July 2, 2025 • 51 mins
The CWB Association had the privilege to attend the Skills Canada New Brunswick Provincial Competition in Saint John, NB. Join us as we bring you special episodes recorded in person to advocate for careers in skilled trades and technology across the country.
What began as a one-year contract in marketing has evolved into a nine-year journey that's seen Skills New Brunswick grow from reaching 200 students annually to engaging over 20,000. Behind this remarkable transformation lies Courtney's personal discovery and a team of five full-time staff and 80-100 volunteers. Skills NB has created Atlantic Canada's largest skills event, featuring everything from welding to hairstyling.
Check out: https://www.skillscanadanb.com/
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There is no better time to be a member! The CWB Association membership is new, improved and focused on you. We offer a FREE membership with a full suite of benefits to build your career, stay informed, and support the Canadian welding industry. https://www.cwbgroup.org/association/become-a-member
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
All right, I can check.
Check, I'm good.
So I'm Max Duran.
Max Duran, cwb AssociationWelding Podcast, pod pod podcast
.
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Happy welding.
Hello and welcome to anotheredition of the CWB Association
podcast.
My name is Max Charon and, asalways, I'm out there trying to
(01:07):
find the coolest peoples in theworld.
Courtney Donovan is one ofthose coolest peoples in the
world.
We are here in beautiful StJohn, new Brunswick, for Skills
Atlantic and Skills NewBrunswick.
Courtney, how you doing.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Good, how are you Max ?
Speaker 1 (01:21):
I'm doing fantastic.
I am very happy to be here.
I am so happy that youbasically forced me to come out
here.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
I did, I did.
It was just time Like I need tobring the West out East.
I need you all to know howamazing it is out here.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Well and, to be honest, the CWB group has had a
lot of success and investment inNew Brunswick, and so it is apt
that we are here to uh, youknow, revel in the fruits of our
investment yeah, and we havethe best welder well, I um they
are wonderful, we're wonderful.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
I'm biased, we know I'm biased, I am also biased.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
So, courtney, you are the executive director for
skills new brunswick.
Yeah, congratulations.
When I first met you, you didnot have that job.
No, I, I started in uh as.
So, courtney, you are theexecutive director for Skills
New Brunswick.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
I am Congratulations, thank you.
When I first met you.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
You did not have that job.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
No, I started as a marketing and event coordinator
for.
Skills Canada, new Brunswick,and I was supposed to be here
for one year.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
And.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
That was nine years ago.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
And then what happened?
Speaker 2 (02:19):
I just I loved it.
I came in on a one-yearcontract.
I was supposed to be marketingcommunications.
My background is definitelysports.
You know did the wholeuniversity.
I did do my second degree at acommunity college in Ontario and
then kind of started on thesports route and it was great.
And then, you know, there wasthis random one-year contract
(02:41):
with Skills Canada, newBrunswick, and my mother had
been involved since about 2009,I think at the time, in Skills,
in Skills.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
In what capacity?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
She is the National Technical Committee member for
hairstyling, oh.
I had no idea, yeah, so mymother is a diehard Skills you
know woman and she would comehome every year and talk about
Skills and myself and my father,who's a welder, would kind of
go.
That's great.
You enjoy that.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
We don't know what you're talking about, but you
love it, and your dad'sgeneration wouldn't have known
nothing about skills, right?
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Nothing, nothing.
And he was actually.
He's a teacher at one of thecolleges here in New Brunswick,
so just to tie it all in.
But so I said, you know, maybeI'll take a break from the sport
world.
Apply for this.
You know they're hosting anational competition in New
Brunswick Sounds kind ofexciting and you know, you get
rolling and you're learningabout the trades and I have come
(03:35):
from an entire family of tradespeople and they had kept all of
it a secret, All of it a secret.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
So for the first time Was it to to be like you need
to go to university and escapethis trades world like a little
bit very common thing?
Speaker 2 (03:47):
yeah so a little bit of that, a little bit of just
their own stigma about their owncareers, right you've.
They've heard for years thattheir careers don't matter, or
less important than when I wasgoing through school.
I had, you know, exceptionalmarks, so that was very much
let's go to university.
And that is the route I tookand it was great.
But then again I come back andfind the trade world, and now
(04:08):
I'm working with my dad, who's awelder by trade, and now
teaching a welding inspectorprogram, and my uncle, who's you
know HVAC technician, been withthe same company for 40 years,
and my cousin, who's anautomotive, and so now I'm
getting in their world a littlebit.
(04:37):
And then, and so now I'm gettingin their world a little bit and
and then we're setting up forthe national.
And all of a sudden we startsetting up for a national and it
ever seen and immediately Ican't leave.
How do I stay here and how dowe take what we have and then
grow it so that more NewBrunswickers get to experience?
Speaker 1 (04:52):
this, so you were already thinking about the long
game.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Oh yeah, oh yeah, like it happened very quick.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
And what year was this?
Speaker 2 (04:58):
then that was 2016.
2016.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Okay 2016.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
And yeah, so I was only supposed to be here a
minute and as soon as nationalshappened, I knew I wasn't
leaving.
So how do I stay on as amarketing event coordinator past
, you know, this one year?
Speaker 1 (05:14):
And so, and was it a one year term?
Cause you were covering a leaveor something, or no or was it
just like one years for fun?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
So New Brunswick at that time only had a one-man
operation, so we maybe reachedabout 200 students at that time
purely through competitions.
There was no programming, notri-trades, but a lot of that
was part of what was going oneducationally here in New
Brunswick.
So at that time and previous tothat, a lot of the shops have
been pulled from all the highschools in the province.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yeah, so that a lot of the shops have been pulled
from all the high schools in theprovince.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Yeah, so that had a ripple effect.
So you know, as theorganization was starting to
form in 1998, that's when weestablished here in New
Brunswick the shops were comingout of the schools, so there
wasn't the same, maybe,excitement tie in that some of
the other provinces had.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
It felt like it was almost dying or something A
little bit.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
You know we were really.
New Brunswick was focused somuch on technology then.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
And.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
I teased the future and going to replace everything.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
We both know that hasn't happened and not going to
happen and never going tohappen.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
It's not going to happen, There'll be a lot of
things replaced by AI but weneed our trades people.
That's right um.
So again, it was just kind ofthe natural progression of that
and seeing the importance of allthese jobs and, and not having
been exposed to any of thismyself, and how do I change this
for every other new brunswicker?
Speaker 1 (06:34):
yeah moving forward so you do the one year yeah,
sorry, I get distracted it comesup.
No, my job is to keep you ontrack.
I got this.
Appreciate you yeah so you getto the end of the one year and
they say you're up, yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
So sorry it was.
It was one year.
I immediately started workingon.
I'm not leaving, we're going togrow this.
So again, provincial governmentwas great they said sure we can
continue on with, you know thisgrant.
And then I stayed in thatposition for, I want to say,
three and a half years, and thenI eventually moved into the
executive director role 2020?
(07:09):
.
End of 2019.
So you know, first time comingaround, setting up provincial
competitions as executivedirector and get hit with the
pandemic.
So that's a, you know, funexperience a few months in.
But it was great and again tomove into that role and then
continue to grow it.
From what was a one-man showfor the first 20 years, we now
(07:33):
have five women that run thisshow full time.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
The five-woman show.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
It is a five-woman show.
We have a full 16 board ofdirectors that are full of
education industry and everyindustry.
Um, because that's so importantto us, right?
You know what are we educatingthese?
People for it's.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
It's to go to industry so for you to
understand skills kind of at amore grassroots level, then get
into it, find a passion for it.
You know very quickly, climb ashort ladder right and get to
the top of as ED.
What kind of learning curve didyou have?
Because it's not just welding,it's not just hairstyling.
(08:13):
You know which were the thingsyou had at home.
It's, you know, 40, some tradesand 82 vocations.
And you know how do you getyour head around all of it, or
do you even have to?
Is it just piece by piece, Likehow do you work it?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Little, piece by piece.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
I'm still learning.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
I'm still learning every day, and I think that's
part of what draws me to this,and the skills in the first
place.
You know, when I first startedbeing, I felt like I had been
left out of the trade world.
So I probably took a verydifferent approach.
Sort of FOMO.
I had so much FOMO, so much FOMO.
So, to be honest, when I firststarted, especially when I was
(08:51):
in the marketing role, as a wayto try and understand and learn
more, because we have suchincredible teachers here and
again, I'm sure every province,territory equally does,
especially in the skilled tradesand technology areas, but here
in New Brunswick, god love themall they brought me into their
(09:13):
shops.
I tried welding, I tried allthe different types of welding.
So again, nail learning what thevocabulary the equipment are
consumables, but also understandwhat our competitors are trying
to achieve.
Um, so then I would do the samein bricklaying.
I went into roofing shops, Iwent in.
You know I've laid brick, I'vedone some wiring.
So for me that was reallyimportant was to figure out that
(09:34):
hands-on and just even havethat connection, have the
connection, and also it'simportant to me that all the
instructors we work with knowthat they matter.
Their trade matters.
So to me that was a, you know,a time investment that was
really worth my time and itallowed me to appreciate what
they were doing more, what theywere trying to teach, but also,
(09:56):
again, the love for the tradeand and having a trades person
take that time to teach you thetrade.
There's nothing more pure thanthat.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
There is nothing more pure than that.
There is nothing more pure thanthat.
I get philosophical aboutwelding sometimes and you know
I'll have these deep moments ofthought and one time I thought
you know it's being a tradesperson is an agreement between,
basically, you and the earth.
Right, because we're taking theelements of this planet,
rearranging them in order tobuild right.
And what's more beautiful thanbuilding?
Right, because we're taking theelements of this planet,
(10:25):
rearranging them in order tobuild right.
And what's more beautiful thanbuilding right?
Whether it's building community, building lives, building homes
, building whatever.
We are literally taking thisearth that we've been given and
finding ways to take theelements of it to create things
for ourselves.
And I, you know, I posted thaton Facebook.
It's almost like you know, whatare you smoking?
It's like but and I posted thaton Facebook and someone was
(10:46):
like, what are you smoking?
But really it's something aboutthe trades that's so ingrained
in our societies.
I know that over the last fewyears, many of the skills
competitions in Canada haveincorporated a lot of indigenous
skills, and I was at the SkillsManitoba, skills Saskatchewan.
They had full indigenous skillscompetitions running.
I was at the skill skillsmanitoba, skills saskatchewan.
(11:06):
They had full indigenous skillscompetitions running
concurrently with skills, and itwas wonderful bead uh, ribbon
skirts, kayak paddle making,like indigenous skills and I
thought you know, like the thesepractical skills haven't
changed though right.
They're part of, like, our humanidentity right.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
No, I got deep there.
No, no, no, I am, I'm with youbecause, again.
I look at the trades.
I actually told Irving Oil, oneof our sponsors, again here at
the St John campus.
You can look over.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Irving is everywhere.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
And you can look overlook the beautiful refinery.
Lovely which she's probablylaughing at me again because I
continue to call it a beautifulrefinery.
Yeah, that's the lovely glow ofmoney.
But for me, I look at a placelike that and it's again the
appreciation of A.
How many tradespeople are there, hundreds, the skill, the hours
(12:00):
it takes to have that level thepassion that they all have.
