The Dark Side of Energy Medicine (Part 2) with Marci Julin

In Part 2 of our interview with Marci Julin, we explore her book “Life to the Body - Biblical Principles for Health & Healing”.  She shares the story of how she overcame 12 different diagnosis, her views on mainstream medicine, and practical spiritual solutions for healing.  

 

This episode is available in video on Rumble at: https://rumble.com/v558ab0-tcrp-episode-94-the-dark-side-of-energy-medicine-part-2-w-marci-julin.html

 

To connect to Marci, visit her website: HeartandMindMinistries|Bible teaching for women by Marci Julin|Orlando

 

For more content, check out Marci’s YouTube channel: https://youtube.com/@heartandmindministries2734?si=jEQcELZVl4VKEsO_

 

To get a copy of Marci’s Books: https://books2read.com/u/3G7Mxn https://www.amazon.com/s?k=marci+julin&crid=3HZY81ZEHH151&sprefix=marci+julin%2Caps%2C169&ref=nb_sb_ss_pltr-sample-20_1_11

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
This podcast is not medical or legal advice. If you're looking for such advice,
then do contact a professional.
This is the Collective Resistance Podcast with your hosts, Leo and Fabiola.
Music.

(00:22):
We will be discussing why we find ourselves resisting the narratives of the
common collective, as well as why the Common Collective resists new information.
Fabiola, how are you? Hey, Leo. I'm super excited.

(00:43):
I mean, we had this part one episode last time where we talked about the dark
side of energy medicine.
And in this part, we have Marci back.
We're going to explore her book, Life to the Body, which is right here.
Yes, yes. Marci Julien, the author of Ouija Medicine, as well as Life to the

(01:03):
Body. So we're going to discuss that a little bit more.
Marci, thank you for joining us again for part two and making the time for us.
Super excited. You're very welcome. It's an honor.
Yeah. We're going to talk about some solutions too today. So I'm excited about that.
All right, Fabiola, where are you kicking us off? Yes. So Marcy,
I was reading about your healing journey, which was, you said two decades, right?

(01:27):
So Christ's cruciating in pain and your faith never seemed to waver through that time.
But your experience, I'm sorry, we have some gnats here with the summer coming
in. If we're doing this, don't think we're crazy.
But quite a hard journey with a lot of medical doctors basically saying you

(01:48):
were making things up. It was all in your head.
And eventually you turn into the heart. So we wanted to hear from you,
have our listeners hear from you.
What was your experience being chronically ill for two decades and now being
fully alive and healed and in this lovely journey to share what you've learned

(02:09):
through all that pain? Yeah.
Yeah. So if I can, I'd like to preface to your listeners that I do know,
and I'm going to share a little of those details,
what it is to suffer with day in and day out chronic pain and chronic illness.
And I know the despair that can come with that, the hopelessness and so on.

(02:35):
And I just want to say, if you're just tuning in and you're thinking,
do I want to spend the time to listen to this.
If you're in that situation, please, please, please keep listening because I
really do have hope that I want to share with you.
And so with that being said, so when I was, from the time I was a child,

(02:56):
I had, you know, stomach aches and hormone issues and so on.
But by the time I was 20, I married Seth and I had numerous health issues.
They suspected I had endometriosis. In fact, the doctor told me you either need
to get pregnant or have surgery.

(03:18):
And we didn't have health insurance at the time. So I'm like,
okay, the government will pay for a baby.
They won't pay for surgery. Right.
Let's get it on. But I mean, we were poor.
We were both full-time college students at the time. And so anyway, yeah.
A lot of more issues started when I got pregnant and then after my son was born

(03:43):
and I had chronic fatigue syndrome, Epstein-Barr, my blood pressure was already really low.
I've always had low blood pressure, but then after having my son,
my blood pressure would literally drop into the 40s when I would go from laying down to standing up.

(04:04):
And so I would literally, you know, like wake up in the night to go get my crying
baby and pass out mid-run and go into convulsions.
And so there were a lot of issues there.
I had endometriosis that was eventually confirmed, had two surgeries for that.
I was in constant pain, exhausted all the time.

(04:30):
And those, like so often happens with chronic health, it kind of snowballs.
And so, you know, the conditions you think are so bad, they can't get any worse,
and then they do get worse, and then they get even more, you know, problematic.
And so that was what happened with me. I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism.

(04:51):
I was on medication for several years for that.
I had goiter, a fibroid, monthly ovarian cysts.
I eventually found a naturopath who was also an MD, and he ran complete hormone panel, parasites,
heavy metals, all that kind of stuff, and found the test results that came back from the lab.

(05:17):
Literally they had written on their website.
A handwritten note, we have retested these levels because we thought they couldn't be correct.
Wow. My hormones were so low that they're like, this can't be right.
But it was. My cortisol levels at the highest point in the day on a scale of 0 to 10 were 0.5.

(05:42):
So I was a mess.
He put me on all kinds of hormones trying to adjust it. But it helped for a time.
And then it was like my body just adjusted and downshifted further.
And so the problems were still there.
There were times where it was like my body would just shut down.

(06:03):
I couldn't eat anything. I couldn't drink anything.
I would lose a large amount of weight very quickly.
And then I'd end up in the hospital. One time I was there for 11 days,
another time for eight, while they just tried to figure out what in the world
is going on with this woman's body.
And so traditional medicine was not helping.

(06:24):
And then when I thought things can't possibly get worse, I went to a chiropractor
because I had a bulging disc in my neck that was giving me trouble.
And he adjusted me, and I was so fragile that he herniated a disc in my low back.
So suddenly, I'm not only do I not have the strength to hardly even walk,

(06:50):
but now I am in horrible nerve pain as well as all the other stuff.
So it was just awful. And at that point, I'm like, I had been a Christian since I was a a child.
I had placed my faith and trust in Jesus Christ as my Savior as a child.
And I always tried to serve him and do what was right and so on.

(07:15):
And I couldn't understand why
on earth is God letting all this pain and misery and such into my life.
And so anyway, even though I was a Christian and really wanted to love God,
I didn't feel like he loved me.

(07:35):
But I wasn't even aware of that. I just knew that I was miserable all the time.
And so when I'm finally living as an invalid, you know, I literally could not push any farther.
I was either in bed or in a chair around the clock.
And I thought, you know, I might as well go see a Christian counselor because

(07:59):
I've got some emotional issues and baggage that I need to deal with.
And I can't do anything else on my own.
If I can accomplish the one thing I haven't tried yet. Exactly.
So the Christian counselor very wisely recognized after hearing me talk and so on.
She said, Marcy, you believe everything the word of God says,

(08:22):
except when it says that it loves that God loves you.
And I thought, but I mean, I know God died for me and he loves me.
Jesus loves me enough to have died for me, but, you know, he did that for everybody.
So maybe he has it out for me.

(08:43):
And she challenged me to just choose that day to believe what the Bible says
when it says that God loves me personally.
Personally and to go get in the Bible and look for passages that talk about
God's love and to choose that this applies to me, not just everybody else.

(09:06):
And so I want to share a passage with you guys that really comes from my favorite passage.
So Psalm 103, it's my favorite chapter, but this This is just a few verses from it.
The Lord is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love.

(09:29):
He will not always accuse, nor will he harbor his anger forever.
He does not treat us as our sins deserve, praise God, or repay us according to our iniquities.
For as high as the heavens are above the earth, so great is his love for those
who fear him. As far as the East is from the West, so far has He removed our

(09:52):
transgressions from us.
As a father has compassion on his children, so the Lord has compassion on those who fear Him.
For He knows how we are formed. He remembers that we are dust.
The life of mortals is like grass. They flourish like a flower of the field.
The wind blows over it, and it is gone, and its place remembers it no more.

