Customer Success Playbook Podcast S3 E55 - Elizabeth Harrin - Stop the Burnout

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Ever feel like you're juggling flaming torches while riding a unicycle? That's modern project management for you. In this episode of the Customer Success Playbook, Kevin Metzger and Roman Trebon welcome Elizabeth Harrin, the mastermind behind the award-winning Rebels Guide to Project Management. With over two decades of experience helping professionals navigate the chaos of multiple projects, Elizabeth reveals her battle-tested strategies for maintaining sanity when the pressure cooker of deadlines starts whistling.

Detailed Analysis

The conversation kicks off with Elizabeth dropping a truth bomb that resonates across industries: project management isn't just for project managers anymore. Whether you're in customer success, sales, or support, you're likely juggling multiple initiatives that directly impact client satisfaction. The beauty of Elizabeth's approach lies in its simplicity – she transforms overwhelming to-do lists into manageable "buckets of work."

Her number one tip? Start with visibility. Most professionals treat their workload like an endless scroll of doom, but Elizabeth advocates for packaging work into digestible categories. Think of it as Marie Kondo-ing your project portfolio – group by client, deadline, or theme, then ruthlessly prioritize what truly sparks value.

The discussion takes a practical turn when Elizabeth introduces her "top three goals" approach. By identifying three key objectives each evening for the next day, you create a roadmap that prevents the dreaded email rabbit hole. Roman Trebon enthusiastically validates this method, sharing his own success with a similar journaling practice – proof that even the busiest professionals can benefit from this deceptively simple strategy.

What sets this episode apart is Elizabeth's emphasis on personalization. She acknowledges that traditional prioritization models (like the famous "eat the frog" approach) don't work for everyone, especially those with neurodivergence. The key is experimentation – test different systems, keep what works, and adjust what doesn't. This flexible mindset transforms project management from a rigid framework into a dynamic toolkit.

The episode concludes with a compelling reminder: effective project management isn't about doing more; it's about doing what matters. In an era where burnout lurks around every deadline, Elizabeth's approach offers a refreshing perspective on sustainable productivity.

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Episode Transcript

Kevin Metzger (00:05):
Customer success.

Roman Trebon (00:10):
Hi everyone, and welcome to the Customer Success
Playbook podcast, where we bringyou actionable insights for
creating meaningful customerexperiences and a better way of
working.
I'm your host, Roman Reon.
Joined with me as always is myco-host Kevin Metzker.
Today's guest is someone who'smade project management
practical and human, even whenthe pressure is on.

(00:31):
Kevin, I know you have had somepressure filled projects.
Are you excited to talk to ourguest today?

Kevin Metzger (00:38):
I am.
I am.
And our guest is ElizabethHerron.
She's an author, senior projectmanager and founder of the
award-Winning Rebels Guide toProject Ma Management.
Elizabeth has has spent over twodecades helping professionals
juggle priorities, avoidoverwhelm, and keep their
projects insanity on track.
Elizabeth, we're thrilled tohave you here today.

(01:00):
Uh, share a little bit moreabout yourself.

Elizabeth Harrin (01:03):
Oh, well thank you so much for having me on the
podcast.
I think all kinds of roles thesedays require people to manage
projects.
So even if you don't have thejob title or project manager,
then you're probably doingprojects of some kind, either
contributing to them or, um,leading them, whether it's, you
know, all all kinds of justcustomer service and customer

(01:23):
satisfaction roles, um, to helpyour clients be more successful
are delivered through projectsthese days.
So great to talk to you guys.

Roman Trebon (01:31):
Yeah, we're excited.
Uh, you talk about customersuccess and, and, you know,
projects lead to success or, ornot success, right?
Oh, no.
So we're, we're excited to getinto this, right?
Uh, so let's get right into it.
Elizabeth, what is your numberone tip for handling multiple
projects without hittingburnout?

Elizabeth Harrin (01:49):
Well, I could probably talk about that for a
long time, but to give you asnip, a snippet of what's the,
what's a good starting point?
Yeah.
I think if you think about yourwork overall, you've probably
got loads of projects forclients or internal projects as
well, and I.
The more you can prioritize, thebetter you can choose how to
spend your time.
So the prioritization processbegins for me with visibility.

(02:13):
Most people treat theirworkload, including me as a lo,
a long never ending to-do list.
But if we can package up thework that we do, we do into sort
of.
Buckets.
Perhaps there's a, a bucket perclient or a bucket of, um, work
that has to be done by Decemberor whatever categorization works
well for you, then it becomes alot less overwhelming because

(02:33):
you're only managing sort offive pots of work rather than 20
individual small strands.
And I know that's, that sounds.
Uh, quite a box standard.
Easy thing to, to start offwith, but if you, you've gotta
download all of your work andwork out exactly what it is that
you're doing, and then see howyou can, uh, group the work and
then, and then prioritize.

Kevin Metzger (02:53):
So when you're, when you're bucketing, the, the
idea is.
You're kind of thinking of aproject as a whole as opposed to
breaking it down into the parts.
I'm guessing that helps you kindof understand the prioritization
a little better.
Is that, is that kind of whereyou're going with?

