March 17, 2023 • 33 mins
In this episode - Larry and Thomas discuss how the latest developements in the accidental shooting death of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins by actor Alec Baldwin while on the set of the movie "Rust" will affect the upcoming trial. Next the chat about the NFL - Aaron Rogers quarterback for the Green Bay Packers is now saying he will play for the NY Jets this year. And to wrap it up an analysis of the 2023 Oscars - what it was, what it is , and what it should be.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Good morning, Entertainment brother. Goodmorning, Brother Hackett. We've got a
lot on our docket, as always, more developments in the Rust Case.
We've got some sports to talk about, love it and a look back at
that man named Oscar and what Oscarcan do to improve his standing to stand
even more upright in his goldenness.Going forward, Yes, from Times Square
(00:23):
once again we are the Entertainment Brothersand now the Entertainment Brothers. Here's Larry
Hackett and Thomas Valentino. Hello andwelcome back. I am Larry Hackett.
(00:50):
I am joined by as always myentertainment brother, Thomas Valentino, and welcome
to the Ladies installment of the EntertainmentBrothers, where we go over the mechanics
of this entertainment industry, lift thehood on show business, predict the weather,
the meteorology of what we call entertainment. Yeah, let us begin.
We have spent a lot of timeover the past several months talking about the
(01:11):
Rust Case, and some of youout there may find it boring, but
we find it fascinating because it literallyis at the nexus of what we enjoy,
which is the law, show businessand kind of reputation management. Den
frankly, career survival. It's reallya survival. It's like law and survival.
Yeah, and in this case AlecBaldwin. But frankly, it's still
pregame, it's still exhibition baseball.But he is doing fairly well, I
(01:34):
would say, very well from alegal standpoint. Let's remind everybody where we
were at. Back in October oftwenty twenty one, Alec Baldwin was making
a movie called Rust. It wasa western being shot in New Mexico.
A gun in his hand went offand killed the cinematographer, Helena Hutchins.
Hutchins died. An investigation ensued thatlasted well over fifteen months. Alec Baldwin
was very open and willing to speakto the police and to the press.
(01:59):
After fifteen months, I would ventureto guess that most of us thought that
no charges would be brought. Therewas a flurry of civil lawsuits. Most
of those got settled, including themost important one, which was a settlement
between Hutchins's widow er and Baldwin,which paved the way for the movie to
go on right and looked at,say, if everybody was into clear.
Late last year Balden was charged aswas the armorer in the case. Hannah
(02:22):
gutierres read with involuntary manslaughter, twocharges, one of them quite serious about
involving the death of Hutchins. Inthe intervening months, Balden has hired an
attorney, Lucas Nikos here in NewYork and waged a very aggressive legal campaign
to basically exonerate himself. The thingnumber one was, the most serious charge
that could have put him in jailfor five years, was eliminated because lawyers
(02:46):
for Baldwin argued the law that hadbeen passed into Mexico was not passed until
after the shooting. It could nothave applied at the time of the shooting.
Therefore, he was not able tobe charged on that law. Prosecutors
agreed they got rid of that case. They took a swipe at his attorney
when they did that, but theyagreed to reduce that charge this week.
The second challenge that Baldwin's attorney hadmade was also successful. The special prosecutor
(03:10):
in the case, a woman namedAndrea Reeb, the woman who had done
the investigation on behalf of the SantaFe District attorney and the woman who presumably
was going to be in the courtroombringing the case and litigating the case against
Baldwin was removed from the case because, per the charge, or per the
accusation from Baldwin's attorney, she wasa member of the New Mexico legislature and
(03:32):
therefore could not serve as a specialprosecutor because she would be potentially influenced by
political donations from other attorneys. Theybasically said that it was a conflict of
interest, and again the Santa Feattorney agreed. So these are two pre
trial victories. Yeah, that again, Presage. It seems to me what
(03:52):
is going to be a lopsided andovermatched case in the courtroom between Lucas Knee
Costs, Baldwin's New York based attorney, and the folks in New Mexico who
are committed to justice for Helena Hutchins, but at this stage of the game
look woefully legally outmatched. Yeah.Yeah, but I knew there was a
(04:16):
butt coming. Yeah, I couldsee it. But but you saw it
coming from mine your mouth? Yeah, good, because I did sort of
exaggerated. Okay, when I'm inthese situations, and I'm not a litigator
per se, but I am inadversarial situations what I never do is I
(04:36):
never make any assumptions whatsoever good orbad. Sometimes you may get ten things,
because if you're dealing with a lotof motions and things of that nature,
you feel like you're winning. You'rewinning, you're winning, and the
smartest thing to do is to juststay very balanced abo out it and not
(05:00):
really revel in it too much.Okay, So the two things that you're
talking about, the first one inparticular is significant to Alec Baldwin because it
would potentially reduce the amount of timethat he would spend in jail. So
anytime we have something like that happening, obviously that's very important. If you're
(05:23):
going from five years potentially to eighteenmonths, that's really significant. So that
I think that one was a bigvictory. This one, to me is
really apparent. Okay, it's aconflict of interest. And even if it's
not a conflict of interest, theAmerican Bar Association rules say, if it
(05:44):
looks like a conflict of interest,if it gives the impropriety of a conflict
of interest thing, guess what youhave to resign or recuse yourself or not
be involved in the case. Istill feel this comes down to the courtroom,
to the jury and to the evidenceof the different things that we've been
(06:04):
looking at so far, and youknow, where procedures followed, did different
things happen the way they were supposedto. I think those things are still
more significant than what we've seen sofar. I don't disagree with that.
I think the evidence is going tobe the evidence in this case is going
to be fought in the courtroom,assuming it gets that far. Yeah,
(06:24):
right, But early days suggest thatthe prosecutors. When I say that,
I don't just mean the special prosecutor, I mean the DA in Santa Fe.
I don't want to say they don'tknow what they're doing, but they're
just being outmatched here. Let's rememberwhat happened a couple of weeks ago when
they agreed to remove the charge againstBaldwin. They could have put them in
(06:46):
jail for five years. Right.They basically agreed that the law had been
passed after the shooting and therefore didn'tapply to them. I guess it's that
ex post facto. Yes, yes, well said thank you, and they
took a nasty swipe at the attorney, basically saying we're not going to waste
our time on this because we don'twant this big New York City hot shot
attorney. You know, we're notin the job of letting him give BILLI
bill out, you know, getBILLI bill hours from his client. Yeah.
