Episode 006: What's Really Behind Your Harmless Habits?

What if the things you're reaching for to feel alive are actually draining the life out of you? 

Most of us have seemingly harmless habits we've developed to cope with stress, boredom, or emotional voids. Whether it's that nightly glass of wine after a hard day, scrolling through explicit content online, or constantly seeking validation through achievement and people-pleasing – these coping mechanisms often masquerade as innocent indulgences.

In this raw, unfiltered conversation, we dive deep into society's most normalized addictions: alcohol, pornography, drugs, and even less obvious ones like perfectionism and constant striving. We share shocking statistics – like OnlyFans' $6.63 billion in annual revenue and studies showing over 90% of men and 60% of women consumed pornography last month – that reveal just how pervasive these issues have become.

But this isn't about shame or judgment. We explore the physiological reasons these habits hook us, rewiring our brains and creating escalating cycles that leave us needing more extreme stimulation for the same reward. We discuss the devastating global impact, including the direct connection between pornography consumption and human trafficking, with an estimated 95% of produced pornography coming from sexually exploited women and children.

Throughout our discussion, we offer practical steps for breaking free – from 30-day fasting challenges to journaling exercises – and recommend resources like Annie Grace's "The Naked Mind" and PureHope.net for those seeking recovery. Most importantly, we share a message of hope: what if these cravings are just misdiagnosed homesickness for something greater? As C.S. Lewis reminds us, perhaps our desires aren't too strong but too weak – we're settling for mud pies when God offers us the ocean.

Ready to examine what might be holding you back from experiencing true freedom and abundant life? This conversation might just be your first step toward breaking free.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Well, good morning, friend, good morning.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
I am so excited about this conversation today.
I can hardly stand it.

Speaker 1 (00:17):
I know, talk about eager.
It's like bubbling up in thebelly.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
I know and I say it every time, but I especially
mean it today because it'sgetting juicy, juicy, juicy.
We're talking money, sex power,alcohol, drugs, porn all of the
so-called harmless things thatmany of us are consuming on a
regular basis to cope with life,to feel alive.

(00:42):
But oftentimes it's to fill avoid and to escape from reality,
and I think a lot of us are noteven realizing it.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
And I think that's the key right there.
Most people aren't evenrealizing it.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
Yeah, and it also makes me think of one of my
favorite quotes that I seeflying around social media.
I wonder if you've seen it too.
Lots of different variations,but it's all about hating small
talk.
And so it goes something like Ilove talking about things with
substance and depth, things thatmake you feel alive, god,

(01:11):
growth, sex, music that movesyou.
And it goes on to say somethinglike I like people with
substance, not surface.
I have no interest in talkingabout the weather, what's for
dinner or other people.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
Amen.
Yeah, there's nothing worsethan talking small talk, right.
I hate it when you end up atthose corporate dinners or even
family dinners and you'retalking about the things that
are just mindless.
It's where the introvert in mestarts to come out and I start
to shrivel up on the inside andit's like, please, how do I
escape?
That's it.
So, yeah, we're going to doreal talk here today.

(01:47):
Yeah, with substance.

Speaker 2 (01:49):
Yeah, in all seriousness, this is a really
important eye-openingconversation because there are
so many down-trickleconsequences of these so-called
harmless habits, some of which,frankly, came as a real surprise
to me as I even prepared forthis conversation today.
It's kind of flipping thescript on how I'm thinking about
some of these things.

Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yeah, yeah, it's easy to become numb or desensitized
to what culture thinks is normal, and you realize that things
that are seemingly innocent canactually put us into a
stronghold and it really keepsus from being who God called us

(02:31):
to be the very best.
It slows us down, it pulls usdown, it's an anchor and
oftentimes, if we're not careful, we know that the enemy comes
to kill, steal and destroy.
But the reality is too.
He comes very sly, he's notscreaming in your face, he can

(02:52):
be gentle and slow, and we getinto the situation where we
start to say yes to things thatare not of God.
It's not God's best.
It may not be against God, butit's not God's best.
And then, when we say yes, andthen we say yes again, and then
a yes becomes another yes, itliterally starts to compound and

(03:14):
before you know it, we'vereally lost a piece of ourself
to either the control that someof these things can have on us,
like money, like sex, porn,alcohol, drugs, you name it.
It's what I call the slow fade,yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:31):
Yeah, I read this post by Russell Brandt that
stopped me in my tracks and I'mgoing to paraphrase a little bit
here.
But he said there's nothingmore often misdiagnosed than our
homesickness for heaven.
What we think we want ismultiple random sex partners,
drugs, alcohol, a new partner, anew house, a better car, a

(03:56):
certain kind of vacation.
But what we really want, ourdeepest desires, what we crave,
is the person, capital P that wewere made for and the place
that we were made for Amen.

Speaker 1 (04:09):
That's so beautiful, alisa, so many good things
coming out of Russell Brandthese days, it's true.
Anywho, it just goes to showyou that we're all hungry.
We all have a flesh hunger inus and we want that hunger to be
fulfilled.
It could be a hunger not to bebored.
It could be a hunger to feelexcitement, to feel joy, just to

(04:36):
feed the flesh.
It's not a physical hunger,like I'm hungry for food, but we
desire those dopamine hits, therush, the happiness, the
fulfillment of life, and it justdoesn't come through the way of
the world.
And so we're going to dive intowhat are the illusions that the

(04:57):
world offers that feed thathunger but actually create a
deeper void.
It's like the cavern, it's likea huge Grand Canyon in our soul
that just gets bigger andbigger and bigger when we allow
the world to feed that internalsoul hunger.
And there was a movie that cameout in 2014.

(05:18):
It's called the Song.
It's an incredible movie doneincredibly well.
If you haven't watched it, Ihighly recommend it.
And it's a depiction, modernday era, of King Solomon's life,
and it's about this simple man,simple young man, you know,
good looking, it's got all thischarisma and he's got an

(05:39):
incredible talent in music andit's about how he comes from
very humble beginnings, withsome true tragedy that he had to
grow up in, but he still islike this humble, gentle soul
and then he starts to rise infame and it's about how he
actually gave up the things ofthe Lord to actually feed the

(06:02):
things of the world and thenit's his redemption back.
But it's a beautiful example ofwhat we are talking about today
.
So, for anyone listening, onceyou get through this episode, go
watch that movie and it's justgoing to stir up your soul to
exactly what we're talking about.

Speaker 2 (06:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (06:20):
So what are those things that society is telling
us that could start to feed thewrong thing in our soul?

Speaker 2 (06:28):
Loneliness, addiction , instant gratification, and
society is really capitalizingon all of these things in the
name of individual empowermentand entitlement.
Entitlement, right.
But you know I think it'simportant to say I think you
mentioned this like, all ofthose desires are natural, human

(06:48):
, you know tendencies orinclinations, right, which is
why we have to be so intentionalabout keeping those things
really in check and be consciousabout how we're choosing to
fill those needs.
But listen to some of thesestats in terms of how society is
really capitalizing and they'reseizing an opportunity and

(07:10):
they're feeding us content thatcreates this negative behavioral
reinforcement trap that many ofus are kind of blindly walking
right into.
So let's look at OnlyFans.
What is OnlyFans?
I was just going to say I'mthinking you're not familiar
with OnlyFans and I am notfamiliar, thank goodness either.

