August 18, 2025 • 42 mins
Dr. Joyce Nash shares her remarkable journey from financial struggles to becoming a clinical psychologist with two PhDs and authoring eleven books. Her latest memoir "Realizing a Dream" chronicles her path of resilience, academic achievement, and the pursuit of lifelong dreams despite obstacles.
• Starting college at 28 after being unable to afford higher education after high school
• Earning scholarships that enabled her educational journey at Southern Illinois University
• Obtaining her first PhD in Communication before pursuing her dream career in psychology
• Balancing career ambitions with personal life challenges including two failed marriages
• Publishing eleven books including her recent memoir about her transformative life journey
• Advocating for positive self-talk and overcoming negative thought patterns
• Developing professional expertise in trauma recovery and psychological healing
• Finding inspiration through a lifelong love of reading and learning
Visit joycenash.com to learn more about Dr. Nash's books and career. Remember: "Don't talk yourself out of a dream. Take your dreams, follow them, and take them from hope to reality."
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
She's the voice behind the viral comedy bold
commentary and truth-packedinterviews that cut through the
chaos.
Author.
Brand creator.
Proud conservative Christian,this is Elsa Kurt.
Welcome to the show that alwaysbrings bold faith, real truth
and no apologies.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Well, hello everyone.
Today we are doing a veryspecial interview.
I am so excited to bring on myguest.
She is Dr Joyce D Nash, and sheis a pioneering clinical
psychologist, healthcommunicator and award-winning
author, whose multi-decadecareer has focused on empowering
people to understand theirbehaviors and to heal from
(00:42):
emotional wounds and reclaimagency over their lives.
That is so huge, and in herlatest book, realizing a Dream,
finding Passion in a Career, drNash shares her deeply personal
journey of transformation andthe lifelong pursuit of meaning,
bringing together herprofessional expertise, her
resilience and creative voice.
(01:02):
And she now continues her workthrough writing and community
engagement, speaking candidlyabout neurodivergence, chronic
illness, trauma and radical care.
Dr Nash, it is so nice to haveyou here.
Thank you for joining me.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
So glad, Elsa.
I'm looking forward to talkingto your audience.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Thank you very much.
So you hit on some topics thatI especially love talking about,
but I want to talk to you alittle bit about you primarily,
and your book and that wholeprocess.
So I would love to know yourjourney into earning not just
one but two PhDs.
That is really inspiring,especially for an academic
(01:49):
slacker like myself.
So tell me a little bit aboutthat, would you?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Well, I started my education really early on as a
child, watching other childrengo into school, and I wanted to
go into school but I wasn't oldenough.
I finally got there and therest of the story for that is in
(02:15):
my memoir, realizing a Dream.
But when I got to high school Iwanted to go to college, but
there wasn't enough money in myfamily for that to happen.
A decade later I discoveredthat I could go to night school
at the University of Pittsburgh.
(02:36):
So I started that, even thoughit would take a long time.
It would take a long time.
It was at least a start.
Then a professor said to me youreally ought to quit night
school and go full time.
I said to him I can't afford it.
(02:58):
He said if you really want to,you can do it.
Well, that was an inspiration.
From there I applied forscholarships and, to my surprise
, got two scholarships and thattook me to Southern Illinois
University.
I finished my undergraduatedegree there and was planning on
(03:21):
going back home to get a job.
One of my advisors at SIU saidyou really ought to go to
graduate school.
To satisfy him, mostly Iapplied to graduate schools for
a PhD program.
I didn't realize that I neededa master's degree to go into a
(03:47):
PhD program.
So I applied and, to mysurprise, I was invited to go my
PhD in communication in 1976.
But a long-held dream for mewas to be a psychologist.
(04:16):
But I was in the communicationdepartment, not the psychology
department.
So I graduated from thecommunication department with my
first doctorate, but I keptremembering my dream of being a
psychologist.
(04:36):
Ten years later I discoveredthere was a school where we
lived that trained people to beclinical psychologists.
So I enrolled.
Six years later I was awarded aPhD in clinical psychology, but
(04:57):
it took me two more yearsbefore I was licensed.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Before I was licensed .
After that I practiced for 25years and have been writing
books ever since.
That's amazing.
What an incredible journey ofjust perseverance really,
because that is such a longprocess, it's so taxing.
Of course, you mentioned thefinancial struggles of that,
which you know, and thesacrifice that comes with that
I'm sure is, is incredible.
Tell me a little bit about whatdrew you to psychology.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
You know I was 21.
I remember exactly where I waswhen I had the idea that I
wanted to become a psychologist.
I was walking by the dorms ofUniversity of Pittsburgh and at
that point I thought I'd like tobe a psychologist.
(05:57):
Maybe that would help meunderstand some of the people in
my life, particularly my mother.
So that was my inspiration.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
That's beautiful, it really is, and I think it's so
powerful and impactful on yourown life to gain that kind of
understanding, because I thinkwhen you have challenging family
members or just people in yourlife, relationships in your life
, that you struggle withrelating to them or
understanding them and maybeeven sometimes loving them
(06:32):
because of the challenges thatthey bring into your life, so to
be, I think, to be able tounderstand where they're coming
from and the psychology of theirbehavior, I would imagine it
helps give forgiveness if it'sneeded to give, and just that
understanding.
I find the field of psychologyabsolutely fascinating.
(06:53):
The study of people and humanbehavior obviously is so
fascinating to me and, like Imentioned, I was not
academic-minded enough to dowhat you've done, so I have so
much admiration for all of that.
I want to switch gears a littlebit and ask you a little bit
more about your book.
Now you have a deeply movingpart in your book where you had
(07:14):
to choose between continuing onthat prestigious path or chasing
your longten dreams.
So what helped you make thatleap of faith?
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Well, what helped me change from my first PhD to
seeking another PhD was Irealized that at Stanford I was
being taught to become aprofessor, and the reality was I
(07:52):
didn't want to become aprofessor although it would have
been a very challengingoccupation but instead I had
this long-held dream to become apsychologist.
It took me another decade toundertake the information to
(08:18):
become a clinical psychologist.
What I did was follow along-held dream.
I detail that in my memoirRealizing a decide.
Did I want to reveal so manypersonal things?
(08:50):
I thought about that a lot andin the end I decided that I
hoped my journey would inspireothers to follow their dream and
bring it from hope to reality.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I love that kind of encouragement because I think
that's exactly what holds somany people back, particularly
since we're talking aboutwriting and writing your memoir
and sharing such personalinformation to the world, really
, and just opening yourself upfor that type of scrutiny.
I think there's so many peoplewho would and will and can
benefit from doing that, whetherthey write it for publishing or
(09:33):
for their own sake.
Right?
Would you encourage people todo exactly that, even if it's
just for themselves?
I personally feel that writingis just so cathartic and I think
when you read back what you'vewritten, it's so revealing to
how you feel.
