March 18, 2025 • 29 mins
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In this episode of the Debt Free Dad podcast, Brad Nelson invites financial expert Joseph Lombardi from Ironhawk Financial to discuss the limitations of 401ks and explore better retirement strategies. Lombardi shares his personal journey through financial hardships and offers insights into innovative financial planning methods such as Infinite Banking and IRS code 7702. The conversation covers practical advice on managing debt, planning for retirement, and building a secure financial future. Tune in to learn more about taking control of your finances and achieving true financial freedom.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Brad Nelson (00:00):
Hey.
So as you work your way out ofdebt, you might be wondering
like when do you start to investin your retirement?
Now, many people rely on, andare familiar with, things like
401ks for retirement, but isthat enough?
Now, Joseph Lombardi fromIronhawk Financial joins us on
today's episode to break downthe basics of retirement and
(00:20):
share his thoughts on why a 401kmight fall short and some ideas
on how to build a strongerfinancial future.
Announer (00:30):
You're listening to the Debt-Free Dad Podcast with
Brad Nelson.
Brad and his co-hostsexperienced the anxiety of
living paycheck to paycheckbefore learning the fundamentals
of financial success.
They are now on a mission toempower regular people to pay
off their debt for good andenjoy happier, less stressful
lives.
Keep listening forinspirational interviews, tips,
(00:52):
tricks and practical advice togain financial freedom.
Brad Nelson (01:00):
Hey guys, my name is Brad Nelson, founder of Debt
Free Debt.
I paid off about $45,000 ofdebt, have been debt free now
for more than 12 years.
I've also been fortunate tohelp thousands of other people
save and pay off tens ofmillions of dollars with the
work that we do here at DebtFree Debt.
Now, guys, after listening tothis episode, if you're ready to
take things to the next level,you're ready to break free from
(01:20):
living paycheck to paycheck.
You wanna reduce free fromliving paycheck to paycheck?
You want to reduce financialstress?
You want, to say, build moresavings and finally pay off that
debt for good?
I mean, how amazing would thatfeel?
But, like many, maybe you'renot quite sure how to get
started.
Well, we've created someincredible free resources here
at Debt-Free Dad to help you getthere, and I'm going to be
sharing some details about howyou get started with those later
on in today's episode.
(01:40):
So hey, joseph, welcome to theDebt-Free Dad podcast.
So glad that you're joining ushere today.
Joseph Lombardi (01:45):
Thanks for having me.
Brad Nelson (01:46):
Yeah, hey, real quick.
Can you just share a little bit?
Obviously you're veryknowledgeable when it comes to
investments and retirement andwe're going to talk about that
you know broadly here today ontoday's episode.
But can you kind of share howyou got there, like what makes
you an expert in this area?
Joseph Lombardi (02:02):
Well, when it comes to not just being
debt-free, but emotionally,physically, mentally and
spiritually debt-free is whatgot me to this point.
I was unfortunate enough to seemy dad fall three stories off a
ladder.
It was a $25 millionconstruction company, jb
Lombardi Builders.
He had no disability.
I watched my mother die at 52years old so she was delivered
(02:22):
from alcoholism.
She she had no life insuranceleft me emotionally and
financially devastated because Iwas her closest of kin.
She left us when I was four andI watched my grandmother have a
stroke, left to dementia andshe lost 4.2 million dollars to
love the nursing home becauseshe had a long-term care that
took my grandfather 40 years tobuild right.
So I was unlucky enough to gothrough a bunch of pain, to go
(02:45):
through a bunch of seeing whatis how not to financially plan,
how not to have a financialfoundation, what it does to
somebody on a deep, deep levelof emotional, mental and
spiritual pain because you wantto be able to heal right, you
want to be able to suffer andget through.
(03:06):
But when you have bills to payyou got to get your butt back to
work on Monday Like there's nogrieving.
So we just bury it right andthen it comes out in different
ways.
But it's something where Ilived it and I wanted to make
sure it didn't happen to otherpeople.
I've also been in IRS debt ofover $150,000.
I've had a bunch of reversals inthis business, meaning somebody
(03:28):
started a plan and then withina year canceled it.
I already spent the money and Ipaid back the insurance company
.
So I had to take my money Isaved because we're 1099 and I
had to pay the insurance company.
I couldn't sell anymore.
And then the IRS said, well,where's our state fed money and
I'm like I ain't got it.
So then those penalties andinterest and 37 grand turned to
150 grand over three years Ouchso now you mentioned.
Brad Nelson (03:52):
You kind of went through your own journey, like
you're just talking about.
You got out all of that.
Can you share?
You know, obviously that's whatwe do here at Debt Free Dad.
We really kind of help peopleand that paycheck to paycheck
living to, to get them to thetable with you to start looking
at things like, hey, retirementand future planning and all that
great stuff, can you share justsome of the basic things that
you did to get yourself back tothe point where you can win
(04:14):
again with money?
Joseph Lombardi (04:15):
So this was back in 09 when my mom died.
That's where I went into deepdepression and then worked for a
couple of years at the way Iwas working, before she died,
before I got the proper mentalhealth help.
But I did envelopes, which Iknow we don't have cash anymore,
so the envelope strategy workedwell for me.
I knew that my first housemortgage, which was a 997 square
foot house with a carport on0.18 of an acres, on a hill
(04:39):
that's always yeah, it was astarter home.
I didn't want to rent.
I lived in the crappiest housethat I owned.
I still own it and I actuallyam up a quarter million dollars
when I bought it 15 years agobelieve it or not.
Wow, in equity.
I haven't sold it or anything,I just rented out, which is
paying me like 500 bucks a monthfor life, plus.
That's going up in inflation.
I was at that plan.
(05:00):
Your plan is to fail, right,it's like saying I want to lose
weight but I have no plan andI'm not going to do anything
differently and I'm just goingto magically lose weight.
You think you're going tomagically get out of debt when
you're doing the same crap thatgot you in debt?
Yeah, you have to have thatplan and that structure to say,
hey, this is where I am, and ifit's in your head, it's a dream,
(05:26):
so you have to write it down,to turn it into a goal.
And then, once you write itdown, you come up with a game
plan.
Right, if the goal is I want toget out of debt, then there
should be bullet points.
Right, I'm telling every dollarwhat's going to happen.
Those dollars aren't telling mewhat's going to happen at 1047
on a Friday night, while I'mdrinking a beer, scrolling on
TikTok, buying crap I don't need.
That's the dollar telling youwhere it's going.
Brad Nelson (05:45):
I couldn't decide it by myself.
Oh, that's awesome.
You're absolutely correct.
I love that you pointed thatout because, as you mentioned,
you're very successful in whatyou do, but you started in the
same place that a lot of peopleare listening to this in.
I started worse.
Joseph Lombardi (05:58):
I grew up in an attic with no running water.
I eat noodles and eggs.
We catch up every night.
I had hamburger.
Help about the hamburger meat.
I remember going to specialMcDonald's days when there were
49 cent cheeseburgers.
That's what my dad couldn'tafford.
I grew up in extreme poverty.
I had nothing.
I became a self-mademillionaire based on all the
childhood trauma I went throughand the ADHD that it caused me
(06:19):
to get.
And then I just grind my buttoff because I can't lose.
I never want to go back there,right?
So I almost have like a devilwith a pitchfork on my butt
saying never stop, never stop,never stop, cause I never want
to be back being impoverishedLike I was.
Yeah Well, it made you hungry.
I'm hungry every day to growlike the business you know.
(06:45):
I.
In one year I went from noConnecticut.
Now I'm national.
I never made seven figures inmy life, ever.
