ilet it out. He got really
uncomfortable. And he triedchanging the subject several
times, and I love him dearly.
But in that moment, he could nothold it. He's been able to hold
(28:28):
it in other ways, and in othertimes, in other spaces. But
yesterday, he was not able to.And I was able to get out what I
needed to get out to be able tothen be as present with him as
possible without stewing in mystuff. So it was in service
enough, but I was still, hadsome things still going on.
Timothy Bish (28:47):
Well, mean, I think one of the things I'm
hearing in that story, thatexample, is this idea of the
healing power of being seen andheard. Because I think another
thing that happens is thisdesire to wanna fix. Right? So,
oh, you are you're saying you'reuncomfortable. You're unhappy,
whatever the thing is.
And now I wanna try to, like,offer you some solutions. And in
reality, you are you live inProvincetown right now during
(29:10):
Bear Wee. The solution is tolook at yourself and how you
engage because you're not you'renot stopping Bear Week until
it's over.
Eric Bomyea (29:18):
That's right. Right?
Timothy Bish (29:19):
And so sometimes wanna stop it either.
Eric Bomyea (29:21):
No. Of course.
Timothy Bish (29:21):
But, like, the idea being then that, well, the
I'm not looking for solutions.I'm not looking for
distractions. I'm looking forsomeone to see me in this
feeling right now.
Eric Bomyea (29:32):
Because I feel so lonely and alone this week that
feels like such a communityevent of belonging, and I feel
so alone in it. That's been partof the beautiful thing about the
Bear community, the first barsthat I went to were Bear bars,
where I felt that for a timethat sense of belonging. Now I
(29:54):
just feel like something hasshifted in me that I feel
incredibly lonely in.
Timothy Bish (30:01):
Well, we to recognize that for as much as we
love Provincetown and what itoffers and the open safe space
that it creates, especially inthis moment in time for gay
people and queer people to cometogether and, you know, do the
things, It is a resort town. Andso people come people come with
(30:22):
vacation resort agenda. This isreally true. I believe it to be
true. And so the comments we'remaking right now about Bear Week
aren't necessarily, like,directly specific to the Bear
community, but rather any groupof people that are coming to be
like, I I am on vacation agenda,and I wanna check all the boxes.
(30:43):
And I think that's reallydifferent because I have I have
felt like the bear community,but also the leather so many
communities. The leathercommunity, the bear community,
very accepting, very open. Butbut it's different when you're
like, but it's heightened. We'reon a we're on a seven day sprint
of fun. Right?
We are we are sprinting throughthis experience to do all the
(31:03):
things. So the bear cruise, thebeach, the parties, the pool
party
Eric Bomyea (31:09):
The shows.
Timothy Bish (31:09):
The shows, like, you know, whatever. And nothing
wrong with it, but there is anintensity to it, especially if
you're not on vacation. So,like, if you know, in the P
there's this P town joke about,I'm not on your vacation. You're
on your vacation, but I'm not onyour vaca I'm here with you, but
I'm at work. Right?
And so just wanting to honor youthat I think one of the
(31:30):
challenges is you're a P towniewho's working while other
people, and especially whenthese theme weeks, are having
very intense vacations, whichthey are totally welcome to
have. But the problem with Ptown is you can't you can't
entirely not observe ithappening around you because
it's small and you see it. Imean And it's hard not to
(31:53):
compare. So hard not to compare.
Eric Bomyea (31:56):
See this is the thing, if town floods to a
100,000 people, 75,000 peopleare engaging in a certain way,
I'm not one of those 75,000. Ifeel, I'm like what am I doing
wrong? I don't have like the thenervous system built up to be
able to say like, oh, they cando whatever they want, and I can
(32:17):
do whatever I want. I just amnot there yet. I look at I look
at that, and I'm like, what am Idoing wrong?
Right. What is wrong with me?
Timothy Bish (32:23):
Well, so I was on the bear cruise yesterday, as
you know. And and this idea, youknow, looking around, and I
ultimately had a fairly goodtime, I would say. There were at
least two or three moments,though, where I was like, I'm
feeling a little overwhelmed.And I wish I could get off this
boat. You know, those momentspassed, but I was, like, looking
(32:46):
around and thinking everyonehere looks like they're having
so much fun.
