TDP # 101 Exploring Faith, Fear, and Purpose

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Driftwood podcast.
I'm Daniel the Wizard and it'sbeen a minute.
So today we got Pastor Brian.
I call him a preacher manfriend.
Every time I'm talking tosomebody and they're like oh, my
preacher man friend's callingme Preacher, preacher man.
So that's pretty how you doingtoday, brian man, I'm doing good

(00:22):
man.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
This has been like a long time waiting man to finally
get this done.
I mean, it is funny becausewe're drinking coffee, right?
Now, that's how we met overcoffee, and coffee can bring a
lot of good relationshipstogether.
Man.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
Yeah, I agree, and it's actually really funny.
I actually invited your wife onthis podcast before I invited
you.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
Oh really, I'm glad you told the truth down right.
Now it's normal.
Sometimes Nicole get invited tosome stuff before me and then,
and then it's like it neverhappens, and then I'm the one
where you ask me to kind of justfall us through like it happens
, right, yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
So your wife Nicole, she was doing an event at the
coffee shop and I think she hadone of your daughters with you
or something like that, and shehad her booth set up.
And I walked over and I talkedto her a little bit.
I was like, yeah, because wewere there promoting the podcast
, and I said, hey, would youlike to come on?
I just never really followed up, man.
And look, that's probably why alot of people never ended up on

(01:16):
the podcast, because I lack thefollow up.
Follow up.
Part of it was I was worriedabout equipment at a certain
point and then also at that timeI had a podcast host and yeah,
just long story, but anyways,yeah here we are finally
recording, so the last this isWait, let me say this I got to

(01:36):
clear this out because I don'twant Nicole to get mad Like,
wait a minute, brian, what youtalking about, brian, how that
goes.

Speaker 2 (01:42):
Let me clear it up.
Nicole gets invited to a lot ofstuff, man, and she's just busy
doing a lot of other things.
So that's why sometimes shecan't get to some of the stuff.
And I want to sometimes, youcan listen, I'm going to commend
her.
I always commend her, but I'llcommend her now.
She does a lot of stuff withthe children, especially with
the rhyme, with special needsand stuff, getting kids back and

(02:04):
forth to school.
I'm to her appointments andthen she's also trying to do her
business work at the same timeso that's just.
it's a lot and a lot of peoplecan't always juggle that right.
And she's doing her best ofjuggling them, but she's getting
better day by day.
And then when she looks at meand she's just looking like how?

(02:27):
Are you doing all this stuff,and in my mind I don't think
about it, I just do it, and thenI just do it.

Speaker 1 (02:35):
See, I would think that about my wife, like, how
are?
You doing all this stuff?
Like.
I'm like man, because thethings that I do I can manage
those things, but the thingsthat she would do I'm just like
I'm glad she's doing that.

Speaker 2 (02:50):
So you know, I think that's why he's versa, bro, like
just so-so, she would be like,yep, I'm not getting in the
middle of that today.

Speaker 1 (02:56):
Yeah, no, I think I don't know.
I think that's an interestingthing about perspective, though,
because I like to tell peopleall the time man, I'm glad my
problems are my problems.
Because I see other people'sproblems, I'm like I ain't set
up to deal with that, and sothat makes me really
appreciative of what it is.
So tell me a little bit aboutyourself, man.
What do you do?

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yeah, so I'm pastor with Commissioned Assembly here
of Texas.
We are churches trying to do anew plant.
Here in Garland I work withState Farm.
We moved to Texas.
I wanted, I say maybe fiveyears, now 2018.
So we'll be coming six years inJuly 14th.

(03:37):
I won't forget that day becausethat's the day I needed
everything to get set up so wecould go into our house and from
there God called us to Texas.
And it's just interestingbecause I tell people the story
all the time, man, we haddifferent places where we could
go and find the house.
There was one house we saw thatwas right by the zoo Dallas Zoo

(04:00):
and then Columbus.
Man, we know we got it.
I don't know if you guys heardabout it, but we got a really
good zoo.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
That's the zoo.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
Like it's now two days to go through the zoo, like
a full two days, like anamusement park.
And I have feelings about zoos.
So what, we were thinking like,all right, where we move, doing
stuff for the kids, right, theenvironment for the kids?
And there was a house overthere by the zoo in Dallas, and
then we saw two houses inGarland.

(04:27):
And then I was also trying tojuggle well, where am I going to
move to travel for my job?
And I remember I was justpraying to God.
I was on I-70 back in Columbusand I was going towards
Zanesville and I was justpraying to God.
I said, god, where you want usto go?
I'm like we got Garland, we gotMesquie, we got Dallas.
I'm like, where are we going?
And then, sure enough, I lookedup.

(04:48):
I saw this little hotel orbuilding, say Garland Never seen
it there before in a day in mylife.
And I'm like I got you, god.
I got the answer, so guesswe're going to Garland.
So then we ended up moving inGarland and I'm thankful we're

(05:08):
riding Garland.
And the reason why I say thatis because we have some
fantastic neighbors.
It reminds me of being a kid,so I didn't have to worry about
my kids going outside.
Something happened into them.
Everybody on that street knowseverybody.
Everybody knows who everybody'skids are.
If something goes wrong, youknow who to talk to or they'll
tell you.
So I was real happy about that.

(05:29):
And then my neighbors that is,across the street from me,
beside me we're all kind of likefamily as well too.
Man, they'll invite us out tostuff, we'll invite them to
stuff, cook for each other orjust help out.
And so to move from a city likewe it's a full, taking a whole
family, like we're uprootingfrom Ohio, a whole bunch of
support like master support.

(05:51):
So now you're moving to a placewhere there's limited support
that we have and so we're hereand just to have those neighbors
that made some of the difficultthings that we went through a
lot easier too.
And then just meeting people inGarland like you, like Chastity
and stuff that made it evenbetter, because our first year

(06:11):
it was rough man, because wewere just meeting people that
were just so fake and two-facedand shady.
And then I'm like, well, whereare you from?
And then I find out they ain'tfrom Texas, they from somewhere
else You're like burn.
And then we find some of thefolks from Texas to try to lie
to you, right, and then it'slike dude, you know you could do
way better at this lie thanwhat you're trying to tell me

(06:31):
right.
I know I'm from the Midwest,but I mean we do.
If you want to scam me, we do alittle bit faster what you do
in the road, you're taking yourtime right, so we just met some
bad people.
But then we just started meetingsome really cool people here in
Garland, like even PastorAlicia with Blueprint she's real
cool.
We met with Pastor Chance downat Christ Memorial, chris Benion
over at the County Church he'sPastor Chris.

(06:54):
And then even another PastorChris he's in the Fluent Church
here.
So we started meeting all thesereally cool people.
Man, I was like, oh God, thankyou, man, because I was getting
worried.
I was like yo, I moved.
We moved all the way here toget with shady folks.
I'm like, look, I'm a privateperson, but God, we about to be
super private.
I don't know how I'm gonna doministry, right, I don't know
how I'm gonna live Because I gotto talk to someone.

(07:16):
I'm like I can't do this.
But then I also got some familyhere too.
One of my odds that I'm reallyclose with that I grew up with
from a childhood she's here, butwe just lived 30 minutes away.
My best friend is like abrother to me.
He lives here.
He's about 45 minutes away.
And then I got my other cousinI'm real cool with.
He's about another 35 minutesaway now, where he moved.

Speaker 1 (07:38):
So you at least got a couple people.

Speaker 2 (07:40):
Yeah, I got some people here and then I got my
other cousin.
He lives in Tyler.

Speaker 1 (07:45):
That's my neck of the woods.
That's Tyler, texas.
I'm from around there.
Yeah, he's Texas, yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:49):
I haven't got a chance to meet her, but she's
over there.
And then my other cousin, she'sdown in Houston with one of my
great aunts.
She's down in Houston.
So we, and then my wife'saunt's down in Houston too.
So we've been to Houston a lotjust visiting them.

Speaker 1 (08:02):
We're doing stuff Go.

Speaker 2 (08:03):
Astros yeah.
You know, see I don't know whatyou're trying to do.
Like getting like we startedthis early, you try to get
everybody in trouble man, youknow the.

Speaker 3 (08:12):
Rangers just won, right?
Yeah, I'm still going to ruinmy mess though.

Speaker 2 (08:15):
OK, I'm just saying, man, like you know, you and
Dallas, and I'm proud of theRangers because you know what
they finally got one.
I know that's what I'm happyfor too, finally got one.
They finally got one, and I waslike I'm finally, you know, in
another championship city,because back home I'm a Yankees
fan, right, so obviously hereyou go, right, no, listen,
listen.
The Compass Clippers was theYankees farm team.

(08:39):
So just imagine we looking atJared Dieter.
I'm looking at him from a minorperspective as a little bitty
kid like this is so cool.
This is so cool yeah, I'm aYankee.
Then they switched over to theIndians and like, well, they're
not the Indians now they're thecommanders, or something like
that.
So yeah something weird, butthey still got the same colors,
right.

Speaker 1 (08:57):
Yeah, was it the?
Yeah, I don't even remember.
Guardians the guardians.
Guardians, the ClevelandGuardians.

Speaker 2 (09:03):
Yeah, I got them mixed up with Redskins probably.

Speaker 1 (09:06):
But I still think a wild.
Thing.

Speaker 2 (09:07):
I still think a wild thing, yeah, yeah yeah, but
that's what put them on the maptoo right.
Man, it's a major league man.
So now we talking about somegood stuff, but yeah, so that's
what I do.
And then the other thing that Ido is AHM funding to where we
help people like with getmortgage loans or just loans
from their investment propertiesor just personal loans.

(09:30):
So I try to do that as well.
That one have put too muchfocus in this year because I've
really been trying to put a lotof focus in on the ministry
portion and then my family.
So that's just a little bitabout Brian.
I mean I could probably giveyou a hold on that.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
Yeah, yeah, no, but we could.
I think we understand where youcome from, so I guess the
question that I would have islike how did you get into
ministry?
I know that there's a longstory You've told me the long
story.

Speaker 2 (10:05):
Right, I'll keep it short.

Speaker 1 (10:06):
But just like what drew you to, how did you get to
ministry?

Speaker 2 (10:10):
So, as a kid, with my aunt, my aunt Audrey.
She passed away, she justintroduced me to Christ as a kid
and I just was in love withJesus, right, and I remember, at
eight years old I mean, I drewa green Jesus.
Whatever color you gave me, Iwould draw pictures of Jesus,
man, she in her old apartment.

(10:31):
She got a green picture of Jesusto Audrey.
She always used to talk to meabout it and I remember I was in
church one day and I could hearGod talk, like we had
conversations and everything hewas, you know.
And so I remember him sayinghey, brian, you love me.
I'm like yeah, lord, you know,I love you.
What's up?

Speaker 1 (10:47):
man.

Speaker 2 (10:47):
He like there's all I want you to do for me.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
I'm like OK what.

Speaker 2 (10:51):
And then he showed me this vision of a pulpit, me
behind it, angels, fire going up.
I was like that's what you do.
I was like preach, no, I say Idon't even know the bottle of
Jesus, no.
So I ran and I ran into church.
They had a rule don't run inchurch.
But I ran that time and mygrandmother saw, saw me, and she

(11:12):
was like hey, what's wrong withyou?
Like you saw something.
And then just Holy Spirit spoketo her, was like what a god
tell you?
How'd you know God?
Exactly.
I was like oh my god, I was likeuh, so what are those people up
front?
Oh preacher, oh no, no, no, no.
Uh, there's other people upfrom.
What's those other people upfront?

Speaker 1 (11:31):
Oh, a deacon.

Speaker 2 (11:32):
Yeah, do that, I'll do that.
And then, as soon as you saythat Bishop now, but at the time
was a pastor, pastor BishopRoss, he came down walking and
then he just came at the righttime and so, oh God, I called
him via deacon.
I'm several like now.
He really called me a preacher,but I don't want to do this and
so then Told me, and then oneday they brought me up as a

(11:53):
junior deacon.
I cried on front because I knewthat wasn't what God called me
to do, and then my mom took meout of it.
So then at that point ran intothe world and then flash forward
, got a real bad car accident.
At this part is where my turn,my back on God, because things
just wasn't going how I wantedit to go in life.
You know, there there is andI'll keep it short like I had

(12:20):
choices, didn't go up in thebest, we didn't live in the best
neighborhood, but in the goodneighbor part of the
neighborhood though.
So in Ohio or Columbus there'sno, there's no easing into it.
It's like real bad and thenreal good.
Right, it's like a line, and sowe were right through on that
edge of the line, yeah, and I goright across the street.
It's like real bad.
Yeah and so I had some choicesto make.