(10:16):
But from everlasting to everlasting, the Lord's love is with those who fear him.
Wow. Can we talk about the fear part? Because I'm sure everybody's going to
be like, okay, fear, what do you mean?
Sure. Yeah. I mean, so God is an awesome, all-powerful, all-knowing, holy God.

(10:42):
And so we do fear him in the sense of his mighty power, But,
and we fear him in the sense of that we, we respect, it's more than respect,
but his holiness is so awesome.
And we are sinful creatures. And yet that passage says. So is it more like a humbling?

(11:07):
You think? I'm sorry. Is it more like a humbling?
Well, yeah, that's a part of it, but it's more than that. So for instance, you guys are parents.
Your kids, I imagine, know that if they do certain things, they had better watch out, right?
Yes. Okay. There's a lion that lives in this house. That's right.

(11:32):
Leo the lion. Leo the lion, yeah. it.
So similarly, God is, in that passage, even talks about Him as our Father.
And He is a loving Father, but He also is a Father who cares about His children
and that His children will do the right things, walk with Him in righteousness.

(11:56):
And so, yeah, there's that element of fear Him.
But what really struck me was his everlasting love, his unfailing love,
his unconditional love, that because Jesus died on the cross for my sins and paid for those sins,
then when God sees me, he sees the righteousness of Christ.

(12:21):
And so I don't have to be afraid of His wrath,
and I can just know that I am loved unconditionally because it's not based on how good I can be,
which is how I always thought it was, that I had to do X, Y,
Z, and then I would get the reward, get the acceptance.

(12:42):
And God's not like that, thankfully. Yes.
So anyway, the counselor encouraged me to really begin to focus on passages
that talked about the love of God, to believe it's true.
And here I am, I'm just this, I was so broken. I was an emotional train wreck.

(13:04):
I was in terrible physical situation, but God's word began to just,
It was like salve that just put on the wounds that began to bring healing.
In fact, I could tell as I'm studying God's Word and I'm meditating on the Word

(13:24):
that God was doing something significant, and he impressed on me that I needed
to start writing it down.
And I actually ended up, my first book, which you guys don't have there, so I'll hold it up.
It's called When You Can't Trust His Heart, Discovering the Limitless Love of God.
And it was written as a result of that studies on the love of God and what God did in my heart there.

(13:50):
So anyway, there's this amazing spiritual thing that's going on in my heart,
but I'm still struggling physically.
And that was when I took a major detour into energy medicine,
looking for the solutions for my health that it failed to provide.
But nonetheless, it made a great distraction for several years.

(14:15):
So anyway, at the end of that almost three-year period of involvement with energy medicine,
a friend offered me a book and said, Marci, I don't know anything about this
whole muscle testing business, but it sure seems like you're a slave to it,

(14:37):
like you're in bondage to it.
And I was really offended, and I didn't want to read the book she gave me, but I finally did.
And it caused me to start thinking, huh, maybe God's Word says something about
health, illness, and healing, and I ought to find out what it says.

(14:58):
And so I started reading the Bible from Genesis to Revelation,
highlighting every passage that had to do with those topics.
And I read the whole Bible in three months.
I just kept on and on and on. Wow. Wow. Wow. How do you do that?
I felt like the answer is here.

(15:19):
I've got to find it and I want to find it quick because I'm living this way. Right. Right.
Desperation. It's a great motivator. Exactly. So anyway, through those studies,
as I began to understand a biblical perspective of health,
and apply that knowledge to my life, God healed me of all 13 diagnosed conditions.

(15:46):
Just last week, I think, yeah, last week, I had some blood work done.
I haven't been to the doctor in several years, so I had just the typical stuff
done and had the exam and the doctor felt my neck and it's like,
nope, no lumps, no goiter.
And I'm like, I did once.

(16:09):
And thyroid levels were still, this is 13 years later, still perfectly normal.
All the stuff, cortisol, they
checked my cortisol and it was right in the middle of the normal range.
And I'm just like, God is so amazing. It is so amazing.

(16:57):
I work in that field. I never found for us and for my kids that it was the right path.
It always seems like there's a push for, okay, let's just try taking this and
see what happens. And I'm like, no, we're not going to do that.
And that's why the alternative medicine, it was so appealing.

(17:20):
But then you always felt like, okay, you did something and it worked great.
But then all of a sudden it doesn't work anymore. And then we're on to the next,
the next miraculous, you know, potion and that might not work.
And then you spend all that money and then, oh, no, you should try this.
And it's just never like it's never ending. You really lose.

(17:41):
You really lose trust on your body, right?
Because you don't think like you can ever heal because it's just like the next
thing and the next thing and the next thing. And it just never ends.
And, you know, the money, you keep spending the money and it's more and more and more.
And the results you get, it just don't feel like they are, you know,
they equate to the amount of money you spent. Yeah, they're not tangible. Yeah.

(18:06):
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So after God had healed me of all of that,
and I was healthy, and I began running, and it was like people asked me,
do you want to run with me, or you want to run a race?
And I'm like, you know, I just run because every step is a reminder that God healed me.

(18:30):
And it's a very very personal time of prayer with the Lord when I run,
but just of thankfulness and what he did.
But I wrote Life to the Body because after I was well,
and here I've studied, I've learned a lot about the Bible and about health from

(18:53):
a biblical perspective.
And I know that energy medicine is wrong. And God impressed upon me to write
three blog articles about muscle testing.
And I really didn't want to do it, partly because I felt like I know what it
is to suffer with chronic illness.

(19:13):
And I know that the people who are using muscle testing and energy medicine
are doing so because they have run out of options often with other solutions.
Oh yeah, I felt like if I even went to a practitioner that didn't know how to
muscle test, I'm like, okay, I'm...
It's like the greatest hack. You can just tell me if this supplement,

(19:36):
do I spend money on this one or that one?
So that's how I saw it.
And so I didn't want to tell people, no, you can't do this, and then not offer
them the hope that I had found as well and the healing that I had found.
So I submitted to the Lord in writing the articles because I really felt like

(20:00):
that was what he wanted me to do.
And then I set about to write Life to the Body.
How long did it take you to write Life to the Body?
Four or five years. Did you go along studying the Bible and writing or did you,
okay, gotcha. Both, both. Okay.
That makes more sense. It was a long process. Yes, it's very detailed,

(20:23):
very detailed on how she got to the conclusion she got.
It was just an amazing, amazing book.
Highly recommend, but go on. You're writing the book.
That was after your healing, because I would love to get into that as well. a little bit.
I know it's in the book, but I love to just get the highlights on what you uncovered.

(20:47):
So when you start to look at the scriptures on health and illness and healing,
I would say probably 70% of them all somehow tie in sin with illness and the healing of illness with,
repentance from sin. And so I was reading all of that and thinking,

(21:14):
okay, so maybe I need to ask God to reveal sin in my life.
And because I was, I didn't know of any, I mean, I thought I was a good person.
Like all of us, right? We're good. Yeah, exactly.
But the Bible tells us to, that God searches our hearts and reveals sin.

(21:39):
And so I began to ask him, God, if there's sin in my life, please reveal it
to me so that I can repent.
And for about three weeks, God revealed stuff, going back even into when I was a child.
And that may sound silly, but I felt like God was taking me through this,

(21:59):
this complete cleansing of, you know, dealing with all kinds of stuff.
And so, and then of course, as a parent, you, well, maybe you don't,
because you guys are probably perfect as parents.
Thank you for realizing that. Look at this.
But for me, I started thinking, oh my goodness, that time when I did this,

(22:23):
or when I said this to Caleb or I didn't do it this way and I should have.
And so he would come home from school and I'd be like in tears,
Caleb, I'm so sorry for this. And please forgive me.
And he's like, mom, yes, I forgive you.
But it was just. But you said it went back to when you were a child, right?

