November 20, 2025 • 36 mins
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A musician’s tour, a borrowed camera, and a rowboat on Central Park’s lake: that’s the unlikely path that led Ash Fox from nightlife photography to building a full-service proposal planning studio in New York. This interview digs into how a niche chose her, why proposals feel more honest than weddings, and the exact steps that turn a fantasy location into a smooth, unforgettable yes.
Fox breaks down the difference between a proposal photographer and a proposal planner, and why most couples actually need both. She shares candid stories about early gear mistakes, the collapse of the rock revival scene, and the moment she realized proposals required coaching, logistics, and decoys as much as lenses and light. You’ll hear how she guides clients away from crowded icons like the Brooklyn Bridge into vantage points that protect privacy, control timing, and preserve the surprise. We also explore how Instagram and TikTok changed expectations, when to add video, and how to build decor that matches the couple’s personality rather than chasing trends.
With more than 3,000 engagements planned and photographed, Fox offers practical advice on booking timelines, private rooftops, and what to do when your partner plans everything. She’s frank about viral “no” videos, why they’re often staged, and the real markers that a relationship is ready for marriage.
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Hosted and produced by Gary Pageau
Edited by Olivia Pageau
Announcer: Erin Manning
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Erin Manning (00:01):
Welcome to the Dead Pixels Society Podcast, the
photoimaging industry's leadingnews source.
And here's your host, GaryPageau.
The Dead Pixels Society Podcastis brought to you by Mediaclip,
Advertek Printing, andIndependent Photo Imagers.
Gary Pageau (00:18):
Hello again and welcome to the Dead Pixels
Society Podcast.
I'm your host, Gary Pageau, andtoday we're joined by Ash Fox,
who is the founder of Ash FoxProposals, a business based in
New York City that providesprofessional photography
services and proposal things forgetting engaged.
So I'm like really intrigued bythis.
(00:39):
So Ash, welcome to the show.
Good to see you.
Thank you, Gary.
It's an honor to be here
Tell me about getting startedin professional photography,
because that led to the proposalbusiness.
So where did that start andwhat drove your interest in
that?
Ash Fox (00:57):
Oh, I'm happy to share.
Well, I, yes, I'm aphotographer.
I started as a photographer.
And the funny thing is, I'm avery unlikely photographer, and
I'm an unlikely person also tobe in the wedding industry for
many different reasons.
Um, but to start off, I went toschool, I studied art, I took
(01:17):
one photography class in school,a film photography class.
And I'm telling you, Gary, ifwe had not entered the world of
digital photography, I wouldnever have been a photographer.
I never would have been.
Because the film photographyclass, it was so romantic to me
to be able to be in that.
It was like a fantasy of mineto develop your own film.
But once I actually did it, I'mlike, I'm allergic to the
(01:38):
chemicals.
I'm happy that I already haveallergies as it is.
You don't know if the picturesare gonna come out.
And I'm like, I hate this.
And so that was like my leastfavorite class I took.
Funny enough, I ended upbecoming a photographer.
So after school, I was justdoing all kinds of creative
freelance work while I was inschool and after school.
And a friend was doing reallyelaborate photo shoots because
(02:00):
he was a musician and he waskind of starting like a pop
music career.
And I said to him JustinTimberlake.
Could have been, no, I'm notthat old.
It could have been JustinBieber, but no, I'm not that
old.
I'm right in between those twogenerations.
Um, but he he was a really goodfriend.
He has actually has a career inin Japan, and he said to me,
(02:23):
Um, so we were talking about it,and I'm like, why don't you
just buy a really fancy camera?
I'll figure it out.
And I'm like, I'll just takeyour pictures for you.
So he ended up doing that.
He buys the high-end camera.
I'm playing around with it.
And then he is like, you know,why don't you come on tour with
me?
He was doing this like tour ofum malls and cool stuff for, you
(02:44):
know, to get seen by a lot ofkids.
And so I went with him.
And that's really where Ilearned how to compose and shoot
because every night I wasshooting.
So my first, my first job, myfirst time doing photography
really was a job.
And then simultaneously at thesame time, I had a very, I got a
very funny, one of my odd jobswas a friend who is a rock and
(03:05):
roll DJ in New York City.
He asked me to be a dancer forone of his new parties.
And I was like, dancer.
I'm like, go, go dancer.
I was like, oh, I don't know ifthat's, you know, that's my
thing.
And he was like, no, you canjust wear what you normally
wear.
You don't have to wear likebooty shorts or anything.
I'm like, okay, I'll take thejob.
Um, so I'm doing this job for amonth, and I there was a girl
(03:25):
doing photography, and I waslike, Kel, I could do her job
because she was leaving.
And he was like, All right,you're on.
So he gave me his camera.
And so I started shooting.
And so my first two photographyjobs, I didn't even have a
camera for the longest time.
I just was borrowing camerasand I was learning as I went.
So I got hired and then Ilearned on the job.
(03:45):
And what ended up happening wasit was so amazing, Gary,
because I found I was a big rockand roll fan and a big music
fan.
And I always wondered, like,how I'm not a musician, like,
how would I fit in this world?
And then when I became aphotographer and I was actually
in the mix of all this, likephotographing musicians, um, the
party that we did had all kindsof famous musicians come
(04:07):
through.
Debbie Harry, um, Z Z Top camethrough, John Legend, the guy
from The Killers.
Um, yeah, it was really, reallycool.
And so you're I'm around allthis and I'm photographing
people.
And then I got um an award likebest nightlife photographer in
New York City, and it startedaffirming me, being like, oh,
maybe this is the path forwardfor me.
I'm gonna be like a musicphotographer, I'm gonna go on
(04:29):
tour, I'm gonna work for RollingStone, you know, or spin.
Gary Pageau (04:32):
Right, yeah, yeah.
Ash Fox (04:33):
You know, I start getting press passes to my
favorite bands, and it was, itwas just it was such a weird.
Gary Pageau (04:38):
You never own a camera at that point.
Ash Fox (04:40):
I didn't even own a camera, Gary.
Gary Pageau (04:43):
Okay.
Ash Fox (04:44):
It took like a whole another year for me to buy a
camera.
I was feeling like, okay, Ithink I need to buy a camera now
because this is becoming real.
So I bought my first camera.
I think it was a Nikon D7, Ithink it was Nikon D7500.
Do you know that camera?
That was my first one.
It wasn't full frame.
Um, it was a crop frame, but itdid me well.
(05:06):
I I remember, I remember goingto BNH, you know, BNH photo.
Of course, yeah.
Of course, you know it.
Okay, in New York.
And I'm like, all right, whatlens should I get?
And this guy behind the camera,you know, orthodox guy, um,
he's like, he's like, this isthe money lens.
And he gives me like a 50millimeter.
He's like, this is the moneylens.
You'll make all your money fromthis one lens.
Gary Pageau (05:26):
From a 50 millimeter lens, yeah, 50
millimeter 1.4.
Ash Fox (05:29):
He's like, this is the money lens.
Gary Pageau (05:31):
So we get to even know what you were shooting,
because that's that's aninteresting choice for a rock
and roll photographer.
That's an interesting choice.
Ash Fox (05:40):
I ended up, oh my god, I can you, I can go real deep
into the things that I boughtand the mistakes I made in what
I bought.
Um, that was a lesson I had tolearn the hard way.
I actually bought, funnyenough, I'll just share with
you, I bought a somehow I wasconvinced to buy a 70 to 200
Sigma lens.
I get the lens, Gary.
The lens is defective and Idon't know it.
(06:02):
And I just blamed it on myself.
I'm like, I'm a newphotographer, I don't know what
I'm doing.
It turned out it was defective.
And I had this lens, that'swhere you could return it.
Right.
So anyway, I learned the hardway.
You gotta like really know youneed a lens before just dropping
a whole bunch of money onsomething.
So um, but anyway, back to mystory.
That's how it really started.
That's how I became aphotographer.
(06:23):
So it's, you know, it was Iwasn't a hobby photographer who
then followed my passion andbecame a professional
photographer.
I really kind of became aprofessional out of the gate.
Um, but but I didn't know whatI was doing.
I had to kind of learn on thejob.
Gary Pageau (06:36):
So fortunately, you had people who were willing to
be patient with you, obviously.
Ash Fox (06:42):
People believed in me because the one thing I'll tell
I'll say about myself is I havean eye.
I have a natural ability forcomposition, for aesthetics.
And so I just had to learn howto use the camera pretty much,
but I got framing instantly, Igot composition, um, lighting
that came very natural.
Gary Pageau (07:03):
I know that that's probably from your art
background, right?
Ash Fox (07:05):
I mean that yeah, yeah, exactly.
Gary Pageau (07:09):
So, what kind of photography did you get into?
I mean, do you have you know,rock and roll or pop music or
mall tour photography licked?
You know, why didn't you staywith that?
Ash Fox (07:23):
So, what ended up happening was I had a crash and
burn moment.
So I was doing the rock androll thing.
I had so many dreams andaspirations.
I got um one of the biggest,like I I have never talked about
this on a podcast because it'sit just doesn't seem relevant,
but one of like the biggestexciting milestones in my life,
which like nobody probablycares, is that Stone Temple
(07:44):
Pilots Reunited.
Do you know that band?
Yeah, of course.
Um, they were from the 90s.
Okay, they had a reunion tour,and I got a press pass to be
like to like photographed theirreunion show in New York.
And um, that was like one ofthose incredible moments.
I was riding high, being like,okay, this is really coming
together for me.
Everything's coming.
Sure.
And then I crashed out becausewhat ended up happening was the
(08:06):
rock and roll party that we'dbeen doing, which brought um
what it was was kind of it wasthis whole built community where
we would do concerts and rockshows at different very like
high-end hotels and places inNew York, like bringing kind of
a downtown vibe, uptown.
And what ended up happening wasthe music scene really was
there was this revival rockscene, but then it shifted and
people just wanted hip hop, theywanted uh house music, they
(08:28):
wanted top 40.
