June 26, 2025 • 48 mins
What does it take to build Phoenix’s largest PR firm? For Jennifer Kaplan, founder and CEO of Evolve PR and Marketing, it started with embracing discomfort and a no-excuses mindset.
From being voted “most talkative” in high school to leading a team built on trust—not micromanagement—Jennifer shares how culture, communication, and strong writing skills have fueled Evolve’s growth. She dives into the difference between brand and reputation, the power of community involvement, and why perception really is reality in PR.
Tune in for insights on scaling a people-first business, the legacy she’s building, and what’s next for Evolve.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the Confidence Curve with Ashley and
Rick Bowers, where personal andprofessional journeys define
the art of scaling withconfidence.
Whether you're a businessleader navigating change or
someone seeking personal growth,this podcast offers insights
and actionable advice to helpyou thrive.
Now let's dive into today'sconversation with our incredible
(00:26):
guest.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hi, welcome to Apex GTS Advisors and our podcast,
the Confidence Curve.
My name is Ashley Bowers.
I'm here with my co-host, rickBowers.
Today we have a very specialguest.
We have the founder and CEO,jennifer Kaplan, of Evolve PR
and Marketing, so we're superexcited to have you on.
We've known each other for areally long time, so it's great.
(00:50):
And you two, of course, havethe Sun Devil connection, which
we'll get into here in a littlebit.
But if we could let's juststart off Tell us a little bit
about you and about Evolve.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
All right.
Well, thank you for having me.
I know we've not had a shortageof conversations in the past,
so I'm sure this will flowreally well.
And yes, I love my ASU SunDevils.
Yeah, born and raised inArizona, went to Arizona State,
got senior most talkative inhigh school.
So I kind of thought that myfuture might be in PR, although
I did want to be a sports agentbecause I really love sports.
(01:20):
And then I realized I had to goto law school.
So I stuck with communications,studied communications with an
emphasis in public relations.
So I did sort of know thatwould be a path that I would
take and at 30, started mybusiness.
And here I am, just a coupleyears later now we won't date
(01:42):
anything.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
So it's been a really fun journey and building the
company to now being the largestPR firm in the Valley, but only
doing PR.
So there are full serviceagencies that do a lot of things
and we only do one thing, whichis PR.
So we work to get our client'sname out in the media via TV,
radio, print, online,influencers, all of that.
(02:06):
So, and I'm pretty hands-on andinvolved, but my team is very
empowered to manage and becreative and work to be an
extension of our client's team.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Well, you mentioned being the largest firm, and so
that was actually kind of wherewe want to start the
conversation.
The achievement of that hashappened in a relatively short
time, so that's tremendousgrowth.
But take us back to the earlydays.
What was it like when you firststarted and kind of what gave
you the confidence to continue,to bring it to the point that it
is today?
Speaker 3 (02:38):
So a couple things I would say.
My mom calls fear the real fourletter F word.
So I do come from a family ofentrepreneurs and taking that
risk was something I wascomfortable uncomfortable with.
And I did start a firm with abusiness partner for five years
(02:59):
and then I sold my equity to herto go on my own with Evolve and
that'll be 15 years.
And when I left her to go on myown I found this great girl who
I'm still friends with to thisday and I was like we're going
to do this, I'm going to startthis firm, you know restart I
mean because I'd had the firmand we had a few clients that
(03:20):
stayed with us with the firm,but I didn't know what it was
going to be, you know kind ofbootstraps-ish, and within six
months we hired our secondperson and really felt like at
that point I knew I was doingsomething, that was really who I
am and that the networking andthe connecting and the passion
(03:43):
for helping people build theirbrand.
So the two employees were sortof quick and then we sat for a
little bit for probably maybetwo years and then at that point
was seeing some of the cadenceand really building our brand,
(04:04):
and one of the ways that I wasfortunate enough to do some of
that was getting involved in thecommunity.
So, while I promote PR and knowthe importance of PR for
businesses and it's somethingthat we define marketing as at
Evolve, which is communityoutreach and cross-promotional
opportunities what other wayscan businesses get their name
out there other than PR?
(04:24):
And so I found, when I wasbuilding my company, I got
involved with an organizationcalled Cystic Fibrosis.
I didn't know what CysticFibrosis was and didn't have any
connection to it at that.
I mean, I'm in my early 30s,but they had a young auxiliary
group and they're all up andcoming people that are building
(04:45):
businesses and wanting to, youknow, support each other, and
that was a huge catalyst even tothis day the relationships and
the referrals and theconnections.
I never would have thought that, almost 20 years later, that
that like way of networking inthe community through charitable
outreach and fundraising andgetting involved would have such
(05:08):
an impact.
But it did, and so we had aspurt of growth.
And then you have your zigzagsalong the way with hiring and
staffing, and how do you grow?
And which way do you grow?
Being in the service industry,it's just the team and the staff
.
We don't have a widget orsomething tangible like
inventory or an asset.
(05:28):
The asset is the team.
Sure, so navigating, you knowthe chicken before the egg.
Do you get the clients?
Do you hire staff?
And so Liz, who's still with meto this day, who maybe has two
clients now because she's in avice president role and running
more, at one point had like I'malmost embarrassed to say like
14 clients, and you can'tservice 14 clients with what we
(05:51):
do.
So you know, navigating thatalong the way and just figuring
out, you know the growth andtrajectory.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
I have to say, this is what I love about us doing
these podcasts, because we'veknown each other.
For what?
12 years maybe now?
Yeah, cause I was at.
HomeSmart for 10, and that'swhen we met, um, and I've
learned two new things about Jen.
In the first, like 30 seconds,so one I just have to say real
quick and I'll turn it to youfor a question.
But, um, the sports agent side,and which made me think of
(06:24):
Mollylly fletcher yeah, I don'tknow if you've ever heard her
speak a female sports agent, andshe was kind of known as like
the female jerry mcguire in theindustry.
We've had her speak for acouple different companies over
the years, but my like newestthing, and I just absolutely
love it um, she wrote a bookcalled dynamic drive and there's
(06:44):
a whole section in it and thena kind of a book that came out
of that called the Energy Clock,and it talks about how you
can't, like you need to stopmanaging your time, basically
because time is finite, and thatyou need to manage your energy,
because energy is infinite, andhow you schedule your day and
making sure that you'rebuffering energizers around,
(07:05):
things that are drainers, andI've been following this now for
a few months and it'sabsolutely amazing.
And so the sports agent thinghit, and then I think about you
and your schedule and all thethings you're trying to
accomplish.
It's an amazing book.
If you have time.
It's like a one-hour Audible.
It's really nice.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Yeah, and what you've shared so far does resonate for
me, because I did have a littleauto challenge today, if you
will, and I just kind of figuredI need to get where I need to
get, but I can't control certainthings, and so I just knew that
you know, from the timeperspective that as long as I am
(07:46):
prepared and show up where Ineed to show up and don't let
people down that I mean I don'tknow the book, but just kind of
what's resonating with today is,you know, there's only so much
we can do.
But there's another aspect oftime I know you're talking about
with the book too.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Oh yeah, but it's still.
Do you have the energy to showup to the next thing, based on
how?
Speaker 3 (08:05):
you manage it.
Yeah, 100%.
All right, I'm going to lookthat up.
Yeah, it's a good one.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
And on Audible she reads it as well, so you hear
her tell the story.
Speaker 3 (08:14):
Oh, I like that.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
So it's fun, and we met her when she spoke, so it's
like, okay, you need to checkthis book out because if you
focus on your energy, you'regoing to have more.
You'll actually feel like youhave more time because that
(08:37):
energy is there and then you'remore productive in that
standpoint.
But I wanted to touch onsomething that you said.
You mentioned the uncomfortabletimes versus the comfortable
times, and when people arestruggling with confidence,
usually it's something thathelps us to do something
uncomfortable and then, asyou're successful with that,
that's where the comfort and theconfidence comes from.
(08:57):
So, as you were going throughsome of those early days, what
was maybe one or two of thoseuncomfortable things that kind
of gave you the confidence,because from the outside,
looking in, you always look veryconfident.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
That's a great question.
And when I've beenuncomfortable is totally when
I've grown, because I've donesomething that I didn't want to
do or didn't think I could do,and then I did it and I felt so
empowered to do, or didn't thinkI could do, and then I did it
and I felt so empowered, youknow, because, again, we don't
have an asset except for people,which is a huge asset but
(09:33):
meaning a tangible product.
Just being in the serviceindustry, most of the challenges
and the uncomfortablesituations were dealing with
staff, I would say.
And then, second to that, wereclient issues, because I want to
make sure that everyone's happyand I want everyone to like me.
So if I can approach it thatway, I'll be perfect.
(09:55):
But that's not always how itworks and especially being in my
30s, my early 30s, when Istarted at 30, I mean, what do I
know from certain situationsthat I had to navigate?
So I also would say fake ittill you make it, and it really
put me in a situation to grow upfast and lean on some mentors
(10:18):
as well.
One story that really sticks outand this was 15-ish years ago,
but I still carry it with metoday we were supposed to do a
screening of a movie and therewere just some layers of things
PR-wise that weren't fallinginto place.
(10:40):
And I get on the phone with theclient and it was kind of a
third-party connection.
So that person was on the phonewith the client and it was kind
of a third party connection, sothat person was on the phone
and I just had I had a perfectreason for all of the things.
And that person said the mostimpactful thing to me they don't
want any excuses, they'repaying us to do a job.
And I thought I had all thesegreat reasons I don't remember
(11:03):
them right now, but it could be.
You know, I didn't get enoughfood that day.
I don't know whatever thereasons are and truly they said
I paid you to do a job.
So I mean basically, likethat's your problem.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Deliver.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
I don't care, and so I realized I'm in a lot of
situations since then.
I never, ever, want to come upwith an excuse.
I either want to lean in towhat we've failed or where we
fell short or what we could havedone better and different, or
don't get to that point, just dowhat you need to do to deliver.
