Episode 205 with Gabe Scigliano and Max Ceron

The CWB Association brings you a weekly podcast that connects to welding professionals around the world to share their passion and give you the right tips to stay on top of what’s happening in the welding industry.

What if the skills you learned on the ice could help you excel in the world of welding? Join us as we chat with Gabe Scigliano, a former competitive hockey player from Calgary, who successfully transitioned to a career in welding and pipe fitting. Gabe shares how an unexpected conversation led him down this new path, revealing the cultural differences he encountered between the white-collar vibe of Calgary and the blue-collar spirit of Edmonton. Through his experiences, Gabe offers a unique perspective on Alberta's workforce dynamics and the fulfillment he found in the trades after overcoming initial resistance from his family. Join us for an engaging conversation about the Boilermakers, the path to becoming a journeyman, and the importance of government-funded programs like the Filling the Gap Pressure Welding Training Program.

Check out The Filling the Gap: Advanced Pressure Welder Training Program: https://pressureweldertraining.com/

Thank you to our Podcast Advertisers:
Canada Welding Supply: https://canadaweldingsupply.ca/
Canaweld: https://canaweld.com/
Josef Gases: https://josefgases.com/

There is no better time to be a member! The CWB Association membership is new, improved and focused on you. We offer a FREE membership with a full suite of benefits to build your career, stay informed, and support the Canadian welding industry.  https://www.cwbgroup.org/association/become-a-member

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
All right, I can check.
Check, I'm good.
So I'm Max Duran.
Max Duran, cwb AssociationWelding Podcast, pod pod podcast
.
Today we have a really coolguest welding podcast.
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Happy welding.
Hello and welcome to anotheredition of the CWB Association
podcast.

(01:05):
My name is Max Suron and, asalways, I'm going east, west,
north, south and inside thequantum dimension to find the
speakers for you, my dearlisteners, on this wonderful
show.
Today.
I am out in the west, I'm goingto Calgary to find somebody,
and we've got Gabe Sigliano here.
I'm trying to say that.
Right, uh, gabe, uh, thanks forbeing on the show with us today

(01:28):
.
Uh, no problem, looking forwardto chatting with it.
Awesome man.
So I've been reading your biohere, kind of looking over what
you're doing.
You're a welder, pipe fitterworking with the boiler maker
hall, uh, or I should say you'rea boiler maker who welds pipe.
So let's say get that in theright order.
Yeah and uh and uh, and youknow like, and you're out here
in the West where it's pipewelding, boiler making world,

(01:51):
right, it's a lot of the workthat's out here.
How do?
you?
How's Calgary treating you?
How's it going out there?

Speaker 2 (01:58):
It's awesome.
I've actually I should correctyou a little bit I'm living in
edmonton currently.
So I grew up in calgary, livedthere for my whole life and then
, uh, recently, this summer, Imoved out to edmonton with my
girlfriend because she'spursuing her master's for
physical therapy at u of a.
So we relocated out here forthe next couple years while she
finishes school.

(02:18):
So careful you're gonna getstuck I know, I know, yeah,
there's a lot of work up heretoo, which has been good for me,
um, but I primarily travel mostof the time anyways, so it
doesn't really matter.
But I always consider Calgaryto be home base.
That's where I did all mytraining and I always consider
that to be home yeah, well, Iknow it's.

Speaker 1 (02:38):
Uh, it's a pretty big rivalry between Nate and Sate.
So I saw, I saw Sate there, soI figured Calgary but, and now
you're now you're in Nate'sbackyard, so um yeah but that's
cool, I love.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
Edmonton man yeah, I honestly have enjoyed the city a
lot more than I thought I would.
I think the move kind ofinitially was a little bit
daunting, in the sense that I'vealways been in Calgary and just
used to being there.
You have your routines andstuff like that, so moving out
here is a bit of an adjustment,but I'm really enjoying the city
so far well, that's good,that's good.

Speaker 1 (03:10):
I know that, though, I enjoy all of Alberta's fun um.
My daughter lives up in GrandPrairie, so I know them.
I would say, as a young man Ispent more time in the south
part of the province.
But as an old man, I spend alot more time in the north.
We have a headquarters in nisku, edmonton the cwb.
So you know, we uh, there's alot more for us up there, but uh

(03:33):
, I mean props alberta, rightyeah, I've definitely driven
past that headquarters actuallynot, I'm thinking about it on my
way up north.

Speaker 2 (03:40):
Over the years I've, uh I've driven that highway
quite a few times.
I've seen it there on the righthand side.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
So yeah, yeah, I mean , you're a pretty young guy
though, like I mean you're,you're just coming up in the
world, but you've accomplishedquite a few things.
Let's start at the start.
You know, like you said, you'rein calgary.
That's where you grew up andwere raised.
Now calgary is kind of thoughtto be more of the white collar
capital of alberta, whereedmonton's more the blue collar

(04:06):
city.
You know, when you decided toget in the trades, was there any
pushback or how did you fallinto the trades?

Speaker 2 (04:13):
I guess I'll start.
I'll start at the start of it.
I I, to be honest, I didn'treally, growing up, have the
intentions of going into thetrades.
Um, I grew up playingcompetitive hockey for most of
my childhood into my late teens,so my primary focus was always

(04:34):
sports and I never truly thoughttoo much beyond that about what
my career path was going to begoing into my adult life.
And then, I think, when Idecided to hang out the skates
and start focusing what I wasgoing to do with my life, I
didn't necessarily jump straightinto the trades being my number
one pick.
My father was a father foralmost 47 years.

(05:00):
He just recently retired.
He worked out of the ironworkers hall for many, many
years and I just never reallythought I would go into the
trades.
It wasn't talked about in myhigh school.
It wasn't really pushed on me,like you said it's more of a
white collar city.
You know, all of my buddies werekind of getting ready and
prepared to go to university,take business degrees and go

(05:22):
down that path.
So once I decided that I wasgoing to get into the trades I
sort of just fell into it.
I had a close friend that wasworking with the Boilermakers
Hall and he had just started hiswelding apprenticeship and it
was kind of just a casualconversation that got the ball
rolling.
He basically just said like youknow what a year, what are you

(05:43):
doing?
Kind of thing Like are yougoing to school?
Are you going to you know work?
What's your plans?
And I just didn't really have aplan and I said, well, I'm kind
of just floating in the wind alittle bit.

Speaker 1 (05:55):
Just chilling.

Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, like I didn't have a huge plan.
So he said well, have you everthought about trying welding?
And I thought, no thought notreally like.
You know, my dad was a welderand, like, growing up I'd see
him coming home at the end ofhis shifts and you know he
looked so tired but didn't know,I don't want to do that like
that, doesn't you know?
And uh, I thought, well, youknow, I'm not really doing

(06:20):
anything, like sure.
So I I went with him down tothe boilermakers hall in calgary
and got introduced to, uh, youknow, the people that run the
hall down there yeah on a leadhas been a big part of my uh
training and he's kind of theone that pushed me to go okay.
Well, let's, let's get yourolling here.
So I did a pre-aptitudeprograms through our hall.

(06:42):
So we have uh you know, we havebasic steps that in to, in order
to get indentured as anapprentice, you go through these
small courses that we offer tojust kind of vet out.
If you're interested in thetrade, give you a chance to try
welding.
I had never welded before mywhole life.
I'd never really even beenaround it, even though my father
was a welder for so many years.

(07:03):
I just never really was aroundit and never had much experience
with it.
So trying it out for the firsttime, I mean I think like most
of us who are welders, I wasabsolutely terrible.
I wasn't, I didn't, I wouldn'tsay at the start.
I showed natural aptitudetoward it.
I wasn't necessarily a beginner.
That really took a shine to it.

