Broken and Redeemed- Laura Davis Mansfield's Journey

Episode Transcript
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Chris Nafis (00:00):
Hey, welcome back to the Current.
I'm Pastor Chris Nafis ofLiving Water Church and today we
have an old friend with us,laura Davis Mansfield, who was a
part of our church for manyyears, from the very beginning
on, until she and her husband,monty, left to be in officer
training school in the SalvationArmy.
Laura has had a lot of ups anddowns in her life.

(00:21):
A constant overachiever, shewent from having an Ivy League
degree, being a sports star inhigh school and college to the
streets of San Diego, which iswhere we met her.
This is a story of hardship, butalso a story of redemption.
Laura is very vulnerable withus in the story, so I want to
thank her for being willing toshare that hard part of her

(00:42):
journey so that we can all beenlightened by some of the
things that drive people intohomelessness and to give us some
hope that people can find theirway out of it and into a life
that is redeemed and that isfull of help and service to
others.
So I hope you enjoyed Laura'sstory and be warned, there's

(01:02):
some hard stuff in there, so youknow, if you're a sensitive
listener, just kind of be onyour guard.
But here it is.
Hi, laura, thank you so muchfor taking the time to come on

(01:33):
here with me.

Laura Davis Mansfield (01:34):
We miss you at Living Water?
How are you doing today?
Nice to see everyone.
We're doing pretty good here inRancho Palos Verdes, California
.

Okay, how long have we known each other?

Laura, since at least 2016.
I know that for sure.
When you planted the church inSan Diego, we were doing it
outside in the park.

Yeah.

That park was.

Fall Line Park.
You were there in the Fall LinePark days.
I thought I knew you were there, at least in the old building.
I couldn't remember if you werethere even before that.
So that was like the verybeginning of the church and you
were in and out of the church,mostly in for like a lot of
years until you and Monty gotmarried and you guys got into
the Salvation Army program and,man, we miss you.

(02:16):
It's a joy to see you and wewere talking a little before.
I'm like man, laura just hasthis.
You just have this like energyand this like joy that follows
you everywhere and, um, yeah,it's, it's just a blessing to
have you around and so thanksfor thanks again for being here.
Um, so we're going to talk alittle bit about your journey
because, uh, well, I'll let youtell most of the story, but you

(02:40):
were someone that we, when wemet you, uh, you were on the
street in San Diego, right andstruggling still with addiction
and had a number of issues goingon, but maybe could you tell I
don't even think a lot of LivingWater folks know could you tell
us like a little bit about likeyour life before that, like
what led you, or how'd you get?
How'd you end up on the streetsof San Diego?

Yes, thanks, pastor Chris.
So I grew up in Pennsylvania, alittle town called Drexel Hill,
pennsylvania, right outside ofPhiladelphia, and so my journey
starts with a very dysfunctionalfamily.
My mother's mentally ill andshe has been in a mental
institution since 1987.
And so that was really hard onme.

(03:20):
As a kid I lived with my fatherand stepmother.
She was verbally abusive andemotionally abusive.
I was subjected to sexual abuse.
When I was growing up, too Alittle girl at seven years old.
A lot went on, but I always hadthat smile on my face and I
always had joy of the Lord.
Jesus was always in my heart asa little girl and really I just

(03:43):
loved the world, even thoughthe world at times I felt didn't
love me back.
And so I went off and I got outof my father's and stepmother's
house when I was 12 in 1987.
And when child abuse was nottalked about and I just knew it

(04:03):
would be better in foster careor on the streets, I was scared
for my life.
I thought my stepmother reallywas threatening to kill me.
So I honestly was so scared Ididn't care where I was going.
I just wasn't going home thereand luckily, through the grace
of God, I was able to get outand live with my mother for a

(04:24):
little bit it was right beforeshe got put into the mental
institution for schizophreniaand then.
So I went to go live with auntsand uncles.
So I have fabulous aunts anduncles.
That really took me in, kind oflike that Disney princess right
, we're the prodigal niece, asthey say in biblical terms.

(04:45):
But really my doctor aunt andher husband lived with their
kids during the school year allthrough high school.
And my other aunt on mymother's side and Carol, lived
with them in the summertime andI had wonderful grandmothers.
I was very close to mygrandmother, laura.
She lived to 97 years old and Iloved her with my heart and we

(05:08):
had just a unique, wonderful,beautiful
mother-daughter-grandmotherrelationship.
She was really pivotal inshowing me a role model, what a
woman role model really was, andalso my aunts were very pivotal
in that.
And then all my friends, myfriend's parents, even at age

(05:33):
three.
A woman named Andy Kimmons wasbest friend with Brent since
three years old.
She would watch me at the pooland I'm still friends with her
today.
So it was really my friends allthrough high school and college
that heard my story and saw myhope and my joy in the Lord and
I wasn't allowing anything tokind of defeat me.
So I became an overachiever.
I played sports.
I was able to get onto thevarsity starter when I was a

(05:53):
sophomore in high school.
I was part of the basketballteam and field hockey lacrosse
executive committee.
I was all in journalism brownand white newspaper yearbook and
really kind of voted as mostlikely to succeed in life
because I was very driven andmotivated and worked very hard.
I graduated from Upper DerbyHigh School in the National

(06:17):
Honor Society, which was veryprestigious.
At my school my graduatingclass was about 600 kids, so it
was a big school to, and theyonly chose like maybe 50 people
to be in national honor society.
So, um, and I was really goodat playing lacrosse.
That was like my true, truepassion.
Um, and then I entered it.

Well, I didn't know you played so much lacrosse but
I have to say, like people whoknow you from living water days,
like none of this is reallysurprising.
I think you're such like a youjust you're involved in
everything all the time, youknow, and you just do things
well and again with that joy andlike yeah, that's like, oh,
yeah, that's who Laura is.

(06:59):
Even with all of the baggagegoing on at home, like in your,
in your, with your stepmom andyour dad and all that like even
through that, you had this likewarm support system through
extended family and friends, butlike obviously a lot of like
traumatizing stuff kind of underthe surface, but then you're
just like killing it in schooland in sports and in all the
other areas and just likeinvolved in everything like that

(07:21):
.
I don't know, somehow I'm like,yep, that's, that's Laura.
Anyway, sorry to mean tointerrupt, go on.
So after school.

And later in my story, when I became
homeless.
I became an overachiever andhomeless.

Yeah, for sure, that's that's what I'm saying.
Like, I feel like even when youwere on the street, you were
doing that, like you wereinvolved in everything.
You knew every organization.
You were volunteeringeverywhere, including at our
church, and I'm like, yeah,that's yeah, that's, that's it.

I am, but uh.
But what happened though?
Um, my first challenge is Ilove lacrosse with all my heart.
Um, it kept me out of trouble.
Um, and then I tore my ACL, myknee and lacrosse game and, uh,
I actually had surgery onOctober 1st 1992.

(08:07):
And I was a senior in highschool and I went back.
I actually injured it in myjunior year in the spring.
I went back for field hockeycamp in the summer and I
couldn't move my knee.
I kept going down field so Iwas devastated.
I had knee surgery, acl,reconstructive knee surgery, uh,
with a meniscus tear.

(08:27):
So basically I was out.
You know, I was out, for my onepassion was taken away from me.
But did I let it get me down?
No, I just got involved insomething else so well, and, and
I was also friends with theolder kids.
Um, so when I got into my senioryear it was a little rough.
I don't have lacrosse and I'mbeing recruited for field hockey

(08:49):
and lacrosse by Ivy Leagueschools and so luckily they
could only give academicscholarships, they couldn't give
out sports scholarships.
So I was still able to keep myscholarship in college but
needless to say, I just becamevery, very involved in other
organizations, things thatdidn't revolve around sports,

(09:11):
but I was well-rounded.
So all my eggs weren't in thelacrosse basket, they were
well-rounded.
Other things to fall back on,very pivotal in my story in life
, when I get disappointed inlife or things are going really
good and then I get thrown acurveball, I'm able to be
well-rounded and I havesomething else to fall back on,

(09:33):
and that's a current theme in mylife and I think that's very
important to mention now thatI'm talking to you.
I didn't even realize thisuntil.
I just said it, but I reallyfeel that if we put all of our
energies into one part of ourlives, even just spiritual,
mental, emotional, physical,like if we just work so hard and
like working out, if we'reworking on our, you know,

(09:54):
physical and we're not takingcare of our spiritual things,
are you don't have anything tofall back on when things don't
go your way, um, so, anyway.
So so I was recruited for fieldhockey and lacrosse by Ivy
League schools.
I did get a scholarshipacademic to Lehigh University
it's a hidden Ivy League inPennsylvania, bethlehem,

(10:16):
pennsylvania and I went tocollege and I was there for four
years and originally I waspre-med in journalism, um, and
then my freshman year it waskind of interesting I joined a
sorority delta gamma, uh, andthat's uh.
Sorority life is awesome.
It's not even just thestereotypical like party rah-rah

(10:38):
, fraternities.
We did a lot with um, communityservice and a lot of
fundraisers and organizationsand what have you, and also
going to the fraternity partiesand drinking.
So it was a big year for people.
So I knew I got involved.
I started the rugby team that'sstill a club sport now to this
day, like 25 years later andplus.