You know, I can't help but lookat that place and genuinely
think that is the most beautifulplace because, of that Right
and just understanding what thatrefinery produces and what that
means for you know doctors,lawyers, everyone that might not
(12:23):
know this trade world, but thatday-to-day can't happen without
these tradespeople and theirwork.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
They can't exist without that.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
First, no one can yeah you know our tradespeople
are responsible for our schools,our hospitals, our where we
live, the roads, the planes inthe air, our toilets our fridges
.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
It's quite literally everything right.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
And it's without those things, you know, we would
be quite literally cavemen.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Without our tradespeople.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
So, while there is that stigma, it's my job or what
I feel my job is is to helpchange that and help the general
public not only appreciatethese jobs but have the
education for A if they want toenter in them.
Yeah have the education for a ifthey want to enter in them, but
B, you know, if you want tobuild a house, buy a house.
Understanding the differencebetween a Red Seal carpenter and
(13:11):
somebody that's out doing it,and not saying that there's not
good in both, but again there isthat esteem for a Red Seal and
just like you would not, youknow, find a doctor on the side
of the street to operate on yourfoot.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Yeah, although they could, maybe, maybe they could
yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Maybe they do a good job, but you know, even again
understanding what a compulsorytrade is.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
And why?
Speaker 2 (13:32):
that's important and going and having that
information, even just again asa person on the street yeah, to
emphasize that with thosetradespeople and make sure that
when they're looking to you knowhire someone, that they know
who and what they're hiring.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
And they can trust it Right.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
And they know that those are credentials and
careers that matter just as muchas the university educated ones
.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Right Now, let's talk about what you studied.
What'd you go to university for?
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Oh, my God, my God, what a load of questions.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
So I came out of high school very high 90s.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
Some people are talking lawyer, doctor, talk
right.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Doctor.
I always thought I was going tobe a doctor, and then I get,
and again.
So let's start on the stigma.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
So here in New Brunswick you can't be educated.
So so heard that I took off toDalhousie University.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
Um, I don't think I was there a month and went oh,
this isn't science in highschool, why did they set me up
to want to be a doctor?
Um, so you know very quicklyyou realize biochem is not what
you want to do and also maybenot this route.
Uh, so then it's.
You know well, what can I takenext?
Because, again, we're soingrained with you have to go to
university and get a degree max.
I had no idea what I actuallywanted to do at the end the the
(14:56):
timeline, like none of that'sexplained.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
Um, so, anyways, that biochem degree quickly turned
to a psychology degree with witha minor in political science
another poli sci, ryan, was poliscience too.
Yeah, it's uh actually it'svery versatile yeah, well, I
love my philosophy education, Ilove it and again, because it
makes you think that's right.
So again the psychology.
(15:20):
I can dissect anything and notfreak out.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
I can, that's that's important, it is well, and even
the psychology.
You work with people day to day.
So, understanding the how, what, why of their thinking.
Yeah, I mean, it's just a niceskill, I guess.
But uh, so we finished this.
You know, my parents in thetrades are just like good for
you Um now.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
You want to be an agent.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
No, but work in sports.
So when I finished what was?
Speaker 1 (15:55):
your sport, because you've always been sporty since
I've known you Basketball.
Basketball Okay.
Speaker 2 (15:59):
Basketball, was it?
So did the whole Canada Gamesthing, Did the you know
provincial team going tonationals a bunch of times and
it was fabulous.
But that's kind of thecrossover with skills.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
That's where I was leading with all, and that's
where I was leading with all andthe sports and I think that's
probably why, when I got here, Iappreciated it that much more
um, but I'll go back to theother thing.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
So when did that degree uh worked for the
senators?
A little bit um did some soccerCanada stuff.
Came back to New Brunswick tostart the or help start the uh
National Basketball League ofCanada and more specifically the
Monk of the Miracles at thetime, um and again, it was great
.
But then, when this came, Ithink that's probably how I fell
in love.
(16:38):
So quick is you see the ties tosports and again sports matter
so much, and they have a placeand they teach you so many life
skills, but then this is able togive you that, but then also
set you up for your future alittle bit.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
Yeah, have the longevity that sports camp offer
Right.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
I mean, how many people in minor hockey actually
end up in the NHL Right?
Or right in in, um, not thatthey shouldn't try, that's.
That's definitely not what I'msaying, but it's.
You know, we're able to offerstudents a chance to come here,
um, and have that same kind ofCanada game type experience, but
A they can do it every year.
It's not every four years, sowe're not worried about missing
something.
(17:15):
You can come here, you compete,you could try and go inly and
again, this is helping youfigure out what you want to do
with your future Right andpreparing you for the inevitable
competitions you will be inyour career.
A hundred percent.
I mean when they're here todaythey're practicing skills that
they're going to do when they'reout on the job site right,
(17:36):
absolutely.
Under that pressure, under thetime of it all, and from there
when they go into industry.
You know we had so many peopleI'll pick on welding but we had
so many people start trainingthis year because they wanted
twin provincials.
Well then you know, I see you,or I hear that you, as a welder,
so now I'm training, so we, itnaturally has all these people
(18:00):
doing all this extra work andthen that gets around the shop
and I mean I say the unlikesports, they're training for
competition, they're literallymaking themselves a more
employable yeah but they'reraising the bar, it's, it's
(18:21):
raising the excellence, not onlyhere but in the shop right and
the community and in thecommunity and having those
people you know um like.
We have some alumni who have wonmultiple medals now and they
are kind of our lebron james,our c Crosby you know, whatever
I call them my, most winningest.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
I've made up an entire word.
It's great.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
But how do we take those people that, again, are so
responsible for the safety ofeverything?
And day to day and the building, and give them those same
platforms and recognition.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
How do they get glorified?
Or you know, we put a lot ofpeople in society on pedestals
that perhaps shouldn't be onpedestals.
And then you know, like theidolatry of TV or YouTube or
whatever, and meanwhile we havepeople that are actual amazing
people that are just crushing itand doing amazing things and
(19:12):
they're not in the limelight.
I mean, a lot of the reason Ihave this podcast is to try to
expose these stories of likethere's amazing people in your
communities that are doingthings that are making all of
our lives better.
Um, and no one knows about it.
like they're just like they'rejust doing it just because,
right, just because well, and Iknow you talked to andrew clark
while you've been here in NewBrunswick and he's, you know,
(19:34):
one of our Super gung ho.
Super gung ho.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
The amount of welding camps that man has run and, and
, and no one's making him do itRight.
You know, we, we and everyprovince has that.
But that's the beautiful part.
You need those champions, youdo.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
And it's Like, and he's so wonderful, he's been
coming to me since, I think,2017.
I believe it Right, because Ithink I spoke at a conference
somewhere and he came up to meright after.
He's like, I'm a high schoolteacher in this program and I
was like, oh, like, okay, likeyou are on this, yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
So it's.
It's amazing too, I think, youknow, as we put together these
competitions, as we dotriathletes, as whatever we do,
it's nice that we have thoseteachers and that there's more
and more all the time, becausethey're also looking for the
opportunity, right?
No?
(20:31):
one wants to work in a careerwhere you feel like you don't
matter, Right?
So again to me, what the greatthing about all of this and
being involved in this, whetheryou're a teacher, student,
industry, competitor, alumni,you coming again from the other
end of the country, it's the onetime everyone gets celebrated.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Right For the jobs that they do behind the closed
doors that no one ever gets tosee.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Well, that's my role is to help amplify that Right
and then to push that out there,even just having, you know, the
kids have watched for the lastthree days, walking through this
last door here, right by wherewe're set up which was pretty
cool spot and there's buses ofkids getting dropped off and
going for their tours andthey're walking in and watching
(21:15):
me interview people.
They're immediately interested,they're like what's happening,
what's going on?
There's cameras, there's lights, you know, and I think that
that's good for them to see,because we see that with sports,
we see the hockey players getput under the lights and get
interviewed.
We see it happen with art.
We see it happen with so manythings.
We don't see it happen with thetrades, and it should be.
You know like.
It's almost like you know, whenbill puts the final weld on
(21:37):
that bridge that goes somewhere,they should like have a
ceremony and be like hooray,bill, you finished the job.
You know like, because it'sactually important for society?
Speaker 2 (21:46):
yes, it is, and I you know when we do get on to the
international competitions andoutworld skills.
It is nice to see that thereyeah but I think we still need
to work more to do that here andand not again necessarily new
brunswick.
But as a country yeah and um,again not to be problematic, but
for better or worse, I think,things like tariffs being in the
(22:08):
news every day people thataren't thinking about trades are
now being more aware for betteror worse.
Like those conversations arestill bringing things and
industries that the generalpublic might not typically think
about to the forefront.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
I've had lots of friends in the last few weeks,
probably know me my whole lifeand have no idea what I do.
But be like Are these tariffsaffecting your industry?
I was like yes, yes, very much,yeah, a lot.
Speaker 2 (22:32):
And so again, that's what I mean, like not to be
problematic and bring that up,but it's for better or worse.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
It's good to have the communication.
Yes, yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
And again, it's at least starting a conversation.
So, like we said those, peoplethat might not be familiar with
the trades know what's going on.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
They're at least asking the the question yeah, no
, that's great, right.
And I was bringing up youruniversity earlier and your
sports and your backgroundbecause, as I've learned in this
trade, especially once I becameinvolved with skills and then
like the competitive side of it,um, with teaching, I really
started to see some of theseparallel, you know, connections.
Sports is one of them.
The skills that aretransferable from sports into
the trades is obvious once yousee it.
(23:14):
It's like you know the desireto better yourself, the
self-motivation, because at theend of the day, you're not a
good athlete.
If someone needs to motivateyou, you need to motivate
yourself, or else you're justnot going to be at a high level.
And it's the same with weldingor any of the skill trades.
It's not about your bossyelling at you that you need to
do it better.
You want to do it better andthat's and that's that right it
(23:36):
is.
And you will seek informationand what you need to do these
things better.
Now, with college, this issomething that I'm trying to
connect.
For a lot of people there'salmost like a, a black or white
scenario there, like oh, youneed to go to college or you
need to pick the trades, likeit's one or the other.
You started in college, wentthrough a number of various
routes and ended up working in atrades adjacent organization.
(23:59):
I went to university a fewtimes for a number of different
things, but I still was weldingthe whole time.
And you're like why would youbother going to university if
you're a welder?
I'm like why does it have to bea choice?
If anything, welding affordedme the ability to go to
university with no pressure?
(24:21):
Because now I can just learnfor my own betterment.
I want to start a business.
Well, I can go pick up acommunity college course on
running a business at night,because I can just pay for it
because I have a job right, LikeI mean fabulous, and the
ability to go back and forth,and that's where I see the
future.
I see the future where you'rein school and you're that 99%
(24:43):
kid who just got such greatmarks and they put everything in
front of you and say, oh, youwant to be an engineer?
Cool, why don't you go intofabrication?
First get your Red Seal FAB,then transition into university,
get your degree in materialsengineering and as a combination
of those two, you are going tobe cut throat killer.