(22:45):
And so when we think about children in sin, and I think a lot of people listening
to this might I think, okay, what would I be sinning about when I was a child?
Do you have any like small examples? Yes.
Like stole candy from the candy store? Yes, there you go.
Yeah, so I mean, we, from the time we're young children, we do sin.

(23:11):
We are born with a sin nature, and so it comes out in all of us.
And we're going back to the commandments, right? The Ten Commandments, when we talk about sin.
More than just the Ten Commandments, though. because, I mean,
there's anything that is against God is sin.
So even things like wrong thoughts and attitudes, and some of that's covered

(23:36):
in the Ten Commandments, but the
Ten Commandments were not meant to be the comprehensive list of the law.
When Moses received the Ten Commandments on Mount Sinai, he,
of course, wrote those or God inscribed those on the rock tablets.
But when you read the book of Leviticus, you realize that God gave Moses a whole

(24:01):
lot more laws than just the Ten Commandments.
But thankfully, the Bible says that, in fact, Romans 7 says,
I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law.
For I would have not known what coveting really was if the law had not said, you shall not covet.

(24:25):
And so the Ten Commandments, the law, all of it just serves to make us realize
that we can't meet all the requirements before for God.
We needed Jesus to do that for us. We needed his righteousness.
We needed the Savior, yeah.
I agree with you on that.

(24:47):
Yes. I'm so glad it doesn't depend on us.
Yes, but how does that tie in then with the healing, what you found? Thank you.
So after I had gone through this time of repentance, then I prayed and asked
the Lord, because so often in Scripture, it says that when people repent,

(25:09):
in fact, in the book of Acts, I can't remember the exact chapter and verse,
it says, repent that times of refreshing might come.
And there are numerous passages that just.
Link repentance with healing. So I asked the Lord if he would heal me.
And I was still doing energy medicine and muscle testing at the time,

(25:34):
but at that point, and didn't realize that that was a problem still, but I think God honored,
he knew my heart and he knew that my desire was to do what was right and to
be pleasing in the sight of God.
And so all of the tormenting, what I now know was demonic torment,

(25:59):
all of the constant bizarre reactions that all day long, every day, I was treating for.
With muscle testing, right? I don't know if we touched on that last time,
but you got into practice, right?
You started with yourself and you started helping others.
After that, where you would muscle test people for allergies using an allergy

(26:22):
elimination technique, an energetic allergy elimination technique.
And that helped you in the beginning, the very beginning.
But then you start noticing, okay, that might not be from God.
Right. Yep. And so all of those reactions came to an end at that point.

(26:44):
When you start repenting. When, yes.
And when I repented of the muscle testing and turned from that,
then God healed me completely of everything.
And all my hormone issues were gone. All of my, you know, the fibroid was gone.

(27:08):
Goiter was gone. The hypothyroidism, all of it was gone. And I was in great health.
So how long did it take for you, Marcy? Once you prayed and you asked God to
reveal to you, and I'm sure it wasn't just one sin.
There's probably a laundry list of sins.

(27:30):
What was that journey like and how long did it take? Well,
you know, the thing that began before that,
even when I was describing about how the counselor had challenged me to believe
when God talks about his love for me, at that point, God began saying.

(27:51):
Bringing emotional healing to my heart and in my relationship with him.
And so for the first time, I was at peace with God and I was at peace with myself.
And so one of the things when we get into talking about a biblical perspective
of health is that that has a huge impact.

(28:14):
And that's, you know, when I
said about 70% of the scriptures link sin and illness in the Bible, Well,
then there's about 20% that talk about the heart and how the heart is the wellspring of life.
And when Proverbs 1430 says a heart at peace gives life to the body.

(28:35):
And so there's all these scriptures about the heart, and I can talk more about that in a little bit.
And then the other 10% would be just that we live in a fallen world.
Goodness gracious, when Adam and Eve blew it in the garden, they cost us a lot.
Not that we don't blow it too, but they started it. We would have done the same thing. Yes, probably.

(29:02):
But you feel like 70%, so that's what you found, the 70% of scripture talks
about sin in relation to health.
Right. And then the heart and then the other.
And so God had begun to do the healing of my heart and bring healing.
And then with the repentance from the sin that I was a part of,

(29:27):
then he healed me of the other things.
And that's not to say that I haven't dealt with illness since then in the last
13 years, but it's none of those things that he healed me all those years ago.
None of them have ever returned. Mm You know, we live in a fallen world.

(29:48):
We're going to deal with colds and the flu and deterioration,
bad genetics, old age that, you know, as we age, our bodies are going to deteriorate and break down.
And that's all because of the sinful world that we live in and the curse that

(30:09):
came, the curse of death that came with Adam and Eve.
So if we were to then summarize what.
The biblical view on health, is it mainly heart-centered or are there other quick highlights?
Yeah. So let me share a passage with you that kind of highlights the biblical perspective of health.

(30:38):
Okay. There it is. Psalm 34, 11 through 14. It says, come my children, listen to me.
I will teach you the fear of the Lord. There's that fear again.
Yeah. Whoever of you loves life and desires to see many good days,
so if you love life, you desire to see many good days, all of us do,
keep your tongue from evil and your lips from telling lies.

(31:02):
Turn from evil and do good, and then look at that last phrase,
seek peace and pursue it.
So in that, we
see that a biblical perspective of health is the bottom foundation is God.

(31:32):
God is sovereign. He's over all.
There is a spirit realm that has influence over the physical realm,
and not everything has to go under the watchful control of God,
but God does allow Satan to have power in this world.

(31:53):
And so that bottom layer that is so often ignored in health is that, as Ephesians 6 says,
we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers.
And so that's an important part that the Bible talks about in regard to health.

(32:16):
And then there's the heart, which, according to the Bible, would be the spirit and the soul.
And the heart is...
Who we are, it is our person. So the soul would be your personality,
all of the things that make you, you.
And the spirit is what, my husband likes to describe the spirit as an electric cord on a lamp.

(32:44):
The cord plugs into the wall to get the power from the wall.
It's the connection between the lamp and the power source.
And so our spirit is God's way of connecting to us, us to him.
And so every human has a spirit and a soul, and the heart comprises that.

(33:08):
So when you hear me talk about the heart, I'm talking about who you are,
who God created you to be.
And so the heart realm is really important.
Like I shared the one passage of Proverbs 1430, but also Proverbs 1722 says,
a cheerful heart doeth good like a cure.

(33:30):
So the Bible acknowledges that our thoughts, our emotions, our attitudes,
all of that can have a significant impact on our health.
And science also confirms that. My book, I give a lot of research and study
on how the science backs up what the Bible says as well.

(33:53):
And then the top of the pyramid is the physical.
It's what normally we would think that physical would be at the bottom.
It would be the primary influence on our health.
It's what we eat, what we do, our genetics, the germs we encounter,
the toxins, the nutrition, parasites, all that stuff.

(34:14):
So you feel like that is the smallest, because I think as we,
as we know, being in a falling world, everything is inverted, right?
So I would def like pre talking to you, I would definitely had reverted the
physical with the God, you know?