Would you agree with that?
Oh, definitely.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
You know, the whole writing industry has changed so
much since my first book in 1976.
Since my first book in 1976.
These days a writer, or apotential writer, needs to think
about what kind of book theywant to write.
The traditional publisher wantsto publish a non-fiction book.
(10:26):
A non-fiction book, like myfirst and my second
dissertations, requires researchand the publisher will take on
the job of promoting the book.
But another kind of book thatwriters think about is
(10:48):
self-publishing.
That wasn't available to me in1976 when my first book came out
, and I did try twoself-published books, which are
no longer available, but at thattime I gave that a try.
The kind of publishing mycurrent memoir Realizing a Dream
(11:14):
is published under is what'scalled a hybrid publisher.
That means that the publisherand I cooperate to bring the
memoir to people's attention.
That requires a lot of efforton the writer's table, and so
(11:38):
the writer needs to really getacquainted with how they can
promote their book.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yes, that is so true and you're so right.
The industry and the optionshave changed so dramatically.
You said you wrote your firstbook in the 70s.
So I mean the changes that havehappened since then and I think
it was probably so much harderthen to get published, to
publish because these optionsweren't even available then.
(12:09):
But I agree with you so muchthat you know you really, as a
writer, if you're going toself-publish in particular, you
really do need, you owe it toyourself to learn all of these
aspects and understand whatyou're getting into and these
options and what they mean.
I know there have been peopleyou know you'll know this term
maybe some of our viewersweren't but the pop-up of like
(12:32):
vanity presses, you know, reallycaused a lot of harm to novice
writers and prospective authorswho kind of got taken advantage
of.
So, knowing you know whatyou're doing and what you're
getting into, I just love thatkind of got taken advantage of,
so knowing you know what you'redoing and what you're getting
into, and I just love that kindof encouragement that you give
to you know prospective authorson their own journeys.
That's invaluable.
(12:52):
If you wouldn't mind, I'd liketo wrap back around a little bit
, though, to your journey.
So, throughout your journey,your family dynamics, especially
with your mother.
You mentioned they played ahuge role.
So how did your upbringingaffect the way that you
approached independence andcareer ambition?
Speaker 3 (13:13):
That's a good question and my family for the
most part was very happy andvery encouraging.
In fact, I remember my motherused to say Joyce, you can be
anything, you can even be adoctor.
So that was helpful toencourage me to move on.
(13:34):
It was difficult for me when Icouldn't go to college right
after high school, but I didwhat I could and I got jobs and
I waited for the opportunity tocontinue.
That's when I discovered theUniversity of Pittsburgh had
(13:56):
night classes.
So I enrolled in the nightclasses and because my family
had been so encouraging, Icontinued with night classes
until I transferred to SouthernIllinois University.
My family was very supportive,even though they couldn't help
(14:20):
much financially.
I made up for that by applyingfor scholarships and to my
surprise I got two scholarshipsthat helped me along.
Plus I applied for and got someloans so that I could go off to
(14:42):
college.
So my family was verysupportive of that and it was
wonderful when they came to mygraduation at SIU.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Wow, that is amazing.
Now your title, the title ofyour book Realizing a Dream.
It speaks to awakening longdormant desires and, as a woman
who is now in her 50s and didnot start her writing journey
and her podcasting all of thethings that I do now in the
public eye I didn't start thisjourney until I was in my mid
(15:17):
40s, so I consider myself a latestarter, a late bloomer.
You can call it whatever youwant.
That's what I tend to call it.
Starter, a late bloomer, youcan call it whatever you want.
That's what I tend to call it,and it was based on or the
reasoning was because a lot ofthe things that you touch on,
really, which is so impactfulfor me fear, oh my gosh, let's,
let's just.
We can wrap it all up with fear, fear of the unknown, self
(15:38):
doubt.
You know all of those things.
I would love to know, assomebody who has been doing all
of these things for decades now,despite fear and despite things
that may have held you back.
I would love to know what youwould say to women in their 40s
and in their 50s or even beyond,who feel like it's too late.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
I have one thing to say Never give up.
That's the message in my memoir.
Follow your dream, be willingto put up with the setbacks and
carry on, even if things seem toget difficult.
Never give up.
(16:20):
It's your dream, you can takeit to reality.
Make it your testament to lifeto you.
So never give up, you can do it.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Yes, yes, I love that , I love that and I would echo
you on that a thousand timesover.
I think, and maybe you'll agreewith me I think the fear of
what's to come or what might be,is so much worse than what
actually does.
And I know from personalexperience, like all of my fear
(16:54):
of failing, of falling, all ofthose things and it's not that
they haven't happened I'vedefinitely failed, I've
definitely fallen, I've mademistakes, I've embarrassed
myself and you know all of thosethings.
But the thing that I get tocome away with and maybe you can
say the same is that when Ilook back at those failings and
those falls and all of thosethings, I can say, yeah, but I
(17:16):
got back up and I'm fine, likethe world didn't end.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
The sky didn't fall.
I you know, yeah, I had to dustmyself off, but I was able to
dust myself off and I think thatis so powerful for any
individual and not even not ifyou're just, you know, not even
just if you're in your 40s andyour 50s and beyond For anyone
at any stage.
If you're facing that fear,right, Right, yes, I love that.
Rising to a challenge does takesome courage and there are
setbacks, but you can overcomesetbacks.
And even though I started myjourney really late, I was 28
years old before I startedschool at the University of
Pittsburgh.
When I graduated from SouthernIllinois University, I was 31.
(18:12):
I was 31 when I started atStanford and so a decade later I
graduated from Stanford with myfirst PhD.
So it's been a long journey,and added to that was my journey
to become a psychologist.
(18:32):
So I hope readers will takeaway inspiration and courage to
follow their path wherever itmight lead.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Absolutely, and I believe that they will.
In reading that you know,reading a firsthand testimony of
going through all the things,and you know you talk about
trauma, childhood trauma, thefears and all of those things
which is so relatable to all ofus, and you know to see those
steps, to see somebody who hastaken those steps and made those
(19:06):
strides despite those obstacles.
Tell me a little bit.
So you said that you were 28and then when you started right,
and then 31 when you graduated.
During that time and I hate tomake assumptions, but I'm going
to assume that you were probablyalso starting your own family
(19:26):
during that time or you know allof the family dynamics.
So you're navigating youracademic achievements or goals
and also family life.
How did you balance those twothings?
Because that's a huge struggle.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Well, some would say it was fortunate and some would
say it's not so fortunate.
But I didn't have children.
I was so busy with gettingeducated that I didn't have time
for children, and I also wentthrough two marriages that
(20:01):
didn't work, two marriages thatdidn't work and then finally,
toward the end, I married awonderful man and he has been so
supportive.