(07:09):
Really, this is why you're gettingrid of the charge, because you
don't want this guy to get richelfI like Baldwin. Yeah, that wasn't
smart. It wasn't smart, andit was an indication that, you know,
they've got a little peevish about this. I'm guessing they're gonna be peevish
about this. I hear what you'resaying about don't rest on your laurels if
you've been victorious, right. Idon't think there's anything that suggests that Baldwin
(07:30):
and his attorney are getting cocky becausethey've had these victories. In fact,
I would suggest it's the opposite,and they're going to be even more out
for blood. I don't know.I'm not a lawyer, so I maybe
you're getting out way on a limbhere. But I wonder whether or not
if Andrea Reeve the special prosecutor hasbeen removed, can they move to try
to remove her investigation against him.She should not have been because she should
(07:54):
not have been a special prosecutor backthen. I'm not sure they can do
that. It's a good move,but I'm saying they will continue to try
to rattle the cage of these prosecutorsfrom New Mexico. And I think said
prosecutors are you know, sufficiently rattled. And I think the way they behaved
last time suggests that they are reallygetting shaken up by this. And I
(08:16):
think it's all good news for him. We stipulate, as always, they
will come down to the evidence,as you say, and also I think
many ways to Baldwin and how he'sperceived. Right there is still the possibility
and clearly that people in Santa Fetelegraph this that they're going to paint a
picture of these people from Hollywood whocame out here and you know, didn't
(08:37):
do what they were supposed to.They took advantage of us, they didn't
follow our local regulations and more raysand they kind of did what they wanted
willy nilly. They didn't have enoughmoney, they were in paying attention to
safety regulations, and all of thatwill be dutifully brought up. I'm just
saying, evidence is a big pilesitting on a table It's like ingredients for
a recipe. You can make astew. I can make a stew with
(09:01):
the same ingredients. One of ourstews is going to taste better than the
other one. Yes, And Idon't want to beliebor in my culinary metaphors,
but that is what I think isgoing to happen. There's gonna be
evidence on the table that the prosecutorsare going to try to manipulate in their
way, and that Baldwin's attorney willtrying to manipulate in his way. And
if what's happened thus far as anyindication, you know who's going to do
a better job, so you knowwhose stew is going to taste better?
(09:24):
So far, Really, if youlook at it a certain way, what
Baldwin's attorney has done is what anyattorney would do. It doesn't mean that
he's a great attorney. I meanhe is a great attorney, okay,
But what he's done are things thatanyone, if they're doing what he does
on a daily basis, would makethose motions. It would do those things,
(09:46):
Okay. The first one about thelaw that's good lawyering is that exceptional
lawyering. I'm not so sure right, a research associate does something. It's
like, here you go, theone about the conflict of interest. I
mean, don't have to be alawyer to see that one. Right,
you have someone who's serving in twofunctions and it doesn't make sense, and
(10:07):
okay, that gets eliminated. Right, So I'm not as enamored of these
two moves so far as most peopleare, whether it's you or anyone else.
Right to me, yes, again, the one about reducing the jail
time. That's important because you don'twant your client going and sell for any
(10:28):
period of time. All right.The rest of it, to me,
might work against Baldwin. It mightwork against them when he gets into the
courtroom and they feel like, lookwhat's been going on. They're making all
these moves, and you don't knowhow people are going to react and perceive
this. But I'll tell you something, never ever, ever, This is
(10:50):
like if you're fighting someone in afight in a ring and you're punching them
and they're going down on the ropes, and how many times have we seen
this? And you're virtually certain todeclare that someone's been knocked out and all
of a sudden, rocky, okayor whoever, gets back up and wins
(11:13):
the fight. So my point is, I never ever, ever underestimate any
attorney that passed the bar and thatpractices in a prosecutor's office or anywhere else.
My experience has been that they're allvery, very competent in all areas
(11:33):
of law. So what I'm sayingis out there, everybody, do not
make any assumptions here until we getinto the courtroom. Pawpaw. You've seen
Glen Garry, Glenn Ross many times, all right, Alec Baldwin and ironically
enough, ABC, Yes, alwaysbe closing. Absolutely, I have a
(11:58):
new ABC always be challenging, yes, okay, and that's what his attorney
is doing, and that's exactly butthat's exactly what he's supposed to as supposed
to sit there. Well and toyour point, I mean he's doing a
good job, Okay. I justthink, you know, early days,
with all the you know, talkingabout evidence, the evidence we have thus
far is that the folks in SantaFe are bordering on hapless. Okay,
(12:22):
you heard it here first. WHOA, No, we are nothing if not
provocative. Yeah, So I don'tthink Mary Carmack Altwie was going to be
coming on our show anytime soon.But I'm being serious. You know the
person they hired. I know you'vesaid and thought that maybe they'll hire someone
even better to be the special prosecutor. I was just as good. I
admire your your your belief and optimistbased on practice, right, Okay,
(12:46):
okay? I mean I've gone upagainst attorneys that you know, that I've
never heard of, and then theyblew me away on what they knew.
Move over, drew bledsoe here comesTom Brady. That's a segue, by
the way, yep, did youget the segway? Of course they did,
from one quarterback to who was evenbetter than that one? How's a
(13:07):
former quarterback? You're asking me?And look where we are, and look
where we are. Our second storytoday is about the developments here in New
(13:30):
York. Now we often don't coversports, but the sports for us is
kind of like at the intersection ofentertainment, and nothing perhaps is closer to
that intersection of entertainment and sports thanthe story that is blooming here in New
York this week, which is whatmaybe the imminent arrival of Green Bay's quixonic
quarterback Aaron Rodgers to fill the legendaryWhite shoes once worn by one Joe Willie
(13:58):
Nay. Now, yes, I'mharkening back to a quarterback that you know,
basically last through a football for theGiants during the Nixon administration. But
that's a sign of how desperate andhapless and tragic, Frankie. The quarterback
situation here is the New York Jets. Let me just throw out one statistic
to you. The New York Jetsin the past thirty odd years have probably
(14:22):
had ten twelve fifteen starting quarterbacks.I'd say it's somewhere between ten and fifteen.
I would two. Yeah. TheGreen Bay Packers have had two Brett
Farve, Yeah, and Aaron Rodgers. If it all goes according to plan,
both of those men will end theircareers wearing a different color green,
(14:43):
the green of Gang Green. Yeshere in New York. Now, you
have pointed out that we'll get toRogers in a minute. You have pointed
out that the past experience of GreenBay quarterbacks coming to New York is not
a good one. No elaborate.Well, Brett Farve came here, not
only did he not really do anything. I think he had retired at one
(15:03):
point. Wasn't he retired? Yeah? It was just so strange. I
think he came, he retired,and when I don't know, went back
or whatever. But the bottom lineis, not only did he not deliver
on the football field, but therewere also some sexual harassment allegations. He
delivered other things than those would beThose would be pictures that the young people
(15:26):
have been named for that rhymes.The second word is picks yes, um,
and we'll leave it at that.Yeah. Right, And so his
demise in New York was was quick. He did he did nothing for the
Jets. But then again, theJets, you know that that's barely noticed
because there were so many quarterbacks.He's just in the long line of quarterbacks.
Rogers, we assume will be different. Now, this is all assuming
that all this is going to getworked out, and that Green Bay and
(15:48):
the Jets can agree on on thetrades and what it's going to cost to
get Rogers here. From where westand and what we do, I'm gonna
find this is gonna be a veryinteresting story. The New York papers are
already a flame with stories about Roger, about Rogers's feuds with reporters at ESPN,
about Rogers's kind of like I said, quixotic demands in his behavior.
He had spent time in the offseasonin some kind of dark tank or dark
(16:11):
retreat. So he's a colorful guy. The New York Press is going to
eat that with two spoons. Youknow. There's a famous photograph of Joe
Namath in Miami on the eve ofthe Super Bowl. I guess it was
Super Bowl three, entertaining reporters ashe you know, sat in Shay's lounge,
you know, in his bathing suitwith a shirt off. And it's
a legendary picture, it is.And what the point being that Joe Namath
(16:33):
did win that Super Bowl. Butif you look at the arc of his
career and you look at his numberscompared to other, you know, top
tier quarterbacks, they're not there.Right. There are some people who argue
that Joe Namith shouldn'tven be in theHall of Fame. But he was an
incredibly charismatic character in New York andagain, fifty years later, people still
remember him and the New York thathe embodied. You know, it was
(16:56):
fun city. It was the endof his sick He's the beginning of the
seventies. He wore the fur coatshe wore the white shoes, he had
fantastic hair, He posed nude inplay Girl. He was talking about entertainment.