(12:41):
I remember when my mom lost herjob, and it was a choice of do
I want to be like my friends andsell drugs, or Can I really try
and get this football thing?
Yeah and Try to do a full-body.
Some stuff didn't, didn't,didn't go as planned, couldn't
pass a clearing house, had acouple scholarships get taken
away because of that and I meanthese were D1 scholarships to me

(13:01):
and I was just real bad, madabout it, kept getting hurt.
I met plenty of professionalathletes.
They were looking at me workingout in the gym and stuff like
who team, what team you play for?
I'm like I'm in college, bro,what's the other why you got
that little school?
You know all that stuff.
So I'm in the accident I hadgot into man, I curse, got out

(13:25):
and I heard God speaking to methen and I was like nah, man,
forget you, man, I don't needyou know, I'm gonna do this.
At that moment I was gonna tryand so drugs and do stuff like
my friends.

Speaker 1 (13:34):
I'm like I was doing this to you want to do some hood
rats though?

Speaker 2 (13:36):
Yeah and Cracks.
And it happened, say my life,on my birthday.
I saw a demon getting ready totake me back to hell and I'm
giving you the shorts version ofit and at that moment I felt
breath coming out of my body asit jumped on me because there
was a guy next to me.
I committed suicide, so thatdemon jumped off of him and I
just remember I knew I was aboutto die and but then I heard

(13:58):
Christ voice and he was tellingme don't give up, I'm your, my
son.
And he said you need to call onmy name to get this off of you,
because I used to deal with thisstuff when I was a kid, yeah,
and I Was like, well, you knowwhat I said.
I tried, it didn't work.
And then he was like I need tosay it from your mouth or from
your heart?
And so I was like if I say frommy heart, that means I mean it.

(14:19):
And then he said He'd be goingback and forth a little bit and
he's like do you want to live oryou want to die?
I was like, oh, this is serious.
Like I was like well as you cansee the choice I made right
because I'm here and After thatdemon got off I had.
When they talk about havingthese out-of-body experiences, I
did that.

(14:40):
I was able to see Because I waskind of Stationary on the bed,
I couldn't really move and stufflike that from the car.
It's not to cut me out, Ididn't get a broken bone in my
body, believe it or not.
And I remember walking out ofthat room.
I remember looking the hallway.
I could see the nurses, I couldtell you everything from detail
what was in.
I could mine the neighbor thatthey just put in here.
I saw this bandages and stuff.

(15:02):
And I saw a white light to theleft of me and I was about to go
there and I heard guys say, hey, man, you can't do that, you
gonna be running, rest your life.
And I'm like, alright, well, Iguess I'm about to face it.
And if I'm gonna have to die, Iguess I'm gonna just face this
demon.
And I, you know, I was like,well, I'm gonna die fighting and
let's, let's do it.
You know, and I remember demontry to come back out and saw a

(15:23):
white light and next thing, youknow, I Got up and breath came
back on my body.
I was sweating and at thatmoment I gave my life to Christ,
and that's where I really saythat's when I really Lived for
him right because you can knowhim right, like everybody does.
well, yeah, I believe in Jesus,I know Jesus.
You know what I?
Mean, yet you mean Jesus, coolI know, him, but then we don't
live for him.

(15:43):
So that's, yeah, that's notthat change again, right, that's
not that born again moment.
So I had that born again momenton my birthday.
So my birthday is real specialto me because that's the day I
died but was born again, thelittle price right.
So I'm from there.
Just the journey was just justministering to people.
Man Just talking to peopleabout Christ was understained to
the gospel.
I mean I was in, I Was kind oflike the early Tim Tebow

(16:08):
somewhat, but just like the hoodof virgin abroad.

Speaker 1 (16:11):
Yeah, you weren't crisp, cut like he was.

Speaker 2 (16:13):
Nah, I was just more cuz I still had some.
I Still have some outspokennessabout me.
Some boat is like I just didn'tcare, like I get these mothers,
I just don't care.
But I'll tell you what it is.

Speaker 1 (16:23):
It's just try Jesus, don't try me.

Speaker 2 (16:26):
You know, and I play football, so that was a mindset
to like, you know, playingcorner, you had to have the
confidence and many ways, justministering people.
Then people's like startmeaning like are you a minister?
You know, you're supposed to bea minister, and stuff like that
.
And then there was just one day, man, I was going Because what
flip it was.

(16:47):
I got in a cracks and then theywere trying to.
They turned it around on me.
The guy hit me.
I went through the yellow light.
He was like 65 miles per hour,he was in the coma and
everything.
I don't know what happened tothe guys still to this day, but
they were trying to charge mevehicular assault and then,
because he was in coma, theywere also going to try and
charge me for a vehicularhomicide.
And I'm like dude, he hit me,like how are we switching this

(17:07):
up?
So my junior year, sophomore,junior year of college, I was at
school faced with a potentialof going to jail, something I
didn't do.
And I remember going up toToledo and that's where I
started working on.
This stuff can't close.
That's how I had my opportunityto play with Child, with the
Steelers, yeah, up there.
And I just remember one day Iwas just praying and stuff, but

(17:29):
woke up early in the morning andGod told me he reminded me
certain things I needed to do.
And then it was always thatreminder of when I was eight.
And then I finally went backhome to a home church and then
got in the ministry and Justhere we are.
You know, I'm to give you, Igave you the really good quick
short.
No, that was good detail, I gotyou hit all you hit the bullet

(17:51):
points.
All right, you hit the bulletpoints.

Speaker 1 (17:53):
So just to recap you, you were introduced to God
Jesus early on, you had a goodconnection there and then at a
certain point you decided thatthat wasn't, that wasn't going
to serve you, and you were goingto do it your way.
That sounds like a child tryingto leave their father's home.
All right, that just sounds likea normal thing that kids do.
And then you were faced withsome adversity.

(18:14):
You ended up Having a vehicleaccident, ended up ending up in
an out-of-body experience, neardeath experience however you
want to describe it or label itprofound and then you come out
of that and then you reallyfocused on living, living for
Christ.
And then, ever since then,you've just been on that journey
of living for Christ and SinceI've met you a couple years ago,

(18:36):
you've even improved in thataspect of just living for Christ
because, um, just from myexperience, just even your
outreach and your ability tooutreach, um, you know new area
and things like that you have tolearn, like the culture of the
people and stuff like that.
And and, uh, yeah, I've justseen you grow in that way too,
man, so it's been really cool towatch and that's one of the
things that kind of drew me toyou is like you went out of your

(18:59):
way and you just like, hey, man, let's talk for a second, like
we were just hanging out in thecoffee shop and you're like,
you're interesting, let's talk.
And so we stepped outside thefront of the coffee shop.
I think we stood there for likean hour and a half, first time
we ever like really had aconversation.

Speaker 2 (19:11):
It is my an honest my hour and a half, because I
think it was.
I was supposed to be going myway to work or something like
that.
I was supposed to be as well.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
I was supposed to be on my way as work as well, and I
was late that day.
Yeah, um, but, um, yeah, Iremember that stuff, man,
because, uh, it's like myexperience with with god is is
vastly different.
My experience with god is likeI felt abused by, by like
christianity.
When I was younger.
I felt I felt like it was usedas a hammer and I think that,

(19:40):
growing up in the south, I thinkthat that's just kind of how
people use christianity and Idon't think it's on purpose.
I don't think there's anythingInherently wrong.
I think people are reallytrying to do their best.
But, as a kid, the view thingsthe way that I did, you know I
lost my mom early on.
You know I had a lot of grief,a lot of heartache.
There was a lot of things in mylife that, just like man, I
remember telling my, my sister,one time this is wild Um, we

(20:04):
were sitting, I was hurt, man,and we were sitting out, we're
in the backyard, we were playing, we're doing stuff.
I was like maybe like 10 yearsold Um, that would mean she was
like nine and we were justplaying and she said something
and I was really upset.
I was just had so much vinegarin me.
I was just angry and she saidsomething about Um being perfect

(20:24):
and I turned around, snap backat her, said nobody's perfect,
not even god and I'm like I justcan't even believe that I said
things like that, you know.
But and then I realized that,like after that, I felt really
guilty for saying things likethat because I didn't know, I
wasn't sure, I was just in painand I was hurting, and and so I
used those ideas right to guidemyself.

(20:46):
So we my dad, would take us tochurch sometimes, but the
churches that we went to therewas never really any ministry
towards the children.
It was just like keep them busywhile we talk about grown-up
shit, and that's kind of how itwas.
And then one time we had thispastor at the church so we went
to I can't remember his name, uh, I wish I could, but it was.
He ended up being a cup cupmaster, cup scout master, for

(21:09):
Boy Scouts too, so he brought atroop to the church and so that
actually got me More involved inthe church.
But it was really just becauseI wanted to do like camping.
Never, never did any camps but,I was only in for like a couple
of months Maybe, you know, maybesix months, because you know
the money was tight and thosethings cost money and my dad
really couldn't afford thosethings.

(21:30):
But but yeah, growing up it wasa really tough experience for
me Having those things, becauseI didn't have a lot of positive
to come out of that, because theonly time I'd ever really been
To church was to deal with pain,um and like when my mom passed
away.
My dad, see, I wasn't around mydad's family a whole lot before
my mom passed.
Well, I didn't really know whothey were, be honest with you.
But then after my mom passedaway, all the sudden around all

(21:51):
these new people going to churchand doing all this stuff.
It was just so uncomfortableand everybody's like all giving
me pity and stuff like that.
I didn't want any of it, I justwanted to be in pain.
I guess I don't really know thebest way to say it, but I spent
a lot of time just searchingFor what I don't know, but I
couldn't find it.
And so I Go up on through life,really never really giving much

(22:14):
consideration to God.
I just had no determination.
I never said God's not real,not at this point.
Anyways, I did eventually saythat.
But I never really believed it.
I just wanted that to be truebecause then that would make
sense for why I was in so muchpain.
That was how I justified it.
But going all through teenageyears, going through all these
hard things and you know,thankfully there was people

(22:34):
along the way that really,really really looked out for me
um, some friends, parents I I'mblessing to to have had the
friends that I had, because thecharacter of those people their
parents are the ones that alsocared for me.
So I remember one time I had afriend's parent Let me move in
to their house While my friendwas away at school, and so like,

(22:58):
just again along the way,little bits and little
information, little things andthat, but it was never really
Based around anything other thanjust good natured people.
And then I grow up, I startworking, I start getting around
people a lot of, a lot ofhoodlums, let's just let's just
call them hoodlums, people thatare just into nefarious things
and stuff like that.
And stuff was fun, not a lot toit was fun.
It was a lot of fun.

(23:19):
And I had a lot of really goodexperiences and I had a lot of
lessons learned from that and Iwouldn't have traded any of that
for the world because it givesme the perspective I have now.
But foolish is all get outFoolish.

Speaker 2 (23:31):
You say it was fun, like yeah, we got in fights.
That was fun to me.
Yeah, it was.

Speaker 1 (23:36):
But, and you know, and I, I, really, as a teenager,
I started drinking heavilythough you know I just started
really drinking because that wasthe cultural, cultural okay
thing to do, um, and at least ifI was drinking I could hide it
around everybody else becauseeverybody else was drinking.
And so I relied on that for avery long time to ease pain.
And then growing up, and then Istarted having kids and all

(23:58):
this stuff and I had no guidance.
Man, my dad, bless his heart,he tried, he gave his best
effort to raise me, but I'm adifferent child than what he was
probably prepared for, and somy dad did his best, but I was
adamant on being againsteverything that that man was
about and um, and so again, noguidance, going out in life,

(24:21):
having kids, going through allof these things, just really
questioning everything.
And then I would haveconversations with people at
jobs and stuff like that, and Imet a lot of agnostic people, a
lot of atheists, a lot of, and Ifound good people in all of
those titles and so I was likewhat the hell this doesn't like
if god is real, if god isn'treal, whatever, then how come I
can see this person as a goodperson, but they're not somebody

(24:43):
that follows god and you know?
Just a lot of questions.
And then I've been Just despairthrough my whole life.
And then, slowly but surely, asI start reading things and I
start understanding psychologyand I start paying attention to
the way the human mind works andall this stuff, and I start
realizing that, damn, we're in atrap here and there's got to be

(25:06):
a way out of this trap.
And I spent years searching forpeace, trying to get out of
that trap, and then, you know,the last probably four or five
years, god has been a Focus ofconversation.
Now I can't say that five yearsago that I believed in god.
I don't know that I did ordidn't, but I'd certainly was.
Considering the idea of.

