November 18, 2025 • 56 mins
Ever tried to help and watched it backfire? We unpack the art and soul of feedback—how to speak truth that actually lands, and how to hear correction without shrinking. From family blowups to boardroom debriefs, we share a framework that keeps love and clarity on the same team so growth feels possible, not painful.
We start with the mirror: Matthew 7’s speck and plank reframed as a heart check before any hard talk. Then we layer in neuroscience—why criticism delivers a sneaky dopamine hit that can feed ego, and how healthy exchanges also spark oxytocin and serotonin, producing connection and calm. You’ll learn how the amygdala turns even mild critique into a threat, why some voices trigger us more than others, and practical ways to pause, detach identity, and sift for the gold in any message while tossing the gravel.
On the giving side, we get concrete about motive, timing, and tone. We share scripts for honoring what’s strong before offering what’s next, questions that turn critique into collaboration, and a simple test: does your feedback align with the fruit of the Spirit and leave the person hopeful, not humiliated? Through candid stories—parenting tensions, team coaching, and faith-grounded correction—we show how to match the moment, avoid perfectionism masquerading as excellence, and keep the goal clear: win hearts, not arguments.
We also address a quiet saboteur: “old logs” from forgiven pasts that still color how we speak and hear today. Grace dismantles that false weight, freeing us to grow without shame. If you want conversations that build people up, strengthen trust, and lead to real change, this one’s your playbook. Subscribe, share with a friend who leads or parents, and leave a review with one practice you’ll try this week—what will you change first?
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:09):
Good morning, friend.
Good morning.
How are you doing?
I'm doing good.
How about you?
I'm doing phenomenal.
What you got cooking thisweekend?
SPEAKER_02 (00:17):
Let's see.
Oh, I'm gonna have dinner uh atthe house with a couple of
friends, an engaged couple thatI haven't seen in probably
almost a year.
They've they've I've lived inthis house for three years and
they haven't been to my houseonce, so I'm excited.
SPEAKER_00 (00:30):
That's incredible.
SPEAKER_02 (00:31):
And it cracked me up when I said, um, you know, you
can stay the night, no pressurethough, but you know, I'm out
there.
I mean, I'm far north.
I think when people even they'realready going, okay, am I still
going on 77 and I haven't gottenoff yet?
Yes.
And then when you get off, it'slike farm country.
You pass, you know, cows and abarn and some mini goats and all
(00:53):
kinds of things, and they'relike, whoa, she's where is she?
He said, We'll bring our jamjams.
So, that's fun.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00):
Yeah, awesome.
How about you?
Well, we're just gonna lay low.
John, you know, did something tohis back, and so it's gonna be
caregiving to him.
Okay.
Just kind of laying low.
SPEAKER_02 (01:11):
Does he milk it like most men?
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
He uh he's a trooper, and you know, as he
climbs the years, he getsworried about an ailment.
He's like, Is this the end ofme?
And I'm like, babe, I justpulled a muscle in your back.
SPEAKER_02 (01:28):
Well, he's very active.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
You both are, and you're great pickleball players,
I might add.
I think that's the hardest partis he's very active, and this is
slowing him down to zero.
Yeah, that's hard.
So, but it's good.
It gives us a reason to stay inthe house and just rest and
recharge, nuggle up and rest andrecharge.
Yeah, yeah.
So, what are we talking abouttoday?
SPEAKER_02 (01:48):
Oh, tricky, it's very tricky.
It's a tricky tight rope inevery single one of our
relationships, which isunderstanding the difference
between constructive criticism,uh, correction, encouragement,
and calling out sin.
SPEAKER_00 (02:05):
Ooh, wow, that is meeting.
SPEAKER_02 (02:07):
Yeah, and kind of knowing, you know, when you need
to maybe put down the microphoneand pick up the mirror.
You know, sometimes we're outthere thinking that we are the
Holy Spirit's assistant, right?
SPEAKER_00 (02:20):
Uh yes.
I think that resonates.
SPEAKER_02 (02:24):
Yeah, and Jesus spoke about it in Matthew 7, 3
through 5.
Why do you look at the speck inyour brother's eye and pay no
attention to the plank in yourown?
And I think that we've all beenon both sides of the equation,
you know, whether you're thegiver or the receiver, right?
You know, you've you've tried tohelp someone and have it
completely backfire, or you'vebeen on the receiving end before
(02:48):
and had somebody try to give youconstructive criticism and had
it leave you feeling small.
But then there's other timeswhere that construction,
constructive criticism upliftsand really propels you forward,
you know, and helps you to growand step into everything that
you were meant to be.
So we're gonna talk about thatdelicate, tight rope, um, how to
(03:11):
speak life, um, not shame, youknow, when when to speak up and
when to maybe zip it.
SPEAKER_00 (03:18):
Yeah, exactly.
You know, I often think of thecommon saying, feedback is a
gift.
But it is not a gift if it's notdone with the right heart.
SPEAKER_02 (03:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (03:29):
And so to your point, you said you can give and
receive feedback.
SPEAKER_02 (03:34):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (03:34):
Feedback is a gift if it's done with the right
position of the heart, accordingto scripture, which obviously
we're gonna dive into.
But it's actually poison ordestructive if your position of
the heart is not where it needsto be in alignment with you know
the biblical truth.
Because you you can't givefeedback from a place of hurt.
(03:57):
And then specifically, if you'rereceiving, you can't receive
feedback if you're hearing itthrough the ears of hurt.
That's good.
And so feedback is not always agift, and we need to understand
that it's our role as aChristian to turn the
opportunity of giving feedbackinto the gift that it should be
intended to be.
SPEAKER_02 (04:16):
Yeah, it's good.
Well, first let's talk about thethe big picture of this, you
know, human struggle that we'reall dealing with because we love
to believe that we're helpingpeople, but sometimes we're just
hiding from our own growth.
You know, I think most of thetime people are not trying to be
cruel when they correct someone.
(04:36):
We really do want to help, wewant to protect, we want to love
well.
Um, but sometimes there's abunch of things that could be
going on in the background thatwe don't even realize is
happening.
Like someone else's growth makesus uncomfortable because it
quietly exposes places wherewe're still stuck.
Other times, um, the discomfortisn't even about our own growth,
(05:00):
but it's about how otherpeople's choices make us feel
ourselves.
You know, we want other peopleto just get it together, um, not
just for their sake, but becausetheir behavior reflects back on
us, you know, as a parent, as aleader, as a friend, as a
partner.
Um it's it's almost likesomething about their
(05:21):
imperfection uh, you know,threatens the image that we're
trying to uphold ourselves.
So these are all things that wehave to be conscious of.
Um, we've got to check ourselvessometimes, you know, something
that's that's intended to beloving correction is really just
our own image management.
Um, and that's what you know, wewe said it already.
(05:44):
Um, why do you look at the speckin your brother's eye and pay no
attention to the plank in yourown?
In that scripture, Jesus wasn'tcondemning, he was inviting us
first to check the why beforethe what.
Um, because love can never healwhat pride is trying to control.
SPEAKER_00 (06:03):
Yeah, it's so good.
It's the two-sided coin, right?
It's truth on one side of thecoin and love on the other side
of the coin.
And it can be true that you canbe delivering information,
feedback, observations tosomebody that are true, but it
(06:24):
can feel like a hammer comingdown.
Yeah.
If love is not a blanket wrappedaround it.
And the opposite is also true.
I can love you all day long andnever deliver you, deliver the
truth to you, which is justenabling you to continue on the
uh the path that you're on.
I think it's important too thatfeedback that doesn't call you
(06:50):
higher in the net in the senseof uh feedback that calls us
higher in the name ofperfectionism is not actually
healthy feedback.
It's good because God doesn'tcall the perfect, right?
He actually uh calls theunqualified, and then through
obedience, he qualifies themthrough refinement.
(07:10):
And so the the notion, you know,you started with we try to show
up and be the Holy Spirit.
There's a difference of the HolySpirit refining us and who we
are and uh the craft of whatwe're doing, right?
Versus there's something in mycharacter that actually needs to
(07:32):
be sharpened.
And so when we're talking aboutMatthew 7 specifically, the the
speck and the plank, the speckin your brother's eye, and the
plank in your own, we're we'restarting to unpack when we're
talking about character defects,if you will, I put defect in
(07:53):
quotes, really make sure that wefirst, is it self-serving me or
is it truly in service of theother person?
And in the feedback that I'mgetting ready to deliver, is it
going to cause more harm thangood?
(08:13):
And that's the question mark.
And so gift is a feedback, youknow, feedback is a gift rather,
excuse me.
If it's if the net result isharm to the other person in
front of you, it's not a gift.
SPEAKER_02 (08:27):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:27):
And so I think part of what we have to examine when
we're called to, you know, leanin and love someone in truth, in
compassion, right?
It's do we have discernment onthe readiness that the listener
is going to receive, how they'regoing to hear it, how they're
(08:49):
going to receive it.
And that is equally asimportant, if not more
important, than what we actuallyhave to deliver.
If the information, excuse me,if the information I need to
tell you is more important thanme understanding your position
of heart to hear, then my motiveis not right.
SPEAKER_02 (09:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (09:08):
Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_02 (09:08):
It does.
Yeah, absolutely.
And and you know, we always haveto bring neuroscience in.
Of course not.
Um, you know, what's wild is ourbodies and our the chemicals in
our bodies can even betray us alittle bit, especially when we
are the giver.
Um I discovered that when we,whether it's constructive or
(09:29):
not, criticize other people, ourbrain releases a tiny hit of
dopamine.
So, I mean, think about that andand and how dangerous really
that is.
Because it's like our brain justreleased a tiny hit of that felt
good.
Yeah, that's dangerous.
Like, do that again, right?
(09:50):
Let me reinforce this uhcorrection, if you will.
Um, and so it, you know, our ourour brains can't necessarily
decipher like, did thisconversation bring healing?
Um or you know, did that controlfeel good?
So let me do it again.
(10:11):
That blew my mind in theresearch on on this.
SPEAKER_00 (10:15):
It's wild.
It's kind of you can kind ofpoint to the people that you may
have experienced, and I'm sureI've been one of those people
who other people haveexperienced when I've showed up
poorly.
But sometimes when we uh putopinions out there that kind of
call a microscope on someoneelse, and even if it's true, it
(10:35):
actually validates the valuethat we're providing in the
moment.
Like, look at me, I'm smart,look what I'm seeing, and I'm
gifted to see this thing.
And to your point, the dopamineis reaffirming the bad behavior
that your ego is more importantthan the person who's getting
the feedback in the moment.
That's so powerful.
(10:56):
The way that God made us though,He's so good that you know, you
get this hit of, yeah, do itagain, do it again, do it again.
So God created us to actuallywant to lean in and give
feedback to help his people bediscipled.
And we know the motive is goodwhen it's balanced with the
(11:17):
oxytocin and uh serotonin,right?
And so the oxytocin is actuallygoing to get released between
the two people and it's gonnacreate a connection that is
fortifying the informationthat's being exchanged.
So I'm giving you feedback.
This hormone is released, andwe're actually now forming a
(11:38):
connection when it's allhealthy, right?
When it's healthy, exactly.
It's not just do it again, do itagain, do it again.
It's do it again, and there'sstrong connection, and then
there's this serenity throughthe serotonin of peace coming
in.
Yeah.
So it's, you know, just like theFather, Son, Holy Spirit,
there's three uh little hormonesbeing released through this
(11:59):
exchange of healthy feedbackthat when done right, it ends
with more connection, notdisconnection.
It's good.
SPEAKER_02 (12:09):
Yeah, and the more healed we are, you know, the
more our help actually helpsothers, and the more we're able
to receive it.
Um, so let's really dig into thelens of being the receiver, and
then we'll all switch it and diginto the lens of being the
giver.
