February 27, 2025 • 30 mins
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Ever wondered what it takes to capture the essence of sailing on camera? Join us as we chat with Patrick Condy, the visionary behind PKC Media, who shares his transformative journey from Scotland to the Isle of Wight, fueled by a passion for photography and the ocean. As a water sports visual content creator, Condy offers a behind-the-scenes look at the thrills and trials of photographing dynamic water sports. From his early days interning at OC Sport to founding his own company, Condy reveals how he balances the artistry of photography with the demands of brand storytelling, all while favoring his trusty Nikon gear.
We also tackle the exciting world of drone photography, especially when faced with the unpredictable challenges of the marine environment. Condy recounts breathtaking offshore adventures, sharing insights on strategic shot timing and the intricate dance of managing client expectations in the high-stakes arena of yacht racing. Discover unexpected tactics like using a sail as a last-ditch effort to recover drone footage, showcasing the creativity and resilience required in this field.
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Hosted and produced by Gary Pageau
Edited by Olivia Pageau
Announcer: Erin Manning
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Erin Manning (00:02):
Welcome to the Dead Pixel Society podcast, the
photo imaging industry's leadingnews source.
Here's your host, Gary Pageau.
The Dead Pixels Society podcastis brought to you by Mediaclip,
Advertek Printing, andIndependent Photo Imagers.
Gary Pageau (00:18):
Hello again and welcome to the Dead Pixels
Society podcast.
I'm your host, Gary Pageau, andtoday we're joined by Patrick
Condy, the founder of PKC Media.
He is a visual content creatorof all kinds, and he's coming to
us from the Isle of Wight.
I think he's the first guestfrom the Isle of Wight, so
(00:38):
welcome Patrick.
How are you today?
Patrick Condy (00:41):
Hi Gary, thanks for having me on.
Yes, I'm coming to you from theIsle of Wight here in the UK
across the pond.
All very good here.
A bit chilly on our side of thewater, but all very good and
looking forward to getting intotalking about it on here.
Gary Pageau (00:54):
Are you from the Isle of Wight?
Is that where you started from,or is that where your business
is located?
Patrick Condy (01:05):
business is located here.
I'm originally from Scotland.
My accent has somewhatdisappeared now.
After a couple of gin andtonics it comes back straight
back out.
So you might you might hear alittle twang every now and then,
but it's mostly, uh, softened.
But I moved here for business.
Okay, my work as a photographertakes me into the water sports
and sailing space and, um, thisis the sort of mecca for it in
the UK.
So that's what brought me herealmost eight years ago now.
Gary Pageau (01:28):
Oh, okay, so that was kind of my question.
So you started in Scotland.
Is that where your interest inphotography started, and how did
that start?
Patrick Condy (01:35):
Yeah, my interest in photography started there,
alongside sailing.
Sailing and my business havebeen, are so intertwined.
It is within sailing and I grewup sailing up there with my
family and I had a knee injuryand my father bought me a camera
for Christmas one year becauseI wasn't able to walk and go
very far, and he drove me aroundand take pictures and I fell in
(01:57):
love with it from there and andI decided my degree in sports
was not as fun as takingpictures and so I went down the
route of taking pictures and hasever since continued to grow,
and that led me to moving hereas an intern working at a place
called OC Sport and we had aglobal tour of sailing boats
(02:20):
that would go around and race indifferent cities and I was the
intern with the camera runningaround and and that's where it
all started and that's where Isort of started founding myself
self-employed and then a smallbusiness at pkt media.
Gary Pageau (02:32):
So that's how it started so what kind of sports
were you involved in?
Just the sailing?
Patrick Condy (02:36):
you said you were in the yeah, so that's a good
question, guy.
We do a lot of mainly sailing,um, but there's a lot of
different disciplines withinsailing.
You have, you know, grand prix,so like your Formula 1s that go
around a track, we also haveoffshore sailing, which is a big
focus area of mine, which I tryand relate it to.
Other sports would be kind oflike a rally or the Dakar.
(02:59):
They'll disappear off for twoto three weeks and race across
the Atlantic or race around theworld.
I can't go on that one, but wego on lots and it's our job to
try and tell these stories.
And then the other sports thatI focus on are we have a lot of
surfing here, kind of generalwater sports, wing foiling and
(03:19):
other bits and bobs like thatthat go on In the water or on.
It is the place for me.
I've dabbled in a couple ofbits of Formula E and some other
sports, but for me it's thestories around the ocean and get
told in the ocean and thesports that happen there.
For me that's the interest.
Gary Pageau (03:36):
That's very interesting, because I imagine
it's very, very difficult toeven break into that.
So you said you started withanother company, uh oc sport,
right as an intern.
And then when did you?
How long were you in thebusiness before you broke off on
your own and started uh pkcmedia?
Patrick Condy (03:54):
so basically it's been.
It was eight months um as anintern there and really found my
love for it, but the the sportis fickle in its jobs.
Gary Pageau (04:06):
Exactly.
Patrick Condy (04:08):
Our industry runs on sponsorship and sports
sponsorship, so anything to dowith sports sponsorship is
somewhat fickle, and that was myfirst time being made redundant
from that job and I thoughtthis isn't very nice.
So I thought maybe I don't wantto do that again, and so I set
up PKC Media, just essentiallyfor myself, to contract myself
out to a number of differentpeople, but it's always enabled
(04:32):
me to have the well, I'm justgonna do something else on the
side.
That that interests me and Ithink that's always been the
winner is that, uh, you know Ilove taking pictures of sailing
(04:54):
and offshore, but if there'ssomething else that really
interests me, I'm like, oh, Ithink maybe I'll just try that
out a bit as well, and I'msetting up myself has really
enabled me to do this justfascinating, because you must be
putting the camera systems toextreme tests because you're
moving, your subjects are moving, the background is moving.
Gary Pageau (05:17):
What I mean?
I'm not.
This is not a gear podcast.
I'm just curious.
What is it that you use forthat?
Patrick Condy (05:24):
Yeah, I mean, you're right, Gary, the
environments are some of theharshest that really you can
take a camera to.
I've been through many over theyears and I've sat on all sides
.
I have tried Sony's, I've triedCanon's, I even tried some
Fuji's.
I've tried them all.
But I always come back to theNikons, or Americans you would
(05:44):
say.
You call them Nikons.
I'm not making fun, but Ialways have the conversation
with international people whenthey say nikon and I say nikon,
but we know who we mean.
Um, for me it's a little bit ofa personal preference in that
the first camera, way back whenthat my dad bought me, which was
a, I still have it.
I still have the originalcamera that started the business
(06:04):
.
It was a nikon and then.
So, ever since then, the buttonlayouts yes, they change and
you're much fancier cameras, butthe ethos is the same and
there's part of it for that.
But then I made a big switch tocanon and I did enjoy them and
I had a lot about them, but theykept dying.
They kept dying, they'd getsalty and wet and they would die
.
Um through about three or fourin a year and thought these are,
(06:27):
that's it, and I went back tothe nikons and now I'm using two
z9s and an older z7 for whenit's really wet and horrible.
I'd take that one up because Iknow that I get a good picture
from it, but if it dies, I'm I'mnot going to be too upset so
what?
Gary Pageau (06:43):
what causes the death of a camera?
I mean, I think the obviouswould be just water, and I'm
sure you've got housings andthings to cope with that.
But is it just salt air?
Is it?
What's the?
Patrick Condy (06:55):
Yeah, salty air really kills them off.
I mean, normally it's usually abig wave that I haven't seen.