(07:32):
Okay, but for those who aren'taware, my understanding is it's
a social media platform.
Think of Instagram, but thinkof Instagram without censorship
and sort of a pay-to-play, ifyou will, rather than likes,
people can tip you, they canrequest custom content and they

(07:54):
can pay to access your privatefeed.
Okay, oh, wow, okay, you'rehearing this for the first time.

Speaker 1 (08:00):
Yeah, I seriously don't know what OnlyFans is.

Speaker 2 (08:02):
And it's wildly popular.
Wait, just wait till I tell youthe stats, but my understanding
is that there are.
You know, there's some healthycontent on there, like you know
fitness or cooking classes, art,things like that but even
OnlyFans is upfront about thefact that the majority of their
revenue comes from sexuallyexplicit content, and what I

(08:27):
mean by that is things likeprivate live stream sex shows,
private masturbation shows orprerecorded things like that
fetishes, kinks.
I mean.
There's even people payingthousands of dollars I'm not
even going to touch thisWatching people put their feet
in pies Just strange stuff.

(08:48):
But get this.
Let me put this intoperspective.
In 2023, onlyfans reported agross sales volume of $6.63
billion, with a B dollars.
I couldn't find numbers for 24to 25, but all indications say
that those numbers arecontinuing to skyrocket.

(09:10):
I mean, so let that sink in interms of what that says about
where we're placing our time,we're placing our money and our
attention.
I mean, I think it's a soberingreflection right of how
spiritually and emotionallystarved society has become.

Speaker 1 (09:29):
Yeah, wow, that is profound, because the other
thing and we'll touch on thismore, but the reality is is some
of those pay for clicks thatyou're describing I can only
imagine.
Those pay for clicks thatyou're describing I can only
imagine are also people beingexploited.
Yeah, so behind every click,there is actually someone who's

(09:52):
being coerced, forced to dosexual activity, and that is
what people don't understand isthe connection to a lot of
online sexual exploitation.
That's exactly what it isSexual trafficking.
Yeah, a lot of online sexualexploitation.
That's exactly what it is.
Sexual trafficking, sextrafficking.
That is connected to thesethings, and I just want to
reinforce, because we're goingto continue to get into the deep

(10:15):
sea on this topic there is noshame in this.
There is a gut check.
There is like is this God'sbest for you?
If you're connected to theseissues, if you have a loved one
and you've been almost thevictim of their addiction or
what they choose to play aroundin, you're kind of suffering the

(10:38):
consequences of that.
There's no shame and there's nocondoning, and the reality is
that we all have something thatGod wants to work on us now in
right, because we all fall shortof the glory of God.
That's right, and so sometimes,when we're talking about really
big things like this, we thinkit's a big thing, and it is.

(10:59):
But everything's a big thing toGod, but everything's a big
thing to God.
Lying as an example is just asimportant, as you know.
Basically telling the truth isjust as important as not, you
know, letting your eyes see thethings that are impure.
So I just wanted to wrap, justdo a little wrapper around.
I know God's hard on this.

(11:19):
We are speaking on it to stirthe hearts of conviction and to
really just shed some lightabout what the enemy of your
soul is trying to do to you.
That's right, and that ourprayer is that this is going to
set the captives free.
Yeah, amen, so good Amen.

Speaker 2 (11:39):
Yeah, and I'm so glad that you said that, because
it's not that anybody is bad,yeah, but it really is a
behavioral trap that weoftentimes walk into and it
tricks our brain.
We'll talk a little bit moreabout that.
There was also this recentstudy in the Journal of Sex that
found that last month over 90%of men and over 60% of women

(12:04):
watched porn.
Isn't that amazing?
That shocked me.
Yeah, I mean, maybe I know youare well researched in all of
this.
We'll talk a bit about thatlater too.
But those I mean I knew a lotof people watched porn, but I
had no idea that those statswere that high.
And again to your point, somany people think that it's
harmless.
You know it's something you doin the privacy of your own home,

(12:26):
without realizing the downtrickle impact that that kind of
material is having not only onour psyches but also our
relationships, and then overalso in a much bigger global
impact, which we're going toshed some light on today, global
impact which we're going toshed some light on today.

(12:47):
But another study showed thatporn-induced arousal led to
lower relationship satisfactionand stability after only two
months of watching it.
So I mean the bottom line iswe've got all of these things at
our fingertips, easy access,that are supposedly empowering
us.
Right that we have, we deservethat we can just lean into to

(13:09):
cope with life and feel alive.
Yet at the same time, there'swarning signs going off all over
society that something has goneterribly wrong.
You've got rates of depressionat all time highs.
You got people onantidepressants and anti-anxiety
drugs.
That's all-time highs.
Suicide rates are up.

(13:31):
We're seeing a decline inhappiness, especially among
young people, which isheartbreaking.
And then also, what fascinatesme in my research here was that
all addictions are on a dramaticrise, not just sex, drugs and
alcohol, but now you've gotother behavioral and emotional

(13:53):
crutches like scrollingaddictions, digital addictions I
guess you'd call that.
Even porn falls into thatbucket, and the sexual bucket
right falls into that bucket.
And the sexual bucket rightGambling, shopping, even you
know more emotional things, likeyou know people pleasing and

(14:13):
codependency.
You know those are sort oflesser known illusions of
fulfillment and unfortunatelywhat's happening is well.
Let me back up.
I actually think underneath allof those addictions are
legitimate human needs like love, like connection, like purpose,
like meaning and significance.

Speaker 1 (14:34):
Right, but the problem is we're reaching for
the wrong things to fill thoseup and it just goes back to how
we started.
It's the illusions that theworld offers.
So the world offersgratification and satisfaction
and fulfillment in the thingsthat you just described, but the
reality is, and it's justshowing in the fruit of the

(14:55):
world that it's decaying Againdepression, suicide, et cetera.
And I want to reinforce we tendto think that this is a male
problem.
Great point.
But, like you said, 60% ofwomen.
Yeah, wow, that blew me away.
I mean, I'm familiar with thestat around the men and I always

(15:16):
liken it to if you have 10people sitting around a business
table, 10 people sitting arounda dinner table or 10 people out
to eat in a restaurant, andthen all the people who are
around you, 10 people servingyou, waiting on you, et cetera.
You are around people who arestruggling with addiction.
Yeah, they may not realize it.

(15:40):
Yeah, thing that we can sit inis to say, okay, what is God
calling me to?
Maybe let go of and start thehealing process so I can
overcome this thing.
That's anchoring me down,because we know that the thief
comes to kill, steal and destroy.
But that's the thing in John10.10.
The thief comes to kill, stealand destroy.

(16:02):
And then the big, the big but,but god.
And every time there's a butgod man, I get excited because
it says but god came to givelife and give it abundantly.
So anything that the enemy istrying to do in our life, to
kill, steal, destroy, kill, makeus depressed, drive us into
depression, etc.
Kill, steal our joy, steal thefruit of what God has for us,

(16:26):
destroy our destiny, destroy ourpurpose.
God says, nope, but me.
But me, and I am here.
All you got to do is make thestep and lay it over like,
surrender it at my feet.

