August 4, 2024 • 33 mins
In this episode, we speak with Jacob, a young musical theatre performer, who shares his journey from a small dance school in Melbourne to starring in major shows like Mary Poppins and Groundhog Day.
Highlights:
- Jacob's early dance training in Melbourne and the pivotal moment when his first dance school shut down.
- The unexpected audition and subsequent casting in "Mary Poppins," which set a high standard for Jacob's future endeavors.
- The challenging yet transformative experience of being let go from "Moulin Rouge!" and how Jacob used that setback to fuel his determination.
- Transitioning from "Moulin Rouge!" to "Groundhog Day" in a matter of weeks and the valuable lessons learned along the way.
- The importance of maintaining routines and continually working on skills, even while performing professionally.
- Insights into the Australian musical theater scene and the mindset needed for long-term success.
What to Expect:
- Candid and motivational conversation with Jacob about his career journey.
- Behind-the-scenes anecdotes from his time in major musical productions.
- Practical advice for aspiring performers.
- Insights into maintaining routines and skill development.
- Encouragement for anyone pursuing their dreams in the performing arts.
- Valuable lessons learned from setbacks and triumphs in the industry.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Hello and welcome If you are new here.
I'm Taylor.
I'm the host of the DivePodcast.
I'm also a musical theatreperformer and I've been in the
industry for over 10 years.
Alongside that, I'm also a yogaand dance teacher and I'm the
creator and founder of the Dive,which is the fastest growing
support platform for musicaltheatre artists, both emerging
(00:37):
and professional.
Join us for conversations onmindset behind the scenes,
stories of professionals in theindustry and how you can
navigate the challenges that weface as artists.
Once a week, you'll have aprofessional guest come on the
show who we will interview, andevery second week you'll have me
as your podcast host, whereI'll be coming on and sharing
(00:57):
with you practical exercises andresources to help you on your
way to becoming a professionalin the industry.
Thank you so much for being on,jacob.
I'm so excited that you're hereand we actually lived together
for a little while back when.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
We did, we did Early this year.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Yeah, and you would have probably then seen a lot of
the behind the scenes of whatthe Dive podcast was, because I
was only creating it when wewere together.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
Yeah, built from the ground up literally in my little
office that we had in the toproom, always riding away, riding
away planning schedule.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Yeah, exactly, it's so good.
Yeah, well, it's awesome tohave you on.
We're such great friends and Igot to meet you on Mary Poppins,
which was just such an awesomeexperience to work together and
you've gone ahead and built thisbeautiful career for yourself
and it's just been kind of awhirlwind because it's only.
It has been Kind of onlyhappened in the past how many
(01:58):
years, like two, three years.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Yeah two, let's go a humble, two years.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
A humble two, yeah A two, yeah, a humble two yeah,
well, let's kind of start there.
Let's kind of give people apicture of what it's been like
for you, maybe a little bitabout where you're, where you
trained and kind of how you gotinto your first musical.
All right.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
So I'm 21 now.
I'm living in melbourne.
I grew up in Melbourne.
I grew up dancing in this tinydance school in Boronia, which
is like a suburb you knowBoronia, yeah, small suburb and
it was like not, it was not likewhere people went to make it
big.
Do you know what I mean when I?
(02:40):
I think I was in about yeareight or year nine that dance
school shut down and my mom andI we were like what are we going
to do?
And then the principal of thatdance school, she was like, well
, you know, jacob could bereally good.
I don't know how she said it,but she was basically like he
could be serious with this if hewanted to.
(03:00):
And I was like I did not care,I was like I just want to dance,
it's not that serious.
But then we were like, allright, let's do it.
And it was.
I went to May Downs School ofDance in the city and that was
like a huge thing for me, causeI was like, oh my gosh, the city
.
I'm going to have to drive withwhoever for 40 minutes to get
(03:22):
there, which is crazy now,because like I go to the city
all the time.
And then so I went there and Iremember just the types of kids
that were there.
This was during like Matildaand School of Rock, and then I'd
make friends and then I'd belike, oh, where's like, where's
Tiana?
And they're like, oh, she'sdoing Matilda today, so she kind
(03:43):
of come to dance and I was like, oh my gosh, this is crazy.
Like all these kids my age werelike already there you know
Doing the thing.
And yeah, and it was, I think itwas that that kind of was like
kind of made me feel like ifthey can do it, I can do it.
And then so after that, afterthat, I did that until year 12
(04:05):
and then in year 12 I auditionedfor all the the schools and I
got into music theater at vcoand then so I planned to do the
three years there and then in myfirst year I got it was a I
don't even know what you wouldcall it, it was super like not
(04:27):
official because there was noway to contact me I got a
message about auditioning forMary Poppins and I was like sure
, I was kind of like notthinking about that far ahead
until, like you know, I was inthe last year of full time and
then I'll start thinking aboutdoing stuff and I was like I'll
just do it for experience andlike to put myself out there.
(04:49):
And then it happened and thatwas like I thought I was riding
on a train to a destination anda boulder just came and smashed
the train off the rails.
It was literally, and I waslike, okay, this is crazy.
And then so, yeah, I did marrypoppins with you for however
long and that experience waslike such a great first
(05:13):
experience to have you know yeahlike, just have my level yeah,
level of expectation of how Ishould be treated great people
to be around.
The standard was just set atsuch a high bar for my first
experience, which is justsomething that I'm grateful for
forever, you know.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
So then, after that, I left to do Moulin Rouge, and I
did that for about three months.
That was a very challengingtime for the people that I mean,
like, should I talk about it orshould I not?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
You can absolutely talk about it if you wish.
I mean, I'm fine to talk aboutit.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
I think maybe it would be good to talk about.
So I got into that show.
I was supposed to be inUnderstudy, santiago and I was
in the ensemble T7, andrehearsed for four weeks and
then started doing shows likeone on one off because they
wanted to sort of ease me intoit.
And basically it just got tothis point where they were like
(06:18):
we have made a mistake withcasting you in this show and it
was like such a tough time likeit was like so confusing.
I remember when I found out Ilike I couldn't eat or speak.
I was just like what ishappening Surprisingly?
(06:41):
I was so resilient.
I was like great, let me tryeven harder, which is obviously
for a few days I was like wow,my life is whatever I thought it
was.
But then I just got back up andI was like I want the next
(07:01):
thing even more.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Even with that, because I was living with you at
this stage and a bit ofbackstory because I was there a
little bit of it, and it wasn'tthat you weren't trying, or I
think there was even some physiostuff to help you get stronger
and all different sorts.
There was all these avenues youwere taking and it just so
happened that the circumstancehappened where we weren't able
(07:23):
to fill that role in thecapacity that they once thought,
which is a shame on their part.
But also maybe, like you justsaid, you then used that as
power and fuel where a lot ofpeople would probably diminish
and really be upset with thosethings and stay there and maybe
not feel so good, really beupset with those things and stay
(07:47):
there and maybe not feel sogood.