(25:05):
That's going to be an amazingrole because you have such a
breadth of understanding that Isee that cross-training to be so
important it is, and even justthe conversation.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
not that I hate the university versus college thing,
but I think it's so much moreimportant if we can find or
direct students to their passion.
What are you passionate about?
What makes you happy?
Because in 2025, I am surethere's a job somewhere that
ties to that right, yeah, yeah,or let's or create it.
Or create it right, Becausethat world now is so easy.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Like GoDaddy, I have a website in 10 minutes and I
can go register a business in$75.
Right.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
Like Right.
So what have?
Um, just to your point, and Ilove your story.
We we had an alumni last yearhe was our post automotive
competitor, so he to your pointyeah came to the college, took
his pre-employment uh,pre-apprentice, you know,
automotive course um, he endedup winning the provincial
(26:04):
competition with us last year,came with us to nationals and we
just loved him.
So, while we're there, you'relike grant, you're gonna, you
know, sign up, as obviously.
We'll see as you continue yourjourney.
He goes well, I am, but I'mactually signed up to take
business at the University ofOttawa next year.
So my plan is to go to Ottawatake my degree.
He goes.
I'm going to actually sign upas an apprentice there, and when
(26:27):
I'm not in school I'm going tocontinue to get my hours.
And he said my plan is tofinish my you know Red Seal
concurrently to my degree.
And he said then, when I finishI can open a shop.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
Yeah, and I'm sitting there.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Exactly so smart I'm sitting there.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
Wow.
You know you're 19 years old Tohave that planned and sorted.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
I was planning on gas money at 19, like that's my
plan yeah and and again.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
On to your point.
I'm fairly certain.
Looking back, what mostly tookme to university I did was
basketball yeah how much was Ireally worried, or focused on
the degree or what I was?
Speaker 1 (27:07):
no, it was just the means.
Yeah, I just want to playbasketball.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
I wasn't done and and we see that a lot with athletes
they go on university becausethey're not done with that and
then they kind of, you know, dowhatever they're going to do,
and we do see a lot of them backat college after it's funny, my
son went through that he was avery, very good football player,
captain of the football team,played center.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
They won provincials.
Finished high school he hestruggled with school.
He never really liked theacademic side of school but he
loved the sports and thecamaraderie he had a.
He played football for a longtime and had won a few
championships throughout hiscareer.
And it came to the concept, theconversations of university and
it was like, well, you know,with your football career, you
(27:47):
can get into university, noproblem, right.
But he turned it down, turnedit down.
He was like I don't like school, why would I do that?
It's like, well, if you don'tgo to school, you're not going
to get to play football.
And it's like, well, then Idon't play football because I'm
not going to just do one and beunhappy, put myself through this
trauma.
Basically, yes.
For this.
And now he's working at aconstruction company and he's
(28:10):
perfectly happy and he coaches.
Now right, Because he can justdo that on the other side and
still maintain his connection tothe sport.
And now he's making moneybecause he would have hated
universities so much.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
But even that right, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
That's I.
Just if we can talk to kidsabout what are you passionate
about.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
What do?
Speaker 2 (28:31):
you want to do?
What do you want to do?
How do you like to learn you?
Know, again like we.
I don't want to talk about iton a moving end, but we have a
young lady here today who youknow.
She contacted us out of theblue to start running a program
for her at her high school.
But when she first reached outit was, you know, I have ADHD
and as soon as I got in the shopand got my hands busy, my mind
(28:52):
just completely shut off.
Yeah, and you know that's such abeautiful thing to be able to
offer someone.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
I think that a lot of people in the trades migrated
towards them because of thingsthey didn't know.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Probably In terms of their neurodivergence.
But if you know how do how donot we promote that more, but
just give more people theopportunity.
Give the space, yeah not wepromote that more, but just give
more people the opportunity tofigure that out for themselves.
Right, rather than a guidance?
Counselor, teacher or parentjust say you know, oh, you seem
smart in this, or you see, thisis what you should do.
Why don't we just ask them?
Speaker 1 (29:25):
yeah, we ask them more questions.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
What makes you happy?
Right like you're choosing todo this the rest of your life.
What makes you happy?
Do you like working with yourhands?
Speaker 1 (29:33):
Do you want to sit at a?
Speaker 2 (29:34):
computer.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Do you like being outside, do you?
Like to eat the outside Right,right, like I mean.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
These things matter, they do, and it's, and I think
again too, that will help notonly the industry, but we're
going to get them younger,because the average Asian
apprentice right now in theprovince is 29.
Right, it's a little older.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
When I first started as an old man.
That's a young number, but Iknow what you mean, Right?
Speaker 2 (30:02):
But even that number has changed nationally.
I think when I started andagain don't hold me to this, but
when I started I want to saynationally it was 24 and now
it's 27.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
I want to say nationally.
It was 24 and now it's 27.
Well, we know about the agingpopulation of the tradespeople.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
So it's you know how do we just give them the
education or make sure it'savailable to them and they know
the pathways.
And to me, this is what skillsis all about.
Right, I don't here in NewBrunswick and we have our
Anglophone and Francophoneschool section or Department of
Education.
Then you have your privateschools.
You know the number of studentsbeing homeschooled is always
(30:35):
varies.
The great thing about skills iswe're open to everyone.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Yeah, everyone's welcome.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
Everyone is welcome.
You know, even if you're not intraining, you're not in
education, still come learn.
And it's fabulous because youcan come here, you can walk
through colleges, you can seethe shops, you can meet the
instructors, but you're alsomeeting, you know, your
apprenticeship officer and theycan talk to you about what
blocks are really like, and thenyou can also go and meet you
(31:02):
know two dozen industry that youcould potentially work at, and
not only talk to HR, but you'retalking to people that are
actually doing that job for them.
Right, and that's so beautiful.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
It is.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
To be able to get that information.
In one space and have thoseconversations.
I still feel truly blessed thatthis is my job.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
You're so authentic Makes me mad, that's why we get
along no Max.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Why do we get along All?
Speaker 1 (31:33):
right?
Well, we have blown past ourcommercial break.
So sorry so we're going to haveto stop now for a quick moment
from our advertisers, which welove.
Thank you for sponsoring theshow.
So we're going to be right backhere with Courtney Donovan, the
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And we are back here on the CWBAssociation podcast.
I am Max Duran.
I'm here in New Brunswick withCourtney Donovan, all right.
(33:27):
So right before the break wewere talking about, you know,
obviously, the aspects of skillsthat are related to community,
the job, the jobs, you know,sustaining the people,
supporting people.
But let's talk more now aboutspecifically this skills
competition.
So what's been happening theselast two days?
How many people are here whocame to see it?
(33:48):
Walk me through this.
I'm sure you've been planningthis for months and months and
months and months as the ed here.
So what went down?
What's happening?
Speaker 2 (33:58):
yeah, so, um, this is the first time we've ever had a
two-day event in the middle ofthe week, um, and it was a huge
success, very exciting about it.
So the first day we had 16post-secondary competitions.
So that was the majority ofthem.
I won't say all of them, we arerestricted to you know what
equipment is at what college.
So there are a handful that arehappening elsewhere in the
(34:20):
province, but we had 16 runyesterday and then 11 secondary
high school competitions rantoday.
Throughout the both days wewere busing in about 5,000
students and to view not onlythe competition, but we had a
fabulous triad trade that wasmade up of college programs as
well as industry associations,unions, you name it from not
(34:44):
only across the province, but wedid have a few national
partners, like yourself whoagain, as New Brunswick
continues to grow, theirprovincial again are coming to
support.
As we know, these industriesexist in New Brunswick and
they're growing and they'restrong, so it's really nice to
see all that happen.
The first day we also had ayoung women's conference, so
(35:07):
that's our second one that we'vedone with the Women's Equality
Branch and it was fabulous.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
I heard there was a couple hundred people.
Yes, yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
And it you know, we the high school students that
come in.
They have the opportunity tovisit the tri-tree and see the
competitions, but then they alsoare able to go into breakout
rooms and talk to specificallyfemale mentors who are either
have a Red Seal or working inthat area.
Male mentors who are eitherhave a red seal or working in
that area and just talk to themabout what they went through is
again in the reality of workingin male dominated spaces male
dominated spaces in a provincethat has 4% women in trade.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
Yeah Right, we are one of the lower ones.
4% has come up a lot this weekduring my conversations.
It comes up a lot for me in mywork in general.
I mean mean I have a strong mom, a strong sister and a strong
daughter.
I don't know how we only havefour percent in this trade like
it's.
It's.
It's embarrassing, to be honest, like it needs to be correct it
does, it, it does and so thatagain, especially as a woman,
(36:07):
with a two-year-old daughter.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
That is extremely important to me.
How do we normalize that?
You know, I think we're makingmoves.
It was yesterday.
I will also say wrong trade,but it was fabulous that for the
first time ever the electricalinstallation Three women on the
podium.
Three women.
(36:29):
Yeah, I love it and I also likethere was a woman on the podium
and welding and steam Two womenon the podium.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
Three women, yeah, I love it, and I also like there
was a woman on the podium inwelding and steam fitter.
Two women on the podium.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Like, and I was up there and I missed that.
So the welding steam, fitterpipe, fitter carpentry, you know
there was at least one or twowomen in every single one.
So, having that and you know,even just being able to post
those pictures, you know whenother female students are
looking at that, you seeyourself.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
I mean that's part of it would be the same with
Disney, it's hard to see whatyou or be what you can't see.
That's the thing, right.
Speaker 2 (37:02):
And it is, and I don't know, I don't know how we
would do that.
Yeah, I've been trying to be aDisney princess for a long time
I was going to say Disney A longtime and I haven't quite
figured.
Speaker 1 (37:14):
I feel like it's kind of working out.
Speaker 2 (37:16):
It's kind of working out, kind of working out.
Speaker 1 (37:17):
Get some vibes, yeah you haven't seen me in a dress,
though, not yet.
Not yet See what happens toRegina, yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
But again, that's a piece of it.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
Yeah, it is.
You don't see yourself in thosetrades.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
So it's really important to me Like we have
women here in the province likeBella Hicks, who you know got in
the trade so young and has beensuch an incredible advocate.
Check out her podcast, yeah,she you know, she, when she was
still a student, would come withby 19, she's crushing it,
crushing it, oh my God,no-transcript.
(38:20):
They come in, they see herwelding.
Speaker 1 (38:22):
It's okay to be here, yep um, and we need more of
that we need more of that inevery space every space, right,
you know, because it's likewe're at the point where it's
all hands on deck, like fortrades, like it's just we need
so many people, um, that it'sfrom from not even uh, uh, a
side of separation or of ofexcluding people, just on the
(38:46):
side of we can't be pickyanymore, like we just need so
many workers like you, you know,you got blue hair, one eye and
six fingers.
I don't care, man, like let'sgo, we got work.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
And if you're driven right Like that is that's it.
We just need driven people whoare ready and willing to work.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
The jobs are there, the jobs are great.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
They're great paying jobs Again, whether you're in
New Brunswick or another part ofthe country, so why?
Speaker 1 (39:14):
St John.
You know, when you were lookingat the setup for this year's
provincial you I mean there'slots of beautiful places and
wonderful places in NewBrunswick.
What made you pick the city?
Speaker 2 (39:26):
So we have a three kind of school rotation for our
provincial competitions basedoff the size of campuses.