And so that's been like areally raw lesson that I had and
(11:43):
I'm not just chalking it up tobeing younger or not having the
confidence, but that situationreally hit me in the face pretty
hard, and I try to make surethat we never come up with
excuses at Evolve Like we justcan't.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
So does it really become part of your culture?
Speaker 3 (12:03):
like we just can't.
So this, is it really becomepart of your culture?
A hundred percent, yeah, I mean, that's definitely like there's
, and because of what we do, wehave to show results.
So where's the coverage that wehired you for an end of month
report?
You know where are thedeliverables and we can't hide
behind that right so it's reallyimportant that you know we're
ahead of it.
We've done some things at thecompany to make sure midway
(12:25):
through the month where are weat with this client, so we don't
get to the end of the month andthen go sorry, we were waiting
for you to send us something oryou didn't get us what we needed
.
No, what are we doing to beproactive?
Speaker 2 (12:42):
and in those situations, you mentioned people
challenges, staff challengesand things like that as well.
How has your approach toleadership and being connected
with the staff changed over thetime, going from two employees
to over 25 employees?
Because, following Evolve onSocial and things like that, you
(13:04):
can really see you have astrong, close-knit team, but to
your point, there's no excusesand you're having to deliver
results.
So how's your leadership stylechanged over the?
Speaker 3 (13:14):
years I've definitely had to release a lot and not be
as I wouldn't say I wascontrolling, like from a
micromanagement standpoint, butI've tried to just be, feel like
I can empower the team more.
And it's not the team today,it's just over.
(13:35):
You know, it's the, thegeneration of me growing.
And so empowering is definitelyone of them, and letting them
navigate things but know theycan come to me.
One thing that sort of maybehits on what your question is
one thing that I make sure myteam does not do, and I tell new
(13:56):
people when they join do notcall me your boss.
And I think that sets aprecedent to I don't see myself
as a boss.
I don't want to like come thatword is not something I'm
comfortable with.
I work with Jen.
Jen owns the company, jen's theCEO, whatever reference to give
me.
You know the level of who.
(14:18):
I am Right, but I don't likewhen they use the word boss, and
so for me, I feel like thatmakes me more approachable.
At least that's like I said,the way I see it.
So they do know that it's not ascary thing to come to me and
share and know that I'm going tosupport them and be there for
them.
So that's, you know.
Another thing I want to empowerthem, but I want them to know
(14:43):
that I'm here and they can cometo me with anything.
Yeah, so that's one way of sortof navigating the growth,
giving them the empowerment, andthat helps me relinquish some
of that, and then you know,bringing it down to a level
where we can support each other.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Do you feel like and I probably have talked about
this several times on thepodcast, but I like to talk
about when there's engagementwithin the organization, you can
tell the difference between,like renters and owners.
And when you create what you'vejust talked about, you have a
staff full of owners, thosepeople that are really engaged,
it's like it's their ownbusiness and they treat it like
(15:24):
they would treat their own homeversus a rental person in a
rental property, kind of a thing, and so it's just a powerful
when you start to see all ofthat and they buy into the
vision and they understand allof those things.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Yeah, big time.
That's another thing reflectingon the journey that.
I've had, and when I look atcertain periods of starting out
and midway, a lot of turnoverand things that we weren't doing
to create the connection andthe culture and getting people
(15:54):
to want to buy in.
I guess what you know in whatyou're saying and now I guess in
what you're saying and now,knock on wood, so much less
turnover.
And when people are leaving,they're moving out of state or
they're maybe changing theircareer or they're starting a
family or something like that,it's not like we need to go down
(16:17):
the street to the competitor tofind something.
We need to go down the streetto the competitor to find
something and so, yeah, that's agrowing pain, that can be super
challenging.
But, you know, creating thatculture and getting people to
feel, I think, the empowermentis part of that, to make them
feel a part of it and they'reempowered in situations, makes
(16:40):
them maybe more feel that theyhave a stake in you know what
they're doing and, yeah, that'sthat's really important.
I want people to be with meforever.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
One of the things I loved about our working
relationship with Evolve was youknow the fact that it's more
than just a service that you'reproviding out there from a PR
perspective, but also theeducation component, media
training and things like that.
And you know in that we talk alot about.
You know you have your brandsthat you're promoting and then
you have the reputation thatyou're building out there.
(17:16):
Can you talk a little bit forour listeners as they're?
You know, maybe going over that50 employee mark or hitting
that 100 employee mark and youknow kind of the differences.
It might be a nuance, it mightsound just like semantics, but
it's really critical that thoseare really two different things,
and one you have a little bitmore control over than
potentially the other.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
Yeah, so there's a few things there.
So media training and crisis,and then brand and reputation.
So, as part of what we do as anextension of the team with
these clients are helping withmedia training and crisis
communication, because both arereally important in their
messaging and their positioningand their posturing, good or bad
situations.
And then that's internally andexternally.
(17:56):
When it comes to the crisis,media training is just a great
way to build their confidencewhen they're in interviews and
in presentations.
Even Brand and reputation, youknow, are also internal and
external and it could reallydevastate a business or an
organization or it could reallyelevate them and enhance the
(18:19):
allure of that business, and wesee that a lot.
But businesses can come and goreally quick.
So your brand is what you buildand create from starting with a
logo.
You know what are the colors,what is your look, what is your
feel.
You know we don't know what aStarbuck is, but they created a
brand and that is a brand EvenUber, xerox, over the years.
(18:42):
You think about these brandsthat people use to compare Can
you Xerox this or can you?
I'm going to call an Uber, butyou're really maybe calling a
different ride share.
So those companies have built abrand, then the reputation is
totally different.
So the reputation is whatpeople think of you.
Oh, I don't like Starbucks.
Their coffee is blah blah blah.
(19:03):
Or I never take Uber, I takeLyft.
So the reputation is somethingthat businesses.
It's really hard for them tochange reputation Brand as well,
but maybe you'll see a brandrefresh or do whatever, and it's
still Uber.
But they went from black andwhite to yellow and white, but
(19:25):
you're still going to have thatperception.
And I tell people and clientsall the time perception is
reality and so it's really hardto change that perception and
that reputation that people haveof you.
And the second you wake up andget on a virtual at your house
or walk out the door and go tothe gym or the grocery store,
(19:45):
your reputation is there.
So the way you look, the wayyou act, what you say, how you
say it, people are creatingthese perceptions of you and you
are representing yourself andyour organization.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
Right, and it's so important for the staff right to
even know and understandingwhat they're putting out there,
their digital footprint and allI mean it's just the education
is valuable for the organizationand what they're trying to
achieve and you're really doinga service to that team too for
their futures, Because a lot oftimes just depending on for
first getting in, it's like,well, my social is my social,
and it's like but it's not, itis your digital footprint,
(20:20):
whether you want it to be or not.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
I see.
Speaker 3 (20:23):
A lot of people that are in.
Well, celebrities do this.
Media people do this.
They'll create a separatesocial media page that's not
their real name, that they wantto curate whatever content to
people that they just want tohave see it.
Or now, on social media, youcan actually just have your
regular page and then there'scertain content, so you don't
(20:44):
need to create a second one witha pseudonym or another name,
but there's certain posts thatyou can share that only certain
people will see.
Your small groups.
Right because they know.
They know that to the massesit's not the greatest thing to
put out there.
But when I'm not just puttingkids down, but high school
graduates, college graduates, tobe thinking about where they
(21:09):
might rush for a sorority,fraternity or do an internship
or look for a job, thoseemployers or people that are
looking at them will probably goto the social and look and get
a perception of what they putout there.
So yeah, the digital footprintis and it's technically forever.
I mean, yes, you can take downa page or block a page, you know
(21:29):
your own page, but I mean theInternet's forever.
It's really hard to work aroundthat.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
We talked a lot about your team and how awesome the
team is and how well you getalong in the culture and those
kinds of things, which kind ofbuilds that employee brand as
well.
So you have the company brandbut there's an employee brand.
Some companies struggle withthat and then they also struggle
to hire new people because thatreputation gets out there of
(21:57):
kind of what it is, what's itlike to work for this company.
So have you worked withorganizations to try to fix the
employee brand side of thingsfrom a PR standpoint?
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Yeah, I mean, my big thing with that is it has to
seem authentic and if it feelslike they're fixing or
overcompensating to do somethingbecause they know they need to,
people sometimes see rightthrough that and so I feel like
it's got to be so real and evenif it's not, but it's got to
(22:30):
feel that way, or else we're inanother damage control situation
as well, like theovercorrecting.
So you know, doing things tobuild the team together and not
just feel like you're goingthrough some motion just because
you need to.
And it is hard.
I mean, you've got people ofdifferent ages and backgrounds
(22:52):
and you know this one's married,this one's not.
This one, you know, went to thesame school as maybe a coworker
and this one didn't.
So you've got to make everyonefeel so inclusive and it's
something we talk about atEvolve all the time.
It is a crazy, crazy gift.
I don't know how this got built.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
And it's all them.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
And, of course, what I can try to do.
But it's so special when yourteam can support each other and
back each other up and have eachother's back, and I think it's
so special.
I say at Evolve I don't want towork in an environment that has
drama and dynamics and stuff.
So I don't want to create anenvironment that is that way,
(23:39):
because I don't want to work atthat place.
So you know, finding thatformula is important but it can
be very challenging, you know,for organizations to get over
that hump.
But you know, I think doing itwith authenticity and culture is
really.
I mean, the people should befirst, absolutely.
Speaker 4 (23:57):
It really should be.
I agree with what you said.
It's not a fix, it's kind of anurture or a rebuild.
It really starts with theleadership and them connecting
with the people.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
And it's so much more challenging now for companies
that haven't gone back to eitherworking in their office or
they've gone back even verylimited.
You have to work even harderfor those connections and the
culture, because it's not mondaythrough friday anymore.
I mean businesses are, I don'tmean that it's zero, but it's
not in the office.
But it's changed so much, andso you've got to work harder on
(24:33):
that well, you know and foreveryou know we.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
What's the saying?