But what made you feel likestrength and power to actually
continue and go ahead?
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Well, I remember in the official meeting I was like,
if we were going to do thisagain, what could I have done
differently?
And they were like honestly,nothing.
You did everything that weasked of you.
You put in the effort, which isit was a bit freeing actually,
because I was like, okay,although this is affecting me
(08:12):
directly, it is not because ofme.
I mean like it is because of me, but it wasn't because of
anything I could have donedifferent.
And then I think what empoweredme was, yeah, it's just this
feeling of I can be a victim,like I can sit and be a victim
(08:32):
and be like, oh my gosh, howcould this happen to me?
But it's not.
I feel like when I feel likethat, nothing happens, nothing
changes, which I am not a fan of.
So I was kind of like, even ifjust for a story, what an
amazing story for me to be likeat the bottom of how I'd ever
(08:56):
felt maybe in my life and thento bounce back into something I
didn't know when it was going tohappen, but to come back and
people be like no, people belike oh, that's Jacob.
He got let go or fired from ajob, but now look how he walks,
(09:17):
you can't even tell he's stillgrowing and energetic.
And I just thought wow, I knowwho I can be, so I'm going to
try.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Did you surprise yourself in that that you went
ahead and kind of just took thatand was like, right, use this
as a redirection, using it toyour strength.
Did you surprise yourself or doyou feel like that?
Maybe through your upbringingyou've already had that sort of
quality, so you had that from abase forever?
Speaker 1 (09:46):
just like loving a challenge, or like people saying
, oh no, you can't do it thisway, and then being I don't know
, I love the rebellion of likeI'm going to be the one to do it
, you know, which is like it canhelp but it also can hinder.
But yeah, in this situation itreally helped me.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Because then from there you ended up going on to
Groundhog Day right, which wasone of the most incredible
experiences for you.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
It honestly, would have had to be supernatural.
Like I auditioned for that show, I think, four weeks after I'd
been let go, so some time off.
But then four weeks Iauditioned for it and then a few
weeks later after that and Igot that and I was like what do
you mean?
Well, clearly it does happen,but I was like this could not
(10:38):
have come at a better time in,with everything that was going
on, and to bounce back intoanother show like a month and a
half after being set back andit's like that.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
That experience for you was obviously so good.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
I got to see you in it, which is awesome, and you
know, imagine if you were stillin moulin you probably wouldn't
have been able to do that rightyeah, and also if I had have
stayed in that show I would havejust kind of traveled along,
obviously learned some, but likehaving the drop but then the
win, like it's just the range ishuge yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Because in the moment it never feels like it's what
is meant to be.
You're like no, but then now,looking back at how it's all
panned out, can you now see,like, why things have happened
that way?
Speaker 1 (11:29):
I can, yeah, yeah, and even people close to me,
like my agent and my bestfriends and my mom and my family
, just being having likereinforcing that sort of idea of
like things that are meant tobe won't pass you by, that sort
of thing and like of coursethey're going to be crap times
(11:51):
but there will be things thatfeel and are right.
And also, I think, by thebiggest takeaway that I learned,
which is like crazy, is thatI'd much rather not get a job
because it isn't right for methan be put in a job.
Not get a job because it isn'tright for me, then be put in a
(12:12):
job that isn't right for me andit's just uncomfortable.
You can kind of tell whenyou're like, oh, I don't think
I'm right for this and thentrying to do it is like painful.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
It's almost like fitting a mold, that if you're a
triangle and you're trying toget through a square, it doesn't
work.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
It's just not enjoyable.
But then, doing Groundhog day,I was like, oh my gosh,
everything that I have inside meis already enough for this
character and I didn't have tolike change.
Not change who I was, butchange myself to be the thing
you know.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Yeah, what an experience Crazy.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
Crazy experience.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
So crazy and it's so good and like we were talking a
little bit earlier and we can gointo this now about you know
there was obviously maybe someroutines and things that helped
you in that progression.
And I mean, when you're gettinginto the industry so young and
so fresh, you know there's somuch growth happening and lots
of things to like take on board.
When you were like starting outinto your first year basically
(13:17):
of training and then all of asudden you're doing eight shows
a week.
What was that shift like foryou and what would you say like
you learned the most fromactually like being in the show?
Speaker 1 (13:29):
I think what I learned probably is that once
you get there, it's not the endof like learning, which was a
rude awakening.
I know there's this quote aboutlike when you get to the top of
the mountain, it's just thebottom of the next, which is, oh
my gosh, it was just a lot ofstaying on top of everything and
(13:53):
because I had left my full-timetwo years early.
I think the more I went on, themore I realized I needed to work
on my skills.
But when I first made thattransition I was like, well, I
need to practice.
And it's not.
I knew it wasn't good enoughfor me to just do the eight
(14:14):
shows because, like, once theshow's done, what am I left with
if not, if I haven't been likeworking those skills while I can
, while I've got the money,while I've got the time and
while I get to put it intopractice, it's like the best
time.
It was like the best situation.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Yeah it was so good to see you actually install that
as an individual, because it'sa big network like musicals here
in Australia and that we havesome fantastic like artists
coming to shows and new peopleand experienced people.
It's a whole mix mash ofdifferent people.
And there's one thing that Idefinitely will call out and if
(14:55):
people that are musical theatreperformers I definitely believe
we're all at a different journeyand whatnot but there is that
mindset that kind of comes in.
It's very easy to get into ashow and arrive like arrive in a
show and not continue thatskill development.
And there is times for that,for sure, because sometimes you
(15:16):
feel like you've done the workright, you've done all this work
to get into this thing, andthen you're here and you've made
it sort of you know vibe.
But the people that I've workedwith that have this longevity
you know Lisa Songtag comes tomind to different artists that I
really admire and look up to.
They're all people that don'tarrive.
They constantly are humbled bythe next work or what they can
(15:39):
improve on and they're bringingthat into that weekly life and
seeing that that was already athing for you, you kind of got
into the habit of that, probablywithout even knowing it, that
that's what you need to andbecause you were starting out
your training and you neededthat next extra step, but you
were able to actually go aheadand do it whilst in a show,
(16:00):
which then probably reinforcedthe importance of it yeah, and I
think also looking people inthat show specifically, that I I
was like oh my gosh, I thinkthey're top-notch performers.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
But people like Kim Hodgson, who I was like oh my
gosh, she's amazing and shealways oh, it just freaks me out
a bit.
I would ask her about what shedoes and even still, I don't
know how old she is, but she'sbeen doing it for a while and
she's like doing classes andit's that sort of thing that you
(16:36):
don't see.
I don't know if she's doingclasses, but what I know is that
when she turns up, she's doinga banging job of it.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
Yeah, and there's probably that misconception that
when you don't see it, becauseeverything's online now a lot of
the time, we think that thepeople are actively posting,
that they're in class, that thepeople that are working on it.
But I think there is such powerin not having to share, like
whilst you're still working awayon your skills.
