December 10, 2025 • 37 mins
Milissa Bradley is a former professional dancer, choreographer, yoga lead trainer, and educator. Her choreographic work has been described as “American Chic” and hailed by the Huffington Post as the “e.e. cummings of ballet.”
She began her professional performing career in 2005 with The Oakland Ballet under the direction of Ronn Guidi and served for twelve years as an Artist in Residence at the Ruth Asawa San Francisco School of the Arts. She holds a B.A. with Honors from Saint Mary’s College of California’s Liberal Education for the Arts (LEAP) program, an M.F.A. with Honors in Dance: Creative Practice from Saint Mary’s, and a doctorate with distinction in Educational Leadership from California State University, Stanislaus.
Currently, she teaches yoga, fitness, and dance at Ohlone College and Diablo Valley College, where she is also the Lead Trainer for the 200-hour Yoga Teacher Training Certificate.
Milissa's Links:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/milissa-bradley-933b3362/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
So I think this episode deservesquite a bit of background and
set up. Melissa is here with US1 is just
an amazing person and our originstory really is based off of
Melissa was a student, one of mymaster's degree classes,
contemporary issues and exercisescience.
And as I told her before I got on, she's an excellent writer
(00:25):
and also an excellent researcher, different topics.
And Melissa has a big background, yoga, dance, things
of that nature. And she just blew me away when
she submitted some work in this master's degree class about yoga
and VO2 Max. I just had, it was like mind
(00:46):
blown moment. And I was like, wait, wait,
wait, wait a minute. A contribution of VO2 Max
through yoga. So we're going to talk about
that. But first, I want to say,
Melissa, thank you so much for spending some time with me
today. My pleasure, Thank you for
having me here. So I think we'll help set this
up too, is for the audience to understand your considerable
background and the topic and just so everyone gets a good
(01:11):
idea what you've been up to for all these years and and how
we've gotten to this point. OK, well thanks.
So I actually found yoga throughmy professional dance.
Career I. Was a trained ballerina and I
danced professionally for over 10 years and then that led me to
(01:32):
leading my own dance company, a choreography project where I
toured around the United States making ballets for different
companies as well as having my own.
Bay Area based ballet. Company in my first master's
program. I had a peer.
In my. Cohort who taught yoga.
And she was encouraging me to come take a yoga class and I was
(01:55):
a little bit apprehensive because I had taken different
styles. Of yoga before.
And I just didn't really think that it.
Fit like the way that I viewed. Exercise and mindfulness.
And she was like no no, no, justcome take my yoga class.
So for background. Her yoga class was.
A vinyasa style dance yoga classand I loved.
(02:16):
It because it had. So many nuances of dance styles
in it. It was in a heated room.
There was a sense of community. There was like great.
Music playing and it. Just I, I went.
Into the experience wanting a workout and I left the
experience with a surprising work in and ever since then I
(02:38):
have been just a. Such a huge.
Proponent of yoga and the ways that it can not only.
Offer a physical practice. But what it can do for the?
Body the breath. And the mind.
Yeah, that's fantastic. And I've, you know, yoga's been
kind of in and out of my life throughout 25 years.
(03:00):
I've always had a tremendous respect for it.
And I think, you know, for the purpose of this discussion,
which is students and colleaguesand clients, you know, the
majority of people have, I wouldsay, you know, a pretty narrow
view of yoga. I would say a focus is something
(03:20):
that, you know, a mind body, spirit based practice, but also
not thinking about it as technically.
And this ties into what we're talking about a workout that
contributes to increasing oxygenconsumption to improve VO2 Max,
which is essentially A gigantic metric of decreasing all 'cause
(03:41):
mortality and longevity practices.
And so I wanted to get an idea of how did you come to this with
start thinking about like getting this research, because I
had never seen this research research before.
And that's why when more background, I give feedback, a
lot of feedback in my classes and I was writing or or speaking
(04:04):
to Melissa and like, what what is this?
Like this is surprising to me and this was the start up there.
So let's let's talk a little bitabout that.
How you discovered this? Well, yoga is a tool for
adaptability. So the body wants.
To adapt. And when we move with intention
and breath and awareness, and werepeat those patterns
(04:27):
consistently, then the body recognizes itself around balance
and efficiency. So VO2 Max is just one
measurable expression of that. I like to tell my students all
the time that the body's primaryjob is homeostasis, so we're
continuously recalibrating to keep us balanced.
(04:50):
So yoga. Asana, yoga, pranayama,
meditation, those are just essentially structured
conversations that we're having with adaptive systems.
So when you practice consistently, your breath, your
nervous system and your muscles,they all learn to respond more
efficiently. So my research is.
Really targeted. Around the the homeostasis, the
(05:14):
the, the physical adaptations that yoga can provide and I
think a. Lot of people that.
Haven't practiced yoga consistently?
Haven't found the. Right yoga teacher, the right
yoga space they're. Coming into the conversation of
yoga with some preconceived notions that might be.
A little dated or that. Structure just around something
kind of like slow and not a Rd. and.
(05:37):
There is such a wide. Range of.
Yoga out there, especially like.Within the past 10 years, we've
seen such a boom in the yoga industry.
And so I think a lot of people are just coming in with, I don't
want to say like a negative connotation, but maybe not like
an accurate understanding. About like how yoga.
(05:58):
Can support them in their aerobic and cardiovascular.
Goals. Yeah, I'm going to say I think a
lot of people have. My speculation is a lot of like
movie yoga and it's. Kind of.
I'm going to explain. It's almost a yoga you see in a
movie that is just extremely gentle and it's it's very much
(06:21):
more like a meditative version of it, not necessarily something
that you would see that is for the purpose of this conversation
more dynamic that is pushing cardiovascular endurance for
that I never see in a movie. That's what I call it, movie
yoga, where it's like, wow, thatlooks a little more intense than
(06:42):
it looks. Just more just relaxing more
than anything and not pushing cardiovascular endurance on on
some level to it. That's just what I always see in
a movie when it's like they're on vacation or something like,
Oh yeah, movie yoga. I'm like, you know, type of
thing. Well, you're, you're giving me
like Lillian Fullen, PBS, 19. 80s vibes right here.
(07:04):
That's like I'm, I'm getting from that and actually I'm gonna
contradict that and say. That that is.
That is just one small componentof yoga and there is like such a
boom in. Yoga.
Corporations that are out there,I mean, I know I've, I've taught
for them and. There is just a.
Huge interest in what yoga is offering right now and all these
(07:26):
like. Hybrids of yoga too, like we see
a lot of like yoga with weights yoga.
Fusion, different things like that.
So, and this is a big discussionbetween yoga teachers and
exercise fitness teachers too. Because a lot of what?
We see in those sort. Of like a big box.
Corporation Yoga Studios is it'smoving towards more of exercise
(07:51):
and moving away from the spirituality component of what?
Yoga really is. And I think like in the.
West, what we practice is called.
An asana yoga if you were to go to different.
Parts of the world they're they're.
Practicing more of a. Spirituality, yoga, So there's a
lot. Of kind of like.
Cross. Messages being sent about.
(08:13):
Yoga. But let me tell you, you can
increase. Your cardiovascular rate by.