Speaker 2 (16:38):
Yeah, that's so good.
That's so good, and you know Idon't want to speak for you when
I say this, but from myperspective, I don't think that
the sex, the money, the alcoholin moderation in and of
themselves are bad necessarily.
I think the issue is is whenwe're chasing those things to

(16:59):
fill a void or something that'sbroken inside of us, rather than
reaching for the Lord andbecoming healthy and whole, you
know, and seeing some of thosethings as gifts like sex,
frankly, to be enjoyed in theright context.

Speaker 1 (17:14):
Yeah, so, just to your point, sex in the bounds of
marriage.
You know where you're honoring,you know your husband, your
wife, and it's truly an intimateconnection between the two of
you and at the heart of it is tolove and express that through
intimacy.
I mean that's what God designedsex to be.
But anytime we're using sex ina lustful manner, where we need

(17:38):
to fill a satiable need, adesire, just a lust spirit,
we're crossing into territorythat that's not what God
intended it to be.
As an example Alcohol, alcohol,having a drink here and there.
God is very clear that don'tjudge what you eat or drink.
Let it be between you and God.

(18:00):
And if God is calling somebodyto celibacy, as an example, just
like Paul, he was celibate.
He was single his whole life.
He never had intercourse with afemale.
God called him to that life.
Sometimes God will call peoplenot to have alcohol and
sometimes people aren't calledto that.
So it's really about therelationship that you have with

(18:22):
the Lord and what is God callingyou to do?
Some things he's very expliciton.
Like we said, sex is, you know,inside the bounds of marriage
between a man and a woman whoare married, and that's what
it's called and created for.
But we get into some of theseand this is where the enemy can

(18:42):
get.
You know.
Tricky is he sneaks in and sayswell, god doesn't say not to
drink, so just have one.
Well, you know, the secondone's not going to hurt.
You have the second one.
Next thing, you know fivedrinks in and you're probably
hugging the toilet and you knowyou're getting to replay what

(19:04):
you put in your mouth that day.
I can say that I have been therea long time ago, right, but
nonetheless we all feel short ofthe glory of God.
I have done that, okay.
I have also had sex outside ofmarriage and I can tell you that
the fruit when I did it was notwonderful.
It actually created a hole, awound in my heart that I

(19:29):
actually had to get healing fromthe Lord and, even more
importantly, I had to get thathealed so I could have a healthy
sexual relationship with myhusband, because you carry this
stuff with you and so it's soimportant to understand where is
the enemy trying to usesomething that seems so innocent

(19:51):
, but then over time it can geta hold on you, you know.
I think it's also worth notingthat.
You know we're obviouslytalking about some pretty clear
illusions that the world offers,but sometimes they're not so
obvious.

Speaker 2 (20:06):
Yeah, yeah.
Fortunately for me fortunately,I can say meaningless, random
sex has never been an issue,neither as drugs or alcohol,
although, like you mentioned,there certainly have been many
times, probably far too manytimes, and I like to count my
entire lifetime that.
I had too much to drink.
No doubt.

(20:27):
Have you ever hugged the toilet?
Of course, of course, yes,embarrassingly enough, yes, it's
been a very, very long time.

Speaker 1 (20:37):
We can hardly remember.

Speaker 2 (20:38):
Decades, decades, I can say Thank goodness.
But for me I just seemed tounderstand and was taught and
learned from a young age thatsharing your body was something
very special.
And then my entire life I'vebeen an athlete, a health nut,

(20:59):
frankly, you know, I evencarried into my early 20s as a
nationally ranked fitnesscompetitor where I did
military-style obstacle courses.
So drugs, you know, and excessalcohol, just not a thing.
But you know, I say all thatbecause where you started was.
There are illusions that areless obvious and they can show
up dressed as ambition or theconstant need for applause or

(21:25):
admiration.
They can show up aspeople-pleasing and keeping the
peace, and for me, I can saythat some of the biggest ones
that I struggled with waspeople-pleasing and keeping the
peace.
And for me, I can say that someof the biggest ones that I
struggled with waspeople-pleasing.
For sure, perfectionism as well.
Done a lot of work on both ofthose, and then also striving,
and frankly, with striving,that's still something I wrestle

(21:49):
with to this day, finding thatreal balance between God's grace
and our grind, because I reallyhave to be mindful about my
work ethic.
I'm always going to show up andgive extraordinary effort.
That is just not going to letup, because I care deeply about

(22:11):
delivering excellence, but Ihave to be very careful that
that doesn't cross over intostriving.
So how do you keep that balance?
Well, I have to be reallyintentional about it.
You know much like we've talkedabout in our last two episodes
with gratitude, and you are whatyou think.
You know.
You truly have to be mindfulabout it.
But I would say, to answer yourquestion, I got to take a

(22:33):
little step back into childhoodand give you the short picture.
We always have to step back tochildhood, that's true.

Speaker 1 (22:41):
It all stems to childhood right.

Speaker 2 (22:43):
It's all childhood.
So I was raised by what I wouldcall two warrior parents.
My parents walked throughliteral hell in their childhoods
and they were forthcoming aboutthat.
They met each other at 18 and19 years old.
They got engaged in less thantwo months, married in less than

(23:04):
a year, celebrated over 50years of marriage, yeah, and
just recently, and when they gottogether, they basically said
not literally but figurativelywe are going to build something
different in this family.
And does that mean they'reperfectly healthy people who did

(23:25):
everything right?
No, but it meant that they wereserious about being better,
being different and creatingsomething different in our
family.
And they did.
And so, because they didn'thave people to count on growing
up, they taught my brother and Iincredible work ethic.
I remember hearing even if yougrow up to be a ditch digger,

(23:48):
you better be the best ditchdigger there ever was.
Not sure where that one camefrom, but that's what we heard
over and over again and I thinkkind of more subliminally not
necessarily intentionally theyalso might've taught us that if
you want something done right,you got to do it yourself,

(24:08):
because no one's coming to saveyou.
And I'm really grateful forthose principles to learn to
deliver excellence and give ityour best.
But now, as I bring all ofthose principles into a
relationship with God, I'm moreable to find that balance today

(24:29):
where I can show up and give itmy best.
But then I got to give it toGod and lay my head on the
pillow at night and surrenderthe outcome.
But before God I would obsessover every last detail.
If the outcome wasn't what Ithought it should have been or
what I wanted, I would try tofind one thing, maybe multiple

(24:54):
things, probably back in the day, that I could have done better.
Different that I'm, that I tieto a change in the outcome.
Right, and all of that is aboutfear.
It's about a false sense of ofcontrol.

Speaker 1 (25:10):
That's so good, you know it's.
It reminds me too much of agood thing can become a bad
thing, right, yeah, and so,similar to you with the whole,
things need to be just so.
Where it comes out for mebeyond work at home, is my house
.
People joke you could eat offmy floors.

(25:32):
You've heard that, but likeliterally you could.

Speaker 2 (25:35):
I mean if.

Speaker 1 (25:35):
I see even a foot mark on my wood floor.
It's going to be gone twoseconds after I see it.
I used to have a beautifulcarpet that was in my foyer of
my house and it had tassels onit.
Had tassels on it?

