Empathy & Connection: A Holistic Approach to Healthcare with Dr. Malasa Jois Kahn

Episode Transcript
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BLANCHE (00:08):
Hi everybody,
My name is
Blanche Garcia and welcome home.
That is to the
conscious Home podcast.
I'm really excited todaybecause today we have Dr.
Melissa Joyce Kahn.
She
is an innovative family medicine physicianand co founder of Khan Health, a direct
care practice in Montclair, New Jersey.
Her holistic approach combines integrative

(00:30):
and evidence based practiceswhile centering connection and
empathy.
In
addition to treatingprimary care patients, Dr.
Khan provides in home postpartum
and and pediatric care forbirthing families in the fourth
trimester.
Outside of her work, she enjoysbeing a mom to two energetic and
creative girls while tacklingthe journey of life with her
husband.
Welcome.

MALASA (00:50):
Thank
you.
Thanks for the introduction.

BLANCHE (00:52):
And side note, I know you because our children go to the same school.

MALASA (00:57):
Yes,
and so we know each
other
through, through that.
It's so
funny how you know someone for so long.
So we've been in class
for a year or was itlike a year last year?
No, no, no.
Just this year.
This year.
And only a month ago, did westart speaking and realize
we have so
many shared interests?

BLANCHE (01:14):
and
I find it
interesting because I think that that's
what happens a lot of times.
And I've
always said, thought to myself thatwhen you're in experiences or in
communities or speaking to people,
you kind of have to step outside
yourself to really
see energetically what's going on.
Like for instance, that
day, I remember setting an intention.
A lot of
times I set intentions.
And I remember just kind of

(01:34):
being
like,
funky, just bleh.
And I was like, I'm going to a
kid's party.
I, which can
work, which,
yeah.
And I was just like, uh, I waslike, I'm going to a kid's party.
And I'm like, well, Blanche,what do we want out of today?
And I was like, I would really love
to have just a connectionAnd conversation with
somebody that really surprises me.
and that's really what I said to myselfas I was walking up to the party and

(01:54):
I was like Well, I've seen everybodyat school and different parties and
it was interesting because I thinksomebody started talking about retreats
That was the conversation I walkedinto and you started talking about
retreats but holistic retreats and I was
just like I was like,Ooh, this is interesting.
I'd like to talk about this.
So I think we just startedgoing down the rabbit hole.

(02:14):
And I realized that
your emphasis
on what you, your work, your life is about
and what your passions are, arereally very much dovetailed into
kind of what conscious home is
and some
of the experiences that I've had.
So I just thought that this
was going to be
just such a great conversation.

MALASA (02:32):
of all, it's so nice to know that you had
that intention and how itunfolded the conversation.
It was really
beautiful.
I would say my intention
is, 99
percent
of the time
to connect
with someone.
Yeah.
And I'll talk about
that you know, in my work and
how
that plays into
my work I'm
always looking for a connection.
Not everyone's
there.
In
that energy and I
went, I can't say a
hundred
percent of the time I'm there,
but
I'm always
looking
to
connect

(02:52):
with humans.
I'm
so passionate
about
that It's how I
get my energy
Before
I came here,
I
was thinking about just reflecting on
what our
how our conversation might go
and how
different.
an
interior designer and a
doctor are,
just how, how
just disparate it
can feel.
Like one is.
based
in art and
visual

(03:12):
aesthetic.
one is
based in science,
but we found
such common ground in theway we actually do our work.
there
was so much overlap and our energiesflow together so easily when we
started
talking about it.
so
I
thought
that was so interesting.
Like if you look at it, kind of,if you wrote it down on a piece
of paper, we seemed so
different.
but
when
we started talking, we found that deep
connection, which

(03:33):
I
always feel that it's
just a matter of
time and
conversation
to find how
you can connect with someone.

BLANCHE (03:38):
Yeah, and I honestly feel I mean listen, that's why I
created Conscious Home because of my
experiences Honestly thatstemmed from postpartum

IMG_9438 (03:46):
And

BLANCHE (03:47):
you know the health system and how my intuitive
connection actually was so
Integral to how I see life and howI manage life and how I thrive in
life And so that's whereconscious Home came
from And that's you know, oddlyenough which is why I wanted to
have you on today because There's
such a reasoning and such a
passion behind Why the
platform

(04:07):
was created
and a lot of it, honestly has todo and stems from my experience
not only in postpartum, but also themedical connection, to the intuitive.
And I really loved your viewpoint on it.
So we're going to get into ittogether and I just think it's
going to be really great for
a lot of our listeners and ouraudience to kind of learn more.
so how would you explain your roleas a practitioner who combines

(04:31):
traditional Western medicinewith wellness and holistic
care?

MALASA (04:34):
Yes, I think it's a good place to
start.
I
was reflecting
on that
question,
should an evidence based sort of
scientific approach
and.
a
holistic
or wellness approach even be combined?
for
me, the answer is, yes.
Why can't we
have the best
of both worlds?
So how
I function,
my
role
as a
person in the
world is not

(04:54):
just to
be a doctor and
to
fix a problem, which is how
the
medical model
or
Modern Western
medicine is
based on
a
problem,
an illness, and then you
give it a remedy to solve it.
I don't see myself as that
limited in scope.
Even though the model
is essentially
based on that.
Most
people
who have been
in healthcare
can sense
that, right?

(05:15):
I only go in when I have
a problem, or They
only
address
this
problem.
They
don't really talk
about my life,
or they don't ask about that.

BLANCHE (05:21):
But

MALASA (05:21):
what, what I know
as a
human,
is that our lived experience
drives
our
whole life,
how
we grew up,
the behaviors we do, the
people we
connect with, the spirituality
we have,
the kinds of foods welike what do we like to do
in our
downtime?
this is our lived
experience.
I mean, you could
go on
and on
with
that list.
And when
we go for us to seek

(05:42):
healing.
So
I don't
see myself
only as a doctor
but I
see myself
as a healer or someone who facilitates
healing whereas medical model is
really focused more on the doctor being
the penultimate point in solving
your
medical issue.
I see myself as
more
of a
facilitator,
a
facilitator,
in your healing or in your journey.

(06:02):
I think how can I help heal
someone?
When I
don't understand
their
lift experience, it just
seems

IMG_9438 (06:08):
counterintuitive

MALASA (06:09):
counterintuitive to
go in
and not know
what relationship you had with your
parents, how you grew up.
not know any of those
things,
and say, take this medication.
Right.
There are urgent
matters.
a
critical surgery.
in
an accident.
Your arm

BLANCHE (06:23):
is falling off.
I

MALASA (06:25):
don't,
we
don't have time to have
that conversation.
We have
to
intervene with.
what we know Right.
now,
as
a life saving
measure.
Right.
And that's all true,but then there's going
to
be the conversation after.
there's going to be the part of
that healing that
happens
after that
surgery.
so I really think
it's pervasive,
even though sometimes
we'll
choose one
thing
over another.
in that
moment,
because we think that's
the best choice
in that

(06:45):
moment.
so my role
as a practitioner
integrating both of these things,
is that, I'm a doctor, but I'm
more than a
doctor.
Right.
you know, I don't limit myself
to
the
way we
practice medicine.
You're
looking at
the
whole picture.
And
we're looking at
the whole
picture because I, realistically
just
can't meet someone, like say we start
talking and not
be
curious.

BLANCHE (07:05):
Mm hmm.

MALASA (07:05):
Why do you do
conscious
home?
how did you?
bring your intuitive
practice?
where does your
intuitive practice
come from?
Who taught you that?
What
stories did you grow up with?
Why is this important
to
you?
it's just a curiosity part of mewhere I just can't help but wonder
those
things.
and why can't I also
do that and
have that in a patient encounter?
It feels really
good to
me.
It feels
intuitive, intuitively right,

(07:26):
And
it feels really good to, to,
the people that I'm
working with as well.

BLANCHE (07:29):
I also think that
it, it's only
to your
benefit and it's
only to
the people who come toyou their benefit because
you're
looking at
the whole picture.
And it's funny becausemy journey with medicine
and
just
you know, My
own
self
care and healing throughout my life.
I feel like a lot of Westernmedicine is reactive you have a
boo
boo
or something's hurting you So theygive you a band aid or they give

(07:49):
you a pill or things like that And Ithink somewhere along my journey, I
believe it was like in
my early 20s
I was
having like an autoimmune
issue.
And I realized that,
I started doing
more deep work into like holistic
work
and
like Bach flower remedies and justdifferent things, energetic work,
and I realized I was like, Oh,I have been treating the symptom
instead of treating the root.
And I really started thinking

(08:10):
about how do I treat the root?
It just made sense to me, right?
Nobody had to talk me into that.
I was just like, okay, this makes sense.
There's a root and then
there's a symptom,
right?
And so if you're only treating the
symptom, you're only treatinga portion of the issue.
And with Conscious Home, that'sexactly how I treated Conscious Home.
I was like, as an interior designer,we're looking at the space, but the
person inhabiting the space, there'sso many layers and there's so many

(08:34):
parts to make a space a certainvibration that when somebody walks
into it or
somebody's experiencing it, that they'regetting the end result that they want.
And the visual is only one portion of it.

