June 10, 2025 • 31 mins
The principal focus of this second installment of our series is the ongoing investigation into the perplexing disappearance of Lindsay Wells, who vanished while nine months pregnant on March 27, 1999. In this episode, we engage once more with Melanie Flowers, who provides further insights and reflections on Lindsay’s case, emphasizing the profound implications of her absence not only for her loved ones but also for the community. We delve into the details surrounding the investigation, exploring the troubling lack of interest and action from law enforcement that has perpetuated the mystery for over two decades. As we dissect the elements surrounding Lindsay's disappearance, we are reminded of the importance of keeping her story alive, ensuring that her memory endures and seeking justice for her and her child. Join us as we reflect on the intricacies of this heart-wrenching case and the enduring impact it has had on those who loved her.
The views expressed in this podcast are solely my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my partners. These are my opinions and theories and the people mentioned are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:04):
Welcome to the Dead Life.
Here's world renowned mediumAlison Dubois.
Today we're going to hear fromMelanie Flowers giving some more
of the information of thedisappearance of Lindsay.
Well, she was her best friend.
Lindsay disappeared when shewas nine months pregnant back on
March 27, 1999.
(00:26):
So welcome back to part two tohear us unpack what led up to Lindsay's
disappearance.
If you have a life questionfor me and Sophia for my love me
love me not segment or witnessinformation about Lindsay Wells disappearance,
leave your question or commentat 802-332-3811.
If you want to watch past andpresent episodes of the Dead Life,
(00:49):
you can follow me on YouTube,please like and subscribe.
I'm pleased to announce thatmy Divination 22 intention setting
vodka, both the money potionand love potion are now available@divination22.com
and bigthirst.com you can nowget your hands in your own bottle
(01:09):
and use your inner light tochange your life.
I want to welcome MelanieFlowers to my show.
Melanie, thank you for beinghere again today.
Are there areas in Simi Valleyknown for discarding people?
Because often there will be atown or a city where everyone like
(01:30):
we have north Scottsdale andnot to freak anybody out, but that
was never Scottsdale before.
They just called it that sothey could like jack up the prices
of the houses here.
And that's where we used tocall body dumping territory.
Because if somebodydisappeared it was going to be up
in the desert that, thatbodies were just found occasionally
(01:50):
up there.
So when they built all thosehouses and people moved here from
other states and my friend waslike, I think my house is haunted.
I'm like, I'm sure it is.
That's there's a lot of peopleup there.
So for you, is there an arealike that in Simi Valley?
When I lived there, yeah,there would be the Santa Susana Nold
(02:14):
White Face.
And then I'm trying to, okay,that's all on that side of town.
And then that's pretty much it.
That's what Miles had said.
He said, and I'm quoting him,he was saying that David said I dumped
that up by White Face Mountain.
(02:37):
And, and there was never anyconfirmation about it.
It's what Miles said.
Miles always seemed to betrying to point fingers at David
and away from John.
And I found that interestingas well.
So the fact that he said hewitnessed that but nobody else did,
I found odd and suspicious andthat that's why he was wearing the
(03:01):
wire to try and get him toAdmit it again, you know, admit that
he is responsible forLindsay's disappearance.
And that enraged David.
Not just that he would try anddo that and trap him in.
In jail, but that he wouldthink he would hurt Lindsay because
(03:23):
she's the mother of his child.
And as.
As heinous as David's familywas, it did seem like David would
protect her if he could.
If somebody was hurting her,he would.
He would definitely step in.
And he just seemed like thatkind of guy.
Again, not an upstanding guyand definitely a criminal vibe, but
more of a.
More of a drug thief, assaultenergy rather than somebody who just
(03:50):
sees dark energy and murder.
He just didn't have thatenergy to him.
So he had said that Miles saidthat, that David had said that, and
he witnessed that, and that'swhat he was trying to get him to
admit.
We went into the areas whereLittle House on the Prairie used
(04:12):
to be filmed.
I believe that was one of theareas that we wanted to look at.
I had a woman with me namedLaurie Campbell, who's particularly
good at working crimes as well.
And she pointed, she drew anarea, and we found that area that
she had been drawing.
(04:33):
And we brought in cadaver dogsto see if they would pick up on any
scent.
And we had two cadaver dogsdrop on the ground in an area indicating
human remains.
This is.
Now, there were two thingshere that stood out to me.
(04:55):
One is, I think other peoplehave been buried up there.
I think I heard that there wassome mafia that used to maybe dump
bodies there as well.
But for dogs to pick up onhuman remains, it wouldn't be 50
years ago.
I would imagine it'd be muchsooner for them to pick up on it
(05:15):
without a lot of coaxing,because they let the dogs go.
And the dogs just went rightto the same spot and laid down.
So there was something there.
We gave the information to thepolice, and they never dug it up.
And our homicide detectivecalled them multiple times to see
if they'd gone there yet, andthey had not.
(05:38):
So they didn't seemparticularly interested in getting
to the body, bottom of who wasburied in that area.
My sense was that we've got tolook at the backyard of John's home.
That's where I would look.
I think he's lazier than totake it there.
(05:59):
And I think Miles was tryingto throw.
He was either trying to throwus off by saying White Face Mountain
and just give them somethingto try and divert attention away
from him and John towardsDavid, or she is buried there and
(06:19):
he Knew they'd find a bodybecause they put her there.
But it would indicate Davidand he might have been setting him
up.
So this is a.
I just found this case very interesting.
There's a lot of liars involved.
There's a great.
A good bit of covering up anda lot of drug use in the actors at
play.
(06:41):
Did the Simi Valley policeever contact you?
Yes, I did talk to them.
I told them everything aboutthat morning because I did get.
