May 16, 2025 • 25 mins
Nathaniel Mahowald, founder of Pickaxe, shares his remarkable journey from living in a van for over two years while pursuing entrepreneurship to building an AI company serving over a million monthly users.
• Transforming from data scientist intern to CEO in just six years
• Living in a van to save money while college friends took jobs at Google
• Starting multiple failed companies before finding success
• Getting laid off during COVID and working without pay for five months at a startup
• Finding his first customer in Alaska through a Reddit post
• Riding a beat-up motorcycle across Florida to meet a potential mentor
• Building Pickaxe to help coaches and consultants leverage AI in their businesses
• Growing to over 1,200 paying customers with exponential growth since 2023
• Making AI accessible and less intimidating for everyday entrepreneurs
• Understanding what you truly want from life to guide difficult decisions
Head over to terrylfossum.com to pick up your free gifts and learn how to break through your comfort zone to reach the pinnacle of success in every area of your life.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
If you've been stuck in fear, self-doubt, your past
failures and you're ready tobreak through your comfort zones
to finally reach the pinnacleof success in every area of your
life, then this podcast is foryou.
Here's your host, Terry LFossum.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hey everybody, Terry L Fossum here once again and
welcome back to the ComebackChronicles podcast.
We have a very special podcasttoday, and what makes this so
special is I didn't even knowwho this guy was about, I don't
know, 20 minutes ago and I goton a Zoom with him talking about
a service that he providespeople.
You're going to want to hearabout that, and I became so
impressed, not just with theservice, but with this guy's
(00:51):
story, his comeback story.
I'm like we need to dropeverything.
We need to put you on tape, weneed to get your story out there
to the world.
So this is really going to be ablast.
It's very off the cuff.
Nothing is prepared.
We're going to get on and havefun and just talk like two
people.
So let me tell you who this guyis.
Okay, Nathaniel, I'm going tomispronounce it.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Sorry, Mohald Pronounce it for me Mohald, yeah
, mohald, mohald.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Mohald.
There we go, and I'm justleaving that on.
We're rolling tape, it's allright, man.
So right now it's 2025.
Just six years ago, in 2019,this guy was a data scientist
intern just an intern and thenin 2019, he became a data
scientist for Vodaai.
In 2020, a data scientist forC6 Bank In September 2020, the
(01:45):
lead data scientist for Civo,and then he went to be an
associate at ARK InvestmentManagement in 2021.
And now he is the founder andCEO for a service called Pickaxe
, and I'm going to let himexplain what Pickaxe is first,
and then we're going to go backinto his amazing background, his
(02:06):
Comeback Chronicle background.
Welcome to the show, nathaniel.
So glad you decided to jump onand join me here, man, thank you
so much for having me.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
It's so great to get the chance to talk a little bit
about myself and talk aboutPickaxe.
You know, pickaxe is a servicefor the millions of americans
who make money by selling accessto their knowledge, whether
they're consultants, coaches,they're creating courses.
You know, it really is thebroad field, and there are
millions of americans that workfor themselves selling access to
(02:37):
their specialties that theyhave owned over years and years
of work.
And all we're doing withpickaxe is is saying, hey, if
you you see that ChatGPT, youknow, is a valuable resource for
your customers that also givesgood advice.
Don't have your customerschoose between that or hiring
you and working with you.
You should be able to have allthe firepower of that AI within
(03:00):
your own business, and that'sall we do at Pickaxe is we help
folks to build those toolswithin their own business.
And that's all we do at Pickaxeis we help folks to build those
tools within their own funnelsand within their own businesses
so that they can have theirexpertise combined with the
amazing power of AI in a brandedenvironment where they can
monetize and control access toit.
And we're just so excited tohelp anybody in that space, you
(03:22):
know, build tools to help theirbusinesses.
Well, that's how we got to knoweach other, because I'm as
space.
You know, build tools to helptheir businesses.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Well, that's how we got to know each other, because
I'm as probably the listenersknow I'm building out a huge
TEDx training platform.
Now, I'm not associated withTEDx, but this is called the
viral stage and because it is aviral stage, it's the world's
largest stage and I'm helpingpeople get on that stage and
blow the doors off of it.
It's the world's largest stageand I'm helping people get on
(03:47):
that stage and blow the doorsoff of it.
But here was my problem.
I'm building these amazing AIsI mean better than literally
anything else in existence butright now not everybody is on
chat GPT, so there's thisroadblock there and we don't
like roadblocks.
So that's where his service wasrecommended to me and I looked
into it.
I had some questions about itand right away, nathaniel's like
(04:10):
let's talk, and got on thisthing.
I'm like, okay, yep, so withinGod willing, the next couple,
three weeks, I'm going to betransferring all of this stuff
over to this service.
So you're going to see hisservice on my service, which is
cool.
Okay, you've got an incrediblebackground.
I mean six years.
But and now, of course, hereyou are, a young CEO building a
(04:34):
company and building it veryquickly.
It's very exciting and I thinkit's going to build more quickly
, but that's not always the wayit was.
You told me something that blewmy mind.
What was that, nathaniel?
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Well, when I was in college and graduating college,
I lived in a van for actually alittle over two years and you
know, it was just.
It was something that it seemedlike I needed to do in order to
save the money that I wanted tostart a business.
I knew when I went into schoolI wanted to be a physicist, but
(05:09):
I quickly got rid of that notionand I said I want to be an
entrepreneur.
This is the only thing that'sexciting to me.