(34:35):
So I'm like, the reason we have an epidemic in this fallen world of chronicle illness, right?
Can't deny, like there's not enough doctors out there for the demand, right?
We have a healthcare, a sick care crisis.
I don't know even how to put that in perspective. So would you feel that we

(34:58):
don't really have a chronicle? I mean, the chronicle illness is just the symptom, right?
Because the root is really, we just don't have the relationship with God.
We don't have that foundation.
And people could go and argue and say, well, like, I don't have God in my life,
but I'm pretty healthy. So how do we balance that?

(35:21):
I don't know if anybody has ever asked you that question, but I'm sure people
listening would be wondering about that.
Right. So God created what he calls in, let's see what passage it is, Jeremiah, I think it is.
He refers to the fixed order of heaven and earth.

(35:43):
And yeah, Jeremiah 31 and 33. And so basically, when God created the world,
he created it to follow fixed laws, physical laws.
So, you know, the one everyone's the most familiar with would be gravity.
Now for the flat earthers.

(36:03):
He created our bodies to work a particular way, and that way can be studied
and measured and analyzed and understood through science.
But that's only one part of the truth.
There's also the spiritual realm, not just the physical realm.

(36:24):
And what you see in Scripture is that the physical realm is greatly dependent,
much more than we ever realize, on the spirit realm.
And so there's a passage that says, it talks about how God is saying to the

(36:46):
people through Jeremiah, are there no physicians?
Are there no remedies in Gilead?
Why are my people sick?
And then he goes on to say that it's because of their sin.
So what we see, and that's not the only place where it shows that,
but what we see in the Bible is that God can block the effectiveness of remedies,

(37:12):
of diets, of physical treatments if he's trying to accomplish something good in our lives.
And so, for instance, David, King David says in one of the Psalms,
it was good for me to be afflicted because I came to know God's word.
And I didn't quote that just right, but that was the idea.

(37:34):
And I feel like that, that God used my affliction, my suffering,
to bring me to a closer relationship with him, to bring me to complete health,
to bring me joy and life to the full. Mm-hmm.
So if someone is doing all the right things,

(37:56):
and I see this all the time, people who are on the best diets of what is considered
the healthiest, and yet they're sick all the time.
Why is that? Well, it could be because they are not at peace in their hearts
with God, with themselves, or with others.
Or it could be that they're walking in sin, and God is trying to get their attention

(38:21):
and bring them to a place of fullness instead of rebellion.
Now, Marcy, something that comes to mind, because we're always about hard questions, too.
And so something that comes to mind when you say that is like, if 70% of the Bible,
when it talks to health, it's relating it with sin, then, I mean,
would it be a fair assessment that if we're to go out in the world and we're

(38:45):
to meet individuals that, you know, are afflicted with chronic illness,
you know, regardless of what their appearance is spiritually,
you know, like they go to church every week, they help out, you know,
with charity and all this. You as a great example, right?
You had this close walk with God since you were a child.

(39:07):
I think you shared with me when you're five is when you gave your life to Jesus.
And so you still had your sin. And let's say we have other people that don't
even know who Jesus, like, I didn't know who Jesus was.
And I'm usually for the most part, pretty healthy.
I mean, I have kids with issues, which is another conversation I'd love to get

(39:29):
into at some point. But...
Why, why, I guess, I mean, I'm here humbly myself, I'm sorry,
asking the why question, but, you know, how come that happens?
I know God works on everything for good and for his purposes.
Why do we have people walking in sin and, you know, look at Hollywood,

(39:50):
like all those stars, they look amazing, but we know that they do some not so great things.
Yeah. Leo, did you want to add something to that too? Yeah, I just wanted to know your thoughts.
And if we go out there in the world and we see these people,
I mean, is it a fair assessment that, you know, if we talk about bringing,

(40:11):
you know, the word of the Lord to people as disciples and whatnot,
then, I mean, is it fair to go to those people and say, hey,
you know, have you really assessed your life?
Or, I mean, because 70% is pretty high, right? Yeah.
Well, and Jesus, when he healed people in the Gospels, we're told that he often

(40:35):
would say, your sins are forgiven.
And then he would say, take up your mat and walk.
The Pharisees got offended that how can you say you're forgiven?
But he was connecting there that healing of not just the physical body,
but the healing of the heart from the punishment of sin as well.

(41:00):
But Leo, what you say, so this sounds maybe a little confusing,
but it's almost like there, according to the Bible, there are two different groups of people.
There are those who are children of God.
Some people think, well, everybody's a child of God. Yeah, that's what I believe

(41:21):
forever. They are in the sense that he created everyone.
So he is the father of everyone. But not everyone is a part of his family.
And so those who have placed their trust in Jesus for salvation,
they are the children of God, the Bible says.
And so as his children, he is going to treat his children differently than he

(41:49):
treats those who are not his children.
Just like, Leo, you would never discipline your friend's children,
but you would your own because they are your children. And it's not that you
don't love your children.
You love them passionately, I'm sure.
Yeah. And that's why you're disciplining them, really.

(42:11):
Exactly. Yes. So...
So God, according to scripture, God often will discipline his children when they walk in sin. Why?
Not because he's trying to be mean and he's punishing.
You know, I grew up, corporal punishment was a very common certain thing in our household.

(42:33):
Yeah, I can relate. And it wasn't always done in kindness or love,
but because people are human.
With God, it always is. His desire is not to punish his children when we rebel.
But instead because he loves us and he wants to be in close fellowship with us.

(42:54):
Now, that said about his children, for those, Leo,
who we encounter who have never established that relationship with Jesus Christ
and are not God's children,
then God sometimes just lets them have life to the full.
And why? Because this is all they have. This is it.

(43:19):
When they die, they are going to spend eternity in hell. Wow.
And that sounds so harsh, but it's the truth.
So, you know, even King David in the Psalms, there's one particular Psalm where
he talks about how upset he is over the fact when he looks around,
all these people that could care less about God are rich and have perfect health

(43:45):
and their kids are doing well.
And he's like, why is this?
And then he says in the Psalm, but then I remembered their eternal state.
And so God is working in his children in this life to make us into.
These amazing people sanctified, set apart to enjoy God for eternity,

(44:11):
those who do not know Him may or may not experience those struggles in the same way.
Regardless, the issues of the heart are universal to everyone,
whether they are a child of God or walking in rebellion and say,
there is no God because God created our hearts to be, according to Proverbs 3,

(44:39):
the wellspring of life.
And so out of our heart flows life.
And this is what, in summary, of kind of what I found in the Bible on health
is that when we are at peace with God, peace with ourselves, and peace with others,
then our hearts breathe life, so to speak, into our bodies.

(45:04):
When you guys are married, my husband and I, we've been married for 32 years.
We've had many a fight through the years.
When there's fight between us, it makes me sick.
I mean, I get sick to my stomach. I I have physical results from it.
We've all experienced some sort of physical reaction in relation to an emotion or a thought.

(45:33):
And of course, depression is proven over and over again to be linked to all
kinds of health conditions and so on.
So anyway, for all those who are out there and listening, thinking,
well, how does this apply to me.
If you're not ready to let God into your life and to know the joy that He brings,

(45:59):
there's still that element of deal with your heart because your heart is the wellspring of life.
Does it even make sense for us to step back a little bit and talk about.
I guess, your thoughts on mainstream medicine?
And I think you talk about that in your book quite a bit where we sometimes,

(46:20):
you know, we want the solution for our suffering, right? We don't want to be suffering.
We don't want to be in pain. We don't want to have the symptoms.
And the first thing we think of is I got to go to the doctor, right?
Or, you know, the alternative, which is I'm going to go to a chiropractor or
the naturopath or the...
Whatever energy healer out there. Right. And so going back to that phrase,

(46:46):
the fixed order of heaven and earth,
as far as mainstream medicine sticks to the fixed order of heaven and earth,
then it can accomplish, it can help a great deal.
For instance, sense, science has learned an incredible amount about anatomy

(47:06):
and physiology and made all kinds of insights.
And that's all knowledge that God has allowed science to discover about the human body.
And we can benefit from that. So a mainstream doctor has a great deal of knowledge,
but they do say they practice medicine.

