Exploring the New College Football Playoff Format and NFL Challenges

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Is the new 12-team college football playoff format the game-changer we've all been waiting for, or does it still need some tweaks? Join us as we explore the potential and pitfalls of this revamped system. With Ed and Donnie at the helm, we dig into the concept of reseeding and whether conference winners truly deserve automatic byes. We draw intriguing parallels with college basketball and consider how an eye test, combined with data-driven ranking, could revolutionize fairness in the playoffs. Our analysis also takes a historical turn as we reflect on the impact of computer-based rankings and their role in shaping future iterations of college football.

Catch the heated debate on player transfers, a hot-button issue reshaping college football. We scrutinize the different strategies of coaches like Les Miles and Dabo Swinney, and how their approaches impact player retention and team performance. With a sharp eye on media narratives, we also tackle the perceived bias towards the SEC and how conference realignments muddle the storyline of dominance. When it comes to the NFL, our conversation takes a deep dive into quarterback development, discussing Marcus Freeman's coaching prospects and the evolving landscape of player compensation in the wake of NIL deals and the transfer portal.

From the challenges of young NFL athletes navigating newfound wealth to the dysfunction within teams like the Cleveland Browns and New York Giants, our latest episode covers it all. We dissect the career trajectories of Baker Mayfield and Johnny Manziel, emphasizing the role of maturity in professional success. With a critical eye on management and ownership, we analyze how decision-making impacts team dynamics and performance, particularly with high-profile players like Aaron Rodgers. As we wrap up, our thoughts shift to the broader sports scene, setting the stage for future discussions on NCAA basketball playoffs and more. Join us for a thorough exploration into the dynamic world of college football and the NFL.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
You paid the wrong player.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's alevel of dysfunction.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
By the way, both those players are no longer with
the team Right.

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Yeah, I mean you let the one guy walk that should
have never walked and you paidthe other guy and he just didn't
earn it.
He wasn't worth it because heshouldn't have given it to begin
with.
Is anybody there?
Minute to begin with.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
All right, all right, all right.
Well, welcome everybody to theDHC podcast.
My name is Ed, also known asthe Data, and with me I got my
good friend, my companion, oneof the co-hosts of the Data
Chronicles sports show.
That's right.
Val is not with us tonight.
We will be doing something alittle bit different, ok, so we
are starting a little segment.

(00:56):
We're going to be talking toall about sports, right, this is
the new year, this is the firstrecording of 2025.
So, uh, what?
Uh, you know, I put it ontwitter, I put it on threads, uh
, and I asked uh, everybody waslike hey, do you want to?
You want to hear about moreabout other sports?
You want to hear just strictlybaseball and um, it was

(01:18):
overwhelmingly uh in favor ofother sports, which I'm okay
with because I'm a fan of allsports, right, except for tennis
.
No, I'm kidding, I'm kidding,totally kidding.
I guess the Australian Open isgoing on right now.

Speaker 1 (01:31):
So there's, your tennis.

Speaker 2 (01:32):
talk right there, right, all right.
So, but again, like I said, oneof my good friends, my co-host,
donnie Wise, also known as themayor, my friend, how are we
doing today?

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Doing great.
Glad to hop on here with youand talk some sports topics and
see what we can get into herefor this.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
I'm sure we will agree on everything right, like
always Right.
And just so you guys know thatHacker Chronicle Sports Show it
is on Tuesdays and Thursdays, 9pm Eastern time on YouTube Make
sure you guys go ahead and hitthe subscribe and like button so
that way you guys are always inthe know.
All right, and then also makesure you tell one more person

(02:13):
about this.
All right, donnie.
The first topic that I want todiscuss because we had a little
pre-meeting and then wediscussed what we wanted to talk
about and one of the thingsthat you know we have been
having a a ton of discussion andespecially me, I've been
trolling people on threads isthe college football playoff,

(02:36):
and I want to get your thoughtson it because obviously we go
back and forth on on some ofthese things and you know some
of the things that we feel thatshould be tweaked, and but I
want to get your thoughts firston how do you feel about, so far
, this new version of thecollege football playoffs?

Speaker 1 (02:53):
I mean, I think it's better than it was.
I think each step has been animprovement.
Obviously, there's a lot ofthings they're going to have to
adjust and tweak going forward,but until you change something,
you really don't know what youneed to fix about it.
So you've got to pick astarting point.
So I like the 12 teams.
I don't think you could have.

(03:16):
I mean, you could have gonejust with eight and not had the
buys.
The problem is they're trying toaccommodate everybody.
That's always complained,Correct, and you can't just you
can't do that.
You've got to say this is whatwe're going to do, like it or
not.
I mean you'd have four teamsand you'd have, you know, teams
that are five and six in some ofthese smaller conferences
complaining that they didn'thave a shot.

(03:38):
You know they go undefeated,Like a Boise State would go
undefeated or somebody like thatwould go undefeated and they're
like we can't even get into thefour-team playoff.
So now they throw 12 out there.
There's plenty of slots for you.
But then they give you a buyand it's like I know.

Speaker 2 (03:55):
I know, I know.

Speaker 1 (03:56):
You went too far with that one.
It's like we're going to makeyou a spot and we're going to
give you a buy for yourconference and if you're, you
know, one of the higher rankedconferences, and so they gotta
adjust that yeah, but overallit's an improvement yeah, so so

(04:17):
I, I and I and I'm not trying to, you know, put words in your
mouth or anything like that butI think we can both agree that
seating needs to be tweaked.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
uh, you know, at this point, right, I, I don't think
that just because you won yourconference you get to have an
automatic buy.
I think it should be like theuh, like basketball is college
basketball that you win yourconference, that gives you an
automatic bid into the playoff.
At that point you made it right, that's it, we're good, thank

(04:48):
you.
And then have a reseating ofthe teams that are put into the
college football playoff.

Speaker 1 (04:57):
Yeah, I don't know how much the playoff committee
utilizes the data that they gotback when it used to be a lot of
computerized, even you know,back to the era.
I hope they use some of that inin companion with their eye
test, because I I think theproblem that started it was the

(05:19):
computers and everybody's likewell, the computer can't see the
eye test of a team, they'rejust looking at numbers.
Okay, you got to have both.
I hope they.
Everybody's like.
Well, a computer can't see theeye test of a team, they're just
looking at numbers.
Okay, you got to have both.
I hope they didn't go the otherway.
Hopefully they also take thatinto account as they tweak this,
Because I think if you take thecomputer modules that they used
to use and apply that with,then at least as a component or

(05:43):
some percentage of the rankingsof the teams, Correct, correct.
Because you start looking ateverybody, start complaining
about strength of schedule andall these.
You know not to pick onVirgil's favorite team, mercer,
but you see these teams likethat getting scheduled against
Alabama's and so forth and youknow they're good teams in their

(06:03):
own right but that hurt, thatshould be hurting your strength
of schedule and it doesn'taffect it as much as it should
be in the eye test.
Part of it because they're likewell, it's alabama, they should
beat these people but let's puta computer module to it,
because they don't playeverybody in their conference.
Because the conferences havegotten so big, they play a
random, a random level ofnon-conference teams to begin

(06:25):
with.
So add that in, add thecommittee's eye test.
Get rid of the buys, except forthe top four teams.
Whoever the top four teams are,they get the buy yeah, and I I
agree with that.

Speaker 2 (06:40):
You know, and you know something that you said
regarding the um, those, thoseeasy games that they get to play
, right, like I mean, I get thatRight.
You want a game or two at thebeginning of the season, which
I'm OK, I'm in favor of that,I'm good with that, I'm good
with you having the early onesRight, the early ones are the
good ones is when you schedulethem towards the end of the

(07:01):
season.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
It's sort of almost like a bye week is what you're
scheduling?
A practice week?