But I knew it wasn't going tobe super easy and while my kind
of the other folks, kind of myfriends in college, went and
worked for Google, I moved intothe van.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Wow, wow.
So they're getting paid a lotof money to work at Google short
term, but you had this longterm vision.
That was a whole differentballgame.
Tell me more about that.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Well, you know, I think To say I had a long term
vision is maybe giving me alittle bit too much credit.
I think I just was unemployablewith my proclivity to just want
to do things my own way.
I tried to start a bunch ofdifferent companies.
I tried to start a company thatwould put these boxes in your
(05:59):
house that would mine Bitcoinwith solar power.
A company that would put theseboxes in your house that would
mine Bitcoin with solar power.
I tried to start a company thatwould help you give micro
donations to local politicalcandidates.
I was just super excited aboutthe idea of exploring starting
things.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
And let me jump in right there, because this is so
critical and we talked aboutthis real quick and we were just
chatting back and forth.
One of the things I teach theroad to success is paved with
failure.
It's failure, man.
If you're failing, it's not bad.
It's a very good thing, becauseevery single person who
succeeded at anything ofsignificance at all has failed
(06:38):
and failed, and failed, andfailed.
You're telling me you're one ofthose people, and you're
telling me you're one of thosepeople.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
I mean, I got this amazing job at C6 Bank.
You know, it was so exciting.
You know, okay, I'm going to bein New York and I was laid off
after three months four monthsbecause of COVID.
I started work in January of2020.
So, very quickly, shortlythereafter, I was laid off and
(07:12):
you're out of college and you'reunemployed're unemployed and
also the world is ending,apparently, um, so that was a.
That was quite an experience, umand and you know, just
traveling around and and findingmyself and what I really needed
to do, I finally startedworking at at this uh company,
sivo, um, and part of that storythat I haven't really told
publicly is that they did notpay me for four or five months
(07:33):
on starting working there.
They said, hey, we're going topay you, but they were an early
stage startup themselves and youknow, you have to have some
empathy for early stage startups.
You have to have that kind ofdrive to just be like I'm just
going to make this work, nomatter what.
I started working at a bar inthe nights, you know, bartending
(07:54):
to kind of make ends meet,living in the van, working for
the startup that was not at thetime paying me, and just getting
the chance to meet the CEO andto talk to the people working
there and see the team that shehad built, which is a phenomenal
team.
And they did end up paying meafter four or five months, wow.
That's rough, though that'srough to hold on man, yeah, yeah
(08:18):
, I would say there's a lot offolks out there that want to
start companies and want to beentrepreneurial, and I think a
great way to do that is just towork at com, at early stage
companies.
But it is the wild west outthere a bit yeah, yeah,
absolutely.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
But.
But, like you said, that'swhere you're going to learn the
wild west.
Because you're going to gothrough those things, you might
as well go through them withsomebody else's dime and
somebody else's heartbreak,quite frankly, and learn all the
hard lessons you can whereveryou can.
Does that make sense?
Speaker 3 (08:48):
That makes complete sense.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
Yeah, it sounds like exactly what you were doing.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
When I was going to start Pickaxe, I had a very
close friend from college whoactually he was working at
Google and we agreed that wewere going to quit our jobs and
and and work on pickaxe.
Um, and I quit and he did notquit.
(09:14):
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Oh man.
There's your bud.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
This was in uh.
This was in uh in uh in 2022and uh, and there was a period
of time when I when I really wascompletely alone, you know,
trying to figure out what to do,so so that was probably one of
the hardest times is when youare kind of you expect to have a
partner and uh, and you know,you're just like and you know
(09:42):
you're not making any money atthat point right, you're losing
money.
Um, I'll never forget gettingthe first customer for Pickaxe.
It's this guy in Alaska.
I mean, just you put this thingout there on Reddit and you see
who will bite.
And that was just the mostamazing feeling I think I've
ever had.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Yeah, yeah, like wait a minute.
I believe in this idea.
But son of a gun, somebody elsedoes too.
Huh.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
Oh my God, that's incredible and that was I didn't
feel alone from that dayforward, because, you know,
without a co-founder at thattime I did feel alone, but that
first customer really, reallyhelped.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
So before that, you said youfelt all alone.
And there's a lot of mylisteners out there that,
whether they're an entrepreneurand doing those efforts or
whatever it is, they feel allalone.
If you would, let's help themout.
You know what was that feelinglike for you, and let's get,
let's dig into it.
(10:46):
You know we don't mind emotionhere, that's okay and it's a
safe place to talk.
And then what kept you going,man?
Speaker 3 (10:56):
Well, I think that being alone and trying to found
a company is pretty much it'sthe hardest thing I can think of
trying to do, you know, becausestarting a company is already a
really difficult thing to do.
I know because starting acompany is already a really
difficult thing to do.
I mean, you're out there, it'syou against the world, and so
you know, it was just a horriblefeeling, I mean.
(11:20):
But I think you, you reallyonly learn about yourself from
putting yourself through those,those, those times.
I mean you, you go from a pointof getting up in the morning
and being like I don't know,today it's going to be me,
tomorrow it's me, yeah, the nextday it's myself, and I yeah,
(11:44):
yeah, yeah, I understandcompletely.
So, so there's.
There's not going to be anybodythat's going to say, hey,
you're slacking off.
There's not going to be anybodythat's going to say, hey,
you're slacking off.
There's not going to be anybodythat's going to say, you know,
hey, you should look at it thisother way.
