More Than a Jab: The Uneducated PT Karl O’Rourke on the Power of GLP-1s and Belonging [S2E9]

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
None of this conversation shouldbe taken as medical advice for
you. Before starting or changing any
medical or Wellness treatment, always consult your GP and
medical care team. You are very welcome along to

(00:44):
another episode of the Dose withmyself, Paddy and the other
Dose. Hi, Belinda.
You're welcome. You're.
Welcome. Just you're welcome.
You're not even hello. Like just you're welcome.
Yeah, yeah. Thank you very much.
Love being here. Yeah, I'm so happy to be here
with you. You like, filled my life with so
much joy. How are things today, Belinda?

(01:05):
Good. It's OK.
Everything's OK. It's the house is.
Quiet. I know the house is quiet, I'm
on my own and the dog's locked out the back, so it's all good,
yeah. Yeah, I said later, before I hit
record, I was dealing with my dad rattling a metal trader
right outside the window. I was like, oh, holy mother of
God. Yeah, people, there was talent
trying to work. Yeah.

(01:29):
Anyway, we've a great episode lined up.
So Belinda, I'm gonna hand it straight over to you, actually.
Yeah, right now. Yeah, right now.
Yeah, OK, so I'm going to tell you about our guest.
So today's guest is someone who doesn't just talk about fitness,
he talks about like, real life. You might know him online as the
uneducated PT, but don't let thename fool you.

(01:51):
Carlo Rourke is one of the most emotionally intelligent,
grounded and thoughtful voices in the health space right now,
and he's not here to sell you a quick fix or a summer a summer
body. He's here to ask questions about
belonging, about growth, about why we really struggle
sometimes. And that's exactly why we wanted
to have him on our podcast today.

(02:13):
Carl has also become a really, really, really, umm, good ally
in the GLP One community, showing genuine support, asking
thoughtful questions and helpingto breakdown the stigma in a way
that feels safe and genuine. So in this episode, we're
digging deep what really broughtCarl to this space in his life

(02:34):
and, you know, just getting to know him a little bit better.
And let's let's go forward and talk to us.
Talk to you, Carl. Sorry.
That that feels like the start of to remember that program.
This is your life. That used to be on my life.
Yeah, Carl's like, no, Patty, I'm too young to remember.

(02:54):
Carl, how old are you? I am 32. 32 OK.
Here, Ninja, no, we're only bringing people on.
We're only bringing people on that are like in their 40s like.
You're the youngest yet. I got I'm not going to, I'm
going to bridge the gap between you and the gens ears.

(03:14):
OK, what is Riz? What is all these words?
And I don't know how. Oh Jesus, I'm not that yoga.
I can't. I can't help you there.
Yeah, my luck. Karl, you're very welcome to the
podcast. It's great to have you on.
Thank you. Thank you for having me.
And also what a lovely intro. I think I'm going to write that
down to the user for for myself now.

(03:37):
This is how I'm going to introduce it to you.
Very well. Yeah, please, please do.
Thank you. Yeah, if there's somebody that
is not familiar with Carl's Presents and Sass online, I'm
going to start off by playing this.
Usually I get on well with dietitians.
I've never had any back and forth until the hungry

(03:57):
nutritionist came at me because she does not understand my time
with an undefeated record of 0 glasses and 0 fights.
Dish dish. Anyway, so I made this harmless
video where I show people how I increase my protein intake by
just having more of the same foods that I'm already having.
Instead of putting on 50 grams of salmon, you're gonna put on
150. And she came on telling me how
the West has already eaten more protein than the meat, and how

(04:18):
an excessive amount of protein can cause heart disease and
diabetes and some cancers, and how she's way more qualified
than I am when it comes to giving nutritional advice.
I and smoke. Much smarter than you, all
right, Well, I was just making bagels in my kitchen.
And then she asked me what my research advice was based on.
A dietitian asked me what my research advice was based on for

(04:39):
encouraging a high protein intake.
Good question. High protein diet's going to
lead to greater mass retention and a greater percentage of
weight loss coming from body fat.
It's going to lead to greater satiety, improve insulin
sensitivity, increase energy expenditure.
She's trying to make this weird argument where we're eating too
much protein and it's causing heart disease and that she's
referencing the British Heart Foundation.
So. Karen, have you stopped eating

(05:01):
so much protein? Sensory.
You know what, that's hilarious that he's brought that up.
I like I didn't even think he would be able to find that
because I haven't there. I haven't done much nutrition
there content in a while there, but that's hilarious.
But now I've continued the a high protein diet and
shockingly, I feel healthier than ever.

(05:24):
That's good. That's good.
Yeah. So that was gas Yeah, that was
no, because I was looking through some of your, your kind
of areas and stuff like that. And that was the one that, uh,
stuck out with me. So I was umm, as did I know you
had a post up this morning kind of get by GLP one as well.
And I guess I have an interest in your approach to things, not

(05:45):
just GLP one, but from a obviously a client perspective,
but also the business perspective.
And in a former life, I worked as a personal trainer as well.
One of your posts from a few weeks ago, I'm just going to
read a snippet of it. I think it's from one of your
sub stacks as well. But yeah, personally, I've seen
more clients walk through my doors since GLP once hit the
mainstream. When people lose weight, they

(06:06):
often feel more confident stepping into a gym.
Movement becomes easier, their joints hurt less, they're less
self-conscious, they're ready totake the next step.
And that's where we come in. As long as you're not the kind
of trainer who shames people forneeding help, especially help
that works, GLP ones can supportyour business, not sabotage it.
So talk to us about, I guess, where, Yeah.

(06:31):
WH what helped you form your opinion of the role GLP ones
play in terms of health and fitness?
Because it's still quite a new area.
And it's something I get a huge amount of hate from from
typically other personal trainers.
Yeah. So I'd love to know, Yeah.
What kind of started you on thatroad to actually this isn't
something to be hated on. Yeah, so Eve, even on the
obviously, well, before I go into any advice that I gave are

(06:58):
my opinions and, umm, you know, how I, how I approach health and
fitness is always trying to follow science and evidence
base. And if it's evidence base, it
will, it will make sense to me. And then I tried to kind of form
my opinions on my approaches around that.
And you know, that's, that's basically the, the, the emphasis

(07:23):
of why I am probably in the samecamp as the two of you in terms
of, you know, this is like my role as a coach is to help
people improve the quality of their life, you know, period.
That's the end result. That is, that is the outcome.
And you know, if, if, if medication can help someone to
improve the quality of their life through weight loss, which

(07:44):
we know it can be such a really difficult thing to achieve, then
it only makes sense to be an advocate of, of that medication.
And you know, when I, and even like the post that I did this
morning, obviously, you know, I,I did that because obviously
coming on here today. So, you know, my thought process
was, was around GLP ones, like the reason most personal

(08:06):
trainers, umm, you know, give people push back about these
medications is, you know, ignorance.
They don't understand the insecurities.
You know, they feel like that it's going to umm, take over
their business and that they're not going to be able to get any
clients and no one's going to work with them.
So again, it comes from insecurities and not understand
them, the role of these GLP ones.

