September 15, 2025 • 43 mins
Clyde Simpson shares his powerful insights on spiritual growth and development, offering a clear roadmap for Christians to move from spiritual infancy to full maturity through proper understanding of Scripture.
• The vast majority (99%) of Christians never progress beyond spiritual infancy due to lack of proper teaching
• Romans provides the foundational doctrine for Christian growth, with Corinthians offering reproof and Galatians providing correction
• Understanding which books of the Bible were written specifically to Gentile believers versus Jewish believers provides crucial context
• The growth process follows three steps: understanding God's love (Romans 1-9), responding to that love (Romans 10), and being transformed (Romans 12)
• Christians often take Scripture out of context because they're taught to jump between different passages without understanding their purpose
• Spiritual growth happens automatically when believers plant the Word in their hearts and renew their minds
• Christ's sacrifice addresses wholeness in all three dimensions: spiritual, mental, and physical
• Moving beyond spiritual infancy requires a clear understanding of doctrine before advancing to deeper teachings
Find Clyde Simpson's books, including "Spiritual Growth and Development from Babe to Full Maturity" and "Christian Leadership: Honor, Reverence and Respect for God in His Word" on Amazon or at ClydeSimpsonBooks.com.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
She's the voice behind the viral comedy.
Bold commentary andtruth-packed interviews that cut
through the chaos.
Author.
Brand creator.
Proud conservative Christian.
This is Elsa Kurt.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Welcome to the show that always brings bold faith,
real truth and no apologies.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Oh, hello, hello and welcome to our interview series
Today's guest.
I am so excited for I feel likeI just get to sit back and just
get this wonderful, amazinglesson that you all get to be a
part of too.
I have with me Clyde Simpson.
He is the author of SpiritualGrowth and Development from Babe
to Full Maturity.
(00:39):
Welcome to the show.
Thank you so much for coming ontoday.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
You're very welcome.
I'm blessed to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Thank you.
Thank you.
I'm blessed to have you herebecause, as the people who watch
and listen to me know, I callmyself rightly a baby Christian.
I think I will live and die asa baby Christian.
I started late in life to justanswer this calling to faith and
(01:07):
to God and to respond to Hiscall on my life.
And now I'm playing this bigfat game of catch up are going
to give me some information andour viewers and listeners some
lessons and ways to, I guess Iwant to say, learn better if
(01:31):
that makes any sense.
So tell me, let's start rightwith the title from Babe Through
Full Maturity.
What does that mean?
Speaker 2 (01:41):
It means, from the moment that you accept Christ,
you are a babe in Christ,according to the word, and in
order to mature, you must learnabout what it is that you've
received, learn about God andhis word and what is expected of
you and what your capabilitiesare.
What does this born again thingmean?
(02:02):
You know, you said somethingthat is very striking.
You said you are a babe inChrist and you're under the
impression that it's going totake you a while to get to where
you need to be.
Let me say this Ninety ninepercent this is a very bold
statement.
Ninety nine percent ofChristians, people who call
themselves Christians, livetheir entire lives and never
(02:25):
make it out of the babe inChrist state.
There is a reason for that.
Unfortunately.
There's a very unfortunatereason for that, but the way to
overcome that is just to knowthe truth, and unfortunately,
this particular basic truth isnot being taught.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah, I think you're right.
You know, and I think maybewhat happens is we, as baby
Christians, we get sooverwhelmed and we don't quite
know where to start.
Do you start, literally, at thebeginning of the Bible, Do you
start with Genesis or do youstart with the New Testament?
(03:07):
You hear what I'm saying?
There's so many or or or and Ithink so many of us, myself
included, need somebody to situs down, virtually literally,
whatever the case is, and sayhere's where you start.
You know.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
One of the questions in my book at the very beginning
is a question that I am awarethat I, as well as many other
Christians, ask where do I start?
Well, my book answers thatquestion, because in the Bible,
you can learn, we can learn fromanything in the Bible.
(03:44):
That's plenty to learn, but theentire Bible was not addressed
directly to us, for instance,genesis.
There's nothing in Genesisregarding being born again.
There's information that we canlearn to find out, to learn
about God and his word and thehistorical functioning between
(04:07):
his, the way he interacted withhumans, with mankind.
You can learn much about that.
You can learn about his natureand things of that, of that
course, but that does not helpus, for the most part, to know
what it is we're supposed to doas babes in christ.
(04:28):
Well, as babes in christ, weare given doctrine, in fact.
In fact, this is where we wouldstart.
Where is it in the word that welearn how to become a christian
?
That's a very good question.
The answer is romans.
This is where we learn tobecome a Christian.
Some might say well, you learnin gospel.
(04:49):
No, no, you don't.
There is no one born again inthe gospels.
It wasn't available to be bornagain in the gospels.
It wasn't available until theday of Pentecost, which is in
Acts, which is literally adocumentary of the events that
the apostles went through.
The Acts of the Apostles is thename of that particular
documentary, but the first bookof doctrine to the believer is
(05:15):
the book of Romans.
I'm talking about the Gentilebelievers, because there are two
processes that we find in theNew Testament.
There are two processes that wefind in the New Testament.
One is to Israel.
One process is to Israel.
The other process is to theGentiles.
As we know, paul's ministry wasto the Gentiles.
His ministry was not to Israel,although he did write, for
(05:38):
instance, hebrews to Israel, buthis ministry was not to Israel.
That was the job of the otherapostles.
So you will find, however, thepurpose of all scriptures for
doctrine, reproof and correction, which is instruction in
righteousness that the man ofGod may be perfect, thoroughly
(05:59):
furnished or throughly furnishedunto all good works.
In other words, we're to havethrough the furnace unto all
good works.
In other words, we're to have,by learning scripture,
understanding scripture, we'resupposed to be fully equipped to
do everything that God expectsof us.
But if we're not taught thosethings, if we're not taught that
Romans, through Thessalonians,fall into the categories of
(06:22):
doctrine reproof, correctiondoctrine, reproof, correction
Doctrine, reproof, correctionDoctrine.
If we're not taught that we gointo those epistles not really
knowing what to expect, eventhough we see who they're
addressed to.
I could go on, but I'm going toallow you to moderate this.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Well, it's just so fascinating to me, as you're
saying this, it's just sofascinating to me, Like you know
, as you're saying this, it'smaking me think of, like all the
challenges that we as whetheryou're a baby Christian, as I
call myself, or a seasonedChristian, as I've heard the
term used, you know, I feel likewe just there's so many
(07:02):
different challenges we face,Like in your opinion, like what
is the?
I don't know.
I guess that the.
If there's a foundation of ourchallenges, would you say, it's
that that we just simply don'tunderstand these aspects of
these lessons of the Bible, oris it something external?
(07:25):
What are we facing right now?
That's probably like ourbiggest challenge or obstacle as
Christians.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
The biggest problem is our leaders do not recognize
Romans as the foundational truthfor our beliefs.
If you don't, let me ask youthis let's say you have a child
who's reached the age of six,ready, ready to start school,
right?
So you enroll that child inschool in first grade.
(07:52):
You leave him or her there forone month and then you switch
them to the sixth grade for onemonth, then the third grade for
one month, then the fifth gradefor one month, second grade for
one month, fourth grade for onemonth, and that is the pattern.
(08:13):
What do you think the outcomeof that child's mentality would
be?
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Mm-hmm, yeah, absolutely Totally confused.
Yeah, completely confused Right.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Because the foundation, they will not grasp
the foundation.
But this is exactly whathappens to us when we go to
church.
We're dragged all over theplace from one place to another
and we're not taught that Romansis doctrine, the first book of
doctrine.
We're not taught thatCorinthians is the book of
reproof Back to the doctrine ofRomans.
(08:44):
We're not taught that Galatiansis correction back to the
doctrine of Romans.
We're not taught that Galatiansis correction back to the
doctrine of Romans.
There are things going on inthose epistles that Paul has to
deal with to direct them back toRomans.
And unless we, as believersborn again, believers bathed in
Christ, if we do not master thebasic foundational doctrine of
(09:05):
Romans, it is impossible for usto grasp the principles of
Ephesians.
It's not just challenging orjust difficult, it is impossible
because you cannot go into.
Paul even called Corinthiansmilk.