Taking a yoga class and I know because I've taken them and I've
taught them so. So tell me, so explain to the
audience that concept like what?Because they're probably
thinking, OK, maybe I maybe I haven't taken a yoga that does
(08:34):
push more cardiovascular endurance.
How would you describe that, that version of yoga, what that
would be like? Well, a lot of times too, we're
also thinking about like a heat component too.
Because a. Lot of what people are doing now
is like a hot. Yoga so just like a. 60 minute
or 90 minute? Class by itself.
Can be taxing, but then you put in that 95° heat that 105.
(08:56):
Degree heat that 40. Percent humidity.
And all of a. Sudden you are working out.
So. When I talk about.
Like what's? Happening in yoga, there's also
this component of prana yama. OK so prana yama is connected to
asana and asana in Sanskrit literally means seat.
(09:17):
So when it started. Out physical postures were just.
Meant as a reason to. Prepare the body for.
Pranayama and for meditation. OK, now what we see.
Are these like huge? Variations of what asana can be
and a lot of overtime, especially within the past. 30
years. There's been this physical
(09:37):
activity, gymnastics, kinesthetics, like military.
Based exercises that have. Been integrated into yoga.
Practice. And a lot of that we see is in
the Austin and known as Surya Namaskar.
So when people do sun salutations, so like 7 to 11 or
12 poses, and you're moving through a sequence, a dynamic
(09:59):
sequence, and every pose is connected to breath, and then we
have this pranayama component, which is pranayama in Sanskrit.
If we break it down, prana meanslife.
Force. Vital energy AKA breath OK and a
yama means extension or expansion.
So what? You're literally.
(10:19):
Doing people think like, oh, youjust come to yoga and you
breathe in and out. That is not what you're doing at
all. OK In pranayama, it's about
controlling the breath. It's about internal regulation
of the movement of the prana through the breath.
And when you do. That all of a.
Sudden, you're improving your VOT Max, you're increasing your
(10:41):
endurance, you're reducing perceived exertion.
At the same time, you're improving recovery after
exertion. So when you combine breath with
movement, the body learns how tostay calm under load, and that's
in a way an emotional resilience.
So you're doing all these amazing things.
For your body, through physical activity, through breath.
(11:03):
That's amazing. That's so awesome.
Well said. I definitely have some questions
following up with this. So let's I want to come back to
what you said, but I want to also make sure we get into the
research, especially the research that was presented to
me within the course 'cause thatwas, I thought that was really
interesting. And so talk a little bit about
(11:24):
that research and, and in addition to that, an addendum is
what in terms of these studies, what, what is the significance
in terms of improvement of VO2 Max?
What percentage or amount of improvement are can we expect
based off of the research that we currently have that you
presented in there? Sure, let's talk about the first
study. So it was yoga.
(11:46):
Pranayama VO2 Max and aggressionin swimmers OK.
So this study is by. Rinchu and Manikam and.
It worked with 50. Competitive swimmers from
Kerala. Which is a southwest West.
Coast town in India and these were young athletes, so
(12:11):
groupings of 18 to 21, and none of these individuals had had any
kind of prior yoga experience, so the researchers.
Divide that. Divided them into two groups.
We had a. Yoga group and then a control.
Group. And.
The yoga group. Practiced asana and pranayama.
So our. Poses and our breath retention.
(12:32):
And they did that for five mornings a week.
For 8 weeks. And the researchers measured. 3
variables. Within that study, they measured
aggression, VO2 Max and then flexibility.
And So what they found was not only did aggression go down and
flexibility increase, but they found a significant increase in
(12:53):
the swimmers maximal oxygen uptake.
So the authors, the researchers.Explained that this happened
because of the pranayama training, so they reduced their
resting oxygen consumption. They lowered the heart.
Rate for the same workload that the control group was getting,
(13:15):
they improved their lung efficiency and breath control,
and they enhanced oxygen extraction at the muscular
level. So in essence, yoga made
swimmers more efficient, it madethem more calm, and it made
them. Psychologically adaptable, so
all. Extremely important for
(13:35):
competitive athletes. I mean all extremely important
for any individual. I mean.
The one we're behind driving it.On the freeway like.
We would all benefit from a little bit of yoga.
We need less aggression on the highway, right?
We do, and I just think that like.
Breath itself is just. So interesting.
I love to tell my students like we're taking anywhere from 22 to
(13:56):
24,000 breaths a day, OK? And those are all involuntary,
like we're not even paying attention to it and the times
that we are actually thinking. About our breath are.
In silly moments when we're giggling and we're like I can
get my breath or like somebody startles us and we go and we.
Lose our breath? OK, but what yoga teaches you?
Is to be mindful. About about your breath to take.
(14:17):
Study inhales, study exhales, and as we move through a
pranayama practice. There's all these like, cool.
Ways that we can manipulate. Our breath.
But 95% of us are. Just like we're just up here,
we're just chest breathers. We're short, shallow breaths.
We're not even getting to that like diaphragmatic awareness and
so. I think what was.
Happening here in this study is that we see swimmers increasing
(14:40):
their VO2 Max just by increasingtheir awareness of their.
Breath. I wonder.
So funny we're talking about VO2Max, but the aggression part
actually really tripped me up. That and what and what I mean by
that is like what was the motivation for studying that the
aggression and swimmers. That's curious to me.
(15:01):
I mean, but really important, I think, you know.
Well, the authors. Explained that pranayama and the
asana, it shifted the nervous system towards that
parasympathetic dominant so theywere going into kind of the rest
and digest instead of that like.Fight or.
Flight symptom and when they didthat it.
Lowered the heart rate. It.
Lowered their psychological arousal.
(15:23):
It reduced. Excuse me it.
Better regulated their. Emotions and then it reduced
that sympathetic. Fight or flight?
Activation. So aggression didn't necessarily
just go down, but it was like a measurable reduction in their
physiological and psychological tension that they might have
felt like. Before a big.
Race or something? Yeah.
OK, gosh, that makes so much sense.
(15:44):
I love that study actually. It's just so.
And when you presented that, I was like, what?
It's not often I'm presented with something.
I'm like, I literally have neverheard of this before.
It was amazing. Well, there's another cool
study. Too that I brought.
To your attention, OK. And it so this one's a little
bit like more, I would say knownand famous.
(16:05):
So it was about. Long term yoga improvement with
VO2 Max and fitness in adults. So this study is by.
Udan Ivanka day and fatale and it's one of the largest yoga and
physiological. Studies out there.
So it actually had a a big. Sample It worked with 200
adults. Ages 30 to 50 who practice yoga.
(16:28):
One hour per day. Six days a week.
For six months. OK, quite the commitment.
And the yoga sessions included asana, pranayama and meditation.
And they looked at. Several cardio respiratory
markers. So they're looking at.
Like their PFI? Index their physical fitness
index, they're looking at VO2 Max, they're looking at BMI and
(16:50):
weight, they're looking at the basal metabolic rate, and they
measured and found. Through a validity test.
That after six months. Of Yoga VO. 2 Max increased by
14%, a very meaningful. Shift for adults.
Yeah, for adults. Not training in sort.
(17:11):
Of like a high. Intensity exercise regiment SO.
Why did it decrease? Why did it increase?
Well, it the author cited that. It improved yoga, improved
muscular endurance, it increasedthe oxygen extraction it.