You don't leave companies, youleave you know bosses and and
stuff, and so that connectivitywith connectivity with your
coworkers is what kept you kindof through some of the hard
times, cause every company goesthrough some bumps and bruises.
I always used to say, like it'snot all rainbows and
butterflies all the time, butit's also not all doom and gloom
all the time either.
Right, like we have our ups anddowns and that connectivity
(24:59):
keeps you through those downs.
Right, I mean, it's just likein personal relationships and
without that now I feel likesometimes employees are a little
bit faster to give up on it andmaybe look at the next
opportunity.
So it's keeping it so important.
I also think, doing somethingyou're super passionate about
and obviously you guys help.
You know so many differentorganizations and different
(25:20):
products and different services.
Is there any like project thatcomes to mind that was a super
passion project for you that,like you and or your whole team,
just got so excited over whatit was that you were able to be
a part of from a clientperspective that you can share?
Speaker 3 (25:35):
yeah, and this one is an easy answer, and it also got
the media super excited as well.
Sprinkles cupcakes oh so theycame here to the valley and they
were this beverly hills brandand oprah, you know, had them on
their show.
I mean, this is dating way backand they came here to the
valley and we had theopportunity to work with them
(25:57):
and we were with them for nineyears and Candice Nelson, who
founded Sprinkles, was onCupcake Wars and doing all this
stuff on the Food Network, ourfood channel, and we had her
here locally on the cover ofmagazines and we're bringing
cupcakes to all the TV stationsand I mean we would joke that we
were like had the back door toall these, you know, media
(26:18):
people and it was such a bigpart in the growth of my career,
more so on the media sidebecause every month I was
bringing cupcakes, they lookedforward to it.
I let them know I was coming,they would open the back door,
and so it was.
Really it was a fun product andI love sweets and sugar.
So I was excited to do meetingswith them.
(26:41):
I would eat and you probablyknow some of my idiosyncrasies
with food and health and allthat I would eat three cupcakes
in a meeting.
Then I narrowed it down to twoand a frosting shot, because
they would give you shots offrosting and I would go to the
back door of Sprinkles.
They had the graveyard, whichis where the cupcakes that
(27:01):
didn't look presentable for thefront.
So there were these racks ofthe cupcakes that were on the
graveyard and I would go to theback door.
I mean I was like so personally, professionally, and it was so
fun.
You know it was the Valentine'scupcake or the St Patty's
cupcake or the holiday cupcake.
Yeah, and I learned a lot.
It really those nine years weremore the beginning of Evolve
(27:25):
and it helped me grow up a lotand learn a lot.
They had a lot of standards andbrand standards and just
different things.
That helped me mature and growas a PR person too, that's
amazing.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
So when we talked earlier this week, we talked a
little bit about externalcommunication versus internal
communication and justunderstanding what information
is critical to get out earlyversus what should wait till a
certain point, because maybecertain times product releases
and you don't want leaks orthings like that.
So how do you help people withthat internal communication or
(28:04):
what message would you haveabout internal communication?
Speaker 3 (28:08):
Do it and I've learned that and that's a
challenge of mine learning everyday is to make sure that
businesses are.
You don't want your teaminternally to find something out
about your own company orsomething you're working on.
It might not even truly affectthem maybe it's a product launch
and they didn't work on thatproduct or something but they're
(28:30):
still.
It still makes them feel thatequity in the company and in the
brand.
So I would say, first of all,internal is number one and that
message is going to be differentinternally than externally.
So I would say that has got tobe number one and consult with
you.
Know, maybe it's an in-house PRperson or marketing person, but
(28:52):
sometimes messages can beemotional or reactive and so to
make sure it's that's why welove when our clients do use us
as that outside gut check,because we come from a different
place and can see itdifferently.
And then, externally, you knowthat's obviously key to some of
the other stuff we're talkingabout with brand and reputation.
(29:13):
But internally, I mean, you canlose people like that if if you
don't make them feel likethey're part of that.
And there's some companies rightnow that they've got some
announcements and they're nottelling everyone on their team.
They're telling you, but notyou.
So when I tell everyone it'sprobably going to come out,
(29:39):
somebody else knew Right, ormaybe you're going to sidebar I
actually kind of knew that andthen you're going to feel like,
well, I give just as much to thecompany, why didn't I know?
And now, guess what?
Now you're kind of mentallychecking out and you have
resentment and it just causes,and maybe even to a coworker if
that was your coworker nowyou're like, well, I don't even
(29:59):
like him anymore because he knewbefore me.
And so, yeah, I would sayinternal is just as important,
not more.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
It's funny because we in previous life would use code
words for a lot of things whicha lot of companies do.
Speaker 3 (30:13):
That's what this company is doing too.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Yeah, a lot of code words, and we had a subset of
people that were typically readin on every code word project.
And so people who were neverread in on code words, like they
would just know, they kind ofhad an idea of what type of
thing would be coming, becausethat's what we use code words
for, and usually had the mindsetof of, okay, that tells us
(30:35):
something is coming and I'm justgonna keep my head down until,
like, I need to deal with it,and so that was okay.
And then we had a biggerproject that also had a code
word and about four people whowere typically read in weren't
read in in the beginning and wejust, you know, like, okay,
we're using a code word, we dodo this all the time.
It's accepted, it's trusted.
But what it did to like thosefour people, like am I on my way
(30:59):
out?
I'm always read in, and now I'mnot.
And it was just a huge miss.
And luckily the relationshipswere strong enough where those
people were coming in and sayingI'm seeing meetings with a code
word, I'm not in them, like isit intentional?
Can I know about it?
Like what's happening?
And we could have a dialogue torebuild that trust.
But thank goodness that theydid feel like they could come
(31:21):
and have the conversation,because they were creating a
narrative that was not true andwas way worse than the exciting
news of the code word Right,which I always try to tell
somebody when we're consultingwith different companies and
stuff.
They're like, well, they don'tneed to know or I don't have
information to share yet.
I only know this much and it'slike but they know that you know
something, they know thatsomething is going on.
(31:43):
Just tell them the informationthat you have and build the
trust that, as you have moreinformation, it will be shared.
Yeah, you know.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
Yeah, even if it's a meeting that you closed your
door and you normally don'tclose your door for those
meetings with that person likepeople are going to pick up on
the energy and the vibe in theoffice and the narrative they
make up is always worse.
Speaker 2 (32:02):
I feel like always 100 percent.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
So it's easier just to you know, kind of dispel it
as best you can.
But I do agree there arecertain situations and certain
times a merger and acquisition,a public filing, you know things
like that.
That.
I know you do want to managethat when the time is right to
tell the team, but it can besort of polarizing how it
(32:26):
affects the dynamics.
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 4 (32:29):
So, as you think about kind of growing the
company over the last decade, Iguess what have been some of the
things that have beensuccessful mentoring young
people coming up in the PRindustry?
What are some of those tips andtricks?
Speaker 3 (32:45):
Well, the biggest thing I tell people if they want
to get into PR because a lot ofpeople are like I love PR, I
love people and I loveconnecting people but the one
thing that is really importantin our job is writing.
And we're not writing thesis anddissertations and things like
that, but we've got to writesomething in a way that's going
to catch the media's attention.
(33:07):
Or we're writing statements or,you know, press releases,
pitches, things like that, andthere's certainly there's AP
style and there's, you know,forums, that, things like that,
and certainly there's AP styleand there's forums that we
follow with that.
But if someone can't really tapinto that writing skill, it's
pretty challenging in our job,even with technology and even
(33:29):
with AI and chat, gpts and allof that, because we know that
that's out there.
Well, we have to writesomething, we have to edit it,
we have to proof it, we have to.
So I have a lot of friends whoare like oh, my daughter or son
wants to do PR and I'm like whatis their experience writing and
do they like writing?
Because we're storytelling andso if we're not, you know, doing
(33:54):
that, that then we're going toprobably fall a little short and
so, yeah, I would say writingis an important skill for pr
well, I think you said that.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
Do they like writing right?
Because we do do a lot of it.
Yeah, there's a lot of the time, and so is it something that
they're passionate about, inaddition to having a competency
in.
Speaker 3 (34:12):
Yeah, and that is something with interviewing
people for a position.
We give them writing tests andwe want to put them through some
of those examples so we cantell if they like it, if they're
passionate about it, if they'regood at it.
So that's an important one.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
I volunteered at a student veteran event at asu
last week and reviewing resumes,helping with interview press or
prep and those kinds of things.
And there was one girl and herresume was like very, very good,
but you could tell it was justdetail, detail, detail, detail.
And I was like you're anelectrical engineer but there's
(34:54):
no passion here and she lookedat me like I don't have passion
for this.
It's like she, she got thedegree for the wrong reason
right and I said but you hadlike this summary paragraph at
the top, has to stand out andget somebody's attention, and so
it goes back to writing.
And if you can't tell a storyeven in that short paragraph to
get the interviewer's attention,you're going to struggle.
Speaker 3 (35:16):
So they were just more tactical than making it
come across like I want to builda career in this industry and
yeah, I mean, that's the otherthing too.
Those words, you know, comeacross.
You know, even a social mediapost going back to that Someone
could write maybe not try to saythe wrong thing, but you know
it across.
You know even a social mediapost going back to that Someone
(35:37):
could write maybe not try to saythe wrong thing, but you know
it can come across the wrong way.
So same thing a resume, anythingWriting is an important skill.
Speaker 2 (35:44):
Okay, well, we have to talk about the impact that
you've made.
Obviously, you know yes, youknow being a native going to ASU
, being an entrepreneur, you'vedone so many different things
and we'll jump into scholarshipand some of the work at ASU.
But kind of, you know, lookingback and now dreaming forward,
what are some of the impactsthat you want to make in the
(36:04):
next 10 years?
Speaker 3 (36:06):
Great question.
I want to double and triple insize.
I want to continue growing.
I feel this energy and thisopportunity of what Evolve
foundationally has done and 10years like the next 10 years
then we'll talk.
It might be different where Ifocus, but I'm all in.
