July 14, 2025 • 42 mins
The team explores the challenge of writing personal bios, unpacking why this seemingly simple task often becomes complicated by overthinking, imposter syndrome, and concerns about authenticity.
• Writing a bio forces uncomfortable questions like "Who am I?" and "Am I writing for myself or others?"
• Most people struggle to translate their essence into words that feel authentic yet professional
• Imposter syndrome makes it difficult to claim achievements that reflect our true capabilities
• Modern recruiting systems force people to "game" their bios rather than being authentic
• The most powerful bios focus on who you are rather than simply what you've done
• Approaching your bio as art—an authentic expression of self—changes the entire process
• You are enough, and what you write is enough for now—bio-writing is an evolving process
• Authenticity resonates more deeply than perfectly crafted marketing language
Remember, you are the art and whatever you paint onto that canvas is beautiful. Just be true to yourself.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Sometimes I wish we could go back to a time when
things weren't so complicated.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Welcome to the Complexity of Toilet Paper, the
podcast that dives into theeveryday moments where we
overthink, hesitate or just getstuck.
I'm overthinking, I'm over, I'moverthinking.
Let's hear it for the toiletpaper Through honest
conversations, unexpectedinsights and a whole lot of
(00:28):
humor.
Your hosts, phyllis Martin,mark Pollack and Al Emmerich,
are here to help you roll withit and make your life a little
less complicated.
One conversation at a time,that's right, dude.
The beauty of this is itssimplicity.
Speaking of which, it's time toenter the stall.
Put the lid down or not,depending get comfortable and
(00:52):
roll with it.
Oh worry not, dear friend, it'sreally quite simple.
Welcome to the stall.
How about that?
Wouldn't that be cool if, whenyou stepped into the stall,
(01:14):
there was like imagine if publicrestrooms.
You walked into the stall,there was like welcome Mark
Pollack to the stall.
I would love walk-on music.
How great.
Welcome Mark Pollack to theStar.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
I would love walk-on music.
How great would that be.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Holy shit, what an idea.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Phyllis, Martin Phyllis welcome to the Star
Dun-dun-dun-dun.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
And it was different for whatever you had to do.
Yeah, you know, like there'd beone for the urinals 50% of our
listeners just dropped off going.
I know, they're like what isgoing on?
You guys must have recordedthis on a Friday.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
At 4.
18.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
With friends coming over and cocktails flowing.
Oh, hi Mark, hi Phil, yeah,hello Al.
No-transcript.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
You know, I had a big aha this week.
I don't know what has caused it, but let's just go with it.
Cool, it's really.
I think it's going to soundpathetic and sad.
I think it's really the firsttime.
Mark, stop laughing at me, it'stoo early.
Um, I feel like it's about tobe the episode of eeyore.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Well, it was sad and we had a terrible time.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Leave her alone, mark , actually.
No, don't leave her alonebecause I have to say total
train wreck here.
But one of the things that Icould have never seen coming is
the utter joy of hearing PhyllisMartin's laugh.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Well, let her tell her story.
We're going to get it out now.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Okay, stop, mark, she's going to hemorrhage from
her belly button.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
I'll just leave it at this.
I've had a great week and it'sprobably the first week in my
entire professional career.
Go'll just leave it at this.
I've had a great week and it'sprobably the first week in my
entire professional career.
Go ahead, insert, eeyore, thatyou know there've been some
challenges to the week and I'vejust taken the approach that,
okay, we're going to havechallenges this week and it's
(03:41):
nothing, it's just life, it'sjust work, it's just
relationships, it's just people.
There's no judgment, there's noworry, there's no angst,
there's no overthinking.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
So what I'm hearing you say is you flushed the
complexity this week.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Dun-dun.
I feel like balloons should gooff and things should be coming
out of the sky.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Good for you, good for you, good for you.
Mark, anything on your ropebefore we dive into this talk.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
I'll tell you I do, but I'm excited about today's
topic so I will save my aha forthe next one.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
And.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
I'm probably going to write about it and share it
with our listeners on theFacebook page.
So more to come there.
But yeah, I had some reallyinteresting ahas.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
Well, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, you
know what that means.
It's time to step into thestall.
All right, no, walk up music,walk in music.
But it is us.
And just to give everybody somebackdrop, this is actually a
topic we pre-recorded one othertime, but we were in different
(04:53):
states of mind and all of usagreed.
We were like you know what,let's redo that one, let's start
from a fresh slate.
And so you could see from thetitle of the show, it's called
bio hazard.
But what happened is we wereall writing our bios for the
website and to get our launchready, and all three of us were
(05:15):
really struggling, and we werestruggling for different and
unique reasons, and that led usto say, hey, let's talk about it
.
But even since that time, we'vehad to rewrite some different
things, and so we thought thiswould be a great forum for us to
share our own journey with you.
Hopefully, you'll hear yourselfin this and you'll even comment
(05:38):
on our Facebook page andcontribute your journey.
But let's go behind the curtainand dive into the stall to go.
Why the hell is it so hard tocelebrate our own awesomeness
and to compile that in bio or aresume?
Um, and and so when we firstunpack this and now even I'd
(05:59):
love to start with with you,phyllis, like when you hear the
word I got gotta write my bio,or the the phrase um, besides
sticking your tongue out andgoing what it, what goes through
your mind, like what is what isin front of you, so you know, I
was going back through oldemails and I saw um, where I
sent my bio that I had finallywritten after months to mark,
(06:21):
and it was like something likemy bio ick Even then which I had
taken a lot of time.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
You know, it feels daunting.
And I think it feels dauntingparticularly when you're doing
it for a job search, perhaps, oreven for this, but mostly for a
job search, because I find mymind always goes to how do I
capture, how do I make thisgreat combination of
(06:51):
competencies, skill sets and thething that's the hardest to
capture, which is the essence ofPhyllis Martin, and I always
find myself trying to put it ina format or a form that I think
employers are going to beinterested in looking at and
hearing.
And it's just never been a greatexperience.
And I'm always reminded I'veshared this with you before how
(07:16):
I was in the final phase of ajob search one time and the
headhunter was like you're somuch better than your resume.
I was like you're so muchbetter than your resume and I
was like what?
Like, are you kidding?
Yes, of course I'm better thanmy resume.
Like the resume should be theteaser that whatever's on the
paper should have piqued yourinterest, but in no way is that
ever going to capture theessence of the human being or
(07:38):
the experience or thephilosophical approach of the
human being that you are sittingsitting across from, and so I
have like clearly I have someissues um with with now is now
the time we're going to do this?
no, that's a different show oh,it is a different show, darn it.
Um, but I'm getting, you know,I'm getting better at it, I
(08:01):
think, as I become more wholeand older, and also I am who I
am.
That's not going to change, andI have every bit of evidence to
say yeah, you should have aconversation with me, and then
we can both go from there,because that's a two way street.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
I'm going to go next, mark, because, no, you just
have these really cool thoughtsand ideas.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
And I think that.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
I mean, dude, we've had what?
How many ever shows we've had,you always drop it like you,
you're like it's like.
Whatever we say, it's like oh,that was cool.
And then here comes mark aroundthe corner mic drop anyway.
So I'm gonna let you do the micdrop, but, um, I I recently gave
a keynote uh, the National MSSociety in Northeast Florida,
(08:51):
and it was a great experience.
Thank you, heidi Katz, thankyou everybody.
Mark, you were there.
Awesome experience.
I'd given them my bio and I waslistening as they were reading
my bio and I was like God, did Ireally write that?
That's way too damn long.
Now, is it all true?
Yes, am I proud of it?
Yes, but literally all I couldthink of is who am I writing for
(09:18):
?
Am I writing for them or am Iwriting for me?
Right, and if I'm writing forme, to say, hey, gosh, I'm just
going to show up here I am.
Um, that's the mindset I think Iwould rather use when I'm
writing a bio, right, becausewhen you're writing for them,
(09:38):
you're trying to figure outwhat's going to make them relate
.
Make them relate, and it's socounterproductive in jobs and in
so many environments when wetry to project for them versus
us, and that was a big aha.
And so what I run into when I'mwriting a bio is two things.
(10:02):
Number one is how do I craftthis so it doesn't sound over
egotistical and yet I'm reallyfricking proud of the things
I've done.
I mean, I've done some coolstuff in my life and it's why
I'm standing on a stage or it'swhy I'm applying over here.