Provided better blood flow. To working muscles, there was a
(17:33):
reduction in the vascular tone from the parasympathetic
activation, and it increased in.Efficiency of the respiratory.
System So in other words, yoga improved the economy of the
cardio. Respiratory.
System. I'm telling you this mind
blowing and I'm going to say whybecause the traditional idea of
(17:54):
improvement of VO2 Max is very much linked to your more high
intensity based exercise. Your kind of your or also like
your two to four minute intervalrange where it may start a
little easy. And then by that last minute, I
mean you're struggling pretty hard.
And I think the significance of that is a different pathway for
(18:16):
achieving a similar result because clearly there's many
ways to get to a similar point. And for a lot of people, a more
high intensity activity, whetherit's biking, whether it's
running, whether it's any high intensity based resistant
training work is not attractive to a lot of people all the time.
(18:39):
And so often I see a lot of people not engaging in VO2 Max
based training because 1 is justincredibly painful and not
attractive to a lot of the population.
So this to me what what drew me was like, oh, another pathway
that is probably actually more digestible to a larger
(19:01):
population, larger percentage ofpopulation speculation all
speculation for that. But I don't know what do you
think of that? I just think that there's a
component to yoga that we haven't really addressed that
much and I think the reason why people see an increase in it is
because. It is a.
Body breath and mind exercise and so when individuals are in a
(19:23):
yoga. Class there there's a.
Community setting. OK in yoga and Sanskrit
language, we call that our sangha.
We're part of a community there's motivation from.
Others we're very close. Matt to Matt and.
There is a lot of. Things that are happening,
happening psychologically withinus, that are being motivated by
the. Words that the yoga is speak
(19:44):
that the yoga teacher is. Speaking so there's like years
and hundreds. Of years of philosophy.
Undertones behind this sort of westernized modern workout
that's happening, and a lot of times people are connecting to
these. Philosophical.
Elements just through the simple.
Practice of these. Awesomeness.
OK. And one of the things that
people are connecting with is something called tapas.
(20:06):
And no, it's not an expensive small plate of food.
That you get at a restaurant, OK.
This is known as our discipline or austerity, OK?
It's literally my favorite thingin the world that I tell my
students all the time. It's commitment.
It's doing the thing that you said you were going to do long
(20:27):
after the mood that you set it in.
Has passed. So there's a commitment that's
happening because it in your yoga practice, because strong
looks different in yoga. OK, It's not like going and
lifting a bunch of weights, or like running for miles and
miles. Or biking for miles and miles.
It's the ability that. At any point, you're standing in
(20:48):
a pose with your arms out, and you could just drop your arms
and go get French fries or go text message a friend or
something. But you don't.
You stay committed in this pose and you.
Push yourself to the edge. And that's what's what's
happening through that, this psychological connection that's
expanding everything within you from a.
(21:10):
Physical the basis, lowest levelphysical gross body all the way
through your subtle bodies. And so I don't know if I
correctly answered your question.
I do, I do want to just talk about the component of the
psychological connection that's happening within yoga.
That's really important and that's.
(21:30):
Why we see people? Continuing That's why we.
See people? Making a difference.
Physically with VO2. Max consumption and expansion
and also in terms of like aggression like in the 1st.
Study, Yeah. Are shifting their way that
they're looking at themselves, and that's helping that the way
(21:52):
that they're looking at others because what's happening on the
mat? All that good stuff.
You take that out in the world and then that's what helps you
not freak out when you're sitting in traffic.
Yeah, Yeah, I, you know, I thinkI'm, I'm going to get back to
the question part a little bit, but I think that's one of a
larger benefit of exercise in general.
Is, is in addition to that is ithelps you become hopefully if
(22:17):
you're doing a consistent practice of exercise should make
you feel better inside your body, outside your body and
better and become better to other people and your life
through that practice. We've often associated the
practice of any exercise or movement was just a very
physical outcome for this instead of an outcome that's
more holistic for that. And I, I think back to the
(22:40):
question a little bit. You did answer, you added a lot
of a lot of layer too, which is great.
But I think with the pathway is people haven't seen this wise is
the least interesting. I can only speak for myself and
my knowledge, just observationally that the most
people I know, they don't look at yoga as something that will
improve their via to Max. They they're not entering into
(23:01):
it going. I'm doing this practice because
it's going to actually add to that.
This is again, just a group of people I know and my
observation, it's always looked at as I'm going here to like
center myself kind of a meditative practice, but and
they're not looking at it as this very large, like 14%
change. That's that's big.
That's actually really big. And so I think turning that you,
(23:25):
you could actually get even morepeople into it if they saw that
aspect to it as well. The VO2 Max, because you're
going to get a lot of people whoare like exercise physiologists,
that's what they're looking for that type of aspect too.
I think that is that has a massive ripple into
participation and of people who may not come to the practice
(23:46):
through maybe more traditional means, but like, hey, I can
improve my VO2 Max and get theseother benefits.
That's amazing. Yeah, better breathing, better
stamina, calmer nervous system is.
Exactly what that? Research is capturing indicating
when we see VO2 Max improvement and the exciting thing is is.
That yoga just. Doesn't like make you more
(24:07):
flexible or more people? It literally can make you more
aerobically efficient. Yeah.
And that to me is that's amazing'cause I had never really
associated that myself, the aerobic efficiency.
But it's another great benefit of yoga practice that has not
(24:31):
been promoted. And, and just in my space at 25
years, I have known tons of people who have taught yoga.
I've hired yoga instructors for clubs that run.
Not one yoga person has ever talked about aerobic efficiency
in my in my time with that. And I think that language that
talk actually will speak to a lot more people who are into
(24:51):
that aspect of exercise. Yeah, I mean there.
Yoga is a. Structured aerobic exercise
program. And if it's not being portrayed
that way, then it needs to be marketed that way more.
And I hope this conversation, this discussion that we're
having can ripple out and more individuals can understand that
this is occurring through yoga pranayama meditation.
(25:14):
I totally agree. I want to come back to something
because I was just curious aboutyour thoughts about this.
You had talked about the Westernaspect of yoga and I know a lot
of people have a lot of feelingsabout yeah, I think you know
where this is going, the spiritual nature of yoga, the
intertwining of that and the practice and the spirituality
(25:36):
versus maybe as you're, as you said, of a kind of the removal
of more of the spiritual practice, but more of just the
the exercise. What are your thoughts?
Is this positive, negative. What are you feeling about this
neutral? Oh my gosh, it's we could spend.
Hours. Years.
Talking about this. The the dialogue is.
(25:56):
So nuanced and I think when it comes down to it, the the best
thing to do about this conversation is to.
Educate yourself. So if you're unsure, it's
important to have a base understanding, like what we
practice right now in our westernized.
Culture. Like that is not.
Yoga, like yoga the. The timeline of yoga, but as
(26:20):
even the conversation of it is completely challenged all the
time. Is it 10,000?
Is it 7000? Is it 2000 years?
I mean. Literally what we.
Practice now in our Western ice.Culture, it's about like.
Little over 100. Years, OK.
This is when yoga was. Brought to the West.
(26:41):
And. It was brought by.
Indian. Philosophers that were.
Helping us at a time when a lot.Of us were, were.
Seeking sort of new ways. To look at the world.