And there are these momentswhere I was not having fun. I
still largely had fun. But andthose are moments where it feels
really hard to be what's wrongwith me? Why don't why am I why
don't I belong here? It lookslike everyone else is super
(33:08):
comfortable and they belong, andI don't feel that way.
It's really tricky.
Eric Bomyea (33:13):
What if it isn't something that we find? What's
something that we like build?
Timothy Bish (33:17):
Well, okay. So, yes. A, yes. Let's build it.
And, you know, from my ownpersonal experience, the the
short time I've lived inProvincetown, I'm working on
three and a half years of livinghere.
I feel like I have worked hardto build spaces that that I find
nourishing, that I think are addvalue. But there can that can be
(33:42):
fatiguing. And there can bemoments when you I just want to
I just want to step into someoneelse's container or have a place
that I can go that I don't haveto also create. So, yes, we
should all work hard to createthese spaces, and sometimes it's
nice to oh, I which is why whenyou started leading the circle,
(34:02):
both the embodiment circle andthe sharing circle, one of the
reasons I was so happy aboutthat in addition to the fact
that you were a member of theteam and, you know, we were
building a thing was that Icould step in and for once be
the participant in the spacethat I was otherwise always
leading. So so nice.
(34:23):
So, yes, we have to create thosespaces, but sometimes it's nice
to have a space already so thatwe can fill our tank.
Eric Bomyea (34:30):
What about building our internal spaces? I mean, we
talked about this with sacreddrala, the episode on sacred
drala where drala is a conceptthat can be applied both
externally and internally. Sowhat about building the space
within ourselves to feel like webelong, just conform us with
ourselves, then be able to buildmore spaces externally? Sure.
Timothy Bish (34:53):
Well, I mean, I'm gonna, right back to you. I
mean, I still I still strugglewith feeling, like, othered and
like I don't belong. So, yes, Iwould love to do that. I think
that these practices help me dothat, and these spaces help me
do that. When I'm teaching yoga,for example, in those moments, I
(35:16):
have found that the world feelslike it falls away, and I get I
get really focused and connectedto what is happening in that
moment.
And there's a real lovelinessin, like, oh, there's like, I
can be me here fully, and thatfeels really, really good. And
so, yeah, the idea of glimpsingthose moments and then starting
(35:38):
to try to figure out how tobring them more frequently, I
think, is really, reallyhelpful. I mean, I can't be
teaching yoga all day long toavoid feeling othered or
isolated, but but recognizing ifI if I
Eric Bomyea (35:50):
can tap into it there, then maybe I can start
tapping into it at other places.Recognizing for me it's like the
safety that I feel. So how can Iremind myself that I am safe,
first and foremost? Because alot of the times that's the
anxiety and the nerves that getbuilt up, is that like, I don't
(36:12):
feel like I belong myself,right? So I'm like inside myself
saying like, I don't belong.
This is me. And I'm notaccepting certain parts of me.
Because I'm afraid that theywon't be accepted. So a lot of
my work has been, how do Iaccept these parts of me? How do
I accept the stern, stoic, hardparts of myself, and the
(36:37):
playful, expressive parts ofmyself as well?
To then rest in my own safety,my own built space of safety
inside of myself where all partsof me are welcome, to then be
able to bring that out into theworld regardless if I fit in.
Well, do you do that? I do thatwith a lot of affirmations at
(36:59):
this point, and sometimes theywork and sometimes they don't.
But it really is the constantreminder of like, your system is
telling me I am not safe.There's a siren going off
somewhere, and it's the comingback of like, I am safe, I am
safe, I am safe.
Recognizing when I'm truly notsafe, which is very
infrequently. Truly, in my life,there are very few moments that
(37:21):
I am not safe. Sometimes bikingdown commercial Street is very
unsafe. Physically. But likethere are very few moments that
I'm very fortunate to be able tosay that currently in my life,
there
Timothy Bish (37:30):
are very few moments that I'm actually not
safe. Well, it's it'sinteresting now I'm picking up,
for me at least, my ability tobelong feels like it is deeply
connected to my level of controlor competency. So one of the
reasons I think yoga is a placewhere I can I feel very
(37:52):
confident there, and I am incontrol there? And I think the
moments when I don't feel like Ibelong, like the few moments on
the bear cruise and, you know,countless moments in in this gay
community, are are those where Ifeel like I have very little
control. And so for me, this isjust me.