But I have gone through myeducation without children, but
with a lot of support fromfamily and eventually from my
(20:23):
husband.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
That is so awesome and, again, so relatable.
For so many people, it feelslike you touch on all these
different aspects of life thatyour readers can find so
relatable, whether it's, youknow, going for your career over
raising children, going throughdivorce, which is totally
(20:49):
relatable.
All of those experiences lendso much insight, and I think
it's always more valuablehearing somebody's story and
journey who's been through itand you know not, rather than
somebody who has not beenthrough it.
You touch on working in amorally questionable firm early
in your career, so how did thatexperience influence your
(21:12):
ethical compass and then later,your professional choices?
Because that's that's achallenge that also a lot of
people face.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
My first job was in a small firm only two people
actually and I came to realizethat these people didn't do what
I thought was an ethical job.
They offered the opportunityfor applicants to get a support
(21:46):
from a bank, but they offered todo this by going out to the
property and evaluating it.
Almost never did these lead toa mortgage, to a mortgage.
So I didn't like the kind ofthing that first job introduced
(22:08):
me to.
I was only 18, and I didn'tknow much about business.
So when I got into that firstjob, number one, I didn't know
how to dress professionally.
And then, as I observed thegoings on of that firm, I
(22:30):
realized that what they weredoing I thought was unethical.
So for that reason I resignedfrom that job and tried for
another job.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
That's actually really bold because you know
you're stepping into a lanewhere you have some financial
security and to choose, you knowyour moral compass over that
paycheck.
So you're 18, correct?
Yes, yeah, that's like.
Yeah, wow, that's amazing.
I want to ask you about this.
There's a scene where youovercome a deep-seated fear to
(23:13):
perform in an operetta as achild, which that alone.
I need to hear more about that,because that's wow in itself.
What advice would you give tosomeone that is paralyzed in
fear rooted in early lifeexperiences?
Speaker 3 (23:25):
It sounds like you've read the book and I thank you
for that.
The time you are referring towas about when I was 10 years
old and I was afraid of singing.
But the local people, thepriests and the nuns, were going
to put on an operetta.
(23:46):
They wanted me to sing solo.
Oh my God, that was so terrible, so frightening.
As a 10-year-old I heard theirencouragement, but it was still
very frightening.
Our encouragements, but it wasstill very frightening, I think
(24:08):
for people who are afraid.
they need to dig deep, findtheir dream and be willing to
push through the fear.
There's a book, an old book,called something about pushing
into our fear, in other words,getting that gumption that you
(24:29):
have and pressing forward.
It turns out, for most peoplethe fear is more imagined than
real.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Yeah, there's like a whole psychology to that too.
Right, that happens that youactually have to, you know,
almost verbally, switch off inyourself.
You know and tell yourselfright on this topic.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
But what happens for a lot of people?
They imagine things that aregoing to happen and they become
afraid of what could happen.
Most of the time those fears donot materialize.
(25:18):
It is possible to talk toyourself and encourage yourself
and push forward with positiveself-talk.
By doing that, you can becomeyour own supporter and it helps
by using positive self-talk thatsays you can do it, keep going
(25:43):
and keeping focused on what youwant to accomplish.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
It's like rewiring your brain, basically right,
yeah, yeah, I love that, and Iam definitely a person who has
had to, and has to, regularly doexactly that.
And the wild thing to me, joyce, is when you start hearing,
you're really listening toyourself and the things that you
say to yourself.
(26:10):
Like so many other people, Ithink in the world that we have
a tendency to self-sabotage withthe thoughts in our own head,
like you know, instead of saying, oh, you just made a mistake,
that's okay, move on from it andtry again.
You know, you're like I'm sostupid, you know.
Instead of saying, oh, you justmade a mistake, that's OK, move
on from it and try again.
You know you're like I'm sostupid, you know these are the
things and you're.
You're literally training yourbrain to believe that you're
(26:31):
stupid.
Right.
Speaker 3 (26:33):
Right.
When we criticize ourselveslike that, we become our own
worst enemy.
It's really important to keepthat negative self-talk
suppressed, and you do that bythinking more positive things,
in other words, focusing on whatyou have achieved and your
(26:58):
ability to do that.
So focusing on that kind ofthing helps with self-talk,
remembering your goal and usingthat goal as a incentive to keep
going.
So I'd say be careful, don'tget into self-criticism.
(27:21):
There's enough criticism in theworld.
You certainly don't need to doit to yourself.
Take courage, keep focused onwhat you want to achieve and
tell yourself I can do it.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
I love that.
I love that and it goes so farbeyond.
You know, people like to talkabout affirmations and you know
just like we're talking aboutand we forget how truly
important and life changing itis to do exactly that.
And I think, if people look atall of the people you know I
don't necessarily want to saysuccessful people, because
that's probably relative but youknow, if you look at somebody
(27:58):
who is doing something that youaspire to do, you know, imagine
yourself doing that instead ofsaying, you know I'll never be
able to do that, you know I'llnever be as good as them.
How about?
Okay, that's just my model ofwhat I want to do.
So I think you know yeah, Ihave to echo you the things that
we say to ourselves are soprofoundly important and
(28:21):
life-changing and can actuallyhelp us get on that path that we
want to be on.
You mentioned something aboutreading a moment ago, reading a
book or a book that you had read.
I see in my notes here that youmentioned that people often
joked that you couldn't doanything without reading a book
about it first.
And that is so much of yourstory is so relatable.
(28:44):
I was always, you know, teasedand kind of actually got yelled
at as a kid because I always hadmy nose in a book, like I never
, I never, not had a book.
Tell me a little bit about that, please.
Speaker 3 (29:13):
I have always loved books.
In fact, when I was about sixor seven, we lived in a second
floor apartment me to thesection on children's books and
I stayed there and I went backon my own repeatedly.
I love books and, yes, myparents my mother in particular
(29:36):
used to say oh, joyce can't doanything without reading a book.
She is so true.
In order to learn to write, Iread many books on how to write.
That was very helpful.
I also learned to write bywriting, as you well know,
(29:59):
because you help people who aretrying to write, maybe for the
first time.
So loving books and loving tolearn has been a motivator for
me.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Me too, me too, and like you, I remember, as a child
, going into the library and I'mnot saying it's necessarily the
very first books that I pickedout for myself, they're the
first ones.
I remember and are still mymost beloved treasures that I
have, and it's Beatrix Potter,the Peter Rabbit and all of
(30:35):
those beautiful, wonderfulstories and those gorgeous
illustrations.
And I remember walking into.
It was our elementary school.
Our elementary school had alittle library and we would go
in there and we'd get to pickout those books, right, and the
Joyce.
You brought back the memory ofthat right now and, like my
heart is so happy thinking aboutthat and just going and getting
(30:58):
to looking at all of those,those titles lined up on the
shelves, and knowing that therewas, you know, some kind of
magic or mystery or informationinside those books that was just
waiting for me.