(07:25):
So after trying it out Ithought you know, okay, like I
think I could you know, see howit goes, I'll do the
pre-apprentice program that wehave at the hall.
So went through the program andI did well enough, I suppose,
to be accepted into theBoilermakers apprenticeship
program and that's kind of how Istarted my apprenticeship and

(07:47):
then, once I got the ballrolling, I should say to
actually start my apprenticeship.
That's, I think, when thatignited that passion in me to be
like, okay, I think this isgoing to be the path I'm going
to go down.
This is going to be my career.

Speaker 1 (08:06):
Yeah, it's a very interesting couple things you
have in there.
One of them is right off thetop.
Most of the best welders I knowfabricators, trades, people, um
are usually from a backgroundof either sports or music.
They usually had something thatmade them be competitive at an
early age.
Because once you realize thatwelding can be also competitive

(08:31):
and or like internallycompetitive where, like, you
compete with yourself, thatopens up kind of a whole nother
window, um, where you canconnect those dots.
You're like you know sports.
You're judged on every singlemove, every single shift, every
single like.
I mean the better you get, thehigher up you get in sports, the
more critical they are oneverything how you stand, how

(08:53):
you put your knees, how yourelbows cocked at a certain
degree during a certain move.
That level of critique isperfect for people that get into
welding, because that's sosimilar to what we do when you
start learning to weld well,like real well, not just basics.
You look at everything, everyangle, every piece, every
possible procedure, every uh,variable, right?

(09:17):
Did you feel that that kind ofconnected the same way in your
world?

Speaker 2 (09:21):
yeah, I would definitely say that that
competitive spirit that I hadwith playing hockey growing up
translated into the welding onceI got you know to my first year
school, for example.
You know you meet guys in yourclass and you kind of develop
that camaraderie and it's thatfriendly competition to push
each other to succeed, and it'snot necessarily just to be

(09:45):
better than the next guy, butit's also just to improve day
over day.
Every day you show up to schooland you're getting in the booth
and you're practicing thesewelds over and over again.
You're getting that experience,but you're you're getting that
one percent better every day andyou're just progressing over
time.
And I think welding as a whole,that's kind of what makes guys

(10:07):
and what and and girls separatethemselves from the rest of the
you know because I think thereare a ton of welders in the
province.
I mean, I don't know the exactstatistics, but I'm sure we're
up there as far as, like I think, general population for uh
having a lot of welders, I knowin our hall personally, we have
over 700 welders on our activemembers list and it's

(10:32):
competitive, it's it's just an f, you know, you have to be at
the top of your game, um, and Ithink that that growing up
playing sports created that workethic and that competitive
nature to me to want to be at myabsolute best every time I'm
striking an arc.
And those little adjustmentsyou make in welding especially

(10:53):
well, only pipe, uh, tig weldingand things like that you're
making small little changes andthat can make all the difference
in your world to allow you toperform well, for sure, like I
mean, if, if you're not payingthat attention to detail, you
fall off the bus pretty quickyeah, you know, and it'll be
like why is this not working?

Speaker 1 (11:12):
and then someone's like well, did you do this?

Speaker 2 (11:14):
it's like oh, right yeah yeah, it's little things.
If I remember my first time, uh, tig welding.
You know, I go from welding onehand to all of a sudden
introducing that second handinto the equation and it's that
it's legit.
It's just very smalladjustments and learning from

(11:34):
people that I was very fortunateto get very good training
throughout my apprenticeship,both at school and also through
our union hall.
I mean, we have some of the bestI would argue some of the best
tig welders in the provincecoming out of our union hall and
we have a lot of really skilledtrades, people that can, that
were able to help me and give methose minor details to allow me

(11:56):
to progress forward yeah,ontario, or I mean, sorry,
alberta, right now, uh, as oflast year, has 14,185 registered
welders.
Wow, yeah, I'm not surprised tohear that at all.

Speaker 1 (12:10):
Yeah, it's only.
The only two provinces withmore are Quebec and Ontario,
which are quadruple thepopulation.
Exactly yeah so it's well, andthe compulsory aspect of
training of welding in Albertareally increases the ability to
become an apprentice and a and ared seal right down the road.

(12:33):
Yeah, because that's notcompulsory in every other, any
other province, um, and someprovinces don't really even
really push apprenticeship atall.

Speaker 2 (12:41):
Right, yeah, yeah, absolutely so, for yourself.

Speaker 1 (12:45):
I'm interested about your family dynamic because you
know dad was an iron worker.
And yeah, and it's very funnybecause my dad was a boiler
maker and I became an iron and Ibecame an iron worker.
But uh, that must have beeninteresting he didn't want me to
get into the trades.
He kind of did everything hecould to kind of steer me away

(13:05):
from that and to go touniversity.
It was like you know, you don'twant to do what I do.
But then when I became a welder, I was like why would you not
want me to be this?
It's, I have fun at work everyday.
I love the people that I workwith.
I get to build these awesomethings.
And then the days fly by like alike everyone looks at a welder
at the end of the day and it'slike they're dirty and they're

(13:27):
tired.
But ask them how fast it wentlike.
It's like you snap your fingersand a 10 12 hour shift is done.
Now you sit 12 hours behind thedesk and tell me how you feel
you know what I mean that's along day, I'd rather do 12 on
the tools any day right Now,when you came home and said, hey

(13:48):
, mom, dad, you know I'm goingto try out with the Boilermakers
, I'm going to see what's upwith that and I might go down
this path, Was there anypushback from your dad or from
mom?

Speaker 2 (13:58):
Were they like, no, no, you could do something else,
I think yeah, it's like my, myparents, it's like I grew up in
a very honest household.
So, and especially when I wasplaying sports, like there was
no beating around the bush, if Ihad a bad game, I knew there
was no, you know, oh, you did agood job.

(14:22):
You know they give you thecourtesy pat of the pat of the
back, but it was always prettyhonest and yeah my dad and mom,
I think, knew that I didn'tnecessarily show great aptitude
towards, like I was never gonnabe the guy that was gonna go do
a four-year university degreeand work an office job.
That just was never gonna be me.

(14:42):
I didn't have interest inschool um, that type of school I
should preface, because I thinkonce I got to SAIT I showed
that I wanted to apply myself, Iwanted to be there and I think
I just needed to find the rightthing.
But to circle back to yourquestion, like my dad didn't

(15:02):
have anything against me gettinginto the trade because I think
he saw that I had showed genuineinterest in it.
It was probably the first thingthat I had ever come to them
and said, like I'm reallyinterested in this, I think I'd
be good at it so they supportedme the whole way.
They they believed that becauseof the interest I was showing,

(15:23):
that this was probably the rightpath for me to go down good,
good, because you, you'd hate tohave that struggle at home,
right, absolutely yeah, because,like I mean I, think sorry, go
ahead.

Speaker 1 (15:36):
Well it's.
It's hard to do anything as itis when you're not used to it,
and having to defend it is tough.
But you know, I'm glad thatthey had that support for you
yeah, I think it's.

Speaker 2 (15:46):
You know we me and my dad, we we, you know go back
and forth and we'll have alittle.
You know we'll chirp at eachother a little bit about which
hall is better and you knowwho's got.
You get your benefit statementand when my dad was still
working he'd get his benefitstatement and we'd be comparing
and sitting there going, oh, oh,I got a little more money for
massage this year.

Speaker 1 (16:07):
This or that.
Just a little joke here andthere.

Speaker 2 (16:09):
But my dad and mom have always supported me and
believed that I could be good atwhatever I chose to do, and
because I show a passion forwilding, I think they just
supported me from day one.

Speaker 1 (16:21):
So one of the things that happens when you become an
apprentice is that there'sschool, you know, and then you
kind of had been wanting toavoid school as much as possible
.
Yeah, when they're like okay,well, you know, you get to be a
boiler maker, this is a part ofthe deal.
Um, you know, what do you thinkabout doing your first block
when it comes up?