Um, because sometimes we we'vealready alluded to this, we
(12:32):
can't receive the correctionbecause the giver is wounded and
needs a mirror.
But sometimes it's we can'treceive the correction because
we're listening from the woundsthat we still haven't healed.
Um, so if I, you know, say itanother way, it's like sometimes
it's not what's said, um, it'swhat's unhealed.
SPEAKER_00 (12:53):
It's so true.
And oftentimes people don't hearthe correction.
Yeah.
They hear rejection.
Yeah.
And so I I know for me, there'sbeen so many times where I have
been, you know, feedback hasbeen given to me, and I
literally hear it like I'mfailing.
Yes.
There's like this complete likeoh I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm
(13:16):
failing in this moment.
Yeah.
And it could just be, you know,uh, my child says, You did this
thing and you hurt me.
And then I'm like, oh my gosh,I'm hearing that not like where
their position of their heart'scoming from, that they're
actually hurt.
I hear it as you stink as amother, you're failing as a
mother, da-da-da.
And I can't even deal with theirbroken heart in the moment.
(13:37):
Yeah.
And so I've really had to pushmyself to slow down to say, how
do I hear first their pain?
That's good.
And detach my identity to whatthey're telling me so I can
actually be a mother to them.
That's right.
And so it's this notion of whereis it's not my pride set that
(14:00):
it's not my pride that is theproblem, it's my pain that is
the problem.
Yeah.
That somewhere in my wiring,there's still something unhealed
that is making me feel rejectedor less than or a failure when
the feedback's coming in.
And so being able to capturethose moments as fast as
possible is the receiver, isgoing to help me even meet the
(14:23):
person who's being courageous togive me feedback, assuming
they're coming from a place oflove.
I can actually be a bettersteward of the feedback that
they're giving me real time toeven love them back.
SPEAKER_02 (14:33):
Yeah.
Well, isn't that a huge signwhen we immediately are
triggered and we're on thedefense and our fight or flight
is, you know, going off thecharts when you're receiving
feedback, even no matter howit's delivered, right?
I mean, that should be a momentwhere we go, okay, Holy Spirit,
you know, what do I still needto work on?
(14:54):
Um, and after we have worked onwhat needs healing, then your
fight or flight actually won'tgo off and you won't immediately
be on guard, no matter howsomebody delivers it.
SPEAKER_00 (15:07):
I have seen so many times in our family as a working
example, where my kids arehearing, and let me get let me
even be more specific.
My daughters, when they receivefeedback from me, it will
trigger them and some defenseswill come up, and all of a
(15:28):
sudden they're in fight orflight mode.
And my husband can use the exactsame words to them, and it is
like they're cool as a cucumber,they're not triggered at all.
And so there is this notion thatwho is giving the feedback
triggers an underlying belief inthe receiver's mind.
(15:48):
And so when I started tounderstand this was actually
happening, it wasn't like madeup in my brain.
It's like, well, what is that?
What are the underlying rebelbeliefs in the receiver that
when I say something, it'striggering defense.
But when my husband is sayingit, it's like this awesome
conversation, and they canactually solve a problem
(16:10):
together, right?
The funny thing is, the flipside is equally as true when it
comes to the boys.
I can say anything unpolishedwithout grace to my boys.
And it's like water goes offtheir back, they don't get
offended, they're like, oh mom,okay.
They hear everything, they soakit up.
(16:30):
They're just like they'responges.
When my husband says somethingto the boys, you might as well
crush their soul.
He can use the exact same words,and they walk away feeling like
they're failures.
And so I don't know if it's likethe the dad on something, and
then the mom on the like there'ssomething with the the parental
role, mom, dad towards sons anddaughters that trigger different
(16:54):
things.
Sure.
And so it's an incredibleopportunity to like what's
really going on underneath thecovers to say, how can we
actually hear the feedback andmove forward?
Because somewhere along the way,uh positive intent is getting
lost.
SPEAKER_02 (17:10):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (17:11):
And, you know, insecurities are brewing.
SPEAKER_02 (17:14):
Yeah.
Well, I mean, sometimes, youknow, when we're genuinely
trying to help, um, it's ourfilters, you know, that get in
the way.
Um, our fears, our past wounds,you know, of course, all the
triggers we've already talkedabout.
And it's often hard to tell thedifference when you're like in
it.
You know, connecting some ofwhat you just shared about what
(17:36):
y'all experience as a family,uh, in correction, is back to a
little bit of neuroscience.
You know, the moment that any ofus senses criticism, whether
it's loving, you know,constructive or or not, even if
it's mild, what happens on theinside is our amygdala, which is
that, you know, alarm center,that that fight or flight, that
(17:59):
threat center in our brain, itlights up.
So our body often reacts beforeour spirit, you know, can even
take that moment to interpretwhat's happening.
Um, but again, you know, we'vesaid it already.
I mean, once you are healed andyou let God do that work inside
of you, I think you're able totake more of that pause.
(18:21):
But just naturally, our body isgoing to react that way.
So sometimes that means we'renot actually reacting to the
person.
Um, so you know, give yourselfsome grace.
We're just reacting, you know,to what's happening in our body
or maybe some undealt history ofour of our own.
Um when I think about um, youknow, reacting, dealing with
(18:46):
undealt history.
Um, hopefully, dad, if youlisten to this, it's okay if I
say this out loud.
But I do, I I think of my dadum, who struggles with this
because of his childhood.
I mean, he literally has likePTSD.
Um, so it's easy for him to takeeven just a small um, maybe, you
(19:11):
know, we might consider doing itthis way, as instantly the way
you describe that your daughtersreact.
You know, the fight or flightgoes off.
Um, he feels like it's apersonal attack, and I know what
he hears, even at the slightest,you know, here's how we could do
something better, different.
It's like you're wrong, you'rebad, you know, shame.
(19:35):
Um it's like his brain uh wireditself to equate even the
smallest correction withrejection.
And that's why all of this is soimportant, like for us to really
pause before we personalizethings, whether we're receiving
or giving.
SPEAKER_00 (19:52):
100%.
Oftentimes I've given feedbackin my career to people who are
working directly for me or not.
Right.
I mean, that is the role thatyou play in leadership is how do
you continue to give feedbackand help people rise to what you
know God has put in them.
And I have met my feedbackalmost, I've been attacked back.
So the receiver is hearingrejection from me or they're
(20:16):
hearing me say, you're failingbecause I'm observing a certain
characteristic in them.
And I'm always, and it's sotough, you know, to navigate,
especially like if it's a newerrelationship and you don't have
the depth and breadth of historyto tell you that this feedback
is actually safe.
It's gonna help me get stronger,better.
SPEAKER_02 (20:35):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (20:35):
There's always the initial bumpy to bump bump that
you can quickly start to seewhere God is still working on
healing a human heart whenyou're coming up against that.
I mean, just recently I wasgiving feedback uh to someone
that I work with, and it wasalmost like I was received as a
(20:56):
bully.
Like, I can't believe you'regiving me this type of feedback.
And instead of me beingdefensive on why would you ever
think that I'm trying to bullyyou?
Right.
It really made me more curiousabout how are you hearing what I
just said this way?
And love loving that person,even though they're getting
(21:20):
visibly upset with me, is morelike, hey, I want you to slow
down.
And I actually want tounderstand what really just
happened to make you respondthat way.
And so this notion like, what dowe do in those moments as the
receiver when we are gettingtriggered?
It's slow down, yeah, pause andthen don't personalize it.
(21:42):
Oftentimes we're gettingtriggered when we're receiving
information because it's comingup, you know, talk about
rejection.
It's actually coming up, it'sbumping up against our identity.
And the identity is sayingthere's something wrong with me.
That's good.
And now I have to preservebecause if there's something
wrong with me, that starts to goagainst my value, my worth, etc.
(22:03):
Where there's so much uhreaction to the uh situation as
opposed to thoughtful response.
And thoughtful response willallow you to decouple the words
that someone's saying to youfrom who you are in Christ.
SPEAKER_02 (22:20):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (22:21):
And so that's the first thing is pause, right?
The next is just extract thegood, the precious metals, the
gold, yeah, and get rid of thejunk, right?
And so sometimes, oftentimes,remember, we're human beings to
human beings.
So a human being is givingfeedback and we're receiving the
feedback.
And it's two imperfect people ina very delicate exchange of
(22:45):
information.
And we both probably, the giverand the receiver, have something
to learn.
And so when I'm gettinginformation as the receiver,
what actually has merit in whatthey're saying?
What might be the gold, thetreasure, the precious stones
that God wants me to hear?
Yeah, because he's calling mehigher.
(23:06):
It's good.
And when he calls me higher, Ican actually expand my wings and
I can fly, like the eagle,right?
But what is the noise?
What's the distraction?
What's the pebbles, the gravel?
Like what needs to go away, andI don't need to take it with me.
And it's not dismissing what'simportant for the sake of
self-preservation.
Yep.
It's truly like you've processedit with the Lord.
(23:29):
So you've been able topersonally, number one, you've
detached from the actualfeedback personally.
Yeah.
So your emotions are not drivingyou and you're in a response
mode.
You're sifting for the good,right?
And you're gonna you're gonna beintentional to understand what
that is, and you're getting ridof the noise.
So pick up the signal, get ridof the noise.
And then lastly, understand howdo you start to take the
(23:52):
feedback and put it into action,but ensure that it aligns with
the fruit of the Holy Spirit.
That's good.
So you got to test to make surethat the feedback coming in
actually aligns with the fruitof the Holy Spirit found in
Galatians.
And if it doesn't, then dump it,right?
SPEAKER_02 (24:10):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (24:10):
It's it's run for the hills.
Uh, because again, remember thatanything that makes you feel
less than ashamed, guilt-ridden,it's not from the Holy Spirit.
That is flesh on flesh.
But anything that calls youhigher, and it's like very clear
conviction that can take you toa broader field of planting, if
(24:36):
you will.
Um, you know, spreading yourwings to fly, that's where God's
in it to help you fly.
Oh, such good points.
SPEAKER_02 (24:43):
Um, yeah, and it just makes me think that we have
to remember with being calledhigher, that sometimes we have
splinters that God needs to digout and he's gonna use other
people to do that, right?
And yeah, that process ispainful, but ultimately you feel
better.
It leaves you feeling peace ifit's actually from the Holy
(25:05):
Spirit and does that call youhigher.
Literally got a visual of asplinter being stuck in my
finger.
SPEAKER_00 (25:10):
We've all been there.
Yeah.
It hurts.
And just to kind of summarize itagain, make sure emotionally
you're in a place not to react,but to respond thoughtfully as
the receiver.
SPEAKER_01 (25:23):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:23):
And sometimes, by the way, if you're hearing
something that does not trulyalign to your spirit, you can
graciously say, Thank you.
Yeah, thank you for caring forme.
Thank you for that feedback.
I'm gonna need a minute toprocess it.
SPEAKER_01 (25:39):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:39):
And you don't have to say anything in the moment,
right?
God says, you know what, listenmore than we speak.
And so when we're hearing,listen and then go process with
the Lord.
SPEAKER_02 (25:53):
Yeah, nothing diffuses a potential argument
faster than when you can staycentered and not react uh
emotionally.
I also think it's really kind ofa test in your own security and
your own identity, you know, uh,to not immediately feel
triggered.
(26:14):
Exactly.
Yeah, so I mean, at the end ofthe day, we need to stay open
without staying wounded.
Feedback isn't our enemy, it'san invitation in some cases to
rise higher, um, but only whenwe learn how to filter it
through love and not fear andour own unhealed wounds and
(26:34):
triggers.
Um, so let's kind of flip thescript a little bit and move on
to being the giver, you know,talking about the one who's
actually giving that thatfeedback, which sometimes feels
a whole lot easier to be thewise one, right?
