Unraveling Misinformation: Truth, Tribalism, and Critical Thinking

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What if standing firm in your beliefs makes you more susceptible to misinformation? Join me, Darrell McClain, as we unpack the complex dance between truth and tribalism in our media landscape. This episode challenges the conventional notion that unwavering belief is a virtue and suggests that it might actually blind us to deception. By examining the web of misinformation, such as the baseless allegations involving USAID and figures like Chelsea Clinton, we strive to illuminate how ideological commitments can cloud judgment, urging listeners to sharpen their critical thinking skills.

Dive into the murky waters of conspiracy theories as we dissect the false claims surrounding USAID's alleged financial dealings with celebrities and media outlets. From the fictitious narratives about payments to Ben Stiller and Angelina Jolie to the misinterpretations involving Politico and the BBC, we unravel the threads of deceit. Our aim is to differentiate between genuine financial transactions and mere subscriptions, highlighting the pressing need to combat misinformation in an age of rampant media trickery.

The conversation doesn't stop there. We also tackle pressing issues like corporate layoffs and their impact on the job market, as well as stories of justice like Gilbert Merritt III's exoneration after two decades of wrongful imprisonment. Touching on broader societal and political issues, including the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and the distractions of culture wars, we confront the moral dilemmas posed by political allegiances. This episode promises a thought-provoking journey through the complexities of justice, economics, and the political landscape, urging listeners to question and reason in our shared world.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
I was born in the mid-80s and so throughout the

(00:05):
90s, during the height of thehip-hop era, we had a lot of
sayings.
One of the sayings that wasvery popular to say is if you
don't stand for something, youwill fall for anything.
I actually like that ditty alot, but I actually think, after
living Almost 40 years on thisearth, that if you stand for

(00:31):
something, it is actually verylikely that you will also fall
for anything, and I think thatis because of the then, the will
that a lot of us have, the willthat a lot of us have to want
something to be true.
That just ain't so.

(00:51):
And this was a lesson that wasreinforced to me this week when
there were the fight over Doge,the fight over the Department,
so the department of governmentefficiency.
There was a fight over ummisinformation, disinformation,

(01:14):
a lot of uh lists going aroundon the internet be uh being
shared and um conversations Ihad with uh family and friends
and uh normal uh debatingpartners and other podcasters,
et cetera, about what is trueand what is not true.

(01:34):
This conversation with a lot ofactually very kind and
intelligent people who just havecertain ideologies some I agree
with, some I don't agree with,I could see that the problem is

(01:56):
not so much what they know, it'sthat what they know just may
not be so.
And I realized that a lot oftimes people fall for certain
media tricks.
They fall for a certain socialmedia tricks because they so

(02:16):
badly want what is to be, whatis being said, to be true.
You have a certain type ofontological belief system, that
is, a foundational principles ofwhich you stand.
You get information thatconfirms said beliefs and you

(02:37):
kind of carry the water forthose beliefs.
But in that vein, we're goingto have to go through some of a
bit of these claims and we'regoing to talk about what's true
and what's not true.
We're also going to just kindof explore some of the things
that happened throughout theweek as well, as I play this

(02:59):
game that I'm going to beplaying with you of what they
said then versus what they saynow.
Let's get into the episode.
Welcome to Darrell McClain.
Show them your host, darrellMcClain.
This is the episode would endup being 443 independent media.

(03:20):
That will not reinforcetribalism.
We have one planet, nobody isleaving, so let us reason
together.
So let's start with on this onewith the USAID stuff, so and
USAID is a kind of from myperspective a wing of United

(03:43):
States soft power.
It's also kind of a cia frontthat they use to topple a lot of
uh governments.
Yeah, the democrats kind ofgave the game away a bit when
one of the senators andcongressmen, um, etc.
We tried to defend USAID andsaid something like it's how we

(04:06):
get to fight China by going intoAfrica and making sure we get
important minerals, and kind ofgiving the game away.
That it's the USAID.
Aid is a foreign policy thingwhere the CIA uses that money to
kind of influence pedal inAfrica, in Somalia, in the

(04:30):
Middle East, etc.
So, that being said, there wereseveral lists going around on
the internet.
I'm not going to take the timeand read every list that said
every false thing, but I amgoing to and read every list
that said every false thing.
But I am going to somewhat getinto some of the nitty gritty of
it because a bit of a longershow.

(04:51):
So no, chelsea Clinton, benStiller and Politico didn't get
millions from USID the biggestDepartment of Government
Efficiency hoaxes that spread onX.
So false claims thatcelebrities receive millions of
dollars from the gutted USAgency for International

(05:12):
Development have spread on Xthis week among many viral
hoaxes about the organization,as President Donald Trump and
billionaire Department ofGovernment Efficiency czar Elon
Musk effectively shutter theUSAID.
So many false and misleadingclaims about USAID spending
practices have quickly spread onX, popped up by billionaires

(05:36):
including Musk and Bill Aikman.
Did Chelsea Clinton get a bigpaycheck from USAID?
That was obviously one of theclaims.
No.
Several viral posts on Xclaimed that Chelsea Clinton
ranked in large, a large $84million sum from USAID, but the

(05:58):
references to the Clintonsactually refer to the Families
Foundation on and the relatedorganizations that have received
USAID funding, and that is, ofcourseendinggov.

(06:27):
The grant that was given to theClinton Health Act's initiative
was used to fund the servicesin Zimbabwe between 2019 and
2021.
And Chelsea Clinton receives nocompensation as a board member,
including during the years thegrant money was used, and that

(06:51):
is according to IRS documents.
Next claim did the USAID paycelebrities to visit Ukraine,
including Ben Stiller andAngelina Jolie?
So, of course, this one wasgiven, brought to my attention
by one of the former guests andone of my cousins who kind of

(07:13):
floats down the conspiracywormhole, avid Trump supporter
etc.
And he gave it to me, broughtit to my attention.
I immediately kind of thoughtit was not true, but then wanted
to look into it because I doknow, like um.
So when I was in the unitedstates uh, military, it was very

(07:34):
rare, um, I wasn't going to saythey they used to have what was
called uso tours.
So there's a lot of times thatI met celebrities et cetera
because the USO would fly theminto the Middle East to kind of
entertain us.
Robin Williams used to do it, Imet the actors from Avatar and

(07:59):
so I thought that there could besomething to this.
But when I went and looked itup, there was actually no
evidence that USAID paidcelebrities to visit Ukraine.
So several viral social mediaposts accused USAID of paying
Ben Stiller, angelina Jolie,sean Penn and Orlando Bloom to

(08:21):
travel to Ukraine to takepictures with Ukrainian
President Vladimir Zelensky.
So according to Forbes magazine, forbes had reached out to
Stiller, jolie, penn and Bloomfor comment.
Stiller called the claimstotally false and untrue.
In a post on X he's clarifyinghe funded his entire trip to

(08:41):
Ukraine by himself and had notreceived any money from USID.
He also said that it was peopleneed to understand that this
was a part of a Russiandisinformation campaign to
somewhat have to have apropaganda war with Ukraine.