(16:41):
Was that daunting to you?
Was that something you're likeoh, no school.
Or did you feel better about it?

Speaker 2 (16:46):
I think, yeah, I'd been told.
As you know, the first year, Ibelieve personally the first
year of walling school wasprobably the most difficult,
because I think you are gettingbombarded with so much
information.
At one time I remember gettingmy stack of books in the mail,

(17:06):
you know, and it's two boxes andit's this high and you're
thinking how am I going to getthrough all this in eight weeks?
So I think just the first dayjitters were very high, but I
was excited because I wasexcited to go and learn
something that I was genuinelyinterested in and not feel like
I'm doing it because I have tobe there.
I'm doing it because I have tobe there, I'm doing it because I
want to be there.

(17:27):
So there was some nerves and,to be honest, I did my first
year of school during COVID.

Speaker 1 (17:33):
So you were all online.

Speaker 2 (17:34):
Yeah, so my first year of school experience, I
think, was different than mostapprentices and people who went
to school at all during.
Covid, I'm sure you can attestto that it was different.
But I think overall, aftergetting through it and moving on
to second year and having nowcompleted school entirely, I

(17:57):
think the first year overall isthe most difficult.
But once you get through that Ithink you're able to gain
confidence and go.
Okay, I can get through this.

Speaker 1 (18:06):
That's awesome.
Well, let's take a break rightnow and when we get back I'd
like to talk about.
You know what that Boilermakerjourney person path looks like,
and then I know you've taken aspecial program that was offered
by the Boilermakers this lastyear.
And I want to talk about thatprogram and how that played out,
because I think that that'ssomething really interesting
that a lot of different placesare starting to do specialized

(18:26):
programming like this.
But we're here with Gabe, we'retalking Boilermakers, we're
talking welding, we're talkingAlberta, and we'll be back right
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And we are back here on the CWBAssociation podcast.
My name is Max Charon and I'mhere with Gabe Sigliano.

(20:17):
Nailed it, I nailed it.
It's the worst because my staffis Italian, so I'm always
trying to learn italian, butit's like the last names that
get me they're hard they canthey all sound the same and
they're all pronounced different?
so.
So let's get back to where wewere.
You, you know, you started yourjourney with the Boilermakers.

(20:39):
You got through that firstblock, which is scary because
that's like where you'reintroduced to all the terms, all
the things that you may or maynot have heard of, and if you
haven't, then it's a biglearning curve.
And then you get, you know.
Then you get out to thetraining part and you got to go
work.
How was that for you to be,start getting some of that work
under your belt?

Speaker 2 (21:00):
that I would say it was probably more daunting than
school.
I would say our hall does areally good job of trying to
prepare you as best they can.
But I think that doing fieldwork because because we have two
branches right, we have fieldwork and we have shopper I've

(21:20):
only personally ever done fieldwork, um, but I have a pretty
good idea what the shop work islike.
You know it's kind of 40 hourweeks, pretty standard, same
place, every day.
Field work is.
I don't know how much fieldexperience you have yourself,
but you show up and it's kind oflike what's happening, you know
yeah, it's very confusing.

(21:42):
You don't know where to go.
It's like first day of school,right you're kind of all over
the map.
But having you know, I remembermy first job was at a canadian
natural in fort mcmurray.
So I, you know, I drive eightand a half hours out to the
middle of nowhere, show up andyou don't really know what to

(22:02):
expect.
You kind of know, and then youget out there and you're
standing in the middle of thisrefinery, you're looking around
and you're like no clue whatanything does you don't know
what.
You know what the names are,what they're called, you know
yeah, I mean, it's like you know, and you're the new guy yeah, a
lot of the most of the time I'mone of the younger guys on site

(22:25):
and now, being more experienced, it's much easier for me to go
about my day and handle mybusiness.
But showing up on the first daywhen my first job, you're as
green as it gets and you're likeyou just don't know what to do.
But I had a good crew that kindof held my hand and they're
like come with me, buddy, I'llshow you where to go and what to
do, and you kind of startlearning the ropes and you kind

(22:48):
of just get your foot in thedoor.
That first job for me was justkind of getting my feet wet and
understanding the basics on avery small scale, of what it is
that it means to be a boilermaker, what we do, um, and that
umbrella, I'm still learning.
I'm still learning things um itnever really ends, honestly no

(23:08):
it doesn't and, and especiallyfor the, I think, the nature of
our specific union and what wedo.
There are so many differentthings that we work on, there's
so many different types of weldsthat you're going to come
across, and I think throughoutmy apprenticeship I learned a
lot about things that aren'tnecessarily just welding.
I learned a lot about fittingand rigging and all those things

(23:32):
that I think have helped mesort of become a more
well-rounded trades person no,and that's so interesting.

Speaker 1 (23:39):
I remember one of the first job sites.
I got dropped off on um.
I wasn't meant to go to thesite that day and then someone
else called in sick so they'relike, okay, you're going out to
the site and I was like, uh,okay, you know, I was like I was
like 19 and they just droppedme off like after like the
sign-in booth.
They just because they couldn'tcome in, because they weren't
signed in for the job, they werejust dropping me off at this

(24:00):
door.
And then they're like, like yougot to go to overhead door
number two.
The crew's working in behindthere and it's like this giant
steel mill with like a thousanddoors.
I'm like door number two.
Like where's door number two?
Like I have no idea.
So I just like started walkingthrough this yard and I know now
that they just did it to me tobe jerks.

(24:20):
I was like wandering aimlessly,trying to find this door number
two and finally find this truckdriving by, wave them down.
I'm like, hey, man, I'msupposed to go to door number
two.
And they all started laughing.
They're like all our doors arelettered, not numbered, and I
was like, oh, they're like whoyou with?
I'm like I'm with shc.
They're like, oh yeah, you guysare in the background there.

(24:41):
I'm like, thank you, but I mean, those things are scary, you
don't know.
But you don't know what youdon't know, right, so no and I
remember just my big thing was Ilearned quickly.

Speaker 2 (24:54):
You're going to make mistakes, you're going to go to
the wrong place, you're going tobe late, you're going to make
you know and you just have toget through it and it's just
part of it.
Yeah, over time that goes awayand you're you'll.
I look back on those kind ofstories that you're saying and I
just laugh because it's, it'sfunny, it's funny yeah.
You're the new guy and it's justpart of the crew bringing you

(25:18):
into the fold and bring me, youto be a part of the union or
part of the crew.

Speaker 1 (25:24):
Yeah, and and then you know you do your time
working.
You got to go for block numbertwo.
Now your confidence is comingup right like you're.
Yeah, you're feeling better.
I know that for most people,once you start getting the the
hours and the apprenticeshiprolling, then you start getting
a little bit of that sense ofurgency, like like let's hammer
this out, let's get this done.
You know, uh, is that what youwere feeling too?

Speaker 2 (25:46):
100.
I mean it.
I always heard guys telling meoh, you'll miss being an
apprentice.
Being an apprentice is awesomeand I, to be honest with you,
I've never felt that way.
I've always wanted the day Isigned up for my apprenticeship
and went to my first job and gotthat experience on my first job
.
I was like I can't wait to be ajourneyman.

(26:08):
That was.
I was always hungry to get myjourneyman for sure.

Speaker 1 (26:13):
And how, how'd you find those last two blocks?
How hard was it?
What were like the really toughparts for you?

Speaker 2 (26:29):
for you.
I found third year block to beprobably the most challenging,
just as far as like the actualdifficulty of the material.
Um, I found blueprint readingto be particularly difficult for
me because I didn't have muchexperience with that a lot of
people struggle with that, youknow.
So that was something I had towork through for sure.
I was definitely leaning on myteachers a lot at SAIT to kind
of help me with that and it justrequired a lot of extra time

(26:52):
for sure.