Brad Nelson (06:47):
And I made it in 2024.
Yeah, that's incredible.
Well, congratulations to you,man.
It's a heck of a comeback story.
And now that you're helpingpeople obviously with this whole
idea of retirement and settingthem up financially and passing
down that knowledge, that'sawesome.
That's incredible.
Let's get into it just a littlebit as far as this retirement
stuff, because we'll get thisquestion obviously from many of
our people like, hey, brad, I'maggressively paying down my debt
(07:07):
, I've got an end goal in mindwhen I'm done, but like I'm
thinking like what's after that?
Like I want to start looking atthings like retirement or
investing or even, like youmentioned, like real estate or
you know what are the thingsthat are out there.
So can you just, if someone'sconsidering retirement or any of
these, can you just kind ofoutline just the basics of
things that they should startconsidering?
Joseph Lombardi (07:30):
So if you're out of debt, right, because I
have clients and prospects thatcome to me saying, joe, I'm
ready to invest in that tax-freething, averaging 15% rate of
returns, liquid, sue-proof,divorce-proof, can't lose could
be my own bank and leverage themoney.
I want that thing and I'm like,okay, I can't just sell it to
you.
I have to make sure it'ssuitable for you so I don't get
(07:50):
sued or you don't start thisthing and then you can't afford
it in a year and you lose allyour money.
So I do fact finders and mosthalf of the time I can't work
with the people because they'rein high interest debt.
Right, if you have a retirementaccount, right, and you have a
(08:14):
29.99% credit card interest rate, your retirement account is not
netting you 29.99% tax-freerate of return on your money.
So you have to really take alook at what am I paying versus
what am I loaning or investing?
Right, what am I borrowing andwhat am I loaning out to invest
for the future?
If what I'm spending on mycurrent debt is a high interest
(08:35):
rate, stop your retirementaccount.
Do not do it.
I don't care how great it isthat Bitcoin is going to go to
the moon.
Diamond hands.
Cash that out, pay off yourdebt.
Debt is cancer to your financialhealth.
Debt takes away the earningpotential of you in the future.
Debt's going to be robbing youof that Wednesday drive home
(08:58):
eight and a half months from now, where you're miserable because
you had a fight with your wifeand you don't want to be there
and that whole experience youwent through was to pay for
something you did not need, thatyou put on a credit card eight
and a half months before.
So you have to make sure to getout of debt is number one.
Think of that as like your life, because, if I said, gun to
(09:18):
your head, if you don't get outof debt in 12 months, you will
die, and or your children youlove most will die.
I guarantee you'll get out ofdebt.
In 12 months.
You will die, and or yourchildren you love most will die.
I guarantee you'll be out ofdebt.
So you know what that tells me.
It's not a priority to you.
So make it a priority.
Brad Nelson (09:33):
Right man.
We preach that message all thetime here, and it is Debt is
robbing you of your future andsadly, we just live in a society
where debt is just so normal.
So for people to even thinkabout like to have no credit
card debt, or not pay off mycars, or to be able to spend a
good amount of my income towardsinvesting and building my own,
how about building my quality of?
Joseph Lombardi (09:53):
life.
Right.
I just bought a new front doorfor $16,000, a new back door for
$5,000, brand new garage doorsfor $12,000.
I'm getting a sauna, a hot tub.
It's cool.
Yeah, 12 grand.
I'm getting a sauna, a hot tub,it's cool.
All the money I made in the past10 years went to my gambling
debts, went to the IRS, so I'dmake $150,000 deal and I have to
give it all away.
Now the money that comes ismine.
(10:14):
My only debt I have is themortgage on this house.
I bought my wife a brand new2024 Escalade in cash, esb Sport
.
I still have a debt on my car.
I have a Jaguar.
It was 600 horsepower SVR, butI kept that because it's 3.3.
So I'm like I'd be stupid topay that off.
I'm making 3% on the bank'smoney with inflation.
(10:34):
So I have my car, my mortgageand my solar.
That's the only debt.
I have.
Everything else no credit cards, nothing.
No college loans, everythingsaved for my kids.
I got three accounts all set upfor my kids tax-free, by the
way that they can use forcollege and having financial
peace.
And with my childhood trauma, Igambled why?
(10:56):
Because I would blow all themoney I earned so I could get
back into that trauma focusCause that was something that I
had to work through.
Right, we all have our ownthings we have to deal with
Because, if you think about it,if you win the lottery, how many
of those people not only loseall their money but go bankrupt?
Can you imagine winning $100million and then, six years
later, not only did you lose the$100 million and spend the $100
(11:18):
million, you spent $120 million.
You're $20 million in debt andIRS debt, so you have to go
bankrupt.
So it's not about the money.
I have clients.
I've been doing this 22 years.
I have 2,000 clients, over $2billion of protection and
rollovers.
In my career, I won 29 industryawards.
Right, I have clients who make$80,000 a year that are
millionaires, and I have clientswho make $600,000 combined and
(11:41):
their net worth is negative.
Wow, I hope all you guys heardthat it doesn't matter how much
you make.
That's the mindset, the trapthey want you in.
Oh well, I don't make sixfigures a year, so of course I'm
brokey.
I don't, I don't, I don't, Idon't do this.
So of course it's just, it's aBS excuse.
If you had every single thingplanned out of what is going on,
(12:03):
you can easily get to where youwant to be.
But if it's too complicated, Iwant to think about it.
Work's stressing me out mygirlfriend, my ex, my kids, my
baby daddy, my baby mama.
There's always going to besomething in your life that is
hard.
And if you don't spend the timeto do it and I'm doing it I'm
getting my chubby fat butt tothe gym three times a week
because I realize if I'm richand unhealthy, all the millions
(12:25):
in the bank are going to benothing.
If I'm in a ventilator or if I'min a home or I have to stay
home, I can't travel when I'm 65or 70.
So it's a balance.
But you have to understand thatmoney is, first of all, most
talked about in the Bible thanany other subject in the Bible.
I wonder why?
Because when you understandmoney, what it does is it gives
(12:46):
you peace.
It gives you freedom, and ifyou don't have that peace in
your life, you will never befinancially wealthy because you
will find an excuse or a reasonto blow it.
Brad Nelson (12:57):
Yeah, I love that you brought up the amounts like
the $80,000 and the $600,000.
I want to pick on the $80,000.
You mentioned people who makearound $80,000 a year and
they're millionaires.
So they're like how the heckdoes that happen, joseph?
Like I want to do that.
So what did those peoplespecifically do?
Obviously, you mentioned getout of debt.
(13:17):
I'm guessing that they are, andwhat's the next step then?
What have they done all theseyears to get to that level?
Joseph Lombardi (13:24):
So most of my clients invest in IRS code,
right?
I don't know if you rememberwhen Hillary Clinton and Donald
Trump were on the politicalstage fighting for presidency in
2016.
And Hillary Clinton goes toDonald Trump shows your tax
return, shows your tax return.
Donald Trump says I show my taxreturn, I pay no taxes because
I use the same IRS codes thatyour donors use in your 30 years
.
To close the loophole and youdid it right.
(13:46):
You can easily rewatch that.
What they were talking about inthat moment was IRS code 7702.
You can Google it IRS code,section 7702.
What the heck is that?
That's a code embedded inpermanent life insurance, not
term life.
Embedded in permanent lifeinsurance, it allows my clients
(14:06):
to be their own bank.
Meaning, if this couple making$80,000 a year took 20% of their
income, which would be $16,000a year, lived under their means.
Most important, most of us areliving over our means.
We spend 102.1% of our GDP as acountry, which means for every
dollar that comes in, we spend$1.02.