MALASA (08:44):
That they feel themselves.
that they feel in tune with
themselves.
that space.

BLANCHE (08:48):
Right.
And it connects with their life.
Yeah.
Just like your healthconnects with the rest
of your life.
Right?
It's all one big
picture.

MALASA (08:54):
Yeah.
Absolutely.

BLANCHE (08:55):
Fascinating.
Okay, so this, I'm actually really,
interested
in
this, this
next question.
What was the turning
point in your career that led you
to incorporate
holistic practices intoyour medical practice?
Like, what was that
one thing that
you can
actually look at in the road of your
career that
you were like, Oh, Wow, that actually
shifted

(09:15):
me.

MALASA (09:16):
I
found this question
really hard,
because.
There was
no
one moment.
I
mean, there's a
few things
in my
life where I
can,
find,
uh, this
or that
moment,
clarifying moment, an
epiphany
of sorts, but a lot
of things in my life
I see
as a mosaic or a
painting.
There's
things I'm collecting
throughout
life, whether it's

(09:36):
ideas,
experiences.
knowledge, because I'm also just
a curious
person, I want
to
know,
that shape
who I've become
today.
And my medical practice
is
the same way.
And I really
think my
medical practice, who I am
there, and as a human, are really similar.
and that's intentional.
I
try to
do my,
work the way I
live.
I want it to be
authentic.

IMG_9438 (09:56):
So

MALASA (09:56):
As a, kid, I always
wanted
to
connect with people.
I'm just
chatty.
I like people.
I'm not, I'm
not the most, like
forthcoming person in a,
large
group,
but I
just, really
like knowing
people.
So I've always felt
that as a kid, I've always wanted to
work
with people.
I couldn't
imagine myself um,
and I
have a daughter
that's very
into art.

(10:16):
she would
love to
be in a
room by herself
doing art.
Like I could never imagine myself
that
way.
So, I always saw myself interacting
with
people, and wanting to connect
with
people, which is
not necessarily medicine.
You
can do that
in a lot of
places.
So,
the
main way I integrate my
medical care is by
using
connection
and
empathy.
So, even though it's not
a
Alternative practice,
so to speak.
it's

(10:36):
not
acupuncture.
It's not Ayurveda.
It's not traditional Chinese medicine.
It's just the fundamental
concept of
empathy
and
connection.
Some
people
call
it
narrative
medicine,
but
I think that's just a,
fancy way of saying, talkingto people like they're
human.

BLANCHE (10:50):
Mm hmm.

MALASA (10:51):
so, I see that as one of the
most fundamental ways
that I'm
integrative.
And I think that has
been
with me
my whole life.
I've always
felt
that way.
I've always been that
person.

BLANCHE (11:00):
did you always know
that
you wanted
to
be a doctor?
Or was that something that was
just like,
in your family?
cause that's
something that
not every
kid says, I want to be a doctor.

MALASA (11:09):
Not at
all.
as a Southeast Asian, and this
is
not,
Really surprising to most
people,
being a
doctor
is one of the main
things that's
talked about or
seen in your community.
so my mom
went
to medical school, she's anamazing person and she has
wonderful story, but
she loved medicine.
She
thought she would be
an OB GYN.
She loved babies.
so

(11:29):
I think it's funny
that
I
kind of do this work
because
I see
a lot of
magic in that.
one of the most fundamental
birth and death things of our lives.
And she,
came here to the U.
S.
and she was
taking her
exams
and trying to get into residency.
And she
was pregnant with
my brother, my older brother,and there's three of us.
and they said, This
is
great,
but
you are pregnant, soyou will not get a job.

(11:49):
You
might
get a job
in two or
three
years, but
certainly
not now
while you're
pregnant.
Which
is so So my mom was a doctor, so that
certainly
was a template
for
me to go
off of.
But she never practiced, and
she was never really
pushing
me.
She
knew what a hard life it was.
She had a very good friend,
We call her my aunt, like
friend of hers
that I
grew
up with, seeing her do
it and all the
sacrifices she

(12:10):
made,
the things she
had to
miss being
a
doctor.
So my mom
was never pushing me
to be
a doctor,
knowing
that
it's a really
hard life,
especially
for
women.
Yeah.
so it was always there for me.
I always loved
art.
as a kid,
I loved drawing
and I was like, I'm
going to be an artist.
And
my mom
said, what if you did
like
art?
and Medicine.
She's

BLANCHE (12:29):
like,

MALASA (12:29):
what

BLANCHE (12:29):
have

MALASA (12:29):
you made?

BLANCHE (12:31):
When it was funny,
when I was younger, I told my mom I wantedto be an artist my mother has a Latin.
like her, whatever.
And She was like, Oh,
Nina, She's like, you're
going to be
a
starving artist.
You better figure something out.
to do with that.
you
cannot.
just.
And
I was just, I
remember being like, Oh, you mean
I have
to make a business out of it?
I can't just like
make
all these
beautiful pieces.

MALASA (12:49):
Yes.
there's a practicality,
especially I
think
immigrant communities are
really driven by
certainty
And uh, reliability and having
that, you know, security.

BLANCHE (12:58):
yeah,

MALASA (12:59):
security

BLANCHE (12:59):
is a lot of root
chakra, like security
and
material and, and
being able to
support and family legacy and tradition.

MALASA (13:08):
And I can totally
understand
like all the things, you know, I could
think about her story
and how that impacted
me.
That's like a whole other
conversation.
but yeah, Medicine
was
not,
you know,
something totally
out of the box.
There were
templates, there
were
role models around me.
but I
was, you know, as a very
young child, I
don't think I was that
interested in it.
I
was just a very, I was sort of like
a free
spirit.
very distracted,

(13:29):
creative,
rambunctious, I
was
singing all the time.
I'm
a big
singer.
I still am.
yeah, you know, so like
kind
of like on my own
wavelength,
but
along
the way I,
realized you know, if I had
to
pick something as I
grew and
matured,
something
with
people.
I
did like helping people.
I sort of
had
that.
spark or gene in me.
and
of,
the things that I

(13:49):
thought were
available
to me at the time, it
seemed
like a really good fit.
But I always
thought,
as a child, remember
having,
like these long thought processes
before I fell
asleep for a
half an hour, or an hour about like
how the world
works
and
why are we
like this a really young
age, probably like late elementary school,
middle school,
and
just having these deep conversations with
myself,

(14:10):
Mm hmm.
and that's
what really
inspired
me.
I
thought
if
we could know more about
ourselves,
if we
could
be better, if we could grow.
I was
really
inspired
by that and
sharing that or
facilitating that
for
other people.
When
I ultimately went
to medical school, I was like, oh,they don't teach you any of that.
That's not what it's, that'snot what it's about at all.

BLANCHE (14:26):
So that's great and all, but let's just shelf that for a minute.
I

MALASA (14:30):
mean, it wasn't even a shelf that It was like, yeah.
you know, I was
thinking this over here, andthey're like, we're on another
planet.
This is the planet.
of medicine.
It's
very
even just
going to undergrad
and having to choose
biology, thinking that I
might go to med
school, even
though I wasn't
100 percent sure.
And
wanting
to write
the introduction of my
biology
papers very creatively, like,
maybe I'll make
it a
poem.

(14:51):
And
they're like, no, we just want the
data.
We want all the data and
we want it to be accurate.
this
is so boring.
Yeah.
So you're like, I'mgoing to stick with this.
Yeah.
And then I was like, oh, I guessyou know, it wasn't necessarily my
forte not that I'm not a rigorous
doctor,
but it wasn't, it just wasn't very
inspiring
to me.
so I've always been inspired
by
the
beauty of connection.
It's
very creative.

(15:11):
It's
very, flow state to talk
to someone
and connect
with them.
And you can get to really
interesting ideas or you can get
to
spaces in your
mind
and
your spirit that you didn't know that you
could
get to.
So I would say that grew
with me.
It's
always
been
with me.
and there's
other practical
piece of
like,
I
do incorporate
things like, I can teachyou about turmeric, or I
could teach you
about,
ways

(15:32):
to, utilize food as
medicine.
I could Teach you about mindfulness.
I could
teach you about,
evidence around acupuncture.
So these are like specificelements that I felt like
I was exposed
to at a very
young
age because it's so
integrated into Indian culture,you know, South Asian culture is.
we have signs, but everyone is veryspiritual and Ayurveda is prevalent
in
the way
we eat.

(15:52):
Even though we don't
talk
about it as
Ayurveda,
the way we eat and
why she marked the way
of life.
it's just the way
of life.
No.
And It's
really interesting.
It's always
been
a

BLANCHE (15:58):
part of me.
It's
really interesting because my
journey going through to
conscious home, so one of my
very good friends is Indian
and
we started talking
and
I'm like, Oh, I'm going
to create this and blah, blah.
And
she works
with me in my businessin different capacities.
And she said
to me,
she's like, Blanche, Iswear to God, there must
be Indian
in your past life because she'slike, you're, this is how we live.
This is how we live.
There's like a
spirituality And whatnot.