Speaker 1 (26:53):
But I think it's like anything you just I had at that
point learned how much effortand time needs to be put in
outside the classroom justreviewing and studying to
succeed so at that point, I knewwhat the expectations were as
far as like how much time perday I needed to be putting in in
order to succeed it's likesports man, like I mean, game

(27:15):
day is game day, but then, uh,if that's all the practice
you're putting in is minimumpractice, then then you get
minimum, you know Minimumresults.

Speaker 3 (27:24):
Minimum results For sure, and that's what you get
Like it's.

Speaker 1 (27:29):
If you're not thinking about it, kind of as
you're falling asleep, do youeven really want to be there?
Yeah, yeah, you know you domention something interesting
that is not necessarily commonacross Canada and that's the
fact that you did a lot of yourboiler boiler maker training at
SAIT.
So this isn't a hundred percentthe same way in every province

(27:52):
or every hall.
Lots of halls have theirstandalone hall, their
standalone training center, andthat's it.
They don't work with collegesor other groups.
The unions are all different,like that, like between the iron
workers, pipefitters,boilermakers they all have that
kind of a different mix withthat.
The iron workers just shut downtheir college school here in
Saskatchewan and went back tostraight being in the hall, but

(28:14):
you went to SAIT, so it was likea boilermaker program through
the hall at SAIT, right?
So are you referring to?
the filling the gap program oryour initial school, so all of
my initial school was the welderum.

Speaker 2 (28:35):
I guess it'd be your journeyman welder school, your
standard welder school, and Iwould assume that would be the
same across all of albertaweather, because when I was in
school I had members of myclasses that were pipeliners
that were working in shops thatwere like I was built.
There was only two boilermakers in my third year class,

(28:57):
for example okay I see, I see.
So the way that our union isstructured is they keep track of
your hours and manage your bluebook throughout your
apprenticeship completed, younotify the hall that you've
completed it, you send in yourmarks and they check that off in

(29:28):
your blue book so you canprogress.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
Okay, yeah, and see, that's not available in every
province.
That's an interesting thing.
So, like, in some provincesit's all on the Boilermakers.
They do their training in-house, they do their welding in-house
, they do all the pieces, andnot every facility is the same.
So there's some, you know,halls and this is like I mean
between all unions some hallsyou're getting more welding

(29:52):
training than other halls, right, you go to some halls and they
only got six welding booths andyou go to another one, they got
30.
It's like, okay, that'sdifferent, right, but I know
that Alberta is very weldingheavy.
Um, but I know that Alberta isvery welding heavy, right, like,
I mean, a lot of the trainingdoes push towards physically
welding because there's just somuch work, like really, at the
end of the day, there's just somuch work.
Did you struggle with the, withthe journey person exam?

(30:14):
Was it tough?
How'd you do?

Speaker 2 (30:16):
I think I did very well.
There's a saying, I'm sureyou've heard it it's 70s a
hundred.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
Yeah, oh, there's a saying I'm sure you've heard,
it's 70s, 100.
Yeah, oh yeah, I used to teachthe Red Seal program.

Speaker 2 (30:29):
I hated saying it, but it's true.
Yes, yeah, I'm not.
Uh, I hate to say it, but Idon't specifically remember what
I passed my Red Seal with.
I wasn't.
I wasn't expecting to be in the90s or anything, I think uh.
I think I got in the 80ssomewhere, but I managed to pass
and that was what was mostimportant to me.
I really wanted that red sealon the first try.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
On the first try.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
Yeah, I know a lot of other people.
They go and they do their jurymeetings and they pass.
And then they go the next day,they write that red seal and
unfortunately don't pass pass,and then they go the next day
they write that red seal andunfortunately don't pass.
And I was very, I very, verybadly wanted to pass my red seal
and just get it out of the way.
Yeah, so I could be done andsay that I completed everything

(31:13):
on the first go yeah, more of apersonable than anything.

Speaker 1 (31:17):
Nobody was sitting there telling me like, oh, you
better get it on the first trybut it was more of a personal
thing again and thatcompetitiveness in myself better
get it on the first try.

Speaker 2 (31:23):
But it was more of a personal thing again that
competitiveness in myself to getit on the first try.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
So there's some statistics that say you did the
right thing.
Because, first of all, as ateacher, anecdotally I found
that if students didn't passtheir red seal on the first try,
their chances of coming back tofinish dropped like 60%, Like.

Speaker 2 (31:45):
Really.

Speaker 3 (31:45):
Like lots If you look at the national average, only a
third of apprentices.

Speaker 1 (31:50):
Apprentices actually get their red seal.
Interesting Right, Okay, andmost of those it's because they
failed on their first try andthen chickened out.
There's a lot of test anxiety,there's a lot of fear and if you
fail, like right after school,imagine taking six months off
and then trying again without ateacher, without it being fresh

(32:11):
in your mind it gets yeah itgets like scarier and scarier
the further away you get from itright so yeah, it's really sad
build it up yeah, exactly soit's sad to see people try and
then not come back and try again.
It's like, hey, we want to keeppeople in finish your red seal,
but unfortunately not everyonedoes and it is a hard exam.

(32:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (32:34):
I remember opening the booklet and reading the
first question and going well,that wasn't in my notes, you
know you're just sitting theregoing.
I just remember having thismoment of panic when the first
question you read, you're justlike, okay, I might be in one

(32:55):
here, yeah, and it's 124 more ofthose coming.

Speaker 1 (32:59):
So, yeah, yeah.
So now, what do you do?
Like?
Now you got your red seal, youare, you're in, in with the
boiler makers and you're workingis.
Is that it like?
Are you set for your career?
What are your kind of yourgoals within that?

Speaker 2 (33:16):
uh, I think personally, at the moment my
goals lie around just developingmy skittles as a, b pressure
welder um that was a recentachievement I accomplished last
summer was, uh, getting my beadpressure ticket.
So once I got that, I meanalmost 90 percent of our welding

(33:37):
work in our hall is beadpressure work yeah, so getting
thin boiler tubes headers,boiler tubes plating, you know
that's rare so at this pointit's now just revolved around
developing my skills as a bwelder so that I can progress in
my career.
I guess.
In that way, I think most of mygoals are pretty small ones,

(34:01):
that I just have the ourpersonal goals, because at this
point it's kind of just aboutyou know working and sort of
wreaking the rewards of, youknow, going through school and
getting my red seal, my beatpressure.
Now I'm at the point where I'mgetting kind of top rate, you
know.
Yeah, you're getting your.
You're the most money you'vemade.
This is your opportunity now toget your name up there and

(34:23):
develop your skills as a field bwelder so that I would say
overarchingly, would be my maingoal um it's a.

Speaker 1 (34:30):
Beyond that, it's pretty competitive to be the
best right, because there's alot of good, really good,
welders out there yeah, and Ithink I think to my age plays a
factor as well.

Speaker 2 (34:42):
I'm 24 years old, so I think stepping onto a job site
most guys are.
They're looking at me, thinkingI'm an apprentice or that you
know just what does this guyknow?
yeah, yeah, and, and andhonestly, like compared to some
of the wilders that I've workedwith over the past five, six
years, or I don't know much-compared to these guys that have

(35:02):
been doing it for 30 years yeah.
Main goal would be to justdevelop my skills as a bee
wilder and then long-term planwould be probably to work my way
into supervision levelpositions and start running jobs
be the long-term goal.

Speaker 1 (35:19):
Now, in terms of you know you get that bee pressure
ticket.
That was through a reallyinteresting program.
So do you want to talk abouthow that program worked, how you
got into it and kind of whatthe results?

Speaker 2 (35:30):
were um, and to be honest, I think probably a good
portion of my skill developmenttook place in that two month
period that I did the utipcourse.
That really helped me progressas a welder.