Elizabeth Harrin (03:09):
Exactly, yes.
So when I, um, I ended upwriting a book about managing
multiple projects because somany people were having this
problem.
And when I was talking to peopleabout how they manage their
work, a lot of people.
Don't actually have a handle onexactly what it is they're doing
every day because it's soreactive.
Or just stuff gets piled on andthen you get to the end of the
week and you think, oh yeah, I'msupposed to have also made

(03:31):
progress on this activity.
And that activity and your to-dolist just becomes really long.
So we always start off bysaying, you know, just, just
spend 10 minutes, get a cup oftea, write down everything that
you're working on, the projectwork, the client work, the stuff
that you're doing that ismentoring or coaching, or
organizing a team away day.
All of that activity.
And then you've got a real clearview of exactly what it is that

(03:53):
you you need to do, so then youcan start making choices.
I.
Which ones of these arepriority?
How are we going to prioritize?
Which ones can I drop?
Who can I delegate this to?
And start thinking about howyou're spending your time and
that will really help you focuson the things that are most
important for you, for yourclients, for the, for the value
that you want to deliver foryour organization.

(04:15):
So it's.
Prioritization, I think can endup feeling like it's all about
doing more just so that I cancreate more hours in the day to
do more stuff, but we don't havemore hours in the day.
We all have the same amount ofof time.
So it's about doing what mattersand not feeling guilty because
you've made the right choicesabout what things are not being
worked on this week, and maybeyou are putting those off and

(04:35):
you'll, you'll work on them nextmonth,

Roman Trebon (04:37):
Elizabeth, for, for.
Any of our audience members thatmay be feeling that burnout
coming.
Right.
And they're hearing you andthey're talking about, oh, I
like the idea of prioritization.
Is this something they shouldstart?
Like how do they start?
Should they do it like at aweekly basis, daily basis,
monthly basis?
Like how do you, if you, ifsomeone's is feeling that
burnout, they feel overwhelmed,and the to-do list is growing

(04:58):
and growing and growing, whatwould you recommend as a good
starting place?

Elizabeth Harrin (05:02):
Start with, what are your top three goals
for today or for tomorrow?
So I, I work it out the nightbefore, so I'll work out
tomorrow and I'll write at themon a sticky note and leave it on
my keyboard.
What is it that I need toachieve tomorrow?
And then when you come in in themorning, you've already got it
written out there.
These are my three things that Iwant to try to achieve.
That is my priority activity forthe day, because.

(05:23):
I, I, I don't know if you arethe same, but I was coming into
work and thinking, oh, I'll justhave a look at my emails, and
then, oh, I need to reply tothat message, and then suddenly
it's lunchtime and you've notactually done anything that's
super urgent or important orhelped you move closer to
delivering value for yourclients.
You've just.
You know, you've done reactivestuff.
It's not wasted time, butperhaps it's not spending time

(05:45):
on the highest priorityactivities.
So if you can just spend fiveminutes before you leave, before
you close down your laptop and,and shut your office door for
the day on the what my keyactivities that I must get done
tomorrow.
And they just keep coming backto that all throughout the day.
So that's a really small tip.
I'd, I'd suggest that that'swhere people start.
If, if getting outta the, theburnout zone feels like it's too

(06:08):
much of a challenge to do anykind of like larger, more
strategic planning.

Roman Trebon (06:12):
I am a, a plug for, I use something called,
I've been doing this for acouple years now, is there's an
old journal, Elizabeth.
And in this Oak journal, right.
It asked you to do, you have agratitude list, all this stuff,
but in that list is your threemost important things for the
day.
Right.
And so kinda like you said, eachnight I write down my three most
important things going into thenext day.
It's been a total game changer.

(06:33):
'cause like you said, you can,you can, you can do a lot of
work.
Nothing progresses.
Right?
Like it, it's, you get thatsense of, oh, I've done so much
today.
And then you look back in aweek, you're like, no big things
have actually moved from whatI've done.
So the three most importantthings for me, which it sounds
like you recommend as well, thatreally changed it.

(06:53):
'cause I, I, what's that?
Eat your frog thing?
Is that, what's that saying?
Eat frog.
Eat the frog.
Yeah, you eat the frog.
I'm eating my frog early.
Then I can get into other stuff.
But at least I've made progresson those big, those big rock
initiatives, those big projects.
And, and, and, and so I, I feel,I feel reaffirmed in a way,

Elizabeth Harrin (07:10):
well, I would say that the, the Eat the frog
thing, um, is good.
But some of these prioritizationmodels, including that one, so
I've heard, don't work so wellfor people.
Who have neurodivergence.
So I think it's really importantthat you try out a few different
prioritization strategies.
And maybe it's an urgentimportant grid.

(07:31):
Maybe it's must have, must, mustdo, should do.
Would like to do, if I've gottime, whatever model it is that
you use, try out a few and seeor try out, you know, an app or
a to-do list, journal thing or abullet journal or whatever it
was that you just said.
The the note journal.
The

Roman Trebon (07:48):
journal now we gotta get as a sponsor cap, I
gotta reach out to the Yojournal we promoted

Elizabeth Harrin (07:54):
and just taste.
And when it works, do more.
And if it doesn't work, changeit and do something else.
There's no one size fits allthat's going to work for
everyone.
I

Roman Trebon (08:04):
love it.
This is fantastic, Elizabeth.
Thank you for your one big tip.
I think we always say one bigtip, but I feel like we always
get two or three out of ourguests, so I appreciate you
sharing that with us and helpingour, our audience stay sane as
they're managing, um, all thesedifferent priorities and
projects.
I.
Elizabeth, I hope you'll comeback and join us on Wednesday,
right where we're gonna tackleour one big question show, and

(08:26):
you're gonna talk about how youcan align stakeholder
expectations across multipleprojects.
So when, what happens, maybewhen you have competing
priorities.
I'm excited to dive into that,Kevin.
Until next time,

Kevin Metzger (08:39):
keep on playing.