(25:27):
That might be the best way todeal with this.
Yeah and so, slowly but surely,god started putting more.
I think god started puttingmore people around me.
You know, and david, like whenhe was on the podcast, he he had
a very negative experiencegrowing up with religion too.
He grew up in uh and some sortof cult or something like that,
right, so we would share ournegative experiences with
religion.
But even while we were talkingabout these things, just because

(25:50):
the people that were operatingNegatively with these things, it
didn't make those things nottrue to me.
So I I could separate thethings, but I couldn't
understand how people could usethat if it's supposed to be holy
, it's supposed to be good, anduse that against somebody.
Just never really connected tome and I realized we're, we're
faulted people.
Um, but yeah, and then the last, probably like Three years or

(26:12):
so, I actually been around.
Chastity was a big deal for mebecause she never missed a point
to say god wants you to think.
You know, she never missed apoint to bring it up and I
appreciate her for that, becauseat first I scoffed at it.
I scoffed at it, but I'm gonnatell you the reason why I
listened to chastity, the reasonwhy I ever really gave any Real
consideration of that isbecause the first day that I

(26:35):
ever went into the dang coffeeshop I smelled those waffles.
Bro, I Still miss those wafflesbut I smelled those waffles.

Speaker 2 (26:44):
We're gonna have to do something.
I say, hey, I'm gonna have tojust do like a community day,
yeah, and I was just I was in apissy mood.

Speaker 1 (26:51):
man, I was just in a pissy mood and they served me
with the most grace that anyonehad ever Served me with that
kind of attitude.
Hang on, I'm gonna let the dogout real fast.

Speaker 2 (26:59):
Yeah, I know this guy over here like yeah, I need to.

Speaker 1 (27:18):
Sorry, that's quick pause, anyway.
So chastity, you know theystart her and Dave her husband,
they, uh, they served me up andman, that moved me because they
didn't have to treat me that way.
They asked me how the food was,asked me all this stuff like
that.
They were really they saw thatI was dealing with some, some
stuff and then Slowly but surelyjust started showing back up

(27:38):
that waffles is what brought meback bro Then waffles brought me
back.
And so I just kept showing upand then we developed a
friendship because I, you know,going up to the coffee shop and
things like that, and she, shewas never ashamed of it and I
admired that and for a while Iwas.
I would push back on a lot ofthe things that she said, and

(28:00):
not because I disagreed with her, but because I just wanted to
challenge what she thought sheknew, and sometimes the
challenges were valuable becauseI think that expanded her
perspective on that too, as wellas mine, which is why I kept
doing it, because I kept growingin knowledge and faith and
stuff like that, and so it wasreally cool to have those
experiences.
And then, you know, meetingpeople like you have met a lot

(28:21):
of people, actually most of thepeople that have been guests on
the podcast I met at the coffeeshop.
So, paul, uh, uh, yeah, there'sbeen a, there's been several
people, so, anyways, but yeah,so my path to to this is it's
been a long drip, and so when Iwas a kid, I felt misplaced, I

(28:42):
felt out of place, and then, asthrough life, I felt out of
place.
But the last couple years Ireally started to find my place
and I think a lot of that has todo with me Really developing.
I don't even say developing, Ithink uncovering the
relationship that was alreadythere, because I think that you
used to have to Develop it.
But now my understanding isn'tthat you develop it, it's always

(29:02):
there, it's just let's washaway the dirt, let's wash away
the grime, let's start gettingrid of some of these things to
let the light that is alreadythere shine through, and having
that perspective has made itmuch easier to transition into
being able to have a healthyrelationship.
I want to say healthyrelationship because, I didn't
have a healthy one, yeah, but ahealthy relationship with uh,

(29:23):
with god and a lot of people maycall it by different names or
whatever um in regards to, butin in all my view, it's just All
being like the, the whole thing.
It doesn't no shape, no form,it's, it's all of it, and so
Uncovering that relationship hasmade me more connected with the

(29:43):
people around me.
It's made me more connectedwith the things that I do.
It's made me really appreciateall of the hard shit that I had
to go through, because I don'thave to go through it no more,
not the same way anyways and somy point to get here was just
vastly different.
But I've always been a talker.
I've always felt the need tohelp, I've always felt called Um

(30:04):
, because anytime somebody askedme, anytime anybody needed a
ear or hand, I was that guy.
I was the guy to listen, I wasthe guy to talk, I was the guy
to give advice, and Somehow Igave good advice, with no
experience, and I just I neverreally understood how, until
like started going to biblestudy with uh, with you, you
know You're doing the biblestudy at your house and inviting

(30:24):
me over, which the first time Iwas really worried not worried,
I was scared.
I was scared of judgment, I wasscared of I Don't know.
I don't know what I was scaredof, honestly, just uncertainty,
and but then, in going throughthe lessons and things like that
and understanding differentthings, like it's just all Built
and it just continues to do soand I'm Going through hard stuff

(30:46):
in my life, but I'm more atpeace in life, which is the only
thing that I ever, ever wantedwas to be able to deal with all
the hard shit in my life withgrace, honestly, and I think
that I'm getting closer to thatpoint.
Not that I do it perfectly, but,um, yeah, no, it's.
It's been a it's been a wildride to get here, but it's
interesting because it did bringus together.

(31:07):
I, you know you, moved to texasin 2018.
I actually moved out of texasin 2018 and I moved back two
years later Wait where'd youmove to?
I moved to pennsylvania.

Speaker 2 (31:18):
We're not weird pennsylvania.

Speaker 1 (31:19):
I moved to mccongee, pennsylvania.

Speaker 2 (31:21):
Ain't that why pigs bird?
No, I was on the other side ofthe state.
I was on the other side of thestate.

Speaker 1 (31:24):
No, I was on the other side of the state, bro, I
was.

Speaker 2 (31:27):
I was closer to new jersey.

Speaker 3 (31:29):
I was closer to philly, yeah, so we were on like
all in town.

Speaker 1 (31:35):
Yeah, so and and so here we are, 30 minutes in, you
know, giving a little brief ongod or whatever, but the whole
reason that I wanted to talk toyou and bring you here is
because there's a very specifictopic that I think a lot of
people deal with I've dealt withbecause I'm an addict.
I've had Issues in my life withsobriety, I've had issues with
just even like food, like I'vebeen a food addict.

(31:58):
I've been Whatever.
Whatever can ease any littlebit of pain.
I'm trying it, you know,because I was just always felt
in so much pain and I wantedrelief of life.
And so the point I got somepoint of one point trying to
commit suicide and I think thatthat's really when things really
changed for me is because Idied that day.
I was like I was, I gave up, Iwas over with, it was over with

(32:20):
and I ended up at the hospital.
Don't remember it, don't?
I remember being really ashamedstanding at the at the uh, the
check-in at the emergency roomand they asked me what I was
there for.
I said I need help and he saidwith what?
And I just I didn't know whatto say and I was like I wanna
kill myself.
And they're like, oh, like they, you know, it was a.

(32:43):
It was a.
It was Bonham, texas, it wascountry country hospital, right,
but things changed after that.
Things changed for me becausethen I started trying to take my
mental health serious, Istarted really trying to get
better and so.
But what I've identified in allof that and the thing, the
reason why I wanted to talk toyou, is because I think the
thing that people are scared todeal with is the fear Like what?

(33:03):
What is the fear?
Right?
And so like this whole idea offear and things that we're
scared of and all that, and sothat was why I wanted to talk to
you.
So you have, in your experienceand you know, the car wreck and
you know not getting thecollege scholarships and doing
all of these things right, I gota college scholarship.

Speaker 2 (33:20):
It was the NFL.
Okay, yeah, and then-.

Speaker 1 (33:25):
Well, I just remember you saying you lost some
scholarships and things likethat.
Yeah, yeah yeah, so, butthrough all of those journeys,
the battles of fear, man, whatwas that for you?
So what do you think of fear?
What do you think of fearthrough all of that, all of your
experience?
What is your assessment of?

Speaker 2 (33:42):
it.
So the one thing I think fearcontrols a lot of the world's
aspect and stuff.
Right, and you said somethingearlier and I know we've talked
about it before but where it'slike, where we've done wrong and
that's the body of Christ iswe've tried to scare people into

(34:03):
trying to have a relationshipwith God, or is that, if that's
what you're going to call, thatwe try to scare people into
coming into the faith?
Right, and we use all these,you know, fire and brimstone
messages and I'm like, yeah,that's cool.
But the Bible also says inRomans two, four and I'll just
give you the fourth part of itit says the goodness of the Lord

(34:24):
brings man into repentance.
So it's by the goodness of Godthat brought me to where I was
at.
It wasn't that I was.
I mean, yeah, I was scared whenI finally knew I was about to
go to hell.
Right, but it was His goodnessthat brought me to repentance.
Right, and I think sometimes,because fear is controlling a

(34:46):
lot of our lives, right, in allaspects, everybody deals with it
.
And then it's just how you dealwith it, or how you control it.
I'm gonna say, control it justhow you process it, and then
your way, how you process it ishow you react.
And I think fear is ineverything.
But then, at the same time, howI give the verse and then I'll

(35:08):
tell you how I deal with it isis the Bible says that God does
not give us a spirit of fear.
So, and the reason why I sayit's controlled, like the
world's controlled, because it'sa spirit, it's a spirit that's
all through the world.
And so if we know that God saysthat God does not give you the
spirit of fear, but of love,power and it was sound mind,
well then why would I take onsomething that he never meant
for me to have in the firstplace?

(35:30):
Why do I need to have that?
And I always go back to thepoint of hey, when I was made, I
was made in God's image.
And then songs 139, I'm talkingabout how we were wonderfully
made right.
So he wonderfully made me, hemade all of us beautifully right
.
And then, of course since we'renot gonna try and go through a
preaching sermon point right now, but the point of it is that

(35:53):
that's something that we don'thave to have, right, we don't
have to take it.
And so then the next step comesin.
Well, how do you deal with it?
Right, if you know it's not you, then what does that mean?
Well, don't accept it, right?
And so some of the things thatI've done that I was scared of,
and the way that I overcame them, I just faced it Like I just

(36:14):
took it head on, because I wasjust like I don't want this
thing to control me, becausewhat ends up happening is that
spirit ends up having controlover you, right?
And then this fear creates allthis different hate and stuff.
Like when you think about howracism came about.
Somebody was scared ofsomething because of somebody's
color.
Because they saw how they weredoing it, they thought, well,

(36:34):
we're gonna be extinct here.
You know what I mean.
Let's create this here raceagainst these different type of
people or just type of culture,and so just my thing is just
face it head on, right.
So it's how I did it.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
So like you and your dog, Finn right, you said that
you had a fear of dogs right.

Speaker 2 (36:58):
You used to have a fear of dogs.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
So tell me about that .

Speaker 2 (37:02):
All right, so I'll give you two fears One I have a
master and one I finally is like, let me just deal with it.
So and I told y'all I faced it.
So one of them is I'm scared ofrats and mice.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
That's a reasonable thing to be a little bit
terrified of because they'recreepy.

Speaker 2 (37:17):
No, bro, like I will freak out, Like jump on the
counter, yeah, I will run outthe house.
Like it's so funny, like iffellas in the truck they brought
a grab and like all right guys,y'all, y'all.
So but with like Finn, like Ihad a scared thing of dogs and
growing up always kind of hassome fear of dogs.
But if it was my dog I was coolwith it because I raised it and

(37:39):
it was funny because I had somefriends that were just we just
mean.
We're gonna call it what it is.
Kids sometimes were mean and soyou didn't know if they were
trained a dog and it would playwith you to kind of come and
attack you and really the dogwas just barking because I
wanted to play with you becauseit's puppy, right.
And so I just remember I hadthis big phobia with dogs.
I remember one time, man it wasrecent too that I literally

(38:02):
almost had like a somewhat panicattack.
Man, I was breathing heavy.
I was like, oh my God, man, Idon't know if I could do this.
And then my cousin, man, youneed to get yourself together.
Like I'm trying, man, but Ican't take it right.
And then what finally said man,I can't do this, no more.
Is when I saw my son realscared of dogs, he was frozen,
he couldn't move.
And I'm like and when I sawthat I got to be tough now for

(38:25):
my son, Like, if this is dad, Iprotect you.
And I was like, man, I can'thave him have the same fear I
have.
We got to get over it.
I got to get over it.
And so I remember talking tobuddies of mine that I was gonna
try to get it a massive oh geez, I wanna.