(35:53):
So I did that, uh, as soon as Ifinished third year school it
was just before christmas, Ifinished third year school at
the time and then I wentstraight into the filling the
gap program in the new year.
And they start right away Firstday, welding on six inch pipe,
getting ready to do your Bpressure test or your C pressure

(36:15):
test, depending on if you werean apprentice or a journeyman.
At the time I didn't haveenough hours so I was still an
apprentice apprentice eventhough I completed all my
schooling.
So I was preparing to do the zpressure certification same test
, but um so basically, like thestarting point, they're just
getting you prepared to do yourb pressure exam.

(36:36):
They're teaching you.
We teach primarily the tigroute.
Uh, you're given the option of6010 route over carbon tig route
I chose to do the tig routebecause I found that I had more
success with it and I found itto be a little more forgiving.
I suppose when you make amistake you can.
I found it easier to kind ofknife in there, make it a little

(36:57):
correction.
We call it not a repair it's acorrection, but uh yeah.
So that program overall teachesyou basically everything you
would need to know as far asbecoming a skilled b pressure
welder, with our all as much asthey can without giving you
hands-on field experience.
You're starting with your bpressure um.

(37:18):
You even do your cwbcertifications, which I think
are very importantfoundationally to be able to
just use your CWB certs.

Speaker 1 (37:28):
I've used them throughout my whole
apprenticeship in the field,there's always something
structural around.
You know, always, always.

Speaker 2 (37:36):
I think a lot of B welders.
At certain points of theircareer they kind of cast the CWB
certification to the side alittle bit because they're so
focused on welding pipe.
But I've always maintained mycwb certifications because I've
found them to be very importanton jobs.

Speaker 1 (37:52):
I've always found the way to use it at some point oh,
yeah, yeah, even just weldingbrackets on for the electricians
or something like that, like Imean, all those things have to
be certified exactly, and uh,after your cwb certifications
through the program you move onto uh small bore pipes.

Speaker 2 (38:09):
So you're moving down from the six inch pipe down to
a two inch pipe.
So it's a little bit differentprocess.
You're moving from a weed beadon your caps and stuff to
stringer bead.
It's different positioning andyou move through carbon alloys
or sorry, carbon to the alloyssame with us and Inconaut all
the way up to Chrome and ourinstructors at the time.
I mean we have what I would sayis the best training program

(38:33):
that I've heard of.
I mean we have top notchinstruction that helps you start
from zero take the experienceand can get you all the way to
the point of some some membersof my filling the gap last
minute.
All the way to the ink andalloy and past past of
certifications, having zero,take experience and not having a
beat pressure in the matter ofeight weeks.

(38:55):
Yeah, so it's a very effectiveprogram.
It gives you all the tools youwould need to get from basically
like zero to as certified asyou can possibly be how many
people were in your class?

Speaker 1 (39:06):
we had eight people, eight people and how did they
select those eight like how didyou apply?
How did like?
How'd you hear about it?

Speaker 2 (39:14):
so I heard about it from the.
So sean ouellette is the headof our cal reunion hall down
there or one of the managers ofthe hall down there and he runs
the welding center down there.
So he's the head examiner andI've always had a really good
relationship from him, with himfrom day one, and he kind of
told me about it that they wereintroducing the program like a

(39:36):
year before I did it they saidlook, you know, get your name on
the list.
They're starting to collectnames for people that are
interested in doing the program.
And so I did.
I jumped on it right awaybecause I thought you know what,
that's probably going to be mybest shot at getting my
certifications through the hall.
I developed my skills.
It's all paid for, obviously bygovernment funding and I thought

(39:59):
it was probably the bestopportunity I'd have to get some
good training.
So I just I literally just putmy name down on the list and was
able to fortunately snag a spot, because it was in a very high
demand program.

Speaker 1 (40:12):
Yeah, it is In her hall.
Well, they've ran them allacross the country a couple of
hundreds, I think 140.
Some people have gone throughit.
Now Seems to be that everyone'sloving it.
Yeah, your instructor for thatprogram.
Was it a hall instructor?
Was it someone they brought in?

Speaker 2 (40:29):
yeah, so my instructor his name was lincoln
brown, who is a very successfulbee welder through our hall.
And then he, you know, and seanall that over, he was the
overseer of the whole programbut but Lincoln did our
day-to-day instruction, so itwas kind of like a chain of
command thing but, he, primarily, was with us in the booth every

(40:51):
single day, showing useverything and giving us those
demos, hands on you know, he wason you and you had eight people
in the class so there wasn'treally anywhere to hide.
So if you were in your boothleaning on your jig and not
welding and you'd, he'd see itfor sure and he'd get on you.

Speaker 1 (41:08):
Well, and you know it's interesting that you get to
go through so many types ofmaterials.
That's always the biggest thingthat catches anything in the
pipe world.
And you know, like you, you getyour initial six inch.
Everyone does it F3, f4, the 60, 60, 10 roots, 70, 18, fill and
cap.
That's kind of like thestandard everyone knows about,
whether it's SCED 40 or SCED 80.
That's, that's neither here.

(41:29):
That's, that's your max outdeposit, whatever.
But past that is where peoplestart to get hung up.
Right, it's like do I go sixinch to two inch and get my my
small bore?
Or do I go six inch and just goto an f5, f6 and do my tig root
carbon out or stainless rootcarbon out on on uh, on pipe at

(41:51):
six inch?
Or do you know there's so manyvariations.
Your p44s, which are yournickels, your 40, what you know
what was 47 is ink.
now there's a bazillion numbersand positions and then do you
need, uh, do you need it in 6Gor do you need it in 5G, 2g?
It's a lot of information andif you go to ASME 9,.

(42:11):
It doesn't help.
Those documents are confusingas and even the people that test
ASME 9, the pipe testers.
They can't even agree on what'sallowed sometimes, like you're
talking about.
Is it a repair?
Well, you don't say that word.
You know, but can?
you grind out a stop, 100%, youcan.

(42:31):
You know, like, and if I happento have to grind back three
inches from that stop, meh, well, you know, things happen,
prayer, and then it's like andthen how much deposit is allowed
on the inside?
Is it the three mil everyonealways tells you, or more or
less, and it's a lot to navigateright.
And when you get pulled into aprogram like that, it kind of

(42:54):
you can just dial it in.
Okay, what do you want to learn?
What's next?
And we got a person here toteach you.

Speaker 2 (42:59):
Let's hammer it out, right yeah, you get a path, and
I think that's you know, we haveopportunity to go and practice.
If you're a path and I thinkthat's what, uh, you know we
have opportunity to go andpractice.
If you're a member and getstanding with our hall, you can
go practice at any time ifyou're not working at that time.
You can go, utilize the hall'sresources at any point.
But having a structured programlike the filling the gap
program, that gives you a pathto be like okay, your b pressure

(43:23):
, and then you do your F3, f4,and then you do your F6, f4,
there's a path and it kind ofgives you a structured in the
same way school does.
It gives you a structure and anoutline so that you know what
you need to do, yeah.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:39):
And then, when that program was over, you know how
did that affect your career.
Was it a?
Did you see an immediate bumpin the type of work or the work
you could do?
Wages you know what was.
What was the benefits?
The?

Speaker 2 (43:53):
benefits, truthfully, were mainly confidence.
Yeah, and I think that'sprobably the biggest determining
factor when it comes to awelder's success, especially in
the field, is just having theconfidence to even try to do.
You know we have some prettydifficult position welds in
position welds in the field thatwe as boilermakers have to make

(44:16):
, and I think just having theoverall confidence to go of an
attempt to the joint and knowthat you are going to be able to
do it successfully, that's whatthat program gave me.
It was a confidence to be ableto go ahead and and and every
single job I go to I do shutdown work, so I work for maybe
five different contractors ayear, or sometimes two, or it

(44:38):
just depends on the lengths ofjobs.
Every single job I go to,though, I have to do a well test
for, and obviously that'spretty similar for most uh
industry, most people in theindustry.
They have to test a lot, butthat program also gave me the
confidence to go and do welltests and not have no plan.
There was no wingy and I had aplan because of the filling the

(45:02):
gap program.
I know when I'm doing a F3, f4,right 60, 10, root, 70, 18, fill
cap, I have a process in mymind.