Yeah, we rotate through an NBCCMoncton campus and then NBCC St
John, and then next year we goback to CCNB Bathurst.
Speaker 1 (39:40):
Awesome, I've never been to that campus.
I've been to Moncton a fewtimes but I've never been to the
Bathurst and Matthew Roy is awelding instructor up there.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
Love him.
Speaker 1 (39:49):
He's amazing, yeah, so, and I met one of the other
instructors yesterday.
Speaker 2 (39:54):
Well, we'll have to get you up there.
Other instructors yesterday.
Well, we'll have to get you upthere.
So next year we'll go toBathurst and again there will
probably be at least 16competitions.
It is a huge campus.
Speaker 1 (40:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
We love it up there, so very excited to be back and
see what we can do.
But St John is great.
I mean you look out the windowsof the college and you see the
refinery.
This is a very industrial.
Speaker 1 (40:17):
I got a good tour yesterday, so I'm from Regina
very industrial city.
Right.
Right A lot of people don't seethe beauty in industry, but
they don't understand thatindustrial cities have money.
I mean, we have resources thatwe're thankful for.
We have a refinery in Regina.
We have a steel mill.
You know, you guys have a giantpaper mill.
Pulp mills you, for we have arefinery in regina.
(40:37):
We have a steel mill.
You know, you guys have a giantpaper mill pulp mills.
You got the refinery, which isthe largest north america, or
one of them, um, you and youhave mines not too far from here
.
You got all these things goingon.
One of the things that blew blewmy mind this week is the amount
of training programs newbrunswick has for the size you
know you got 14, 15 secondarystudents competing just in
welding, representing 14 highschools, all with individual
(41:00):
welding programs, and I wasshocked by that.
And then one of the instructorssays, well, that's only like 14
of the 30 that we have.
And I was like I don't know ifI got 30 high schools in all
saskatchewan that have weldingprograms.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
That's amazing and again on two sides francophone
and anglophone.
Speaker 1 (41:17):
That's impressive, it is, and again.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
We, I think, are one of the first provinces to have
high school bricklaying, butthat's again.
It's that industry involvement.
You know it's what are weeducating people for?
It is it's for the vacancies,it's for the shortage, and you
know industry needs to beinvolved with helping all that.
But it's for the shortage andyou know industry needs to be
(41:40):
involved with with helping allthat.
But it's um, yeah, my brainjust went on me.
Sorry, it's one of thosemoments to the end.
Oh yeah, no, I'm good, I'm goodnow for for you.
Speaker 1 (41:47):
You know, in terms of the future let's talk about.
You know, for the last couplequestions here, what's your
future state for skills?
You know you have a vision as aed of where you want to take
this.
So what do you see?
You know, next year, five years, um, so for one.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
When again I first started, we reached maybe about
200 students a year and nowwe're up to well over 20 000, so
, um for one, this event, uh,when we first started, a lot of
people said couldn't be possiblein new brunswick, and now,
within just a five-year rotation, this is now the largest event
in Atlantic Canada.
Speaker 3 (42:19):
So huge strides.
You're there, we love it.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
So, as far as the competition, you know, it's
great, it's going to continue togrow within itself, but then
it's, what more can we do?
Is there more tri-trades, andI'm not interested in putting
band-aids on things, max, whatare the problems?
Speaker 1 (42:37):
The stateable programs.
Speaker 2 (42:39):
How do we find out not only what the root problem
is, but again fix it from theroot, then put a band-aid on it?
So some of those projects I'mworking on a training center.
Speaker 1 (42:51):
Oh.
Speaker 2 (42:52):
Yeah, that would also have a bit of a tri-trade
aspect to it.
Speaker 1 (42:57):
Kind of like a makerspace idea, almost Kind of.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
And it's again, whether it's Team New Brunswick,
we're getting in there foradditional training or Monday to
Friday, helping, you know, fillsome gaps in the education
system and make sure thatthere's training with you know,
potentially people with redseals.
That's what we want to help anddo more of.
Speaker 3 (43:15):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (43:19):
So that's what we want to help and do more of.
So I say that's I say in theworks here in.
New Brunswick, or myaspirations for the next five
years.
So be in the loop.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
And what's your team look like here?
You started with just one, thentwo, and how many do you got
now?
Speaker 2 (43:29):
There's five of us full time, and then we also
again have our outside of that,our HR and CPAs.
Speaker 1 (43:36):
How many volunteers did you have in total out here
then?
Because there's a lot.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
I'd say we had at least 80 to 100 volunteers in
the last two days.
How are you?
Speaker 1 (43:45):
liking managing all this stuff.
Speaker 2 (43:46):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (43:47):
Yeah, do you sleep much.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
I mean, I don't even sleep.
I'll sleep on the weekend.
Speaker 1 (43:53):
No, you won't.
You have a two-year-old.
Speaker 2 (43:54):
I do have a two-year-old, so I won't take
that either.
No, but this is, this is allthat matters.
Like again, when you come andyou see the competitors and the
instructors and the industry andeveryone come together.
It's, it's the passion thatfuels it to do more for them,
because I understand and have anappreciation for what those
(44:16):
tradespeople do for us.
So, if I can go out of my way tothrow them a massive you know
celebration and be at acompetition and give them that
platform, then I'm going to makethat as big as I can for them.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
Well, I would have to say, knowing you for a number
of years now, is that youundersell your passion as being
one of the driving motivators.
You know, when you say we wentfrom 200 people to 20,000, we're
going to have to start callingthat the Courtney effect.
I'm okay with that, right, likethat's the Courtney effect,
because you know and it came upwith Ryan when we were talking
(44:50):
about it from the deputyminister of education you have a
passion.
You had a passion forbasketball, you had a passion
for traveling.
You had a passion for traveling.
You have a passion for your kid.
You don't do things passionless, right?
And you, in this job, I feellike that's the fit.
That's the fit that made thiswork so well.
When I heard you got the ED job,I was like, oh, that's a
(45:12):
no-brainer, because you werealready like within, like I
think, the first couple monthsof your job, you messaging me,
being like, hey, I need tofigure out some ideas.
I got some things.
What do you think about this?
And I was like, holy, you'rejust on the ball, like you're
ready to rock, and and that alsotranslates to this competition,
right?
So it's not just them givingback to you, you're, you're
(45:34):
feeding them as well yeah, butbut again, I, I feel lucky.
Speaker 2 (45:40):
I feel lucky to be here and this is, I think, yes,
this is more of an admin job, Iguess.
On the on the trade side.
I'm not on the tools, but thisis what I am trying to match
students to.
Right and know that you youdon't have to go one way or
another like I did.
Speaker 1 (45:58):
And like so many people did I mean I'm doing a
podcast.
I was a welder.
Like what's the road Right?
And that's one of my favoritethings to ask people Right.
Speaker 2 (46:06):
What are you doing now versus what was your dream
job as a kid?
Yeah, and why didn't you do it?
Yeah, and are you really happynow?
And?
And?
Are you really happy now?
And it's really interesting.
Speaker 1 (46:16):
Just the deep existential questions.
Speaker 2 (46:18):
Well, I mean, I don't mean, they're newbie but it's
more of a, not a study, but I'mjust interested.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
Just a self-awareness , yeah.
Speaker 2 (46:27):
And again, if we can start to craft that code, what
does that then mean for thefuture generations?
Right, All right yeah.
Speaker 1 (46:34):
All right, well, last question how do people get
involved with skills newbrunswick?
If they're in the province andthey're listening to this, how
do they get a hold of the team?
How do they volunteer?
How do they get involved?
Or, if you're a trades personand wants to help with training
or teaching or mentorship, whodo they reach out to?
Speaker 2 (46:52):
well they reach out to me.
I will take anyone personally.
I probably shouldn't, but I'mone of these only people that
still will pick up the phone andcold call everyone.
Speaker 1 (47:01):
Oh my God, I love it.
I never answer the phone.
I love talking to people.
My ADHD does not allow me toanswer the phone.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Oh no, I will.
Speaker 1 (47:07):
I'll even just look at it, wait for them to hang up
and then call them back, but Ijust can't answer it.
Speaker 2 (47:12):
No, they can reach out to us on social media.
We have a website and it's justskillscanadanbcom.
We're on Facebook, TikTok,Instagram, LinkedIn.
All the politicians, but wewere disconnected and that's
super important to me.
So we actually moved our officeto MVCC Moncton back in 2016
(47:43):
and, having that directconnection with the teachers,
the students have really allowedus to make this growth in a
pretty short period of time,with the pandemic in the middle.
Speaker 1 (47:52):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (47:53):
So I say I cannot thank the colleges and all their
staff for all their supportbecause, again, while I take
care of the lunches and then youknow, inviting you and the
t-shirts and the registration.
It really is those teacherexperts.
Speaker 1 (48:10):
A hundred percent that make these competitions.
And they're glowing too allweek.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
Oh, my god, like welding, I like.
I have to give a shout out tomr scott steen and adam stead
this morning because we had thewelding again has taken off and
it's huge and we had 13 spotsfor post-secondary as well
secondary, and then we had waitlists and this morning we had
two people from the waitlistshow up thinking they were in.
(48:38):
Yeah, hoping they were gettingin and and devastated when they
didn't think.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
And again, because the teachers and everyone are
here for the student theyfigured it out and all 15 people
were able like as soon as we'redone, I'm gonna go over there
and see how they did.
Speaker 2 (48:51):
Yeah, and I just to me, that's what it's all about.
Yeah, and I, I love, and thankyou so much for coming out here.
We've loved having you.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
And we'll see you in Shanghai.
No, we'll see you in Regina.
Speaker 2 (49:03):
You just wait.
Speaker 1 (49:06):
We're thinking about it too.
Speaker 2 (49:07):
We're, we got some.
Speaker 1 (49:08):
Let's talk.
Speaker 2 (49:08):
We're training a little bit for.
Regina so we'll see if we canintentionally put something.
We've, I will admit, any timein the past New Brunswick has
actually made Team Canada.
It was kind of by accident, wedidn't necessarily do it on
purpose?
Speaker 1 (49:23):
Yeah, not anymore.
Speaker 2 (49:24):
Yeah, not anymore, we're here to play.
We're here to play.
Speaker 1 (49:27):
Awesome.
Well, I hope to see many ofyour competitors in Regina,
because it'll be very, verylovely when Saskatchewan beats
them.
But that's fine, we'll uh butabout that, yeah, yeah we'll see
about that, I mean, but this isall fair in the spirit of
competitiveness always andalways a pleasure to see you,
courtney and always a pleasureto see you.
Thank you so much, all rightwell, thanks everyone for
watching and downloading andlistening to the podcast.
(49:49):
We uh make sure you check themall out from the skills can uh
skills, atlantic series and uh,you know, make sure that you get
back to us with feedback and,knowing what's going to happen
on the podcast, catch you at thenext one.
We hope you enjoy the show.
Speaker 3 (50:15):
Do you own a company in the welding industry or want
to share a targeted message withour listeners?
Then this 45-second audio adspace could be yours.
We have the coolest listenersfrom all over the world, with
over 60,000 downloads, and 88%are from North America.