I have housing, you know rubber.
Gary Pageau (07:03):
I shouldn't laugh at that, but that just sounds no
, no usually what happens?
Patrick Condy (07:06):
because you forget, you know the sailor or
the subject is facing the way ofthe ocean and I'm my back to it
normally.
So I usually get caught out and, um, you know, it will be in
those moments where I think thatsunrise is just perfect and I'm
gonna I don't have time to putit in the housing or whatever uh
, and you end up with the barecamera and you, you think I'll
risk it and that's when.
(07:27):
That's when so it's user errorso yeah, it's risking it
sometimes for the shot.
It's worth it, that's usuallyworth it.
That's what kills them off andit's cruel.
It's very cruel because theythey get wet and you dry them
out and they sort of come backto life, but then it's like a
slow death over the next fewmonths.
The salt that's got in themjust slowly kills them off.
(07:49):
Yeah, it's not very nice,unfortunately for them.
Erin Manning (07:51):
Oh goodness.
Gary Pageau (07:56):
So, and of course, nikon I'm going to use your
phrase, since we're in yourworld you know had the Nikonos
system.
You know where they wereliterally the platform for
underwater photography for somany years.
So there's a lot of heritagethere with Nikon.
Patrick Condy (08:09):
Yeah, and actually when I've been a
naughty boy and forgotten to putmy housing on, or I've had a
housing flood, which is prettyexciting, the Nikons do seem to.
Actually, I thought I floodedthis very Z9 that we're using
now in a housing and it had afull drenching and and it's
(08:35):
still so far it's a year and ahalf later is surviving, oh wow.
Gary Pageau (08:36):
So I want to talk a little bit about where you are.
I mean, are you is there likeanother boat, that is, like a
media boat, or are you embeddedwith a team?
And who pays for that?
Who's hiring you?
Patrick Condy (08:43):
yeah, it's a really interesting question and
and it's very dependent.
So there's a.
The business model works on afew different ways.
So the team themselves willhire me internally, um, and that
usually means that I'm on boardthe yacht that's racing, or on
board one of the team's ribs, um, and so the, the sports team,
is paying for me, but they'regetting their money from a
(09:03):
sponsor.
So somebody wants the, theirtitle, down the side of the
vessel.
They're paying the team forthat and then they use that to
pay me, and that's the easiestform, that's the most common.
The other one you will have isthe races themselves.
The organizers will wantcoverage of the race, and so
(09:23):
they'll employ me to cover therace starts or finishes or parts
of the race.
And then the most complicatedand and somewhat outdated system
, which started when I wasaround, was taking, going to
events on my own back, takingpictures and selling them
individually to participants atthe events, and that was the
(09:45):
norm in our industry and hasbeen for a long time.
And when I started sailing andgoing to these events, I was a
poor student and I didn't wantto pay, you know, 50, 60 pounds
for a picture of me sailing, andI thought this model doesn't
work because I would see peopletake screenshotting from the
website and just posting withthe watermark.
It always doesn't work.
(10:06):
It's a waste of why bother, andso I changed my focus and I
never really saw after that.
I always thought that that'sgoing to leave that to the older
blokes.
Gary Pageau (10:16):
Well, you know it's funny you just said, because
over um I, I, one of my friendsof the podcast, is a guy named
Haim Ariyaf who runs the uh,glossy finish and they do sports
photography and he has a systemfor doing action sports
photography and it's very kindof.
It's kind of similar to whatyou do, right, people pay for
the service and he calls thewhat you say, the old blokes,
(10:39):
that process.
He calls that spray and prayright, you take a picture and
you pray.
Patrick Condy (10:44):
Someone buys one yeah, exactly, and I just think
it never worked.
And so I tried it out andnobody ever bought any.
And I thought think it neverworked, and so I tried it out
and nobody ever bought any.
And I thought, well, it's notbecause my pictures are terrible
, I think it's just a rubbishmodel and and I'm targeting the
teams and the organizations andand actually that makes a lot
more sense and it's about howyou market that.
So, for instance, I say to theorganizers you need to advertise
(11:06):
to the people that are payingyou that they're getting images
for free, that they don't haveto then pay for them.
And slowly over the years it'sbecoming the norm.
You know people enter sailingevents or go to races and they
know that they'll get images forfree part of the entry.
So it's been an interestingdevelopment in the model of the
business and that it's movedwith the times, the digital
times.
(11:26):
Now that's how it works.
Gary Pageau (11:28):
Speaking of moving with the digital times, you also
do some videography and youalso do some drone.
Yeah, what's that like on theopen seas using drones?
It's got to be harrying orhorrible.
Patrick Condy (11:45):
Yeah, I think my photography and videography
skills and storytelling is good,but I often say part of my big
appeal and why I ended up havinga job was the ability to fly
drones on these rocks.
And so imagine driving down acountry lane at 30 miles an hour
where it's water spraying inthe window and inside these
boats it can be 120 decibels, soit's being like stood next to
(12:08):
roadworks, so it's not a verynice environment.
And then trying to fly a droneis pretty tricky.
And the bit that's challengingis that there is only 10 or 20
or so people in the world thatdo this and the drones aren't
made for that.
So the drones don't like totake off while they're moving,
they don't like being at sea.
The image gets confused.
(12:29):
The image sensing gets confused.
Gary Pageau (12:31):
Right.
Patrick Condy (12:32):
And the worst part is that your controller
doesn't have any GPS in it, soit doesn't know where it is.
Erin Manning (12:37):
Right.
Patrick Condy (12:37):
So the drone knows where it took off, which
can be four kilometers that way.
Right, so the whole time youhave to fight the system.
Gary Pageau (12:44):
So the whole return to base function is useless.
Patrick Condy (12:49):
Useless.
Not that I am the return tobase function, gary, that's my
job in this, so it's prettytricky and we do lose them.
But look, and I don't feel goodabout putting plastic in the
ocean.
But in terms of our otheroptions it's helicopters and A
they're a lot more costly byalmost tenfold and they're a lot
(13:09):
worse for the environment tohave those things flying around
in the sky.
So they really have changed theway that we tell our sports
story and take pictures, and Ithink drones in general for the
wider photography community havejust changed the game
unbelievably.
It's accessible to everybodynow for $200.
Gary Pageau (13:26):
What would a typical like you have an
objective when you're launchinga drone?
You probably have a shot or avisual in mind, right, that
you're trying to capture, right,because you know a boat
crossing the sunset or whatever.
What kind of planning goes intodoing that kind of thing?
Because that's got to be somuch pre-visualization and
planning more so than anythingelse.
Patrick Condy (13:48):
Yeah, and part of it is planning and part of it
is being ready, because I'm notin control of the boat.
I am a little in terms that Ican ask.
I'm a sailor myself, so Iunderstand the environment, so I
know what's going to happenwhen roughly, and I can ask the
sailors to move the boat in acertain way, but I'm not in
control of the environment atall, and so you have to just
(14:10):
basically be ready to fly whenyou feel there's a good moment.
So, for instance, I'll tell youa story.
We go offshore on these boatsfor extended periods of time to
capture assets, and we did atwo-week trip down to Portugal
and I remember specificallylying in my bed.
Gary Pageau (14:27):
I'm so sorry you had to do that.
Patrick Condy (14:30):
Well, we never got to Portugal, we just got
there and got back on the boat.
I remember lying in my bunk andthinking, oh, it's feeling a
bit more rough, and I could seethis weird light coming through
and I thought, I think it's,we've picked up speed and it's
probably about sunset andsomething good is happening.