He was a true entertainer. Hevie. He brought the but not only
that. He had brought the NFLfrom the Johnna Units, crew cut era,
(17:19):
absolutely high top black shoes to beingshow business. Right. They didn't
call him Broadway Joe for nothing.Absolutely, And I wonder whether or not
Rogers will do the same here.Rogers is a prickly fellow. Yes,
right. He made his announcement yetagain on about his desire to come to
(17:40):
New York on this podcast, TheMcAfee The Pat McAfee Show. Pat McAfee
seems to be the only reporter thathe talks to. More or less,
he's going to get a stern lessonwhen he comes to New York. And
you know, come the third gameof the season, he'll already be feuding
with people. He won't be goingto the locker room the postgame press conference.
They'll be all kinds of may yes, correct, right, correct,
(18:00):
It'll be Ricky Henderson. There's aNew York reference. It'll be Rickey Henderson
all over again. But we findthat very amusing and he might find it
amusing too. For all we know, is this good news? Is this
across the board good news? Doyou think, well, it's better news
than if you're a Jet fan?Then what we have currently right, which
(18:21):
is not a lot? Lit'tle stipulatethat? Okay, what about again,
in the kind of broader realm thanwe dealing? Is this good for the
NFL? Is it good for television? Is it good for fall sports?
Whatever it might be? Is thereare there bigger ramifications in this? Or
is this really just a trade storyabout a thirty nine year old quarterback,
you know, trying to live outthe end of his career, you know,
(18:44):
at a franchise that hasn't won anythingsince, you know, barely after
the you know, men walked onthe moon. Aaron Rodgers is news.
Let me correct that it was actuallybefore men walked on Okay, Aaron Rodgers
is news. Okay, no matterwhere he goes, he comes here and
naturally he's already news before he getshere. So it's gonna be news on
(19:06):
top of news. Okay, You'regonna have that dynamic going on. And
then on the field itself, itremains to be seen what he can do.
But he is still one of thetop five quarterbacks in the NFL currently
and people say he's thirty nine.Well, people said that about Tom Brady,
(19:26):
and you know, Tom Brady wasstill the best at thirty nine.
So this guy, when he playsand when he's focused, it's one of
the greatest quarterbacks who ever lived.So if nothing else, New Yorkers will
be have a privilege to see areal quarterback because we haven't had a real
quarterback in a long time. Arguablymaybe Phil Simms. But you know,
(19:48):
again, if there's going to bepeople that debate this, but certainly in
the last fifteen years, there hasn'tbeen someone with the aura of Aaron Rodgers.
Count thirty quarterbacks in thirty years offrom the Jets. Yeah, now
that's God's maybe started one or twogames, okay, but you're interesting.
It's it's Kenny O'Brien, Bois andBrowning, Nagel, Yes, Neil O'Donnell,
(20:15):
Vinny Testaverdie, Vinnie Ray Lucas,Chad Pennington. Chad Pennington was supposed
to be Mark Sanchez, Mark anothernext thing, but fumble exactly love Mark
Sancheino Smith, Michael Vick was herefor three games. Wow, Ryan Fitzpatrick,
Josh McCowan, Bryce Petty, SamDarnold, Joe Flacco started four games,
(20:37):
Zach Wilson, Mike White. Yeah, I mean it's just it's so
the position is in terms of karma, you'd sort of say, wow.
I mean, if if you don'thave someone on the level of Aaron Rodgers
filling these shoes, it's gonna betough. Like what I'm saying is,
if he doesn't bring them a SuperBowl in the next couple of years,
(21:00):
it could be another thirty years beforethey get the right person. And I
think it's great news for the NFL. I think it's it's going to have
a lot of built in storylines.I think the amount of profile that agonic
Aaron Rodgers has gotten from working inGreen Bay, which again, the world
is different now. Green Bay isnot like what it was in the nineteen
sixties or seventies when it was trulyyou know, it's it's a tiny media
(21:22):
market. Getting there is hard.You know, it's two hours from Mobile,
it's an hour and a half fromMilwaukee. I mean it's far away.
Yeah, but the world is adifferent place now. Yeah, And
they have beat reporters and they're onespanel the time. Absolutely, in large
part I think because of him andbecause before him. Oh yeah, but
I think the potential here to reallyfor him to become to transcend football to
(21:42):
some degree. Say what you allabout Tom Brady. Obviously the best quarterback,
if not the best player in theNFL. Tom Brady does not have
that degree of media electricity that Igot like Aaron Rodgers has. Correct,
He's just not as interesting, correct. Um. So I think it'll be
quite a scene for York and AaronRodgers, and I'm looking forward to it.
Rogers sort of came out two orthree years ago in the sense of
(22:06):
when I say coming out where hewas basically pretty quiet. He was non
controversial up until a couple of yearsago. And it really started with him
going on the Pat mcavie Show andsaying the first thing was he said,
I'm vaccinated, right right, orno, I'm not vaccinated right right.
First he said he had he hadbeen there, was doing his own research
(22:30):
or something. Yeah, all right, see a lot of that stuff.
And then it turned out that hewasn't. Let me say this, the
New York media lacare, the NewYork media landscape is not what it was
ten or fifteen years ago. Right, The papers don't dominate New York like
they do used to, but they'restill going to be more guys in this
locker room than he's ever seen before. Yeah right, yeah, week in,
week out, Yeah, practice,practice out beginning in July. It's
(22:53):
at you know, training, andI know he's a big time quarterback and
he's used to the NFL, butGreen Bay still is not New York.
Right, right, there's a revelation. Green Bay is not New York.
That is that's the found Let's seewhat happens. Okay, it'll be fun
to watch it. Fair enough.Our life story today is the Oscars against
(23:26):
something we've visited a lot, butI think needs to be looked at.
Because what's interesting about this year isthat the show was decent. Yes,
it was solid, yea, itwas sturdy, it was moving. Kiweek
one's speech was fantastic, Jamie LeeCurtis was great. The fact that the
almost all Asian cast of everything everywhere, all at once cleaned up Best Picture,
(23:48):
Best Director, you know, MichelleYow won. It was amazing and
it was the Oscars. Right.There was no slap, there was no
drama, but of course, somepeople tuned in last year. They didn't
know that slap was going to happen. Right. We can make kind of
you know, glib arguments about whetheror not they should have allowed Will Smith
to show up this year, ifonly because more people would have watched and
(24:08):
the show would have gotten better ratings. But as we subsequently learned, the
Academy had put almost rules on JimmyKimmel about what he could say about the
slap. He met a couple ofjokes, but they were a bit oblique,
you know, when had any questionwhat he was talking about, but
it wasn't like he came back toover and over and over again. The
Academy is very sensitive about this.But as a show, even though they
(24:30):
restored a lot of the awards thatthey had removed earlier, it was you
know, your basic solid, youknow, Oscar broadcast. The ratings ticked
up a tiny bit, but theyare still tens of millions below where they
were just ten years ago. Rightback in the twenty forty million people watched
(24:52):
this year, it was under twenty. It was eighteen points something last year.