(10:59):
So I ended up playing a cluband not wearing my knee brace
and kind of risking it.
Luckily I didn't get hurt inthe knee and I played that year
round, kept me out of trouble,kept me involved and I loved it.
And we wouldn't like a sport atthe time Like you could beat
each other up on the field andwith a rugby ball and I was

(11:22):
scrum half, so it's kind of likethe quarterback of the team,
and then you get to party withthem afterwards so that was kind
of cool in college.
I don't recommend that now, butit was really fun in college.
And then I graduated fromcollege.
It actually took me that summerafter graduation for me to

(11:43):
complete my degree because Icould walk with my class, but I
had a few classes that I had totake in order to graduate.
My junior year I wasn't doingso well in college.
I was behavioral neuroscience,a big biopsychology and
journalism and I just I wasfailing all my classes, which
was very hard to deal with.

(12:03):
I just wasn't in the rightmajor.
It has a very big engineeringand business school with a lot
of work in chem and engineersthat were like knocking off all
the classes and really wasn'twhere my passion lied.
So basically, my junior year Iwas year round summer sessions,
winter sessions and fall andspring session and I completed I

(12:27):
think 60 credits out of 125needed in one year and I really
buckled down.
I lived off campus so I didn'thave that much responsibility
with a sorority.
I worked as a waitress allthrough college on weekends to
pay my way because I didn't haveparents in my life to help me

(12:47):
with that.
So really it's a blessing and acurse.
I was able to do what I wanted,when I wanted, whatever I
wanted, and I had to be my ownparent and you know, counselor,
parent, teacher.
So that was kind of, you know,hard, I guess.
But, like I said, I overcameand I'm an overcomer resilient.
So I graduate with a BA inpsychology and a BA in

(13:11):
journalism, with a minor inscientist writing, and I was
working as a counselor for KidsPeace in Pennsylvania and then I
decided California.
Dreaming, I wanted to come toCalifornia.
I was 23 years old, I had justgraduated from college and I was
dating this man which, when youdon't have a very good

(13:36):
relationship with your father orany kind of male figures
growing up in life, we tend tochoose men that are just like
our fathers.
It's either just like yourfather or nothing like your
father.
Unfortunately for me, I alwaysliked the bad boys and that
weren't very healthy for me.
That kind of got in the way ofme achieving.

(13:58):
I got emotionally involved inwhat have you in multiple
relationships, like long-termrelationships, monogamous, but
at the same time it kind ofshifted my focus from
overachieving to investing timeinto a relationship.
Anyway, I came out toCalifornia.

So just to pause real quick.
Just to pause real quick, ifthat's okay.
So because just to highlight,like at this point in your life,
like you have a double majorfrom an Ivy League school,
you're a decorated athlete,you're like popular sorority
girl, quarterback of the rugbyteam.
For you know, just for the Iknow that's not the position,
but like you know, you're like aleader on the team and like

(14:38):
most people would probably lookat you from outside and be like,
wow, she is just killing it,like this is killing it in life.
But obviously, like you'resaying, there's some, some
things from that, likerelationships, from that family
dynamics that um are stillcarrying with you, that are kind
of leading into these, thesenegative uh relationships that
are starting to show some signsof trouble.

(14:59):
Thankfully you're a veryresilient person and so you're
able to overcome even some ofthose setbacks in the time.
But like, yeah, just to like alittle reset, uh, because I'm
following along with the story.
Okay, so you started.
You come to california, do youcome to san diego or did you
come somewhere else?

no, san diego.
So I have six weeks crosscountry.
I'm in a beat up old red andblue pickup truck with all my
worldly possessions in the back,with the tarp cover, and we
traveled for six weeks crosscountry Amazing experience.
My family really was me againstcoming out here aunts and
uncles and what have you, andeven my aunt's, like you can't

(15:37):
bring your car.
I said, well, I don't need mycar, here you go, here are the
keys, I'm out.
So and then my friend's fatheralways said he's like Laura,
just go for the experience.
You never want to be sittinglater in life and wondering what
had, what would have happenedif I had gone out there?
Following a dream Also was good.
He's like you can always comeback, which is true I go back

(16:00):
for vacations and spend timewith family, but that's.
I never really went back afterfive years or almost 30 years in
California, but yeah, so it wasmore or less like moved to San
Diego, cross country travels forsix weeks Amazing, get planted
in.
Actually it was.

(16:20):
At first it was Imperial Beach.
So I was working in ImperialBeach well, working in Coronado
at a place called Costa Azul I'mwaitressing.
Then I moved to Pacific Beachand I started working for a
publishing company.
It's a printing company.
Things are going good.

(16:41):
I'm breaking up with theboyfriend and he was getting
involved in drugs and alcoholand and weed and all this other
stuff that I wasn't down with atthe time and so I stopped
partying with them and I'm and Ijust really focus on working.
I'm all in, like it depends,like if I'm in a relationship,

(17:04):
I'm all in.
If I'm in work.
I'm all in, like it depends Like.
If I'm in a relationship, I'mall in.
If I'm in work, I'm all in.
If I'm in recovery, I'm all in.
It's like I'm always all in forJesus, too, I'm like, always
all in.
I'm either all out, you know,but I'm.
I get distractions along theway.
But then I started working in apublishing company and I I have
a servant heart, but I also amattracted to people that are

(17:26):
going through uncomfortablesituations, family deaths.
It seems like a big pattern inmy life.
When somebody is going througha boyfriend is going through
something, then I am there forthem as support, and then we end
up dating and then it turnsinto a whole long term thing.
So, anyway, so I met Padreprinters and publishers.

(17:47):
I met my daughter's dad.
His mom was suffering fromcancer pancreatic cancer that
metastasized breast cancer, whathave you.
So I was really there for him.
I had broken up with myboyfriend for some few reasons
and so, yeah, it was.
We were even on change of heart, which I'll have to send you

(18:08):
that link, um, my ex-boyfriendand I.
so you can actually see a videoof what I was like when I was 20
years old out to californiadreaming um, but that turned
into like a little bit of notdreaming.
So I met my daughter's dad.

I never married him uh together nine years.

Got pregnant, met my daughter's dad
I never married him Togethernine years Got pregnant with my
daughter, probably about a yearinto our relationship and he's
11 years older than me.
I'm still good friends with himtoday for the sake of my
daughter, and we are goodfriends with co-parenting, or
the co-relationship withparenting of my daughter.

(18:43):
So I just became all in.
I was pregnant with my daughter.
So I just became all in.
I was pregnant with my daughter.
She was my dream come true.
If you ask my aunt, she wouldsay all that I really wanted was
to have a family of my own, youknow, to have a family, kids of
my own that I love.
They love me, a supportivehusband, and I really didn't get
that.
It was more or less.
I had a very much singlelifestyle with my daughter's dad

(19:07):
.
We lived together, but I becamea single mom working from home.
We were like two shifts,passing the night he was in
sales.
He'd go out at night fordinners and drinks with the
sales guys, and then weekends itwas always a football game or
what have you.
Um, out the bars drinking andum.

(19:27):
And then it was like 2005 whenwe had a lot going on that year,
um, that neither one of uscould emotionally handle.
Um, it was pivotal, um, to thepoint of where I did become a
single mom.
That following like six monthslater, um, but 2005 we had um,
oh, by the way, I tore my ACL ormy shoulder when I was in rugby

(19:49):
, but I let it go seven years.
So I had in 2005,.
I had to have reconstructiveshoulder surgery from rugby.
So I had that surgery.
And in April my mother-in-lawwell, april, my mother-in-law
well, my daughter's dad's motherwe called her mama.
She passed away in February.

(20:09):
Then I had shoulder surgery inApril.
I'm working now in business.
I'm an executive assistant atNexcel for three years Very
reputable.
My daughter's in kindergartenand preschools and kindergarten
and what have you.
My daughter's in kindergartenand preschools and kindergarten
and what have you.
And then my aunt had ananeurysm, her third brain

(20:30):
aneurysm that erupted.
She's totally fine today, butit was a very scary time for me.
We thought we were really goingto lose her.
And then it was my birthday.
I gave myself a deadline and Ijust kind of knew after that
year.
And then my daughter's dad he'sbasically my brother-in-law.

(20:53):
He passed away in October.
So a lot of things went on thatwhole year a lot of deaths.
My daughter's dad starteddrinking a lot out of the bars,
moving away from me and I wascarrying the load of, you know,
mother working, mom supportingmy daughter, taking care of
everything, with her school,involved, with the PTO.

(21:16):
It was just a lot to handle,yeah, and we had definitely just
, we were like two ships passingthe night, so I decided to
leave him.
Definitely, just, we were liketwo ships passing the night, so
I decided to leave him.
So I finally, it was mybirthday, september 30th of 2006
.
And I finally left mydaughter's dad.
And now, mind you, chris, I'mlike 31 at the time and I'm 3000

(21:40):
miles away from family.
My mother's still in a mentalinstitution, which is very hard.
I didn't have a mom to call andsay, hey, I'm a single mom and
I can't handle it.
Like what do you do?
I'm freaking out because I'malone, three thousand miles away
from any help, um, and I haveno emotional support.