The interesting thing is too,about a week after Lindsay went missing,
I got a text message from herand from her phone and it said, number
(07:08):
four, no lettuce, cherry coke.
And that's what we would.
She would always order fromDel Taco, her chicken soft tacos.
She couldn't get lettucebecause of her braces, which gave
me hope because I believed, ohmy gosh, she's okay.
But they never looked into it.
They never got back to me.
Nothing.
(07:29):
But I believe they neverlooked into where that text message
came from.
No, nothing.
But I believe it was Johnbecause obviously he knew what she
ate too, right?
Especially pregnant.
Yeah, probably quite a bit of it.
And I always told them thatthere was a.
(07:51):
It was kind of like one ofthose pirate chests from the pirate
ships back in the day, but itwas at the foot of their bed and
it had a lot of her personalbelongings and some new baby things
that we had just gotten forthe baby.
And she.
I remember her telling meprobably about two months before
all this happened, if I evergo missing, make sure this gets to
(08:15):
my mom.
And I remember asking Donna,have you gotten any of Lindsay's
thing?
And she had a diary that shewould write in about John.
Never got anything.
Nothing.
So there's so many different things.
And it's like they would notlisten because Lindsey, she had a
bad rap with the police.
(08:36):
You know, she had written abad fraudulent check.
They just didn't care.
They didn't put anyconsideration care into this case
at all.
They didn't.
I think they were annoyed thatwe were actually there.
I think you're absolutelyright that they just figured it was
some low level somebody orother and they weren't going to put
(08:59):
the energy into it.
Now I did, you know, there wasspeculation amongst the investigative
group.
I'm sorry, I know that this ishard for you.
It's 25 years bubbling to the surface.
22 and pregnant.
You know, it's like, how doyou not care?
Yeah.
(09:20):
And.
And she had a lot of peoplethat loved her, that, that needed
her and.
And she is Important, which iswhy we were there.
We wanted to find justice forLindsay in this case and her baby
and either bring her home safewas, you.
(09:42):
Know, her daughter knowingthat her daughter would grow up without
a mom.
Right?
Yeah.
I mean, David and Lindsayweren't the best parents, but they
were still her parents.
And sometimes parents turntheir life around, and she deserved
that chance to do that.
And, I mean, you got out ofSimi Valley, and I assume you created
(10:03):
a beautiful life for yourself,which Lindsay would really want and
be so happy for you that yougot out.
So, yeah, she mattered to us.
And we did find them to be alittle difficult.
But we were wondering if therewas a connection between the concrete
(10:23):
company plant, which, fromwhat I learned through the investigation
that my team did, we thoughtthere was a tie, that either John's
dad owned the concrete plantor was higher up in the concrete
plant, which would make sensewhy John had a job there and maybe
was able to carry a job or getthose materials, you know, so quickly
(10:48):
that day.
And was there a connection tothe police department between those
two entities?
A friendship maybe that bondedthem or some kind of connection?
We didn't know.
Again, people weren't talking,and there were a number of John's
friends that were just waywhacked out on drugs that we just
(11:09):
couldn't even haveconversations with.
And they were just so far, sofar gone.
I talked to a couple of thembriefly, and they just couldn't even
handle dealing with that this happened.
And they just.
It was a sort of code ofsilence that we were met with by
(11:32):
them.
Donna came out and talked to us.
You know, she wanted to findher daughter.
She was hoping things wouldturn around for Lindsay and that
this baby would be it andstill loves her daughter very much.
I haven't talked to Donnasince then, so it's been a long time.
But I never forgot Lindsay.
(11:52):
And I wanted to make sure thatthe pilot that we had filmed never
went to air.
And the only thing thatbothered me about that is that all
of this information, thecadaver dogs hitting on an area for
human remains specifically.
And there's only a few dogs inthe country that are certified to
(12:14):
the level that these dogs were certified.
They were the highestcertification as accurate in.
In cadaver recovery and sensing.
So we knew there were humanremains there, and we just, the whole
time, were met with roadblocks.
And I just wanted people toknow this is why there are cases
(12:37):
that don't get solved.
Sometimes law enforcementdoesn't care.
And there's a lot of good copsout there, but there's some bad ones,
too.
And the ones that stand in theway make it hard for everybody to
get justice and heal sonothing ever gets resolved.
(12:59):
Sometimes it's because thefriends of the perpetrator won't
talk.
The family members of theperpetrator won't talk.
I've sat in courtrooms withguys who raped, tortured, and murdered
a woman while their mothersits there and cries and says her
son's a good boy.
And we have DNA to back upthat they raped, tortured, and murdered.
So there are people out therethat live in a delusional state,
(13:23):
that have children that growup and do bad things.
And I think that with John,his mother seemed to not, in my opinion,
get to the bottom of this orcare that Lindsay was gone.
And that trunk is anotherinteresting piece.
What happened to the trunkthat was at the foot of the bed and,
(13:48):
and somebody could talk andclear this up, yet they don't.
And I.
I just find that bothersome.
And even if the body thecadaver dogs hit on wasn't Lindsay,
that's somebody's missingfamily member.
So it still matters.
What's the harm?
We offered to go in, and weknow we're not a CSI unit, so the,
(14:08):
you know, it has to be done ina particular way to preserve evidence,
to go to court.
But if they're never going todig it up anyway, what difference
does it make?
Let us go in.
So it was.
It was very shocking.
I'm hoping that it's sinceit's been 25 years that there's been
a lot of turnover within thecommunity and in law enforcement.
(14:30):
And sometimes people are lessscared or worried and more likely
to come forward and share whatthey know.
And I'm really glad that yougot to share all of what you have
for Lindsay, because if wedon't speak up for her, nobody will.