I feel like there's a time andplace to share and making sure
(17:05):
that we're sharing authenticallyin a way that actually is
expressing us where we are now,what we have to offer in a place
.
That's fun.
But I do believe there is thathidden power of you're really
only as strong as what you'redoing when no one's watching, I
believe more than anything.
Yeah, succeeding in silence,yes, I think it's so attractive
(17:29):
and it's so more importantbecause it's really kind of like
the definition of discipline aswell.
That comes in.
It's a lifestyle, it's not aparty trick you know absolutely
well, we're talking aboutroutines, then, and maybe some
things that really helped youalong the way when you kind of
got in, because there's a lot ofpeople on here that are
aspiring performers that want todo the skills they want to work
(17:52):
on their skills, thatultimately, we all want to be in
a musical, we want to workprofessionally and we want to
have not only the gig but wewant to be able to stay there
and sustain it and buildlongevity.
We were just recently talkingabout routines and maybe some
things that have been helpingyou lately and the importance of
that, how you found that.
Would you love to speak alittle bit about that?
(18:13):
And maybe how performers canstart to create that for
themselves?
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yeah Well, I think it would be if I was thinking from
like the perspective of Ihadn't done any like big main
stage professional gigs.
I think it's about like aperspective change because what
I'm facing now is that I haven'thad this much free time ever
(18:38):
and so I'm having to work myroutine and figure out what
classes I need.
And I think it would be likehelpful to change your
perspective in the sense of,like the routine that you create
before you start working is aroutine you can always fall back
on in terms of likestrengthening skills you've
(19:00):
already got and also learningnew skills.
Basically, what I've been doingis ballet is my non-negotiable,
especially after like careerstuff that I've had.
I'm like I want to be strong, Iwant to prevent injury, all
that and just have thatdiscipline.
And then finding a singingteacher.
(19:21):
I listened to Jeff's episode.
I love him and he talking abouthaving a vocal coach and then
also a technical singing teacherand just someone to help you
stylistically and then someoneto help you technically.
And then finding your voice,finding what works for you so
that when auditions come up, youcan be like I know who I am
(19:45):
when I'm performing.
And I think this matches thatand I'm going to go in.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Yeah, just give it.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
Yeah, yeah, think this matches that, and I'm going
to go in.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
Yeah, just give it, yeah.
Yeah, it's so important and alot of the things that come up,
especially with auditions,because at the end of the day,
we're musical theatre performersand we're all auditioning all
the time.
You know the routines arereally what are going to save
you.
The things that you're doingweek in, week out are really.
I love the thing that you saidabout when you're in the show,
even if you're in the audition,having actual habits and things
(20:14):
that you can fall back on thatyou know are progressing you.
It's definitely going to allowus to not feel the rejection so
much or not feel the ups anddowns as much, because you're
creating, or starting to create,those real foundational habits
that actually make you feelprogressed and make you feel
like you're in, or starting tocreate those real foundational
habits that actually make youfeel progressed and make you
feel like you're in thismomentum regression mine and if
(20:35):
an audition comes up and youdon't get it, you're like fine,
because I'm still working on meand I'm progressing in this
direction.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
That I know, essentially, is what I'm needing
to work on yeah, and it's alsogreat to have somewhere to put
that feeling of like.
If an audition goes really wellor it goes really badly,
regardless, you can take theexperience and be like I need to
think about this when I'm doingthis.
I need to think about my pliesmore, because I was like
(21:06):
unstable landing jumps in thatdance call or like work on my
legit voice or like my vibrato,whatever it is.
You can take it.
It's like a tennis match,really Like audition technique.
Audition technique, you know.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
Yeah, that's it, I love that.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
So good yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
When I'm just talking a little bit about auditions.
I'd love to know was there anyperceptions you had of auditions
before going in?
Because of course you said youwere growing up Baronia, then
you're going to another danceschool and you're seeing other
people kind of get into things,but you never really knew how
that was going about and thenyou were going into an audition.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
What were you thinking before?
And then you did the auditions,because a lot of performers
that are listening in haven'tauditioned as well.
Yeah, bring in piano sheetmusic.
And I was like, simply what forLike, why would I bring sheet
music in?
And I remember I brought it inI don't know what I thought it
was going to be like.
And there was a person on apiano and I was like, what's he
(22:26):
doing here?
And only like, as I walked in,I was like, oh no, come on.
I was like I have to sing withthe piano.
I was like, oh my God.
I was like I have to sing withthe piano.
I was like I've never done thatbefore, but that was before I
started full time.
So I was lucky to have anaudition and I was like, oh,
there's a whole other skill thatI need to learn.
I don't know what I thought wasgoing to happen, but I didn't
think they were going to play mymusic.
(22:46):
I was like, how would he knowhow to play my music?
Speaker 2 (22:56):
He, they were going to play my.
I was like how would he knowhow to play my music?
He's never seen it before, youknow, or how would they know?
Well, maybe a better questionto actually ask you is knowing
what you know now aboutauditions, what advice would you
give yourself before going in?
Speaker 1 (23:03):
I would say part of it is learning as you go, but
knowing how you work.
If you need quiet time beforeyou're going to meet the
material in the audition room,prioritize that.
I know it can be intense whenyou walk in and there's all
these people, or there's peopleyou're seeing on stage,
currently like in the same roomas you, and you're like, oh my
(23:25):
gosh, I adore that person.
It's really a lot, it'sheightened.
But I think the advice I wouldgive is that know what you can
do before you get there.
Don't figure out what you cando when you're there.
That was a big thing for me,because I remember doing scales
and singing notes that I waslike I didn't know I could do
(23:49):
this and then no one's going tohire someone who doesn't know
what they could do.
You know, or if you don't trustyourself, how can they trust
you sort of thing.
There was a kind of a timewhere I felt like I could do it
alone or I could turn up, nottalk to anybody and just kind of
be fine.
(24:10):
And then I heard this quote Idon't know where it was from,
but it was like don't push awaythe people who might understand
you the most and I was likeeveryone who's there.
I know you're not reallycompeting because everyone is so
different, but they get it.
(24:31):
If anyone's going to understandhow you feel, it's other
performers, and I think that waslike a huge thing for me
because I was like nobody getsme.
All the people who I wastalking to tried to understand
me but just can't really fathomthe intensity of it.
But other performers we're allin the same boat just trying to
(24:55):
figure it out, as it happens.
So yeah, making friends atauditions, I think there are
people who I see, who I kind ofgo for the same things, and just
having building friendshipswith them so that I know that
I've got someone to talk to.
And also it's another reason tolook forward to my auditions,
(25:18):
because I'm like, oh, am I gonnasee him, am I gonna see them
again?
Like it adds like just anelement of like support and
something to look forward to.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
Yeah, well, there's so many different people and I
mean I love that you said thatwe're all kind of in the same
boat, because sometimes what itlooks like when you're at an
audition even pros or peoplethat have been I've done a lot
of auditions myself like it maylook like we have it all
together, but like I still getjittery and nervous, like I
still want to do well, like Ihave to still navigate that.
