Customer Success Playbook S3 E45 - Cairo Marsh - AI and Empathy: Can Technology Truly Understand Your Customer?

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In this forward-looking Friday edition of the Customer Success Playbook, Cairo Marsh returns to round out his trilogy of episodes with a critical discussion: can artificial intelligence enhance empathy in customer experience, or does it risk eliminating the human touch? Cairo, Roman, and Kevin dive into the real-world uses of AI in sentiment analysis, automation, and service design, exploring when and how AI tools can be customer-centric rather than just cost-centric. From call centers to cultural nuance, this conversation balances optimism with realism.

Detailed Analysis: The final installment in Cairo Marsh's series on the Customer Success Playbook podcast explores the intersection of artificial intelligence and empathetic customer experience. While AI is often championed for its efficiency and cost-saving potential, Cairo is quick to caution that most implementations prioritize business needs over customer value—a misalignment that risks undermining trust.

He argues that true empathy-driven AI must empower the customer, not just the brand. The conversation unpacks this idea with practical examples: AI as a helpful tool for low-value, transactional queries ("Did my payment clear?") versus high-emotion, high-stakes moments ("I’ve been in a car accident"), where human connection is irreplaceable. The team discusses the strategic importance of context in deciding where AI belongs.

But the episode doesn't stop at critique. Kevin and Roman offer ideas on human-AI collaboration—pairing agents with AI copilots to enhance real-time service without sacrificing warmth. Cairo reinforces that the real opportunity lies in using AI to support customers on their terms, not as a substitute for authentic engagement.

In a surprisingly touching moment, Cairo shares a story from a bank in Taiwan, illustrating that sometimes, the most valuable service is simply human presence. As businesses embrace automation, remembering our innate desire for connection may be the key to designing AI with empathy.

This episode challenges us to ask: Is your AI working for you, or for your customers?

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Episode Transcript

Kevin Metzger (00:05):
Customer success.

Roman Trebon (00:10):
Welcome back to the Customer Success Playbook
podcast.
I'm your host, Roman Reon, herewith my co-host Kevin Metzger.
Kevin, happy Friday.
We made to the end of the week.
We've had an amazingconversation all week with Cairo
Marsh, founder of relative.
We're talking empathy andmarketing value.
We've touched on a bunch oftopics today.
Know you're excited to get intothe impact of artificial

(00:33):
intelligence.

Kevin Metzger (00:34):
Always love ai.
Friday, Monday, we talked withCairo about explain why empathy
should guide every customerinteraction.
Wednesday we dove into buildingempathetic marketing strategies,
and today it's AI Friday.
So how can AI tools help or hurtbrands aiming to build genuine
connections?
Cairo, many companies areturning to AI tools for

(00:58):
sentiment analysis and customerfeedback at scale.
In your view, how does AI fitinto an empathy first approach
and what pitfalls should brandsbe aware of?
I

Cairo Marsh (01:08):
think it's really interesting'cause I don't know,
I, I know what I think.
The technology should eventuallydo.
I think right now, and I thinkthis is one of the challenges
that I think we have as anindustry, is that I think
there's still a lot of emphasison AI as a cost saving measure
more than anything, and as acost saving measure, completely
understand it, right?
Completely understand.

(01:30):
But, but I think that also endsup coming from the vantage point
of the brand or the business,not the service value add for
the consumer.
So everyone, I think, you know,every consumer has these
nightmares of being like stuckon the, the, the phone queue
with, with whatever, uh, partnertrying to figure out how can I
speak to an operator?
Can I speak to an operator?

(01:50):
Right?
And, and, and the brand issaving money, right?
Is how it feels like it, yeah.
And whether that's, whetherthat's, you know, a legacy
system which isn't quiteartificial intelligence or more
evolved sort of chatbots orwhatever that do incorporate
artificial intelligence tools.
The question is, are you doingit for the consumer?
Are you doing it for the um, forthe business?

(02:11):
I think, I think the challengebrands has right now is I think
the general perceptions of doingit for the business, which will
therefore not create an empathyor trust.
It creates Yeah, I get it.
We're saving money.
You have a view of where youthink it should go?
Well, I think ultimately lookand don't, and don't get me
wrong, nothing wrong with savingmoney.
I completely understand it.
I completely understand it as abusiness, but I think

(02:33):
ultimately, I.
What you wanna be able to do,what consumers want, I think, is
they want to feel moreempowered, right?
So I think, I think the questionis how do I as a brand or a
business, when I introducedifferent AI tools, sort of put
them not at my, not to do mybidding, but to help do the
consumer's but bidding.
Right?
So I think, and that may be,and, and I think at scale, I, I

(02:56):
think there's.
Probably, in my opinion, only afew companies can really do it
right, because you want it towork across platforms.
But I think of AI sort ofagents, if you will, being able
to be assigned to me as anindividual where I can sort of
tap into that AI agent and go,here's the things that I want
you to buy or want you to manageto be more efficient.
For me, that's powered orenabled by Brand X, whoever that

(03:19):
is, that will, um, simplify mylife.
I think AI is a, is a, is aconsumer empowerment, will be an
amazing thing.
And I, and I think that'llhappen.
I think it's, it's a matter ofwhen, not if.
Um, I think that will be anamazing thing.
Until then, I don't think itwill, it will, AI will be
positioned today as somethingmaking the end user or

(03:41):
consumer's life more beneficial.
It'll, right now, I think todayit's more about the, the
business of the brand.