And I have never lost thataffection for books.
And I think you just gave one ofthe absolute most important
(31:20):
bits of advice for new andaspiring authors.
When they ask you know how do Ibecome an author?
What do I do?
And you said it right thereread, read, read, read
voraciously.
Read everything, not just, notjust.
You know the genre that youwant to write in right.
Also, read all different typesof books because it just it
(31:42):
gives you those insights intotiming and cadence and pattern
and sentence structure and allof those things.
And I especially love your lovefor books.
Do you by any chance rememberlike your earliest favorite book
?
Speaker 3 (32:00):
Well, I remember.
I remember the book I think itwas called the the some kind of
rabbit, where the eyes of therabbit were buttons and one of
the buttons fell off so he onlyhad one eye the velveteen rabbit
, that was the name of it, and II remember that book because
(32:24):
that started my love of animals.
And the Velveteen Rabbit isabout being loved even if you're
not perfect, which is a messagethat we all need to get.
And speaking of writing, whichyou mentioned, it starts with an
(32:44):
idea, but in order to write,the person, the would-be writer,
has to dedicate time to dowriting.
When I started writing thismemoir, I started my writing
about seven o'clock in themorning and I would write until
(33:07):
lunchtime and then after lunchI'd write for another hour or
two.
Committing oneself to writingat a particular time most of the
days of the week is reallyimportant and something that a
lot of people who don't becomeauthors they think they can skip
(33:32):
that part.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
Yes, you're so right and I've talked to many people
about that very same thing.
It's so funny that you broughtthat up and we're so like minded
on that as well.
When I started writing, Ithought I could only write when,
like, the mood hit me and Ilearned, right, right, and I
learned very quickly that, no,you have to.
You have to train your, yourbrain, you know, and your body
(33:57):
to treat that as like, almostlike a job, as a nine to five
job, whatever the case.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Yeah right.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Yeah yeah it's.
It's such such a game changer,I want to ask you I'm talking
about where I'm getting us over,all over the the writing
process.
I want to talk a little bitmore about the things inside
your book that people willreally resonate with and, in
particular, listeners or readersthat are navigating chronic
(34:26):
illness or trauma.
What practical you know we'repulling in your psychology
degrees there.
We're pulling in yourpsychology degrees there.
What practical mindset shiftswould you suggest or strategies
do you most often recommend topeople?
Speaker 3 (34:40):
Well, trauma is a problem for a lot of people and,
depending on the trauma, thetreatment is different.
There are people who havewhat's called complex trauma,
meaning their trauma goes for along time.
(35:02):
For example, a child who isabused.
That doesn't happen just once.
That continues on for a periodof time.
Those people with complextrauma, which includes soldiers
that have returned from the war.
They need time to talk aboutthis with a person who can
(35:28):
listen and be there for them.
Many of these soldiers who comeback from war need to see a
psychologist for a long time toget over the trauma.
The same would be true for achild.
(35:48):
Although a child doesn't talk,a child plays, and so the
therapist would have the means,like a sand tray, for children
to act out their trauma.
(36:18):
But when we think of trauma, wecan think of abrupt trauma.
For example, some years ago wewere driving up a mountain and
coming down the mountain was avan that turned over almost in
front of us.
It turned out that this was avan of people who were mentally
ill and the driver had lost hisbrakes and the only way he was
(36:40):
able to save it was to drive upon the opposite bank and turn
over the van.
The van.
He did that and he and theother occupants were able to get
out the back door.
This was a trauma that he hadto deal with.
(37:03):
At first he couldn't even talkabout it.
I was there and I went up tohim and just was there, present
with him, so he wasn't justpresent with the trauma.
When there is what I'll call anaccidental or a short-term
(37:23):
trauma, it's helpful to talk tosomeone who understands trauma.
That's likely to be apsychologist or a therapist of
some sort, and in a safe spacethey have to talk about what
(37:48):
happened, their feelings and soforth.
So trauma is something thatneeds the ability to review it.
It's sort of like eatingsomething, eating a large dinner
and needing to digest it alittle bit at a time.
That's like trauma Eating toomuch and then being able to
(38:09):
consume a little bit at a time.
That's just an example, ananalogy, but the trauma itself
is too big to get over in aquick way.
Little by little, that traumagets incorporated into the mind
(38:32):
in a way that is helpful.
There are therapies that helppeople recover from trauma, and
one is EMDR, or eye movementsensitivity and retraining.
I'll tell you about that someother time, but it's very
(38:55):
helpful for trauma.
Speaker 2 (38:58):
It's just amazing the advances that have come over
the years in helping peoplethrough trauma, through life's
difficulties that obviouslyshape every aspect of who we are
and how we operate and functionin the world.
So I have great admiration forthe work that you do and you've
done for others and now, ofcourse, through this book and
(39:22):
just you know this whole otheravenue, and I'll quickly mention
too you have multiple.
Is it 10 books?
I think 10 books you'vepublished.
Yes, thank you.
Yeah, the memoir is my 11thbook?
Speaker 3 (39:58):
Yes, thank you.
The memoir is my 11th book.
The 10 books I have writtenbefore that are all
traditionally published, and Itold you what that means the
publisher takes theresponsibility for publishing
and promoting the book.
So my first 10 books the firstone was published in 1976.
The last one was published twoyears ago.
So I have those 10 booksavailable to see on my website,
which is joycenashcom, and Ihave more information about my
memoir on the website.
So I encourage your listenersto go to my website and read
(40:24):
more about all of my books.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
You took the words right out of my mouth.
It's like you knew I was goingto ask you to share with
everybody that information sothey knew where to find you.
And, by the way, your websiteis beautiful, it's a wonderful
website and you know just andyour books.
They're all in my to be readlist.
I don't know if you're like me,I have a very long to be read
book.
We call it the TBR right?
(40:48):
Our TBR list is, and those arein it too.
I look forward to reading thosebecause they they are clearly a
wealth of insight andinspiration and information, of
course, on just.
You know tools and tips toimprove your life in various
ways.
So I think that's absolutelywonderful and and I so applaud
(41:08):
you on your incredible,illustrious career and your
prolific authorship Justincredible and again I'll use
the word again such aninspiration.
Do you have any last messageyou'd like to give to our
viewers and our listeners tohelp them on their journey?
Speaker 3 (41:28):
Well, the most important thing is don't talk
yourself out of a dream.
Have your dreams, follow yourdreams.
Of course, we all have dreams,but usually there's one that
stands out.
Be willing to take that dreamunder your wing, so to speak,
(41:54):
and follow it wherever it goes.
Be willing to sacrifice certainthings, like time, to get what
you want.
So take your dreams, followthem and take them from hope to
reality.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
I love that.
That is beautiful.
Dr Joyce Nash, I cannot thankyou enough for joining me for
this wonderful interview.