And this is the only way tokeep her really on people's minds
(14:54):
that she matters.
And that's what today isabout, is to let people know who
she is and that.
That she and her baby matter,no matter what their circumstances.
Have you heard anything on thestreets since she disappeared?
Did you hear some rumors, ordo people even talk about it after
(15:17):
she disappeared?
Or did everybody just shuttheir mouths and keep going about
their lives?
Everyone just was quiet.
Wow.
Yeah, that's.
I mean, that's amazing and unthinkable.
So if you were to look atsomeone who was involved in this,
(15:42):
the last person to see her, Ibelieve, was John.
Is that right?
John and his Mother.
John and his mother.
And that's something I hadasked on the last one.
Where's the mother in all this?
Yeah, you know, where is she?
Because she.
(16:02):
Most mothers care about otherpeople's children.
If I see somebody especiallyyounger than me that's being hurt
and I have three daughters andI see somebody's girl, you know,
who's 22 years old andsomebody's trying to hurt her, I'm
probably going to jail becauseI'm stepping in, you know, that's
(16:23):
like that's going to happen.
So that's a maternal instinctthat a lot of women have to save
and protect.
She again seemed to have dark energy.
I guess apple doesn't fall farfrom the tree and that her absence
speaks louder than words.
Her silence, it's justdeafening and.
(16:45):
And then the father.
And so in a perfect world I'dget to send an, an investigator and
they'd be subpoenaed and beforced to talk to the investigator
and give their testimony andtheir information, their whereabouts,
the luminal to see if there'sany blood spatter patterns in the
garage, the bathtub, anywherewhere this could have taken place
(17:09):
or ended up and a sonar in thebackyard to look under the concrete
that was laid there.
I'm still shocked that thepeople that I don't know if they
were renting the home or hadpurchased the home, my, in my mind's
eye, I'm thinking rented.
But the fact that they didn'twant to try and get to the bottom
of if Lindsay was under thereand they could go about their business
(17:32):
living in that house notknowing if There was a 22 year old
young woman under there, ninemonths pregnant with her baby just
blows my mind.
Because they wanted $3,000 inorder to bring her home.
Because that could havechanged everything.
Everything.
Because you know, if in asituation, say John did it and we're
(17:55):
just supposing in thishypothesizing, theorizing that John,
if he did it and thought hewas safe because the concrete had
been laid and people in townhad been quieted up and code of silence
and threatened, you know,people have been threatened and know
to keep their mouth shut andall of that had taken place and I'm
(18:19):
feeling pretty confident thatI'm going to get away with this because
the cops aren't pursuing itand I would, I could move and leave
her there without moving thebody, thinking I got away with it
and also knowing I could goback and visit that space, you know,
if I wanted to because a Lotof killers will go back to the scene
(18:42):
of the crime to relive it to,to sort of possess the person that
they took their life, youknow, to feel that level of control
and power over them.
And if we would have been ableto look under that concrete, best
case scenario, we would havefound her.
Worst case scenario, we couldhave eliminated the area as that
(19:04):
being where she is.
The fact that a concrete slabwas poured hours after she actually
disappeared is completely mind blowing.
I think you may have stumbledonto the scene of the crime and the
fact that you were able to leave.
I'm so glad because I thinkyou came in when everything was just.
(19:27):
The dust was starting tosettle and that's why he was so freaked
out by your presence.
And this is just my opinion,but I think you spooked him.
And he, he was trying to calmhis nerves because he'd been up all
night and with everything thathad gone on, he was processing.
And when you came in there, Ithink it really caught him off guard
(19:49):
and you, and he had no answerfor you as to what happened to her.
So I'm really glad that yougot out of there safely and were
able to live the life thatyou've lived.
Lindsay would definitely wantthat for you.
So those are the people Iwould definitely want to look at.
(20:10):
If the police were cooperativeor interested at all, I would hope
they would do their own investigation.
And I know lie detectorsaren't admissible in court, but they
could be very good indicatorson who you're wasting your time talking
to and who you need to go morein depth examining and, and finding
alibis for.
(20:31):
And this just to me seems soobvious in nature of a case.
First, when I, when I waspicking up that he was capable of
doing this, John had very dark energy.
David had Keystone Copcriminal energy, just kind of that
energy and just very differentby nature.
(20:54):
And, and then how everything unfolded.
I just, it, to me, I'd look atJohn, the mother, the house is the
last place she would seen itneeds to be turned over.
Blood can still exist 25 yearslater in the paint and, and behind
surfaces that can be foundwith luminol.
(21:16):
And we have DNA abilitycapabilities now that we didn't have
then to be able to determinequite a bit.
And I'd like to see a newinvestigative team go in and look
at that property because Ithink that property was absolutely
key and it's mind blowing thatthat didn' so what do you miss the
(21:40):
most about Lindsay?
Like what do you want peopleto remember about her?
She Only got to live 22 years.
She didn't get to make a markon this world.
She didn't get to figure outwho she is or what, you know, what
she wanted in life.
She probably would be comingmaybe a grandmother soon or, you
know, because her daughterwould be 25 now or.
(22:04):
No, 20, 20, 28.
She was three and a half whenshe disappeared, and she disappeared
in 99.
My daughter was born July 4th,1999, and she's going to be 26.
So her daughter would be goingon like 29 or 30 at this point.
And do you ever go back toSimi Valley, have you run into her
(22:27):
daughter?
No, no, I wasn't really closewith that side of David's family
at all.
I was scared of them all.
Well, they sound pretty scaryand honestly it's not hard to figure
out how they became the waythey became.
Once she meets some of thefamily members there, it's pretty
unnerving.
(22:49):
And I just, I wonder how manypeople my sense is.
And I got this when I wasthere at the scene and I told our
investigator, I said, multiplepeople know what happened to her.