You have to get in touch withyourself.
You have to think.
I need to feel comfortable withwhat I can accomplish today to
(12:08):
understand other people'sperspectives without them having
to breathe down my neck becausenobody's going to tell me that
I'm making a bad decision untilit's too late.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Yeah, yeah, and then the customer tells you, or the
ex-customer does Exactly so,finding people to support me.
Speaker 3 (12:26):
And there's a story during that time I met this guy
online who had started abusiness, a really great guy
named Eliam Medina.
He started a company calledWilling that he sold and now
he's out there teaching kidsabout entrepreneurship, actually
in Miami.
But at the time I met him and Ididn't even have a car.
(12:49):
I had a two TCC really oldbeat-up motorcycle and I was
living in Tampa and I drove thatmotorcycle across the state to
Miami just to meet him and totalk to him and just to get
advice from him because he hadhad success.
And so I would say, if you arealone and you're starting a
business, just go the extra mileto get connected with people
(13:13):
who can advise you and inspireyou and go and physically talk
to them and have dinner withthem, because they'll like that.
Especially if you ride in on abeat-up motorcycle that's
breaking down halfway across thestate, they'll be like this kid
is going places.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
Right on.
Yeah, absolutely.
And it is amazing how peoplewant to help you.
You know, all too often wethink, yeah, nobody's going to
help me out, nobody's going togive me advice.
Yeah, no, there's a lot ofpeople out there who like to.
I mean, everybody likes to havetheir opinion listened to.
So what you're saying is reachout to them.
Huh.
Speaker 3 (13:48):
Of course, yeah.
I mean, I think people don'toften think about how they feel
when they get asked for help,because if you get asked for
help, if I get asked for help,I'm like, yeah, I want to help,
I want to be a person that helps, I want to be out there.
I see myself in other peopleand we kind of forget that when
we're asking for help, there arepeople.
Even if they're famous anddoing quite well, they're going
(14:10):
to have the same reaction.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Yeah, okay.
So now things are movingforward.
You've gotten through a lot.
What's driving you to push thisfurther?
I know you're unemployable and,by the way, for somebody who's
not an entrepreneur, that's oneof the phrases we use.
I am unemployable myselfpersonally.
We just can't be employed, wecan't do the job thing.
(14:33):
It's not who we are.
So, first of all, what do youthink are some of the traits of
the unemployable from thatstandpoint, and how do you
continue to have the motivationto move forward with everything
you're doing?
Speaker 3 (14:48):
It's a good question.
You know the traits theunemployable um, I think when I
was working at um.
Just, you know you.
You notice you're unemployable.
You look at all the jobs thatyou work at and you want to go
above and beyond your.
Your pushing to do things thatare beyond even what's expected
of you, but always a little bitdifferent from what you know.
(15:11):
Whoever's supervising youexactly wants you to do right
and if you're finding thatthat's happening repeatedly.
Um, and you will have your ownideas.
Okay, hey, it would be best,better, if we did something like
this, or you know.
Then I think you know you haveto go out and test those ideas
for yourself and and the marketwill decide whether or not
they're good or bad.
(15:31):
You know so.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
So there is there's that risk.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
You know, and you know the trajectory of Pickaxe
has been one of, I mean, thewhole first year.
We were just exploring, wedidn't know, we, we did every
single thing you can think of.
We worked with um, we workedwith, uh, non-profit
organizations conducting largesurveys.
(15:56):
We worked with some hollywoodorganizations doing writing and
helping uh with them, uh, in inthose circles which I can't even
fully talk about, all thedetails of that.
But we explored all thesedifferent opportunities and you
know, I think the thing it'sthat that same story of that
(16:17):
first customer in Alaska, youknow, we just saw the core
business of Pickaxe slowlygrowing in the background while
we were kind of blinded bysearching for these larger
enterprise opportunities.
We thought nobody's going tocare about a business that
serves these kind of likesolopreneur, coach, consultant
folks.
We talked to investors andthey're like I don't understand
(16:39):
those people.
Right, who are those people?
I, you know, like what are theyactually doing?
You know, so, you know, we, we,we, for the first year we were
really looking, we were like wegot to find different customers,
you know, and still, you know,people signed up, people told us
how much they love the product.
We fell in love with with these, these folks, and we fell in
(17:01):
love with helping them.
And and and 2024 was just astory of of of really figuring
out the product and getting itreally fit, and since the summer
, we've had some basicallyexponential growth.
I would say Things are reallytaking off.
We are seeing just greatmetrics.
We have more than 1,200 payingcustomers now.
(17:23):
More than a million people usethe product every month as end
users, thousands of monthlyactive builders building things,
testing things out, and we wantto be that playground where
people can come in for free youdon't have to pay to try out the
product and just see what itfeels like to have a business
powered by AI.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Well, and just a few months ago I couldn't spell AI.
Just a few months ago Icouldn't spell AI and I knew at
that point that either I learnAI or I retire.
You know, that's just the wayit is and I'm sorry for
everybody listening on.
I don't mean to hurt anybody'sfeelings, but that is the way it
(18:03):
is.
Ai is like it or not, love itor not, it's going to take over
everything.
Okay, it is the future.
And what I actually got togetherwith somebody who I
wholeheartedly endorse now shesat with me for one hour
exploded my brain.
There's actually still brainmatter on my ceiling here.
It's really embarrassing andwhat I realized, what it could
(18:26):
do.