(08:27):
Whereas because I followed what the research suggests and just
true, you know, day-to-day working people, what I've come
to realize is that, you know, these things, it's not US
against the medications in termsof the fitness industry.
It's, you know, this can be a tool that helps us help more
people because like, there's a huge gap in the fitness industry

(08:49):
of people who don't train or don't get into a gym because
they don't feel that the gym or the fitness space is very
inclusive. And to a good degree, they're
absolutely right. You know, a lot of the fitness
industry is, you know, people who have never struggled with
fitness people, you know, we're ridiculous low body fat
percentages who would, you know,make it seem that you have to

(09:09):
look a certain way to belong into a gym, which is absolutely
ridiculous. The reason people get into the
gym is to pursue health and fitness, you know, whatever
stage at life that you're in. And again, we're, we're the,
with the GLP ones, if that helpsyou to, you know, pursue your,
your weight loss journey, which you've been struggling with.
You know, we've seen a time and time again, I have clients in

(09:32):
this position now who, who were on GLP ones, who, they've lost a
certain amount of weight. They actually feel confident
enough now to actually put themselves into a gym
environment where now we can help to, to train them and, and
learn how to strength train. And, you know, the, the
confidence that they, uh, build from that is, is unbelievable.
So like, it's, it's, it's, it's a, it's a bridge to get them

(09:53):
into the, to the fitness industry, which will only help
more personal trainers because, you know, they have more people
who, who want to get involved infitness.
So it's, it's, it's, I just findthat ironic.
The people that are complaining about these medications are also
the same people that would actually benefit from these
medications in terms of their business.
If you know, they weren't ignorant and they had their eyes

(10:14):
wide open and, you know, maybe they've, they followed the
science of, of, of the medications.
And obviously a big, I'm a big advocate now of I've kind of
obviously I was debunking a video there on kind of, you
know, the dangers of high protein diets and stuff like
that. Obviously, for a lot of my
career, I made my name on talking about training and
nutrition and misconceptions around certain diets and stuff

(10:37):
like that. And I've really kind of dived
into the last year and I went tomore on to this, the social
connection side of things when it comes to fitness.
And I believe that, you know, one of the benefits that people
actually don't talk about with these drugs now is that, you
know, a lot of people, people who are struggling with their
weight, I feel isolated. A lot of times they feel like,

(10:57):
you know, they can't, they, theycan't be in certain spaces
because they feel judged, which contributes to their loneliness.
And that loneliness a lot of thetime can umm, play into this
kind of emotional feedback with food.
So we use food, umm, as, as an emotional coping mechanisms for
the, for the things that we don't have in our life.
So if these weight loss drugs can help people to feel more

(11:19):
inclusive in certain spaces, youknow, that they get that social
connection, which actually will also help in terms of
emotionally and stuff like that as well.
So, you know, I, I think it's a,it's really important as
trainers that we, we provide a space where, you know, people
can feel accepted and they can create that, you know,
connection in, in, in certain spaces, whether it's, you know,
fitness classes or whatever, umm, to replace that, you know,

(11:41):
coping mechanism of field. And Carl, like you talk a lot
about social health on your platform, and I love hearing
about it. And umm, and I don't think
enough people realize how much that matters.
Like for so many of us, it's notthe food or the workout that
kind of break us. It's the loneliness, the lack of

(12:04):
connection, the feeling that nobody really gets it.
Like, when did you realize that belonging might be the most
important part of health? And was there a time in your own
life that that was missing? And then it then you found it
and then you realized, was that,was that the kind of process
that you went through? Yeah, 100%.

(12:24):
So I went through my own kind ofpersonal experience of like I've
been a personal trainer for 10 years now.
And you know, most of my life itwas like for me, health was, you
know, if you went to the gym andyou did push ups and you went
running, then you know, you werehealthy.
That's what health was. And, and you know, I still

(12:46):
obviously believe that that's obviously still important, like
your physical health important, they helps with your mental
health as well. But you know, a lot of people
don't talk about social health, They don't talk about the
relationships around you and howthat can dictate the quality of
your life and also your your long term health.
And there's loads of different kind of studies to to suggest
this as well. But I went through a stage there

(13:08):
where, you know, I was doing everything that you needed to do
in terms of self development. Like I was training, I was
running, I was eating the vegetables, I was, you know,
eating my protein as obviously is.
No, I'm an advocate protein. And, you know, I was reading the
books, I was doing the journaling sessions, I was doing
all the self development stuff that you need to do to be
healthy. But yeah, I still felt like

(13:30):
there was something often myselfin my life.
I still felt. Yeah, I couldn't, I, it was, it
was hard to kind of describe it,but you know, I just, I felt
unwell in a, in a way. And what I realized back in
November is that, you know, I had kind of isolated myself a
lot from the relationships around me.

(13:50):
And I, you know, I would, I wentreally kind of, you know,
focused completely on work and, you know, the laptop lifestyle
and running an online business and, you know, being a social
media creator and, and all this stuff.
And, and I woke up one day and Iwas like, I feel awful.
Like I'm doing all the things that's supposed to make me feel

(14:12):
better and getting out and goingfor a run and I'll go for AC dip
and I'll, you know, eat all my meals that are going to make me
feel healthy. Umm, and I was still training,
but I was training by myself andstuff like that.
And I realized that what I was doing is I was neglecting, eh,
the relationships around me, youknow, and I felt isolated and I
felt lonely and, you know, I needed to make a radical change

(14:34):
in my life because, you know, I was so hyper focused on work
that and like this hyper individualism and this kind of
hustle culture and stuff like that, that I, I forgot to, that,
you know, the reason that you'resupposed to do all these things,
The reason that we get healthy and we get fit and we go to the
gym and we lose weight and we build confidence and we do all
these things so that we can actually, you know, enjoy life.

(14:58):
And you only enjoy life when you're with other people.
I think, I like, I think the quality of your life is
determined by the quality of your relationships.
And I mean, if you're doing all this self development stuff and
for the people listening on thiscall, who will all be kind of on
a, on a weight loss pursuit withtheir medications, you know, the
reason that you're pursuing thisand the it's not actually the

(15:19):
weight loss that gives you the quality of life.
If the the weight loss is a toolto other aspects of your life
and if it means that you're moreconfident.
So, yeah, you can enjoy social outings and be more present than
not be up in your head and not even thinking about our other
people judging you. And actually be looking at the
person in front of you, your friend or your family member and
having a conversation with them and be completely engaged and

(15:39):
not thinking about other things because weight loss has given
you that. Like that is a wonderful thing.
Yeah. So weight loss is giving, giving
you that opportunity you need toconnect on a deeper level with
the people in your life that youlove.
And for me, I was doing all these things, but I was
neglecting relationships and I felt off from that.
And like what I came to learn from my research on loneliness

(16:00):
and on social health is like, you know, there's different
types of loneliness as well. Like you have transitional
loneliness and you have chronic loneliness.
So transitional loneliness is a very common experience that all
humans go through at all points of our lives.
Like you might get a new job andyou feel lonely.
You might move to a new city. You know, the kids might grow up
and leave the house. You might leave the house and

(16:21):
you know, you might like, you might solo travel and there's so
many different things. You might go through a divorce,
you might go through a breakup. And for me, it was like, you
know, I hit my 30s and all my friends who I used to hang
around with every day started tomove to different cities, and we
didn't see each other as often. And they started to have kids.
And it's like the people that you consider your best friends
you haven't actually spoken to in the last six months, or at

(16:42):
least you haven't seen in person.
You might send Whatsapps and stuff like that, but you're not
getting the same connection fromthat.
And I also retired from football, which was, you know,
giving me like, something that Ithink is really, really
important as well. Is that like if you can join
some sort of like a community group that is involved in
fitness, you don't just get the health benefits from the
fitness, but you get the health benefits from being part of a

(17:03):
community. And I had that from like 4 years
of age up until 30 where, you know, every single week weather
was raining out and I didn't want to go train.
And I had to because I had teammates and had a manager who
were relying on me to be there. And, and I kind of lost that
then, which, you know, probably had a big impact on how I was
feeling as well without realizing.
So I wasn't seeing my friends asmuch.