(16:19):
And I always find it interestingour life paths because
If you took a step
back, I always look at people's
life paths
and
I go, it's so interestingwith how their energy
was aligned
with what life
they
were born
into.
And
with your interest in this
kind of, self awareness and
spiritual connection
and
those types of things, Ifind it so interesting that

(16:40):
you were
kind of married
to, a family in a way or put into thatlife that is kind of more of the doctor,
valley, like you were on that
stream.
So it's like combining in a way,
you know,
I always call it
like Trojan horsing.
Like
I ended up in design
and then my
parallel
was intuitive.
Right?
And it was
always spiritual connection.

(17:00):
Yeah.
and now I'm melting the
two.
So in
your life.
you
get
to melt the two in a way thatpeople in your arena that
would normally
not
be
open to that, maybe now would be moreopen because you're like a little of both.
You're like sprinkling it in
together.

MALASA (17:15):
Yeah, I call it like a segue, a foot in the door, a pathway
to
knowing more because
people are
familiar with
doctors and more familiar with
the, you know,
institutions of health care that it feels
familiar.
it gives people accesstalking about spirituality.
My family's highlyspiritual and, my dad's an
engineer and
he,
he's
also an entrepreneur like

(17:35):
me, which I probably got
from him.
but he is also a
priest.
So he just felt compelled,even though he didn't
grow up in
that
culture.
my
grandma was
a little spiritual
and
performed rituals
and things like
that, but
he just we're
similar in the way that we're
always
seeking.
we're seeking truth orknowledge or growth,
and he was Like well, Iwant to learn all these

(17:56):
ancient rituals.
And
he taught
them to us growing up.
So we had, I
had
memorized, Vedic chants.
Two, three hours worth
of and
things like
that
and we would chant them.
I
mean he would make
us do it, like it was so normal.
It was a very ritual, theway people go to church.
Right.
So
it
was not forced upon us, but itwas just like, this is what we do.
Yeah.
And we would go to people's
homes
and he's an engineer and

(18:16):
a
business person,
what always drove him wasthe connection community
and the spiritualityhelping others, in this way
that he
could do
it.
I definitely grew up
with seeing worlds
collide and inter, interconnect,
I find that that's
the way Indians
are.
Even a scientist that's working
in molecular physics, or
I don't know, you know,quantum physics, still goes to

(18:36):
the temple.
And praise and whereas in the Westernsociety, we're very different.

BLANCHE (18:41):
And I think that, in my career and I
noticed
this
very
early on because I've always beenan entrepreneur and I've always
been.
Similar,
a seeker and always
wanting to be authentic.
But I was doing a show for TravelChannel and I was traveling the
world,
Hotel Impossible and things like that.
And it was like a very DIY
show and I
was Jack of all trades
and I would learn how to do sheetrockand paint and do all these things.

(19:02):
And when I went to go publish my firstbook, I remember all the publishing
houses going,
Oh, well, you're gonna writea book about design It's
a tabletop design book and about yourdiy and all the stuff and I was like
That's not what I want to write aboutI want it to be more like empowered
design and designing like inside out and
that there's a connection And theywere very firmly like no that's not the
book You're gonna write ifyou want to write with us.

(19:22):
This is the book you write you'rea designer and your experience
Like nobody's gonna takeyou seriously in this
Arena, right only that andI was like, oh You they're
trying to box me in and I, Iget very annoyed by that and
I just
do what I want to do and I, andI like melding and it's just
interesting and today what you're
saying is that.
the way you were raised in
your culture there isa big blend of a lot of
these things and in the

(19:43):
Western culture there isn't and I seethat, but now I see there is more of a
blending where it's not so much boxed in.
And I see a lot ofpeople and women able to
kind
of Branch out and bridge both of these
things in a
lot of ways and even that's whatwas interesting to me because I
saw that you were doing that when
we had our conversation
with
the medical field.

(20:03):
And I do that with design.
Whereas in design, this is a veryuncommon, unless you're a feng shui, like,
everybody thinks I'm feng shui at first.
I'm like, Oh, you're
feng shui.
I'm like
no,
or
like Deepak Chopra.
What I love about him is that,
He is very
much
into, the energetic space
and the intuitive space
but he's very evidencebased, and he brought that to
that
arena.

MALASA (20:23):
Yeah,
absolutely.
I, I,
just one, I don't like when people
box me in,
two, I think I have seen people growingin their awareness of possibilities
and I, I agree that
women are doing
it, I
see women doing
it
more,
meaning seeking solutions,
options,
healing
growth,

BLANCHE (20:42):
and

MALASA (20:42):
I
think
it's
just
cause women
want more and they are.
willing to
seek
and understand
because
they're
always limited in their
access.
get shut out, we get blockedoff of things, right?
and we're always striving to find those
things that help us grow.
So I find that women are, Excellent.
as
they
always have been, like,
historically in history.

(21:03):
And we're multitaskers.

MALASA EPISODE (21:04):
Like,

BLANCHE (21:05):
I feel Like, men can only handle, like
one thing at a time.
And I just like to createon so many different levels.
I don't want to be told no on
any of them.

MALASA (21:13):
Yes, exactly.
I mean,
women drive society.
They hold societies together.
they, often
birth children, right?
so this is the
fundamental,
way that society
grows and is driven.
So I love that.
I love
that
women, uh, are often theones that are driving
change or setting
tones, even though it's

(21:33):
sort of
under the
radar,
right?

BLANCHE (21:35):
I
think not anymore.
I feel like That's true.
Yeah.
I feel like
this is the age, what do theysay, um, I'd like it to be
even
more.
I know, I mean, we want to
take over the world.
Yeah, I'd like it to be 50 times more.
But they say, I think it'sin um, astrology right now,
we're the year of the dragon.
Am I wrong?
We're the dragon.
We're The year of the dragon, yes.
And so, apparently, also,
because I'm really big into numerologyand astrology, that's my jam.

(21:58):
Apparently The nexteight years is like for
women it's now like the best rebalancing.
Yes, which yes And I was like,yes, let's take over the world.
Oh my god okay, So you've broughtattention to the importance
of postpartum care,which is extremely vital.
I find it vital Could
you share your perspective onhow women are currently supported

(22:19):
after giving birth and areas where
you feel that more support
can be given?
I mean, I feel likethat's like a rabbit hole.
So I guess your top, I know.
I'm like, Oh,
just
postpartum
care.
Yes.

MALASA (22:30):
Yes.
Oh.
And before we move on,
I just noticed
this
when I
looked down at my sheet that I am
an
osteopath.

BLANCHE (22:36):
So

MALASA (22:37):
I'm an
osteopathic
physician.
D dot
O dot.
So,
I'm a DO.
Okay.
And what does that mean
for those
out there?
Doctor of Osteopathy,
meaning doctors are known as
MDs generally,
but
they're
actually both
MDs
and DOs
use an understanding
of of
musculoskeletal medicine

(22:57):
as well as body work
Okay.
And I use the word body work
loosely, it's osteopathy
technically, but body
work because people know what thatmeans, like using your hands to heal or
align the body to optimize
its healing.

BLANCHE (23:09):
Okay.

MALASA (23:09):
So when I
inadvertently
became a DO,
I did
not know a lot about
osteopathy, but
this,
I would say, was a crux moment even thoughI was in medicine and that's very evidence
based and I want to call it
one, one dimensional.
When I became an osteopath, I said, Oh,
wow, actually these people that
are doing
the
exact same medicine
as their MD counterparts

(23:30):
have
this
biopsychosocial
model, holistic
model in the
background
of their
education.
it's an important aspectof their education.
thing about osteopathy is the body's
ability
to heal itself.
When we adjust or align the body
to
find space, releaseand alignment, the body
can intrinsically start to
heal itself.

(23:50):
That's right.
So,
providing release,
relief where
there's
things that are stuck,and we're talking about
musculoskeletal things, butthere's also treating the
internal organs
as
well.
Would inflammation fall into that?
inflammation
plays,
inflammation's a big topicbecause it's used very kind of
loosely.
In
sort
of pop culture now or, pop medicine.
but it's a
pretty complex topic.