And so the DJ was like, he hadto pivot.
And so that whole scene starteddying.
And we had to go to these clubsthat were just absolutely
awful, Gary.
Like I was in these clubs with,you know, everybody is on drugs
and drinking heavily.
It's not about art, it's notabout music.
And I'm up until 4 a.m.
I'm having to negotiate withlike the manager who's trying
(08:49):
to, who's basically harassingme, you know, like in a dark
room, like where I would justwant to get my check and go
home.
And he's like wanting to talkto me and flirt.
And I got to my breaking pointand I actually like I was very
lucky.
My dad was a real mentor forme.
And I'm like, Dad, what am Igonna do?
Like, you know, should I what Idon't know what to do?
He's like, you need to do barmitzvahs, you need to do
baptisms, you need to doweddings, like very fulsome
(09:13):
photography.
I'm like, dad, I'm not asellout, I'm cool, you know, I'm
a cool downtown, like like rockand roll chick, you know.
This isn't cool.
Um, but I really because I gotto my breaking point, I was
willing to make a change becauseI was getting depressed being
up all night.
Gary Pageau (09:29):
And so the scene changed really wasn't the type
of music that you were into.
So that's it was so when yousaid you you flamed out, it
really was really more like yourmarket flamed out.
Ash Fox (09:41):
Exactly.
The market flamed out becausethere was this beautiful revival
scene and it flamed out.
And I'm like, oh, well, now Ican't really, it's not really
carving that path anyway.
Oh, the other thing, Gary, isyou know, like spin and Rolling
Stone, those magazines, they allhad to shift the way they
worked with photographers.
Like in the past, they hadpeople who were staff
photographers, right?
But with everything, all thechanges and the budget cuts,
(10:03):
there was no more staffphotographers.
It was just, you know, you getGetty images to submit an image
or buy an image from Getty orsomething like that.
It completely changed.
That wasn't a viable pathanymore.
Gary Pageau (10:14):
Were you on the city?
Ash Fox (10:15):
I was not on staff.
I I was about to get on staffwith one of those agencies like
Getty, actually.
Um, funny enough, yeah, this issuch a great conversation,
Karen, because I haven't thoughtabout this stuff in years.
But I actually was about to geton staff with one of the top
agencies.
A guy, funny enough, abartender at one of these clubs
said to me, Hey, I can get, Iknow someone who's like the
(10:37):
who's at one of these staffingagencies, and I was so excited.
I did the whole training withthem.
And then when it came down toit, they had just too many
photographers that I was barelygonna get anything.
So that's kind of when I leanedmore into the family
photography at that point.
And what ended up happening wasthe family photography and
doing like the baptism and doingthe little wedding and all
(10:57):
these things is how I ended updoing my first proposal.
And that is what completelyshifted and changed the whole
game.
Gary Pageau (11:05):
So, how long were you doing like the family
photography thing?
I mean, when you say familyphotography, that's mostly like
weddings then and things likethat, right?
Ash Fox (11:14):
Or what I wasn't just doing family.
Honestly, I was Jill of alltrades photographer, you know,
like who's literally doinganything she can do.
So I didn't have a niche.
I my niche had been the rockand roll stuff, and so I'm kind
of coming out of that and I wasjust doing whatever I could do.
I did a corporate photography,I did a lot of like
pharmaceuticals, pharmaceuticalcorporate photography.
I once wore a hazmat suit andhad to like go in to a
(11:37):
pharmaceutical facility, likeshooting it in the hazmat suit
was crazy, like shooting plasma.
It was, I have a photo of it.
It's honestly really funny if Ican send it to you.
But yeah, I had to literallylike each room you had to take,
put a new hazmat suit suit onand like suit up your camera
just to shoot in there.
But I was doing really, I wasdoing family photography and
corporate at thissimultaneously.
(11:58):
The corporate, I would have, Iwould be still doing corporate
to this day.
But what ended up my wholebrand changed and then corporate
stopped hiring me, butcorporate was a big thing for
me.
Um, but but what ended uphappening was oh, so that was
over the course of gosh, I thinkthat this was around 2010 is
when the whole thing started.
And then I probably did, Idon't know if I did my, I can't
(12:20):
remember if I did my firstproposal in 20 like 11 or 12,
but it was around there.
I ended up getting a jobinquiry for a marriage proposal.
And I, Gary, when I got this, Iwas like, what?
I had to like look at it threetimes.
I'm like, what does this guywant me to do?
Because remember, we gotta rollback the clock.
Instagram wasn't even a thingthen.
(12:40):
Like Instagram, right?
I think had just come out, butpeople weren't really on the
platform.
It took some time before thatblew up.
I think that blew up aroundlike 2014-15.
You know, people just youdidn't see all this, people with
photographs of their proposal.
It was like there was thewedding, and that was really it.
Gary Pageau (12:56):
You didn't see proposals, proposal you might
see some honeymoon pics lateron, but not from the
professional photographer, ofcourse.
Ash Fox (13:03):
No, or wedding pictures, but you never saw
proposal pictures.
So I got this guy wanting me toshoot his proposal.
I'm like, what is this?
So I'm like, all right, sure,I'll do it.
And pretty much in those daysback then, I wasn't Ash Fox who
I am now, was like the proposalspecialist.
So I just showed up to do myjob, which was just to take some
pictures.
I couldn't give him any advice.
(13:24):
I didn't know, I couldn'tadvise this man in any any any
which way like we do now.
So I show up, the proposals onthe lake in Central Park in New
York City.
Um, Central Park's this likegiant, beautiful park, very
iconic in New York's, in casepeople don't know it.
Um, but there's this beautifullake.
You can take a little robo out.
And so that's what he wanted todo.
He was gonna take a little roboout with his fiancee to be, and
(13:49):
he was gonna row it up to thisfamous bridge.
It's called the Bow Bridge, andhe wanted to propose like right
near the Bow Bridge.
So I found a little hut where Icould hide out.
I had my 70 to 200 lens thatwas faulty, by the way.
Um, brought that with me.
Gary Pageau (14:04):
Didn't have your 50 mil on that one.
Ash Fox (14:06):
I had my 50, yeah, I had my 50 on the side, but no, I
definitely needed my 70 to 200.
And um, I'm just waiting inthis little hut like a sniper,
waiting for him to, you know,roll up.
And the only thing he told mewas, we're both blonde.
I'm in a, she's in a greendress, I'm in a blue shirt,
you'll see us.
So I'm waiting for him, waitingfor him.
And he rolls up, and at themoment of the proposal, he turns
(14:27):
the boat in the completelywrong direction.
So we see the back of her headand don't get to see her
reaction.
Gary Pageau (14:33):
Wow.
Ash Fox (14:34):
And so I'm like, oh my gosh, damn it.
So I take the pictures, I feelso bad because I'm like, it's
not my fault because I can'tswim, but um still like swim to
get the shot.
Gary Pageau (14:43):
But he wasn't prepped as to where you were
gonna be either.
Ash Fox (14:47):
So he knew I was gonna be in the hut.
He just he turned the boat inthe wrong place um instead of
like looking out for where Iwas.
So it was totally fine becausehe he was like, Don't worry
about it, Ash.
Like, I love these pictures,it's perfect, you know.
Because again, we didn't havereferences.
This was just the early days.
So he would, they were just sograteful.
And um, and I did it.
But here is the thing for methere was a big shift.
(15:08):
So I watched this proposalhappen.
I got the pictures, and mywhole perspective changed.
And I was like, wow, this issuch a special moment.
This is such an intimatemoment, this is such a romantic
moment.
This was not at all what Ithought.
Like when I when I said I wasso jaded, I was like, why would
you want a photo of this?
I'm like, no, of course youwant a photo of this because
(15:29):
this is really the real, this isthe real thing.
Like the wedding, in a way, isa big performance.
Gary Pageau (15:35):
And if and if she said no, you can dump her out of
the boat.
Ash Fox (15:39):
Oh my gosh.
I hope not.
I hope not.
But no, it just it was like,hey, this is actually way more
romantic because I had beendoing weddings and I saw how
weddings are, weddings areamazing, but weddings have a
staged quality to them, they'revery performative for the
family.
Gary Pageau (15:54):
I know a lot of people get really burnt out
doing weddings fairly quicklybecause it's it's a lot of work,
a lot of stress, a lot ofpersonality management.
Like you said, there's aschedule, there's an itinerary,
there's you know, things toshoot, yeah, family dynamics to
navigate, there's all kinds ofthings in there.
Ash Fox (16:12):
And I'll tell you the crazy thing about proposals,
Gary, we have all of that in acondensed amount of time.
We have all of that, and it'svery condensed.
But um, but yeah, no, you canget the thing about weddings
that was the hardest part for mewas it really hurt my
shoulders.
It just like it killed me justbecause it's it's very heavy to
be to be like this, you know,with both.
I had two cameras and I'd belike this for like eight hours,
(16:33):
and it just it was a lot.
Um, but anyway, what ended uphappening was this is the crazy
part of the story.
So one, it was either one ortwo weeks later, I get an email
from a woman.
My son is proposing on the lakein Central Park.
I need a photophotographer todo it.
And I'm like, wait, I literallyjust did a proposal last week
(16:55):
on the lake in Central Park.
I can help your son.
I know exactly what to do.
I exactly know how the timingfor it, where he should go,
where I'm gonna be, how to turnthe boat in the right direction,
all that.
So I end up helping her and herson.
We do the proposal.
It's you know, chef's kiss,perfect.
She grabs me.
She's like, you don'tunderstand what this meant to
(17:16):
our family.
She's like, this was everythingto us.
And this is your calling inlife.
You're meant to do proposals.
You're meant to help peoplewith their proposals.
And I'm thinking, like, is shecrazy?
Like, this is just one-offproposal.
This is the second proposalI've ever had.
Like, why is this my calling?