But we have luminaries like Krishnamacharya.
Pattabhi Joyce, BK. SIN gar and these individuals
created an. Offshoot of.
(27:01):
Of asana based yoga and over time it's taken on this nuances
of gymnastics, calisthenics. We see high to.
Low planks like in military. Type activities.
OK, it's. Manifested so much and with.
That a lot of the roots of yoga have gotten.
(27:23):
Lost so we've. Lost the philosophies of.
Yoga, and it's progressed into something more modern.
Exercise based, OK. But the long answer to your
question is. If it works for you.
Then there's something in there that's important and you should
listen to that. And if the.
Teacher of yoga. It's their duty.
(27:45):
It's their. Responsibility to be educated
and where yoga came from and also.
The way that yoga adapts. Based on what the?
Culture needs OK so if a good teacher is able to.
Bring in what worked in the. Past, but what's?
Presently needed for the. Future for the.
Present student, then they're doing the right thing.
(28:07):
It's honoring the roots, but at the same time staying relevant
and present to what the community and the culture needs
in the present moment. Well said.
Yeah, just like class, just likein class, I'm telling you.
I'm curious what your thoughts are on why this is a big
question. Why the spiritual aspect of yoga
(28:28):
has become less and less over time in Western nice versions of
yoga. Oh my gosh, I I mean, I think
there's a sitting here. Like as like a.
White woman who has never been into, never been to India, never
studied with these, you know. Type of guru type.
Individuals, I think there's a. Lot of.
(28:50):
Fear of appropriation? I think there's a need.
To to respect the the past of it, but also.
And when you are teaching a class and I know you know this
through and hopefully the listeners too that have taught
any type of. Physical activity class OK,
(29:12):
there is a. Lot of things going on.
OK, You are not just teaching a class to one student, you're
teaching a class to 2540 sixty students.
How many are in your class? That's a lot of bodies that you
are. Taking care of.
There's a lot of physical. Alignment things that you are
trying to support your students with.
There's the music, there's the clock, there is your peak.
(29:36):
Pose that you're working for. There's a lot of like.
Pens in the air that you're juggling, and I think a lot of
times teachers get stuck on teaching the physical.
Aspects of it they let the physical poses Dr. The yoga.
Car and letting. Other aspects like.
Pranayama, meditation, philosophy, those things work
(29:57):
themselves in, so I just think it.
Takes a skilled. And experienced teacher to find
a way to make a well-rounded class that can that can that can
be a cornucopia of all of those things.
And sometimes you know things. Get left out.
(30:19):
And unfortunately a lot of timesthe things that.
Get left out are the the philosophy aspects of it.
Because you're trying to supportthe student and the students
there because they want to work out, they want to work.
Out and. It's your the teacher to also
help them like I said in the beginning of this to find a work
in. Yeah, what about the
(30:42):
certification organizations for yoga?
Is the curriculum indicative of one that has the spiritual
practice within it or is it non spiritual practice based?
That is such a fantastic question.
So there is one large governing board of certifications for
(31:06):
yoga. Teachers, it's yoga.
Alliance and I am a certified yoga alliance.
Teacher as well as. Running a school.
That offers a yoga teacher. Training 200 hours.
Certificate. And that governing board is
exceptional about having students that are that are
(31:28):
teacher trainees to become a teacher, having an education
that's well-rounded, that's hitting all checking all the
boxes when it comes to asana Pranayama, teaching techniques,
anatomy, and. Physiology.
Yoga Philosophy. And I do.
Have to say that. As somebody that leads.
All of those classes. For my teacher trainees,
(31:51):
students as soon as they learn about.
The philosophies of yoga. Lifestyles and ethics.
They're so enamored. By it, it's so deep, it's like I
tell my. Students, these are all the
things that they're talking about in these.
Philosophies like through the. Ancient texts.
Like the bhava garhitas. The Upanishads.
The Yoga Sutras of. Patanjali, like these are all
(32:11):
things that we feel inside, thatwe've learned along the way, and
somehow we just need to be reminded of them.
And that's what these ancient texts do.
But again, a lot of times, new teachers, young teachers, they
have a hard time finding a way to integrate.
Those. Themes into their physical asana
based classes and these sort. Of like big box.
(32:33):
Corporation Students. It's so amazing.
It's interesting, right? I mean, it's, as someone who's
been an exercise for a long timeand, and as a professor and
stuff, I actually spend a lot oftime in like certified personal
training courses that I teach atvarious colleges on philosophy
(32:53):
because I, I actually think it'sa huge part of the practice of
whether you're a personal trainer or group exercise
instructor. But we're so focused on the
exercise Physiology aspect of it, which is great, which is
totally great to have baseline information for that.
But we we don't often talk aboutthe the philosophy related to
(33:16):
oneself, your own practice, how you show up to your sessions
with clients and also teaching clients about philosophy and
different forms of philosophy, whether it's, you know, in this
version of pragmatism, naturalism, axiology,
metaphysics. All these different things are
an important in my thought process behind why students made
(33:37):
love the lifestyle, ethics, yogapart because it speaks to
becoming more human and how to become a better person through
yoga. And I think all exercise should
be an instruction on how to become a better human being for
that, for the practitioner, for the instructor, all those
(33:59):
things. But we often try to push that
away from the curriculum quite abit in in lieu of let's talk
about chronic adaptation, acute adaptation, the Krebs cycle,
electron transport again, which are important, but it often is
in lieu of actually spending a lot of time on the self
(34:21):
improvement part for that. So I love that.
I've always loved that about yoga.
I was just curious how much of that was a part of the
curriculum, you know? Definitely a part of it because
when it comes down to it, yoga is about yoking.
It's about a. Union it's about understanding
more about yourself and when youfind.
Out about yourself. Then you can show up and be
(34:44):
better for the individuals around you.
And I think we can all agree that no matter what the.
Workout is that we're. Picking We always feel like a
better human being, we. Always feel like our bigger
capital self after that workout.100%.
Everything else that we were bringing in, it doesn't.
Feel. As drama or important?
(35:06):
Afterwards, because we're clear headed, we've.
Moved stuff around we've. Shifted all those.
Thoughts and those emotions I tell my students all the time if
you're if. You have that thought.
Loop going through your head. Take a deep.
Breath in, just sigh it out and that's going to help move.
That thought through. Yeah, I you, I mean, you're
speaking a huge truth here. I'm telling you, when I was in
(35:27):
college many, many years ago, whenever I would have some
conflict in my life and I was a collegiate athlete, so I was
already working out, but I wouldalso go to the recreational
center of my college and I wouldwork out.
And I always felt so much betterafterwards.
Whatever was bothering me was essentially no longer an issue
for me. And I remember I realized that
(35:50):
so early in life that this is, this has an incredible medicinal
approach here, this thing that we're doing.
And it continues to be so beneficial for me in my life.
And sounds like obviously for you and your life and what an
incredible impact you've had through your work and dance and
yoga and now as an educator and someone going through school,
(36:13):
you're going to continue to havean incredible impact in the
lives of a lot of people. Melissa, I appreciate that about
you. Thank.
You. Well, thank you for giving me
some of your time and being opento doing this.
Just really amazing. And I can't say for the
audience, I can't say enough good things about Melissa.
(36:34):
I've taught the classes she was in.