I've fully immersed myself forI mean last months, just sitting
here.
I've got several screens infront of me and I'm just
learning, training, training,training, learning, training,
training, getting frustrated,frustrated, frustrated.
You know what I mean by thatand training, training and now
working with it, from what I'munderstanding at a cognitive
level, more than 99% of thepopulation.
(18:50):
But we have to keep thingssimple, and that too, again, is
where your product comes in, andI think it was Einstein that
said genius is making thecomplex simple, something to
that effect a little misquote,but general idea, and I know
that's what your product does.
Let's talk, let's switch forjust a couple of minutes.
We've got left here becausethere are I mean AI as of this
(19:10):
recording.
This is May of 2025, it's thisrecording and people are just
starting to understand or beaware that AI may be the future
and are pretty scared of it andthings like that.
Give me your take on the futureof AI.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
You know, if you're out there and you're worried,
you haven't talked to ChatGPTyet.
You know you're kind of worriedabout this.
It's really nothing so scary,you know.
You just have to think about itlike if you had a free high
school or even maybe a freshman,sophomore and college assistant
that was just always hangingaround in your computer.
(19:50):
Be a freshman, sophomore andcollege assistant that was just
always hanging around in yourcomputer and they're going to do
freshman or sophomore incollege work for you.
You can ask them questions.
They'll give an answer thatsomebody like that would give
and they'll give awell-constructed answer.
But you know, it's like, why nottalk to that free assistant
just because it's?
You know it's not a person,it's in the computer.
It's really.
(20:11):
It's not scary, it's not.
I mean, people are worried thatit's going to take their jobs,
but it's like, it's almost funny.
It's like the high schoolersand the freshmen and sophomores
in college, those people areeventually going to take the
jobs that are right, like theywill eventually be doctors and
lawyers, but but you know thatdoesn't mean we should be afraid
(20:34):
of them, that that just meanswe should.
We should figure out how to workwith them and and grow with
them, and, and, and.
If, if I had an army of peoplelike that, I would be all
powerful, you know, I would beable to do so much more.
So you know, for anybody that'sout there, you know what do we
think the future of AI lookslike?
It just looks like getting moreacquainted with this technology
(20:59):
and using these things for moreand more applications.
I mean with Pickaxe.
Every single day, I am stunnedby the things that people figure
out how to do that I didn'teven know was possible for them
to do.
And the core kernel of what wecare about and we love so much
at Pickaxe is, if you're talkingto Chachapiti, well, that's
(21:21):
some billionaires that aremaking that bot and that's great
.
But we want to create asituation where a bunch of
hopefully future millionaires,but just everyday people for the
most part, can, can themselvesbe in that position of where the
open AI people are.
Now, you know, craft somethingthat feels useful to you and put
(21:43):
it out there in the world.
You know, see what theresponses are and and get a
sense for that, brand it andreally make it part of your
business Even make money from itdirectly through Pickaxe.
And so we think that the futureof AI is based in people doing
their jobs, and increasingly,their job is to learn how to
manage an AI that did what theirjob was before, and that is a
(22:06):
great thing.
I mean, that's basically whathiring and growing a company is
it's bringing on people to helpyou do the job that you were
doing alone before, and now youcan do that without having to
pay whatever people are askingfor for salaries today.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
Yeah, yeah, well, and it's so much.
I mean I don't, I don't Googleanything anymore.
I don't.
You know, I don't do a searchengine for anything.
I go to my AI and I ask it thequestion and it uses its web
tool and it gives me much betteranswers than any web search by
myself could ever do, and that'sjust one thing.
(22:43):
So now, when I have a questionabout absolutely anything, I go
to AI.
Now, oftentimes it is wrong, asNathaniel and I can attest to
Absolutely yeah, but a lot oftimes it's really really right.
And now I've developed it towhere it's actually now, way
more than just a high school ora college level.
(23:04):
It's at an extremely high level, strategic level, helping me
develop stuff that I can't evenimagine, and it's developing it
for me in my voice.
So, yeah, it's crazy.
So I think, yeah, I agree, it'sgoing to be again, it's going
to be everywhere, it's going tobe doing everything and you're
helping bring it to the masses,which is very cool.
(23:25):
Now again, this being theComeback Chronicle podcast,
let's end with some advice thatyou'd give to some people who
are going through the challenges, the setbacks, the
disappointments, the failures,the self-doubts, the fears, the
excuse, everything else.
What advice would you give tothose people, nathaniel?
Speaker 3 (23:46):
thing, at least from my perspective, is to understand
what you actually want to getout of your life, and your
career in particular.
You will be constantly facedwith decisions that test that at
its core, and there'll bepeople who offer you a lot of
money.
There'll be people who offer youother things.
(24:07):
And if you are aware of whatyou really want which is
something that it's reallydifficult to get to I mean, it
takes a lot of time to figurethat out but if you can say to
yourself every day this is whatI want, and I know that for sure
those decisions will becomemuch easier.
And you know, I wish that I hadfigured it out earlier.
(24:29):
And I just think you know,meditating on that and making
that decision in your own mindand in your heart is the most
helpful thing you can do.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
I love it.
I love it.
So, everybody listening.
Your job now is to figure outwhat that is for you.
What is that?
What do you want to do?
What do you want to be on yourdeathbed?
What do you want to look backat and be proud of?
What do you want people to besaying about you after that?
And then get out there and failand fail and fail and live in
(24:59):
your van if you have to Screwsome things up, but do something
and then you can have your ownComeback Chronicle.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
So that's it for today's episode of the Comeback
Chronicles.