Like, let me just bless you realquick.
Let me help you help yourself.
(26:55):
My unsolicited discernment here.
Um, but we've got to checkourselves um, you know, with
with how we go about doing that.
Um, because sometimes thingsthat can be disguised as
discernment actually isjudgment, and we not might not
even realize that ourselves.
Um, so just like, you know, whenwe're on the receiving end, we
(27:19):
need to pause, connect with theHoly Spirit, kind of take out
the nuggets.
I think we we've got to pauseand pray and and ask the Holy
Spirit before we reach out andshare our constructive
criticism.
You know, uh ask ourselves, arewe sharing truth and love, or
are we just sharing our opinion?
(27:40):
You know, is are we simplycalling out something in someone
else that makes us uncomfortablebecause it somehow reflects on
us, or am I truly trying to lovesomeone well and call them
higher?
SPEAKER_00 (27:53):
Yeah, 100%.
You know, and just because youruh intent may be pure, like the
hammer coming down, your impactcould be in a completely
different zip code.
Yeah, right.
I think for me, when I am goingto give feedback, when I know
(28:13):
that my heart is pure before theLord, I actually don't want to
initially give the feedback.
And they that might soundstrange.
I'm not saying this is universalfor everyone, but for me, it's I
almost shy away from thefeedback.
Like, oh, I don't want to hurtthat person.
They I don't know that they'reready to hear it.
And all the fears that I haveabout how they're like it's
(28:37):
almost like people pleaser kicksin.
Like I it's more about howthey're gonna hear my feedback
and how it's gonna reflect on mein a negative way than how
they're gonna receive it and howit's gonna help them.
Now it's kind of like flippingit flipping it on its head.
Why do I know that that's themoment the Holy Spirit's calling
(28:58):
me to give the feedback?
It kind of sounds strange.
SPEAKER_02 (29:01):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:01):
Because it is the exact opposite of my flesh.
So I'm why do I care so muchabout self-preservation?
Why is my safety more importantthan helping the person?
And then what could be thealternative instead of them
rejecting my feedback?
How could this help them?
And do I truly love them enoughto help them rise?
(29:22):
And God has to get my heart to aplace of serving that person
purely, and then I can go in andgive the feedback.
So there's this initial, I don'twant to give the feedback, and I
start to wrestle it with theHoly Spirit.
And then He gets me repositionedto be effective in the feedback.
That's when I know that I'mhonoring the Lord.
(29:45):
Where I have fallen straight onmy face as the giver of feedback
is where I respond in the flesh.
Oh, look, I'm gonna tell youwhere you messed up.
I'm gonna tell you.
And I just dive head first withno prayer, no processing.
I know I'm right.
Right out of the gate, and I'mjust gonna give it to you.
That's when I'm ahead of theHoly Spirit.
SPEAKER_02 (30:04):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (30:05):
And so there's, I think there's this holy pause
that says, maybe I shouldn'tgive this feedback, be quick to
listen, slow to speak.
That's what God says.
SPEAKER_02 (30:16):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (30:17):
And then when the nudge is like, no, I need you to
speak, I need you to speak, andthere's that continuance and
that nudging, then I know theHoly Spirit is working.
SPEAKER_02 (30:26):
That's so good and so honest.
I mean, I feel like all of us uhhave that inner turmoil
constantly.
And I think we easily, asChristians, get confused that
it's not nice, you know, it'snot kind uh to give that
constructive feedback, but Imean, get right back into his
word.
(30:47):
You know, Ephesians tells usspeak truth and love.
Yes.
Uh 2 Timothy 4.2 reminds us tocorrect, rebuke, and encourage
with patience.
Um, and Ezekiel 33, and to bewatchmen, you know, and warn
against when when danger iscoming.
So his word reminds us, and ofcourse, Jesus, you know,
(31:10):
corrected all day, every day,right?
With love, um, with patience,with grace.
Um, but we have to remember thatwhen our feedback lacks
solution, or it lacks hope, orit lacks belief in somebody's
ability to really grow, um, Ithink it stops being
(31:31):
constructive.
Um, it stops being well-meaning.
SPEAKER_00 (31:35):
That's so good.
It's also uh goes back to theother point that you made.
Is the feedback in service tothe person in front of me to
help them rise, or is it inservice to the image I'm trying
to protect?
SPEAKER_02 (31:49):
Good.
SPEAKER_00 (31:50):
Right?
And I can say regretfully andwith utmost humility, I have
given feedback uh probably moreto my daughters, because I
think, you know, the tensionbetween moms and daughters and
the tension between fathers andsons, you know, I said it in
just a little bit ago.
But there's this notion where Ithink the daughters can more
(32:12):
easily see themselves and theirshortcomings, how they view
their shortcomings more in theirmother.
SPEAKER_02 (32:17):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (32:18):
Or they see the strengths in their mother, and
because they don't have thosesame strengths, they see it as
their own shortfall.
Sure.
And it's not the same whenyou're going to a male.
SPEAKER_02 (32:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (32:28):
Males are wired differently.
And same thing with boys withtheir fathers, they can see how
great their father is.
And if they're not living up tothat standard in their head, the
feedback is I'm failing.
Right.
And so there's this measuringstick, this comparison that's
constantly going on while we'rein relationship together.
That's just how the flesh is,and God says, do not compare.
(32:50):
But the fact is, we do compare.
SPEAKER_02 (32:52):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (32:53):
And so I can say, with all honesty, there have
been times where I have given mydaughters feedback, comparing
their path in womanhood to myown path.
Sure.
And I have called them short,meaning you're you're on the
short end of the stick.
You need to raise your game.
You need you need to dosomething differently than
(33:14):
you're doing.
Yeah.
But do they?
Is what I'm actually picking onthem?
Is it a character defect?
Is it unrighteous living?
And if it's not unrighteousliving, I actually shouldn't
have a lot of opinions.
Fair.
If I'm just if I'm justnitpicking where they're at in
their journey of this life,which has a hundred different
(33:35):
ways to get to heaven, yeah,right, with workmanship and
whatever.
Um, you know, I had just as aworking example, I had it in my
head.
I have six kids.
All six kids were going to go tocollege and get the degree, and
then da-da-da.
And, you know, I have one thatliterally is not wired to do
that, right?
I mean, she she literally is agifted artist and she it thrives
(34:00):
as um a hairstylist, etc.
And her journey to figure thatout, it was not a traditional
path that I had prescribed forher.
And there was lots ofopportunities for me to give her
feedback, and it was a hundredpercent not aligned to anything
that in scripture that says shehad to go to a four-year
(34:21):
university.
Do you see what I'm saying?
Yeah.
And so the the point is, is herpath didn't fit what I deemed as
the traditional path to lead herto success.
Yeah.
But at the end of the day,clearly she's in the gifting and
the calling of the Lord.
And so the question starts tobecome when am I giving
feedback, when I'm givingfeedback to somebody, am I truly
(34:45):
helping them rise in character?
That's good.
Or am I nitpicking on somereflection of what's making me
as the mother look less than?
And it's just a holy pausemoment.
Yeah.
Well, where'd that shift happenfor you?
Well, honestly, you have tosometimes hit a pit to be able
(35:09):
to see.
And so it takes, as my all mychildren continue to grow and
mature in adulthood, some of thethings that you say in passing,
you don't even realize that it'slike sandpaper on an open wound.
SPEAKER_01 (35:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:25):
That they hear it when you know, when you say
this, mom, you make me feel A,B, and C.
And you're like, what?
I would never want to make youfeel that way.
Why do you feel that way when Isay that?
And there's always someunderlying thing that somewhere
along the way, the it certainwords and actions made them
(35:45):
believe something to be trueabout who they are.
SPEAKER_01 (35:48):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:49):
And these words cause rejection.
So, for example, my daughter nottruly going through a four-year
university.
I'm gonna think less of her.
She's less valuable than thekids who are getting the
four-year degree.
That's just nonsense.
Yeah.
But yet, culture tells kids thistoday.
And then my actions reallyputting a lot of weight into the
(36:13):
four-year degree.
And why?
Because I didn't have atraditional path.
It took me, you know, until mymid-20s to finish my degree.
And that was the unlock for myown success to really grow into
leadership.
And so in my mind, you had tohave the degree.
Yeah.
And I want the very best for mykids.
But so then you take a kid who'son an untraditional degree path,
(36:34):
and then all of a sudden they'regoing to feel less than their
siblings.
Yeah.
And so it's when they'recourageous enough to actually
open the door to thevulnerability of, hey, this
makes me feel insecure.
This makes me feel less than,you start to understand what
seems to be innocent feedback isactually destructive towards the
(36:55):
receiver.
And so now it's up to me toguard my words.
And is it really about helpingthis person rise?
Or is it about preserving my ownego, my own image?
That's good.
Whatever, or actually mitigatinga fear.
So in this example, you know,maybe some of it's tied to my
ego, wanting all my kids to havea degree, and I can, you know,
(37:19):
browbeat my chest from thatnature.
I don't really think that's it.
Uh but for protection.
But for me, it's it's in thename of protection.
SPEAKER_02 (37:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (37:28):
But it's not protection because when you lead
from fear, when you mother fromfear, you're not love, you know,
fear casts out love.
SPEAKER_02 (37:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (37:37):
Love casts out fear.
And I've said this before (37:38):
if I'm loving my children from a
place of fear, I'm not lovingthem at all.
And so I'm really giving themfeedback to minimize or to get
rid of a fear that I have.
It's good.
SPEAKER_02 (37:54):
Yeah, and even God does that.
His correction always comeswrapped in encouragement.
It always has grace and truth.
Um, it's never one or the other,you know, and the goal is never
to win, win an argument.
It's always to win a heart.
Um, and you've said this before,to call people higher, you know,
(38:15):
to help them rise higher.
Ephesians 4 29 reminds us let nocorrupt word proceed out of your
mouth, but only what is helpfulfor building others up.
So you already started to hit onsome practical tools, really,
um, if you are the giver.
Um, you talked a little bitabout checking your motive
first, um, which, and thank youfor sharing all those honest
(38:38):
stories about how y'all havenavigated that because it helps
it make sense for for ourlisteners, you know.
Are we moved by love?
Are we moved by truth, or are wemoved by our own motives, like
frustration or control uh orbeing right?
Um, is what I'm about to sayreally about their freedom?
I love that you said character.
(39:00):
You know, is this really acharacter issue or not?
Or is it about my ownfrustration or my own image or
my own need to control?
Um, you know, matching themoment is another good tool.
Um, every moment doesn't need asermon.
Been there.
Yes, amen.
(39:21):
I have a hard time with a lot ofwords sometimes.
Um you know, so discern that.
Um, know your setting, know youraudience.
You know, if it's if it's amoment of like celebration, like
somebody just conqueredsomething that was difficult
before you just come in hot.
(39:42):
How about start with, you did,you know, great up there, you
know, don't necessarilyencourage the whole, you know,
poop sandwich, but start withsomething that they did well and
acknowledge the courage that ittook maybe to step out and do
that thing before you come in umwith the criticism and even
(40:02):
asking yourself, am I qualifiedto give this advice?
Right?
Like, there's a lot of is thatwhere the term Karen came from?
Is it?
I don't even know, is it?
SPEAKER_00 (40:15):
Like, I don't know.
Like uh you're Karen abouteverything, I guess.
That's so funny.
No, it's so true.
And I think knowing the time, asyou said, like, ooh, there's
been feedback given to me atsuch the wrong moment.
Yeah.
You know, uh, I could I couldhave just given a huge
(40:36):
presentation at work, and I hadbeen manifesting stress, and you
know, I literally have been withpeers in rehearsals on the big,
you know, presentation forleadership kickoff of the year.
And, you know, you're doing itto 300 people, and so there's
some anxiety around it, etcetera.