And I got up and I'm in myunderwear and I think, oh, this
is amazing, I've got to take apicture of this.
(14:52):
And I launched the drone and Ican remember being stood on the
back of this boat doing almosttop speed in my pants, flying
the drone trying to capturethese images.
So there is pre-planning, butthe planning is having.
It sounds silly, but having thebox and the case, that's usable
, and having the drone chargedand and the organization around
that and then just getting themoment at the time.
Gary Pageau (15:15):
So that's the, that's the challenge and the
logistics are just, you know you.
Patrick Condy (15:19):
I mean, I don't know what brand drone you use,
but you don't get a lot of lifeout of those things in terms of
battery no, so we're using theum, I use dgi's and usually,
whatever the most recent modelis, the fastest one is the wind
speeds are a challenge formyself, and so that's what I
used.
But you've got to be organizedwith the charging the batteries
and you only get, you know now25 minutes out of them, but five
(15:43):
minutes of that is landing.
I'm pretty quick at landing,but the bow is moving a lot and
you're moving, and so landingtakes a minute.
So you've got to'm pretty quickat landing, but the bow is
moving a lot and you're moving,and so landing takes a minute.
So you've got to be prettyquick with knowing when you're
ready to go.
Gary Pageau (15:52):
So your actual useful video time is 15, 20
minutes tops.
Patrick Condy (15:58):
Yeah, that's about it.
So you launch with a hundredpercent and if I'm getting down
to, you know, when I'm gettingto 40%, I'm I'm getting nervous,
you know, so you don't end upwith long.
I'm getting nervous, you know,so you don't end up with long.
Gary Pageau (16:09):
So have you ever had one like drop off, like when
it's on, it's on the approachand it's going to make it, and
then it just dies?
Patrick Condy (16:18):
Yeah, and it's the worst feeling, cause you can
see it go and you're so closebut you're so not.
Gary Pageau (16:23):
I mean you can't tell the boat to turn around and
retrieve it.
Patrick Condy (16:27):
And they sink.
They've gone instantly theysink.
I've lost a few now and they'vegone.
And the only thing if it'sreally, really windy and we're
struggling to get them back on,I the.
The sail of the boat is softand, um, it's hard to damage.
So I often, if I'm really gonna, I know the shot is worth it
and I'm not gonna get the droneback I'll fly the drone into the
sail and then the drone breaks,but I get the memory card.
Gary Pageau (16:49):
That's the important bit because it's not
streaming, is it?
So you have to have the cardout of it?
Patrick Condy (16:54):
yeah, and when they are streaming, it's
streaming in such low qualitythat is almost no use.
It's almost more hurtful thatyou have that than you have the
original you're killing yourbattery is what you're doing
yeah, exactly that.
So it's.
It's a challenge all in all,but you know, you know that's
what makes the job exciting andthat's, when you get those
images, what makes it worth itto get into like a niche like
this.
Gary Pageau (17:26):
I mean, I don't want people to come in and start
competing with you, but there'sa ton of other niches that
people could do this kind ofthing.
I'm thinking like rock climbingor mountaineering or something
like that.
So if someone was interested ingetting into this kind of
business, what do you thinkwould be essential for I mean,
(17:46):
besides obviously having apassion for the category right,
having being a passion for theniche?
Patrick Condy (17:52):
I think it's a good question.
Actually and I think I thoughtabout this before it's nothing
to do with the equipment or howyou approach it or anything.
I think, as you say, having apassion but also an
understanding that you have toearn your place there in terms
of and I don't mean this in thatyou know you need to go and be
an intern or anything else youneed to gain the trust of the
(18:15):
people that are doing it andthey will see god, this guy
really loves it and he actuallywants to tell my story and then
suddenly all the doors are flungopen for you and then you get
into the.
You know equipment and andunderstanding the niche and and
working with suppliers.
That that's been a big one.
For me is is working with.
I've done some stuff with nikonand and outex, which are a
(18:38):
housing company on the products,because they didn't quite work
for me in this niche, and Ireach out to them and say, look,
I love this, I love the product, I need your help to help me
with it.
And again people can feel thepassion and then they go okay,
why should we help this chap?
And he goes you can, they cansee what you do and they earn
the respect, and then the doorsare opened, and that's, for me,
(18:58):
is the the biggest advice is toto earn the place to open the
door.
Gary Pageau (19:02):
Once the door is open, you've got to run straight
through it, and then it goesthe business side of it is kind
of interesting, I think, to me,because you mentioned gear and
stuff like that almost downbelow the actual relationship
side of it.
Um, do you think it is valuablefor people to have been a
competitor or an enthusiast inan event to become a
(19:26):
photographer or a storyteller,if you will, in the category,
because you have a salientbackground but you never were
able to really compete in it.
Do you think that's important?
Patrick Condy (19:36):
A hundred percent , I really do, and I think that
if you have any sort ofunderstanding about the sport
and really engaging in it,before you even bother taking a
picture of it, you know, go andwatch every YouTube there is to
watch about it or really investabout what it is, and then you
will understand the stories.
And that that, for me, isthat's the key from a business
(19:58):
is it doesn't matter how you'regoing to take the picture in the
first instance, that it mattersafter.
But to be able to open the door, you need to understand what
door you're knocking on.
You know, and that, that, forme, is the big thing is
understanding who you'respeaking to and what their story
is and I imagine you have somecredibility.
Yeah, I think that helps.
Gary Pageau (20:17):
You know what you can ask for and what you
shouldn't ask for at certaintimes.
Patrick Condy (20:22):
Yeah, exactly Like you know.
For instance, if I'm not goingto ask one of the sailors that I
work with right in the intensemoment of changing a sail, which
is a very difficult physicalprocess, oh sorry, could you
just do that again?
Again, tell me to go away innot so polite terms, and they
have, and I have asked thosequestions and I've learned my
lesson right.
(20:43):
But you have to go and then yourealize, oh, actually it's your
privilege to be in that spaceand you have to, and and
sometimes you can.
For me, the relationship of aphotographer and as a business,
you're always using your tokens,you're earning your tokens and
thanks very much.
You know I'm doing a good jobfor you.
I'm doing a good job.
Oh, by the way, now I doactually need you to do that
(21:04):
again, but here are more mytokens that I'm going to cash in
to make you do that again forme, you know that's right that's
my kind of way sometimes Itreat some of the clients is
that you know you've got to usethe relationship occasionally to
better the picture.
Gary Pageau (21:18):
They then realize, oh okay, he was worth it for
that picture do you get like ashot list or an objective when
you're covering things, or or ifyou're covering something for a
brand, let's say, for example,let's say, uh, you've worked
with some big brands.
Maybe one of those big brandssays, hey, hey, we're sponsoring
this boat.
I shouldn't say boat, that'sprobably not the right word.
Patrick Condy (21:39):
No, no it's correct All right?
Gary Pageau (21:45):
Well, I didn't want to be a yacht or a racer or a
schooner or whatever, so do theygive you a shot list per se of
covering the event for theirbrand.
Patrick Condy (21:57):
Or are they trusting you to tell their story
that way?
That's an interesting question,and actually I think this is
one of the areas that I feelI've had some success in
delivering.
Is that from being somebodythat did the social media and
from both ends, you know I woulddo the end to end taking the
picture, making the document,making the pitch deck,
publishing things on the website.
I know what is needed on themarketing side and I know I take
(22:18):
that.
Rather than trying tounderstand a good picture, I go,
okay, you know, clothing branda that's employed me.