He wanted to be able to givethem the meat of the word, but
(09:27):
they were still getting the milk.
That's all he could give thembecause they had not matured to
the level of understanding andspiritual growth, whereas he
could be able to give them ahigher learning.
But Ephesians is that secondstage of growth.
But Ephesians is that secondstage of growth.
You cannot go into the secondstage of growth, of spiritual
(09:48):
development, without masteringthe first Doesn't mean that
you're going to be perfect, butit does mean that you have a
very strong grasp of theprinciples of the doctrine, of
the foundational doctrine.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Yeah, I guess I kind of always feel like you know in
my personal journey.
I feel like, you know, takingthis Bible in my hands and
understanding like this is whatto learn, but I don't know how
to learn and I feel like whatyou're doing with your book and
(10:23):
everything that you're sayingnow is kind of teaching.
You know, telling the readerhow to learn, and that's
something that I personally havebeen, you know, craving to,
because everybody has an opinionright, everybody will tell you
everybody has a differentperspective.
They'll tell you oh well, startright from the beginning and
read.
You know, read straight through, or start here or start there,
(10:45):
and you know, and what you'resaying to me is making so much
sense because you know we're theOld Testament was written for a
very specific group and I'llecho right and I'll echo what
you said.
That that you know, of courseit's.
It's great to read and great tolearn that history.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
But we also should be learning what's applicable to
us and how to use it in our life, right, well said, well said.
Thank you, thank you.
Ok, good, that makes me feelbetter because I want to make
sure that I'm that I'munderstanding and following what
you said, because I I get.
I turn into that student thathates getting tested and I'm
(11:27):
afraid of giving the wronganswer.
So I appreciate you gentlywalking me through this, and I
know anybody watching andlistening appreciates that too.
Now I'm going to read thisquestion to you, because I made
it a little bit more long-windedthan I probably should have, so
bear with me.
So you draw heavily on bookslike Romans, Corinthians,
(11:48):
Galatians, Ephesians to craftyour roadmap.
Basically, Could you share aspecific teaching or concept
from one of these letters thatyou find especially pivotal in
guiding spiritual transformation, maybe like one that believers
like me commonly misunderstand,because I feel like I
(12:09):
misunderstand a lot of thingsand I go for a correction.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
I'm so glad you asked that question.
I'm going to deal with Romans.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Let me outline Romans for you.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
Please.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
The first nine chapters of Romans is Paul is
telling us how much God loved us, even when we were just filthy
and totally unworthy.
I mean, we're never going to beworthy of God's love, except
when he makes us so.
The first nine chapters is he'stelling us God's love for us.
Even when we were in ourdeparted, separated life from
him, he loved us.
Chapter 10 tells us ourresponse to that love, because
(13:00):
God has loved us so much.
Our response is Romans 10, 9.
If thou shalt confess with thymouth Lord Jesus, and believe in
thy heart that God is raisingfrom the dead, thou shalt be
saved, and so on and so on.
That is our response to thefirst nine chapters.
Then we get to chapter 12.
(13:23):
Understand, god didn't putthese chapter headings there.
This is a letter.
So we get to chapter 12.
The only way to live lifeaccording to that decision that
we just made, the only way to besuccessful according to that
decision of Romans 10, 9, isRomans 12, 1 and 2.
(13:45):
I beseech you, my brethren, bythe mercies of God, that you
will present yourself yourbodies a living sacrifice, holy,
acceptable unto God, which isyour reasonable service, and be
not conformed to this world butbe transformed by the renewing
of your mind.
(14:06):
He just told us in one of theearlier verses that.
So then, with the body, I servethe elements of death or the
elements of sin, but with themind, I serve the law of God.
I serve the law of God.
(14:28):
So the only way to betransformed into what God has
made us inside is to renew ourminds to the word that tells us
about what he made us so as andaccording to Jesus.
If you plant a seed and should Isay, the kingdom of heaven is
like a man sowing a seed hesleeps day and he plant sows a
seed, and he sleeps day andnight and the crop grows.
He knows not how.
And those words are the wordsthat we get.
(14:51):
When we get our wordautomatically, it happens
automatically.
If we put the word on in ourminds and bury it in our heart
on fertile ground in other words, we make it our own then we
grow automatically.
That's the way the word works.
It's a seed, it becomes a partof us, we become a part of it.
(15:14):
So if we do not, however, if wedo not do that step three,
which is chapter 12, we will notlive according to that growth
pattern that God has for us.
So it's like steps one, two andthree.
(15:35):
First we accept, we hear aboutthe love of God, we respond to
it, and then we commit ourbodies a living sacrifice and we
renew our minds to the word sothat we can be transformed.
It really is that simple.
Should I say it is that clear.
(15:55):
It's not necessarily easy.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
I like that clarification.
The information is that simple.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
It doesn't mean the task is easy, because as long as
we're fighting the desires ofthe flesh, it's tough.
But God made us so that we canovercome those desires because
we have Christ in us.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
You're just making my heart so happy, because this is
exactly and I know I'm notalone in this.
I know so many people that aregoing to watch and listen to
this or, I believe, are going tofeel the same way.
You know so many people thatare going to watch and listen to
this are, I believe, are goingto feel the same way.
Like this gives such claritythere's that word again.
There's the clarity of the how,the how to learn, how to apply,
how to relate.
(16:35):
And I have to say I wasespecially, like, happy when you
quoted be not conformed.
That verse means so much to mebecause I feel like that's one I
engrave on my heart and repeatto myself so many times.
Most of my well, almost all ofmy work life is built around an
(16:58):
online presence and there's somuch inundation of opinions and
thoughts and things and stuffand things, and you know, it's
so easy to be, I don't know,swayed or yeah, I guess swayed
by the world, and that is alwaysto me the reminder to be not
(17:20):
conformed and to be transformed.
And so I just wanted to sneakthat in there very quickly that
it just made my heart so happywhen I heard you say that.
It's absolutely one of myfavorites.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
All Scripture is given by inspiration of God and
it's profitable for doctrine,reproof and correction, for
instruction in righteousnessthat the man of God may be
perfect, thoroughly furnished orthroughly furnished unto all
good works.
I just remembered it as youwere talking.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
However, I'd like to offer you some relief.
If you understand those steps,if you understand Romans, the
foundational aspects of Romans,foundational principles, if you
get those steps, you absolutelywill grow.
(18:11):
There's no way you can stop it.
If you actually go according tothose steps, you will grow, and
you will probably grow in a waythat you never thought you
would.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Yeah, do you think you know I know I do it myself
and I would imagine others do itas well in our Christian walk
and that we kind of beatourselves up?
Like I know I do it, I beatmyself up for not knowing enough
, not knowing more, not knowingfast enough, not being able to
(18:45):
recite as much scripture as Iwould love to be able to, and
all those things?
Do you think we're too hard onourselves on that, or do you
think we should be kind ofharder on ourselves and like
push harder?
Speaker 2 (18:56):
For the most part, we're too hard on ourselves,
yeah, so in that, in thatrespect, let me tell you the
problem we don't know because wehaven't been taught.
I developed something shortlyafter I left home.
(19:19):
After I graduated high school,I had a to some degree.
I had a blessed childhood andto another degree, I had a
pretty tough childhood, but Idecided I just turned 18, I
joined the military.
I decided you know what?
Whatever decisions were madefor my life while I was growing
up, I have no responsibility inthat those were decisions that
(19:48):
were made by others regarding mylife.
But, going forward, thedecisions for my life I will
make.
I can't blame anyone else, nordo I hold them responsible,
because they didn't know.
They were bumbling along likemost of us.
However, regarding the word andclarity of the word, it is
(20:09):
available to know.
However, you have to siftthrough so much junk because our
spiritual leaders simply don'tknow the word.
The majority of our spiritualleaders know what they know from
parroting others rather thanknowing understanding the word
themselves.
Because I can tell you, eventhough there are Bibles that
(20:32):
have the doctrine reproofcorrection right before the
epistles, for instance, I have acompanion Bible.
It has it written in there.
But it has it written in therefor Romans through Thessalonians
.
But the process is exactly thesame for Israel.
There's doctrine, reproof,correction.
(20:52):
It doesn't have it there and Ididn't recognize that when I
started writing the book.