But the other part now isdifferent's like I'm gonna
(10:25):
reclaim my voice, tell my story,and, um, that's got to resonate
louder than anything else soI'm jumping in before mark drops
the mic because so muchpressure so much pressure, you
know well, you know what we'regonna do something if you don't
handle it well, if, if you don'tlive up to the deal.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
You know a part of that too is something you just
said, like you're proud of allthe stuff you've done, and that
is, and you should be.
You've done amazing, amazingthings, yeah, and but part of it
too is, again, we're humanbeings and so the bio.
I think part of the tensionwith me in the bio is, yeah,
(11:12):
I've done stuff, but that's not,that's like such a fraction of
what I want people to know aboutme, and I feel like, culturally
, we've been trained to list allthe stuff the awards, the, the
engagements, the, whatever it.
I understand it has a place andit's important.
(11:32):
From my perspective, it's notmore important than who I am,
because who I am allowed forthis stuff to happen that mark,
you need to quit the show.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
Phyllis just dropped it I'm holding up, I'm taking
over.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
You can't quit, no you're so right, phil, that's it
, that is.
It is like it is who.
That's what people want people.
People want us you, me to be us.
This show will be successful,to whatever level it is, because
(12:10):
we stayed true to being us.
And God, that's a major dropright there.
And that is when you're writingyour damn bio.
Who is it for and who careswhat you've done?
It's who you are, becausepeople are going to listen.
They're going to be intriguedbecause I see myself, I see an
alignment, I see a connection.
(12:30):
Wow, that's somebody I'd wantto spend time with.
And I mean, who doesn't want tohang out with you, phyllis?
I mean, you are the coolest ofus can't imagine.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
I.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
I know, Just your laugh alone.
In fact, we need to record yourlaugh track Anyway.
All right, Mark.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
So you know, I think and I go back to the fact that
you're kicking me off the showif this is not good.
So there's a lot of pressure tobe thoughtful here.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
It's a short bio.
It's a short.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
He did a podcast for like 35.
He had one great thought andthen we let him go.
Um, when I think of a bio and Ilisten to bios and I read
resumes and I've read tons ofthem, just like many of you our
listeners have have read,depending on on the role or
roles that you currently have oryou're going through LinkedIn,
the, the the story that comes tomind is this I was recently on
a vacation and that was we wentto a comedy show one of the
(13:35):
nights.
We were on a cruise and whatwas amazing was, you know, there
was this comedian and Irealized not everybody is funny
to everybody and so please takethat with a grain of salt, but
it was like.
You know, this comedian wasfeatured on Comedy Zendral, you
know, the late, late, late showthis and that and won this award
, and they weren't funny.
(13:56):
And it made me think ofauthenticity.
And are we using words on apage to be somebody or to
impress somebody, and to whatend?
And so when I look at my bio orI read other people's bio, I
almost don't read it withauthentic eyes, I read it as did
(14:21):
you really do these things?
Is this really you?
And I think what?
What comes into my mind when Iwrite my own, or have in the
past, is one imposter syndrome.
Um, yeah, I did those things,but but did I really?
And there were a lot of peopleinvolved.
I mean, nothing I've ever donethat was super successful.
(14:42):
I've ever done by myself.
Right, there's always somebodywith you to do those things.
And so there's, there's thatpiece.
You're like I led this hugecharge against this thing and
you're like, yeah, but there wasan army of people behind me
Then.
Then there's always thatthought of like, well, my
audience, well, I've got tospeak in an executive tone or I
have to speak in a funny tonebecause it's about the podcast
(15:05):
and it's got to have pot ofhumor.
This is a friend's thing.
So there's so many elementsthat make it complicated,
because there's so many voicesin your head saying, well,
that's too formal and that's notformal enough, and did you
really do that or did you notreally do that?
And so what I think it comesdown to is storytelling.
(15:25):
If we could start sharingstories about who we are, it
would be way more authentic thanto say all the accomplishments
that we did or did not do, and Ithink that, for me is the
failure of bios well, it's, it's.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
It's the failure not of bios, it's the failure of a
I'm going to get pissy right nowit's the failure of a system
that forces us to do exactlywhat.
The antithesis of what you justsaid, yes, and and, and, and I
mean.
I think about, I think aboutthe job search modality of um.
(16:13):
What does it call a?
What's the term for the?
Speaker 3 (16:17):
making sure the ATI systems.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
Yeah, the ATI systems , right?
Um, I mean there was a companyI don't remember it was workday
or whatever.
Systems, right, I mean therewas a company, I don't remember
it was Workday or whatever.
One of these large companiesgot sued and is maybe still in
suit because they were basicallylooking at when somebody said I
have 20 years of experience,they were getting kicked out
because it was age or anyway.
(16:40):
I don't want to get into that.
So the point is, these searchengines and the way companies
try to find talent is incomplete opposition to the thing
that they want.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
Well, you're exactly right.
So if I'm, if I'm going for ajob, and I know that I have to
have in, and there's websiteslike job scan and others that
you put your resume in and yousee how many of the words in
your resume match the jobdescription, and if it's not at
like 95 percent, that system isgoing to kick it out.
And so what do you do?
You put your resume or yourcover letter into some sort of
(17:17):
AI feature, whatever you likechat, gpt, claude, you know
copilot, and now you're startingto match stuff up.
You know copilot, and, and nowyou're starting to match stuff
up.
So when you then sit down tohave an authentic conversation,
it's just words to get someoneto read it, it, it, it's, it's
it's lost its intentionality,it's it's lost its humanity,
(17:38):
it's it's words.
So you happen to read my thing,you happen to look at my
artwork and I think that's a.
That's a scary place to be,because it's almost like um
going out with somebody in thedark.
You, you don't know what theylook like right, and because
(17:59):
it's, you can't see them, andand so there's these words on a
page.
But you know, is it them, is itnot them?
Speaker 1 (18:06):
that is a powerful analogy.
Sorry, phil, go ahead yeah no,it's it.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Just listening to the two of you and I think and I've
been thinking about this tooit's almost like a standardized
test.
So people who, who have figuredout how to, who are great
standardized test takers greatyeah yep, which goes back to how
, I think, I started theconversation.
It totally negates and rules outsome high percentage of the
population who have a lot ofother competencies and skills
(18:35):
and values and possibilitybecause they couldn't figure out
how to do that, and I feel likeit's the same process now that
(18:58):
we're going through, because youdo have to know how to work the
system.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
It's a question of who am I?
It's a question of who is thisfor?
Who am I trying to impress?
Am I being authentic or am Iperforming?
Should this be a story, a pitch, a tagline, and is it truly at
the essence of who I am?
Speaker 1 (19:23):
And I think it's important to draw the line
between, currently, what we cancontrol and what kind of is
controlled for us, and what I'mhearing, to quote your words,
mark is what we're talking about.
The name of the show isBiohazard, right, and so it's
about your bio and that's howyou get introduced or how you
write your introduction, if youdo that sort of thing your
(19:44):
LinkedIn profile, your Facebookprofile and for so many of us,
whether we're older or younger,it's still the same conundrum.
I mean, look, I spend my timehelping people realize their
greater value.
I help people literally.
I mean, the value equation wasdesigned to say let's just get
(20:09):
to the cut and the chase of whatdefines you.
You're not a this because ofthis, this and this.
You are actually this and thisis what matters, and it's
natural and it's authentic.
And I was literally just givingthis this recently in a seminar
and somebody said yeah, thatsounds great.
(20:30):
I would say that from themountaintops, but I'm afraid to
put that in my profile and I'm.
I said to him I was like whyisn't that you?
He's like yeah, but, and that'sthe problem.
That's like yeah, but, andthat's the problem.
That's a confidence issue, thenRight, so well, it's confidence,
but also maybe that person issearching.
(20:50):
No, I think it's two things.
It's like hey, you want toreflect this on your bio.
So, first of all, what I wantus to do is to take the resume
out of the conversation for aminute, because I think that
that's a different, that's adifferent topic because of the
science behind the way jobsearch functionality is, which
is that's not our show heretoday.
But when it comes to how youpresent yourself to the world,
(21:13):
what I've heard from both of youis, seriously, I'm freaking.
Going back to my bio and I'mchanging it.
I am changing it to reflect thesame person that you hear on
this show, because that'sauthentic, al, not all the extra
accolades, and I'll throw insome of those things, sure,
because people still want toknow, oh, this person.