Yeah, sweat, sweat, sweat.
And as soon as you're done,someone comes up and you know,
(41:00):
gives you an at a girl on theback.
But it's like, did you reallyhave to have to do that?
Did you have to say it rightthen?
And it's like, oh, can we notjust say you did a great job?
And then when we get to, youknow, what can we raise the bar
(41:21):
on next time around?
Let's do it then.
Yeah.
And so knowing the time is so,so critically important.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (41:29):
Yeah.
And then there's times of ofstruggle where you want, you
should probably comfort thembefore you correct them, you
know, like they're going throughsomething hard, but there's
still something for you toaddress.
Um, and then there's time whensomeone actually asks you for
your input.
Yay! Um, you're like, since youasked, you know, there's my
(41:52):
green light.
So always remember to lead withhonor and grace, like like the
Lord does.
Call people higher rather thanpush them back down or chastise
them.
Because oftentimes the way thatwe correct people, we can cut
them off at the knees whenthey're actually on their own
assignment.
SPEAKER_00 (42:12):
Yeah, they're stepping into their calling.
100%.
You know, it reminds me of uhjust so many people that I've
had the privilege of workingwith over the years.
Another way to give feedbackthat can be really, really well
received.
Specifically, if I know someoneis having a hard time with uh,
(42:34):
it could be executivecommunication.
So when you go from anindividual contributor and you
start to rise in leadership andyou're starting to communicate
to executive teams orboardrooms, et cetera, how the
style of communication changes,right?
And it really is a bit of an artand a science on how you start
to elevate your voice in thosevarious settings.
(42:56):
Yeah.
And a lot of people that I havefound, specifically in
technology, struggle with thattransition and elevation of
voice for impact influence.
And so I have to be very carefulwhen I am growing and harvesting
talent that I'll give thefeedback, but I'm not the hammer
coming in constantlymicromanaging every time they're
(43:21):
in a meeting.
And it's more of, you know, ameeting finishes and they've
really been trained to come backto me and say, Hey, how was
that?
And I'll say, I don't know, howdid it feel to you?
And really get them to be moreintrospective.
SPEAKER_01 (43:36):
It's good.
SPEAKER_00 (43:37):
And if I hear that they're picking up on where they
uh fell short, if you will, inmy observation, I will say,
let's not be too hard onyourself.
SPEAKER_01 (43:50):
It's good.
SPEAKER_00 (43:51):
Because there's this fine line of again, truth with
love.
You have to leave someoneencouraged with the ability to
believe that they're actuallygoing to elevate their game.
Yeah.
They can't leave theconversation defeated.
Yeah.
And so our job as the giver offeedback is to make sure someone
(44:13):
feels inspired and empowered toconquer the mountain when they
leave our presence.
And it's just like I think ofMoses again, Moses and God.
God called Moses, and Moses hada stutter.
He called him to speak toPharaoh, the number one leader
in the world, right?
And he called him as a voicewith a stutter.
(44:36):
He said, right?
And he's like, not me, Lord.
He's like, literally, not me,not me, send someone else.
And after this exchange,multiple times, God is
frustrated with him.
You know, do you not see thatI've called you?
But you know what?
In my grace, I'm going to, I'mgoing to give you Aaron, and
Aaron will be your mouthpiece.
(44:57):
Okay.
So here's your get out of jailfree card.
But the point is, God didn'tkick Moses out of the
conversation.
SPEAKER_02 (45:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (45:06):
He actually qualified him in his weakness,
and he still led the Israelitesfor 40 years in the wilderness.
SPEAKER_01 (45:14):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (45:15):
And so, wow, if that is God and how God raises up
people, that's our model.
Like when we're, we can nitpickon people's skill, the level of
their skill, and how they'reshowing up.
But it's really, how are ourwords truly impacting the person
in front of us, their ability togrow?
SPEAKER_01 (45:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (45:37):
Which means, I'm going to restate it, they have
to leave the conversation offeedback with us as the giver of
feedback, empowered in beliefthat they're ready to conquer
the next mountain.
SPEAKER_02 (45:48):
So good.
That's so beautiful what you dowith your team members because
you took constructive criticismand made it collaboration.
SPEAKER_00 (45:58):
And you know, I don't, I know we've said the
word criticism a lot uh today.
I actually don't like that word.
Yeah.
Criticism.
Uh who are we to critique God'screation?
SPEAKER_02 (46:10):
That's good.
SPEAKER_00 (46:10):
Again, it's how do you feel about how if if it's
again, there's there's two typesof feedback, right?
How am I showing up?
Well, there's three.
How am I showing up inrelationships?
And, you know, how are weinteracting together?
How am I showing up doing work,the work that I'm doing for
vocation or the work that I'mdoing for the Lord, right?
(46:34):
And then there's my character.
Who am I as a righteous personin front of the Lord?
What defects do I have in mycharacter?
So feedback can be like, hey,I'm seeing some unrighteous
behavior in you.
I'm gonna need, I'm gonna callyou higher.
Yep, right?
As far as the work goes, thecritique goes, that's a lot of
that, like how do you raisesomebody up in a skill set?
(46:58):
A lot of that is the person withthe Lord, growing their
confidence and letting the Lorddo the work in that person.
And we be a voice of empowermentand inspiration, right?
And so that's kind of just how Ikind of zoom back out and think
about, and then relationally,obviously, I started with that
(47:18):
one.
If I'm not treating you acertain way, that you, if I'm
not treating you with respect,well, you're gonna have a little
bit of feedback for me.
SPEAKER_02 (47:26):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (47:26):
Right?
And so, how you treat people,how do you manage the work of
God and the skill that He's putin you?
And then how are you owning yourcharacter as uh a follower of
Jesus Christ?
It's good.
SPEAKER_02 (47:38):
Yeah, so so just a little challenge for all of us
before we correct someone, youknow.
I would say, ask, have youprayed about this?
Yeah, you know, first always goto the Holy Spirit, or did you
just stew on it and you're readyto share your care and feedback?
I know.
It's so good.
(47:58):
Am I speaking to help them growor am I speaking to be right?
That's a big one.
Um I like being right.
SPEAKER_00 (48:07):
I do too.
Dan, I'm right a lot.
I was gonna say that if youdidn't ever spend.
SPEAKER_02 (48:16):
It's hard being right all the time.
Just ask your husband, John.
Yes, exactly.
Oh my goodness.
And if it's not, you know,wrapped in love, um, then it's
you know not from God.
Um, there's one more would notneed to be spoken.
SPEAKER_00 (48:33):
Amen.
There's one more that I it's uha little unusual that I want to
just kind of pull back as I waspraying this morning over this,
actually.
I felt like God was showing mesomething.
So it's not a fully developedthought, but it's worth planting
a seed for all of us to kind ofexplore with God.
Okay.
(48:53):
What happens when we start tosee a speck in our own eye that
is actually a log that hasalready been released from our
(49:18):
life.
SPEAKER_02 (49:20):
It's like in our own eye, that is a log that's
already been released.
Well, I you're now have to helpme unpack that one because how
is it there at all if it'salready been released?
SPEAKER_00 (49:34):
Yep.
Okay, so I'm gonna restate itagain.
Okay.
So I wanna I wanna go somewherethat's a little bit different
than when we when we think aboutthe the speck in your brother's
eye, your sister's eye, and thelog in your own.
I want to talk about the logsthat remain in our heart like
(49:57):
anchors that God's alreadyforgiven us for.
So a historical past log, okay.
Maybe uh I was a perpetual liarbefore I knew Christ.
Uh maybe I stole something,maybe I cheated, maybe fill in
the blank.
Whatever the sin is, the log inyour own eye, that thing that
(50:22):
you keep beating yourself upabout, that keeps telling you
you're less than the person nextto you because you still have
this log.
But when you came to Christ, Godsays, I see that log, I forgive
that log, let it go.
And then what he's gonna do isas you continue to transform
(50:43):
your heart in front of him, he'sgonna show you the next log that
needs to be dealt with, right?
I think oftentimes there's thisinternal abuse that we put
ourselves through, yeah, wherewe're looking at the log in our
own eye, but it's actually notan active log.
(51:07):
It's something that's alreadybeen buried through the blood of
Christ.
Yeah.
When we were forgiven, but wekeep pulling it back up like
it's real.
Do you see what I'm saying?
Yeah, it's a wall, it creates awall in our relationship between
us and the Lord.
Yes.
So when we are quick, you know,when we're talking about judging
others, we're also quick tojudge ourselves.
(51:27):
Oh, yeah.
Okay.
I'm real good at that.
And so I just want to spend justa minute on that.
Um not to completely, you know,um unpack it, but literally when
I was praying over this episodethis morning, I just felt like
God tell me, what are theundealt with logs in your life
(51:49):
that aren't current?
They're in the past that stillcome into the present.
And I didn't fully unpack it,but it's this notion of if you
are if you're activelystruggling with something from
your past where you haveconfessed it to God, okay, you
(52:11):
have repented, meaning you nolonger do those actions.
So if you were a perpetual liarand you repented to God and you
no longer lie, that is buriedwith the blood of Jesus.
But you actually haven'treceived his forgiveness.
You need to receive hisforgiveness.
SPEAKER_01 (52:29):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (52:29):
And how do you do that?
You do it through praise andworship and declaration that you
who are set free in Christ isfree indeed.
You are free.
I just really feel like ourlisteners needed to hear that.
So there's something that'skeeping you in your own bondage,
(52:49):
some log that you think iscurrent, you're beating yourself
up about it.
You don't deserve this, you'renot worthy of that because of
something from your past, butit's gone, it's dead, it's
buried.
Let it go.
Walk free in Christ.
Amen.
Amen.
Amen.
I just need to show that.
Thank you.
Yep.
(53:10):
So maybe start to considerjournaling a time where you got
it wrong.
So I've given a couple ofexamples where uh I have
received feedback and I feltlike I was rejected, or I've
given feedback and the feedbackon the other end wasn't received
so well.
So I didn't really, you know,effectively give the feedback to
(53:33):
the other person in front of me.
I would encourage us to reallybe mindful.
When have I been a giver or areceiver and I didn't do it
God's way?
What can I learn from it?
And what can I do differentlynext time?
How can I think about this roleof giving and receiving feedback
(53:56):
is an opportunity to strengthena connection?
What needs to be different tofortify that relational
connection and to help theperson in front of me if I'm the
giver?
And even if I'm the receiver,how do I obviously protect from
the noise, but then rise in thegrowth?
(54:17):
Like, what's the gold I'msupposed to extract?
SPEAKER_02 (54:19):
Yeah, well, that's it.
I mean, we're all walking thefine line between wanting to
help and not wanting to hurt.
Um, and we've said it before,but the goal at the end of the
day is never to win an argument,it's to win a heart and help
people, you know, rise higher.
Um, Jesus did that all day long.
He didn't shame people intochange, he loved them into
freedom.
(54:39):
And so we can do the same thingif we go to him first before we
have those conversations.
Um, and sometimes, sometimes themost powerful thing is to maybe
say nothing at all.
You know, yeah, like when itreally isn't about somebody's
character, as you said.
I think that that that verysuccinctly helps you think about
(55:04):
things.
I think you know, if thefeedback I'm getting isn't truly
about like protecting them,truly protecting them or their
character or their morals ortheir integrity.
Um think long and hard aboutwhether that's your role or
Jesus' role.
SPEAKER_00 (55:25):
Amen.
I love it.
Well, how about we pray?
Awesome.
Okay.
Well, Heavenly Father, we justthank you so much that you give
us eyes to see where we needheart change.
And Lord, that you are justsharpening our minds, our
mouths, and our hearts to bejust incredible stewards of
(55:48):
feedback, both receiving it andgiving it, Lord.
Thank you that we will firstlook at the logs in our own
eyes.