(09:02):
A propaganda war with Ukraine.
Now Sean Penn's litigationattorney, matthew Rosengart,
told Forbes that claims arecompletely false and noting that
Penn also self-funded his visitand he threatened to take legal
action if the deframatorystatements continue.
Now Elon Musk amplified thesefalse claims on X reporting Uh

(09:30):
and um, of course, because sorry, x and Facebook, to me those
are media organizations, butanyway.
So Musk uh reported, and Ireposting a video that was
fabricated to look like it hadbeen reported by E news.
E news then stepped in anddenied any statement to the AFP
that is credited to the video.
Very interesting.
The next one was did USAID fundresearch that caused the

(09:55):
COVID-19 pandemic?
The answer is no, no.
Now Musk reported a claim thatUSAID funded research by a
scientific nonprofit, echoHealth Alliance, that led to the
creation of COVID-19.
Now, although USAID and othergovernment agencies has given

(10:16):
its funds to an Echo HealthAlliance method and they are
very controversial and they arevery controversial the group has

(10:51):
previously said the virus thatit studied were not similar to
COVID.
Other right-wing leaning outletsfigures have spread the claims
that USAID gave news outletPolitico millions of dollars,
which Trump baselessly claimedwas to write good stories about
Democrats suggesting this couldbe the biggest scandal in
history, but when you look intoit, politico never received any
donations from USAID.

(11:12):
Now, according to the fundingrecords on USAspendinggov and a
statement from the company,usaid spent $44,000 between 2023
and 2024 on a subscriptioncalled Politico Pro, which the
news outlet describes asprofessional subscription
service used by companies andorganizations and yes, some

(11:35):
government agencies, and it istargeted specialized users and
private sectors who want totrack legislation and public
policy news.
Now the subscription reportedlystart at about $10,000.
Politico said it never receivedany government subsidies or
grants and clarify USID'spurchase was a transaction, not

(11:59):
funding.
Now conspiracies about Politicobeing funded by USID spread
after a technical error causedpaychecks from Politico staff to
be delayed earlier this week,leading some ex-users to jump to
the false conclusion that USAID, which was gutted before the
payroll issues, must have beenthe funding outlet for Politico

(12:21):
as well, which is what causedtheir payment glitch.
Next one was did USAID fundother media organizations, like
the British Broadcast Channel?
Other news outlets face similarhoaxes as Politico, as ex-users
use misleading and false casesand outright false claims about

(12:42):
the payments by USAID to mediacompanies like Politico.
Some of these transactions werepayments for subscriptions by
government agencies, not grants,not subsidies.
The New York Times said it hadnot received any grants and
clarified that the federal fundsit received were payments for
subscriptions that governmentoffices and agencies have
purchased to better understandthe world that government

(13:03):
offices and agencies havepurchased to better understand
the world.
Rutters and the AssociatedPress also said they have not
received government grants andagencies have purchased
subscriptions.
Instead, usaid and othergovernment agencies have funded
some global media organizations,but not many of the big name
outlets targeted by X.
The BBC said in a statementit's charity arm supporting

(13:26):
local media worldwide, bbc MediaAction, received about 8% of
its income from the USgovernment between 2023 and 2024
.
But the charity is whollyseparate from BBC News, which
does not receive any funding.
Usaid made 1.9 milliondonations to the BBC media
charity, not to BBC News, tosupport its efforts in India.

(13:50):
The rumors USAID funded the BBCNews were boosted by Musk.
Countries with limiteddemocracy, our free press,
including media in Ukraine andRussia, as well as the organized

(14:12):
crime corporation reportingproject, which supports
corruption reporting worldwide.
Another one was did USAID fundcondoms in Gaza and Afghanistan?
Various rumors that theDepartment of Government
Efficiency identified millionsin US spending on condoms in
Gaza and in the Middle Eastspread with no evidence.

(14:34):
Trump's press secretary,carolyn LeVette, claimed last
week the USAID spent $50 millionon condoms in Gaza.
Levette may have been referringto USAID's grants issued to the
International Medical Corp, agroup that provides aids to
victims of war, and totalingmore than $100 million, in which

(14:57):
a family planning programincluding contraceptives, were
included, which is typical foraid packages to developing
countries.
Now the Associated Pressreported that Rep Buddy Carter,
the Republican, claimed in aninterview Thursday that USAID
spent $15 million on condoms forthe Taliban, echoing a claim

(15:18):
made earlier this week by RepBrian Mass, a Republican from
the great state of Florida.
Ryan Mass, a Republican fromthe great state of Florida.
Now the Atlantic reported thatUSAID had in past funded condoms
for Afghan citizens, not forthe Taliban, which controls the
Afghanistan government.
Cnn reported the agency did notfund any condoms for the entire

(15:40):
Middle East during the threeprevious fiscal years.
Now an ex uh must said theunited states should not be
sending us taxpayers money tobuy condoms for foreigners and
baselessly claim money forcontraceptives ended in the
pockets of hamas.
Did usaid fund a transgenderopera and a dei musical?

(16:02):
No, levette and several viralposts on X claimed USAID spent
thousands of money ontransgender opera in Columbia
and, although the government didgive a grant to the Columbia
University to increasetransgender representation, it
wasn't a USAID fund.
The State Department gave$25,000 to a universal program

(16:27):
called Universidad des LosAngeles in Boca Raton for a
purpose in 2021.
Similarly, the State Departmentnot USAID gave $70,000 in 2022
to fund a musical in Irelandthat promoted diversity, equity,
inclusion and accessibility.

(16:49):
Did USAID spend six milliondollars on tourism in Egypt?
No, usaid announced a sixmillion dollar payment to Egypt
to increase educationalopportunities and strengthen
livelihoods of the people inNorth Sion, not to fund tourism,
as the White House claimed.
The White House fact checksheet linked to USAID's

(17:12):
announcement actually does notmention tourism at all and it
was issued in 2019 duringTrump's first administration.
Were any of the controversialclaims of USAID spending
actually true?
Yes, usaid did provide fundingfor several programs that have

(17:32):
been slammed by Republicans.
Usaid gave $1.5 million in 2022to advance diversity, equity
and inclusion in Serbian'sworkplace and business
communities communities and toincrease employment
opportunities for LGBTQ Serbians.
This payment was slammed byLeVette and several Republican
members of Congress, includingTed Cruz, the Republican senator

(17:56):
from Texas, and the White Housealso criticized a $2 million
payment by USAID for sex changesin Guatemala, which turned out
not to be true.
But USAID did make a $2 millionpayment to strengthen translate
organizations and genderaffirming healthcare in
Guatemala.
Through gender affirming care,income passes more used for.

(18:17):
So that took us a while and, asI said before in a previous show
, everybody knows I like dittiesand this is just.

(18:38):
This is one.
The ally will get around theworld three times before a troop
even gets out of the bed andputs his pants on.
And what I've learned from justmy many years of talking about
foreign policy etc.
Is I'll just say the governmentis bad enough.