Speaker 1 (45:11):
You know the numbers already.

Speaker 2 (45:14):
I know what I'm going to run my heat at.
I know, I just know because ofthe program, though.

Speaker 1 (45:19):
You know where you struggle, you know which part of
the clock is not your favoritepart, and you program though.
You know where you struggle,you know which part of the clock
is not your favorite part inthe, and you're like, all of it
was 60 10 to be honest, but I'mold so we only got trained on 60
10 when I was coming up, andthen when I did my first tig
route, I was like, oh my god,this is so much easier.
Slower, yeah, slower, but uh,but I mean it depends how hard

(45:42):
they're holding you on thatthree hour slot to get it done.
Um, but I mean, when you getdown to the two inch 60 10 on a
two inch barf, that's not fun atall, like yeah, it's.

Speaker 2 (45:55):
I remember my first time attempting one, thinking oh
yeah, like I just welded, I'dbeen welding.
This was in the fifth in thegap program I'd been welding 60
temp in school like I had apretty good idea what was going
on, but I had never welded oneon that small bore pipe yeah and
I remember around it's like redhot and like half a freaking

(46:17):
rod I got about halfway aroundthe pipe before I was key holing
about a quarter inch you know,and you
realize okay, I got some work todo here.
This is not.

Speaker 1 (46:29):
uh, take your time and move.
You got to move a lot quickeryeah.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:35):
There's a big learning curve.
I remember that yeah.

Speaker 1 (46:38):
And if you get a chance, go for max deposit, not
just because you get to weldmore, but because there's more
of a heat sink.
The more material to suck thatheat out of that joint, the
better, honestly.
Absolutely.
So what about other things?
So what's left on your wishlist for things you'd like to
learn welding, you know, becausethere's new technologies all

(47:00):
the time right now, and big inthe pipe world is the rolling 1G
STT routes or modified waveformroutes.
So MIG route, flux, core, filland cap.
That sounds really boring to alot of people, but you know what
, when you see it in a shop orsomewhere running live, you get
it.
These machines are sweet, theyblow it in there and you can get
a giant well done in minutes.

(47:21):
Right, they're looking at youknow there's probably gonna be
new shirts coming out for stufflike that in the future because
things are getting pretty fancy,right?

Speaker 2 (47:29):
yeah, I had a small experience with.
I mean, I worked on a projectin bc a couple years ago now and
I was there for over a year anda half and we built the large I
believe it's the largest liquidnatural gas tank in north
america well, clng went up northyeah yeah, so when we were

(47:50):
building that tank because, asI'm sure you know, all tanks are
built using automatic well,they're sub-automatic and
horizontal, and I had neverworked or experienced sub arc at
all so, getting that experience, I realized, like, how
efficient those machines becomewhen you have them set and

(48:14):
dialed correctly, like whenthey're dialed in, especially
the guys that were running themevery day.
Yeah, it's so sweet yeah andthey just they just hit the
button off, it went.
They're chipping the slag alittle bit.
I don't know.
I always used to I'd bewatching them while on back
grinding some big for sittingthere watching them.

Speaker 1 (48:31):
I'm like super jealous yeah, I need to learn
how to be that guy yeah Ilearned to run sub arc when I
was pretty young and a lot ofpeople were like, isn't it
boring?
I'm like, well, it is boring,but things are only boring if
you get bored, and I'm notreally a bored type of person.
So, like I would, I would tryto figure the machine out.
Like I mean, it's one thing tojust run a machine, but then

(48:53):
it's another thing to reallylearn the machine what it can do
.
And then, by my, you know, bythe second year we bought, after
we bought that sub arc at thatshop, I became like the sub arc
dude, which I had no problemsbeing that guy.
Like I mean, no one else wasstepping up and I was the only
person that showed interest inthe machine.
Everyone thought it was boring,but then I became the sub arc

(49:14):
guy.
And then, after I became thesub arc guy, then they were like
you're, you're our automationguy.
You're our automation guy,you're going to learn how to do
automatic bead rolling, you knowautomatic this and automatic
that.
And I was like it's that easy,like you just got to show the
interest in the right spot atthe right time and then you get,
you go with it, right, you justkind of get to run with it.

Speaker 2 (49:33):
Yeah, I had a similar experience because I was an
apprentice when I was working onthat tank, and almost all
apprentice guys that worked ontanks as an apprentice will tell
you your primary job is togrind Grind.
Yeah, that is your gig.
And I had been on this projectfor probably six months at a

(49:55):
certain point and I finally theycame to me and they said, hey,
we got this sub arc starting uphere.
We're going to start weldingthe floor.
Are you in learning?
track yeah yeah, and at thatpoint I didn't even know really
what sub arc was but it didn'tsound like grinding yeah, so I
said sign me up, and I took it.

(50:18):
It's saying kind of similarstory.
As you, I took it and ran withit and I became the sub arc guy
on our ship for doing the floorplate and doing the corner
scenes and all that stuff, and Ilearned a ton and I took that
experience with me and you takepride in it because you can do a
really good job.

Speaker 1 (50:34):
You can also make a really big mistake really fast
with sub arc.
Oh, and I did Like.
People are like oh, I gotporosity, try getting porosity
with sub arc.
You're grinding for the nextthree hours, yeah.

Speaker 2 (50:47):
I remember I punched you it was real thin plate, this
floor plate, and I punched ahole like right through it,
cause I wasn't paying attention.
You know we were on a 14 andseven schedule on night shift.
So I was on.
I think I was on like day 13 or14.
It was like close to going hometime.
So my brain was fried yeah, andI'm on my little sub-arc machine

(51:10):
, I'm on the tractor and I getmy you know what I thought was
the right heat, and I hit, goand I and it, and I always could
tell by the sound oh yeah, I'msure you can relate to that you
know when it's running good.
And I just remember I heardthis pop and I looked down and
there was probably about a loonysize hole in the spore and I
punched a hole right through itand I'm thinking, oh God.

Speaker 1 (51:34):
And where did that slag go?
Just like down on someone'shead, yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:41):
Not ideal situation, for sure.

Speaker 1 (51:45):
Well then you pull out the stick machine and you
start filling it in.
Grind it smooth, run the passover top of it.
No one will ever know.

Speaker 2 (51:50):
Yeah, they know now that I'm telling this story, but
yeah, they'll never find theexact spot yeah, yeah, as far as
I know, that tank's inoperation now.

Speaker 1 (52:00):
It must be all good they check it, they have testers
, they have inspectors.
They're good yeah so what's,what do you see yourself doing
in the future?
You know, as we get to the endof the interview, you know like
you got your long time goals.
You said you want to get yourskills up for sure.
Um, usually people that arelike you, that are quite
ambitious with skills andlooking to grow, you also really

(52:22):
start to realize that you likelearning and that you kind of
like teaching too.
That seems to be kind of a cyclefor a lot of people that I see
in these situations.
Have you gotten to that pointyet?
Where you're, you don't mindteaching, or or maybe you see it
as a someday future job, or areyou just full-on?
Teach me as much as you can.