(21:34):
But anyway, I think it'simportant that, moving forward,
for whatever we talk about inthe rest of this time together,
we're talking about theauthenticity of answering your
questions, mark.
What do we stand for?
Who are we?
What matters to us?
Because that's what people wantto hear.
(21:54):
And so my question then to youis, when we ask those questions,
who are we, what do we standfor what do you think
complicates that?
Speaker 3 (22:13):
An inability to put that into words.
I meet with a lot of people.
We're wordy people, right, andI think that's why we're able to
do something like this, but alot of people don't know how to
translate the things thatthey've done or seen or
experienced into wordseffectively.
And I think that it sounds easyand what you're saying sounds
(22:40):
great, but you do that for aliving and I think what it comes
down to someone writingsomething for LinkedIn, let's
say it's hard.
It's hard in a way that maybewe don't understand, because we
are wordy, we are writers, weare creatives, and so to
(23:05):
translate I've done these thingsdoesn't necessarily come off
the page really well and, and soI think that's that's one of
the things.
There's embarrassment, um, andthose are just things that I
have talked to people prior tothe show, trying to get a better
idea of, like when they writetheir stuff, some of the
objections that they run into,and that's what they shared with
me.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
But isn't it, isn't there?
Sorry, phil.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
I'm going to just ask this question and I'll step out
.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
I think it's before that.
Okay, I think it's.
I think it's.
Before you can get to the words.
You have to see it andunderstand it, and and and
clarify it in your mind.
You understand it and clarifyit in your mind.
You have to have the inventory.
First of all, let's go back towhat you introduced, which was
forget what you've done in amoment, because the actions are
a representation of what youstand for, who you are as a
(23:53):
person, what you do right, like,for example, al, what do I know
about myself?
Above all else, I bringpositivity to the world.
Like, first and foremost,everybody that knows me is like
oh, my God, alice is thispositive person and he loves on
people.
Ok, that's quote, unquote.
The technical term is that'shis brand.
All right, Now all these otherthings I've done MC, keynote
(24:16):
spokesman, entrepreneur I bringthose things with me.
It's not like they.
They separate at, you know,when it breaks the surface of
the sky, right, and so, underwhat we're talking about now, if
I want to just be simple andnot complicate shit, then when I
introduce myself, then when Iintroduce myself, I'm a
(24:42):
positivity enthusiast whoactually loves on people.
End of story.
Now, sure, there's other stuff,but I think that people
struggle to convert what quoteunquote.
They've done is much deeperthan what they've done.
It's tapping into who they are.
(25:02):
All right, phil, I'm done.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
I'm just going to add one layer, like we could go
backwards and backwards, but Ido think there's a layer of and
what jumped to me into my mind,mark, when you were talking, is
the question am I enough, am Igood enough, as I am, and I
(25:24):
think, to get to the answer?
The answer is yes, and when youcan get to yes, then something
is going to come out, and it'snot going to be, mark, I totally
hear you.
I mean, some people are greatwriters, some people just it
comes naturally.
Other people really reallystruggle with how to do that and
somehow, I think you know, forour, for our listeners, getting
to simplicity can be you areenough and what you write is is
(25:46):
enough for now.
So then you learn more, andthen you can, and then you can,
then you can do more I?
Speaker 3 (25:53):
I think it is like, um, the way that I relate it
based on our conversation.
The visual that comes to mindis a piece of art, right?
So if you're an artist and youpaint something, you paint it
for yourself, right?
You're really not painting itfor an audience to love.
You painted it because youloved it.
(26:14):
That was the image that was inyour head and you translated
that onto a canvas.
Same with your bio you are theart and it needs to be
translated onto a canvas.
Same with your bio you are theart and it needs to be
translated onto the canvas.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
Now you get to drop the mic.
I just threw toilet paper.
I'm glad you came through,thank you.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
I was sweating.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I was too I I know we're joking here, but um I I
gotta tell you that's one of themost beautiful things I've ever
heard.
Well, thank you.
That is holy shikers.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
Hey Al.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Insert.
Insert laugh track Al can hestay now?
Speaker 2 (27:11):
Can he stay on the podcast now?
Speaker 1 (27:12):
He can stay on the podcast, mark Okay.
Mark he can stay on the podcast, all right.
I don't think there's anotherplace that we could go from here
.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
I would agree.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Other than to take a moment of repose, to step out of
the stall and do something thatwe call the roll up.
Yes, ladies and gentlemen, boysand girls, cats and dogs,
pigeons and sparrows, war andgentlemen, boys and girls, cats
and dogs, pigeons and sparrows,war eagles, alligators and
(27:46):
three-legged hippopotami.
This is the moment when,regardless of whether we have a
guest or it's just the three ofus in the stall, we dig deep, we
unpack things that areSphinx-like in their mysteries
and we ask the questions thatmove mountains, and that is why
(28:07):
we call it the roll-up.
So each of us has not warnedone another of the questions
we're about to ask.
Now, when we ask our guests incase this is the first time
you're joining us we have somequestions we ask, as well as
some random stuff, but when it'sjust the three of us, we have
(28:27):
no idea what poo is being flung.
I'm so sorry, by the way,that's such a cool, funny phrase
Flung poo.
In fact, I dare one of you tointroduce yourself, phyllis.
Yes, I dare you to introduceyourself as flung poo.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
I'm going to do it.
Don't you worry about it, it'shappening.
Hi, we're on the complexity oftoilet paper.
This afternoon I'm flung poo.
Let me introduce you.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
I'm Flung Poo.
Let me introduce you and, bythe way, if you happen to be
anywhere in the world and yourname actually is Flung Poo, we
apologize, no no, you got tocome on the show.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
You have complexified your life with your name and we
want to hear all your stories,so please call us.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
All right, all right, here we go.
Who wants to start?
We, we don't have an order.
I will start mark go.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
If the walls of your bathroom could talk, what would
they say about you?
Speaker 1 (29:34):
oh shies good lord after the bios.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
Oh my god well, that's exactly why I came up
with this.
I figured, if we're going totalk about bios, if, if the
walls of your bathroom werewriting your bio, what would it
say about you?
I want to tell you.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
You want to go first?
Speaker 3 (29:56):
Phil, somebody's got to go.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Al you go.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
I'll go first.
All right, one thing, or can wesay two things'll go first.
All right, one thing, or can wesay two?
Speaker 2 (30:03):
Sure, all right.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
We say it would say two things man that guy's fast.
No, no, sorry, no, no.
It would say man that guy'sconsistent, ok, consistent, all
right.
I thank God, I pray, it doesn'tchange when I get really old,
but since I've been a kid it'sbeen like you know and I know
(30:25):
what I'm doing, and it's likeclockwork.
Okay, so consistency.
Okay, all right the secondthing, oh, there's two.
Yeah, there was two.
The second thing is God.
Why does he talk so much?
Speaker 2 (30:45):
Is there somebody in there with you?
Speaker 1 (30:47):
No, I will.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
He's just in there talking, you know he is.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
We've had a guest or two or so discuss this, but I
will talk to some people.
I will yeah, okay, all right,fill us.
Yeah, okay, all right.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
So there it is.
I think the walls of thebathroom would say like Al two
things, one it's going to comeout wrong.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Is that what it would say?
Speaker 2 (31:12):
It's going to come out wrong.
No, it would say, gosh, she'sdeep, Because I always do my
deep thinking in the bathroom.
It would say, gosh, she's deepbecause I always do my deep
thinking in the bathroom,combined with combined, combined
with.
She's a multitasker because Ido a lot of things when I'm in
there, like there are severalthings that go on, I can.
(31:34):
I can do things.
I can answer email, I can wipedown baseboards.
I'm, you know, very flexible.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
I was going to say like your baseboards there's,
you know, very flexible.
I was going to say, like yourbaseboards, there's a lot.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
There's a lot, a lot, a lot.
Sometimes I'm putting on makeupat the same time.
It just depends.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
Hey, mark, mark, no, hey, don't tell Phyllis.
Cone of silence.
Don't tell Phyllis, but nexttime we're at her house, let's
go look at the size of herbathroom, cause I'm trying to
figure out how she can do thebaseboards while she's while
she's going potty.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
Don't you worry about it, I'll show.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
Hey, does this mean, like you have, like all your
like cleaning supplies close tothe toilet?
Speaker 3 (32:15):
Yeah, I did.
I did notice her baseboards arevery clean in her bathrooms.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Didn't she, though?
I have a thing about baseboards.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
I did All right.