(17:24):
I wasn't playing sport. I had moved out from my family
home where there was like 10 of us living in a tree bed house at
one stage, but just bodies all over the place.
So I went from like a house thatwas filled with, you know,
conversation and arguments and laughter to the definite sound
of silence living in A1 bed flatby myself.
You know, I also went through a breakup.
I was in a relationship for the best part of my 20s, you know,

(17:45):
and even though it was a little bit toxic at times, you know, we
were young and in love. We just didn't know how to
communicate our our frustrations.
So all these little events were,you know, adding up together to
then one day I just woke up and I was like, Oh, this is weird.
What is this feeling that I feel?
It's loneliness. Umm, and, and that kind of got
me really intrigued in that topic.

(18:06):
And then, you know, what I foundout from that was that like, you
know, one in four adults worldwide, you know, suffer with
loneliness on a regular basis. And so it's, it's prevalent all
over the world. And, you know, society
contributes to this because, youknow, even in a digital age now,
like, you know, instead of instead of going out to a
restaurant and having food with a friend, we just, you know, get

(18:28):
a just eats delivered straight to the door.
Or, you know, instead of, you know, going out and eh, you
know, talking to the waitress, we can scan the barcode.
Or instead of talking to the checkout lady in Tesco, we can
just, eh, go to the self-serve and checkout.
Or, you know, there's so many different examples where we've
traded human connection or humaninteraction for a screen or for

(18:49):
a computer. And you know, if you look at the
statistics, we spend more time than ever before.
On average, we spend about 7 hours a day by ourselves.
If you're over 65, you spend from 7 to 10 hours alone by
yourself. Umm, people are spending less
time with family, less time withfriends.
Umm, less time with children, spending more time on screens,

(19:10):
less time outdoors. Umm, people are getting married
less 50. There's a 50% drop in the last
30 years of people getting married.
Umm, less people are having children, less people are living
together. Uh, there's a huge increase in
one household, Umm, people live living by themselves.
Umm, and this is also contributing to a lot of people
kind of dying by themselves in their apartments and in their

(19:33):
houses and no one even realizingthat they're gone.
And I, when I was doing a talk on this back in January and that
blown, I talked about something called, eh, Kotakushi, which is
basically a Japanese term, whichmeans lonely deaths.
And basically it's, you know, people who die alone, unnoticed,
uh, for months at a time without, uh, you know, people
realizing that they're dead. And, and you know, that's not

(19:55):
just in Japan as well. This is prevalent all over the
Western Germany and Italy. Umm, and you know, it's starting
to pick up as well in the UK andIreland as well.
So there's there's a lot of people who are living alone.
Prevalent in Japan though, isn'tit?
Yeah, yeah. Japan's, Japan and South Korea
are like the, the gold standardsof what you don't want your
society to look like. And, and in Japan as well, they

(20:18):
have a thing called a Croce, which is basically, you know,
it's where they glorify, glorify, Yeah.
Relentless productivity. And, you know, it's like work
until you fall asleep at the desk and then continue to work
and work again. And they, they prioritize this
kind of hustle culture, hyper individualism over community and
friends. And, you know, maybe don't take
that last e-mail. Maybe go out and have a walk

(20:40):
with a friend or maybe go to your fitness class and, you
know, spend time in your community and stuff like that.
And I think we've gotten furtherand further away from community
and relationships and the importance of that for a
successful life. And so I wanted to take that
back into kind of, you know, thefitness industry and into my own
kind of business and be like, OK, you know, something that's
really missing here is actually the importance of community when

(21:02):
pursuing health and fitness. And so I wanted to make that a
little bit more prevalent in thefitness industry that people
understand that, you know, don'tsacrifice, you know, the people
that you love or the relationships that you love for,
for whatever goal it is. Like I always say to people
like, you know, yes, pursue weight loss, you know, yes,
weight loss is great, but don't be afraid to consume excess

(21:25):
calories, You know, going out and having dinner with your
friends or your family because you have a weight loss goal.
Like weight loss is supposed to complement your life.
It's not supposed to take it over.
And I think, you know, if that'sa message that we can does.
Happen a lot though. It does 100%.
Happens a lot because people, people, you know, of course
people have a goal that they want to achieve.

(21:46):
Umm, but then a lot of the timesthen we can just take it to the
extreme. And that's why we kind of need
to pull people back and like, you know what, you can go out
and have, you know, cheesecake and A, and a drink with your
friend and you know, your, your,your goals to pursue weight loss
are still going to be there tomorrow.
Yeah. And I find it really interesting
what you said as well about weight loss and confidence,

(22:09):
confidence and like being present.
Like I, that kind of just struckA chord with me there as well,
because it's something that I haven't noticed until you said
it about how because I have lostweight, I umm, if, if I'm
talking to somebody, I'm speaking to them, but I'm also
listening now to what they have to say.

(22:31):
Instead of shifting myself around, making sure that my
roles aren't showing, making sure that my hair is OK, tying
up my jacket or continuously just my own in my own mind,
focus on exactly how I look because that's what I had to do.
That's the only way that I couldmake my feel myself feel
comfortable. To sit there or stand there in
front of people was to make myself look presentable.

(22:54):
You're putting yourself in new spaces as well.
Like even if you think of the gym, do what I mean like.
So I think 100%, yeah. It's coming from yeah, yeah,
it's not just like before I would have like just hid away
from so many of those scenarios.Whereas now it's like, God, I
can't wait. And our gym, as I mentioned
before, has put in a sauna. Like I would have never gone
into a sauna in the gym or like all these ripped people.

(23:16):
And I hope like whereas now I'm like, no, this actually nice get
chatting to people, get to know their members, all this kind of
stuff. And it's like, yeah, it is a
whole, a whole new kind of thing.
A couple, yeah, a couple of things.
Car, they're touched on one, Japan I find fascinating because
it is one of the countries equally that is put on a
pedestal as being one of the healthiest in terms of obesity,

(23:36):
in terms of the world. And it's interesting.
That you and their food is phenomenal.
So it's interesting on one side you're like, look at here is a
country that is put on a pedestal as being one of the
healthiest and least obese countries in the world.
Yet maybe mental health wise that's not actually on the
decline, which which is interesting.
Yeah, very interesting. Was it?

(23:57):
Is that where Katherine Thomas went?
Yeah, it was. Yeah.
It's where it's where a lot of them like you want Harry and the
the. Johann Harry did as well.
Yeah, A. Lot and the other aspect, Carl,
then they're about umm, that social connection For me, the
1st place that I think I got true social connection in terms
of anything fitness rate, it wasactually not too far from your

(24:19):
front door down in Wicklow, in CrossFit and Wicklow.
So ah, yes, strength, Strength. Wicklow, I think they're called.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Wicklow strengthen fitness to
work CrossFit Wicklow back in the day and that's where I first
joined and got to I guess form atribe as I'll call them like of

(24:41):
people that just got me not juston the like the the journey or
stuff like that. Now this is going back.
God, I don't know how many yearsago when I was when I first
moved to a club you're. Still in contact with them
though aren't. You oh massively, massively
lifelong friends was up out in Dublin with them this weekend.
Like they are my literally my tribe, some of the people from
there. And yeah, it just changes your

(25:02):
whole experience of engaging with with kind of movement or
health or well-being when you have that human connection with
other people around you. Like, yeah, I, I think it's
mass, I think it's massive. And it's just something that,
umm, it's just something that I think a lot of people, eh, you
know, bypass or ignore or just aren't aware of when they're

(25:23):
talking about health and fitnessand the importance of health and
fitness. But like, you know, going to
going to the gym by yourself andtrain and daily and, you know,
following an app and stuff like that.
Like, I understand people have personal goals and umm, you
know, maybe it's easy for them to kind of work off their own
schedule, get to the gym and train and then head home and

(25:44):
stuff like that. But I think if you can even
incorporate maybe going to a class once a week where you're,
where you're interacting with other people, umm, like the
benefits that you get out of that, not just besides the
physical benefits, it's, it's so, so important.
Umm, you know, they did, eh, there's a, there's a study that
I continue to reference wheneverI'm doing talks about, you know,

(26:06):
the importance of relationships and them, it's the, the Harvard,
eh, study of adult development. And essentially what they did is
they track these, they track these men from like 7 years of
age up until they die up until 7580.
And and then, you know, they, they asked them, they asked them
as they get them to do surveys and stuff like that.