(25:57):
Well, by golly, I had a comb inthe.
I had, you know, a cabinet thathad a drawer and I kept a comb
in there.
So when I was passing by, ifone of the tassels was out of
place, I could take that combout and just kind of straighten
it up real quick.
I love it.
This is a knowing laugh just soyou know.
Yes, you know you're connectingto what I'm saying.
And sometimes when my kidsweren't listening, they would be
on tassel detail, which meantthat they got to go take the
comb and they got to comb thingsout.

(26:19):
But we joke about it.
I've learned over the years thetassels don't matter and if I
can't stop that impulsivecontrol crazy of actually
combing tassels, get rid of therug, even though I think it's
beautiful.
If it's going to invoke controlissues in me, get rid of it.

(26:41):
And so same thing is with adinner party.
I used to be the Martha.
There's the Mary and the MarthaMary's the one sitting at
Jesus's feet.
Martha's the one who's runningaround doing everything and
complaining that Mary's lazy andshe's doing all the work, and
Jesus says no, no, no, no, she'sexactly where she needs to be.
Well, I'm Martha.
I will host Everything'sperfect, every detail's thought
of, and I'm so into in the nameof serving other people.

(27:15):
I'm not actually connected towhat's going on.
I start to notice the dishespiling up as the evening goes on
and all the things startkicking in.
So instead of just doing theMartha in the moment, I've been
practicing remove myself fromthe kitchen sink, get away, go,
force myself into conversation,and that way God is refining me.
But where does it come from?
It comes from the childhood.
Mine's a little bit differentthan yours, but it's when I
would bring friends over and myhouse wasn't as orderly or clean

(27:38):
as what they experienced intheir own homes.
And that became the Mondaymorning target, bullying me on
the playground and sharing howdisorganized, or maybe unclean,
my home was.
And so there was real hurt andpain.
That came at me as a kid, thatreinforced order, cleanliness,
perfection, because it guardsagainst the hurt that humanity

(28:01):
can inflict upon you.
And so, again, in excess.
It's not God's design.
And so what are things to?
How do you surrender that notso obvious control tendency that
gets in the way of relationship?
Yeah, if I'm so busy cleaningand I'm not connecting to my
guests, why do I even havepeople over to begin with?

(28:22):
That's it.
You know, my kids weren't bornto be, you know, tassel comers.

Speaker 2 (28:28):
Tassel duty.

Speaker 1 (28:29):
Duty.
Tassel duty.
Yeah, they're not ditch diggers, they're like the tassel duty
Duty.
Tassel duty yeah, they're notditch diggers, dick diggers,
they're like the tassel Experttassel Detanglers but yeah, it's
really just where in your lifeis the activity trumping a
relationship opportunity?
Yeah, and for me that's whatGod has to.
You know, he continually showsme where my activity is trumping

(28:53):
the relationship and that's ared flag.
Yeah, what other things do youhave to kind of lean into for
balance?

Speaker 2 (28:59):
Well, people-pleasing , like I said, was one that I
really struggled with way toomany years saying yes to too
many things and other peopleunder the guise well, I
shouldn't say guise under theumbrella of my great big heart
and my kindness, and I do have agreat big heart.
You know, I am kind, I amthoughtful and I'm very proud of

(29:21):
those things.
But what I had to learn overtime is that you have to have
that same heart and that samethoughtfulness and kindness for
your own heart and guard yourown heart.
It's interesting.
This is kind of a fun storythat happened even just in the
last five years where agirlfriend of mine she wanted so

(29:41):
desperately to do that mud runthat comes around.
And this was all women.
She enlisted like four of us,and when she asked, I actually
didn't want to do it from thebeginning, which is surprising
when you think about my history.
I love to compete, but that'sexactly why Because still I

(30:03):
recognize even today.
You take me to a company or afamily picnic and the gun goes
off in a potato sack race, I'mtaking out the five-year-old,
like there's still no in-between, and so now, as I've gotten
older, I want to protect my bodya little bit more, because I
enjoy snowboarding in the winterand wakeboarding and water

(30:27):
skiing and my workout classesand all the things.
So I didn't want to do it fromthe start, but I love her you
know, and she was really excitedabout it.
And then there was anothergirlfriend who felt the same way
but was also doing it becausethey, you know, love this friend
and she was so excited about it.
Well, here comes the day.
Our heat was 1 PM that day andI and I'm pretty sure it was

(30:52):
early April when it came throughCharlotte Woke up that morning.
It was an unusually cold dayand pouring down rain and the
whole entire day was going to bethat.
So let's layer on top.
I didn't want to do it to start,and now you're cold and wet and
getting mud in places.
You probably don't really wantto think about getting mud right

(31:17):
and I am like I'm going to bemiserable and I felt terrible.
But I ended up sending a textmessage that morning to
everybody and I was thoughtfulabout it, but I was very honest.
I said I feel terrible.
The last thing I want to do isdisappoint you.
I know how excited you wereabout running this race, but it

(31:38):
has taken me a lot of years inmy life to be forthcoming and
honest about also taking care ofmyself and I'm just going to be
miserable.
And it was a little moreeloquent than that but,
shockingly, what came back frommy friend who so desperately
wanted to do this race and theother friend who didn't want to

(32:01):
do it either.
No, they weren't necessarily.
That's funny.
That here my honesty, I thoughtwould disappoint them.
They came back in almost aweteach me your ways, Wow, Because

(32:21):
they struggle with the samething.
I mean, one of the reasonswe're such good friends is
because of their great bighearts and their kindness.
So that just blew me away whenthat happened.

Speaker 1 (32:32):
It's so good.
I love the example becauseoftentimes when I think about
people pleasing, it's in therealm of work and I'm choosing
to do something to please mypeer or make my boss happy or to
do whatever.
That's where it can show up forme and I have to be really

(32:55):
intentional to say do I reallybelieve in this idea and do I
want to put my name and energybehind it, or do I need to speak
up up front in the vein ofpleasing the person?
And the pleasing is just moreof the fear of the rejection,

(33:15):
right Like I don't want to beviewed as not a team player, or
what's wrong with you?
Aren't you smart enough?
Don't you understand this idea?
And then I can kind of see downthe road and whatever it is I'm
envisioning starts to becomethe reality.
For what the fear?
Why I didn't agree with it tobegin with, and so I think what
I'm taking away from your storytoo.

(33:36):
Just in any realm of life, ifour heart's not in something,
two things can be true.
One is that we may need to do itjust because God's calling us
to do it.
So suck it up, buttercup, andsay yes, sometimes in the name
of love.
In the name of love.
But if we're saying yes out offear, whatever the fear is, stop

(33:57):
, pause and inspect, because youmay not get the outcome that
you had.
There could be collateraldamage.
So the very notion of pleasingthe person in front of you.
You could actually displeasethem even more by actually going
through with it.
You had an incredible outcome,and I love it because it's
wisdom that led you right.
Yeah, so let the wisdom lead us.

(34:19):
And how do we say no early ifthat is truly what God's calling
us to do?
So good.

Speaker 2 (34:26):
So good?
Well, let's circle back to someof the more obvious illusions
of fulfillment, because I knowthat we want to hit on a few of
the things that are oftencontroversial, especially in the
Christian community.
So let's take money, forinstance.
Money I know we both agreeisn't evil in and of itself.
Money is a tool that providesfreedom.