I enjoyed spending this timewith you so much.
I look forward to reading yourother books and for our viewers
and listeners, of course, I willbe putting all of those links
in our show notes and I thankall of you for watching and we
(42:38):
will see you guys in the nextepisode.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
She's the voice behind the viral comedy bold
commentary and truth packedinterviews that cut through the
chaos.
Author.
Brand creator.
Proud conservative Christian,this is Elsa Kurt.
Welcome to the show that alwaysbrings bold faith, real truth
and no apologies.
She's the voice behind the viral comedy bold
commentary and truth-packedinterviews that cut through the
chaos.
Author.
Brand creator.
Proud conservative Christian,this is Elsa Kurt.
Welcome to the show that alwaysbrings bold faith, real truth
and no apologies.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Well, hello everyone.
Today we are doing a veryspecial interview.
I am so excited to bring on myguest.
She is Dr Joyce D Nash, and sheis a pioneering clinical
psychologist, healthcommunicator and award-winning
author, whose multi-decadecareer has focused on empowering
people to understand theirbehaviors and to heal from
(00:42):
emotional wounds and reclaimagency over their lives.
That is so huge, and in herlatest book, realizing a Dream,
finding Passion in a Career, drNash shares her deeply personal
journey of transformation andthe lifelong pursuit of meaning,
bringing together herprofessional expertise, her
resilience and creative voice.
(01:02):
And she now continues her workthrough writing and community
engagement, speaking candidlyabout neurodivergence, chronic
illness, trauma and radical care.
Dr Nash, it is so nice to haveyou here.
Thank you for joining me.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
So glad, Elsa.
I'm looking forward to talkingto your audience.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Thank you very much.
So you hit on some topics thatI especially love talking about,
but I want to talk to you alittle bit about you primarily,
and your book and that wholeprocess.
So I would love to know yourjourney into earning not just
one but two PhDs.
That is really inspiring,especially for an academic
(01:49):
slacker like myself.
So tell me a little bit aboutthat, would you?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Well, I started my education really early on as a
child, watching other childrengo into school, and I wanted to
go into school but I wasn't oldenough.
I finally got there and therest of the story for that is in
(02:15):
my memoir, realizing a Dream.
But when I got to high school Iwanted to go to college, but
there wasn't enough money in myfamily for that to happen.
A decade later I discoveredthat I could go to night school
at the University of Pittsburgh.
(02:36):
So I started that, even thoughit would take a long time.
It would take a long time.
It was at least a start.
Then a professor said to me youreally ought to quit night
school and go full time.
I said to him I can't afford it.
(02:58):
He said if you really want to,you can do it.
Well, that was an inspiration.
From there I applied forscholarships and, to my surprise
, got two scholarships and thattook me to Southern Illinois
University.
I finished my undergraduatedegree there and was planning on
(03:21):
going back home to get a job.
One of my advisors at SIU saidyou really ought to go to
graduate school.
To satisfy him, mostly Iapplied to graduate schools for
a PhD program.
I didn't realize that I neededa master's degree to go into a
(03:47):
PhD program.
So I applied and, to mysurprise, I was invited to go my
PhD in communication in 1976.
But a long-held dream for mewas to be a psychologist.
(04:16):
But I was in the communicationdepartment, not the psychology
department.
So I graduated from thecommunication department with my
first doctorate, but I keptremembering my dream of being a
psychologist.
(04:36):
Ten years later I discoveredthere was a school where we
lived that trained people to beclinical psychologists.
So I enrolled.
Six years later I was awarded aPhD in clinical psychology, but
(04:57):
it took me two more yearsbefore I was licensed.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Before I was licensed .
After that I practiced for 25years and have been writing
books ever since.
That's amazing.
What an incredible journey ofjust perseverance really,
because that is such a longprocess, it's so taxing.
Of course, you mentioned thefinancial struggles of that,
which you know, and thesacrifice that comes with that
I'm sure is, is incredible.
Tell me a little bit about whatdrew you to psychology.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
You know I was 21.
I remember exactly where I waswhen I had the idea that I
wanted to become a psychologist.
I was walking by the dorms ofUniversity of Pittsburgh and at
that point I thought I'd like tobe a psychologist.
(05:57):
Maybe that would help meunderstand some of the people in
my life, particularly my mother.
So that was my inspiration.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
That's beautiful, it really is, and I think it's so
powerful and impactful on yourown life to gain that kind of
understanding, because I thinkwhen you have challenging family
members or just people in yourlife, relationships in your life
, that you struggle withrelating to them or
understanding them and maybeeven sometimes loving them
(06:32):
because of the challenges thatthey bring into your life, so to
be, I think, to be able tounderstand where they're coming
from and the psychology of theirbehavior, I would imagine it
helps give forgiveness if it'sneeded to give, and just that
understanding.
I find the field of psychologyabsolutely fascinating.
(06:53):
The study of people and humanbehavior obviously is so
fascinating to me and, like Imentioned, I was not
academic-minded enough to dowhat you've done, so I have so
much admiration for all of that.
I want to switch gears a littlebit and ask you a little bit
more about your book.
Now you have a deeply movingpart in your book where you had
(07:14):
to choose between continuing onthat prestigious path or chasing
your longten dreams.
So what helped you make thatleap of faith?
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Well, what helped me change from my first PhD to
seeking another PhD was Irealized that at Stanford I was
being taught to become aprofessor, and the reality was I
(07:52):
didn't want to become aprofessor although it would have
been a very challengingoccupation but instead I had
this long-held dream to become apsychologist.
It took me another decade toundertake the information to
(08:18):
become a clinical psychologist.
What I did was follow along-held dream.
I detail that in my memoirRealizing a decide.
Did I want to reveal so manypersonal things?
(08:50):
I thought about that a lot andin the end I decided that I
hoped my journey would inspireothers to follow their dream and
bring it from hope to reality.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I love that kind of encouragement because I think
that's exactly what holds somany people back, particularly
since we're talking aboutwriting and writing your memoir
and sharing such personalinformation to the world, really
, and just opening yourself upfor that type of scrutiny.
I think there's so many peoplewho would and will and can
benefit from doing that, whetherthey write it for publishing or
(09:33):
for their own sake.
Right?
Would you encourage people todo exactly that, even if it's
just for themselves?
I personally feel that writingis just so cathartic and I think
when you read back what you'vewritten, it's so revealing to
how you feel.
Would you agree with that?
Oh, definitely.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
You know, the whole writing industry has changed so
much since my first book in 1976.
Since my first book in 1976.
These days a writer, or apotential writer, needs to think
about what kind of book theywant to write.
The traditional publisher wantsto publish a non-fiction book.
(10:26):
A non-fiction book, like myfirst and my second
dissertations, requires researchand the publisher will take on
the job of promoting the book.
But another kind of book thatwriters think about is
(10:48):
self-publishing.