(26:27):
And like they use all different demographics from like Harvard
students to underprivileged Boston boys.
So like all kind of different openings and stuff like that.
And they are just ask some simple questions like, you know,
what does success mean to you? And what does health and
happiness mean to you? You know, and a lot of, a lot of
the times when they started off this, this research study, you

(26:49):
know, people would come back andsay, you know, well, if I am,
you know, rich and famous, and if I have this amount of money
and I have this house and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, you
know, that will be success and that will be fulfillment and
that will be happiness and, and you know, then I'll feel healthy
and all this stuff, you know, And what they found over time
was that like the happiest and the healthiest individuals were
all the ones who were able to maintain strong, meaningful

(27:10):
connections with both their friends, their family and their
community as well. And the ones who had the worst
health outcomes were actually the ones that weren't able to
maintain relationships with front friends and family for
whatever reasons. There was loads of different
reasons to why they they couldn't maintain relationships.
1 was like social and or emotional intelligence and the,
the inability to forgive and stuff like that, you know, but

(27:32):
it, it goes to show that, yeah, why we what we think health is
and what health is and what happiness is, you know, can
sometimes be mis misconstrued. And I think, you know, if you
have healthy relationships in your life, both with friends,
family and your community, I think there has to be a, a, a
degree of all because you can have a, like a loving partner,
but you could be, you know, missing that connection with a

(27:54):
community or vice versa. You could have, you know, a
community of people that you love, but you, maybe you don't
have them connections with deep connections with friends or
family. You know, I think you need a
little bit of an aspect of all of that.
And like, that is the biggest predictor of longevity.
And when I, we, we speak about Japan as well, There's also
parts of Japan where, you know, you have these like tribes that

(28:15):
are live until like 8090 years of age, these old women, you
know, smoking and everything, but they live with all their
generations as well. And they haven't actually, you
know, you know, being integratedinto that other type of a
lifestyle that you can see in Japan.
And again, like, I think they've, they've done loads of
different documentaries on this.It's like, why are these people
living so long and stuff like that?

(28:36):
And a big aspect of it is the social connection and being
involved in the community. Yeah.
And, and your family not moving too far away from you.
Whereas obviously we live in a in a, in a world now where, you
know, you could be living on theother side of the world to the
people that you grew up with. Yeah.
Exactly. Exactly.
I think that's going to be us like in our 90s with a bag of
hands down. The green recording for a social

(29:00):
connection would be there, like taking our teeth out so we can
sip out. Yeah, you'll be like to health
idea you're kind of druids. So Carol, I'm just going to take
you back to the start. Like before the uneducated PT,
before the memes, before the podcast, was this always the
plan? Was health and fitness something

(29:22):
that you were drawn to from an early age or did like kind of
steer you, umm, in that direction?
And was this something that you expected?
Yeah, no, it definitely wasn't something I expected.
I definitely didn't expect to bedoing what I'm what I'm doing
today. And like I said, I had multiple
different jobs that I was, I wasworking at the time.
I was, you know, over in Spain for a period of time where, you

(29:44):
know, I was out on the streets trying to pull people into pubs.
And, you know, I was in the Armyfor a little bit and I was, you
know, doing wedding venues and being a barman, I thought the
worst barman ever in the world of history pulling the point.
I was a metal sheet worker for atime being.
So I was kind of still just trying to find my feet, trying

(30:06):
to figure out what I wanted to do with myself and into a kind
of personal training course. And you know, like I said, so
you know, a lot of the people that were in there, they were
far more into fitness and into the gym than I was at the time.
Biting Why, why I've lasted so long, whereas a lot of people
who probably were doing the course aren't even in the

(30:28):
industry anymore is because there's this misconception that
you need to be into fitness to be, umm, successful in the
fitness industry. When, you know, the
misconception is it's not about being into fitness, It's about
being into people. It's about one thing and willing
to help people. It's about being empathetic and
compassionate and, you know, wanting people to succeed and

(30:48):
getting as much joy out of otherpeople succeeding, umm, as
succeeding yourself. And I think, I think that's why,
umm, you know, I've lasted as long as I have in the fitness
industry is because, you know, understanding what people want,
what people need and, and being able to be attentive to people.

(31:08):
And that's where you see kind ofout of the, the the bitchiness
and stuff like that comes in thefitness industry as you kind of
have these two kinds of people and people here, you know, we're
in the fitness industry purely in terms of ego and want them to
just, you know, get pictures with them with off and get loads
of likes and loads of validation.

(31:29):
And then, you know, pretend that, you know, they know how to
help actual everyday people. And then they might throw an app
out that, you know, doesn't really support people or give
them the give them the educationor the accountability that that,
that they need versus, you know,people who actually are willing
to go the extra mile to help people.
And I think that's also where does the the gap in empathy

(31:50):
probably comes from, as you know, people who have been very
self-serving versus those who actually are there to to help
me. Yeah, like Long story short, it
was definitely wasn't something that I planned on doing.
Eh, but like most great things, it's like, I don't, I don't
think, I don't think you find your passion.

(32:12):
I think you created and, and youknow, I've created a life out of
this thing that I felt umm, and I think that can be, you know,
you can join anything that if umm, if you kind of do it with,
you know, wanting, wanting to help people at the at the
forefront of your mind. Yeah, yeah.
I think if you have that, you know, no matter who you are, you

(32:33):
can be a success in it. I think it's interesting because
I saw something a couple of things there.
So when I had lost all my weightbefore, the only kind of time
ever where I'd lost a sizeable mid weight back in 2011.
And of course back then I thought I'm fixed now should the

(32:53):
way it's gone, I've touched on this before, but I've gone fixed
way. It's gone.
That sounds now what am I going to do?
Want to become personal trainer so I can help other people.
So I went off did my whatever 16week course or whatever it was
up in Dublin and I thought, great, I'm personal trainer now
and I now know on reflection, that's absolutely not what makes
you a personal trainer is that yes, there's some eh and I'd say

(33:15):
even some questionable knowledgethat are shared in some of those
courses, but there's like that was yeah, yeah, like literally
eh like it's mentally when I think back in it now, Oh my God.
Anyway, umm. But like, that's what might get
you the piece of paper, but in terms of making you a personal
trainer is that connection, understanding with people.
And this brings me to the thing that, umm, when I moved from

(33:37):
Wicklow back to Sligo back in 2019.
And then at that point I would have been, I'd say I was maybe
20. I don't know.
I'm going to say maybe 21, maybe22 stone at that stage.
I don't know. Now I'm about 6 foot, 6 foot
one. I'm quite broad.
So people always tell me, Oh, you carry your weight.
Well, that lovely compliment, you carry your weight.

(33:57):
Well, rabbit, rabbit hole won't go there.
But anyway, and I was amazed at the amount of people that were
getting back in touch from me tobe like, oh, Paddy, you're going
to your boxer size classes again.
Are you going to your classes again?
I'm like, huh, I'm like, how, how are these people ask me if
we want to do this when I look like this?