This podcast serves to educateand connect the welding
(50:35):
community together and isavailable on all major platforms
, including the CWB GroupNetwork.
If you are interested, reachout to info at cwbassociationorg
.
Look at that.
I just gave you all of thatinformation in only 45 seconds.
You've been listening to theCWB Association Welding Podcast.
(50:56):
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Please subscribe or visit us atcwbassociationorg to learn more
.
All right, I can check.
Check, I'm good.
So I'm Max Duran.
Max Duran, cwb AssociationWelding Podcast, pod pod podcast
.
Today we have a really coolguest welding podcast.
The show is about to begin.
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Happy welding.
Hello and welcome to anotheredition of the CWB Association
podcast.
My name is Max Charon and, asalways, I'm out there trying to
(01:07):
find the coolest peoples in theworld.
Courtney Donovan is one ofthose coolest peoples in the
world.
We are here in beautiful StJohn, new Brunswick, for Skills
Atlantic and Skills NewBrunswick.
Courtney, how you doing.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Good, how are you Max ?
Speaker 1 (01:21):
I'm doing fantastic.
I am very happy to be here.
I am so happy that youbasically forced me to come out
here.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
I did, I did.
It was just time Like I need tobring the West out East.
I need you all to know howamazing it is out here.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Well and, to be honest, the CWB group has had a
lot of success and investment inNew Brunswick, and so it is apt
that we are here to uh, youknow, revel in the fruits of our
investment yeah, and we havethe best welder well, I um they
are wonderful, we're wonderful.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
I'm biased, we know I'm biased, I am also biased.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
So, courtney, you are the executive director for
skills new brunswick.
Yeah, congratulations.
When I first met you, you didnot have that job.
No, I, I started in uh as.
So, courtney, you are theexecutive director for Skills
New Brunswick.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
I am Congratulations, thank you.
When I first met you.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
You did not have that job.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
No, I started as a marketing and event coordinator
for.
Skills Canada, new Brunswick,and I was supposed to be here
for one year.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
And.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
That was nine years ago.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
And then what happened?
Speaker 2 (02:19):
I just I loved it.
I came in on a one-yearcontract.
I was supposed to be marketingcommunications.
My background is definitelysports.
You know did the wholeuniversity.
I did do my second degree at acommunity college in Ontario and
then kind of started on thesports route and it was great.
And then, you know, there wasthis random one-year contract
(02:41):
with Skills Canada, newBrunswick, and my mother had
been involved since about 2009,I think at the time, in Skills,
in Skills.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
In what capacity?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
She is the National Technical Committee member for
hairstyling, oh.
I had no idea, yeah, so mymother is a diehard Skills you
know woman and she would comehome every year and talk about
Skills and myself and my father,who's a welder, would kind of
go.
That's great.
You enjoy that.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
We don't know what you're talking about, but you
love it, and your dad'sgeneration wouldn't have known
nothing about skills, right?
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Nothing, nothing.
And he was actually.
He's a teacher at one of thecolleges here in New Brunswick,
so just to tie it all in.
But so I said, you know, maybeI'll take a break from the sport
world.
Apply for this.
You know they're hosting anational competition in New
Brunswick Sounds kind ofexciting and you know, you get
rolling and you're learningabout the trades and I have come
(03:35):
from an entire family of tradespeople and they had kept all of
it a secret, All of it a secret.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
So for the first time Was it to to be like you need
to go to university and escapethis trades world like a little
bit very common thing?
Speaker 2 (03:47):
yeah so a little bit of that, a little bit of just
their own stigma about their owncareers, right you've.
They've heard for years thattheir careers don't matter, or
less important than when I wasgoing through school.
I had, you know, exceptionalmarks, so that was very much
let's go to university.
And that is the route I tookand it was great.
But then again I come back andfind the trade world, and now
(04:08):
I'm working with my dad, who's awelder by trade, and now
teaching a welding inspectorprogram, and my uncle, who's you
know HVAC technician, been withthe same company for 40 years,
and my cousin, who's anautomotive, and so now I'm
getting in their world a littlebit.
(04:37):
And then, and so now I'm gettingin their world a little bit and
and then we're setting up forthe national.
And all of a sudden we startsetting up for a national and it
ever seen and immediately Ican't leave.
How do I stay here and how dowe take what we have and then
grow it so that more NewBrunswickers get to experience?
Speaker 1 (04:52):
this, so you were already thinking about the long
game.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Oh yeah, oh yeah, like it happened very quick.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
And what year was this?
Speaker 2 (04:58):
then that was 2016.
2016.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Okay 2016.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
And yeah, so I was only supposed to be here a
minute and as soon as nationalshappened, I knew I wasn't
leaving.
So how do I stay on as amarketing event coordinator past
, you know, this one year?
Speaker 1 (05:14):
And so, and was it a one year term?
Cause you were covering a leaveor something, or no or was it
just like one years for fun?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
So New Brunswick at that time only had a one-man
operation, so we maybe reachedabout 200 students at that time
purely through competitions.
There was no programming, notri-trades, but a lot of that
was part of what was going oneducationally here in New
Brunswick.
So at that time and previous tothat, a lot of the shops have
been pulled from all the highschools in the province.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yeah, so that a lot of the shops have been pulled
from all the high schools in theprovince.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Yeah, so that had a ripple effect.
So you know, as theorganization was starting to
form in 1998, that's when weestablished here in New
Brunswick the shops were comingout of the schools, so there
wasn't the same, maybe,excitement tie in that some of
the other provinces had.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
It felt like it was almost dying or something A
little bit.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
You know we were really.
New Brunswick was focused somuch on technology then.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
And.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
I teased the future and going to replace everything.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
We both know that hasn't happened and not going to
happen and never going tohappen.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
It's not going to happen, There'll be a lot of
things replaced by AI but weneed our trades people.
That's right um.
So again, it was just kind ofthe natural progression of that
and seeing the importance of allthese jobs and, and not having
been exposed to any of thismyself, and how do I change this
for every other new brunswicker?
Speaker 1 (06:34):
yeah moving forward so you do the one year yeah,
sorry, I get distracted it comesup.
No, my job is to keep you ontrack.
I got this.
Appreciate you yeah so you getto the end of the one year and
they say you're up, yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
So sorry it was.
It was one year.
I immediately started workingon.
I'm not leaving, we're going togrow this.
So again, provincial governmentwas great they said sure we can
continue on with, you know thisgrant.
And then I stayed in thatposition for, I want to say,
three and a half years, and thenI eventually moved into the
executive director role 2020?
(07:09):
.
End of 2019.
So you know, first time comingaround, setting up provincial
competitions as executivedirector and get hit with the
pandemic.
So that's a, you know, funexperience a few months in.
But it was great and again tomove into that role and then
continue to grow it.
From what was a one-man showfor the first 20 years, we now
(07:33):
have five women that run thisshow full time.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
The five-woman show.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
It is a five-woman show.
We have a full 16 board ofdirectors that are full of
education industry and everyindustry.
Um, because that's so importantto us, right?
You know what are we educatingthese?
People for it's.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
It's to go to industry so for you to
understand skills kind of at amore grassroots level, then get
into it, find a passion for it.
You know very quickly, climb ashort ladder right and get to
the top of as ED.
What kind of learning curve didyou have?
Because it's not just welding,it's not just hairstyling.
(08:13):
You know which were the thingsyou had at home.
It's, you know, 40, some tradesand 82 vocations.
And you know how do you getyour head around all of it, or
do you even have to?
Is it just piece by piece, Likehow do you work it?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Little, piece by piece.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
I'm still learning.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
I'm still learning every day, and I think that's
part of what draws me to this,and the skills in the first
place.
You know, when I first startedbeing, I felt like I had been
left out of the trade world.
So I probably took a verydifferent approach.
Sort of FOMO.
I had so much FOMO, so much FOMO.
So, to be honest, when I firststarted, especially when I was
(08:51):
in the marketing role, as a wayto try and understand and learn
more, because we have suchincredible teachers here and
again, I'm sure every province,territory equally does,
especially in the skilled tradesand technology areas, but here
in New Brunswick, god love themall they brought me into their
(09:13):
shops.
I tried welding, I tried allthe different types of welding.
So again, nail learning what thevocabulary the equipment are
consumables, but also understandwhat our competitors are trying
to achieve.
Um, so then I would do the samein bricklaying.
I went into roofing shops, Iwent in.
You know I've laid brick, I'vedone some wiring.
So for me that was reallyimportant was to figure out that
(09:34):
hands-on and just even havethat connection, have the
connection, and also it'simportant to me that all the
instructors we work with knowthat they matter.
Their trade matters.
So to me that was a, you know,a time investment that was
really worth my time and itallowed me to appreciate what
they were doing more, what theywere trying to teach, but also,
(09:56):
again, the love for the tradeand and having a trades person
take that time to teach you thetrade.
There's nothing more pure thanthat.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
There is nothing more pure than that.
There is nothing more pure thanthat.
I get philosophical aboutwelding sometimes and you know
I'll have these deep moments ofthought and one time I thought
you know it's being a tradesperson is an agreement between,
basically, you and the earth.
Right, because we're taking theelements of this planet,
rearranging them in order tobuild right.
And what's more beautiful thanbuilding?
Right, because we're taking theelements of this planet,
(10:25):
rearranging them in order tobuild right.
And what's more beautiful thanbuilding right?
Whether it's building community, building lives, building homes
, building whatever.
We are literally taking thisearth that we've been given and
finding ways to take theelements of it to create things
for ourselves.
And I, you know, I posted thaton Facebook.
It's almost like you know, whatare you smoking?
It's like but and I posted thaton Facebook and someone was
(10:46):
like, what are you smoking?
But really it's something aboutthe trades that's so ingrained
in our societies.
I know that over the last fewyears, many of the skills
competitions in Canada haveincorporated a lot of indigenous
skills, and I was at the SkillsManitoba, skills Saskatchewan.
They had full indigenous skillscompetitions running.
I was at the skill skillsmanitoba, skills saskatchewan.
(11:06):
They had full indigenous skillscompetitions running
concurrently with skills, and itwas wonderful bead uh, ribbon
skirts, kayak paddle making,like indigenous skills and I
thought you know, like the thesepractical skills haven't
changed though right.
They're part of, like, our humanidentity right.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
No, I got deep there.
No, no, no, I am, I'm with youbecause, again.
I look at the trades.
I actually told Irving Oil, oneof our sponsors, again here at
the St John campus.
You can look over.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Irving is everywhere.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
And you can look overlook the beautiful refinery.
Lovely which she's probablylaughing at me again because I
continue to call it a beautifulrefinery.
Yeah, that's the lovely glow ofmoney.
But for me, I look at a placelike that and it's again the
appreciation of A.
How many tradespeople are there, hundreds, the skill, the hours
(12:00):
it takes to have that level thepassion that they all have.
You know, I can't help but lookat that place and genuinely
think that is the most beautifulplace because, of that Right
and just understanding what thatrefinery produces and what that
means for you know doctors,lawyers, everyone that might not
(12:23):
know this trade world, but thatday-to-day can't happen without
these tradespeople and theirwork.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
They can't exist without that.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
First, no one can yeah you know our tradespeople
are responsible for our schools,our hospitals, our where we
live, the roads, the planes inthe air, our toilets our fridges
.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
It's quite literally everything right.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
And it's without those things, you know, we would
be quite literally cavemen.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Without our tradespeople.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
So, while there is that stigma, it's my job or what
I feel my job is is to helpchange that and help the general
public not only appreciatethese jobs but have the
education for A if they want toenter in them.