(22:01):
I'm I'm working atcel, have agood reputation, but I'm
embarrassed to tell people thatI can't handle being a single
mom trying to get my daughter toschool.
She was getting sick a lot, alot of infections and a few
other things going on with hermedically and it was just a

(22:21):
really rough time.
Honestly, pastor Chris and Istarted I couldn't sleep.
I was so stressed out that I,honestly, I was so worried about
everything how I was going topay my rent my rent was like
$1,600 a month in my ownone-bedroom apartment how I was
going to give food for mydaughter.
And, not having a break, shedidn't go to her dad, she went

(22:44):
to her dad's on Mondays andTuesdays during school and and
work.
I had no weekends off for yearsand I really burned myself out
to the point of I couldn't sleep.
And they, I went to the ER, theemergency room in San Diego, uh,
scripps, mercy, and they put meon Klonopin, which is a benzo,
and they no longer prescribethis in doctor's offices because

(23:07):
it's highly, highly addictive.
And so I went there and they'relike, hey, why don't we give
you like some Klonopin andyou'll be fine?
And they gave me some Klonopinand I was fine, but I was
addicted, right, and it was.
You know, I had like anaddictive personality.
Um, you know, when I was incollege I drank alcohol, but not

(23:29):
to excess for the most part, um, but when I got out of college
I could go and have a glass ofwine or a margarita and it was
fine.
It didn't lead into you knowother things, um.
But when I got put on thatKlonopin, it's like a Valium or
a Xanax, but times 10.
And it relieved my anxiety.
But I was addicted and I had tohave it like you felt like when

(23:54):
I was withdrawing withoutmedical help and doctors weren't
prescribing it to me either.
So I started going overseas andthe doctors are like the
psychiatrist here is like no,we're not giving it to you, it's
very addictive, very addictive.
You can't be on it forlong-term because it's not
healthy and also you're probablysuffering from depression,

(24:17):
situational anxiety.
Either go home to Pennsylvaniawhere you have support.
But I believed in thefather-daughter bond, so I was
not.
My daughter is very close toher dad, so I didn't want to
take her away from her dad.
Um, so I just um.
I got in this whole clump and Ihad to have it and it became
like Monty always talks about um, my husband, monty, always says

(24:40):
, like the phenomenon, cravingof the phenomenon, or phenomenon
of the craving, um, but that'sreally when my addiction really
set in and started, uh, gettingit overseas.
So for maybe seven years it wasa vicious cycle um of me
getting my prescription Klonopinoverseas.
Some of the shipments would getconfiscated, never gotten to

(25:02):
any legal trouble thankfullyShipments would get confiscated,
never got into any legaltrouble.
Thankfully because I sent it toa PO box.
So I was kind of smart there.
But my daughter had to see mego from successful single mom,
pto mom, to a mom addicted toKlonopin and then when I

(25:24):
couldn't get my Klonopinshipments, sometimes there was
like a month where.
I couldn't get them.
Then I to hard alcohol andthat's the only thing hard
alcohol and I never agreed.
And beer wine used to be fine,but I never.
Really I stayed away on purposefrom shots and hard alcohol but
that's all that I could do tohelp me with like coming down.
You feel like you're losingyour mind.
I mean, yeah, I don't know ifyour audience, if anybody's been
on this drug, but it honestly,when you come off, you could

(25:47):
have a heart attack, you couldhave like a stroke if you don't
have a medical detox from it.
And I did this over and overand over again.
It's like the whole saying likethe insanity, keep doing the
same thing over and over againand expect different results.

Were you just trying to quit on your own?
Or were you like was it justbecause the shipments didn't
come in, or or?
Well, yeah, where were you atwith?

that, honestly, when you're in that
cycle on, and I wasn't workingand I had sold my car to pay my
rent because I was tooembarrassed to tell my family I
wasn't making it out here, Iquit my job at Nexel through the
merger of Sprint because Icouldn't handle taking my
daughter to school and workingfull time and traveling to

(26:30):
Irvine.
I just couldn't do it.
So I took a sales job that Iwas terrible at, I hated sales,
so anxious, and then I couldn'tfind a job.
For many years I could not finda job.
So after a while I got sodiscouraged I gave up.
I sold my car so I have no wayof getting around and I
basically put myself into myhouse for like three years.
Honestly, pastor Chris, forthree years of my life I barely

(26:53):
went out.
I was scared to take my trashout to my dumpster.
I would go out at night and Iwas so embarrassed about the
alcohol that I started like inmy kitchen it became like a
mountain of of alcohol bottlesand.
I keep looking back.
I I never lost hope in my life,but I lost hope and it was like

(27:15):
dark.
I shut the shades and I and mydaughter had to see witnesses
and she had to see me.
It wasn't like.
I was always like how old wasshe?
She was, uh.
It got really bad when she wentinto sixth grade.
Um, because she was at, uh, anelementary school by where we
lived in little italy.
Um, but then my single momgroup we dispersed because all

(27:38):
of our kids were going todifferent, uh middle schools,
because here, in california.
It's something different thanpennsylvania, but we have choice
out schools.
So in Pennsylvania you have togo public schools, you have to
go to that school.
That's in your zip code.
California you can choosewhatever.
As long as parents providetransportation, you can go to
any school you choose.

(27:59):
So my daughter went to a schoolover in Pacific beach and all my
friends were in La Mesa and,like my social support, my
emotional support of single momfriends with daughters
themselves, they kind ofscattered.
It scattered and I had nobodyand that's when I sold my car to
pay my rent, it turned into awhole big thing, downward spiral

(28:21):
.

Honestly, pastor Chris, it's downward spiral,
which, again, like knowing youand, like you said, like we've
known each other for a long timeand living water folks that
have been around long enough,like you are not an introverted
person, you know what I mean.
Like you are someone who likesto be out there, kind of social
butterfly, and so to imagine youlike pent up in your house,

(28:43):
like you must have been reallystruggling pretty hard with some
things and really feeling a lotof shame and all of that.
So how did you end up losingyour place?

Well, actually it's a whole long story
.
It's when I finally got intosome recovery.
I kind of pulled the plug on myown housing and became homeless
by choice in some ways.
So it gets kind of convoluted.
So anyway, so my PhilippinesIgloo RX no longer in business,

(29:16):
goes out of business, no longergetting my Klonopin from
Philippines.
Everybody else is a scam.
That I tried and found out.
Everybody's a scam.
So they closed the Roush plantPhilippines.
Everybody else is a scam.
Then I tried and found outeverybody's a scam, so they
closed the Roush plant.
It was like RoushPharmaceuticals and they closed
the plant.
This is April 1st of 2000 andmaybe 12, I think, and 2013,

(29:40):
2012 or 2013.
So I got sober, cold turkey andon April 1st of that year got
rid of the alcohol.
Immediately my daughter got hermom back.
You know I cleared out.
I put on Craigslist like, hey,come, pick up all my beer
bottles that I've been storingup for years.
They all came.
They're like oh, this isamazing that you're turning your

(30:01):
life around.
They invited me to AA meetings.
I went to a few AA meetings butit's kind of clicky.
The one few meetings that Iwent to I just didn't really
find my groove or my people thatI could.
So I didn't really stick withthat.
So I was just sober, but I hadno job.
I was in my apartment.

(30:22):
I was like going and hangingout at the coffee shop, not
drinking anymore, which is great, but I had nothing else.
I was doing nothing else.
Again, if you put all your eggsin one basket and other areas
of your life aren't working,it's all going to collapse on
you.

Right.

No, I wasn't on Klonopin.
I was getting my life together,like mentally I was with it and
I was working physically, butmy spiritual and emotional
well-being really wasn't being.
It was just the symptoms wasn'tbeing treated, I guess.
So for a few months I justdidn't know what to do with

(31:01):
myself.
But at least I was going out, Iwas walking every day, I was
going into little Italy.
I was, um, I was going on thebuses learning the bus systems
of San Diego.
So I was getting out there, um,and it gave my daughter hope
that she was getting her momback.
I started watching kids againand my daughter's friends would
come over and I'd take them outeverywhere and started renting a

(31:23):
car.
I rented a car, like just permonth, um, so like things were
getting good again, right, soagain they're you know, three
year lapse of of going into deepdespair, um.
But then I came out again and,um, it's kind of like falling
into the deep end of a pool andlike, or jumping off a cliff and

(31:45):
coming up from air, and you'relike, oh, I, you know, I can
breathe again.
Oh, this is what it's like.
It's like to breathe.
I can't believe I wasunderwater for so long and then
it's like okay, well, I don'treally know how to do anything
but doggy paddle right, I don'tknow.
I don't know how to swim.
Really, I'm sitting therefloating around.
So I ended up.

(32:08):
So I was going through a verybig depression.
I didn't know what to do withmy life.
I wasn't relying on drugs andalcohol.
It's like that fog had liftedfor like six months.
So I remember on my birthdayagain, I went up to the ER and I
said I'm really depressed.
Like I am really depressed.
I, um, I don't know what'sgoing on with like I, I just

(32:33):
have like empty.
It was like kind of like anempty shell.
I said I need help, and so theyactually put me in a crisis
house for the first time.
San Diego is wonderful with theresources resources for the
most part, because there'snowhere after the.
Are you familiar with whatcrisis houses are, chris?

I am, but maybe say for those who aren't, yeah.

So and I spend this is kind of pivotal in
my homeless story too theresources of San Diego that,
pastor Chris, you and I haddiscussed earlier on.
Like you said, I use all ofthem.
I have like a Yelp rating oneach one and all of them get a
piece of four star becausethere's a lot of resources in
San Diego that I hope othercities do model, because really

(33:16):
we have it going on in San Diegofor programs.
The only thing about thehomelessness is there's programs
for when you're in crisis, butthere's nowhere to go after the
crisis is over, right.
So, no long-term solutions.
So you go to a crisis house forabout two weeks.
There's like four in San Diego.

(33:37):
They're like renovated housesand at each house and they're
really houses there's likemental health counselors,
psychiatrists, so they help youget on medication if you're
having some mental issues.
It's a community living, so youhave tours and everybody gets
their room or shared with aroommate.

(33:58):
You get food, you get fed, youlearn to get your doctor's
appointments out of the way.
You can go to, like, if you'relooking into rehabs, I go to
church but it's really only 10days Two weeks is the limit and
then they just put you back onthe street again without any
real kind of rehabilitation,like a new way of life.

(34:20):
So you go to doing what youknow and then it turns into
another cycle.

So what happens to your daughter when you're at a
crisis house?