(24:10):
When anything
is disrupted
in our body, there can
be
inflammation.
or,
if there's disease, therecan be inflammation.
very, very basically,
you have a
muscle strain, right?
And
what your muscle is tellingyour brain is I need to
be
tight
and tense,
because I'm in
pain.
And
then it
doesn't even
go, traverse all the wayto your brain, goes just
to your
spine
and your spines like, right.
Stay tight and tense
because you're in
pain.
So
it's a reflex that actually doesn't

(24:31):
reach all the
way to your brain for your brain,to actually relax that muscle.
So when there's
pain or trauma our
body guards that area
And for efficiency, doesn't even
send the signal to the
brain.
Like, let's just work at it at this spinal
level.
So sending the signal
to the spine, and
the spine sending the
signal back to your arm, say,

BLANCHE (24:47):
and

MALASA (24:48):
we do.
that
creates pain.
It can be chronic, it could
be acute.
So maybe you've
had pain
for a long time,
and that signal is
just going on
all
day.
Osteopathy
can with
different bodywork
techniques,
breaks that
pain signal, So you find a relief, a
respite, and your brain andbody start saying, wait a
minute,
Actually don't
need to
be in
this chronic state of

(25:08):
tightness and guardingand pain I can start
to
heal so
there are healing
process that
naturally
take place, even all the time, you,
hurt your arm and it gets
better
But sometimes it doesn't, right?
you
have chronic
pain or it's so bad that you need a break
or
a relief from that
to You expedite the healing So it's
a healing modality.
So osteopaths learn
not only
that, but how
to
treat internal organs, the

(25:28):
interplay
between internal
organs and muscles.
The very simple example
is heart
and arm,
pain
in your heart creating pain in your arm.
so there's other visceral
organs
that create pain.
sensations on our body.
So we're
trained in
treating all of that in additionto all the things that our MD

BLANCHE (25:43):
counterparts.
do.
It
sounds like you have,you found a pathway that
was a little bit more
authentic to
where you wanted to go.
Yeah, inadvertently.
Yeah, and I always say, so I have
these
conversations, I've alwaysbeen fascinated with the
fact that
By the time your
body is
exhibiting some sort of
illness or what not, usually,
there were other signals within your
body or your

(26:04):
emotional body that was the start
point.
And so for me, I've alwaysbelieved is that when certain
things happen like illnesses
Autoimmunes or things like that.
it's multifaceted It's not just likeall of a sudden you were a healthy young
girl and you woke up one day and you
have this autoimmune Forme, it's always been like,
what is the cycle that's
going on in your body, in yoursystem, whether it's emotional that

(26:27):
turned into the physicalbecause our body believes
what we tell it, right?
So, like you just said withthe arm, if I keep thinking
like, oh my god, like my arm,
or If I feel,
grief,
or if I
feel like
I should have, would have done or I feelrejection and I keep perpetuating that
in my emotional body,eventually your body's going
to try to protect you to some degree.

(26:49):
And so it doesn't realize that yourfight or flight is just emotional
and it starts protecting youin ways that you don't realize.
At least
that's what I've always felt.
Yeah.
and so keeping your
emotional
body, being open and aware
and
kind of
like, releasing in a way so that it didn't
hold on tight and then manifest in the
physical.
And I don't think that's forevery physical, but that's

(27:09):
my thought process and a lot of emotion.
Our body and

MALASA (27:11):
body are
intricately connected, so, in another
simple example is the
same chemicals
that supply
how our brain
nerves work, our brain
cells work,
also affect other nerves
in our body, like our
gut.
Sometimes
they call it
the gut
brain, right?
so they're working onsimilar pathways or chemical.
patterns.
so
absolutely the mind
And body
are
intricately

(27:31):
connected.
Do we know exactly how that
is?
No.
Does it mean that it's
not?
I
don't
think so.
I
think intuitively
we all know
that
that's true.
and going even further like
you did.
you could say like well,how, how do I hold on
to these things
and how do they manifest
in
myself?
Whether it's again, simple,
clenching your jaw when you're tense,
right?

(27:51):
Or
something more complex that we
can't see.
So
obviously easier to sort of
explain things we
could see and feel more.
in
a straightforward
manner, but harder to dowith things that we can't
see our internal body, things like that.
Yeah.
So
I, absolutely agree that
those connections do exist, And whenwe talk about integrative practices,
in the Western medicine paradigm,

(28:13):
when we say alternative,
integrative, complementary, because it'salternative to the Western paradigm,
but using that nomenclature,
talk about those
things,
we think
about risk and benefit as we always
do, and this is, again, usingthat evidence based or critical
thinking lens or clinical,
decision making lens, risk and benefit.
But if
the
risk is very low,
like
I usually say,

(28:33):
The biggest risk
of
you being more mindful isthat you feel a little better
or you feel nothing, right?
The biggest risk is you feel
nothing.
Right.
It's not like you're taking
like a bunch of pills andyou're like, Whoa, I just
ended up in the hospital.
And
then
the benefit might
be small or great.
But what we know
again,
intuitively is
that when we grow our spirit, when we grow
ourselves from the inside out.

(28:54):
We generally are better.
we feel better.
We feel fulfilled.
We know what that means to feel whole
and
fulfilled.
So why can't we talk about
that in the medical visit andwhy can't that support your
overall health?
It's very

BLANCHE (29:04):
hard.
Even when I go to doctors andthey're like, Oh, so what are
you taking What are you doing?
And I'm like,
well,
I'm
taking like
this holistic supplementor like energy work.
And I really had this knot in my
solar plexus.
And then I work on thatevery day And they're just
like looking at me.
they're like
what?
And I was like, okay,
nevermind.
Advil?

MALASA (29:22):
We know, we
know Advil
can
sometimes help.
And Advil sometimes
does help.
Sometimes Advil
does help.
Sometimes Advil
helps.
and I usually say the same thing about
integrative practices, Ifyou're looking for holistic
practices or something to kindof hang your hat on that you want
to try.
I
usually say
low risk, right?
If someone's selling
you this
is going
to be the best
thing and
it's going to change your life andit's only a thousand dollars a month,

(29:43):
Maybe rethink that one.
Right.
But if it's something that
intuitively makes sense toyou, you connect with it,
that's the major thing, the
mind
body connection.
If you
believe this will work and
it helps you center and connect
yourself to
yourself
that's where you can find the
most healing.
If that's
acupuncture.
great.
So I
usually say, like, if acupuncturist,
I'm

(30:04):
not going to tell you
to stop.
If you're working
on yoga nidra, And that's
really
working
for you.
I'm not going to
tell you to stop, right?
we don't want tointerrupt people's healing
journeys, right?
And I always
say,
I'm a visitor
on your journey
as a practitioner.
You are living your life.
you
are going to be in your body 100 percent
of the time, birth to death.
I'm just visiting.
So I will try to

(30:24):
find
how can I
fit into this
paradigm
to either provide you evidence,
education, empowerment.
Something that you can
connect with that
I can share with you and offer
to you
that
might help in that
journey.
So I
might
know that something
you're doing is harmful
and I'll share
that.
But I'll
try to do it in a way that
still fits into yourparadigm and thinking.
Because if you don't trust me or don'tbelieve me, it doesn't matter what I say.

BLANCHE (30:47):
Well, it's really interesting, I remember
going
to a
retreat at Omega there inRhinebeck, and I used to go a lot
more
before I had a kid.
and so I would go everyyear, and I remember going
to go listen to John Holland, who happens
to
be a medium,
and I was like, oh, I'm going
to know John Holland.
And he was doing a co workshop with Anita
Marjana.
So Anita
Marjana, I don't know if
you know anything abouther, she basically had

(31:08):
cancer.
Mm hmm.
and
she didn't have cancer originally.
Her best friend or herfriend had cancer and she
every day felt such guiltthat her, friend was going
through this and she wasn't.
And she would always be like, so
guilt ridden about this,till finally one day she
got cancer and her first thoughtwas, oh my god, thank god,
because, like, I felt soguilty, which is crazy, right?
And she admits that this was
crazy.
So anyway, she was a normal, workingperson, and she ends up in the hospital

(31:33):
disintegrating, and sheends up going into a
coma.
And then, they were likeshe was unresponsive
for a couple of days andwhile she was unresponsive,
I
think she flatlined Andshe ended up going to
the other side and her
father was
there and whatnot and basically said
this is not your time, her guides,and they said you're gonna go back
and you're making a decision.
Completely
healed,
healed.
And you
have more
to

(31:53):
do.
And
she
was just like,
wait, what?
So
she said that when she came back,she actually remembered like
her husband going to theairport to pick up her parents
and what
flight they were on And she toldthe doctors conversations they
had in other rooms and different
things.
And
she wakes up
like
a day goes by two days
And the doctors
come in And they, go,
we have something to tell you.
And they look like really upset.
and she's like, what's the matter?

(32:14):
and they
go.
Well,
we can't
find the cancer, but don't worry.
We're going to
look until we
find it.
And she was like, no, no, no.
I think we're good.
Yeah.
I think we're good.
So she ends up, um, nevergetting cancer again.
And she
ends up
by a series of eventswriting and she wasn't
even planning on writing but she endedup, writing her story And actually.
Masking who wrote the storyand she put it online and

(32:35):
she didn't want to befound She gets found.
by Dr.
Wayne
Dwyer.
She ends up getting a book deal,all these different things.
But what
was
interesting about the seminarthat I was in, the most
interesting thing, the biggest
takeaway
was
she said,
Whatever you focus on and
you believe whether
it's getting if let's say you have cancerand this was a lot of cancer patients
I didn't realize it was in a room
full of cancer
patients, some that are

(32:57):
were
in remission and
whatnot
and she said Whatever you
do to heal yourself.
You have to
believe in so
if chemotherapy Is
you're feeling drawnto that and that's your
modality, your healing modality
You have to 100 percent believe
that that's going to heal
you.
if you're just doing something,
but you're begrudgingly doingsomething and your energy is
not there, it will not heal you.
And that
is the
truth.

MALASA (33:16):
It's like swimming upstream.
I always say that you haveto be open to receive the
treatment.
Whatever
treatment that is.
So if you have to be open to receive,just like energy, you have to be open
to receive,
100%.
like when I'm doing
osteopathy or body work,
if people are
really, really, reallyguarded, I do very little.
I'm
just working to createsafety so they feel open to
receive the
treatment.

(33:37):
so, and even
I do that with words.
If people are really resistant
to care, I really
try to
just
create
safety first.
And it's not medical.
It's just,
Like A trust.
A trust.
just
building trust.