(34:19):
And I was like, seriously, you're you're wondering if I'm
going to be doing because again,in my head, I this whole
narrative written about myself, remembering about my weight.
I'm about my side and about how how much I devalued myself
because of my weight when the reality was these people were
like, no, Paddy, you get it. We want, we don't want someone

(34:39):
that's ripped in tread. You get what we're going
through. We don't give a fuck about the
ABS and about having to be ripped in tread and all.
We want somebody that actually can understand that if we're
there trying to do like, I don'tknow, a Berkby or something like
that, We are fearing for the love of God, that our T-shirts
going to roll up and our tummy'sgoing to hop out.
Or that if we're doing press UPSthat we're worrying about our

(35:00):
Bingo Wings T-shirt run up, thatkind of stuff.
And you get that that's what we want to come to you.
But the reason I'm bringing thisup as well is because I actually
saw somebody who I respect, umm,a personal trainer, but they
actually had a poll up recently about would you train with a
trainer who was out of shape? And, and I also find this
interesting. I've never been in shape.

(35:21):
I would never say I've been in shape ever.
I've been thinner, but I have never been in shape.
Yet it's a big difference, isn't?
It a big difference, yeah. But anyway, it was quite a
negative slant on if a personal trainer isn't in the traditional
in shape that then that devaluesthem as a personal trainer.
This is a this is a debate that is like gone on since industry,

(35:43):
I suppose, started to have a have more of a dynamic of
trainers in it. And I think you've seen a huge
jump of trainers who have becomemore successful, who are, you
know, not the typical, you know what, why you expect the trainer
to look like in in the fitness industry.
And it's like, you know, this old like your your body is your

(36:03):
business cards slogan crap that you hear.
And I think a lot of people trying to get confused that with
this argument. And it's like, you know, if, if,
if you if, if your business is purely based on how you look and
you're trying to be like, you know, 8%, nine percent body fat

(36:24):
all year round. Like you're not going to be able
to show up for your clients. You're not going to be
productive, you're not going to be present, you're not going to
be, you know, you're constantly just thinking about maintaining
an unrealistic physique for mostpeople, unless you're some sort
of a genetic freak. But but most people, you know,
they have to work really, reallyhard to to stay in that kind of
shape all year round. And I think again, it's like

(36:48):
you're, you're serving a self-serving a goal there versus
like I said, it's, it's not about being into fitness, it's
not hoping into yourself, it's about being into people.
And I think people, people get that straight away.
People, people know if like you're, you really care about
them, if you're really listeningto them, if you're actually
attentive to them, if you're actually pushing them to, to do

(37:09):
better. I, I know myself like, you know,
if I feel that someone you know,is rooting for me to do well,
I'm more inclined to take their advice on board.
You know, if I feel like I'm notbeing seen by that person, I'm
less inclined to want to work with them.
Like I don't care if someone, you know, it has the, you know,
perfect Greek God physique. If I feel like, you know, I'm

(37:32):
not being seen by that person, you know, I really don't care
what their physique looks like. So I think, you know, instead of
your, your body being your business card, like your
business card is, is how you hold yourself, how you treat
people, how you communicate, umm, all these things like I, I,
I do think that you should walk the walk in terms of, you know,

(37:52):
actively being pursuing health, actively pursuing fitness.
Umm, but how you look is not very important to me at all
because people, people come in all shapes and sizes.
People have all different types of genetics.
Umm, but like fundamentally the question is, can you get me from
A to B? Can you get me where I want to
be? And if the answer is yes, then I
think that's the, the only thingthat that matters.

(38:13):
And like, I always like to use the, when I'm arguing with
personal trainers on this online, I always like to use the
eh, Jose Mourinho, eh, argument.I'm like, well, Jose Mourinho
wasn't the greatest football in the world.
Boy, one of the greatest managers.
So would you not want to be, would you not want to be managed
by him during his peak? And then, you know, they have,
they have nothing to say about that, you know, And then I think

(38:34):
if you can relate it into thingslike that, it's like, you know,
even messy, the greatest footballer in the world and
needed coaches. Absolutely, because I'd even
think that about my day job thatI do like I lo, so my kind of
day job full time is umm, like apeople manager, some HR stuff
and that, and I love that. And it's something that I would
consider I'm good at. But if I used to think of the
work that like my, my folks are,they're, they're way better at

(38:57):
that than me. So they're like way better at
kind of their day in their outfits.
But I can guide them, coach them, help them develop all that
kind of stuff because I, I guessagain, the, the bits that are
needed for that kind of kind of thing.
So that is then talking about fighting with personal trainers.
So when we had a doctor Mick rotting on, I played in the clip

(39:21):
of Gillian Michaels from The Biggest Loser USA and eh, she is
somebody who I would have lookedup to quite a lot for various
reasons, but. Back in when you were on TV, I'd
say wasn't. It Yeah yeah yeah yeah but even
since like I would have like shewent a bit Cray Cray with some
of her stuff like but more recently like she she has gone

(39:42):
hell for a leather on the whole eat less move more and eh don't
come down and like the whole other side of how bad and
dangerous and negative GLP one medication are for you now this
is the same woman that was pushing her own kind of uh diet
pills and all this kind of stuffas well like not so long ago I
think that's an important element here too but like what

(40:03):
kind of interactions do you get from other person from from your
peers in the industry umm where they see you kind of being
supportive and compassionate towards people that are on GLP
one because I see even from whenwe did when I when I did the
Catherine Thomas show earlier this year and even just from
that little. Thing there was 2 personal

(40:25):
trainers in particular that justfucking were going hell for
later on me with how how could you be there is no way you can
be a qualified umm confidence professional if you're
encouraging people to take pillsand portions and stuff I was
like but it's a medication it's not a pill and a portion type
yeah so I'd love to know what's that like I.
Think now I'm, I think I'm quitelucky as in I've kind of maybe

(40:48):
be maybe because I can be quite umm, you know, polarizing that a
lot of the personal trainers whoI don't want on my on my page.
I've probably left my page a long time ago.
And to be fair, I have a quite agood following of like, you
know, well educated dietitians and fitness professionals and

(41:10):
evidence based practitioners, which is which is nice.
So I don't really get too much pushback on my page anymore.
I think maybe, maybe I think I did a post maybe about two years
ago where I this and yeah, I gothuge pushback because I think
there was again, inflation out there even two years ago where
there was more kind of ignorant trainers and stuff like that.

(41:32):
I think I think one thing that'sgoing on is that a lot of
personal trainers, you know, a lot of them use the messaging a
lot of the times of, you know, there are no quick fixes.
You need to, you know, do something that's sustainable.
And they were looking at like you had this diet culture that
was selling diet pills and, you know, weight loss gimmicks and,

(41:54):
you know, down this for lose 10 lbs in 10 days and stuff like
that. And, you know, there was
obviously a lot of pushback against that.
And I think what they've done isthey've conflated, you know,
actual medication with, you know, weight loss kind of, you
know, gimmicks like that and stuff like that.
So again, it, it's definitely has to be ignorance is, is one
part of it. And I think again, another part

(42:16):
of it has to be kind of insecurity.
I think like you just touched on, there's like, I think a lot
of it comes down to, eh, maybe abias because they're trying to
sell you a certain way of doing things.
And, you know, if that goes against that, then they're,
they're going to talk that as well.
And and then I also think that, you know, one thing that we

(42:37):
didn't touch on is this kind of health, you know, moral
superiority that people have, right?
So if you think about it, let's say you're a fitness trainer,
right? And all you have, not all you
have, but probably the thing that you feel that you get
respected for the most is being in shape.
Like being in shape is, is you signal sick.