Head on over to Apple Podcastsor wherever you listen, and
subscribe to the show.
If you're ready to get overyour fears, self-doubts and past
failures and break through yourcomfort zone to reach the
pinnacle of success in everyarea of your life, head over to
terrielfawesomecom to pick upyour free gifts and so much more
(25:34):
.
We'll see you next week on theComeback Chronicles podcast.
If you've been stuck in fear, self-doubt, your past
failures and you're ready tobreak through your comfort zones
to finally reach the pinnacleof success in every area of your
life, then this podcast is foryou.
Here's your host, Terry LFossum.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hey everybody, Terry L Fossum here once again and
welcome back to the ComebackChronicles podcast.
We have a very special podcasttoday, and what makes this so
special is I didn't even knowwho this guy was about, I don't
know, 20 minutes ago and I goton a Zoom with him talking about
a service that he providespeople.
You're going to want to hearabout that, and I became so
impressed, not just with theservice, but with this guy's
(00:51):
story, his comeback story.
I'm like we need to dropeverything.
We need to put you on tape, weneed to get your story out there
to the world.
So this is really going to be ablast.
It's very off the cuff.
Nothing is prepared.
We're going to get on and havefun and just talk like two
people.
So let me tell you who this guyis.
Okay, Nathaniel, I'm going tomispronounce it.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Sorry, Mohald Pronounce it for me Mohald, yeah
, mohald, mohald.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Mohald.
There we go, and I'm justleaving that on.
We're rolling tape, it's allright, man.
So right now it's 2025.
Just six years ago, in 2019,this guy was a data scientist
intern just an intern and thenin 2019, he became a data
scientist for Vodaai.
In 2020, a data scientist forC6 Bank In September 2020, the
(01:45):
lead data scientist for Civo,and then he went to be an
associate at ARK InvestmentManagement in 2021.
And now he is the founder andCEO for a service called Pickaxe
, and I'm going to let himexplain what Pickaxe is first,
and then we're going to go backinto his amazing background, his
(02:06):
Comeback Chronicle background.
Welcome to the show, nathaniel.
So glad you decided to jump onand join me here, man, thank you
so much for having me.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
It's so great to get the chance to talk a little bit
about myself and talk aboutPickaxe.
You know, pickaxe is a servicefor the millions of americans
who make money by selling accessto their knowledge, whether
they're consultants, coaches,they're creating courses.
You know, it really is thebroad field, and there are
millions of americans that workfor themselves selling access to
(02:37):
their specialties that theyhave owned over years and years
of work.
And all we're doing withpickaxe is is saying, hey, if
you you see that ChatGPT, youknow, is a valuable resource for
your customers that also givesgood advice.
Don't have your customerschoose between that or hiring
you and working with you.
You should be able to have allthe firepower of that AI within
(03:00):
your own business, and that'sall we do at Pickaxe is we help
folks to build those toolswithin their own business.
And that's all we do at Pickaxeis we help folks to build those
tools within their own funnelsand within their own businesses
so that they can have theirexpertise combined with the
amazing power of AI in a brandedenvironment where they can
monetize and control access toit.
And we're just so excited tohelp anybody in that space, you
(03:22):
know, build tools to help theirbusinesses.
Well, that's how we got to knoweach other, because I'm as
space.
You know, build tools to helptheir businesses.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Well, that's how we got to know each other, because
I'm as probably the listenersknow I'm building out a huge
TEDx training platform.
Now, I'm not associated withTEDx, but this is called the
viral stage and because it is aviral stage, it's the world's
largest stage and I'm helpingpeople get on that stage and
blow the doors off of it.
It's the world's largest stageand I'm helping people get on
(03:47):
that stage and blow the doorsoff of it.
But here was my problem.
I'm building these amazing AIsI mean better than literally
anything else in existence butright now not everybody is on
chat GPT, so there's thisroadblock there and we don't
like roadblocks.
So that's where his service wasrecommended to me and I looked
into it.
I had some questions about itand right away, nathaniel's like
(04:10):
let's talk, and got on thisthing.
I'm like, okay, yep, so withinGod willing, the next couple,
three weeks, I'm going to betransferring all of this stuff
over to this service.
So you're going to see hisservice on my service, which is
cool.
Okay, you've got an incrediblebackground.
I mean six years.
But and now, of course, hereyou are, a young CEO building a
(04:34):
company and building it veryquickly.
It's very exciting and I thinkit's going to build more quickly
, but that's not always the wayit was.
You told me something that blewmy mind.
What was that, nathaniel?
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Well, when I was in college and graduating college,
I lived in a van for actually alittle over two years and you
know, it was just.
It was something that it seemedlike I needed to do in order to
save the money that I wanted tostart a business.
I knew when I went into schoolI wanted to be a physicist, but
(05:09):
I quickly got rid of that notionand I said I want to be an
entrepreneur.
This is the only thing that'sexciting to me.
But I knew it wasn't going tobe super easy and while my kind
of the other folks, kind of myfriends in college, went and
worked for Google, I moved intothe van.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Wow, wow.
So they're getting paid a lotof money to work at Google short
term, but you had this longterm vision.
That was a whole differentballgame.
Tell me more about that.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Well, you know, I think To say I had a long term
vision is maybe giving me alittle bit too much credit.
I think I just was unemployablewith my proclivity to just want
to do things my own way.