You guys are weird.
I do All right, all right.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Your question, phil, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (32:28):
Maybe Mark doesn't have to answer his own question.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
Okay, oh, yeah, oh yeah, mark, yeah, sorry, go
ahead yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
I think my bathroom would being speedy Gonzalez.
Uh in in the.
Uh, the old cartoon or roadrunner, super in there and fast
right.
Uh, mine would be the opposite.
Be like don't you havesomething else to do today?
Other than spend spend yourafternoon sitting in here, Uh,
so yeah, that's great.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yeah, uh, all right, yeah, yeah, oh shit, yeah, yeah,
oh shit why?
Speaker 3 (33:10):
are my legs numb?
I don't know?
Speaker 2 (33:11):
yeah, do you know what?
One time when I was that likeone time when I was younger, a
lot younger.
Why am I sharing the story?
I really did fall asleep on thetoilet.
When I woke up, my legs werenumb and I went to stand up and
I couldn't.
They had fallen asleep and itwasn't drunk.
Drinking was not involved.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
So yeah, and there you have it.
So I have a question.
Okay, Not as good as Mark's,but it's still a question.
Speaker 1 (33:39):
Hey see, there you are negating your own value.
Oh my God, why on earth would IAll?
Speaker 3 (33:43):
right.
Speaker 2 (33:44):
I want to know what your panic buy at the grocery
store is, when you feel likeyour life is falling apart.
Speaker 3 (33:52):
Oh wow, I got that chocolate chip mint ice cream.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
That's my go-to.
If you see me just sitting witha half pint of chocolate chip
and ice cream, it's been a badday.
Speaker 1 (34:09):
All right, I've got a combo and considering that I'm
a type 1 diabetic, this isdeadly, so I hope my insulin
pump is not listening to me ormy endocrinologist.
Mine is a one-two punch it, uhit is.
I can't remember the name of it.
I should it's.
It's the combo of, likechocolate, uh, anyway, um, trail
(34:35):
something, trail whatever.
Anyway, it's publics.
Um, like peanut butter andsomething else Like Chex Mix.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
Ice cream.
Is it ice cream?
Speaker 1 (34:45):
Oh sorry, it's an ice cream.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
Yeah, it's an ice cream.
Yeah, it's an ice cream.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
What's that ice cream that's got like moose tracks in
it.
Moose tracks.
Thank you, thank you, it isPublix moose tracks with Hostess
Ding Dongs.
Oh Yum oh, yum, wow, yeah,absolute.
Like just sedate me, which itpretty much does anyway, because
(35:09):
of the blood sugar.
So, yeah, I buy that my insulinpump texts me and go.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
You are an asshole, you realize that you should
probably not do that okay, yeah,um is what your pump says.
I think you should, becausethat's a good thank you?
Yeah, phyllis, did you go onthat one?
It was your question okay.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
So I don't have a thing at the grocery store, but
I do have, and we've slightlydiscussed it.
When I feel like life is out ofcontrol, I have to.
I clean my baseboards becauseit's controllable.
Hence, clean baseboards.
Yeah, I know, don't no there'sthis.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
That's really a whole right there.
I don't I don't even know howto respond to that, other than
there's got to be some level ofcomplexity and something else
mixed together to make thathappen.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
Probably so, but it makes me feel a thousand times
better, and also my baseboards.
Speaker 3 (35:59):
My baseboards are not that clean, so if you're
feeling that way, if youwouldn't mind coming over.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I'm coming over.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
I will have chocolate chip men screaming.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
If you work, if you are listening to this episode
and you work with a company thatspecializes in cleaning
baseboards, would you pleasecontact us?
We would like you to sponsorPhyllis Not the show,
necessarily, but Phyllis broughtto you by.
Speaker 3 (36:25):
And if you bring her a shirt with your company logo
on it, she'll wear it while shecleans 100 I like everybody to
have um clean, clean baseboards.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
That's great all right what's your question now?
My damn question now is did Iclean my baseboards before
phyllis comes over?
No, um, all right, I I have twoquestions.
Here you go.
First question what's?
Speaker 2 (36:49):
your blush Like the color of my blush.
What is it?
Speaker 1 (36:51):
No, no.
What is it that?
No matter what, where, how, youwill probably blush.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
If someone asked me to sing, I can't sing.
You'll blush.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
I'll blush.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
I actually get embarrassed.
Speaker 3 (37:05):
I don't get embarrassed by doing almost
anything other than singing.
Singing is the only thing thatmakes me embarrassed.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
Phil what's your blush?
Speaker 1 (37:17):
Do I blush?
We've seen you blush.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
I can't remember to what I think, just when I get
nervous, in general I blush, I'msure.
Speaker 1 (37:25):
I blushed through the first 10 podcasts we did.
I think well, I don't know ifthat's a, but that's your blush,
so it's what we've seen, butyou don't blush anymore like you
used to.
No, so you've kind of no I'mtalking about.
There's got to be somethingthat's like you're going to
blush and you'll blush foreverbecause of this.
(37:46):
Ladies and gentlemen, what youdon't see is her mouth is
stretched, her eyes are nearlywatering as she thinks hard to
come up with an answer.
Pass, for fear of being kickedoff.
Pass, all right.
Speaker 3 (37:59):
All right.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Give me a better question what's your blush?
Speaker 3 (38:02):
What's your blush?
Speaker 1 (38:02):
Yeah, my blush and this is so, uh, obviously you
guys know this my blush is hey,aren't you that kia guy?
Aren't you that toyota guy?
So for those of you that don'tknow, uh, which is probably the
(38:22):
majority of you, I was on cameraas a spokesman for car
dealerships for close to 20 to25 years throughout the
Southeast, and a lot of it inJacksonville, florida, and I
don't know why, but wheneverpeople bring that up, I blush, I
get it.
Okay, all right.
So here's your second question,phil, since I had two, and then
(38:44):
we'll wrap this puppy and Mark,you don't get to answer this
unless you want to.
You'll understand why.
When I ask this song, don'tgive me that look.
All right, phyllis, first,what's your shower song?
Speaker 2 (38:57):
That depends on what day it is.
Oh gosh, I just had a shower,so occasionally it's Hallelujah.
Any Katie Lang's version of it,which I think is just a
beautiful version.
Sometimes I make up a song.
Speaker 1 (39:20):
Okay, good, wow, creative in the shower.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
It was Linda Ronstadt the other day.
Yeah, it just depends.
And do you know what?
I love singing in the showerand my last vocal coach was like
it's because of the acousticsin the shower.
Okay, Hmm.
Speaker 1 (39:40):
You don't sing when you clean the baseboards.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
No, cleaning the baseboards is all business.
Speaker 3 (39:44):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
Don't mess with my base mark yeah, I don't have a.
Speaker 1 (39:47):
I don't have a song no, I don't have a song either,
but I do have music and I loveto listen to shine down in the
shower, which sounds like youknow, shine down in the shower,
okay, well, there you have it.
Deep thoughts, um, thank you,jack.
Handy reference to saturdaynight live.
Saturday night live great,great, great, great show.
(40:09):
Uh god, this has been fun ithas been fun, can I?
just tell you I love you, I loveeach of you.
I love this, I love thisexperience.
What a way to build afriendship.
And, oh, I just love you guys.
Um, our next guest who's goingto be appearing on the show?
(40:29):
You can always find out whenyou check out our shows, and our
shows can be found, of course,on our feed.
Just search for the complexityof toilet paper.
We're hosted through Buzzsprout, but if you want the direct
link, go to our Facebook pagethe Complexity of Toilet Paper.
We hope you've enjoyed the pastshows so far and just moving
(40:52):
forward, just so you know thecadence.
What we're trying to do iscreate a good mix of shows where
we've gotten a great humanbeing and we're exploring a
unique thing, like we did withToby Kinsel.
That was a great show,fantastic, as well as shows like
this, which is just the threeof us in the studio.
(41:15):
So anyway, real quick aroundthe horn.
What's your big takeaway fromBiohazard, phil?
Speaker 2 (41:25):
Mark really said it, auth said it authenticity, truth
to self, um, and, and the themethat has run through a lot of
our shows, which is around fearand and and letting that go mine
is what do you stand for andwho are you versus what you've
done?
Speaker 1 (41:44):
That's, that's me.
Speaker 3 (41:45):
Mark, mine is you are the art and whatever you paint
onto that canvas is beautiful.