Well, I went to the first crisis house,
they put me on Zoloft, which Ido not recommend.
I did have an adverse reactionto Zoloft and so I was diagnosed
with bipolar, but I wasdiagnosed when I was like coming
off a Klonopin, so it was um.

(34:50):
You know, I, I do believethere's a spectrum of bipolar.
I'm your functional bipolar.
I don't like to um lead by thestigma of bipolar and I don't
feel bipolar Um, but there is astigma and I, I, I say this
lightly, I didn't want to beturned into my mom.
You know that like always afear in my life.

(35:12):
So when I get the diagnosis ofbipolar, and once you get
diagnosed on, it's very hard toget away from the diagnosis, um.
And.
But mine was a drug relateddrug related diagnosis, coming
off of Klonopin and alcohol, but, needless to say, so I'm off,
it's September 30th of 2013.

(35:34):
And so I went to the crisishouse and my daughter's dad did
watch my daughter.
He knew I was not well, youknow, but he couldn't do
anything really about it, didn'ttry any intervention and what
have you.
So I went there and it was likea breath of fresh air, like I'm
not alone, there's resources,um, anyway.

(35:55):
So I got put on on Zoloft andit's an antidepressant.
Um, you should never take thatwithout a mood stabilizer if you
are bipolar.
And so I'm not drinking, not onclonpin, don't have any life or
any kind of spiritual um thing.
I was like up at night andsleeping during the day.

(36:22):
It was like October 22nd of 2013.
My daughter's in seventh grade,I think yeah, seventh grade,
and I don't know what happenedthat night, but I take my Zoloft
and sometimes Zoloft andEffexor, which comes into play
later, not with me, but with mycousin that committed suicide.

(36:43):
It can cause suicidal ideations, so I do not recommend getting
on any new medication without onany kind of like accountability
partner or somebody that canhelp you oversee.
Yeah, throw you on a medication, a psych medication, and just
throw you back in your apartment, like I said, no programs to go
after that, and you could bedead in there if nobody checks

(37:05):
on you.
Right?
That's what happened to me andI was get.
I got prescribed from thedoctors on this Zoloft and I had
an adversary action and it was.
You know, I almost committedsuicide in front of my daughter.
So, that was like really toughsuicide in front of my daughter.

(37:28):
So that was like really toughand um, you know, and I couldn't
blame it on alcohol and Icouldn't blame it on drugs,
because that wasn't it um, I didthe best that I could do with
my daughter at the time do stillhold on to like a lot of guilt,
but I kind of like my wholeworld, yeah.
So like, if you hear my story,um, even when I was homeless and
I met you, I didn't really talkabout my daughter a whole lot.

(37:48):
I was like ashamed and, um, andI really love my daughter and
I've worked very hard to, youknow, mend the relationship in
god's timing, um, but at thattime I lost everything.
Like my whole world likecollided and my daughter went to
go live with her dad and, um,that night she called her dad

(38:09):
and he came and picked her upand, um, and then, uh, yeah, I
went into, uh, san Diego Countyum psychiatric, uh, there, and
again they treated me, um, andthey put me on a bipolar med, a
mood stabilizer, and then sentme home again, and so my

(38:31):
daughter's now really mad at me.
Uh, she was always strong willed, but now she's like I'm going
to live with my dad.
She had like I had 85% custodyof her.
Um, how could you do this to me?
And it was very uncomfortable.
I go visit her on Thursdays ather dad's, now supervised, and
this is 2013.
I finally and I and 2024,finally had my first lunch with

(38:57):
my daughter without her dad'ssupervision.
So it really took me 10 years ofreally working on my
relationship with my daughter,but there is hope out there for
anybody, because my daughterswore she would never talk to me
again.
She's 13, 14, doesn't want totalk to me.
And then the following year,about six months later, I'm and

(39:20):
I went through a deep, darkdepression, couldn't even get
out of bed, um, but I'm notdrinking no alcohol, but I had
nothing.
And um, then I I go to pacificbeach and I met up with friends
and I found meth, meth andamphetamine.
I always said it saved my life.
I'm so grateful that I did findmeth because it got me out of

(39:43):
my room Hold on one second andit got me out of my dark place.
But my counselor later told mehe said, laura, you didn't get
your life back.
He's like you got a life back,but not your life back, that's
right.
But then I was.
Then it was on.
I was on methamphetamine forabout two years.

(40:05):
I yeah, it was.
It was.
I found friends in PacificBeach.
It was fun.
I had that joy back in my heart.
It felt good.
I was partying, I was makingfriends.
It was, you know, great atfirst and then turned into not
so great again after theaddiction kicks in.

(40:27):
So then I met my ex-boyfriend.
I'm an Uber driver.
I've now joined the Uberex-leasing program, so I'm
driving around a new Prius andgetting myself together on meth.
And for a while, and then itturned into not so much.
So my ex-boyfriend, uh, againanother ride or die, bad boy

(40:49):
drug dealer.
Um, and it was on so for liketwo years.
I, um my daughters live with herdad ever since this incident on
2013.
Um, now I'm just not presentfor her um in her high school
years, like she's in eighthgrade, ninth grade, 10th grade,

(41:09):
11th grade I'm not there, um andI became homeless in.
My first day of being homelesswas October 30th of 2016.
So from like 2014 to like 2016,I'm on meth.
I'm off and on going up toOrange County relapsing where my

(41:32):
boyfriend lived at the time,not working really other than
occasional Uberber drives.
I'm just on meth partying andwith other people and uh yeah,
so it was a whole big thing.

But yeah, well, that's a.
We met you not long after that,I think, or maybe even be,
maybe even right around then,and yeah you, you met me.

I started using math.
It was like February 22nd of2015.
And then a year later, in 2016.

And like I guess what I'm noticing as I listen to
your story is first of all, howthese, all these different
experiences, they just likecompound one another.
You know what I mean and theylead to one another.
So you know, getting like, youknow, physical injury that leads

(42:26):
to some mental issues, and then, you know, you get on, you get
a prescription that's addictiveand that leads you to further
deepening addiction and thatleads to broken relationships.
And you know, and just you canjust see how, like everything
kind of like folds in on eachother and like you know, like,
when you're telling your story,and like, discovering meth is

(42:48):
like a life-saving thing.
You know what I mean.
Like that's, you're like, ohyeah, something is wrong here
because like, how bad must ithave been that like getting into
meth was like actually like astep up in the world.
You know what I mean becauseit's you know we like, we know
meth pretty well in our, in ourcontext, and it's interesting
because meth was huge back thenin in our neighborhood.

(43:10):
Now it's all fentanyl, so it'skind of like a.
I mean people still use meth,but it's just like a.
I don't know.
It's interesting how the wavescome, but um, um, but you can
just see how, like everythingkind of rolls in on each other
and then you like have thisbroken relationship with your
daughter, which is superdepressing and leads you further
into like the pit and uh, youknow and and all of this, like
we we wouldn't, we didn't knowany of this.

(43:32):
Like we met you and you're likethis bubble of joy knew you
were using, you know, just likeyou seem like probably using
meth, but didn't, like you said,you didn't mention your
daughter for a lot of years Ithink it was like several years
before I knew you even had adaughter and she's like the huge
, like maybe the biggest pieceof your life.
But there's so much like shameand and all the things around it

(43:53):
, uh, that you know you got tokeep this part of yourself
hidden, I guess.
I guess what I'm just trying tohighlight for people that are
kind of unfamiliar with likethis, just homelessness and
addiction in this world is likehow complicated things are and
how much is going on underneaththe surface, because everybody
that we meet in our church,that's on the street,
everybody's story is different,obviously, but everybody has

(44:14):
been through something you knowwhat I mean and everybody has
like more going on than youthink.
I like I wouldn't have guessedI knew you're smart and you know
could tell you were probablylike an achiever type person,
but like wouldn't have guessedyou had an Ivy league degree.
Like there's so many thingsbeneath the surface that, um,
that people are just guardedabout it.

(44:34):
And so if you only have like asurface level relationship with
somebody on the street, they'reonly going to show you a little
bit of themselves and they'reonly going to show you what they
want to show you and that'sself-protection, like if they're
not being necessarily beingmanipulative or something.
That's just like becausethey're ashamed.
You know we all do this.
We all kind of guard what weshare with others.
Um, and when you're, when it'sso difficult to unpack all the

(44:55):
things that you've been through,it's got to feel overwhelming
to try to open that up forsomebody else also.
All right, so you're on, you're, you're using meth, you're on
the street, you're comingthrough, you know like a more of
an opioid type addiction beforethat, and and where do you?
I mean, are we there yet?
Like, where do you start tofind some help in getting clean

(45:18):
and sober and for real, you know.
So, like you said, chris, Imean are we there yet?

Like, where do you start to find some
help in getting clean and sober?
And, for real, you knowhomeless.
So, like you said, chris, Imean thank you for actively
listening and just kind ofrepeating back to me.
And it really is.
It's refreshing for me to get asummary of when you're going
through things firsthand.
You forget about the outsider'sperspective that sees things

(45:41):
that you can't Even in the roomsof recovery.
It's like you all loved me atLiving Water Nazarene Church
when I couldn't love myself.
Same thing with this podcastrecording.
It's just really refreshinghearing it from you, because we
do have a friendship and you are.
You know, you have counseled mein the past, and pastoral care

(46:05):
too, and so it's really nice tocome to terms.
You know now that I'm on theother side, you know, and it's
just super refreshing, but myfirst day being homeless, so
it's October 30th of 2016.
I'm still on meth.
I've been on meth for a year.
It's kind of a binger.