Without without a sense ofcontrol, then I start to
(38:13):
question my safety. And withouta sense of safety, it's hard to
then make bold choices about howit is you wanna be. I'm working
through this now in real time,but maybe understanding ways
that I can feel more in controlof my own self in moments like
this, in moments where inmoments where I'm not the one
(38:37):
leading the class or you know?So I don't have an I don't have
an answer except that I'm gonnaI'm gonna start thinking about
that. Okay.
How can I how can I inject alittle bit more of control for
myself in this moment so that Idon't feel like I'm at the mercy
of a moving crowd?
Eric Bomyea (38:58):
It's like, what bold choice can I make right now
to belong with myself, mypurpose, my higher power, all
that good stuff, so that I amless inclined? I have less of an
impulse, less of a desire to fitin.
Timothy Bish (39:15):
You know, we've talked about this on two
occasions. I oh, I don't we'vetalked about this, but on two
occasions, my teacher, AmirKalighi, has asked me to do sort
of an improvisationalinterpretive dance as part of a
ceremony. And I realized thefirst time I did that, I got a
(39:36):
little nervous when he firstasked me, I'm like, yeah. I'm
down for that. And then I didit.
And I remember thinking, oh,well, years ago, I would have
been so nervous about this,especially basically doing this
interpretive dance, you know, infront of a bunch of straight
guys. You know, what are theygonna think? And and I remember
thinking, oh, I wasn't thatnervous about it. I I still
wanted it to go well, obviously,but I wasn't that nervous. And
(39:57):
now I realize, I'm like, yeah,but I'm also in charge.
All of these men know me as,like, the guy who's calling the
shots. And so it never reallyoccurred to me until right now
to be like, oh, I was able to dosomething that was really
authentically me, but alsoeveryone here knew that I'm I'm
like, there was a level ofcontrol that wasn't specific to
(40:19):
that moment. Right? Like, theywere all seated and I was doing
this thing. Right?
But there was control in the inthe arc of the whole retreat.
And it never occurred to meuntil right now. Oh, maybe
that's why I was able to relax alittle bit because I had that
level of control. Now I have tostart to think about, okay so
the next episode is gonna beabout control. Control.
Eric Bomyea (40:39):
Stay tuned next week when Tim learns how to.
Timothy Bish (40:42):
Either like consciously direct my control or
relinquish the need for it attimes, which I think probably
both. But control as connectedto safety. If I feel safe in
your love for me, if I feel safein your commitment to keep me in
your life even in the momentswhere I'm not my best, I can
(41:06):
probably show up more fully,more authentically. If I am
uncertain that you actually loveme, then I'm probably gonna have
a harder time not thinking aboutwhat it is I need to do to make
you love me. And, like, we couldgo into, like, all kinds of
childhood trauma about, youknow, what parents have said or
(41:27):
not said that needed to be said,shown up or not shown up, you
know, all that sort of stuff.
But bottom line is it's reallyhard for some people, myself
included, to feel like I cantrust that. And so, obviously,
moments you have, you do trustthat, feel so good that you're
(41:49):
then, like, incentivized to tryto find them again and again and
again, which is why peopletrying to fit in is not at all
surprising. It feels terriblewhen I don't feel like I belong,
and it feels unbelievable when Ido. So I'm probably gonna be
willing to go to great lengthsto get that feeling. When you
don't fit in, you're leftbehind.
Eric Bomyea (42:11):
And what used to happen if you got left behind?
You eaten by wolves. You want tofit in so badly. Yeah. It would
be great if we belonged.
It would be great if we fullycould be ourselves in it. And I
really do hope, I sincerely hopethat we can all continue to do
the work that we're all doing.
Timothy Bish (42:31):
Well, think we need to be mindful. If now we're
talking about the gay maleexperience or the queer
experience, we have to bemindful when we are regularly
putting ourselves inenvironments where everybody is
adhering to group think. Becausebecause then we're gonna have
this giant current of ofengagement and thought. And it's
(42:55):
gonna be contrary to actualbelonging. Like, oh, now when I
think about, like, theseparties, for example, like the
one we just referred to, they'relike, okay.
Well, there are 600 of us here.And 90 something percent of us
have all agreed on this sort ofmanner of engagement. So then if
(43:16):
you're there and really beyourself and belong, that can be
really tricky. It's a it's ait's tough current to fight. And
so one of the reasons why Ithink these conscious spaces and
why in yoga they talk aboutsatsang and the importance of
conscious community with peoplewith like minded manners of
engagement are so important,it's because the current is
(43:40):
working with you and you arebeing lovingly reminded and kind
of constantly folded back in.