(36:30):
I see a great opportunity forPR and us pivoting where we need
to pivot, with technology anddifferent nuances like podcasts
and influencers and things thataren't just in that traditional
media lane, and the energy andexcitement from our team to want
to go down that path and not bestuck where maybe other PR
(36:52):
firms or, you know,practitioners are.
And so we want to really growlocally and nationally and, yeah
, increase a lot.
Speaker 2 (37:02):
So yeah, my goal you can see light up as you talk
about it.
Speaker 3 (37:04):
Yeah definitely the energy is there, so I'll read
Molly's book and hear more abouttime and energy, but yeah, I
definitely feel it.
I don't feel like I'm on a winddown.
Wind down, almost a renewedenergy too that's awesome,
wonderful.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
Okay, you two, we have to talk about asu.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
Yes, um so one of the things that I think is is
amazing is just the the sundevil 100, and you're one of a
handful maybe less than fivecompanies that have been awarded
every year since they startedthe process.
So what has the Sun Devil 100meant to you or done for your
business?
Speaker 3 (37:42):
Well, first I have to say I'm not a Wildcat fan and I
love the rivalry.
So my Arizona people sorry, I'ma big Sun Devil and I can't
wait until football season.
Oh, I know, because basketballI can't wait till football
season.
I know, because basketball Idon't talk smack.
So the Sun Devil 100 has reallyopened my eyes to ways that I
can stay involved at theuniversity and while I love the
(38:07):
recognition and the camaraderieamong the other Sun Devil 100
individuals and the people I'vemet and learning about other
businesses, it's been a greatway for me to stay or get
engaged with university.
And so for me the first thingwas a scholarship and the Sun
(38:31):
Devil 100, after a couple yearsI realized there's probably more
ways that I could give back tothe university and I don't have
kids.
So creating a legacy was alsoimportant to me.
And creating the scholarship,for I have initial parameters to
it which are mimicking me alittle bit someone from Arizona,
(38:55):
female, wanting to do PR, allof that.
But then if no one's in, thatit's, you know, male or female,
and all of that.
But I want to support and liftup other, you know, people
wanting to pursue their passionand their career.
And I get to meet them everyyear and stay in touch with them
and it's really special.
(39:16):
So the Sun Devil 100 continuesto be sort of that catalyst and
bright light for my initialevery year wanting to do more.
I can't explain it.
It's like more than alumni,it's more than even though it is
, we're all alumni.
It's just this very, you know,uplifting thing to hear these
(39:37):
stories of entrepreneurs andpeople that we share, this ASU
journey back in the day where weall probably never thought
20-30 years later we'd be backat the campus, you know,
rah-rah-ing each other, and thenhad the opportunity this last
year, in the last few months, toname a conference room at the
school that I went to, um at thehugh down school of
(40:01):
communication, which I meangetting me to class was enough
of a challenge as it is, and nowI have a conference room.
Um, I still don't know where thelibrary is at asU, because I
never went there.
No, I'm kidding, but you know Iowe that all to Sun Devil 100,
truly because it's just reallyhelped me see and appreciate the
(40:24):
value that ASU had in my lifeand ways that I can continue
supporting the university.
Speaker 4 (40:30):
Have you had a meeting in your conference room?
Speaker 3 (40:33):
I haven't and I definitely.
That's definitely on the list.
I mean, it was pretty new thatwe did it a couple months ago,
right?
So yeah, it's pretty neat tothink about you know, people
making a meeting in the buildingand saying what, what room are
they?
I don't know?
Are they going to say JGK?
Are they going to shorten it,jk, kaplan room, I don't know.
(40:53):
But yeah, going to say JGK, arethey going?
Speaker 2 (40:54):
to shorten it.
Speaker 3 (40:55):
JK Kaplan Room.
I don't know.
But yeah, I wanted to havesomething a little bit more, and
maybe there's again somethingin the future that I'll do more
at the university, so I'mexcited about that.
But I won't stop with that.
Sun Devil 100.
Yeah, as long as we hit thosenumbers and we're doing the
things to qualify, I still wantto continue that as well that's
(41:17):
awesome um.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
So I mean whether it goes back to when we kind of
talked about this a little bitum on the we talked earlier this
week.
But you know, looking back atyou know when you graduated, you
know to today, and thatconnection that you have still
um with the university and howinvolved you're in I know that
that's really important to you.
What other advice would yougive your younger self, kind of
(41:40):
looking back?
Speaker 3 (41:43):
Well, maybe get some more sleep along the way as an
entrepreneur.
I think that I mean I don't wantto divert the question, but I
feel like some of those misstepsor experiences I didn't
necessarily want to go throughgot me to where I am.
(42:05):
You know I am still friendswith my ex-business partner, but
you know that's not something Iwould have wanted to navigate
and so, but had I not had thosesituations, I really and like I
said, I'm not trying to becliche or kind of soften what
(42:25):
you're trying to answer, but Ireally feel like the growth came
through some of the challengesthat I did have.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
So, for what I take from that, though, is embrace
the bumps.
Yeah, totally so there's goingto be some turbulent times, but
embrace them, because those arereally big growing moments,
versus maybe resisting them aswe do when we're in them.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
And stay focused on your passion.
I mean I would use well, notsurprised I make a sports
reference but Tiger Woods, Imean he would use well, not
surprised I make a sportsreference, but Tiger Woods, I
mean he got to such anincredible place in his career
but then you'll see his parentsshow pictures of him at three
years old with a golf club, likehe stayed focused on what he
wanted to do.
So maybe less about the youngerself, but also what I would
(43:11):
tell people on their journey.
The engineer, you know, what isshe passionate about?
What are people passionateabout?
You know, you've got a skill,you've got something that gets
you excited, and then thesuccess or the reward will come
if you're doing something thatyou love.
So I think that's what helpedme get through some of those
times.
But yeah, there's definitelybeen those challenges where I
(43:33):
wanted to throw it in, but thenI look back and I realize that
it helped me grow.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
Those little moments, yep All right.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
I like to always end with a fun question.
So for those of you that followyou on social media, they know
your love for cruising.
Yes, your cruises.
I've never been on a cruise youhave.
So what would yourrecommendation be for someone
new?
And maybe what would yourrecommendation be for someone
new and maybe what's yourfavorite or your bucket list
cruise?
Speaker 3 (43:56):
Well, I do feel like people either love or hate it.
I talk to people and they'relike we love cruising.
Or oh, I went on a cruise and Ididn't like it at all.
To me I say what didn't youlike?
I mean, you put your luggage inthe room, you pay one price and
you go and have some fun thefood and drink and the
entertainment and the activitiesand going to different ports.
(44:16):
You don't need to think aboutany of that.
So I love cruising.
I did grow up with cruisingbecause my dad was in the travel
industry, so I guess I'm alittle biased because I did have
that pretty much my whole life.
But I do love the getting onthe ship and truly not having to
think.
When you go on vacation andthere are all-inclusive resorts
(44:39):
that have a similar structurebut let's say, your typical
vacation you've got to figureout your transportation and
where are we going to go todinner and you know what kind of
activities.
What do you want to do?
What do you want to do On acruise ship?
I mean, they dummy proof it foryou.
It's like all right there youcan eat here for this food and
it's just so easy.
And so I love that.
(45:00):
And I do like waking up andbeing in a different port, um,
the, the Caribbean and the youknow, the Bahamas, and those
types of cruises are great.
Um, I have found over the lastfour or five years and I did one
when I was younger, but four orfive years doing European
cruises are so different A lotof the Bahamas and Caribbean.
(45:25):
You wake up and it kind oflooks the same.
Each port, obviously, each cityhas something special and I can
sit at a beach bar all day long, so I'm fine with that.
But in Europe it's like youwake up here in Croatia and you
wake up here in Italy and youwake up here in these different
countries, and that, to me, hasbeen something really special.
(45:47):
So I'm looking forward to thatin the next couple weeks.
Speaker 2 (45:49):
Yeah, it's going to be amazing.
The one that I went on was forwork and it was mediterranean,
and so it was, uh, 14 days, 11ports, starting in rome and
ending in barcelona, and, yeah,it was only one day at sea.
Yeah, um, and I thought it wasamazing.
It's the same thing like youunpack, you're done, everything
is there, it's all planned foryou.
(46:10):
You get to go see all thesedifferent places without packing
and repacking, which is a petpeeve of mine on vacation.
So, and he loves water, I thinkhe'll love it.
Yeah, oh sure.
Speaker 3 (46:20):
So if you like water, yes so and I can't imagine you
would get seasick if you likewater and boating and things
like that.
So you know, I think that'ssomething that people get.
One thing is they want to bestuck.
They don't want to be stuck ona boat and then be seasick.
So I can appreciate that.
I tell people to take maybe athree-day cruise to get
acclimated to that and then,outside of that, the other thing
(46:42):
that people say is they justdon't want to feel so confined.
These ships are so big You'renot feeling confined, you're not
on top of each other.
I mean, maybe if you go to abreakfast buffet at 7 30 you'll
feel that way, uh, but for themost part, yeah, you know, it's
very spread out and I mean, alot of these ships now have over
(47:03):
the top experiences and shopsand some of them have 40
restaurants and it's justunbelievable.
Yeah, yeah, you want fornothing.
You'll be hooked.
Speaker 2 (47:13):
I want to know after you go.
All right, all right, we haveto look at that one for next
year.
Yeah Well, it's been amazinghaving you on today.
We really appreciate youdedicating the time and sharing
some stories with us.
If people want to talk to youmore about Evolve, about
cruising, about your giving backto ASU, where should they reach
out?
Speaker 3 (47:33):
I would say the website is the best and easiest
evolveprandmarketingcom, andit's got the contact us and the
socials and the phone numbersand all the things.
So I think that's the best Allright, well, thank you.
Speaker 2 (47:47):
Thank you so much for being here.
Speaker 3 (47:47):
We really appreciate it, Thank you.
Speaker 2 (47:48):
Bo Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (47:53):
Thanks for tuning in to the Confidence Curve.
We hope today's episode leftyou inspired and ready to
embrace your journey confidently.