BLANCHE (33:48):
Yeah.
And in the postpartum world,
kind of going
back to
that.
Yes.
Where do you see that,
where it's found a place, or
it still needs to happen,
or
And I, as a man, I my own journey,
my postpartum journey, whichif you haven't read it or seen
seen it, go to episode one, wasnot an easy postpartum journey.

(34:09):
that's what I was so interestedin getting your viewpoint
on.

MALASA (34:11):
Yeah.
And you were saying
before, what are we doingfor postpartum folks now?
what is the lack?
is there room for what we're talking
about?
the
connection, the openness, the
receiving.
and what are we doing?
much.
We're not doing much.
What should
we be
doing?
A lot more.

BLANCHE (34:28):
A lot

MALASA (34:29):
more.
It's almost like we're
not doing
anything and we need to do everything.

BLANCHE (34:32):
Yeah.

MALASA (34:32):
so,
In the United
States now, and I
wrote down some of the stats,you can go to a two week
postpartum visit
if you
had a C
section or surgical intervention,or you will go to a six
week postpartum visit.
any
and I say this a lot, but
any person,
that's had a
child
know that and I don't know if we
can curse on
here.
Oh yeah.
You can say whatever you want.
We have an
R rating.
Yes, okay, so all
the shit

(34:52):
has
already gone
down.
Oh yeah.
You're at a six weeks.
Yep.
Call
me
five and a half weeks ago.
that's
when
shit was hitting.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it's like made a,

BLANCHE (35:00):
everything's on fire.
And I'm
like, so
are
you going to kill yourself?
No.
Okay, cool.
Okay.
Come back in like
a month or two.
As long as
you're

MALASA (35:07):
not going to kill someone or kill yourself, your baby.
Yeah.
You're good.
Then
you're good.
those are something
we ask.
that's
the only thing we ask.
Yeah, that's sometimes something we ask.
And, if you're not feeling safe in
your home.
If you're having
chest pain.
If your blood pressure is high but
no one's checking it.
This
is all happening
before
six weeks.
Yeah.
happening in the
first two weeks.
let alone just the quote unquote

(35:28):
normal the common
newborn
Difficulty.
they just

BLANCHE (35:31):
hand you the baby and they're like bye and you're like,
whoa,
And you're
like,

MALASA (35:35):
wait what?
Yeah, you're like, what am I doing?
I think and for those who birth
in the hospital, it's like, well,I really liked having someone bring
me three
meals
a day.
At least that
was taken care of.
Yeah.
when you
get home,
none of those things exist
And it depends.
Some people
birth at
home and some
people have very strong
processes
and,
customs and
that really works well
for them.
So this is not a universal experience,

(35:56):
but more often than
not,
people are having traumatic eitherphysically or emotionally or both.
And that's
up
to
45 percent by
NIH.
So
45 percent
of
new birthers will.
say
they experience trauma.
That is,
that's almost

BLANCHE (36:12):
half.
Right.
So, and nobody's addressing it.
Like your regular OBGYN is
just like, are you bleeding out right now?
Yeah.
Cool.
You're, you're good.
Right.
And you're like, no,there's a lot more going
on.
and

MALASA (36:24):
they're not
trained.
You
know, physicians
do, I'm a physician.
They do amazing
work,
They save lives.
Yeah.
Most
of
them they desire the best for the
patient.
Yeah.
within their scope of knowledge
and
understanding.
so that being said, peopleare still going home in
the
most industrialized
nation in the world
with not only physical and emotional
trauma,

(36:44):
But dying
at an absurd rate, more than
our colleagues in similar
nations.
maternal mortality in the U.
S.
23.
out of a hundred thousand live births.
Okay, you're like, okay,
that's still
a fairly
small number, I
guess.
I don't
know,
it's statistics.
What does that mean?
Well,
France is
8.

(37:05):
7, Canada 8.
Australia 4.
8, New Zealand 1.
7,
So, yeah, This
is a
very high number.
No,

BLANCHE (37:11):
there's like a big gap of support that's
missing.

MALASA (37:14):
And
it's, so I
say like,
why?
this is not an
ethereal,
conceptual, woo
woo.
Oh, we want everyone to feel
good and
and
their chakras to be aligned, Right.
da da da.
no, they die.
Yeah.
Women die.
Babies have complications.
Because we don't support women
we don't support women
of color.
Because they die at a

(37:35):
disproportionately high rate Yes.
And the rate is only increasing.
over the
last
five to six
years.
Yeah,
which is to me absurd.
What
is happening
in
our
country?
And
we we know what's happening.
We
know that
it's fragmented
care,
Let's start
even with the
biggest picture.
So there's lack of
postpartum,
you know, connectivity
touch points.
Understanding education,but There is a culture

(37:59):
of not
valuing
the person who gives birth.
there is a
culture of not wanting to support families
with children.
And I always say, you know, in theadvocacy world, like, these people
become our society.
They are
our
society,
right?
They're not
just children.
The children grow up and those
children have families
and those families were

(38:19):
the people
who gave birth to them andthen lived around them,
while they grew up and thenthey go into our society.
So if
we don't support this
moment, this
critical moment,
how do we
support our society?
and that's when things likepaid family leave become
A non issue.
Oh, we
should, we should support that.
Well, in other

BLANCHE (38:34):
countries, they have
like months.
If not a year plus.
Right.
And it's
really insane.
And it's funny to me, even
like women
in general are support.
it's
just now more prevalent whereyou're seeing commercials
that are supporting women who
are perimenopausal or menopausal.
That's my next.
You, you never support women.
And now you're starting to see it.
I'm like, literally

(38:54):
it's 2024.
And you're just realizingthat your mom is losing
her ship because of hormonesand not because she hates
you and guess just realizing that

MALASA (39:02):
And guess how long women
have
had that
experience
since the beginning of, of time, women.
And I

BLANCHE (39:07):
thought when I had a kid, in my mind, I was like, I am
this.
Amazon woman and I
am a leader and I
am
in this
and when I have a
kid I'm
just
gonna have the
kid and then we're justgonna go back to our life
and it's just gonna be we'll just havelike More child care and that'll be easy.
Yeah,

MALASA (39:21):
we're gonna fly
around the world We're gonna like
people say oh, it doesn't
matter what they want
cuz I'm just gonna take them everYeah, they're gonna be part of my life

BLANCHE (39:28):
and like I'm gonna just keep going and building that mountain and I'm
just gonna be Like whoo, and I'mgonna look great in a couple of
weeks I'm gonna bounce back goto the gym and blah blah You The
hardest
thing I've ever
done in my entire life, and the only
reason we
keep doing it is becauseThey're so fucking cute.
They're so fucking cute.
You're just like,
like my daughter,
like at the same time that shelike smacks me in the face because

(39:51):
she just thought that was funny,

MALASA (39:53):
she'll be like, I love
you, you are my family.
You're
like, you're the best
mommy in the world.
Yeah, Right after a fight.
After they just like punched you

BLANCHE (40:02):
in
the throat because they just thought
it was really cute.
Yeah.

MALASA (40:05):
You're like, yes.
Yeah.
I mean, that's the
beauty of
humans, right?
we love we
love each other.
We love our
children.
So it's not just a primal desire to
procreate,
but we have
consciousness.
that honestly,

BLANCHE (40:18):
it like,
It has
pushed me
so much as a human.
You don't realize your
growth until you have a kid becauseyou don't realize how much you
have not grown, how
much work you still have
to do.
have a kid and then you'rethe triggers are bigger than
you've ever felt in your life

MALASA (40:31):
nothing
shines
a
garish light on your
own upbringing and yourown traumas like having
a child.
and certainly otherbig things caring for a
parent, maybe
that that's dying, like very big things
can also do this.

IMG_9438 (40:45):
you

MALASA (40:46):
caregiving kind of thing
But there's something about parenting
and having been parented that
is a unique situation, whether
it's from birthing or fromadoption or another type of
parenting, family situation.
So anytime that you're in this type
of
situation, it justshines the biggest light

BLANCHE (41:03):
on
yourself.
I feel like there'stwo things in the world
or experiences, that will either shine
a light on whetheryou're a complete asshole
or you have healed.
And one is having
a kid because it'll letyou know where you're at
in that
Yeah.
And sometimes you're

MALASA (41:17):
like here and then you go back and then you're up there.
And you're like, oh,oh, oh, today I'm here.
Yeah.
There are days

BLANCHE (41:21):
where I'm just like, I can't believe I just
did that.
I can't believe I just did that.
And
you're just like, oh my God.
Yeah.
And money.
it doesn't make
you a worse or better person.
It shows up, like,
it makes
you show up
more of
who you actually already
were.
Yes.
That's why, it's like, it'snot the root of all evil.
You were actually already evil.
You're already evil.
We'll

MALASA (41:37):
all be evil.
We're all a little evil already.
We just gave you more

BLANCHE (41:41):
access to being more evil.