There are a lot of things Ilearned by revelation as I was
writing the book and I guaranteelet's put it this way If you
read my book, if you read mybook, I guarantee you you will
(21:12):
have a clarity of the overallentire, the overall New
Testament that you, like younever thought you would, and you
would have that clarity in justthe length of time it takes to
read the book it's less than 100pages.
In just the length of time ittakes to read the book.
It's less than 100 pages butit's going to entice you into
(21:38):
other aspects of the wordbecause now you have an idea of
what you're looking at.
You will understand the entireNew Testament in a way that you
never thought you would.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
That is so profoundly helpful and it's so exciting to
me because I and it's probablylike an issue of the times that
you know I want all theinformation fast and I want all
of like immediate, like I alwaysjoke that if I could just plug
a USB port into my head and justdownload information into it
(22:11):
really fast, I would be so happy.
So but this is like a kind ofyou know, normal version of
doing that and I love that youwrote this book.
Tell me, if you don't mind,tell me a little bit about that
process, like what did somethingspecific happen to inspire you
to write this book?
And just tell me a little bitabout that book writing process.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
It's pretty simple actually.
I experienced it throughout mylifetime.
This specific that you werereferring to, bottom line, is,
it's simple, what I saw in theBible, what I see in the book of
Acts, what I see throughout theword of God, I simply didn't
see in real life.
By the time I was 30 years old,I had a heart to heart talk
(22:55):
with God.
I mean, I knew it was a heartto heart because I was kind of
cringing when I said it, becauseI was just being honest and I
knew I couldn't, I couldn't, Icouldn't, I couldn't shock him,
I can't, I couldn't throw himoff.
I might as well be honest and Icould have chucked him.
(23:20):
I couldn't throw him off, Imight as well be honest.
And I told him, father, I'msorry, and I actually apologized
in advance.
I said, father, I'm sorry, butI have a problem.
I have a problem that I reallyneed you see in real life.
Now.
You see it once in a greatwhile, here and there, hit and
miss.
And I said and I need to knowwhy, because I refuse to believe
that you are not real and thatyour word is not true.
(23:43):
And fortunately, in about twoweeks, I met someone who
introduced me to people whoactually taught me the word in a
way that I had never dreamed,and they taught me certain
principles of understandingScripture.
(24:03):
For instance, I'll give you apoint Paul's thorn in the flesh.
I'll give you a point Paul'sthrowing in the flesh.
I've heard all my life so manyministers talking about what
Paul's throwing in the flesh was, and it went from everywhere,
from sickness to blindness tobad eyesight to perversion, all
(24:24):
kinds of stuff.
The way that you understandwhat that means, you know what.
It's amazing how the collegeworld and the professional world
understand that phrase a thornin the flesh.
But when it comes to the Bible,when we apply it to the Word,
it's like we lose our mind.
A thorn in the flesh in sportsis someone who has given you a
(24:48):
hard time constantly.
It's a figure of speech.
So what you do to understand itis find that particular phrase
in the Bible where it was firstused, and you will find that
every time it's used, god toldIsrael if you don't go in and
destroy these people, they willbe thorns in your side and
(25:12):
pricks in your eyes.
In other words, every time yousee that phrase it's talking
about people.
Paul didn't have some disability, some physical or mental or
perversive thing that he wasdealing with.
He was dealing with people andI can give you details which we
don't have time for, as to allthe issues that Paul dealt with
(25:33):
with the Judaizers, mostly theJudeans, who wanted to live
according to the law of Moses.
Every time Paul would go to aparticular city and he preached
the gospel, along comes theJudaizers.
Yes, yes, yes, but you have toacknowledge the law of moses too
, and he uh, romans tells youexactly where the law of moses
(25:59):
stands compared to the thingsthat christ accomplished on our
behalf.
It was because I didn't see andand and out here, what I saw in
the word, and he helped me tounderstand why, and that started
, that basically boosted me ontomy journey.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
And I'm so glad that it did, because, in speaking
with you and getting theopportunity to watch not only
your knowledge but your passionfor the subject it's, it's such
a joy to to watch and listen tobecause, like I said, not only
do you know what you're talkingabout, you love what you're
(26:41):
talking about and that reallycomes through.
It really really does.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
That's amazing.
You're exactly right.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Thank you, thank you, it really it just I'm watching
you, you know it's, I'm laughingat myself actually, because you
paused to give me anopportunity and I'm just sitting
here like wow.
That's why I'm sitting herelike wow, because it just it
conveys so nicely.
I wanted to kind of vaguelytouch on something you kind of
(27:07):
sort of said kind of vaguely, ortouch on something you kind of
sort of said, um, or it made methink of this that uh, we have
such a terrible habit uh notjust Christians, I mean
everybody um of taking biblicaltruths out of context.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Right.
It's amazing that you could.
I can't believe that you'regoing to hit on that.
Speaker 1 (27:28):
Let me show you something I had to and I'm so
glad you don't mind, because Ifeel like I might be segueing a
little bit.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
So I hope you don't mind that I do that.
That's perfect Good.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Talk to me a little bit about that please.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
Let me show you something.
Okay, I can guarantee you thereason we take Scripture out of
context.
Just about every Sunday we goto church.
We're literally taught to takeScripture out of context.
Let me give you an example.
The minister's reading.
He said turn with me to suchand such Scripture.
(28:01):
And he reads a couple of versesand he said now, turn with me
to such and such.
Let's say 2 Peter, 2, verse 14.
And then he takes you toTimothy, and then he takes you
to you understand?
Speaker 1 (28:19):
what I'm saying Bouncing around.
Yes, You're only getting bitsand pieces.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Now, unless he or she has done the background on that
and bringing everythingtogether in the same context,
not four or five differentcontexts, then they'll say well,
you know, you don't have totake my word for it, you go home
and you read it for yourself.
(28:43):
You know what the averageperson is going to do Going to
go home, if they're going toread it at all.
They're going to go home andthey're going to read those same
exact scriptures, right, andknow no more than before they
read it.
They don't know whether or notthey read doctrine, reproof or
correction.
They don't know who it waswritten to.
(29:06):
For instance, one of thescriptures is 2 Peter.
2 Peter is not to me, that's toIsrael.
Now, the principles thatprocess that I mentioned to
Israel and the process to theGentiles is the same and
principle is exactly the sameWith both is doctrine of reproof
, correction.
However, with Israel, theprinciples are taught from their
(29:32):
historic background, historicbackground.
If that was taught the same wayto the Gentile believers, they
wouldn't be able to relatebecause that was not their
history.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
You understand?
Yes.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
So, if we understand, if we understand Dr Reproof's
correction, and who is thisaddressed to?
We will know as Gentilebelievers.
Gentile believers is Romans,through Thessalonians, it is a.
It is addressed directly toGentile believers because that
was Paul's ministry to theGentiles, and Hebrews through
(30:15):
Hebrews James first, second,peter, first, second, third,
john Jude.
Revelation that's Israel.
That's 1st, 2nd Peter, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, john Jude Revelation
that's Israel.
That's all Israel and they areaddressed to Israel.
Now, if we understand theformat, we can understand either
process because in principlethey are the same, but we need
(30:37):
to understand that there aresome basic things that we need
to know.
When we approach, we startreading right in the middle of a
text.
If I wrote you a 10 page letterand you started on page seven,
do you expect to understand forthe most part what it is I'm
(30:58):
trying to portray to you?
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Right.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
We do it all the time .
Once you know the word, thenyou have the skill to do that.
But until you understandchapters one, two, three, four,
five, six of any epistle three,four, five, six of any epistle,
then there's no point in goingto chapter seven, eight or nine,
(31:26):
because you don't know what'sgoing on.
But when we go to church,that's what we get, because
every person doesn't read theBible for the most part, or they
don't read the Bible any morethan a scripture or two that
they were given.
So we are taught we areliterally taught to take the
Bible out of context.
Let me say one more thing, andI'm going to try to slow down.
When I was a teenager, I wasbrought up in a particular
(31:49):
denomination there's no point inme saying which one.
I was 15 years old and thisparticular denomination taught
that it was wrong for a woman towear something clothing
pertaining to a man.
Those are the exact words.
So I was standing on the churchground one day talking to a
(32:14):
friend of mine and I happened tolook over and I saw my friend
and my sister getting offbicycles.