I tried to start a bunch ofdifferent companies.
I tried to start a company thatwould put these boxes in your
(05:59):
house that would mine Bitcoinwith solar power.
A company that would put theseboxes in your house that would
mine Bitcoin with solar power.
I tried to start a company thatwould help you give micro
donations to local politicalcandidates.
I was just super excited aboutthe idea of exploring starting
things.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
And let me jump in right there, because this is so
critical and we talked aboutthis real quick and we were just
chatting back and forth.
One of the things I teach theroad to success is paved with
failure.
It's failure, man.
If you're failing, it's not bad.
It's a very good thing, becauseevery single person who
succeeded at anything ofsignificance at all has failed
(06:38):
and failed, and failed, andfailed.
You're telling me you're one ofthose people, and you're
telling me you're one of thosepeople.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
I mean, I got this amazing job at C6 Bank.
You know, it was so exciting.
You know, okay, I'm going to bein New York and I was laid off
after three months four monthsbecause of COVID.
I started work in January of2020.
So, very quickly, shortlythereafter, I was laid off and
(07:12):
you're out of college and you'reunemployed're unemployed and
also the world is ending,apparently, um, so that was a.
That was quite an experience, umand and you know, just
traveling around and and findingmyself and what I really needed
to do, I finally startedworking at at this uh company,
sivo, um, and part of that storythat I haven't really told
publicly is that they did notpay me for four or five months
(07:33):
on starting working there.
They said, hey, we're going topay you, but they were an early
stage startup themselves and youknow, you have to have some
empathy for early stage startups.
You have to have that kind ofdrive to just be like I'm just
going to make this work, nomatter what.
I started working at a bar inthe nights, you know, bartending
(07:54):
to kind of make ends meet,living in the van, working for
the startup that was not at thetime paying me, and just getting
the chance to meet the CEO andto talk to the people working
there and see the team that shehad built, which is a phenomenal
team.
And they did end up paying meafter four or five months, wow.
That's rough, though that'srough to hold on man, yeah, yeah
(08:18):
, I would say there's a lot offolks out there that want to
start companies and want to beentrepreneurial, and I think a
great way to do that is just towork at com, at early stage
companies.
But it is the wild west outthere a bit yeah, yeah,
absolutely.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
But.
But, like you said, that'swhere you're going to learn the
wild west.
Because you're going to gothrough those things, you might
as well go through them withsomebody else's dime and
somebody else's heartbreak,quite frankly, and learn all the
hard lessons you can whereveryou can.
Does that make sense?
Speaker 3 (08:48):
That makes complete sense.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
Yeah, it sounds like exactly what you were doing.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
When I was going to start Pickaxe, I had a very
close friend from college whoactually he was working at
Google and we agreed that wewere going to quit our jobs and
and and work on pickaxe.
Um, and I quit and he did notquit.
(09:14):
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Oh man.
There's your bud.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
This was in uh.
This was in uh in uh in 2022and uh, and there was a period
of time when I when I really wascompletely alone, you know,
trying to figure out what to do,so so that was probably one of
the hardest times is when youare kind of you expect to have a
partner and uh, and you know,you're just like and you know
(09:42):
you're not making any money atthat point right, you're losing
money.
Um, I'll never forget gettingthe first customer for Pickaxe.
It's this guy in Alaska.
I mean, just you put this thingout there on Reddit and you see
who will bite.
And that was just the mostamazing feeling I think I've
ever had.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Yeah, yeah, like wait a minute.
I believe in this idea.
But son of a gun, somebody elsedoes too.
Huh.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
Oh my God, that's incredible and that was I didn't
feel alone from that dayforward, because, you know,
without a co-founder at thattime I did feel alone, but that
first customer really, reallyhelped.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
So before that, you said youfelt all alone.
And there's a lot of mylisteners out there that,
whether they're an entrepreneurand doing those efforts or
whatever it is, they feel allalone.
If you would, let's help themout.
You know what was that feelinglike for you, and let's get,
let's dig into it.
(10:46):
You know we don't mind emotionhere, that's okay and it's a
safe place to talk.
And then what kept you going,man?
Speaker 3 (10:56):
Well, I think that being alone and trying to found
a company is pretty much it'sthe hardest thing I can think of
trying to do, you know, becausestarting a company is already a
really difficult thing to do.
I know because starting acompany is already a really
difficult thing to do.
I mean, you're out there, it'syou against the world, and so
you know, it was just a horriblefeeling, I mean.
(11:20):
But I think you, you reallyonly learn about yourself from
putting yourself through those,those, those times.
I mean you, you go from a pointof getting up in the morning
and being like I don't know,today it's going to be me,
tomorrow it's me, yeah, the nextday it's myself, and I yeah,
(11:44):
yeah, yeah, I understandcompletely.
So, so there's.
There's not going to be anybodythat's going to say, hey,
you're slacking off.
There's not going to be anybodythat's going to say, hey,
you're slacking off.
There's not going to be anybodythat's going to say, you know,
hey, you should look at it thisother way.
You have to get in touch withyourself.
You have to think.
I need to feel comfortable withwhat I can accomplish today to
(12:08):
understand other people'sperspectives without them having
to breathe down my neck becausenobody's going to tell me that
I'm making a bad decision untilit's too late.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Yeah, yeah, and then the customer tells you, or the
ex-customer does Exactly so,finding people to support me.
Speaker 3 (12:26):
And there's a story during that time I met this guy
online who had started abusiness, a really great guy
named Eliam Medina.