(47:27):
It's, it's a very, it is not a sure thing.
And so they are only limited. So practice meaning like you are.
Exactly. Whoa, I never saw it that way. That's very interesting.
Okay. They're practicing.
There you go. Yeah. When we were, we cared for my husband's mother for many,

(47:49):
many years with Alzheimer's until she passed away in February.
And one of the hospice doctors, I would ask him questions and he's like,
Marcy, that's why we say we practice medicine.
That is wonderful. Okay, that's gonna stay with me. I've heard that with law.

(48:09):
Yeah, okay, okay, stay with medicine, wow.
You would think they would know, right? They get the big bucks,
they get paid the big bucks. That's right. There's no practicing here.
But often medicine, you know, when it gets into...
How to handle that knowledge, what to do with that knowledge.

(48:30):
That's where a breakdown often comes because medicine cannot heal. Only God can heal.
And so when we go to a doctor, whether it's a traditional mainstream doctor or a naturopath,
they can only do what they do based on the knowledge that they have.

(48:51):
They cannot bring healing.
And so when I get sick, when I am dealing with some symptom that doesn't go
away, I spend time in prayer before I go to the doctor.
Now, if it was an emergency situation, if I broke a bone, I'm not going to pray
about, should I go to the doctor or not?

(49:13):
It's a given. Yeah, let's go get it. Right. You can still pray on the way.
Right. Exactly. Pray on the way. That's right.
But if it's just a chronic symptom,
before I even make that doctor's appointment, I will pray about it.
And sometimes even fast for a period of time so that I can just really pull

(49:38):
away from the distractions of everything
and seek God on why is it that I'm sick and what would He want me to do about it.
What is the biblical view on fasting? Why do people in the Bible fast?
Because, you know, there's fast is a huge trend right now.

(50:02):
And some people, even Christians say, I won't fast because it is a trend and
it's not, you know. Like intermittent fasting. Yeah, yeah.
What is your view on that? I guess not your view, but the biblical view.
Yeah. So there are several different reasons in Scripture to fast.
Whenever there is a serious issue that someone is facing,

(50:26):
for instance, in the book of Esther, when the Jews were facing annihilation,
Esther called a fast for all of Israel to pray and plead with the Lord to intervene
on their behalf and to save them from annihilation.
So in situations where, you know,

(50:47):
I've had in my own family issues with addictions and where I have fasted for
long periods of time to pray for them that God would rescue them and have seen
God work in amazing ways in those situations.
But with health, it's more fasting biblically is a way to humble yourself before

(51:14):
God and admit in a very serious way that I can't fix this.
I don't have the wisdom. I don't have the knowledge. I don't know how to handle
this. God, I need your help.
And so that kind of summarizes is the gist of why.
It's like a mind clearing or it's like some sort of a denial of your most physical flesh needs.

(51:43):
Yeah, yeah, definitely. But it also is a way of putting into action a seriousness
of your heart that is saying, God, I don't know what else to do.
I can't do this without you.
And so to me, it's not something that I do because it's not like intermittent

(52:09):
fasting or fasting to lose weight or that kind of thing.
It's more a way to seek God, to spend extra time in His Word instead of sitting
down to eat, go and pray and read the Word.
And there have been many times where when
I was dealing with different health issues where God has honored that and answered

(52:33):
given insight as to what I should do given peace that okay I should go to the
doctor and check this out or no it's you know Marcy you're you've been.
Bitter about this or that and you need to deal
with that you know it just so it's not really what

(52:54):
i'm because when i went into this this even
like wanting to interview for this podcast i had
this in my mind again energy medicine
and alternative medicine really being the
counter alternative to mainstream because i
didn't trust mainstream and i was like okay i want
maybe marcy has the answer is it one or is it the other or

(53:16):
it's is there in between but what you're saying
is there's something really important in the middle which
is God and so like we don't explore
that alternative first we don't seek him first we just want the symptoms to
go away make me normal again so I don't have to deal I mean I really don't have

(53:38):
to go back and and figure okay what What maybe have I done?
Because this is true in the, I want to say, in the new age of the popular spirituality realm.
There is this idea that everything that happens to you has a purpose and it
springs from something you have done.

(54:01):
Like if you got sick, let's say you have, like one of my friends has Parkinson's, right?
And the way that it manifests for her is rigidity. Her body gets really rigid.
And she may think that, well, the reason it's rigid is because my disposition in life is to be rigid.
I'm not very flexible as far as, you know, when I'm making decisions,

(54:23):
I'm very much, this is the only way, and this is it, and this is all I'm going to do.
So you take ownership. If you have cancer, you know, maybe there's some bitterness
that you've been harboring.
And as long as you recognize that, that should be enough for you to, you know, move forward.
And if you don't, maybe there's something else, but there's never a,

(54:44):
you never take a relationship with the creator, you know, as an alternative,
an alternate explanation for your symptoms.
So again, it's not alternative or mainstream.
It's basically our relationship with God and seeking God to figure,
okay, how can we, what are you trying to tell me?

(55:07):
Yeah. And, you know, one thing that I found interesting when I was reading the
Bible, looking for passages that had to do with healing, Jesus healed everybody different ways.
Have you ever noticed that? I mean, one person, he just tells them,
take up your mat and walk.

(55:27):
And then another, he spits in the mud and rubs mud in their eyes and tells them
to walk to the pool of Siloam and wash it off.
And some, he told lepers, go present yourselves to the priest.
Well, they weren't healed when they left him, but Jesus wanted them to demonstrate

(55:48):
faith that they believed they would be healed as they went to the priest.
So all these different, and in the Old Testament, there's somebody who was healed
because he dipped in the water when Elijah the prophet told him to seven times.
So it's like all these different ways.

(56:09):
Why did God do that? Well, what I take from that is that God is not limited
in how he can bring healing.
He can do it in any way you can think of. It could be in an instant.
It could take a long time.
It could be through a doctor. It could be through a remedy. It could be through a surgery.

(56:32):
But the important thing is, is he blessing?
Is he going to block or bless the way?
And that's why when we seek him
first, we are going with his blessing as opposed to, I'm going to do this.
And God, by the way, will you heal me when I do this?

(56:55):
There's a different attitude there. King Asa in the Old Testament in 1 Kings
and in 2 Chronicles were told about a king named King Asa who was a godly king
who did a lot of good and did right,
but it says that he got a disease.
And he didn't, he chose not

(57:17):
to well in fact i'll read you what it says second chronicles 16
12 and 13 says though his disease
was severe even in his illness he did not seek help from the lord but only the
physicians then in the 41st year of his reign asa died and you know god just

(57:37):
he wants us to come to him first and to seek him,
and then he will lead us according to his will. Now, not that...
It's not that it's always going to, you're not always going to be healed by seeking, right?
Because I bet there are situations out there. I don't know if you ran into that in the Bible.

(58:00):
Like there's the story of Job, right? He had horrible diseases.
It wasn't really because he still followed the Lord, right?
Oh, no. But it was we're told that was demonic, that Satan actually brought
those boils on him, that illness on him.
Yeah, let's talk about this, because is it the case where every ailment anybody

(58:27):
has is consequences, sin or or there's demonic oppression?
There is environmental factors also, maybe. Maybe, how can you tell that is
it your sin or is it oppression?
Why would you be oppressed? For example, like I suffered with anxiety.

