Episode Transcript
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Greg (00:00):
Hi, everyone, we're back
on the air on The Culturally
Intelligent Safety ProfessionalPodcast, we've had a couple of
months off just, sorting somestuff out and doing other
things.
And yeah, we're back with acouple of looking back episodes
and also planning for season twowhich is due to start in late
January, 2025.
(00:21):
So great to be back on TheCulturally Intelligent Safety
Professional Podcast.
This is a series aimed atproviding a platform whereby
safety professionals can developa pathway to enhance their
cultural intelligencecapability, which will help them
function more effectively whenworking in a multicultural
situation.
(00:43):
I'm Greg Dearsly your host andbetween February and June of
this year.
I interviewed 15 people, forseason one of the Culturally
Intelligent Safety, ProfessionalPodcast.
These fabulous guests range fromCQ professionals to academics,
communication professionals,safety professionals and hailed
(01:04):
from not only New Zealand, butincluded people based in
Singapore and Australia.
I'm really grateful for the timethat the guests put aside to
speak with me and share theirknowledge which I aim to further
analyze and reflect on duringthis looking back series.
I've grouped the feedback anddiscussion into these like
sessions, including culturalintelligence, education,
(01:28):
neurodiversity and MāoriPacifica.
And there's also a bit of amixed bag on a range of subjects
for our last episode.
In this summary session wereflect on episodes four, eight,
and 15, which all featuredinsightful discussion around
(01:48):
Māori and Pacifica culture.
In episode four, we spoke toVance Walker who shared his
journey from WorkSafe inspectorto PhD student, focusing on
connecting, te ao Māori toworkplace safety, highlighting
the importance of culturalintelligence in the field.
(02:10):
Initially entering theprofession due to his farming
background he emphasizes theneed for health and safety
practitioners to developcultural awareness especially
when working with Māoricommunities.
He introduced his project KiaTupato which aims to enhance
workers risk perceptions throughcautious behavior rather than
(02:31):
your traditional safetyprotocols.
Here's what Vance had to say.
Vance (02:36):
they had a preference
for, or predisposition towards
cautious behaviour rather thansafety.
Safety being an ideal that youhave to try to attain.
Cautious, made more sense tothem.
Greg (02:46):
Vance explains also that
effective communication with
Māori workers requiresunderstanding cultural values
like whakapapa, or(genealogy),and the importance of
establishing trust andrelationships.
He suggests using the pepeha(traditional Māori introduction)
to connect with workers, whichmight help overcome biases that
(03:07):
may hinder better communication.
Vance introduced the concept ofacquiescence bias which is a
phenomenon where individuals arelikely to agree with something
regardless of how they actuallyfeel.
He suggests that Māori used thiswhen communicating and discusses
(03:28):
how this is not an idealsituation from a health and
safety perspective as health andsafety professionals really need
to get to the heart of thematter rather than being told
what they might want to hear.
Here's more from Vance,
Vance (03:41):
so they've gained what's
known as an acquiesence bias, so
that's, they know how to playthe game.
So they'll nod their head whenyou want them to nod their head,
and everyone will go awayfeeling happy.
That's probably the worstcommunication you want as a
practitioner because you reallywanna get to the heart of the
matter so when they go back totheir tasks, you've got a bit of
comfort around things.
Greg (04:02):
We went on to discuss the
nuances of expressiveness and
communication styles and Māoriculture noting that workplace
interactions may differ fromthose on marae or a tribal
meeting ground.
Vance stresses the significanceof being approachable and
willing to learn which fostersbetter rapport and cooperation.
(04:23):
We went on to explore thenuances of nonverbal
communication, particularly inthe context of māori culture and
health and safety practices inAotearoa.
Vance highlights, how eyecontact varies across cultures,
what may be seen asdisrespectful in one culture can
be respectful in another.
(04:43):
He notes that Māori often avoideye contact out of respect but
health and safety practitionersshould encourage it to ensure
effective communication.
Vance also discusses thesignificance of gestures like
the east coast wave, which is araised eyebrow when you see
somebody, It's a casual greetingused amongst Māori and other
(05:06):
cultures emphasizing theimportance of using culturally
relevant expressions like kiaora to foster connections.
He stresses that culturalintelligence involves not only
understanding but knowledgeparticularly about, matauranga
Māori or Māori knowledge, whichunderpins tikanga Māori, Māori
(05:30):
customs.