(18:59):
The government does enoughfoolish things without us having
to make stuff up and because ofthe way this whole game works
when it comes to social media, alot of times people can just
make stuff up of times, becauseof people's ideological

(19:23):
persuasions, they will accept itas true because they want it to
be true.

Speaker 2 (19:32):
members of the Tuskegee Airmen has died a hero
and a trailblazer.
Tonight here remembering anAmerican hero, a group of
average.

Speaker 3 (19:41):
Americans must become a team of fighting men with
wings.

Speaker 2 (19:46):
Retired Lieutenant Colonel Harry Stewart Jr was a
fighter pilot in World War II,part of the Tuskegee Airmen,
America's first ever blackcombat pilots.

Speaker 3 (19:55):
Squadron after squadron out of Tuskegee.

Speaker 2 (19:57):
The Tuskegee Airmen playing a vital role in the US
victory of World War II.
Lieutenant Colonel Stewartwould fly 43 combat missions
during World War II.
Lieutenant Colonel Stewartwould fly 43 combat missions
during World War II.
He was one of only fourTuskegee Airmen with three
air-to-air victories in a singleday, taking down three Nazi
planes in one flight At 18,training with the first group of

(20:18):
black pilots at Tuskegee ArmyAirfield in Alabama.
Retiring in 1950, he would goon to become an executive in
Detroit.
Lieutenant Colonel Stewart, oneof the last Tuskegee surviving
airmen, died at his home inBloomfield Hills, michigan.
He was 100 years old Tonight.
Here retired Lieutenant ColonelStewart.

Speaker 4 (20:36):
In his own words I'm just happy that I did my part
and that's it, and if any of thebenefits that our race derived
from it gives me very, very,very proud we honor his
sacrifice so in the the durellmclean uh reading club, this

(20:57):
week I'm reading the book by thesenator from vermont, uh,
bernie sanders.

Speaker 1 (21:04):
Uh, the book is called it's Okay to Be Angry
About Capitalism, of course.
Remember last month I read thebook by Walter Isaacson about
Elon Musk, and so this month weare going through Bernie
Sanders' book Now reading thebook.

(21:24):
It is actually well done and ofcourse it led me to certain
thoughts.
And of course everybody knowson this show.
I always say Of courseeverybody knows.

(21:45):
On this show.
I always say I'm concernedabout the money, I'm an economic
existentialist is kind of thething.
And so one of the things that itmade me ask was what does it
actually mean to be a freeperson in the United States of
America?
And and um, and of course thatcomes from the economic

(22:28):
standpoint that I take under theDepartment of the Navy and
several years working for theDepartment of Homeland Security
and in the private industry.
Shift work makes my sleeppattern abnormal.
But what I asked was what doesit truly mean to be free?

(22:49):
Are individuals genuinely freeif they are unable to access
medical care when they face illor face financial ruin upon
leaving the hospital?
Are they truly free if theycannot afford prescription
medications necessarily tosustain their lives?
Are individuals truly free whenthey devote over half of their

(23:11):
income to housing costs and arecompelled to secure loans from
payday lenders at exorbitantrates of 200% interest?
Are seniors truly free at theage of 70 if they are still
forced to work due toinsufficient pensions or
retirement savings?
Are individuals truly free ifthey are unable to pursue higher

(23:31):
education or vocationaltraining due to their family's
limited financial resources?
Are individuals truly free ifthey are forced to work
extensive hours, often 60 plusor 80 hours a week, simply to
make ends meet due to the lackof jobs offering a living wage?
Are new parents truly free ifthey are compelled to return to

(23:53):
work immediately following thebirth of their child due to the
absence of paid family leave?
Are small business owners orfamily farmers truly free if
they are pushed out of themarket by the monopolistic
practices of large corporations?
Are veterans truly free if,after putting their lives on the
line to defend their country,they find themselves without a
home and forced to live on thestreets?

(24:15):
Are individuals truly free ifthey work in a job that offers
no genuine autonomy and arevulnerable to the authoritarian,
which may result intoautomation, which may result in
not only them losing their jobs,but having to train their
replacement to take their jobs.
Are individuals truly free whencritical decisions regarding

(24:36):
technological advancements insuch areas such as communication
, health care and welfare aremade by multinational
corporations prioritizingprofits over public health and
well-being?
The answer is that Americansmay not be nearly as free as
they perceive themselves to bethe company.

Speaker 5 (24:58):
Workday announced it is cutting about 8% of its
workforce.
Workday, which is based inPleasanton, says the cuts will
work out to about 1,700 jobs.
The company's CEO says thechanges are part of a
restructuring plan and that thecompany is also investing more
in AI and continuing to hire inother strategic areas.

(25:18):
The impacted workers may knowby today this is the second
round of cuts for Workday in ayear.
It did cut 3% of its workforcelast February.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
So Workday is based in Placenton, is cutting 1,750
jobs.
Salesforce in San Francisco andis cutting 1,750 jobs.
Salesforce in San Francisco andWalmart are also slashing jobs.
Workday is the payroll and HRcompany based in Pleasanton, and
they announced on Wednesdaythat they're cutting 8.5% of
their workforce to use AIinstead.

(25:51):
Basically, the CEO, carlAsenbach, said the changes are
part of a restructuring plan.
He began with an open lettercalling his employees workmates
and said the company is at apivotal moment where the
companies everywhere arere-managing and re-imagining how
work gets done and increasing ademand for AI as a potential

(26:14):
drive to as an era of new growthfor Workday.
So what else do?
We don't know is.
Workday is a global company andit's unclear how many cuts will
occur over time.
The big picture is that thisthe Salesforce base in San

(26:38):
Francisco announced it will alsobe slashing 1,000 jobs while
hiring artificial intelligenceroles.
The company has not disclosedwhich division will be affected
by job cuts.
In addition, walmart, thenation's largest private
employer, is eliminatinghundreds of roles and closing
one of its North Carolinaoffices as it continues to pull

(27:00):
workers back to its main hubs inCalifornia and Arkansas,
according to the internal memoseen on Fox Business on Tuesday.
On Tuesday, walmart ChiefPeople Officer Donald Morris
said in a memo sent to employeesthat the company is cutting

(27:22):
roles and asking office-basedemployees in Hoboken and some of
its smaller offices to relocateto the company's newly opened
headquarters in Arkansas, aswell as the offices in Sun
Valley, california.
In Sun Valley, california.
So tough times actually may becoming, because the job market
is actually flashing signs thatlayoffs probably could

(27:43):
accelerate this year.
There are signals coming fromemployers that they hit that
layoffs could accelerate.
Layoff announcement rose 28% inJanuary from the prior month,
according to Challenger data.
Now business filings of masslayoffs as well have also
elevated in the month.
The resilient US job marketcould weaken this year, with

(28:07):
employers sharing early signsthat they are readying for more
job cuts in 2025.
For more job cuts in 2025.
So job cuts announcementscontinued to rise in January,
even as the labor marketremained on solid footing.
Overall, layoff announcementsswelled to 49,795 over the month

(28:27):
of January, according to thedata from Challenger Gray and
Christmas.
That marks a 28% increase fromthe prior month, though it was
the quietest January for thelayoff announcement since 2022,
the career replacement firm saidin the report.
Now the number looks poised toincrease in the coming months,
giving recent layoffsannouncements.