Speaker 3 (38:39):
I don't want a little dog, I want a big dog, Like if
here's my thing.

Speaker 2 (38:42):
If I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna try and do it, big man
.
So I'm just gonna get it allthe way out the way.
I don't need to ease me intonothing, throw me into 12 feet,
we'll figure it out.
And so we ended up getting awayto get finned and somehow, like
, my fears of dogs finally wentaway.
Like as a kid I wasn't, I wasscared, but if I had my dog I

(39:02):
was cool with it, right.
And then it was like then itwas like when I got a lizard
because we had a lizard then itwas like I got terrified of dogs
and I couldn't do like I can'ttrust you dog, I don't know you
right.
And then when I finally gotfinned, I was like, man, we
could do this.
And then just somehow, stuffjust started, naturally, just
went away, right.
And then I saw my son.
It took him day and a half.

(39:23):
He was no longer scared of thedogs, he was taken, finned by
the collar and going around thehouse and walking.
And I was like so that's how Ijust dealt with it, I just got
it, I faced it, you know, andsometimes that's what we have to
do.
We have to face our fears.
Because here's the thing aboutfear.
Right, we fear the unknown, wefear the thing that we imagine

(39:45):
was gonna happen.
Right?
People look at the dog.
They see teeth, and let me tellyou what fin is a lab and a pit
bull mix right.
And some of the moment you say,pit bull, oh my God, it's a
killer dog, right.
And so we just faced it.
And when you find out it's notas bad as you think it is, then

(40:05):
you can deal with it.
But it's that false perceptionof things that makes sense.
I think that's where a lot ofpeople get stuck, because we've
created things in our minds orwe just fed into the fear so
much that it created this bigger.
I don't wanna say to wherefictitious, because some stuff
is real, but we've created itbigger than what it needed to be

(40:28):
.

Speaker 1 (40:28):
Yeah, I think the way that I view fear.
So, like, I have a very simpleview on fear, right, my view is
there's two emotions, that's it.
There's only two existingemotions, and everything else
roots from those.
There's love and lack of love,right?
Lack of love we call fear.
And so, in my perspective, ifyou're operating from a place of
fear, there's no love there,right?

(40:48):
And so in those moments andthose times where I'm fearful, I
have to ask myself, like, am Ioperating from love or fear here
?
Am I operating from feelinglove, feeling full, or am I
operating from feeling depleted,scared, worried, like I don't
know, I'm not gonna get food orwhatever, right?
And so that perspective, thatsimple, simple perspective, has

(41:09):
changed the whole thing for me.
With fear, because I grew upscared of everything, man.
And look, I didn't have comfortgrowing up.
I didn't have security, Ididn't have those things.
I was scared, dude.
I was scared that I wasn't evengonna survive.
Now, through my teenage years,I thought I was invincible, but
that was a delusion.
It wasn't that I actuallythought I was invincible.

(41:29):
I think I had more of a deathwish, kind of like let this take
me out, god, what am I gonnalet me get out that easy, bro.
I was gonna have to go throughsome stuff.
So I think that there's just alot of misconceptions with fear
and I think people use fear tohandicap themselves.
And I don't think it's onpurpose, I don't think people
choose to do that, but once youget in that trap, that's a hard

(41:49):
one to get out of and it's likehow do you get out of that trap
of fear, of being scared ofthings of, like you were talking
about the dog man I had?
I don't like I was scared ofcats for a while because my
uncle used to have a cat and mysister used to have a cat and
they were both vicious, vicious,vicious creatures to me and I
didn't even do nothing to them.
Maybe I did, I don't remember,but they were vicious to me.
I'm innocent, I'm a child, okay,but I had this fear of cats and

(42:12):
then on through life, like Iwould, really I would test my
fear against like dude, I woulddrive reckless in cars, I would
do stupid shit on bikes, allkinds of crazies.
I was fearless with that stuff.
But then, like dealing withsomebody or having a
conversation about something, Ididn't like I was so scared of
those things.
I was so scared of judgment, Iwas so scared that I wouldn't be

(42:34):
accepted.
I was so scared again ofeverything.
And so, having the perspectivechange of like okay, with this
person.
If I'm scared of this person,if I have anxiety or whatever,
I'm scared of this person,that's right here in front of me
.
If I'm scared, what am I reallyactually scared of?
Well, maybe those things arelegitimate, but the thing is,
like you said, it's notsomething that we have to have.

(42:56):
And so then I just asked myself,like, how do I deal with this
with love instead of fear?
Because even if I do have thetrepidation, the fear, the
things that are like inside ofme, I don't have to like hang on
to that.
I'm not gonna say ignore it,because you do gotta deal with
it, because if not, like youjust move in on past it and it's

(43:17):
not a thing that's actuallygonna be helpful, but letting it
linger, because the fear onlyserves as a lesson.
But if you hang on to it, it'snot a lesson, it's suffering,
all right, and I think that Iwas just so tired of suffering
and I just wanted to find outhow to quit suffering.
So I'd started praying, startedasking God and all this stuff.
I just started trying to finddifferent ways to not be scared

(43:40):
because, like I said, I'm just ascared person and so, taking
that view and then really tryingto apply it to different things
, I really try to find the holesin it.
But again, it's so simple, it'sreally hard to find holes in it
.
And I wonder what yourperspective is on the whole fear
thing, like just from what Isaid, with the love and lack of

(44:01):
love, what you think about thatFrom the biblical perspective,
you being a preacher man and all.

Speaker 2 (44:06):
So perfect love casts out all fear right.
And when you're saying likejust the lack of love and the
one thing I was probably gonnaadd to fear was like fear also
can be like an emotion orsomething too right, like a
warning sign.

(44:26):
Definitely, it's definitely anindicator it definitely Like
something's going on right and Ithink, one of the things I like
when you say you're let's dealwith the holes of it.
So, when we're looking atcertain fears like, or like
things that we love, like wegotta really look at it.
Like, like you were saying,what is it that's causing me not

(44:47):
to move forward?
Right, let's break it down,like, because when we look at
fear, you gotta look at it.
Is it a thing?
Is it me succeeding?
Like there's so many differentbroad perspectives that it can
bring it to the table, and if Iand then let's I don't know
which one you wanna go down oryou want me to pick Whatever man

(45:09):
, so, like, if we look at itfrom a perspective of us
successful, right, let's.
I think that's the biggest fearthat people have of, maybe why
they don't start a businessright, or maybe why they don't
talk to that girl or that guythat they like because, they're
scared of the rejection pieceright, or I don't know if I

(45:31):
should get this thing becauseI'm scared of indecisive, I
don't know if I'm gonna make theright choice, right, and so
then that's where that comesback into that love piece, like
if, when you love God, god thenshows you and his relationship
of who you are right, and soit's just really identifying who
you are as a person and knowingwho you are.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
Yeah, so if you're so , like if to start the business
or to talk to the girl orwhatever, the fear, what would
the fear be serving at thatpoint?
Right, so like, is it tangible?
Is it tangible fear, or is itlike the indicator that what
it's telling you is it something?

(46:11):
Is it telling you somethingtangible or is it just bullshit?
I guess would be the simplestway for me to ask.

Speaker 2 (46:21):
So I would think anything that wants you to be
successful, of course you havethe antagonist.
What's the enemy?
It's not gonna want you to moveforward in doing it, and that's
that rejection or that failurepiece.
And so I think that's a lot ofthe fear that you gotta deal
with.
Like, for example, man, like,if, like, I'll just use this

(46:41):
here in the industry piece, I'lluse me, I mean, I think I'm the
best example to talk about it.
Right, everybody has a fear,and my biggest fear was and let
me go back because fear isactually also implanted in us
too Like, think about it, whenwe were kids or babies, there

(47:02):
was only a few things that wewere scared of because it was an
unknown, but then there wascertain stuff that was planted
in us.

Speaker 1 (47:07):
There's, like I remember I know there was a
study or a test done with kidsin heights Like kids will not
crawl off the edge of a table,like they won't just keep going,
they stop, like almost everytime, and I don't remember I
took it to some psychology class, but it was a study that we had
to go through to, where itidentified the way kids like

(47:28):
there's just an inherent no,that that's programmed, like
don't do that.
So at what point, though, doesthat fear though, no longer be
the lesson?
Because at what point is itlike oh, I'm not scared of that,
it's just I'm not gonna do that.

Speaker 2 (47:43):
Yeah, that's where I think the majority piece comes
in.
To know like, hey, you know, isthis really gonna be good for
me?
Because, like the B-Skier infront of a gun is a valid fear,
because you can lose your life,right.

Speaker 1 (48:01):
Well, I'll push back against that.
I'll push back against thatbecause I would say, if you're
fearful in that moment, you'regonna make a bad choice.
I'm not saying that it's not.
You can't be aware, like youcan be aware, that that gun's
going to kill me, but you don'thave to be scared that that
gun's going to kill you, right?

(48:22):
You don't have to be fearful ofthat, because I think that that
fear, anytime we're in thatemotional state, obviously
you're not gonna be happy there,it's like, unless you're asking
for it, but I think that thatemotional state that you get in
get you out of line withcorrectness or righteousness or
the light or whatever.
And so if that fear exists, evenif somebody is standing point

(48:43):
blank right With a gun in yourhead or whatever, I think that
the best way to deal with thatis to not be scared, to have
faith in something larger thanwhat's going on there, and I
don't know any other way toarticulate that other than God.
So, but if I'm standing thereand somebody is pointing a gun
at me and I'm scared, I'm notgoing to make the best decision

(49:08):
to keep me alive.
I'm just not.
I'm gonna make a fearfuldecision to protect myself, but
that still may not be the rightthing.
Now, I'm not saying it's athing that you can do or that
anyone can do, but we've seen ithappen.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (49:22):
You know what I mean?
Yeah, and I was just using ittrying as an example, not saying
like you know what I mean.
Man, maybe lose my train ofthought.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
Well, it's well, haven't so having the fear of
somebody shooting you?
Right, and it's a legitimatefear.
It's not illegitimate.
Yeah, that's what it islegitimate.

Speaker 2 (49:38):
And I think back to your point too is again go set
an identity piece like right,you know who God is right.
So there's times I had guns andstuff put on me.

Speaker 1 (49:50):
And Me too.
This is me too.

Speaker 2 (49:51):
This would be like before I say it was let's do it,
bro.

Speaker 1 (49:55):
Like let's go.
You know what I?

Speaker 2 (49:56):
mean you just crazy and stupid.
And I was like, well, you don'tcontrol, have control of power
of my life.
Now, like I remember just gotout the car accident man, we was
out and this one dude wastalking about he's gonna go pop
the trunk to kill me, and I gotmad and I was just like, well,
first of all, bro, you don'teven control, you don't have to.

(50:17):
Your, my life is not in yourhands, my life is in God's hand,
and if it's my time to go, cool, but you don't say when it's
time to go, he does.
You know so.
But then that goes back to thatpart of knowing who you are
right.
And so if we're looking at froma Christian standpoint or a
biblical standpoint, you have toknow who you are in Christ.
When you know who you are inChrist, then you'll realize like
, hey, I don't really have totake this fear right, all my

(50:39):
fear fears are gone or beingcast away because guess what,
I'm in.
So love with God, that I don'thave a fear that I can't be
successful, right.
And so when we think about whenno one all right, is this the
thing to do or not?
Like if God has placed an ideain there from you, right, all
ideas are birthed from God.
Like that's gonna help you besuccessful let's put it like

(50:59):
that Then that's coming from God, because there's something that
he has placed inside of youthat he's trying to get you to
use.
It's the gift right.
And we talked about, I think inBible.
We talked about the man withthe five talents, the two
talents and the one right.
So the man that had the fivetalents multiplied it and got 10
, the one with two multiplied itand got four.
But the one that had one talent, he was so scared that he hid

(51:24):
it.
And then, when Christ came back, he said you, wicked and
slothful servant, though youhave a whip and a gas on the
teeth, is because sometimeswe're scared to step out and use
that gift that God's given usand it goes back to that point
where I was talking about likesome stuff can be imputed into
you, right, and I was gonna usemy example like a parent or a

(51:49):
role model or a guardian is socrucial for a child because they
look up to that individual togive them the encouraging words
or to help them with life.
And then if you plant negativeseeds, like hey man, that may
not be good enough for you, oryou're not gonna make it.