Just be true to yourself.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
We call this the complexity of toilet paper, and
that's about as simple as itgets.
Thank you for joining us.
Have an amazing, whatever nexthappens.
And hey, when you step into thestall, think of us.
It's okay, we're safe.
Speaker 2 (42:10):
Did you say toilet paper?
Everything complicated, one big, big mess.
I'm overthinking.
Speaker 1 (42:18):
I'm over, I'm overthinking.
This is the complexity oftoilet paper.
Sometimes I wish we could go back to a time when
things weren't so complicated.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Welcome to the Complexity of Toilet Paper, the
podcast that dives into theeveryday moments where we
overthink, hesitate or just getstuck.
I'm overthinking, I'm over, I'moverthinking.
Let's hear it for the toiletpaper Through honest
conversations, unexpectedinsights and a whole lot of
(00:28):
humor.
Your hosts, phyllis Martin,mark Pollack and Al Emmerich,
are here to help you roll withit and make your life a little
less complicated.
One conversation at a time,that's right, dude.
The beauty of this is itssimplicity.
Speaking of which, it's time toenter the stall.
Put the lid down or not,depending get comfortable and
(00:52):
roll with it.
Oh worry not, dear friend, it'sreally quite simple.
Welcome to the stall.
How about that?
Wouldn't that be cool if, whenyou stepped into the stall,
(01:14):
there was like imagine if publicrestrooms.
You walked into the stall,there was like welcome Mark
Pollack to the stall.
I would love walk-on music.
How great.
Welcome Mark Pollack to theStar.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
I would love walk-on music.
How great would that be.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Holy shit, what an idea.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Phyllis, Martin Phyllis welcome to the Star
Dun-dun-dun-dun.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
And it was different for whatever you had to do.
Yeah, you know, like there'd beone for the urinals 50% of our
listeners just dropped off going.
I know, they're like what isgoing on?
You guys must have recordedthis on a Friday.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
At 4.
18.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
With friends coming over and cocktails flowing.
Oh, hi Mark, hi Phil, yeah,hello Al.
No-transcript.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
You know, I had a big aha this week.
I don't know what has caused it, but let's just go with it.
Cool, it's really.
I think it's going to soundpathetic and sad.
I think it's really the firsttime.
Mark, stop laughing at me, it'stoo early.
Um, I feel like it's about tobe the episode of eeyore.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Well, it was sad and we had a terrible time.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Leave her alone, mark , actually.
No, don't leave her alonebecause I have to say total
train wreck here.
But one of the things that Icould have never seen coming is
the utter joy of hearing PhyllisMartin's laugh.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Well, let her tell her story.
We're going to get it out now.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Okay, stop, mark, she's going to hemorrhage from
her belly button.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
I'll just leave it at this.
I've had a great week and it'sprobably the first week in my
entire professional career.
Go'll just leave it at this.
I've had a great week and it'sprobably the first week in my
entire professional career.
Go ahead, insert, eeyore, thatyou know there've been some
challenges to the week and I'vejust taken the approach that,
okay, we're going to havechallenges this week and it's
(03:41):
nothing, it's just life, it'sjust work, it's just
relationships, it's just people.
There's no judgment, there's noworry, there's no angst,
there's no overthinking.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
So what I'm hearing you say is you flushed the
complexity this week.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Dun-dun.
I feel like balloons should gooff and things should be coming
out of the sky.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Good for you, good for you, good for you.
Mark, anything on your ropebefore we dive into this talk.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
I'll tell you I do, but I'm excited about today's
topic so I will save my aha forthe next one.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
And.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
I'm probably going to write about it and share it
with our listeners on theFacebook page.
So more to come there.
But yeah, I had some reallyinteresting ahas.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
Well, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, you
know what that means.
It's time to step into thestall.
All right, no, walk up music,walk in music.
But it is us.
And just to give everybody somebackdrop, this is actually a
topic we pre-recorded one othertime, but we were in different
(04:53):
states of mind and all of usagreed.
We were like you know what,let's redo that one, let's start
from a fresh slate.
And so you could see from thetitle of the show, it's called
bio hazard.
But what happened is we wereall writing our bios for the
website and to get our launchready, and all three of us were
(05:15):
really struggling, and we werestruggling for different and
unique reasons, and that led usto say, hey, let's talk about it
.
But even since that time, we'vehad to rewrite some different
things, and so we thought thiswould be a great forum for us to
share our own journey with you.
Hopefully, you'll hear yourselfin this and you'll even comment
(05:38):
on our Facebook page andcontribute your journey.
But let's go behind the curtainand dive into the stall to go.
Why the hell is it so hard tocelebrate our own awesomeness
and to compile that in bio or aresume?
Um, and and so when we firstunpack this and now even I'd
(05:59):
love to start with with you,phyllis, like when you hear the
word I got gotta write my bio,or the the phrase um, besides
sticking your tongue out andgoing what it, what goes through
your mind, like what is what isin front of you, so you know, I
was going back through oldemails and I saw um, where I
sent my bio that I had finallywritten after months to mark,
(06:21):
and it was like something likemy bio ick Even then which I had
taken a lot of time.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
You know, it feels daunting.
And I think it feels dauntingparticularly when you're doing
it for a job search, perhaps, oreven for this, but mostly for a
job search, because I find mymind always goes to how do I
capture, how do I make thisgreat combination of
(06:51):
competencies, skill sets and thething that's the hardest to
capture, which is the essence ofPhyllis Martin, and I always
find myself trying to put it ina format or a form that I think
employers are going to beinterested in looking at and
hearing.
And it's just never been a greatexperience.
And I'm always reminded I'veshared this with you before how
(07:16):
I was in the final phase of ajob search one time and the
headhunter was like you're somuch better than your resume.
I was like you're so muchbetter than your resume and I
was like what?
Like, are you kidding?
Yes, of course I'm better thanmy resume.
Like the resume should be theteaser that whatever's on the
paper should have piqued yourinterest, but in no way is that
ever going to capture theessence of the human being or
(07:38):
the experience or thephilosophical approach of the
human being that you are sittingsitting across from, and so I
have like clearly I have someissues um with with now is now
the time we're going to do this?
no, that's a different show oh,it is a different show, darn it.
Um, but I'm getting, you know,I'm getting better at it, I
(08:01):
think, as I become more wholeand older, and also I am who I
am.
That's not going to change, andI have every bit of evidence to
say yeah, you should have aconversation with me, and then
we can both go from there,because that's a two way street.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
I'm going to go next, mark, because, no, you just
have these really cool thoughtsand ideas.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
And I think that.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
I mean, dude, we've had what?
How many ever shows we've had,you always drop it like you,
you're like it's like.
Whatever we say, it's like oh,that was cool.
And then here comes mark aroundthe corner mic drop anyway.
So I'm gonna let you do the micdrop, but, um, I I recently gave
a keynote uh, the National MSSociety in Northeast Florida,
(08:51):
and it was a great experience.
Thank you, heidi Katz, thankyou everybody.
Mark, you were there.
Awesome experience.
I'd given them my bio and I waslistening as they were reading
my bio and I was like God, did Ireally write that?
That's way too damn long.
Now, is it all true?
Yes, am I proud of it?
Yes, but literally all I couldthink of is who am I writing for
(09:18):
?
Am I writing for them or am Iwriting for me?
Right, and if I'm writing forme, to say, hey, gosh, I'm just
going to show up here I am.
Um, that's the mindset I think Iwould rather use when I'm
writing a bio, right, becausewhen you're writing for them,
(09:38):
you're trying to figure outwhat's going to make them relate
.
Make them relate, and it's socounterproductive in jobs and in
so many environments when wetry to project for them versus
us, and that was a big aha.
And so what I run into when I'mwriting a bio is two things.
(10:02):
Number one is how do I craftthis so it doesn't sound over
egotistical and yet I'm reallyfricking proud of the things
I've done.
I mean, I've done some coolstuff in my life and it's why
I'm standing on a stage or it'swhy I'm applying over here.
But the other part now isdifferent's like I'm gonna
(10:25):
reclaim my voice, tell my story,and, um, that's got to resonate
louder than anything else soI'm jumping in before mark drops
the mic because so muchpressure so much pressure, you
know well, you know what we'regonna do something if you don't
handle it well, if, if you don'tlive up to the deal.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
You know a part of that too is something you just
said, like you're proud of allthe stuff you've done, and that
is, and you should be.