Yeah have the education for a ifthey want to enter in them, but
B, you know, if you want tobuild a house, buy a house.
Understanding the differencebetween a Red Seal carpenter and
(13:11):
somebody that's out doing it,and not saying that there's not
good in both, but again there isthat esteem for a Red Seal and
just like you would not, youknow, find a doctor on the side
of the street to operate on yourfoot.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Yeah, although they could, maybe, maybe they could
yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Maybe they do a good job, but you know, even again
understanding what a compulsorytrade is.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
And why?
Speaker 2 (13:32):
that's important and going and having that
information, even just again asa person on the street yeah, to
emphasize that with thosetradespeople and make sure that
when they're looking to you knowhire someone, that they know
who and what they're hiring.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
And they can trust it Right.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
And they know that those are credentials and
careers that matter just as muchas the university educated ones
.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Right Now, let's talk about what you studied.
What'd you go to university for?
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Oh, my God, my God, what a load of questions.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
So I came out of high school very high 90s.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
Some people are talking lawyer, doctor, talk
right.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Doctor.
I always thought I was going tobe a doctor, and then I get,
and again.
So let's start on the stigma.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
So here in New Brunswick you can't be educated.
So so heard that I took off toDalhousie University.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
Um, I don't think I was there a month and went oh,
this isn't science in highschool, why did they set me up
to want to be a doctor?
Um, so you know very quicklyyou realize biochem is not what
you want to do and also maybenot this route.
Uh, so then it's.
You know well, what can I takenext?
Because, again, we're soingrained with you have to go to
university and get a degree max.
I had no idea what I actuallywanted to do at the end the the
(14:56):
timeline, like none of that'sexplained.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
Um, so, anyways, that biochem degree quickly turned
to a psychology degree with witha minor in political science
another poli sci, ryan, was poliscience too.
Yeah, it's uh actually it'svery versatile yeah, well, I
love my philosophy education, Ilove it and again, because it
makes you think that's right.
So again the psychology.
(15:20):
I can dissect anything and notfreak out.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
I can, that's that's important, it is well, and even
the psychology.
You work with people day to day.
So, understanding the how, what, why of their thinking.
Yeah, I mean, it's just a niceskill, I guess.
But uh, so we finished this.
You know, my parents in thetrades are just like good for
you Um now.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
You want to be an agent.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
No, but work in sports.
So when I finished what was?
Speaker 1 (15:55):
your sport, because you've always been sporty since
I've known you Basketball.
Basketball Okay.
Speaker 2 (15:59):
Basketball, was it?
So did the whole Canada Gamesthing, Did the you know
provincial team going tonationals a bunch of times and
it was fabulous.
But that's kind of thecrossover with skills.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
That's where I was leading with all, and that's
where I was leading with all andthe sports and I think that's
probably why, when I got here, Iappreciated it that much more
um, but I'll go back to theother thing.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
So when did that degree uh worked for the
senators?
A little bit um did some soccerCanada stuff.
Came back to New Brunswick tostart the or help start the uh
National Basketball League ofCanada and more specifically the
Monk of the Miracles at thetime, um and again, it was great
.
But then, when this came, Ithink that's probably how I fell
in love.
(16:38):
So quick is you see the ties tosports and again sports matter
so much, and they have a placeand they teach you so many life
skills, but then this is able togive you that, but then also
set you up for your future alittle bit.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
Yeah, have the longevity that sports camp offer
Right.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
I mean, how many people in minor hockey actually
end up in the NHL Right?
Or right in in, um, not thatthey shouldn't try, that's.
That's definitely not what I'msaying, but it's.
You know, we're able to offerstudents a chance to come here,
um, and have that same kind ofCanada game type experience, but
A they can do it every year.
It's not every four years, sowe're not worried about missing
something.
(17:15):
You can come here, you compete,you could try and go inly and
again, this is helping youfigure out what you want to do
with your future Right andpreparing you for the inevitable
competitions you will be inyour career.
A hundred percent.
I mean when they're here todaythey're practicing skills that
they're going to do when they'reout on the job site right,
(17:36):
absolutely.
Under that pressure, under thetime of it all, and from there
when they go into industry.
You know we had so many peopleI'll pick on welding but we had
so many people start trainingthis year because they wanted
twin provincials.
Well then you know, I see you,or I hear that you, as a welder,
so now I'm training, so we, itnaturally has all these people
(18:00):
doing all this extra work andthen that gets around the shop
and I mean I say the unlikesports, they're training for
competition, they're literallymaking themselves a more
employable yeah but they'reraising the bar, it's, it's
(18:21):
raising the excellence, not onlyhere but in the shop right and
the community and in thecommunity and having those
people you know um like.
We have some alumni who have wonmultiple medals now and they
are kind of our lebron james,our c Crosby you know, whatever
I call them my, most winningest.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
I've made up an entire word.
It's great.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
But how do we take those people that, again, are so
responsible for the safety ofeverything?
And day to day and the building, and give them those same
platforms and recognition.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
How do they get glorified?
Or you know, we put a lot ofpeople in society on pedestals
that perhaps shouldn't be onpedestals.
And then you know, like theidolatry of TV or YouTube or
whatever, and meanwhile we havepeople that are actual amazing
people that are just crushing itand doing amazing things and
(19:12):
they're not in the limelight.
I mean, a lot of the reason Ihave this podcast is to try to
expose these stories of likethere's amazing people in your
communities that are doingthings that are making all of
our lives better.
Um, and no one knows about it.
like they're just like they'rejust doing it just because,
right, just because well, and Iknow you talked to andrew clark
while you've been here in NewBrunswick and he's, you know,
(19:34):
one of our Super gung ho.
Super gung ho.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
The amount of welding camps that man has run and, and
, and no one's making him do itRight.
You know, we, we and everyprovince has that.
But that's the beautiful part.
You need those champions, youdo.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
And it's Like, and he's so wonderful, he's been
coming to me since, I think,2017.
I believe it Right, because Ithink I spoke at a conference
somewhere and he came up to meright after.
He's like, I'm a high schoolteacher in this program and I
was like, oh, like, okay, likeyou are on this, yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
So it's.
It's amazing too, I think, youknow, as we put together these
competitions, as we dotriathletes, as whatever we do,
it's nice that we have thoseteachers and that there's more
and more all the time, becausethey're also looking for the
opportunity, right?
No?
(20:31):
one wants to work in a careerwhere you feel like you don't
matter, Right?
So again to me, what the greatthing about all of this and
being involved in this, whetheryou're a teacher, student,
industry, competitor, alumni,you coming again from the other
end of the country, it's the onetime everyone gets celebrated.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Right For the jobs that they do behind the closed
doors that no one ever gets tosee.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Well, that's my role is to help amplify that Right
and then to push that out there,even just having, you know, the
kids have watched for the lastthree days, walking through this
last door here, right by wherewe're set up which was pretty
cool spot and there's buses ofkids getting dropped off and
going for their tours andthey're walking in and watching
(21:15):
me interview people.
They're immediately interested,they're like what's happening,
what's going on?
There's cameras, there's lights, you know, and I think that
that's good for them to see,because we see that with sports,
we see the hockey players getput under the lights and get
interviewed.
We see it happen with art.
We see it happen with so manythings.
We don't see it happen with thetrades, and it should be.
You know like.
It's almost like you know, whenbill puts the final weld on
(21:37):
that bridge that goes somewhere,they should like have a
ceremony and be like hooray,bill, you finished the job.
You know like, because it'sactually important for society?
Speaker 2 (21:46):
yes, it is, and I you know when we do get on to the
international competitions andoutworld skills.
It is nice to see that thereyeah but I think we still need
to work more to do that here andand not again necessarily new
brunswick.
But as a country yeah and um,again not to be problematic, but
for better or worse, I think,things like tariffs being in the
(22:08):
news every day people thataren't thinking about trades are
now being more aware for betteror worse.
Like those conversations arestill bringing things and
industries that the generalpublic might not typically think
about to the forefront.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
I've had lots of friends in the last few weeks,
probably know me my whole lifeand have no idea what I do.
But be like Are these tariffsaffecting your industry?
I was like yes, yes, very much,yeah, a lot.
Speaker 2 (22:32):
And so again, that's what I mean, like not to be
problematic and bring that up,but it's for better or worse.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
It's good to have the communication.
Yes, yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
And again, it's at least starting a conversation.
So, like we said those, peoplethat might not be familiar with
the trades know what's going on.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
They're at least asking the the question yeah, no
, that's great, right.
And I was bringing up youruniversity earlier and your
sports and your backgroundbecause, as I've learned in this
trade, especially once I becameinvolved with skills and then
like the competitive side of it,um, with teaching, I really
started to see some of theseparallel, you know, connections.
Sports is one of them.
The skills that aretransferable from sports into
the trades is obvious once yousee it.
(23:14):
It's like you know the desireto better yourself, the
self-motivation, because at theend of the day, you're not a
good athlete.
If someone needs to motivateyou, you need to motivate
yourself, or else you're justnot going to be at a high level.
And it's the same with weldingor any of the skill trades.
It's not about your bossyelling at you that you need to
do it better.
You want to do it better andthat's and that's that right it
(23:36):
is.
And you will seek informationand what you need to do these
things better.
Now, with college, this issomething that I'm trying to
connect.
For a lot of people there'salmost like a, a black or white
scenario there, like oh, youneed to go to college or you
need to pick the trades, likeit's one or the other.
You started in college, wentthrough a number of various
routes and ended up working in atrades adjacent organization.
(23:59):
I went to university a fewtimes for a number of different
things, but I still was weldingthe whole time.
And you're like why would youbother going to university if
you're a welder?
I'm like why does it have to bea choice?
If anything, welding affordedme the ability to go to
university with no pressure?
(24:21):
Because now I can just learnfor my own betterment.
I want to start a business.
Well, I can go pick up acommunity college course on
running a business at night,because I can just pay for it
because I have a job right, LikeI mean fabulous, and the
ability to go back and forth,and that's where I see the
future.
I see the future where you'rein school and you're that 99%
(24:43):
kid who just got such greatmarks and they put everything in
front of you and say, oh, youwant to be an engineer?
Cool, why don't you go intofabrication?
First get your Red Seal FAB,then transition into university,
get your degree in materialsengineering and as a combination
of those two, you are going tobe cut throat killer.
(25:05):
That's going to be an amazingrole because you have such a
breadth of understanding that Isee that cross-training to be so
important it is, and even justthe conversation.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
not that I hate the university versus college thing,
but I think it's so much moreimportant if we can find or
direct students to their passion.
What are you passionate about?
What makes you happy?
Because in 2025, I am surethere's a job somewhere that
ties to that right, yeah, yeah,or let's or create it.
Or create it right, Becausethat world now is so easy.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Like GoDaddy, I have a website in 10 minutes and I
can go register a business in$75.
Right.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
Like Right.
So what have?
Um, just to your point, and Ilove your story.