They had on dresses.
I just happened, the timing wasjust impeccable.
I happened to look over as myfriend was getting off the bike
and I felt like, oh, I can'ttell you how badly I felt.
All of a sudden, I under herclothes and all I did was just
(32:38):
look over Bottom line.
She shouldn't have been on abike with a dress on.
That's not how, but we weretaught that it was wrong.
So the next day I went toschool, went to the library and
did some research on clothingback in those days and I
(32:59):
realized what the deal was.
We would look.
This is the bottom line.
Is it a shame for a woman towear anything pertaining to a
man?
Oh, is it a shame for a man towear long hair?
This is in 1 Corinthians, and Ihad hair down to my shoulder
(33:20):
when I was young and I wasdenigrated for it.
If they had only read twoscriptures not not two chapters
or two epistles over twoscriptures below that, Paul said
but if any man wishes to becontentious, we do not observe
(33:41):
such customs.
Neither does the churches ofGod.
In other words, Paul's ministrywas to the Gentiles.
They had customs that Israeldidn't have to deal with.
So when Paul had to deal withthem, he had to deal with their
customs, because many of theircustoms violated the principles
of the word.
So, yes, we do read the wordout of context frequently.
(34:04):
We are literally taught to doso.
We're taught that way from thepulpit.
Speaker 1 (34:09):
That's such a fascinating perspective on it
that I hadn't even thought ofuntil you said that.
I was like, oh yeah, I get that, I get that, and I will give a
quick little shout out to ourpastor and our church, because
this conversation with you ishelpful in so many ways, and one
of them being that it gives methis sense of relief because all
(34:31):
of the things that you'resaying are actually things that
our pastor does.
The good parts, the rightthings, are all things that he
does.
He gives us context and we'reactually in well, I don't
believe in coincidence, but weare in Romans right now and
we're going through Romans.
So what a timely conversationyou and I are having, right, I
(34:52):
mean, god is so good, the waythat he works and the way that
he brings everything together.
It just blows my mind constantly, and this is another one of
those moments as we're sittingand talking, so either correct
me or expand on what I'm saying.
When I think about your bookand everything that we've talked
about, I feel like describingyour book as the foundation to
(35:18):
understanding our foundation.
Does that?
Speaker 2 (35:22):
That is sweet.
Is that good?
Is that good?
I feel like that's.
Speaker 1 (35:26):
Thank you.
Thank you, because that'sreally what it is.
I mean, you're offering up andI want to just say let me see
where it is here.
I have it in here.
Oh, the readers.
I just wanted to let ourviewers and listeners know this
that many readers say that thebook feels like a mentor walking
alongside them.
(35:48):
And I actually had a questionfor it, but I sidetracked us.
But was that intentionally yourgoal or just kind of just
happened that just kind of thethe holy spirit talking through
you?
Speaker 2 (36:00):
you know, elsa, I I was telling my wife last night.
I just sometimes, wow, almostgot emotional on that one.
Sometimes I feel so burdenedwhen I think about not only do
people in droves not know thetruth, but they don't want to
(36:23):
know, they want to continue inreligion, they want to continue
in what is comfortable.
When it's a lie, they don'trealize they're not comfortable,
they've just acclimated to it.
If they understood what comfortreally was, if they understood
what God has actually doneinside us, we wouldn't have so
(36:47):
many worries, so many stresses.
You know what?
Check this out.
The word in Isaiah, I believe.
It says he was wounded for ourtransgression, bruised for our
iniquities.
The chastisement of our peacewas upon him and with his strife
we are healed.
Now it mentions three thingsthere.
(37:10):
In other words, when Godcreated man, he made him body,
soul and spirit.
Body, soul and spirit.
It mentions, it talks about ourspiritual wholeness, the bruises
and the wounds.
In other words, he took on whatwas necessary to guarantee our
(37:30):
spiritual wholeness.
He bore it so we wouldn't haveto the mental anxieties and the
mental deficiencies and themental diseases, those things he
bore for us, so we wouldn'thave to the stripes he took for
the healing of our bodies.
Only thing we talk about is thespiritual aspect of it.
(38:03):
Why are we so willing to ignoretwo thirds of what Christ
accomplished on our behalf?
Because he, in other words, hecorrected the errors that came
about because of Adam.
Adam was perfect in all hisbeing spiritually, physically
and mentally but then that waslost.
(38:25):
Christ came to correct that.
He made us whole again, but wedon't know it because we're not
taught it.
I don't get sick, elsa, Isimply don't get sick.
I don't believe in beingdepressed.
Speaker 1 (38:43):
I'm with you.
Speaker 2 (38:43):
I'm with you, you're preaching to the choir here.
It's not because I'm any betterthan anybody else.
It's just that I know what theword says regarding this and I
apply it to my life.
I simply don't get sick.
I've been in the house with twograndkids my wife, two
grandkids and a son.
They were all sick.
Now we're breathing the sameair.
My wife and I are sleeping inthe same room in the same bed.
(39:05):
They're all sick.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
And.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
I don't get sick simply because I don't buy it.
I don't buy what well this iswhat's going around.
I know what Jesus did so Iwouldn't have to deal with it.
And once we know the truth ofthe word and I understand that
that was just an example, butall of life is that way Once we
(39:28):
understand what God did byputting Christ in us, by giving
us his seed and making us hissons his seed and making us his
sons, then we realize what he'stalking about when he says
(39:50):
greater is he that is in us thanhe that is in the world, that
we are overcomers, that we havevictory in all things, because
the adversary was spoiled.
I mean, any authority that hehad over us was just obliterated
, and there's no need for us tobe bullied by him.
If we know who we are, he'safraid of us.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
Yeah, yes, yes, yes, absolutely.
That was literally the mostperfect way to close out.
You know, it's literally themost perfect way to close out.
You know, it's literally themost perfect message to kind of
wrap up this whole thing.
And I have to tell you I don'twant to wrap this up.
I want to keep talking all day,but I you know, I know you have
(40:29):
a life to get to.
I understand that Before we dosay goodbye here, I would be
very remiss.
Not to mention that there isnot only one book out by you,
sir.
There is another book.
It is called ChristianLeadership Honor, reverence and
Respect for God in His Word.
Will you tell everyone wherethey can find your books?
(40:50):
And if there's a website,anything else, please let them
know and we will put it.
Guys, it will be in the shownotes, don't worry if you miss
it for any reason, we will itthere for you.
But where can they find yourbooks?
Speaker 2 (41:00):
it gives you locations.
One is Clyde Simpson bookscomthat is my website, and the
other is Amazon.
When you go to Amazon, you caneither google the book or you
can google my name, clydeSimpson.
The books are going toautomatically pop up, and they
do, because I looked you can buythe book.
Speaker 1 (41:17):
You can buy my name, clyde Simpson.
The books are going toautomatically pop up, and they
do, because I looked.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
You can buy the book.
You can buy the book on eitheron my website or on Amazon.
The only difference is, if youbuy it on my website, I don't
have to share the postings withAmazon.
If you buy it on Amazon, I haveto share 30%.
Yes, exactly, so you know whatthe most important thing is that
it is bought.
I don't care if it's neverbought on my website, as long as
(41:42):
it gets into the hands of thepeople and they finally
understand the word of God in amuch better way.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Yes, absolutely, I'm so excited to read this book,
Both of those books actually,but I am starting with the first
one because, as a babe, as ababe, I well not a babe.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Which first one are you referring to?
Speaker 1 (42:02):
You know, what I mean .
Speaker 2 (42:03):
I'm sorry, which first one you say?
Starting with the first one.
Speaker 1 (42:06):
I started.
Oh, I well, I should saystarting with the second one.
I like, yeah, thank you.
Yes, thank you for correctingme on that.
Speaker 2 (42:12):
Let me make a distinction between the two, the
way they were written.
The first book, which is theleadership book, was literally
my dissertation from mydoctorate program.
I knew that it would be read byPhDs and doctors.
However, I had never written abook before, so I just
(42:33):
transformed it for the most part, modified it a bit, transformed
it into a book.
Not thinking about the averageperson is not Some of the
terminology used and the wordsused is just going to turn some
people off.
But the more educated peoplewill get it, it's no big deal
(42:54):
for them.