(46:26):
I could like put it down for awhile and then I would.
Basically my pattern or mycycle would be I'd use meth and
then I'd go up to Orange County,come back to San Diego, get
sober for three months and thenI'd use meth and then I'd go to
Orange County, come back to SanDiego, get sober for three
months and then I'd be missingmy boyfriend and go back up
there again.
I couldn't find a job.
The one key part is I couldnever find a job and I honestly

(46:49):
felt that if there was a programthat was offered to me, like
the Alproject Wheels of Change Iwas on the news for that, like
the Al Project Wheels of Change,I was on the news for that.
Really, when I was given a joblike I don't feel that my life
would have gotten so out ofcontrol because I would have had
accountability.
If things were going with me,other people would know and call
me out on it.

(47:09):
So there's that loving kindnessthat I've always felt from
others, no matter what.
But it's first day and I hadcome off.
I was up and stranded in OrangeCounty.
My boyfriend just dropped meoff the Amtrak.
No money, no food, on meth.
So I camped out there for threedays in the woods of Amtrak of

(47:31):
Irvine and I came out and I washungry.
So I'm not on, I'm not high,I'm super skinny, though.
I haven't eaten for three daysand I remember getting a
cardboard box and writing on thecardboard box because I
couldn't I was so embarrassed tolike ask somebody for a train

(47:51):
ticket to San Diego or food.
I was hungry, I was reallyhungry.
So I put it, said I need food,can somebody please buy me a
sandwich?
And there was a vending machine.
So I put it, said I need food,can somebody please buy me a
sandwich?
And there was a vending machine.
So I'm not asking for money,I'm literally just want to.
I want a sandwich out of thevenue and I like a one-way

(48:12):
ticket to San Diego so I can getout of here Right.
And now I had already been in acrisis house, so I know there's
help in San Diego if I couldjust get myself to San Diego.
So I, this gentleman, uh, youknow, they always say about
entertaining angels.
I mean this was like myentertaining.
Uh, he was like an angel indisguise.
Um, I truly felt that.
Um, he was like a young guy, um, maybe in his 20s, a tech guy

(48:37):
working for a dot com, and hecame up to me and he said are
you hungry?
And I said yes, and he's like Iread your sign.
He's like let me buy yousomething to eat.
So he bought me a sandwich andone of those roundtable things.
And then he said he heard mystory and he's like, wow, this
is an insane story.
Again, he saw something in meand I wasn't high and I wasn't

(48:59):
drunk, and I was, I was detoxed,right.
So, um, so he bought me aone-way ticket back to San Diego
and I didn't.
I had a paper ID and theydidn't want to get let me on the
Amtrak train and it was a wholething.
And then the conductor's likewell, it's your lucky day, I'm
giving you a one-way ticket backto San Diego, don't come back.
But he said it lovingly, likehe saw the good in me, and I

(49:23):
took the Amtrak train, got backto San Diego on that night and
it's raining.
All I have is one bag over myshoulder like a vest, a white
vest, shorts that were likewhite and like a coral
sweatshirt, shoes and maybe likea few things in my bag.

(49:44):
And, um, and I'm tired, I'mlike where do I go?
Um, my aunt had, um, I tried afew rehabs in this convoluted
story.
Uh, so I still had my placestory.
So I still had my place.
And when I was like I leftcrash to go back out and use
drugs.
My aunt was packing up myapartment.

(50:05):
I said I cannot go back to thathouse, just like the abuse of my
stepmother's house was verysimilar to this house.
It was just filled with yearsof bad memories.
I said I can't go back there.
And my aunt's like, well, we'renot buying you another house.
My family was supporting me atthe time and they were paying
for my house for many, manyyears.
So I said, and it was like atiny, like half house.

(50:26):
It wasn't like a house house,it was like a side house, like a
granny flat with like onebedroom in it and a kitchen and
a dining room.
But anyway, so I said no, I'mnot going back there.
So my aunt's like, well thenyou're going to be homeless
because and my aunt did not wantme to be homeless, nor did my
grandmother, you know, this is aLehigh college educated two

(50:47):
degree girl who got her ownscholarship and people to
believe in her.
And now she's like a drugaddict hanging out with the
wrong group of kids or people,adults hanging out with a bad
guy, and I'm on drugs.
And she's like my aunt's, likeif you leave, that we're not

(51:08):
paying for your house and I said, well, I'm not going back there
, so get rid of it.
And they took.
My daughter's dad was verysupportive at the time.
He ended up turning into agreat dad when he my daughter
went to go live with him whenshe was 13.
He could.
He dropped everything.
He stopped drinking.
He like focused all on her.
To this day he still focusedall on her.

(51:29):
He never got involved in anyother relationships and he
really is a really good fatherto my daughter and they're super
close.
I'm super grateful that he wasthere.
No CPS was involved on you knowit was.
I still had like 10% custody soshe could still get my Medi-Cal
insurance, which comes into playlater because I didn't get

(51:51):
general relief or any money whenI was homeless because I still
had 10% custody.
So in a way I chose mydaughter's medical insurance
over me getting general reliefmoney.
But I'm getting a little aheadof myself.
So I first day just come offthe Amtrak train and I'm down by
like you know where the likeEmbarcadero is, down on the it's

(52:14):
basically the port of San Diego, along the water by Seaport
Village and I I wind my way upto like little Italy and I'm
right outside of that onebuilding and it's raining and I
don't know where to go.
So I literally was so tiredthat I just I put my head down,

(52:34):
I just laid on the ground, likeI just stood there and I laid on
the ground and it was like alittle shaded area kind of, and
I fell asleep.
And that night it's my pizzastory and I love telling the
story and I don't tell it enough, but you know Felipe's pizza
that's really good in downtownSan Diego.
And when you're homeless likeyou do, look for food that

(52:56):
people like.
Usually the people leave likehalf portions of stuff of their
food on top of um trash cans.
Uh, so the homeless people caneat the food and I was one
person that always would eat thefood and um that was left, not
really dumpster diving but uh,pretty close to it.
And this piece of story I had,um, so I just rested my head

(53:19):
down, I put my like jacket overmy head and I just fell asleep.
And, uh, I woke up sometime inthe middle of the night and
there was this full Filippi'sfull cheese, filippi's pizza,
there on the ground for me toeat.
Somebody who knows who littleanother angel thought enough to

(53:42):
leave me a pizza and I was sohungry to devour that and I was
just like thinking I said thisis going to be, I'm going to be
all right, you know.
And God was in my life andJesus was in my life at the time
, and Jesus, I had this feelingthat came over me at that time.
That was almost like an embrace, um, from Jesus and God, um,

(54:02):
that basically I knew I wasgoing to be okay, um, that other
people, as long as I didn'tisolate myself in my house, um,
that I'd be okay.
And so I chose that night to behomeless because I still had my
house until the next day, myNovember 1st or the 31st was
Halloween, like.
Two days later, my house wasbeing closed up and I could have

(54:23):
called my aunt and begged andsaid I can't be homeless.
Like, how am I going to surviveas a homeless person.
But I didn't.
I said I'm not going back tothat house, it's too much bad
energy and too much nightmarelife.
And I wasn't going back and Ididn't.
I chose to become homeless thatnight and and so I woke up the

(54:46):
next morning it's Halloween.
I'm there in, so I get up and Ihear these homeless people
talking about Terminator right,sarah Connor.
And when I was in my addictionI thought I was Sarah Connor at
some point.
So they're talking Terminatorand like.

(55:07):
And I went up to them I saidI'm, where do you go if you're
homeless, like?
I literally asked somebody onthe street talking about
Terminator.
I didn't ask for drugs.
I said where do you go to getfood?
And they're like that way.
So they pointed down to likewhere you are, at 15th and um
market, right there with theIsland intersection.
And I just started walking thatway and it was Halloween day

(55:28):
and all the kids homeless uhwere walking around in like
their Halloween costumes, whichwas really sad.
My first night in a shelter wastwo steps down.
It was a God descended ham.
It was right there on Island, Ithink 16th and Island.
Very bad location for someone,especially like myself.
But I was a venture and I wasgoing to do this homeless thing

(55:51):
and I was going to overdo thishomeless thing and I was going
to conquer the world and I wasgoing to get sober and I was
going to get my daughter backand everything was going to
happen overnight, and so if Icould just get shelter for
tonight?
And so I walk over to God'sextended hand and they were
giving out a dinner, and so Iasked, I said, where can I find

(56:14):
shelter for the night?
Well, the first night actuallywas underneath the bridge and
these people just startedhanding out food.
Like this community, churchcommunity, just regular people,
like a group of people startedhanding out sandwiches and they
put candy in the bags and like,and then I found my way to God's
extended hand and ate there.

(56:35):
So I they're no longer open.
But it was really the onlyshelter in San Diego that didn't
have a 30-day minimum or curfew.
If you didn't make curfew atthe Alproject, you were kicked
out.

On.

Rescue Mission.
You had to be there 30 days andif you missed a night you're
kicked out.
You lost your spot.
But at God's extended hand itwas.
Just.
Come as you are.
If you need a place to sleepwomen and children, no men but
if you need a place to sleep, goline up outside of god's
extended hand at I don't know,like seven or eight, and then

(57:09):
they will let you in.
Um being a single lady, um,sometimes I said the inn wasn't
open.
Uh, sometimes they had MotherMary and Jesus on Christmas
decoration.
You know the lighted nativityscene, the fantastic nativity

(57:31):
scene.
They even had Mother Mary andbaby Jesus.
My first day being homeless, Iwas on Halloween looking up
there and I'm like, okay, thisis where Jesus stayed right and
heartwarming, and it was rainingagain and we're standing in
line and all these kids arelined up at the.
It was heartbreaking.
The kids are crying.