Speaker 1 (52:06):
It starts to build a lot of doubt.

Speaker 2 (52:08):
So then there it is.
It comes that doubt right, itcomes that that's a part of fear
just doubting right, and sowhen there's doubting, there's
no faith, and doubting faithcan't mix.
So you don't have faith, not inGod, you don't even have faith
in yourself, and then you'reslapping God in the face because
, to give you place inside ofyou, you don't even believe that
it could be profitable right.

(52:30):
And so then you're like almostno good to anybody.
So then it's kind of nautistic.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
That seems kind of nautistic, like kind of like
well, none of this matters.
That's kind of what that startsto feel like.
Yeah, and you're just numb.

Speaker 2 (52:46):
You, just like you, become a robot or a zombie.
What they per se nowadays Likeyou're just a zombie, you're
just going through the motions,but we're all here to serve a
greater purpose.
So once you know who you areand you have your identity, you
know that's a good gift.
Well then, everything that Godis a yes and a amen.
It's a green light.
It's a green light until hedoes something or he shuts the

(53:06):
door, and that's for yourprotection.

Speaker 1 (53:08):
And that door only changes your direction.
It's not even that door closingonly changes your direction.
It doesn't stop you.

Speaker 2 (53:15):
Yeah, it's not saying all you're done is just saying
hey, you're not going that way,like don't go this way, I got
another way for you.
Like just, and I'll go back tome, like, so one of my biggest
things, where it even came justwith ministry, where it came
with football, where it camethrough talking with people, is
because there was some negativeseeds that were planted in me

(53:37):
where it was saying hey, man, Idon't think you're good enough.
And so then I would questionmyself well, I only could go,
but so far, because that may betoo good, I'm good with it, I
should be satisfied.
A second or third place, don'tworry about be number one.
But then there's another partof me that says, nah, man, I
don't want that, I don't want tobe number one.
Yeah, see, yeah.
And then so the way that you dothat.

(53:58):
And then there's plenty in likeI love hearing people's success
stories, like when I thinkabout a Dion and I even say this
guy's name because he was he'son Netflix Paul, I can't think
of anything like Paul Ruff,whatever the YouTube or that was
boxing all these people, Ithink about Jake Paul.
Jake Paul there it is.
I think about him, I thinkabout Arnold Schwarzenegger.
Like at least a lot ofsuccessful people's, they all

(54:21):
had to deal with some of thatfear, right?
And so you have a choicewhether you're going to be
succumbed by that fear or you'rejust going to push through it.
You know what I mean, and sowhen I look at those people's, I
love hearing their overcomingstories.
Right, and God's called us toall to be overcomers, but you
can't overcome something if youdon't have an obstacle in the
way.
And so when we're looking atthese different things, like, do

(54:45):
I trust God enough?
Do I trust the Christ in me?
Do I love God enough let's say,you do like that Do I love God
enough to know that he's goingto be with me to get through
this?
When we're talking about himbeing our shepherd, he's like
the shepherd, if you look atPsalm 23,.
He's in front of us, he'sbehind us, he's surrounding us,
he's the omnipresent God.
Right?
Do I have enough love than Godto say, hey, man, he's going to

(55:05):
walk me through this heresituation, he's going to get me
through it, right?
So when you think about thosethings, man, like that's where
it comes back to.
And then that's where we're ina one point where I'm saying
like it's affecting, like thiswhole world, is because there is
an absence of a personalrelationship with Christ.

(55:26):
Because once you have thatpersonal relationship with
Christ, he then tells you whoyou are, right.
He then starts guiding you, man,and when I'm saying like a
parent and a guardian is soimportant, because guess what?
That's what a guardian issupposed to do with their child,
or their parent does with theirchild.
They lead them up, show them,guide them into life, and but
then, if they're not there, evenif they're there, god does that

(55:48):
for you too.
So it's just really one ofthose things like who's reports
you're going to believe.
Like you're going to believeyour report.
You're going to believe God'sreport.
Are you going to take that step?

Speaker 1 (56:00):
Yeah, I think that if you assess like, do I trust
myself enough to make that call?
I think the answer is always no.
Like it's like because we'refoolish in this world.
Like man, I'll go buy acheeseburger at midnight, bro,
it's not the smart choice, right, because I know my digestive
system doesn't work that wellwhen I'm trying to like.
Like logic will apply there.

(56:20):
So, like, if I know I'll makethat stupid choice, what other
stupid choices am I making thatI don't know that I'll make?
Yeah, so it's really.
It becomes really difficult totrust that I know that I'm
making the right choice, unlessyou give that guidance, like you
allow yourself to be helped orlike you put it out there and
forgot.
And so you brought up somethingabout a couple of sports

(56:43):
athletes, and I wanted to bringup two specific people, because
I started reading this bookcalled Winning, but it's Kobe
Bryant and Michael Jordan, andso I'm really fascinated with
the mind of these two specificindividuals others as well, but
specifically these two becausethey have the same trainer, they
had the same trainer and what Ilike about it is like the fear

(57:03):
part of it.
It's like what I liked aboutKobe called it the Mamba
mentality.
Right.
In all reality, it was just acomplete dispelling of fear.
It was just like, no matterwhat's going on, I'm doing this,
no matter how bad, how hard,how much it hurts, I'm doing it.
And being that committed tosomething I always wanted to
understand how can someone be socommitted, regardless of their

(57:28):
circumstances, how can someonefight through a torn quad and
still play a full game withouteven limping?
How can someone do that?
No clue, like, how are you evenable to do that?
But he did it, kobe did it.
You know Kobe would show a cutand the thing is is like you
obviously gotta know when torest, you gotta know your body

(57:50):
will?
You gotta know these things andyou gotta know how far you can
push yourself.
But I think it's reallyimportant to understand that the
dispelling of fear, the abilityto push through something that
seems terrible, that sucks orwhatever, but to get on the
other side of it and to knowthat you withstood that and
you're fine, all right.
And I really admire people thatare able to do that.

(58:11):
I really admire people that areable to put aside their little
bullshit problems and to be ableto accomplish something greater
.
And I think about things likethat because I wanna let me be
clear.
I don't like attention.
I've always been scared ofattention.
I've always been scared of theresponsibility of attention, but
I've always done things thatalways garnered me some sort of

(58:33):
attention, and then I shell upas soon as that attention is
garnered.
And so I've always been put inpositions to gain attention, and
I've never wanted it.
I've always been so like getaway from me, I'm just gonna go
high for a little bit till theattention goes away, and then
I'll start doing something againand thinking about Kobe,
thinking about Michael Jordan.

Speaker 2 (58:57):
How could I?

Speaker 1 (58:58):
have dealt with that attention, because everybody's
looking at them, the whole worldis looking at them and they're
still out there gritting it.
They're still running theirmouth, they're still out there.
And then you talked aboutwinning or coming in second.
I should be happy to.
I think, the most importantthing that one has to ask
himself did I do everything thatI possibly could do?

(59:19):
Did I keep my word to myself?
Did I keep my word to God?
Did I do everything that Ipromised that I would do to
accomplish what I said I wasgoing to accomplish?
And if you haven't, you'rescared.
You're scared, but what are youscared of?
Why are you still holding ontothat fear?
And I think that that'ssomething that I think about a
lot, because having to overcomeaddictions and things like that,

(59:40):
what am I scared of?
Why am I holding onto this?
Well, I'm scared that I won'thave a way through it.
I'm scared that I won't knowwhat to do.
I'm scared that I won't haveguidance.
I'm scared that I won't knowwhere the next thing comes that
alleviates this pain that I'mfeeling.
I'm so scared to have to dealwith this, but that's the only

(01:00:01):
way to not have to have thosethings is to deal with it.
Like you said, you got to havesomething greater, you got to be
able to pull into somethinglarger, and it's just the two
people that I brought up, kobeand Michael, and reading that
book it made me just think aboutlike, how strong, how strong

(01:00:22):
does the stranglehold of theworld have to be to cripple you
every time you try to step outof what your norm is, to elevate
yourself, to be beyond that,and then that doubt like we
talked about earlier just startscreeping in, just like.
There's this little story calledthe devil's yard cell.
Have you ever heard it?
I'm gonna give you a very briefversion of it, but this is

(01:00:43):
something that I used to give inimpact meetings when I was
doing sales, and so this issomething to motivate people.
But it's an interesting thing.
So, like it's laid out, thedevil's having a yard cell,
right, he's got all of his toolslaid out on the table.
He's got all the things thatthe devil would use, right.
He's got hate, he's got anger.
He's got all of these things.
They're all for sale.

(01:01:04):
Going along and checking allthese things, somebody picks up
this little wedge shaped thingLike what's this?
He's like oh that one's not forsale.
And they're like why is thisone not for sale?
He goes oh, that's the mostvaluable tool that I have.
I'm like what is it?
Doubt, that's the brief of it,that's the whole thing.

(01:01:26):
So the devil can't even sellhis wedge shaped doubt, because
that's his way.
In the moment that you doubtyourself, the moment that you
doubt, you're not capable,you've lost.
And so whenever you face thosemoments of doubt, you're
allowing fear to come in.
If you don't say, look thatdoubt, that I'm feeling that

(01:01:47):
stuff, that everybody's sayingthat judgment, that I'm feeling
none of that stuff is important.
I know what I'm supposed to do.
Like you said, your identitywith God.
You've been given that identity.
You can dispel those things.
But when you start feeling thatdoubt, somebody calls you crazy.
Somebody says, oh, you'redelusional.
Somebody says, oh, what are youtalking about?
You sound like you're in a cult.
Doesn't matter.
Doesn't matter, because youcan't doubt what God has you

(01:02:10):
here for.
You can't doubt what purposeyou're serving.
Once you have that assignment,once you know what that is, you
cannot doubt.
Because every time I feel likeyou do that, you take a step
back.
Now we're all gonna do it Likeit happens, but I have to keep
in my mind.
I think, that if that doubtshows up, I'm doing the right
thing, because that doubtshowing up means that I'm being

(01:02:31):
challenged, I'm being questioned, and am I gonna do what Christ
needs, what God needs me to do?
Am I gonna do God's will atthis point, or am I gonna do it,
daniel, once, and go buycheeseburger at midnight?
You know what I'm saying.
It's like it feels freeing togive up that control that I have
to make those decisions.
It feels so freeing and I thinkthat's the freedom people talk

(01:02:52):
about in Christ that I don'tthink is explored very much,
because I've seen a lot ofaddicts start going to church
right, and they get addicted toJesus, but it becomes an
idolatry thing.
It's not even like I believe itwith my heart.
It's just like I'm gonna keepsaying these words until I
believe them and maybe thatworks.
I don't know, but it just seemsso empty and I worry about the

(01:03:13):
way some people deal with thesethings and they're using fear to
guide that thinking and they'remissing the whole idea of what
that relationship is supposed tobe.
And this isn't my mind.
This is not me telling peoplehow to do it.
But I think that once you startquestioning the, the
methodology or theindoctrination or however you're
going about these things, ifyou just ask yourself what's my

(01:03:36):
relationship like, what is myrelationship with God like, and
is God leading me where I needto go or am I leading myself
away from that?
Because that's the only wayyou're going to lead yourself is
away from God, because youmaking decisions means that
you're allowing the ego and thedevil, the doubt, all of that
stuff to start guiding you andpointing you into a direction.
So I Don't know.

(01:03:57):
That's what I think about,about.
I just went on a little tangentabout all these things.

Speaker 2 (01:04:02):
It was not, it was a good tangent, I mean, but this
is what we do anyway.
Yeah and our personal time whenwe talk.
But there were, there is,there's.
I'm gonna use those twoexamples.
Yeah and I'm gonna make it evenmore simplistic, because when
we're talking about perfect love, cast out off fear right.
You know why Jordan and Kobeand any good athlete are great

(01:04:22):
they love the game.
Mm-hmm.
So check this out when youreally love something.
It doesn't matter what's inyour way.
Yeah because when you reallylove something, guess what
what's real love?
Sacrifices, right, you want tosacrifice Getting up early in
the morning to go do a 5 amWorkout?
Look bro, that's a sacrifice.

(01:04:43):
All right, you're on.
It seems like one.

Speaker 1 (01:04:45):
Oh, no, that's a sacrifice.
No, it seems like one.
It seems like one from myathlete telling you that that's
a sacrifice when you in college.
Yeah, that's a sacrifice.