You've done amazing, amazingthings, yeah, and but part of it
too is, again, we're humanbeings and so the bio.
I think part of the tensionwith me in the bio is, yeah,
(11:12):
I've done stuff, but that's not,that's like such a fraction of
what I want people to know aboutme, and I feel like, culturally
, we've been trained to list allthe stuff the awards, the, the
engagements, the, whatever it.
I understand it has a place andit's important.
(11:32):
From my perspective, it's notmore important than who I am,
because who I am allowed forthis stuff to happen that mark,
you need to quit the show.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
Phyllis just dropped it I'm holding up, I'm taking
over.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
You can't quit, no you're so right, phil, that's it
, that is.
It is like it is who.
That's what people want people.
People want us you, me to be us.
This show will be successful,to whatever level it is, because
(12:10):
we stayed true to being us.
And God, that's a major dropright there.
And that is when you're writingyour damn bio.
Who is it for and who careswhat you've done?
It's who you are, becausepeople are going to listen.
They're going to be intriguedbecause I see myself, I see an
alignment, I see a connection.
(12:30):
Wow, that's somebody I'd wantto spend time with.
And I mean, who doesn't want tohang out with you, phyllis?
I mean, you are the coolest ofus can't imagine.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
I.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
I know, Just your laugh alone.
In fact, we need to record yourlaugh track Anyway.
All right, Mark.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
So you know, I think and I go back to the fact that
you're kicking me off the showif this is not good.
So there's a lot of pressure tobe thoughtful here.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
It's a short bio.
It's a short.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
He did a podcast for like 35.
He had one great thought andthen we let him go.
Um, when I think of a bio and Ilisten to bios and I read
resumes and I've read tons ofthem, just like many of you our
listeners have have read,depending on on the role or
roles that you currently have oryou're going through LinkedIn,
the, the the story that comes tomind is this I was recently on
a vacation and that was we wentto a comedy show one of the
(13:35):
nights.
We were on a cruise and whatwas amazing was, you know, there
was this comedian and Irealized not everybody is funny
to everybody and so please takethat with a grain of salt, but
it was like.
You know, this comedian wasfeatured on Comedy Zendral, you
know, the late, late, late showthis and that and won this award
, and they weren't funny.
(13:56):
And it made me think ofauthenticity.
And are we using words on apage to be somebody or to
impress somebody, and to whatend?
And so when I look at my bio orI read other people's bio, I
almost don't read it withauthentic eyes, I read it as did
(14:21):
you really do these things?
Is this really you?
And I think what?
What comes into my mind when Iwrite my own, or have in the
past, is one imposter syndrome.
Um, yeah, I did those things,but but did I really?
And there were a lot of peopleinvolved.
I mean, nothing I've ever donethat was super successful.
(14:42):
I've ever done by myself.
Right, there's always somebodywith you to do those things.
And so there's, there's thatpiece.
You're like I led this hugecharge against this thing and
you're like, yeah, but there wasan army of people behind me
Then.
Then there's always thatthought of like, well, my
audience, well, I've got tospeak in an executive tone or I
have to speak in a funny tonebecause it's about the podcast
(15:05):
and it's got to have pot ofhumor.
This is a friend's thing.
So there's so many elementsthat make it complicated,
because there's so many voicesin your head saying, well,
that's too formal and that's notformal enough, and did you
really do that or did you notreally do that?
And so what I think it comesdown to is storytelling.
(15:25):
If we could start sharingstories about who we are, it
would be way more authentic thanto say all the accomplishments
that we did or did not do, and Ithink that, for me is the
failure of bios well, it's, it's.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
It's the failure not of bios, it's the failure of a
I'm going to get pissy right nowit's the failure of a system
that forces us to do exactlywhat.
The antithesis of what you justsaid, yes, and and, and, and I
mean.
I think about, I think aboutthe job search modality of um.
(16:13):
What does it call a?
What's the term for the?
Speaker 3 (16:17):
making sure the ATI systems.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
Yeah, the ATI systems , right?
Um, I mean there was a companyI don't remember it was workday
or whatever.
Systems, right, I mean therewas a company, I don't remember
it was Workday or whatever.
One of these large companiesgot sued and is maybe still in
suit because they were basicallylooking at when somebody said I
have 20 years of experience,they were getting kicked out
because it was age or anyway.
(16:40):
I don't want to get into that.
So the point is, these searchengines and the way companies
try to find talent is incomplete opposition to the thing
that they want.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
Well, you're exactly right.
So if I'm, if I'm going for ajob, and I know that I have to
have in, and there's websiteslike job scan and others that
you put your resume in and yousee how many of the words in
your resume match the jobdescription, and if it's not at
like 95 percent, that system isgoing to kick it out.
And so what do you do?
You put your resume or yourcover letter into some sort of
(17:17):
AI feature, whatever you likechat, gpt, claude, you know
copilot, and now you're startingto match stuff up.
You know copilot, and, and nowyou're starting to match stuff
up.
So when you then sit down tohave an authentic conversation,
it's just words to get someoneto read it, it, it, it's, it's
it's lost its intentionality,it's it's lost its humanity,
(17:38):
it's it's words.
So you happen to read my thing,you happen to look at my
artwork and I think that's a.
That's a scary place to be,because it's almost like um
going out with somebody in thedark.
You, you don't know what theylook like right, and because
(17:59):
it's, you can't see them, andand so there's these words on a
page.
But you know, is it them, is itnot them?
Speaker 1 (18:06):
that is a powerful analogy.
Sorry, phil, go ahead yeah no,it's it.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Just listening to the two of you and I think and I've
been thinking about this tooit's almost like a standardized
test.
So people who, who have figuredout how to, who are great
standardized test takers greatyeah yep, which goes back to how
, I think, I started theconversation.
It totally negates and rules outsome high percentage of the
population who have a lot ofother competencies and skills
(18:35):
and values and possibilitybecause they couldn't figure out
how to do that, and I feel likeit's the same process now that
(18:58):
we're going through, because youdo have to know how to work the
system.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
It's a question of who am I?
It's a question of who is thisfor?
Who am I trying to impress?
Am I being authentic or am Iperforming?
Should this be a story, a pitch, a tagline, and is it truly at
the essence of who I am?
Speaker 1 (19:23):
And I think it's important to draw the line
between, currently, what we cancontrol and what kind of is
controlled for us, and what I'mhearing, to quote your words,
mark is what we're talking about.
The name of the show isBiohazard, right, and so it's
about your bio and that's howyou get introduced or how you
write your introduction, if youdo that sort of thing your
(19:44):
LinkedIn profile, your Facebookprofile and for so many of us,
whether we're older or younger,it's still the same conundrum.
I mean, look, I spend my timehelping people realize their
greater value.
I help people literally.
I mean, the value equation wasdesigned to say let's just get
(20:09):
to the cut and the chase of whatdefines you.
You're not a this because ofthis, this and this.
You are actually this and thisis what matters, and it's
natural and it's authentic.
And I was literally just givingthis this recently in a seminar
and somebody said yeah, thatsounds great.
(20:30):
I would say that from themountaintops, but I'm afraid to
put that in my profile and I'm.
I said to him I was like whyisn't that you?
He's like yeah, but, and that'sthe problem.
That's like yeah, but, andthat's the problem.
That's a confidence issue, thenRight, so well, it's confidence,
but also maybe that person issearching.
(20:50):
No, I think it's two things.
It's like hey, you want toreflect this on your bio.
So, first of all, what I wantus to do is to take the resume
out of the conversation for aminute, because I think that
that's a different, that's adifferent topic because of the
science behind the way jobsearch functionality is, which
is that's not our show heretoday.
But when it comes to how youpresent yourself to the world,
(21:13):
what I've heard from both of youis, seriously, I'm freaking.
Going back to my bio and I'mchanging it.
I am changing it to reflect thesame person that you hear on
this show, because that'sauthentic, al, not all the extra
accolades, and I'll throw insome of those things, sure,
because people still want toknow, oh, this person.
(21:34):
But anyway, I think it'simportant that, moving forward,
for whatever we talk about inthe rest of this time together,
we're talking about theauthenticity of answering your
questions, mark.
What do we stand for?
Who are we?
What matters to us?
Because that's what people wantto hear.
(21:54):
And so my question then to youis, when we ask those questions,
who are we, what do we standfor what do you think
complicates that?
Speaker 3 (22:13):
An inability to put that into words.
I meet with a lot of people.