But the second book, Iunderstood what a miscalculation
that I made.
So the second book a sixthgrader can understand.
I wrote it in such a way thatthe average person can
understand clearly what I'msaying.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
That's phenomenal.
I am super excited to read itand uh, and I'm I'm excited for
everybody else to to see thisinterview and and to uh, just to
see what you're all about andwhat these books are all about,
and uh, what, what a blessing,what a blessing to have met you
and to have had thisconversation, so I thank you
very much.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Thank you very much wonderful.
Speaker 1 (43:35):
All right guys.
Thank you for watching with usand we will see you in the next
episode.
Take care.
She's the voice behind the viral comedy.
Bold commentary andtruth-packed interviews that cut
through the chaos.
Author.
Brand creator.
Proud conservative Christian.
This is Elsa Kurt.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Welcome to the show that always brings bold faith,
real truth and no apologies.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Oh, hello, hello and welcome to our interview series
Today's guest.
I am so excited for I feel likeI just get to sit back and just
get this wonderful, amazinglesson that you all get to be a
part of too.
I have with me Clyde Simpson.
He is the author of SpiritualGrowth and Development from Babe
to Full Maturity.
(00:39):
Welcome to the show.
Thank you so much for coming ontoday.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
You're very welcome.
I'm blessed to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Thank you.
Thank you.
I'm blessed to have you herebecause, as the people who watch
and listen to me know, I callmyself rightly a baby Christian.
I think I will live and die asa baby Christian.
I started late in life to justanswer this calling to faith and
(01:07):
to God and to respond to Hiscall on my life.
And now I'm playing this bigfat game of catch up are going
to give me some information andour viewers and listeners some
lessons and ways to, I guess Iwant to say, learn better if
(01:31):
that makes any sense.
So tell me, let's start rightwith the title from Babe Through
Full Maturity.
What does that mean?
Speaker 2 (01:41):
It means, from the moment that you accept Christ,
you are a babe in Christ,according to the word, and in
order to mature, you must learnabout what it is that you've
received, learn about God andhis word and what is expected of
you and what your capabilitiesare.
What does this born again thingmean?
(02:02):
You know, you said somethingthat is very striking.
You said you are a babe inChrist and you're under the
impression that it's going totake you a while to get to where
you need to be.
Let me say this Ninety ninepercent this is a very bold
statement.
Ninety nine percent ofChristians, people who call
themselves Christians, livetheir entire lives and never
(02:25):
make it out of the babe inChrist state.
There is a reason for that.
Unfortunately.
There's a very unfortunatereason for that, but the way to
overcome that is just to knowthe truth, and unfortunately,
this particular basic truth isnot being taught.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah, I think you're right.
You know, and I think maybewhat happens is we, as baby
Christians, we get sooverwhelmed and we don't quite
know where to start.
Do you start, literally, at thebeginning of the Bible, Do you
start with Genesis or do youstart with the New Testament?
(03:07):
You hear what I'm saying?
There's so many or or or and Ithink so many of us, myself
included, need somebody to situs down, virtually literally,
whatever the case is, and sayhere's where you start.
You know.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
One of the questions in my book at the very beginning
is a question that I am awarethat I, as well as many other
Christians, ask where do I start?
Well, my book answers thatquestion, because in the Bible,
you can learn, we can learn fromanything in the Bible.
(03:44):
That's plenty to learn, but theentire Bible was not addressed
directly to us, for instance,genesis.
There's nothing in Genesisregarding being born again.
There's information that we canlearn to find out, to learn
about God and his word and thehistorical functioning between
(04:07):
his, the way he interacted withhumans, with mankind.
You can learn much about that.
You can learn about his natureand things of that, of that
course, but that does not helpus, for the most part, to know
what it is we're supposed to doas babes in christ.
(04:28):
Well, as babes in christ, weare given doctrine, in fact.
In fact, this is where we wouldstart.
Where is it in the word that welearn how to become a christian
?
That's a very good question.
The answer is romans.
This is where we learn tobecome a Christian.
Some might say well, you learnin gospel.
(04:49):
No, no, you don't.
There is no one born again inthe gospels.
It wasn't available to be bornagain in the gospels.
It wasn't available until theday of Pentecost, which is in
Acts, which is literally adocumentary of the events that
the apostles went through.
The Acts of the Apostles is thename of that particular
documentary, but the first bookof doctrine to the believer is
(05:15):
the book of Romans.
I'm talking about the Gentilebelievers, because there are two
processes that we find in theNew Testament.
There are two processes that wefind in the New Testament.
One is to Israel.
One process is to Israel.
The other process is to theGentiles.
As we know, paul's ministry wasto the Gentiles.
His ministry was not to Israel,although he did write, for
(05:38):
instance, hebrews to Israel, buthis ministry was not to Israel.
That was the job of the otherapostles.
So you will find, however, thepurpose of all scriptures for
doctrine, reproof and correction, which is instruction in
righteousness that the man ofGod may be perfect, thoroughly
(05:59):
furnished or throughly furnishedunto all good works.
In other words, we're to havethrough the furnace unto all
good works.
In other words, we're to have,by learning scripture,
understanding scripture, we'resupposed to be fully equipped to
do everything that God expectsof us.
But if we're not taught thosethings, if we're not taught that
Romans, through Thessalonians,fall into the categories of
(06:22):
doctrine reproof, correctiondoctrine, reproof, correction
Doctrine, reproof, correctionDoctrine.
If we're not taught that we gointo those epistles not really
knowing what to expect, eventhough we see who they're
addressed to.
I could go on, but I'm going toallow you to moderate this.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Well, it's just so fascinating to me, as you're
saying this, it's just sofascinating to me, Like you know
, as you're saying this, it'smaking me think of, like all the
challenges that we as whetheryou're a baby Christian, as I
call myself, or a seasonedChristian, as I've heard the
term used, you know, I feel likewe just there's so many
(07:02):
different challenges we face,Like in your opinion, like what
is the?
I don't know.
I guess that the.
If there's a foundation of ourchallenges, would you say, it's
that that we just simply don'tunderstand these aspects of
these lessons of the Bible, oris it something external?
(07:25):
What are we facing right now?
That's probably like ourbiggest challenge or obstacle as
Christians.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
The biggest problem is our leaders do not recognize
Romans as the foundational truthfor our beliefs.
If you don't, let me ask youthis let's say you have a child
who's reached the age of six,ready, ready to start school,
right?
So you enroll that child inschool in first grade.
(07:52):
You leave him or her there forone month and then you switch
them to the sixth grade for onemonth, then the third grade for
one month, then the fifth gradefor one month, second grade for
one month, fourth grade for onemonth, and that is the pattern.
(08:13):
What do you think the outcomeof that child's mentality would
be?
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Mm-hmm, yeah, absolutely Totally confused.
Yeah, completely confused Right.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Because the foundation, they will not grasp
the foundation.
But this is exactly whathappens to us when we go to
church.
We're dragged all over theplace from one place to another
and we're not taught that Romansis doctrine, the first book of
doctrine.
We're not taught thatCorinthians is the book of
reproof Back to the doctrine ofRomans.
(08:44):
We're not taught that Galatiansis correction back to the
doctrine of Romans.
We're not taught that Galatiansis correction back to the
doctrine of Romans.
There are things going on inthose epistles that Paul has to
deal with to direct them back toRomans.
And unless we, as believersborn again, believers bathed in
Christ, if we do not master thebasic foundational doctrine of
(09:05):
Romans, it is impossible for usto grasp the principles of
Ephesians.
It's not just challenging orjust difficult, it is impossible
because you cannot go into.
Paul even called Corinthiansmilk.
He wanted to be able to givethem the meat of the word, but
(09:27):
they were still getting the milk.
That's all he could give thembecause they had not matured to
the level of understanding andspiritual growth, whereas he
could be able to give them ahigher learning.
But Ephesians is that secondstage of growth.
But Ephesians is that secondstage of growth.
You cannot go into the secondstage of growth, of spiritual
(09:48):
development, without masteringthe first Doesn't mean that
you're going to be perfect, butit does mean that you have a
very strong grasp of theprinciples of the doctrine, of
the foundational doctrine.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Yeah, I guess I kind of always feel like you know in
my personal journey.