(28:49):
The firm added.
Since the start of February, admhas said it was planning to cut
up to 700 workers in the latestcost-cutting measures.
While Salesforce had worked,they also made plans of cutting
1,000 workers and 1,750 workersrespectively.
January was relatively quiet interms of job cut announcements.

(29:10):
However, we've also seen majorannouncements in the early days
of February, so it seems quiteunlikely to last.
Andrew Challenger, the seniorvice president, wrote in a note.
Meanwhile, warren Filingsregulatory filings business with
more than 100 workers mustadmit if they are planning to
lay off.
More than 50 people at worksites have also increased in

(29:30):
recent months.
Companies filed 253 layoffnotices in December with plans
to cut 21,873 jobs, according topublic records accessed by
WarrantTrackercom.
Now that's up from the primemonth when firms filed 217
notices with plans to cut 20,105workers.

(29:52):
Now the numbers and thepositions covered by warrant
Fowler jumped in November andremained relatively high in
December.
As a result, we still think thetrend in claims will rise to
about 250,000 people by the endof quarter one, reflecting a
fading drag from residualsensibility and the
deterioration of underlyingtrends.

(30:14):
Now that comes from SamuelToombs, the chief US economist
at Pantheon Macroeconomics Now.
Hiring was robust in December.
The economy added 256,000 jobsthat month, well above the
expected 164,000 jobs.
The jobless rate, meanwhile,remained near record low,

(30:35):
slipping to 4.1%.
Economic forecasters do havebeen observing weaker labor
market conditions in the pastyear, with the unemployment rate
climbing 30 basis pointsthroughout 2024.
Friday job support was expectedto show that hiring decelerated
but continued to grow.
In January, economists expectUS employers to have added

(30:58):
170,000 jobs, according toFactSet.
In Virginia there's a guy by thename of Gilbert Merritt III Now
.
He spent more than 20 years inprison for a murder in Norfolk
he did not commit.
His exoneration was settledafter a witness told a judge she
lied under oath due tomanipulation and threats from a

(31:20):
disgraced Norfolk detective,robert Glenn Ford.
Now the delegate, rip Sullivanwants to make it easier for
wrongfully incarcerated peoplelike Merritt, who was imprisoned
due to intentional acts by lawenforcement, to get a maximum
payout outlined in the state.
Now this is coming out ofNorfolk, virginia, where I'm

(31:44):
currently sitting.
Now, standing before stategallants.
During the General Assemblyhearing last month, a tearful
Gilbert shared a deep andemotional toll of spending more
than 20 years in prison for acrime he did not commit and it
has taken on his life.

(32:06):
You know the toll it took.
He said his whole family wasripped apart, which, of course,
is understandable.
During the January committeemeeting to hear the testimony
about a bill that wouldcompensate him for his wrongful
incarceration.
Now Merritt was in his 20s inthe year 2001 when he was

(32:30):
sentenced to 30 years in prisonfor murder in Norfolk.
Sentenced to 30 years in prisonfor murder in Norfolk.
The Merritt's exoneration wassettled in 2024, according to a
bill asking the General Assemblyto compensate Merritt as a
witness confessed in the year2001,.

(32:51):
Later told the Norfolk CircuitCourt judge in 2022 that she
lied under oath due tomanipulation and threats from a
disgraced Norfolk detective,robert Glenn Ford.
Ford is infamously tied tofalse confessions of four
Norfolk sailors in the 1997 rapeand murder of Michelle Moore

(33:13):
Bosco.
Those men have also sincegained their freedom After
retiring from the Norfolk PoliceDepartment.
Forrest was sentenced in 2010to 12 years in federal prison
for taking bribes from drugdealers while on the job.
Shouldn't we give these peoplemore money because of how they

(33:34):
were mistreated?
Shouldn't we give these peoplemore money because of how they
were mistreated by DetectiveFord?
Said Delegate Rip Sullivan fromFairfax during the same January
hearing where Mayer shared hisstory.
It's hardly a stretch that fourtimes base the amount,
regardless of this, might beproper.
Depp Sullivan authored a billthis year that would have
removed barriers for people whowere wrongfully incarcerated due

(33:56):
to intentional actions by lawenforcement to receive quadruple
the base pay rate outlined inthe state's law.
Current state law allows thatlawmakers to compensate and
order exonerated people roughly55 000 for each year they spent
in prison.
The current law also allowspeople like mary, who have been
incarcerated due to intentionalacts, to receive up to four

(34:18):
times that amount, but only ifthe city or county that wronged
them would contribute to thepayout.
The delegate stressed to hisfellow delegates during the
hearing do we want to hand overthis responsibility, which we
can enhance someone's claimsunder the wrongful and contrary
statutes and give localities theability to block it, either

(34:39):
because they don't like theresults or they can't pony up
the money?
However, delegate Sullivan'sfix fell apart in the committee,
but his colleagues in the Houseof Delegates did agree that the
state could double the pay forpeople like Merritt on their own
and still allow the wrongperson to go after the city or
the county where they werewrongfully convicted for more

(35:01):
money.
Sullivan's bill is now in theVirginia Senate's hands and
could face more challenges andamendments.
Thing but the front of the packwhen it comes to terms how we
treat our citizens who have beenso badly wronged, said Sullivan
in a conversation in 2022 abouthis successful effort to

(35:21):
increase the yearly payout forwrongfully incarcerated people.
Regardless of the fate of thebill, the measure to secure
compensation for merit at thecurrent pay rate is on path for
approval, yet there is no amountof money that can make up for
what people like Merritt haveendured.
It is no real answer, saidMerritt.

(35:45):
It's no real closure.
Ford has never been criminallycharged for his connection to
the wrongful incarcerations.
Unfortunately, a reported in2023, norfolk's Commonwealth
Attorney, ron Fitts, is allowingthe University of Virginia's
Innocent Project to reviewFord's old cases to learn if
there are any additionalinnocent people that he, his

(36:07):
investigations, etc.
Put in prison.

Speaker 6 (36:10):
Every investigation reveals black people are more
likely to be wrongfullyincarcerated for crimes they did
not commit than any other groupin America.
According to the NationalRegistry of Exonerations, while
black people are just over 13%of the US population, they are
53% of the 3,200 exonerationssince 1989.

(36:30):
I analyzed the registry'snumbers for Virginia.
Data shows of the 64 peopleexonerated in the Commonwealth
since 1989, half of them areblack men.
While those men have beenexonerated, there's a number of
people who were freed becausethe evidence shows they're
innocent, but the courts andprevious governors have yet to
exonerate them.

(36:51):
As a few of them shared with meduring a conversation at the
UVA Innocence Project, those menare asking what more do they
have to prove?

Speaker 7 (36:59):
They actually allowed me to be encaged in that prison
.

Speaker 6 (37:04):
A horrific experience shared among these men.