(58:49):
It's funny, I've had anxiety since my teenage years, maybe childhood even.
And I didn't know what it was until my mom one day just kind of happened to mention it.
You know, your dad and I were talking about it and you seem like you're a very
anxious person. And I go like, oh, so that horrible feeling I have all the time, that's anxiety?

(59:12):
And I can tell you, like,
the older I get, I feel like the intenser it is until recently,
where here I have a lot of the same stressors that throw me off a kilt,
but I don't necessarily feel the debilitating anxiety there anymore.

(59:35):
And it's when I started praying about it because I recognized,
well, maybe this is not from God.
Maybe there's another force there that is influencing.
I mean, not that I don't want to take responsibility for, you know,
my beliefs about things.
But at the same time, how many situations where I found myself having extreme

(59:56):
anxiety for no reason and heart palpitations, I'm like, I'm just on vacation.
Why am I feeling like this? So I recognize that and I feel like it's been better
since I started reading the word and started coming to God.
But at the same time, how can we tell when an illness is part of sin or part

(01:00:16):
of oppression or just simply because we just ate really bad food?
Right. Yeah, yeah. Well, and that's part of where the seeking God first comes
in, because we don't know.
And so to ask him to guide us and to guide.

(01:00:38):
Shed light on why it is that we're dealing with that particular illness.
And it is a simple process because, as you said, you were struggling with believing
that God loved you, right?
That was a big struggle. And I think that would be a struggle for most people.
Honestly, if we think about it, why don't we seek God? We don't think He's going

(01:00:59):
to talk back, or we're not going to notice that He's talking back.
How is that process? Yeah, or He doesn't, And yeah, he's got a lot on his plate.
He created everything already. I mean, why are we coming to him?
So what did that look like for you when you started seeking?
So going back, though, to what you were asking about demonic oppression,

(01:01:23):
there are numerous passages in the New Testament where it talks about Jesus healing people.
And it says that he also, many who were demon-possessed also were delivered.
There are actually two different words that are used. One simply means torment.
And then the other one is much more severe.

(01:01:46):
So if you think of it, if somebody like if Leo was next to you and he just started
picking at your shirt and it was irritating, it's like, what are you doing?
You know, would you stop it already? Or like the gnats all over me.
Or the gnats. There you go. That you is like a mild torment that is not all-consuming.

(01:02:12):
But then if you think about like if you were to go to Disney and you're there
when a million other people are there and it's hot and everybody is just bumping
up against you and you're rubbing shoulders.
Been there. Everybody, it's this constant, all-consuming, I can't escape this onslaught.

(01:02:34):
That is a whole other level.
But demonic torment can be anywhere in that realm.
Satan does have the power to influence our physical bodies. And so...
I've heard many people that have been involved in energy medicine share with

(01:02:57):
me that when they repented of energy medicine, all that stuff stopped.
People that have had severe vertigo and dizziness, and it just suddenly stopped.
And I believe that's because it was demonic torment. When we get involved in

(01:03:18):
spiritual things, we're opening a door to spiritual forces to influence us.
And so when you close that door, then that torment can stop.
But I've also heard people say how they can tell is, like some people have said,

(01:03:38):
every time I sit down to try and read the Bible, I start to have this particular symptom.
That kind of makes you think, hmm, maybe something's trying to keep you from reading the Bible.
Or there was a woman that I got to know through the ministry,
and her son became very tormented as a result of her involvement with muscle testing.

(01:04:05):
So it's not just limited to you. It's limited to your children as well or your family members?
Yes, it could be. And in her case, the son was treated for muscle testing and
immediately following began demonstrating all these very out-of-control behaviors and symptoms.

(01:04:28):
And so that was actually why she reached out to me because of the concern over
what was going on with her son.
But what she noticed, they ended up becoming Christians. Right.
And what she said was when they would try to go to church, her son might be just fine.
And then in the car on the way to church, suddenly he is just going berserk, out of control.

(01:04:53):
And so it kept them from being able to go to church.
That has the earmarks of, you know, demonic torment that is trying to prevent
you from getting close to God. Wow.
So some things like that are definitely worth taking notice of.
And in the case of someone who is a child of God, the Bible says that we have

(01:05:17):
power in the name of Jesus to stand against the enemy.
And James 4, 7 says, submit yourself to God, resist the devil,
and he will flee from you.
So we don't need some deliverance ministry as children of God.
We just need the the name of Jesus and the covering of His blood.

(01:05:38):
Well, I've got several things swirling in my head,
but something that just popped in is, okay, we're talking about people who develop
illness and what the Bible says a large percentage of the time are potential vectors for that.
And what about the individuals who are born afflicted?

(01:06:00):
Mm-hmm. Like blindness or... Well, not even permanent things.
They're born with diseases, whether it's neurological or something.
Or yeah, maybe they immediately have cancer, right?
You know, a baby. Like one of our children, he was born with Hirschsprung's
disease, which is basically the lining of his intestine didn't have nerve cells

(01:06:23):
to do peristalsis, so he wouldn't poop.
And so he had to have emergency surgery when he was—three surgeries by the—you
know, when they found out, finally.
But I guess what I'm wondering is we're talking about, you know,
can the sins of the family, you know, impact the well-being of the child?

(01:06:44):
Yes. and there are you
know we see the example in the story
of david king david when he had the affair with bathsheba and then had her husband
killed by sending him to the front lines and the baby that was conceived in
that affair bathsheba's son when she gave birth to it the child died and it's made

(01:07:09):
clear in the Bible that that was the result their parents sent,
the child's parents sent.
But the child is going to eternal life, right? Yes. So the child is fine.
It's just the parents are going to have to suffer with that. Yeah.
But often as parents, the Bible, and I don't have the scriptures written down

(01:07:30):
to be able to tell you the references,
but the well-being of the children in the Bible is is closely linked to the parents.
And so when we are walking in sin, when we are not at peace and our homes are
not at peace, that's going to take a toll on our kids and their hearts too.

(01:07:55):
It's also when we have opened the door to spiritual forces, even in pregnancy
or when When the children are young, then they are vulnerable,
unfortunately, to demonic attack as well.
And so one of the women that I've recently come into contact with through my ministry is,

(01:08:20):
Her name's Ninka Moritzson, I think. And she actually has a program for moms of kids with autism.
And she had a son who also was severely autistic, and he is now an adult and just doing fantastic.

(01:08:41):
But anyway so she has this thing that
she says at the beginning of her program all
the time that autism is a wake-up call for the parent oh yeah her program is
and I don't know all the details of it but basically that you know moms you've
got to start with yourself you can't fix your child She says,

(01:09:04):
you can't teach your child Italian if you don't speak Italian.
Right. And, you know, so you've got to, as parents, what we're doing greatly impacts our children.
And so, yeah, there is a link there.
But the passage in the Old Testament that says the sins of the father are visited

(01:09:27):
to the third and fourth generation,
that's a very interesting thing because it
actually epigenetics which is a whole other
fascinating but big topic that i
talk about in the book life to the body okay i'm gonna read that next it's it's
interesting stuff but we see through epigenetics that that the sins of the the

(01:09:51):
father are literally passed down to the third and fourth generation.
But the Bible says that God does not punish the children for the father's sins.
The children have the choice to either, when they get to be adults,
are they going to follow the sins of the father or are they going to follow the Lord?

(01:10:13):
And God will treat them according to how the choices that they make individually.
And of course, when we.
Become a Christian, the Bible says that all things are made new.
And so we are new creations in Christ.
We do not have to be bound by the sins of the Father. We make our choices.