We're wordy people, right, andI think that's why we're able to
do something like this, but alot of people don't know how to
translate the things thatthey've done or seen or
experienced into wordseffectively.
And I think that it sounds easyand what you're saying sounds
(22:40):
great, but you do that for aliving and I think what it comes
down to someone writingsomething for LinkedIn, let's
say it's hard.
It's hard in a way that maybewe don't understand, because we
are wordy, we are writers, weare creatives, and so to
(23:05):
translate I've done these thingsdoesn't necessarily come off
the page really well and, and soI think that's that's one of
the things.
There's embarrassment, um, andthose are just things that I
have talked to people prior tothe show, trying to get a better
idea of, like when they writetheir stuff, some of the
objections that they run into,and that's what they shared with
me.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
But isn't it, isn't there?
Sorry, phil.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
I'm going to just ask this question and I'll step out
.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
I think it's before that.
Okay, I think it's.
I think it's.
Before you can get to the words.
You have to see it andunderstand it, and and and
clarify it in your mind.
You understand it and clarifyit in your mind.
You have to have the inventory.
First of all, let's go back towhat you introduced, which was
forget what you've done in amoment, because the actions are
a representation of what youstand for, who you are as a
(23:53):
person, what you do right, like,for example, al, what do I know
about myself?
Above all else, I bringpositivity to the world.
Like, first and foremost,everybody that knows me is like
oh, my God, alice is thispositive person and he loves on
people.
Ok, that's quote, unquote.
The technical term is that'shis brand.
All right, Now all these otherthings I've done MC, keynote
(24:16):
spokesman, entrepreneur I bringthose things with me.
It's not like they.
They separate at, you know,when it breaks the surface of
the sky, right, and so, underwhat we're talking about now, if
I want to just be simple andnot complicate shit, then when I
introduce myself, then when Iintroduce myself, I'm a
(24:42):
positivity enthusiast whoactually loves on people.
End of story.
Now, sure, there's other stuff,but I think that people
struggle to convert what quoteunquote.
They've done is much deeperthan what they've done.
It's tapping into who they are.
(25:02):
All right, phil, I'm done.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
I'm just going to add one layer, like we could go
backwards and backwards, but Ido think there's a layer of and
what jumped to me into my mind,mark, when you were talking, is
the question am I enough, am Igood enough, as I am, and I
(25:24):
think, to get to the answer?
The answer is yes, and when youcan get to yes, then something
is going to come out, and it'snot going to be, mark, I totally
hear you.
I mean, some people are greatwriters, some people just it
comes naturally.
Other people really reallystruggle with how to do that and
somehow, I think you know, forour, for our listeners, getting
to simplicity can be you areenough and what you write is is
(25:46):
enough for now.
So then you learn more, andthen you can, and then you can,
then you can do more I?
Speaker 3 (25:53):
I think it is like, um, the way that I relate it
based on our conversation.
The visual that comes to mindis a piece of art, right?
So if you're an artist and youpaint something, you paint it
for yourself, right?
You're really not painting itfor an audience to love.
You painted it because youloved it.
(26:14):
That was the image that was inyour head and you translated
that onto a canvas.
Same with your bio you are theart and it needs to be
translated onto a canvas.
Same with your bio you are theart and it needs to be
translated onto the canvas.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
Now you get to drop the mic.
I just threw toilet paper.
I'm glad you came through,thank you.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
I was sweating.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I was too I I know we're joking here, but um I I
gotta tell you that's one of themost beautiful things I've ever
heard.
Well, thank you.
That is holy shikers.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
Hey Al.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Insert.
Insert laugh track Al can hestay now?
Speaker 2 (27:11):
Can he stay on the podcast now?
Speaker 1 (27:12):
He can stay on the podcast, mark Okay.
Mark he can stay on the podcast, all right.
I don't think there's anotherplace that we could go from here
.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
I would agree.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Other than to take a moment of repose, to step out of
the stall and do something thatwe call the roll up.
Yes, ladies and gentlemen, boysand girls, cats and dogs,
pigeons and sparrows, war andgentlemen, boys and girls, cats
and dogs, pigeons and sparrows,war eagles, alligators and
(27:46):
three-legged hippopotami.
This is the moment when,regardless of whether we have a
guest or it's just the three ofus in the stall, we dig deep, we
unpack things that areSphinx-like in their mysteries
and we ask the questions thatmove mountains, and that is why
(28:07):
we call it the roll-up.
So each of us has not warnedone another of the questions
we're about to ask.
Now, when we ask our guests incase this is the first time
you're joining us we have somequestions we ask, as well as
some random stuff, but when it'sjust the three of us, we have
(28:27):
no idea what poo is being flung.
I'm so sorry, by the way,that's such a cool, funny phrase
Flung poo.
In fact, I dare one of you tointroduce yourself, phyllis.
Yes, I dare you to introduceyourself as flung poo.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
I'm going to do it.
Don't you worry about it, it'shappening.
Hi, we're on the complexity oftoilet paper.
This afternoon I'm flung poo.
Let me introduce you.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
I'm Flung Poo.
Let me introduce you and, bythe way, if you happen to be
anywhere in the world and yourname actually is Flung Poo, we
apologize, no no, you got tocome on the show.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
You have complexified your life with your name and we
want to hear all your stories,so please call us.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
All right, all right, here we go.
Who wants to start?
We, we don't have an order.
I will start mark go.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
If the walls of your bathroom could talk, what would
they say about you?
Speaker 1 (29:34):
oh shies good lord after the bios.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
Oh my god well, that's exactly why I came up
with this.
I figured, if we're going totalk about bios, if, if the
walls of your bathroom werewriting your bio, what would it
say about you?
I want to tell you.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
You want to go first?
Speaker 3 (29:56):
Phil, somebody's got to go.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Al you go.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
I'll go first.
All right, one thing, or can wesay two things'll go first.
All right, one thing, or can wesay two?
Speaker 2 (30:03):
Sure, all right.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
We say it would say two things man that guy's fast.
No, no, sorry, no, no.
It would say man that guy'sconsistent, ok, consistent, all
right.
I thank God, I pray, it doesn'tchange when I get really old,
but since I've been a kid it'sbeen like you know and I know
(30:25):
what I'm doing, and it's likeclockwork.
Okay, so consistency.
Okay, all right the secondthing, oh, there's two.
Yeah, there was two.
The second thing is God.
Why does he talk so much?
Speaker 2 (30:45):
Is there somebody in there with you?
Speaker 1 (30:47):
No, I will.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
He's just in there talking, you know he is.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
We've had a guest or two or so discuss this, but I
will talk to some people.
I will yeah, okay, all right,fill us.
Yeah, okay, all right.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
So there it is.
I think the walls of thebathroom would say like Al two
things, one it's going to comeout wrong.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Is that what it would say?
Speaker 2 (31:12):
It's going to come out wrong.
No, it would say, gosh, she'sdeep, Because I always do my
deep thinking in the bathroom.
It would say, gosh, she's deepbecause I always do my deep
thinking in the bathroom,combined with combined, combined
with.
She's a multitasker because Ido a lot of things when I'm in
there, like there are severalthings that go on, I can.
(31:34):
I can do things.
I can answer email, I can wipedown baseboards.
I'm, you know, very flexible.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
I was going to say like your baseboards there's,
you know, very flexible.
I was going to say, like yourbaseboards, there's a lot.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
There's a lot, a lot, a lot.
Sometimes I'm putting on makeupat the same time.
It just depends.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
Hey, mark, mark, no, hey, don't tell Phyllis.
Cone of silence.
Don't tell Phyllis, but nexttime we're at her house, let's
go look at the size of herbathroom, cause I'm trying to
figure out how she can do thebaseboards while she's while
she's going potty.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
Don't you worry about it, I'll show.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
Hey, does this mean, like you have, like all your
like cleaning supplies close tothe toilet?
Speaker 3 (32:15):
Yeah, I did.
I did notice her baseboards arevery clean in her bathrooms.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Didn't she, though?
I have a thing about baseboards.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
I did All right.
You guys are weird.
I do All right, all right.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Your question, phil, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (32:28):
Maybe Mark doesn't have to answer his own question.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
Okay, oh, yeah, oh yeah, mark, yeah, sorry, go
ahead yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
I think my bathroom would being speedy Gonzalez.
Uh in in the.
Uh, the old cartoon or roadrunner, super in there and fast
right.
Uh, mine would be the opposite.
Be like don't you havesomething else to do today?