(57:52):
They're like, luckily nicepeople in the community were
handing out candy and it was sosad to be in that place and you
walk in and you sleep on a cotand floors are dirty and there's
dripping in the bathrooms andit is.
It was a place.

Yeah, gothic Sand in Hand was an interesting place
because, like you said, it wasthis oddly accessible place that
people could just go to andthere would be a roof at least.
But a lot of bad stuff happenedthere.
Like I don't even know if youknow, but the building isn't
even there anymore.
It's been razed to the groundafter people kept setting it on
fire over and over again afterit closed down.

(58:32):
But you know, yeah, anyway wecould go.
We talk a lot about GhaziSaint-Han and just kind of the
warning that it is, but also thebeauty that it is that isn't
there anymore Because there's nolike.
There's no like ultimate placethat catches people.
Now, like everything is like amuch more over over organized

(58:53):
program.
I don't know if that's theright way to say it, but like
everything, you have to get room, you have to go through the
systems, you have to do curfew,you have all these rules and all
these kinds of things.
And god's extended hand wasjust like this little wild west
type place that was superdangerous.
Like I would almost didn'trecommend people go there.
I remember will used to call itgod's extended finger instead

(59:16):
of god's extended hand, but itdid serve this really odd role
in the community.
That was like significant.
Anyway, I'll go off on God'sextended hand.

Also, we were talking about resources
later on, like where do peoplego if you're experiencing
homelessness?
Right, and where do you go, butthere's a process for getting
into the homeless shelters.
So, like government, so if youget a, if you're lucky to get a
bed at the app project or anyother shelters, you want to keep

(59:50):
your bed.
And what I liked about God'sextended hand, that's not there.
Now that it's been closed down,there's no program in san diego
, which I would like to seeagain.
Something safer facilities thatare clean, um, but one that's
just a come as you are.
If you want to stay the night,great, line up at the door and,
um, and come in, spend the nightand then go on your way.

(01:00:12):
So if you choose to not go backfor one night, you're not
losing your bed.

Chris Nafis (01:00:18):
You can come there again right, and that's kind of
how our inclement weathershelter works.
It's just that we're only openon certain nights, exactly.

Laura Davis Mansfield (01:00:26):
And it's a great program.
I would like to see moreshelters that didn't have the
you know specifications ofstaying at.

Yeah, I don't know how to better all the barriers
and all the rules and everythinglike it really is.
I don't think people who aren'tfamiliar with the shelter
system realize how, howdifficult it is for people.
You know, like I know, peoplewho have had to choose between
their job and their shelterbecause their job they didn't
get off until after curfew andthey had to decide if they want

(01:00:59):
to keep their job or if theywant to sleep in their shelter
bed or lose their shelter andall the work they've done in the
program, and so they eitherquit their job or they left the
shelter and either way it's alose-lose.
You know, and you know thosethings are in place for reasons,
because the organizations haveto be able to like function and
they want to keep people safeand they want to see people
progress over time and not justdrop in and out.

(01:01:21):
But it also you know that thatworks when people are in a
certain place in their journey,but in a lot of other places
this really doesn't, doesn'treally help very much.
Um, all right, so we, uh, I,we've shared a lot of your
backstory and I I really, youknow, really helpful, I think,
to hear how somebody gets to.
Kind of, where you got, we, I'mgoing to get kicked out of

(01:01:44):
library before too long herebecause I got I got a limitation
on the room, but also want tomake sure that we, that people,
are able to tune in long enoughto hear kind of the redemption
side of your story.
So you know, you, you utilize,like you said, all kinds of
different organizations andprograms, including Living Water
and Voices of Our City Choir,which at the time was really

(01:02:04):
closely connected to LivingWater and they're still friends
and stuff, but they've moved toa different location.
And but tell me a little bitabout, like, all right, so
you're trying to get clean andsober.
You've had this up and downjourney with that.
Um, where do you find sort ofredemption?
How does that come?

well, I think, uh, pastor chris, it
comes uh, through a lot ofdifferent things, but it's like
you said, in and out.
I went in and out like sixrehabs, um, until I finally
graduated from program thesalvation army adult Center.
Really it was a work therapyprogram and I had discussed
before.
I couldn't find a job, couldn'tfind a job, couldn't find a job

(01:02:46):
.
So I ended up giving up.
And then, actually, it was kindof interesting because my last
day that I was homeless and,like you said, when I was
homeless I was going to AAmeetings there was a downtown AA
meeting in the same building asLiving Water.
I was going to Voice Our CityChoir.
On Friday I was community living, but there was a news article

(01:03:11):
and I don't know exactly whathappened other than it was God.
It was God showing his lightthrough me and, um, he just said
clearly enough is enough.
All or nothing, laura.
I I remember distinctlythinking all or nothing.
You're either going to doyou're going to get sober for

(01:03:32):
your daughter and for you, um,or you're going to go down this
other path.
And um, so, um.
So I went to it was LivingWater, nazarene, your church was
having an NA meeting on aThursday.
It was called the open market.
I helped name the uh, the openmarket or whatever.
Thursday AA NA meeting wasactually NA and I was secretary

(01:03:54):
and I um, I again was sober formost of the summer at the Alpha
Project and then my ex-boyfriendmoved into the Alpha Project
with me, which was kind ofinteresting.
I ended up relapsing.
I go to Living Water NazareneChurch.
Probably about two weeks beforeI finally got sober I went

(01:04:14):
through a crash three times.
I never graduated.
I went through like like housemetamorphosis.
Nothing was really working.
Behavior modification the seedsare planted but for whatever
reason I couldn't get more thanthree months sober and then I
just go and relapse and then Ishow up again and here I am
surfacing again.
I was known to like disappearfor a while, even from the

(01:04:36):
church.
And then there's Laura againand and being that governor that
she was even labeled me likegovernor because I come and I
knew everybody and I was thebest dressed homeless person
ever because the lawn there wasno laundry facilities to do my
laundry other than like NeilGood Day Center, which people

(01:04:58):
are washing their clothes in thesink, and that was not a good
place to hang out if you werenot using drugs not safe at all
for a single female.
Needless to say, I would justgo to Rachel's day shelter, get
coffee, some lunch andfellowship and clothes out of
the boutique right Out Projectsame thing.

(01:05:18):
So I was always switching up myclothes and um, but finally it
was um, I had a I don't know ifyou remember, pastor Chris, but
you're I had a um seizureoutside of living water Coming
out and I had just relapsed onmeth again.
And um, and it was coming outof the NA meeting and I had a

(01:05:42):
full on seizure, um out front ofliving water, nazarene, where I
hit the ground hard with myhead.
Luckily no damage, noconcussion or anything.
Luckily, uh, I came to in theambulance and what have you?
But I was getting scared.
I was like, oh no, like this isa meth induced seizure.
And then so I kept using and wehad this great smoke out and

(01:06:09):
whatever, and every time I waslike, okay, I'm going to be done
, and then I could put away,like I said, for three months
and then I'd go back to it.
It was insane.
But this time I was at the AlphaProject.
I was Wheels of Change.
The Alpha Project had a workprogram so you sign up and you
could go out and pick out trashin the San Diego community and

(01:06:32):
they would pay you $46 cash andit was wonderful, it was I
coined it cash or trash.
And there's still news articles.
The last day that I use iscaptured on video and I sent it
to you, pastor Chris, a littlesnippet.
Actually, I haven't sent youthe news article, I sent you
some other things filmed thatday, but finally it was working.

(01:06:54):
I was working and there washope, like I.
Like I said I couldn't find ajob and, um, the wheels of
change I, there were so many,there's like 300 people in that
they only had like 10 spots, soit was like maybe once a month
and it was lottery if my namegot called, if I could go work.
It wasn't like a daily thing,but it gave me my dignity back

(01:07:18):
and and again I became like theposter child of wheels of change
on the news and what have you.
But the same particular wasOctober 3rd of 2018.
And they, they filmed me on thenews and I was pick up
hypodermic needles on the ground.
So well, I had used thatmorning and that was the last
time I never used after thisnewscast.

(01:07:40):
Never used again and for a fewreasons, I don't know whether
it's I finally got a job.
God had sent me the signal likeyou're either all in or you're
all out An awakening, theyalways say.
You know you have a spiritualawakening, but anyway.
So that afternoon it was.
So I woke up the next day and Ididn't use.

(01:08:04):
I don't know.
Basically, it was the next day,on October 4th, we were having
an NA meeting.
I'm secretary and I get calledout by one of the members at
Living Water Nazarene Church.
They called me out, they saidno, you can't be secretary
because you're high and yourelapse.
And I did take a newcomer'schip and so I got up and my

(01:08:27):
friend Mario, who was helping mepick up trash, and he believed
in me.
And we walk out of Living WaterNazarene Church and I'm like
we're gonna go back to.
I don't need these negativepeople.
Um, I'm going to go to my firstany meeting I ever went to.
It's called narcotics Uh, Idon't know, victorious narcotics

(01:08:47):
or notorious narcotics, and itwas at the?
Um, the other building on downby St Vincent de Paul.
I forget what the name of thatbuilding was, anyway.
Um, so I went there and we'rewalking there and my friend
Mario, who's also filmed, hesaid he said, uh, you need to
get off the drug floor.

(01:09:08):
And he's like you have too muchgoing for you and whatever.
He just he said something andthen he held like a USA patch,
flag patch and he's like don'tdo it for me or do you do it for
your country, or something likethat.
Right, and that all kind ofstayed with me.
I always was able to see thehumor.
I think how I've been able toget through everything is really

(01:09:30):
finding the humor in some ofthe stuff.
I mean, if you don't cry you'regoing to.
I would much rather laugh thancry and sometimes it helps you
go through bad things when youcan actually look back and
you're like, yeah, that wasn'treally a good decision or that
was kind of a crazy story, butat least it's my story, right.