We will deal with those logswith you, and we will receive
forgiveness.
We will turn from them, andLord, we will be set free in
you.
And Lord, when you call us togive just counsel to a person in
(56:10):
front of us, Lord, let us bemindful that we need to be just
washed first in your truth andyour love.
So our words will be just avessel of setting the person in
front of us free.
Freedom in you, Lord, first andforemost.
(56:31):
Lord, we love you and we justgive you glory in the name of
Jesus.
Amen.
Amen.
Good morning, friend.
Good morning.
How are you doing?
I'm doing good.
How about you?
I'm doing phenomenal.
What you got cooking thisweekend?
SPEAKER_02 (00:17):
Let's see.
Oh, I'm gonna have dinner uh atthe house with a couple of
friends, an engaged couple thatI haven't seen in probably
almost a year.
They've they've I've lived inthis house for three years and
they haven't been to my houseonce, so I'm excited.
SPEAKER_00 (00:30):
That's incredible.
SPEAKER_02 (00:31):
And it cracked me up when I said, um, you know, you
can stay the night, no pressurethough, but you know, I'm out
there.
I mean, I'm far north.
I think when people even they'realready going, okay, am I still
going on 77 and I haven't gottenoff yet?
Yes.
And then when you get off, it'slike farm country.
You pass, you know, cows and abarn and some mini goats and all
(00:53):
kinds of things, and they'relike, whoa, she's where is she?
He said, We'll bring our jamjams.
So, that's fun.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00):
Yeah, awesome.
How about you?
Well, we're just gonna lay low.
John, you know, did something tohis back, and so it's gonna be
caregiving to him.
Okay.
Just kind of laying low.
SPEAKER_02 (01:11):
Does he milk it like most men?
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
He uh he's a trooper, and you know, as he
climbs the years, he getsworried about an ailment.
He's like, Is this the end ofme?
And I'm like, babe, I justpulled a muscle in your back.
SPEAKER_02 (01:28):
Well, he's very active.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
You both are, and you're great pickleball players,
I might add.
I think that's the hardest partis he's very active, and this is
slowing him down to zero.
Yeah, that's hard.
So, but it's good.
It gives us a reason to stay inthe house and just rest and
recharge, nuggle up and rest andrecharge.
Yeah, yeah.
So, what are we talking abouttoday?
SPEAKER_02 (01:48):
Oh, tricky, it's very tricky.
It's a tricky tight rope inevery single one of our
relationships, which isunderstanding the difference
between constructive criticism,uh, correction, encouragement,
and calling out sin.
SPEAKER_00 (02:05):
Ooh, wow, that is meeting.
SPEAKER_02 (02:07):
Yeah, and kind of knowing, you know, when you need
to maybe put down the microphoneand pick up the mirror.
You know, sometimes we're outthere thinking that we are the
Holy Spirit's assistant, right?
SPEAKER_00 (02:20):
Uh yes.
I think that resonates.
SPEAKER_02 (02:24):
Yeah, and Jesus spoke about it in Matthew 7, 3
through 5.
Why do you look at the speck inyour brother's eye and pay no
attention to the plank in yourown?
And I think that we've all beenon both sides of the equation,
you know, whether you're thegiver or the receiver, right?
You know, you've you've tried tohelp someone and have it
completely backfire, or you'vebeen on the receiving end before
(02:48):
and had somebody try to give youconstructive criticism and had
it leave you feeling small.
But then there's other timeswhere that construction,
constructive criticism upliftsand really propels you forward,
you know, and helps you to growand step into everything that
you were meant to be.
So we're gonna talk about thatdelicate, tight rope, um, how to
(03:11):
speak life, um, not shame, youknow, when when to speak up and
when to maybe zip it.
SPEAKER_00 (03:18):
Yeah, exactly.
You know, I often think of thecommon saying, feedback is a
gift.
But it is not a gift if it's notdone with the right heart.
SPEAKER_02 (03:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (03:29):
And so to your point, you said you can give and
receive feedback.
SPEAKER_02 (03:34):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (03:34):
Feedback is a gift if it's done with the right
position of the heart, accordingto scripture, which obviously
we're gonna dive into.
But it's actually poison ordestructive if your position of
the heart is not where it needsto be in alignment with you know
the biblical truth.
Because you you can't givefeedback from a place of hurt.
(03:57):
And then specifically, if you'rereceiving, you can't receive
feedback if you're hearing itthrough the ears of hurt.
That's good.
And so feedback is not always agift, and we need to understand
that it's our role as aChristian to turn the
opportunity of giving feedbackinto the gift that it should be
intended to be.
SPEAKER_02 (04:16):
Yeah, it's good.
Well, first let's talk about thethe big picture of this, you
know, human struggle that we'reall dealing with because we love
to believe that we're helpingpeople, but sometimes we're just
hiding from our own growth.
You know, I think most of thetime people are not trying to be
cruel when they correct someone.
(04:36):
We really do want to help, wewant to protect, we want to love
well.
Um, but sometimes there's abunch of things that could be
going on in the background thatwe don't even realize is
happening.
Like someone else's growth makesus uncomfortable because it
quietly exposes places wherewe're still stuck.
Other times, um, the discomfortisn't even about our own growth,
(05:00):
but it's about how otherpeople's choices make us feel
ourselves.
You know, we want other peopleto just get it together, um, not
just for their sake, but becausetheir behavior reflects back on
us, you know, as a parent, as aleader, as a friend, as a
partner.
Um it's it's almost likesomething about their
(05:21):
imperfection uh, you know,threatens the image that we're
trying to uphold ourselves.
So these are all things that wehave to be conscious of.
Um, we've got to check ourselvessometimes, you know, something
that's that's intended to beloving correction is really just
our own image management.
Um, and that's what you know, wewe said it already.
(05:44):
Um, why do you look at the speckin your brother's eye and pay no
attention to the plank in yourown?
In that scripture, Jesus wasn'tcondemning, he was inviting us
first to check the why beforethe what.
Um, because love can never healwhat pride is trying to control.
SPEAKER_00 (06:03):
Yeah, it's so good.
It's the two-sided coin, right?
It's truth on one side of thecoin and love on the other side
of the coin.
And it can be true that you canbe delivering information,
feedback, observations tosomebody that are true, but it
(06:24):
can feel like a hammer comingdown.
Yeah.
If love is not a blanket wrappedaround it.
And the opposite is also true.
I can love you all day long andnever deliver you, deliver the
truth to you, which is justenabling you to continue on the
uh the path that you're on.
I think it's important too thatfeedback that doesn't call you
(06:50):
higher in the net in the senseof uh feedback that calls us
higher in the name ofperfectionism is not actually
healthy feedback.
It's good because God doesn'tcall the perfect, right?
He actually uh calls theunqualified, and then through
obedience, he qualifies themthrough refinement.
(07:10):
And so the the notion, you know,you started with we try to show
up and be the Holy Spirit.
There's a difference of the HolySpirit refining us and who we
are and uh the craft of whatwe're doing, right?
Versus there's something in mycharacter that actually needs to
(07:32):
be sharpened.
And so when we're talking aboutMatthew 7 specifically, the the
speck and the plank, the speckin your brother's eye, and the
plank in your own, we're we'restarting to unpack when we're
talking about character defects,if you will, I put defect in
(07:53):
quotes, really make sure that wefirst, is it self-serving me or
is it truly in service of theother person?
And in the feedback that I'mgetting ready to deliver, is it
going to cause more harm thangood?
(08:13):
And that's the question mark.
And so gift is a feedback, youknow, feedback is a gift rather,
excuse me.
If it's if the net result isharm to the other person in
front of you, it's not a gift.
SPEAKER_02 (08:27):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:27):
And so I think part of what we have to examine when
we're called to, you know, leanin and love someone in truth, in
compassion, right?
It's do we have discernment onthe readiness that the listener
is going to receive, how they'regoing to hear it, how they're
(08:49):
going to receive it.
And that is equally asimportant, if not more
important, than what we actuallyhave to deliver.
If the information, excuse me,if the information I need to
tell you is more important thanme understanding your position
of heart to hear, then my motiveis not right.
SPEAKER_02 (09:07):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (09:08):
Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_02 (09:08):
It does.
Yeah, absolutely.
And and you know, we always haveto bring neuroscience in.
Of course not.
Um, you know, what's wild is ourbodies and our the chemicals in
our bodies can even betray us alittle bit, especially when we
are the giver.
Um I discovered that when we,whether it's constructive or
(09:29):
not, criticize other people, ourbrain releases a tiny hit of
dopamine.
So, I mean, think about that andand and how dangerous really
that is.
Because it's like our brain justreleased a tiny hit of that felt
good.
Yeah, that's dangerous.
Like, do that again, right?
(09:50):
Let me reinforce this uhcorrection, if you will.
Um, and so it, you know, our ourour brains can't necessarily
decipher like, did thisconversation bring healing?
Um or you know, did that controlfeel good?
So let me do it again.
(10:11):
That blew my mind in theresearch on on this.
SPEAKER_00 (10:15):
It's wild.
It's kind of you can kind ofpoint to the people that you may
have experienced, and I'm sureI've been one of those people
who other people haveexperienced when I've showed up
poorly.
But sometimes when we uh putopinions out there that kind of
call a microscope on someoneelse, and even if it's true, it
(10:35):
actually validates the valuethat we're providing in the
moment.
Like, look at me, I'm smart,look what I'm seeing, and I'm
gifted to see this thing.
And to your point, the dopamineis reaffirming the bad behavior
that your ego is more importantthan the person who's getting
the feedback in the moment.
That's so powerful.
(10:56):
The way that God made us though,He's so good that you know, you
get this hit of, yeah, do itagain, do it again, do it again.
So God created us to actuallywant to lean in and give
feedback to help his people bediscipled.
And we know the motive is goodwhen it's balanced with the
(11:17):
oxytocin and uh serotonin,right?
And so the oxytocin is actuallygoing to get released between
the two people and it's gonnacreate a connection that is
fortifying the informationthat's being exchanged.
So I'm giving you feedback.
This hormone is released, andwe're actually now forming a
(11:38):
connection when it's allhealthy, right?
When it's healthy, exactly.
It's not just do it again, do itagain, do it again.
It's do it again, and there'sstrong connection, and then
there's this serenity throughthe serotonin of peace coming
in.
Yeah.
So it's, you know, just like theFather, Son, Holy Spirit,
there's three uh little hormonesbeing released through this
(11:59):
exchange of healthy feedbackthat when done right, it ends
with more connection, notdisconnection.
It's good.
SPEAKER_02 (12:09):
Yeah, and the more healed we are, you know, the
more our help actually helpsothers, and the more we're able
to receive it.
Um, so let's really dig into thelens of being the receiver, and
then we'll all switch it and diginto the lens of being the
giver.
Um, because sometimes we we'vealready alluded to this, we
(12:32):
can't receive the correctionbecause the giver is wounded and
needs a mirror.
But sometimes it's we can'treceive the correction because
we're listening from the woundsthat we still haven't healed.
Um, so if I, you know, say itanother way, it's like sometimes
it's not what's said, um, it'swhat's unhealed.
SPEAKER_00 (12:53):
It's so true.
And oftentimes people don't hearthe correction.
Yeah.
They hear rejection.
Yeah.
And so I I know for me, there'sbeen so many times where I have
been, you know, feedback hasbeen given to me, and I
literally hear it like I'mfailing.
Yes.
There's like this complete likeoh I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm
(13:16):
failing in this moment.
Yeah.
And it could just be, you know,uh, my child says, You did this
thing and you hurt me.
And then I'm like, oh my gosh,I'm hearing that not like where
their position of their heart'scoming from, that they're
actually hurt.
I hear it as you stink as amother, you're failing as a
mother, da-da-da.
And I can't even deal with theirbroken heart in the moment.
(13:37):
Yeah.