Speaker 8 (37:07):
Incarceration is damaging to the mind, the body
and the spirit, especially thespirit.

Speaker 6 (37:15):
Their bond forged in a bondage that evidence
indicates they never should haveendured.

Speaker 7 (37:21):
The relationships that we shared.
That's what helped me getthrough Us.
We didn't.

Speaker 6 (37:26):
Each man convicted of crimes in the Commonwealth in
the 90s, when incarcerationrates started soaring nationwide
.

Speaker 7 (37:32):
So you can clearly see that during that particular
time of incarceration, somethingwas wrong with the justice
system.

Speaker 6 (37:40):
Rojay Fentress was 16 years old when he was convicted
of murder in Richmond.
He'd spent 24 years in prisonwhen former Governor Ralph
Northam set him free in 2020.

Speaker 7 (37:50):
So I fainted when I was convicted, but I didn't cry
or shed a tear when I wassentenced, because I knew that
wasn't my sin.
That ain't what God had for me.

Speaker 6 (37:58):
Darnell Phillips was 19 years old when he was
sentenced to life for the rapeof a Virginia Beach girl.
He was paroled in 2018 afternearly 28 years in prison.

Speaker 7 (38:08):
It threw me away, you know, because I didn't matter,
my life didn't matter, my breathon earth didn't matter, like I
didn't matter, like my lifedidn't matter, like my breath on
earth didn't matter.

Speaker 6 (38:15):
Messiah Johnson was 24 when he was sentenced to
essentially life in prison for abeauty salon robbery in Norfolk
.
I wrote the story about hisquest for freedom in 2017.
He was released by formerGovernor Terry McAuliffe the
following year after 21 years inprison.

Speaker 8 (38:29):
I fought for my freedom since day one, since the
day they put the handcuffs onme.

Speaker 6 (38:36):
In all, these men have spent more than 70 years
behind bars.

Speaker 4 (38:38):
This is a problem.
It needs to be addressed.

Speaker 6 (38:40):
The UVA Innocence Project estimates anywhere
between 40,000 and 230,000prisoners are actually innocent.
So what's driving this?
The National Registry ofExonerations points to mistaken
witness identification, which ismore likely to happen to people
of color, misconduct by policeand prosecutors and false or
misleading evidence.

Speaker 7 (39:01):
Seek justice and not conviction.

Speaker 6 (39:03):
In Phillips, virginia Beach case in 1990, the little
girl identified him as therapist but Innocence Project
attorneys learned that was onlyafter Beach police misled the
little girl about the weight ofevidence against Phillips.
Attorneys also learned that theDNA evidence excluded Phillips
as the perpetrator.
The victim now supportsPhillips' exoneration.

(39:24):
You can clearly see thatsomething's wrong.
In Ventress' case the InnocenceProject learned the woman who
identified him in that 1996Richmond murder told the
detective she was intoxicatedduring the interrogations.
She initially identifiedsomeone else but the detective
did not disclose that during thetrial.

Speaker 8 (39:42):
I want to be vindicated, and exoneration is
my path to death.

Speaker 6 (39:46):
And, in Johnson's case, a victim in the 1997
Norfolk Beauty Salon robbery hewas accused of.
Identified him days later froma distance at night while police
surrounded Johnson.
The definition of a suggestiveshow up at sensing a family
friend helped Johnson keep thefaith.

Speaker 8 (40:03):
I must have.
My head must have went down alittle bit.
She had the awareness to sayhold your head up, we ain't
gonna stop fighting, come on.
And you know, I just kind ofstood up straight and I've been
standing up straight since then.

Speaker 6 (40:16):
And now side by side with his brothers in their
journey for justice.

Speaker 7 (40:20):
I see Messiah like family, that's what I see in
that.
I met Roseanne.
Like little brother.
I met his name.
I just want to live.

Speaker 6 (40:30):
And they are.
Phillips is a pastor, johnsonhas his own trucking business.
Still Virginia courts havefailed to exonerate them, but
Governor Glenn Youngkin can,with an absolute pardon.

Speaker 7 (40:41):
I've just been waiting for someone to do the
right thing.
All I want is for that lastshackle on me, that last shackle
, to be broken off of me.
We're going to stand before God.
My conscience is clear brokenoff of me.

Speaker 6 (40:56):
We're going to stand before God.
My conscience is clear.
Governor Youngkin has until theend of his term to exonerate
them, making them eligible forcompensation from the state.
But what's the solution to stopwrongful incarcerations in the
first place?
Some prosecutors say morediversity among prosecutors and
police is a start, and tougherscrutiny of using eyewitness
identification alone, which isthe leading cause of wrongful
convictions.
You may remember myinvestigation into former

(41:18):
Chesapeake basketball coachBrian Falcon's conviction.
He was set free after ourreports revealed the victim in a
2012 robbery identified him ina suggestive show and our
reports revealed the DNAcollected from the crime scene
did not match Falcon.
He was freed in January and hasyet to be exonerated either.
To learn more about theunreliability of using

(41:41):
eyewitness identification aloneand the wrongful incarceration
rates in Virginia, click insidethis story at WTKRcom.
Jessica Larche, News 3.

Speaker 1 (41:52):
So that's just something that's sad and
ridiculous that this is stillhappening in the year 2025.
And in the state that I amcurrently sitting in, 20 years

(42:18):
of a 30 year sentence for acrime you did not commit because
a detective purposely trumpedup charges against you, and then
that detective is still notbeing had not been charged for
all the people who he falselyput in jail and is getting
sitting in jail now for 12 yearsless time than the people he

(42:39):
had wrongly convicted because hewas caught during another crime
, which was bribing drug dealers, etc.
Accepting payouts from drugdealers.
This is why I have alwayssuggested that I am against the
death penalty, etc.
Because when you have stufflike this, when the system is

(43:07):
this corrupt and corroded?
corrupt and corroded?
How could you trust that thepeople that you have put on
death penalty are the peoplethat actually did the crime when
you have a evidence afterevidence, case after case of, of

(43:28):
, of erroneous arrest, of fakeevidence, of, uh, of the
exculpatory evidence that couldget somebody off being purposely
um hidden?
This is a monstrous betrayal ofwhat justice is supposed to be,
and this is why I've alwayssaid you should not give a

(43:48):
corrupt government and a corruptsystem the tools and the power
to kill its own citizens.
Absolute power corruptsabsolutely, and that does not
change because you give somebodya shiny collar device or a
badge.
One of the funniest thingshappened this week that I've

(44:10):
been kind of debating,ironically, also this week.
So on Tuesday, president Trumpsigned an executive order
designed to prohibit transgenderstudents from participating in
girls sport.
Now, despite that fact that thenumbers in the US are extremely
small, the number is evenfurther when you look
specifically at the people heclaimed that he wants to target.