Speaker 2 (07:07):
right, and that's that's my issue is that, you
know, my issue is like, like,really, you're gonna put you
know uh, uh, mercer at the endof the season and then you're
going and again, sorry, virgil,we're not picking on your team,
I'll put, it's just the namethat came up.
But right, like I mean, youwant to make sure that you are.
If you're going to do that, yougot to make sure that you know

(07:27):
that if you put that at the endof the season, that is going to
hurt your chances of yourstrength of schedule, because at
that point your strength ofschedule goes down yeah, and it
should affect your.

Speaker 1 (07:39):
To me it should affect your strength of schedule
more if you schedule them atthe end of the season versus
that same team, if you schedulethem at the beginning of the
year.
Because you know, again, it'sall about money, we all know
that.
So it's all about money for thesmall schools that's how they
fund their programs is gettingthese paychecks to come play.
And every once in a whilesomebody will upset somebody

(08:01):
randomly or make a run at it.
Yeah, in a while somebody willupset somebody randomly or make
a, you know, make a run at it.
But you know the the thing isit used to be even before the
the whole BCS came about.
You always had those three orfour games at the beginning of
the season and then you startedyour conference schedule and
that's kind of how it was.
And then you started havingthese, these matchups of ACC

(08:22):
versus SEC and a kickoff gameand week zero games and all that
kind of mess, and so a lot ofthe teams started shuffling some
of these weaker teams to laterin the year, like right before a
big rivalry game.
So it's like, okay, we play ourconference schedule, we get to
the end of the year and it'seither a conference big rivalry,

(08:43):
like the Alabama-Auburn is, orit's like South Carolina-Clemson
.
That's always the Saturday ofThanksgiving.
Sometimes Clemson, sometimesSouth Carolina will schedule a
weaker team right before that.
It doesn't happen every year.
I think I even mentioned thatnormally we did this year, um,

(09:03):
but, but the last four or fiveyears it's just all been
conference games.
So, um, all that should betaken into account when it comes
to to strength of schedule, notjust who you play when you play
them.
And then you know a lot of thestuff about alabama.
Everybody's like you know youlost to two six and six teams,
yeah, and they're like, yeah,but they were sec teams, like

(09:24):
well, that doesn't matter, youknow, just because they're sec
teams doesn't mean they'rebetter at better six and six
teams yeah, and I can't.

Speaker 2 (09:31):
I think this is also goes into what we also we were
talking about, that the sec isno longer the sec that we know.
The big 10 is not the big 10that we know.
Right, everything has changedand and I think that nil has
really.
You know, um has leveled outthe playing field for a lot, of,
a lot of teams, because wealways talked about it.

(09:53):
Okay, so now this player whocould be starting in another
team now has a chance to go towhatever you know um.
You know FIA or whatever, right, florida International, right,
and then FIU.
And then you know, get millionsof dollars, right, right, prime
example, all right, listen, wegot Carson Beck right, who just

(10:23):
left Georgia.
It is now transferred to Miami,the University of miami, and it
is making 10 million dollars,right, right, so he's making
more than a lot of rookie nflquarterbacks right now and does
not need to go into the nfl.
Why?
Because one, he he's alreadypretty popular.
He's going to go to a prettynotable big school, so why even

(10:49):
go?
So now we're having thisconversation, it's like well, he
was in the SEC, that's the best.
Conference Says who, right?

Speaker 1 (11:00):
Yeah, I mean exactly, and they like to still claim
they are and that's fine.
I mean they're in bed with ESPN.
Espn promotes them, has theirnetwork, all that kind of stuff.
And from the money standpoint,as far as ESPN is concerned, sec
is the best conference Fox.
Of course they're going to toutthat and to some extent they

(11:25):
are, but they're only that way,in my opinion, because they've
been manufactured to be that way.
Oh, my God, it's such a pain inmy.
They get ranked.
They rank all these teams.
You rank seven or eight of theteams in each of these
conferences in the top 20.
And then you know they beat upthe lower teams within their own

(11:46):
conference and then when theyplay each other as highly ranked
teams, it's touted as a biggame and whoever loses doesn't
drop very much because they lostto a highly ranked opponent or
vice versa.
It's like it's all a shell gamein my opinion, the way it's
done.
And the other conferences youknow the big 12, the acc, um and

(12:09):
and the former pack 12, whichis the pack 2, now um yeah, why
even stay there.
Just yeah, I mean, I I'll givethem credit.
They're rebuilding it andthey're taking the money that
all the other teams left behind,which is good because they
still have the contractualobligation, so they're getting
paid and they're kind ofrebuilding it, but again they're

(12:30):
not even going to be what theyonce were, because all the big,
you know blue blood schools thatwere part of it are gone to
these other conferences andeventually something else is
going to come along.
It's going to change.
I don't know what it is but italways does yeah, a lot of these
teams are going to pull away,the conferences are going to
maybe go away, who knows.
But you're right, these portalthings as far as the player, you

(12:52):
know, taking money to gosomewhere else and stay a year
in college, rather than GoPro, Imean, you got guys that are
going to end up playing four orfive years and make all the
money they're ever going to makebecause they're never going to
play in the nfl but, they'regoing to get paid a lot of
college money to help promotethese programs and all the money
they make, and then they'regoing to just be like a college

(13:13):
legend or some kind, but they'renever going to play in the nfl
it's like the minor leaguesystem for um for the nfl yeah,
exactly, and there's nothingwrong with that.
I again, we always say it allthe time If you can get the
money, get it.

Speaker 2 (13:33):
But don't tell me that the system is one way when
it really isn't that way.
I definitely do not want tohear it from coaches saying that
the system is broken.
You broke the system, right.
You know what I mean.
Les Miles is a perfect example,right, he is complaining about
players transferring.
They shouldn't be like this.
Dude has constantly beentransferring, got you know, from

(13:55):
school to school to schoolbecause of money.
He's got more money whereeverywhere else it has broken.
His contract has left the teamthere, like you know, dry at
ball games and at, uh,championship games.
So you know, I don't want tohear from coaches saying, well,
it's, the system is broken.
You know what?

Speaker 1 (14:15):
death here, yeah yeah , and and that.
The funny thing is and I knoweverybody jokes on dabbo and
I'll I'll get into this for justa second about not using the
portal and that he needs toadapt or they're going to fall
behind.
You know what's going to happen, or what is happening is all
these teams that werecomplaining about him not using

(14:35):
the portal and him fallingbehind the times they're coming
back to him because he looked atthe portal the last few years.
He's not found players in theportal better than what he feels
he has on his team.
This year we've brought in moreportal players because it's not
like he's refused to adapt,just like Paul Feinbaum has said

(14:58):
.
He's not refusing to doanything.
He's being smart about how hedoes it.
He's not just taking whatever,and I saw an article the other
day that said that Clemson hasthe best retention rate of
players leaving for the portalversus what they've got coming
in.
Granted, he hasn't had anythingcoming in for a while, but he's
plus three.
This year he's brought in fiveguys.

Speaker 2 (15:20):
He also hasn't had a lot of opportunities for, hasn't
really shown a lot that he canwin.
So that's the thing, thoughhe's going to get measured on
whether or not you're going tomake it back to the college
playoff.

Speaker 1 (15:33):
Right, and that's not necessarily an issue with the
portal either.
That's been more coaching.

Speaker 2 (15:42):
Yeah, 100%.
We can go into that one all day.

Speaker 1 (15:44):
That's not a portal issue Because show me the teams
that have leapfrogged Clemsonjust because of the portal.
There isn't any.
There's players that have cometo a team Ohio State maybe gets
a player so they only get one ortwo players from the portal
that make any kind of impact.