It was about the same. Theyear before, it was terrible.
That was the COVID year, soit's gone up. But to find signs
that it's going to somehow really getoff the floor and you know, be
what it used to be. Ifind very difficult. All the more because
it wasn't a bad show, right, right, it's a show that's a
(25:14):
disaster. Right. You could say, well, this is why it was
so right, you know, beforethe broadcast on Sunday night in the week
before that, I saw some storylinesemerging, particularly about everything everywhere, all
at once that I thought, we'repretty compelling. I we get people to
watch, and they some did,right, but it wasn't enough to make
people really tune into the show.Ye. My worry is that it is
(25:36):
just one more indication that movies simplydo not occupy the same headspace and cultural
importance that they used to. Andyou can blame COVID, and you can
blame not going to theaters, andyou can blame and you can blame streaming
services. Yeah, and all thosethings, in fact do contribute. I
think the most important contributor is thefact that, and this is not new,
(25:57):
it's over the past ten or fifteenyears, the level of television that
is, to say, the thingsyou can watch at home. And I'm
not going to distinguish between a movieand TV, but the level of what
passes for TV, the level ofthings that don't play in theaters, COVID
or not, is so much betterthan it used to be that movies just
(26:18):
simply don't occupy that place. Imean, in the old days, right
you basically, you know, youhad you know, mash was the best
television show you had, and thenyou had movies which, a, we're
dealing with themes you couldn't see ontelevision, right that was number one.
You just did not see the kindof things that TV had because it was
broadcast television. With the advent ofcable and the improvement in shows beginning with
things like The Sopranos and moving on, yeah, adult themes, nuanced storytelling,
(26:42):
longer forms of stories afford the samekind of nuance and thoughtfulness and art
that the movies used to do.Meanwhile, movies no longer make that middle
tier, you know, the Kramerversus Kramers and those kinds of pictures.
They don't make those anymore. Youknow, they buy art movies, so
(27:03):
something like Tar or independent movies thatare relatively obscure, and then Big ten
Poll movies, which is you havepointed out like Top Gun don't get any
awards anyway. Right, they're ina real bind. Yeah, okay,
they're in a bind. The Grammysare in a bind. All awards shows
are in a bind. Okay,So music doesn't have the same impact the
same way you're talking about movies.Right, we're just moving. This is
(27:26):
generational. Okay. Can I jumpin for one second. Yeah, of
course. The saying that separates theGrammys from the Oscars is that you launch
performances. Right of the best partof the Oscars performance a shollow on Sunday
night was that you know, songand dance number from that Indian film nobody
saw. Yeah, but it wasentertaining. Yeah, okay, I'd rather
(27:47):
watch that than some very earnest fellowwho just won Best Cinematographer or Best Short
Film thank his mother. But youhave at the Grammys, you have performances
too. No, that's my point. That makes the Grammys better at its
space. They've figured it out.It's three hours of musical performance. Well,
what they did is they figured outa way. And again, I
don't know that their ratings are somuch better after everything they did at the
(28:10):
end of the day. So theconcept could be that people over forty don't
really watch award shows. Well,they've never been as high as the Oscars,
but my guess is they haven't fallenas far. Okay, the ideas,
you know, they reached out toactively embrace a lot more of what
was going on, but then theyalso gave awards to those particular areas of
(28:32):
music, and they expanded everything totry to get them to a different place.
The Oscars seem to be doing thesame thing. So let's just say
you improve the Oscars new and improved, and you know, there are a
lot of things that I saw thereis a new administration in place at the
Academy. Okay, so that's interestingbecause you could you could sort of feel
(28:56):
that, like the set design andstuff like that. So there could be
an argument to make that no matterhow good the show is, the ratings
are only gonna go so high atthe end of the day. And we
are where we are, and it'sstill the top show and entertainment after the
super Bowl, it's probably the topshow you know in America that everyone sort
(29:18):
of gets together and watches and talksabout, I mean live TV. Yeah,
Yeah, basically sports and award showsan election night. Yeah, so
it may not be in again,people didn't know that the slap was going
to occur, so and people didn'tknow that they were going to give the
award to the wrong movie like twoyears before that, right, But maybe
(29:40):
it's just at the point where itis what it is and no matter what
they do, it's gonna do okay, and that's it, and you know,
maybe that's how it rolls out.Yeah, I think nibbling at the
edges or tweaking the edges is notwhere it's at. I don't think that
the Academy will ever approve anything reallyradical. You and I joked on one
of our other media appearances that maybeit should be the same day as a
(30:03):
super Bowl, or that the superBowl that you know, the Oscars should
take place at halftime of the superBowl, or the super Bowl should take
place in the middle of the Oscars, ha ha ha. But I think
short of any kind of truly revolutionarynotion, you know, it'll still be
a show that you know, twentymillion people might tune into. But the
idea that it goes back to anywherenear what it had used to be,
even ten years ago. I thinkit's a pipe dream. It just can't
(30:26):
do that. And it's not theshow's fault. It is the fault of
where the movies sit in our culture. Everyone's famous now, yeah, Okay.
Andy Warhol said it, okay,sly and the Family Stones said it.
Wow, everybody is a star,right, okay? So are we,
(30:48):
you know, are we as enamoredof movie stars? In my opinion,
people used to watch the show morefor the movie stars, or as
much for the movie stars who werein attendance as for the awards themselves.
In other words, you had Jackin the room, right, You had
people like every year, and henever wanted it was Jackson, you were
(31:11):
you were going there to watch Jackor whoever your person was, right,
And we just don't have that levelof stardom anymore because everybody's a star on
TikTok or wherever. Right, Sothere is some of that that the Academy
is having to deal with, likeevery other medium that involves humans who were
(31:32):
stars, music too, same thing. Yeah. I wonder if looking back
on it, part of the problemwas after Billy Crystal, who I think
did nine, there was an erawhere there was a real Rocky Road for
some of these hosts, right,David Letterman and others, they just didn't
do a good job. Yeah,and I think it really made the show
kind of wobbly. I mean,say what you will about Johnny Carson and
(31:56):
Billy Crystal and he Bill got tiredof Billy Crystal. It was incredibly entertaining.
Oh yeah, right, and itwas a different time. Yeah,
but you tuned in to watch thatmontage and which again which Jimmy Kimel tried
to do this time. But JimmyKimmel doesn't dance and sing well, not
only that Billy Crystal does. Andas I watched the montage, I thought,
Okay, this is getting nostalgiic forBilly Crystal. I'm not sure that's
(32:17):
what you want to do right,right, but you know, for try
for this year and again they havea new administration in place. You know,
it might not have been a badway to go to just sort of
like, hey, let's get thisone off the ground and next year we
can start to play around with tryingto do some other things maybe work maybe.
Like I said, it was asolid show. Yeah, it is
(32:37):
what it is. Yeah, theculture isn't what it was, and that
may be your problem. Yeah.Yeah, I think we've solved the world's
problems today. I think we have. Maybe they can have Aaron Rodgers on
the Oscars next year. I thinkhe should host the Oscars next year,
Right, what could be honest something? Yeah, it'd be good for the
Jets. I mean, come on, tell your friends, tell your aunt
(32:58):
mincles like us everywhere. We arethe mutube. Either way, that bit
of house caim me. We willnot be here next week. Okay,
we'll be here the weekend for that. Okay, all right now, I'm
always you know, in the psychEnjoy your leg march and we'll see you
again. We get you next.Take care of everybody.