I know that you need this foryour website, so I know that you
, you don't care if it's alovely picture.
You care if your brand is niceand your jacket's there.
Um, exactly, that's been the key, I think, for me as a
photographer and a storytelleris to, because the brands are
(22:41):
the people that are paying,right, they're paying directly
in the photo shoot or they'repaying the team to put the brand
on the boat or the team member.
That's the whole thing.
The brand is always paying andso you always have to cater to
them, and I see somephotographers yes, it's a
beautiful picture, but there'sno branding in it and so there's
no value to that.
And we've been.
I've employed people forvarious teams and other things
(23:04):
for photo shoots and I thinkwhere's the branding?
The brand are paying you, butyou've got not a single picture
and so there's no point, and sothere is sometimes briefs.
But now I get to a point wherethere's some trust there and
they know that actually I'm herefor you and for the brand and
that's what it is.
And don't get me wrong, I stilltake those beautiful pictures,
but they have different usecases.
Gary Pageau (23:25):
That's been the keys, just understanding the
need of who's employing it whenyou go to a shoot and you see
those beautiful pictures, whoowns all those right?
Let's say, for example, youwanted to and I know stock
photography is a terriblebusiness to be in but let's say,
for example, you were to,wanted to build a stock
portfolio of pretty ships on theseas and sunsets and whatnot
(23:47):
and you want to license it.
Or somebody came to you and say, hey, can I license that?
Can you do that?
Who?
Who owns this stuff?
Patrick Condy (23:54):
so again, and, as you say, stock photography is a
world of gray areas and tripsand trapfalls and similar for
mine.
I'm not in stock photography,but I like to, where possible,
keep the rights for myselfbecause I might want to print
them coffee table book that I'mworking on doing and other
things like that.
So there's a negotiation thathappens.
(24:14):
Some clients want just for them, only for them, and then I have
to say, okay, well, you'regonna have to pay a little bit
more for if you want exclusiverights, right, and usually it's
quite significantly more, uh.
And then they say, oh, no,thanks, and then I get to remain
the rights and I'm, I play thegame, you know, I know what are
their headline pictures andthey're going to be the ones
(24:34):
with the jacket and the thingsthat they want.
I'm not going to use those, butI might use the pretty ones
from that shoot and so there'sthe tradeoff I'm not using the
brand pictures, I'm using thenicer ones, Right?
Gary Pageau (24:46):
And that's what I was getting to.
Is that I'm sure there's a lotof content you have that are not
brand appropriate or brand nice, or I'm not sure what the word
is but yeah and but still aregreat pictures.
And you know, if you signedover the rights to the whole
shoot, they're kind of not ofuse to anyone at that point.
Patrick Condy (25:02):
Exactly, and thankfully in our industry here
in the UK it's not super commonto have exclusive rights, so it
does happen, it's verynegotiated and it's very clear
that that is what's happening,so it's much easier in a way.
Gary Pageau (25:14):
How is that category of racing boats doing?
Is it wildly popular?
Is it becoming more popular?
I'm curious because I knowother sports that are kind of
affluent, adjacent right, likehigh-end golf and things like
that are going through a lot ofchanges now with sponsorships
and controlling bodies andthings like that are going
(25:35):
through a lot of changes nowwith sponsorships and
controlling bodies and thingslike that.
What's happening in the worldof boat racing?
Patrick Condy (25:42):
Yeah, in the world of my main genre is
offshore racing, which is sortof off into big oceans, and a
lot of it happens in France.
The French, as a population,love it, they are fully invested
in.
You know, it's like um nfl inthe states.
Everybody knows about it.
Yeah, so the race that ishappening at the moment is
(26:03):
called the vende globe.
Uh, it happens from a region infrance.
96 percent of france know aboutthe race, so the whole country
knows about it.
So the vende globe race istheir super bowl.
You know, it's a huge, hugedeal and it's only getting
bigger.
It took a real spike in covetbecause people were at home
watching sports and you could beat a boat.
Gary Pageau (26:26):
You were isolated.
People could exactly so.
Patrick Condy (26:29):
Covet was good for sailing in some sense.
Uh, grow the sport and then,year on year, it is growing.
But yeah, we're seeing a changein sailing, that it's all
moving forwards, but it's theexpensive ones.
The bigger, higher end teamsare growing and the smaller
lower end teams are strugglingwith budgets and and finding
cash is becoming harder.
(26:49):
So there's growth at the topand and growth at the very
bottom, but the middle bit isbecoming becoming trickier.
It's interesting for me in thatmost of my business will always
happen at the top, right, um,and not so much in the middle,
so at current it's it's notaffected us a huge amount, uh
here.
Gary Pageau (27:07):
So we'll see what continues to happen who are the
typical sponsors of this sport?
Are they like internationalbrands?
Are they French brands?
I'm curious, if I tune in onYouTube to watch one of these
things, who am I gonna see?
Patrick Condy (27:24):
yeah, it's a good question.
So we've had a few big onesover the years that I've worked
for.
So Hugo Boss, the clothingmanufacturer and company they
were a big sponsor for many,many years of a team I worked
for.
L'occitane en Provence, whichsome people may have heard of,
is a cosmetic and skincare brandthat were very large in Europe
and France and Asia pushing outthere.
(27:45):
So they're one.
And then you have things likeI'm trying to think Chiral, they
make burgers.
So they make all the Frenchmeat burgers in France, so
they're kind of a bit like.
You probably haven't heard of abrand called bird's eye, but
you know food manufacturers arequite common and mcdonald's
sponsors a boat as well, sothere's a few of those.
Yeah, yeah, mcdonald's francesponsor one of the boats, so
(28:09):
there's there's quite a range ofof people that sponsor these
things.
So emirates as well, you knowthey sponsor some stuff.
Gary Pageau (28:14):
So it's, it's a, it's a big range, it's yeah,
that is the big range going fromuh hugo boss down to mcdonald's
yes, exactly so, and it's a lotdependent on what the company's
objectives are.
Patrick Condy (28:28):
You know, for us, with hugo boss, alongside that,
we launched a clothing line.
We were the sole faces of theclothing line was the sailing
clothing line.
That was meant for the marineenvironment and by the beach and
the sea and everything, and soit worked.
The synergy was there.
And for McDonald's, she talks alot about food health.
Gary Pageau (28:43):
I was thinking the Filet-O-Fish is what I was going
.
Patrick Condy (28:47):
I have to say I've never tried one of those,
but they, you know, and at theend of the day they're, they're
eyeballs on the logo.
Gary Pageau (29:01):
That's what they're paying're eyeballs on the logo,
right, that's what they'repaying some of the time as well.
Patrick Condy (29:04):
So the mcdonald's is eyeballs on the logo and
your job is you make the makewhat that eyeball sees.
Very good, yeah.
And prime example is we'veemployed people when they used
to cut off the hugo boss.
They're not.
They'd have half, they'd havehugo.
And you're like, well, you'veliterally taken a picture of
half of the logo.
So no use, I'm afraid.
And so that was always the onewhere, if you can service the
brand, you'll be within a joband you'll have a business well,
patrick, it's been greattalking to you.
Gary Pageau (29:22):
Where can people go to see your work and learn more
about pkc media?
Patrick Condy (29:29):
thank gary.
Yes, it has been great and Iknow it's been short, but it's
been really interesting to chatand people can take a look at my
website at pkcmediacom or hitme up on Instagram.
That's where you'll see lots ofbehind the scenes stuff.