I've taught 8 jillion times, I swear, and she was one of the
most memorable people that has ever gone through that class.
I was just endlessly impressed from day one through the last
day in the class. You were amazing.
Thank you. Well, hopefully.
(36:54):
We can continue. The research about.
The impact of yoga and VO2 Max and continue the conversation
and so more individuals can understand about all the great
things that are happening with yoga and aerobic capacity.
Most definitely. Thank you so much for your time,
Melissa. Appreciate you.
So I think this episode deservesquite a bit of background and
set up. Melissa is here with US1 is just
an amazing person and our originstory really is based off of
Melissa was a student, one of mymaster's degree classes,
contemporary issues and exercisescience.
And as I told her before I got on, she's an excellent writer
(00:25):
and also an excellent researcher, different topics.
And Melissa has a big background, yoga, dance, things
of that nature. And she just blew me away when
she submitted some work in this master's degree class about yoga
and VO2 Max. I just had, it was like mind
(00:46):
blown moment. And I was like, wait, wait,
wait, wait a minute. A contribution of VO2 Max
through yoga. So we're going to talk about
that. But first, I want to say,
Melissa, thank you so much for spending some time with me
today. My pleasure, Thank you for
having me here. So I think we'll help set this
up too, is for the audience to understand your considerable
background and the topic and just so everyone gets a good
(01:11):
idea what you've been up to for all these years and and how
we've gotten to this point. OK, well thanks.
So I actually found yoga throughmy professional dance.
Career I. Was a trained ballerina and I
danced professionally for over 10 years and then that led me to
(01:32):
leading my own dance company, a choreography project where I
toured around the United States making ballets for different
companies as well as having my own.
Bay Area based ballet. Company in my first master's
program. I had a peer.
In my. Cohort who taught yoga.
And she was encouraging me to come take a yoga class and I was
(01:55):
a little bit apprehensive because I had taken different
styles. Of yoga before.
And I just didn't really think that it.
Fit like the way that I viewed. Exercise and mindfulness.
And she was like no no, no, justcome take my yoga class.
So for background. Her yoga class was.
A vinyasa style dance yoga classand I loved.
(02:16):
It because it had. So many nuances of dance styles
in it. It was in a heated room.
There was a sense of community. There was like great.
Music playing and it. Just I, I went.
Into the experience wanting a workout and I left the
experience with a surprising work in and ever since then I
(02:38):
have been just a. Such a huge.
Proponent of yoga and the ways that it can not only.
Offer a physical practice. But what it can do for the?
Body the breath. And the mind.
Yeah, that's fantastic. And I've, you know, yoga's been
kind of in and out of my life throughout 25 years.
(03:00):
I've always had a tremendous respect for it.
And I think, you know, for the purpose of this discussion,
which is students and colleaguesand clients, you know, the
majority of people have, I wouldsay, you know, a pretty narrow
view of yoga. I would say a focus is something
(03:20):
that, you know, a mind body, spirit based practice, but also
not thinking about it as technically.
And this ties into what we're talking about a workout that
contributes to increasing oxygenconsumption to improve VO2 Max,
which is essentially A gigantic metric of decreasing all 'cause
(03:41):
mortality and longevity practices.
And so I wanted to get an idea of how did you come to this with
start thinking about like getting this research, because I
had never seen this research research before.
And that's why when more background, I give feedback, a
lot of feedback in my classes and I was writing or or speaking
(04:04):
to Melissa and like, what what is this?
Like this is surprising to me and this was the start up there.
So let's let's talk a little bitabout that.
How you discovered this? Well, yoga is a tool for
adaptability. So the body wants.
To adapt. And when we move with intention
and breath and awareness, and werepeat those patterns
(04:27):
consistently, then the body recognizes itself around balance
and efficiency. So VO2 Max is just one
measurable expression of that. I like to tell my students all
the time that the body's primaryjob is homeostasis, so we're
continuously recalibrating to keep us balanced.
(04:50):
So yoga. Asana, yoga, pranayama,
meditation, those are just essentially structured
conversations that we're having with adaptive systems.
So when you practice consistently, your breath, your
nervous system and your muscles,they all learn to respond more
efficiently. So my research is.
Really targeted. Around the the homeostasis, the
(05:14):
the, the physical adaptations that yoga can provide and I
think a. Lot of people that.
Haven't practiced yoga consistently?
Haven't found the. Right yoga teacher, the right
yoga space they're. Coming into the conversation of
yoga with some preconceived notions that might be.
A little dated or that. Structure just around something
kind of like slow and not a Rd. and.
(05:37):
There is such a wide. Range of.
Yoga out there, especially like.Within the past 10 years, we've
seen such a boom in the yoga industry.
And so I think a lot of people are just coming in with, I don't
want to say like a negative connotation, but maybe not like
an accurate understanding. About like how yoga.
(05:58):
Can support them in their aerobic and cardiovascular.
Goals. Yeah, I'm going to say I think a
lot of people have. My speculation is a lot of like
movie yoga and it's. Kind of.
I'm going to explain. It's almost a yoga you see in a
movie that is just extremely gentle and it's it's very much
(06:21):
more like a meditative version of it, not necessarily something
that you would see that is for the purpose of this conversation
more dynamic that is pushing cardiovascular endurance for
that I never see in a movie. That's what I call it, movie
yoga, where it's like, wow, thatlooks a little more intense than
(06:42):
it looks. Just more just relaxing more
than anything and not pushing cardiovascular endurance on on
some level to it. That's just what I always see in
a movie when it's like they're on vacation or something like,
Oh yeah, movie yoga. I'm like, you know, type of
thing. Well, you're, you're giving me
like Lillian Fullen, PBS, 19. 80s vibes right here.
(07:04):
That's like I'm, I'm getting from that and actually I'm gonna
contradict that and say. That that is.
That is just one small componentof yoga and there is like such a
boom in. Yoga.
Corporations that are out there,I mean, I know I've, I've taught
for them and. There is just a.
Huge interest in what yoga is offering right now and all these
(07:26):
like. Hybrids of yoga too, like we see
a lot of like yoga with weights yoga.
Fusion, different things like that.
So, and this is a big discussionbetween yoga teachers and
exercise fitness teachers too. Because a lot of what?
We see in those sort. Of like a big box.
Corporation Yoga Studios is it'smoving towards more of exercise
(07:51):
and moving away from the spirituality component of what?
Yoga really is. And I think like in the.
West, what we practice is called.
An asana yoga if you were to go to different.
Parts of the world they're they're.
Practicing more of a. Spirituality, yoga, So there's a
lot. Of kind of like.
Cross. Messages being sent about.
(08:13):
Yoga. But let me tell you, you can
increase. Your cardiovascular rate by.
Taking a yoga class and I know because I've taken them and I've
taught them so. So tell me, so explain to the
audience that concept like what?Because they're probably
thinking, OK, maybe I maybe I haven't taken a yoga that does
(08:34):
push more cardiovascular endurance.
How would you describe that, that version of yoga, what that
would be like? Well, a lot of times too, we're
also thinking about like a heat component too.
Because a. Lot of what people are doing now
is like a hot. Yoga so just like a. 60 minute
or 90 minute? Class by itself.
Can be taxing, but then you put in that 95° heat that 105.