Good morning, Entertainment brother. Goodmorning, Brother Hackett. We've got a
lot on our docket, as always, more developments in the Rust Case.
We've got some sports to talk about, love it and a look back at
that man named Oscar and what Oscarcan do to improve his standing to stand
even more upright in his goldenness.Going forward, Yes, from Times Square
(00:23):
once again we are the Entertainment Brothersand now the Entertainment Brothers. Here's Larry
Hackett and Thomas Valentino. Hello andwelcome back. I am Larry Hackett.
(00:50):
I am joined by as always myentertainment brother, Thomas Valentino, and welcome
to the Ladies installment of the EntertainmentBrothers, where we go over the mechanics
of this entertainment industry, lift thehood on show business, predict the weather,
the meteorology of what we call entertainment. Yeah, let us begin.
We have spent a lot of timeover the past several months talking about the
(01:11):
Rust Case, and some of youout there may find it boring, but
we find it fascinating because it literallyis at the nexus of what we enjoy,
which is the law, show businessand kind of reputation management. Den
frankly, career survival. It's reallya survival. It's like law and survival.
Yeah, and in this case AlecBaldwin. But frankly, it's still
pregame, it's still exhibition baseball.But he is doing fairly well, I
(01:34):
would say, very well from alegal standpoint. Let's remind everybody where we
were at. Back in October oftwenty twenty one, Alec Baldwin was making
a movie called Rust. It wasa western being shot in New Mexico.
A gun in his hand went offand killed the cinematographer, Helena Hutchins.
Hutchins died. An investigation ensued thatlasted well over fifteen months. Alec Baldwin
was very open and willing to speakto the police and to the press.
(01:59):
After fifteen months, I would ventureto guess that most of us thought that
no charges would be brought. Therewas a flurry of civil lawsuits. Most
of those got settled, including themost important one, which was a settlement
between Hutchins's widow er and Baldwin,which paved the way for the movie to
go on right and looked at,say, if everybody was into clear.
Late last year Balden was charged aswas the armorer in the case. Hannah
(02:22):
gutierres read with involuntary manslaughter, twocharges, one of them quite serious about
involving the death of Hutchins. Inthe intervening months, Balden has hired an
attorney, Lucas Nikos here in NewYork and waged a very aggressive legal campaign
to basically exonerate himself. The thingnumber one was, the most serious charge
that could have put him in jailfor five years, was eliminated because lawyers
(02:46):
for Baldwin argued the law that hadbeen passed into Mexico was not passed until
after the shooting. It could nothave applied at the time of the shooting.
Therefore, he was not able tobe charged on that law. Prosecutors
agreed they got rid of that case. They took a swipe at his attorney
when they did that, but theyagreed to reduce that charge this week.
The second challenge that Baldwin's attorney hadmade was also successful. The special prosecutor
(03:10):
in the case, a woman namedAndrea Reeb, the woman who had done
the investigation on behalf of the SantaFe District attorney and the woman who presumably
was going to be in the courtroombringing the case and litigating the case against
Baldwin was removed from the case because, per the charge, or per the
accusation from Baldwin's attorney, she wasa member of the New Mexico legislature and
(03:32):
therefore could not serve as a specialprosecutor because she would be potentially influenced by
political donations from other attorneys. Theybasically said that it was a conflict of
interest, and again the Santa Feattorney agreed. So these are two pre
trial victories. Yeah, that again, Presage. It seems to me what
(03:52):
is going to be a lopsided andovermatched case in the courtroom between Lucas Knee
Costs, Baldwin's New York based attorney, and the folks in New Mexico who
are committed to justice for Helena Hutchins, but at this stage of the game
look woefully legally outmatched. Yeah.Yeah, but I knew there was a
(04:16):
butt coming. Yeah, I couldsee it. But but you saw it
coming from mine your mouth? Yeah, good, because I did sort of
exaggerated. Okay, when I'm inthese situations, and I'm not a litigator
per se, but I am inadversarial situations what I never do is I
(04:36):
never make any assumptions whatsoever good orbad. Sometimes you may get ten things,
because if you're dealing with a lotof motions and things of that nature,
you feel like you're winning. You'rewinning, you're winning, and the
smartest thing to do is to juststay very balanced abo out it and not
(05:00):
really revel in it too much.Okay, So the two things that you're
talking about, the first one inparticular is significant to Alec Baldwin because it
would potentially reduce the amount of timethat he would spend in jail. So
anytime we have something like that happening, obviously that's very important. If you're
(05:23):
going from five years potentially to eighteenmonths, that's really significant. So that
I think that one was a bigvictory. This one, to me is
really apparent. Okay, it's aconflict of interest. And even if it's
not a conflict of interest, theAmerican Bar Association rules say, if it
(05:44):
looks like a conflict of interest,if it gives the impropriety of a conflict
of interest thing, guess what youhave to resign or recuse yourself or not
be involved in the case. Istill feel this comes down to the courtroom,
to the jury and to the evidenceof the different things that we've been
(06:04):
looking at so far, and youknow, where procedures followed, did different
things happen the way they were supposedto. I think those things are still
more significant than what we've seen sofar. I don't disagree with that.
I think the evidence is going tobe the evidence in this case is going
to be fought in the courtroom,assuming it gets that far. Yeah,
(06:24):
right, But early days suggest thatthe prosecutors. When I say that,
I don't just mean the special prosecutor, I mean the DA in Santa Fe.
I don't want to say they don'tknow what they're doing, but they're
just being outmatched here. Let's rememberwhat happened a couple of weeks ago when
they agreed to remove the charge againstBaldwin. They could have put them in
(06:46):
jail for five years. Right.They basically agreed that the law had been
passed after the shooting and therefore didn'tapply to them. I guess it's that
ex post facto. Yes, yes, well said thank you, and they
took a nasty swipe at the attorney, basically saying we're not going to waste
our time on this because we don'twant this big New York City hot shot
attorney. You know, we're notin the job of letting him give BILLI
bill out, you know, getBILLI bill hours from his client. Yeah.
(07:09):
Really, this is why you're gettingrid of the charge, because you
don't want this guy to get richelfI like Baldwin. Yeah, that wasn't
smart. It wasn't smart, andit was an indication that, you know,
they've got a little peevish about this. I'm guessing they're gonna be peevish
about this. I hear what you'resaying about don't rest on your laurels if
you've been victorious, right. Idon't think there's anything that suggests that Baldwin
(07:30):
and his attorney are getting cocky becausethey've had these victories. In fact,
I would suggest it's the opposite,and they're going to be even more out
for blood. I don't know.I'm not a lawyer, so I maybe
you're getting out way on a limbhere. But I wonder whether or not
if Andrea Reeve the special prosecutor hasbeen removed, can they move to try
to remove her investigation against him.She should not have been because she should
(07:54):
not have been a special prosecutor backthen. I'm not sure they can do
that. It's a good move,but I'm saying they will continue to try
to rattle the cage of these prosecutorsfrom New Mexico. And I think said
prosecutors are you know, sufficiently rattled. And I think the way they behaved
last time suggests that they are reallygetting shaken up by this. And I
(08:16):
think it's all good news for him. We stipulate, as always, they
will come down to the evidence,as you say, and also I think
many ways to Baldwin and how he'sperceived. Right there is still the possibility
and clearly that people in Santa Fetelegraph this that they're going to paint a
picture of these people from Hollywood whocame out here and you know, didn't
(08:37):
do what they were supposed to.They took advantage of us, they didn't
follow our local regulations and more raysand they kind of did what they wanted
willy nilly. They didn't have enoughmoney, they were in paying attention to
safety regulations, and all of thatwill be dutifully brought up. I'm just
saying, evidence is a big pilesitting on a table It's like ingredients for
a recipe. You can make astew. I can make a stew with
(09:01):
the same ingredients. One of ourstews is going to taste better than the
other one. Yes, And Idon't want to beliebor in my culinary metaphors,
but that is what I think isgoing to happen. There's gonna be
evidence on the table that the prosecutorsare going to try to manipulate in their
way, and that Baldwin's attorney willtrying to manipulate in his way. And
if what's happened thus far as anyindication, you know who's going to do
a better job, so you knowwhose stew is going to taste better?