Overall Vance advocates forintegrating cultural
intelligence into health andsafety practices enabling
practitioners to better connectwith diverse worker populations
and promote safer workplaces.
In wrapping up Vance introducedthe three R's for engaging with
(05:51):
Māori.
He encourages us to findsomething that resonates,
reconcile differentperspectives, and repeat those
practices, to improve culturalengagement over time.
He encourages health and safetypractitioners to build deeper
connections by sharing their ownbackgrounds,(whakapapa).
(06:14):
And be open about their learningjourney regarding Māori culture.
In episode eight, we caught upwith a Afele Paea who highlights
how he transitioned from aprobation officer to a safety
manager.
He reflects on his first job asa painter and his experiences
with workplace safety whichsparked his interest in the
(06:37):
field.
Afele discusses his role insocial welfare and community
corrections emphasizing theimportance of empathy and
effective communication inmanaging risk, both for the
offenders and in workplacesafety settings.
He describes how skills from hisprobation officer role like risk
(06:58):
assessment are applicable inhealth and safety inspections,
here's what he had to say.
Afele (07:03):
At Corrections, you're
assessing the risk of the
individual, at WorkSafe, you'reassessing the risk of a
scaffold.
And to be honest, a scaffold's alot more easier to work with
than the guy resisting you everytime he has to report in and do
his programs and stuff.
Greg (07:19):
Afele also addresses the
cultural context of his work as
it relates to Pacific and Māoricommunities facing significant
challenges in unemployment andworkplace safety outcomes.
He emphasized self-awareness andthe need for thoughtful
communication recounting amoment when he sought to convey
(07:40):
his ideas effectively in a boardmeeting.
It's all about storytelling andhe views storytelling as a
powerful tool for connecting andunderstanding and this draws
upon his upbringing and sharedcultural experiences to relate
to others in his professionalenvironment.
(08:00):
Afele explains.
Afele (08:01):
So for me, I've always
wanted to just put my best foot
forward and I wanted to addvalue and I was looking for an
opportunity.
Like I said, I was confident.
of why I was in the room becauseI know I could connect in with a
lot of the workforce thatrepresent those statistics.
And when I was talking aboutthose details that you were
(08:23):
going on about too, the way I'msitting and how I say it, it's
because I want to be perceivedproperly.
I want to be perceived in theright way.
And I guess from some otherexperiences.
I've had trouble with perceptionas to people look at me and they
think I'm just a grunt.
Greg (08:41):
We went on to discuss the
importance of understanding
cultural differences in theworkplace, particularly between
health and safety professionalsand senior managers.
Afele emphasizes that knowingwhat stimulates your employees
especially those from Pacificacultures where family is a key
motivator can lead to betterengagement and health outcomes.
(09:06):
We also touch on the evolutionof wellness programs advocating
for a more tailored approachthat considers employees
cultural backgrounds.
Things such as blood pressureand cardiovascular health.
Afele shares an example from hisexperience with companies
employing Pacifica workers whofaced health issues related to
(09:26):
eating oysters on the job.
He suggests involving familiesin health initiatives as they
often have the most influence onthe worker's wellbeing.
Afele encourages health andsafety professionals to be
compassionate and engageemployees in interactive, visual
ways like storytelling andkinesthetic learning rather than
(09:48):
solely relying on traditionaltraining methods.
We ended our discussion with aAfele sharing practical tips for
creating a more inclusive andsupportive workplace
highlighting the need for goodcommunication and understanding
of cultural context.
Here he is, as we wrapped up.
Afele (10:06):
And then the next thing I
would say is yeah, we'll just go
back to that stimulation.
How would you stimulate yourworkers?
And for Pacifica workers inparticular, we're very visual,
so if you're to use Pictures ata toolbox, don't bring out the
SOP of eight pages or the SWMSof 75 pages sort of thing.
Storytell it.
Greg (10:26):
Finally in this looking
back series, we reflect on the
discussions that we had withJodhi Warwick-Ponga who is the
head of programs andapprenticeships at Vertical
Horizons and a trustee of TeRopu Marutau o Aotearoa, TRMA,
or the Māori Health and SafetyAssociation.
Jodhi shares her diverse careerjourney which includes roles in
(10:49):
engraving.
banking and health and safetyconsultancies.
She highlights TRMA's growthsince its inception in 2017
evolving from informal meetingsinto a formal organization with
around 90 paid members now,focusing on providing support
and resources for Māori healthand safety practitioners.