Last night, for example, somesplashing around in the garden
with a hose trying to take somepictures which you would never
know were taken in a back garden.
So yeah, that kind of funhappens on Instagram, so hit me
(29:54):
up there All right, well, thankyou so much, patrick.
Gary Pageau (29:56):
Good to see you and stay safe out there.
Patrick Condy (30:00):
Yeah, thanks again, Gary.
Erin Manning (30:02):
Thank you for listening to the Dead Pixels
Society podcast.
Read more great stories andsign up for the newsletter at
wwwthedeadpixelssocietycom.
Welcome to the Dead Pixel Society podcast, the
photo imaging industry's leadingnews source.
Here's your host, Gary Pageau.
The Dead Pixels Society podcastis brought to you by Mediaclip,
Advertek Printing, andIndependent Photo Imagers.
Gary Pageau (00:18):
Hello again and welcome to the Dead Pixels
Society podcast.
I'm your host, Gary Pageau, andtoday we're joined by Patrick
Condy, the founder of PKC Media.
He is a visual content creatorof all kinds, and he's coming to
us from the Isle of Wight.
I think he's the first guestfrom the Isle of Wight, so
(00:38):
welcome Patrick.
How are you today?
Patrick Condy (00:41):
Hi Gary, thanks for having me on.
Yes, I'm coming to you from theIsle of Wight here in the UK
across the pond.
All very good here.
A bit chilly on our side of thewater, but all very good and
looking forward to getting intotalking about it on here.
Gary Pageau (00:54):
Are you from the Isle of Wight?
Is that where you started from,or is that where your business
is located?
Patrick Condy (01:05):
business is located here.
I'm originally from Scotland.
My accent has somewhatdisappeared now.
After a couple of gin andtonics it comes back straight
back out.
So you might you might hear alittle twang every now and then,
but it's mostly, uh, softened.
But I moved here for business.
Okay, my work as a photographertakes me into the water sports
and sailing space and, um, thisis the sort of mecca for it in
the UK.
So that's what brought me herealmost eight years ago now.
Gary Pageau (01:28):
Oh, okay, so that was kind of my question.
So you started in Scotland.
Is that where your interest inphotography started, and how did
that start?
Patrick Condy (01:35):
Yeah, my interest in photography started there,
alongside sailing.
Sailing and my business havebeen, are so intertwined.
It is within sailing and I grewup sailing up there with my
family and I had a knee injuryand my father bought me a camera
for Christmas one year becauseI wasn't able to walk and go
very far, and he drove me aroundand take pictures and I fell in
(01:57):
love with it from there and andI decided my degree in sports
was not as fun as takingpictures and so I went down the
route of taking pictures and hasever since continued to grow,
and that led me to moving hereas an intern working at a place
called OC Sport and we had aglobal tour of sailing boats
(02:20):
that would go around and race indifferent cities and I was the
intern with the camera runningaround and and that's where it
all started and that's where Isort of started founding myself
self-employed and then a smallbusiness at pkt media.
Gary Pageau (02:32):
So that's how it started so what kind of sports
were you involved in?
Just the sailing?
Patrick Condy (02:36):
you said you were in the yeah, so that's a good
question, guy.
We do a lot of mainly sailing,um, but there's a lot of
different disciplines withinsailing.
You have, you know, grand prix,so like your Formula 1s that go
around a track, we also haveoffshore sailing, which is a big
focus area of mine, which I tryand relate it to.
Other sports would be kind oflike a rally or the Dakar.
(02:59):
They'll disappear off for twoto three weeks and race across
the Atlantic or race around theworld.
I can't go on that one, but wego on lots and it's our job to
try and tell these stories.
And then the other sports thatI focus on are we have a lot of
surfing here, kind of generalwater sports, wing foiling and
(03:19):
other bits and bobs like thatthat go on In the water or on.
It is the place for me.
I've dabbled in a couple ofbits of Formula E and some other
sports, but for me it's thestories around the ocean and get
told in the ocean and thesports that happen there.
For me that's the interest.
Gary Pageau (03:36):
That's very interesting, because I imagine
it's very, very difficult toeven break into that.
So you said you started withanother company, uh oc sport,
right as an intern.
And then when did you?
How long were you in thebusiness before you broke off on
your own and started uh pkcmedia?
Patrick Condy (03:54):
so basically it's been.
It was eight months um as anintern there and really found my
love for it, but the the sportis fickle in its jobs.
Gary Pageau (04:06):
Exactly.
Patrick Condy (04:08):
Our industry runs on sponsorship and sports
sponsorship, so anything to dowith sports sponsorship is
somewhat fickle, and that was myfirst time being made redundant
from that job and I thoughtthis isn't very nice.
So I thought maybe I don't wantto do that again, and so I set
up PKC Media, just essentiallyfor myself, to contract myself
out to a number of differentpeople, but it's always enabled
(04:32):
me to have the well, I'm justgonna do something else on the
side.
That that interests me and Ithink that's always been the
winner is that, uh, you know Ilove taking pictures of sailing
(04:54):
and offshore, but if there'ssomething else that really
interests me, I'm like, oh, Ithink maybe I'll just try that
out a bit as well, and I'msetting up myself has really
enabled me to do this justfascinating, because you must be
putting the camera systems toextreme tests because you're
moving, your subjects are moving, the background is moving.
Gary Pageau (05:17):
What I mean?
I'm not.
This is not a gear podcast.
I'm just curious.
What is it that you use forthat?
Patrick Condy (05:24):
Yeah, I mean, you're right, Gary, the
environments are some of theharshest that really you can
take a camera to.
I've been through many over theyears and I've sat on all sides
.
I have tried Sony's, I've triedCanon's, I even tried some
Fuji's.
I've tried them all.
But I always come back to theNikons, or Americans you would
(05:44):
say.
You call them Nikons.
I'm not making fun, but Ialways have the conversation
with international people whenthey say nikon and I say nikon,
but we know who we mean.
Um, for me it's a little bit ofa personal preference in that
the first camera, way back whenthat my dad bought me, which was
a, I still have it.
I still have the originalcamera that started the business
(06:04):
.
It was a nikon and then.
So, ever since then, the buttonlayouts yes, they change and
you're much fancier cameras, butthe ethos is the same and
there's part of it for that.
But then I made a big switch tocanon and I did enjoy them and
I had a lot about them, but theykept dying.
They kept dying, they'd getsalty and wet and they would die
.
Um through about three or fourin a year and thought these are,
(06:27):
that's it, and I went back tothe nikons and now I'm using two
z9s and an older z7 for whenit's really wet and horrible.
I'd take that one up because Iknow that I get a good picture
from it, but if it dies, I'm I'mnot going to be too upset so
what?
Gary Pageau (06:43):
what causes the death of a camera?
I mean, I think the obviouswould be just water, and I'm
sure you've got housings andthings to cope with that.
But is it just salt air?
Is it?
What's the?
Patrick Condy (06:55):
Yeah, salty air really kills them off.
I mean, normally it's usually abig wave that I haven't seen.
I have housing, you know rubber.
Gary Pageau (07:03):
I shouldn't laugh at that, but that just sounds no
, no usually what happens?
Patrick Condy (07:06):
because you forget, you know the sailor or
the subject is facing the way ofthe ocean and I'm my back to it
normally.
So I usually get caught out and, um, you know, it will be in
those moments where I think thatsunrise is just perfect and I'm
gonna I don't have time to putit in the housing or whatever uh
, and you end up with the barecamera and you, you think I'll
risk it and that's when.