We we had an alumni last yearhe was our post automotive
competitor, so he to your pointyeah came to the college, took
his pre-employment uh,pre-apprentice, you know,
automotive course um, he endedup winning the provincial
(26:04):
competition with us last year,came with us to nationals and we
just loved him.
So, while we're there, you'relike grant, you're gonna, you
know, sign up, as obviously.
We'll see as you continue yourjourney.
He goes well, I am, but I'mactually signed up to take
business at the University ofOttawa next year.
So my plan is to go to Ottawatake my degree.
He goes.
I'm going to actually sign upas an apprentice there, and when
(26:27):
I'm not in school I'm going tocontinue to get my hours.
And he said my plan is tofinish my you know Red Seal
concurrently to my degree.
And he said then, when I finishI can open a shop.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
Yeah, and I'm sitting there.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Exactly so smart I'm sitting there.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
Wow.
You know you're 19 years old Tohave that planned and sorted.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
I was planning on gas money at 19, like that's my
plan yeah and and again.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
On to your point.
I'm fairly certain.
Looking back, what mostly tookme to university I did was
basketball yeah how much was Ireally worried, or focused on
the degree or what I was?
Speaker 1 (27:07):
no, it was just the means.
Yeah, I just want to playbasketball.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
I wasn't done and and we see that a lot with athletes
they go on university becausethey're not done with that and
then they kind of, you know, dowhatever they're going to do,
and we do see a lot of them backat college after it's funny, my
son went through that he was avery, very good football player,
captain of the football team,played center.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
They won provincials.
Finished high school he hestruggled with school.
He never really liked theacademic side of school but he
loved the sports and thecamaraderie he had a.
He played football for a longtime and had won a few
championships throughout hiscareer.
And it came to the concept, theconversations of university and
it was like, well, you know,with your football career, you
(27:47):
can get into university, noproblem, right.
But he turned it down, turnedit down.
He was like I don't like school, why would I do that?
It's like, well, if you don'tgo to school, you're not going
to get to play football.
And it's like, well, then Idon't play football because I'm
not going to just do one and beunhappy, put myself through this
trauma.
Basically, yes.
For this.
And now he's working at aconstruction company and he's
(28:10):
perfectly happy and he coaches.
Now right, Because he can justdo that on the other side and
still maintain his connection tothe sport.
And now he's making moneybecause he would have hated
universities so much.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
But even that right, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
That's I.
Just if we can talk to kidsabout what are you passionate
about.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
What do?
Speaker 2 (28:31):
you want to do?
What do you want to do?
How do you like to learn you?
Know, again like we.
I don't want to talk about iton a moving end, but we have a
young lady here today who youknow.
She contacted us out of theblue to start running a program
for her at her high school.
But when she first reached outit was, you know, I have ADHD
and as soon as I got in the shopand got my hands busy, my mind
(28:52):
just completely shut off.
Yeah, and you know that's such abeautiful thing to be able to
offer someone.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
I think that a lot of people in the trades migrated
towards them because of thingsthey didn't know.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Probably In terms of their neurodivergence.
But if you know how do how donot we promote that more, but
just give more people theopportunity.
Give the space, yeah not wepromote that more, but just give
more people the opportunity tofigure that out for themselves.
Right, rather than a guidance?
Counselor, teacher or parentjust say you know, oh, you seem
smart in this, or you see, thisis what you should do.
Why don't we just ask them?
Speaker 1 (29:25):
yeah, we ask them more questions.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
What makes you happy?
Right like you're choosing todo this the rest of your life.
What makes you happy?
Do you like working with yourhands?
Speaker 1 (29:33):
Do you want to sit at a?
Speaker 2 (29:34):
computer.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Do you like being outside, do you?
Like to eat the outside Right,right, like I mean.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
These things matter, they do, and it's, and I think
again too, that will help notonly the industry, but we're
going to get them younger,because the average Asian
apprentice right now in theprovince is 29.
Right, it's a little older.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
When I first started as an old man.
That's a young number, but Iknow what you mean, Right?
Speaker 2 (30:02):
But even that number has changed nationally.
I think when I started andagain don't hold me to this, but
when I started I want to saynationally it was 24 and now
it's 27.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
I want to say nationally.
It was 24 and now it's 27.
Well, we know about the agingpopulation of the tradespeople.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
So it's you know how do we just give them the
education or make sure it'savailable to them and they know
the pathways.
And to me, this is what skillsis all about.
Right, I don't here in NewBrunswick and we have our
Anglophone and Francophoneschool section or Department of
Education.
Then you have your privateschools.
You know the number of studentsbeing homeschooled is always
(30:35):
varies.
The great thing about skills iswe're open to everyone.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Yeah, everyone's welcome.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
Everyone is welcome.
You know, even if you're not intraining, you're not in
education, still come learn.
And it's fabulous because youcan come here, you can walk
through colleges, you can seethe shops, you can meet the
instructors, but you're alsomeeting, you know, your
apprenticeship officer and theycan talk to you about what
blocks are really like, and thenyou can also go and meet you
(31:02):
know two dozen industry that youcould potentially work at, and
not only talk to HR, but you'retalking to people that are
actually doing that job for them.
Right, and that's so beautiful.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
It is.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
To be able to get that information.
In one space and have thoseconversations.
I still feel truly blessed thatthis is my job.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
You're so authentic Makes me mad, that's why we get
along no Max.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Why do we get along All?
Speaker 1 (31:33):
right?
Well, we have blown past ourcommercial break.
So sorry so we're going to haveto stop now for a quick moment
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So we're going to be right backhere with Courtney Donovan, the
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And we are back here on the CWBAssociation podcast.
I am Max Duran.
I'm here in New Brunswick withCourtney Donovan, all right.
(33:27):
So right before the break wewere talking about, you know,
obviously, the aspects of skillsthat are related to community,
the job, the jobs, you know,sustaining the people,
supporting people.
But let's talk more now aboutspecifically this skills
competition.
So what's been happening theselast two days?
How many people are here whocame to see it?
(33:48):
Walk me through this.
I'm sure you've been planningthis for months and months and
months and months as the ed here.
So what went down?
What's happening?
Speaker 2 (33:58):
yeah, so, um, this is the first time we've ever had a
two-day event in the middle ofthe week, um, and it was a huge
success, very exciting about it.
So the first day we had 16post-secondary competitions.
So that was the majority ofthem.
I won't say all of them, we arerestricted to you know what
equipment is at what college.
So there are a handful that arehappening elsewhere in the
(34:20):
province, but we had 16 runyesterday and then 11 secondary
high school competitions rantoday.
Throughout the both days wewere busing in about 5,000
students and to view not onlythe competition, but we had a
fabulous triad trade that wasmade up of college programs as
well as industry associations,unions, you name it from not
(34:44):
only across the province, but wedid have a few national
partners, like yourself whoagain, as New Brunswick
continues to grow, theirprovincial again are coming to
support.
As we know, these industriesexist in New Brunswick and
they're growing and they'restrong, so it's really nice to
see all that happen.
The first day we also had ayoung women's conference, so
(35:07):
that's our second one that we'vedone with the Women's Equality
Branch and it was fabulous.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
I heard there was a couple hundred people.
Yes, yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
And it you know, we the high school students that
come in.
They have the opportunity tovisit the tri-tree and see the
competitions, but then they alsoare able to go into breakout
rooms and talk to specificallyfemale mentors who are either
have a Red Seal or working inthat area.
Male mentors who are eitherhave a red seal or working in
that area and just talk to themabout what they went through is
again in the reality of workingin male dominated spaces male
dominated spaces in a provincethat has 4% women in trade.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
Yeah Right, we are one of the lower ones.
4% has come up a lot this weekduring my conversations.
It comes up a lot for me in mywork in general.
I mean mean I have a strong mom, a strong sister and a strong
daughter.
I don't know how we only havefour percent in this trade like
it's.
It's.
It's embarrassing, to be honest, like it needs to be correct it
does, it, it does and so thatagain, especially as a woman,
(36:07):
with a two-year-old daughter.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
That is extremely important to me.
How do we normalize that?
You know, I think we're makingmoves.
It was yesterday.
I will also say wrong trade,but it was fabulous that for the
first time ever the electricalinstallation Three women on the
podium.
Three women.
(36:29):
Yeah, I love it and I also likethere was a woman on the podium
and welding and steam Two womenon the podium.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
Three women, yeah, I love it, and I also like there
was a woman on the podium inwelding and steam fitter.
Two women on the podium.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
Like, and I was up there and I missed that.
So the welding steam, fitterpipe, fitter carpentry, you know
there was at least one or twowomen in every single one.
So, having that and you know,even just being able to post
those pictures, you know whenother female students are
looking at that, you seeyourself.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
I mean that's part of it would be the same with
Disney, it's hard to see whatyou or be what you can't see.
That's the thing, right.
Speaker 2 (37:02):
And it is, and I don't know, I don't know how we
would do that.
Yeah, I've been trying to be aDisney princess for a long time
I was going to say Disney A longtime and I haven't quite
figured.
Speaker 1 (37:14):
I feel like it's kind of working out.
Speaker 2 (37:16):
It's kind of working out, kind of working out.
Speaker 1 (37:17):
Get some vibes, yeah you haven't seen me in a dress,
though, not yet.
Not yet See what happens toRegina, yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
But again, that's a piece of it.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
Yeah, it is.
You don't see yourself in thosetrades.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
So it's really important to me Like we have
women here in the province likeBella Hicks, who you know got in
the trade so young and has beensuch an incredible advocate.
Check out her podcast, yeah,she you know, she, when she was
still a student, would come withby 19, she's crushing it,
crushing it, oh my God,no-transcript.
(38:20):
They come in, they see herwelding.
Speaker 1 (38:22):
It's okay to be here, yep um, and we need more of
that we need more of that inevery space every space, right,
you know, because it's likewe're at the point where it's
all hands on deck, like fortrades, like it's just we need
so many people, um, that it'sfrom from not even uh, uh, a
side of separation or of ofexcluding people, just on the
(38:46):
side of we can't be pickyanymore, like we just need so
many workers like you, you know,you got blue hair, one eye and
six fingers.
I don't care, man, like let'sgo, we got work.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
And if you're driven right Like that is that's it.
We just need driven people whoare ready and willing to work.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
The jobs are there, the jobs are great.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
They're great paying jobs Again, whether you're in
New Brunswick or another part ofthe country, so why?
Speaker 1 (39:14):
St John.
You know, when you were lookingat the setup for this year's
provincial you I mean there'slots of beautiful places and
wonderful places in NewBrunswick.
What made you pick the city?
Speaker 2 (39:26):
So we have a three kind of school rotation for our
provincial competitions basedoff the size of campuses.
Yeah, we rotate through an NBCCMoncton campus and then NBCC St
John, and then next year we goback to CCNB Bathurst.
Speaker 1 (39:40):
Awesome, I've never been to that campus.
I've been to Moncton a fewtimes but I've never been to the
Bathurst and Matthew Roy is awelding instructor up there.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
Love him.
Speaker 1 (39:49):
He's amazing, yeah, so, and I met one of the other
instructors yesterday.
Speaker 2 (39:54):
Well, we'll have to get you up there.