Roman Trebon (03:46):
We had a guest on recently Cairo talking about
this in the call center, right?
You had mentioned the callcenter on Wednesday.
If I call into a call center andI just want to know if my
payment cleared.
Use ai, right?
It's a low touch, low value.
Great.
Like you paid it on Thursday,great job.
If I am in a car accident and Ineed to file a claim, get that
AI outta there.
I want talk to someone and Iwant to get it done right?

(04:07):
And if, if you start having youragent trying to handle that, my
frustration grows.
Right?
So it's that balance.
And I think right now it's like,to your point, it's all about
the cost savings.
And I think companies arestruggling a little bit with
where does that human touch,where's that human touch come
in?
Right?

Cairo Marsh (04:22):
I think that's a great point.
If I can just add on, I thinkit, it is you that, that example
of the, the car accident'sperfect in the sense that it's
contextual that says, when areyou really gonna make a
difference?
As a brand, you don't make adifference to tell me what my
balance is.
It's mean, it's meaningless, butwhen I'm in a jam and you step
up and help me, that's where youactually do make a difference.
And that's really where I wantto.
Feel the impact and the point ofview and the per perception.

(04:44):
I think that's also another, andwith technology in general, I
think the more that we all as abusiness society adopt similar
tools, we sort of create a verycommoditization of our brand
experience in a lot ofcapacities, right?
One call center bots like theother one who cares, but the
difference will be in how theactual.
Customer service person engageswith you and treats you

(05:07):
differently based on the cultureof that organization and where
to where to interject.
Those moments become reallycritical.
So you still provide costsavings, but you allow yourself
to be distinctive, not by thesame unifying technology that
everyone else has.

Kevin Metzger (05:20):
Yeah, that's a great point.
I do think that the, you know,the ability for sentiment
analysis and AI is starting to,to get there.
Sure.
Um, and looking at and talkingwith people when you're
interacting with a bot or anagent of some sort, I.
And you start seeing thesentiment change and the
interaction change, that's anopportunity where you can start

(05:44):
creating those exit clauses todrive into the human element and
bring, bring the human in thecall.
One of the things I know that,uh, Roman and I have talked
about in the past is where youput the AI agent as well.
Does the AI agent sit there asthe interface to the customer,
or do you break.
Bring a human on with an AIagent, both helping to drive the

(06:09):
customer experience.
Yep.
I think that's anotheropportunity, right?
So that.
The age, the AI agent has allthe knowledge that you might
need to access, but having thatconversation with a real human
who can help help you work withthe AI agent to really drive all
of the stored knowledge Yep.

(06:29):
To, to the right answers.
I think, uh, those are wherewe've, we're starting to.
I, I think we've got a lot ofopportunities to start changing
what the customer experiencelooks like.

Cairo Marsh (06:40):
I think that makes sense.
And if I can just add one lastthought.
It reminded me of a story like,uh, like recently,'cause I said
we opened up, uh, an office nottoo long ago in Taiwan.
I was in the bank in Taiwan, andbanks in Taiwan are notoriously
slow.
They don't go very fast.
You're there for a while.
And I was there, the, the a fewpeople there waiting, usually a

(07:01):
little bit older, and they werethere waiting for like hours.
And I was asking, you know, theperson helping me translate in
Taiwan, like, um.
Why, why this is so inefficient,why all these people here?
And part of what they weresaying was that, well, I, these
people are retired, they don'thave anything else to do.
This is, this is a day out.
This is good fun.
You know what I mean?
Like, and, and, and I kind ofunderstood that.

(07:22):
My point in that is I thinkthere is a natural human desire
for humans, right?
Like there's a, there's a needfor belonging.
And I think as, as brands use AIand they use technology.
When they figure out what are,what are those right points
where you can combine that,where my need to belong, my need
to connect, my need for someoneto actually understand me gets

(07:42):
empath, gets, gets overlaid withthe technology.
That'll be critical because Ithink that example that I was
saying about in the time is justpeople need people, you know,
and I don't think that goes awaywith technology.

Roman Trebon (07:53):
This is awesome stuff.
Thank you for joining us allweek.
You've rocked it.
You knocked it outta theballpark.
This is terrific.
Uh, I would say catch out, catchCairo in the Bronx, but he may
be in Taipei, he may be inJapan.
So Kyro, where can our audiencekeep tabs on you?
I know on LinkedIn.
Where else can they find outwhere, what's, what's the latest
you have going on?

Cairo Marsh (08:11):
Find, you can find me on LinkedIn or or Instagram.
My name's Cairo Marsh.
I'm pretty much the only one, soif you type that in right,
you're bound to find me.
The, the other place, obviouslya company website is R-E-L-A-T-I
v.com relative no e.com Find usthere and like happy to continue
this conversation with anyonewho would like to.

Roman Trebon (08:33):
That's awesome, Cairo.
I really appreciate it.
Uh, to our audience, this is theend of our mini series with
Cairo.
Again, you can connect with himon LinkedIn, check out relative,
uh, and, and more.
He's, he's bringing greatinsights I to our audience.
If you found these episodeshelpful, please subscribe and
share them with your team, yourcolleagues, your friends.
We really appreciate it.
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(08:56):
or a rating that helps us growour audience.
We really appreciate youlistening.
We'll be back next week withmore customer success strategies
and insights, Kevin, until nexttime, keep on playing.