(34:48):
I think God wants us to beprosperous in life because it
affords us the opportunity tobless others in his kingdom.
Right?
So it's the love of money, thegreedy hoarding of money, that's
evil.

Speaker 1 (35:04):
Yeah, the other thing that's evil too is believing
that money is evil.
Just rest on that for a minute.
And what do I mean by that?
It means that people who livein a poverty mindset, a scarcity
mindset, that, yes, you canchoose to live a simple life.

(35:24):
You can choose to live a simplelife and not hoard material
things or build up materialthings over the course of your
life, and God may be calling youto a simple life, like John the
Baptist had to live in thewilderness, right, he lived on
locusts and honey.
But the notion that we callmoney evil is evil itself,

(35:45):
because money actually makes theworld go around.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
We don't have trade.

Speaker 1 (35:50):
We don't have a world , and money is at the heart of
community and so the community.
It used to be that you wouldhave to sell and trade goods.
There was not this currency,like I'm going to give you a
dollar and you give me a dollar,and the notion of money was a
little bit different.
It was all about what goods didyou have.
If I'm the seamstress in thetown, I would be the one who's

(36:12):
making all the clothes for thecommunity and I'm going to give
you clothes, and then maybeyou're going to be the shoemaker
and I'm going to get a pair ofshoes from you and you just
trade the goods around thecommunity.
Why did God design it that way?
Because it built relationship.
So money, trade is God's heartfor the community.
It brings people together.

(36:34):
What has happened over time andwhere the flesh gets in, is
where we use money to gain thepower.
Like you said right, we abuseit and we actually cause someone
else to suffer at the hand ofour gain.
Okay, so if I'm going to createwealth and I'm going to use it

(36:55):
to hurt people, then obviouslythat's not God's design or
intention, but nor does it meanthat money's evil.
Take the sex trade.
We talked about pornography.
The sex trade we talked aboutpornography, but if you actually
add on humans being sold to bein a slave trade of sex, it is

(37:17):
the number one trade in theworld.
Globally, over 40 millionpeople are enslaved in the sex
trade.
Yeah, okay, and so that's evilin the sight of the Lord?
Yeah, yeah, okay, and so that'sevil in the sight of the Lord.
Yeah, but the very thing that'sneeded to set those captives
free money is the very thingthat's going to get them out.

(37:38):
Yeah, so the thing that putthem in the greed of money, the
blessing of money, is the samething that's going to get them
out.
Yeah, you need money to stand upsafe houses.
You need money forrehabilitation services.
Yeah, you need money to educatepeople and lean into disciple
and really get into the heartsand minds of man.
And so, again, the notion ofchasing the dollar for your own

(38:03):
gain is not God's plan.
Yeah, but working hard, he says.
We are to work as though we'reworking unto the Lord himself.
We are to work hard, and thereality is as God says.
I'm going to bless the handsthat work, and so it's a
biblical principle.
Absolutely, amen, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
And then there's alcohol.
I enjoy alcohol in moderationtoo, but frankly that's even
something that I feel like.
Fairly recently, god's beenworking on me a little bit there
as well round out a stressfulday, or maybe, in some cases,
strictly out of boredom, ratherthan reaching for it, maybe in

(38:56):
celebration, you know, at a, ata concert.
And I mean the reality is, moreand more studies are coming out
, um, that are catching myattention, some of which are
because my mom sends them to meabout 15 reels a day.
Faithful mom?
Yes, that's right, but I meanit's everywhere.
All of the research and thedata is showing us that even

(39:19):
alcohol in very small amountscan cause permanent damage to
our brains.
And then on top of that I mean,when you look at all the
statistics of alcohol, those arealways, those are always, more
often than not, our greatestmoments of shame.
Right, or we cheated or made asexual decision that we wouldn't

(39:43):
have made if we weren'tdrinking.
So, yeah, wheels are turning onthat one quite a bit as well.

Speaker 1 (40:03):
Yeah, I think it's such an important topic to
discuss and I actually want todedicate a whole segment to it
because there's just so muchinformation we could share on it
.
Want to dedicate a wholesegment to it because there's
just so much information wecould share on it.
But again, I grew up, you know,in a world where alcohol was
associated to alcoholism, and soto maybe start to look at what

(40:25):
would be a culturally acceptedhabit, in the lens of you might
have a dependency issue, was areally shameful topic for me,
because if you were to say maybeI shouldn't be drinking, you're
basically saying I'm analcoholic and if I'm an
alcoholic, I'm the byproduct ofwhat I grew up in, and so the

(40:47):
problem with that is over 80% ofthe world is drinking alcohol
and the majority of all thosepeople are consuming well more
than what the doctors would sayis the daily limit.
If you will, and if we'rehonest with ourselves and I can
say this for me I like to saythe relationship with alcohol,

(41:11):
because if it's in your life ona consistent basis, you're
having a relationship with it,and anything that you're having
a relationship with, if it's notproducing a healthy outcome,
it's probably something that Goddoes want us to examine.
Does it mean that therelationship or the thing needs
to go away completely?
Again, that's between you andGod, god.

(41:34):
But I can say personally for me, I started to explore this a
couple of years ago because Istarted to see some of my loved
ones facing real challenges withthe use of alcohol and I can
say that I started the journeyof exploring my own like do I
want to be drinking?
Should I be drinking?
Because I saw my loved onesmaybe starting to struggle a
little bit?
But if I'm real honest, like Iwas using it, I was using it to,

(41:58):
just like you said, decompressat the end of the day.
You know you're working 14 hourdays, you're dealing with tons
and tons of stress.
And, man, that glass for me,pinot Grigio, I just love it.
And who doesn't like abeautiful wine glass with a
yummy yummy pinot in it.
And the other thing is, myhusband is a man who never stops

(42:19):
asking questions.
He's so curious and if youunderstand how the human brain
works, you need 100% more energyto answer questions than just
having a conversation.
And so when I would get homefrom work and he would start to
ask me questions, the only thingI could do to actually relax,
to then engage, is to have aglass of wine.
And so I started to see veryclearly that this habit that I

(42:44):
formed even though it wasn't aproblem in my relationships at
large or it wasn't causing me tobe defunct at work or anything
like that it just I wasn't maybeprocessing in a pure way, you
know, in order to de-stress.
You know, if I have to have aglass of wine as opposed to
doing mindfulness with the Lordor decompressing, which is what

(43:06):
he calls me to do, then I haveto take a look at it.
So, personally for me, it sentme on this huge, again
multi-year journey that I'vebeen on, where I started off
with, okay, I put limits aroundmyself, x number of days per
week, and so I'm a goal person,crush that goal and then last
year it's like I'm going to do a60% reduction overall and I

(43:31):
manage everything.
It's kind of nauseating, but Ido, and so crush that goal.
So this year it's, I'm justgoing to do an alcohol-free year
Now.
Will I choose to drink in 2026?
Maybe, but the point is is forme, I really I knew, you know in
your gut you just said God isnudging you, you're exploring