That wasn't available to me in1976 when my first book came out
, and I did try twoself-published books, which are
no longer available, but at thattime I gave that a try.
The kind of publishing mycurrent memoir Realizing a Dream
(11:14):
is published under is what'scalled a hybrid publisher.
That means that the publisherand I cooperate to bring the
memoir to people's attention.
That requires a lot of efforton the writer's table, and so
(11:38):
the writer needs to really getacquainted with how they can
promote their book.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yes, that is so true and you're so right.
The industry and the optionshave changed so dramatically.
You said you wrote your firstbook in the 70s.
So I mean the changes that havehappened since then and I think
it was probably so much harderthen to get published, to
publish because these optionsweren't even available then.
(12:09):
But I agree with you so muchthat you know you really, as a
writer, if you're going toself-publish in particular, you
really do need, you owe it toyourself to learn all of these
aspects and understand whatyou're getting into and these
options and what they mean.
I know there have been peopleyou know you'll know this term
maybe some of our viewersweren't but the pop-up of like
(12:32):
vanity presses, you know, reallycaused a lot of harm to novice
writers and prospective authorswho kind of got taken advantage
of.
So, knowing you know whatyou're doing and what you're
getting into, I just love thatkind of got taken advantage of,
so knowing you know what you'redoing and what you're getting
into, and I just love that kindof encouragement that you give
to you know prospective authorson their own journeys.
That's invaluable.
(12:52):
If you wouldn't mind, I'd liketo wrap back around a little bit
, though, to your journey.
So, throughout your journey,your family dynamics, especially
with your mother.
You mentioned they played ahuge role.
So how did your upbringingaffect the way that you
approached independence andcareer ambition?
Speaker 3 (13:13):
That's a good question and my family for the
most part was very happy andvery encouraging.
In fact, I remember my motherused to say Joyce, you can be
anything, you can even be adoctor.
So that was helpful toencourage me to move on.
(13:34):
It was difficult for me when Icouldn't go to college right
after high school, but I didwhat I could and I got jobs and
I waited for the opportunity tocontinue.
That's when I discovered theUniversity of Pittsburgh had
(13:56):
night classes.
So I enrolled in the nightclasses and because my family
had been so encouraging, Icontinued with night classes
until I transferred to SouthernIllinois University.
My family was very supportive,even though they couldn't help
(14:20):
much financially.
I made up for that by applyingfor scholarships and to my
surprise I got two scholarshipsthat helped me along.
Plus I applied for and got someloans so that I could go off to
(14:42):
college.
So my family was verysupportive of that and it was
wonderful when they came to mygraduation at SIU.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Wow, that is amazing.
Now your title, the title ofyour book Realizing a Dream.
It speaks to awakening longdormant desires and, as a woman
who is now in her 50s and didnot start her writing journey
and her podcasting all of thethings that I do now in the
public eye I didn't start thisjourney until I was in my mid
(15:17):
40s, so I consider myself a latestarter, a late bloomer.
You can call it whatever youwant.
That's what I tend to call it.
Starter, a late bloomer, youcan call it whatever you want.
That's what I tend to call it,and it was based on or the
reasoning was because a lot ofthe things that you touch on,
really, which is so impactfulfor me fear, oh my gosh, let's,
let's just.
We can wrap it all up with fear, fear of the unknown, self
(15:38):
doubt.
You know all of those things.
I would love to know, assomebody who has been doing all
of these things for decades now,despite fear and despite things
that may have held you back.
I would love to know what youwould say to women in their 40s
and in their 50s or even beyond,who feel like it's too late.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
I have one thing to say Never give up.
That's the message in my memoir.
Follow your dream, be willingto put up with the setbacks and
carry on, even if things seem toget difficult.
Never give up.
(16:20):
It's your dream, you can takeit to reality.
Make it your testament to lifeto you.
So never give up, you can do it.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Yes, yes, I love that , I love that and I would echo
you on that a thousand timesover.
I think, and maybe you'll agreewith me I think the fear of
what's to come or what might be,is so much worse than what
actually does.
And I know from personalexperience, like all of my fear
(16:54):
of failing, of falling, all ofthose things and it's not that
they haven't happened I'vedefinitely failed, I've
definitely fallen, I've mademistakes, I've embarrassed
myself and you know all of thosethings.
But the thing that I get tocome away with and maybe you can
say the same is that when Ilook back at those failings and
those falls and all of thosethings, I can say, yeah, but I
(17:16):
got back up and I'm fine, likethe world didn't end.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
The sky didn't fall.
I you know, yeah, I had to dustmyself off, but I was able to
dust myself off and I think thatis so powerful for any
individual and not even not ifyou're just, you know, not even
just if you're in your 40s andyour 50s and beyond For anyone
at any stage.
If you're facing that fear,right, Right, yes, I love that.
Rising to a challenge does takesome courage and there are
setbacks, but you can overcomesetbacks.
And even though I started myjourney really late, I was 28
years old before I startedschool at the University of
Pittsburgh.
When I graduated from SouthernIllinois University, I was 31.
(18:12):
I was 31 when I started atStanford and so a decade later I
graduated from Stanford with myfirst PhD.
So it's been a long journey,and added to that was my journey
to become a psychologist.
(18:32):
So I hope readers will takeaway inspiration and courage to
follow their path wherever itmight lead.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Absolutely, and I believe that they will.
In reading that you know,reading a firsthand testimony of
going through all the things,and you know you talk about
trauma, childhood trauma, thefears and all of those things
which is so relatable to all ofus, and you know to see those
steps, to see somebody who hastaken those steps and made those
(19:06):
strides despite those obstacles.
Tell me a little bit.
So you said that you were 28and then when you started right,
and then 31 when you graduated.
During that time and I hate tomake assumptions, but I'm going
to assume that you were probablyalso starting your own family
(19:26):
during that time or you know allof the family dynamics.
So you're navigating youracademic achievements or goals
and also family life.
How did you balance those twothings?
Because that's a huge struggle.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Well, some would say it was fortunate and some would
say it's not so fortunate.
But I didn't have children.
I was so busy with gettingeducated that I didn't have time
for children, and I also wentthrough two marriages that
(20:01):
didn't work, two marriages thatdidn't work and then finally,
toward the end, I married awonderful man and he has been so
supportive.
But I have gone through myeducation without children, but
with a lot of support fromfamily and eventually from my
(20:23):
husband.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
That is so awesome and, again, so relatable.
For so many people, it feelslike you touch on all these
different aspects of life thatyour readers can find so
relatable, whether it's, youknow, going for your career over
raising children, going throughdivorce, which is totally
(20:49):
relatable.
All of those experiences lendso much insight, and I think
it's always more valuablehearing somebody's story and
journey who's been through itand you know not, rather than
somebody who has not beenthrough it.