Speaker 2 (01:04:54):
You do other things right, yeah and then when you
even think about like that,playing through the hurt, right,
yeah, that's a true love.
And so, when you could, whenyou add a case to like a
relationship, that when you lovesomebody, right, let's just use
like the closest form that wecan have to any love.
It's like from a parent to achild, right?
And so when you think aboutthat, that's the closest way we

(01:05:17):
get to the Gopi level.
Gopi level, goddess is.

Speaker 1 (01:05:19):
Unconditional.
Yeah, it's just unfailing.

Speaker 2 (01:05:21):
You can't do it.
I mean it never fails.
And so, as a parent any goodparent they will sacrifice for
their child.
Have the time let's be real asadults, we don't be want to get
up and go to work every day,like these days I'm most days
this is like this I'm looking atthe clock like brah, I'm tired,
I don't want to get up.

(01:05:42):
I don't want to go to, I'mgonna.
I gotta get you ready forschool too.
No, I don't want to do outthere.
Let's have a day off, right.
But you get up Because you knowwell, I got to get the bills
paid.
I got it.
I got to go out here and make aliving for us, right?
I can't just sit here and belazy, so you sacrifice getting
up.
So, all those different things.
It pushes that fear awaybecause you're in, so love with

(01:06:04):
it, right.
And so then that's where itcomes back, like With just God.
And when I think about this, Ithink about reading some of
those stories when I was inschool, even hearing about
certain people that's over in,like Africa or the foreign
countries where they're gettingkilled every day for their faith
.
They're not worried about deathbecause they know where they're
going.
Right but because they love Godso much and even in and the

(01:06:26):
interest right, they love God somuch that they were willing to
die for, because he died for us.
He loved us so much that hedied for us.

Speaker 1 (01:06:32):
Yeah the fear of death.
I think that's one of thebiggest things that we as
society face.
You bring that up and it makesme think, like I think the fear
of death Is the biggest fear andI think it's the wrong fear.
I don't think.
I think fear of death isfoolish, because we're all Going
to perish in our physicalbodies, all of us.
There's no avoiding it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:52):
I Think is when we talk about death, I think it's
the fear of how we're gonna dieright.
Well, I suffer, you know, Ithink for me maybe I think about
like, am I gonna be the onethat suffers?
And I say this because I'vebeen around people that taking
their last breath and it's not alike, it's not a real cool like

(01:07:12):
, it's a real peaceful.
Yeah, it's like, oh my god, like, is that?
Like, am I gonna suffocate andI'm gonna suffer any few seconds
or moments, whatever this is?
Or then you hear about peoplepassing away in their sleep like
what did they go peaceful?
Like so is that?
It's that unknown piece?
Right?
I think we were talking aboutthis earlier and then sometimes,
that that unknown piece bringsfear too.

(01:07:33):
Right, because Because heregoes a question right, how do I
know I'm gonna?
Go to heaven?
How do?
I know I'm gonna go to hell,like is this a real thing?
To me that's an easy answer.
I mean, for me it is too.
But I'm just saying.

Speaker 1 (01:07:46):
For most people I might even have a different
answer than you, but to me it'san easy answer.
And the reason why I know it'san easy answer for me is because
, like the idea of suffering, Ido think that being here and
facing this life, it is aboutNot suffering through the pain,
not suffering through the thingsthat you go through.

(01:08:07):
You're supposed to be at peacewith these things.
So if you are being hung on across, there's no suffering.
Right, it's not to suffer thesuffering that we endure.
Am I going to heaven or hell?
How did I face these things inlife?
How did I face these sufferingsthat I just Woe is me and just
curl up in a ball and say thisis just my life and this sucks?

(01:08:28):
That's why it's an easy answerfor me, because I know that I'm
facing the things as they shouldbe faced and I'm not doing it
arrogantly.
It's not like, oh yeah, I'mgoing to heaven because I'm
doing this.
It's like, no, I'm just don'twant to suffer here, and the way
to not suffer is to love Period.
There's no other way to notsuffer, in my opinion, and the

(01:08:49):
only way to love is through Godbecause, like you said, the
agape is the only True,undeniable full.
The whole thing?
Right, yeah, that is the of.
God part of it, and so I knowthat, as long as I continue to
operate with that, that I'm fine.
I'm not, but again, it's noteven about a destination, it's

(01:09:11):
about how many people cannottake with me, because I don't go
to heaven if my brothers don'tgo to heaven.
That's my mission, because ifthe people around me are not
blessed and loved in heaven, I'mnot blessed and loved and cared
for and stuff like that.
I haven't done my part becauseI'm taking it all too personal.
I'm making it about me, butit's not about me, it's about
all of us.
If one of us goes, all of usgoes, none of us go, none of us
go, all right.

(01:09:31):
And so I have to operate thatway and that gives me a sense of
being not even being, just asense of fullness, because I
know that, no matter what myfeelings don't matter about this
this person needs to love andcare the same as I did.
It doesn't matter what thecircumstance of the situation is
, and as long as I can keepviewing it that way, I know
God's using me in a way to Dealwith those things, to get all of

(01:09:55):
my brothers to heaven.
I say brothers in the sense ofevery human being alive, because
anybody that I come ininteraction with, that's an
opportunity for me to show grace, to show love, to show care.
And I, if I'm taking thingspersonal, if I'm taking things
oh, this is a shot at me.
I'm not doing that.
If I'm taking.
Oh why are they mad at me?
They're not letting me comeover.
They don't blah, blah, blah.
It's ain't about me, though.

(01:10:16):
Hurt people hurt people.
Healthy people don't hurtpeople, and so if you're hurting
people, you're unhealthy andyou need help, you need love,
you need care, and that'ssuffering.
The only way to get out ofsuffering is love.
The only way to heaven is love,and so I know that I operate
that way and so I'm cool, but Idon't know that that's how
everybody believes.
I don't know if that's howeverybody feels.
There's probably scripture thatthat supports some of what I

(01:10:39):
said, because I've learned thata lot too, some of the things
that I've just figured out inlife.

Speaker 2 (01:10:43):
There's scriptures of support in me if I just read
the damn book Now.

Speaker 3 (01:10:48):
I think that's what anybody just read the book is
your answer to life.

Speaker 2 (01:10:52):
Yeah.
So in my opinion, when it comesto like death right, I Just
gave you my testimony.
Yeah, I know hell is real sohell's real, heavens real.
Yeah and I know what the wordsays, that the only way to
heaven, where Jesus says I'm theway, the truth in life, nobody
comes to a father set through me.
Yeah so I know that he's the keyright.

(01:11:12):
He was the key for me to getthat demon off of you.
He's the key of while I'm here.
So my belief and accepting ofhim and having a personal
relationship with him, I knowI'm gonna be with him in heaven
right.
And I to your point, like, yeah,while I'm on here on heaven,
I'm gonna do as much as I can toeither plant seeds, to water

(01:11:35):
seeds, but any day God gets theincrease, I know I can't.
Nobody could get into heavenlike off of my coat tail, right,
right of course you know likethey Relationship they got it.
They got to do it on their ownbecause, I just remember it, a
few was a buddy, was used to belike younger, like, well, you
know, my grandma, right, is shego there?
She knows you got a spot for me, she might ready gonna take me

(01:11:57):
ever, because that's that's whatI was.
And it's like, well, I can'ttake you here, baby, you gotta
do this.
Like, oh, so it's just kind ofjust, that's how I view it and I
think.
And then there was also still,as a Christian there was before
I had that experience there wasthat question hey, is all this

(01:12:18):
stuff for real or is all thisstuff fake?
And then, once you have thatpersonal relationship, then
you're like, okay, no, this thisreally is real.
And I think, and for me is just, I just want everybody one, I
don't want anybody ever get tothe life and death.
Yeah, cuz then there's not athere, there's not a guarantee,
uh-huh, you will be able tocontinue living like you might

(01:12:40):
get saved and go to heaven.
But then that's it right, cuz II digress well, I guess.

Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
I guess the way that I perceive this is like fear,
hell is fear, and so if I'mfocusing on that, I'm running.
I'm running away from that.
I ain't got time to run awayfrom shit.
I've been doing that my wholelife Running towards something,
now Right, running towardspurpose, running towards
fulfillment and running towardspeace, instead of I'm running

(01:13:10):
from my problems, running fromwhat I'm scared of, running from
all those things.
And so To me it's the same love, lack of love, all right, and
so heaven, hell, love, lack oflove.
That's the existence of thethings.
I'm not saying that they're notreal from my perspective.
I just don't have it as adestination.
It's just because, once weleave this physical world, I
don't think we truly understandthat.

(01:13:31):
It doesn't.
It's not shaped like this.
The stuff don't look like thisyou know, right, our bodies,
that we think we see we may seeour loved ones or whatever in
heaven and all that stuff andthat's fine, but we think
they're gonna look like this.

Speaker 2 (01:13:44):
We don't know that no , the Bible tells us we'll
become spiritual beings.
Yeah, but again, what's theconcept of that?
Yeah, what does?

Speaker 1 (01:13:52):
that look like, and I think that that's where I I see
is because it's not a, it's nota place where you go and visit
it's.
It's a shapeless, namelessthing.
Like it's not nameless, thisshapeless thing, it doesn't have
a form that our human minds canconceive, and so to me, hell is
kind of the same thing.
It's the love lack of love.
I'm not saying it's not there,I'm just saying the existence of

(01:14:14):
.
I'm not going to run from hell,I'm not gonna do the fire and
brimstone, I'm not gonna do allthat stuff because, though that
may be true and valuable, Iain't got enough space in my
head to be worried about that,because I know where I'm focused
, I know what I'm doing.
That's my name, jack.

Speaker 2 (01:14:27):
Yeah, you don't run away from it.
And and why you don't run awayfrom it is because why do I have
to fear something that I haveauthority and power over?

Speaker 1 (01:14:35):
exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:14:36):
He.
And when you become the end,set Christ as yours every heat.
The moment you accept JesusChrist, he gives you power and
authority over all six indisease and over all devils.
Mm-hmm.
So wait a minute.
You telling me, devil, I usedto fear you, but wait, I have
now power and authority over you.
Oh, I'm the cop now.
You're, I don't have to runfrom you, I, I can face you what

(01:14:58):
you want to do today.
I ain't got no doubt because Ihave authority over this.

Speaker 1 (01:15:02):
Like there's nothing that you can sell.
The devil can tell me to dispelmy authority over him.
Right, and see, that's thatthing that I call the ego.
Right, a lot of peopleidentified as the devil.
I call it ego because in mymind it's that little thing
that's sitting in your headthat's always trying to get its
way, always trying and, and, andI know that Thing is only

(01:15:25):
trying to keep itself alive.
The same thing as the devil's,same thing as hell.
The same thing is lack of love.
Those things try to stay alivebecause it's a poison, it's
something, and only way itsucceeds is if it kills you
while it succeeds.
And so I just I try to focus onand I again I encourage people
to I I just I'm not saying thatDon't pay attention to hell or

(01:15:46):
whatever it is, but I'm justsaying that, like, worry about
what you need to worry about andit'll work itself out.
If I'm worried about oh, am Igoing to hell for this?
I'm thinking about the wrongthing.

Speaker 2 (01:15:58):
Well, if you're thinking about, am I going to
hell for this knee, I think.
Well, dude, are you really saylike?
Have you really said because,like, when you know you don't
worry about those things?
Yeah?
Right right when you know youhave the money to pay something
you don't worry about.
I need to get the money.

Speaker 1 (01:16:12):
Yeah, you know.
If you know you got the moneypay your bills, you ain't
worried about right, if I knowhey man, I got food in a place.

Speaker 2 (01:16:18):
I ain't worried about what's for dinner.
I'm gonna put was in, you know,in my fridge, on the, on the
stove or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:16:22):
Yeah me.

Speaker 2 (01:16:23):
So it's just kind of like once you know, you know
right.
Yeah but then it's getting tothat that knowing piece right
that I think that's what's thehinder that can be a long
journey.

Speaker 1 (01:16:36):
That can be a very long or it can be a very quick
yeah.
But here's the thing.

Speaker 2 (01:16:40):
Nobody can tell anybody how quick or how long
that journey is gonna be.
That's something that thatindividual has to come across.
And then here's the thing wecan't be judgmental for somebody
that it may take a lifetime orit may take somebody Two seconds
to get it right, I'm is only atool right, you know.
I mean, everybody has their owndifferent levels of perspective

(01:17:02):
.