I feel like, you know, takingthis Bible in my hands and
understanding like this is whatto learn, but I don't know how
to learn and I feel like whatyou're doing with your book and
(10:23):
everything that you're sayingnow is kind of teaching.
You know, telling the readerhow to learn, and that's
something that I personally havebeen, you know, craving to,
because everybody has an opinionright, everybody will tell you
everybody has a differentperspective.
They'll tell you oh well, startright from the beginning and
read.
You know, read straight through, or start here or start there,
(10:45):
and you know, and what you'resaying to me is making so much
sense because you know we're theOld Testament was written for a
very specific group and I'llecho right and I'll echo what
you said.
That that you know, of courseit's.
It's great to read and great tolearn that history.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
But we also should be learning what's applicable to
us and how to use it in our life, right, well said, well said.
Thank you, thank you.
Ok, good, that makes me feelbetter because I want to make
sure that I'm that I'munderstanding and following what
you said, because I I get.
I turn into that student thathates getting tested and I'm
(11:27):
afraid of giving the wronganswer.
So I appreciate you gentlywalking me through this, and I
know anybody watching andlistening appreciates that too.
Now I'm going to read thisquestion to you, because I made
it a little bit more long-windedthan I probably should have, so
bear with me.
So you draw heavily on bookslike Romans, Corinthians,
(11:48):
Galatians, Ephesians to craftyour roadmap.
Basically, Could you share aspecific teaching or concept
from one of these letters thatyou find especially pivotal in
guiding spiritual transformation, maybe like one that believers
like me commonly misunderstand,because I feel like I
(12:09):
misunderstand a lot of thingsand I go for a correction.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
I'm so glad you asked that question.
I'm going to deal with Romans.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Let me outline Romans for you.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
Please.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
The first nine chapters of Romans is Paul is
telling us how much God loved us, even when we were just filthy
and totally unworthy.
I mean, we're never going to beworthy of God's love, except
when he makes us so.
The first nine chapters is he'stelling us God's love for us.
Even when we were in ourdeparted, separated life from
him, he loved us.
Chapter 10 tells us ourresponse to that love, because
(13:00):
God has loved us so much.
Our response is Romans 10, 9.
If thou shalt confess with thymouth Lord Jesus, and believe in
thy heart that God is raisingfrom the dead, thou shalt be
saved, and so on and so on.
That is our response to thefirst nine chapters.
Then we get to chapter 12.
(13:23):
Understand, god didn't putthese chapter headings there.
This is a letter.
So we get to chapter 12.
The only way to live lifeaccording to that decision that
we just made, the only way to besuccessful according to that
decision of Romans 10, 9, isRomans 12, 1 and 2.
(13:45):
I beseech you, my brethren, bythe mercies of God, that you
will present yourself yourbodies a living sacrifice, holy,
acceptable unto God, which isyour reasonable service, and be
not conformed to this world butbe transformed by the renewing
of your mind.
(14:06):
He just told us in one of theearlier verses that.
So then, with the body, I servethe elements of death or the
elements of sin, but with themind, I serve the law of God.
I serve the law of God.
(14:28):
So the only way to betransformed into what God has
made us inside is to renew ourminds to the word that tells us
about what he made us so as andaccording to Jesus.
If you plant a seed and should Isay, the kingdom of heaven is
like a man sowing a seed hesleeps day and he plant sows a
seed, and he sleeps day andnight and the crop grows.
He knows not how.
And those words are the wordsthat we get.
(14:51):
When we get our wordautomatically, it happens
automatically.
If we put the word on in ourminds and bury it in our heart
on fertile ground in other words, we make it our own then we
grow automatically.
That's the way the word works.
It's a seed, it becomes a partof us, we become a part of it.
(15:14):
So if we do not, however, if wedo not do that step three,
which is chapter 12, we will notlive according to that growth
pattern that God has for us.
So it's like steps one, two andthree.
(15:35):
First we accept, we hear aboutthe love of God, we respond to
it, and then we commit ourbodies a living sacrifice and we
renew our minds to the word sothat we can be transformed.
It really is that simple.
Should I say it is that clear.
(15:55):
It's not necessarily easy.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
I like that clarification.
The information is that simple.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
It doesn't mean the task is easy, because as long as
we're fighting the desires ofthe flesh, it's tough.
But God made us so that we canovercome those desires because
we have Christ in us.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
You're just making my heart so happy, because this is
exactly and I know I'm notalone in this.
I know so many people that aregoing to watch and listen to
this or, I believe, are going tofeel the same way.
You know so many people thatare going to watch and listen to
this are, I believe, are goingto feel the same way.
Like this gives such claritythere's that word again.
There's the clarity of the how,the how to learn, how to apply,
how to relate.
(16:35):
And I have to say I wasespecially, like, happy when you
quoted be not conformed.
That verse means so much to mebecause I feel like that's one I
engrave on my heart and repeatto myself so many times.
Most of my well, almost all ofmy work life is built around an
(16:58):
online presence and there's somuch inundation of opinions and
thoughts and things and stuffand things, and you know, it's
so easy to be, I don't know,swayed or yeah, I guess swayed
by the world, and that is alwaysto me the reminder to be not
(17:20):
conformed and to be transformed.
And so I just wanted to sneakthat in there very quickly that
it just made my heart so happywhen I heard you say that.
It's absolutely one of myfavorites.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
All Scripture is given by inspiration of God and
it's profitable for doctrine,reproof and correction, for
instruction in righteousnessthat the man of God may be
perfect, thoroughly furnished orthroughly furnished unto all
good works.
I just remembered it as youwere talking.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
However, I'd like to offer you some relief.
If you understand those steps,if you understand Romans, the
foundational aspects of Romans,foundational principles, if you
get those steps, you absolutelywill grow.
(18:11):
There's no way you can stop it.
If you actually go according tothose steps, you will grow, and
you will probably grow in a waythat you never thought you
would.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Yeah, do you think you know I know I do it myself
and I would imagine others do itas well in our Christian walk
and that we kind of beatourselves up?
Like I know I do it, I beatmyself up for not knowing enough
, not knowing more, not knowingfast enough, not being able to
(18:45):
recite as much scripture as Iwould love to be able to, and
all those things?
Do you think we're too hard onourselves on that, or do you
think we should be kind ofharder on ourselves and like
push harder?
Speaker 2 (18:56):
For the most part, we're too hard on ourselves,
yeah, so in that, in thatrespect, let me tell you the
problem we don't know because wehaven't been taught.
I developed something shortlyafter I left home.
(19:19):
After I graduated high school,I had a to some degree.
I had a blessed childhood andto another degree, I had a
pretty tough childhood, but Idecided I just turned 18, I
joined the military.
I decided you know what?
Whatever decisions were madefor my life while I was growing
up, I have no responsibility inthat those were decisions that
(19:48):
were made by others regarding mylife.
But, going forward, thedecisions for my life I will
make.
I can't blame anyone else, nordo I hold them responsible,
because they didn't know.
They were bumbling along likemost of us.
However, regarding the word andclarity of the word, it is
(20:09):
available to know.
However, you have to siftthrough so much junk because our
spiritual leaders simply don'tknow the word.
The majority of our spiritualleaders know what they know from
parroting others rather thanknowing understanding the word
themselves.
Because I can tell you, eventhough there are Bibles that
(20:32):
have the doctrine reproofcorrection right before the
epistles, for instance, I have acompanion Bible.
It has it written in there.
But it has it written in therefor Romans through Thessalonians
.
But the process is exactly thesame for Israel.
There's doctrine, reproof,correction.
(20:52):
It doesn't have it there and Ididn't recognize that when I
started writing the book.
There are a lot of things Ilearned by revelation as I was
writing the book and I guaranteelet's put it this way If you
read my book, if you read mybook, I guarantee you you will
(21:12):
have a clarity of the overallentire, the overall New
Testament that you, like younever thought you would, and you
would have that clarity in justthe length of time it takes to
read the book it's less than 100pages.
In just the length of time ittakes to read the book.
It's less than 100 pages butit's going to entice you into
(21:38):
other aspects of the wordbecause now you have an idea of
what you're looking at.