You touch on working in amorally questionable firm early
in your career, so how did thatexperience influence your
(21:12):
ethical compass and then later,your professional choices?
Because that's that's achallenge that also a lot of
people face.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
My first job was in a small firm only two people
actually and I came to realizethat these people didn't do what
I thought was an ethical job.
They offered the opportunityfor applicants to get a support
(21:46):
from a bank, but they offered todo this by going out to the
property and evaluating it.
Almost never did these lead toa mortgage, to a mortgage.
So I didn't like the kind ofthing that first job introduced
(22:08):
me to.
I was only 18, and I didn'tknow much about business.
So when I got into that firstjob, number one, I didn't know
how to dress professionally.
And then, as I observed thegoings on of that firm, I
(22:30):
realized that what they weredoing I thought was unethical.
So for that reason I resignedfrom that job and tried for
another job.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
That's actually really bold because you know
you're stepping into a lanewhere you have some financial
security and to choose, you knowyour moral compass over that
paycheck.
So you're 18, correct?
Yes, yeah, that's like.
Yeah, wow, that's amazing.
I want to ask you about this.
There's a scene where youovercome a deep-seated fear to
(23:13):
perform in an operetta as achild, which that alone.
I need to hear more about that,because that's wow in itself.
What advice would you give tosomeone that is paralyzed in
fear rooted in early lifeexperiences?
Speaker 3 (23:25):
It sounds like you've read the book and I thank you
for that.
The time you are referring towas about when I was 10 years
old and I was afraid of singing.
But the local people, thepriests and the nuns, were going
to put on an operetta.
(23:46):
They wanted me to sing solo.
Oh my God, that was so terrible, so frightening.
As a 10-year-old I heard theirencouragement, but it was still
very frightening.
Our encouragements, but it wasstill very frightening, I think
(24:08):
for people who are afraid.
they need to dig deep, findtheir dream and be willing to
push through the fear.
There's a book, an old book,called something about pushing
into our fear, in other words,getting that gumption that you
(24:29):
have and pressing forward.
It turns out, for most peoplethe fear is more imagined than
real.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Yeah, there's like a whole psychology to that too.
Right, that happens that youactually have to, you know,
almost verbally, switch off inyourself.
You know and tell yourselfright on this topic.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
But what happens for a lot of people?
They imagine things that aregoing to happen and they become
afraid of what could happen.
Most of the time those fears donot materialize.
(25:18):
It is possible to talk toyourself and encourage yourself
and push forward with positiveself-talk.
By doing that, you can becomeyour own supporter and it helps
by using positive self-talk thatsays you can do it, keep going
(25:43):
and keeping focused on what youwant to accomplish.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
It's like rewiring your brain, basically right,
yeah, yeah, I love that, and Iam definitely a person who has
had to, and has to, regularly doexactly that.
And the wild thing to me, joyce, is when you start hearing,
you're really listening toyourself and the things that you
say to yourself.
(26:10):
Like so many other people, Ithink in the world that we have
a tendency to self-sabotage withthe thoughts in our own head,
like you know, instead of saying, oh, you just made a mistake,
that's okay, move on from it andtry again.
You know, you're like I'm sostupid, you know.
Instead of saying, oh, you justmade a mistake, that's OK, move
on from it and try again.
You know you're like I'm sostupid, you know these are the
things and you're.
You're literally training yourbrain to believe that you're
(26:31):
stupid.
Right.
Speaker 3 (26:33):
Right.
When we criticize ourselveslike that, we become our own
worst enemy.
It's really important to keepthat negative self-talk
suppressed, and you do that bythinking more positive things,
in other words, focusing on whatyou have achieved and your
(26:58):
ability to do that.
So focusing on that kind ofthing helps with self-talk,
remembering your goal and usingthat goal as a incentive to keep
going.
So I'd say be careful, don'tget into self-criticism.
(27:21):
There's enough criticism in theworld.
You certainly don't need to doit to yourself.
Take courage, keep focused onwhat you want to achieve and
tell yourself I can do it.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
I love that.
I love that and it goes so farbeyond.
You know, people like to talkabout affirmations and you know
just like we're talking aboutand we forget how truly
important and life changing itis to do exactly that.
And I think, if people look atall of the people you know I
don't necessarily want to saysuccessful people, because
that's probably relative but youknow, if you look at somebody
(27:58):
who is doing something that youaspire to do, you know, imagine
yourself doing that instead ofsaying, you know I'll never be
able to do that, you know I'llnever be as good as them.
How about?
Okay, that's just my model ofwhat I want to do.
So I think you know yeah, Ihave to echo you the things that
we say to ourselves are soprofoundly important and
(28:21):
life-changing and can actuallyhelp us get on that path that we
want to be on.
You mentioned something aboutreading a moment ago, reading a
book or a book that you had read.
I see in my notes here that youmentioned that people often
joked that you couldn't doanything without reading a book
about it first.
And that is so much of yourstory is so relatable.
(28:44):
I was always, you know, teasedand kind of actually got yelled
at as a kid because I always hadmy nose in a book, like I never
, I never, not had a book.
Tell me a little bit about that, please.
Speaker 3 (29:13):
I have always loved books.
In fact, when I was about sixor seven, we lived in a second
floor apartment me to thesection on children's books and
I stayed there and I went backon my own repeatedly.
I love books and, yes, myparents my mother in particular
(29:36):
used to say oh, joyce can't doanything without reading a book.
She is so true.
In order to learn to write, Iread many books on how to write.
That was very helpful.
I also learned to write bywriting, as you well know,
(29:59):
because you help people who aretrying to write, maybe for the
first time.
So loving books and loving tolearn has been a motivator for
me.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Me too, me too, and like you, I remember, as a child
, going into the library and I'mnot saying it's necessarily the
very first books that I pickedout for myself, they're the
first ones.
I remember and are still mymost beloved treasures that I
have, and it's Beatrix Potter,the Peter Rabbit and all of
(30:35):
those beautiful, wonderfulstories and those gorgeous
illustrations.
And I remember walking into.
It was our elementary school.
Our elementary school had alittle library and we would go
in there and we'd get to pickout those books, right, and the
Joyce.
You brought back the memory ofthat right now and, like my
heart is so happy thinking aboutthat and just going and getting
(30:58):
to looking at all of those,those titles lined up on the
shelves, and knowing that therewas, you know, some kind of
magic or mystery or informationinside those books that was just
waiting for me.
And I have never lost thataffection for books.
And I think you just gave one ofthe absolute most important
(31:20):
bits of advice for new andaspiring authors.
When they ask you know how do Ibecome an author?
What do I do?
And you said it right thereread, read, read, read
voraciously.
Read everything, not just, notjust.
You know the genre that youwant to write in right.
Also, read all different typesof books because it just it
(31:42):
gives you those insights intotiming and cadence and pattern
and sentence structure and allof those things.