(01:09:52):
But anyway.
So that day I never toucheddrugs again.
I left the ALF project, I leftthe guy.
I started going to the God'sExtended Hand sober.
I went to meetings.
In your building of LivingWater Nazarene Church next door
there was a downtown AA meeting.
I was going every day to an AA,every afternoon to an NA.

(01:10:13):
I have pivotal people in mylife that are in the recovery
community that I'm still friendswith today.
They said I'm like, I'm tryingto get into a rehab and they
basically said that myex-boyfriend boyfriend at the
time was like a weight, like ananchor, and I needed to cut the
anchor and sail ship and go to arehab anyways a whole long

(01:10:37):
story which was true but I waslike no, I had this great idea.

I'm like, oh, I'll be 30 days sober and then I'm
gonna bicycle around the world Iwas gonna ask you about this
because I was like you had thiscrazy idea and you were dead set
on it.
You got a bike, you had ahelmet and you were going to
like bike around across thecountry and maybe like around
the world, and we were just likeall right, like, but like you

(01:11:04):
were so set like we're going tobe able to talk you out of it.
We're like uh, like, uh, lord,I don't think this is gonna work
, but then we're afraid you'djust be like well, then forget
you, you don't believe in me,I'm gonna go do it on my own
anyway.
So we're trying to be likesupportive, like, so, like tell
me about the bike around theworld thing really quick,
because again, we're going alittle long here but like what,
tell me what happened with that?

okay, so I'm 30 days sober and uh, drugs,
alcohol, meth, everything.
I actually I quit smoking forabout two years after this, so I
quit.
I quit everything, I quit.
I quit even caffeine for thefirst month that I was sober
Cause I associated cigaretteswith the caffeine coffee, so I

(01:11:49):
like cold turkied everything.
I just got off and um so then Iwas like I need to get out of
California, I need to get out ofSan Diego, I need an adventure
and I always had my bike.
I I.
San Diego and that's part of myum my testimony always having a
bike.
Um, steph Johnson bought me abike and her husband from uh

(01:12:11):
founders of Living.
Walk Voices, our City Choir.
So, uh, she was pivotal to, inmy um, my getting out of the
cycle of homelessness, butanyway, I had a bike, always
with the lights and the bell andthe basket.
I had it all going on.
Uh, I had so many bikes,needlessless to say, I was going

(01:12:33):
to.
My whole thing was I was goingto go to any meetings everywhere
in the U S by bike and I wasgoing to recycle in every town
and buy a postcard for mydaughter.
I asked my daughter can I leaveCause?
I was talking to her at thetime and she gave me her
blessing that I could go on thisbike ground.
They thought it would be goodfor me to get out of town for a

(01:12:54):
while and started my freightwithout all the triggers.
So I said goodbye to all of you.
I said and I'm sober at the timetoo- so I know like I, off a
rocker and then I'm at the umthe alf roger, and they're like
they're gonna eat you alive outthere, they're gonna eat you

(01:13:16):
alive.
I was like, oh, I'll be fine.
And um, if I can survive on thestreets for two years by myself
as a single female like I canpretty much survive anything and
um, and at one point my ex waslike we're at the L project,
he's like you're making homelesssound cool, laura, it's not
cool attitude.

(01:13:37):
So when I saw I was like, okay,I'm done with all this, I'm
sober, I'm gonna go to anymeetings, aa meetings, um, all
around the the states and I'mgonna go cross-country by bike
and I going to stay at all theshelters and use all the food
resources and whatever.
And I never really went hungryin San Diego those two years.

(01:13:59):
I was homeless, like there wasalways someplace where I knew I
could get food and but I'm alsoliving in San Diego, that's
going, has a lot of resourcesgoing on in San Diego.
That's going, has a lot ofresources going on.
I'm not like Pennsylvaniablizzard or anything.
So, so, needless to say, I I'mlike, okay, I'm done, I'm saying
goodbye.

(01:14:20):
Usually I just disappear, butthis time I say goodbye.
I got on my bike and I have nomoney on me at all.
Don't get generally for years,have no money, um, and I hop a
train with my bike on the umcoaster up to Oceanside, a half
on a Metro link and I make it toSanta Ana.

(01:14:42):
Now I had been homeless SantaAna uh before and uh, right
outside of Irvine, so I staythere for like a week and I'm
chilling there and whole longstory.
So I decided I'm going to cutmy hair off, right.
So I got the Shanita O'Connorplaying over the radio like, uh,
nothing compares to you.

(01:15:03):
And I shop off all my hair, gota whole buzz cut, I was
chopping all the drugs out of myhair and and whatever.
So that was kind of pivotal,kind of crazy.
And then I made it to Skid Row.
So I made it to Skid Row andeverybody in Santa Ana thought
it was so cool that I was likeon this adventure and I was so
like I had a plan and I wassober and I was at meetings and

(01:15:24):
I'm recycling and everything'sgreat.
Get to LA Skid Row.
It's actually funny going inSomebody's like you need a
sightsee.
Have you ever seen like the topof this like building with the
fuel around.
So I show up with my bike and Ihave my um, my crowbar or
whatever for my bike and so Ipull up to like this huge

(01:15:45):
building and they have abeautiful sky deck on the very
top floor in a museum and and Istarted talking to whoever the
guard and they're like oh yeah,we'll put your bike in this back
room.
And I went up there and I had agreat time sightseeing like I'm
a tourist.
And then I'm like where's SkidRow?
And they're like, oh my gosh,this girl is like looking to be

(01:16:05):
homeless on Skid Row and I hadso much fun, it was so fun, but
they don't do any recycling, sothere was no way I could send my
daughter postcard and it gotreal old.
I joined the women's.
The women's centers are verypivotal, very important.
Anyway, it's like Thanksgivingand I'm staying at the midnight

(01:16:28):
mission and people are handingthings out on the streets and I
get really sick.
I don't know if it was foodpoisoning or whatever, but I was
really sick and I remember likecalling my family and I got off
the phone and I was like Ithink I need to go to rehab.
I don't need.
I was already sober.
I started rehab when I was 56days sober, so almost two months

(01:16:50):
sober.
So I was like, yeah, maybe thisisn't a good right.
Oh, and they stole my bike.
I went into an AA meeting onSkid Row outside the midnight
mission and they stole my bike.
So I said I have no cycling nomoney, no bike, no way to get a
new bike, don't know anybody onSkid Row.
So I was like I think it's timefor me to go, and so I'm back

(01:17:14):
to san diego.
And then I um, I called up thesalvation army.

uh, the adult rehabilitation center we were
very relieved to see you, by theway, because I was like she
might die out there.
I don't know what's gonnahappen, but we're very happy to
see you back there.

Okay, so then you got the salvation army
yeah, and then just kind ofspeed it up.
So I'll kind of speed it up foryou.
So it's a salvation army.
It's a six-month uh, free rehabprogram.
It's a work therapy program.
So I worked in the warehouseduring the day.
I went to meetings, had supportgroups.
I met a lot of the women in theprogram who were just like me,

(01:17:48):
surrendered to god, became aleader, became a daughter of the
king, which is basically anusher, an adherent for the
church leadership position, andwas really there for the women
in the Salvation Army.
Other alcoholics trying to getrecovery Didn't talk to any of

(01:18:09):
the guys.
They do have a rule like nofraternization, which is talking
to guys or girls, and um, andthen no ceiling called pilfering
, so weird terms.
Anyway, did that for like sixmonths.
I was all speed ahead, um,decided I'm not, I'm giving up
on the men scene right now.
They're not healthy.
And um, I choose.

(01:18:30):
I had a bad picker they call itlike a relationship picker Like
I have a bad, it's broken, so Ilet it stay broken and I just
focus on.
And then I started coming backafter the program and I
graduated from the ARC.
I'm living at the Bridge HouseSalvation Army Door of Hope in
Claremont.
It's called Reentry.
So I lived there, sober living,for 18 months.

(01:18:51):
I started working at the.
I started working at the thriftstore in Point Loma Salvation
Army thrift store.
So I'm working again, which isa key component to getting out
of the homelessness.
I basically just go to AAmeetings, na meetings.
I get a job at the Live and LetLive Alana Club up in Hillcrest

(01:19:12):
that is now shut down.
I found my you know people thatI could relate to in the rooms.
I was the all through COVID.
We would like open and shutdown the club but I still worked
even though it was COVID, eventhough the center was closed.
We were working on rules ofreopening and the distance and

(01:19:37):
how that was going to look forAA meetings, like the six feet
apart, and we had a sound system, zoom and all that stuff.
Then I would donate my time,volunteer at Living Water
Nazarene Church, all throughCOVID, handing out meals during
the day on my bike, and thenthings are going good, the 18

(01:20:00):
months sober.
My daughter I am talking to mydaughter every day, every week.
I've called her six and a halfyears every Sunday.
Talk about her Since I date,basically like day 56 of the
Salvation Army.
I've been doing that and nowI'm like day 2000 and something,
um.
So I was very uh.

(01:20:21):
But my daughter really, um, Ididn't see her for a year and a
half, all through COVID, becauseher dad was battling cancer.
She was in a nursing programfor a CNA with a lockdown,
everything else.
So I didn't see her for a yearand a half.
We've never Zoomed, we've neverSkyped in all these years.
It was always by phone and so Iwould see her like after COVID

(01:20:46):
and liftoff.
I see my daughter like fourtimes a year COVID and liftoff.
I see my daughter like fourtimes a year.
But it's the quality of timeand it's the weekly calls that
have really mended therelationship.
And, like I said, it took aboutfive years for me to really get
the trust of my daughter againand so the fear that I'm not
just going to walk out andrelapse and walk out of her life

(01:21:08):
again.
So she really started trustingme and now it's a beautiful
relationship.
We talk about two hours everySunday and we both really enjoy
the conversations.
It's a beautiful, healthyrelationship that God has mended
.
But it took some time God'stiming, not my own.
So about two years sober.