(01:10:36):
Are we going to follow the Lord or not? Okay, that's wonderful.
So going back to what we were saying, we start with a prayer, right?
You said you do some fasting at times, but you ask God to reveal your sin.
Would you ask him also to review, could this be oppression or could this,

(01:10:57):
before you seek the physical, unless it's an emergency and you have a broken
leg and it's obvious, right? You seek in prayer.
And in some of your talks, you talked about, you know, there's different things
There's prayer, there's confession, which I kind of wanted to understand that better.

(01:11:18):
Do you just confess in your mind or let's say you figure, okay,
whatever this is that I'm dealing with came from, I had a relationship with
someone that I didn't treat very well.
Could you just silently tell God, I'm sorry, or do you need to go a step farther?
Is that something that God would reveal to you? Yes.

(01:11:41):
If you have sinned against somebody else, then you need to confess that to God,
but you also need to go to that individual, if that's possible, and ask forgiveness.
And that's very hard to do. It's very humbling. Yeah, like in your experience
when you were practicing energy medicine, did you feel like you had to go to
each individual you work with and apologize?

(01:12:04):
Yes, I did. and tell them why I was wrong and ask them to forgive me.
And, you know, oftentimes when you do that, people are like,
oh, yeah, no big deal. Don't worry about it.
Okay. It can be kind of awkward. You're like, I got to have this conversation
with you. And they're like, oh, this is it? Okay.

(01:12:25):
Don't worry about it. But then you also talk about thought patterns. Yes.
What is that? You know what I'm referring to, I'm sure.
Yeah, and you're talking about
the chapter about being transformed by the renewing of our mind and how,
like, when we think, and science bears this out, that when we think a thought,

(01:12:47):
it's like a pathway is laid in the brain.
And every time we think that thought, that pathway is made faster and faster. It's reinforced.
It's kind of like if you've ever gotten to go sledding and you take a sled down
a hill, the first time down the hill, the snow is fresh and the sled is not going to go as fast.

(01:13:14):
But the next time you go down and you go down that same path, it's going to go faster.
And then each time the rut gets bigger and deeper and you're going to go easier and easier.
The same is true with our thoughts. And so if we have a pattern of thoughts,
like for so long, I was, I had major depression my entire life.

(01:13:39):
And I, because of all those years of physical suffering and then various traumas
in my life, I just had this constant thought of, I just want to die. I just wait.
First, it was thinking about killing myself.
And then it was, okay, I guess that's wrong. God, I'm sorry.

(01:14:02):
So would you just take me, Lord, please just take me to heaven.
Make it easy for me. Exactly. That became a constant repetitive thought.
Another one was that life is hard. And I would just, in my mind,
that would go through my mind constantly.
Life is too hard. Life is hard. That is something that I do kind of.

(01:14:25):
So that's interesting you brought that up.
And so overcoming those kind of thoughts were really, that was a challenge.
But the way the Bible says to do it is to take every thought captive and bring
it into submission to the truth.
And so God's Word, when I've struggled with different things,

(01:14:46):
I will find passages in the Bible and I'll write them on a little note card.
And maybe you want to put it in your phone. I'm old school.
I like to write it on a card and stick it somewhere and just keep thinking and
praying about that scripture, memorizing it.
And that truth begins to take the place of the wrong thinking.

(01:15:09):
So kind of like, you know, people would say in the new age affirmations or mantras, but yeah,
but you're using. You're not reflecting back on yourself. You're affirming God's word.
Exactly. Yeah. And there's the Bible, there's power in the Bible, in the word of God.
And so it's not just words.

(01:15:30):
It's not just positive thinking. It is truth and it has power.
Another specific example of that for me was because of all my years of struggles
with eating and sensitivities to food and so on, even when God healed my stomach,
I really was afraid to eat.

(01:15:52):
And it's like, oh, I can't eat dairy. I can't eat that. I can't eat that.
And I was afraid. I mean, like I could just thinking about the food,
feel my stomach start to hurt.
And so I realized that you know, this is not just about a food sensitivity.

(01:16:13):
This is something about that pattern in my brain that for so long has been reinforced
that that food is evil and it's going to hurt me.
And so I actually wrote down a passage in 1 Timothy 4, I believe, on a note card.
And it says, and everything God created is good and nothing is to be rejected

(01:16:36):
if it is received with thanksgiving because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer.
Is that okay? Does that include food sprayed with glyphosates and genetically modified?
You know, interestingly, I mean, I do try to avoid those kind of things whenever it's possible.

(01:16:58):
But the interesting thing about that passage is that the context is in the last
days, and And it's talking about deceiving, in fact...
Yes. Let me see if I can find it real quick and read it because it's good.
But the context is that it's the last days.

(01:17:22):
And so I'm pretty sure God knew what was going to be the condition of our food supply.
Oh, yeah. He knows all, right?
That's right. So if he wrote this, then
perhaps he did it with the
full knowledge of what we would be facing with our
food supply at this point in time so let

(01:17:45):
me find here it is
interesting this topic specifically because i remember years ago we had a conversation
around you know this is in full new age mode but you know we were talking about
another guest robert and he had a guest on that's because you know he was he's
very doom and gloom and everything and and one of the guests that that this gentleman,

(01:18:08):
he's a astrologer.
But anyway, the guest said, you know, I really believe that it is our opinion
of what we think of the food that we eat that creates the most challenge for us.
And she actually was making the case that, you know, we need to adapt our thoughts.

(01:18:31):
Now, that's obviously much more self-focused. You know, we're kind of saying
the same concept here, but we're saying, God,
take what is harmful away from this and bless it, despite those that produced
it in this way. So it's just kind of an interesting parallel.
Right, yeah. So I found the passage, and I'll start with verse 1 in chapter

(01:18:55):
4 of 1 Timothy, and it says, Now the Spirit,
meaning the Holy Spirit, Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times
some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines
of demons. Sound familiar?
Speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, forbidding to marry,

(01:19:20):
and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving
for those who believe and know the truth.
For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be refused if it is received
with thanksgiving, for it is sanctified by the word of God in prayer.

(01:19:41):
So, you know, we're hearing a lot of teaching about how awful our food is and
saying to abstain from all these areas of nutrition that God created for us to enjoy.
Are we referring to veganism?

(01:20:02):
Well, maybe. All kinds of. There are so many different variations.
Of... Grains, for example, is one that I... Yep, anything with glue. I have, yep.
And yet it says here that in the last days that these are doctrines of demons

(01:20:24):
and deceiving spirits that will tell people to abstain from foods God created to be a bolsey dust.
So that's pretty powerful to me. So anyway, I wrote that down on a card and
every time before I would eat,
I would read that card as a prayer to God and say, God, you know I'm afraid

(01:20:46):
of this food, but I am trusting you because you said,
and then I'd read the card and
I'd say, thank you, Lord, for this food and make it a blessing to my body.
And pretty quickly, those patterns of thought of fear towards food began to
change and my reactions to the food began to change.

(01:21:08):
Now, that's not to say that there aren't true allergies to foods.
And I'm not saying to just eat, you know, if you have ulcerative colitis to
start downing ice cream and dairy, please don't do that.
And the same is true, you know, if somebody is on, I know that, you know, in general,

(01:21:33):
your listeners probably are not big fans of pharmaceuticals,
but if somebody is using something because of a true health condition,
please don't just stop it because you think, I don't need it anymore. God's healed me.
You know, like with my thyroid, when I was on medication, I didn't just stop

(01:21:54):
the medicine because I decided I was going to stop it.
My God healed my thyroid and brought that thyroid into working order again.
And it made it apparent that I don't need that medicine anymore.
So anyway, that's just kind of a side note.
Yeah. So just to go going full circle, what I'm thinking you are saying is that the answer to.