But it's wild.
I kind of think of her as likemy proposal fairy godmother
because she sort of like tookher magic wand.
(17:37):
This is what you're meant todo.
Um, and that, crazy enough,it's what happened.
What ended up, I didn't try tofollow this path at all, Gary.
Um, I wasn't like, I never atany point said my niche is going
to be proposals.
What happened was the nichegrabbed me.
And I just kept on getting moreand more um people saying, you
know what you're doing, you'rethe expert.
(17:57):
Um, and I became that.
And so um, yeah, it's reallyinteresting.
Gary Pageau (18:01):
So it's another case of a niche finding you
rather than you finding it.
Because that happened with thewith the music photography,
obviously, and that sort ofthing.
Exactly.
Not happened with theproposals.
So when when you're talkingabout a proposal, like I'm a
proposal coordinator,photographer, whatever, what
does that actually mean?
I mean, can you just kind ofput that definition in there of
(18:23):
like what constitutes that interms of like what your job
entails?
Is it even like setting it upthe venue or what costume?
I don't know about costuming,but I'm happy to tell you, Gary.
Yeah, I mean, obviously, it'smore than just showing up and
taking a picture with yourfaulty lens.
Ash Fox (18:43):
Which eventually got fixed.
We eventually upgraded to anice, you know, Nikon 70 to 200
to lay out the um vernacularhere of the jargon.
Proposal photographer, therestill are those, and a proposal
photographer is what I was.
I was one of the first proposalphotographers of that time,
whatever.
I ended up getting known asthat.
The Daily News wrote a story onme, like Ashbox is the proposal
(19:05):
photographer of New York, andthat kind of like blew things up
for me.
Gary Pageau (19:08):
Oh, yeah.
Ash Fox (19:08):
Um, but but what ended up happening for me was so so
proposal photographer is stillsomething that exists where
people show up, they shoot theproposal, and that's what they
do.
But what ended up happening forme was I really felt like it's
not enough to just shoot thesepictures because if you just
stand by and you're waiting forthe client to tell you where to
(19:29):
where to go, what to do, it's somessy, it's so stressful.
And a lot of these guys, it'snot that they don't know what
they're doing, but a lot oftimes people have a vision, but
they don't know actually howthat translates in real life in
many different ways, from likeeven the conception of what a
picture would be like.
Like I've had multiple men say,I want to propose on the
Brooklyn Bridge.
They had a fantasy at theBrooklyn Bridge.
And I was like, at a certainpoint, I said, No more Brooklyn
(19:52):
Bridge proposals, because we gotto do a pictures with a view of
the Brooklyn Bridge, but not onthe bridge, because the bridge
is a bridge that people walk onand there's bicycles, and it's
you know, it's it's not reallyall that great once you're on
it, right?
Gary Pageau (20:03):
I mean, you see what I'm saying.
Ash Fox (20:07):
Exactly.
It just got to a point wherethere was a lot of things people
wanted, and I was happy toaccommodate, and I still am if
people have a real reason forit.
Like if a guy told me, which wedid, we had a client who his
grandfather proposed on theBrooklyn Bridge, was like, no,
it's gotta be on the BrooklynBridge because we're keeping
that family tradition.
Um, but when a person who justhas never been to New York
before has a vision of somethingand they don't know what that
(20:28):
reality is really like, theyreally need someone to hold
their hand through the process.
And that's just one aspect ofit.
There's a lot of things.
So what I realized was it's notjust enough to just do the
photography.
I'm really like a consultant,I'm an advisor, I'm a coach to
these guys.
Um, it's not just guys, butit's mostly guys.
And so when they when they gotin touch, we would do a planning
session, which is really wherewe go over their idea, you know,
(20:51):
get my feedback because I'vedone at this point 3,000
proposals and um really justtell them what I think would
work for them and be the bestfor them and answer all their
questions.
Like there are family dynamicsthat people are navigating.
There's a lot of um decoys thatwe have to figure out to really
surprise their, to surprisetheir partner because they might
(21:12):
have a partner who planseverything.
And so it's hard on them tokind of how am I gonna work this
out when she plans everything.
So that's one piece of it.
Well, that's a big that'sthere's many pieces of the
planning session.
So the planning session becamea big part of it.
So it was more than justobviously the photography.
So that was there.
And then what happened is as Iwent along, I realized a lot of
(21:33):
my clients need more help thanjust the photography.
Like they really need privatevenues to propose.
And I started working withprivate venues, and I got my,
I've got now 12 rooftops that wehave that we have like very
private, beautiful spaces forclients.
Then we started doingdecorations because it was like,
hey, people want decorationsnow for some of these things.
(21:53):
Also, you know, proposal theproposal game changed in a lot
of ways because of Instagram.
Back to Instagram, it's likepeople started seeing pictures
of things that were more andmore elaborate.
And so people started feelinglike, hey, you know, their eye,
it's like it's I hate to sayit's kind of like porn, you
know, like you see something andthen all of a sudden you're
desensitized.
And so, um, kind of like withInstagram, you you see a certain
(22:15):
kind of proposal.
Now you're desensitized, itdoesn't look elaborate enough.
So you want something even morewild, right?
Gary Pageau (22:20):
Because everyone's wants like a unique thing, but
it's gotta be in tune with whatpeople are currently doing,
right?
The current trend, right?
Whatever, whatever that is,right?
Ash Fox (22:32):
Because people want to fit, you know, people obviously
it's not everybody's like this,but there are people who are in
friend groups and things wherethey don't want to be like the
one guy in the group that didn'tdo something nice, or you know,
the girls talk now, and youknow, it's just it's just um,
and it's not just girls.
We have all kinds of peoplegetting engaged all the time,
it's mostly straight men uhproposing to women, but we have
a lot of women proposing awomen, and we have some men
(22:53):
proposing a men, and we have umtransgender and you know, queer
people too.
So that's really what ended uphappening with me.
It was it really just.
Gary Pageau (23:00):
Oh, so how do you I guess my question was
interesting was like you had tofigure out then, okay, I need to
charge for the proposal piece.
That needs to be like a revenuegenerator, right?
As opposed to an add-on servicefor just the picture side of
it.
Ash Fox (23:16):
So how when Oh, the planning you're saying, are you
saying planning?
Are you meaning planning?
Gary Pageau (23:20):
I mean, you I mean, you had to figure out like
that's gonna be a product too,as opposed to I'm just gonna
help people out, right?
Ash Fox (23:27):
Well, Gary, at first I did not.
Honestly, to this day, I don'tfeel I really am charging for
that.
That's the thing that honestlyseparates working with me from
other people out there, wheresome guy might be like, and
there are people like this,like, like, oh, let me just find
the cheapest photographerpossible.
Or someone might say, Let mejust find a really good
photographer.
Well, honestly, like me and myteam were both, because you
don't just get a greatphotographer, because that's a
(23:49):
big tenant of what we do.
You're gonna get the planningsession with me too.
So that's added value that mostthat are not they're not gonna
have that.
So I pretty much just my ownethos.
It wasn't really about chargingfor that.
It was more like, I need togive this to the men because I
don't think their proposals aregonna come out well if they
don't have a session with me.
That was pretty much what itwas.
Gary Pageau (24:09):
So I I've got to ask before I before I forget.
Yeah, have you ever had onewhere the proposal went just
completely sideways where itjust fell flat?
It was uncomfortable.
Let's put it that way.
Ash Fox (24:22):
So we have never ever ever had anyone say no to a
proposal.
And I can't, yeah, and I can'ttake full credit for that, but I
will say that my clients,number one, and I always say
this don't propose to someone ifyou don't know the answer is
gonna be yes.
Like, do not do a whole bigproposal.
You know, you should know thatyou're on the same page that you
(24:43):
want marriage.
The next thing I'm gonna say isthe reason why people ask me
that so often, has anyone saidno, is because of the viral no
videos that are on YouTube andTikTok.
And I'll just tell you, theyare fake.
Like, I'm I'm 99.9% sure thatthese are not real.
That what it is is that it's atrend.
Cause you can get um, you know,like even on like you can make
(25:04):
money from a viral video onlineif you get enough of them.
So people just make them.
They're like, let's just fake aproposal and you'll say no, and
we'll get all like millions ofviews.
Cause they do.
Gary Pageau (25:13):
Right.
Ash Fox (25:13):
So they're just not real.
Um, because people don't reallydo that.
They just don't, you know,people don't get on their knee
and propose and buy a ring anddo a whole thing if they're if
they don't, you know, intend tomarry the person.
But no, in terms of like havingproposals go sideways, so we've
done 3,000 proposals.
Everyone is happy, everyonegets ends up getting engaged.
(25:34):
Not everyone makes this to thealtar.
Gary Pageau (25:37):
Ah, okay.
Ash Fox (25:38):
Yes.
And the reason for that is Ithink sometimes we've had a few,
I can think of a couple ofexamples of situations where,
you know, just from being aroundit so much, I can sense
sometimes I can sense certainthings just in the people.
You know, I work closely withmy clients.
I love my clients.
And sometimes there's timeswhere you can feel that like
maybe someone is a little bitmore high octane about getting
(26:02):
this going than the otherperson.
Maybe the other person isn't sosure.
You know, you watch that show,Love is Blind.
Gary Pageau (26:08):
I don't know if you've ever seen it, but they
gotta make it family members whovery much like that show, yes.
Ash Fox (26:13):
Yeah, and you like you wait till that day they get to
the altar, and then it's like,are they gonna say yes?
Now they've been engaged for awhile, and sometimes there's one
person who's way more into itthan the other person.
Gary Pageau (26:22):
Right.
Ash Fox (26:22):
And so I can think of a few clients who I, you know, I
really love.
One of them, he did anincredible proposal.
He was at the biggest heart,and yeah, they didn't make it to
the altar, you know, it didn't,it didn't end up working out.