I said, this is, this is notsomething that he's taking to his
grave.
I said, this is like as ifhe's bragged about it or used it
(23:12):
maybe, and I'm justtheorizing, but use that information
to threaten other people.
You know, if you do that,you'll end up like her, like criminals
do that.
He had that same energy to meand I just find it unbelievable that
he went silent in the last 25 years.
(23:35):
I would be interested in whathis criminal activity or did he move,
did the family move?
You know, with John, whathappened with him?
I think David's family isstill doing the same thing they were
always doing because they hadnothing to run from.
You know, if, if, if John andhis family did stay, I would hope
(23:55):
that they'd be willing to bere interviewed.
And there's no statue oflimitation on murder.
So I do hope that they go back in.
I just wanted you to know Iwent in with a team of specialists,
including forensicspecialists, and we just couldn't
get anywhere with them.
They, they gave us so littleand they tried to, in my view, obstruct
(24:20):
us at every turn.
And so if anyone's in SimiValley and you vote, vote people
in that are going to carry outjustice for you folks or you're not
going to ever have a, have achange of energy in that, in that
city.
It was just, it was really alost place to be.
(24:43):
And this.
This should have been solvedon day one.
Like, the cops, as soon as shewas reported missing, could have
gone in.
And.
And John, no matter what youthink of him, he's definitely no
genius, and I don't think hegot that he was so forensically knowledgeable
(25:04):
that he was able to totallylock down the house where there would
be no evidence left behind.
I'm sure there was evidenceleft behind, and I'm just shocked
they didn't converge on thathouse immediately with it being the
last place she was seen,because typically, that's what law
enforcement will do.
They'll call in their csis andthey'll go over it with a fine tooth
(25:27):
comb.
They pull the matter that's inthe drains of the bathtub to see
if there's blood, to see ifthere's bone, are there teeth?
You know, they look for thesethings, and it.
It just seems they just didn't.
Not only didn't care, itseemed as though they were trying
to keep it from ever beingsolved, which means they know who
(25:48):
did it, and they're maybetrying to cover that up because I
can't understand why else theywould actually actively try to obstruct
David from taking that liedetector test.
And.
And they didn't want him exonerated.
And now 25 years has passed,and maybe a lot of people in Simi
(26:08):
Valley don't even know whoLindsay is, but she's a young woman
that didn't get to live herlife, and she had a baby that never
got to get started and nevergot to take his first steps and will
never know his sister, and thesister won't know him.
I mean, whoever killedLindsay, or some people still speculate,
(26:31):
maybe she was abducted.
Maybe the baby was born alive.
Maybe it was adopted out.
Maybe.
Maybe.
Maybe it's like.
Statistically, it's moreprobable that.
That he got mad at her either.
There wouldn't be much of afight because Donna said that Lindsay
couldn't even walk.
(26:52):
Yeah, because she was not onlyso pregnant, she was so uncomfortable
in the pregnancy, and shecouldn't even walk, so she wouldn't
have been able to fight backon any level.
And so for him, I'm.
I'm sure the anger was comingfrom him.
And maybe she told him thatafter I have the baby, you know,
(27:13):
I'm moving back with my mom,or, you know, I'm not.
I'm not gonna be with you anymore.
He could have gotten upset andreacted and.
Or it could have beensomething that was a little more
premeditated.
It.
We won't know until somebodyopens their mouth.
(27:34):
So I hope you coming on willencourage some of the people around
them that may have moved awayto share what they know, because
I know that at least severalpeople know exactly what happened
to Lindsay and exactly whereshe is.
So I just want to thank you onbehalf of Lindsay and my listeners
(27:54):
for coming on and, and talkingabout her disappearance.
And if you think of anythingelse, I have a very good friend,
Ashley Flowers.
You guys share a last name,and she's the host of Crime Junkie,
which is like a millionfollower true crime podcast.
And I've shared Lindsay'sstory with her, and I've.
(28:17):
I've shared the video footagethat I have from the pilot of all
the interviews that we did atthat time.
I still have those.
And she was interested inmaybe pursuing, looking into Lindsay's
case, and she has a muchbigger staff than I do, so I will
share this with her as well,and maybe this will be something
(28:38):
that she puts some energy into.
Fingers crossed on that.
And people are, for whateverreason, really into true crime right
now, want to understand theminds of people who commit these
kinds of crimes, and they wantto understand who the victims are.
And.
But for me, Lindsay was one ofvery, very few cases that I never
(29:01):
saw a resolution to.
And it bothered me because itwasn't because we were doing anything
wrong in our investigation.
It was because we were being prevented.
And that was the mostfrustrating part of all of it.
I would have liked to giveDonna a little peace of mind and
give her her daughter back, ifpossible, and.
And give you peace of mind andeveryone who ever loved Lindsay.
(29:24):
And she deserves that dignity and.
And that care.
So who knows who will hear this?
And.
And you did a really nicething for her, coming on and letting
her know that you love her andthat she matters to you, and.
And if you ever want to comeon and.
And talk more about, you knowwhere to find me.
(29:44):
So thank you for being here, Melanie.
I want to thank you on behalfof Lindsay and thank you on behalf
of my listeners for coming onmy show and talking about something
so deeply personal as yourbest friend's disappearance 25 years
ago.
We appreciate you.
Keeping Lindsay's story aliveis the most loving thing that we
(30:06):
can do for her and her baby.
So if you were a witness orhave any details, people have told
you, maybe you've heard it ina bar in Simi Valley 15, 25 years
ago, whenever, about whathappened to her, someone who claims
to have witnessed it, pleasegive us a call, give us that information.
(30:28):
Lindsay deserves to havepeace, and her loved ones deserve
to have her back.