(43:53):
different things, et cetera.
When you get that stirring inyour heart and we don't want to
let something go, that's thevery thing the enemy is going to
say You're going to miss out onsomething if you let this go.
That means God has somethingbetter for you on the other side
of it.
So, for me.
I had this epiphany.
It's like what am I missingfrom God Because I'm choosing to

(44:16):
have my glass of wine insteadof whatever it is he has for me?
I don't know what it is, Istill don't know, but I know I'm
being faithful to what hestirred in my spirit, and so I'm
expectant whenever he choosesto show me what's going to be on
the other side of that.
And why do I want to take thetime to say it?
Because, again, there's so muchshame connected to this notion

(44:38):
of alcohol and our culture is sosteeped in it that the world
literally ignores.
I can't tell you how many timespeople say to me why aren't you
having a drink tonight at asocial hour?
It's the only drug on theplanet that people literally say

(45:16):
why aren't you taking thisthing?
And so that is a signal that asa society, we are starting to
wake up a little bit, I think,because I am running more and
more into the conversation.
But it's just another examplewhere the illusion is alcohol is
culturally acceptable and itprovides so much joy.
But if you really are curiousto look at the benefits of it,
the damage and what it takesfrom your life is so much
greater than the benefits thatyou get from it.
It's just an interestingquestion, and I think the next
one that you click into that'srising very quickly is marijuana

(45:37):
.
Great point.
We don't need to dive into thatright now.
But again, if you're smokingmarijuana on a daily basis,
study after study is showingit's shrinking your brain.
It's doing damage Just becauseyou feel relaxed in a moment.
It's the enemy putting woolover your eyes.
It is literally destroying yourbrain.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:58):
I agree.
Anywho, we can then pivot andtalk about sex.
Yeah, right, yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:04):
It's supposed to be amazing, it's supposed to be
celebrated and enjoyed, but inthe right context.

Speaker 1 (46:09):
Yeah, man, woman and the balance of marriage, God's
going to do beautiful things.
Yeah, man, woman and thebalance of marriage, God's going
to do beautiful things.
And again we touched on this atthe beginning, but, clicking
into the detail on it, the bigquestion is porn really a big
deal?

Speaker 2 (46:27):
Yes, spoiler alert.

Speaker 1 (46:31):
Spoiler alert.
It's such a big deal.
It's more addicting than allthe major drugs on the street
today.
Yeah, okay, and it rewires yourbrain faster than anything.
Yeah, in a very negative way.
It's almost like your brain'sgetting rewired to be
schizophrenic, almost.
That's why, all of a sudden,depression rises up in you and

(46:54):
suicidal ideation rises up inyou.
So I know that I could givetestimony to being exposed to
porn throughout my life.
When do you first rememberbeing exposed to porn?

Speaker 2 (47:07):
I can remember exactly.
Actually I was in fourth orfifth grade so I guess that
would make me nine or 10 yearsold and it was a snow day.
All the kids were home fromschool.
I was up the street sleddingand I can remember walking into
a house full of boys.
Some of these boys had olderbrothers and they were all

(47:29):
crowded around the TV screenwatching something that clearly
was not for adults, you know.
But I can remember at that timeprobably not really having words
, you know, for what I wasseeing, but just sort of
instantly knowing in my gut notonly what was on the screen but
then also the environment of allthe boys and older boys, like

(47:52):
radar went off, get out of here.
So I mean I just went backoutside and and started sledding
again and that was that Um, butit's funny, I, I I also can
remember um growing up.
That it was.
I don't know if you had thesame experience, but commonplace
for Playboy and Penthousemagazines to be in everybody's

(48:13):
bathrooms, like it was BetterHomes and Gardens or something
right Like very common.
It's like a proud display yes,very commonplace.
So as a kid curiosity, you're insomeone else's bathroom, you
take a look at that quick, but Ican remember it being very
clear that in our house thatthat was not okay, and not at

(48:38):
all because my parents areprudes Sorry, mom and dad,
hopefully they won't get mad ifthey listen to this but it was
very clear that they desired oneanother growing up in a healthy
way.
But no, that it was more about.
I don't know something about.
It would like cheapen orviolate or distract, you know,

(49:03):
from their relationship.
So, fortunately for me.
I mean, I don't know if it wasjust a combination of those
things, I don't know if it wasjust a combination of those
things not being exposed to itor whatnot, but it just never
became a thing for me.
Ever growing up I was neverinterested in it.
But I'll tell you what I do.

(49:27):
Remember you were 23 andraising three babies, so you
probably weren't exposed to thisas much as I was when I was in
my early 20s.
But do you remember when allthese spice things up parties
started coming out?
Probably not.

Speaker 1 (49:36):
I have no idea what you're talking about.
Okay, good for you.
I was doing Barney partiesWonderful.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
Yeah, well, much like jewelry parties that they do
these days.
You think you're going over toa girlfriend's house for a glass
of wine.
Next thing you know you'reflipping through a catalog
filled with all these toys and Ijust felt like there was this

(50:02):
real push really towards womentoo for toys and porn and all
the things.
And, frankly, I can rememberthinking and sometimes saying in
conversation and I don't wantthis to come out as judgment for

(50:23):
anyone whatever you, marriedcouples, are doing in privacy of
your own home is fine, but Iremember thinking like if you
need all of those things to getexcited about your partner, like
maybe you're not doing it,right, you know, and, more
importantly, maybe you'remissing the entire point of it

(50:45):
all together, right, yeah.

Speaker 1 (50:47):
Well, there's something bigger going on there,
right, spiritually, we know,yeah, but the reality, with
pornography and anything that'sin and around the exaggeration
of a sexual experience, right,that's really taken out of
context of what God created itto be the reality is that we

(51:09):
have a physical reaction to thepornography, that we get a
dopamine hit.
Yes that we get a dopamine hit.
I mean, it's a physicalresponse that hits us.
It makes us feel really, reallygood.
The pleasure hits.
We start to become desensitizedto, maybe even how often we're

(51:32):
getting dopamine hits off thisdrug of pornography.
And then the need physically,your brain craves more and more
dopamine.
So it starts to escalate, right, and the next thing you know
you have this chronic addictionbecause your brain is in a
chemical cycle.
You don't have to be puttingchemicals in your body to

(51:54):
actually have addiction.
The result is sexual.
God says protect your eyes.
He says you might as well takeyour eyes out and you might as
well cut your ears off right,Cut your tongue out, If it's
going to cause you to get into acycle that's going to be
hurtful to you.
Get rid of those things.
That's how dire the plea isfrom God.

(52:17):
God wants to love you andprotect you.
So just know, physically thisis how our body is responding.
So that's the reality, and ifyou know that, you can have deep
compassion and empathy forreally what's going on in a
person's brain.
So well said.
And the question is not, whyare you doing it?

(52:38):
Because literally it's physical.
It's how do we help you get toa healthier place.

Speaker 2 (52:46):
Yeah, right, I love that you use the word escalation
.
Um, cause, that's exactly whathappens.
You know, you starts out asthis harmless.
You know, escape or habit, and,and you alluded to, alluded to
it, but you start to need much,in the same way that it happens
with drugs.
Right that?
The escalation happens whereyou need something harder,

(53:09):
something riskier, somethingmore taboo, in order to get that
same stimulation that you hadbefore.
And why on earth would any ofus sign up for that?