Other than spend spend yourafternoon sitting in here, Uh,
so yeah, that's great.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yeah, uh, all right, yeah, yeah, oh shit, yeah, yeah,
oh shit why?
Speaker 3 (33:10):
are my legs numb?
I don't know?
Speaker 2 (33:11):
yeah, do you know what?
One time when I was that likeone time when I was younger, a
lot younger.
Why am I sharing the story?
I really did fall asleep on thetoilet.
When I woke up, my legs werenumb and I went to stand up and
I couldn't.
They had fallen asleep and itwasn't drunk.
Drinking was not involved.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
So yeah, and there you have it.
So I have a question.
Okay, Not as good as Mark's,but it's still a question.
Speaker 1 (33:39):
Hey see, there you are negating your own value.
Oh my God, why on earth would IAll?
Speaker 3 (33:43):
right.
Speaker 2 (33:44):
I want to know what your panic buy at the grocery
store is, when you feel likeyour life is falling apart.
Speaker 3 (33:52):
Oh wow, I got that chocolate chip mint ice cream.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
That's my go-to.
If you see me just sitting witha half pint of chocolate chip
and ice cream, it's been a badday.
Speaker 1 (34:09):
All right, I've got a combo and considering that I'm
a type 1 diabetic, this isdeadly, so I hope my insulin
pump is not listening to me ormy endocrinologist.
Mine is a one-two punch it, uhit is.
I can't remember the name of it.
I should it's.
It's the combo of, likechocolate, uh, anyway, um, trail
(34:35):
something, trail whatever.
Anyway, it's publics.
Um, like peanut butter andsomething else Like Chex Mix.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
Ice cream.
Is it ice cream?
Speaker 1 (34:45):
Oh sorry, it's an ice cream.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
Yeah, it's an ice cream.
Yeah, it's an ice cream.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
What's that ice cream that's got like moose tracks in
it.
Moose tracks.
Thank you, thank you, it isPublix moose tracks with Hostess
Ding Dongs.
Oh Yum oh, yum, wow, yeah,absolute.
Like just sedate me, which itpretty much does anyway, because
(35:09):
of the blood sugar.
So, yeah, I buy that my insulinpump texts me and go.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
You are an asshole, you realize that you should
probably not do that okay, yeah,um is what your pump says.
I think you should, becausethat's a good thank you?
Yeah, phyllis, did you go onthat one?
It was your question okay.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
So I don't have a thing at the grocery store, but
I do have, and we've slightlydiscussed it.
When I feel like life is out ofcontrol, I have to.
I clean my baseboards becauseit's controllable.
Hence, clean baseboards.
Yeah, I know, don't no there'sthis.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
That's really a whole right there.
I don't I don't even know howto respond to that, other than
there's got to be some level ofcomplexity and something else
mixed together to make thathappen.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
Probably so, but it makes me feel a thousand times
better, and also my baseboards.
Speaker 3 (35:59):
My baseboards are not that clean, so if you're
feeling that way, if youwouldn't mind coming over.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I'm coming over.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
I will have chocolate chip men screaming.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
If you work, if you are listening to this episode
and you work with a company thatspecializes in cleaning
baseboards, would you pleasecontact us?
We would like you to sponsorPhyllis Not the show,
necessarily, but Phyllis broughtto you by.
Speaker 3 (36:25):
And if you bring her a shirt with your company logo
on it, she'll wear it while shecleans 100 I like everybody to
have um clean, clean baseboards.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
That's great all right what's your question now?
My damn question now is did Iclean my baseboards before
phyllis comes over?
No, um, all right, I I have twoquestions.
Here you go.
First question what's?
Speaker 2 (36:49):
your blush Like the color of my blush.
What is it?
Speaker 1 (36:51):
No, no.
What is it that?
No matter what, where, how, youwill probably blush.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
If someone asked me to sing, I can't sing.
You'll blush.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
I'll blush.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
I actually get embarrassed.
Speaker 3 (37:05):
I don't get embarrassed by doing almost
anything other than singing.
Singing is the only thing thatmakes me embarrassed.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
Phil what's your blush?
Speaker 1 (37:17):
Do I blush?
We've seen you blush.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
I can't remember to what I think, just when I get
nervous, in general I blush, I'msure.
Speaker 1 (37:25):
I blushed through the first 10 podcasts we did.
I think well, I don't know ifthat's a, but that's your blush,
so it's what we've seen, butyou don't blush anymore like you
used to.
No, so you've kind of no I'mtalking about.
There's got to be somethingthat's like you're going to
blush and you'll blush foreverbecause of this.
(37:46):
Ladies and gentlemen, what youdon't see is her mouth is
stretched, her eyes are nearlywatering as she thinks hard to
come up with an answer.
Pass, for fear of being kickedoff.
Pass, all right.
Speaker 3 (37:59):
All right.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Give me a better question what's your blush?
Speaker 3 (38:02):
What's your blush?
Speaker 1 (38:02):
Yeah, my blush and this is so, uh, obviously you
guys know this my blush is hey,aren't you that kia guy?
Aren't you that toyota guy?
So for those of you that don'tknow, uh, which is probably the
(38:22):
majority of you, I was on cameraas a spokesman for car
dealerships for close to 20 to25 years throughout the
Southeast, and a lot of it inJacksonville, florida, and I
don't know why, but wheneverpeople bring that up, I blush, I
get it.
Okay, all right.
So here's your second question,phil, since I had two, and then
(38:44):
we'll wrap this puppy and Mark,you don't get to answer this
unless you want to.
You'll understand why.
When I ask this song, don'tgive me that look.
All right, phyllis, first,what's your shower song?
Speaker 2 (38:57):
That depends on what day it is.
Oh gosh, I just had a shower,so occasionally it's Hallelujah.
Any Katie Lang's version of it,which I think is just a
beautiful version.
Sometimes I make up a song.
Speaker 1 (39:20):
Okay, good, wow, creative in the shower.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
It was Linda Ronstadt the other day.
Yeah, it just depends.
And do you know what?
I love singing in the showerand my last vocal coach was like
it's because of the acousticsin the shower.
Okay, Hmm.
Speaker 1 (39:40):
You don't sing when you clean the baseboards.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
No, cleaning the baseboards is all business.
Speaker 3 (39:44):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
Don't mess with my base mark yeah, I don't have a.
Speaker 1 (39:47):
I don't have a song no, I don't have a song either,
but I do have music and I loveto listen to shine down in the
shower, which sounds like youknow, shine down in the shower,
okay, well, there you have it.
Deep thoughts, um, thank you,jack.
Handy reference to saturdaynight live.
Saturday night live great,great, great, great show.
(40:09):
Uh god, this has been fun ithas been fun, can I?
just tell you I love you, I loveeach of you.
I love this, I love thisexperience.
What a way to build afriendship.
And, oh, I just love you guys.
Um, our next guest who's goingto be appearing on the show?
(40:29):
You can always find out whenyou check out our shows, and our
shows can be found, of course,on our feed.
Just search for the complexityof toilet paper.
We're hosted through Buzzsprout, but if you want the direct
link, go to our Facebook pagethe Complexity of Toilet Paper.
We hope you've enjoyed the pastshows so far and just moving
(40:52):
forward, just so you know thecadence.
What we're trying to do iscreate a good mix of shows where
we've gotten a great humanbeing and we're exploring a
unique thing, like we did withToby Kinsel.
That was a great show,fantastic, as well as shows like
this, which is just the threeof us in the studio.
(41:15):
So anyway, real quick aroundthe horn.
What's your big takeaway fromBiohazard, phil?
Speaker 2 (41:25):
Mark really said it, auth said it authenticity, truth
to self, um, and, and the themethat has run through a lot of
our shows, which is around fearand and and letting that go mine
is what do you stand for andwho are you versus what you've
done?
Speaker 1 (41:44):
That's, that's me.
Speaker 3 (41:45):
Mark, mine is you are the art and whatever you paint
onto that canvas is beautiful.
Just be true to yourself.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
We call this the complexity of toilet paper, and
that's about as simple as itgets.
Thank you for joining us.
Have an amazing, whatever nexthappens.
And hey, when you step into thestall, think of us.
It's okay, we're safe.
Speaker 2 (42:10):
Did you say toilet paper?
Everything complicated, one big, big mess.
I'm overthinking.
Speaker 1 (42:18):
I'm over, I'm overthinking.
This is the complexity oftoilet paper.
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