(01:21:30):
I started working for a rehab,an outpatient private pay
insurance called Refresh Also,parent company La Jolla Recovery
became house manager for thewomen's residence there.
I met my husband, monty,actually through the Salvation
Army.
He graduated from SanBernardino, came down to San

(01:21:52):
Diego when he was 18 monthssober and I'm two years sober
and he starts living in themen's residence at the Salvation
Army working as assistantmanager for the men.
And we meet up because I'mstill going to chapel and church
at the Salvation Army as agraduate and alumni, going to
chapel and church at theSalvation Army as a graduate and

(01:22:13):
alumni.
We meet, we date.
Eventually we get married.
We saw a youth for marriagecounseling.
So now my husband, now I have ahusband.
He's a really good guy.
Finally, you know, really tooktwo years, not dating, not even
talking, not to anybody.
And then Monty kind of showedup in my life, a very good

(01:22:33):
person and very supportive of me.
Then we end up.
We went back to the SalvationArmy because we wanted to be
officers of the Salvation Army.
So we kind of pulled away fromall of you at Living Water
Nazarene Church because wereally were like we were living
in Claremont in our ownapartment.
We were working crazy businesshours.

(01:22:56):
I was starting to take class atCity College again for alcohol
and drug counseling.
It was just a lot.
And so we went back to theSalvation Army and started
volunteering our time there,working with the kids programs
and just being present.
And then God just put on ourhearts for the calling to be
Salvation Army officers.
And here we are now.

(01:23:17):
We've been married for threeand a half years.
I'm six and a half years sober,I have my daughter in my life
who's in a nursing program, andI'm very proud of her.
So things are good.
I've worked very hard to uh,discipline myself, be obedient
in my calling, be there forothers.
Um and it's just veryinteresting and I'll just kind

(01:23:40):
of end on this Um, when I washomeless in San Diego, there was
um, I was being served, youknow, by the different
organizations, and for clothingand for food and for resources

(01:24:03):
and shelter where I can lay myhead.
Once I got sober and haddeveloped a life, I was able to
give back in the same rooms ofrecovery, the same churches that
served me.
I was able to give back to themand help other homeless people,
even as just to listen to theirstories, to give them a bottle

(01:24:25):
of water and say everything'sgoing to be okay.
I've been there too.

Yeah, yeah for sure .
And I would say, even along theway, even while you were
actively on the street, and evenin and out of sobriety, like
you were still using or notusing, you were still, um,
helping and volunteering andbeing a part of the community.
Uh, and I think, like thosethose experiences, like
participating in the ministry,is part of what builds your

(01:24:50):
confidence and builds your, youknow, your sense of dignity and
allows you to make meaningfulrelationships with people that
aren't just transactional I'mjust here to get a water or
whatever but like I'm herebecause I'm part of it.
You know, and I think I don'tknow, I don't want to put words
in your mouth but I feel likeall of those experiences were a
really important part of youkind of finding yourself again

(01:25:11):
and getting back in the righttrack.
And then you've kind of pouredyour life into giving back to
others, serving God, servingothers through the Salvation
Army.
Now, and it's just been a greatjourney to watch, so grateful
for all that God has done inyour life and all the work that
you've done on yourself and inyour own life and in your
relationships to get to whereyou are now.

(01:25:32):
Um, it's just like a, it's likea joy to see you, you know, and
to see you guys, both you andmonty, to just see you guys like
um, uh, just doing so well andum, and not not doing so well,
even just for your own sake, butso that you can serve others.
It's uh, it's yeah, it'sbeautiful, it's come full circle
, like you said, um, yeah,anywhere.
We've gone a little long here,but that that's okay.

(01:25:54):
Uh, any closing thoughts?
Anything?
I mean, maybe that was it thatyou want to lead leave with
people.
Is that like you?
Now, all the things that servedyou while you were on the
street, now you're able toparticipate in, in giving back
and serving the next, uh,generation of lauras who are out
there struggling through life?
Um, any closing dots?

really being um open to reaching out to
others if you're really havingum a difficult time in your life
, whatever that may look like.
Um to not stay isolated,because it's a lot easier to
hold in the guilt and not behumble, and be not be vulnerable
, because you don't want othersto know that you're not doing

(01:26:33):
good, whether that's emotionallyor mentally or physically.
Sometimes I know I put on afacade, or I used to put on a
facade that everything's OK, butit's OK to say I'm not OK and I
think I'm.
I started with isolation once Iwas able to be around community
, and that's really what achurch is about.
I started with isolation once Iwas able to be around community

(01:26:54):
, and that's really what achurch is about.
It's not really about anythingelse, but being there together
in a community, taking others asfar as you come yourself.
So my biggest takeaway is, ifyou're having a difficult time
with processing anything, to notwait to reach out to somebody,
whether that's a friend or evena hotline number.
Just pick up that phone or callthat friend, or call that

(01:27:15):
pastor, or call somebody thatyou can trust.
Go to an AA meeting, even ifyou're not part of addiction.
We're all addicted to something, but it's a community of people
so you can say, hey, I'm havinga difficult time, can somebody
give me a resource, can somebodyhelp me out, as opposed to

(01:27:35):
keeping it all in, because Iknow once I keep everything in,
it's like anger turned inwardwill turn into a snowball effect
, as we've just gone down mywhole story.
It's the worst times in my life.
When I gave up hope was when Iwas alone, when I was trapped in
my own bear, my own head.

(01:27:56):
Uh, when I you know like I soldmy car, pay my rent, so I have
no way to get out there, be withpeople, and I just sat in my
house for like three years doingGod only knows what, um on
drugs, because I was so bearsfilled with shame.
Um, there's also a lot, a lot.
Give ourselves a break.
I think there were certaintimes that I was so filled with

(01:28:17):
remorse and guilt that it'salmost like I took a lot of
anti-shame and a lot ofanti-guilt classes when I was in
rehabs.
And there's a whole big thingBrene Brown has a whole thing on
it on your mental health whenyou hold on to shame and guilt,

(01:28:41):
and I think that's a big part ofrecovering from anything from
homelessness, from any life'sdowns.
It's really let go of the shameand letting people help you any
life's downs.
It's really let go of the shameand letting people help you.
I think just being real withpeople and being transparent.
Today, I try to be authentic.
In everything that I do, I tryto be transparent and my new

(01:29:02):
word of 2025 is intentional.
I'm intentional when I loveothers and I make others feel
valued and important in my life.
It's very intentional, likewhen I get set out to do
something.
It's like I'm.
I have a plan and I'm veryintentional about it.

(01:29:25):
So if I was like going to rehab, then I'd be like very
intentional about me getting tothe interviews.
Or if I was trying to findhousing, if I was homeless, I'm
very intentional about makingsure I'm at wherever I need to
be for those resources.
So it's just being intentional,being authentic self and just
letting go and letting God.

(01:29:45):
I mean that's really like yousaid I had to do some of the
work I didn't.
God just didn't.
You know, like you said, I hadto do some of the work I didn't.
God just didn't, you know,magically make my life better
overnight.
These things took years and um,and it's spending fellowship
and other people, um, being partof a community, something
greater than yourself uh,finding, you know, in the rooms

(01:30:08):
of recovery, it's finding agreater.
I found God, you know, in therooms of recovery, finding a
greater.
I found God, you know, andthat's just what I did.
I found God, I followed Jesusand my biggest goal in life,
honestly, pastor Chris, is if Ican have one person in my life
get through a difficult time,then I will be successful in
life, and I really feel thatwith my story, there's more than

(01:30:31):
one person that I've helped inmy journey.
So, and you can only take othersas far as you come yourself.
Um, so eventually I like to bemore of a a leader or, you know,
inspirational talker orsomething to give back to these
organizations right now now I'mso busy with Officer Training,
college and getting my ordainedminister, seminary school, all

(01:30:55):
that stuff, that I can't reallygive back on a board or
something.
But becoming involved again,the hands and feet of these
organizations that I feel reallymet me where I'm at, you don't
have to be like even just goingto church.
You don't have to dress up andbe in fancy clothes to go to
church.
Just come as you are and I knowthat's like really cliche, but

(01:31:19):
nobody cares.
They, like you said, we justwanted you to show up again and
I'm on my world tour Right.

And.

I'm not high.
You're not like, well, I wishshe would get off drugs.
I'm off of drugs, like, oh, Iwish they're.
Like, what are you doing?
But I had so much um enthusiasmand I had so much like goals.
This is what I was going to do.
Nobody's going to talk out ofme, so you're just like, okay,
like there she goes again, um,but it's it's really just

(01:31:48):
staying connected to yourcommunity and it's it's working
with others and again, notkeeping everything inside.

Yeah, I'm getting, I'm getting the hook over here
from the librarian, butabsolutely Well, you're doing
all those things right now.
Thank you for sharing a littlebit of your time with us, laura,
and many blessings on the nextpart of your journey.
Just, I hope you will, I knowwe will.
We'll stay in touch and keepkeep being part of your journey.
Just, I hope you will, I knowwe will.
We'll stay in touch and keepkeep being part of the story and
and God's using you.

(01:32:17):
So keep it up.
All right.
Thanks for your time.
We love you too.
We'll see you later.
Bye, thank you.

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