(25:52):
I think even a recent audition Idid, I couldn't go into like
the big room where everyone waslike warming up because just too
many people for me.
It would make me even moreanxious.
But maybe when I was beginningI would feel like, oh, I have to
be in there with.
So you start to learn differentways on what actually suits you
best and what's actually goingto help you, so that you can
(26:12):
actually then go into theaudition and give your best shot
.
And I think that only comeswith experience.
So that would definitely Iwould personally recommend, you
know, have a look at what goeswell in the audition, but things
that maybe can make you feelsafer or make you feel like you
can still be authentic and showup, and, yeah, that only comes
with experience, but I thinkhaving that reflective mindset
(26:33):
is going to really help.
You know you go forward forsure yeah, and also trying.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
I know rehearsals are usually the place to try new
things, but also try differentaudition things at each
different thing.
Of course.
Do this things that you feellike you need to succeed in your
audition, but also trydifferent things.
What happens when I don't gointo the big room and I just
kind of play my music and focuson my breath or whatever it is?
(27:02):
Or what happens when I learnthe choreography in the front
row from when I first get there?
Or what happens when I learn inthe back?
What happens when I ask aquestion that I actually,
because I know for me.
Sometimes I'm like, oh, I won'task because I don't want them
to think I'm some lie, I don'twant them to think I'm whatever,
(27:25):
but then asking, I get theinformation I need and maybe so
do other people in the room.
You know what I mean.
It kind of is it's for you, forthe performer, to try.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
Yeah a lot of listeners in and people I've
been speaking to recently lovelistening to the podcast and
something they wish they couldimplement is actually like how
these things we're talking aboutactually can impact them
directly.
So I'm just going to give alittle two top tips on something
that we were just talking about.
The thing that you said, youknow trying out if you're do the
dance around in the front orthe back.
(28:00):
I now actually don't do it inthe front, because I used to go
right to the front center, youknow, to give the dance round
and like halfway through I wouldmentally just forget Corrie,
because I have been going flatout every time, like all the
rounds, and so by the time itgets to groups I'm exhausted.
So now if you see me in anaudition, I'll be like near the
(28:21):
back or and there's actuallymore space, which is so much
better because you can do yourown thing and then you can just
mark it fill in your body.
So your own thing and then youcan just mark it fill in your
body.
So that's what helps me.
But, like you said, maybe youneed to be at the front so that
you can absorb and can go flatout.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
So that's definitely one tip that I give.
Did you have anything to add onthat?
Well, also, yeah, for me I lovestarting at the back, because
one I can kind of warm up to myconfidence, and then, by the
time the lines are switching, Iget to the front.
For when my focus drops off,it's usually the fourth or fifth
bar of eight where my focusliterally just I'm like I'm
(29:00):
hungry or something Like I justcannot focus.
But then by the time I get tothe front, I'm like, oh, it's
right there, I'll just you knowthat's how I work, but I only
figured that out like now.
Yeah, oh, it's right there,I'll just you know that's how I
work, but I only figured thatout like now.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Yeah, that's it and I think that that's so.
You've wrapped that up reallybeautifully.
Because there is so muchinformation nowadays, I feel
like all students we want to dowell, I still consider myself a
student, never ending learning,but I definitely feel like
there's this need to knoweverything, because if we feel
like we know everything then wecan be safe.
(29:32):
But I think there's such beautyin the unknowing of it all,
being a beginner, discovering itall for the first time.
You know we can give you everysingle second of what happens
into an audition, but it's neveractually going to help you
until you're there andexperiencing it and seeing how
you're responding to it.
So you know, I want to kind ofgive people that are listening
(29:54):
in just a bit of more freedom.
Know that you don't have toknow everything to progress.
Because I tell you, we bothdidn't know Like I mean, back
when I wasn't posting anything,we weren't doing classes posting
, we weren't like the auditionexperience was similar to you.
You didn't like I knew At thatstage I had to sing, but you
(30:16):
don't know, for example,something simple I'm going to
learn to the mirror and then allof a sudden turn around or turn
to the side.
These things.
I just don't know.
But I think you actually learnthe most by sometimes not
knowing, because it kind ofeither catches you off guard,
but it's in those small momentsthat when things catch you off
guard is when your routines andyour skills and your development
(30:38):
on yourself are really going totake over.
So I thought of wrapping it upall into what we were speaking
about there, that bringing backfocus to what you need to work
on and having that as thepredominant factor in your life
of okay, this is what I need towork on.
They're all going to show upwhen all the other factors are
like against you.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
Yeah.
Or when you feel like you'relosing control, the things that
you've practiced in a quiet orlike nice place, they're just
going to meet you where you needthat's.
That is a crazy thing that I'velearned what you've put in
before can just come out nowwithout even you thinking about
(31:18):
it.
Crazy, right it is.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Well, it's been awesome having you on, Jacob.
I feel like we can talk forhours and hours.
Speaker 1 (31:26):
Thank you for having me.
You at least have theturnaround that we have on, but
we've lived together, so you'veseen all the things.
It's so good.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Yeah, I'd love to maybe ask this because I feel
like you're a, you know, ahumble two years into the
industry.
Is there any advice you wouldgive younger Jacob, now being in
the industry, that you wouldlove to give?
Speaker 1 (31:46):
I'd probably say surrounding myself with people
who elevate the ideas that Ihave for myself already.
So, for example, if I've beenthinking about, oh, I really
want to get feel stronger inthis, having people behind me
(32:07):
who can help guide me to getbetter at what I want, rather
than worrying about these noisyat what I want, rather than
worrying about these noisy,irrelevant ideas about like how
things look I know that in thisindustry, there's a massive
element of like how things look,but I want to be around people
(32:27):
who are concerned with how theyfeel, about what they're doing,
about where their life is going,not how it looks, Because how
it looks has nothing to do withhow it feels.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Boom.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Let's go.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Let's go.
It's been awesome having you on, jacob.
I love speaking to you and Ireally was happy and proud of
our conversation.
I know that there's a lot ofdifferent elements in there that
people can go ahead and takefrom.
We talked about routines,talked about coming into the
industry fresh and that sort ofexperience auditions, what they
look like and the differentthings and the things they've
(33:04):
experienced has just, you know,shaped you into who you are now
and I'm really happy to see,like your progression and the
work that you put in and it'sit's really awesome to see yeah,
thank you.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Thank you so much, thanks for having me, of course.
Speaker 2 (33:17):
Well, if anyone wants to ask Jacob a question, you
can probably reach him on hisemail.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
Yeah, I'm going to email Jacob
J-A-C-R-B-Z-S-T-E-E-N atgmailcom.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
Boom.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
There you go, because you want to email me?
Speaker 2 (33:34):
Yes, and, as always, if you have a question for us at
the Dive or you want to reachJacob as well, you have our
email access, which is info atthe divecomau.
We have a free community onlineon Facebook if you want to be
involved as well.
Anyone that's listening in.