Speaker 2 (16:03):
Right.
Remember when Desmond Howardwas like well, you know, they
bought players, not really, no,no, like.
I mean, those players have beenthere.
Have they gotten a coupleplayers here and there?
Absolutely Well, so hasMichigan.
So let's not say that.
You know a lot of these playershave been recruited and they
have been there for a long time.
So you know it falls on deafears when you say something like

(16:26):
that.
Ohio State has done it, alabama, michigan, all these Big Ten,
you know, even ACC and SEC teamshave done it.
They have all done it.

Speaker 1 (16:40):
Yeah, and that goes back to what you said earlier
about the playing field beingmore level, because all of the
teams are doing it.
You've got some teams thatjumped all into the portal and
started bringing in as many guysfrom other schools as they
could.
But what have we been sayingabout that is they're leaving a
program for multiple reasons,and not all.
Not the last reason thatthey're leaving is because

(17:02):
they're so good they want to gosomewhere else.
They're leaving because they'reso good they want to go
somewhere else.
They're leaving because they'renot getting play in time,
they're not getting the moneythey want, or they're just not
happy with the program.
It's not like oh, I'm leavingbecause I'm so good I deserve to
play for a better school,correct, you know.
And it's not like ohio state isout there collecting, you know,

(17:24):
six heisman candidates fortheir team.
This is not happening.
That way.
They're collecting eight or tenguys and they might have one or
two that pan out.
It's like a free-for-all a freeagency.

Speaker 2 (17:36):
Again, there's nothing wrong with that.
We're not saying that there'sanything wrong with that.
We're just saying that they'retaking advantage of the
situation that they have beenput in right Because they are a
big.

Speaker 1 (17:47):
The media shouldn't be selling me a bill of goods
that this is the way it is andif you don't do this, then
you're going to get left behind.
No, you're not going to getleft behind.
Everyone else is going toeventually slow down to you.

Speaker 2 (18:01):
Listen, we watch ESPN .
You and me, we watch ESn atnauseam.
Right, we watch nbc sports.
We, we do that, we watch it.
We that, we, we love our sports.
My, my issue with, like, uh,with espn right now is that it
has become very evident thatthey are favoring one thing or
another.
Right, you know, like it is, itis, it is as clear as day.

(18:22):
They favor the SEC.
Right now.
It is they're showing us.
It's like they're coming fromthe top.
It's like, hey guys, we needyou guys to talk about the SEC.
The SEC is what we need to talkabout, because we have this
contract with them and we needto push it.
And that's my problem with PaulFeinbaum.
Let's calm down.
You know what I mean.
Right, last, right, last time Ichecked, no SEC team is in the

(18:47):
college football playoffchampionship.
Right, and the only SEC teamwho was, by the way, from a
different conference was thelast one standing.

Speaker 1 (19:00):
Yeah, I mean, they've only been in the SEC this year,
so right, I don't.
I barely even count that as anSEC team making it.
It's a technicality issue to me, because Texas is basically a
Big 12 team that joined yourconference and then beat
everybody to the end of the line.

Speaker 2 (19:16):
Right, just got lucky with again our issue, and then
we can have a discussion aboutthis all for a whole, while
Re-seeding that's the problem,right, Because they were able to
take advantage of the seedingthat they got.
Oregon, on the other hand, gotscrewed on seeding, yes.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Yeah, yeah, I mean Oregon should have had.
They should have had won thebye to play the team that was
coming from the lowest seed.

Speaker 2 (19:47):
They were the number one team all year.

Speaker 1 (19:48):
Right.
They ended up kind of in aweird spot where they were the
number one team all year andthen, by the time it gets to
where they're placed, theiropponent is going to be
somewhere in the middle of thosefirst four games not the lowest
seeded games.

Speaker 2 (20:04):
Ohio State put a whooping on them.
Yeah, they just.

Speaker 1 (20:07):
That was not a good game and that was payback for
Oregon winning the first game ina way.

Speaker 2 (20:14):
And I would say that Ohio State lost that game more
than Oregon won the last game,exactly.

Speaker 1 (20:20):
And I think Ohio State was pissed and they wanted
to.
You know they wanted to rectifythat issue and show that they
should have won the first gameand we're going to do everything
we can to show you.
And again, oregon's a Pac-12team, they're not a Big Ten team
.

Speaker 2 (20:38):
They're not.
Neither is Washington.
Yeah, yeah, if you think aboutit, give me another year and
then we can talk about whetherthat should you know.
Yeah, yeah, if you think aboutit, give me another year and
then we can talk about whetheryou know Exactly.

Speaker 1 (20:47):
They came into the Big Ten and then they got a very
favorable Big Ten schedule andthen got lucky that, like you
said, ohio State lost that gamemore than they beat Ohio State
when it came down to it.
Otherwise they're not even inthe playoff.
If they lose that game to OhioState, they may not even be

(21:08):
making the playoff because theywould have lost that game early.
And if that's their only loss,then they may end up making it
like Penn State or somebody.
One of the other teams came infrom the conference as well.
Well, that's interesting, butthey wouldn't have been in the
top seed either.

Speaker 2 (21:24):
Yeah, because you know what You're right.
That's interesting.
Oh, I didn't think about that.
Also, penn State choked again,as usual.
You know you get to the biggame, you can't win the big game
.

Speaker 1 (21:40):
Well, and then talking about the players, I was
going to bring this up.
When you're talking about theplayers jumping as well for
money or for whatever, how aboutearlier the year, the
quarterback from UNLV that satafter three games?
He's like I'm not playing thatfourth game in burning this year
because you haven't given me myNIL money, correct?
He's not going to play.

(22:00):
And then he's entered thetransfer portal and leaving UNLV
over NIL dispute, where did heend up going to.
I don't know if he's made adecision at this point the last
article I see is from October,so I'm not sure at this time
what he chose to go to but justthe fact that he can sit there

(22:26):
and say, no, I'm going to sitafter three games, cause if you
play the fourth, fourth game,then that year counts.
And you're like okay, I'm goingto get an extra year here
because I'm going to transferout, and it's okay, and
everybody's like fine with it.
And it's like wait a minute,that shouldn't happen either.
Well, wait a minute, thatshouldn't happen either.

Speaker 2 (22:43):
Well, at the same time.
The schools kind of screwed himover at the same time.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
Right?
Well, the thing is, did theschool screw him over or not?
Because there's no real ruleson the NIL.
So he's saying he got screwedover.
The school may be saying thatthey didn't, who knows, because
there's no set rule for how thisis going to work.
It's all still very, very fluid.

(23:07):
So, um, again, that goes backto do you want to use the portal
to improve your team?
Do you bring a guy in like thatthat if he's not going to get
his money, he's going to gosomewhere else?
And the thing is, how, how manyyears can you do that?
Like you guys, eight, nineyears in college, like just keep

(23:29):
hanging on, hanging on, hangingon, like what are we doing here
?

Speaker 2 (23:36):
And I'm one that I'm going to, most more likely than
not, I'm going to side with theplayer on this one.
But the only reason is, for solong ncaa and colleges were able
to take advantage of the nameand likeness right, right they
were.
They were able to sell all thatmerchandise.
The players could not get asingle dime out of it.
Now they are, and, uh, and nowa lot of the colleges are upset

(24:01):
that they, the players, are ableto do that.
You know so they're trying tofind the loophole and to try to
get the power back right, I meanit's funny.

Speaker 1 (24:11):
This all started with johnny manziel.
Oh god, yes, yeah, and thatthat's, that's what that's what
is so funny to me about.
it is like the guy that you knowwas all about the money, money
and money, money, money.
The whole reason NIL kind ofmorphed into what it is was
because Texas A&M was making afortune off of him and he

(24:33):
couldn't sign his signature andget paid for it, or he couldn't
go to a card show or he couldn'tsell.
They were selling a ton ofjerseys and it's like, you're
right, they're getting what theydeserve?