Speaker 1 (01:17:02):
Yep, time is a tool, because in Infinity there is no
time.
All right, so, like, the onlyreason time is valuable to us is
because it's teaching ussomething.
All right, what is it teachingus?
And each person the thing thatit's teaching.
That might be a little bitdifferent, but the reality is
time is fictional, it's not real, it's made up.
It's something that we use toguide our lives and live our

(01:17:24):
lives.
When I saying ignore time, notsaying Don't be late for work,
but what I'm saying is like youknow, I was the value of time is
Based on perception, becausehaven't you sat and the clock
has gone by quickly.
But you've also sat, it's goneby very slowly you see the
expression watching paint draw,it's like, but the same amount

(01:17:45):
of time has technically passed.
So what is the perception ofthe time?
What's that's the that's thevalue there.
So if you can find a way toperceive time in a different
manner and see, this is whereI'm good at things in life.
It's like all of the thingslike they're not waking up, the
things like that.
It's about giving yourself aperspective that makes that not

(01:18:05):
a thing that causes you badfeelings, because those bad
feelings start creating doubt.
You start you know all of thesethings.
So if I need to wake up earlyin the morning, I need to adopt
a perspective that's gonna allowme to do that with as little
conflict as possible.
So you say waking up and goingto do the things as a sacrifice,
a Sacrifice, for what a desire.
Okay, well, those are yourdesires.

(01:18:25):
It's not really a sacrifice.
You're not sacrificing yourdesire.
You just don't have that right.
But you have something largerthat you love, that you care
about.
So having a perspective to say,oh, my goal is this, so what I,
my desires don't matter.
Oh, do I want to go hang outwith the boys and stay out late,
drinking and stuff like that,fine, understand, and you feel
like you're sacrificing by notgoing.
But are you really sacrificingby not going?

(01:18:48):
Because the perspective thatone would carry, if you think
you are sacrificing, you'recausing yourself suffering
Because the sacrifice isn'tactually real.
What's happening is you'regiving up something for
something else, and the onlyreason it would be a sacrifice
is because you desire thatgreater than what you're
actually doing, until you don't.
And so that's the only reason Isee sacrifices of as a problem,

(01:19:11):
in the sense that the use oflanguage when people say that
they're sacrificing, they thinkit seems noble or like they're
giving something up of value islike oh, I sacrificed myself for
my family.
I don't believe that, though Idon't believe you sacrificed.
I think you did the thing thatyou thought you needed to do.
Now, if you claim that as asacrifice, that means you're

(01:19:33):
blaming something else for whyyou didn't get what you want.
And I just don't, and I'm notsaying that that's truly how
people feel.
But when you use the words thatway and you think about it that
way, you start limiting yourown self-belief and you don't
even realize you're doing itbecause you think that, oh man,
I don't get to go do this.
Well, why have bad feelings?
But why be like, why have?

(01:19:54):
Why worry about any of that?
And it's the same thing forlike like hell.
For me it's like is it asacrifice?
No, because I'm not going tohell.
Like what I'm doing is not asacrifice.
Me not being able to go Smokeweed and drink beers and all
that stuff is like I had my fundoing that stuff and it was all
cool and well.
But not doing it now is not asacrifice, because I'm not

(01:20:14):
giving it up, I'm done with it.
I'm not exchanging that forsomething else.
I've made decisions in my lifeto know that If I'm truly to
sacrifice something, all thesacrifices needed has already
been done.
Right, god gave his onlybegotten son, so this who who
shall ever perish, so haveeverlasting life, or whatever

(01:20:35):
the scripture actually reads,right and so like.
There's no actual sacrificebeyond that.
That sacrifice has already beenmade.
Now it's just do we make thedecision to live in that way, or
the decision not?
And the only true sacrifice Ithink you can make would be
sacrificing yourself to not livethat way.

Speaker 2 (01:20:52):
That's just what I think so I think that's a good
one way to think right, and I'mgonna say that I'm like not
Dementioning, I don't, it's just, yeah, just a perspective, it's
just perspective so that youcan give yourself the best
chance, because how many timeswe put roadblocks in our way For
and for what reason, yep, and Iwas going to say, like you have

(01:21:14):
.
I think desire Is in part ofthat too right like there, there
is an ultimate goal right.
There's a goal in something thatthey love doing.
Yeah, there's some kind ofdesire there's an objective.
Yeah, there's an objective, whatyou want to end it.
So there's a desire of right,like Michael Jordan's desire was

(01:21:37):
to be the greatest basketballplayer.
Coveys was to be the greatestbasketball player.
Right in in a marriage, youknow, the greatest spouse, I'm
gonna be the greatest spouse, orI'm gonna be the greatest
father, right, there's always agoal that's driving it.
Like, even in Christ, I Want tobe the greatest To what I can be
, be great at what I was calledto do.
So when I get to heaven, hecould say well done.

(01:22:00):
But I don't want to hear welldone, loyal, faithful servant.
I want to hear well done, son.
That's what I want to hear,right.
So there's something that isdriving me right.
That's that.
That's that push.
But it's also connected to ifthat love piece like so they go,
they go hand in hand.
So I think, when, when we'resaying, or when I say, when I'm
sacrificing Something to get tothat goal, because when you

(01:22:24):
think about it, you, you do, you, whether you want to use the
word sacrifice or not, there'ssomething that you have to put
down in order to get to go, likeyou got to make a choice.

Speaker 1 (01:22:34):
You do got to make a choice, I think every day, I
think all the time.
I think that's the mostconstant thing is what choice Do
you make, god's?

Speaker 2 (01:22:41):
will or not?

Speaker 1 (01:22:42):
Yeah, I think that that's the.
I think that's the choice thatmost people don't even realize
they're making with everydecision that they make.
Everything they do, every stepthat they take, every time they
turn, is turn the car on likeit's, like my decisions are my
decisions, in line or out ofline.
But if you have no line, how doyou know?

Speaker 2 (01:23:01):
just you're just living.
You know what I mean and likeit's funny I said, is because of
Ashley to a what goes more inperson in prayer.
God just spoke something realeasy and simple to me.
He was like you make a choiceby you.
You choose your choosing thisright now.
Like I'm not, I'm not forcingyou to choose, you're choosing

(01:23:21):
what you want to eat.
Because he asked me about thisone thing if I wanted it right,
and I was like, well, let methink about it, god you know,
Let me go through the thing.
And he's like but it's yourchoice.
And I was like well, god, youknow this here.
You know, if you give me allthis, I won't be funny like this
.
Really get to this oldChristian.
You know, you know you know,talk about funny.

(01:23:42):
And I say, well, God, if it'sgonna please you, you know, then
he's just like Brian.
Brian, can we be real for asecond?
Okay?
All right.
And so I think it is like it'sbeing consciously Awareness,
aware, right.
So, when we so because we,because we brought up a lot of
good points about fear, right,we brought up the fact of what

(01:24:05):
creates fear is doubt.
Right, we brought up not havinglove.
I'm the brain about fear.
We brought up about Void is theunknowns and stuff, right.
And so I think the other partwhen it, when it comes to fear,
is Am I aware of the choicesthat I have a friend?

(01:24:27):
Have I thought about each stepthoroughly enough to where, if I
make that choice, when I standin front of God, I can say, hey,
I did my best, right?
Or can it be the one where wejust said you know, I didn't
really think at that moment, Ijust kind of did it, because and

(01:24:50):
when we say this, this doesn'tmean that everybody's gonna be
perfect at it, man, it's just,it's just what it is you know,
don't want to be perfect at this, but it's one of those things.
And then, and here's our problem, I like how we use this balance
thing right.
You don't want to be so stuckin.
Oh my God, am I making theright choice today?
Yeah, I'm gonna spend five, 20minutes just praying.
Hey, god, do I put on browntoday or blue pants today?

(01:25:11):
It don't matter.

Speaker 1 (01:25:12):

Speaker 2 (01:25:15):
But it's being aware of.
Okay, what am I gonna choosetoday?
Right, and I love how you sayam I gonna choose to be in your
will or I'm gonna choose not tobe in your will?
Right, and I think one of thethings is that we have in this
world and I believe, just as abody is we have to understand
and know the will of God.

(01:25:35):
Right, the Bible tells us andI'm just gonna paraphrase, I
mean John.
It tells us about how we prayand the confidence of God's will
.
And when we pray in thatconfidence, we know that what we
say will come to pass.
Because why?
It's in this will, it aligns upin this work.
Word does not come back, returnto avoid, or I love how the
easy reverse does not come backempty handed, but it

(01:25:57):
accomplishes out the thing thatit's supposed to do.
Right, so when you understandhere it is, the other part of
fear is like understanding.
I think we didn't brought outlike six points for this.
I don't know how I can keep itcount, it's all right, but it's
like understanding, right?
Do we understand where we'regoing?
Do we understand the processwe're going through or why we

(01:26:19):
gotta go through that process?
Do we even understand thereason how we say that earlier.
Do you really understand thereason of the fear right now?
Like, how did it get here?
Let's get to the root of okay,why is the fear here?
And, like I was saying earlier,some of that could have just
been you had the wrong voicespeaking to you that day.

(01:26:41):
Right, some of it is.
You could have watched thewrong show and now you don't
know where the influence camefrom.

Speaker 1 (01:26:47):
You cannot know where the influence came from.

Speaker 2 (01:26:49):
Some of them like people scared of clowns most of
the time they watched that movieit and I'm talking about the
old Stephen King, not the newone.
I ain't even seen either one ofthem.
I think I used to be in thescary movies but something about
that clown and I was like Icannot watch this movie bro.
Oh, pennywise, yeah, I couldnot.
I don't even know what to dothere.
I could not watch that movie.
But then, guess what?
I saw the walking the firstnight of living there.

Speaker 1 (01:27:13):
That movie scared the mess out of me, right.

Speaker 2 (01:27:15):
As a kid, I was scared to be around dead people
Cause I'm like man.
When's the moment they gonnaget about that casket and ask
for my brains?

Speaker 1 (01:27:22):
right man, I watched all the Friday the 13th so I was
scared of a guy with macheteand a hockey mask.
That was that way.
And then me.

Speaker 2 (01:27:29):
I'm the one that will laugh at Jason and Freddie
Cougar.
Like these dudes are comical,yeah, but to give me a dead body
, oh my.

Speaker 1 (01:27:35):
God oh man.
And I, like I watched Candy man.

Speaker 2 (01:27:39):
Have you ever watched that one.

Speaker 1 (01:27:40):
Yeah, yeah, that one messed me up, dude.

Speaker 2 (01:27:42):
And then Blair Witch.

Speaker 1 (01:27:43):
I watched it recently .
I mean it was retarded.
But I'm sorry, I don't mean tobe offensive to retarded people
but, that movie was terrible,but I watched it as a kid.
I was like 10.
Maybe that movie was messed meup because there's no video
camera through the woods.

Speaker 2 (01:27:58):
Yeah, there's running around.
You don't know what's going on,what it tore me up, dude.

Speaker 1 (01:28:01):
It made me scared of the woods.
I grew up in the woods.

Speaker 2 (01:28:06):
So you need that hat that I had with the light on it,
right yeah, no dude.

Speaker 1 (01:28:11):
And like man.
For a long time it was like andI love abandoning shit out in
the woods too.
I used to love exploring, butit helped me off a little bit.
It helped me off a little bit,so here goes the point right.

Speaker 2 (01:28:22):
Sometimes we'll create fears for ourselves.
We just talked about watchingmovies that placed a picture in
our head of you guys should bescared of this, and we're like
not knowing if it's real or true.
Matter of fact, we know it'snot real right and you brought
up the candy man, like, I think,every kid, even to this day.

(01:28:45):
I don't even mess with thatjoint right.

Speaker 1 (01:28:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:28:48):
I won't watch it.
I'll get in the mirror andthey'll be like hey, man, you
get bowed and say, carry me.

Speaker 1 (01:28:52):
Or I don't know if you remember the books called
Scary Stories and then the ladycalled Bloody Mary, whatever
right there you say in themirror five times we used to do
that when we were kids, bro, butI don't even look.
We did some stupid stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:29:05):
Stupid stuff so then, but this also goes back to kind
of like Nicole's message thatshe was doing in her Bible study
about all those differentthings of witchcraft and how we
get into it, and a lot of thosethings that they're showing or
placing on the screen iswitchcraft stuff, right, like
saying, saying a name in themirror is really saying like an
incantation.

Speaker 1 (01:29:23):
Yes, it says an incantation.