I've just been starting tobuild this.
There's about a hundredstudents in there and it's all
about mindset and careerdevelopment.
(33:56):
I'm going to be running someupcoming workshops once a month
on there with guests and, yeah,building excitement there, so
you can go and check that out,and otherwise you can check out
our website for free resources.
There's a bunch of freeresources that are on there now,
from breathwork, meditation,different meditations and
resources to help you on yourway to becoming a professional
(34:17):
in the industry.
So feel free to go check all ofthose out and I will see you on
the next episode.
Thank you, jacob.
Thank you, bye, everyone.
Hello and welcome If you are new here.
I'm Taylor.
I'm the host of the DivePodcast.
I'm also a musical theatreperformer and I've been in the
industry for over 10 years.
Alongside that, I'm also a yogaand dance teacher and I'm the
creator and founder of the Dive,which is the fastest growing
support platform for musicaltheatre artists, both emerging
(00:37):
and professional.
Join us for conversations onmindset behind the scenes,
stories of professionals in theindustry and how you can
navigate the challenges that weface as artists.
Once a week, you'll have aprofessional guest come on the
show who we will interview, andevery second week you'll have me
as your podcast host, whereI'll be coming on and sharing
(00:57):
with you practical exercises andresources to help you on your
way to becoming a professionalin the industry.
Thank you so much for being on,jacob.
I'm so excited that you're hereand we actually lived together
for a little while back when.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
We did, we did Early this year.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Yeah, and you would have probably then seen a lot of
the behind the scenes of whatthe Dive podcast was, because I
was only creating it when wewere together.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
Yeah, built from the ground up literally in my little
office that we had in the toproom, always riding away, riding
away planning schedule.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Yeah, exactly, it's so good.
Yeah, well, it's awesome tohave you on.
We're such great friends and Igot to meet you on Mary Poppins,
which was just such an awesomeexperience to work together and
you've gone ahead and built thisbeautiful career for yourself
and it's just been kind of awhirlwind because it's only.
It has been Kind of onlyhappened in the past how many
(01:58):
years, like two, three years.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Yeah two, let's go a humble, two years.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
A humble two, yeah A two, yeah, a humble two yeah,
well, let's kind of start there.
Let's kind of give people apicture of what it's been like
for you, maybe a little bitabout where you're, where you
trained and kind of how you gotinto your first musical.
All right.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
So I'm 21 now.
I'm living in melbourne.
I grew up in Melbourne.
I grew up dancing in this tinydance school in Boronia, which
is like a suburb you knowBoronia, yeah, small suburb and
it was like not, it was not likewhere people went to make it
big.
Do you know what I mean when I?
(02:40):
I think I was in about yeareight or year nine that dance
school shut down and my mom andI we were like what are we going
to do?
And then the principal of thatdance school, she was like, well
, you know, jacob could bereally good.
I don't know how she said it,but she was basically like he
could be serious with this if hewanted to.
(03:00):
And I was like I did not care,I was like I just want to dance,
it's not that serious.
But then we were like, allright, let's do it.
And it was.
I went to May Downs School ofDance in the city and that was
like a huge thing for me, causeI was like, oh my gosh, the city
.
I'm going to have to drive withwhoever for 40 minutes to get
(03:22):
there, which is crazy now,because like I go to the city
all the time.
And then so I went there and Iremember just the types of kids
that were there.
This was during like Matildaand School of Rock, and then I'd
make friends and then I'd belike, oh, where's like, where's
Tiana?
And they're like, oh, she'sdoing Matilda today, so she kind
(03:43):
of come to dance and I was like, oh my gosh, this is crazy.
Like all these kids my age werelike already there you know
Doing the thing.
And yeah, and it was, I think itwas that that kind of was like
kind of made me feel like ifthey can do it, I can do it.
And then so after that, afterthat, I did that until year 12
(04:05):
and then in year 12 I auditionedfor all the the schools and I
got into music theater at vcoand then so I planned to do the
three years there and then in myfirst year I got it was a I
don't even know what you wouldcall it, it was super like not
(04:27):
official because there was noway to contact me I got a
message about auditioning forMary Poppins and I was like sure
, I was kind of like notthinking about that far ahead
until, like you know, I was inthe last year of full time and
then I'll start thinking aboutdoing stuff and I was like I'll
just do it for experience andlike to put myself out there.
(04:49):
And then it happened and thatwas like I thought I was riding
on a train to a destination anda boulder just came and smashed
the train off the rails.
It was literally, and I waslike, okay, this is crazy.
And then so, yeah, I did marrypoppins with you for however
long and that experience waslike such a great first
(05:13):
experience to have you know yeahlike, just have my level yeah,
level of expectation of how Ishould be treated great people
to be around.
The standard was just set atsuch a high bar for my first
experience, which is justsomething that I'm grateful for
forever, you know.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
So then, after that, I left to do Moulin Rouge, and I
did that for about three months.
That was a very challengingtime for the people that I mean,
like, should I talk about it orshould I not?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
You can absolutely talk about it if you wish.
I mean, I'm fine to talk aboutit.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
I think maybe it would be good to talk about.
So I got into that show.
I was supposed to be inUnderstudy, santiago and I was
in the ensemble T7, andrehearsed for four weeks and
then started doing shows likeone on one off because they
wanted to sort of ease me intoit.
And basically it just got tothis point where they were like
(06:18):
we have made a mistake withcasting you in this show and it
was like such a tough time likeit was like so confusing.
I remember when I found out Ilike I couldn't eat or speak.
I was just like what ishappening Surprisingly?
(06:41):
I was so resilient.
I was like great, let me tryeven harder, which is obviously
for a few days I was like wow,my life is whatever I thought it
was.
But then I just got back up andI was like I want the next
(07:01):
thing even more.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Even with that, because I was living with you at
this stage and a bit ofbackstory because I was there a
little bit of it, and it wasn'tthat you weren't trying, or I
think there was even some physiostuff to help you get stronger
and all different sorts.
There was all these avenues youwere taking and it just so
happened that the circumstancehappened where we weren't able
(07:23):
to fill that role in thecapacity that they once thought,
which is a shame on their part.
But also maybe, like you justsaid, you then used that as
power and fuel where a lot ofpeople would probably diminish
and really be upset with thosethings and stay there and maybe
not feel so good, really beupset with those things and stay
(07:47):
there and maybe not feel sogood.
But what made you feel likestrength and power to actually
continue and go ahead?
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Well, I remember in the official meeting I was like,
if we were going to do thisagain, what could I have done
differently?
And they were like honestly,nothing.
You did everything that weasked of you.
You put in the effort, which isit was a bit freeing actually,
because I was like, okay,although this is affecting me
(08:12):
directly, it is not because ofme.
I mean like it is because of me, but it wasn't because of
anything I could have donedifferent.
And then I think what empoweredme was, yeah, it's just this
feeling of I can be a victim,like I can sit and be a victim
(08:32):
and be like, oh my gosh, howcould this happen to me?