Remember whether you're leadinga team, growing your business
or pursuing personal growth,each step forward builds your
curve.
If you enjoyed today'sconversation, don't forget to
(48:14):
subscribe, share and leave us areview For more insights and
resources.
Visit us at apexgtscom.
Until next time, keep climbingthe curve.
Welcome to the Confidence Curve with Ashley and
Rick Bowers, where personal andprofessional journeys define
the art of scaling withconfidence.
Whether you're a businessleader navigating change or
someone seeking personal growth,this podcast offers insights
and actionable advice to helpyou thrive.
Now let's dive into today'sconversation with our incredible
(00:26):
guest.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hi, welcome to Apex GTS Advisors and our podcast,
the Confidence Curve.
My name is Ashley Bowers.
I'm here with my co-host, rickBowers.
Today we have a very specialguest.
We have the founder and CEO,jennifer Kaplan, of Evolve PR
and Marketing, so we're superexcited to have you on.
We've known each other for areally long time, so it's great.
(00:50):
And you two, of course, havethe Sun Devil connection, which
we'll get into here in a littlebit.
But if we could let's juststart off Tell us a little bit
about you and about Evolve.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
All right.
Well, thank you for having me.
I know we've not had a shortageof conversations in the past,
so I'm sure this will flowreally well.
And yes, I love my ASU SunDevils.
Yeah, born and raised inArizona, went to Arizona State,
got senior most talkative inhigh school.
So I kind of thought that myfuture might be in PR, although
I did want to be a sports agentbecause I really love sports.
(01:20):
And then I realized I had to goto law school.
So I stuck with communications,studied communications with an
emphasis in public relations.
So I did sort of know thatwould be a path that I would
take and at 30, started mybusiness.
And here I am, just a coupleyears later now we won't date
(01:42):
anything.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
So it's been a really fun journey and building the
company to now being the largestPR firm in the Valley, but only
doing PR.
So there are full serviceagencies that do a lot of things
and we only do one thing, whichis PR.
So we work to get our client'sname out in the media via TV,
radio, print, online,influencers, all of that.
(02:06):
So, and I'm pretty hands-on andinvolved, but my team is very
empowered to manage and becreative and work to be an
extension of our client's team.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Well, you mentioned being the largest firm, and so
that was actually kind of wherewe want to start the
conversation.
The achievement of that hashappened in a relatively short
time, so that's tremendousgrowth.
But take us back to the earlydays.
What was it like when you firststarted and kind of what gave
you the confidence to continue,to bring it to the point that it
is today?
Speaker 3 (02:38):
So a couple things I would say.
My mom calls fear the real fourletter F word.
So I do come from a family ofentrepreneurs and taking that
risk was something I wascomfortable uncomfortable with.
And I did start a firm with abusiness partner for five years
(02:59):
and then I sold my equity to herto go on my own with Evolve and
that'll be 15 years.
And when I left her to go on myown I found this great girl who
I'm still friends with to thisday and I was like we're going
to do this, I'm going to startthis firm, you know restart I
mean because I'd had the firmand we had a few clients that
(03:20):
stayed with us with the firm,but I didn't know what it was
going to be, you know kind ofbootstraps-ish, and within six
months we hired our secondperson and really felt like at
that point I knew I was doingsomething, that was really who I
am and that the networking andthe connecting and the passion
(03:43):
for helping people build theirbrand.
So the two employees were sortof quick and then we sat for a
little bit for probably maybetwo years and then at that point
was seeing some of the cadenceand really building our brand,
(04:04):
and one of the ways that I wasfortunate enough to do some of
that was getting involved in thecommunity.
So, while I promote PR and knowthe importance of PR for
businesses and it's somethingthat we define marketing as at
Evolve, which is communityoutreach and cross-promotional
opportunities what other wayscan businesses get their name
out there other than PR?
(04:24):
And so I found, when I wasbuilding my company, I got
involved with an organizationcalled Cystic Fibrosis.
I didn't know what CysticFibrosis was and didn't have any
connection to it at that.
I mean, I'm in my early 30s,but they had a young auxiliary
group and they're all up andcoming people that are building
(04:45):
businesses and wanting to, youknow, support each other, and
that was a huge catalyst even tothis day the relationships and
the referrals and theconnections.
I never would have thought that, almost 20 years later, that
that like way of networking inthe community through charitable
outreach and fundraising andgetting involved would have such
(05:08):
an impact.
But it did, and so we had aspurt of growth.
And then you have your zigzagsalong the way with hiring and
staffing, and how do you grow?
And which way do you grow?
Being in the service industry,it's just the team and the staff
.
We don't have a widget orsomething tangible like
inventory or an asset.
(05:28):
The asset is the team.
Sure, so navigating, you knowthe chicken before the egg.
Do you get the clients?
Do you hire staff?
And so Liz, who's still with meto this day, who maybe has two
clients now because she's in avice president role and running
more, at one point had like I'malmost embarrassed to say like
14 clients, and you can'tservice 14 clients with what we
(05:51):
do.
So you know, navigating thatalong the way and just figuring
out, you know the growth andtrajectory.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
I have to say, this is what I love about us doing
these podcasts, because we'veknown each other.
For what?
12 years maybe now?
Yeah, cause I was at.
HomeSmart for 10, and that'swhen we met, um, and I've
learned two new things about Jen.
In the first, like 30 seconds,so one I just have to say real
quick and I'll turn it to youfor a question.
But, um, the sports agent side,and which made me think of
(06:24):
Mollylly fletcher yeah, I don'tknow if you've ever heard her
speak a female sports agent, andshe was kind of known as like
the female jerry mcguire in theindustry.
We've had her speak for acouple different companies over
the years, but my like newestthing, and I just absolutely
love it um, she wrote a bookcalled dynamic drive and there's
(06:44):
a whole section in it and thena kind of a book that came out
of that called the Energy Clock,and it talks about how you
can't, like you need to stopmanaging your time, basically
because time is finite, and thatyou need to manage your energy,
because energy is infinite, andhow you schedule your day and
making sure that you'rebuffering energizers around,
(07:05):
things that are drainers, andI've been following this now for
a few months and it'sabsolutely amazing.
And so the sports agent thinghit, and then I think about you
and your schedule and all thethings you're trying to
accomplish.
It's an amazing book.
If you have time.
It's like a one-hour Audible.
It's really nice.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Yeah, and what you've shared so far does resonate for
me, because I did have a littleauto challenge today, if you
will, and I just kind of figuredI need to get where I need to
get, but I can't control certainthings, and so I just knew that
you know, from the timeperspective that as long as I am
(07:46):
prepared and show up where Ineed to show up and don't let
people down that I mean I don'tknow the book, but just kind of
what's resonating with today is,you know, there's only so much
we can do.
But there's another aspect oftime I know you're talking about
with the book too.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Oh yeah, but it's still.
Do you have the energy to showup to the next thing, based on
how?
Speaker 3 (08:05):
you manage it.
Yeah, 100%.
All right, I'm going to lookthat up.
Yeah, it's a good one.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
And on Audible she reads it as well, so you hear
her tell the story.
Speaker 3 (08:14):
Oh, I like that.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
So it's fun, and we met her when she spoke, so it's
like, okay, you need to checkthis book out because if you
focus on your energy, you'regoing to have more.
You'll actually feel like youhave more time because that
(08:37):
energy is there and then you'remore productive in that
standpoint.
But I wanted to touch onsomething that you said.
You mentioned the uncomfortabletimes versus the comfortable
times, and when people arestruggling with confidence,
usually it's something thathelps us to do something
uncomfortable and then, asyou're successful with that,
that's where the comfort and theconfidence comes from.
(08:57):
So, as you were going throughsome of those early days, what
was maybe one or two of thoseuncomfortable things that kind
of gave you the confidence,because from the outside,
looking in, you always look veryconfident.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
That's a great question.
And when I've beenuncomfortable is totally when
I've grown, because I've donesomething that I didn't want to
do or didn't think I could do,and then I did it and I felt so
empowered to do, or didn't thinkI could do, and then I did it
and I felt so empowered, youknow, because, again, we don't
have an asset except for people,which is a huge asset but
(09:33):
meaning a tangible product.
Just being in the serviceindustry, most of the challenges
and the uncomfortablesituations were dealing with
staff, I would say.
And then, second to that, wereclient issues, because I want to
make sure that everyone's happyand I want everyone to like me.
So if I can approach it thatway, I'll be perfect.
(09:55):
But that's not always how itworks and especially being in my
30s, my early 30s, when Istarted at 30, I mean, what do I
know from certain situationsthat I had to navigate?
So I also would say fake ittill you make it, and it really
put me in a situation to grow upfast and lean on some mentors
(10:18):
as well.
One story that really sticks outand this was 15-ish years ago,
but I still carry it with metoday we were supposed to do a
screening of a movie and therewere just some layers of things
PR-wise that weren't fallinginto place.
(10:40):
And I get on the phone with theclient and it was kind of a
third-party connection.
So that person was on the phonewith the client and it was kind
of a third party connection, sothat person was on the phone
and I just had I had a perfectreason for all of the things.
And that person said the mostimpactful thing to me they don't
want any excuses, they'repaying us to do a job.
And I thought I had all thesegreat reasons I don't remember
(11:03):
them right now, but it could be.
You know, I didn't get enoughfood that day.
I don't know whatever thereasons are and truly they said
I paid you to do a job.
So I mean basically, likethat's your problem.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Deliver.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
I don't care, and so I realized I'm in a lot of
situations since then.
I never, ever, want to come upwith an excuse.
I either want to lean in towhat we've failed or where we
fell short or what we could havedone better and different, or
don't get to that point, just dowhat you need to do to deliver.
And so that's been like areally raw lesson that I had and
(11:43):
I'm not just chalking it up tobeing younger or not having the
confidence, but that situationreally hit me in the face pretty
hard, and I try to make surethat we never come up with
excuses at Evolve Like we justcan't.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
So does it really become part of your culture?
Speaker 3 (12:03):
like we just can't.
So this, is it really becomepart of your culture?