You know, my teacher Amir usesthis phrase of, like, bringing
them back into the center of theboat. Like, bring them back into
the boat. Sort of constantlydrawing people back in. Hey,
brother. Hey, brother.
How are you? And so so thatenvironment is so important, and
(44:05):
we have to create thoseenvironments. I've created some
of them. You've created some ofthem. But it sounds like it
feels like we need a lot more.
Eric Bomyea (44:12):
So again, like for me, the environment has to start
with me. I have to do thatenvironmental work on myself. I
need to check-in with myself.Hey brother, how are you doing?
You belong here, you are safe.
Timothy Bish (44:26):
So I'm hearing a personal check-in, hearing
affirmations.
Eric Bomyea (44:31):
Like because if I don't feel like I believe, if me
myself, I don't belong withmyself, how the hell am I gonna
belong somewhere else? Okay. Butlike seriously though, because a
lot of this is like I do notlove all the parts of myself. I
do not fully love all the partsof myself. Sure.
And I've hid parts of them.Yeah. You know. And so now, I
(44:55):
think my work is to help allthose parts feel like they
belong, so that I can go intoany room anywhere, still feel
like I belong, because I belongwith myself.
Timothy Bish (45:06):
Yeah. I hear that, and I agree with you.
Operational. I just mean I Ijust exactly. I just wanna point
out that that is a long process,and you're referencing parts
work.
Right? So I can let the I canhonor the angry part. I can
honor the effulgent part. I canhonor the goofy part. I can
honor the sexy part.
I can you know? But that isn't Iwanna make sure that we're being
(45:27):
really clear that, you know,feeling safe with myself isn't a
thing I can just decide.Totally. Yeah. And so that is
also a process and thinking,okay.
Well, there might be a momentwhen even through that practice,
it doesn't feel like it's goingvery well. And I wanna normalize
that. You know you know, my yogapractice, but even my practice
(45:48):
of, you know, ballet or moderndance, sometimes you walk in and
you have a killer class and youfeel I remember sometimes I
would leave dance class drivingback from Downtown Pittsburgh
with my friend Andrea and belike, oh my god. Like, that
class was amazing. And othertimes, you're like, that didn't
that didn't go well, and I'mnever gonna make it.
(46:09):
Like, this you know? And thoseclasses where you feel not great
are equally important as we'reputting in the reps. We're
coming we're coming back overand over and over. I come back.
I come back.
I come back. I come back. So ifyou're in the process now of
trying to create a safe spacefor yourself and start loving
parts of yourself, recognizethat some days that's gonna feel
(46:31):
really good and other daysyou're likely gonna feel like
you're not doing it as well. Andthat's not gonna feel good, and
you may have to then it'llimpact maybe some of the choices
you make. If you're in thatspace and you go into that other
environment.
Maybe today's not
Eric Bomyea (46:47):
the day. Rewind to me yesterday. Like, I'm not
saying that it is a switch.Yeah. I am actively going
through it every single day.
Well, and thank
Timothy Bish (46:57):
you for modeling it because I think that's the
thing. And then this is why thecommunity is so important so
that you you can have a personwhere you say, hey, I'm
practicing this self love thing,and today is not going great.
Because, you know, it's funnywhen when it is going great, you
often, I'll speak for myself, Ioften don't need a lot of
support when I'm like, I'm kindakilling it right now. Like, I'm
(47:18):
feeling really good and, like,very, you know, like it's the
moments when I'm not, when Ineed it. The moments when I feel
ugly and messy and, you know,like a lot you know, am I gonna
be too much for I mean, I can'ttell you how many times in the
last two and a half years whereI have wanted to call a friend
(47:39):
and then been like, I can't callthem and cry again.
I just that's all I do. Right?Because you're like, I'm a
burden. I'm too much. This isyou know?
So having people that will watchit over and over is a big part
Eric Bomyea (47:56):
of it. I I can like turn on my sassy dial. Can turn
that way up. And like I can tryto tell myself because I've been
in those positions of like, oh,I don't want be too much. My
sassy dial turns up, and thenI'm like, well, if you think I'm
too much, go find less.