Her and her baby, her littleboy, deserve some dignity, respect.
And they deserve the love.
And now's the time.
And thank you to my listeners.
Tune in next Tuesday for afresh episode of the Dead Life.
(30:51):
I'm Allison Dubois.
This is the Dead Life.
And to all of my believers outthere, don't stop believing.
Join us next week on the Dead Life.
And don't forget to subscribenow to get notified of every new
episode.
Welcome to the Dead Life.
Here's world renowned mediumAlison Dubois.
Today we're going to hear fromMelanie Flowers giving some more
of the information of thedisappearance of Lindsay.
Well, she was her best friend.
Lindsay disappeared when shewas nine months pregnant back on
March 27, 1999.
(00:26):
So welcome back to part two tohear us unpack what led up to Lindsay's
disappearance.
If you have a life questionfor me and Sophia for my love me
love me not segment or witnessinformation about Lindsay Wells disappearance,
leave your question or commentat 802-332-3811.
If you want to watch past andpresent episodes of the Dead Life,
(00:49):
you can follow me on YouTube,please like and subscribe.
I'm pleased to announce thatmy Divination 22 intention setting
vodka, both the money potionand love potion are now available@divination22.com
and bigthirst.com you can nowget your hands in your own bottle
(01:09):
and use your inner light tochange your life.
I want to welcome MelanieFlowers to my show.
Melanie, thank you for beinghere again today.
Are there areas in Simi Valleyknown for discarding people?
Because often there will be atown or a city where everyone like
(01:30):
we have north Scottsdale andnot to freak anybody out, but that
was never Scottsdale before.
They just called it that sothey could like jack up the prices
of the houses here.
And that's where we used tocall body dumping territory.
Because if somebodydisappeared it was going to be up
in the desert that, thatbodies were just found occasionally
(01:50):
up there.
So when they built all thosehouses and people moved here from
other states and my friend waslike, I think my house is haunted.
I'm like, I'm sure it is.
That's there's a lot of peopleup there.
So for you, is there an arealike that in Simi Valley?
When I lived there, yeah,there would be the Santa Susana Nold
(02:14):
White Face.
And then I'm trying to, okay,that's all on that side of town.
And then that's pretty much it.
That's what Miles had said.
He said, and I'm quoting him,he was saying that David said I dumped
that up by White Face Mountain.
(02:37):
And, and there was never anyconfirmation about it.
It's what Miles said.
Miles always seemed to betrying to point fingers at David
and away from John.
And I found that interestingas well.
So the fact that he said hewitnessed that but nobody else did,
I found odd and suspicious andthat that's why he was wearing the
(03:01):
wire to try and get him toAdmit it again, you know, admit that
he is responsible forLindsay's disappearance.
And that enraged David.
Not just that he would try anddo that and trap him in.
In jail, but that he wouldthink he would hurt Lindsay because
(03:23):
she's the mother of his child.
And as.
As heinous as David's familywas, it did seem like David would
protect her if he could.
If somebody was hurting her,he would.
He would definitely step in.
And he just seemed like thatkind of guy.
Again, not an upstanding guyand definitely a criminal vibe, but
more of a.
More of a drug thief, assaultenergy rather than somebody who just
(03:50):
sees dark energy and murder.
He just didn't have thatenergy to him.
So he had said that Miles saidthat, that David had said that, and
he witnessed that, and that'swhat he was trying to get him to
admit.
We went into the areas whereLittle House on the Prairie used
(04:12):
to be filmed.
I believe that was one of theareas that we wanted to look at.
I had a woman with me namedLaurie Campbell, who's particularly
good at working crimes as well.
And she pointed, she drew anarea, and we found that area that
she had been drawing.
(04:33):
And we brought in cadaver dogsto see if they would pick up on any
scent.
And we had two cadaver dogsdrop on the ground in an area indicating
human remains.
This is.
Now, there were two thingshere that stood out to me.
(04:55):
One is, I think other peoplehave been buried up there.
I think I heard that there wassome mafia that used to maybe dump
bodies there as well.
But for dogs to pick up onhuman remains, it wouldn't be 50
years ago.
I would imagine it'd be muchsooner for them to pick up on it
(05:15):
without a lot of coaxing,because they let the dogs go.
And the dogs just went rightto the same spot and laid down.
So there was something there.
We gave the information to thepolice, and they never dug it up.
And our homicide detectivecalled them multiple times to see
if they'd gone there yet, andthey had not.
(05:38):
So they didn't seemparticularly interested in getting
to the body, bottom of who wasburied in that area.
My sense was that we've got tolook at the backyard of John's home.
That's where I would look.
I think he's lazier than totake it there.
(05:59):
And I think Miles was tryingto throw.
He was either trying to throwus off by saying White Face Mountain
and just give them somethingto try and divert attention away
from him and John towardsDavid, or she is buried there and
(06:19):
he Knew they'd find a bodybecause they put her there.
But it would indicate Davidand he might have been setting him
up.
So this is a.
I just found this case very interesting.
There's a lot of liars involved.
There's a great.
A good bit of covering up anda lot of drug use in the actors at
play.
(06:41):
Did the Simi Valley policeever contact you?
Yes, I did talk to them.
I told them everything aboutthat morning because I did get.
The interesting thing is too,about a week after Lindsay went missing,
I got a text message from herand from her phone and it said, number
(07:08):
four, no lettuce, cherry coke.
And that's what we would.
She would always order fromDel Taco, her chicken soft tacos.
She couldn't get lettucebecause of her braces, which gave
me hope because I believed, ohmy gosh, she's okay.
But they never looked into it.
They never got back to me.
Nothing.
(07:29):
But I believe they neverlooked into where that text message
came from.