And so I've really had to pushmyself to slow down to say, how
do I hear first their pain?
That's good.
And detach my identity to whatthey're telling me so I can
actually be a mother to them.
That's right.
And so it's this notion of whereis it's not my pride set that
(14:00):
it's not my pride that is theproblem, it's my pain that is
the problem.
Yeah.
That somewhere in my wiring,there's still something unhealed
that is making me feel rejectedor less than or a failure when
the feedback's coming in.
And so being able to capturethose moments as fast as
possible is the receiver, isgoing to help me even meet the
(14:23):
person who's being courageous togive me feedback, assuming
they're coming from a place oflove.
I can actually be a bettersteward of the feedback that
they're giving me real time toeven love them back.
SPEAKER_02 (14:33):
Yeah.
Well, isn't that a huge signwhen we immediately are
triggered and we're on thedefense and our fight or flight
is, you know, going off thecharts when you're receiving
feedback, even no matter howit's delivered, right?
I mean, that should be a momentwhere we go, okay, Holy Spirit,
you know, what do I still needto work on?
(14:54):
Um, and after we have worked onwhat needs healing, then your
fight or flight actually won'tgo off and you won't immediately
be on guard, no matter howsomebody delivers it.
SPEAKER_00 (15:07):
I have seen so many times in our family as a working
example, where my kids arehearing, and let me get let me
even be more specific.
My daughters, when they receivefeedback from me, it will
trigger them and some defenseswill come up, and all of a
(15:28):
sudden they're in fight orflight mode.
And my husband can use the exactsame words to them, and it is
like they're cool as a cucumber,they're not triggered at all.
And so there is this notion thatwho is giving the feedback
triggers an underlying belief inthe receiver's mind.
(15:48):
And so when I started tounderstand this was actually
happening, it wasn't like madeup in my brain.
It's like, well, what is that?
What are the underlying rebelbeliefs in the receiver that
when I say something, it'striggering defense.
But when my husband is sayingit, it's like this awesome
conversation, and they canactually solve a problem
(16:10):
together, right?
The funny thing is, the flipside is equally as true when it
comes to the boys.
I can say anything unpolishedwithout grace to my boys.
And it's like water goes offtheir back, they don't get
offended, they're like, oh mom,okay.
They hear everything, they soakit up.
(16:30):
They're just like they'responges.
When my husband says somethingto the boys, you might as well
crush their soul.
He can use the exact same words,and they walk away feeling like
they're failures.
And so I don't know if it's likethe the dad on something, and
then the mom on the like there'ssomething with the the parental
role, mom, dad towards sons anddaughters that trigger different
(16:54):
things.
Sure.
And so it's an incredibleopportunity to like what's
really going on underneath thecovers to say, how can we
actually hear the feedback andmove forward?
Because somewhere along the way,uh positive intent is getting
lost.
SPEAKER_02 (17:10):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (17:11):
And, you know, insecurities are brewing.
SPEAKER_02 (17:14):
Yeah.
Well, I mean, sometimes, youknow, when we're genuinely
trying to help, um, it's ourfilters, you know, that get in
the way.
Um, our fears, our past wounds,you know, of course, all the
triggers we've already talkedabout.
And it's often hard to tell thedifference when you're like in
it.
You know, connecting some ofwhat you just shared about what
(17:36):
y'all experience as a family,uh, in correction, is back to a
little bit of neuroscience.
You know, the moment that any ofus senses criticism, whether
it's loving, you know,constructive or or not, even if
it's mild, what happens on theinside is our amygdala, which is
that, you know, alarm center,that that fight or flight, that
(17:59):
threat center in our brain, itlights up.
So our body often reacts beforeour spirit, you know, can even
take that moment to interpretwhat's happening.
Um, but again, you know, we'vesaid it already.
I mean, once you are healed andyou let God do that work inside
of you, I think you're able totake more of that pause.
(18:21):
But just naturally, our body isgoing to react that way.
So sometimes that means we'renot actually reacting to the
person.
Um, so you know, give yourselfsome grace.
We're just reacting, you know,to what's happening in our body
or maybe some undealt history ofour of our own.
Um when I think about um, youknow, reacting, dealing with
(18:46):
undealt history.
Um, hopefully, dad, if youlisten to this, it's okay if I
say this out loud.
But I do, I I think of my dadum, who struggles with this
because of his childhood.
I mean, he literally has likePTSD.
Um, so it's easy for him to takeeven just a small um, maybe, you
(19:11):
know, we might consider doing itthis way, as instantly the way
you describe that your daughtersreact.
You know, the fight or flightgoes off.
Um, he feels like it's apersonal attack, and I know what
he hears, even at the slightest,you know, here's how we could do
something better, different.
It's like you're wrong, you'rebad, you know, shame.
(19:35):
Um it's like his brain uh wireditself to equate even the
smallest correction withrejection.
And that's why all of this is soimportant, like for us to really
pause before we personalizethings, whether we're receiving
or giving.
SPEAKER_00 (19:52):
100%.
Oftentimes I've given feedbackin my career to people who are
working directly for me or not.
Right.
I mean, that is the role thatyou play in leadership is how do
you continue to give feedbackand help people rise to what you
know God has put in them.
And I have met my feedbackalmost, I've been attacked back.
So the receiver is hearingrejection from me or they're
(20:16):
hearing me say, you're failingbecause I'm observing a certain
characteristic in them.
And I'm always, and it's sotough, you know, to navigate,
especially like if it's a newerrelationship and you don't have
the depth and breadth of historyto tell you that this feedback
is actually safe.
It's gonna help me get stronger,better.
SPEAKER_02 (20:35):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (20:35):
There's always the initial bumpy to bump bump that
you can quickly start to seewhere God is still working on
healing a human heart whenyou're coming up against that.
I mean, just recently I wasgiving feedback uh to someone
that I work with, and it wasalmost like I was received as a
(20:56):
bully.
Like, I can't believe you'regiving me this type of feedback.
And instead of me beingdefensive on why would you ever
think that I'm trying to bullyyou?
Right.
It really made me more curiousabout how are you hearing what I
just said this way?
And love loving that person,even though they're getting
(21:20):
visibly upset with me, is morelike, hey, I want you to slow
down.
And I actually want tounderstand what really just
happened to make you respondthat way.
And so this notion like, what dowe do in those moments as the
receiver when we are gettingtriggered?
It's slow down, yeah, pause andthen don't personalize it.
(21:42):
Oftentimes we're gettingtriggered when we're receiving
information because it's comingup, you know, talk about
rejection.
It's actually coming up, it'sbumping up against our identity.
And the identity is sayingthere's something wrong with me.
That's good.
And now I have to preservebecause if there's something
wrong with me, that starts to goagainst my value, my worth, etc.
(22:03):
Where there's so much uhreaction to the uh situation as
opposed to thoughtful response.
And thoughtful response willallow you to decouple the words
that someone's saying to youfrom who you are in Christ.
SPEAKER_02 (22:20):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (22:21):
And so that's the first thing is pause, right?
The next is just extract thegood, the precious metals, the
gold, yeah, and get rid of thejunk, right?
And so sometimes, oftentimes,remember, we're human beings to
human beings.
So a human being is givingfeedback and we're receiving the
feedback.
And it's two imperfect people ina very delicate exchange of
(22:45):
information.
And we both probably, the giverand the receiver, have something
to learn.
And so when I'm gettinginformation as the receiver,
what actually has merit in whatthey're saying?
What might be the gold, thetreasure, the precious stones
that God wants me to hear?
Yeah, because he's calling mehigher.
(23:06):
It's good.
And when he calls me higher, Ican actually expand my wings and
I can fly, like the eagle,right?
But what is the noise?
What's the distraction?
What's the pebbles, the gravel?
Like what needs to go away, andI don't need to take it with me.
And it's not dismissing what'simportant for the sake of
self-preservation.
Yep.
It's truly like you've processedit with the Lord.
(23:29):
So you've been able topersonally, number one, you've
detached from the actualfeedback personally.
Yeah.
So your emotions are not drivingyou and you're in a response
mode.
You're sifting for the good,right?
And you're gonna you're gonna beintentional to understand what
that is, and you're getting ridof the noise.
So pick up the signal, get ridof the noise.
And then lastly, understand howdo you start to take the
(23:52):
feedback and put it into action,but ensure that it aligns with
the fruit of the Holy Spirit.
That's good.
So you got to test to make surethat the feedback coming in
actually aligns with the fruitof the Holy Spirit found in
Galatians.
And if it doesn't, then dump it,right?
SPEAKER_02 (24:10):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (24:10):
It's it's run for the hills.
Uh, because again, remember thatanything that makes you feel
less than ashamed, guilt-ridden,it's not from the Holy Spirit.
That is flesh on flesh.
But anything that calls youhigher, and it's like very clear
conviction that can take you toa broader field of planting, if
(24:36):
you will.
Um, you know, spreading yourwings to fly, that's where God's
in it to help you fly.
Oh, such good points.
SPEAKER_02 (24:43):
Um, yeah, and it just makes me think that we have
to remember with being calledhigher, that sometimes we have
splinters that God needs to digout and he's gonna use other
people to do that, right?
And yeah, that process ispainful, but ultimately you feel
better.
It leaves you feeling peace ifit's actually from the Holy
(25:05):
Spirit and does that call youhigher.
Literally got a visual of asplinter being stuck in my
finger.
SPEAKER_00 (25:10):
We've all been there.
Yeah.
It hurts.
And just to kind of summarize itagain, make sure emotionally
you're in a place not to react,but to respond thoughtfully as
the receiver.
SPEAKER_01 (25:23):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:23):
And sometimes, by the way, if you're hearing
something that does not trulyalign to your spirit, you can
graciously say, Thank you.
Yeah, thank you for caring forme.
Thank you for that feedback.
I'm gonna need a minute toprocess it.
SPEAKER_01 (25:39):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:39):
And you don't have to say anything in the moment,
right?
God says, you know what, listenmore than we speak.
And so when we're hearing,listen and then go process with
the Lord.
SPEAKER_02 (25:53):
Yeah, nothing diffuses a potential argument
faster than when you can staycentered and not react uh
emotionally.
I also think it's really kind ofa test in your own security and
your own identity, you know, uh,to not immediately feel
triggered.
(26:14):
Exactly.
Yeah, so I mean, at the end ofthe day, we need to stay open
without staying wounded.
Feedback isn't our enemy, it'san invitation in some cases to
rise higher, um, but only whenwe learn how to filter it
through love and not fear andour own unhealed wounds and
(26:34):
triggers.
Um, so let's kind of flip thescript a little bit and move on
to being the giver, you know,talking about the one who's
actually giving that thatfeedback, which sometimes feels
a whole lot easier to be thewise one, right?
Like, let me just bless you realquick.
Let me help you help yourself.
(26:55):
My unsolicited discernment here.
Um, but we've got to checkourselves um, you know, with
with how we go about doing that.
Um, because sometimes thingsthat can be disguised as
discernment actually isjudgment, and we not might not
even realize that ourselves.
Um, so just like, you know, whenwe're on the receiving end, we
(27:19):
need to pause, connect with theHoly Spirit, kind of take out
the nuggets.
I think we we've got to pauseand pray and and ask the Holy
Spirit before we reach out andshare our constructive
criticism.
You know, uh ask ourselves, arewe sharing truth and love, or
are we just sharing our opinion?
(27:40):
You know, is are we simplycalling out something in someone
else that makes us uncomfortablebecause it somehow reflects on
us, or am I truly trying to lovesomeone well and call them
higher?
SPEAKER_00 (27:53):
Yeah, 100%.
You know, and just because youruh intent may be pure, like the
hammer coming down, your impactcould be in a completely
different zip code.
Yeah, right.