(07:27):
That's when so it's user errorso yeah, it's risking it
sometimes for the shot.
It's worth it, that's usuallyworth it.
That's what kills them off andit's cruel.
It's very cruel because theythey get wet and you dry them
out and they sort of come backto life, but then it's like a
slow death over the next fewmonths.
The salt that's got in themjust slowly kills them off.
(07:49):
Yeah, it's not very nice,unfortunately for them.
Erin Manning (07:51):
Oh goodness.
Gary Pageau (07:56):
So, and of course, nikon I'm going to use your
phrase, since we're in yourworld you know had the Nikonos
system.
You know where they wereliterally the platform for
underwater photography for somany years.
So there's a lot of heritagethere with Nikon.
Patrick Condy (08:09):
Yeah, and actually when I've been a
naughty boy and forgotten to putmy housing on, or I've had a
housing flood, which is prettyexciting, the Nikons do seem to.
Actually, I thought I floodedthis very Z9 that we're using
now in a housing and it had afull drenching and and it's
(08:35):
still so far it's a year and ahalf later is surviving, oh wow.
Gary Pageau (08:36):
So I want to talk a little bit about where you are.
I mean, are you is there likeanother boat, that is, like a
media boat, or are you embeddedwith a team?
And who pays for that?
Who's hiring you?
Patrick Condy (08:43):
yeah, it's a really interesting question and
and it's very dependent.
So there's a.
The business model works on afew different ways.
So the team themselves willhire me internally, um, and that
usually means that I'm on boardthe yacht that's racing, or on
board one of the team's ribs, um, and so the, the sports team,
is paying for me, but they'regetting their money from a
(09:03):
sponsor.
So somebody wants the, theirtitle, down the side of the
vessel.
They're paying the team forthat and then they use that to
pay me, and that's the easiestform, that's the most common.
The other one you will have isthe races themselves.
The organizers will wantcoverage of the race, and so
(09:23):
they'll employ me to cover therace starts or finishes or parts
of the race.
And then the most complicatedand and somewhat outdated system
, which started when I wasaround, was taking, going to
events on my own back, takingpictures and selling them
individually to participants atthe events, and that was the
(09:45):
norm in our industry and hasbeen for a long time.
And when I started sailing andgoing to these events, I was a
poor student and I didn't wantto pay, you know, 50, 60 pounds
for a picture of me sailing, andI thought this model doesn't
work because I would see peopletake screenshotting from the
website and just posting withthe watermark.
It always doesn't work.
(10:06):
It's a waste of why bother, andso I changed my focus and I
never really saw after that.
I always thought that that'sgoing to leave that to the older
blokes.
Gary Pageau (10:16):
Well, you know it's funny you just said, because
over um I, I, one of my friendsof the podcast, is a guy named
Haim Ariyaf who runs the uh,glossy finish and they do sports
photography and he has a systemfor doing action sports
photography and it's very kindof.
It's kind of similar to whatyou do, right, people pay for
the service and he calls thewhat you say, the old blokes,
(10:39):
that process.
He calls that spray and prayright, you take a picture and
you pray.
Patrick Condy (10:44):
Someone buys one yeah, exactly, and I just think
it never worked.
And so I tried it out andnobody ever bought any.
And I thought think it neverworked, and so I tried it out
and nobody ever bought any.
And I thought, well, it's notbecause my pictures are terrible
, I think it's just a rubbishmodel and and I'm targeting the
teams and the organizations andand actually that makes a lot
more sense and it's about howyou market that.
So, for instance, I say to theorganizers you need to advertise
(11:06):
to the people that are payingyou that they're getting images
for free, that they don't haveto then pay for them.
And slowly over the years it'sbecoming the norm.
You know people enter sailingevents or go to races and they
know that they'll get images forfree part of the entry.
So it's been an interestingdevelopment in the model of the
business and that it's movedwith the times, the digital
times.
(11:26):
Now that's how it works.
Gary Pageau (11:28):
Speaking of moving with the digital times, you also
do some videography and youalso do some drone.
Yeah, what's that like on theopen seas using drones?
It's got to be harrying orhorrible.
Patrick Condy (11:45):
Yeah, I think my photography and videography
skills and storytelling is good,but I often say part of my big
appeal and why I ended up havinga job was the ability to fly
drones on these rocks.
And so imagine driving down acountry lane at 30 miles an hour
where it's water spraying inthe window and inside these
boats it can be 120 decibels, soit's being like stood next to
(12:08):
roadworks, so it's not a verynice environment.
And then trying to fly a droneis pretty tricky.
And the bit that's challengingis that there is only 10 or 20
or so people in the world thatdo this and the drones aren't
made for that.
So the drones don't like totake off while they're moving,
they don't like being at sea.
The image gets confused.
(12:29):
The image sensing gets confused.
Gary Pageau (12:31):
Right.
Patrick Condy (12:32):
And the worst part is that your controller
doesn't have any GPS in it, soit doesn't know where it is.
Erin Manning (12:37):
Right.
Patrick Condy (12:37):
So the drone knows where it took off, which
can be four kilometers that way.
Right, so the whole time youhave to fight the system.
Gary Pageau (12:44):
So the whole return to base function is useless.
Patrick Condy (12:49):
Useless.
Not that I am the return tobase function, gary, that's my
job in this, so it's prettytricky and we do lose them.
But look, and I don't feel goodabout putting plastic in the
ocean.
But in terms of our otheroptions it's helicopters and A
they're a lot more costly byalmost tenfold and they're a lot
(13:09):
worse for the environment tohave those things flying around
in the sky.
So they really have changed theway that we tell our sports
story and take pictures, and Ithink drones in general for the
wider photography community havejust changed the game
unbelievably.
It's accessible to everybodynow for $200.
Gary Pageau (13:26):
What would a typical like you have an
objective when you're launchinga drone?
You probably have a shot or avisual in mind, right, that
you're trying to capture, right,because you know a boat
crossing the sunset or whatever.
What kind of planning goes intodoing that kind of thing?
Because that's got to be somuch pre-visualization and
planning more so than anythingelse.
Patrick Condy (13:48):
Yeah, and part of it is planning and part of it
is being ready, because I'm notin control of the boat.
I am a little in terms that Ican ask.
I'm a sailor myself, so Iunderstand the environment, so I
know what's going to happenwhen roughly, and I can ask the
sailors to move the boat in acertain way, but I'm not in
control of the environment atall, and so you have to just
(14:10):
basically be ready to fly whenyou feel there's a good moment.
So, for instance, I'll tell youa story.
We go offshore on these boatsfor extended periods of time to
capture assets, and we did atwo-week trip down to Portugal
and I remember specificallylying in my bed.
Gary Pageau (14:27):
I'm so sorry you had to do that.
Patrick Condy (14:30):
Well, we never got to Portugal, we just got
there and got back on the boat.
I remember lying in my bunk andthinking, oh, it's feeling a
bit more rough, and I could seethis weird light coming through
and I thought, I think it's,we've picked up speed and it's
probably about sunset andsomething good is happening.
And I got up and I'm in myunderwear and I think, oh, this
is amazing, I've got to take apicture of this.
(14:52):
And I launched the drone and Ican remember being stood on the
back of this boat doing almosttop speed in my pants, flying
the drone trying to capturethese images.
So there is pre-planning, butthe planning is having.
It sounds silly, but having thebox and the case, that's usable
, and having the drone chargedand and the organization around
that and then just getting themoment at the time.
Gary Pageau (15:15):
So that's the, that's the challenge and the
logistics are just, you know you.