Speaker 1 (53:20):
Yeah, you know I mean people don't sign up for it day
one they don't and that's howthe enemy is sly and it's really
easy to just judge somebodywho's caught in the world of
addiction.
Yeah, it doesn't matter whatthe thing is they're addicted to
, we can throw stones all daylong.
I mean, we're really good atthat as human beings.

(53:41):
It's really hard to actually becurious enough to understand
what's going in in the personthat's in front of you to say,
how do I get to really what'sphysically going on with them so
I can be a vessel to helpunlock spiritually what God
wants to set them free from?
Yeah, and I think we're calledto that.
I mean, I have seen lovingcouples like.

(54:04):
It just devastates my heart whenI think about it.
You're talking iconic marriages, multiple decades of marriage,
role models for other people whoare married like an icon in the
marital community.
And you know, sexual addictioncreeps in and it destroys the
marriage and I've witnessed it.
I've been a part of thatbrokenness and there's again no

(54:27):
throwing stones in it.
It's devastating what thisstuff does to people.
People again I know this is myfavorite tagline is people don't
come into this world thinkingthis is what I want the outcome
of my life to be.
God created them for purpose andso when we bump into, if we're
having the problem ourself, seekout help.

(54:48):
Don't do it alone, that's right.
We're not meant to do life inisolation.
We need people who either havegone ahead of us, who have won
the battle, who can inspire usright, or just get to the
medical professionals who canhelp, because medical
professionals help with sexualaddiction too.
There's so many differentresources out there.

(55:09):
We'll get into it, but thepoint is if we are struggling
with an addiction, let us becurious to get the help.
If we have a loved one who'sstruggling with an addiction,
let us be curious to get thehelp.
If we have a loved one who'sstruggling with addiction, love
them.
It doesn't mean that youcompromise yourself and you put
yourself in harm's way, but whatcan you do beyond prayer to

(55:31):
take an action to help providean opportunity for that person
to get the help that they need?
You very well could be thevessel that's going to help set
that person free.

Speaker 2 (55:40):
That's so good and you're so right about calling
attention to no judgment orshame because, again, as we've
said, once you engage in it, itgrabs a hold of you.
It's a trap and it's designedto be that way, where it truly
rewires your brain.
So you do need help coming outfrom that and rewiring your
brain.
So you do need help coming outfrom that and rewiring your
brain towards something good.

Speaker 1 (56:03):
Yeah, you know, Lisa, the thing that I I know we're
going to come to a close herereal quick, but just want to
reinforce a couple things thatwe've said today.
$693 billion you said inrevenue on fans, only $63
billion $6.63 billion.

Speaker 2 (56:21):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (56:22):
Okay, that's a lot, whatever that means.
Okay, so billions of dollars.
Right, there is a source, it'scalled the Exodus Road.
You can go to the Exodus Roadwebsite for more information,
but it's estimated that over28,000 users watch pornography
every second.
Every second, Every second.

(56:44):
Wow, with 35% of those havinginternet downloads per day.
Okay, just kind of sit on thatfor a minute.
Youth with sexual search term,youth there are people out there
who are searching for youth insex over 400 million web

(57:10):
searches and teen is among thetop search terms on Pornhub.
Wow, okay, so you got youth,and teen is the most popular
search term on Pornhub, withover 400 million hits.
Ugh, this is a problem.

(57:30):
Why do I say it this way?
Because God talks aboutgenerational sin, generation to
generation to generation and wecan become so, so, again,
desensitized that we have aproblem.
90 of men, 60 of women.
Yeah, that means that listenerswho are definitely hearing this
are in this war, of course.
Okay, we can be the generationthat breaks the cycle.

(57:53):
Yeah, we can be the gen exodus.
We can be the ones that aresetting people free.
Yeah, I mean, I do a tremendousamount of work in human
trafficking.
Yeah, talk about that.
Yeah, specifically with sextrafficking and there's a direct
correlation.
People don't realize that.
Yeah, so 95% of all producedpornography is coming from

(58:15):
sexually exploited children, mm.

Speaker 2 (58:17):
Women 95%.

Speaker 1 (58:18):
It's crazy.
Yes, you can learn more aboutthat through the Exodus.
Produced pornography is comingfrom sexually exploited children
, women.
Ninety-five percent it's crazy.
Yes, you can learn more aboutthat through the Exodus Road as
well.
But it is such a problem thatpeople think, oh, this is just
me, that I'm hurting, and thenit starts to spill into their
family.
Yeah, the cycle repeats itselfA father does it, then the son
does it, and so forth and so on.
But the reality is is everytime you click, you're paying to

(58:40):
exploit the person who isbehind that picture, I mean
these babies.
Like, if you're searching foryouth, if you're searching for
youth and you're searching forteens, and this is what you're
doing you need help.
There is no ifs ands buts aboutit.
You need to get the help and ifand take this as the warning
right and if you don't get thehelp, you will get God's wrath.

(59:03):
God is such a gracious God.
He gives us opportunity to hearthe truth, to turn from our
wicked ways right, and he willlove us with compassion back to
Him.
But there's only so much.
And if you truly look at thesex trafficking issue and again
we could talk for hours aboutthat it's a problem.
And so if you see yourself inthis, I don't want you to hear

(59:29):
that we're sitting here throwingstones out, but we will call it
evil in the sight of the Lord.
It's evil in the sight of theLord, and so this is an
opportunity, it's a gateway thathe is saying you need help.
I love you, my child.
You can break this curse offthe nations.
That's the empowerment here iswe have choice, amen.

Speaker 2 (59:52):
So we've covered a lot here this morning in terms
of illusions of fulfillment, lothere this morning in terms of
illusions of fulfillment.
Our choices, our habits, thecontent that we consume A lot of
us statistically are maybewrapped up in some things that
maybe we need to take a look atand we'd like to learn more
about how to unravel.
What are some steps that we cantake ourselves or to help loved

(01:00:17):
ones?

Speaker 1 (01:00:18):
Yeah, I love that question and God is so good and
sovereign because he gives ussuch an easy playbook and it
seems so simple.
We can be desensitized towhat's good, yeah, ok, but God
says to fast.
So what is fasting?
It means to take a break fromsomething.
It means to take a break fromsomething that we get life from

(01:00:40):
that could be placed ahead of orabove God, okay and so, or it
could be something, and again,if it is ahead of or above God,
then it's got to hold on us.
And so if you could take any ofthe things that we talked about
today, from alcohol topornography, gambling, whatever,

(01:01:01):
it doesn't matter and you couldsay you know what, just for 30
days, I'm going to try this outfor 30 days, and it's not just
every day for 30 days toactually unpack why this thing

(01:01:21):
exists in your life.
Or do it for a loved one.
If you don't have the addictionbut your loved one does, you
fast for 30 days on theaddiction.
But you take that time and youlearn, you read, you understand
what's going on physically withthem and you pray and you

(01:01:42):
declare freedom over your lovedone and you let no word of
disagreement, lack of faith comeagainst your loved one, come
against you if you're prayingfor yourself.
Yeah, god says all things arepossible for those who believe,
for those who yourself.
Yeah, god says all things arepossible for those who believe.
For those who believe, yeah,there is so much hope when we