A hundred percent, yeah, I mean, that's definitely like there's
, and because of what we do, wehave to show results.
So where's the coverage that wehired you for an end of month
report?
You know where are thedeliverables and we can't hide
behind that right so it's reallyimportant that you know we're
ahead of it.
We've done some things at thecompany to make sure midway
(12:25):
through the month where are weat with this client, so we don't
get to the end of the month andthen go sorry, we were waiting
for you to send us something oryou didn't get us what we needed
.
No, what are we doing to beproactive?
Speaker 2 (12:42):
and in those situations, you mentioned people
challenges, staff challengesand things like that as well.
How has your approach toleadership and being connected
with the staff changed over thetime, going from two employees
to over 25 employees?
Because, following Evolve onSocial and things like that, you
(13:04):
can really see you have astrong, close-knit team, but to
your point, there's no excusesand you're having to deliver
results.
So how's your leadership stylechanged over the?
Speaker 3 (13:14):
years I've definitely had to release a lot and not be
as I wouldn't say I wascontrolling, like from a
micromanagement standpoint, butI've tried to just be, feel like
I can empower the team more.
And it's not the team today,it's just over.
(13:35):
You know, it's the, thegeneration of me growing.
And so empowering is definitelyone of them, and letting them
navigate things but know theycan come to me.
One thing that sort of maybehits on what your question is
one thing that I make sure myteam does not do, and I tell new
(13:56):
people when they join do notcall me your boss.
And I think that sets aprecedent to I don't see myself
as a boss.
I don't want to like come thatword is not something I'm
comfortable with.
I work with Jen.
Jen owns the company, jen's theCEO, whatever reference to give
me.
You know the level of who.
(14:18):
I am Right, but I don't likewhen they use the word boss, and
so for me, I feel like thatmakes me more approachable.
At least that's like I said,the way I see it.
So they do know that it's not ascary thing to come to me and
share and know that I'm going tosupport them and be there for
them.
So that's, you know.
Another thing I want to empowerthem, but I want them to know
(14:43):
that I'm here and they can cometo me with anything.
Yeah, so that's one way of sortof navigating the growth,
giving them the empowerment, andthat helps me relinquish some
of that, and then you know,bringing it down to a level
where we can support each other.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Do you feel like and I probably have talked about
this several times on thepodcast, but I like to talk
about when there's engagementwithin the organization, you can
tell the difference between,like renters and owners.
And when you create what you'vejust talked about, you have a
staff full of owners, thosepeople that are really engaged,
it's like it's their ownbusiness and they treat it like
(15:24):
they would treat their own homeversus a rental person in a
rental property, kind of a thing, and so it's just a powerful
when you start to see all ofthat and they buy into the
vision and they understand allof those things.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Yeah, big time.
That's another thing reflectingon the journey that.
I've had, and when I look atcertain periods of starting out
and midway, a lot of turnoverand things that we weren't doing
to create the connection andthe culture and getting people
(15:54):
to want to buy in.
I guess what you know in whatyou're saying and now I guess in
what you're saying and now,knock on wood, so much less
turnover.
And when people are leaving,they're moving out of state or
they're maybe changing theircareer or they're starting a
family or something like that,it's not like we need to go down
(16:17):
the street to the competitor tofind something.
We need to go down the streetto the competitor to find
something and so, yeah, that's agrowing pain, that can be super
challenging.
But, you know, creating thatculture and getting people to
feel, I think, the empowermentis part of that, to make them
feel a part of it and they'reempowered in situations, makes
(16:40):
them maybe more feel that theyhave a stake in you know what
they're doing and, yeah, that'sthat's really important.
I want people to be with meforever.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
One of the things I loved about our working
relationship with Evolve was youknow the fact that it's more
than just a service that you'reproviding out there from a PR
perspective, but also theeducation component, media
training and things like that.
And you know in that we talk alot about.
You know you have your brandsthat you're promoting and then
you have the reputation thatyou're building out there.
(17:16):
Can you talk a little bit forour listeners as they're?
You know, maybe going over that50 employee mark or hitting
that 100 employee mark and youknow kind of the differences.
It might be a nuance, it mightsound just like semantics, but
it's really critical that thoseare really two different things,
and one you have a little bitmore control over than
potentially the other.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
Yeah, so there's a few things there.
So media training and crisis,and then brand and reputation.
So, as part of what we do as anextension of the team with
these clients are helping withmedia training and crisis
communication, because both arereally important in their
messaging and their positioningand their posturing, good or bad
situations.
And then that's internally andexternally.
(17:56):
When it comes to the crisis,media training is just a great
way to build their confidencewhen they're in interviews and
in presentations.
Even Brand and reputation, youknow, are also internal and
external and it could reallydevastate a business or an
organization or it could reallyelevate them and enhance the
(18:19):
allure of that business, and wesee that a lot.
But businesses can come and goreally quick.
So your brand is what you buildand create from starting with a
logo.
You know what are the colors,what is your look, what is your
feel.
You know we don't know what aStarbuck is, but they created a
brand and that is a brand EvenUber, xerox, over the years.
(18:42):
You think about these brandsthat people use to compare Can
you Xerox this or can you?
I'm going to call an Uber, butyou're really maybe calling a
different ride share.
So those companies have built abrand, then the reputation is
totally different.
So the reputation is whatpeople think of you.
Oh, I don't like Starbucks.
Their coffee is blah blah blah.
(19:03):
Or I never take Uber, I takeLyft.
So the reputation is somethingthat businesses.
It's really hard for them tochange reputation Brand as well,
but maybe you'll see a brandrefresh or do whatever, and it's
still Uber.
But they went from black andwhite to yellow and white, but
(19:25):
you're still going to have thatperception.
And I tell people and clientsall the time perception is
reality and so it's really hardto change that perception and
that reputation that people haveof you.
And the second you wake up andget on a virtual at your house
or walk out the door and go tothe gym or the grocery store,
(19:45):
your reputation is there.
So the way you look, the wayyou act, what you say, how you
say it, people are creatingthese perceptions of you and you
are representing yourself andyour organization.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
Right, and it's so important for the staff right to
even know and understandingwhat they're putting out there,
their digital footprint and allI mean it's just the education
is valuable for the organizationand what they're trying to
achieve and you're really doinga service to that team too for
their futures, Because a lot oftimes just depending on for
first getting in, it's like,well, my social is my social,
and it's like but it's not, itis your digital footprint,
(20:20):
whether you want it to be or not.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
I see.
Speaker 3 (20:23):
A lot of people that are in.
Well, celebrities do this.
Media people do this.
They'll create a separatesocial media page that's not
their real name, that they wantto curate whatever content to
people that they just want tohave see it.
Or now, on social media, youcan actually just have your
regular page and then there'scertain content, so you don't
(20:44):
need to create a second one witha pseudonym or another name,
but there's certain posts thatyou can share that only certain
people will see.
Your small groups.
Right because they know.
They know that to the massesit's not the greatest thing to
put out there.
But when I'm not just puttingkids down, but high school
graduates, college graduates, tobe thinking about where they
(21:09):
might rush for a sorority,fraternity or do an internship
or look for a job, thoseemployers or people that are
looking at them will probably goto the social and look and get
a perception of what they putout there.
So yeah, the digital footprintis and it's technically forever.
I mean, yes, you can take downa page or block a page, you know
(21:29):
your own page, but I mean theInternet's forever.
It's really hard to work aroundthat.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
We talked a lot about your team and how awesome the
team is and how well you getalong in the culture and those
kinds of things, which kind ofbuilds that employee brand as
well.
So you have the company brandbut there's an employee brand.
Some companies struggle withthat and then they also struggle
to hire new people because thatreputation gets out there of
(21:57):
kind of what it is, what's itlike to work for this company.
So have you worked withorganizations to try to fix the
employee brand side of thingsfrom a PR standpoint?
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Yeah, I mean, my big thing with that is it has to
seem authentic and if it feelslike they're fixing or
overcompensating to do somethingbecause they know they need to,
people sometimes see rightthrough that and so I feel like
it's got to be so real and evenif it's not, but it's got to
(22:30):
feel that way, or else we're inanother damage control situation
as well, like theovercorrecting.
So you know, doing things tobuild the team together and not
just feel like you're goingthrough some motion just because
you need to.
And it is hard.
I mean, you've got people ofdifferent ages and backgrounds
(22:52):
and you know this one's married,this one's not.
This one, you know, went to thesame school as maybe a coworker
and this one didn't.
So you've got to make everyonefeel so inclusive and it's
something we talk about atEvolve all the time.
It is a crazy, crazy gift.
I don't know how this got built.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
And it's all them.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
And, of course, what I can try to do.
But it's so special when yourteam can support each other and
back each other up and have eachother's back, and I think it's
so special.
I say at Evolve I don't want towork in an environment that has
drama and dynamics and stuff.
So I don't want to create anenvironment that is that way,
(23:39):
because I don't want to work atthat place.
So you know, finding thatformula is important but it can
be very challenging, you know,for organizations to get over
that hump.
But you know, I think doing itwith authenticity and culture is
really.
I mean, the people should befirst, absolutely.
Speaker 4 (23:57):
It really should be.
I agree with what you said.
It's not a fix, it's kind of anurture or a rebuild.
It really starts with theleadership and them connecting
with the people.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
And it's so much more challenging now for companies
that haven't gone back to eitherworking in their office or
they've gone back even verylimited.
You have to work even harderfor those connections and the
culture, because it's not mondaythrough friday anymore.
I mean businesses are, I don'tmean that it's zero, but it's
not in the office.
But it's changed so much, andso you've got to work harder on
(24:33):
that well, you know and foreveryou know we.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
What's the saying?
You don't leave companies, youleave you know bosses and and
stuff, and so that connectivitywith connectivity with your
coworkers is what kept you kindof through some of the hard
times, cause every company goesthrough some bumps and bruises.
I always used to say, like it'snot all rainbows and
butterflies all the time, butit's also not all doom and gloom
all the time either.