But it's not.
I feel like when I feel likethat, nothing happens, nothing
changes, which I am not a fan of.
So I was kind of like, even ifjust for a story, what an
amazing story for me to be likeat the bottom of how I'd ever
(08:56):
felt maybe in my life and thento bounce back into something I
didn't know when it was going tohappen, but to come back and
people be like no, people belike oh, that's Jacob.
He got let go or fired from ajob, but now look how he walks,
(09:17):
you can't even tell he's stillgrowing and energetic.
And I just thought wow, I knowwho I can be, so I'm going to
try.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Did you surprise yourself in that that you went
ahead and kind of just took thatand was like, right, use this
as a redirection, using it toyour strength.
Did you surprise yourself or doyou feel like that?
Maybe through your upbringingyou've already had that sort of
quality, so you had that from abase forever?
Speaker 1 (09:46):
just like loving a challenge, or like people saying
, oh no, you can't do it thisway, and then being I don't know
, I love the rebellion of likeI'm going to be the one to do it
, you know, which is like it canhelp but it also can hinder.
But yeah, in this situation itreally helped me.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Because then from there you ended up going on to
Groundhog Day right, which wasone of the most incredible
experiences for you.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
It honestly, would have had to be supernatural.
Like I auditioned for that show, I think, four weeks after I'd
been let go, so some time off.
But then four weeks Iauditioned for it and then a few
weeks later after that and Igot that and I was like what do
you mean?
Well, clearly it does happen,but I was like this could not
(10:38):
have come at a better time in,with everything that was going
on, and to bounce back intoanother show like a month and a
half after being set back andit's like that.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
That experience for you was obviously so good.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
I got to see you in it, which is awesome, and you
know, imagine if you were stillin moulin you probably wouldn't
have been able to do that rightyeah, and also if I had have
stayed in that show I would havejust kind of traveled along,
obviously learned some, but likehaving the drop but then the
win, like it's just the range ishuge yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
Because in the moment it never feels like it's what
is meant to be.
You're like no, but then now,looking back at how it's all
panned out, can you now see,like, why things have happened
that way?
Speaker 1 (11:29):
I can, yeah, yeah, and even people close to me,
like my agent and my bestfriends and my mom and my family
, just being having likereinforcing that sort of idea of
like things that are meant tobe won't pass you by, that sort
of thing and like of coursethey're going to be crap times
(11:51):
but there will be things thatfeel and are right.
And also, I think, by thebiggest takeaway that I learned,
which is like crazy, is thatI'd much rather not get a job
because it isn't right for methan be put in a job.
Not get a job because it isn'tright for me, then be put in a
(12:12):
job that isn't right for me andit's just uncomfortable.
You can kind of tell whenyou're like, oh, I don't think
I'm right for this and thentrying to do it is like painful.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
It's almost like fitting a mold, that if you're a
triangle and you're trying toget through a square, it doesn't
work.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
It's just not enjoyable.
But then, doing Groundhog day,I was like, oh my gosh,
everything that I have inside meis already enough for this
character and I didn't have tolike change.
Not change who I was, butchange myself to be the thing
you know.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Yeah, what an experience Crazy.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
Crazy experience.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
So crazy and it's so good and like we were talking a
little bit earlier and we can gointo this now about you know
there was obviously maybe someroutines and things that helped
you in that progression.
And I mean, when you're gettinginto the industry so young and
so fresh, you know there's somuch growth happening and lots
of things to like take on board.
When you were like starting outinto your first year basically
(13:17):
of training and then all of asudden you're doing eight shows
a week.
What was that shift like foryou and what would you say like
you learned the most fromactually like being in the show?
Speaker 1 (13:29):
I think what I learned probably is that once
you get there, it's not the endof like learning, which was a
rude awakening.
I know there's this quote aboutlike when you get to the top of
the mountain, it's just thebottom of the next, which is, oh
my gosh, it was just a lot ofstaying on top of everything and
(13:53):
because I had left my full-timetwo years early.
I think the more I went on, themore I realized I needed to work
on my skills.
But when I first made thattransition I was like, well, I
need to practice.
And it's not.
I knew it wasn't good enoughfor me to just do the eight
(14:14):
shows because, like, once theshow's done, what am I left with
if not, if I haven't been likeworking those skills while I can
, while I've got the money,while I've got the time and
while I get to put it intopractice, it's like the best
time.
It was like the best situation.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Yeah it was so good to see you actually install that
as an individual, because it'sa big network like musicals here
in Australia and that we havesome fantastic like artists
coming to shows and new peopleand experienced people.
It's a whole mix mash ofdifferent people.
And there's one thing that Idefinitely will call out and if
(14:55):
people that are musical theatreperformers I definitely believe
we're all at a different journeyand whatnot but there is that
mindset that kind of comes in.
It's very easy to get into ashow and arrive like arrive in a
show and not continue thatskill development.
And there is times for that,for sure, because sometimes you
(15:16):
feel like you've done the workright, you've done all this work
to get into this thing, andthen you're here and you've made
it sort of you know vibe.
But the people that I've workedwith that have this longevity
you know Lisa Songtag comes tomind to different artists that I
really admire and look up to.
They're all people that don'tarrive.
They constantly are humbled bythe next work or what they can
(15:39):
improve on and they're bringingthat into that weekly life and
seeing that that was already athing for you, you kind of got
into the habit of that, probablywithout even knowing it, that
that's what you need to andbecause you were starting out
your training and you neededthat next extra step, but you
were able to actually go aheadand do it whilst in a show,
(16:00):
which then probably reinforcedthe importance of it yeah, and I
think also looking people inthat show specifically, that I I
was like oh my gosh, I thinkthey're top-notch performers.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
But people like Kim Hodgson, who I was like oh my
gosh, she's amazing and shealways oh, it just freaks me out
a bit.
I would ask her about what shedoes and even still, I don't
know how old she is, but she'sbeen doing it for a while and
she's like doing classes andit's that sort of thing that you
(16:36):
don't see.
I don't know if she's doingclasses, but what I know is that
when she turns up, she's doinga banging job of it.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
Yeah, and there's probably that misconception that
when you don't see it, becauseeverything's online now a lot of
the time, we think that thepeople are actively posting,
that they're in class, that thepeople that are working on it.
But I think there is such powerin not having to share, like
whilst you're still working awayon your skills.
I feel like there's a time andplace to share and making sure
(17:05):
that we're sharing authenticallyin a way that actually is
expressing us where we are now,what we have to offer in a place
.
That's fun.
But I do believe there is thathidden power of you're really
only as strong as what you'redoing when no one's watching, I
believe more than anything.
Yeah, succeeding in silence,yes, I think it's so attractive
(17:29):
and it's so more importantbecause it's really kind of like
the definition of discipline aswell.
That comes in.