Other instructors yesterday.
Well, we'll have to get you upthere.
So next year we'll go toBathurst and again there will
probably be at least 16competitions.
It is a huge campus.
Speaker 1 (40:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
We love it up there, so very excited to be back and
see what we can do.
But St John is great.
I mean you look out the windowsof the college and you see the
refinery.
This is a very industrial.
Speaker 1 (40:17):
I got a good tour yesterday, so I'm from Regina
very industrial city.
Right.
Right A lot of people don't seethe beauty in industry, but
they don't understand thatindustrial cities have money.
I mean, we have resources thatwe're thankful for.
We have a refinery in Regina.
We have a steel mill.
You know, you guys have a giantpaper mill.
Pulp mills you, for we have arefinery in regina.
(40:37):
We have a steel mill.
You know, you guys have a giantpaper mill pulp mills.
You got the refinery, which isthe largest north america, or
one of them, um, you and youhave mines not too far from here
.
You got all these things goingon.
One of the things that blew blewmy mind this week is the amount
of training programs newbrunswick has for the size you
know you got 14, 15 secondarystudents competing just in
welding, representing 14 highschools, all with individual
(41:00):
welding programs, and I wasshocked by that.
And then one of the instructorssays, well, that's only like 14
of the 30 that we have.
And I was like I don't know ifI got 30 high schools in all
saskatchewan that have weldingprograms.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
That's amazing and again on two sides francophone
and anglophone.
Speaker 1 (41:17):
That's impressive, it is, and again.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
We, I think, are one of the first provinces to have
high school bricklaying, butthat's again.
It's that industry involvement.
You know it's what are weeducating people for?
It is it's for the vacancies,it's for the shortage, and you
know industry needs to beinvolved with helping all that.
But it's for the shortage andyou know industry needs to be
(41:40):
involved with with helping allthat.
But it's um, yeah, my brainjust went on me.
Sorry, it's one of thosemoments to the end.
Oh yeah, no, I'm good, I'm goodnow for for you.
Speaker 1 (41:47):
You know, in terms of the future let's talk about.
You know, for the last couplequestions here, what's your
future state for skills?
You know you have a vision as aed of where you want to take
this.
So what do you see?
You know, next year, five years, um, so for one.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
When again I first started, we reached maybe about
200 students a year and nowwe're up to well over 20 000, so
, um for one, this event, uh,when we first started, a lot of
people said couldn't be possiblein new brunswick, and now,
within just a five-year rotation, this is now the largest event
in Atlantic Canada.
Speaker 3 (42:19):
So huge strides.
You're there, we love it.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
So, as far as the competition, you know, it's
great, it's going to continue togrow within itself, but then
it's, what more can we do?
Is there more tri-trades, andI'm not interested in putting
band-aids on things, max, whatare the problems?
Speaker 1 (42:37):
The stateable programs.
Speaker 2 (42:39):
How do we find out not only what the root problem
is, but again fix it from theroot, then put a band-aid on it?
So some of those projects I'mworking on a training center.
Speaker 1 (42:51):
Oh.
Speaker 2 (42:52):
Yeah, that would also have a bit of a tri-trade
aspect to it.
Speaker 1 (42:57):
Kind of like a makerspace idea, almost Kind of.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
And it's again, whether it's Team New Brunswick,
we're getting in there foradditional training or Monday to
Friday, helping, you know, fillsome gaps in the education
system and make sure thatthere's training with you know,
potentially people with redseals.
That's what we want to help anddo more of.
Speaker 3 (43:15):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (43:19):
So that's what we want to help and do more of.
So I say that's I say in theworks here in.
New Brunswick, or myaspirations for the next five
years.
So be in the loop.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
And what's your team look like here?
You started with just one, thentwo, and how many do you got
now?
Speaker 2 (43:29):
There's five of us full time, and then we also
again have our outside of that,our HR and CPAs.
Speaker 1 (43:36):
How many volunteers did you have in total out here
then?
Because there's a lot.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
I'd say we had at least 80 to 100 volunteers in
the last two days.
How are you?
Speaker 1 (43:45):
liking managing all this stuff.
Speaker 2 (43:46):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (43:47):
Yeah, do you sleep much.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
I mean, I don't even sleep.
I'll sleep on the weekend.
Speaker 1 (43:53):
No, you won't.
You have a two-year-old.
Speaker 2 (43:54):
I do have a two-year-old, so I won't take
that either.
No, but this is, this is allthat matters.
Like again, when you come andyou see the competitors and the
instructors and the industry andeveryone come together.
It's, it's the passion thatfuels it to do more for them,
because I understand and have anappreciation for what those
(44:16):
tradespeople do for us.
So, if I can go out of my way tothrow them a massive you know
celebration and be at acompetition and give them that
platform, then I'm going to makethat as big as I can for them.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
Well, I would have to say, knowing you for a number
of years now, is that youundersell your passion as being
one of the driving motivators.
You know, when you say we wentfrom 200 people to 20,000, we're
going to have to start callingthat the Courtney effect.
I'm okay with that, right, likethat's the Courtney effect,
because you know and it came upwith Ryan when we were talking
(44:50):
about it from the deputyminister of education you have a
passion.
You had a passion forbasketball, you had a passion
for traveling.
You had a passion for traveling.
You have a passion for your kid.
You don't do things passionless, right?
And you, in this job, I feellike that's the fit.
That's the fit that made thiswork so well.
When I heard you got the ED job,I was like, oh, that's a
(45:12):
no-brainer, because you werealready like within, like I
think, the first couple monthsof your job, you messaging me,
being like, hey, I need tofigure out some ideas.
I got some things.
What do you think about this?
And I was like, holy, you'rejust on the ball, like you're
ready to rock, and and that alsotranslates to this competition,
right?
So it's not just them givingback to you, you're, you're
(45:34):
feeding them as well yeah, butbut again, I, I feel lucky.
Speaker 2 (45:40):
I feel lucky to be here and this is, I think, yes,
this is more of an admin job, Iguess.
On the on the trade side.
I'm not on the tools, but thisis what I am trying to match
students to.
Right and know that you youdon't have to go one way or
another like I did.
Speaker 1 (45:58):
And like so many people did I mean I'm doing a
podcast.
I was a welder.
Like what's the road Right?
And that's one of my favoritethings to ask people Right.
Speaker 2 (46:06):
What are you doing now versus what was your dream
job as a kid?
Yeah, and why didn't you do it?
Yeah, and are you really happynow?
And?
And?
Are you really happy now?
And it's really interesting.
Speaker 1 (46:16):
Just the deep existential questions.
Speaker 2 (46:18):
Well, I mean, I don't mean, they're newbie but it's
more of a, not a study, but I'mjust interested.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
Just a self-awareness , yeah.
Speaker 2 (46:27):
And again, if we can start to craft that code, what
does that then mean for thefuture generations?
Right, All right yeah.
Speaker 1 (46:34):
All right, well, last question how do people get
involved with skills newbrunswick?
If they're in the province andthey're listening to this, how
do they get a hold of the team?
How do they volunteer?
How do they get involved?
Or, if you're a trades personand wants to help with training
or teaching or mentorship, whodo they reach out to?
Speaker 2 (46:52):
well they reach out to me.
I will take anyone personally.
I probably shouldn't, but I'mone of these only people that
still will pick up the phone andcold call everyone.
Speaker 1 (47:01):
Oh my God, I love it.
I never answer the phone.
I love talking to people.
My ADHD does not allow me toanswer the phone.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Oh no, I will.
Speaker 1 (47:07):
I'll even just look at it, wait for them to hang up
and then call them back, but Ijust can't answer it.
Speaker 2 (47:12):
No, they can reach out to us on social media.
We have a website and it's justskillscanadanbcom.
We're on Facebook, TikTok,Instagram, LinkedIn.
All the politicians, but wewere disconnected and that's
super important to me.
So we actually moved our officeto MVCC Moncton back in 2016
(47:43):
and, having that directconnection with the teachers,
the students have really allowedus to make this growth in a
pretty short period of time,with the pandemic in the middle.
Speaker 1 (47:52):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (47:53):
So I say I cannot thank the colleges and all their
staff for all their supportbecause, again, while I take
care of the lunches and then youknow, inviting you and the
t-shirts and the registration.
It really is those teacherexperts.
Speaker 1 (48:10):
A hundred percent that make these competitions.
And they're glowing too allweek.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
Oh, my god, like welding, I like.
I have to give a shout out tomr scott steen and adam stead
this morning because we had thewelding again has taken off and
it's huge and we had 13 spotsfor post-secondary as well
secondary, and then we had waitlists and this morning we had
two people from the waitlistshow up thinking they were in.
(48:38):
Yeah, hoping they were gettingin and and devastated when they
didn't think.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
And again, because the teachers and everyone are
here for the student theyfigured it out and all 15 people
were able like as soon as we'redone, I'm gonna go over there
and see how they did.
Speaker 2 (48:51):
Yeah, and I just to me, that's what it's all about.
Yeah, and I, I love, and thankyou so much for coming out here.
We've loved having you.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
And we'll see you in Shanghai.
No, we'll see you in Regina.
Speaker 2 (49:03):
You just wait.
Speaker 1 (49:06):
We're thinking about it too.
Speaker 2 (49:07):
We're, we got some.
Speaker 1 (49:08):
Let's talk.
Speaker 2 (49:08):
We're training a little bit for.
Regina so we'll see if we canintentionally put something.
We've, I will admit, any timein the past New Brunswick has
actually made Team Canada.
It was kind of by accident, wedidn't necessarily do it on
purpose?
Speaker 1 (49:23):
Yeah, not anymore.
Speaker 2 (49:24):
Yeah, not anymore, we're here to play.
We're here to play.
Speaker 1 (49:27):
Awesome.
Well, I hope to see many ofyour competitors in Regina,
because it'll be very, verylovely when Saskatchewan beats
them.
But that's fine, we'll uh butabout that, yeah, yeah we'll see
about that, I mean, but this isall fair in the spirit of
competitiveness always andalways a pleasure to see you,
courtney and always a pleasureto see you.
Thank you so much, all rightwell, thanks everyone for
watching and downloading andlistening to the podcast.
(49:49):
We uh make sure you check themall out from the skills can uh
skills, atlantic series and uh,you know, make sure that you get
back to us with feedback and,knowing what's going to happen
on the podcast, catch you at thenext one.
We hope you enjoy the show.
Speaker 3 (50:15):
Do you own a company in the welding industry or want
to share a targeted message withour listeners?
Then this 45-second audio adspace could be yours.
We have the coolest listenersfrom all over the world, with
over 60,000 downloads, and 88%are from North America.
This podcast serves to educateand connect the welding
(50:35):
community together and isavailable on all major platforms
, including the CWB GroupNetwork.
If you are interested, reachout to info at cwbassociationorg
.
Look at that.
I just gave you all of thatinformation in only 45 seconds.
You've been listening to theCWB Association Welding Podcast.
(50:56):
You've been listening to thecwb association welding podcast
and if you enjoyed what youheard today or want to send us
some questions to answer, youcan text the show using the link
in the episode descriptionbelow.
We can't wait to hear from you.
Please subscribe or visit us atcwbassociationorg to learn more
.
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