Right, like we have our ups anddowns and that connectivity
(24:59):
keeps you through those downs.
Right, I mean, it's just likein personal relationships and
without that now I feel likesometimes employees are a little
bit faster to give up on it andmaybe look at the next
opportunity.
So it's keeping it so important.
I also think, doing somethingyou're super passionate about
and obviously you guys help.
You know so many differentorganizations and different
(25:20):
products and different services.
Is there any like project thatcomes to mind that was a super
passion project for you that,like you and or your whole team,
just got so excited over whatit was that you were able to be
a part of from a clientperspective that you can share?
Speaker 3 (25:35):
yeah, and this one is an easy answer, and it also got
the media super excited as well.
Sprinkles cupcakes oh so theycame here to the valley and they
were this beverly hills brandand oprah, you know, had them on
their show.
I mean, this is dating way backand they came here to the
valley and we had theopportunity to work with them
(25:57):
and we were with them for nineyears and Candice Nelson, who
founded Sprinkles, was onCupcake Wars and doing all this
stuff on the Food Network, ourfood channel, and we had her
here locally on the cover ofmagazines and we're bringing
cupcakes to all the TV stationsand I mean we would joke that we
were like had the back door toall these, you know, media
(26:18):
people and it was such a bigpart in the growth of my career,
more so on the media sidebecause every month I was
bringing cupcakes, they lookedforward to it.
I let them know I was coming,they would open the back door,
and so it was.
Really it was a fun product andI love sweets and sugar.
So I was excited to do meetingswith them.
(26:41):
I would eat and you probablyknow some of my idiosyncrasies
with food and health and allthat I would eat three cupcakes
in a meeting.
Then I narrowed it down to twoand a frosting shot, because
they would give you shots offrosting and I would go to the
back door of Sprinkles.
They had the graveyard, whichis where the cupcakes that
(27:01):
didn't look presentable for thefront.
So there were these racks ofthe cupcakes that were on the
graveyard and I would go to theback door.
I mean I was like so personally, professionally, and it was so
fun.
You know it was the Valentine'scupcake or the St Patty's
cupcake or the holiday cupcake.
Yeah, and I learned a lot.
It really those nine years weremore the beginning of Evolve
(27:25):
and it helped me grow up a lotand learn a lot.
They had a lot of standards andbrand standards and just
different things.
That helped me mature and growas a PR person too, that's
amazing.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
So when we talked earlier this week, we talked a
little bit about externalcommunication versus internal
communication and justunderstanding what information
is critical to get out earlyversus what should wait till a
certain point, because maybecertain times product releases
and you don't want leaks orthings like that.
So how do you help people withthat internal communication or
(28:04):
what message would you haveabout internal communication?
Speaker 3 (28:08):
Do it and I've learned that and that's a
challenge of mine learning everyday is to make sure that
businesses are.
You don't want your teaminternally to find something out
about your own company orsomething you're working on.
It might not even truly affectthem maybe it's a product launch
and they didn't work on thatproduct or something but they're
(28:30):
still.
It still makes them feel thatequity in the company and in the
brand.
So I would say, first of all,internal is number one and that
message is going to be differentinternally than externally.
So I would say that has got tobe number one and consult with
you.
Know, maybe it's an in-house PRperson or marketing person, but
(28:52):
sometimes messages can beemotional or reactive and so to
make sure it's that's why welove when our clients do use us
as that outside gut check,because we come from a different
place and can see itdifferently.
And then, externally, you knowthat's obviously key to some of
the other stuff we're talkingabout with brand and reputation.
(29:13):
But internally, I mean, you canlose people like that if if you
don't make them feel likethey're part of that.
And there's some companies rightnow that they've got some
announcements and they're nottelling everyone on their team.
They're telling you, but notyou.
So when I tell everyone it'sprobably going to come out,
(29:39):
somebody else knew Right, ormaybe you're going to sidebar I
actually kind of knew that andthen you're going to feel like,
well, I give just as much to thecompany, why didn't I know?
And now, guess what?
Now you're kind of mentallychecking out and you have
resentment and it just causes,and maybe even to a coworker if
that was your coworker nowyou're like, well, I don't even
(29:59):
like him anymore because he knewbefore me.
And so, yeah, I would sayinternal is just as important,
not more.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
It's funny because we in previous life would use code
words for a lot of things whicha lot of companies do.
Speaker 3 (30:13):
That's what this company is doing too.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Yeah, a lot of code words, and we had a subset of
people that were typically readin on every code word project.
And so people who were neverread in on code words, like they
would just know, they kind ofhad an idea of what type of
thing would be coming, becausethat's what we use code words
for, and usually had the mindsetof of, okay, that tells us
(30:35):
something is coming and I'm justgonna keep my head down until,
like, I need to deal with it,and so that was okay.
And then we had a biggerproject that also had a code
word and about four people whowere typically read in weren't
read in in the beginning and wejust, you know, like, okay,
we're using a code word, we dodo this all the time.
It's accepted, it's trusted.
But what it did to like thosefour people, like am I on my way
(30:59):
out?
I'm always read in, and now I'mnot.
And it was just a huge miss.
And luckily the relationshipswere strong enough where those
people were coming in and sayingI'm seeing meetings with a code
word, I'm not in them, like isit intentional?
Can I know about it?
Like what's happening?
And we could have a dialogue torebuild that trust.
But thank goodness that theydid feel like they could come
(31:21):
and have the conversation,because they were creating a
narrative that was not true andwas way worse than the exciting
news of the code word Right,which I always try to tell
somebody when we're consultingwith different companies and
stuff.
They're like, well, they don'tneed to know or I don't have
information to share yet.
I only know this much and it'slike but they know that you know
something, they know thatsomething is going on.
(31:43):
Just tell them the informationthat you have and build the
trust that, as you have moreinformation, it will be shared.
Yeah, you know.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
Yeah, even if it's a meeting that you closed your
door and you normally don'tclose your door for those
meetings with that person likepeople are going to pick up on
the energy and the vibe in theoffice and the narrative they
make up is always worse.
Speaker 2 (32:02):
I feel like always 100 percent.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
So it's easier just to you know, kind of dispel it
as best you can.
But I do agree there arecertain situations and certain
times a merger and acquisition,a public filing, you know things
like that.
That.
I know you do want to managethat when the time is right to
tell the team, but it can besort of polarizing how it
(32:26):
affects the dynamics.
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 4 (32:29):
So, as you think about kind of growing the
company over the last decade, Iguess what have been some of the
things that have beensuccessful mentoring young
people coming up in the PRindustry?
What are some of those tips andtricks?
Speaker 3 (32:45):
Well, the biggest thing I tell people if they want
to get into PR because a lot ofpeople are like I love PR, I
love people and I loveconnecting people but the one
thing that is really importantin our job is writing.
And we're not writing thesis anddissertations and things like
that, but we've got to writesomething in a way that's going
to catch the media's attention.
(33:07):
Or we're writing statements or,you know, press releases,
pitches, things like that, andthere's certainly there's AP
style and there's, you know,forums, that, things like that,
and certainly there's AP styleand there's forums that we
follow with that.
But if someone can't really tapinto that writing skill, it's
pretty challenging in our job,even with technology and even
(33:29):
with AI and chat, gpts and allof that, because we know that
that's out there.
Well, we have to writesomething, we have to edit it,
we have to proof it, we have to.
So I have a lot of friends whoare like oh, my daughter or son
wants to do PR and I'm like whatis their experience writing and
do they like writing?
Because we're storytelling andso if we're not, you know, doing
(33:54):
that, that then we're going toprobably fall a little short and
so, yeah, I would say writingis an important skill for pr
well, I think you said that.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
Do they like writing right?
Because we do do a lot of it.
Yeah, there's a lot of the time, and so is it something that
they're passionate about, inaddition to having a competency
in.
Speaker 3 (34:12):
Yeah, and that is something with interviewing
people for a position.
We give them writing tests andwe want to put them through some
of those examples so we cantell if they like it, if they're
passionate about it, if they'regood at it.
So that's an important one.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
I volunteered at a student veteran event at asu
last week and reviewing resumes,helping with interview press or
prep and those kinds of things.
And there was one girl and herresume was like very, very good,
but you could tell it was justdetail, detail, detail, detail.
And I was like you're anelectrical engineer but there's
(34:54):
no passion here and she lookedat me like I don't have passion
for this.
It's like she, she got thedegree for the wrong reason
right and I said but you hadlike this summary paragraph at
the top, has to stand out andget somebody's attention, and so
it goes back to writing.
And if you can't tell a storyeven in that short paragraph to
get the interviewer's attention,you're going to struggle.
Speaker 3 (35:16):
So they were just more tactical than making it
come across like I want to builda career in this industry and
yeah, I mean, that's the otherthing too.
Those words, you know, comeacross.
You know, even a social mediapost going back to that Someone
could write maybe not try to saythe wrong thing, but you know
it across.
You know even a social mediapost going back to that Someone
(35:37):
could write maybe not try to saythe wrong thing, but you know
it can come across the wrong way.
So same thing a resume, anythingWriting is an important skill.
Speaker 2 (35:44):
Okay, well, we have to talk about the impact that
you've made.
Obviously, you know yes, youknow being a native going to ASU
, being an entrepreneur, you'vedone so many different things
and we'll jump into scholarshipand some of the work at ASU.
But kind of, you know, lookingback and now dreaming forward,
what are some of the impactsthat you want to make in the
(36:04):
next 10 years?
Speaker 3 (36:06):
Great question.
I want to double and triple insize.
I want to continue growing.
I feel this energy and thisopportunity of what Evolve
foundationally has done and 10years like the next 10 years
then we'll talk.
It might be different where Ifocus, but I'm all in.
(36:30):
I see a great opportunity forPR and us pivoting where we need
to pivot, with technology anddifferent nuances like podcasts
and influencers and things thataren't just in that traditional
media lane, and the energy andexcitement from our team to want
to go down that path and not bestuck where maybe other PR
(36:52):
firms or, you know,practitioners are.
And so we want to really growlocally and nationally and, yeah
, increase a lot.