And that's my way of saying, I'mgoing to accept me as this quote
unquote too much person. Youcan't accept that that's on you,
(48:19):
girl. And so saying that, I cansay that jokingly. Do I feel it
100%? No.
But I can relate to you when yousay, oh, I don't want to be too
much. In those moments, it is myhope, my prayer, my wish for
myself, for you, for everyone.We don't have that dialogue. You
(48:40):
can just be you, and if somebodycan't handle your too muchness,
they can go find less.
Timothy Bish (48:45):
Yeah. But that okay. Yes. Sassy dial is up. I
hear you.
I love it. I hear you. But, youknow, we have to recognize that
if if that's the idea, if I'mtoo much for you, you go find
less. And if that person wouldbe like, okay. Then the person
who felt like potentially toomuch but was gonna adhere to
(49:05):
their authentic expression isstanding alone in that moment.
Right? So it's like there isstill sometimes a cost to things
that have to be considered. Iremember telling a story in
sharing circle last week abouthaving to have a conversation I
didn't wanna have. And, youknow, one of the reflections
(49:27):
was, can I ask a clarifyingquestion? I said, yes.
And, like, well, why didn't youwhy didn't you say that you
didn't wanna talk about that?And I said, oh, because there's
a cost. There's a social cost tothat in this moment. And I
recognized that it exists, and Ihad to decide if I was willing
to pay that or not. And so,yeah, I I mean, I love the idea
(49:49):
of, like, if I'm too much, gofind less as, like, a broad, but
then honoring Well, at timesthen that means you're standing
you're standing alone whilesomeone walks away from you
because they can't hold you.
And that's still their problem,but then that's gonna be your
experience.
Eric Bomyea (50:05):
And their hope then is that you belong so much with
yourself. Yes, it does hurt. Butyou you don't have a desire to
fit in. And I think like that'sthe aspiration. Yeah.
Again, very aspirational. Not alight switch. This is not like
this is gonna happen tomorrow.Yeah. But like, aspirationally,
like, be yourself.
(50:25):
I wanna be able to be myself somuch, and then if that person
does leave, I'm okay withmyself.
Timothy Bish (50:31):
Well, I think that I think that we are getting to
this is clearly gonna be thefirst of many because I want
that. I want to feel socomfortable and safe and like I
belong with myself that thesethings don't have a huge impact
on me, and I am currently notthere. Currently, it's tough for
(50:53):
me when people I care aboutcan't meet me, and I feel the
emotional aftermath of that. AndI feel it in, like, a pretty
intense way. I feel itemotionally and mentally and
intellectually and physically,like, all kinds of things.
So let's keep talking about itbecause I think you're
absolutely right. The idea if Ifelt so certain that I belonged
(51:18):
with myself, then maybe it wouldall change. And, you know, I
recognize I grew up IrishCatholic and my grandmother in
particular, like, it was justeverything was about what other
people thought. So I have lotsof rewiring to do. Yeah.
It's layers. So this
Eric Bomyea (51:35):
is it's layers of fear Yeah. That makes this very
challenging. But worth doing.Totally worth doing. Like like,
I don't want it to just be mysassy self that says that.
I just want that to be me.
Timothy Bish (51:47):
I mean, you finally did something sassy.
You've been talking about yoursassy dial for what, the last
five minutes, and then I waslike, when are you gonna give me
like a like a thing? And so Ijust got the I just got the arm.
So feeling pretty happy aboutthat because I've been waiting
for some some, you know,demonstration of sass. You gave
it.
Thank you. I think that's agreat way to wrap up this
(52:10):
episode with some sass.
Eric Bomyea (52:12):
I feel like all parts of me are feeling very
belonging right now.
Timothy Bish (52:15):
Your sassy part is I think also
Eric Bomyea (52:19):
that, yeah, you said this is probably the first
of a couple of around thistopic. It's a really important
And I'm working through everyday. You're working through
Timothy Bish (52:29):
it every day. I feel complete. So let's close
our eyes. Take a deep inhalethrough the nose. Soft exhale
through the mouth.
And it is with deep appreciationand gratitude for any insights,
awarenesses, or understandingsthat were gained here in this
shared sacred space ofbrotherhood that we now release
the archetypes and the spiritsthat we called in. And as we
(52:52):
leave here, I wish everyonesafety, community, and love.
With these words, our containersopen but not broken.
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