You will understand the entireNew Testament in a way that you
never thought you would.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
That is so profoundly helpful and it's so exciting to
me because I and it's probablylike an issue of the times that
you know I want all theinformation fast and I want all
of like immediate, like I alwaysjoke that if I could just plug
a USB port into my head and justdownload information into it
(22:11):
really fast, I would be so happy.
So but this is like a kind ofyou know, normal version of
doing that and I love that youwrote this book.
Tell me, if you don't mind,tell me a little bit about that
process, like what did somethingspecific happen to inspire you
to write this book?
And just tell me a little bitabout that book writing process.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
It's pretty simple actually.
I experienced it throughout mylifetime.
This specific that you werereferring to, bottom line, is,
it's simple, what I saw in theBible, what I see in the book of
Acts, what I see throughout theword of God, I simply didn't
see in real life.
By the time I was 30 years old,I had a heart to heart talk
(22:55):
with God.
I mean, I knew it was a heartto heart because I was kind of
cringing when I said it, becauseI was just being honest and I
knew I couldn't, I couldn't, Icouldn't, I couldn't shock him,
I can't, I couldn't throw himoff.
I might as well be honest and Icould have chucked him.
(23:20):
I couldn't throw him off, Imight as well be honest.
And I told him, father, I'msorry, and I actually apologized
in advance.
I said, father, I'm sorry, butI have a problem.
I have a problem that I reallyneed you see in real life.
Now.
You see it once in a greatwhile, here and there, hit and
miss.
And I said and I need to knowwhy, because I refuse to believe
that you are not real and thatyour word is not true.
(23:43):
And fortunately, in about twoweeks, I met someone who
introduced me to people whoactually taught me the word in a
way that I had never dreamed,and they taught me certain
principles of understandingScripture.
(24:03):
For instance, I'll give you apoint Paul's thorn in the flesh.
I'll give you a point Paul'sthrowing in the flesh.
I've heard all my life so manyministers talking about what
Paul's throwing in the flesh was, and it went from everywhere,
from sickness to blindness tobad eyesight to perversion, all
(24:24):
kinds of stuff.
The way that you understandwhat that means, you know what.
It's amazing how the collegeworld and the professional world
understand that phrase a thornin the flesh.
But when it comes to the Bible,when we apply it to the Word,
it's like we lose our mind.
A thorn in the flesh in sportsis someone who has given you a
(24:48):
hard time constantly.
It's a figure of speech.
So what you do to understand itis find that particular phrase
in the Bible where it was firstused, and you will find that
every time it's used, god toldIsrael if you don't go in and
destroy these people, they willbe thorns in your side and
(25:12):
pricks in your eyes.
In other words, every time yousee that phrase it's talking
about people.
Paul didn't have some disability, some physical or mental or
perversive thing that he wasdealing with.
He was dealing with people andI can give you details which we
don't have time for, as to allthe issues that Paul dealt with
(25:33):
with the Judaizers, mostly theJudeans, who wanted to live
according to the law of Moses.
Every time Paul would go to aparticular city and he preached
the gospel, along comes theJudaizers.
Yes, yes, yes, but you have toacknowledge the law of moses too
, and he uh, romans tells youexactly where the law of moses
(25:59):
stands compared to the thingsthat christ accomplished on our
behalf.
It was because I didn't see andand and out here, what I saw in
the word, and he helped me tounderstand why, and that started
, that basically boosted me ontomy journey.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
And I'm so glad that it did, because, in speaking
with you and getting theopportunity to watch not only
your knowledge but your passionfor the subject it's, it's such
a joy to to watch and listen tobecause, like I said, not only
do you know what you're talkingabout, you love what you're
(26:41):
talking about and that reallycomes through.
It really really does.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
That's amazing.
You're exactly right.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Thank you, thank you, it really it just I'm watching
you, you know it's, I'm laughingat myself actually, because you
paused to give me anopportunity and I'm just sitting
here like wow.
That's why I'm sitting herelike wow, because it just it
conveys so nicely.
I wanted to kind of vaguelytouch on something you kind of
(27:07):
sort of said kind of vaguely, ortouch on something you kind of
sort of said, um, or it made methink of this that uh, we have
such a terrible habit uh notjust Christians, I mean
everybody um of taking biblicaltruths out of context.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Right.
It's amazing that you could.
I can't believe that you'regoing to hit on that.
Speaker 1 (27:28):
Let me show you something I had to and I'm so
glad you don't mind, because Ifeel like I might be segueing a
little bit.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
So I hope you don't mind that I do that.
That's perfect Good.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Talk to me a little bit about that please.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
Let me show you something.
Okay, I can guarantee you thereason we take Scripture out of
context.
Just about every Sunday we goto church.
We're literally taught to takeScripture out of context.
Let me give you an example.
The minister's reading.
He said turn with me to suchand such Scripture.
(28:01):
And he reads a couple of versesand he said now, turn with me
to such and such.
Let's say 2 Peter, 2, verse 14.
And then he takes you toTimothy, and then he takes you
to you understand?
Speaker 1 (28:19):
what I'm saying Bouncing around.
Yes, You're only getting bitsand pieces.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Now, unless he or she has done the background on that
and bringing everythingtogether in the same context,
not four or five differentcontexts, then they'll say well,
you know, you don't have totake my word for it, you go home
and you read it for yourself.
(28:43):
You know what the averageperson is going to do Going to
go home, if they're going toread it at all.
They're going to go home andthey're going to read those same
exact scriptures, right, andknow no more than before they
read it.
They don't know whether or notthey read doctrine, reproof or
correction.
They don't know who it waswritten to.
(29:06):
For instance, one of thescriptures is 2 Peter.
2 Peter is not to me, that's toIsrael.
Now, the principles thatprocess that I mentioned to
Israel and the process to theGentiles is the same and
principle is exactly the sameWith both is doctrine of reproof
, correction.
However, with Israel, theprinciples are taught from their
(29:32):
historic background, historicbackground.
If that was taught the same wayto the Gentile believers, they
wouldn't be able to relatebecause that was not their
history.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
You understand?
Yes.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
So, if we understand, if we understand Dr Reproof's
correction, and who is thisaddressed to?
We will know as Gentilebelievers.
Gentile believers is Romans,through Thessalonians, it is a.
It is addressed directly toGentile believers because that
was Paul's ministry to theGentiles, and Hebrews through
(30:15):
Hebrews James first, second,peter, first, second, third,
john Jude.
Revelation that's Israel.
That's 1st, 2nd Peter, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, john Jude Revelation
that's Israel.
That's all Israel and they areaddressed to Israel.
Now, if we understand theformat, we can understand either
process because in principlethey are the same, but we need
(30:37):
to understand that there aresome basic things that we need
to know.
When we approach, we startreading right in the middle of a
text.
If I wrote you a 10 page letterand you started on page seven,
do you expect to understand forthe most part what it is I'm
(30:58):
trying to portray to you?
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Right.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
We do it all the time .
Once you know the word, thenyou have the skill to do that.
But until you understandchapters one, two, three, four,
five, six of any epistle three,four, five, six of any epistle,
then there's no point in goingto chapter seven, eight or nine,
(31:26):
because you don't know what'sgoing on.
But when we go to church,that's what we get, because
every person doesn't read theBible for the most part, or they
don't read the Bible any morethan a scripture or two that
they were given.
So we are taught we areliterally taught to take the
Bible out of context.
Let me say one more thing, andI'm going to try to slow down.
When I was a teenager, I wasbrought up in a particular
(31:49):
denomination there's no point inme saying which one.
I was 15 years old and thisparticular denomination taught
that it was wrong for a woman towear something clothing
pertaining to a man.
Those are the exact words.
So I was standing on the churchground one day talking to a
(32:14):
friend of mine and I happened tolook over and I saw my friend
and my sister getting offbicycles.
They had on dresses.
I just happened, the timing wasjust impeccable.
I happened to look over as myfriend was getting off the bike
and I felt like, oh, I can'ttell you how badly I felt.
All of a sudden, I under herclothes and all I did was just
(32:38):
look over Bottom line.
She shouldn't have been on abike with a dress on.
That's not how, but we weretaught that it was wrong.
So the next day I went toschool, went to the library and
did some research on clothingback in those days and I
(32:59):
realized what the deal was.
We would look.
This is the bottom line.
Is it a shame for a woman towear anything pertaining to a
man?