(44:33):
So the numbers shrink evenfurther when you look at middle
school and high school.
According to Newsweek's,jillian Breitbart, a
spokesperson for the AmericanCivil Liberties Union, pointed
out that, to save women's sports.
One of the spending groupspushing for such bans could only
actually themselves identifyfive transgender athletes

(44:55):
competing on the girls teams inK-12 sports.
So let me just say this againthat is not 5,000.
That is not 500.
That is not 50.
There are five trans studentathletes.
Yet lawmakers have poured timeand political energy, on
political outrage, intolegislation aimed at stopping

(45:18):
this tiny handful of youngpeople from playing in school
sports.
Now, if they can write a billthat will target only five
students, why not write one onthe taxes to, you know, the top
10% of US families who controlover 60% of the nation's wealth
and use it to help everydayAmericans who are struggling?

(45:40):
It is because and this is whatI have been debating with some
people this week this is aculture war issue.
This group is a very smallpercent of the population.
They do not affect these thingslike people think that they
affect.

(46:01):
And when you have years ofrhetoric, years of rhetoric
aimed at a said group, and thenthe legislation comes down and
you see the legislation affectsfive people.
Now think about all themillions of dollars in ads.
You know that this was a con.

(46:23):
This was nothing more than abait and switch to get people
riled up about something thathas no material effect on their
lives will not put a penny in apocket, will not change their
lives in one material way.
It is a ploy that is alwaysused by the donor class to stop

(46:47):
people from looking at what thereal material problems in their
life are, which are economic.
And if you can stop people fromfocusing on the economic
disparity between those who haveand those who have not, if you
can stop people from focusing onthe cost of the groceries, et

(47:09):
cetera, et cetera, and get intofocus on wedge issues, you are
going to always have people tomanipulate and unfortunately,
because of the tribal nature ofthe way humans think, they are
always easily ready to bemanipulated.
So let me tell you a secretabout me.

(47:31):
I, darrell McClain, consume alot of eggs.
I was spoiled for many yearsbecause one of my closest
friends owns a farm and on thatfarm he used to have chickens.
So, out of the kindness of hisheart, he would regularly give

(47:54):
me free eggs, people that workedat his job eggs, as well as
people that just were around him, because they were free for him
, because he owned a lot ofchickens and I got spoiled with
getting the deliciousfree-ranged brown eggs Now.

(48:15):
So being outside of the economywhen it comes to eggs made me a
spoiled little brat because Inever, ever, had to pay
attention to the price of eggswhen I started to go to the
grocery store to get eggs, itwas also relatively inexpensive.

(48:39):
I would get 30 eggs and theywould be about $3 for 30 eggs
from the local food line.
So I was shocked when, duringthe Biden administration, we
started to hear all thisconversation about the price of
eggs going up and it made me dothis thing that I rarely do when

(49:02):
I go shopping.
I am historically weird when itcomes to things like gas and
groceries.
I do not look at the prices ofthings.
I make a list, I go, I grab it,I go to the register, I swipe,
I move on with my life.
I don't pay attention to gasprices.
I have already in my head I amputting $25 in the car, I go and

(49:25):
put said $25 in the car, Idrive off, I, I and it's.
It's somewhat similar when,when I go grocery shopping, I'll
say my plan is to spend 150bucks, uh, I go and I grab the
things on the list, list I, thenmy total will come up to eighty
two dollars.
I say mission accomplished.

(49:46):
I spent less than 150 bucks.
Now, during the campaign, it wasall a buzz that the prices of
eggs were going through the roofand a mistake that Joe Biden
was making, you know, accordingto the the um analysts was there
was inflation at the cost ofeggs, normally around a dollar

(50:11):
or so.
$2, $3 were just skyrocketingto the fact that now 12 eggs
would be $4.
And when Donald Trump wasrunning of course, as
politicians do he said he wasgoing to take care of it.
Jd Vance had a famous tweetwhere he talked about how, when

(50:31):
Kamala Harris took office, theprice of eggs were a dollar, but
because of Kamala Harrisinflationary policies, the cost
of eggs are now $4 or somethinglike that.
So yours truly, your humbleservant, goes to the local
grocer to get 12 eggs.
I actually wanted to get 30eggs.

(50:52):
To be honest, the egg shelf wasalmost bare, and so I grabbed
the 12 free range beautifulbrown eggs that I like to get,
and I go to the register and domy normal thing of not looking
at the price, but I'm inself-checkout.
As I scan the 12 eggs, it says$7.47.

(51:17):
And that was the reality that Iguess the price of eggs have
drastically gone up, because theself-checkout that used to say
one dollar, two dollar, threedollar now is saying seven
dollars.
And out of all the things thatwere said on the campaign trail,

(51:40):
it actually does not seem, whenyou look at the market analysis
, that this price of eggs thingis going to get better anytime
soon.
In fact, when I was looking upthe research, it actually showed
that, according to the marketanalysis, the price of eggs will
probably not go down untilsometime in May.
Now eggs are the ingredientthat people use in cooking to

(52:08):
make almost everything, so thisis going to affect everyday
people.
Now, of course, we run into thebig problem that people on the
campaign trail said one thingand they had a plan to do one
thing.
And of course now you see thepolicies that are being passed
and they see that it is verydifficult to actually solve this

(52:30):
problem.
Yours truly will survive.
I'm not going to stop buyingeggs.
I'm going to keep doing thesame thing that I used to do.
I'm still going to be on thesearch for the 30 eggs and if I
can't get them out, just buy the12 and keep it moving.
But not everybody is asfortunate as me and this is

(52:54):
going to become a big problem,whether people want to ignore it
or not.
For partisan political purposesthese are pocketbook issues.
You can distract people for awhile with the trans stuff.
You can distract people a whilewith the old the gays are
kissing.
Should they be allowed to bemarried?

(53:16):
You can distract people a whilewith the culture war stuff.
But eventually, when they startgoing to the store and they
realize things aren't gettingcheaper, like was promised,
we're going to run into a verybig problem very, very fast.
It's very easy to campaign, infact, as somebody who's on the

(53:41):
outside of the Republican Party,disgruntled ex-Republican, as
somebody who's on the outside ofthe Democratic Party the only
person that I ever officiallyliked who even ran on the
Democratic ticket was SenatorBernie Sanders.
Senator Bernie Sanders the onlyDemocrat that I can somewhat

(54:02):
stomach are all the outsiders,the AOCs, the Bernie Sanderses,
the Elizabeth Warrens, the kindof the crazy people in the party
I guess they would becategorized as and, when it
comes to the Republican Party,the person that I think that
obviously has their finger onthe pulse of what's more correct

(54:24):
would be your Rand Paul's, yourJosh Hawley's, your Thomas
Massey's, and so my politicalcoalition is actually very tiny.
Welcome to the world ofanarcho-syndicalism.
The viewpoints that I have arenot going to be shared with a
large portion of the americanpublic.