Speaker 2 (24:49):
Yeah, absolutely.
So it's a good conversation, myfriend.
I like this one.
I like this one.
We've been talking about thisfor a while now, and now that
we're at the time of thisrecording, we know who are the
top two teams that are going tomake it to the college football
playoff championship, which isOhio State and Notre Dame.

Speaker 1 (25:08):
In my opinion, I think those are the top two
teams that are the best teamsleft in the playoff, and so yeah
, I mean everybody was like youknow, georgia, georgia, georgia,
georgia has not been that goodof a team all year long.
They haven't gated by on a lotof stuff.
Texas has not been that good ateam all year.

(25:31):
They've kind of skated by.
I mean it really, you know,Penn State, just Penn State.
So yeah, penn State, penn Statewill do Penn State things yeah
because people used to say thatabout Clemson Clemson is just
Clemsoning, they get there andthen they choke until we didn't.
So yeah, I mean Notre Dame hasbeen, and I hate to say it

(25:54):
because Notre Dame is kind of apretender to me, because they
sort of got a toe in the waterfor the ACC.

Speaker 2 (26:00):
Oh, our friend.

Speaker 1 (26:00):
Eric is going to get you.
But hey, all credit to NotreDame.
They have.
And I love Marcus Freeman.
I think that guy is one hell ofa coach.
Yeah, and you know I picked himto win it all earlier, you know
, last week.

Speaker 2 (26:18):
You just picked him to win it all because you hate
Ohio State.

Speaker 1 (26:21):
Well, true, but I also think, looking at it, I
mean, granted, ohio state's kindof got a little little fire
under their uh, yeah, they didskin right now, but, um, I just
thought that, uh, notre dame isa more complete team overall and
they've gotten better andbetter as the season's gone

(26:43):
along in my opinion.

Speaker 2 (26:44):
Do you think that Notre Dame is a more complete
team over Ohio State?

Speaker 1 (26:49):
More balanced and complete.

Speaker 2 (26:51):
yeah, Interesting, I think, ohio.

Speaker 1 (26:55):
State makes too many mistakes and they overcome a lot
of mistakes because they've gotthe talent team.

Speaker 2 (27:02):
Notre Dame only won by three.

Speaker 1 (27:07):
Again, it's my opinion.
I think that they are, to me, amore balanced team.
We'll see how it shakes out.
It's going to be a good game.
I will say that I think it'llbe a good game.
It's not one of these where Ithink Ohio State's going to be a
good game.
I will say that I think it'llbe a good game.
It's not one of these where Ithink Ohio State's going to come
out and blow the tops off onNotre Dame.
Notre Dame's not going to letthat happen, and you know Notre

(27:30):
Dame's, they've got a lot ofgood players.
Their only weakness is thequarterback can be a little
sketchy at times, but again,that's because they've utilized
the portal the last two yearsand brought an ACC quarterback
to Notre Dame, and so they hadHartman last year, but they

(27:52):
surrounded him with a team thatall they needed was a guy that
can manage it, and he managed it, and that's the same thing
they've done this year.

Speaker 2 (28:01):
And there's nothing wrong with that.
Again, we're not saying don'tuse the portal, do it.
Here's my problem.
I don't know if it's a problem,but I think it's going to.
Now, marcus Freeman is about tointerview for the Chicago Bears
job.
What do you do?
Do you leave Notre Dame to goto Chicago?

(28:25):
You know what I mean.
That's going to be differentand everybody's like well, you
know these.
You know these players aremaking millions of dollars.
Nobody's going to listen to itthere.
A lot of these players that hehas in Notre Dame are making
millions of dollars.
So it's, it's not like ithasn't changed, right?
Uh, and again, we also talkabout that.
You know where that all ofthese players are making money.
A lot of these players are not.

Speaker 1 (28:47):
Right, there's only a handful that make a lot of
money.

Speaker 2 (28:49):
It's only a handful that are making the money, and
the other ones are just there.
They're on scholarship, ontheir loan or they're playing
whatever.
So I don't know.

Speaker 1 (29:01):
Yeah, so we got talking about how how bryce
young um kind of had aresurgence after getting benched
earlier this year.
He needed to sit and wait, uh.
And then of course you've hadyour cj strouds um from last
year that came in at the sametime and was was better off the
bat.
You know everybody's.
Everybody was like oh, panthersmade a horrible mistake, they

(29:22):
should have got CJ Stroud.
I was one of them.

Speaker 2 (29:24):
I thought CJ Stroud was a better quarterback, so did
.

Speaker 1 (29:26):
I and maybe he still is.
But you know, some of theseguys coming out they just need
some time and that's somethingthat they don't have anymore.
And it seems like I mean I wastrying to look back at see kind
of where that started.

(29:46):
I mean it was early 2000s, Ithink, is where it really
started after um.
I think it really started whenthey went to uh right after the
sam bradford deal, because sambradford was the last guy to
like get drafted, get 50 milliondollars and not work out.
People were like, okay, we gotto have a quarterback structure,
a salary structure going inlevels to start with, and these

(30:09):
rookie deals began so that theyweren't having to pay a guy $50
million.

Speaker 2 (30:13):
I feel bad, though, for Sam Bradford, because Sam
Bradford was injury prone tooTrue.

Speaker 1 (30:18):
A lot of injuries.
That offensive line was shit,but he didn't deserve.
At was shit, but he didn'tdeserve at that time.
He didn't deserve a 50 million,50 million dollar contract that
would be like.
That would be like draftingbryce young number one and
giving him a 350 million dollarcontract to start like he hasn't
even done anything, because 50million dollars back then was

(30:40):
that's a lot of money.
50 is now yeah, um, from thatstandpoint, because it was 50
million over a few years.
So that's what started it andwe started the conversation.
You know about some of the guysthat have sat, like jordan love
with green bay.
You know he sat behind aaronrogers for a few years and
everybody questioned green baylike what are they doing?

(31:00):
They?
They drafted this guy.
Why are they not playing him?
Is he not any good?
Right, right, they knew he wasgood and it was cheap enough to
keep him on the bench becausethey weren't paying him.
And that's the whole issue inthe media is you got some of the
media saying you need to playhim while he's cheap and the
other saying you need to sit himwhile he's cheap.

(31:20):
We need to play him while he'scheap and the other saying you
need to sit him while he's cheap.

Speaker 2 (31:23):
We need to play now.
We need to now.
We want it now.
We want it now.
We're in that society where wewant it right away.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
Right, Because the fan base wants to see the
immediate result of this topdraft pick that's supposed to be
so great.
One top draft picks, we allknow, go to the worst teams.
Two, they're probably the worstteam because of the coaching,
and now the coach is trying tosurvive on a player that's
supposed to come in and doeverything for them and some of
these guys are just not ready.

(31:49):
I mean.
But it depends again and someof this will change too with
what we just talked about howlong do they stay in college?
Are they 21, 22 coming out ofcollege?
Are they 23, four or fivecoming out of college?
You?

Speaker 2 (32:00):
took 4 or 5 coming out of college.
That's and I was just you.
You took my point becausethat's what I was going to talk
about like, are they developingin college, right?
If you have someone that's gotthere's only spent two years in
college and only really play thelast year, bro, you gotta sit
down exactly and you gotta learn.
But you have someone like bonicks, right, who went to auburn
, then went to Oregon, right,and spent a couple of years

(32:23):
developing in different systemsand you know he has shown that
he's been successful right now.
Now we'll see, because you knowthere's always that that second
year slump that you know wetalk about.
But we'll see if it, if it,pans out.