Um, and I can think of anotherman who I won't name him, but I
remember him telling me she wasa gorgeous girl, and he told me
he's like, Ash, the prenup saysshe can't cut her hair.
(26:44):
Well, they didn't make it tothe altar, okay?
Gary Pageau (26:47):
So that's interesting.
Ash Fox (26:51):
I would I've heard a lot of funny things in my in my
days.
Gary Pageau (26:54):
I mean, I I mean, does that ever come up to like
prenup stuff?
Because you know, I I I'm kindof like when I got married,
there was no prenup thinghappening.
So I'm just curious, like, youknow, do you ever hear about
weird stuff like that?
I mean, I mean, that to me isjust a weird condition.
I mean, that's almost like oh,it's totally bizarre.
Ash Fox (27:16):
Absolutely, and that's probably why it didn't work out
with them, and that's what Imean.
Like, there's they she said,yes, they had a beautiful
proposal, they're a gorgeouscouple, but they didn't make it
to the altar because you know,that's a kind of a sign
something's a little off, right?
So the times that I've noticedthings, and like I said, there
was a guy who did an incredibleproposal, amazing guy.
She seemed really happy, butthey didn't make it to the altar
either.
And there was something justtheir energy was a little
(27:38):
different where it seemed alittle bit like I hate to say
it, I sense he was trying to winher over a little with his
proposal.
And you should never do that,you know.
But I have, but that just thatsaid, I just want to caveat that
is we have so many clients whogo above and beyond in all
different ways, whether it'sdoing something a little over
the top, or not even just that.
It's just the sentiment thatthey put into it, the effort,
(27:59):
the thought, the care.
And it's equally matched by theperson they're with.
And so they end up, they domake it to the altar, they make
it, they've been together foryears and years and years.
So it doesn't mean just becauseyou go out of your way that
it's not gonna work out.
It's just like don't do that ifyou're sensing the person is
not ready for marriage, really.
Gary Pageau (28:16):
When you're talking about your package of services,
right, does that still includelike weddings and other things,
or are you just focused onproposals only?
Ash Fox (28:26):
We are proposals only.
What we do is proposals.
That's our specialty.
Now, if we have a client andwe've had clients like this who
are like, oh my gosh, this wasso incredible.
We love you so much.
We're doing an elopement orwe're doing a small wedding in
the tri-state area in New Yorkarea.
We want to use you guystotally.
We do them.
We do them for people.
Um, but it's not our main um,it's not like the way that we
(28:50):
front face.
We we'll do it if people wantit, because we're happy to do
it.
And sometimes people also,there's a comfort because it's
it's a very vulnerable thing,the whole proposal.
And you get close and you get,you know, I've been close with
my clients where they're like,yeah, we want, we want to carry
on.
The other thing to mention,Gary, is I have a team now.
So I have three amazingphotographers who have been
trained in my proposal methodapproach, my ash box proposals.
(29:13):
Yeah, and they're soincredible.
Gary Pageau (29:15):
And like and they have access to your places that
you've really have relationshipswith and things like that.
Ash Fox (29:20):
Oh, well, yes, we have a whole beautiful system for
everything.
So the way that our our wholeprocess works is like a client
comes in the door, we do aplanning session, and then all
they now need to do is getthere.
They just need to show up forthe proposal and get out on
their knee.
They don't have to do anythingbecause we have it all.
Gary Pageau (29:38):
How much late time do you usually have to put
together something like this?
Ash Fox (29:42):
Well, we have a we have a range, it depends on the guy.
So one month is awesome.
One month you can geteverything done, pretty much.
But we have sometimes peoplewho, you know, they want to book
things way further in advance,which is totally fine.
There's a little challenge withthat, is just that proposals
are a different.
Animal than weddings.
And so with weddings, peoplealways think of you got to book
(30:03):
it way in advance because youwant to make sure all the
vendors, everything's free.
Proposals, me and my team, youcan book us a year ahead.
You can book us, you know, ayear and a half ahead.
But with some of the otherthings that we offer, like some
of our venues, we can't confirmthat until way closer to the
date.
It's a smaller event.
So that's sometimes just likethe one reason to, you know,
book a little closer.
(30:24):
But yeah, six months is evengood.
Um, a year is a little bitmuch, but we can't do that.
Gary Pageau (30:28):
No, that's kind of excessive, I think.
Ash Fox (30:30):
But some people want New Year's, some people want
Christmas, they want like reallyhot button dates or Valentine's
Day.
So they book those ahead oftime.
But yeah, most people book likeI'd say average is like three
months, one month to threemonths, but we we even do ones
two weeks ahead, too.
We've even had week of ones ifwe can do it.
We can't always do it, butsometimes we can.
That's cool.
Gary Pageau (30:49):
So have you noticed any trends?
Like you've been doing this fora while, about 10 years, right?
Specifically.
More.
So, like from pre-COVID versuspost-COVID, has there been any
kind of changes there in termsof what people expectations are?
Because you've had a few bunchof things happen, right?
You've had obviously COVID hasimpacted things, and then you
like you said, you've had thekind of the social media thing.
(31:11):
Like, have you had to do someTikTok stuff to kind of like as
part of your portfolio, do somevideo clippage and things like
that?
I mean, because the world'schanged in those 10 years.
Ash Fox (31:21):
You're so right, Gary.
Um, because I haven't not evenreally considered that to that
level.
But the main things that havechanged are you're right, video
is huge.
We for years we did video, butI didn't really promote it
because I kind of felt like, ah,who needs, you know, maybe they
don't need it.
The thing with me too is thisis probably not where I'm the
(31:41):
best businesswoman, but I don'tsell things just to sell them.
It's kind of like what you'resaying to me before, you're
like, oh, do you charge extrafor the, you know, the call and
everything?
I'm like, no, I just includeit.
I don't sell things just tosell them.
I sell things if I feel myclient it's something that they
need and would want.
Um, because it's not like, oh,you have to because I just feel
like it's a very personal thing,it's a very sentimental thing.
(32:02):
And so you can't just say onesize fits all, or like you
should grab all these bells andwhistles that you don't
necessarily need.
Not everyone needs video, butthere's people who do need
video.
There's people who love socialmedia, there's people who do
want to share this, there'speople who want to show it at
their engagement party, theywant to do it.
So for them, it's great.
Or there are also couples whowant video because they want it
(32:22):
to be just something that theycan look at and cherish.
So we do a ton of video, likealmost all of our proposals now.
A lot of our clients are havingvideo too.
Every proposal comes withphotography, it comes with
planning with me, one-to-onewith me.
But then we have all the extrasyou can add, which is fine.
You can add private venues, youcan add decorations, you can
add video, you know, and so on.
(32:43):
Other changes that I've seen.
You know what?
It's been mostly consistent, Iwill say, in terms of what
people are desiring.
It hasn't changed that much,but like I said, things have
gotten bigger visually.
Gary Pageau (32:58):
Okay.
Ash Fox (32:58):
So when I first started, we were doing a lot of
parks, very understated, maybesome rose petals.
Now we still do that plenty.
We still do simple parkproposals with some rose petals,
maybe a few candles.
But we also have proposals thatare pretty over the top with
like very big decor and thingslike this.
And people for the rightperson, it's right.
For the wrong person, it'swrong.
(33:19):
You know, some people love thataesthetic, and some people are
more understated.
So we serve, we serve ourclient.
If they want something over thetop, we can make it happen.
If they want something moresubtle, can totally do it.
It just depends on who theyare.
Gary Pageau (33:33):
Well, this has been a crazy conversation.
I mean, I didn't even know thisexisted.
This is so cool.
Are there any otherphotographers out there who do
what you do?
Ash Fox (33:41):
I am kind of an OG in the space.
I'm honestly an OG.
I've been around a long time.
You can look up, you can Googlemy name and too, and just like
watch old videos of me onYouTube.
I had a video go viral in 2017.
It was like 12 million peoplewatched it.
And that video made peopleaware of what this was because
(34:01):
people didn't really know aboutit.
And so a lot of people, thecomments on that video were
like, oh, I didn't know thisexists.
And the second commentunderneath that would be a girl
being like, I want to do whatshe does.
So, like a lot of peoplestarted doing this.
There are people out there, butprobably, I mean, I'm OG in
this space.
If you want to be to work withsomeone who's been doing this
for, you know, a zillion yearsin terms of you know, the modern
(34:23):
times that we're in, I've seenit all.
So I'm happy to help you.
Gary Pageau (34:26):
Well, but I think it validates the business,
right?
I mean, it's always one ofthose things where people copy
success, right?
They think when they see thingsthey want to do.
And of course, you know, thewedding photography business is
just replete with those peoplewho, you know, I went to a
wedding and I can do what shecan do.
It's just almost to an extremein in the wrong direction.
Back that, you know, you getpeople.
(34:47):
I think there's that's one ofthe purchases that uh when it
comes to a wedding, a lot ofpeople regret because of
photographers overselling theirskills or for various other
reasons they're not deliveringthe product they promised.
Ash Fox (35:01):
I didn't know that.
I didn't even know that.
Gary Pageau (35:03):
Oh, yeah, there's yeah, that's an off offline
conversation.
But wow.
This is this has been wonderfultalking to you.
Um, where can people go formore information to learn about
the Ashbox proposals?
This is just crazy.
Ash Fox (35:18):
Thank you, Gary.
Well, I'm just gonna say, um,just share something real quick.
I offer planning sessions andyou can do them one-off with me.
If someone is proposing, needsadvice, ideas, guidance,
anything like that, you can booka session with me.
If you are proposing in the NewYork area, we have full service
(35:39):
proposal planning, photography,planning, everything,
coordination, happy to help youthere.
But if you are in someplaceelse in the United States or in
the world, I'm also happy tohelp you.
And you know, for certainclients we do fly out to if they
can do it.
So to find me, Ashfox proposalson Instagram, TikTok, and
(35:59):
that's just it, AshFoxProposals.
And then if you want to checkout my website, it's
ashfoxproposals.com orashfoxphotography.com.