MALASA (41:43):
Absolutely.
it's it's it's a truth
teller.
kids are truth tellers.
You know, there's so many
things I say
and then immediately say,that's the wrong thing to say.
You know?
Yeah.
like I'll
even say it out loud.
That was the wrong.
Nope.
I'll stop myself and
I'll say, Nope, that's
not what I'm not
supposed to say.
I know.
I'll like

BLANCHE (41:58):
say to her, I'll be
like, so mommy, should not have said that.
What I should have said, you understandthat mommy apologizes to you.
And
she's like, I don't knowwhat apologizes means.
Sorry.
I'm extremely sorry.
And Just the

MALASA (42:10):
modeling, right?
No one used to do it.
before.
No one used to do it whenwe were growing up, at
least when I was growing up.
it happened, but it's certainly not the
culture of parents apologizing
to their children.
But again, if you see children not
as
just,
Small humans
that can't do anything and have no
power, and
you see them as humans, autonomous beings,

(42:31):
it kind of makes a
lot
more sense.
I have to respect
them, and that's what
teaches them to respect others.
Well, I, yeah.
it's really fucking hard.
It's

BLANCHE (42:38):
really hard, and I remember when I was younger, pregnant.
Everybody
kept saying, Oh, are you excited
to have a little mini me?
And it used to grate on
my
nerves because I'd sayshe's not a mini me.
Like I always
used to speak to her Like she's a beingthat, and this is where my woo woo comes
in.
So it's my woo woo.
I was like, she's choosing to be withme on this planet and as her family.
And We are life

(42:59):
partners in this life and it just happensat this turnaround that I'm the parent.
Maybe in the last life
she was parent.
Who knows?
Maybe I was her dog.
I have no idea.
I
hope she treated me well.
But in this life
I was
like, you know what?
I'm
just here to
make sure I keep her safe.
I give her some tools and I just let her
be her amazing badass self.
And if that ends up being
that she decides to

(43:20):
be A garbage lady
or like, you know,whatever she decides to be
and be in her room whatever makesher happy My job is to make sure
that I let her know that that'sokay and to be as bright as
she wants to be Right andit's not for me to control
her I just want to keep her safe.
But other than that,
you know.
If you
want to wear your underwear on theoutside of your pants, which she
has decided to do on many days.
Yeah.
I don't know if
you've seen her at school,but that is what she's

(43:42):
chosen.
Yeah.

MALASA (43:43):
I mean, that's it's like a
really hard, it's a wonderful way
to see
it, right?
In, in, in a spiritualparadigm, things are placed
In, our proximity or with
us,
you know,
in,
sort of a grand
spiritual
journey, right?
Yeah.
So it's not like
she's just your kid
and
you
can control her.
Right.
I like that idea is that you've sort of
been blessed with
this
connection.
We didn't know that this

(44:04):
connection could
happen in this way, that
she would be ever
and you would be her mom and that
you would be together.
and our kids
always ask that
like,
what if you both marry different people?
Would I still
be me?
And like, we're like, no, it likeit literally had to be that moment.
And that everything had to be
just.
It was meant to be that you were
born,
right?
Like, only you could

(44:24):
have been born at that moment.
Yeah.
Because all of history happened
just as it did.
Well, she can speculate,but, but that's exactly how
it happened.
She said to

BLANCHE (44:32):
me the other day, she goes, I've
decided that I
like my family.
And I said, Oh, I, I
appreciate that ever.
She's like, I, Yeah.
I love my
family.
even Abuela.
And I love, you know, and I'm,
and
I'm just like laughing.
I'm like, okay, I'll like,
that's great.
I'm, I'm glad.
Cause you could actuallychoose not to like your family.
you know, and it may shift atcertain points of your life, but,
it's always very interesting.

MALASA (44:52):
Yes.
And that's,
that's what.
I
try,
my goal is
to share
that
energy
when I'm doing postpartum
work.
So I,
in my work,
am
trying
to fill that
gap with the knowledge and
awareness of our shortcomings
as a country,
you
know, our healthcare system,which is a non system, is to say.

(45:14):
All of these things don't work very
well.
Let me do what
I can Right.
To create
this kind of
energy.
A safe space
for
people, for folks to come.
Based on
connection
and empathy and understanding.
come and,
I will
be their doctor.
But it's
not,
again,
it's not just being their doctor,
but facilitating
their healing, guiding them through this

(45:36):
transition
With a lot of
the holistic practices
of multiple countries and traditions
do acknowledge
birthing people.
Whether it's first 40
days or whatever country you'refrom, guarantee there is a
practice.
around
birthing
that is ancient or has a long history.
Oh, a hundred
percent.
And,
you know, I try to draw from

(45:56):
all of
those things.
And, I
have a friend
who,
created the,
organization, it's astartup organization called
Center for Fourth
Trimester Care,
she has such deep knowledge
in
Multiple practices across the world,
Ayurveda,
acupuncture, yoga, and
just bringing all of the practicesand the knowledge, the wisdom,
and bringing it together inthe moment of care, still using

(46:19):
evidence based
work.

IMG_9438 (46:21):
based work.
and

MALASA (46:23):
that, of
course,
the the one thing we
can do
is prevent women
from dying.

BLANCHE (46:27):
Right.

MALASA (46:28):
Okay?
So
we don't,
we
don't have to do a lot.
We just want to make sure that we're
doing that.
So even if you
can't do all of
these things.
and that
means
having someone they can go to.
I remember
feeling, Uh,
in my
second postpartumexperience that I called the
lactation
person a very harried
state.
I
was so,
my baby wasn't latching

(46:48):
and like, I had oversupply,and severe engorgement.
Ugh.
And
some
people say like, oh, the
baby's growing though, oversupply, great.
But actually, it comes
with
pain, and, baby's gassy, andfussy, and then they won't
sleep, and if they don't sleep,

BLANCHE (47:02):
you don't sleep,
and if they don't eat, you don't
eat.
You don't eat.
Yeah.
They're

MALASA (47:05):
all
doing, all of those things were happening.
I remember
calling the lactation person,
and just saying, uh, do XYZ, I
think it took about 30 seconds for her to
answer my
question.
and then said, I'll call you back,
And then
never
called me back

BLANCHE (47:17):
Yeah.

MALASA (47:18):
And
then
just
feeling
so
alone.
I, I desire
for people
to have someone they can
call
and
follow
up, right?
Well, then what am I
supposed
to do?
And just that feeling of loneliness not
having connection.
Especially when you're already,
postpartum
states, in ancient, or tribal Mexican,I've heard my friend who's a doula

(47:40):
is,
It, you
know, opens portals.
And this
is also kind of universalthroughout, throughout the world.
Different
cultures believe that portals are opened
and can leave you dysregulatedif you are not closing them back
up.
Oh yeah.
If you are not regulating them back
in sort of a spiritual
way.
And you can think again,
This is, falls into kind
of more of a holistic or alternative

(48:03):
category.
But very
simply that we know thatanxiety and depression
increase right after you have
birth.
Your mind is
reeling from changesin your hormone levels.
Yeah,
and your
body.
So The same thing
that happens right
before
a person has a
period,
Which is
a shift in your hormones, andyou feel a little down, or
cranky or
bloated, all those arehappening times a thousand.

(48:24):
And
you're taking care of a baby and
you're not sleeping
and you're not
maybe eating that well Yeah, no, it's a,

BLANCHE (48:30):
it's a,
it's a
perfect
storm And I and I said this on my
podcast or whatnot And
when I gave birth to my
daughter, it
was 2020
going into lockdown.
And, my complete portal my energeticfield was completely open my
third eye
was
completely blown
open and that's
how come I was able to
connect so acutely and so
So I would
say dramatically, but Ididn't realize what was

(48:51):
going on and separate from that.
Let's just keep thatseparate Let's just say as
a postpartum mother.
I'm going
through whatever I'm going through
physically, right?
And I just remember going
to the
hospital and my ob gyn telling my husband
like nobody's gonna come see Blanche Soyou're going to have to take her to the
hospital and
literally dropped me off
at the hospital So I'm
there And it's like Alone.
Alone.

(49:12):
And without my
baby and
it's six weeks and I'm still lactating
and,
and I'm like,
who's feeding my baby?
And there's no backup
to that.
And I remember thinking to
myself at
the very
least,
my OBGYN is going
to
come or she's going to call, orI'm going to have a conversation
with her because I just
gave
birth.
And, um, I have no idea what's going on
And, she never
called and she never calledmy husband after that

(49:33):
call and
never checked up
and
was like,
Hey, how'd your wife do?
Did you ever drop her off at the hospital?
Did she ever come homeAnd I remember coming
home.
and I think my first call
with her was about a month
later
and I called her and I'm
thinking
I'm gonna get on the
phone with her and I'mgonna be like, she's
gonna be
like, oh my god, and we're gonnahave like this whole conversation
and she's gonna ask mewhat happened and all these

(49:54):
things and literally
it was a 10 minute conversation andshe's like, oh, hi, and I was like,
hey,
And
she's like, how are things going?
And I'm like, well, I was in thehospital and, um, I'm home now.
And she's like, okay,and how are you feeling?
Better?
Okay,
that's great.
So, like, in a few weeks maybecome in and check up to make
sure.
And I
was just like,
Lady, I have been through the gauntlet.