Speaker 1 (32:40):
Right, and a lot of times that slump comes because
they get the tape on you andthey start figuring out your
tendencies, because that's theirjob, that's all they do is to
figure out how to stop you.
But you're right.
I mean Bo Nix had over 60 gamesunder his belt in college.
I mean that's like three.

Speaker 2 (32:57):
I was going to say Duke got married.

Speaker 1 (33:00):
Yeah, it's like three NFL seasons worth of games.
It's like he's coming into theleague in his fourth year now,
kind of thing.
So, that being said, I was kindof looking back and trying to
find out who was where and whostarted when, and so forth and
so on.
So just to rattle off a few.

(33:20):
So these are some of thequarterbacks, and this list goes
back to like 1920.
Oh wow, 19 or 20 years to 2000.

Speaker 2 (33:30):
Oh, okay, okay okay.

Speaker 1 (33:33):
So these are the quarterbacks that have come in
first round and started rightaway Joe Burrow, kyler Murray,
jameis, winston, andrew Luck,cam Newton.
Right away, joe burrow, kylermurray, jamis winston, andrew
luck, cam newton, sam bradford,stafford david carr, carson
wentz, mariotta rg3, darnoldmatt, ryan mark sanchez, ryan

(33:53):
tannyhill, ej manual, joe flacco.
But then you get down here.
You got kyle Bowler, brandonWhedon, I mean Deshaun Kaiser,
one of your.
Well, you've already said twoof them yeah, quincy Carter,
mike Glennon, russell Wilson,kyle Orton, winky, dak Prescott.

(34:15):
Those guys all started rightaway first week.
So these guys didn't.
They didn't start the firstweek, but sometime in the second
, through eighth week they camein.
You got Joey Harrington, danielJones, Blaine Gabbert, ben
Roethlisberger, jimmy Claussen,baker Mayfield, bortles, vince
Young, byron Leftwich, JoshRosen, teddy Bridgewater.

(34:39):
We all had 40 quarterbacks.
You're going to have a few onthis list.
Some of these guys, guys, Idon't even remember Trent
Edwards, trubisky Leinart, coltMcCoy, tua, christian Ponder,
josh Freeman, josh Allen, justinHerbert, deshaun Watson.
You know some of these guys.

(35:01):
I mean, I remember Josh Freemanwas like a thing and then he
wasn't.
Um.
So then, then you've got thoseguys that started the second
half of the season right DwayneHaskins, jared Goff, eli Manning
, jason Campbell, nick Foles,alex Smith, cutler, drew Locke,
charlie Fryts, derek Anderson,patrick Ramsey Tavares, jackson

(35:23):
Jamarcus Russell I mean, thoseare all guys that started at
some point in the first seasonthat they were a pro Talk about
a major boss dog JamarcusRussell.

Speaker 2 (35:35):
Yeah, I mean, how many names out of that are
seriously legit quarterbacks.

Speaker 1 (35:42):
I mean you've got.
Stafford is a long time.
Roethlisberger uh, you knowsome of these we don't know
about yet.
Cam newton worked out.
I mean you might have had threeor four guys totals out of all
those names, but then then thisis where it jumps.
So you got these.
These are the guys that startedin year two that sat a whole

(36:03):
one year Carson Palmer, MichaelVick, Jake Locker, Pat Mahomes,
JP Lossman, Drew Brees, SimeonJacoby, Brissett, Mark Bolger,
Tim Tebow, Tom Brady, ChadHenney, Chris Sims, Brady Quinn,

(36:23):
Colin Kaepernick, Josh McCownYou're seeing it.
After that one full year ofsitting, you're seeing a better
level of guys a little more.

Speaker 2 (36:31):
The percentage gets better for success Right.

Speaker 1 (36:36):
There's only three guys on this list that started
year three, that sat for twoyears and didn't start till year
three Phillip Rivers, tony Romoand Chad Pennington.
And then you get to year four.
It only goes to people thatstarted after their fourth plus
year Rex Grossman, aaron Rodgers, matt Schaub, kirk Cousins,

(36:58):
matt Castle, garoppolo Osweiler,david Gerrard.
So those are all in the last 24years, first round quarterbacks
that started either week one,first half, second half, or year
two, three or four.

Speaker 2 (37:12):
So year two and year three really is the sweet spot.

Speaker 1 (37:16):
The sweet spot, because if you haven't started
until year four, then what'swrong reason?
Maybe that you're not andsomebody eventually takes a shot
, because there's still a coupleof good ones there.
But two and three, like you getthat second, third year in.
That's when you should be ableto take it over the rack.

Speaker 2 (37:32):
That curve right.
There is like okay, two, three,four, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (37:36):
At that point you're back up yeah, and I get it when
they want to start this guy.
We've got to find out what hecan do.
Put him out there, he's notcosting us anything.
But again, what if they gave upon Bryce Young after last year?
They're like, oh, this guy's abust, we're just going to cut

(37:57):
our losses and he goes somewhereelse and he gets into that
second and third year now withanother team, a la sam darnold.
Look at what sam darnold's donethis year.
I mean he was seeing ghosts afew years ago with a horrible
jets team.
That's still horrible.
You know he took a pit stop incarolina.
He took a pit stop in sanfrancisco and I mean we've even

(38:19):
joked about this.
Him and Baker Mayfield madethat Carolina pit stop.
They made the California pitstop, one in San Francisco, one
in LA, and now look at whatthey're doing.
I mean, obviously Baker's beenin there a little bit longer
than Darnold, but still, someguys just need time and they
need the right system.

Speaker 2 (38:39):
So I'll be the first one to say dude, I hated Baker
Mayfield Absolutely andCleveland, I hated Baker
Mayfield Absolutely In Cleveland, fucking hated him.
Right, he played like shit andthe problem is he came in with
this cockiness but then didn'tback up.
What was going on.
Right, if you were to just, youknow all right, humble yourself

(39:00):
a little bit.
I think that's what happened.
Right, he was humbled by beingsent to Carolina.
No offense, I know that's yourteam, but you know what I mean.
But he was Right.
He was like we're trading youto Carolina because we don't
think you're that good.
He had to take a step back andbe like shit.
If I don't get it together, I'mout, out of the league.
You know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (39:22):
He was on the road to being the next Johnny Manziel,
right behind him 100% Because hecame in.
He wasn't quite as crazy outthere with the ego as Manziel,
but he wasn't far behind Yep andhe's figured it out while he's
still in the league.
I think Manziel's figuring itout now that he's no longer in
the league.
But that's his fault and got hisstuff together personally, but

(39:44):
yeah, I mean, it's just one ofthose things that's like, okay,
you've got to live and learn.
I mean, imagine giving theseguys at 21, 22, you know,
millions and millions of dollars, nothing but time on their
hands, no structure as far aslike classes and stuff.
Not that they necessarily wentto classes, but college life was

(40:05):
a little more structured insome ways.

Speaker 2 (40:07):
And I think there was also a maturity level.
I think that's what we'retalking about, right, it goes
back to the conversation that wewere just having with college
football.
Right Now you're having theseguys are coming in at 23, 24, 25
.
All right, now we have a littlebit more maturity and, um,
they're, they're able to handlemore things.

(40:27):
You know as an adult johnnymanziel.
Let's be honest, that dude wasirresponsible.
He was childish.
That he was.
There was no talking to him, hewould not listen, he would not
read the playbook, none of that.
That Right, and it showed.
Yeah, if he would have justapplied, he could have been
special.

(40:47):
He could have been that DrewBrees player, he could have been
that Pat Mahomes, but he didn'tbecause he didn't want to.
Could no one tell him?

Speaker 1 (40:55):
Right.