Patrick Condy (15:19):
I mean, I don't know what brand drone you use,
but you don't get a lot of lifeout of those things in terms of
battery no, so we're using theum, I use dgi's and usually,
whatever the most recent modelis, the fastest one is the wind
speeds are a challenge formyself, and so that's what I
used.
But you've got to be organizedwith the charging the batteries
and you only get, you know now25 minutes out of them, but five
(15:43):
minutes of that is landing.
I'm pretty quick at landing,but the bow is moving a lot and
you're moving, and so landingtakes a minute.
So you've got to'm pretty quickat landing, but the bow is
moving a lot and you're moving,and so landing takes a minute.
So you've got to be prettyquick with knowing when you're
ready to go.
Gary Pageau (15:52):
So your actual useful video time is 15, 20
minutes tops.
Patrick Condy (15:58):
Yeah, that's about it.
So you launch with a hundredpercent and if I'm getting down
to, you know, when I'm gettingto 40%, I'm I'm getting nervous,
you know, so you don't end upwith long.
I'm getting nervous, you know,so you don't end up with long.
Gary Pageau (16:09):
So have you ever had one like drop off, like when
it's on, it's on the approachand it's going to make it, and
then it just dies?
Patrick Condy (16:18):
Yeah, and it's the worst feeling, cause you can
see it go and you're so closebut you're so not.
Gary Pageau (16:23):
I mean you can't tell the boat to turn around and
retrieve it.
Patrick Condy (16:27):
And they sink.
They've gone instantly theysink.
I've lost a few now and they'vegone.
And the only thing if it'sreally, really windy and we're
struggling to get them back on,I the.
The sail of the boat is softand, um, it's hard to damage.
So I often, if I'm really gonna, I know the shot is worth it
and I'm not gonna get the droneback I'll fly the drone into the
sail and then the drone breaks,but I get the memory card.
Gary Pageau (16:49):
That's the important bit because it's not
streaming, is it?
So you have to have the cardout of it?
Patrick Condy (16:54):
yeah, and when they are streaming, it's
streaming in such low qualitythat is almost no use.
It's almost more hurtful thatyou have that than you have the
original you're killing yourbattery is what you're doing
yeah, exactly that.
So it's.
It's a challenge all in all,but you know, you know that's
what makes the job exciting andthat's, when you get those
images, what makes it worth itto get into like a niche like
this.
Gary Pageau (17:26):
I mean, I don't want people to come in and start
competing with you, but there'sa ton of other niches that
people could do this kind ofthing.
I'm thinking like rock climbingor mountaineering or something
like that.
So if someone was interested ingetting into this kind of
business, what do you thinkwould be essential for I mean,
(17:46):
besides obviously having apassion for the category right,
having being a passion for theniche?
Patrick Condy (17:52):
I think it's a good question.
Actually and I think I thoughtabout this before it's nothing
to do with the equipment or howyou approach it or anything.
I think, as you say, having apassion but also an
understanding that you have toearn your place there in terms
of and I don't mean this in thatyou know you need to go and be
an intern or anything else youneed to gain the trust of the
(18:15):
people that are doing it andthey will see god, this guy
really loves it and he actuallywants to tell my story and then
suddenly all the doors are flungopen for you and then you get
into the.
You know equipment and andunderstanding the niche and and
working with suppliers.
That that's been a big one.
For me is is working with.
I've done some stuff with nikonand and outex, which are a
(18:38):
housing company on the products,because they didn't quite work
for me in this niche, and Ireach out to them and say, look,
I love this, I love the product, I need your help to help me
with it.
And again people can feel thepassion and then they go okay,
why should we help this chap?
And he goes you can, they cansee what you do and they earn
the respect, and then the doorsare opened, and that's, for me,
(18:58):
is the the biggest advice is toto earn the place to open the
door.
Gary Pageau (19:02):
Once the door is open, you've got to run straight
through it, and then it goesthe business side of it is kind
of interesting, I think, to me,because you mentioned gear and
stuff like that almost downbelow the actual relationship
side of it.
Um, do you think it is valuablefor people to have been a
competitor or an enthusiast inan event to become a
(19:26):
photographer or a storyteller,if you will, in the category,
because you have a salientbackground but you never were
able to really compete in it.
Do you think that's important?
Patrick Condy (19:36):
A hundred percent , I really do, and I think that
if you have any sort ofunderstanding about the sport
and really engaging in it,before you even bother taking a
picture of it, you know, go andwatch every YouTube there is to
watch about it or really investabout what it is, and then you
will understand the stories.
And that that, for me, isthat's the key from a business
(19:58):
is it doesn't matter how you'regoing to take the picture in the
first instance, that it mattersafter.
But to be able to open the door, you need to understand what
door you're knocking on.
You know, and that, that, forme, is the big thing is
understanding who you'respeaking to and what their story
is and I imagine you have somecredibility.
Yeah, I think that helps.
Gary Pageau (20:17):
You know what you can ask for and what you
shouldn't ask for at certaintimes.
Patrick Condy (20:22):
Yeah, exactly Like you know.
For instance, if I'm not goingto ask one of the sailors that I
work with right in the intensemoment of changing a sail, which
is a very difficult physicalprocess, oh sorry, could you
just do that again?
Again, tell me to go away innot so polite terms, and they
have, and I have asked thosequestions and I've learned my
lesson right.
(20:43):
But you have to go and then yourealize, oh, actually it's your
privilege to be in that spaceand you have to, and and
sometimes you can.
For me, the relationship of aphotographer and as a business,
you're always using your tokens,you're earning your tokens and
thanks very much.
You know I'm doing a good jobfor you.
I'm doing a good job.
Oh, by the way, now I doactually need you to do that
(21:04):
again, but here are more mytokens that I'm going to cash in
to make you do that again forme, you know that's right that's
my kind of way sometimes Itreat some of the clients is
that you know you've got to usethe relationship occasionally to
better the picture.
Gary Pageau (21:18):
They then realize, oh okay, he was worth it for
that picture do you get like ashot list or an objective when
you're covering things, or or ifyou're covering something for a
brand, let's say, for example,let's say, uh, you've worked
with some big brands.
Maybe one of those big brandssays, hey, hey, we're sponsoring
this boat.
I shouldn't say boat, that'sprobably not the right word.
Patrick Condy (21:39):
No, no it's correct All right?
Gary Pageau (21:45):
Well, I didn't want to be a yacht or a racer or a
schooner or whatever, so do theygive you a shot list per se of
covering the event for theirbrand.
Patrick Condy (21:57):
Or are they trusting you to tell their story
that way?
That's an interesting question,and actually I think this is
one of the areas that I feelI've had some success in
delivering.
Is that from being somebodythat did the social media and
from both ends, you know I woulddo the end to end taking the
picture, making the document,making the pitch deck,
publishing things on the website.
I know what is needed on themarketing side and I know I take
(22:18):
that.
Rather than trying tounderstand a good picture, I go,
okay, you know, clothing branda that's employed me.
I know that you need this foryour website, so I know that you
, you don't care if it's alovely picture.
You care if your brand is niceand your jacket's there.
Um, exactly, that's been the key, I think, for me as a
photographer and a storytelleris to, because the brands are
(22:41):
the people that are paying,right, they're paying directly
in the photo shoot or they'repaying the team to put the brand
on the boat or the team member.
That's the whole thing.
The brand is always paying andso you always have to cater to
them, and I see somephotographers yes, it's a
beautiful picture, but there'sno branding in it and so there's
no value to that.