No, nothing.
But I believe it was Johnbecause obviously he knew what she
ate too, right?
Especially pregnant.
Yeah, probably quite a bit of it.
And I always told them thatthere was a.
(07:51):
It was kind of like one ofthose pirate chests from the pirate
ships back in the day, but itwas at the foot of their bed and
it had a lot of her personalbelongings and some new baby things
that we had just gotten forthe baby.
And she.
I remember her telling meprobably about two months before
all this happened, if I evergo missing, make sure this gets to
(08:15):
my mom.
And I remember asking Donna,have you gotten any of Lindsay's
thing?
And she had a diary that shewould write in about John.
Never got anything.
Nothing.
So there's so many different things.
And it's like they would notlisten because Lindsey, she had a
bad rap with the police.
(08:36):
You know, she had written abad fraudulent check.
They just didn't care.
They didn't put anyconsideration care into this case
at all.
They didn't.
I think they were annoyed thatwe were actually there.
I think you're absolutelyright that they just figured it was
some low level somebody orother and they weren't going to put
(08:59):
the energy into it.
Now I did, you know, there wasspeculation amongst the investigative
group.
I'm sorry, I know that this ishard for you.
It's 25 years bubbling to the surface.
22 and pregnant.
You know, it's like, how doyou not care?
Yeah.
(09:20):
And.
And she had a lot of peoplethat loved her, that, that needed
her and.
And she is Important, which iswhy we were there.
We wanted to find justice forLindsay in this case and her baby
and either bring her home safewas, you.
(09:42):
Know, her daughter knowingthat her daughter would grow up without
a mom.
Right?
Yeah.
I mean, David and Lindsayweren't the best parents, but they
were still her parents.
And sometimes parents turntheir life around, and she deserved
that chance to do that.
And, I mean, you got out ofSimi Valley, and I assume you created
(10:03):
a beautiful life for yourself,which Lindsay would really want and
be so happy for you that yougot out.
So, yeah, she mattered to us.
And we did find them to be alittle difficult.
But we were wondering if therewas a connection between the concrete
(10:23):
company plant, which, fromwhat I learned through the investigation
that my team did, we thoughtthere was a tie, that either John's
dad owned the concrete plantor was higher up in the concrete
plant, which would make sensewhy John had a job there and maybe
was able to carry a job or getthose materials, you know, so quickly
(10:48):
that day.
And was there a connection tothe police department between those
two entities?
A friendship maybe that bondedthem or some kind of connection?
We didn't know.
Again, people weren't talking,and there were a number of John's
friends that were just waywhacked out on drugs that we just
(11:09):
couldn't even haveconversations with.
And they were just so far, sofar gone.
I talked to a couple of thembriefly, and they just couldn't even
handle dealing with that this happened.
And they just.
It was a sort of code ofsilence that we were met with by
(11:32):
them.
Donna came out and talked to us.
You know, she wanted to findher daughter.
She was hoping things wouldturn around for Lindsay and that
this baby would be it andstill loves her daughter very much.
I haven't talked to Donnasince then, so it's been a long time.
But I never forgot Lindsay.
(11:52):
And I wanted to make sure thatthe pilot that we had filmed never
went to air.
And the only thing thatbothered me about that is that all
of this information, thecadaver dogs hitting on an area for
human remains specifically.
And there's only a few dogs inthe country that are certified to
(12:14):
the level that these dogs were certified.
They were the highestcertification as accurate in.
In cadaver recovery and sensing.
So we knew there were humanremains there, and we just, the whole
time, were met with roadblocks.
And I just wanted people toknow this is why there are cases
(12:37):
that don't get solved.
Sometimes law enforcementdoesn't care.
And there's a lot of good copsout there, but there's some bad ones,
too.
And the ones that stand in theway make it hard for everybody to
get justice and heal sonothing ever gets resolved.
(12:59):
Sometimes it's because thefriends of the perpetrator won't
talk.
The family members of theperpetrator won't talk.
I've sat in courtrooms withguys who raped, tortured, and murdered
a woman while their mothersits there and cries and says her
son's a good boy.
And we have DNA to back upthat they raped, tortured, and murdered.
So there are people out therethat live in a delusional state,
(13:23):
that have children that growup and do bad things.
And I think that with John,his mother seemed to not, in my opinion,
get to the bottom of this orcare that Lindsay was gone.
And that trunk is anotherinteresting piece.
What happened to the trunkthat was at the foot of the bed and,
(13:48):
and somebody could talk andclear this up, yet they don't.
And I.
I just find that bothersome.
And even if the body thecadaver dogs hit on wasn't Lindsay,
that's somebody's missingfamily member.
So it still matters.
What's the harm?
We offered to go in, and weknow we're not a CSI unit, so the,
(14:08):
you know, it has to be done ina particular way to preserve evidence,
to go to court.
But if they're never going todig it up anyway, what difference
does it make?
Let us go in.
So it was.
It was very shocking.
I'm hoping that it's sinceit's been 25 years that there's been
a lot of turnover within thecommunity and in law enforcement.
(14:30):
And sometimes people are lessscared or worried and more likely
to come forward and share whatthey know.
And I'm really glad that yougot to share all of what you have
for Lindsay, because if wedon't speak up for her, nobody will.
And this is the only way tokeep her really on people's minds
(14:54):
that she matters.
And that's what today isabout, is to let people know who
she is and that.
That she and her baby matter,no matter what their circumstances.
Have you heard anything on thestreets since she disappeared?
Did you hear some rumors, ordo people even talk about it after
(15:17):
she disappeared?
Or did everybody just shuttheir mouths and keep going about
their lives?
Everyone just was quiet.
Wow.
Yeah, that's.