Speaker 2 (40:56):
He just wanted to party.

Speaker 1 (40:57):
Have a good time.
I got plenty of money.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
Go to Vegas party, have a good time.
I got plenty of money go tovegas, have.
Just he wanted to live the thebig life well, and the funny
thing is he comes from oil money.
Right, right, you know what Imean.
So like it, just it was right.

Speaker 1 (41:11):
In between the ears, yeah, and that's what really
pissed me off yeah, and and someof these kids, you know they
come out and they are prettymature because they've again, it
goes back to a lot of times,goes back to your upbringing.
You know, I don't knowpersonally, but if you're if
you're Manziel and you're aspoiled brat more balanced, then

(41:32):
you're going to have more ofthat maturity coming out of
college because your family gaveyou some of that maturity.
I mean, it's all upbringing andwho you surround yourself with.

(41:54):
And that's one of the things Iwas hearing about Bryce Young.
Again, like I said, I wasn'tsure what we were doing at the
beginning of the year playinghim.
I'm like I just don't knowabout this guy.
I was happy when he was benchedbecause he wasn't doing
anything good, but I was alsothe same guy that was happy when
he came back and was becomingsuccessful and he changed my

(42:16):
opinion of him which is thereason this whole conversation
we're having now came about wastalking about that and the fact
that he has this cool calmnessabout him.
And everybody said he had thatat Alabama.
Well, he had it at Alabamabecause he didn't have to do as
much at Alabama.
He had such a powerhouse teamaround him, right, all he had to

(42:38):
do was manage it, so it waseasy to have it.
Then when you come to the NFLand it's all on your shoulders
and you don't have thatpowerhouse team around you.

Speaker 2 (42:47):
In college.
They fed him that informationright Because he didn't have to
go through all that.
But now you're in the NFL andit's like oh boy.

Speaker 1 (42:56):
As a fan, I'm happy to see he's starting to make
progress here, if he can justkeep the owner out of the way,
we'll be all right.
Well, that's a whole differentconversation.
We can talk about ownership,and then that is going to be oh,
boy, because you and I bothhave terrible owners, but right
now our teams are in twodifferent directions.

Speaker 2 (43:20):
Despite that, my team has the number two overall pick
, which, by the way, they'resaying it's a lock, call it.
They're getting a quarterbackbecause of the Sean Watson.
Yeah, let's leave it at thatbecause I'm going to go.
I'm going to go on a differenttangent and we got to move on.
You know, I love this onebecause this is a good segue of
what we know our uh.

(43:41):
Our final uh topic here that youand me were talking about here
is dysfunctional teams.
They are dysfunctional becauseof they have a lot of good
players to have a really goodhead coach.
I really am a fan of uhstephansky.
Right, I am andrew barry's agood gm.
I'm a fan of gm.
You know a lot of people theythey have they disagree with.

(44:02):
What a lot of the stuff thathe's done.
The one thing that I'm finallyhappy that it is it is done.
The experiment is done.
Deep odessa is done.
In cleveland he's gone, no more,right, he was always working
remote.
He wasn't even even cleveland,right?
He never really living incleveland.
He was always in california,which really pissed me the hell
off.
Right, you're helping me doyour job, right, and you live in

(44:25):
California, all right.
So that's that the DeshaunWatson.
And before anybody saysanything and I'll say this
because a lot of people aregiving the Cleveland Browns a
lot of shit for this there werea lot of teams that were lined
up to sign up to get to seanwatson yeah, cleveland was

(44:46):
actually not the team that hewanted to go to and was not
really leading candidate to gethim nope, they were actually out
of the uh the contention theywere.

Speaker 1 (44:57):
They were actually told they were out of it, and I
don't even remember who theother teams were.

Speaker 2 (45:02):
Atlanta was going to be the one that they were going
to go to.
He was going to choose.
He was going to choose Atlanta.

Speaker 1 (45:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (45:10):
Which in retrospect.

Speaker 1 (45:12):
I wish he would have.
Well, yeah, I mean, who knowswhere Atlanta would be?
But yeah, I think everybody wasshocked with Cleveland and the
problem was, again, your ownergave him a guarantee that none
of the other teams were willingto give him as far as the total
amount.

Speaker 2 (45:29):
And they shouldn't have.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
They were all wanting to give him the same amount of
money.
I think they were actuallyoffering him more money in
Atlanta than the 230.
They just weren't guaranteeingit.

Speaker 2 (45:38):
They shouldn't have.
And, by the way, he actuallymight lose the last two years of
his contract because he's anidiot, you're eight weeks out,
you're supposed to wear it for10 weeks.
You don't wear your boot.
You're.
You make a tiktok video indecember while your team is
playing, getting their asseshanded to them, and you're
playing.

Speaker 1 (45:55):
You're doing tiktok videos in miami which, like you
said, what are you doing in mi,miami, when your team's still
playing anyway?
So why are you on vacation?
Because you're injured.
And, like I said, you and I hadthe conversation.
This is not the Deshaun Watsonthat I remember from school,
from Clemson, that I rooted for.
I'm not sure where his choiceschanged, other than they were in

(46:21):
Houston is where they were, butI mean, I just don't know at
what point in his life hestopped being the guy that he
was, or at least he appeared tobe, I should say when he was in
school.
And again, this kid could havebeen a hall of fame quarterback.
He had the talent to be that,he had the whole setup to be
that.
A Hall of Fame quarterback, hehad the talent to be that, he

(46:43):
had the whole setup to be that.

Speaker 2 (46:44):
And then it just poof .
The city of Cleveland gave youthe keys to the city.
I mean, they literally justopened up their arms.
They're like all you had to dowas come in and win.

Speaker 1 (46:54):
That was as fresh a start as you could get from the
turmoil.
He was in with all the lawsuitsand everything.
You got a team that's willingto just give you all this money.
All you got to do is just comein and keep your nose clean and
play football.

Speaker 2 (47:07):
And you couldn't even do that, couldn't even do that
Unreal.
So, all right, let's move on toanother team that we have here
and is the New York footballgiants.

Speaker 1 (47:17):
That's just a management nightmare right there
.
You know, it's like we wetalked about.
I mean, teams don't like to goon hard knocks.
And then you go on hard knocksand you have edit control and
you don't edit out aconversation that was filmed,
with you basically letting thebest player you had walk away so

(47:39):
that you could pay another guymore money than he deserves you
paid the wrong player yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a level of.

Speaker 2 (47:48):
By the way, both those players are no longer with
the team right, yeah, I meanthe guy.

Speaker 1 (47:54):
You let the one guy walk that should have never
walked and you paid the otherguy and he just didn't.
He didn't earn, he wasn't worthit because he shouldn't be
giving it to begin with.

Speaker 2 (48:04):
That's the whole thing.
It's like you got, you gaveDaniels all that money and then
you go in that same year thatyou let Barkley go to
Philadelphia, which, by the way,I mean talk about just like
he's still within your division,and that's the other thing.
Yeah, in the division too.

Speaker 1 (48:24):
It wasn't even that you let him go somewhere else.
You let him go to the samedivision.

Speaker 2 (48:29):
Well, in the general manager he was such a cocky dude
so I was like, yeah, he's notgoing to get anything and I was
like, yeah, go ahead, Find out,figure out.
He sure did out, figure out,yeah, he sure did.
The two players that havereally made their, their, their

(48:51):
opportunity?

Speaker 1 (48:52):
uh, is him and henry.
Oh yeah, yeah, I mean I.
I mean I get that tennessee wasmaybe trying to start over a
little bit.
They didn't want to pay thatmoney.
But I mean, tennessee, derekHenry is all you had.
I mean, if you'd have kept him,maybe Will Levis looks like a
better quarterback and he's gota running back to help take the
pressure off.