(08:56):
Degree heat that 40. Percent humidity.
And all of a. Sudden you are working out.
So. When I talk about.
Like what's? Happening in yoga, there's also
this component of prana yama. OK so prana yama is connected to
asana and asana in Sanskrit literally means seat.
(09:17):
So when it started. Out physical postures were just.
Meant as a reason to. Prepare the body for.
Pranayama and for meditation. OK, now what we see.
Are these like huge? Variations of what asana can be
and a lot of overtime, especially within the past. 30
years. There's been this physical
(09:37):
activity, gymnastics, kinesthetics, like military.
Based exercises that have. Been integrated into yoga.
Practice. And a lot of that we see is in
the Austin and known as Surya Namaskar.
So when people do sun salutations, so like 7 to 11 or
12 poses, and you're moving through a sequence, a dynamic
(09:59):
sequence, and every pose is connected to breath, and then we
have this pranayama component, which is pranayama in Sanskrit.
If we break it down, prana meanslife.
Force. Vital energy AKA breath OK and a
yama means extension or expansion.
So what? You're literally.
(10:19):
Doing people think like, oh, youjust come to yoga and you
breathe in and out. That is not what you're doing at
all. OK In pranayama, it's about
controlling the breath. It's about internal regulation
of the movement of the prana through the breath.
And when you do. That all of a.
Sudden, you're improving your VOT Max, you're increasing your
(10:41):
endurance, you're reducing perceived exertion.
At the same time, you're improving recovery after
exertion. So when you combine breath with
movement, the body learns how tostay calm under load, and that's
in a way an emotional resilience.
So you're doing all these amazing things.
For your body, through physical activity, through breath.
(11:03):
That's amazing. That's so awesome.
Well said. I definitely have some questions
following up with this. So let's I want to come back to
what you said, but I want to also make sure we get into the
research, especially the research that was presented to
me within the course 'cause thatwas, I thought that was really
interesting. And so talk a little bit about
(11:24):
that research and, and in addition to that, an addendum is
what in terms of these studies, what, what is the significance
in terms of improvement of VO2 Max?
What percentage or amount of improvement are can we expect
based off of the research that we currently have that you
presented in there? Sure, let's talk about the first
study. So it was yoga.
(11:46):
Pranayama VO2 Max and aggressionin swimmers OK.
So this study is by. Rinchu and Manikam and.
It worked with 50. Competitive swimmers from
Kerala. Which is a southwest West.
Coast town in India and these were young athletes, so
(12:11):
groupings of 18 to 21, and none of these individuals had had any
kind of prior yoga experience, so the researchers.
Divide that. Divided them into two groups.
We had a. Yoga group and then a control.
Group. And.
The yoga group. Practiced asana and pranayama.
So our. Poses and our breath retention.
(12:32):
And they did that for five mornings a week.
For 8 weeks. And the researchers measured. 3
variables. Within that study, they measured
aggression, VO2 Max and then flexibility.
And So what they found was not only did aggression go down and
flexibility increase, but they found a significant increase in
(12:53):
the swimmers maximal oxygen uptake.
So the authors, the researchers.Explained that this happened
because of the pranayama training, so they reduced their
resting oxygen consumption. They lowered the heart.
Rate for the same workload that the control group was getting,
(13:15):
they improved their lung efficiency and breath control,
and they enhanced oxygen extraction at the muscular
level. So in essence, yoga made
swimmers more efficient, it madethem more calm, and it made
them. Psychologically adaptable, so
all. Extremely important for
(13:35):
competitive athletes. I mean all extremely important
for any individual. I mean.
The one we're behind driving it.On the freeway like.
We would all benefit from a little bit of yoga.
We need less aggression on the highway, right?
We do, and I just think that like.
Breath itself is just. So interesting.
I love to tell my students like we're taking anywhere from 22 to
(13:56):
24,000 breaths a day, OK? And those are all involuntary,
like we're not even paying attention to it and the times
that we are actually thinking. About our breath are.
In silly moments when we're giggling and we're like I can
get my breath or like somebody startles us and we go and we.
Lose our breath? OK, but what yoga teaches you?
Is to be mindful. About about your breath to take.
(14:17):
Study inhales, study exhales, and as we move through a
pranayama practice. There's all these like, cool.
Ways that we can manipulate. Our breath.
But 95% of us are. Just like we're just up here,
we're just chest breathers. We're short, shallow breaths.
We're not even getting to that like diaphragmatic awareness and
so. I think what was.
Happening here in this study is that we see swimmers increasing
(14:40):
their VO2 Max just by increasingtheir awareness of their.
Breath. I wonder.
So funny we're talking about VO2Max, but the aggression part
actually really tripped me up. That and what and what I mean by
that is like what was the motivation for studying that the
aggression and swimmers. That's curious to me.
(15:01):
I mean, but really important, I think, you know.
Well, the authors. Explained that pranayama and the
asana, it shifted the nervous system towards that
parasympathetic dominant so theywere going into kind of the rest
and digest instead of that like.Fight or.
Flight symptom and when they didthat it.
Lowered the heart rate. It.
Lowered their psychological arousal.
(15:23):
It reduced. Excuse me it.
Better regulated their. Emotions and then it reduced
that sympathetic. Fight or flight?
Activation. So aggression didn't necessarily
just go down, but it was like a measurable reduction in their
physiological and psychological tension that they might have
felt like. Before a big.
Race or something? Yeah.
OK, gosh, that makes so much sense.
(15:44):
I love that study actually. It's just so.
And when you presented that, I was like, what?
It's not often I'm presented with something.
I'm like, I literally have neverheard of this before.
It was amazing. Well, there's another cool
study. Too that I brought.
To your attention, OK. And it so this one's a little
bit like more, I would say knownand famous.
(16:05):
So it was about. Long term yoga improvement with
VO2 Max and fitness in adults. So this study is by.
Udan Ivanka day and fatale and it's one of the largest yoga and
physiological. Studies out there.
So it actually had a a big. Sample It worked with 200
adults. Ages 30 to 50 who practice yoga.
(16:28):
One hour per day. Six days a week.
For six months. OK, quite the commitment.
And the yoga sessions included asana, pranayama and meditation.
And they looked at. Several cardio respiratory
markers. So they're looking at.
Like their PFI? Index their physical fitness
index, they're looking at VO2 Max, they're looking at BMI and
(16:50):
weight, they're looking at the basal metabolic rate, and they
measured and found. Through a validity test.
That after six months. Of Yoga VO. 2 Max increased by
14%, a very meaningful. Shift for adults.
Yeah, for adults. Not training in sort.
(17:11):
Of like a high. Intensity exercise regiment SO.
Why did it decrease? Why did it increase?
Well, it the author cited that. It improved yoga, improved
muscular endurance, it increasedthe oxygen extraction it.
Provided better blood flow. To working muscles, there was a
(17:33):
reduction in the vascular tone from the parasympathetic
activation, and it increased in.Efficiency of the respiratory.
System So in other words, yoga improved the economy of the
cardio. Respiratory.
System. I'm telling you this mind
blowing and I'm going to say whybecause the traditional idea of
(17:54):
improvement of VO2 Max is very much linked to your more high
intensity based exercise. Your kind of your or also like
your two to four minute intervalrange where it may start a
little easy. And then by that last minute, I
mean you're struggling pretty hard.