(50:16):
I feel like I have beenthrough hell and back.
It
feels

MALASA (50:18):
like a
near death
again.
No, I, I

BLANCHE (50:21):
literally energetically died and I am not the same person
that you're talking to right now.
And at
no point have you
acknowledged anything and I amout here Without a life raft and
yes, I don't know what you

MALASA (50:33):
wait
for that singular momentwhere you're like, they
didn't
call okay,
I'll put that aside.
right?
They
didn't call my husband.
Okay, I'll
put that aside,
right?
I'm gonna use
this.
I'm gonna cautiously enter
this moment
for a life raft
hoping for a little bit of
connection being a little bit of safety
Yeah, and imagine such a
vulnerable
person, especially a postpartum
person.
Yeah being in

(50:53):
that moment
and let
alone, okay,
so you have that plus You you're in acategory of person who dies at a higher
rate after birth.
Plus you're in
a category of person who is
traditionally marginalized, like
the
LGBTQIA
community.
imagine those things together.
Right.
That's hard.
That's hard.
That's hard.
Yeah.
Like, those categories are hard.

(51:14):
it's
such a vulnerable moment,
and
it's so scary,
and
it's so tender, and
when you take that away
from,
when you, when you kill the
trust
You kill the trust
for the
whole
health
care.
community.
Oh,

BLANCHE (51:26):
Yeah.
And then,
so,
if you don't feel safe,
Yeah.
Going to a practitioner after that,guess what else falls through the cracks?
Yeah.
the rest of your health.
And guess
what?
When your child is
sick,
you don't
want to go to the doctor.
Guess who you're not calling.
The last person you're calling is probably
someone you should be letting them knowlike something's wrong or I'm feeling this
or this seems off, but you don't do that

(51:46):
anymore.
Right?

MALASA (51:47):
Absolutely.
Okay.
Okay.
that was,
was, sorry.
That was a heavy
one That's about birthing Yeah, oh

BLANCHE (51:55):
my god Oh my god, okay Um, so what is
the intersection of your passion formedicine, wellness, and holistic care?
How do you
picture this
journey
unfolding in the field?
what does that look like
to you

MALASA (52:07):
I think in a perfect world, I would love
everyone who
interacts
with me.

IMG_9438 (52:13):
people

MALASA (52:14):
healing space, doctors, practitioners,
nurses,
anybody who interacts with
people.
To be trained in
holding space.
To be trained In mental health.
To be trained in
understanding.
to exercise their
compassion.
perfect world,
the systems would support
that So,
it's so hard
that your OB GYN
didn't respond

(52:34):
to you
in the way that you had hoped.
And that would have been helpful
to you.
and at the same time, I know
Thousands
of doctors are severely
overworked and
burned out.
that they
want to check
their
box so they could do the next thing.
They're workhorses, they, they don't have
autonomy.
They don't
have a
lot of
support.
Sometimes They do, but a large portion of

(52:54):
people don't.
so in a
perfect world,
the
context in which we work
supports people to spendtime, to linger, to be
curious.
That's in a perfect
world
that all people have
that
knowledge
and desire.
I desire that for our world,
you know, that we take time and we,we linger with people and we find
connection and we find healing.

BLANCHE (53:16):
I had that conversation with
another medical practitionerwho said the same thing.
It's just like, there's
like
this big gap
and just having the time
to
be
able
to, give a little bit moreand support more to the
emotional, body.
to Yes,

MALASA (53:29):
yes,
yes.
And I think, in a perfectworld, our incentives shift
from commercialism and capitalism,which have their merit, like
it produces drugs that
save lives of children andchanges people's journey with
cancer
and things
like that.
Like, critical things
are helped by the way our industriesare driven to work, based on their

(53:52):
incentives.
At the same rate, in my perfect world,
we center
value and give importance
to wellness, keeping people well,
keeping people healthy and fulfilled.
and in a very practical
way, that's policies
around Family leave.
That's policies around
childcare.
That's even policies on

(54:13):
things like incarceration,
it's
policies on things that relate,
to, marginalized communities and
people of
color.
because those are the places where the
discrepancies
happen.
So in a practical
way,
those policies
have to be
in place to show that
we
care
we've we care.
and we've put these
policies
in place to show how

(54:33):
we care.
And when
we
place that groundwork and
we
build the foundation, societycan grow more fulfilled
within that
paradigm.
within that context.
So that's my
hope
for
all of health care sortof in a lofty way, you
know, in
general.
for my own practice,
I think my
vision is to
continue to be able to do
this
work
and

(54:53):
share
it
and grow the knowledge education.
So be an advocate
You know, personally dothat work, the one to
one level, but also at the communitylevel or, you know, regional or
bigger,

BLANCHE (55:04):
I
think it's, um, spaces.
And I
think it's interestingbecause I think a lot of
people think that thingshave to be either or.
Yes.
Meaning that you either have to
be profitable or you're
completely like a shwarmy living
on a reserve.
And the truth is
is that there can be a balance.
There can be a little bit of
each.
Yeah.
To
make things
the whole of
the sum.
And I think people forget

(55:24):
that, That you can have.
It's kind of
like, I always liken it
back to like women It'slike a lot of women that
I
talk to or
throughout
my career, they think that being
completely profitable
means that they have to
give up on themselves.
They have to not be femininein their, their this.
they can't have a
family.
They can't, You know, take
care of themselves and blah, blah, blah.
I
have to like be go, go, go and

(55:44):
I'm like, well, you can actually
be profitable and happy.
You can actually
live out
your dream and
make money.
You can
actually
be healthy and, you know what I mean, and
still make money.
Like, it's just like a,
it's a mix.
And
so
I feel like what you're saying
is, is very similar inthe sense that there can
be a very cohesive
blending of the two.

MALASA (56:02):
Yeah,
that's my,
that's what I believe.
I get stressed out, you know, about
political, you know, news and
policy changes.
And
we can go
into that,
but I won't.
But,
um,
I
get twinges in my heart knowing
that
there are
people living in, living
in poor conditions, meaning
the health care is not therefor them And the policies are
falling away at their feet,

(56:23):
leaving
even less
resources for
those
people.
that's definitely stressful, but that's
my
hope.

BLANCHE (56:29):
Yeah.
And I mean,
speaking of
that,
are there any
specific advancements or
changes
that you're particularly passionate about?
Like, is there something that's happeningor that you're like, oh, this needs to
happen?
I'm

MALASA (56:41):
not so inspired.
yet.
I
mean, I think there's small changes.
I'm
I'm always,
uh,
rather than
snip the edges
of a bush,
I want to take it out
and
build,
you know,
plant a
new
one.
That's sort of
my,
and I joke with
my friend, we're all,
we're kind of in the burnit all down category.
burn it, it's not working,
Burn it, down,
build a new
thing, right?
that.
And by the way, I think that's

(57:01):
happening
right now.
So if you haven't seen

BLANCHE (57:04):
what's
happening.

MALASA (57:05):
It's, it's happening
in small fires.
And I
think that's,
I think that's really
good.
You know, I think,
there's no particular.
thing that I'm hopeful for based, on the
practical, the
reality of our sociopolitical context,I'll say, I'll kind of leave it there,
right?
I'm not sure that I see
anything
in particular because
I
think in a
practical way, that's what I

(57:26):
need to
see to know that people can
function.
things that I love that's
happening, outside of the system
that's happening
in smaller spurts
are
things that I things like direct
care.
cutting out insurance companies
and saying the patientdirectly pays the provider,
you know exactly what you're getting.
It's very
transparent.
so I do that with direct primary
care.
It doesn't matter whatyour insurance status

(57:47):
is
And generally direct primary
care
is very transparent.

IMG_9438 (57:49):
better.

MALASA (57:49):
philosophically made to be affordable
for people, a monthlymembership kind of thing.
So I'm
inspired by
the doctors utilize
saying,
fuck the system.
We will just do
what we know in our
hearts
is
possible.
Let's
just do
it.
And that's kind of
how I ended
up in my
particular.
Situation.
My
husband was like, he's also a
physician.
He is the, co founder

(58:11):
of my, of our
business.
And I credit
the
impetus.
We were
both
interested in
this idea.
We
had a colleague who didit right out of graduating
from residency.
So she's already physician, finished her
training as a physician, and then,
started like right
out the gate
and built it
from the ground up and now
she's like multiple
sites.
That's direct
primary care, it's notnecessarily postpartum.
direct primary care,

(58:31):
is that what there's a membership?
Membership, directly pay your doctor.
It's usually that the
national average will be somewhere
between like 60 and ahundred dollars based on the
cost of living.
so
we were both
inspired by
her
but my husband said
like we had one
kid and
another one on the way
and You are working
in a community health center.
I know you love
this
work.
so I was
working for, almost exclusivelyMedicare patients It's federally

(58:53):
funded, or uninsured folks.
And
he was like, but you're already,
burnt out.
And it's only been like nine months and
it's
like very early on
to be nearly
feeling burnt
out
already in your
career after working in residency,
which is a
pretty rigorous
job already, but you justdon't get paid anything.
So, He
was like, let's do this.
We have
to do
this.
So I credit
him for, he always has a

(59:14):
vision so it's like when he gets
his vision,
he's like, no, we got to do
this.
We're going to,
move to a new town.
We're
going to,
start the same way.
Like

BLANCHE (59:20):
once I
have something in my head, I'mlike, that's what I'm doing.
And I
was

MALASA (59:23):
like no, but I love my patients.
And I, you know, I actually, Ilike my coworkers, even though
it's like a hard job.
He was like but howlong could you do this?
like, how long is the sustainable?
and you know, given the timing, it was the
right
time.
We wanted to move anyway.
So we did it.
We
just
like left our jobs
and we were like, we're movingto Montclair and we're going to
like start this whole new thing.
And here we are.