(09:24):
So far, Really, if youlook at it a certain way, what
Baldwin's attorney has done is what anyattorney would do. It doesn't mean that
he's a great attorney. I meanhe is a great attorney, okay,
But what he's done are things thatanyone, if they're doing what he does
on a daily basis, would makethose motions. It would do those things,
(09:46):
Okay. The first one about thelaw that's good lawyering is that exceptional
lawyering. I'm not so sure right, a research associate does something. It's
like, here you go, theone about the conflict of interest. I
mean, don't have to be alawyer to see that one. Right,
you have someone who's serving in twofunctions and it doesn't make sense, and
(10:07):
okay, that gets eliminated. Right, So I'm not as enamored of these
two moves so far as most peopleare, whether it's you or anyone else.
Right to me, yes, again, the one about reducing the jail
time. That's important because you don'twant your client going and sell for any
(10:28):
period of time. All right.The rest of it, to me,
might work against Baldwin. It mightwork against them when he gets into the
courtroom and they feel like, lookwhat's been going on. They're making all
these moves, and you don't knowhow people are going to react and perceive
this. But I'll tell you something, never ever, ever, This is
(10:50):
like if you're fighting someone in afight in a ring and you're punching them
and they're going down on the ropes, and how many times have we seen
this? And you're virtually certain todeclare that someone's been knocked out and all
of a sudden, rocky, okayor whoever, gets back up and wins
(11:13):
the fight. So my point is, I never ever, ever underestimate any
attorney that passed the bar and thatpractices in a prosecutor's office or anywhere else.
My experience has been that they're allvery, very competent in all areas
(11:33):
of law. So what I'm sayingis out there, everybody, do not
make any assumptions here until we getinto the courtroom. Pawpaw. You've seen
Glen Garry, Glenn Ross many times, all right, Alec Baldwin and ironically
enough, ABC, Yes, alwaysbe closing. Absolutely, I have a
(11:58):
new ABC always be challenging, yes, okay, and that's what his attorney
is doing, and that's exactly butthat's exactly what he's supposed to as supposed
to sit there. Well and toyour point, I mean he's doing a
good job, Okay. I justthink, you know, early days,
with all the you know, talkingabout evidence, the evidence we have thus
far is that the folks in SantaFe are bordering on hapless. Okay,
(12:22):
you heard it here first. WHOA, No, we are nothing if not
provocative. Yeah, So I don'tthink Mary Carmack Altwie was going to be
coming on our show anytime soon.But I'm being serious. You know the
person they hired. I know you'vesaid and thought that maybe they'll hire someone
even better to be the special prosecutor. I was just as good. I
admire your your your belief and optimistbased on practice, right, Okay,
(12:46):
okay? I mean I've gone upagainst attorneys that you know, that I've
never heard of, and then theyblew me away on what they knew.
Move over, drew bledsoe here comesTom Brady. That's a segue, by
the way, yep, did youget the segway? Of course they did,
from one quarterback to who was evenbetter than that one? How's a
(13:07):
former quarterback? You're asking me?And look where we are, and look
where we are. Our second storytoday is about the developments here in New
(13:30):
York. Now we often don't coversports, but the sports for us is
kind of like at the intersection ofentertainment, and nothing perhaps is closer to
that intersection of entertainment and sports thanthe story that is blooming here in New
York this week, which is whatmaybe the imminent arrival of Green Bay's quixonic
quarterback Aaron Rodgers to fill the legendaryWhite shoes once worn by one Joe Willie
(13:58):
Nay. Now, yes, I'mharkening back to a quarterback that you know,
basically last through a football for theGiants during the Nixon administration. But
that's a sign of how desperate andhapless and tragic, Frankie. The quarterback
situation here is the New York Jets. Let me just throw out one statistic
to you. The New York Jetsin the past thirty odd years have probably
(14:22):
had ten twelve fifteen starting quarterbacks.I'd say it's somewhere between ten and fifteen.
I would two. Yeah. TheGreen Bay Packers have had two Brett
Farve, Yeah, and Aaron Rodgers. If it all goes according to plan,
both of those men will end theircareers wearing a different color green,
(14:43):
the green of Gang Green. Yeshere in New York. Now, you
have pointed out that we'll get toRogers in a minute. You have pointed
out that the past experience of GreenBay quarterbacks coming to New York is not
a good one. No elaborate.Well, Brett Farve came here, not
only did he not really do anything. I think he had retired at one
(15:03):
point. Wasn't he retired? Yeah? It was just so strange. I
think he came, he retired,and when I don't know, went back
or whatever. But the bottom lineis, not only did he not deliver
on the football field, but therewere also some sexual harassment allegations. He
delivered other things than those would beThose would be pictures that the young people
(15:26):
have been named for that rhymes.The second word is picks yes, um,
and we'll leave it at that.Yeah. Right, And so his
demise in New York was was quick. He did he did nothing for the
Jets. But then again, theJets, you know that that's barely noticed
because there were so many quarterbacks.He's just in the long line of quarterbacks.
Rogers, we assume will be different. Now, this is all assuming
that all this is going to getworked out, and that Green Bay and
(15:48):
the Jets can agree on on thetrades and what it's going to cost to
get Rogers here. From where westand and what we do, I'm gonna
find this is gonna be a veryinteresting story. The New York papers are
already a flame with stories about Roger, about Rogers's feuds with reporters at ESPN,
about Rogers's kind of like I said, quixotic demands in his behavior.
He had spent time in the offseasonin some kind of dark tank or dark
(16:11):
retreat. So he's a colorful guy. The New York Press is going to
eat that with two spoons. Youknow. There's a famous photograph of Joe
Namath in Miami on the eve ofthe Super Bowl. I guess it was
Super Bowl three, entertaining reporters ashe you know, sat in Shay's lounge,
you know, in his bathing suitwith a shirt off. And it's
a legendary picture, it is.And what the point being that Joe Namath
(16:33):
did win that Super Bowl. Butif you look at the arc of his
career and you look at his numberscompared to other, you know, top
tier quarterbacks, they're not there.Right. There are some people who argue
that Joe Namith shouldn'tven be in theHall of Fame. But he was an
incredibly charismatic character in New York andagain, fifty years later, people still
remember him and the New York thathe embodied. You know, it was
(16:56):
fun city. It was the endof his sick He's the beginning of the
seventies. He wore the fur coatshe wore the white shoes, he had
fantastic hair, He posed nude inplay Girl. He was talking about entertainment.