(42:59):
You know, look at me, you know, I focus on my health.
I have discipline, I have willpower, I have all these
things. And you know, that separates you
100% yeah. Umm, like I worked so hard to
get here, like like this is me, you know, almost Braden, you

(43:19):
know, all the, the superiority that I have.
And now something has come in that could be, you know, life
changing to a huge, you know, umm, amount of people where it's
like now people have the help that they need in order to also
pursue health and fitness and also be able to, you know,
improve their body composition and build muscle and, you know,

(43:40):
be able to be inclusive in gyms and stay fit and stay healthy
and stuff like that. And I think that a lot of them
see that as a, you know, an attack on what what they are
compared to the rest of the population.
So I think there is an element of that as well.
And that's that's a play. It's like, OK, well, if

(44:01):
everyone's going to be held and are healthy and fit now, you
know, what do I have left? And I think there is a little
bit of that as well as this kindof, you know, moral superiority
of round. You know, I train every day and
I work really hard, even though what a lot of these personal
trainers won't tell you is that,you know, it's actually not hard
work for them because they absolutely love it.
They've probably grown up aroundfitness their whole life.

(44:21):
There isn't that much pushback for for them to be able to go to
the gym or push back for them tobe able to ruin our train.
You know, they've probably been brought up in a two parent
household where that home cookedmeals done from them every
night. They're probably genetically,
you know, designed to be able to, you know, stop eating
wonderful. So they've have have all these
things that they don't understand is working, working

(44:43):
for them as well on top of that.But then again, they'll, they'll
use this, you know, badge of honor that, you know, I'm into
fitness because I'm so hard working and I have so much
willpower and I'm so disciplined, even though they
really don't understand, uh, what it's like to be any other
person. Uh, this is.
Any other way? Yeah, this is something that
we've touched on I think twice or three times coincidentally

(45:04):
just over the last few podcasts where they've come up whereby
you will see this message off. Uh, you know, we all have the
same 24 hours. And usually it'll be kind of the
younger and naive just out of that sixteen week course that
like, hey, we're going to do this.
You got the same 24 hours. And as we just say, go tell that
to a parent that has three kids running around house that's up
at 6:00 in the morning working too job, you do not have the

(45:26):
same. And that's again, I think that
relatability to the people that you're trying to work on and
understanding their kind of lifestyle and their life and
stuff like that as well. I'd love to know, looping back
to that idea of community and the importance of community,
umm, social media, Facebook group, stuff like that.
Do you think good or bad for community?

(45:48):
Mixed bag, I would say mixed bag.
So like, I think it can be really, really helpful in terms
of like what we didn't have before is like, let's say you
lived in a town where you, you, you know, you didn't really
relate to the people around you that you didn't really relate to
your friend group. You had certain kind of, eh,
passions and hobbies that, you know, you couldn't find a, a
subgroup of people that you related to.
Like being able to find that online is, is absolutely

(46:11):
groundbreaking for, for some people.
And I think if you can use that to then, you know, meet up with
these, these people, these groups and kind of find your
tribe, I think that is like so beneficial.
But then again, you know, you have the, the other side of it
where it's like, you know, if you're just chronically online
because you're feeling lonely and because you don't have

(46:34):
anyone else and you're not kind of engaged in the, you know,
real world and going out and touching some grass and actually
having conversations with your friends and your family and your
community. You know, that's also
detrimental as well. Like, like I've used social
media to umm, you know, collect with lots of individuals that,
like, you know, I've, I'm very, very grateful for and, and made

(46:56):
great friendships. Like we wouldn't be able to, the
three of us wouldn't be able to sit here and have this
conversation if it wasn't for, you know, the, the, the digital
world that we live in. So I think there's so many huge
benefits to it. And you know, when I'm, when
I'm, when I'm warning people about the dangers of social
media, like I, I like, it's alsoabout being realistic as well.
It's like it's, it's not going anywhere And I don't think it

(47:19):
should go anywhere. Like, I'm not an advocate of
like taking 10 steps back in terms of the progression of
society or something like that. But it's just about kind of
understanding the, the dangers that can, that can come from
this. Like, you know, Speaking of the,
of the younger generation that we don't understand the
terminology to like like 18 to 24 year olds, They're actually
the loneliest demographic. Umm, in the world at the moment

(47:43):
where a lot of people would havethe misconception that it would
be, you know, elderly people living on their own, They're
probably the loneliest of yesterday, the most isolated,
but actually not, not the the loneliest.
The loneliest demographic is 18 to 24 year olds.
And I think social media obviously played a huge part.
And that because, you know, theygrew up in screens, you know,
they, they stopped going outside.
They stopped having a, you know,an outside childhood where, you

(48:06):
know, they'd go outside and playuntil the lamp posts came on
and, you know, played sports or,you know, tip the can with their
friends. And, you know, all these things
that we got to do when we were younger, they didn't get to do
when like less teens are socializing now and stuff like
that. Actually put up a real
interesting post the other day that, you know, it was something

(48:27):
that Jonathan Height spoke about.
It was like, you know, people think that at the Gen.
Z are are very responsible because they're not drinking as
much as as the older generationsdid.
But it's not that they're not drinking anymore.
Yeah, it's they're not doing anything anymore.
They're not drinking. They're not going out, They're
not driving, They're not socializing.
They're they're just staying at home sedating themselves on

(48:48):
screens. And, you know, when we talk
about like the rise in mental health issues, you know,
depression, anxiety, social anxiety, you know, suicidal
ideation, all these things, you know, no wonder they're,
they're, they're feeling the, these ways because, you know,
they haven't learned to interactwith their neighbor.
They haven't learned to interactwith their friends.
Umm. I was just going to say that

(49:10):
what's happening there in that generation we're learning from
because the for the people like me that have young children,
that's I am never, ever going toallow that to happen to them
ever. Because I can now see the what
how detrimental it is, you know?So yeah, we are learning.
We are, you know, I want to say that as well, but.

(49:32):
They have they've put they've put in, they've put in laws in
the in, in certain, certain countries.
I think in Australia, you like you, you can't be on social
media or until you're over 16. And I think they're introducing
that in other countries as well.And because they've obviously,
they've obviously noticed that the detrimental effects that
this is having on young teens. And like, you can see it from

(49:56):
like from 2010 when like Facebook and Bebo and all these
social media started to arise, That's when you had a huge drop
in, you know, all these different statistics between,
you know, people spending less time together, people not
interacting, you know, people having less social circles,
people having less friends. So, you know, I think there is a

(50:16):
big, huge correlation between obviously social media, this
loneliness, loneliness epidemic that we're we're in.
So it's just something for people to be aware of, I think.
I I love that Bieber got a mention.
There is no. Jesus Christ, Oh Bebo, that was
like that was like, Oh God, top weird.
Oh, it was brilliant. I love it.
And then like the the drama of who was in your pinned a top

(50:39):
friends or something like that. Yeah, yeah, you had your Yeah,
you had your top, Yeah, top 16 friends.
Yeah, yeah, That was. I was living in England.
Yeah, I was living in England. I.
Was living in England as well actually I had a 30, a Nokia
3310. I think I still have a best
phone in the world man. And you had a flash box.
It was one video you could have on your page.

(51:01):
Yeah, mine was probably the Vengaboys because it probably
still would be the Vengaboys. It's like.
Yeah, probably. It's great.
I just want to go. I just want to go back now,
Carl, to something else that youmentioned on your platform as
well. You've spoken about like
redefining the metrics of success and I found that really,
really interesting and sorry, I just lost my train of thought

(51:21):
there. And also, you know, just it
within, applying it all to the inanimous of just.
You're you're right. I was talking about hidden
metrics versus surface level metrics in terms of internal
weight loss. Yeah.
And I think that's a really, yeah, I think it's a, it's a
really important aspect, especially when you know, anyone

(51:43):
is going on. So anyone who, who might be
listening to this, who, who was on their own weight loss
journey, um, with GLP ones, um, or just on their own weight loss
journey by themselves or whatever it is, you know, if, if
you determine success, whether you've lost weight or not this
week, you're going to be in for a world of pain because you
know, it, it, it just doesn't work like that.