It's the same URL.
So yeah.
Gary Pageau (36:10):
Well, thanks, Ashley.
Great to meet you.
Like I said, I learned a bunch.
This has been fun, and uh neverthought I'd hear Stone Temple
Pilots in a one of my podcasts.
So that's that's a first.
So I appreciate the call backto the classics and uh hope to
talk to you again later.
Ash Fox (36:26):
That's great.
Thank you for having me, Gary
Erin Manning (36:29):
Thank you for listening to the Dead Pixels
Society podcast.
Read more great stories andsign up for the newsletter at
www.theadpixels society.com.
Welcome to the Dead Pixels Society Podcast, the
photoimaging industry's leadingnews source.
And here's your host, GaryPageau.
The Dead Pixels Society Podcastis brought to you by Mediaclip,
Advertek Printing, andIndependent Photo Imagers.
Gary Pageau (00:18):
Hello again and welcome to the Dead Pixels
Society Podcast.
I'm your host, Gary Pageau, andtoday we're joined by Ash Fox,
who is the founder of Ash FoxProposals, a business based in
New York City that providesprofessional photography
services and proposal things forgetting engaged.
So I'm like really intrigued bythis.
(00:39):
So Ash, welcome to the show.
Good to see you.
Thank you, Gary.
It's an honor to be here
Tell me about getting startedin professional photography,
because that led to the proposalbusiness.
So where did that start andwhat drove your interest in
that?
Ash Fox (00:57):
Oh, I'm happy to share.
Well, I, yes, I'm aphotographer.
I started as a photographer.
And the funny thing is, I'm avery unlikely photographer, and
I'm an unlikely person also tobe in the wedding industry for
many different reasons.
Um, but to start off, I went toschool, I studied art, I took
(01:17):
one photography class in school,a film photography class.
And I'm telling you, Gary, ifwe had not entered the world of
digital photography, I wouldnever have been a photographer.
I never would have been.
Because the film photographyclass, it was so romantic to me
to be able to be in that.
It was like a fantasy of mineto develop your own film.
But once I actually did it, I'mlike, I'm allergic to the
(01:38):
chemicals.
I'm happy that I already haveallergies as it is.
You don't know if the picturesare gonna come out.
And I'm like, I hate this.
And so that was like my leastfavorite class I took.
Funny enough, I ended upbecoming a photographer.
So after school, I was justdoing all kinds of creative
freelance work while I was inschool and after school.
And a friend was doing reallyelaborate photo shoots because
(02:00):
he was a musician and he waskind of starting like a pop
music career.
And I said to him JustinTimberlake.
Could have been, no, I'm notthat old.
It could have been JustinBieber, but no, I'm not that
old.
I'm right in between those twogenerations.
Um, but he he was a really goodfriend.
He has actually has a career inin Japan, and he said to me,
(02:23):
Um, so we were talking about it,and I'm like, why don't you
just buy a really fancy camera?
I'll figure it out.
And I'm like, I'll just takeyour pictures for you.
So he ended up doing that.
He buys the high-end camera.
I'm playing around with it.
And then he is like, you know,why don't you come on tour with
me?
He was doing this like tour ofum malls and cool stuff for, you
(02:44):
know, to get seen by a lot ofkids.
And so I went with him.
And that's really where Ilearned how to compose and shoot
because every night I wasshooting.
So my first, my first job, myfirst time doing photography
really was a job.
And then simultaneously at thesame time, I had a very, I got a
very funny, one of my odd jobswas a friend who is a rock and
(03:05):
roll DJ in New York City.
He asked me to be a dancer forone of his new parties.
And I was like, dancer.
I'm like, go, go dancer.
I was like, oh, I don't know ifthat's, you know, that's my
thing.
And he was like, no, you canjust wear what you normally
wear.
You don't have to wear likebooty shorts or anything.
I'm like, okay, I'll take thejob.
Um, so I'm doing this job for amonth, and I there was a girl
(03:25):
doing photography, and I waslike, Kel, I could do her job
because she was leaving.
And he was like, All right,you're on.
So he gave me his camera.
And so I started shooting.
And so my first two photographyjobs, I didn't even have a
camera for the longest time.
I just was borrowing camerasand I was learning as I went.
So I got hired and then Ilearned on the job.
(03:45):
And what ended up happening wasit was so amazing, Gary,
because I found I was a big rockand roll fan and a big music
fan.
And I always wondered, like,how I'm not a musician, like,
how would I fit in this world?
And then when I became aphotographer and I was actually
in the mix of all this, likephotographing musicians, um, the
party that we did had all kindsof famous musicians come
(04:07):
through.
Debbie Harry, um, Z Z Top camethrough, John Legend, the guy
from The Killers.
Um, yeah, it was really, reallycool.
And so you're I'm around allthis and I'm photographing
people.
And then I got um an award likebest nightlife photographer in
New York City, and it startedaffirming me, being like, oh,
maybe this is the path forwardfor me.
I'm gonna be like a musicphotographer, I'm gonna go on
(04:29):
tour, I'm gonna work for RollingStone, you know, or spin.
Gary Pageau (04:32):
Right, yeah, yeah.
Ash Fox (04:33):
You know, I start getting press passes to my
favorite bands, and it was, itwas just it was such a weird.
Gary Pageau (04:38):
You never own a camera at that point.
Ash Fox (04:40):
I didn't even own a camera, Gary.
Gary Pageau (04:43):
Okay.
Ash Fox (04:44):
It took like a whole another year for me to buy a
camera.
I was feeling like, okay, Ithink I need to buy a camera now
because this is becoming real.
So I bought my first camera.
I think it was a Nikon D7, Ithink it was Nikon D7500.
Do you know that camera?
That was my first one.
It wasn't full frame.
Um, it was a crop frame, but itdid me well.
(05:06):
I I remember, I remember goingto BNH, you know, BNH photo.
Of course, yeah.
Of course, you know it.
Okay, in New York.
And I'm like, all right, whatlens should I get?
And this guy behind the camera,you know, orthodox guy, um,
he's like, he's like, this isthe money lens.
And he gives me like a 50millimeter.
He's like, this is the moneylens.
You'll make all your money fromthis one lens.
Gary Pageau (05:26):
From a 50 millimeter lens, yeah, 50
millimeter 1.4.
Ash Fox (05:29):
He's like, this is the money lens.
Gary Pageau (05:31):
So we get to even know what you were shooting,
because that's that's aninteresting choice for a rock
and roll photographer.
That's an interesting choice.
Ash Fox (05:40):
I ended up, oh my god, I can you, I can go real deep
into the things that I boughtand the mistakes I made in what
I bought.
Um, that was a lesson I had tolearn the hard way.
I actually bought, funnyenough, I'll just share with
you, I bought a somehow I wasconvinced to buy a 70 to 200
Sigma lens.
I get the lens, Gary.
The lens is defective and Idon't know it.
(06:02):
And I just blamed it on myself.
I'm like, I'm a newphotographer, I don't know what
I'm doing.
It turned out it was defective.
And I had this lens, that'swhere you could return it.
Right.
So anyway, I learned the hardway.
You gotta like really know youneed a lens before just dropping
a whole bunch of money onsomething.
So um, but anyway, back to mystory.
That's how it really started.
That's how I became aphotographer.
(06:23):
So it's, you know, it was Iwasn't a hobby photographer who
then followed my passion andbecame a professional
photographer.
I really kind of became aprofessional out of the gate.
Um, but but I didn't know whatI was doing.
I had to kind of learn on thejob.
Gary Pageau (06:36):
So fortunately, you had people who were willing to
be patient with you, obviously.
Ash Fox (06:42):
People believed in me because the one thing I'll tell
I'll say about myself is I havean eye.
I have a natural ability forcomposition, for aesthetics.
And so I just had to learn howto use the camera pretty much,
but I got framing instantly, Igot composition, um, lighting
that came very natural.
Gary Pageau (07:03):
I know that that's probably from your art
background, right?
Ash Fox (07:05):
I mean that yeah, yeah, exactly.
Gary Pageau (07:09):
So, what kind of photography did you get into?
I mean, do you have you know,rock and roll or pop music or
mall tour photography licked?
You know, why didn't you staywith that?
Ash Fox (07:23):
So, what ended up happening was I had a crash and
burn moment.
So I was doing the rock androll thing.
I had so many dreams andaspirations.
I got um one of the biggest,like I I have never talked about
this on a podcast because it'sit just doesn't seem relevant,
but one of like the biggestexciting milestones in my life,
which like nobody probablycares, is that Stone Temple
(07:44):
Pilots Reunited.
Do you know that band?
Yeah, of course.
Um, they were from the 90s.
Okay, they had a reunion tour,and I got a press pass to be
like to like photographed theirreunion show in New York.
And um, that was like one ofthose incredible moments.
I was riding high, being like,okay, this is really coming
together for me.
Everything's coming.
Sure.
And then I crashed out becausewhat ended up happening was the
(08:06):
rock and roll party that we'dbeen doing, which brought um
what it was was kind of it wasthis whole built community where
we would do concerts and rockshows at different very like
high-end hotels and places inNew York, like bringing kind of
a downtown vibe, uptown.
And what ended up happening wasthe music scene really was
there was this revival rockscene, but then it shifted and
people just wanted hip hop, theywanted uh house music, they
(08:28):
wanted top 40.
And so the DJ was like, he hadto pivot.
And so that whole scene starteddying.
And we had to go to these clubsthat were just absolutely
awful, Gary.
Like I was in these clubs with,you know, everybody is on drugs
and drinking heavily.
It's not about art, it's notabout music.
And I'm up until 4 a.m.
I'm having to negotiate withlike the manager who's trying
(08:49):
to, who's basically harassingme, you know, like in a dark
room, like where I would justwant to get my check and go
home.
And he's like wanting to talkto me and flirt.
And I got to my breaking pointand I actually like I was very
lucky.