So they lived under their means.
(14:28):
They took 20% of every dollarthat came in and they put it in
my strategy right.
In that time it was called awhole life plan, right?
Interest rates shot up.
I just switched them all to anIUL right Indexed universal life
.
I know I'm speaking Spanish fora lot of you guys.
So by doing that, it built afoundation for their family.
(14:49):
What does that mean?
Foundation all these genericterms.
What it will do specifically isit will give you the ability to
leverage your money.
There's no 59.5-year rule or10% penalty.
Like a 401k or an IRA, youcannot lose in either one.
One uses option contracts likecalls and longs against puts and
stops.
Now I'm starting to speakGerman.
(15:10):
I get it.
They have the ability toleverage the money out to
finance vehicles, for they'retheir own bank.
So imagine you not paying fordof america 13.99 on your car for
seven years.
An 84 month loan where the caryou bought was 30 grand but
you're paying 53 for it, paying23 grand in interest over eight
(15:32):
years.
Imagine, instead of you doingthat, you're in your own bank.
The strategy has been averaging15% and they charge you a 5%
loan rate and you still earnmoney on money that's not there.
You know what that's called.
Viewers can Google thisNon-direct recognition.
(15:53):
So if you have IRS code 7702with non-direct recognition
built into your life insuranceretirement liquid savings
account plan.
You can then buy whatever youneed for the rest of your life
and earn interest on moneythat's not even there.
So I had a client that justsold a house in California.
I know these are large numbers,you don't have to do large
(16:14):
numbers.
I have clients who do $200 amonth, $500 a month, Dumped in
1.1 million from the sale of hishouse in Santa Barbara.
Bought a house in Arizona for680,000, downsizing, divorce,
had three kids they were older,so you didn't have to stay for
custody or anything.
Kids they were older, so hedidn't have to stay for custody
or anything.
Put the 1.1 in my strategy,pulled out 680 the next day,
(16:36):
still earned interest on 1.1.
, Even though 680 paid for hishouse, which saved him an
additional half a milliondollars in interest over the
next 30 years.
So now he was able to earn twostreams of income on one US
dollar.
Brad Nelson (16:51):
Yeah, and that's incredible.
I mean especially because and Idon't know if you mentioned it
this is infinite banking right.
Is what you're talking about,be?
Joseph Lombardi (16:56):
your own bank .
Rich person's Roth.
If you want to really learnabout this, go to Forbes rich
person's Roth on Google, andthere's an article from 2018 on
Forbes written by a publicaccountant who doesn't even sell
life insurance, and there wasone written in 2020 written by a
public accountant who doesn'teven sell life insurance, and
there was one written in 2020written by a certified financial
planner, on this strategy thatI've been doing for 22 years.
Brad Nelson (17:18):
Gotcha Okay.
So now you had mentioned though, so I mean, what are the
negative sides to this?
Joseph Lombardi (17:22):
Like you had mentioned, this Yep, there is a
negative side For some reasonI'm guessing, if you back out,
not a good thing?
What's called lapsing the policy.
Cancel it, you're going to losea boatload of money.
Short term it sucks.
It's not a 12 to 24 monthstrategy.
I had a couple of clients thatdumped.
You know, in that case, with theperson had 1.1 million, taking
out 680 the next day he was ableto do that.
(17:45):
But if he wanted to take out amillion after putting in 1.1, he
couldn't.
He only had access to about 65%, 70% of his money year one,
then it's like 75%, then it's80%, then 86%, then 88%, then
90% and it's a 10-year surrender.
And why would they do that?
Well, they do that for numbereight, to cover the insurance
company's butts, because theypay us commission Right.
(18:07):
And then people think, ohcommission, oh you're just sell.
Do you know how much you pay inyour 401k, in your ira?
Do you know your 30th year offees is more than what you
contributed the first two yearscombined?
Instead of a 401k or an ira,half the money while you're
accumulating it goes to wallstreet.
And then, when you takedistributions out, half the
(18:28):
money goes to the federalgovernment.
And what do you get when you'repaying these?
12b1 fee, class A share fundfee, money manager fee, annual
account fee, mutual fund expensefees.
What are you getting?
I'm getting the satisfaction ofknowing I'm paying for some
schmucks Lamborghini inManhattan and I used to be that
schmuck.
I worked there for seven yearsin Manhattan Wall Street.
I was there.
Or you can go the private route,where there's competition and
(18:50):
hundreds of investment andfinancial and insurance
companies fighting for yourdollars and they're coming up
with cool strategies of addinglong-term care for free, adding
liquidity features for free,adding option contracts, so you
can't lose.
Give us your dollar, peter.
Give us your dollar, sarah.
What's the government doing?
They're a monopoly.
Oh, pay the penalty, pay thefees.
You're locked your money.
Do you know how much money yougot in 08 when you took out a
(19:12):
distribution before you're 59and a half?
31% of your account value.
You're able to take out 31%,yeah, so what people don't do is
they don't do that long-termplanning.
You have a past self, a presentself and a future self.
If you live in the past, youlive in depression.
If you live in the future, youlive in anxiety.
(19:32):
Right, but you have to plan foryour future because if you
don't do it, nobody will do it.
And if you're enriching yourpresent self with debt, debt,
debt, debt, debt.
All you're doing is screwingyour future self.
Brad Nelson (19:43):
Right, you had mentioned you can set this up
like a certain amount everysingle month, but how long does
that go for?
How does, like the wholestructure of this whole thing
work?
The amount, how long is theterm?
Does it ever mature?
What does that look like?
Joseph Lombardi (19:56):
I have clients who dumped in 300 grand
year one and paid nothing forthe life of the loan.
I have clients that do 500bucks a month.
It's very malleable and thecool thing about the IUL that's
not in the whole life.
Whole life is very rigid.
You pay your $500 a month for30 years and you'll get your
million dollars of death benefitguaranteed to pay out whenever
Right.
Iul, the be your own bankstrategy, is flexible.
So what if you have a reallygood year?
(20:17):
Right, you can throw in 20grand.
Let's say you have a really badyear, you put in zero.
What if you have a really goodyear?
You put in 15 grand.
What if a bad year?
You put in two grand.
Right, so that gives you theflexibility.
I will tell you one thing whatis bad about an IUL is if it is
built wrong at the wrong carrier, with too much death benefit by
(20:37):
a greedy commission hungryinsurance agent.
This has to be at the rightcarrier.
There's only three of them andthere's 200 to choose from.
So good luck, there's onlythree of them.
And it has to have the rightriders and you have to lower the
death benefit, because thedeath benefit is what has all
the fees and where all ourcommissions come from is the
more death benefit you buy, themore money we make, meaning I
(21:00):
can make more money on a $500 amonth policy than a $3,000 a
month policy.
It's all how you build it and alot of the public is so ignorant
to it they're like sure, I'mjust getting to be your own bank
.
Well, they realize they'regetting rinsed and the policy is
going to lapse and you're goingto lose a boatload of money.
So you have to make sure I meanhalf my business is replacing
(21:21):
those crappy life insurancepolicies.
You were sold by these networkmarketing life insurance guys
where they're like plumbers nineto five and wife insurance
financial planner from six toeight, like good luck.
So you have to make sure it'sdone right.
Brad Nelson (21:36):
Yeah, and, like you said, one of the benefits to
infinite banking at least thismodel is that there is no
penalty when you access thatmoney like, say, like an IRA or
a 401k something like that.
Joseph Lombardi (21:49):
Well, not only is there no 10% penalty,
there's no federal tax, there'sno state tax, there's no FICA,
medicare, unemployment or socialsecurity tax.