Speaker 2 (49:10):
Who knows, I was just thinking the same thing.

Speaker 1 (49:12):
It's like the fact that the NFL has undervalued the
running backs.
Back to Le'Veon Bell.
It started there.
Le'veon Bell thought he wasworth $14 million and Steelers
were like no, you're not Forgiveme for saying this, piss away
$60 million on a quarterback,but they won't give a running
back $14 million.
That's like a friend of mineused to say you're tripping over

(49:34):
dollars to pick up dimes.
It's like what are you doing?
Pay the running back $.
Yep, you know.
It's like what are you doing?
Like, oh God, pay the runningback 14 million and then make
the quarterback work and youkeep the running back happy.
Like how is that?
I don't understand how youcan't fit a $14 million contract
for running back in a salarygap.

Speaker 2 (49:56):
And not only that, but, like everybody and their
mother saw that Daniels was notthe right quarterback for the
Giants.
Everybody saw it, everybody sawit.
But you're playing withanalytics and you're playing
with, you know, thinking they'llsay well, the running back is
not, we can just plug in anyrunning back in that position

(50:17):
and they'll be fine, there'll beno issues Right Forgetting that
you have one of the best, mostpremier running backs in all of
NFL, yep, in all professionalfootball.
And not only that, you looklike an ass that when he's
breaking records and he isgetting those incentives, and
all of that because, boom, youlet him go, yeah, and now you

(50:42):
have nothing to show for.

Speaker 1 (50:44):
Yeah, because you thought nobody's going to give
him that kind of money.
It's like that just shows youhad, no, no real evaluation of
your own talent at that point,because you should have been
like, hey man, there's somebodywho's going to pay this guy and
we better not let him walk.
But yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:00):
So you know, we and we talk about this,
functionality and all that, butthere's one team that takes the
cake when it comes todysfunction.
There's one team that as bad asthe Browns and as bad as the
New York Giants are.
There's one team that is justabove all of that.
They said hold my beer, hold myliquor.

(51:21):
We will be that team, and thatis the New York Jets and the.

Speaker 1 (51:26):
Jets.
I give them credit.
They tried.
They were like, okay, we'regoing to go out, we're going to
get Aaron Rodgers.
Aaron Rodgers is a greatquarterback, he's a Hall of Fame
quarterback.
We're going to go get him, andthen it just does not work.

Speaker 2 (51:41):
Here's my thing, though, and you know how I feel
about him.
Yeah, oh, yeah.
So Aaron Rodgers, the last yearand a half, two years in Green
Bay, he was diminishing intalent.
Yeah, he was also becoming moreof a cancer.
He was more of a cancer andmore of a distraction that he

(52:03):
was to help with the team.

Speaker 1 (52:08):
I think what the Jets saw, though, was the Jets saw
that they didn't have aquarterback because they had
drafted Darnold.
They drafted these otherquarterbacks that weren't
working out.
It was like, okay, we've gotthese receivers, they have these
other skilled position guysthat are young.

(52:28):
Let's go get a veteranquarterback.
That may be diminishing, thatmay be, with whatever weird
personal issues he deals with.
He's still Aaron Rodgers.
He comes to New York, he's gotthe limelight.
Maybe it'll'll click.
They're trying to catchlightning in a bottle, is what?
And who knows, maybe if hedoesn't go down in that first

(52:52):
game with the achilles issue,maybe this is a whole other
story from last year.
But he has the injury and thenhow he handles the injury and
the rehab and the whole, justthe whole logistics of that
Everybody, even his ownteammates, were like rolling

(53:14):
their eyes, just like you didand I get it.
I mean I did too.
It's like what, what is thisguy's bit deal here?
Like what is he doing?

Speaker 2 (53:26):
And he was to be the smartest person in the room.

Speaker 1 (53:30):
And he always has tried to be that and he's not.
He's not that at all.
The thing is, he got away withit more before because he was
winning, but he was on anorganization that gave him what
he needed to win Yep.

Speaker 2 (53:45):
And he was great.
He'll end up going into theHall of Fame Like listen, I'll
even admit that like, right, yougot to take the person, put the
person aside and then take alook at the skill set and
everything that he's been ableto do.
He was a great quarterback.
Right, he's no longer thatquarterback because he's a
40-year-old quarterback thatcannot throw the ball the way he
wants it, and that's what madehim so successful.

(54:07):
Here's the thing.
The problem is with AaronRodgers.
You cannot divide that becauseof he brings that person into
the locker room.
He does so much bullshit whenhe's blaming coaches, he's
blaming players, but he's nevertaken accountability for his own

(54:29):
actions accountability for hisown actions.

Speaker 1 (54:32):
Right he's, if he would have just been like if he
had just taken it all on himselfperiod, whether he liked it or
not.
But he's just not going to dothat.
His personality will not allowhim.
And you know all the I.
You know I could care less whatyou do in the off season, what
your, your personal beliefs andpersonal lifestyle is like.

(54:55):
If you're my quarterback, Ijust want you to win, but I also
don't want you to bring thatcrap to work either 100% Once
the season starts.
It better be about football,not all this other mess.
Not about you going into a darkroom and then getting inoculated
the fuck not all this othermess, not about you going into a
dark room and and then you knowif it works if it works for you

(55:18):
, that's fine, and if it, if ithelps us win games, I could care
less.
But the the fact that you youput it in everybody's face that
it's better and you're betterthan them because of it.
That's where you start rubbingeverybody the wrong way who's
gonna want him now?
who's gonna want exactly I, I.
And the thing is, I think Ithink he wanted to prove that if

(55:44):
tom brady could do it, he coulddo it.
I think that has something todo with it in my mind.
I think that's how he saw somethings like hey look, tom did
this, I and I'm as good orbetter quarterback than he is.
He's not you're not.

Speaker 2 (55:58):
Let's be honest, he's not.
What tom brady has is wellaaron rudge will never have.
You know what I mean.
Tom brady was actually a reallysmart quarterback yeah, 100
he's a smart person, person.

Speaker 1 (56:12):
But Tom wanted to work at everything, yep, and he
held the expectation to theother guys above and beyond
anything else.
And those guys I mean it's evensaid people came to New England
to play with Tom, not forBelichick.
So that says all you need toknow, right there, people, and

(56:36):
let's not take anything awayfrom belichick, because
belichick is a great head coach.

Speaker 2 (56:39):
he's going to go into the hall of fame.
And now I'm really intrigued onwhat he's going to do with
north carolina, but that's adifferent topic, right, but like
it's like I'm so intrigued bythat, yeah, um, but aaron, right
again.
And then, and then know, andlet's take a look at the
ownership side of things, right.
Then you know, because AaronRodgers is not happy, you want
you fire your head coach.

(57:00):
Right, he wasn't the reasonthat the team was bad.
All right, if anything, thedefense got worse as soon as he
got fired.

Speaker 1 (57:11):
I think the defense gave up on the team and the
ownership because they fired him.
I think they supported Sala.
They liked him as a head coachbecause he was one of their guys
.
He was a defensive minded guy.
I just think they just saidwe're going to stick it to
ownership here for firing thisguy.

(57:31):
You're right, sala wasn't theproblem.
He may not be the best coacheither, but they weren't giving
him the best tools to work with.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
Then you get why we see her saying that if Aaron
Rodgers comes back, they wantout.
Like when you see that in thenews, like you're Aaron Rodgers,
you're sitting and you'rehearing this and you're like
like, how do you not think toyourself like shit, am I the
problem?

Speaker 1 (57:59):
Right now, if you're Aaron Rodgers, you're like well,
those guys are idiots.

Speaker 2 (58:04):
I thought you know who I am.

Speaker 1 (58:06):
Yeah exactly.