(52:05):
And you know, I again, weight loss shouldn't be the goal
forever as well. We should always be thinking
about, OK, like, you know, the main, that weight loss.
So, you know, what other ways can we think about success?
Because if you can have multipledifferent ways that you're
successful, then you have the opportunity to, to, to be
successful every single day. But if your only metric of
success is whether you've lost weight, then you know, you're,

(52:27):
you're cutting yourself short ofjoy more so than anything else.
And, you know, like we talked about, weight loss is just a
tool to improve people's qualityof, of lives.
And we, and we spoke about how, you know, umm, you know, if
weight loss helps you to be morepresent in conversations and to
be able to enjoy the, the company that you're in, that is
a huge win. But that's something that we, we

(52:48):
don't look at umm, you know, if,if weight loss helps you to, you
know, have more energy, so, you know, you can actually do
something after work because you're not exhausted and you
want to lie down on the couch. Like that's also a huge metric
of success. You know, if that means that you
are now comfortable and confident to socialize in many
different aspects. Maybe you're doing a class that

(53:10):
you've never done before. Maybe you want to try Zumba for
the first time, or you want to do paddle tennis or you know,
you want to do whatever it is. It's like you have all these
opportunities that come from the, you know, pursuit of weight
loss that isn't really just about weight loss itself.
And I think that's a really important aspect, even if, if
we, if we're kind of, uh, GLP ones, like if, if weight loss

(53:30):
helps you to be more confident in your skin.
So now you have the, uh, confidence or the opportunity
to, you know, go up and ask someone for their number and go
on a day like that could be a life changing thing for you that
like now you feel confident enough to try and get into a
relationship with someone, you know, or, or just have a
conversation with them. Like all these huge things that
that can come from your massive life changing.

(53:52):
So it's, it's not, it's, it's not about it.
It's not about the, the weight that you lose.
It's about the life that you gain.
So you have to understand as what is it that you want from
your life. Yeah, absolutely.
And you know, and the reason that that really, really struck
A chord with me was because I spent like when I say it out
loud, it's unbelievable. I spent 3 decades of my life

(54:14):
changed to a cycle of letting that metric, that number dictate
my worth. And when I tell you, my gosh, it
took me 12 months of what I was basically therapy to be able to
step away from that and to put my worth in other things.

(54:35):
And it's the hardest thing I, I've, I've found about this
journey is to take the focus away from the inanimate object
on the floor. And I talk about this all the
time on my Instagram and with mysubscribers and stuff, you know?
And once you do kind of step away from that, there's strength
in that, there's peace in that, and there's joy in that because

(54:56):
you start showing up in different parts of your life
that you didn't really notice that you weren't showing up in,
you know? I was going to say like on, on,
on that kind of the measures of success and what we look at for
success. Like one thing that I definitely
don't, you know, rely on heavilyin terms of measure for success.

(55:17):
Umm is, is the scales. I weigh myself and this is
something we spoke for quite a bit with Belinda, but I weigh
myself as a data point now purely in a, in a journey as
opposed to a Oh my God, I haven't lost a pound this week.
Very different relationship withit.
But umm, I think this past year is probably one of the, it's one

(55:38):
of the few, if if not the only attempt so far of, of kind of
weight loss for me whereby I don't give a fuck about other
people and what they're kind of like trying to make them happy.
And that's why like even in person now I'm like, I'm
actually challenging people whenthey say things to me or stuff
like that. Or even like yesterday I put up,
umm, A TikTok people will say things with and I know they'll
be saying it from a place of positive intent and things like

(56:03):
umm, oh God. Or little phrases even.
Like let's say I'll keep going and it's like, how far do you
want me to go? Like, like, you know, in terms
of weight loss or, umm, other phrases like, oh, you'd want to
stop losing weight now. And I'm sure in their mind, they
think this is a positive thing. And beforehand I would have been

(56:24):
very much like, Oh yeah, yeah, OK, thanks.
Whereas now I'm actually like, no, that doesn't, that doesn't
sit right with me in terms of where I, where I am now.
So actually, do you know what? That's probably not the best
phrase to say to, to somebody, but I asked ChatGPT, uh, good
old ChatGPT who is also a regular on the podcast.
We've never had them talk, but they get mentioned so a lot, so
such that, but I've seen somebody had a thing up on umm,

(56:46):
uh, it was probably tick tock, uh, about asking us based on
everything you know about me, what are my top five blind
spots? And it was interesting because
obviously this one was like, I don't know how much data I fed
into over the years and all thiskind of.
Stuff. My whole life is in there.
Yeah, literally one of the things it fed though was about
that need for external validation and accountability
versus internal consistency and kind of calmness and peace.

(57:09):
And I said that's mad because that's very much where my mind
has tried to be at now over the last kind of 8-9 months of kind
of that shift off. Couldn't give a fuck if I have
one follower, million followers and it does not cost me a
thought anymore. Or like the need to put a video
to make somebody in line. Like that's why even in terms of
the videos, but they're probablynot as frequent as they were
because it's like, I'll do and I'm ready.
Like when I want her shit like that.
Umm. But yeah, Chachi PT knows better

(57:31):
than we know ourselves, love. It.
Yeah, it's OK. Yeah, I think, I think that's a
really good point is sorry, sorry, you go ahead.
OK, so I just wanted to ask you then on the back of all of that,
what does success really look like to you now?
And how do you help people maybeunlearn the damaging like number

(57:55):
obsessed mindset that they're in?
Because you must see that day after day after day in the gym
where people are coming in, men and women that are just
completely obsessed with the, the number on the scale.
Even though there are, there could be 100 different
variables, umm, as to why your weight could go up by 2 lbs in
one day. And you can probably guarantee

(58:17):
that the, the reason that it's not is because it's pure fat
either. So how do you how do you help
people with that? Yeah.
Well, what I would say is, uh, just to even, uh, like to, to
repeat what you said in, in terms of how long it took you
to, to go on that journey of, you know, not being at war with

(58:39):
yourself over the scales. It's like when I'm, when I'm
saying this, obviously it's, it's a lot easy, easier to say
than it is to obviously implement.
And it's something that I think This is why I think like
podcasts that you do like this and, you know, having a voice
for people to kind of listen to when they're just going on their
walk. And it's just, it's not about

(59:01):
saying the thing. It's about saying the thing over
and over again in different waysand emphasizing.
And because what people need more than anything, you know, is
reassurance, I think. And like reassurance that, oh,
that's OK, this the scales will go up, the scales will go down,
the scales will stay the same. And again, it doesn't mean that
you are a failure or a success and it isn't, uh, based on

(59:25):
yourself worth, but like that conversation.
That's why I think, you know, having somebody who's going to
support you and who's going to be empathetic and he's going to
be compassionate and it's going to give you guidance is really
important. Because like what people need to
understand when they go on a weight loss journey is that, you
know, your biggest obstacle willprobably be yourself.
It will be the internal thoughts, it will be the

(59:46):
negative chatter. It will be, you know, days when
you're saying, oh, this isn't working, Oh, this isn't working
because you know, I'm this or I'm that and stuff like that.
So, you know, having someone to like, like you said, we are like
Patty said, we all have our blind spots.
And that's why, you know, no matter how self aware you are,
we all need someone to be able to kind of bounce off what we're

(01:00:07):
feeling, what we're saying that day to kind of keep us on course
with with the work and that we need to do.
And I always just say to even a client who let's say.
You know, they've had a really good week where, you know,
they've trained, they vet well, they've done all the things that
they need to do. They're they're non negotiables
for the week or whatever it is, you know, and then they jump on
the scales and they get disheartened because their their

(01:00:27):
goal is weight loss. Eh, we just kind of break that
down and being and, you know, ask the questions like, Oh,
well, what do you think you've done well this week?
And they're like, well, you know, I got to the gym three
days a week, you know, and you know, well, what were the
benefits of you going to the gymand do with scale way?
And they're like, well, I felt better after the gym.
OK. And what does what does that