Speaker 2 (01:29:24):
You're opening yourself up to that spirit.
So whether that's candy man,there's probably, there's
actually a demon that's probablyassociated to it with the name
right, whatever, that is thiscop pack, as we ain't gonna go
in that or that deep but again,remember I said earlier, fear is
a spirit, right.
So what we did was we justinvited that spirit into

(01:29:46):
ourselves and then, like thespirit is rampant in this whole
world, we evolved the spirit ofhate to come and ramp.
Well, I think we got all thesewars and stuff, man, like we
open ourselves or we can openourselves to being in fear.
But then if it's something thatyou open yourself in, well,
guess what?
There's deliverance in it,there's ability to get out of it

(01:30:06):
, right.
So it's like, hey, do you wannatake the exit of the freeway
now or you wanna keep going andjust, hopefully the rest stop
area will be in the next fivemiles.
I don't know and I use thatbecause how many times we've
been on the road?
Trip.
And you see that rest area andit comes up like, oh crap, I
missed it, I gotta go to thebathroom.
You're like, well, hopefullythere's another one.
I gotta wait for the gas 97miles.
Yes, you're like oh God, Idon't know what to do with this.

(01:30:28):
Hey, if I got a Coke bottle youknow, get a red bottle.

Speaker 1 (01:30:31):

Speaker 2 (01:30:33):
So, but I mean, I think we brought us some good
points, man, like awareness,understanding, doubt, not having
love.
I think another one could justbe too and this goes with love,
like trying to fill a void thatwe missed or we've been wanting
or we desired.
It goes back into the desirepiece, Like we desire something
but we have an ability or wehaven't been able to attain it.

(01:30:55):
I mean, and I think, like fearis such a good, a big subject
it's a broad subject, right andI don't think we could.
Man we can have 30 episodesabout this and not even touch it
Right right and I think thegoal I don't know we're out on
time Maybe it's give somesolutions like how do you get
out of fear?
So I'll ask you I know you tryand get me to interview but and

(01:31:17):
I can come back with it but whatare some of your solutions to
get out of fear?
And guys, I wanna ask him togive solutions, cause I don't
know if he told you maybe you'vebeen watching some of his other
videos but he's also a lifecoach too, right.

Speaker 1 (01:31:28):
So I want him to coach us.
I alluded to that slightlyearlier when I said this is what
I'm good at.
So the reality is, in my mind,the most practical way to deal
with fear number one this isn'tthe most practical like what
you'd like facing it Like that'sthe.
But the other way to do it is,once you've faced enough fears,
you start to understand theprinciple of the fear's

(01:31:50):
existence, and so I guess, ifyou've gone through practice of
trying to face the fears, thebest way in my mind to deal with
the fear is to just give it up.
Just, if you're scared ofsomething, just ask yourself
like why?
What value is that fear servingme?
If you can just ask yourselfthat simple what value does this

(01:32:11):
have for me?
Because it's trying to dosomething, whether it's
something that you've created inyour own mind by watching a
movie.
Right, if I'm scared, if I'mscared of going out and looking
at abandoned things because I'mscared of the witch is gonna get
me right that fear the way, thebest way that I could think to
dispel that fear would be toacknowledge the practicality of

(01:32:33):
if that does happen, and ifsomething like that does happen
in my cool.
I think that's really the onlyway to deal with it.
And so if I'm fearful ofsomething, first off, journal,
that's gonna be the mostpractical thing.
That is literally the most.
Write down what you're scaredof and why you think you're
scared of it.
That right there, that's gonnasolve a lot of your problems,

(01:32:56):
because now you can get it offyour chest.
You ain't gotta carry it aroundwith you.
You ain't gotta pretend thatyou're not, cause I think a lot
of people pretend that they'renot scared and they're like I
ain't scared.
That's how I know you're scared.
You know how you're.
I ain't scared.
That's proof you are.

Speaker 2 (01:33:09):
Hey, can I say this Listen, there's something around
, though they said I ain'tscared of nothing.
And then they say you know, Isee the right side of it.
They said I was scared thiswhole time.
This was holding me back.
I'm like bruh, it's like bruhand so like, if you're going
around, I ain't scared of that?

Speaker 1 (01:33:24):
I ain't scared of me.
Like, yeah, you are.
Like if you're having to saythat you're doubting yourself
because you're trying toconvince yourself or somebody
else around you or compensatingfor something, yes compensating.
And so again, I guess to stateit again or differently if you
want to deal with fear, I wouldsuggest journaling about it,
because if you do somereflection journaling, I mean

(01:33:46):
that's I'm going to be honestwith you To me that's like
praying, it's like giving up tothe Holy Spirit, it's like it's
like giving it away so that youdon't have to hang on to it.
But if you don't have apractice of letting it go,
whether it be to the Holy Spiritor journey, like you just have
to have an action of practice ofa way to get it off of you,
because our bodies retain thesememories and they'll hold on to

(01:34:09):
it, right, and then we'll havethese physiological responses to
these things that we're scaredof.
That we think that we've dealtwith.
We just pushed it really really, really, really, really far
down.
But if you haven't done thework to deal with it, facing it
and stuff like that andunderstanding the principles,
look, if you ask God to have younot afraid, you better be
prepared to face the most scaryshit that you've ever faced.

(01:34:30):
Because you're asking to dispelfear, that means you're holding
on to fear, so you're gonna haveto deal with it.
I mean, sure, pray for that, doall that stuff.
But I'm gonna tell you thethings that you're scared of
right now.
Just start giving it up and sowhen those new things come on
that you are scared of that yourealize that you don't know how
to deal with.
You already have a process todeal with it.
So when you start praying, god,give me peace, god, give me the

(01:34:53):
opportunity to get past thisfear that's hurtling me, that's
causing me a hurdle.
All right, if you have apractice in place to deal with
that, look, it doesn't matterwhat you face, you've got a
practice in place, and I thinkthat that's what a lot of things
that happen in the church thatget taught that I think are
missed with the meaning or why.
Because, oh, pray, yeah, butwhy, like, what's it doing?

(01:35:15):
So that's a practice toalleviate those fears, those
symptoms, those things that youget.
Journaling, and again, it'slike, to me it's just a
different action that representsa similar thing or the same
thing.
So that would be my thing Prayand write, pray and write, pray
and write.
Because in my mind they'reoperating in the same way,
because as I'm writing, I'mpraying, I'm thinking about
these things, I'm letting themgo.
So that's my answer.

Speaker 2 (01:35:36):
Cool.
How would you?
What do you say?
Oh, you ain't gonna saypreacher man.

Speaker 1 (01:35:40):
Preacher man what's up, preacher man what you got.

Speaker 2 (01:35:43):
I would say remember, you have a choice.
You have a choice to accept andyou have a choice to reject.
And way the choice.
Is this a life-threateningthing, right?
Like?
Is this going to destroy mycharacter?
Is this trying to destroy who?
I am trying to destroy my call?
And if it's not trying to dothat and it's the opposite, like

(01:36:05):
it's trying to stop me fromgetting to the best of me, well
then, that's when you know thatyou have a power of authority,
if that's how you can recognizeyou know, what.
This isn't really coming fromGod.
This is really coming from theenemy, like if it's trying to
stop me and if it's trying tokeep me from doing what God's
called me.
Well, I know that's not of Godright.
So then, just going back againto the Bible, says what God

(01:36:27):
doesn't give us a spirit of fear, right, but of power.
So here it is I got power overauthority over right, a sound
mind.
When you're not, when you'refearful, your mind just confused
, you act erotically, you actout of character, you do things
out of character and thensometimes those consequences are
overbearing right.

(01:36:49):
And I'll just use an example.
I remember when I wanna say Ithink it was a Philando who got
killed in Minnesota by the copand he shot like his arm off.
And if you saw the full video,that cop was scared right before
he even got to the window healready had his gun, kind of

(01:37:09):
halfway blown out.
And then out of that fear, right, he lost control and his
reaction was shoot the gun off.
And so it's that sound mind ispeace, right, because it's
crucial, because if my mind issound, then now I can process
this, I can analyze this, andsometimes to get a sound mind is

(01:37:31):
just take a step back and lookright, and then power.
So it gives the sound mindpower.
And then love right, love castsit out of all fear.

Speaker 1 (01:37:41):
That's the answer to everything.
Love is always the answer, andthe thing is, is not our
definition of, not like thehuman definition?
Oh, love, is I love you, notthat, that's a word.
What I'm talking about I'm surewhat you're talking about too
is, it's literally the lifeforce in everything that exists,
the action of it, yeah and sothe action of representation, of

(01:38:03):
bringing life, of giving lifeof those things.

Speaker 2 (01:38:07):
If it's not in that way, then and then the other one
yeah, go back, go into prayerabout it and then just asking
God to either deliver you fromit and then just know your
identity of who you are inChrist, right, like dude.
When you know who you are, thenyou know there's certain stuff
you just won't accept and youwon't allow to have.

(01:38:29):
You just nip it in a butt.
And once you do that, just nipit in a butt.
And the last thing is, like yousaid earlier, and I think we
all agree, you gotta face yourfears.
The only way that you canovercome anything is you gotta
face the obstacle or the thingthat is trying to hinder you
right?

Speaker 1 (01:38:45):
All right, man, we'll .
Hey, we just spent an houralmost 40 minutes chit-chatting
about this, so I'd love to haveyou on again.
First off, thank you for comingon this time.

Speaker 2 (01:38:54):
Great conversation, hey thank you for having me.
I meant to say that earlier.
You know what I mean, so youknow I already know.

Speaker 1 (01:38:58):
I'm thanked.
Anyways, man, I appreciate youcoming on and do you have
anything that you wanna plug?
Where can they find you if theywanna catch your Bible studies
or your sermons?
Where can they find you at?

Speaker 2 (01:39:11):
Awesome.
So we do have a website.
It's wwwlivecommissionorg.
You can catch our most recentBible studies online.
You can catch us on Facebook atcommission assembly of Texas
Incorporated.
We're online there.
It also has a link to where youcan come to our Zoom meetings
as well.
And then if you wanna come inperson, you can come to our

(01:39:34):
house.
We do small groups at our house, which is 1710 Del Mar Drive,
garland, texas, 75040.

Speaker 1 (01:39:42):
And don't come acting crazy but One more thing that I
wanna say is commission hasbeen blessed with a location to
be doing some future work.
Revival Did you call it arevival?
What are you calling it?

Speaker 2 (01:39:55):
Yeah, so it's like a revival Saturdays which will
begin in 2024.
And it's just one Saturday outthe month where we'll start
kinda having revivals, and I wasgonna mention that up there.
But thank you, daniel man, Iappreciate you bro.
You're giving me your point, butwe will be there.
It's off of Broadway and if yougive me a second I can give you

(01:40:16):
that address, cause we just gotthe keys, so hold on.
So the address is 3321 BroadwayBoulevard, suite 101, garland,
texas, 75063.
And we're looking to do arevival every second Saturday

(01:40:41):
between 2 pm and 4 pm, once amonth.
We're doing that just for thefirst six months, but these
revivals aren't gonna be likeyour traditional revivals.
We're looking for ways to helpa community.
When we're talking aboutcommission assembly, our focus
is to help a community of people.
So I'll give you our vision andI'll give you our mission

(01:41:04):
statement, if that's okay withyou.

Speaker 1 (01:41:05):
Absolutely man.

Speaker 2 (01:41:06):
So our vision is to build bridges that were never
there or once there, andbringing them together and
bringing them to the kingdom ofGod, because it takes a bridge.
So the bridge is buildingrelationships right, bringing
people together, and our missionis to love God, love people and
do the work of Christ well, andso what that means is doing

(01:41:28):
your very best to representChrist well in whatever it is
that you do, and so what wewanna do is we don't.
We're not a church that likesto stay behind the four walls.
We're a church that wants to bein the community and help the
community, and the only way thata community can get better is
if a community comes together toget better, like there's not
one people, one church, oneorganization.

(01:41:50):
That's gonna make you feelbetter.
The community gets betterbecause the community wants to
be better.

Speaker 1 (01:41:54):
Absolutely yeah.
Well, I appreciate that, man.
Again, thank you for coming on.
I really appreciate it and I'msure I'll have you on again.
All right man.
So you guys take care.
I appreciate you guys forlistening.
I love you guys.
Also help support Brian andcommission, because he's out
here trying to do the good workand so you know, if you're
interested in setting upsomething or even doing some

(01:42:15):
more reach out work and stufflike that, be sure and get ahold
of Brian, because he's alwayslooking for ways to help the
community.
So if you got some ideas andthings like that, send them some
stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:42:26):
You can go on the website too and get all of them
too.
Love you guys.

Speaker 1 (01:42:29):
Take care.

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