I think for me, when I am goingto give feedback, when I know
(28:13):
that my heart is pure before theLord, I actually don't want to
initially give the feedback.
And they that might soundstrange.
I'm not saying this is universalfor everyone, but for me, it's I
almost shy away from thefeedback.
Like, oh, I don't want to hurtthat person.
They I don't know that they'reready to hear it.
And all the fears that I haveabout how they're like it's
(28:37):
almost like people pleaser kicksin.
Like I it's more about howthey're gonna hear my feedback
and how it's gonna reflect on mein a negative way than how
they're gonna receive it and howit's gonna help them.
Now it's kind of like flippingit flipping it on its head.
Why do I know that that's themoment the Holy Spirit's calling
(28:58):
me to give the feedback?
It kind of sounds strange.
SPEAKER_02 (29:01):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:01):
Because it is the exact opposite of my flesh.
So I'm why do I care so muchabout self-preservation?
Why is my safety more importantthan helping the person?
And then what could be thealternative instead of them
rejecting my feedback?
How could this help them?
And do I truly love them enoughto help them rise?
(29:22):
And God has to get my heart to aplace of serving that person
purely, and then I can go in andgive the feedback.
So there's this initial, I don'twant to give the feedback, and I
start to wrestle it with theHoly Spirit.
And then He gets me repositionedto be effective in the feedback.
That's when I know that I'mhonoring the Lord.
(29:45):
Where I have fallen straight onmy face as the giver of feedback
is where I respond in the flesh.
Oh, look, I'm gonna tell youwhere you messed up.
I'm gonna tell you.
And I just dive head first withno prayer, no processing.
I know I'm right.
Right out of the gate, and I'mjust gonna give it to you.
That's when I'm ahead of theHoly Spirit.
SPEAKER_02 (30:04):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (30:05):
And so there's, I think there's this holy pause
that says, maybe I shouldn'tgive this feedback, be quick to
listen, slow to speak.
That's what God says.
SPEAKER_02 (30:16):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (30:17):
And then when the nudge is like, no, I need you to
speak, I need you to speak, andthere's that continuance and
that nudging, then I know theHoly Spirit is working.
SPEAKER_02 (30:26):
That's so good and so honest.
I mean, I feel like all of us uhhave that inner turmoil
constantly.
And I think we easily, asChristians, get confused that
it's not nice, you know, it'snot kind uh to give that
constructive feedback, but Imean, get right back into his
word.
(30:47):
You know, Ephesians tells usspeak truth and love.
Yes.
Uh 2 Timothy 4.2 reminds us tocorrect, rebuke, and encourage
with patience.
Um, and Ezekiel 33, and to bewatchmen, you know, and warn
against when when danger iscoming.
So his word reminds us, and ofcourse, Jesus, you know,
(31:10):
corrected all day, every day,right?
With love, um, with patience,with grace.
Um, but we have to remember thatwhen our feedback lacks
solution, or it lacks hope, orit lacks belief in somebody's
ability to really grow, um, Ithink it stops being
(31:31):
constructive.
Um, it stops being well-meaning.
SPEAKER_00 (31:35):
That's so good.
It's also uh goes back to theother point that you made.
Is the feedback in service tothe person in front of me to
help them rise, or is it inservice to the image I'm trying
to protect?
SPEAKER_02 (31:49):
Good.
SPEAKER_00 (31:50):
Right?
And I can say regretfully andwith utmost humility, I have
given feedback uh probably moreto my daughters, because I
think, you know, the tensionbetween moms and daughters and
the tension between fathers andsons, you know, I said it in
just a little bit ago.
But there's this notion where Ithink the daughters can more
(32:12):
easily see themselves and theirshortcomings, how they view
their shortcomings more in theirmother.
SPEAKER_02 (32:17):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (32:18):
Or they see the strengths in their mother, and
because they don't have thosesame strengths, they see it as
their own shortfall.
Sure.
And it's not the same whenyou're going to a male.
SPEAKER_02 (32:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (32:28):
Males are wired differently.
And same thing with boys withtheir fathers, they can see how
great their father is.
And if they're not living up tothat standard in their head, the
feedback is I'm failing.
Right.
And so there's this measuringstick, this comparison that's
constantly going on while we'rein relationship together.
That's just how the flesh is,and God says, do not compare.
(32:50):
But the fact is, we do compare.
SPEAKER_02 (32:52):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (32:53):
And so I can say, with all honesty, there have
been times where I have given mydaughters feedback, comparing
their path in womanhood to myown path.
Sure.
And I have called them short,meaning you're you're on the
short end of the stick.
You need to raise your game.
You need you need to dosomething differently than
(33:14):
you're doing.
Yeah.
But do they?
Is what I'm actually picking onthem?
Is it a character defect?
Is it unrighteous living?
And if it's not unrighteousliving, I actually shouldn't
have a lot of opinions.
Fair.
If I'm just if I'm justnitpicking where they're at in
their journey of this life,which has a hundred different
(33:35):
ways to get to heaven, yeah,right, with workmanship and
whatever.
Um, you know, I had just as aworking example, I had it in my
head.
I have six kids.
All six kids were going to go tocollege and get the degree, and
then da-da-da.
And, you know, I have one thatliterally is not wired to do
that, right?
I mean, she she literally is agifted artist and she it thrives
(34:00):
as um a hairstylist, etc.
And her journey to figure thatout, it was not a traditional
path that I had prescribed forher.
And there was lots ofopportunities for me to give her
feedback, and it was a hundredpercent not aligned to anything
that in scripture that says shehad to go to a four-year
(34:21):
university.
Do you see what I'm saying?
Yeah.
And so the the point is, is herpath didn't fit what I deemed as
the traditional path to lead herto success.
Yeah.
But at the end of the day,clearly she's in the gifting and
the calling of the Lord.
And so the question starts tobecome when am I giving
feedback, when I'm givingfeedback to somebody, am I truly
(34:45):
helping them rise in character?
That's good.
Or am I nitpicking on somereflection of what's making me
as the mother look less than?
And it's just a holy pausemoment.
Yeah.
Well, where'd that shift happenfor you?
Well, honestly, you have tosometimes hit a pit to be able
(35:09):
to see.
And so it takes, as my all mychildren continue to grow and
mature in adulthood, some of thethings that you say in passing,
you don't even realize that it'slike sandpaper on an open wound.
SPEAKER_01 (35:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:25):
That they hear it when you know, when you say
this, mom, you make me feel A,B, and C.
And you're like, what?
I would never want to make youfeel that way.
Why do you feel that way when Isay that?
And there's always someunderlying thing that somewhere
along the way, the it certainwords and actions made them
(35:45):
believe something to be trueabout who they are.
SPEAKER_01 (35:48):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:49):
And these words cause rejection.
So, for example, my daughter nottruly going through a four-year
university.
I'm gonna think less of her.
She's less valuable than thekids who are getting the
four-year degree.
That's just nonsense.
Yeah.
But yet, culture tells kids thistoday.
And then my actions reallyputting a lot of weight into the
(36:13):
four-year degree.
And why?
Because I didn't have atraditional path.
It took me, you know, until mymid-20s to finish my degree.
And that was the unlock for myown success to really grow into
leadership.
And so in my mind, you had tohave the degree.
Yeah.
And I want the very best for mykids.
But so then you take a kid who'son an untraditional degree path,
(36:34):
and then all of a sudden they'regoing to feel less than their
siblings.
Yeah.
And so it's when they'recourageous enough to actually
open the door to thevulnerability of, hey, this
makes me feel insecure.
This makes me feel less than,you start to understand what
seems to be innocent feedback isactually destructive towards the
(36:55):
receiver.
And so now it's up to me toguard my words.
And is it really about helpingthis person rise?
Or is it about preserving my ownego, my own image?
That's good.
Whatever, or actually mitigatinga fear.
So in this example, you know,maybe some of it's tied to my
ego, wanting all my kids to havea degree, and I can, you know,
(37:19):
browbeat my chest from thatnature.
I don't really think that's it.
Uh but for protection.
But for me, it's it's in thename of protection.
SPEAKER_02 (37:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (37:28):
But it's not protection because when you lead
from fear, when you mother fromfear, you're not love, you know,
fear casts out love.
SPEAKER_02 (37:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (37:37):
Love casts out fear.
And I've said this before (37:38):
if I'm loving my children from a
place of fear, I'm not lovingthem at all.
And so I'm really giving themfeedback to minimize or to get
rid of a fear that I have.
It's good.
SPEAKER_02 (37:54):
Yeah, and even God does that.
His correction always comeswrapped in encouragement.
It always has grace and truth.
Um, it's never one or the other,you know, and the goal is never
to win, win an argument.
It's always to win a heart.
Um, and you've said this before,to call people higher, you know,
(38:15):
to help them rise higher.
Ephesians 4 29 reminds us let nocorrupt word proceed out of your
mouth, but only what is helpfulfor building others up.
So you already started to hit onsome practical tools, really,
um, if you are the giver.
Um, you talked a little bitabout checking your motive
first, um, which, and thank youfor sharing all those honest
(38:38):
stories about how y'all havenavigated that because it helps
it make sense for for ourlisteners, you know.
Are we moved by love?
Are we moved by truth, or are wemoved by our own motives, like
frustration or control uh orbeing right?
Um, is what I'm about to sayreally about their freedom?
I love that you said character.
(39:00):
You know, is this really acharacter issue or not?
Or is it about my ownfrustration or my own image or
my own need to control?
Um, you know, matching themoment is another good tool.
Um, every moment doesn't need asermon.
Been there.
Yes, amen.
(39:21):
I have a hard time with a lot ofwords sometimes.
Um you know, so discern that.
Um, know your setting, know youraudience.
You know, if it's if it's amoment of like celebration, like
somebody just conqueredsomething that was difficult
before you just come in hot.
(39:42):
How about start with, you did,you know, great up there, you
know, don't necessarilyencourage the whole, you know,
poop sandwich, but start withsomething that they did well and
acknowledge the courage that ittook maybe to step out and do
that thing before you come in umwith the criticism and even
(40:02):
asking yourself, am I qualifiedto give this advice?
Right?
Like, there's a lot of is thatwhere the term Karen came from?
Is it?
I don't even know, is it?
SPEAKER_00 (40:15):
Like, I don't know.
Like uh you're Karen abouteverything, I guess.
That's so funny.
No, it's so true.
And I think knowing the time, asyou said, like, ooh, there's
been feedback given to me atsuch the wrong moment.
Yeah.
You know, uh, I could I couldhave just given a huge
(40:36):
presentation at work, and I hadbeen manifesting stress, and you
know, I literally have been withpeers in rehearsals on the big,
you know, presentation forleadership kickoff of the year.
And, you know, you're doing itto 300 people, and so there's
some anxiety around it, etcetera.
Yeah, sweat, sweat, sweat.
And as soon as you're done,someone comes up and you know,
(41:00):
gives you an at a girl on theback.
But it's like, did you reallyhave to have to do that?
Did you have to say it rightthen?
And it's like, oh, can we notjust say you did a great job?
And then when we get to, youknow, what can we raise the bar
(41:21):
on next time around?
Let's do it then.
Yeah.
And so knowing the time is so,so critically important.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (41:29):
Yeah.
And then there's times of ofstruggle where you want, you
should probably comfort thembefore you correct them, you
know, like they're going throughsomething hard, but there's
still something for you toaddress.
Um, and then there's time whensomeone actually asks you for
your input.
Yay! Um, you're like, since youasked, you know, there's my
(41:52):
green light.
So always remember to lead withhonor and grace, like like the
Lord does.
Call people higher rather thanpush them back down or chastise
them.
Because oftentimes the way thatwe correct people, we can cut
them off at the knees whenthey're actually on their own
assignment.
SPEAKER_00 (42:12):
Yeah, they're stepping into their calling.
100%.