There's no loss if the marketgoes down for any reason.
It's sue proof, it's divorceproof in most states, right,
it's averaging 15%, documentedin writing by 178-year-old, the
oldest insurance company in theworld that does this strategy.
The third oldest in the worldbehind New.
(22:10):
This strategy, the third oldestin the world behind New York
Life and Penn Mutual.
I worked for both thosecompanies, by the way, and me,
being in the business for 22years, working for six of the
top eight insurance companiesbefore I started my own business
.
I know everything and I'm notsounding cocky or anything but
when I tell you I knoweverything.
I know everything about product, rider structure, whole life,
iul, height, weight rate ratios,liquidity returns, and I'm a
(22:34):
broker, a master broker.
I have access to 200 carriers,so I actually work for my
clients.
I'm not pigeonholed becausewhen I was working at MetLife,
guess what I sold you MetLifeauto, home, life, annuities,
investment accounts, disability,long-term care.
Were they the best in any ofthose?
No, but that's all I could sellyou.
Now, being able to shop thewhole market.
(22:56):
I give you the best product onthe market, I don't care what it
is.
That's only 3% of financialadvisors, agents, insurance
agents, planners in the worldcan do what I do.
Brad Nelson (23:08):
Yeah, last question for you, justin.
Before we get to, I'm going togive you an opportunity to let
us know, like, where can peoplefind out more information about
infinite banking and if it'sgoing to be right for them, or
information about you.
But if someone were in this andthey do die, because you did
say there is a death benefit,what happens to the money that
they put in there to actuallyuse as the investment side?
Does that get brought back tothe family or the estate, or how
(23:29):
does that work?
Joseph Lombardi (23:30):
Great question.
So in a contract there's optionA, which is level, which means
you don't get the cash value.
Then there's option B, which iscalled progressive, where
you're able to have the cashvalue accumulated in the death
benefit.
So one, the death benefit goesup every single year as your
cash value grows up, so you getboth tax free.
One is to keep the cost down.
(23:52):
You could do level, becausewhat if you don't care about the
death benefit?
What do you have?
No kids.
I have 18 to 22 year old people.
All three of my kids have thesepolicies right when they were
born.
You have a 15, 12 and nine yearold, right.
So my 15 year old almost has$100,000 in cash in his account
by me putting away $380 a monthfor the last 15 years.
It depends.
(24:13):
Which is cool, because you dooption A or option B and me
having software, I can custombuild plans for anybody, sure.
Brad Nelson (24:22):
And obviously as someone who's an expert in this.
I mean, you have someone who'sa and I'm guessing not everyone
would be a good client for thisproduct too, right?
I mean you have to have acertain situation If you're
super aggressive, aggressive,don't.
Joseph Lombardi (24:31):
Do this.
You know, like, if you likebitcoin and xrp and you're
putting all your money there,good luck, keep it.
Yeah, right, this is more of aconservative, no more like a
moderate right.
Whole life is conservative,right, don't, but the whole life
is for grandma, right, the iul.
Now I do have 18 to 22 yearolds, because 15 tax-free annual
compounding and the cost ofinsurance is still nothing for a
(24:52):
23-year-old, 30-year-old,38-year-old.
It's so cheap, right, if you're55,.
If you're 60, it may not bethat strategy for you, unless
you want long-term care and youdon't want to be thrown into a
jail, also known as a nursinghome.
Right, that's where I sell aboatload of it to the 55 to
70-year-old community.
But I don't sell it as a growthplay, even though you do get
(25:13):
all your money back.
I sell it as a long-term careplay.
Brad Nelson (25:18):
Awesome.
Well, Joseph, thanks so much,man.
This has been interesting.
I hope our listeners got a lotof this.
And if they want moreinformation, where can they find
more information about you andInfinite Banking?
Joseph Lombardi (25:27):
Right.
So I've written three books.
Being your Own Bank.
There's a Better Way Than a401k and Long-Term Care Without
Long-Term Pain.
If any of your listeners likeall three of my books, the
articles, all the major newsoutlets I've been featured in
International Business Times,business Insider, market Insider
, I will send you everything forfree.
Just write an email to Joe atIronhawk Financial Free books.
(25:50):
I heard you on Debt Free Dad.
I'll send you a Calendly linkif you want to book a time on my
calendar.
If not, you don't go on anytype of list or anything.
So you can go to joe atironhawkfinancialcom.
Send me an email if you like,meaning you're not ready to meet
with me, but you want to learnabout this?
Right, I'm going to give youeverything for free.
Number two if you are ready tomeet with me, you can go to
(26:11):
wwwironhawkfinancialcom ironlike the metal hawk, like the
bird financialcom and there's acontact us button on the top
right.
Just fill out your name, youremail and your phone number and
me or somebody on my team willreach out to you to get you on
my calendar.
Awesome.
Brad Nelson (26:26):
Well, like I said, thanks so much for being here.
We appreciate your time.
Joseph Lombardi (26:30):
I appreciate you, and I'm a debt-free dad too
, and it feels great Awesome.
Brad Nelson (26:34):
I love it, man.
Thanks so much.
All right, guys, if you'reready to break free from living
paycheck to paycheck, you wantto reduce financial stress, you
want to build savings andfinally pay off debt for good,
but again, you're not sureexactly where to get started.
Don Simplify my Money is senteach Sunday to your email.
It's your step-by-step roadmapto better financial control, and
you're also going to learn someeasy to follow strategies to
(26:56):
manage your money effectivelyStress-free money decisions that
will help you simplify yourfinancial life with proven tips
that work, and you're going togain the tools and the
confidence to tackle yourfinancial goals head on.
Sign up for Simplify my Moneyby clicking the link at the top
of the show.
Notes me.
(27:17):
Let's talk about death.
Let's talk about death.
Tune into Death, free Death.
Tune into Death, free.
Joseph Lombardi (27:25):
Death.
Brad Nelson (27:38):
All right, guys.
You know that sound means it'stime for the celebrations of the
show, and today we are kickingit off with Daria.
Daria says I've been doing myRoots 15 every day and this week
I've also tracked all of myspending, which is awesome.
She said she set up automaticsavings for $100 a month.
I was also able to keepgroceries and dining out within
her budget this week.
Daria, amazing wins for you.
(28:01):
Congratulations, vanessa.
I had three goals listed in mydebt freedom planner.
Number one pay off my husband'struck five months early to free
up that cash for other debts.
Number two add $200 to ouremergency fund.
And three use points and cashto buy airline tickets.
She reports.
All three have beenaccomplished, vanessa.
(28:23):
And that car getting paid off.
Man, it's got to feel amazing.
Congratulations to you.
And last but not least is Misty.
Misty says I paid off a creditcard this month and paid extra
on the next one.
I wrote out my budget and it'sugly, admittedly, but it's done.
My next budget will be waybetter.
I started my cash envelopesystem to manage spending better
.
Misty, number one I'm gladyou're taking action and you're
(28:45):
getting started.
You're right, that first budgetcan be a little ugly, but, yeah
, they're going to get better.
So great job in getting going,hey guys.
As always, congratulations toall of you guys who are taking a
stand for your financial lifeand are wanting better.
Hey, we get that.
Getting out of debt isn't easy,but with our help and hopefully
with your consistency anddiscipline, we promise you guys
this will be some of the bestwork that you guys do in your
(29:05):
entire life.
Thanks for joining us ontoday's show and we'll see you
guys on the next episode.
Announer (29:15):
Thanks for listening to the Debt-Free Dad podcast.