Oh, is it a shame for a man towear long hair?
This is in 1 Corinthians, and Ihad hair down to my shoulder
(33:20):
when I was young and I wasdenigrated for it.
If they had only read twoscriptures not not two chapters
or two epistles over twoscriptures below that, Paul said
but if any man wishes to becontentious, we do not observe
(33:41):
such customs.
Neither does the churches ofGod.
In other words, Paul's ministrywas to the Gentiles.
They had customs that Israeldidn't have to deal with.
So when Paul had to deal withthem, he had to deal with their
customs, because many of theircustoms violated the principles
of the word.
So, yes, we do read the wordout of context frequently.
(34:04):
We are literally taught to doso.
We're taught that way from thepulpit.
Speaker 1 (34:09):
That's such a fascinating perspective on it
that I hadn't even thought ofuntil you said that.
I was like, oh yeah, I get that, I get that, and I will give a
quick little shout out to ourpastor and our church, because
this conversation with you ishelpful in so many ways, and one
of them being that it gives methis sense of relief because all
(34:31):
of the things that you'resaying are actually things that
our pastor does.
The good parts, the rightthings, are all things that he
does.
He gives us context and we'reactually in well, I don't
believe in coincidence, but weare in Romans right now and
we're going through Romans.
So what a timely conversationyou and I are having, right, I
(34:52):
mean, god is so good, the waythat he works and the way that
he brings everything together.
It just blows my mind constantly, and this is another one of
those moments as we're sittingand talking, so either correct
me or expand on what I'm saying.
When I think about your bookand everything that we've talked
about, I feel like describingyour book as the foundation to
(35:18):
understanding our foundation.
Does that?
Speaker 2 (35:22):
That is sweet.
Is that good?
Is that good?
I feel like that's.
Speaker 1 (35:26):
Thank you.
Thank you, because that'sreally what it is.
I mean, you're offering up andI want to just say let me see
where it is here.
I have it in here.
Oh, the readers.
I just wanted to let ourviewers and listeners know this
that many readers say that thebook feels like a mentor walking
alongside them.
(35:48):
And I actually had a questionfor it, but I sidetracked us.
But was that intentionally yourgoal or just kind of just
happened that just kind of thethe holy spirit talking through
you?
Speaker 2 (36:00):
you know, elsa, I I was telling my wife last night.
I just sometimes, wow, almostgot emotional on that one.
Sometimes I feel so burdenedwhen I think about not only do
people in droves not know thetruth, but they don't want to
(36:23):
know, they want to continue inreligion, they want to continue
in what is comfortable.
When it's a lie, they don'trealize they're not comfortable,
they've just acclimated to it.
If they understood what comfortreally was, if they understood
what God has actually doneinside us, we wouldn't have so
(36:47):
many worries, so many stresses.
You know what?
Check this out.
The word in Isaiah, I believe.
It says he was wounded for ourtransgression, bruised for our
iniquities.
The chastisement of our peacewas upon him and with his strife
we are healed.
Now it mentions three thingsthere.
(37:10):
In other words, when Godcreated man, he made him body,
soul and spirit.
Body, soul and spirit.
It mentions, it talks about ourspiritual wholeness, the bruises
and the wounds.
In other words, he took on whatwas necessary to guarantee our
(37:30):
spiritual wholeness.
He bore it so we wouldn't haveto the mental anxieties and the
mental deficiencies and themental diseases, those things he
bore for us, so we wouldn'thave to the stripes he took for
the healing of our bodies.
Only thing we talk about is thespiritual aspect of it.
(38:03):
Why are we so willing to ignoretwo thirds of what Christ
accomplished on our behalf?
Because he, in other words, hecorrected the errors that came
about because of Adam.
Adam was perfect in all hisbeing spiritually, physically
and mentally but then that waslost.
(38:25):
Christ came to correct that.
He made us whole again, but wedon't know it because we're not
taught it.
I don't get sick, elsa, Isimply don't get sick.
I don't believe in beingdepressed.
Speaker 1 (38:43):
I'm with you.
Speaker 2 (38:43):
I'm with you, you're preaching to the choir here.
It's not because I'm any betterthan anybody else.
It's just that I know what theword says regarding this and I
apply it to my life.
I simply don't get sick.
I've been in the house with twograndkids my wife, two
grandkids and a son.
They were all sick.
Now we're breathing the sameair.
My wife and I are sleeping inthe same room in the same bed.
(39:05):
They're all sick.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
And.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
I don't get sick simply because I don't buy it.
I don't buy what well this iswhat's going around.
I know what Jesus did so Iwouldn't have to deal with it.
And once we know the truth ofthe word and I understand that
that was just an example, butall of life is that way Once we
(39:28):
understand what God did byputting Christ in us, by giving
us his seed and making us hissons his seed and making us his
sons, then we realize what he'stalking about when he says
(39:50):
greater is he that is in us thanhe that is in the world, that
we are overcomers, that we havevictory in all things, because
the adversary was spoiled.
I mean, any authority that hehad over us was just obliterated
, and there's no need for us tobe bullied by him.
If we know who we are, he'safraid of us.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
Yeah, yes, yes, yes, absolutely.
That was literally the mostperfect way to close out.
You know, it's literally themost perfect way to close out.
You know, it's literally themost perfect message to kind of
wrap up this whole thing.
And I have to tell you I don'twant to wrap this up.
I want to keep talking all day,but I you know, I know you have
(40:29):
a life to get to.
I understand that Before we dosay goodbye here, I would be
very remiss.
Not to mention that there isnot only one book out by you,
sir.
There is another book.
It is called ChristianLeadership Honor, reverence and
Respect for God in His Word.
Will you tell everyone wherethey can find your books?
(40:50):
And if there's a website,anything else, please let them
know and we will put it.
Guys, it will be in the shownotes, don't worry if you miss
it for any reason, we will itthere for you.
But where can they find yourbooks?
Speaker 2 (41:00):
it gives you locations.
One is Clyde Simpson bookscomthat is my website, and the
other is Amazon.
When you go to Amazon, you caneither google the book or you
can google my name, clydeSimpson.
The books are going toautomatically pop up, and they
do, because I looked you can buythe book.
Speaker 1 (41:17):
You can buy my name, clyde Simpson.
The books are going toautomatically pop up, and they
do, because I looked.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
You can buy the book.
You can buy the book on eitheron my website or on Amazon.
The only difference is, if youbuy it on my website, I don't
have to share the postings withAmazon.
If you buy it on Amazon, I haveto share 30%.
Yes, exactly, so you know whatthe most important thing is that
it is bought.
I don't care if it's neverbought on my website, as long as
(41:42):
it gets into the hands of thepeople and they finally
understand the word of God in amuch better way.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Yes, absolutely, I'm so excited to read this book,
Both of those books actually,but I am starting with the first
one because, as a babe, as ababe, I well not a babe.
You know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Which first one are you referring to?
Speaker 1 (42:02):
You know, what I mean .
Speaker 2 (42:03):
I'm sorry, which first one you say?
Starting with the first one.
Speaker 1 (42:06):
I started.
Oh, I well, I should saystarting with the second one.
I like, yeah, thank you.
Yes, thank you for correctingme on that.
Speaker 2 (42:12):
Let me make a distinction between the two, the
way they were written.
The first book, which is theleadership book, was literally
my dissertation from mydoctorate program.
I knew that it would be read byPhDs and doctors.
However, I had never written abook before, so I just
(42:33):
transformed it for the most part, modified it a bit, transformed
it into a book.
Not thinking about the averageperson is not Some of the
terminology used and the wordsused is just going to turn some
people off.
But the more educated peoplewill get it, it's no big deal
(42:54):
for them.
But the second book, Iunderstood what a miscalculation
that I made.
So the second book a sixthgrader can understand.
I wrote it in such a way thatthe average person can
understand clearly what I'msaying.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
That's phenomenal.
I am super excited to read itand uh, and I'm I'm excited for
everybody else to to see thisinterview and and to uh, just to
see what you're all about andwhat these books are all about,
and uh, what, what a blessing,what a blessing to have met you
and to have had thisconversation, so I thank you
very much.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Thank you very much wonderful.
Speaker 1 (43:35):
All right guys.
Thank you for watching with usand we will see you in the next
episode.
Take care.
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