(54:44):
Uh, in the american context I'dbe considered a libertarian,
internationally anarco-syndicalism, uh.
But anyway.
But one thing that I recognizethat ties us all together is we
have to eat, and I'm hoping thatwhen people start to recognize

(55:05):
that it hasn't gotten any easierfor them to eat, that they may
start to realize wait a minute,something is going on.
So why we have this thing goingon where the billionaires have
gotten hold of the treasurydepartment and they're looting
it, while pretending thatthey're doing it for the
American people?
I want people to think and seeis any of this money that

(55:27):
they're allegedly stopping frombeing looting from the Treasury
Department is going to end up inyour pocket?
And if it doesn't, if yourmaterial life hasn't gotten any
better, are you going to coursecorrect?
It's very easy to have an enemy.
It's very easy to have somebodyto point to.
One of the brilliant things thatDonald Trump has always been

(55:48):
able to do, which I want to seeif he can pull it off this term
is to be in control of thegovernment, while acting as if
he is above high, looking at thegovernment and the government
is wrong.
This is why they talk about thedeep state.
To act as if you are runningthe government but you are

(56:09):
somehow not in control of thegovernment is a great talent,
and it's one of the one ofdonald trump's many, many great
talents is to be in controlwhile at the same time uh,
during the first term actinglike he was not in control.
The place is actually run by abunch of bureaucrats, which, in

(56:30):
a lot of senses, the place isrun by a bunch of bureaucrats,
but to act like you were not incontrol of said bureaucrats and
you can't fire them or you don'tput them into place or you
didn't hire them, is a feat thatI wonder if this current
administration is going to getaway with.
Now, and I think, when it comesto these egg prices and if the

(56:55):
groceries don't go down, I wantto see if the economic populism
of the right is going to respond, especially when you have this,
this fight that continues tobrew with Steve Bannon and Elon
Musk, which, on that side of thefight, steve Bannon, in my

(57:18):
observation is correct.
Steve Bannon has his pulse onthe actual American populace and
he's not too interested in theglobalization, he's not too
interested in the massimmigration, he's not too
interested in the overtaking oftech billionaires, because he

(57:40):
has a real, a actual, real andgenuine economic critique and he
knows that money has no loyaltyto any country, he knows that
multinational corporations, bythe very nature, cannot be loyal
to the country and he is verycritical of financialization of,

(58:03):
I'll just say, the Americanpublic.
And the billionaires come totown to save us silliness that a
lot of people have kind ofbought into.
And so at least you know whereI stand, and and so at least you

(58:31):
know I stand, I'm on the SteveBannon side of the argument when
it comes to the type ofpopulism.
So yours truly is feeling thepain of egg prices.
I'm very interested in this onlybecause I recognize that there
was a lot of talk about theprice of eggs during the
campaign.
It was the top subject.
And when I did a just a tinyGoogle search of the stories
about the eggs, et cetera, etcetera, all of a sudden nothing.

(58:54):
Uh uh.
Donald Trump's only beenpresident for three weeks or so,
but all of a sudden, no newsstories about the price of eggs,
no news stories about how theprices are going up, even though
the prices have still beenincreasing.
What they said before versuswhat they said now is going to
be very interesting.

(59:14):
I'm actually very happy thatDonald Trump has allowed
independent media into the presscorps, independent media into
the press corps.
Steve Bannon's War Room will bethere and, yes, obviously
they're on the right, butthey're going to be very
critical, they're going to beasking some very serious

(59:35):
questions, and so that's a plus,a win for independent media.

Speaker 8 (59:38):
How long will it take to cycle through and get some
of the actual prices thatAmericans are paying to come
down?

Speaker 9 (59:42):
Prices at the store and at the grocery pump across
the board, sure?
Well, the president is doingeverything he can, obviously, to
reduce the cost of livingcrisis in this country as
quickly as possible.
That's why he signed a litanyof executive orders across the
board in the first couple ofweeks here.
He declared a national energyemergency.
He committed to cutting 10regulations for every new one on

(01:00:04):
the book as you know, workingfor a Fox business-related
outlet, deregulation and energyindependence are huge drivers of
reducing inflation in thiscountry and I think Americans
can be assured by the resultsPresident Trump had in his first
term when, again, inflation was1.4 percent when he left office
.
Will it be months?

Speaker 2 (01:00:22):
or will Americans have?

Speaker 9 (01:00:22):
the patience to wait for it.
So of course, here's theproblem with that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
Like I said, there is a timeline.
The timeline, according to allexperts, is the prices are going
to be high until May.
The problem with that is, ofcourse, I can survive until May,
fairly decent when it comes tobeing able to buy food or
whatever.
But Donald Trump on thecampaign, made a certain promise

(01:00:58):
of when the problem would besolved.
Promises made, promises kept.
Question mark.

Speaker 9 (01:01:05):
When I will immediately bring prices down,
starting on day one, becausepeople can't afford their
groceries and we're going tostraighten it out.
We're going to bring prices waydown.
It'll also bring your grocerybill way down.
We'll get it done fast andthey're going to be affording
their groceries very soon.

Speaker 1 (01:01:21):
Yeah, day one, day one.
So of course, politicians lieand exaggerate.
The question that I'm going tohave is how many people, when
Donald Trump said day one,really thought he meant five
months in, and if they cansurvive almost half of the year

(01:01:42):
with the prices being outrageous, and what is the actual plan to
lower the prices?
And, like I said many times, alot of this is not about
production.
A lot of this is out of thehands of the president.
A lot of this is about pricegouging.
A lot of this is about pricegouging.
A lot of this is about the newbird flu and the Biden

(01:02:03):
administration killing unsaidnumber of chickens because of
the bird flu outbreak.
But when you have people who sobadly want something to be true
and they vote on something sobadly to be true, when that
bubble is popped, the responsesometimes is visceral and

(01:02:28):
unfortunately I'm already seeingthis.
And look, I'm not somebody togloat and say, yes, I told you

(01:03:01):
so.
But when you look at this stuff, like the Muslims for Trump and
now they're online complainingbecause their family members are
getting deported I look at themlike, oh, you didn't know that
you were in America illegallyand that they can't admit what
they were going to say when theywere talking about mass
deportations.
You didn't think that wasserious.

(01:03:22):
When I look at the gaze forTrump and then the second
they're getting power.
You now have people trying toget Obergefell to the Supreme
Court to be overturned and I say, oh, so you didn't think that
Trump was going to come for you,for your gay marriage, and
they're maybe about to losethose rights.
When I see the groups, theblacks for Trump, and I laugh.

(01:03:45):
And because they're complainingbecause they got fired because
their jobs were targeted becauseit was labeled DEI, and I say,
well, hmm, there used to besomething that liberals used to
say back in the day and it wasseen as insensitive and they
would say they would.

(01:04:05):
And of course it was kind ofliberal propaganda because they
were saying this aboutconservatives and conservatives
kind of return their favor andthey say it about liberals.
But it was that a lot of timespeople vote and they vote
despite that.
The policies that will be putin place are going to hurt them.
Now liberals used to say thatconservatives regularly voted

(01:04:30):
outside of their economicinterests and then they would
have all these postulationsabout why they did such a thing.
But I must admit, when I watchall these videos of all these
groups and all these peoplelooking around and saying, oh, I
didn't think he was talkingabout us.