And I think the significance of that is a different pathway for
(18:16):
achieving a similar result because clearly there's many
ways to get to a similar point. And for a lot of people, a more
high intensity activity, whetherit's biking, whether it's
running, whether it's any high intensity based resistant
training work is not attractive to a lot of people all the time.
(18:39):
And so often I see a lot of people not engaging in VO2 Max
based training because 1 is justincredibly painful and not
attractive to a lot of the population.
So this to me what what drew me was like, oh, another pathway
that is probably actually more digestible to a larger
(19:01):
population, larger percentage ofpopulation speculation all
speculation for that. But I don't know what do you
think of that? I just think that there's a
component to yoga that we haven't really addressed that
much and I think the reason why people see an increase in it is
because. It is a.
Body breath and mind exercise and so when individuals are in a
(19:23):
yoga. Class there there's a.
Community setting. OK in yoga and Sanskrit
language, we call that our sangha.
We're part of a community there's motivation from.
Others we're very close. Matt to Matt and.
There is a lot of. Things that are happening,
happening psychologically withinus, that are being motivated by
the. Words that the yoga is speak
(19:44):
that the yoga teacher is. Speaking so there's like years
and hundreds. Of years of philosophy.
Undertones behind this sort of westernized modern workout
that's happening, and a lot of times people are connecting to
these. Philosophical.
Elements just through the simple.
Practice of these. Awesomeness.
OK. And one of the things that
people are connecting with is something called tapas.
(20:06):
And no, it's not an expensive small plate of food.
That you get at a restaurant, OK.
This is known as our discipline or austerity, OK?
It's literally my favorite thingin the world that I tell my
students all the time. It's commitment.
It's doing the thing that you said you were going to do long
(20:27):
after the mood that you set it in.
Has passed. So there's a commitment that's
happening because it in your yoga practice, because strong
looks different in yoga. OK, It's not like going and
lifting a bunch of weights, or like running for miles and
miles. Or biking for miles and miles.
It's the ability that. At any point, you're standing in
(20:48):
a pose with your arms out, and you could just drop your arms
and go get French fries or go text message a friend or
something. But you don't.
You stay committed in this pose and you.
Push yourself to the edge. And that's what's what's
happening through that, this psychological connection that's
expanding everything within you from a.
(21:10):
Physical the basis, lowest levelphysical gross body all the way
through your subtle bodies. And so I don't know if I
correctly answered your question.
I do, I do want to just talk about the component of the
psychological connection that's happening within yoga.
That's really important and that's.
(21:30):
Why we see people? Continuing That's why we.
See people? Making a difference.
Physically with VO2. Max consumption and expansion
and also in terms of like aggression like in the 1st.
Study, Yeah. Are shifting their way that
they're looking at themselves, and that's helping that the way
(21:52):
that they're looking at others because what's happening on the
mat? All that good stuff.
You take that out in the world and then that's what helps you
not freak out when you're sitting in traffic.
Yeah, Yeah, I, you know, I thinkI'm, I'm going to get back to
the question part a little bit, but I think that's one of a
larger benefit of exercise in general.
Is, is in addition to that is ithelps you become hopefully if
(22:17):
you're doing a consistent practice of exercise should make
you feel better inside your body, outside your body and
better and become better to other people and your life
through that practice. We've often associated the
practice of any exercise or movement was just a very
physical outcome for this instead of an outcome that's
more holistic for that. And I, I think back to the
(22:40):
question a little bit. You did answer, you added a lot
of a lot of layer too, which is great.
But I think with the pathway is people haven't seen this wise is
the least interesting. I can only speak for myself and
my knowledge, just observationally that the most
people I know, they don't look at yoga as something that will
improve their via to Max. They they're not entering into
(23:01):
it going. I'm doing this practice because
it's going to actually add to that.
This is again, just a group of people I know and my
observation, it's always looked at as I'm going here to like
center myself kind of a meditative practice, but and
they're not looking at it as this very large, like 14%
change. That's that's big.
That's actually really big. And so I think turning that you,
(23:25):
you could actually get even morepeople into it if they saw that
aspect to it as well. The VO2 Max, because you're
going to get a lot of people whoare like exercise physiologists,
that's what they're looking for that type of aspect too.
I think that is that has a massive ripple into
participation and of people who may not come to the practice
(23:46):
through maybe more traditional means, but like, hey, I can
improve my VO2 Max and get theseother benefits.
That's amazing. Yeah, better breathing, better
stamina, calmer nervous system is.
Exactly what that? Research is capturing indicating
when we see VO2 Max improvement and the exciting thing is is.
That yoga just. Doesn't like make you more
(24:07):
flexible or more people? It literally can make you more
aerobically efficient. Yeah.
And that to me is that's amazing'cause I had never really
associated that myself, the aerobic efficiency.
But it's another great benefit of yoga practice that has not
(24:31):
been promoted. And, and just in my space at 25
years, I have known tons of people who have taught yoga.
I've hired yoga instructors for clubs that run.
Not one yoga person has ever talked about aerobic efficiency
in my in my time with that. And I think that language that
talk actually will speak to a lot more people who are into
(24:51):
that aspect of exercise. Yeah, I mean there.
Yoga is a. Structured aerobic exercise
program. And if it's not being portrayed
that way, then it needs to be marketed that way more.
And I hope this conversation, this discussion that we're
having can ripple out and more individuals can understand that
this is occurring through yoga pranayama meditation.
(25:14):
I totally agree. I want to come back to something
because I was just curious aboutyour thoughts about this.
You had talked about the Westernaspect of yoga and I know a lot
of people have a lot of feelingsabout yeah, I think you know
where this is going, the spiritual nature of yoga, the
intertwining of that and the practice and the spirituality
(25:36):
versus maybe as you're, as you said, of a kind of the removal
of more of the spiritual practice, but more of just the
the exercise. What are your thoughts?
Is this positive, negative. What are you feeling about this
neutral? Oh my gosh, it's we could spend.
Hours. Years.
Talking about this. The the dialogue is.
(25:56):
So nuanced and I think when it comes down to it, the the best
thing to do about this conversation is to.
Educate yourself. So if you're unsure, it's
important to have a base understanding, like what we
practice right now in our westernized.
Culture. Like that is not.
Yoga, like yoga the. The timeline of yoga, but as
(26:20):
even the conversation of it is completely challenged all the
time. Is it 10,000?
Is it 7000? Is it 2000 years?
I mean. Literally what we.
Practice now in our Western ice.Culture, it's about like.
Little over 100. Years, OK.
This is when yoga was. Brought to the West.
(26:41):
And. It was brought by.
Indian. Philosophers that were.
Helping us at a time when a lot.Of us were, were.
Seeking sort of new ways. To look at the world.
But we have luminaries like Krishnamacharya.
Pattabhi Joyce, BK. SIN gar and these individuals
created an. Offshoot of.
(27:01):
Of asana based yoga and over time it's taken on this nuances
of gymnastics, calisthenics. We see high to.
Low planks like in military. Type activities.
OK, it's. Manifested so much and with.
That a lot of the roots of yoga have gotten.
(27:23):
Lost so we've. Lost the philosophies of.
Yoga, and it's progressed into something more modern.