Connect with us on Facebook,tiktok, youtube and Instagram.
Just search Debt-Free Dad.
If you found value in today'sepisode, please leave us a
rating and review.
We so appreciate it.
For resources, show notes andlinks mentioned in today's show
visit debtfreedadcom.
(29:36):
Catch you next week.
Hey.
So as you work your way out ofdebt, you might be wondering
like when do you start to investin your retirement?
Now, many people rely on, andare familiar with, things like
401ks for retirement, but isthat enough?
Now, Joseph Lombardi fromIronhawk Financial joins us on
today's episode to break downthe basics of retirement and
(00:20):
share his thoughts on why a 401kmight fall short and some ideas
on how to build a strongerfinancial future.
Announer (00:30):
You're listening to the Debt-Free Dad Podcast with
Brad Nelson.
Brad and his co-hostsexperienced the anxiety of
living paycheck to paycheckbefore learning the fundamentals
of financial success.
They are now on a mission toempower regular people to pay
off their debt for good andenjoy happier, less stressful
lives.
Keep listening forinspirational interviews, tips,
(00:52):
tricks and practical advice togain financial freedom.
Brad Nelson (01:00):
Hey guys, my name is Brad Nelson, founder of Debt
Free Debt.
I paid off about $45,000 ofdebt, have been debt free now
for more than 12 years.
I've also been fortunate tohelp thousands of other people
save and pay off tens ofmillions of dollars with the
work that we do here at DebtFree Debt.
Now, guys, after listening tothis episode, if you're ready to
take things to the next level,you're ready to break free from
(01:20):
living paycheck to paycheck.
You wanna reduce free fromliving paycheck to paycheck?
You want to reduce financialstress?
You want, to say, build moresavings and finally pay off that
debt for good?
I mean, how amazing would thatfeel?
But, like many, maybe you'renot quite sure how to get
started.
Well, we've created someincredible free resources here
at Debt-Free Dad to help you getthere, and I'm going to be
sharing some details about howyou get started with those later
on in today's episode.
(01:40):
So hey, joseph, welcome to theDebt-Free Dad podcast.
So glad that you're joining ushere today.
Joseph Lombardi (01:45):
Thanks for having me.
Brad Nelson (01:46):
Yeah, hey, real quick.
Can you just share a little bit?
Obviously you're veryknowledgeable when it comes to
investments and retirement andwe're going to talk about that
you know broadly here today ontoday's episode.
But can you kind of share howyou got there, like what makes
you an expert in this area?
Joseph Lombardi (02:02):
Well, when it comes to not just being
debt-free, but emotionally,physically, mentally and
spiritually debt-free is whatgot me to this point.
I was unfortunate enough to seemy dad fall three stories off a
ladder.
It was a $25 millionconstruction company, jb
Lombardi Builders.
He had no disability.
I watched my mother die at 52years old so she was delivered
(02:22):
from alcoholism.
She she had no life insuranceleft me emotionally and
financially devastated because Iwas her closest of kin.
She left us when I was four andI watched my grandmother have a
stroke, left to dementia andshe lost 4.2 million dollars to
love the nursing home becauseshe had a long-term care that
took my grandfather 40 years tobuild right.
So I was unlucky enough to gothrough a bunch of pain, to go
(02:45):
through a bunch of seeing whatis how not to financially plan,
how not to have a financialfoundation, what it does to
somebody on a deep, deep levelof emotional, mental and
spiritual pain because you wantto be able to heal right, you
want to be able to suffer andget through.
(03:06):
But when you have bills to payyou got to get your butt back to
work on Monday Like there's nogrieving.
So we just bury it right andthen it comes out in different
ways.
But it's something where Ilived it and I wanted to make
sure it didn't happen to otherpeople.
I've also been in IRS debt ofover $150,000.
I've had a bunch of reversals inthis business, meaning somebody
(03:28):
started a plan and then withina year canceled it.
I already spent the money and Ipaid back the insurance company
.
So I had to take my money Isaved because we're 1099 and I
had to pay the insurance company.
I couldn't sell anymore.
And then the IRS said, well,where's our state fed money and
I'm like I ain't got it.
So then those penalties andinterest and 37 grand turned to
150 grand over three years Ouchso now you mentioned.
Brad Nelson (03:52):
You kind of went through your own journey, like
you're just talking about.
You got out all of that.
Can you share?
You know, obviously that's whatwe do here at Debt Free Dad.
We really kind of help peopleand that paycheck to paycheck
living to, to get them to thetable with you to start looking
at things like, hey, retirementand future planning and all that
great stuff, can you share justsome of the basic things that
you did to get yourself back tothe point where you can win
(04:14):
again with money?
Joseph Lombardi (04:15):
So this was back in 09 when my mom died.
That's where I went into deepdepression and then worked for a
couple of years at the way Iwas working, before she died,
before I got the proper mentalhealth help.
But I did envelopes, which Iknow we don't have cash anymore,
so the envelope strategy workedwell for me.
I knew that my first housemortgage, which was a 997 square
foot house with a carport on0.18 of an acres, on a hill
(04:39):
that's always yeah, it was astarter home.
I didn't want to rent.
I lived in the crappiest housethat I owned.
I still own it and I actuallyam up a quarter million dollars
when I bought it 15 years agobelieve it or not.
Wow, in equity.
I haven't sold it or anything,I just rented out, which is
paying me like 500 bucks a monthfor life, plus.
That's going up in inflation.
I was at that plan.
(05:00):
Your plan is to fail, right,it's like saying I want to lose
weight but I have no plan andI'm not going to do anything
differently and I'm just goingto magically lose weight.
You think you're going tomagically get out of debt when
you're doing the same crap thatgot you in debt?
Yeah, you have to have thatplan and that structure to say,
hey, this is where I am, and ifit's in your head, it's a dream,
(05:26):
so you have to write it down,to turn it into a goal.
And then, once you write itdown, you come up with a game
plan.
Right, if the goal is I want toget out of debt, then there
should be bullet points.
Right, I'm telling every dollarwhat's going to happen.
Those dollars aren't telling mewhat's going to happen at 1047
on a Friday night, while I'mdrinking a beer, scrolling on
TikTok, buying crap I don't need.
That's the dollar telling youwhere it's going.
Brad Nelson (05:45):
I couldn't decide it by myself.
Oh, that's awesome.
You're absolutely correct.
I love that you pointed thatout because, as you mentioned,
you're very successful in whatyou do, but you started in the
same place that a lot of peopleare listening to this in.
I started worse.
Joseph Lombardi (05:58):
I grew up in an attic with no running water.
I eat noodles and eggs.
We catch up every night.
I had hamburger.
Help about the hamburger meat.
I remember going to specialMcDonald's days when there were
49 cent cheeseburgers.
That's what my dad couldn'tafford.
I grew up in extreme poverty.
I had nothing.
I became a self-mademillionaire based on all the
childhood trauma I went throughand the ADHD that it caused me
(06:19):
to get.
And then I just grind my buttoff because I can't lose.
I never want to go back there,right?
So I almost have like a devilwith a pitchfork on my butt
saying never stop, never stop,never stop, cause I never want
to be back being impoverishedLike I was.
Yeah Well, it made you hungry.
I'm hungry every day to growlike the business you know.
(06:45):
I.
In one year I went from noConnecticut.
Now I'm national.
I never made seven figures inmy life, ever.
Brad Nelson (06:47):
And I made it in 2024.
Yeah, that's incredible.
Well, congratulations to you,man.
It's a heck of a comeback story.
And now that you're helpingpeople obviously with this whole
idea of retirement and settingthem up financially and passing
down that knowledge, that'sawesome.