He started a company calledWilling that he sold and now
he's out there teaching kidsabout entrepreneurship, actually
in Miami.
But at the time I met him and Ididn't even have a car.
(12:49):
I had a two TCC really oldbeat-up motorcycle and I was
living in Tampa and I drove thatmotorcycle across the state to
Miami just to meet him and totalk to him and just to get
advice from him because he hadhad success.
And so I would say, if you arealone and you're starting a
business, just go the extra mileto get connected with people
(13:13):
who can advise you and inspireyou and go and physically talk
to them and have dinner withthem, because they'll like that.
Especially if you ride in on abeat-up motorcycle that's
breaking down halfway across thestate, they'll be like this kid
is going places.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
Right on.
Yeah, absolutely.
And it is amazing how peoplewant to help you.
You know, all too often wethink, yeah, nobody's going to
help me out, nobody's going togive me advice.
Yeah, no, there's a lot ofpeople out there who like to.
I mean, everybody likes to havetheir opinion listened to.
So what you're saying is reachout to them.
Huh.
Speaker 3 (13:48):
Of course, yeah.
I mean, I think people don'toften think about how they feel
when they get asked for help,because if you get asked for
help, if I get asked for help,I'm like, yeah, I want to help,
I want to be a person that helps, I want to be out there.
I see myself in other peopleand we kind of forget that when
we're asking for help, there arepeople.
Even if they're famous anddoing quite well, they're going
(14:10):
to have the same reaction.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Yeah, okay.
So now things are movingforward.
You've gotten through a lot.
What's driving you to push thisfurther?
I know you're unemployable and,by the way, for somebody who's
not an entrepreneur, that's oneof the phrases we use.
I am unemployable myselfpersonally.
We just can't be employed, wecan't do the job thing.
(14:33):
It's not who we are.
So, first of all, what do youthink are some of the traits of
the unemployable from thatstandpoint, and how do you
continue to have the motivationto move forward with everything
you're doing?
Speaker 3 (14:48):
It's a good question.
You know the traits theunemployable um, I think when I
was working at um.
Just, you know you.
You notice you're unemployable.
You look at all the jobs thatyou work at and you want to go
above and beyond your.
Your pushing to do things thatare beyond even what's expected
of you, but always a little bitdifferent from what you know.
(15:11):
Whoever's supervising youexactly wants you to do right
and if you're finding thatthat's happening repeatedly.
Um, and you will have your ownideas.
Okay, hey, it would be best,better, if we did something like
this, or you know.
Then I think you know you haveto go out and test those ideas
for yourself and and the marketwill decide whether or not
they're good or bad.
(15:31):
You know so.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
So there is there's that risk.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
You know, and you know the trajectory of Pickaxe
has been one of, I mean, thewhole first year.
We were just exploring, wedidn't know, we, we did every
single thing you can think of.
We worked with um, we workedwith, uh, non-profit
organizations conducting largesurveys.
(15:56):
We worked with some hollywoodorganizations doing writing and
helping uh with them, uh, in inthose circles which I can't even
fully talk about, all thedetails of that.
But we explored all thesedifferent opportunities and you
know, I think the thing it'sthat that same story of that
(16:17):
first customer in Alaska, youknow, we just saw the core
business of Pickaxe slowlygrowing in the background while
we were kind of blinded bysearching for these larger
enterprise opportunities.
We thought nobody's going tocare about a business that
serves these kind of likesolopreneur, coach, consultant
folks.
We talked to investors andthey're like I don't understand
(16:39):
those people.
Right, who are those people?
I, you know, like what are theyactually doing?
You know, so, you know, we, we,we, for the first year we were
really looking, we were like wegot to find different customers,
you know, and still, you know,people signed up, people told us
how much they love the product.
We fell in love with with these, these folks, and we fell in
(17:01):
love with helping them.
And and and 2024 was just astory of of of really figuring
out the product and getting itreally fit, and since the summer
, we've had some basicallyexponential growth.
I would say Things are reallytaking off.
We are seeing just greatmetrics.
We have more than 1,200 payingcustomers now.
(17:23):
More than a million people usethe product every month as end
users, thousands of monthlyactive builders building things,
testing things out, and we wantto be that playground where
people can come in for free youdon't have to pay to try out the
product and just see what itfeels like to have a business
powered by AI.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Well, and just a few months ago I couldn't spell AI.
Just a few months ago Icouldn't spell AI and I knew at
that point that either I learnAI or I retire.
You know, that's just the wayit is and I'm sorry for
everybody listening on.
I don't mean to hurt anybody'sfeelings, but that is the way it
(18:03):
is.
Ai is like it or not, love itor not, it's going to take over
everything.
Okay, it is the future.
And what I actually got togetherwith somebody who I
wholeheartedly endorse now shesat with me for one hour
exploded my brain.
There's actually still brainmatter on my ceiling here.
It's really embarrassing andwhat I realized, what it could
(18:26):
do.
I've fully immersed myself forI mean last months, just sitting
here.
I've got several screens infront of me and I'm just
learning, training, training,training, learning, training,
training, getting frustrated,frustrated, frustrated.
You know what I mean by thatand training, training and now
working with it, from what I'munderstanding at a cognitive
level, more than 99% of thepopulation.
(18:50):
But we have to keep thingssimple, and that too, again, is
where your product comes in, andI think it was Einstein that
said genius is making thecomplex simple, something to
that effect a little misquote,but general idea, and I know
that's what your product does.