He was a true entertainer. Hevie. He brought the but not only
that. He had brought the NFLfrom the Johnna Units, crew cut era,
(17:19):
absolutely high top black shoes to beingshow business. Right. They didn't
call him Broadway Joe for nothing.Absolutely, And I wonder whether or not
Rogers will do the same here.Rogers is a prickly fellow. Yes,
right. He made his announcement yetagain on about his desire to come to
(17:40):
New York on this podcast, TheMcAfee The Pat McAfee Show. Pat McAfee
seems to be the only reporter thathe talks to. More or less,
he's going to get a stern lessonwhen he comes to New York. And
you know, come the third gameof the season, he'll already be feuding
with people. He won't be goingto the locker room the postgame press conference.
They'll be all kinds of may yes, correct, right, correct,
(18:00):
It'll be Ricky Henderson. There's aNew York reference. It'll be Rickey Henderson
all over again. But we findthat very amusing and he might find it
amusing too. For all we know, is this good news? Is this
across the board good news? Doyou think, well, it's better news
than if you're a Jet fan?Then what we have currently right, which
(18:21):
is not a lot? Lit'tle stipulatethat? Okay, what about again,
in the kind of broader realm thanwe dealing? Is this good for the
NFL? Is it good for television? Is it good for fall sports?
Whatever it might be? Is thereare there bigger ramifications in this? Or
is this really just a trade storyabout a thirty nine year old quarterback,
you know, trying to live outthe end of his career, you know,
(18:44):
at a franchise that hasn't won anythingsince, you know, barely after
the you know, men walked onthe moon. Aaron Rodgers is news.
Let me correct that it was actuallybefore men walked on Okay, Aaron Rodgers
is news. Okay, no matterwhere he goes, he comes here and
naturally he's already news before he getshere. So it's gonna be news on
(19:06):
top of news. Okay, You'regonna have that dynamic going on. And
then on the field itself, itremains to be seen what he can do.
But he is still one of thetop five quarterbacks in the NFL currently
and people say he's thirty nine.Well, people said that about Tom Brady,
(19:26):
and you know, Tom Brady wasstill the best at thirty nine.
So this guy, when he playsand when he's focused, it's one of
the greatest quarterbacks who ever lived.So if nothing else, New Yorkers will
be have a privilege to see areal quarterback because we haven't had a real
quarterback in a long time. Arguablymaybe Phil Simms. But you know,
(19:48):
again, if there's going to bepeople that debate this, but certainly in
the last fifteen years, there hasn'tbeen someone with the aura of Aaron Rodgers.
Count thirty quarterbacks in thirty years offrom the Jets. Yeah, now
that's God's maybe started one or twogames, okay, but you're interesting.
It's it's Kenny O'Brien, Bois andBrowning, Nagel, Yes, Neil O'Donnell,
(20:15):
Vinny Testaverdie, Vinnie Ray Lucas,Chad Pennington. Chad Pennington was supposed
to be Mark Sanchez, Mark anothernext thing, but fumble exactly love Mark
Sancheino Smith, Michael Vick was herefor three games. Wow, Ryan Fitzpatrick,
Josh McCowan, Bryce Petty, SamDarnold, Joe Flacco started four games,
(20:37):
Zach Wilson, Mike White. Yeah, I mean it's just it's so
the position is in terms of karma, you'd sort of say, wow.
I mean, if if you don'thave someone on the level of Aaron Rodgers
filling these shoes, it's gonna betough. Like what I'm saying is,
if he doesn't bring them a SuperBowl in the next couple of years,
(21:00):
it could be another thirty years beforethey get the right person. And I
think it's great news for the NFL. I think it's it's going to have
a lot of built in storylines.I think the amount of profile that agonic
Aaron Rodgers has gotten from working inGreen Bay, which again, the world
is different now. Green Bay isnot like what it was in the nineteen
sixties or seventies when it was trulyyou know, it's it's a tiny media
(21:22):
market. Getting there is hard.You know, it's two hours from Mobile,
it's an hour and a half fromMilwaukee. I mean it's far away.
Yeah, but the world is adifferent place now. Yeah, And
they have beat reporters and they're onespanel the time. Absolutely, in large
part I think because of him andbecause before him. Oh yeah, but
I think the potential here to reallyfor him to become to transcend football to
(21:42):
some degree. Say what you allabout Tom Brady. Obviously the best quarterback,
if not the best player in theNFL. Tom Brady does not have
that degree of media electricity that Igot like Aaron Rodgers has. Correct,
He's just not as interesting, correct. Um. So I think it'll be
quite a scene for York and AaronRodgers, and I'm looking forward to it.
Rogers sort of came out two orthree years ago in the sense of
(22:06):
when I say coming out where hewas basically pretty quiet. He was non
controversial up until a couple of yearsago. And it really started with him
going on the Pat mcavie Show andsaying the first thing was he said,
I'm vaccinated, right right, orno, I'm not vaccinated right right.
First he said he had he hadbeen there, was doing his own research
(22:30):
or something. Yeah, all right, see a lot of that stuff.
And then it turned out that hewasn't. Let me say this, the
New York media lacare, the NewYork media landscape is not what it was
ten or fifteen years ago. Right, The papers don't dominate New York like
they do used to, but they'restill going to be more guys in this
locker room than he's ever seen before. Yeah right, yeah, week in,
week out, Yeah, practice,practice out beginning in July. It's
(22:53):
at you know, training, andI know he's a big time quarterback and
he's used to the NFL, butGreen Bay still is not New York.
Right, right, there's a revelation. Green Bay is not New York.
That is that's the found Let's seewhat happens. Okay, it'll be fun
to watch it. Fair enough.Our life story today is the Oscars against
(23:26):
something we've visited a lot, butI think needs to be looked at.
Because what's interesting about this year isthat the show was decent. Yes,
it was solid, yea, itwas sturdy, it was moving. Kiweek
one's speech was fantastic, Jamie LeeCurtis was great. The fact that the
almost all Asian cast of everything everywhere, all at once cleaned up Best Picture,
(23:48):
Best Director, you know, MichelleYow won. It was amazing and
it was the Oscars. Right.There was no slap, there was no
drama, but of course, somepeople tuned in last year. They didn't
know that slap was going to happen. Right. We can make kind of
you know, glib arguments about whetheror not they should have allowed Will Smith
to show up this year, ifonly because more people would have watched and
(24:08):
the show would have gotten better ratings. But as we subsequently learned, the
Academy had put almost rules on JimmyKimmel about what he could say about the
slap. He met a couple ofjokes, but they were a bit oblique,
you know, when had any questionwhat he was talking about, but
it wasn't like he came back toover and over and over again. The
Academy is very sensitive about this.But as a show, even though they
(24:30):
restored a lot of the awards thatthey had removed earlier, it was you
know, your basic solid, youknow, Oscar broadcast. The ratings ticked
up a tiny bit, but theyare still tens of millions below where they
were just ten years ago. Rightback in the twenty forty million people watched
(24:52):
this year, it was under twenty. It was eighteen points something last year.
It was about the same. Theyear before, it was terrible.