And I especially love your lovefor books.
Do you by any chance rememberlike your earliest favorite book
?
Speaker 3 (32:00):
Well, I remember.
I remember the book I think itwas called the the some kind of
rabbit, where the eyes of therabbit were buttons and one of
the buttons fell off so he onlyhad one eye the velveteen rabbit
, that was the name of it, and II remember that book because
(32:24):
that started my love of animals.
And the Velveteen Rabbit isabout being loved even if you're
not perfect, which is a messagethat we all need to get.
And speaking of writing, whichyou mentioned, it starts with an
(32:44):
idea, but in order to write,the person, the would-be writer,
has to dedicate time to dowriting.
When I started writing thismemoir, I started my writing
about seven o'clock in themorning and I would write until
(33:07):
lunchtime and then after lunchI'd write for another hour or
two.
Committing oneself to writingat a particular time most of the
days of the week is reallyimportant and something that a
lot of people who don't becomeauthors they think they can skip
(33:32):
that part.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
Yes, you're so right and I've talked to many people
about that very same thing.
It's so funny that you broughtthat up and we're so like minded
on that as well.
When I started writing, Ithought I could only write when,
like, the mood hit me and Ilearned, right, right, and I
learned very quickly that, no,you have to.
You have to train your, yourbrain, you know, and your body
(33:57):
to treat that as like, almostlike a job, as a nine to five
job, whatever the case.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Yeah right.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Yeah yeah it's.
It's such such a game changer,I want to ask you I'm talking
about where I'm getting us over,all over the the writing
process.
I want to talk a little bitmore about the things inside
your book that people willreally resonate with and, in
particular, listeners or readersthat are navigating chronic
(34:26):
illness or trauma.
What practical you know we'repulling in your psychology
degrees there.
We're pulling in yourpsychology degrees there.
What practical mindset shiftswould you suggest or strategies
do you most often recommend topeople?
Speaker 3 (34:40):
Well, trauma is a problem for a lot of people and,
depending on the trauma, thetreatment is different.
There are people who havewhat's called complex trauma,
meaning their trauma goes for along time.
(35:02):
For example, a child who isabused.
That doesn't happen just once.
That continues on for a periodof time.
Those people with complextrauma, which includes soldiers
that have returned from the war.
They need time to talk aboutthis with a person who can
(35:28):
listen and be there for them.
Many of these soldiers who comeback from war need to see a
psychologist for a long time toget over the trauma.
The same would be true for achild.
(35:48):
Although a child doesn't talk,a child plays, and so the
therapist would have the means,like a sand tray, for children
to act out their trauma.
(36:18):
But when we think of trauma, wecan think of abrupt trauma.
For example, some years ago wewere driving up a mountain and
coming down the mountain was avan that turned over almost in
front of us.
It turned out that this was avan of people who were mentally
ill and the driver had lost hisbrakes and the only way he was
(36:40):
able to save it was to drive upon the opposite bank and turn
over the van.
The van.
He did that and he and theother occupants were able to get
out the back door.
This was a trauma that he hadto deal with.
(37:03):
At first he couldn't even talkabout it.
I was there and I went up tohim and just was there, present
with him, so he wasn't justpresent with the trauma.
When there is what I'll call anaccidental or a short-term
(37:23):
trauma, it's helpful to talk tosomeone who understands trauma.
That's likely to be apsychologist or a therapist of
some sort, and in a safe spacethey have to talk about what
(37:48):
happened, their feelings and soforth.
So trauma is something thatneeds the ability to review it.
It's sort of like eatingsomething, eating a large dinner
and needing to digest it alittle bit at a time.
That's like trauma Eating toomuch and then being able to
(38:09):
consume a little bit at a time.
That's just an example, ananalogy, but the trauma itself
is too big to get over in aquick way.
Little by little, that traumagets incorporated into the mind
(38:32):
in a way that is helpful.
There are therapies that helppeople recover from trauma, and
one is EMDR, or eye movementsensitivity and retraining.
I'll tell you about that someother time, but it's very
(38:55):
helpful for trauma.
Speaker 2 (38:58):
It's just amazing the advances that have come over
the years in helping peoplethrough trauma, through life's
difficulties that obviouslyshape every aspect of who we are
and how we operate and functionin the world.
So I have great admiration forthe work that you do and you've
done for others and now, ofcourse, through this book and
(39:22):
just you know this whole otheravenue, and I'll quickly mention
too you have multiple.
Is it 10 books?
I think 10 books you'vepublished.
Yes, thank you.
Yeah, the memoir is my 11thbook?
Speaker 3 (39:58):
Yes, thank you.
The memoir is my 11th book.
The 10 books I have writtenbefore that are all
traditionally published, and Itold you what that means the
publisher takes theresponsibility for publishing
and promoting the book.
So my first 10 books the firstone was published in 1976.
The last one was published twoyears ago.
So I have those 10 booksavailable to see on my website,
which is joycenashcom, and Ihave more information about my
memoir on the website.
So I encourage your listenersto go to my website and read
(40:24):
more about all of my books.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
You took the words right out of my mouth.
It's like you knew I was goingto ask you to share with
everybody that information sothey knew where to find you.
And, by the way, your websiteis beautiful, it's a wonderful
website and you know just andyour books.
They're all in my to be readlist.
I don't know if you're like me,I have a very long to be read
book.
We call it the TBR right?
(40:48):
Our TBR list is, and those arein it too.
I look forward to reading thosebecause they they are clearly a
wealth of insight andinspiration and information, of
course, on just.
You know tools and tips toimprove your life in various
ways.
So I think that's absolutelywonderful and and I so applaud
(41:08):
you on your incredible,illustrious career and your
prolific authorship Justincredible and again I'll use
the word again such aninspiration.
Do you have any last messageyou'd like to give to our
viewers and our listeners tohelp them on their journey?
Speaker 3 (41:28):
Well, the most important thing is don't talk
yourself out of a dream.
Have your dreams, follow yourdreams.
Of course, we all have dreams,but usually there's one that
stands out.
Be willing to take that dreamunder your wing, so to speak,
(41:54):
and follow it wherever it goes.
Be willing to sacrifice certainthings, like time, to get what
you want.
So take your dreams, followthem and take them from hope to
reality.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
I love that.
That is beautiful.
Dr Joyce Nash, I cannot thankyou enough for joining me for
this wonderful interview.
I enjoyed spending this timewith you so much.
I look forward to reading yourother books and for our viewers
and listeners, of course, I willbe putting all of those links
in our show notes and I thankall of you for watching and we
(42:38):
will see you guys in the nextepisode.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
She's the voice behind the viral comedy bold
commentary and truth packedinterviews that cut through the
chaos.
Author.
Brand creator.
Proud conservative Christian,this is Elsa Kurt.
Welcome to the show that alwaysbrings bold faith, real truth
and no apologies.
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