Speaker 2 (37:02):
So yeah, my goal you can see light up as you talk
about it.
Speaker 3 (37:04):
Yeah definitely the energy is there, so I'll read
Molly's book and hear more abouttime and energy, but yeah, I
definitely feel it.
I don't feel like I'm on a winddown.
Wind down, almost a renewedenergy too that's awesome,
wonderful.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
Okay, you two, we have to talk about asu.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
Yes, um so one of the things that I think is is
amazing is just the the sundevil 100, and you're one of a
handful maybe less than fivecompanies that have been awarded
every year since they startedthe process.
So what has the Sun Devil 100meant to you or done for your
business?
Speaker 3 (37:42):
Well, first I have to say I'm not a Wildcat fan and I
love the rivalry.
So my Arizona people sorry, I'ma big Sun Devil and I can't
wait until football season.
Oh, I know, because basketballI can't wait till football
season.
I know, because basketball Idon't talk smack.
So the Sun Devil 100 has reallyopened my eyes to ways that I
can stay involved at theuniversity and while I love the
(38:07):
recognition and the camaraderieamong the other Sun Devil 100
individuals and the people I'vemet and learning about other
businesses, it's been a greatway for me to stay or get
engaged with university.
And so for me the first thingwas a scholarship and the Sun
(38:31):
Devil 100, after a couple yearsI realized there's probably more
ways that I could give back tothe university and I don't have
kids.
So creating a legacy was alsoimportant to me.
And creating the scholarship,for I have initial parameters to
it which are mimicking me alittle bit someone from Arizona,
(38:55):
female, wanting to do PR, allof that.
But then if no one's in, thatit's, you know, male or female,
and all of that.
But I want to support and liftup other, you know, people
wanting to pursue their passionand their career.
And I get to meet them everyyear and stay in touch with them
and it's really special.
(39:16):
So the Sun Devil 100 continuesto be sort of that catalyst and
bright light for my initialevery year wanting to do more.
I can't explain it.
It's like more than alumni,it's more than even though it is
, we're all alumni.
It's just this very, you know,uplifting thing to hear these
(39:37):
stories of entrepreneurs andpeople that we share, this ASU
journey back in the day where weall probably never thought
20-30 years later we'd be backat the campus, you know,
rah-rah-ing each other, and thenhad the opportunity this last
year, in the last few months, toname a conference room at the
school that I went to, um at thehugh down school of
(40:01):
communication, which I meangetting me to class was enough
of a challenge as it is, and nowI have a conference room.
Um, I still don't know where thelibrary is at asU, because I
never went there.
No, I'm kidding, but you know Iowe that all to Sun Devil 100,
truly because it's just reallyhelped me see and appreciate the
(40:24):
value that ASU had in my lifeand ways that I can continue
supporting the university.
Speaker 4 (40:30):
Have you had a meeting in your conference room?
Speaker 3 (40:33):
I haven't and I definitely.
That's definitely on the list.
I mean, it was pretty new thatwe did it a couple months ago,
right?
So yeah, it's pretty neat tothink about you know, people
making a meeting in the buildingand saying what, what room are
they?
I don't know?
Are they going to say JGK?
Are they going to shorten it,jk, kaplan room, I don't know.
(40:53):
But yeah, going to say JGK, arethey going?
Speaker 2 (40:54):
to shorten it.
Speaker 3 (40:55):
JK Kaplan Room.
I don't know.
But yeah, I wanted to havesomething a little bit more, and
maybe there's again somethingin the future that I'll do more
at the university, so I'mexcited about that.
But I won't stop with that.
Sun Devil 100.
Yeah, as long as we hit thosenumbers and we're doing the
things to qualify, I still wantto continue that as well that's
(41:17):
awesome um.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
So I mean whether it goes back to when we kind of
talked about this a little bitum on the we talked earlier this
week.
But you know, looking back atyou know when you graduated, you
know to today, and thatconnection that you have still
um with the university and howinvolved you're in I know that
that's really important to you.
What other advice would yougive your younger self, kind of
(41:40):
looking back?
Speaker 3 (41:43):
Well, maybe get some more sleep along the way as an
entrepreneur.
I think that I mean I don't wantto divert the question, but I
feel like some of those misstepsor experiences I didn't
necessarily want to go throughgot me to where I am.
(42:05):
You know I am still friendswith my ex-business partner, but
you know that's not something Iwould have wanted to navigate
and so, but had I not had thosesituations, I really and like I
said, I'm not trying to becliche or kind of soften what
(42:25):
you're trying to answer, but Ireally feel like the growth came
through some of the challengesthat I did have.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
So, for what I take from that, though, is embrace
the bumps.
Yeah, totally so there's goingto be some turbulent times, but
embrace them, because those arereally big growing moments,
versus maybe resisting them aswe do when we're in them.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
And stay focused on your passion.
I mean I would use well, notsurprised I make a sports
reference but Tiger Woods, Imean he would use well, not
surprised I make a sportsreference, but Tiger Woods, I
mean he got to such anincredible place in his career
but then you'll see his parentsshow pictures of him at three
years old with a golf club, likehe stayed focused on what he
wanted to do.
So maybe less about the youngerself, but also what I would
(43:11):
tell people on their journey.
The engineer, you know, what isshe passionate about?
What are people passionateabout?
You know, you've got a skill,you've got something that gets
you excited, and then thesuccess or the reward will come
if you're doing something thatyou love.
So I think that's what helpedme get through some of those
times.
But yeah, there's definitelybeen those challenges where I
(43:33):
wanted to throw it in, but thenI look back and I realize that
it helped me grow.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
Those little moments, yep All right.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
I like to always end with a fun question.
So for those of you that followyou on social media, they know
your love for cruising.
Yes, your cruises.
I've never been on a cruise youhave.
So what would yourrecommendation be for someone
new?
And maybe what would yourrecommendation be for someone
new and maybe what's yourfavorite or your bucket list
cruise?
Speaker 3 (43:56):
Well, I do feel like people either love or hate it.
I talk to people and they'relike we love cruising.
Or oh, I went on a cruise and Ididn't like it at all.
To me I say what didn't youlike?
I mean, you put your luggage inthe room, you pay one price and
you go and have some fun thefood and drink and the
entertainment and the activitiesand going to different ports.
(44:16):
You don't need to think aboutany of that.
So I love cruising.
I did grow up with cruisingbecause my dad was in the travel
industry, so I guess I'm alittle biased because I did have
that pretty much my whole life.
But I do love the getting onthe ship and truly not having to
think.
When you go on vacation andthere are all-inclusive resorts
(44:39):
that have a similar structurebut let's say, your typical
vacation you've got to figureout your transportation and
where are we going to go todinner and you know what kind of
activities.
What do you want to do?
What do you want to do On acruise ship?
I mean, they dummy proof it foryou.
It's like all right there youcan eat here for this food and
it's just so easy.
And so I love that.
(45:00):
And I do like waking up andbeing in a different port, um,
the, the Caribbean and the youknow, the Bahamas, and those
types of cruises are great.
Um, I have found over the lastfour or five years and I did one
when I was younger, but four orfive years doing European
cruises are so different A lotof the Bahamas and Caribbean.
(45:25):
You wake up and it kind oflooks the same.
Each port, obviously, each cityhas something special and I can
sit at a beach bar all day long, so I'm fine with that.
But in Europe it's like youwake up here in Croatia and you
wake up here in Italy and youwake up here in these different
countries, and that, to me, hasbeen something really special.
(45:47):
So I'm looking forward to thatin the next couple weeks.
Speaker 2 (45:49):
Yeah, it's going to be amazing.
The one that I went on was forwork and it was mediterranean,
and so it was, uh, 14 days, 11ports, starting in rome and
ending in barcelona, and, yeah,it was only one day at sea.
Yeah, um, and I thought it wasamazing.
It's the same thing like youunpack, you're done, everything
is there, it's all planned foryou.
(46:10):
You get to go see all thesedifferent places without packing
and repacking, which is a petpeeve of mine on vacation.
So, and he loves water, I thinkhe'll love it.
Yeah, oh sure.
Speaker 3 (46:20):
So if you like water, yes so and I can't imagine you
would get seasick if you likewater and boating and things
like that.
So you know, I think that'ssomething that people get.
One thing is they want to bestuck.
They don't want to be stuck ona boat and then be seasick.
So I can appreciate that.
I tell people to take maybe athree-day cruise to get
acclimated to that and then,outside of that, the other thing
(46:42):
that people say is they justdon't want to feel so confined.
These ships are so big You'renot feeling confined, you're not
on top of each other.
I mean, maybe if you go to abreakfast buffet at 7 30 you'll
feel that way, uh, but for themost part, yeah, you know, it's
very spread out and I mean, alot of these ships now have over
(47:03):
the top experiences and shopsand some of them have 40
restaurants and it's justunbelievable.
Yeah, yeah, you want fornothing.
You'll be hooked.
Speaker 2 (47:13):
I want to know after you go.
All right, all right, we haveto look at that one for next
year.
Yeah Well, it's been amazinghaving you on today.
We really appreciate youdedicating the time and sharing
some stories with us.
If people want to talk to youmore about Evolve, about
cruising, about your giving backto ASU, where should they reach
out?
Speaker 3 (47:33):
I would say the website is the best and easiest
evolveprandmarketingcom, andit's got the contact us and the
socials and the phone numbersand all the things.
So I think that's the best Allright, well, thank you.
Speaker 2 (47:47):
Thank you so much for being here.
Speaker 3 (47:47):
We really appreciate it, Thank you.
Speaker 2 (47:48):
Bo Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (47:53):
Thanks for tuning in to the Confidence Curve.
We hope today's episode leftyou inspired and ready to
embrace your journey confidently.
Remember whether you're leadinga team, growing your business
or pursuing personal growth,each step forward builds your
curve.
If you enjoyed today'sconversation, don't forget to
(48:14):
subscribe, share and leave us areview For more insights and
resources.
Visit us at apexgtscom.
Until next time, keep climbingthe curve.
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