(01:04:51):
It goes into the fuck around andfind out category of my brain
watching the fight between theleft, so Democrats and leftists.
Because when Trump made thecomments about Gaza, they
immediately said now remember,you guys didn't want to vote for

(01:05:14):
Kamala Harris because she stoodby genocide, joe.
And now what are you going tosay?
You're not protesting now incollege campuses, now that
Donald Trump is going toeradicate the Palestinians from
the land, you have not amumbling word to say.
Et cetera, et cetera.
And I find, I find all this tobe somewhat comical because, of

(01:05:37):
course, the answers to that is abit more nuanced.
Of course the answers to thatis a bit more nuanced.
I may, I may talk about thenuances of that gaza issue and
how the the leftists are gonnaare responding to the democrats
and how the democrats areresponding to the actual
leftists who didn't vote forkamala harris and the muslims

(01:05:59):
who didn't vote for kamalaharris Harris because of what
they viewed as her inaction, arenon-answers.
When it came to thePalestinian-Israeli conflict, um
, it looks like Donald Trump isgoing to give Netanyahu kind of
the the free will to be evenworse than he was during the

(01:06:27):
Obama administration.
And, um, you gotta have tostruggle with the question that
politics makes you struggle with.
Politics is the art of doingwhat is possible.
And, uh, you, you, you.
You regularly have to play thislittle game that I don't like
to play and I debate with peopleall the time the voting of the

(01:06:51):
lesser of two evils and therecognition from somebody who
thinks about this stuff like me,and I respond to that by saying
the voting for the lesser oftwo evils just means that you
have normalized evil and thatyou have corroded yourself and
you are going to eventually beco-opted to do things that are

(01:07:11):
evil, but you will label them asfor the greater good.
Now I was sent something veryinteresting that made me think
about this, and it was from oneof my christian friends and
followers, and they actuallysaid this to me.
Growing up, I was told that thedemise of christianity would be
caused by the country rejectinggod.
Now I actually believe that thedemise of christianity will be

(01:07:36):
caused by christians blatantlyrejecting the teaching of Jesus
for the sake of political power.
Just something to think about,let me tell you something I will
never quit.

Speaker 3 (01:07:50):
I will never stop until we keep a con man from
taking over the party of Reaganand the conservative movement.
He's a con man.
He's a con man.
He's a con man.
He portrays himself as thestrongest guy on illegal
immigration.
That's fine, but Trump Towerwas built by illegal immigrants

(01:08:10):
from Poland, who he paid $4 anhour, $12, 12 hours a day.
A judge found that he wasinvolved in a conspiracy to
defraud these workers of theirpay.

Speaker 1 (01:08:19):
Judge found that he was involved in a conspiracy to
defraud these workers of theirpay, playing the funny little
clip of little Marco Rubio, whois now the Secretary of State,
saying one thing before that youknow he wouldn't say now was

(01:08:42):
just because, when it came tothis discussion about USAID that
I engageded in the beginning ofthe show, of course, just like
Marco Rubio said somethingdifferent about Trump, that he
would say something verydifferent, now he's speaking a
different tune when it comes towhat USAID does other countries.

Speaker 4 (01:08:55):
Well, look, I mean my frustration with USAID goes
back to my time in Congress.
It's a completely unresponsiveagency.
It's supposed to respond topolicy directives of the State
Department and it refuses to doso.
So the functions of USAID thereare a lot of functions of USAID

(01:09:16):
that are going to continue.
They're going to be part ofAmerican foreign policy, but it
has to be aligned with Americanforeign policy continue to be
part of American foreign policy,but it has to be aligned with
American foreign policy.
I said very clearly when weduring my confirmation hearing
that every dollar we spend andevery program we fund that will
be aligned with the nationalinterest of the United States.
And USAID has a history of sortof ignoring that and deciding

(01:09:37):
that there's somehow a globalcharity separate from the
national interest.
These are taxpayer dollars andso I'm very troubled by these
reports that they've beenunwilling to cooperate with
people who are asking simplequestions about what does this
program do?
Who gets the money, who are ourcontractors, who's funded?
And that sort of level ofinsubordination makes it
impossible to conduct the sortof mature and serious review

(01:09:58):
that I think 4 and 8 writ largeshould have.
And we're spending taxpayermoney here.
These are not donor dollars,these are taxpayer dollars and
we owe the American people theassurances that every dollar we
are spending abroad is beingspent on something that furthers
our national interest, and sofar, a lot of the people that
work at USAID have just simplyrefused to cooperate.

(01:10:20):
We do so because it furthers ournational interest.
That's why we give foreign aid.
Now, obviously, there's acomponent to foreign aid that's
humanitarian in scope and that'simportant too.
I promise you it's going to bea lot harder to recruit someone
to anti-Americanism,anti-american terrorism, if the
United States of America was thereason why they're even alive
today.
Anybody who tells you we canslash foreign aid and that will

(01:10:44):
bring us to balance is lying toyou.
Foreign aid is less than 1% ofour budget.
It's just not true.

Speaker 1 (01:10:49):
So that has been our journey into the episode of what
they said before versus whatthey say now, Starring the new
Secretary of State, formerSenator from Florida, Marco
Rubio.
See you on the next episode.
Your fiscal year 2023 budgetrequest to the Defense

(01:11:12):
Department, Department of Stateand US Agency for International
Development to send a clearmessage that the United States
has a comprehensive strategy tocounter the Chinese Communist
Party's expanding globalinfluence and the increasing
threat that it poses to USsecurity interests and those of
our allies.

Speaker 3 (01:11:28):
In all fairness, marco is not a negotiator.
I watched him melt down andI'll tell you it was one of the
saddest things I've ever seen.
He's not going down.
He thinks a Palestinian is areal estate deal.
These people may even betougher than Chris Christie.
The Palestinians are not a realestate deal, donald.
No, no, no.

Speaker 8 (01:11:45):
A deal is a deal.
Let me tell you, I've heard ita long time ago.

Speaker 4 (01:11:47):
A deal is not a deal when you're dealing with
terrorists.

Speaker 2 (01:11:49):
You are not a negotiator.

Speaker 3 (01:11:54):
You are not a negotiator, and if you're
thinking you will never bringpeace, you will never bring
peace.
Donald might be able to bringmore condos in the Palestinian
areas, but he's not going to.
This is not a real thing,people.
He will never be able to do it.
I think I may be able to do it,although I will say this
probably the toughest deal ofany kind is that particular deal

(01:12:17):
.

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
So guess what Marco Rubio wrote the other day?
That the deal that Trump hastried to do in Palestine, that
he suggested, is a great deal.
Let's make Gaza beautiful again.
And of course, donald Trump,who said Marco Rubio is the

(01:12:46):
worst dealmaker ever, is theSecretary of State now who's
going to be working hard onmaking the deal.
This stuff is um laughable.
It used to be commonplace forpoliticians, before we had tv,
to say one thing in one stateand then say something else in
another state, and because theyknew that the people who are
writing the papers, by the timethe news got there it would be
too late.
I think it's just funny, withall the video capabilities that

(01:13:09):
we have, that people still do itand, for the most part, still
get away with it.