Speaker 2 (58:08):
And you go on, pat McAfee, and you're talking all
this shit and you're callingpeople out, and then, on top of
that, you call people out andthen you don't have the receipts
to back it up.
That's my issue with AaronRodgers.
It's just that he talks so muchshit and never backs it up.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
Well, and the thing that two of these three teams
have in common is bad ownership.

Speaker 2 (58:32):
The Giants have great ownership.
In my opinion, they've alwaysbeen bad ownership.

Speaker 1 (58:34):
Oh God, yeah, the Giants have great ownership.
In my opinion, They've alwaysbeen great ownership.
I just don't know if they'vehired the right people to run
the football side for themlately.

Speaker 2 (58:45):
I'll give the Giants credit.
When that news came out, wherewhen he went for Philly right,
he made a commercial.
Saquon Barkley, when he madethat commercial about losing
sleep and all that Right, deonawas like I'm actually upset.
You didn't call me.
You know we could have playedon this whole losing sleep.
I've definitely lost some sleepbecause of this Right.

(59:08):
You know also, like I mean hewas he.
He knew right that there was amistake.
At least he knew there was amistake.
But the problem is he did notget rid of the mistake.
The person who made the mistake, he kept them.

Speaker 1 (59:20):
Yeah, and that that's where that that's where their
dysfunctionality comes into playis.
You're traditionally one of thebest ownership groups there is.
People know your name onlybecause you've owned the team
forever and ever, not becauseyou meddle.
And now they know you becauseyou screwed up and didn't get

(59:43):
rid of a guy that screwed yourwhole organization up.

Speaker 2 (59:47):
Right.
And now you're oh God, that'sso bad.
Right, Because you have ownerslike the Haslam's in Cleveland
who need to be in the know, theyneed to be making the decisions
.
They're the ones who draftedJohnny Manziel.
They're the ones who draftedBaker Mayfield ahead of Josh

(01:00:07):
Allen.
Right, I was like man, weshould be drafting Josh Allen,
Josh Allen during that time.
He would have fit perfectly inthat system.
But no, the ownership wantedthat flashy player, that cocky
player, and look what it got himhe's in Tampa.
Granted, they just lost theplayoffs, right, but still.

(01:00:32):
They're in the playoffs stillcleveland browns are on vacation
, right, looking for aquarterback, looking for an
offensive coordinator, lookingfor an offensive line.
Uh, coach, and what really,really irks me and sorry guys, I
do apologize, but I know it'sbrown state parlor the fact that
, like Buffalo Bills told themabout their OC and exactly what

(01:00:55):
the issue was, and the Brownsstill hired him.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
What the hell.

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
Exactly.
Look what happened to Buffaloas soon as they fired him and
they got rid of him.

Speaker 1 (01:01:04):
They got better.

Speaker 2 (01:01:06):
Exactly, yeah.
So you know what it was funnythe Carolina Panthers are not
here, Even though they have apretty bad owner.
The Carolina Panthers are noton this dysfunctional.
If we're due, top five, maybe,but you know we've got to give
top four to the Tennessee Titans.
They are on it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:26):
I think, and I don't know if the owner made a
conscious decision.
And I don't know if the ownermade a conscious decision.
Tepper, that is to not be asinvolved, or maybe he is as
involved.
I don't know what the rightword is, but last year, with

(01:01:46):
hiring Frank and then changingcoaches and this, that and the
other, he was overly involved.
He was in the news for thewrong reasons he didn't get
frank.

Speaker 2 (01:01:54):
That uh a chance either right.

Speaker 1 (01:01:58):
So this year he brings in canalis and he's like
a ghost.
Now, like you, don't see orhear from him, which is a good
thing.
I'm not complaining, I don'tknow if he made the
conscientious decision, or if itwas a thing where where canalis
was like I gotta run the teamand and he agreed to it.

(01:02:19):
I don't know, leave me the fuckalone.

Speaker 2 (01:02:21):
Whatever it is, it's working and I'm happy that it's
working yep, I agree so, andthen you know we'll have you and
me, we'll sit down again, we'lltalk uh draft.
But you know, as of right nowyou're looking at the giantsants
number one, tennessee Titans.
Number two, cleveland Browns.
Number three, the Raiders.
Number four, anotherdysfunctional team, the New
England Patriots.

(01:02:41):
Number five, then Jaguars,saints, panthers, chicago and
New York Jets.

Speaker 1 (01:02:47):
See, I think a lot of what's going to happen in the
draft will get clearer once someof these teams have our coach,
and again, we'll get into thisas we get closer to the draft.
But I think Vrabel is a greathire for the Patriots yes.
And then again, news today whichwill be old news by the time
this hits the airwaves is MikeMcCarthy's out in Dallas and

(01:03:14):
we'll see where he goes.
I mean, it's one of thosethings like they didn't want
anybody else to talk to him,which was their right, because
they had exclusivity tonegotiate a new contract with
him.
I think he went in and heeither asked for more money or
more control than Jerry wantedto give him, knowing that if he

(01:03:34):
asked for more control he wasgoing to get fired.
He was going to be out.
More so than Jerry will givehim money.

Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
He's not giving him control, that's another bad
owner right there, like from theentertainment side.
Great owner, entertainment,awesome Football.

Speaker 1 (01:03:50):
Yeah, I mean he's been bad again.
Like he said, it's his money,it's his team and he wants to
run it the way he wants to runit.
Fine, but when you're this badfor this many years, I mean the
last time they won a Super Bowl,I was three years away from
being a dad, my son's 28 yearsold.
I mean oh good.

Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
Well, my team has never won the Super Bowl.
They're the only team thatnever hosted or ever played in a
Super Bowl we could have awhole show on NFL owners.
Oh god, we could becausethere's so many bad ones.
Maybe we should bring that onduring the DHC sports show,
maybe, so yeah that'd be a goodtopic to hit on there a little
bit too.

Speaker 1 (01:04:33):
But yeah, where these coaches land, who gets hired?
Yeah, that'd be a good topic tohit on there a little bit too.
Yep, but yeah, where thesecoaches land, who gets hired?
That's going to start dictatinga few of the things, because
it's not a great draft, no, andthere's so many teams that have
needs that they're not going tobe able to fill with the draft,
so it's going to be interestingto see what players start
changing teams too.
Who gets protected, who doesn't?

Speaker 2 (01:04:52):
Correct.
My friend.
This has been a goodconversation.
I love it.
Thank you for doing this withme.
We'll be doing this more often.
We'll.
I'm sure we'll figure somethings out that we can disagree
on, but I want to make sure acouple of things before we we
get going.
Guys, make sure that you guysare following on on Instagram

(01:05:13):
Threads, blue Sky, even Twitter.
Make sure you go to the YouTubechannel so that way you guys
hit the subscribe button andlike the show, because and I say
this because that's where weare also showing the DHC Sports
Show right, we do it everyTuesday, every Thursday, 9 pm,
eastern time.
We talk about all sorts ofsports.
Apparently, there's a listgoing on a bracket that will be

(01:05:37):
coming out soon of the thingsthat Ed hates yes, some of the
things that I hate when it comesto sports Some people, some
players, some teams.
You got to tune in to listen toLots of options there's at
least.
we went past the NCAA collegefootball playoffs and we went

(01:05:58):
straight to the NCAA collegebasketball playoffs because
there's that many.
So there's already some teams,some regions that have been
named.
So there's that.
But again, guys, thank you somuch for joining us.
We will see you guys next timeand we'll you know if you guys
how about this, if you guys wantsome topics that we can discuss

(01:06:18):
, we'll talk about.
Let us know and then we willmost certainly talk about them.
We will see you guys in thenext one.
Hey, this has been a curvebreadmedia production.