I mean, that's amazing and unthinkable.
So if you were to look atsomeone who was involved in this,
(15:42):
the last person to see her, Ibelieve, was John.
Is that right?
John and his Mother.
John and his mother.
And that's something I hadasked on the last one.
Where's the mother in all this?
Yeah, you know, where is she?
Because she.
(16:02):
Most mothers care about otherpeople's children.
If I see somebody especiallyyounger than me that's being hurt
and I have three daughters andI see somebody's girl, you know,
who's 22 years old andsomebody's trying to hurt her, I'm
probably going to jail becauseI'm stepping in, you know, that's
(16:23):
like that's going to happen.
So that's a maternal instinctthat a lot of women have to save
and protect.
She again seemed to have dark energy.
I guess apple doesn't fall farfrom the tree and that her absence
speaks louder than words.
Her silence, it's justdeafening and.
(16:45):
And then the father.
And so in a perfect world I'dget to send an, an investigator and
they'd be subpoenaed and beforced to talk to the investigator
and give their testimony andtheir information, their whereabouts,
the luminal to see if there'sany blood spatter patterns in the
garage, the bathtub, anywherewhere this could have taken place
(17:09):
or ended up and a sonar in thebackyard to look under the concrete
that was laid there.
I'm still shocked that thepeople that I don't know if they
were renting the home or hadpurchased the home, my, in my mind's
eye, I'm thinking rented.
But the fact that they didn'twant to try and get to the bottom
of if Lindsay was under thereand they could go about their business
(17:32):
living in that house notknowing if There was a 22 year old
young woman under there, ninemonths pregnant with her baby just
blows my mind.
Because they wanted $3,000 inorder to bring her home.
Because that could havechanged everything.
Everything.
Because you know, if in asituation, say John did it and we're
(17:55):
just supposing in thishypothesizing, theorizing that John,
if he did it and thought hewas safe because the concrete had
been laid and people in townhad been quieted up and code of silence
and threatened, you know,people have been threatened and know
to keep their mouth shut andall of that had taken place and I'm
(18:19):
feeling pretty confident thatI'm going to get away with this because
the cops aren't pursuing itand I would, I could move and leave
her there without moving thebody, thinking I got away with it
and also knowing I could goback and visit that space, you know,
if I wanted to because a Lotof killers will go back to the scene
(18:42):
of the crime to relive it to,to sort of possess the person that
they took their life, youknow, to feel that level of control
and power over them.
And if we would have been ableto look under that concrete, best
case scenario, we would havefound her.
Worst case scenario, we couldhave eliminated the area as that
(19:04):
being where she is.
The fact that a concrete slabwas poured hours after she actually
disappeared is completely mind blowing.
I think you may have stumbledonto the scene of the crime and the
fact that you were able to leave.
I'm so glad because I thinkyou came in when everything was just.
(19:27):
The dust was starting tosettle and that's why he was so freaked
out by your presence.
And this is just my opinion,but I think you spooked him.
And he, he was trying to calmhis nerves because he'd been up all
night and with everything thathad gone on, he was processing.
And when you came in there, Ithink it really caught him off guard
(19:49):
and you, and he had no answerfor you as to what happened to her.
So I'm really glad that yougot out of there safely and were
able to live the life thatyou've lived.
Lindsay would definitely wantthat for you.
So those are the people Iwould definitely want to look at.
(20:10):
If the police were cooperativeor interested at all, I would hope
they would do their own investigation.
And I know lie detectorsaren't admissible in court, but they
could be very good indicatorson who you're wasting your time talking
to and who you need to go morein depth examining and, and finding
alibis for.
(20:31):
And this just to me seems soobvious in nature of a case.
First, when I, when I waspicking up that he was capable of
doing this, John had very dark energy.
David had Keystone Copcriminal energy, just kind of that
energy and just very differentby nature.
(20:54):
And, and then how everything unfolded.
I just, it, to me, I'd look atJohn, the mother, the house is the
last place she would seen itneeds to be turned over.
Blood can still exist 25 yearslater in the paint and, and behind
surfaces that can be foundwith luminol.
(21:16):
And we have DNA abilitycapabilities now that we didn't have
then to be able to determinequite a bit.
And I'd like to see a newinvestigative team go in and look
at that property because Ithink that property was absolutely
key and it's mind blowing thatthat didn' so what do you miss the
(21:40):
most about Lindsay?
Like what do you want peopleto remember about her?
She Only got to live 22 years.
She didn't get to make a markon this world.
She didn't get to figure outwho she is or what, you know, what
she wanted in life.
She probably would be comingmaybe a grandmother soon or, you
know, because her daughterwould be 25 now or.
(22:04):
No, 20, 20, 28.
She was three and a half whenshe disappeared, and she disappeared
in 99.
My daughter was born July 4th,1999, and she's going to be 26.
So her daughter would be goingon like 29 or 30 at this point.
And do you ever go back toSimi Valley, have you run into her
(22:27):
daughter?
No, no, I wasn't really closewith that side of David's family
at all.
I was scared of them all.
Well, they sound pretty scaryand honestly it's not hard to figure
out how they became the waythey became.
Once she meets some of thefamily members there, it's pretty
unnerving.
(22:49):
And I just, I wonder how manypeople my sense is.
And I got this when I wasthere at the scene and I told our
investigator, I said, multiplepeople know what happened to her.
I said, this is, this is notsomething that he's taking to his
grave.
I said, this is like as ifhe's bragged about it or used it
(23:12):
maybe, and I'm justtheorizing, but use that information
to threaten other people.
You know, if you do that,you'll end up like her, like criminals
do that.
He had that same energy to meand I just find it unbelievable that
he went silent in the last 25 years.
(23:35):
I would be interested in whathis criminal activity or did he move,
did the family move?