Exercise based, OK. But the long answer to your
question is. If it works for you.
Then there's something in there that's important and you should
listen to that. And if the.
Teacher of yoga. It's their duty.
(27:45):
It's their. Responsibility to be educated
and where yoga came from and also.
The way that yoga adapts. Based on what the?
Culture needs OK so if a good teacher is able to.
Bring in what worked in the. Past, but what's?
Presently needed for the. Future for the.
Present student, then they're doing the right thing.
(28:07):
It's honoring the roots, but at the same time staying relevant
and present to what the community and the culture needs
in the present moment. Well said.
Yeah, just like class, just likein class, I'm telling you.
I'm curious what your thoughts are on why this is a big
question. Why the spiritual aspect of yoga
(28:28):
has become less and less over time in Western nice versions of
yoga. Oh my gosh, I I mean, I think
there's a sitting here. Like as like a.
White woman who has never been into, never been to India, never
studied with these, you know. Type of guru type.
Individuals, I think there's a. Lot of.
(28:50):
Fear of appropriation? I think there's a need.
To to respect the the past of it, but also.
And when you are teaching a class and I know you know this
through and hopefully the listeners too that have taught
any type of. Physical activity class OK,
(29:12):
there is a. Lot of things going on.
OK, You are not just teaching a class to one student, you're
teaching a class to 2540 sixty students.
How many are in your class? That's a lot of bodies that you
are. Taking care of.
There's a lot of physical. Alignment things that you are
trying to support your students with.
There's the music, there's the clock, there is your peak.
(29:36):
Pose that you're working for. There's a lot of like.
Pens in the air that you're juggling, and I think a lot of
times teachers get stuck on teaching the physical.
Aspects of it they let the physical poses Dr. The yoga.
Car and letting. Other aspects like.
Pranayama, meditation, philosophy, those things work
(29:57):
themselves in, so I just think it.
Takes a skilled. And experienced teacher to find
a way to make a well-rounded class that can that can that can
be a cornucopia of all of those things.
And sometimes you know things. Get left out.
(30:19):
And unfortunately a lot of timesthe things that.
Get left out are the the philosophy aspects of it.
Because you're trying to supportthe student and the students
there because they want to work out, they want to work.
Out and. It's your the teacher to also
help them like I said in the beginning of this to find a work
in. Yeah, what about the
(30:42):
certification organizations for yoga?
Is the curriculum indicative of one that has the spiritual
practice within it or is it non spiritual practice based?
That is such a fantastic question.
So there is one large governing board of certifications for
(31:06):
yoga. Teachers, it's yoga.
Alliance and I am a certified yoga alliance.
Teacher as well as. Running a school.
That offers a yoga teacher. Training 200 hours.
Certificate. And that governing board is
exceptional about having students that are that are
(31:28):
teacher trainees to become a teacher, having an education
that's well-rounded, that's hitting all checking all the
boxes when it comes to asana Pranayama, teaching techniques,
anatomy, and. Physiology.
Yoga Philosophy. And I do.
Have to say that. As somebody that leads.
All of those classes. For my teacher trainees,
(31:51):
students as soon as they learn about.
The philosophies of yoga. Lifestyles and ethics.
They're so enamored. By it, it's so deep, it's like I
tell my. Students, these are all the
things that they're talking about in these.
Philosophies like through the. Ancient texts.
Like the bhava garhitas. The Upanishads.
The Yoga Sutras of. Patanjali, like these are all
(32:11):
things that we feel inside, thatwe've learned along the way, and
somehow we just need to be reminded of them.
And that's what these ancient texts do.
But again, a lot of times, new teachers, young teachers, they
have a hard time finding a way to integrate.
Those. Themes into their physical asana
based classes and these sort. Of like big box.
(32:33):
Corporation Students. It's so amazing.
It's interesting, right? I mean, it's, as someone who's
been an exercise for a long timeand, and as a professor and
stuff, I actually spend a lot oftime in like certified personal
training courses that I teach atvarious colleges on philosophy
(32:53):
because I, I actually think it'sa huge part of the practice of
whether you're a personal trainer or group exercise
instructor. But we're so focused on the
exercise Physiology aspect of it, which is great, which is
totally great to have baseline information for that.
But we we don't often talk aboutthe the philosophy related to
(33:16):
oneself, your own practice, how you show up to your sessions
with clients and also teaching clients about philosophy and
different forms of philosophy, whether it's, you know, in this
version of pragmatism, naturalism, axiology,
metaphysics. All these different things are
an important in my thought process behind why students made
(33:37):
love the lifestyle, ethics, yogapart because it speaks to
becoming more human and how to become a better person through
yoga. And I think all exercise should
be an instruction on how to become a better human being for
that, for the practitioner, for the instructor, all those
(33:59):
things. But we often try to push that
away from the curriculum quite abit in in lieu of let's talk
about chronic adaptation, acute adaptation, the Krebs cycle,
electron transport again, which are important, but it often is
in lieu of actually spending a lot of time on the self
(34:21):
improvement part for that. So I love that.
I've always loved that about yoga.
I was just curious how much of that was a part of the
curriculum, you know? Definitely a part of it because
when it comes down to it, yoga is about yoking.
It's about a. Union it's about understanding
more about yourself and when youfind.
Out about yourself. Then you can show up and be
(34:44):
better for the individuals around you.
And I think we can all agree that no matter what the.
Workout is that we're. Picking We always feel like a
better human being, we. Always feel like our bigger
capital self after that workout.100%.
Everything else that we were bringing in, it doesn't.
Feel. As drama or important?
(35:06):
Afterwards, because we're clear headed, we've.
Moved stuff around we've. Shifted all those.
Thoughts and those emotions I tell my students all the time if
you're if. You have that thought.
Loop going through your head. Take a deep.
Breath in, just sigh it out and that's going to help move.
That thought through. Yeah, I you, I mean, you're
speaking a huge truth here. I'm telling you, when I was in
(35:27):
college many, many years ago, whenever I would have some
conflict in my life and I was a collegiate athlete, so I was
already working out, but I wouldalso go to the recreational
center of my college and I wouldwork out.
And I always felt so much betterafterwards.
Whatever was bothering me was essentially no longer an issue
for me. And I remember I realized that
(35:50):
so early in life that this is, this has an incredible medicinal
approach here, this thing that we're doing.
And it continues to be so beneficial for me in my life.
And sounds like obviously for you and your life and what an
incredible impact you've had through your work and dance and
yoga and now as an educator and someone going through school,
(36:13):
you're going to continue to havean incredible impact in the
lives of a lot of people. Melissa, I appreciate that about
you. Thank.
You. Well, thank you for giving me
some of your time and being opento doing this.
Just really amazing. And I can't say for the
audience, I can't say enough good things about Melissa.
(36:34):
I've taught the classes she was in.
I've taught 8 jillion times, I swear, and she was one of the
most memorable people that has ever gone through that class.
I was just endlessly impressed from day one through the last
day in the class. You were amazing.
Thank you. Well, hopefully.
(36:54):
We can continue. The research about.
The impact of yoga and VO2 Max and continue the conversation
and so more individuals can understand about all the great
things that are happening with yoga and aerobic capacity.
Most definitely. Thank you so much for your time,
Melissa. Appreciate you.
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