(01:00:49):
mean in terms of your life? Well, I felt better in the gym.
And therefore, you know, when I went home, you know, I was in a
better mood with my kids or I wasn't a snappy with my partner
or is more productive and work or I was more present or, you
know, just mentally that I felt better.
And you're trying to walk them through, you know, all the
benefits that they're getting from this, a journey that
they're on that have absolutely nothing to to do with the scale

(01:01:11):
way. And again, it's, you know, it's,
it's not about the outcome, it'sabout who you're becoming in the
process. And you know, if you like who
you're becoming in the process from doing these things, umm,
it, it makes it easier to kind of stay on track with it.
But again, it's, it's, it's, it's a difficult, difficult
thing. And, umm, you know, I would
never like, yeah, yeah, and, andI would never diminish someone's

(01:01:35):
feelings because you're, you're allowed to feel disheartened
when you see that the scales is,is not going down or staying the
same and stuff like that. But then trying to become as
objective as possible in a very when we're in a very emotional
state, very difficult. And that's why it's, I think
it's important to have people who were there beside you who
can kind of, umm, you know, keepyou on track and, and keep you,

(01:01:57):
keep you grounded. Keep exactly, exactly.
And that. And again, that's also the power
of community. I think it's like, you know, if
you have a community, even if it's an online community where
people are chatting and talking about their wins and talking
about their struggles. And you know, let's say like
someone puts in about how they didn't lose this weight this
week and they feel disheartened.And then someone who's in a
similar experience or was in that experience three months

(01:02:19):
earlier is like, well, listen, don't worry because you know,
this is going to happen. But if you keep sticking at it,
this is what happened for me. And it's like, sometimes it's,
it's not even about, you know, the coach client relationship,
but also, you know, the community around you of the, of
people who are in a similar situation.
And, you know, having that reassurance from them and the,
the accountability and the support that you get from being

(01:02:42):
with other people and other people being in a similar boat.
I think that's just as powerful as as if not more powerful.
I think 100% that idea of umm, I, I kind of, I guess put it
into like what's in your circle of control versus what's not and
what can try, try and influence.Like I use circle of control
myself, like in every aspect of my life.
And it just gives you that mental, mental clarity of I can

(01:03:04):
never, I can never, uh, control definitely what number is going
to show on that scale as what's,when I stand on it, I can
influence it. So, uh, that kind of piece that
comes from it almost totally disconnects the number from, you
know, I don't know, it's a weirdthing, but it definitely is
something that gives me peace interms of, but the rudest
awakening I had in relation to that was back actually during
biggest series. So we were doing like 30 hours

(01:03:25):
of training a week, right? We were doing 5 hours of, uh,
exercise, full on workout, six days a week minimum.
Umm, and I was on about 1900 calories, uh, a day.
And there was one week I lost noweight, no way at whatsoever.
And I was just like, Oh my God. But anyway, uh, Carol, I'm

(01:03:45):
conscious of time as well. And one of the things that I'd
love to get your kind of SLA slant on door for people is if
there's somebody listening and they're on, say, a medicated
journey and they would really love to approach a personal
trainer to work with them. But they're afraid of maybe how
to bring up that conversation. If they should bring up that
conversation about kind of look at them on Monjaro Roman or

(01:04:08):
whatever the case might be, how what, what words of wisdom or
advice would you give them if they're in that place, if that's
the thing holding them back fromengaging with it?
That's a difficult question. I'm not sure if I have the
answer to that because I'm, I'm more conscious of being like
saying I'll just go for it because I do know that, you
know, if you get the, the thing where a lot of personal trainers

(01:04:31):
is a lot of personal trainers are experienced when they're
first starting off in the, in the gym.
Like you don't get, a lot of youdon't get, you do get somebody.
You don't get many experienced personal trainers because they
usually, you know, do their, do their gym floor work for a
couple of years and then they goon to, to do something else,
whether it's, you know, online coaching, go into a niche topic

(01:04:53):
or, you know, coach other coaches and stuff like that.
So my my biggest concern would be would be the exact same as
the actual client who's fear of being judged by someone who
doesn't understand what they're talking about.
But what I would say then is if you do get judged for that, that

(01:05:19):
is a reflection on their ignorance on how stupid that
person is rather than on you. Because you're in there trying
to better yourself, you're in there on your pursuit of self
development. You're in there like that.
It's, it's one of the things that breaks my heart the most
about umm, thinking about peoplestepping into the gym for the

(01:05:40):
first time and having a bad experience because of someone
who's ignorant or because someone who's arrogant and then
that deterring them from ever stepping in the gym again.
Whereas like it should be the case where they walk in, they
feel completely, you know, comfortable because people have
been kind to them. And like a lot of people in the
gym, you know, they would, they want to help people, they want

(01:06:00):
to support people. Like, you know, I love seeing
people from all different backgrounds in the gym, young
people, old people, all different sizes.
And what I would say is, is do your best to do your judgilans,
like if you, if you need to kindof ask them about or ask their
clients about them and stuff like that.
I think you, I think you get you, every personal trainer now

(01:06:21):
has some sort of a social media account and I think you can kind
of get a little bit of understanding on their messaging
through that as well, which might help some personal
trainers. Obviously not as much.
Umm, but yeah, I, I, I don't, I don't know if I have the, the
right answer other than like, itwould be great to see, you know,
more people being, you know, able to be open and transparent

(01:06:45):
about their, their journey without judgment.
And I think that's one of the reasons that I'm so vocal on
social media. Like, I don't know, Belinda,
what would your answer be? Because you're obviously working
with a trainer now at the moment.
Yeah, I am. But to be honest with you, umm,
I didn't say anything when I joined the gym 1st, and I've
been in that gym nearly six months now, 3-4 times a week.

(01:07:07):
And they all know now because they follow me on social media.
And when I spoke to the owner ofthe gym, he was so interested.
Like literally just wanted to know absolutely everything about
it. And that's what you want.
You want people to be engaging, you want people to be
inquisitive, you know, So it's, it's exciting.

(01:07:27):
Like this is a a very, very, very, very exciting time in
history because this is the first time that these
medications or any kind of medication like this is
available to people that need it, you know?
And yeah, I just think everybodyshould be, should be wanting to
know about it because it ain't gone away.

(01:07:48):
Umm, Belinda, do you have any final questions on your side?
Because I don't give an out to me later.
Saint Patty, you cut me off. You didn't my.
No, you're all good, actually. Yeah, it's just reading there.
You're good. The grief I do get from this
woman outside of the podcast in terms of I wanted to ask this or
want to ask that, but Carl Rook,thank you so much for taking

(01:08:10):
time out of your day because I know like you, you, you wear
many different hats. Yeah, for many different things.
Thank you for the, ER advocacy that you do and the different
guises that that that kind of takes on social media, off
social media. And it's honestly been been a
pleasure having you on with us. And thanks for everything that
you do, not just for people thatare on GOP ones, but in general

(01:08:33):
in terms of trying to create a better, ER, Wellness space now,
not just fitness, but in terms of that mental and kind of
social space as well. Umm, it's, it's Trojan work.
And I wish we'd more. People and this is phenomenal.
It's brilliant, Carol, well done.
Your platform's amazing and thanks for putting up that post
as well about GLP one like that's that's really, really
good. More people need to do it.

(01:08:54):
I'll let. Yeah, I'll just say thanks.
Well, listen, it's my absolute pleasure and and thank you for
having me. And also I think the two of you
are doing incredible work and you should be very proud of
yourself so. Thanks.
Tell me. Mommy said that none of this
conversation should be taken as medical advice for you.
Before starting or changing any medical or Wellness treatment,

(01:09:16):
always consult your GP and medical care team.

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