(11:13):
Jodhi discussed the HaumaruTāngata framework launched in
2023.
Designed to address highworkplace injury rates among
Māori in industries likeforestry and construction.
This framework aims to provideculturally responsive health and
safety practices withoutreplacing existing systems.
(11:34):
Jodhi emphasizes itsfoundational principles which
include holistic wellbeing,cultural values, and the
importance of storytelling andcommunication, here's Jodhi to
tell us more.
Jodhi (11:44):
So Haumaru Tāngata is a
framework which provides a guide
for intervention and investmentfor health and safety for Māori
employed in high riskindustries.
So the intent is high riskindustries.
Places that were researched weremostly around our forestry and
also construction.
And we also know that fishingthey have some high rates of
(12:07):
injury for Māori.
And we know that Māori areoverrepresented in all of the
negative statistics in regardsto harm in the workplace.
So the framework is set about tosupport any organization who
would like to take a more Māoricentered approach towards their
health and safety.
Greg (12:24):
The conversation went on
to touch on the concept of mana
which reflects an individualsstanding within the community
and it's intergenerationalimplications.
Jodhi explains that workplaceharm not only affects
individuals but can diminish themana, of their families,
(12:45):
highlighting the need forculturally aware practices in
health and safety.
The conversation tuned to theimplementation of Haumaru
Tāngata and Jodhi overviewed itskey points.
I am going to talk through someof them now.
First we're going to touch oncultural integration which was
about reflecting Māori values inorganizational practices.
(13:07):
Questioning whether the currentpolicies and communications
genuinely represent these valuesor are they merely tokenistic?
Next, we talked about supportand mentorship.
Organizations are encouragedthrough Haumaru Tāngata to
engage with cultural mentorsrather than solely relying on
external advisors, helpingfacilitate genuine integration
(13:32):
of Māori culture in theworkplace.
Assessment and implementation ofthe framework.
It includes a self assessmentwith 20 simple questions to help
organizations identify areas forimprovement in cultural
responsiveness.
This process aims to shift fromtheoretical understanding to
practical application.
(13:53):
Cultural competency is anotherarea that this program explores.
And we talk about the necessityof cultural competence workshops
and the value of engaging withMāori workers as your internal
cultural advisors.
The business benefits andimplementation of Haumaru
Tāngata, it's not just aboutbeing socially responsible, but
(14:14):
it can actually lead to improvedemployee engagement,
productivity and overall workersafety.
The framework, very familiar tothe health and safety
professional, an audit modelwhich helps organizations
systematically incorporatecultural elements into their
operations.
(14:35):
And finally connection andresources.
So Jodhi provided a whole bunchof resources, including
culturally appropriate Karakiaor prayers, and guidance for
workplaces advocating for theinclusion of Māori voices in
shaping workplace practices.
Overall the conversationhighlights the necessity of
(14:55):
authentic engagement with Māoriculture in workplaces to foster
inclusivity, safety andproductivity.
And on the question of whyshould we implement Haumaru
Tāngata, Jodhi had this to say.
Jodhi (15:09):
Why should you implement
Haumaru Tāngata?
Because we have far too manyMāori who are being hurt.
Māori have 51 percent morelikelihood of being harmed in
the workplace.
On top of that, many of theroles that we do are in high
risk industries.
We die earlier, and yet wecontribute all of our life to
(15:34):
the scheme, the pension and whathave you, and yet we do not
access it as long as others do.
We have so much that we can addto help to improve and reduce
workplace harm.
And if we look at it, we needmore workers.
We have a large proportion ofyoung Māori who are going to,
who are going to in the next 50years, they're going to be a
(15:57):
large proportion of ourpopulation.
So if we want to ensure that wehave growth without having to go
externally from New Zealand forthat growth, we need to ensure
that they are upskilled and theyare kept safe.
Greg (16:12):
These looking back and
summary episodes really capture
the essence of what it takes toindigenize health and safety
practices.
I hope you found somethingvaluable that you can take away
that might enhance aspects ofyour own cultural intelligence.
I'll add the transcript fromthis episode to the show notes.
If you'd like to talk aboutcultural intelligence, get in
(16:34):
touch with me via LinkedIn.
If we aren't connected, send mean invite.
If you want to hear more aboutCQ, you can follow or subscribe
to this podcast.
I'd really appreciate it if youdid that.
And keep an eye out for the nextepisode.
Thanks for tuning in to TheCulturally Intelligent Safety
Professional.
(16:55):
Ka kitei.