(01:22:20):
My big question, the solutions, right? Because the first part we talked about,
you know, the issues with the alternatives.
And then we talked a little bit about mainstream medicine, but it seems like
we're coming to our broken relationship.
I mean, we are broken, right? I mean, it's pretty obvious. We can look at the
state of the world and figure that out.

(01:22:41):
But our relationship with our creator is really the one that has been interrupted
because Because we just keep, we keep thinking we're hot stuff or we're good.
And if we make mistakes, we're just not tuning into the right frequency.
It wasn't me. I was just like in a lower vibration or something like that.

(01:23:04):
We really need to repair that relationship.
And it seemed like you talk a lot about prayer. Do you feel like that's where,
if we are chronically ill?
I mean, with anything, is that where we should start? We should start just looking
up and repairing that relationship.
Yeah, and get into God's Word, because that is where the power is.

(01:23:28):
God has given us His Word. He's given—if you're a child of God and you're a
believer in Jesus Christ as your Savior,
the Bible says you have the Holy Spirit dwelling in you, and the Holy Spirit's
job is to comfort, to counsel,
to call to mind the Word of God.
And so, you know, get in the Word, start every day, you know,

(01:23:53):
even if it's just five minutes a day.
When I was young, I was trying to establish a devotion every day.
And I thought, okay, I'm going to set a timer for five minutes,
and I'll just read the Bible for five minutes.
And then I would start reading and think, oh, this is kind of interesting.
I'm going to keep reading, and I'd read a few minutes longer.
But just start with the word.

(01:24:16):
It's so easy to read other stuff, to listen to other sermons,
to listen to just podcasts and sermons and all those things.
And those are good. They can have a real help in our growth as Christians.

(01:24:37):
But it's the word of God that really has the power that can speak to us and
bring change that can bring that peace between us and God.
So yes, I would say prayer and the word of God.
And then as you're praying, as you're reading the word, he's going to make things
known to you and you respond to that.

(01:24:59):
So basically just sit and read it because I felt like that myself,
and I've heard that for many people recently, that the Bible is a difficult
read. It doesn't make sense to them.
Or I have heard, even in our own children, like, I don't hear from God.
I don't think He talks to me.

(01:25:20):
Would you say just keep on reading?
Keep the line of communications open. And I saw on your website,
Heart and Healing Ministries, right? Did I say it right?
No, no. Sorry. Heart and Mind. That's okay.
Heart and Mind Ministries. Heart and Mind Ministries. You used to have a Bible study. Do you still?

(01:25:41):
I've taught a number of Bible studies through the years. Health, health.
Yes, and there's one on that website that all the lessons, I think there's eight
lessons, And it's the same content as Life to the Body, but just not,
there's a lot more in the book that I couldn't cover in those lessons.
But it is a great, you know, it is a great audio version of a lot of that content.

(01:26:06):
Do you do any coaching, like one-on-one?
Well, when people reach out, I do the best I can to try and communicate back
with them, whether it be through email or in phone conversations.
But I don't do anything for pay.
I long ago realized that when you've been involved because of chronic health,

(01:26:32):
you spend a lot of money, whether it's traditional medicine or whether it's
alternative medicine, you are just constantly paying out money.
And I wanted to To contrast that all the other ways except God's cost money, but God's grace is free.

(01:26:54):
And so, no, I don't charge.
But I believe that God is working and bringing about a possibility,
a new direction for the ministry.
And I think that's going to involve a small group support.

(01:27:14):
I mean, I guess in the secular world, you might call it a small group coaching,
but in Christian terms, a discipleship-based support Bible study and group for
those who are dealing with chronic health issues.
Oh, that would be wonderful. Let us know how we can support with that to get that going.

(01:27:38):
In the months ahead, I've started working on that and hoping to get that put
in place soon. Okay, that's wonderful.
And any last thoughts you had? I know you had maybe a few other verses that
you might want to share on your presentation.
Do you feel like they would be applicable? Sure.
The one that I want to just conclude with is 2 Thessalonians 3.16,

(01:28:03):
and it's a short verse, but it says, Now may the Lord of peace himself give
you peace at all times, and in every way the Lord be with all of you.
And that's how I'd like to say goodbye to those listening.
Amen. Amen. Well, thank you so much again, Marci, for all your wisdom.

(01:28:25):
Them. Again, Marci has three books.
The first one is, can you show that again? Because I don't have that one. I need to get it.
When You Can't Trust His Heart. And that's if you're dealing with struggles about the love of God.
If you feel like you've got a broken heart and you don't know how to fix it, this one is an easy read.

(01:28:45):
And there's also a Bible study guide that goes with it where where you can actually
use it to get into the word and allow God to bring healing in your heart.
And then you have Life to the Body, Biblical Principles for Health and Healing
over here, which that's the one I've been digging in.
And your latest, Ouija Medicine.

(01:29:08):
And this one breaks down into different practices, right? Your research on different
practices. And I think you said you've been doing some research on chiropractic.
Yeah, but I'm not ready to go into that yet.
But I'll be looking forward to that content myself.
Again, thank you so much. We'll share all those links in the show notes.

(01:29:30):
And if you need to reach out to Marci, we'll have all the information you need
to do that. Marci, thank you so much.
I hope God continues to bless Bless you with this amazing work that you're doing.
And we appreciate all the time you spend from us with all our crazy questions,
you know, and meeting us where we're at.
Yeah, we're so grateful. So thank you. Thank you.

(01:29:53):
All right, another great episode with Marci Juleen.
Fabi, what was the biggest standout for you? I think it always,
I have this, maybe with every episode, but this one in particular,
I always have obviously this idea of what I want out of it, you know,
and how it's going to go down.
And I think it really surprised me to hear that it wasn't mainstream medicine

(01:30:20):
versus alternative medicine in this case.
I felt like there was still deception there for me that I thought it was just one or the other.
There was no other answer. And, yeah, just finding ways to strengthen that relationship
with God on this healing realm,

(01:30:41):
which has been basically our family foundation has been built on healing our kids,
you know, because we are fairly healthy.
And we just struggle since our firstborn, you know, it's just made.
I mean, we love them to death. that we would do anything for them.

(01:31:02):
But it's just, it hasn't been, not saying that parenting is easy by any stretch
of the imagination, but when you have health, debilitating health things happen
to your kids, like you ask God, why them?
Why not me? Why them? And it's been a hard journey and it's been a journey without

(01:31:24):
God, basically this whole time. And I'm just happy that.
It's coming to me. It's clear that that was the missing piece.
And it's so crazy to think that, man, how did I not see that before?
You know, there's so many puzzle pieces coming together for me.

(01:31:45):
Yeah. I mean, I think you just get so open-minded that you are close-minded to things.
And so... You are close-minded. I heard this said the other day,
which made so much sense, like, Like, that's totally me.
I do that all the time. You get something to put together, like,

(01:32:05):
you know, with an instruction manual, right?
And I always want to put it together without the manual.
Always is my default. Why am I going to read this? I mean, I can't be that dumb
that I have to look at the instruction manual.
And in a way, that's how life has been for me, like doing it all by myself and

(01:32:27):
not looking at the instruction manual. And then now I feel kind of dumb at times.
I'm like, okay, there's the structure manual there all along, you know, the word.
All right. Well, we'll just keep working at it. Yep. Okay. Keep working. Yes, spiritual leader.
All right. So, again, another good episode of the Collective Residence Podcast.

(01:32:47):
If you have comments or if you'll like the episode, please do so.
Otherwise, we will see you next time when we figure out a tagline. All right. See ya.