It's a lifestyle, it's not aparty trick you know absolutely
well, we're talking aboutroutines, then, and maybe some
things that really helped youalong the way when you kind of
got in, because there's a lot ofpeople on here that are
aspiring performers that want todo the skills they want to work
(17:52):
on their skills, thatultimately, we all want to be in
a musical, we want to workprofessionally and we want to
have not only the gig but wewant to be able to stay there
and sustain it and buildlongevity.
We were just recently talkingabout routines and maybe some
things that have been helpingyou lately and the importance of
that, how you found that.
Would you love to speak alittle bit about that?
(18:13):
And maybe how performers canstart to create that for
themselves?
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yeah Well, I think it would be if I was thinking from
like the perspective of Ihadn't done any like big main
stage professional gigs.
I think it's about like aperspective change because what
I'm facing now is that I haven'thad this much free time ever
(18:38):
and so I'm having to work myroutine and figure out what
classes I need.
And I think it would be likehelpful to change your
perspective in the sense of,like the routine that you create
before you start working is aroutine you can always fall back
on in terms of likestrengthening skills you've
(19:00):
already got and also learningnew skills.
Basically, what I've been doingis ballet is my non-negotiable,
especially after like careerstuff that I've had.
I'm like I want to be strong, Iwant to prevent injury, all
that and just have thatdiscipline.
And then finding a singingteacher.
(19:21):
I listened to Jeff's episode.
I love him and he talking abouthaving a vocal coach and then
also a technical singing teacherand just someone to help you
stylistically and then someoneto help you technically.
And then finding your voice,finding what works for you so
that when auditions come up, youcan be like I know who I am
(19:45):
when I'm performing.
And I think this matches thatand I'm going to go in.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Yeah, just give it.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
Yeah, yeah, think this matches that, and I'm going
to go in.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
Yeah, just give it, yeah.
Yeah, it's so important and alot of the things that come up,
especially with auditions,because at the end of the day,
we're musical theatre performersand we're all auditioning all
the time.
You know the routines arereally what are going to save
you.
The things that you're doingweek in, week out are really.
I love the thing that you saidabout when you're in the show,
even if you're in the audition,having actual habits and things
(20:14):
that you can fall back on thatyou know are progressing you.
It's definitely going to allowus to not feel the rejection so
much or not feel the ups anddowns as much, because you're
creating, or starting to create,those real foundational habits
that actually make you feelprogressed and make you feel
like you're in, or starting tocreate those real foundational
habits that actually make youfeel progressed and make you
feel like you're in thismomentum regression mine and if
(20:35):
an audition comes up and youdon't get it, you're like fine,
because I'm still working on meand I'm progressing in this
direction.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
That I know, essentially, is what I'm needing
to work on yeah, and it's alsogreat to have somewhere to put
that feeling of like.
If an audition goes really wellor it goes really badly,
regardless, you can take theexperience and be like I need to
think about this when I'm doingthis.
I need to think about my pliesmore, because I was like
(21:06):
unstable landing jumps in thatdance call or like work on my
legit voice or like my vibrato,whatever it is.
You can take it.
It's like a tennis match,really Like audition technique.
Audition technique, you know.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
Yeah, that's it, I love that.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
So good yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
When I'm just talking a little bit about auditions.
I'd love to know was there anyperceptions you had of auditions
before going in?
Because of course you said youwere growing up Baronia, then
you're going to another danceschool and you're seeing other
people kind of get into things,but you never really knew how
that was going about and thenyou were going into an audition.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
What were you thinking before?
And then you did the auditions,because a lot of performers
that are listening in haven'tauditioned as well.
Yeah, bring in piano sheetmusic.
And I was like, simply what forLike, why would I bring sheet
music in?
And I remember I brought it inI don't know what I thought it
was going to be like.
And there was a person on apiano and I was like, what's he
(22:26):
doing here?
And only like, as I walked in,I was like, oh no, come on.
I was like I have to sing withthe piano.
I was like, oh my God.
I was like I have to sing withthe piano.
I was like I've never done thatbefore, but that was before I
started full time.
So I was lucky to have anaudition and I was like, oh,
there's a whole other skill thatI need to learn.
I don't know what I thought wasgoing to happen, but I didn't
think they were going to play mymusic.
(22:46):
I was like, how would he knowhow to play my music?
Speaker 2 (22:56):
He, they were going to play my.
I was like how would he knowhow to play my music?
He's never seen it before, youknow, or how would they know?
Well, maybe a better questionto actually ask you is knowing
what you know now aboutauditions, what advice would you
give yourself before going in?
Speaker 1 (23:03):
I would say part of it is learning as you go, but
knowing how you work.
If you need quiet time beforeyou're going to meet the
material in the audition room,prioritize that.
I know it can be intense whenyou walk in and there's all
these people, or there's peopleyou're seeing on stage,
currently like in the same roomas you, and you're like, oh my
(23:25):
gosh, I adore that person.
It's really a lot, it'sheightened.
But I think the advice I wouldgive is that know what you can
do before you get there.
Don't figure out what you cando when you're there.
That was a big thing for me,because I remember doing scales
and singing notes that I waslike I didn't know I could do
(23:49):
this and then no one's going tohire someone who doesn't know
what they could do.
You know, or if you don't trustyourself, how can they trust
you sort of thing.
There was a kind of a timewhere I felt like I could do it
alone or I could turn up, nottalk to anybody and just kind of
be fine.
(24:10):
And then I heard this quote Idon't know where it was from,
but it was like don't push awaythe people who might understand
you the most and I was likeeveryone who's there.
I know you're not reallycompeting because everyone is so
different, but they get it.
(24:31):
If anyone's going to understandhow you feel, it's other
performers, and I think that waslike a huge thing for me
because I was like nobody getsme.
All the people who I wastalking to tried to understand
me but just can't really fathomthe intensity of it.
But other performers we're allin the same boat just trying to
(24:55):
figure it out, as it happens.
So yeah, making friends atauditions, I think there are
people who I see, who I kind ofgo for the same things, and just
having building friendshipswith them so that I know that
I've got someone to talk to.
And also it's another reason tolook forward to my auditions,
(25:18):
because I'm like, oh, am I gonnasee him, am I gonna see them
again?
Like it adds like just anelement of like support and
something to look forward to.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
Yeah, well, there's so many different people and I
mean I love that you said thatwe're all kind of in the same
boat, because sometimes what itlooks like when you're at an
audition even pros or peoplethat have been I've done a lot
of auditions myself like it maylook like we have it all
together, but like I still getjittery and nervous, like I
still want to do well, like Ihave to still navigate that.
(25:52):
I think even a recent audition Idid, I couldn't go into like
the big room where everyone waslike warming up because just too
many people for me.
It would make me even moreanxious.
But maybe when I was beginningI would feel like, oh, I have to
be in there with.
So you start to learn differentways on what actually suits you
best and what's actually goingto help you, so that you can
(26:12):
actually then go into theaudition and give your best shot
.
And I think that only comeswith experience.