Let's talk, let's switch forjust a couple of minutes.
We've got left here becausethere are I mean AI as of this
(19:10):
recording.
This is May of 2025, it's thisrecording and people are just
starting to understand or beaware that AI may be the future
and are pretty scared of it andthings like that.
Give me your take on the futureof AI.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
You know, if you're out there and you're worried,
you haven't talked to ChatGPTyet.
You know you're kind of worriedabout this.
It's really nothing so scary,you know.
You just have to think about itlike if you had a free high
school or even maybe a freshman,sophomore and college assistant
that was just always hangingaround in your computer.
(19:50):
Be a freshman, sophomore andcollege assistant that was just
always hanging around in yourcomputer and they're going to do
freshman or sophomore incollege work for you.
You can ask them questions.
They'll give an answer thatsomebody like that would give
and they'll give awell-constructed answer.
But you know, it's like, why nottalk to that free assistant
just because it's?
You know it's not a person,it's in the computer.
It's really.
(20:11):
It's not scary, it's not.
I mean, people are worried thatit's going to take their jobs,
but it's like, it's almost funny.
It's like the high schoolersand the freshmen and sophomores
in college, those people areeventually going to take the
jobs that are right, like theywill eventually be doctors and
lawyers, but but you know thatdoesn't mean we should be afraid
(20:34):
of them, that that just meanswe should.
We should figure out how to workwith them and and grow with
them, and, and, and.
If, if I had an army of peoplelike that, I would be all
powerful, you know, I would beable to do so much more.
So you know, for anybody that'sout there, you know what do we
think the future of AI lookslike?
It just looks like getting moreacquainted with this technology
(20:59):
and using these things for moreand more applications.
I mean with Pickaxe.
Every single day, I am stunnedby the things that people figure
out how to do that I didn'teven know was possible for them
to do.
And the core kernel of what wecare about and we love so much
at Pickaxe is, if you're talkingto Chachapiti, well, that's
(21:21):
some billionaires that aremaking that bot and that's great
.
But we want to create asituation where a bunch of
hopefully future millionaires,but just everyday people for the
most part, can, can themselvesbe in that position of where the
open AI people are.
Now, you know, craft somethingthat feels useful to you and put
(21:43):
it out there in the world.
You know, see what theresponses are and and get a
sense for that, brand it andreally make it part of your
business Even make money from itdirectly through Pickaxe.
And so we think that the futureof AI is based in people doing
their jobs, and increasingly,their job is to learn how to
manage an AI that did what theirjob was before, and that is a
(22:06):
great thing.
I mean, that's basically whathiring and growing a company is
it's bringing on people to helpyou do the job that you were
doing alone before, and now youcan do that without having to
pay whatever people are askingfor for salaries today.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
Yeah, yeah, well, and it's so much.
I mean I don't, I don't Googleanything anymore.
I don't.
You know, I don't do a searchengine for anything.
I go to my AI and I ask it thequestion and it uses its web
tool and it gives me much betteranswers than any web search by
myself could ever do, and that'sjust one thing.
(22:43):
So now, when I have a questionabout absolutely anything, I go
to AI.
Now, oftentimes it is wrong, asNathaniel and I can attest to
Absolutely yeah, but a lot oftimes it's really really right.
And now I've developed it towhere it's actually now, way
more than just a high school ora college level.
(23:04):
It's at an extremely high level, strategic level, helping me
develop stuff that I can't evenimagine, and it's developing it
for me in my voice.
So, yeah, it's crazy.
So I think, yeah, I agree, it'sgoing to be again, it's going
to be everywhere, it's going tobe doing everything and you're
helping bring it to the masses,which is very cool.
(23:25):
Now again, this being theComeback Chronicle podcast,
let's end with some advice thatyou'd give to some people who
are going through the challenges, the setbacks, the
disappointments, the failures,the self-doubts, the fears, the
excuse, everything else.
What advice would you give tothose people, nathaniel?
Speaker 3 (23:46):
thing, at least from my perspective, is to understand
what you actually want to getout of your life, and your
career in particular.
You will be constantly facedwith decisions that test that at
its core, and there'll bepeople who offer you a lot of
money.
There'll be people who offer youother things.
(24:07):
And if you are aware of whatyou really want which is
something that it's reallydifficult to get to I mean, it
takes a lot of time to figurethat out but if you can say to
yourself every day this is whatI want, and I know that for sure
those decisions will becomemuch easier.
And you know, I wish that I hadfigured it out earlier.
(24:29):
And I just think you know,meditating on that and making
that decision in your own mindand in your heart is the most
helpful thing you can do.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
I love it.
I love it.
So, everybody listening.
Your job now is to figure outwhat that is for you.
What is that?
What do you want to do?
What do you want to be on yourdeathbed?
What do you want to look backat and be proud of?
What do you want people to besaying about you after that?
And then get out there and failand fail and fail and live in
(24:59):
your van if you have to Screwsome things up, but do something
and then you can have your ownComeback Chronicle.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
So that's it for today's episode of the Comeback
Chronicles.
Head on over to Apple Podcastsor wherever you listen, and
subscribe to the show.
If you're ready to get overyour fears, self-doubts and past
failures and break through yourcomfort zone to reach the
pinnacle of success in everyarea of your life, head over to
terrielfawesomecom to pick upyour free gifts and so much more
(25:34):
.
We'll see you next week on theComeback Chronicles podcast.
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