My dad was a real mentor forme.
And I'm like, Dad, what am Igonna do?
Like, you know, should I what Idon't know what to do?
He's like, you need to do barmitzvahs, you need to do
baptisms, you need to doweddings, like very fulsome
(09:13):
photography.
I'm like, dad, I'm not asellout, I'm cool, you know, I'm
a cool downtown, like like rockand roll chick, you know.
This isn't cool.
Um, but I really because I gotto my breaking point, I was
willing to make a change becauseI was getting depressed being
up all night.
Gary Pageau (09:29):
And so the scene changed really wasn't the type
of music that you were into.
So that's it was so when yousaid you you flamed out, it
really was really more like yourmarket flamed out.
Ash Fox (09:41):
Exactly.
The market flamed out becausethere was this beautiful revival
scene and it flamed out.
And I'm like, oh, well, now Ican't really, it's not really
carving that path anyway.
Oh, the other thing, Gary, isyou know, like spin and Rolling
Stone, those magazines, they allhad to shift the way they
worked with photographers.
Like in the past, they hadpeople who were staff
photographers, right?
But with everything, all thechanges and the budget cuts,
(10:03):
there was no more staffphotographers.
It was just, you know, you getGetty images to submit an image
or buy an image from Getty orsomething like that.
It completely changed.
That wasn't a viable pathanymore.
Gary Pageau (10:14):
Were you on the city?
Ash Fox (10:15):
I was not on staff.
I I was about to get on staffwith one of those agencies like
Getty, actually.
Um, funny enough, yeah, this issuch a great conversation,
Karen, because I haven't thoughtabout this stuff in years.
But I actually was about to geton staff with one of the top
agencies.
A guy, funny enough, abartender at one of these clubs
said to me, Hey, I can get, Iknow someone who's like the
(10:37):
who's at one of these staffingagencies, and I was so excited.
I did the whole training withthem.
And then when it came down toit, they had just too many
photographers that I was barelygonna get anything.
So that's kind of when I leanedmore into the family
photography at that point.
And what ended up happening wasthe family photography and
doing like the baptism and doingthe little wedding and all
(10:57):
these things is how I ended updoing my first proposal.
And that is what completelyshifted and changed the whole
game.
Gary Pageau (11:05):
So, how long were you doing like the family
photography thing?
I mean, when you say familyphotography, that's mostly like
weddings then and things likethat, right?
Ash Fox (11:14):
Or what I wasn't just doing family.
Honestly, I was Jill of alltrades photographer, you know,
like who's literally doinganything she can do.
So I didn't have a niche.
I my niche had been the rockand roll stuff, and so I'm kind
of coming out of that and I wasjust doing whatever I could do.
I did a corporate photography,I did a lot of like
pharmaceuticals, pharmaceuticalcorporate photography.
I once wore a hazmat suit andhad to like go in to a
(11:37):
pharmaceutical facility, likeshooting it in the hazmat suit
was crazy, like shooting plasma.
It was, I have a photo of it.
It's honestly really funny if Ican send it to you.
But yeah, I had to literallylike each room you had to take,
put a new hazmat suit suit onand like suit up your camera
just to shoot in there.
But I was doing really, I wasdoing family photography and
corporate at thissimultaneously.
(11:58):
The corporate, I would have, Iwould be still doing corporate
to this day.
But what ended up my wholebrand changed and then corporate
stopped hiring me, butcorporate was a big thing for
me.
Um, but but what ended uphappening was oh, so that was
over the course of gosh, I thinkthat this was around 2010 is
when the whole thing started.
And then I probably did, Idon't know if I did my, I can't
(12:20):
remember if I did my firstproposal in 20 like 11 or 12,
but it was around there.
I ended up getting a jobinquiry for a marriage proposal.
And I, Gary, when I got this, Iwas like, what?
I had to like look at it threetimes.
I'm like, what does this guywant me to do?
Because remember, we gotta rollback the clock.
Instagram wasn't even a thingthen.
(12:40):
Like Instagram, right?
I think had just come out, butpeople weren't really on the
platform.
It took some time before thatblew up.
I think that blew up aroundlike 2014-15.
You know, people just youdidn't see all this, people with
photographs of their proposal.
It was like there was thewedding, and that was really it.
Gary Pageau (12:56):
You didn't see proposals, proposal you might
see some honeymoon pics lateron, but not from the
professional photographer, ofcourse.
Ash Fox (13:03):
No, or wedding pictures, but you never saw
proposal pictures.
So I got this guy wanting me toshoot his proposal.
I'm like, what is this?
So I'm like, all right, sure,I'll do it.
And pretty much in those daysback then, I wasn't Ash Fox who
I am now, was like the proposalspecialist.
So I just showed up to do myjob, which was just to take some
pictures.
I couldn't give him any advice.
(13:24):
I didn't know, I couldn'tadvise this man in any any any
which way like we do now.
So I show up, the proposals onthe lake in Central Park in New
York City.
Um, Central Park's this likegiant, beautiful park, very
iconic in New York's, in casepeople don't know it.
Um, but there's this beautifullake.
You can take a little robo out.
And so that's what he wanted todo.
He was gonna take a little roboout with his fiancee to be, and
(13:49):
he was gonna row it up to thisfamous bridge.
It's called the Bow Bridge, andhe wanted to propose like right
near the Bow Bridge.
So I found a little hut where Icould hide out.
I had my 70 to 200 lens thatwas faulty, by the way.
Um, brought that with me.
Gary Pageau (14:04):
Didn't have your 50 mil on that one.
Ash Fox (14:06):
I had my 50, yeah, I had my 50 on the side, but no, I
definitely needed my 70 to 200.
And um, I'm just waiting inthis little hut like a sniper,
waiting for him to, you know,roll up.
And the only thing he told mewas, we're both blonde.
I'm in a, she's in a greendress, I'm in a blue shirt,
you'll see us.
So I'm waiting for him, waitingfor him.
And he rolls up, and at themoment of the proposal, he turns
(14:27):
the boat in the completelywrong direction.
So we see the back of her headand don't get to see her
reaction.
Gary Pageau (14:33):
Wow.
Ash Fox (14:34):
And so I'm like, oh my gosh, damn it.
So I take the pictures, I feelso bad because I'm like, it's
not my fault because I can'tswim, but um still like swim to
get the shot.
Gary Pageau (14:43):
But he wasn't prepped as to where you were
gonna be either.
Ash Fox (14:47):
So he knew I was gonna be in the hut.
He just he turned the boat inthe wrong place um instead of
like looking out for where Iwas.
So it was totally fine becausehe he was like, Don't worry
about it, Ash.
Like, I love these pictures,it's perfect, you know.
Because again, we didn't havereferences.
This was just the early days.
So he would, they were just sograteful.
And um, and I did it.
But here is the thing for methere was a big shift.
(15:08):
So I watched this proposalhappen.
I got the pictures, and mywhole perspective changed.
And I was like, wow, this issuch a special moment.
This is such an intimatemoment, this is such a romantic
moment.
This was not at all what Ithought.
Like when I when I said I wasso jaded, I was like, why would
you want a photo of this?
I'm like, no, of course youwant a photo of this because
(15:29):
this is really the real, this isthe real thing.
Like the wedding, in a way, isa big performance.
Gary Pageau (15:35):
And if and if she said no, you can dump her out of
the boat.
Ash Fox (15:39):
Oh my gosh.
I hope not.
I hope not.
But no, it just it was like,hey, this is actually way more
romantic because I had beendoing weddings and I saw how
weddings are, weddings areamazing, but weddings have a
staged quality to them, they'revery performative for the
family.
Gary Pageau (15:54):
I know a lot of people get really burnt out
doing weddings fairly quicklybecause it's it's a lot of work,
a lot of stress, a lot ofpersonality management.
Like you said, there's aschedule, there's an itinerary,
there's you know, things toshoot, yeah, family dynamics to
navigate, there's all kinds ofthings in there.
Ash Fox (16:12):
And I'll tell you the crazy thing about proposals,
Gary, we have all of that in acondensed amount of time.
We have all of that, and it'svery condensed.
But um, but yeah, no, you canget the thing about weddings
that was the hardest part for mewas it really hurt my
shoulders.
It just like it killed me justbecause it's it's very heavy to
be to be like this, you know,with both.
I had two cameras and I'd belike this for like eight hours,
(16:33):
and it just it was a lot.
Um, but anyway, what ended uphappening was this is the crazy
part of the story.
So one, it was either one ortwo weeks later, I get an email
from a woman.
My son is proposing on the lakein Central Park.
I need a photophotographer todo it.
And I'm like, wait, I literallyjust did a proposal last week
(16:55):
on the lake in Central Park.
I can help your son.
I know exactly what to do.
I exactly know how the timingfor it, where he should go,
where I'm gonna be, how to turnthe boat in the right direction,
all that.
So I end up helping her and herson.
We do the proposal.
It's you know, chef's kiss,perfect.
She grabs me.
She's like, you don'tunderstand what this meant to
(17:16):
our family.
She's like, this was everythingto us.
And this is your calling inlife.
You're meant to do proposals.
You're meant to help peoplewith their proposals.
And I'm thinking, like, is shecrazy?
Like, this is just one-offproposal.
This is the second proposalI've ever had.
Like, why is this my calling?
But it's wild.
I kind of think of her as likemy proposal fairy godmother
because she sort of like tookher magic wand.
(17:37):
This is what you're meant todo.
Um, and that, crazy enough,it's what happened.
What ended up, I didn't try tofollow this path at all, Gary.
Um, I wasn't like, I never atany point said my niche is going
to be proposals.
What happened was the nichegrabbed me.
And I just kept on getting moreand more um people saying, you
know what you're doing, you'rethe expert.
(17:57):
Um, and I became that.
And so um, yeah, it's reallyinteresting.
Gary Pageau (18:01):
So it's another case of a niche finding you
rather than you finding it.