That's incredible.
Let's get into it just a littlebit as far as this retirement
stuff, because we'll get thisquestion obviously from many of
our people like, hey, brad, I'maggressively paying down my debt
(07:07):
, I've got an end goal in mindwhen I'm done, but like I'm
thinking like what's after that?
Like I want to start looking atthings like retirement or
investing or even, like youmentioned, like real estate or
you know what are the thingsthat are out there.
So can you just, if someone'sconsidering retirement or any of
these, can you just kind ofoutline just the basics of
things that they should startconsidering?
Joseph Lombardi (07:30):
So if you're out of debt, right, because I
have clients and prospects thatcome to me saying, joe, I'm
ready to invest in that tax-freething, averaging 15% rate of
returns, liquid, sue-proof,divorce-proof, can't lose could
be my own bank and leverage themoney.
I want that thing and I'm like,okay, I can't just sell it to
you.
I have to make sure it'ssuitable for you so I don't get
(07:50):
sued or you don't start thisthing and then you can't afford
it in a year and you lose allyour money.
So I do fact finders and mosthalf of the time I can't work
with the people because they'rein high interest debt.
Right, if you have a retirementaccount, right, and you have a
(08:14):
29.99% credit card interest rate, your retirement account is not
netting you 29.99% tax-freerate of return on your money.
So you have to really take alook at what am I paying versus
what am I loaning or investing?
Right, what am I borrowing andwhat am I loaning out to invest
for the future?
If what I'm spending on mycurrent debt is a high interest
(08:35):
rate, stop your retirementaccount.
Do not do it.
I don't care how great it isthat Bitcoin is going to go to
the moon.
Diamond hands.
Cash that out, pay off yourdebt.
Debt is cancer to your financialhealth.
Debt takes away the earningpotential of you in the future.
Debt's going to be robbing youof that Wednesday drive home
(08:58):
eight and a half months from now, where you're miserable because
you had a fight with your wifeand you don't want to be there
and that whole experience youwent through was to pay for
something you did not need, thatyou put on a credit card eight
and a half months before.
So you have to make sure to getout of debt is number one.
Think of that as like your life, because, if I said, gun to
(09:18):
your head, if you don't get outof debt in 12 months, you will
die, and or your children youlove most will die.
I guarantee you'll get out ofdebt.
In 12 months.
You will die, and or yourchildren you love most will die.
I guarantee you'll be out ofdebt.
So you know what that tells me.
It's not a priority to you.
So make it a priority.
Brad Nelson (09:33):
Right man.
We preach that message all thetime here, and it is Debt is
robbing you of your future andsadly, we just live in a society
where debt is just so normal.
So for people to even thinkabout like to have no credit
card debt, or not pay off mycars, or to be able to spend a
good amount of my income towardsinvesting and building my own,
how about building my quality of?
Joseph Lombardi (09:53):
life.
Right.
I just bought a new front doorfor $16,000, a new back door for
$5,000, brand new garage doorsfor $12,000.
I'm getting a sauna, a hot tub.
It's cool.
Yeah, 12 grand.
I'm getting a sauna, a hot tub,it's cool.
All the money I made in the past10 years went to my gambling
debts, went to the IRS, so I'dmake $150,000 deal and I have to
give it all away.
Now the money that comes ismine.
(10:14):
My only debt I have is themortgage on this house.
I bought my wife a brand new2024 Escalade in cash, esb Sport
.
I still have a debt on my car.
I have a Jaguar.
It was 600 horsepower SVR, butI kept that because it's 3.3.
So I'm like I'd be stupid topay that off.
I'm making 3% on the bank'smoney with inflation.
(10:34):
So I have my car, my mortgageand my solar.
That's the only debt.
I have.
Everything else no credit cards, nothing.
No college loans, everythingsaved for my kids.
I got three accounts all set upfor my kids tax-free, by the
way that they can use forcollege and having financial
peace.
And with my childhood trauma, Igambled why?
(10:56):
Because I would blow all themoney I earned so I could get
back into that trauma focusCause that was something that I
had to work through.
Right, we all have our ownthings we have to deal with
Because, if you think about it,if you win the lottery, how many
of those people not only loseall their money but go bankrupt?
Can you imagine winning $100million and then, six years
later, not only did you lose the$100 million and spend the $100
(11:18):
million, you spent $120 million.
You're $20 million in debt andIRS debt, so you have to go
bankrupt.
So it's not about the money.
I have clients.
I've been doing this 22 years.
I have 2,000 clients, over $2billion of protection and
rollovers.
In my career, I won 29 industryawards.
Right, I have clients who make$80,000 a year that are
millionaires, and I have clientswho make $600,000 combined and
(11:41):
their net worth is negative.
Wow, I hope all you guys heardthat it doesn't matter how much
you make.
That's the mindset, the trapthey want you in.
Oh well, I don't make sixfigures a year, so of course I'm
brokey.
I don't, I don't, I don't, Idon't do this.
So of course it's just, it's aBS excuse.
If you had every single thingplanned out of what is going on,
(12:03):
you can easily get to where youwant to be.
But if it's too complicated, Iwant to think about it.
Work's stressing me out mygirlfriend, my ex, my kids, my
baby daddy, my baby mama.
There's always going to besomething in your life that is
hard.
And if you don't spend the timeto do it and I'm doing it I'm
getting my chubby fat butt tothe gym three times a week
because I realize if I'm richand unhealthy, all the millions
(12:25):
in the bank are going to benothing.
If I'm in a ventilator or if I'min a home or I have to stay
home, I can't travel when I'm 65or 70.
So it's a balance.
But you have to understand thatmoney is, first of all, most
talked about in the Bible thanany other subject in the Bible.
I wonder why?
Because when you understandmoney, what it does is it gives
(12:46):
you peace.
It gives you freedom, and ifyou don't have that peace in
your life, you will never befinancially wealthy because you
will find an excuse or a reasonto blow it.
Brad Nelson (12:57):
Yeah, I love that you brought up the amounts like
the $80,000 and the $600,000.
I want to pick on the $80,000.
You mentioned people who makearound $80,000 a year and
they're millionaires.
So they're like how the heckdoes that happen, joseph?
Like I want to do that.
So what did those peoplespecifically do?
Obviously, you mentioned getout of debt.
(13:17):
I'm guessing that they are, andwhat's the next step then?
What have they done all theseyears to get to that level?
Joseph Lombardi (13:24):
So most of my clients invest in IRS code,
right?
I don't know if you rememberwhen Hillary Clinton and Donald
Trump were on the politicalstage fighting for presidency in
2016.
And Hillary Clinton goes toDonald Trump shows your tax
return, shows your tax return.
Donald Trump says I show my taxreturn, I pay no taxes because
I use the same IRS codes thatyour donors use in your 30 years
.
To close the loophole and youdid it right.
(13:46):
You can easily rewatch that.
What they were talking about inthat moment was IRS code 7702.
You can Google it IRS code,section 7702.
What the heck is that?
That's a code embedded inpermanent life insurance, not
term life.
Embedded in permanent lifeinsurance, it allows my clients
(14:06):
to be their own bank.
Meaning, if this couple making$80,000 a year took 20% of their
income, which would be $16,000a year, lived under their means.
Most important, most of us areliving over our means.
We spend 102.1% of our GDP as acountry, which means for every
dollar that comes in, we spend$1.02.
So they lived under their means.
(14:28):
They took 20% of every dollarthat came in and they put it in
my strategy right.
In that time it was called awhole life plan, right?
Interest rates shot up.
I just switched them all to anIUL right Indexed universal life
.