And we've been.
I've employed people forvarious teams and other things
(23:04):
for photo shoots and I thinkwhere's the branding?
The brand are paying you, butyou've got not a single picture
and so there's no point, and sothere is sometimes briefs.
But now I get to a point wherethere's some trust there and
they know that actually I'm herefor you and for the brand and
that's what it is.
And don't get me wrong, I stilltake those beautiful pictures,
but they have different usecases.
Gary Pageau (23:25):
That's been the keys, just understanding the
need of who's employing it whenyou go to a shoot and you see
those beautiful pictures, whoowns all those right?
Let's say, for example, youwanted to and I know stock
photography is a terriblebusiness to be in but let's say,
for example, you were to,wanted to build a stock
portfolio of pretty ships on theseas and sunsets and whatnot
(23:47):
and you want to license it.
Or somebody came to you and say, hey, can I license that?
Can you do that?
Who?
Who owns this stuff?
Patrick Condy (23:54):
so again, and, as you say, stock photography is a
world of gray areas and tripsand trapfalls and similar for
mine.
I'm not in stock photography,but I like to, where possible,
keep the rights for myselfbecause I might want to print
them coffee table book that I'mworking on doing and other
things like that.
So there's a negotiation thathappens.
(24:14):
Some clients want just for them, only for them, and then I have
to say, okay, well, you'regonna have to pay a little bit
more for if you want exclusiverights, right, and usually it's
quite significantly more, uh.
And then they say, oh, no,thanks, and then I get to remain
the rights and I'm, I play thegame, you know, I know what are
their headline pictures andthey're going to be the ones
(24:34):
with the jacket and the thingsthat they want.
I'm not going to use those, butI might use the pretty ones
from that shoot and so there'sthe tradeoff I'm not using the
brand pictures, I'm using thenicer ones, Right?
Gary Pageau (24:46):
And that's what I was getting to.
Is that I'm sure there's a lotof content you have that are not
brand appropriate or brand nice, or I'm not sure what the word
is but yeah and but still aregreat pictures.
And you know, if you signedover the rights to the whole
shoot, they're kind of not ofuse to anyone at that point.
Patrick Condy (25:02):
Exactly, and thankfully in our industry here
in the UK it's not super commonto have exclusive rights, so it
does happen, it's verynegotiated and it's very clear
that that is what's happening,so it's much easier in a way.
Gary Pageau (25:14):
How is that category of racing boats doing?
Is it wildly popular?
Is it becoming more popular?
I'm curious because I knowother sports that are kind of
affluent, adjacent right, likehigh-end golf and things like
that are going through a lot ofchanges now with sponsorships
and controlling bodies andthings like that are going
(25:35):
through a lot of changes nowwith sponsorships and
controlling bodies and thingslike that.
What's happening in the worldof boat racing?
Patrick Condy (25:42):
Yeah, in the world of my main genre is
offshore racing, which is sortof off into big oceans, and a
lot of it happens in France.
The French, as a population,love it, they are fully invested
in.
You know, it's like um nfl inthe states.
Everybody knows about it.
Yeah, so the race that ishappening at the moment is
(26:03):
called the vende globe.
Uh, it happens from a region infrance.
96 percent of france know aboutthe race, so the whole country
knows about it.
So the vende globe race istheir super bowl.
You know, it's a huge, hugedeal and it's only getting
bigger.
It took a real spike in covetbecause people were at home
watching sports and you could beat a boat.
Gary Pageau (26:26):
You were isolated.
People could exactly so.
Patrick Condy (26:29):
Covet was good for sailing in some sense.
Uh, grow the sport and then,year on year, it is growing.
But yeah, we're seeing a changein sailing, that it's all
moving forwards, but it's theexpensive ones.
The bigger, higher end teamsare growing and the smaller
lower end teams are strugglingwith budgets and and finding
cash is becoming harder.
(26:49):
So there's growth at the topand and growth at the very
bottom, but the middle bit isbecoming becoming trickier.
It's interesting for me in thatmost of my business will always
happen at the top, right, um,and not so much in the middle,
so at current it's it's notaffected us a huge amount, uh
here.
Gary Pageau (27:07):
So we'll see what continues to happen who are the
typical sponsors of this sport?
Are they like internationalbrands?
Are they French brands?
I'm curious, if I tune in onYouTube to watch one of these
things, who am I gonna see?
Patrick Condy (27:24):
yeah, it's a good question.
So we've had a few big onesover the years that I've worked
for.
So Hugo Boss, the clothingmanufacturer and company they
were a big sponsor for many,many years of a team I worked
for.
L'occitane en Provence, whichsome people may have heard of,
is a cosmetic and skincare brandthat were very large in Europe
and France and Asia pushing outthere.
(27:45):
So they're one.
And then you have things likeI'm trying to think Chiral, they
make burgers.
So they make all the Frenchmeat burgers in France, so
they're kind of a bit like.
You probably haven't heard of abrand called bird's eye, but
you know food manufacturers arequite common and mcdonald's
sponsors a boat as well, sothere's a few of those.
Yeah, yeah, mcdonald's francesponsor one of the boats, so
(28:09):
there's there's quite a range ofof people that sponsor these
things.
So emirates as well, you knowthey sponsor some stuff.
Gary Pageau (28:14):
So it's, it's a, it's a big range, it's yeah,
that is the big range going fromuh hugo boss down to mcdonald's
yes, exactly so, and it's a lotdependent on what the company's
objectives are.
Patrick Condy (28:28):
You know, for us, with hugo boss, alongside that,
we launched a clothing line.
We were the sole faces of theclothing line was the sailing
clothing line.
That was meant for the marineenvironment and by the beach and
the sea and everything, and soit worked.
The synergy was there.
And for McDonald's, she talks alot about food health.
Gary Pageau (28:43):
I was thinking the Filet-O-Fish is what I was going
.
Patrick Condy (28:47):
I have to say I've never tried one of those,
but they, you know, and at theend of the day they're, they're
eyeballs on the logo.
Gary Pageau (29:01):
That's what they're paying're eyeballs on the logo,
right, that's what they'repaying some of the time as well.
Patrick Condy (29:04):
So the mcdonald's is eyeballs on the logo and
your job is you make the makewhat that eyeball sees.
Very good, yeah.
And prime example is we'veemployed people when they used
to cut off the hugo boss.
They're not.
They'd have half, they'd havehugo.
And you're like, well, you'veliterally taken a picture of
half of the logo.
So no use, I'm afraid.
And so that was always the onewhere, if you can service the
brand, you'll be within a joband you'll have a business well,
patrick, it's been greattalking to you.
Gary Pageau (29:22):
Where can people go to see your work and learn more
about pkc media?
Patrick Condy (29:29):
thank gary.
Yes, it has been great and Iknow it's been short, but it's
been really interesting to chatand people can take a look at my
website at pkcmediacom or hitme up on Instagram.
That's where you'll see lots ofbehind the scenes stuff.
Last night, for example, somesplashing around in the garden
with a hose trying to take somepictures which you would never
know were taken in a back garden.
So yeah, that kind of funhappens on Instagram, so hit me
(29:54):
up there All right, well, thankyou so much, patrick.
Gary Pageau (29:56):
Good to see you and stay safe out there.
Patrick Condy (30:00):
Yeah, thanks again, Gary.
Erin Manning (30:02):
Thank you for listening to the Dead Pixels
Society podcast.
Read more great stories andsign up for the newsletter at
wwwthedeadpixelssocietycom.
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