(01:02:03):
turn to God.
Yes, I mean, god is the onlyanswer.
This is a spiritual warfare item.
You, literally, if we couldhave the veil pulled back and
see the spirits and the demonson us, fighting for these
spirits of alcoholism orpornography or fill in the blank
, to just rest on us and be onus.
We're fighting those things off.
So, in the natural, we fast, westop and then, in the spirit,

(01:02:29):
we start wielding the word ofGod.
We start wielding with ourmouth the profession of His Word
, because that's where thedemons have to flee, the spirits
have to flee.
This stuff is real and there'sso much power in that.
I could get so excited about it.
So you take a break.
You be intentional to where youwould be doing that activity

(01:02:55):
having the glass of wine in theevening after a hard day of work
.
Instead of doing that, read abook that teaches you what
alcohol is doing to your body.
Yeah, and you're going to startto rewire your brain.
Sure, just say, wow, maybe Ishouldn't be doing that.
If it's pornography, read abook on pornography addiction.
If it's gambling, do thatInstead of going to a casino or

(01:03:16):
going to buy the scratch-offtickets.
Go somewhere else, have a biteto eat and read, like reprogram,
and then pray and believe Again.
All things are possible if webelieve, pray it, believe it.
I'm an avid advocate forjournaling every single day.
Journal what you're learning,because it's going to reinforce

(01:03:38):
you to learn it.
Walk it out.
Be honest.
What are you struggling with?
Why do you want this thing inyour life?
Be raw, honest.
You can burn this journal atthe end of the 30 days, it
doesn't matter.
Write it down.
Be brutally honest and I'mtelling you I've done it with so
many different things in mylife that after 30 days you
start to say why did I do it tobegin with?

(01:04:00):
And if you can do 30 days, thenstretch it to 60 days, then
stretch it to 90 days.
Just like I explained, Istarted a couple days a week and
then I extended it and now I'mdoing an entire year with no
alcohol.

Speaker 2 (01:04:12):
Do that and you have shared so many things in terms
of how you feel that havetransformed and you were not
even anywhere near abusingalcohol.

Speaker 1 (01:04:24):
No, but God has shown me just so many things.
And y'all, I have this littlething called the Oura Ring and
it tracks your sleep at night,and if I could tell you just the
quality of sleep that I getside benefit.
But why do I care about that?
Because I have clarity of mind,I have no brain fog.
I have so much more energy andas I'm in my midlife, right

(01:04:47):
energy starts to deplete.
Your hormones are changingforever, it seems, or so, John?

Speaker 2 (01:04:53):
tells me.

Speaker 1 (01:04:54):
But the point is is there's so many things that I've
learned.
I want to say this I didn'trealize how muted my days were
when I had wine.
Wow, meaning life is so muchsharper, memories are more vivid
, experiences are more realbecause I'm present.

(01:05:15):
The truth is, when you have aglass of alcohol, because we
have some of the worst days ofour lives with loved ones is
because we lose the ability ofprefrontal cortex control, yeah,
and therefore we actually losethe ability to process
experiences fully.
And so, yeah, there's just beenso many side benefits that I

(01:05:36):
wasn't looking for, but God hasshown me and taught me.
Yeah, what else would you say?

Speaker 2 (01:05:44):
Well, you just shared a plethora of great action
steps.
The only thing that I would addto what you shared you also
mentioned that it starts withawareness.

Speaker 1 (01:05:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:05:53):
So, just before you get to taking those action steps
, just a simple reminder to askGod to show you right, show me
what are the habits, what arethe harmless things that I'm
consuming that might benegatively impacting my life or
have the potential to, and ifyou ask him, he will show you.

(01:06:17):
Yeah, in various ways you'llhear that quiet voice.
And back to the journaling.
Journaling helps you make senseof those things as well.

Speaker 1 (01:06:26):
Yeah, sorry, go ahead .

Speaker 2 (01:06:27):
Nope go.
I was just going to wrap us upwith.
I want to share this CS Lewisquote, but I don't-.

Speaker 1 (01:06:32):
Yeah, hang on to that quote because I want to also
just share some resources.
Please that specifically if youwant to explore the notion of
removing alcohol from your life.
Annie Grace is amazing.
She has two different booksthat I brought in today.
It's called the Naked Mind,okay, and it's Control Alcohol,

(01:06:56):
find Freedom, discover Happinessand Change your Life, annie
Grace, I'm not going to go intothe details, but it's phenomenal
.
And then she came out.
After the Naked Mind, she cameout with the Alcohol Experiment
and it's literally a 30-dayalcohol-free challenge to
interrupt your habits and helpyou take control.
And it's 30 days Now.
I have been doing 30-daychallenges for a long time.

(01:07:17):
Yeah, this just reinforces howamazing it can be.
You can go on Amazon andthere's another gentleman called
Alan Carr, I believe his nameis.
I'm looking real quick.
Yes, alan Carr, easyway, he hasan Easyway book for everything
you can imagine, from smokingcigarettes, drinking alcohol,

(01:07:45):
gambling, porn, you name it.
There's a quit, the easy way.
And again, if you put hispractices into a 30 day
experiment to reprogram yourmind, there's just so much you
can really glean from so good.
And then, on the pornographything, I just want to hit this
home.
Yeah, for those who are reallystuck and you don't know where
to turn purehopenet, purehopenet, incredible resources.

(01:08:08):
It's just an incredible way tostart today on how do you break
free from what the enemy's beentrying to kill, steal and
destroy in your life?

Speaker 2 (01:08:15):
So good Rewind and write those down for sure.
Yeah, thank you for sharingthat.
Okay, cw, lewis, cs, lewis, cs,excuse me.
Yes, that's all right To help uswrap things up today, and I had
never heard this.
I've heard a lot of his quotes,but I'd never heard this one
before until preparing for thisconversation.

(01:08:35):
But it beautifully summarizesit would seem that our Lord
finds our desires not too strongbut too weak.
We are half-hearted creaturesfooling about with drink and sex
and ambition.
When infinite joy is offered us, like an ignorant child who
wants to go on making mud piesin a slum because we cannot

(01:08:58):
imagine what is meant by theoffer of a holiday at sea, we
are far too easily pleased.
Wisdom Isn't that?

Speaker 1 (01:09:06):
amazing, so good.
I love it.
Thanks for sharing that.
I'm going to go ahead and closethis out, please.
Okay, heavenly Father.
Wow, we just love you.
We thank you for thisconversation today.
Okay, heavenly Father, wow, wejust love you.
We thank you for thisconversation today, lord.
We thank you that the wordsthat you had us speak are just
laced with grace, lord, that wehave a heart of compassion and

(01:09:27):
love for every listener outthere, and that these words meet
them exactly where they're atin their life for themselves or
a loved one.
Lord, we thank you, holy Spirit, that you are having your way,
that you are doing immeasurablymore than we can ask, think.
We thank you, holy Spirit, thatyou are having your way, that
you are doing immeasurably morethan we can ask, think or
imagine, and you are making theimpossible possible.
So, lord, thank you forbreaking all the chains off all
those who are listening, andthank you for birthing beauty

(01:09:49):
and creating purpose through thepain that they've already
walked through.
Lord, we love you.
We give you glory.
In the name of Jesus, we pray,amen, amen.