That was the COVID year, soit's gone up. But to find signs
that it's going to somehow really getoff the floor and you know, be
what it used to be. Ifind very difficult. All the more because
it wasn't a bad show, right, right, it's a show that's a
(25:14):
disaster. Right. You could say, well, this is why it was
so right, you know, beforethe broadcast on Sunday night in the week
before that, I saw some storylinesemerging, particularly about everything everywhere, all
at once that I thought, we'repretty compelling. I we get people to
watch, and they some did,right, but it wasn't enough to make
people really tune into the show.Ye. My worry is that it is
(25:36):
just one more indication that movies simplydo not occupy the same headspace and cultural
importance that they used to. Andyou can blame COVID, and you can
blame not going to theaters, andyou can blame and you can blame streaming
services. Yeah, and all thosethings, in fact do contribute. I
think the most important contributor is thefact that, and this is not new,
(25:57):
it's over the past ten or fifteenyears, the level of television that
is, to say, the thingsyou can watch at home. And I'm
not going to distinguish between a movieand TV, but the level of what
passes for TV, the level ofthings that don't play in theaters, COVID
or not, is so much betterthan it used to be that movies just
(26:18):
simply don't occupy that place. Imean, in the old days, right
you basically, you know, youhad you know, mash was the best
television show you had, and thenyou had movies which, a, we're
dealing with themes you couldn't see ontelevision, right that was number one.
You just did not see the kindof things that TV had because it was
broadcast television. With the advent ofcable and the improvement in shows beginning with
things like The Sopranos and moving on, yeah, adult themes, nuanced storytelling,
(26:42):
longer forms of stories afford the samekind of nuance and thoughtfulness and art
that the movies used to do.Meanwhile, movies no longer make that middle
tier, you know, the Kramerversus Kramers and those kinds of pictures.
They don't make those anymore. Youknow, they buy art movies, so
(27:03):
something like Tar or independent movies thatare relatively obscure, and then Big ten
Poll movies, which is you havepointed out like Top Gun don't get any
awards anyway. Right, they're ina real bind. Yeah, okay,
they're in a bind. The Grammysare in a bind. All awards shows
are in a bind. Okay,So music doesn't have the same impact the
same way you're talking about movies.Right, we're just moving. This is
(27:26):
generational. Okay. Can I jumpin for one second. Yeah, of
course. The saying that separates theGrammys from the Oscars is that you launch
performances. Right of the best partof the Oscars performance a shollow on Sunday
night was that you know, songand dance number from that Indian film nobody
saw. Yeah, but it wasentertaining. Yeah, okay, I'd rather
(27:47):
watch that than some very earnest fellowwho just won Best Cinematographer or Best Short
Film thank his mother. But youhave at the Grammys, you have performances
too. No, that's my point. That makes the Grammys better at its
space. They've figured it out.It's three hours of musical performance. Well,
what they did is they figured outa way. And again, I
don't know that their ratings are somuch better after everything they did at the
(28:10):
end of the day. So theconcept could be that people over forty don't
really watch award shows. Well,they've never been as high as the Oscars,
but my guess is they haven't fallenas far. Okay, the ideas,
you know, they reached out toactively embrace a lot more of what
was going on, but then theyalso gave awards to those particular areas of
(28:32):
music, and they expanded everything totry to get them to a different place.
The Oscars seem to be doing thesame thing. So let's just say
you improve the Oscars new and improved, and you know, there are a
lot of things that I saw thereis a new administration in place at the
Academy. Okay, so that's interestingbecause you could you could sort of feel
(28:56):
that, like the set design andstuff like that. So there could be
an argument to make that no matterhow good the show is, the ratings
are only gonna go so high atthe end of the day. And we
are where we are, and it'sstill the top show and entertainment after the
super Bowl, it's probably the topshow you know in America that everyone sort
(29:18):
of gets together and watches and talksabout, I mean live TV. Yeah,
Yeah, basically sports and award showsan election night. Yeah, so
it may not be in again,people didn't know that the slap was going
to occur, so and people didn'tknow that they were going to give the
award to the wrong movie like twoyears before that, right, But maybe
(29:40):
it's just at the point where itis what it is and no matter what
they do, it's gonna do okay, and that's it, and you know,
maybe that's how it rolls out.Yeah, I think nibbling at the
edges or tweaking the edges is notwhere it's at. I don't think that
the Academy will ever approve anything reallyradical. You and I joked on one
of our other media appearances that maybeit should be the same day as a
(30:03):
super Bowl, or that the superBowl that you know, the Oscars should
take place at halftime of the superBowl, or the super Bowl should take
place in the middle of the Oscars, ha ha ha. But I think
short of any kind of truly revolutionarynotion, you know, it'll still be
a show that you know, twentymillion people might tune into. But the
idea that it goes back to anywherenear what it had used to be,
even ten years ago. I thinkit's a pipe dream. It just can't
(30:26):
do that. And it's not theshow's fault. It is the fault of
where the movies sit in our culture. Everyone's famous now, yeah, Okay.
Andy Warhol said it, okay,sly and the Family Stones said it.
Wow, everybody is a star,right, okay? So are we,
(30:48):
you know, are we as enamoredof movie stars? In my opinion,
people used to watch the show morefor the movie stars, or as
much for the movie stars who werein attendance as for the awards themselves.
In other words, you had Jackin the room, right, You had
people like every year, and henever wanted it was Jackson, you were
(31:11):
you were going there to watch Jackor whoever your person was, right,
And we just don't have that levelof stardom anymore because everybody's a star on
TikTok or wherever. Right, Sothere is some of that that the Academy
is having to deal with, likeevery other medium that involves humans who were
(31:32):
stars, music too, same thing. Yeah. I wonder if looking back
on it, part of the problemwas after Billy Crystal, who I think
did nine, there was an erawhere there was a real Rocky Road for
some of these hosts, right,David Letterman and others, they just didn't
do a good job. Yeah,and I think it really made the show
kind of wobbly. I mean,say what you will about Johnny Carson and
(31:56):
Billy Crystal and he Bill got tiredof Billy Crystal. It was incredibly entertaining.
Oh yeah, right, and itwas a different time. Yeah,
but you tuned in to watch thatmontage and which again which Jimmy Kimel tried
to do this time. But JimmyKimmel doesn't dance and sing well, not
only that Billy Crystal does. Andas I watched the montage, I thought,
Okay, this is getting nostalgiic forBilly Crystal. I'm not sure that's
(32:17):
what you want to do right,right, but you know, for try
for this year and again they havea new administration in place. You know,
it might not have been a badway to go to just sort of
like, hey, let's get thisone off the ground and next year we
can start to play around with tryingto do some other things maybe work maybe.
Like I said, it was asolid show. Yeah, it is
(32:37):
what it is. Yeah, theculture isn't what it was, and that
may be your problem. Yeah.Yeah, I think we've solved the world's
problems today. I think we have. Maybe they can have Aaron Rodgers on
the Oscars next year. I thinkhe should host the Oscars next year,
Right, what could be honest something? Yeah, it'd be good for the
Jets. I mean, come on, tell your friends, tell your aunt
(32:58):
mincles like us everywhere. We arethe mutube. Either way, that bit
of house caim me. We willnot be here next week. Okay,
we'll be here the weekend for that. Okay, all right now, I'm
always you know, in the psychEnjoy your leg march and we'll see you
again. We get you next.Take care of everybody.
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