Speaker 2 (52:40):
You want to learn I think at this stage of my career
, based on my experience level,I don't think I'm in a position
to be teaching people if thatmakes sense, yeah I guess on a
smaller scale.
If I was teaching somebody howto pass their b or do something
that I've already done, then Iwould feel confident teaching

(53:01):
and instructing somebody.
But I love passing thatknowledge on to somebody.
Like I would love to be able tosave other people.
The grief, grief that I yeah,that I had to deal with
sometimes but I think it in thefuture I would absolutely love
to become an instructor.
I think that would be like atthe end of sort of the welding

(53:23):
career for me would be the goal.
Or, like I said, just gettingmyself into supervision.
But I think at the moment Ijust want to gain experience and
develop my own skills.

Speaker 1 (53:34):
Is there any sites you'd love to go to?
Any places you'd love to gowork Like I've been able to
travel kind of the world Onceyou start thinking about all the
jobs out there.
You got a travel bug in you atall or do you like being close
to home?
I?

Speaker 2 (53:48):
do like I think, when I was younger.
I I mean I guess you're stillyoung, but when I first got
going, I only I didn't carewhere the job was, I didn't care
, I was just like how much arethey paying?
When do I?
start.
That was all I cared about, Ithink.
Now, um, I would really like towork more primarily around

(54:10):
where I can be at home as muchas I can.
I suppose um, we're supposed tohave a pretty heavy shutdown
season next spring, hopefully,and I'm hoping to land somewhere
more around this area fortsaskatchewan, somewhere in
edmonton.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
I've actually never worked in edmonton in my whole
time being with the boilermakers, surprisingly so well, most of
the guys, most of the teamthat's at the boilermakers all
in edmonton is going to be thepeople with quite a bit of
seniority.
Right, those are the steadyeddie jobs that they're to hold
on to pretty tight.
There is pretty bigmanufacturing facilities in

(54:49):
Edmonton, though, that feed themines and feed the oil and gas.

Speaker 2 (54:53):
Yeah, that's what I'm referring to.
Yeah, would you be?

Speaker 1 (54:56):
interested in getting into the fabrication side of it
, then Like is that somethingyou?

Speaker 2 (55:01):
see yourself go doing , you know, I mean really
anything.
I'm kind of at the point, Ithink, now where I'm trying to
navigate what type of welder Ireally want to dive into being
do I want to be like a tech guy?
Do I want to be like aproduction guy?
That's kind of where I'mnavigating, I think, at the
moment.

Speaker 1 (55:16):
So well and you can always switch as an old guy,
don't stress too much about it.
Look around you.
What's the best opportunity yougot, you go with it.
I always tell people it's funnybecause I used to play hockey,
so you'll get the analogy but Ialways told students, welding is
the nhl of trades, right, weget to kind of pick the teams we
want to be on.
We got to kind of get to pickand you look at your own skills.

(55:37):
Am I a scorer?
Am I a defenseman?
Am I a goalie?
So then what company needs thatposition?
So for me, I was a stainlessguy.
I got really good at stainless.
I loved welding.
Stainless Stick, make flux,core, take, I don't care,
stainless is my baby.
Then I became the stainless guy.
So whenever I saw shutdownscome up for like need stainless
welder.
I'm drafted, I'm going in.

(56:01):
And you just write it with whatyour skills are and over time
you'd be amazed at the teams youplay on and the groups you get
to meet.
And I only did shutdowns for afew years and then I tried going
back in my 30s to do anotherone.
That was a mistake.
Shutdowns are kind of a youngperson's gig, like I mean,
unless you're a supervisor.
It's hard to do shutdowns whenyou're a supervisor.

(56:21):
It's hard to do shutdowns whenyou're in your 30s.
So that's the only kind ofadvice I'd give yeah.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
No, I think, even learning I learned that pretty
quick that you know, if you wantto, I think to have longevity,
I don't necessarily see myselfdoing shutdowns forever,
Although we all know that 60year old who still does
shutdowns.

Speaker 1 (56:44):
You're like wow, you're like crazy, it's yeah, I
remember.

Speaker 2 (56:48):
I'll never forget this fella.
I worked with this fella namedCarmen and he was 70.
And this guy worked like harderthan anybody I've ever seen in
my life.
It's like just non-stop go, go,go, go, go, go go just hard and
you think you work hard untilyou see a guy like that yeah
exactly never mind to see amachine like that yeah, I know

(57:13):
those.

Speaker 1 (57:14):
They do.
It happens to me.
I remember trying to carry Iwent so before my second
marriage.
I wanted to make some money forthe wedding, so I'm like I'll
pick up a shutdown.
That's an easy way to make somequick money.
I'm in s Saskatchewan.
There's mines everywhere.
I'd done lots of mines in myyounger life so I threw my name
in at the iron workers.
I'm like, hey, can I just go inon a permit?
They still remembered me.
They're like yeah, man we'llsend you out.

(57:38):
Yeah, okay, when do you want tostart?
Whenever Monday you're goingout.
So I agree on mine.
I was like, okay, I hadn't doneit like in 10 years.
Man, they knew who I was.
At that time I was alreadyteaching.
So I'm the teacher that had thesummer off that came to do a
shutdown.
So they're like, oh, theteacher maxes back.
So you know, ride me a bit.
And I was like like, oh, man, Istill got the skills, don't

(58:04):
worry about it.
First job was hauling cable.
Really, guys, you're gonna makeme haul the cable.
We got all these 17 year oldkids standing around and you're
gonna make the 37 year old guywho hasn't done a shutdown in 10
years haul 180 pounds of cablesup 13 flights.
Thank you, thank you very much.
Yeah, that's that's how it goes.
That's how it goes.
But let me tell you, I lostlike 20 pounds by the end of my
stint and I got back and I fitmy suit perfectly.

(58:25):
So I was in great shape afterthat.
It's like that is the bestworkout plan ever.

Speaker 2 (58:35):
I think shutdown work has to be next to tank work at
least in my experience, has tobe some of the most physically
challenging work, sometimes justbecause of the spots you end up
getting into and not walking.

Speaker 1 (58:46):
Yeah, it can really end up, and down walking, not
side to side, up and down.
Right yeah, Stairs and stairsand stairs and stairs.
Tanks is just hot and theapparatus you got to wear, right
when you're sitting in 70degrees and you're breathing
your own farts that's not fun,right like it's.

Speaker 2 (59:07):
We have a saying like tanks, but no tanks, and that's
kind of how some guys thinkabout tanks.
I personally, to be honest withyou, I'm a bit of a sicko.

Speaker 1 (59:16):
I absolutely love tanks and I would go back the
quietness and the solitude youjust know what you're doing
every day.

Speaker 2 (59:23):
You just show up and you do the work.
And that's what I enjoyed aboutit the most, but I also do
enjoy the shutdown work.
I mean, you're doing somethingdifferent every day, so that's
cool too.
You're learning new stuff allthe time, yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:37):
Awesome, man.
Well, let's wrap up theinterview here.
I want to ask you just one lastquestion.
You know, for the people thatare thinking about Boilermakers
and the Boilermakers are a greatunion my dad was a Boilermaker
for forever.
I have his tickets right in mydrawer here.
Actually, I keep all histickets because my dad had a
pile of them and I just like tolook at them sometimes.

Speaker 2 (59:56):
Was he a welder?
He was a welder.
Yeah, he was a welder boilermaker Cool.

Speaker 1 (01:00:01):
So for the young people that want to get into
this trade, first of all, thecaveat is you can't just walk
into any boiler maker all andexpect a job.
It doesn't work that way.
You have to apply formembership, you kind of have to
have a backer.
There has to be kind of a wayin.
And they protect their numberson purpose, for real and for

(01:00:23):
real good reasons too, becausethey want to ensure that they
have enough work for all theirmembers, and that's great.
But there's other opportunitiesto get into the field.
Right, you can take courseslike pressure piping courses.
You can learn to pressure pipeon your own, really like, if you
wanted to.
There's lots of ways to get inthere.
From your point of view, nowthat you kind of are a red seal,

(01:00:44):
you're a journey person, you're, you're already destined to be
a mentor and a leader.
What do you say to anyone thatcomes up to you say, hey, man, I
want to get into this.
What do I do?