I know I'm speaking Spanish fora lot of you guys.
So by doing that, it built afoundation for their family.
(14:49):
What does that mean?
Foundation all these genericterms.
What it will do specifically isit will give you the ability to
leverage your money.
There's no 59.5-year rule or10% penalty.
Like a 401k or an IRA, youcannot lose in either one.
One uses option contracts likecalls and longs against puts and
stops.
Now I'm starting to speakGerman.
(15:10):
I get it.
They have the ability toleverage the money out to
finance vehicles, for they'retheir own bank.
So imagine you not paying fordof america 13.99 on your car for
seven years.
An 84 month loan where the caryou bought was 30 grand but
you're paying 53 for it, paying23 grand in interest over eight
(15:32):
years.
Imagine, instead of you doingthat, you're in your own bank.
The strategy has been averaging15% and they charge you a 5%
loan rate and you still earnmoney on money that's not there.
You know what that's called.
Viewers can Google thisNon-direct recognition.
(15:53):
So if you have IRS code 7702with non-direct recognition
built into your life insuranceretirement liquid savings
account plan.
You can then buy whatever youneed for the rest of your life
and earn interest on moneythat's not even there.
So I had a client that justsold a house in California.
I know these are large numbers,you don't have to do large
(16:14):
numbers.
I have clients who do $200 amonth, $500 a month, Dumped in
1.1 million from the sale of hishouse in Santa Barbara.
Bought a house in Arizona for680,000, downsizing, divorce,
had three kids they were older,so you didn't have to stay for
custody or anything.
Kids they were older, so hedidn't have to stay for custody
or anything.
Put the 1.1 in my strategy,pulled out 680 the next day,
(16:36):
still earned interest on 1.1.
, Even though 680 paid for hishouse, which saved him an
additional half a milliondollars in interest over the
next 30 years.
So now he was able to earn twostreams of income on one US
dollar.
Brad Nelson (16:51):
Yeah, and that's incredible.
I mean especially because and Idon't know if you mentioned it
this is infinite banking right.
Is what you're talking about,be?
Joseph Lombardi (16:56):
your own bank .
Rich person's Roth.
If you want to really learnabout this, go to Forbes rich
person's Roth on Google, andthere's an article from 2018 on
Forbes written by a publicaccountant who doesn't even sell
life insurance, and there wasone written in 2020 written by a
public accountant who doesn'teven sell life insurance, and
there was one written in 2020written by a certified financial
planner, on this strategy thatI've been doing for 22 years.
Brad Nelson (17:18):
Gotcha Okay.
So now you had mentioned though, so I mean, what are the
negative sides to this?
Joseph Lombardi (17:22):
Like you had mentioned, this Yep, there is a
negative side For some reasonI'm guessing, if you back out,
not a good thing?
What's called lapsing the policy.
Cancel it, you're going to losea boatload of money.
Short term it sucks.
It's not a 12 to 24 monthstrategy.
I had a couple of clients thatdumped.
You know, in that case, with theperson had 1.1 million, taking
out 680 the next day he was ableto do that.
(17:45):
But if he wanted to take out amillion after putting in 1.1, he
couldn't.
He only had access to about 65%, 70% of his money year one,
then it's like 75%, then it's80%, then 86%, then 88%, then
90% and it's a 10-year surrender.
And why would they do that?
Well, they do that for numbereight, to cover the insurance
company's butts, because theypay us commission Right.
(18:07):
And then people think, ohcommission, oh you're just sell.
Do you know how much you pay inyour 401k, in your ira?
Do you know your 30th year offees is more than what you
contributed the first two yearscombined?
Instead of a 401k or an ira,half the money while you're
accumulating it goes to wallstreet.
And then, when you takedistributions out, half the
(18:28):
money goes to the federalgovernment.
And what do you get when you'repaying these?
12b1 fee, class A share fundfee, money manager fee, annual
account fee, mutual fund expensefees.
What are you getting?
I'm getting the satisfaction ofknowing I'm paying for some
schmucks Lamborghini inManhattan and I used to be that
schmuck.
I worked there for seven yearsin Manhattan Wall Street.
I was there.
Or you can go the private route,where there's competition and
(18:50):
hundreds of investment andfinancial and insurance
companies fighting for yourdollars and they're coming up
with cool strategies of addinglong-term care for free, adding
liquidity features for free,adding option contracts, so you
can't lose.
Give us your dollar, peter.
Give us your dollar, sarah.
What's the government doing?
They're a monopoly.
Oh, pay the penalty, pay thefees.
You're locked your money.
Do you know how much money yougot in 08 when you took out a
(19:12):
distribution before you're 59and a half?
31% of your account value.
You're able to take out 31%,yeah, so what people don't do is
they don't do that long-termplanning.
You have a past self, a presentself and a future self.
If you live in the past, youlive in depression.
If you live in the future, youlive in anxiety.
(19:32):
Right, but you have to plan foryour future because if you
don't do it, nobody will do it.
And if you're enriching yourpresent self with debt, debt,
debt, debt, debt.
All you're doing is screwingyour future self.
Brad Nelson (19:43):
Right, you had mentioned you can set this up
like a certain amount everysingle month, but how long does
that go for?
How does, like the wholestructure of this whole thing
work?
The amount, how long is theterm?
Does it ever mature?
What does that look like?
Joseph Lombardi (19:56):
I have clients who dumped in 300 grand
year one and paid nothing forthe life of the loan.
I have clients that do 500bucks a month.
It's very malleable and thecool thing about the IUL that's
not in the whole life.
Whole life is very rigid.
You pay your $500 a month for30 years and you'll get your
million dollars of death benefitguaranteed to pay out whenever
Right.
Iul, the be your own bankstrategy, is flexible.
So what if you have a reallygood year?
(20:17):
Right, you can throw in 20grand.
Let's say you have a really badyear, you put in zero.
What if you have a really goodyear?
You put in 15 grand.
What if a bad year?
You put in two grand.
Right, so that gives you theflexibility.
I will tell you one thing whatis bad about an IUL is if it is
built wrong at the wrong carrier, with too much death benefit by
(20:37):
a greedy commission hungryinsurance agent.
This has to be at the rightcarrier.
There's only three of them andthere's 200 to choose from.
So good luck, there's onlythree of them.
And it has to have the rightriders and you have to lower the
death benefit, because thedeath benefit is what has all
the fees and where all ourcommissions come from is the
more death benefit you buy, themore money we make, meaning I
(21:00):
can make more money on a $500 amonth policy than a $3,000 a
month policy.
It's all how you build it and alot of the public is so ignorant
to it they're like sure, I'mjust getting to be your own bank
.
Well, they realize they'regetting rinsed and the policy is
going to lapse and you're goingto lose a boatload of money.
So you have to make sure I meanhalf my business is replacing
(21:21):
those crappy life insurancepolicies.
You were sold by these networkmarketing life insurance guys
where they're like plumbers nineto five and wife insurance
financial planner from six toeight, like good luck.
So you have to make sure it'sdone right.
Brad Nelson (21:36):
Yeah, and, like you said, one of the benefits to
infinite banking at least thismodel is that there is no
penalty when you access thatmoney like, say, like an IRA or
a 401k something like that.
Joseph Lombardi (21:49):
Well, not only is there no 10% penalty,
there's no federal tax, there'sno state tax, there's no FICA,
medicare, unemployment or socialsecurity tax.
There's no loss if the marketgoes down for any reason.
It's sue proof, it's divorceproof in most states, right,
it's averaging 15%, documentedin writing by 178-year-old, the
oldest insurance company in theworld that does this strategy.