You know, it reminds me of uhjust so many people that I've
had the privilege of workingwith over the years.
Another way to give feedbackthat can be really, really well
received.
Specifically, if I know someoneis having a hard time with uh,
(42:34):
it could be executivecommunication.
So when you go from anindividual contributor and you
start to rise in leadership andyou're starting to communicate
to executive teams orboardrooms, et cetera, how the
style of communication changes,right?
And it really is a bit of an artand a science on how you start
to elevate your voice in thosevarious settings.
(42:56):
Yeah.
And a lot of people that I havefound, specifically in
technology, struggle with thattransition and elevation of
voice for impact influence.
And so I have to be very carefulwhen I am growing and harvesting
talent that I'll give thefeedback, but I'm not the hammer
coming in constantlymicromanaging every time they're
(43:21):
in a meeting.
And it's more of, you know, ameeting finishes and they've
really been trained to come backto me and say, Hey, how was
that?
And I'll say, I don't know, howdid it feel to you?
And really get them to be moreintrospective.
SPEAKER_01 (43:36):
It's good.
SPEAKER_00 (43:37):
And if I hear that they're picking up on where they
uh fell short, if you will, inmy observation, I will say,
let's not be too hard onyourself.
SPEAKER_01 (43:50):
It's good.
SPEAKER_00 (43:51):
Because there's this fine line of again, truth with
love.
You have to leave someoneencouraged with the ability to
believe that they're actuallygoing to elevate their game.
Yeah.
They can't leave theconversation defeated.
Yeah.
And so our job as the giver offeedback is to make sure someone
(44:13):
feels inspired and empowered toconquer the mountain when they
leave our presence.
And it's just like I think ofMoses again, Moses and God.
God called Moses, and Moses hada stutter.
He called him to speak toPharaoh, the number one leader
in the world, right?
And he called him as a voicewith a stutter.
(44:36):
He said, right?
And he's like, not me, Lord.
He's like, literally, not me,not me, send someone else.
And after this exchange,multiple times, God is
frustrated with him.
You know, do you not see thatI've called you?
But you know what?
In my grace, I'm going to, I'mgoing to give you Aaron, and
Aaron will be your mouthpiece.
(44:57):
Okay.
So here's your get out of jailfree card.
But the point is, God didn'tkick Moses out of the
conversation.
SPEAKER_02 (45:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (45:06):
He actually qualified him in his weakness,
and he still led the Israelitesfor 40 years in the wilderness.
SPEAKER_01 (45:14):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (45:15):
And so, wow, if that is God and how God raises up
people, that's our model.
Like when we're, we can nitpickon people's skill, the level of
their skill, and how they'reshowing up.
But it's really, how are ourwords truly impacting the person
in front of us, their ability togrow?
SPEAKER_01 (45:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (45:37):
Which means, I'm going to restate it, they have
to leave the conversation offeedback with us as the giver of
feedback, empowered in beliefthat they're ready to conquer
the next mountain.
SPEAKER_02 (45:48):
So good.
That's so beautiful what you dowith your team members because
you took constructive criticismand made it collaboration.
SPEAKER_00 (45:58):
And you know, I don't, I know we've said the
word criticism a lot uh today.
I actually don't like that word.
Yeah.
Criticism.
Uh who are we to critique God'screation?
SPEAKER_02 (46:10):
That's good.
SPEAKER_00 (46:10):
Again, it's how do you feel about how if if it's
again, there's there's two typesof feedback, right?
How am I showing up?
Well, there's three.
How am I showing up inrelationships?
And, you know, how are weinteracting together?
How am I showing up doing work,the work that I'm doing for
vocation or the work that I'mdoing for the Lord, right?
(46:34):
And then there's my character.
Who am I as a righteous personin front of the Lord?
What defects do I have in mycharacter?
So feedback can be like, hey,I'm seeing some unrighteous
behavior in you.
I'm gonna need, I'm gonna callyou higher.
Yep, right?
As far as the work goes, thecritique goes, that's a lot of
that, like how do you raisesomebody up in a skill set?
(46:58):
A lot of that is the person withthe Lord, growing their
confidence and letting the Lorddo the work in that person.
And we be a voice of empowermentand inspiration, right?
And so that's kind of just how Ikind of zoom back out and think
about, and then relationally,obviously, I started with that
(47:18):
one.
If I'm not treating you acertain way, that you, if I'm
not treating you with respect,well, you're gonna have a little
bit of feedback for me.
SPEAKER_02 (47:26):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (47:26):
Right?
And so, how you treat people,how do you manage the work of
God and the skill that He's putin you?
And then how are you owning yourcharacter as uh a follower of
Jesus Christ?
It's good.
SPEAKER_02 (47:38):
Yeah, so so just a little challenge for all of us
before we correct someone, youknow.
I would say, ask, have youprayed about this?
Yeah, you know, first always goto the Holy Spirit, or did you
just stew on it and you're readyto share your care and feedback?
I know.
It's so good.
(47:58):
Am I speaking to help them growor am I speaking to be right?
That's a big one.
Um I like being right.
SPEAKER_00 (48:07):
I do too.
Dan, I'm right a lot.
I was gonna say that if youdidn't ever spend.
SPEAKER_02 (48:16):
It's hard being right all the time.
Just ask your husband, John.
Yes, exactly.
Oh my goodness.
And if it's not, you know,wrapped in love, um, then it's
you know not from God.
Um, there's one more would notneed to be spoken.
SPEAKER_00 (48:33):
Amen.
There's one more that I it's uha little unusual that I want to
just kind of pull back as I waspraying this morning over this,
actually.
I felt like God was showing mesomething.
So it's not a fully developedthought, but it's worth planting
a seed for all of us to kind ofexplore with God.
Okay.
(48:53):
What happens when we start tosee a speck in our own eye that
is actually a log that hasalready been released from our
(49:18):
life.
SPEAKER_02 (49:20):
It's like in our own eye, that is a log that's
already been released.
Well, I you're now have to helpme unpack that one because how
is it there at all if it'salready been released?
SPEAKER_00 (49:34):
Yep.
Okay, so I'm gonna restate itagain.
Okay.
So I wanna I wanna go somewherethat's a little bit different
than when we when we think aboutthe the speck in your brother's
eye, your sister's eye, and thelog in your own.
I want to talk about the logsthat remain in our heart like
(49:57):
anchors that God's alreadyforgiven us for.
So a historical past log, okay.
Maybe uh I was a perpetual liarbefore I knew Christ.
Uh maybe I stole something,maybe I cheated, maybe fill in
the blank.
Whatever the sin is, the log inyour own eye, that thing that
(50:22):
you keep beating yourself upabout, that keeps telling you
you're less than the person nextto you because you still have
this log.
But when you came to Christ, Godsays, I see that log, I forgive
that log, let it go.
And then what he's gonna do isas you continue to transform
(50:43):
your heart in front of him, he'sgonna show you the next log that
needs to be dealt with, right?
I think oftentimes there's thisinternal abuse that we put
ourselves through, yeah, wherewe're looking at the log in our
own eye, but it's actually notan active log.
(51:07):
It's something that's alreadybeen buried through the blood of
Christ.
Yeah.
When we were forgiven, but wekeep pulling it back up like
it's real.
Do you see what I'm saying?
Yeah, it's a wall, it creates awall in our relationship between
us and the Lord.
Yes.
So when we are quick, you know,when we're talking about judging
others, we're also quick tojudge ourselves.
(51:27):
Oh, yeah.
Okay.
I'm real good at that.
And so I just want to spend justa minute on that.
Um not to completely, you know,um unpack it, but literally when
I was praying over this episodethis morning, I just felt like
God tell me, what are theundealt with logs in your life
(51:49):
that aren't current?
They're in the past that stillcome into the present.
And I didn't fully unpack it,but it's this notion of if you
are if you're activelystruggling with something from
your past where you haveconfessed it to God, okay, you
(52:11):
have repented, meaning you nolonger do those actions.
So if you were a perpetual liarand you repented to God and you
no longer lie, that is buriedwith the blood of Jesus.
But you actually haven'treceived his forgiveness.
You need to receive hisforgiveness.
SPEAKER_01 (52:29):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (52:29):
And how do you do that?
You do it through praise andworship and declaration that you
who are set free in Christ isfree indeed.
You are free.
I just really feel like ourlisteners needed to hear that.
So there's something that'skeeping you in your own bondage,
(52:49):
some log that you think iscurrent, you're beating yourself
up about it.
You don't deserve this, you'renot worthy of that because of
something from your past, butit's gone, it's dead, it's
buried.
Let it go.
Walk free in Christ.
Amen.
Amen.
Amen.
I just need to show that.
Thank you.
Yep.
(53:10):
So maybe start to considerjournaling a time where you got
it wrong.
So I've given a couple ofexamples where uh I have
received feedback and I feltlike I was rejected, or I've
given feedback and the feedbackon the other end wasn't received
so well.
So I didn't really, you know,effectively give the feedback to
(53:33):
the other person in front of me.
I would encourage us to reallybe mindful.
When have I been a giver or areceiver and I didn't do it
God's way?
What can I learn from it?
And what can I do differentlynext time?
How can I think about this roleof giving and receiving feedback
(53:56):
is an opportunity to strengthena connection?
What needs to be different tofortify that relational
connection and to help theperson in front of me if I'm the
giver?
And even if I'm the receiver,how do I obviously protect from
the noise, but then rise in thegrowth?
(54:17):
Like, what's the gold I'msupposed to extract?
SPEAKER_02 (54:19):
Yeah, well, that's it.
I mean, we're all walking thefine line between wanting to
help and not wanting to hurt.
Um, and we've said it before,but the goal at the end of the
day is never to win an argument,it's to win a heart and help
people, you know, rise higher.
Um, Jesus did that all day long.
He didn't shame people intochange, he loved them into
freedom.
(54:39):
And so we can do the same thingif we go to him first before we
have those conversations.
Um, and sometimes, sometimes themost powerful thing is to maybe
say nothing at all.
You know, yeah, like when itreally isn't about somebody's
character, as you said.
I think that that that verysuccinctly helps you think about
(55:04):
things.
I think you know, if thefeedback I'm getting isn't truly
about like protecting them,truly protecting them or their
character or their morals ortheir integrity.
Um think long and hard aboutwhether that's your role or
Jesus' role.
SPEAKER_00 (55:25):
Amen.
I love it.
Well, how about we pray?
Awesome.
Okay.
Well, Heavenly Father, we justthank you so much that you give
us eyes to see where we needheart change.
And Lord, that you are justsharpening our minds, our
mouths, and our hearts to bejust incredible stewards of
(55:48):
feedback, both receiving it andgiving it, Lord.
Thank you that we will firstlook at the logs in our own
eyes.
We will deal with those logswith you, and we will receive
forgiveness.
We will turn from them, andLord, we will be set free in
you.
And Lord, when you call us togive just counsel to a person in
(56:10):
front of us, Lord, let us bemindful that we need to be just
washed first in your truth andyour love.
So our words will be just avessel of setting the person in
front of us free.
Freedom in you, Lord, first andforemost.
(56:31):
Lord, we love you and we justgive you glory in the name of
Jesus.
Amen.
Amen.
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Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by Audiochuck Media Company.
The Brothers Ortiz
The Brothers Ortiz is the story of two brothers–both successful, but in very different ways. Gabe Ortiz becomes a third-highest ranking officer in all of Texas while his younger brother Larry climbs the ranks in Puro Tango Blast, a notorious Texas Prison gang. Gabe doesn’t know all the details of his brother’s nefarious dealings, and he’s made a point not to ask, to protect their relationship. But when Larry is murdered during a home invasion in a rented beach house, Gabe has no choice but to look into what happened that night. To solve Larry’s murder, Gabe, and the whole Ortiz family, must ask each other tough questions.