Speaker 2 (01:00:54):
I think I think this the first question I would ask
would be like why?
And not to be like negative andsay like, yeah, why would you
want to do this?
That's not what I'm getting at.
I'm saying well, let's playthis scenario.

Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
I like I like this, let's play.
We'll do a couple back andforth, all right, sure?
Hey, gabe, I'd really like toget into this, and you say why?
And I say because I want tomake fast money I would say that
that's probably the wrongreason.

Speaker 2 (01:01:21):
Yeah, I agree.
I agree Because it's too hardto work your way up to where
you're a journeyman, a Red Sealbead welder, and go through the
years of apprenticeship just todo it, because it's not going to
be money like that, right, it'sgoing to be slow.

(01:01:44):
Your pay rate increases ideallyyear over year if you're
getting your hours in and you'regoing to school every year.
Ideally, your pay rate increasesevery year, but it's a slow
build I mean I would say I'mstill very much in the building
stages of my career.
I'm nowhere near established tothe point where I would feel

(01:02:05):
like I've made it Right.
Yeah, so I think if somebody wascoming to me saying like, I
want to get into it because Iwant to make fast money, I would
say that's probably the wrongreason.
If you come to me and say Iwant to be a great pipe welder,
I want to be a great tradesman,I want to travel, I want to
experience what it's like towork in the field, I would say

(01:02:26):
yes, come join the boilermakersfor sure but if it was someone
that was coming up to say hey,gabe, I really like to work with
my hands, but I'm really notinto school, like I've just
never been able to, to do that.

Speaker 1 (01:02:38):
But you know, like I like tinkering around with stuff
, would I have a spot with theboiler makers or in your trade?

Speaker 2 (01:02:46):
I think as long as you have the work ethic and the
desire to learn, absolutely.
But I think it is and I sharedthis misconception.
It's probably a bit of amisconception that you are going
to join any trade and school isjust a non-factor.
I firmly believe that a school,that going to school for a

(01:03:10):
trade is still really difficult,and I definitely had that
misconception that I was like no, like this will be easy, like a
little bit for sure yeah and itis still really difficult to go
to school for a trade.
You have a lot to learn in alittle bit for sure.
Yeah, and it is still reallydifficult to go to school for a
trade.
You have a lot to learn in ashort amount of time well, and
it's uh, it's, it's uh, theseare real diplomas right we're

(01:03:32):
not.

Speaker 1 (01:03:32):
We're not bs, we're not just a fake thing.
Um, trade school is school andthere's expectations and
homework and studying and um, um.
But I will say this, and thisis the big difference between
any university trade schools anytrade school doesn't matter if
it's through a union ornon-union.
They offer a lot of support foryou If you have trouble with

(01:03:57):
reading, if you have troublewith ADHD, if you have trouble
with sitting down, any of thesethings, whatever it is, they'll
help you because at the end ofthe day we need trades people to
build stuff.
So if school's your your hang up, we'll help you with school and
we're not going to make iteasier for you, like it's.
We're not dumbing it down, butwe're just going to help you get

(01:04:18):
to the level where you can.
You can crush it right.

Speaker 2 (01:04:21):
Yeah, give you every tool that you can to succeed and
I I think state did it.
I'll give them a lot of credit.

Speaker 1 (01:04:29):
I was given every opportunity possible to succeed
at school yeah, and you know wesee it time and time again where
most of the time, where peoplefeel like their learning
disability is the reason they'renot doing well.
That's not the reason you'renot doing well.
We all have disabilities of ourown kind.

(01:04:51):
The reason you're not doingwell and this is a self-mirror
check for everyone listening isyou.
It's your self-confidence, it'syour self-worth, your
self-confidence, it's yourself-worth.
That's what's holding you back.
Because I've seen some peoplein my life who are incredibly
intelligent and gifted failmiserably because they didn't
put the work in.
And then I've seen people withgrade three educations own

(01:05:14):
billion dollar companies becausethey just don't give up, right.
So you find yourself on thatscale, saying you don't like to
learn or you're not good atlearning.
It's not really an excuse.
Figure it out.
Someone will help you figure itout.
There's people that will helpyou figure it out.
Get on it.

Speaker 2 (01:05:30):
Absolutely.
I think if I could say anythingtoo and this isn't to brag, but
I received an award in my lastyear of school for being the top
apprentice in welding for thecraw.
When I started welding I wasabsolutely terrible.
So if somebody who hadabsolutely no natural aptitude

(01:05:51):
towards it can reach the pointof being named top apprentice in
the province.
That tells you like, trust me,I'm not special by any means.
It's just work.
It's just putting in the time,putting in the work.

Speaker 1 (01:06:08):
Yeah, I just did a podcast this morning and we
talked about that.
You can't train ambition.
You can train a lot of things.
You can train a lot, and thiscomes back to sports and music
and all these other skills too.
The desire is the fire.
That's number one.
You don't got that fire, thenit doesn't really matter what
you pick.

(01:06:28):
You're not going to, you're notgoing to do.
Well, you got to have that firein you to, to, to do it, to do
well and to ask the questions,and and get past your shyness
and your fear to be like yo, Isuck.

Speaker 4 (01:06:41):
Help me Right Then and then things get way easier
once you get there right.

Speaker 1 (01:06:48):
Yeah, absolutely awesome man.
Well, I can't wait to see youin your career over the next 20
years.
I'm always in and aroundalberta and I'm always doing
work with the boiler makers andother stuff.
Cwb, you know where to find me,um, but I've loved this
interview.
I think you got lots of greatadvice and stories for young
people and people looking to getin the trades.
How do people find you?
Are you on social media oranything?

(01:07:09):
If anyone's got a question foryou or your haul?

Speaker 2 (01:07:13):
Yeah, you can.
If you're interested in gettinginvolved with Boilermakers,
just look us up online atBoilermakers146.
You typed that into google andhop on our website.
All our contacts are listedthere.
Uh, and as for myselfpersonally, I'm on facebook.
If you look me up just by myname, it should come up there.
Um yeah, that's pretty much allI got awesome man.

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
Any shout outs for anybody you want to say hi to.

Speaker 2 (01:07:43):
I guess just shout out to everyone.
That's kind of helped me alongmy journey.
You know who you are.
I'm really happy we had thischat, max, this was great
awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:07:53):
Well, thanks for coming on the show, man.
I really enjoyed it.
Awesome thanks, man, and forall the people that keep
supporting this amazing show andmy staff and the crew you know,
make sure you download, watch,listen, like all our episodes.
We do have a new fan mailfeature on our Buzzsprout.
If you want to send in messagesto us, we're down.
If you have questions, we lovefielding questions.

(01:08:15):
I reply to every DM, trust me.
I set time aside to answer allthe DMs I get because it's about
community, it's aboutsupporting the industry and we
want to make sure that we'redoing the best thing we can here
at CWB.
And remember, at the end of theday, we're a not-for-profit.
All the money we make goes backinto you, the listeners, people
out there in the industry, andtry to make it better for all of
us.
So keep supporting us.

(01:08:37):
We'll keep being there, checkout our podcasts and if you
catch us live somewhere, makesure you don't miss us.
But until then, I'll catch youat the next episode, we hope you
enjoy the show.

Speaker 3 (01:08:59):
You've been listening to the CWB Association Welding
Podcast with Max Serrano.
If you enjoyed what you heardtoday, rate our podcast and
visit us at cwbassociationorg tolearn more.
Feel free to contact us if youhave any questions or
suggestions on what you'd liketo learn about in the future.
Produced by the CWB Group andpresented by Max Serrano, this
podcast serves to educate andconnect the welding community.

(01:09:21):
Please subscribe and thank youfor listening.