You know, with John, whathappened with him?
I think David's family isstill doing the same thing they were
always doing because they hadnothing to run from.
You know, if, if, if John andhis family did stay, I would hope
(23:55):
that they'd be willing to bere interviewed.
And there's no statue oflimitation on murder.
So I do hope that they go back in.
I just wanted you to know Iwent in with a team of specialists,
including forensicspecialists, and we just couldn't
get anywhere with them.
They, they gave us so littleand they tried to, in my view, obstruct
(24:20):
us at every turn.
And so if anyone's in SimiValley and you vote, vote people
in that are going to carry outjustice for you folks or you're not
going to ever have a, have achange of energy in that, in that
city.
It was just, it was really alost place to be.
(24:43):
And this.
This should have been solvedon day one.
Like, the cops, as soon as shewas reported missing, could have
gone in.
And.
And John, no matter what youthink of him, he's definitely no
genius, and I don't think hegot that he was so forensically knowledgeable
(25:04):
that he was able to totallylock down the house where there would
be no evidence left behind.
I'm sure there was evidenceleft behind, and I'm just shocked
they didn't converge on thathouse immediately with it being the
last place she was seen,because typically, that's what law
enforcement will do.
They'll call in their csis andthey'll go over it with a fine tooth
(25:27):
comb.
They pull the matter that's inthe drains of the bathtub to see
if there's blood, to see ifthere's bone, are there teeth?
You know, they look for thesethings, and it.
It just seems they just didn't.
Not only didn't care, itseemed as though they were trying
to keep it from ever beingsolved, which means they know who
(25:48):
did it, and they're maybetrying to cover that up because I
can't understand why else theywould actually actively try to obstruct
David from taking that liedetector test.
And.
And they didn't want him exonerated.
And now 25 years has passed,and maybe a lot of people in Simi
(26:08):
Valley don't even know whoLindsay is, but she's a young woman
that didn't get to live herlife, and she had a baby that never
got to get started and nevergot to take his first steps and will
never know his sister, and thesister won't know him.
I mean, whoever killedLindsay, or some people still speculate,
(26:31):
maybe she was abducted.
Maybe the baby was born alive.
Maybe it was adopted out.
Maybe.
Maybe.
Maybe it's like.
Statistically, it's moreprobable that.
That he got mad at her either.
There wouldn't be much of afight because Donna said that Lindsay
couldn't even walk.
(26:52):
Yeah, because she was not onlyso pregnant, she was so uncomfortable
in the pregnancy, and shecouldn't even walk, so she wouldn't
have been able to fight backon any level.
And so for him, I'm.
I'm sure the anger was comingfrom him.
And maybe she told him thatafter I have the baby, you know,
(27:13):
I'm moving back with my mom,or, you know, I'm not.
I'm not gonna be with you anymore.
He could have gotten upset andreacted and.
Or it could have beensomething that was a little more
premeditated.
It.
We won't know until somebodyopens their mouth.
(27:34):
So I hope you coming on willencourage some of the people around
them that may have moved awayto share what they know, because
I know that at least severalpeople know exactly what happened
to Lindsay and exactly whereshe is.
So I just want to thank you onbehalf of Lindsay and my listeners
(27:54):
for coming on and, and talkingabout her disappearance.
And if you think of anythingelse, I have a very good friend,
Ashley Flowers.
You guys share a last name,and she's the host of Crime Junkie,
which is like a millionfollower true crime podcast.
And I've shared Lindsay'sstory with her, and I've.
(28:17):
I've shared the video footagethat I have from the pilot of all
the interviews that we did atthat time.
I still have those.
And she was interested inmaybe pursuing, looking into Lindsay's
case, and she has a muchbigger staff than I do, so I will
share this with her as well,and maybe this will be something
(28:38):
that she puts some energy into.
Fingers crossed on that.
And people are, for whateverreason, really into true crime right
now, want to understand theminds of people who commit these
kinds of crimes, and they wantto understand who the victims are.
And.
But for me, Lindsay was one ofvery, very few cases that I never
(29:01):
saw a resolution to.
And it bothered me because itwasn't because we were doing anything
wrong in our investigation.
It was because we were being prevented.
And that was the mostfrustrating part of all of it.
I would have liked to giveDonna a little peace of mind and
give her her daughter back, ifpossible, and.
And give you peace of mind andeveryone who ever loved Lindsay.
(29:24):
And she deserves that dignity and.
And that care.
So who knows who will hear this?
And.
And you did a really nicething for her, coming on and letting
her know that you love her andthat she matters to you, and.
And if you ever want to comeon and.
And talk more about, you knowwhere to find me.
(29:44):
So thank you for being here, Melanie.
I want to thank you on behalfof Lindsay and thank you on behalf
of my listeners for coming onmy show and talking about something
so deeply personal as yourbest friend's disappearance 25 years
ago.
We appreciate you.
Keeping Lindsay's story aliveis the most loving thing that we
(30:06):
can do for her and her baby.
So if you were a witness orhave any details, people have told
you, maybe you've heard it ina bar in Simi Valley 15, 25 years
ago, whenever, about whathappened to her, someone who claims
to have witnessed it, pleasegive us a call, give us that information.
(30:28):
Lindsay deserves to havepeace, and her loved ones deserve
to have her back.
Her and her baby, her littleboy, deserve some dignity, respect.
And they deserve the love.
And now's the time.
And thank you to my listeners.
Tune in next Tuesday for afresh episode of the Dead Life.
(30:51):
I'm Allison Dubois.
This is the Dead Life.
And to all of my believers outthere, don't stop believing.
Join us next week on the Dead Life.
And don't forget to subscribenow to get notified of every new
episode.
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