The third oldest in the worldbehind New.
(22:10):
This strategy, the third oldestin the world behind New York
Life and Penn Mutual.
I worked for both thosecompanies, by the way, and me,
being in the business for 22years, working for six of the
top eight insurance companiesbefore I started my own business
.
I know everything and I'm notsounding cocky or anything but
when I tell you I knoweverything.
I know everything about product, rider structure, whole life,
iul, height, weight rate ratios,liquidity returns, and I'm a
(22:34):
broker, a master broker.
I have access to 200 carriers,so I actually work for my
clients.
I'm not pigeonholed becausewhen I was working at MetLife,
guess what I sold you MetLifeauto, home, life, annuities,
investment accounts, disability,long-term care.
Were they the best in any ofthose?
No, but that's all I could sellyou.
Now, being able to shop thewhole market.
(22:56):
I give you the best product onthe market, I don't care what it
is.
That's only 3% of financialadvisors, agents, insurance
agents, planners in the worldcan do what I do.
Brad Nelson (23:08):
Yeah, last question for you, justin.
Before we get to, I'm going togive you an opportunity to let
us know, like, where can peoplefind out more information about
infinite banking and if it'sgoing to be right for them, or
information about you.
But if someone were in this andthey do die, because you did
say there is a death benefit,what happens to the money that
they put in there to actuallyuse as the investment side?
Does that get brought back tothe family or the estate, or how
(23:29):
does that work?
Joseph Lombardi (23:30):
Great question.
So in a contract there's optionA, which is level, which means
you don't get the cash value.
Then there's option B, which iscalled progressive, where
you're able to have the cashvalue accumulated in the death
benefit.
So one, the death benefit goesup every single year as your
cash value grows up, so you getboth tax free.
One is to keep the cost down.
(23:52):
You could do level, becausewhat if you don't care about the
death benefit?
What do you have?
No kids.
I have 18 to 22 year old people.
All three of my kids have thesepolicies right when they were
born.
You have a 15, 12 and nine yearold, right.
So my 15 year old almost has$100,000 in cash in his account
by me putting away $380 a monthfor the last 15 years.
It depends.
(24:13):
Which is cool, because you dooption A or option B and me
having software, I can custombuild plans for anybody, sure.
Brad Nelson (24:22):
And obviously as someone who's an expert in this.
I mean, you have someone who'sa and I'm guessing not everyone
would be a good client for thisproduct too, right?
I mean you have to have acertain situation If you're
super aggressive, aggressive,don't.
Joseph Lombardi (24:31):
Do this.
You know, like, if you likebitcoin and xrp and you're
putting all your money there,good luck, keep it.
Yeah, right, this is more of aconservative, no more like a
moderate right.
Whole life is conservative,right, don't, but the whole life
is for grandma, right, the iul.
Now I do have 18 to 22 yearolds, because 15 tax-free annual
compounding and the cost ofinsurance is still nothing for a
(24:52):
23-year-old, 30-year-old,38-year-old.
It's so cheap, right, if you're55,.
If you're 60, it may not bethat strategy for you, unless
you want long-term care and youdon't want to be thrown into a
jail, also known as a nursinghome.
Right, that's where I sell aboatload of it to the 55 to
70-year-old community.
But I don't sell it as a growthplay, even though you do get
(25:13):
all your money back.
I sell it as a long-term careplay.
Brad Nelson (25:18):
Awesome.
Well, Joseph, thanks so much,man.
This has been interesting.
I hope our listeners got a lotof this.
And if they want moreinformation, where can they find
more information about you andInfinite Banking?
Joseph Lombardi (25:27):
Right.
So I've written three books.
Being your Own Bank.
There's a Better Way Than a401k and Long-Term Care Without
Long-Term Pain.
If any of your listeners likeall three of my books, the
articles, all the major newsoutlets I've been featured in
International Business Times,business Insider, market Insider
, I will send you everything forfree.
Just write an email to Joe atIronhawk Financial Free books.
(25:50):
I heard you on Debt Free Dad.
I'll send you a Calendly linkif you want to book a time on my
calendar.
If not, you don't go on anytype of list or anything.
So you can go to joe atironhawkfinancialcom.
Send me an email if you like,meaning you're not ready to meet
with me, but you want to learnabout this?
Right, I'm going to give youeverything for free.
Number two if you are ready tomeet with me, you can go to
(26:11):
wwwironhawkfinancialcom ironlike the metal hawk, like the
bird financialcom and there's acontact us button on the top
right.
Just fill out your name, youremail and your phone number and
me or somebody on my team willreach out to you to get you on
my calendar.
Awesome.
Brad Nelson (26:26):
Well, like I said, thanks so much for being here.
We appreciate your time.
Joseph Lombardi (26:30):
I appreciate you, and I'm a debt-free dad too
, and it feels great Awesome.
Brad Nelson (26:34):
I love it, man.
Thanks so much.
All right, guys, if you'reready to break free from living
paycheck to paycheck, you wantto reduce financial stress, you
want to build savings andfinally pay off debt for good,
but again, you're not sureexactly where to get started.
Don Simplify my Money is senteach Sunday to your email.
It's your step-by-step roadmapto better financial control, and
you're also going to learn someeasy to follow strategies to
(26:56):
manage your money effectivelyStress-free money decisions that
will help you simplify yourfinancial life with proven tips
that work, and you're going togain the tools and the
confidence to tackle yourfinancial goals head on.
Sign up for Simplify my Moneyby clicking the link at the top
of the show.
Notes me.
(27:17):
Let's talk about death.
Let's talk about death.
Tune into Death, free Death.
Tune into Death, free.
Joseph Lombardi (27:25):
Death.
Brad Nelson (27:38):
All right, guys.
You know that sound means it'stime for the celebrations of the
show, and today we are kickingit off with Daria.
Daria says I've been doing myRoots 15 every day and this week
I've also tracked all of myspending, which is awesome.
She said she set up automaticsavings for $100 a month.
I was also able to keepgroceries and dining out within
her budget this week.
Daria, amazing wins for you.
(28:01):
Congratulations, vanessa.
I had three goals listed in mydebt freedom planner.
Number one pay off my husband'struck five months early to free
up that cash for other debts.
Number two add $200 to ouremergency fund.
And three use points and cashto buy airline tickets.
She reports.
All three have beenaccomplished, vanessa.
(28:23):
And that car getting paid off.
Man, it's got to feel amazing.
Congratulations to you.
And last but not least is Misty.
Misty says I paid off a creditcard this month and paid extra
on the next one.
I wrote out my budget and it'sugly, admittedly, but it's done.
My next budget will be waybetter.
I started my cash envelopesystem to manage spending better
.
Misty, number one I'm gladyou're taking action and you're
(28:45):
getting started.
You're right, that first budgetcan be a little ugly, but, yeah
, they're going to get better.
So great job in getting going,hey guys.
As always, congratulations toall of you guys who are taking a
stand for your financial lifeand are wanting better.
Hey, we get that.
Getting out of debt isn't easy,but with our help and hopefully
with your consistency anddiscipline, we promise you guys
this will be some of the bestwork that you guys do in your
(29:05):
entire life.
Thanks for joining us ontoday's show and we'll see you
guys on the next episode.
Announer (29:15):
Thanks for listening to the Debt-Free Dad podcast.
Connect with us on Facebook,tiktok, youtube and Instagram.
Just search Debt-Free Dad.
If you found value in today'sepisode, please leave us a
rating and review.
We so appreciate it.
For resources, show notes andlinks mentioned in today's show
visit debtfreedadcom.
(29:36):
Catch you next week.
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