Because that happened with thewith the music photography,
obviously, and that sort ofthing.
Exactly.
Not happened with theproposals.
So when when you're talkingabout a proposal, like I'm a
proposal coordinator,photographer, whatever, what
does that actually mean?
I mean, can you just kind ofput that definition in there of
(18:23):
like what constitutes that interms of like what your job
entails?
Is it even like setting it upthe venue or what costume?
I don't know about costuming,but I'm happy to tell you, Gary.
Yeah, I mean, obviously, it'smore than just showing up and
taking a picture with yourfaulty lens.
Ash Fox (18:43):
Which eventually got fixed.
We eventually upgraded to anice, you know, Nikon 70 to 200
to lay out the um vernacularhere of the jargon.
Proposal photographer, therestill are those, and a proposal
photographer is what I was.
I was one of the first proposalphotographers of that time,
whatever.
I ended up getting known asthat.
The Daily News wrote a story onme, like Ashbox is the proposal
(19:05):
photographer of New York, andthat kind of like blew things up
for me.
Gary Pageau (19:08):
Oh, yeah.
Ash Fox (19:08):
Um, but but what ended up happening for me was so so
proposal photographer is stillsomething that exists where
people show up, they shoot theproposal, and that's what they
do.
But what ended up happening forme was I really felt like it's
not enough to just shoot thesepictures because if you just
stand by and you're waiting forthe client to tell you where to
(19:29):
where to go, what to do, it's somessy, it's so stressful.
And a lot of these guys, it'snot that they don't know what
they're doing, but a lot oftimes people have a vision, but
they don't know actually howthat translates in real life in
many different ways, from likeeven the conception of what a
picture would be like.
Like I've had multiple men say,I want to propose on the
Brooklyn Bridge.
They had a fantasy at theBrooklyn Bridge.
And I was like, at a certainpoint, I said, No more Brooklyn
(19:52):
Bridge proposals, because we gotto do a pictures with a view of
the Brooklyn Bridge, but not onthe bridge, because the bridge
is a bridge that people walk onand there's bicycles, and it's
you know, it's it's not reallyall that great once you're on
it, right?
Gary Pageau (20:03):
I mean, you see what I'm saying.
Ash Fox (20:07):
Exactly.
It just got to a point wherethere was a lot of things people
wanted, and I was happy toaccommodate, and I still am if
people have a real reason forit.
Like if a guy told me, which wedid, we had a client who his
grandfather proposed on theBrooklyn Bridge, was like, no,
it's gotta be on the BrooklynBridge because we're keeping
that family tradition.
Um, but when a person who justhas never been to New York
before has a vision of somethingand they don't know what that
(20:28):
reality is really like, theyreally need someone to hold
their hand through the process.
And that's just one aspect ofit.
There's a lot of things.
So what I realized was it's notjust enough to just do the
photography.
I'm really like a consultant,I'm an advisor, I'm a coach to
these guys.
Um, it's not just guys, butit's mostly guys.
And so when they when they gotin touch, we would do a planning
session, which is really wherewe go over their idea, you know,
(20:51):
get my feedback because I'vedone at this point 3,000
proposals and um really justtell them what I think would
work for them and be the bestfor them and answer all their
questions.
Like there are family dynamicsthat people are navigating.
There's a lot of um decoys thatwe have to figure out to really
surprise their, to surprisetheir partner because they might
(21:12):
have a partner who planseverything.
And so it's hard on them tokind of how am I gonna work this
out when she plans everything.
So that's one piece of it.
Well, that's a big that'sthere's many pieces of the
planning session.
So the planning session becamea big part of it.
So it was more than justobviously the photography.
So that was there.
And then what happened is as Iwent along, I realized a lot of
(21:33):
my clients need more help thanjust the photography.
Like they really need privatevenues to propose.
And I started working withprivate venues, and I got my,
I've got now 12 rooftops that wehave that we have like very
private, beautiful spaces forclients.
Then we started doingdecorations because it was like,
hey, people want decorationsnow for some of these things.
(21:53):
Also, you know, proposal theproposal game changed in a lot
of ways because of Instagram.
Back to Instagram, it's likepeople started seeing pictures
of things that were more andmore elaborate.
And so people started feelinglike, hey, you know, their eye,
it's like it's I hate to sayit's kind of like porn, you
know, like you see something andthen all of a sudden you're
desensitized.
And so, um, kind of like withInstagram, you you see a certain
(22:15):
kind of proposal.
Now you're desensitized, itdoesn't look elaborate enough.
So you want something even morewild, right?
Gary Pageau (22:20):
Because everyone's wants like a unique thing, but
it's gotta be in tune with whatpeople are currently doing,
right?
The current trend, right?
Whatever, whatever that is,right?
Ash Fox (22:32):
Because people want to fit, you know, people obviously
it's not everybody's like this,but there are people who are in
friend groups and things wherethey don't want to be like the
one guy in the group that didn'tdo something nice, or you know,
the girls talk now, and youknow, it's just it's just um,
and it's not just girls.
We have all kinds of peoplegetting engaged all the time,
it's mostly straight men uhproposing to women, but we have
a lot of women proposing awomen, and we have some men
(22:53):
proposing a men, and we have umtransgender and you know, queer
people too.
So that's really what ended uphappening with me.
It was it really just.
Gary Pageau (23:00):
Oh, so how do you I guess my question was
interesting was like you had tofigure out then, okay, I need to
charge for the proposal piece.
That needs to be like a revenuegenerator, right?
As opposed to an add-on servicefor just the picture side of
it.
Ash Fox (23:16):
So how when Oh, the planning you're saying, are you
saying planning?
Are you meaning planning?
Gary Pageau (23:20):
I mean, you I mean, you had to figure out like
that's gonna be a product too,as opposed to I'm just gonna
help people out, right?
Ash Fox (23:27):
Well, Gary, at first I did not.
Honestly, to this day, I don'tfeel I really am charging for
that.
That's the thing that honestlyseparates working with me from
other people out there, wheresome guy might be like, and
there are people like this,like, like, oh, let me just find
the cheapest photographerpossible.
Or someone might say, Let mejust find a really good
photographer.
Well, honestly, like me and myteam were both, because you
don't just get a greatphotographer, because that's a
(23:49):
big tenant of what we do.
You're gonna get the planningsession with me too.
So that's added value that mostthat are not they're not gonna
have that.
So I pretty much just my ownethos.
It wasn't really about chargingfor that.
It was more like, I need togive this to the men because I
don't think their proposals aregonna come out well if they
don't have a session with me.
That was pretty much what itwas.
Gary Pageau (24:09):
So I I've got to ask before I before I forget.
Yeah, have you ever had onewhere the proposal went just
completely sideways where itjust fell flat?
It was uncomfortable.
Let's put it that way.
Ash Fox (24:22):
So we have never ever ever had anyone say no to a
proposal.
And I can't, yeah, and I can'ttake full credit for that, but I
will say that my clients,number one, and I always say
this don't propose to someone ifyou don't know the answer is
gonna be yes.
Like, do not do a whole bigproposal.
You know, you should know thatyou're on the same page that you
(24:43):
want marriage.
The next thing I'm gonna say isthe reason why people ask me
that so often, has anyone saidno, is because of the viral no
videos that are on YouTube andTikTok.
And I'll just tell you, theyare fake.
Like, I'm I'm 99.9% sure thatthese are not real.
That what it is is that it's atrend.
Cause you can get um, you know,like even on like you can make
(25:04):
money from a viral video onlineif you get enough of them.
So people just make them.
They're like, let's just fake aproposal and you'll say no, and
we'll get all like millions ofviews.
Cause they do.
Gary Pageau (25:13):
Right.
Ash Fox (25:13):
So they're just not real.
Um, because people don't reallydo that.
They just don't, you know,people don't get on their knee
and propose and buy a ring anddo a whole thing if they're if
they don't, you know, intend tomarry the person.
But no, in terms of like havingproposals go sideways, so we've
done 3,000 proposals.
Everyone is happy, everyonegets ends up getting engaged.
(25:34):
Not everyone makes this to thealtar.
Gary Pageau (25:37):
Ah, okay.
Ash Fox (25:38):
Yes.
And the reason for that is Ithink sometimes we've had a few,
I can think of a couple ofexamples of situations where,
you know, just from being aroundit so much, I can sense
sometimes I can sense certainthings just in the people.
You know, I work closely withmy clients.
I love my clients.
And sometimes there's timeswhere you can feel that like
maybe someone is a little bitmore high octane about getting
(26:02):
this going than the otherperson.
Maybe the other person isn't sosure.
You know, you watch that show,Love is Blind.
Gary Pageau (26:08):
I don't know if you've ever seen it, but they
gotta make it family members whovery much like that show, yes.
Ash Fox (26:13):
Yeah, and you like you wait till that day they get to
the altar, and then it's like,are they gonna say yes?
Now they've been engaged for awhile, and sometimes there's one
person who's way more into itthan the other person.
Gary Pageau (26:22):
Right.
Ash Fox (26:22):
And so I can think of a few clients who I, you know, I
really love.
One of them, he did anincredible proposal.
He was at the biggest heart,and yeah, they didn't make it to
the altar, you know, it didn't,it didn't end up working out.
Um, and I can think of anotherman who I won't name him, but I
remember him telling me she wasa gorgeous girl, and he told me
he's like, Ash, the prenup saysshe can't cut her hair.
(26:44):
Well, they didn't make it tothe altar, okay?
Gary Pageau (26:47):
So that's interesting.
Ash Fox (26:51):
I would I've heard a lot of funny things in my in my
days.
Gary Pageau (26:54):
I mean, I I mean, does that ever come up to like
prenup stuff?
Because you know, I I I'm kindof like when I got married,
there was no prenup thinghappening.
So I'm just curious, like, youknow, do you ever hear about
weird stuff like that?
I mean, I mean, that to me isjust a weird condition.