So that would definitely Iwould personally recommend, you
know, have a look at what goeswell in the audition, but things
that maybe can make you feelsafer or make you feel like you
can still be authentic and showup, and, yeah, that only comes
with experience, but I thinkhaving that reflective mindset
(26:33):
is going to really help.
You know you go forward forsure yeah, and also trying.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
I know rehearsals are usually the place to try new
things, but also try differentaudition things at each
different thing.
Of course.
Do this things that you feellike you need to succeed in your
audition, but also trydifferent things.
What happens when I don't gointo the big room and I just
kind of play my music and focuson my breath or whatever it is?
(27:02):
Or what happens when I learnthe choreography in the front
row from when I first get there?
Or what happens when I learn inthe back?
What happens when I ask aquestion that I actually,
because I know for me.
Sometimes I'm like, oh, I won'task because I don't want them
to think I'm some lie, I don'twant them to think I'm whatever,
(27:25):
but then asking, I get theinformation I need and maybe so
do other people in the room.
You know what I mean.
It kind of is it's for you, forthe performer, to try.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
Yeah a lot of listeners in and people I've
been speaking to recently lovelistening to the podcast and
something they wish they couldimplement is actually like how
these things we're talking aboutactually can impact them
directly.
So I'm just going to give alittle two top tips on something
that we were just talking about.
The thing that you said, youknow trying out if you're do the
dance around in the front orthe back.
(28:00):
I now actually don't do it inthe front, because I used to go
right to the front center, youknow, to give the dance round
and like halfway through I wouldmentally just forget Corrie,
because I have been going flatout every time, like all the
rounds, and so by the time itgets to groups I'm exhausted.
So now if you see me in anaudition, I'll be like near the
(28:21):
back or and there's actuallymore space, which is so much
better because you can do yourown thing and then you can just
mark it fill in your body.
So your own thing and then youcan just mark it fill in your
body.
So that's what helps me.
But, like you said, maybe youneed to be at the front so that
you can absorb and can go flatout.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
So that's definitely one tip that I give.
Did you have anything to add onthat?
Well, also, yeah, for me I lovestarting at the back, because
one I can kind of warm up to myconfidence, and then, by the
time the lines are switching, Iget to the front.
For when my focus drops off,it's usually the fourth or fifth
bar of eight where my focusliterally just I'm like I'm
(29:00):
hungry or something Like I justcannot focus.
But then by the time I get tothe front, I'm like, oh, it's
right there, I'll just you knowthat's how I work, but I only
figured that out like now.
Yeah, oh, it's right there,I'll just you know that's how I
work, but I only figured thatout like now.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Yeah, that's it and I think that that's so.
You've wrapped that up reallybeautifully.
Because there is so muchinformation nowadays, I feel
like all students we want to dowell, I still consider myself a
student, never ending learning,but I definitely feel like
there's this need to knoweverything, because if we feel
like we know everything then wecan be safe.
(29:32):
But I think there's such beautyin the unknowing of it all,
being a beginner, discovering itall for the first time.
You know we can give you everysingle second of what happens
into an audition, but it's neveractually going to help you
until you're there andexperiencing it and seeing how
you're responding to it.
So you know, I want to kind ofgive people that are listening
(29:54):
in just a bit of more freedom.
Know that you don't have toknow everything to progress.
Because I tell you, we bothdidn't know Like I mean, back
when I wasn't posting anything,we weren't doing classes posting
, we weren't like the auditionexperience was similar to you.
You didn't like I knew At thatstage I had to sing, but you
(30:16):
don't know, for example,something simple I'm going to
learn to the mirror and then allof a sudden turn around or turn
to the side.
These things.
I just don't know.
But I think you actually learnthe most by sometimes not
knowing, because it kind ofeither catches you off guard,
but it's in those small momentsthat when things catch you off
guard is when your routines andyour skills and your development
(30:38):
on yourself are really going totake over.
So I thought of wrapping it upall into what we were speaking
about there, that bringing backfocus to what you need to work
on and having that as thepredominant factor in your life
of okay, this is what I need towork on.
They're all going to show upwhen all the other factors are
like against you.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
Yeah.
Or when you feel like you'relosing control, the things that
you've practiced in a quiet orlike nice place, they're just
going to meet you where you needthat's.
That is a crazy thing that I'velearned what you've put in
before can just come out nowwithout even you thinking about
(31:18):
it.
Crazy, right it is.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Well, it's been awesome having you on, Jacob.
I feel like we can talk forhours and hours.
Speaker 1 (31:26):
Thank you for having me.
You at least have theturnaround that we have on, but
we've lived together, so you'veseen all the things.
It's so good.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Yeah, I'd love to maybe ask this because I feel
like you're a, you know, ahumble two years into the
industry.
Is there any advice you wouldgive younger Jacob, now being in
the industry, that you wouldlove to give?
Speaker 1 (31:46):
I'd probably say surrounding myself with people
who elevate the ideas that Ihave for myself already.
So, for example, if I've beenthinking about, oh, I really
want to get feel stronger inthis, having people behind me
(32:07):
who can help guide me to getbetter at what I want, rather
than worrying about these noisyat what I want, rather than
worrying about these noisy,irrelevant ideas about like how
things look I know that in thisindustry, there's a massive
element of like how things look,but I want to be around people
(32:27):
who are concerned with how theyfeel, about what they're doing,
about where their life is going,not how it looks, Because how
it looks has nothing to do withhow it feels.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Boom.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Let's go.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Let's go.
It's been awesome having you on, jacob.
I love speaking to you and Ireally was happy and proud of
our conversation.
I know that there's a lot ofdifferent elements in there that
people can go ahead and takefrom.
We talked about routines,talked about coming into the
industry fresh and that sort ofexperience auditions, what they
look like and the differentthings and the things they've
(33:04):
experienced has just, you know,shaped you into who you are now
and I'm really happy to see,like your progression and the
work that you put in and it'sit's really awesome to see yeah,
thank you.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Thank you so much, thanks for having me, of course.
Speaker 2 (33:17):
Well, if anyone wants to ask Jacob a question, you
can probably reach him on hisemail.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
Yeah, I'm going to email Jacob
J-A-C-R-B-Z-S-T-E-E-N atgmailcom.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
Boom.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
There you go, because you want to email me?
Speaker 2 (33:34):
Yes, and, as always, if you have a question for us at
the Dive or you want to reachJacob as well, you have our
email access, which is info atthe divecomau.
We have a free community onlineon Facebook if you want to be
involved as well.
Anyone that's listening in.
I've just been starting tobuild this.
There's about a hundredstudents in there and it's all
about mindset and careerdevelopment.
(33:56):
I'm going to be running someupcoming workshops once a month
on there with guests and, yeah,building excitement there, so
you can go and check that out,and otherwise you can check out
our website for free resources.
There's a bunch of freeresources that are on there now,
from breathwork, meditation,different meditations and
resources to help you on yourway to becoming a professional
(34:17):
in the industry.
So feel free to go check all ofthose out and I will see you on
the next episode.
Thank you, jacob.
Thank you, bye, everyone.
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