(59:43):
And so patients come to
both of you
and is
it just the two of you?
It is just
the two of
us.
So we are a micro practice
model I call it boutique medicine.
Just
because it's like a word that people can
connect to.
They
know what that
means.
bespoke medicine, whatever, artisanal
medicine.
It's very much a
homegrown, our
style
of medicine.
He has a very
similar philosophy.

(01:00:03):
I would say spiritually
and, um, approach topatients, empathy, connection.
He just, he does it differently because
it's, he's a different person,
but we are very
aligned, We wanted to keep it smallbecause every time you add a third
person to the triangle of adoctor patient relationship,
you
change the communication.
So as long as we can
sustain it
this way.
we will do
it this way.
because that's wherewe see the most value.

(01:00:25):
So things that I can do,
you know,
in this type of
care is, Spend an hour and a
half like we're spending on this podcast.
we can have this type of
conversation,
but we have it in my office andwe get to the bottom of some of
the things that.
you're struggling with or working on foryour health or things that you need to get
done.
we can do all that.
And that's the way
I do medicine.
I can just do it the
way I want.

BLANCHE (01:00:45):
Right.
And you
have like autonomy with that.
so would you be like, if somebody
needed like
a primary care?
would
you be a primary
care?
So I

MALASA (01:00:52):
am a primary
care family
medicine physician.
I say birth to deathbecause I do that postpartum
zero to three months.
generally like the very youngkids, we can't house vaccines.
which is a practical thing becauseof the boutiqueness of our practice.
We'd end up throwing them all away.
Yeah.
so we still take youngkids, but essentially we're,
doing full scope, age
wise primary care,

(01:01:12):
for folks in the
community and surrounding Montclair.

BLANCHE (01:01:15):
I mean, listen, I feel like that is kind of where
everybody's headed in a way.
And I say that everybody, meaning
that and
I and I talk about this
pretty
openly, that.
Mm hmm.
the
trend and what I'm seeing.
So even though there's
like literally the world is
on fire, we all know that the world
is on fire, right?
But separate from that,
I don't focus on that
even though that's realisticand that's the reality.

(01:01:36):
I don't
focus on that.
But what I
am
seeing
is what I
call the glimmers or
the
silver linings.
Absolutely.
And was interesting because when Iwent through my whole postpartum and
I was literally connecting what I call
to source or guides or
universal.
whatever.
I kept seeing this
lightworkers around the worldconnecting and a renaissance

(01:01:57):
and people coming together And
shifting.
And I'm seeing that
now.
And it's not
like everybody, but people arerealizing that they want more.
They want to
be authentic
in the
work that they do.
They want
to
leave the world
a
better
place to some degree
in
their own quadrant, right?
and so like, by just smiling,that's how I make the
world a better
place.

(01:02:17):
I
say
hello to everybody
and
that's my vibration, that's my gift.
And other people are like, I
am Gandhi and I
am saying, you
know, and everybody's got their thingand I'm just seeing that more and more.
And that's what
uplifts me and inspires me
because it's like, as a woman and as an
entrepreneur, I
think that.
we're all
sharing a vibration and
mine
just
happens to be,
I create Conscious Home, I

(01:02:38):
do interior design, I
do podcasts, blah, blah, blah,
But
my
biggest,
like flex, I would say,
is that
I,
no matter what is happening in
my life.
always
believe in the
human spirit.
And I always believe thattomorrow's a better day.
And I always believe that we've got
this So it's always
glass
half
full even
when my humanist takes over And
is like, today was shitty.

(01:02:59):
Or like, I can't believe that OrI just want to crawl under a rock.
There's something
inside of me.
That's like, bitch,
get up,
put
your
big girl panties on
and get out there
and rock
the shit out of this, right?
And that is my
flex, right?
And then all
the other things that
I create.
So, it's like, what, what,
inspires your, what is your
superpower?

MALASA (01:03:17):
Oh, that's a good question.
How would
I phrase that?
mine's
sort of similar to Your big girl panties.
I'm not, I'm not
surprised, but
it's just
the feeling that like,
Who the fuck cares what
anyone else is doing?
That's right.
And I've always been
this way.
I
remember my guidancecounselor saying like,
Oh, she marches to thebeat of her own drum.
I'm like, do

(01:03:37):
you
want everyone
marching
to
the same
drum beat
and like
jumping
off
a
cliff
when that drummer jumps off the cliff?
Right?
Which is what society is doing
sometimes.
Like we're all following who knows who
sometimes on
social media and
it feels really good, but we'renot thinking for ourselves.
So one thing that
I,
I think that's
part of me that I can't
give up.
and it shines
bright is just thinking for

(01:03:58):
myself
And
saying, you
know, F all of this
other stuff.
like I'm just going to do it my way.
I'm
going to do it my way and it's not
perfect and
it's not
the best, right?
Like
I'm
not going to be
perfect all the time.
I will make mistakes and that's okay.
it doesn't have to be only one
way.
So I think
my ability to
see that

(01:04:19):
things don't have to be
one
and it's something Ilove telling other people
too.
Don't let anybody tell you
things have to be one way
or
you can't do it, they're lying yeah,they're lying and they're saying
people say it a lot to
women, and people who arehistorically disenfranchised because
it just keeps them in their lesser
power

BLANCHE (01:04:36):
Well,
I
always
say that too
to people like
don't let
people put their
limitations on you meaning
like
they'll be like Oh,
that's
really hard,
you you know,
like,
I
don't think that's
gonna work.
So many

MALASA (01:04:45):
people were
like Doctors won't like
you if you
become DPC.
You're cherry
picking.
I was like, you don't think insurancecompanies cherry pick who they give
insurance to?
You don't think
the
way you are practiced is It'sfundamentally inequitable.
Actually, I feel,
if I can say,
if
you are
able to provide this
monthly fee, no matter who you are,
You are a part of our practiceand I will give you the
utmost care whether you are a millionairewhether you're uninsured, right?

(01:05:09):
It doesn't
matter because you're all
human.
So when you
walk
in the door, you're the
same person to me.
And I have the freedom to say,
hey, you're in a really difficult
situation.
Don't pay
me for
it.
You know, maybe I shouldn't say that,
but like, You're like caveat.

IMG_9438 (01:05:22):
like caveat,
I

MALASA (01:05:23):
need to feed
myself.
Yeah, a caveat.
But like in that I can
provide
compassion
the way that I
see
fit.
And I
feel like.
What freedom and
what ability to provide equity
again,
it's my
small
corner
of The world,
right?
And I don't need to
solve every problem on
TikTok, right?
Because there's so manyproblems in the world
and we're all trying to advocate
for them.
But in reality, it's

(01:05:44):
super hard
to
affect any
change that way.
Realistic
change.
No, you.

BLANCHE (01:05:48):
can't.
And, And,
like when people's putting their
limitations, you're like, that's just
what the max that you
can
give.
Exactly.
And so don't judge on
me
for the max that you can
give.
And that's cool.
Exactly.
Do you.
So I

MALASA (01:05:59):
can
do, this is what I
can provide the world.
And that's the way I do
it.

BLANCHE (01:06:04):
Yeah.
this has been fascinating.
I knew it
was going
to be.
How can people find you?
Yeah.

MALASA (01:06:09):
we're, KhanHealth.
com is our
practice
website.
it's
K A H
N, which is really trickybecause people often want to
put the H before the A.
health, H E A L
T H
dot
com,
which is
the
same as our Instagram handle,
which is the same as
our Facebook.
We're not
doing great on our
Instagram
social media, but if
you need to reach out to us,
we do check it.

(01:06:30):
Which
means follow
them.
Yeah,
follow us and I do post
some interesting things.
Also, conhealth.
com slash fourth try
is where you'll see some informationon my fourth try practice, so
those are
places connect with us.
And, um, you know.
you can call us.
, Like old school.
Like 1970s.
Yeah.

BLANCHE (01:06:47):
I like
picking up the phone.
I'm a Gen X er.
We
actually
pick up
the phone.
we actually
pick up the phone.
I like picking up the phone.
We're a real person.

MALASA (01:06:55):
Well, it was so
great having you on.
so
much for having me, it's such a
lovely conversation.
I'm not, I
was saying
that I'm not
surprised at all that
we had Just
as much
of a connection as
we did the
other day,
in such a
lovely and fluid conversation.

BLANCHE (01:07:08):
Yeah, that's
the only
conversations I like to
have.
Same.
I don't have
time for any other conversation.

MALASA (01:07:13):
Exactly.
I go
deep quick.
Yes, Why waste our time?

BLANCHE (01:07:16):
Yeah.
Well,
thank
you for
coming on.
I appreciate it.
I'm sure everybody's gonna love
the conversation and getgreat value out of it.
Well,
thanks
so
much for having me.
This
was a pleasure.
Thank you for joining Conscious Home.
Check
us out,
ConsciousHomeBGD.
com and our podcast.

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