I mean, that's almost like oh,it's totally bizarre.
Ash Fox (27:16):
Absolutely, and that's probably why it didn't work out
with them, and that's what Imean.
Like, there's they she said,yes, they had a beautiful
proposal, they're a gorgeouscouple, but they didn't make it
to the altar because you know,that's a kind of a sign
something's a little off, right?
So the times that I've noticedthings, and like I said, there
was a guy who did an incredibleproposal, amazing guy.
She seemed really happy, butthey didn't make it to the altar
either.
And there was something justtheir energy was a little
(27:38):
different where it seemed alittle bit like I hate to say
it, I sense he was trying to winher over a little with his
proposal.
And you should never do that,you know.
But I have, but that just thatsaid, I just want to caveat that
is we have so many clients whogo above and beyond in all
different ways, whether it'sdoing something a little over
the top, or not even just that.
It's just the sentiment thatthey put into it, the effort,
(27:59):
the thought, the care.
And it's equally matched by theperson they're with.
And so they end up, they domake it to the altar, they make
it, they've been together foryears and years and years.
So it doesn't mean just becauseyou go out of your way that
it's not gonna work out.
It's just like don't do that ifyou're sensing the person is
not ready for marriage, really.
Gary Pageau (28:16):
When you're talking about your package of services,
right, does that still includelike weddings and other things,
or are you just focused onproposals only?
Ash Fox (28:26):
We are proposals only.
What we do is proposals.
That's our specialty.
Now, if we have a client andwe've had clients like this who
are like, oh my gosh, this wasso incredible.
We love you so much.
We're doing an elopement orwe're doing a small wedding in
the tri-state area in New Yorkarea.
We want to use you guystotally.
We do them.
We do them for people.
Um, but it's not our main um,it's not like the way that we
(28:50):
front face.
We we'll do it if people wantit, because we're happy to do
it.
And sometimes people also,there's a comfort because it's
it's a very vulnerable thing,the whole proposal.
And you get close and you get,you know, I've been close with
my clients where they're like,yeah, we want, we want to carry
on.
The other thing to mention,Gary, is I have a team now.
So I have three amazingphotographers who have been
trained in my proposal methodapproach, my ash box proposals.
(29:13):
Yeah, and they're soincredible.
Gary Pageau (29:15):
And like and they have access to your places that
you've really have relationshipswith and things like that.
Ash Fox (29:20):
Oh, well, yes, we have a whole beautiful system for
everything.
So the way that our our wholeprocess works is like a client
comes in the door, we do aplanning session, and then all
they now need to do is getthere.
They just need to show up forthe proposal and get out on
their knee.
They don't have to do anythingbecause we have it all.
Gary Pageau (29:38):
How much late time do you usually have to put
together something like this?
Ash Fox (29:42):
Well, we have a we have a range, it depends on the guy.
So one month is awesome.
One month you can geteverything done, pretty much.
But we have sometimes peoplewho, you know, they want to book
things way further in advance,which is totally fine.
There's a little challenge withthat, is just that proposals
are a different.
Animal than weddings.
And so with weddings, peoplealways think of you got to book
(30:03):
it way in advance because youwant to make sure all the
vendors, everything's free.
Proposals, me and my team, youcan book us a year ahead.
You can book us, you know, ayear and a half ahead.
But with some of the otherthings that we offer, like some
of our venues, we can't confirmthat until way closer to the
date.
It's a smaller event.
So that's sometimes just likethe one reason to, you know,
book a little closer.
(30:24):
But yeah, six months is evengood.
Um, a year is a little bitmuch, but we can't do that.
Gary Pageau (30:28):
No, that's kind of excessive, I think.
Ash Fox (30:30):
But some people want New Year's, some people want
Christmas, they want like reallyhot button dates or Valentine's
Day.
So they book those ahead oftime.
But yeah, most people book likeI'd say average is like three
months, one month to threemonths, but we we even do ones
two weeks ahead, too.
We've even had week of ones ifwe can do it.
We can't always do it, butsometimes we can.
That's cool.
Gary Pageau (30:49):
So have you noticed any trends?
Like you've been doing this fora while, about 10 years, right?
Specifically.
More.
So, like from pre-COVID versuspost-COVID, has there been any
kind of changes there in termsof what people expectations are?
Because you've had a few bunchof things happen, right?
You've had obviously COVID hasimpacted things, and then you
like you said, you've had thekind of the social media thing.
(31:11):
Like, have you had to do someTikTok stuff to kind of like as
part of your portfolio, do somevideo clippage and things like
that?
I mean, because the world'schanged in those 10 years.
Ash Fox (31:21):
You're so right, Gary.
Um, because I haven't not evenreally considered that to that
level.
But the main things that havechanged are you're right, video
is huge.
We for years we did video, butI didn't really promote it
because I kind of felt like, ah,who needs, you know, maybe they
don't need it.
The thing with me too is thisis probably not where I'm the
(31:41):
best businesswoman, but I don'tsell things just to sell them.
It's kind of like what you'resaying to me before, you're
like, oh, do you charge extrafor the, you know, the call and
everything?
I'm like, no, I just includeit.
I don't sell things just tosell them.
I sell things if I feel myclient it's something that they
need and would want.
Um, because it's not like, oh,you have to because I just feel
like it's a very personal thing,it's a very sentimental thing.
(32:02):
And so you can't just say onesize fits all, or like you
should grab all these bells andwhistles that you don't
necessarily need.
Not everyone needs video, butthere's people who do need
video.
There's people who love socialmedia, there's people who do
want to share this, there'speople who want to show it at
their engagement party, theywant to do it.
So for them, it's great.
Or there are also couples whowant video because they want it
(32:22):
to be just something that theycan look at and cherish.
So we do a ton of video, likealmost all of our proposals now.
A lot of our clients are havingvideo too.
Every proposal comes withphotography, it comes with
planning with me, one-to-onewith me.
But then we have all the extrasyou can add, which is fine.
You can add private venues, youcan add decorations, you can
add video, you know, and so on.
(32:43):
Other changes that I've seen.
You know what?
It's been mostly consistent, Iwill say, in terms of what
people are desiring.
It hasn't changed that much,but like I said, things have
gotten bigger visually.
Gary Pageau (32:58):
Okay.
Ash Fox (32:58):
So when I first started, we were doing a lot of
parks, very understated, maybesome rose petals.
Now we still do that plenty.
We still do simple parkproposals with some rose petals,
maybe a few candles.
But we also have proposals thatare pretty over the top with
like very big decor and thingslike this.
And people for the rightperson, it's right.
For the wrong person, it'swrong.
(33:19):
You know, some people love thataesthetic, and some people are
more understated.
So we serve, we serve ourclient.
If they want something over thetop, we can make it happen.
If they want something moresubtle, can totally do it.
It just depends on who theyare.
Gary Pageau (33:33):
Well, this has been a crazy conversation.
I mean, I didn't even know thisexisted.
This is so cool.
Are there any otherphotographers out there who do
what you do?
Ash Fox (33:41):
I am kind of an OG in the space.
I'm honestly an OG.
I've been around a long time.
You can look up, you can Googlemy name and too, and just like
watch old videos of me onYouTube.
I had a video go viral in 2017.
It was like 12 million peoplewatched it.
And that video made peopleaware of what this was because
(34:01):
people didn't really know aboutit.
And so a lot of people, thecomments on that video were
like, oh, I didn't know thisexists.
And the second commentunderneath that would be a girl
being like, I want to do whatshe does.
So, like a lot of peoplestarted doing this.
There are people out there, butprobably, I mean, I'm OG in
this space.
If you want to be to work withsomeone who's been doing this
for, you know, a zillion yearsin terms of you know, the modern
(34:23):
times that we're in, I've seenit all.
So I'm happy to help you.
Gary Pageau (34:26):
Well, but I think it validates the business,
right?
I mean, it's always one ofthose things where people copy
success, right?
They think when they see thingsthey want to do.
And of course, you know, thewedding photography business is
just replete with those peoplewho, you know, I went to a
wedding and I can do what shecan do.
It's just almost to an extremein in the wrong direction.
Back that, you know, you getpeople.
(34:47):
I think there's that's one ofthe purchases that uh when it
comes to a wedding, a lot ofpeople regret because of
photographers overselling theirskills or for various other
reasons they're not deliveringthe product they promised.
Ash Fox (35:01):
I didn't know that.
I didn't even know that.
Gary Pageau (35:03):
Oh, yeah, there's yeah, that's an off offline
conversation.
But wow.
This is this has been wonderfultalking to you.
Um, where can people go formore information to learn about
the Ashbox proposals?
This is just crazy.
Ash Fox (35:18):
Thank you, Gary.
Well, I'm just gonna say, um,just share something real quick.
I offer planning sessions andyou can do them one-off with me.
If someone is proposing, needsadvice, ideas, guidance,
anything like that, you can booka session with me.
If you are proposing in the NewYork area, we have full service
(35:39):
proposal planning, photography,planning, everything,
coordination, happy to help youthere.
But if you are in someplaceelse in the United States or in
the world, I'm also happy tohelp you.
And you know, for certainclients we do fly out to if they
can do it.
So to find me, Ashfox proposalson Instagram, TikTok, and
(35:59):
that's just it, AshFoxProposals.
And then if you want to checkout my website, it's
ashfoxproposals.com orashfoxphotography.com.
It's the same URL.
So yeah.
Gary Pageau (36:10):
Well, thanks, Ashley.
Great to meet you.
Like I said, I learned a bunch.
This has been fun, and uh neverthought I'd hear Stone Temple
Pilots in a one of my podcasts.
So that's that's a first.
So I appreciate the call backto the classics and uh hope to
talk to you again later.
Ash Fox (36:26):
That's great.
Thank you for having me, Gary
Erin Manning (36:29):
Thank you for listening to the Dead Pixels
Society podcast.
Read more great stories andsign up for the newsletter at
www.theadpixels society.com.
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