The Ethically Immoral Podcast

In Volume Six: Chapter Eleven of The Program, we welcome a Hamilton, Ontario–based educator, writer, poet, essayist, composer, and musician Gary Barwin. With a BFA and BA from York University and a PhD in Music Composition from SUNY Buffalo, Barwin has built a career that refuses to stay in one lane. He’s the author of more than thirty books and chapbooks—including Yiddish for Pirates, winner of the 2017 Stephen Leacock Medal for H...

 In Volume Six, Chapter Ten we welcomed Hoboken, New Jersey–based educator, poet, writer, and author Isabella DeSendi.

 A 2024 Pushcart Prize nominee, 2024 Ruth Lilly Fellowship finalist, 2024 Best New Poets selection, and 2025 New Jersey Fellowship finalist, Isabella earned her MFA from Columbia University. Her 2020 chapbook Through the New Body won the Poetry Society of America’s Chapbook Fellowship, and her debut full-length coll...

In Volume Six: Chapter Nine, we welcome Dr. Irène Mathieu — a Washington, D.C.–born, Virginia-based pediatrician, educator, researcher, and award-winning poet. She earned her BA in International Relations from the College of William & Mary, her MD from Vanderbilt University, and a Master’s in Public Health from Johns Hopkins. Today she serves as Associate Professor of Pediatrics at the University of Virginia, where she also hel...

In Volume Six: Chapter Eight of The Program, we sit down with Shreveport-born Writer, Poet, Essayist, and Author Destiny Birdsong, 

In our conversation, we trace Destiny’s creative journey from her childhood love of storytelling to the spark that ignited her lifelong devotion to poetry. We talk about how her early awareness of difference shaped her imagination, and how writing became a way to transform both beauty and pain into art....

In Volume Six: Chapter Seven, we are joined by Vancouver-born poet, writer, educator, and editor Gregory Betts. A professor of English at Brock University and Literary Arts Residency Lead at the SETI Institute, Greg has authored or edited more than 25 books, including his most recent collaboration Muttertongue: What is Word In Utter Space, co-written with Lillian Allen and Gary Barwin. 

In our conversation, we trace Greg’s creative ...

In Volume Six: Chapter Six of The Program, we welcome back Chicago-based writer, poet, and blogger Drew Carroll. It’s been over five years since our last conversation, and a lot has changed. Drew has traded powerlifting for building worlds—through poetry, short fiction, and most recently his new digital platform, The Blog of Drew, launched in June.

In our conversation, we discuss his journey from writing poetry during some of the ha...

No guest this week — instead, it's our Chapter Break episode. For this one, We’ve pulled together six of our favorite live readings and spoken word performances from past guests on the program. Think of it as a chance to pause, revisit, and really sit with the words that have stayed with us — and hopefully with you too. We’ll be back next week with a brand-new conversation. 

Recorded Spoken Word Performances Featured Include:

Sa...

In Volume Six: Chapter Five of The Program, we welcomed Story Teller Gordon —a New York-based Community Activist, Poet, Spoken Word Artist, Author of the poetry collection "Don't Speak For Me", and founder of FORM NYC, a nonprofit that blends poetry, public health, and community healing. With a Master of Public Health degree in Health Policy and Management, Gordon is a multidisciplinary creative who uses his art and ...

In Volume Six: Chapter Four of the podcast, we welcome Poet, Spoken Word Artist, and Author Natasha Ria.

Natasha Ria has been writing and performing poetry for three decades. Whether it is performing with live musicians in Jazz, R&B, or Hip Hop or sharing her quieter literary work, her signature voice soothes audiences and brings them closer to themselves. Personal, political, intersectional, Natasha Ria brings her entire self t...

In Volume Six: Chapter Three of the podcast, we welcome Poet, Spoken Word Artist, and Author Alyssa Michelle for her third appearance on the program. Alyssa, based in Albany, New York, is a mother, motivational speaker, and creative writing consultant who has authored three poetry collections: Growing Pains, The Awakening, and Blooming Season.

In our conversation, we ease in with her road trip R&B playlist, then dive into a disc...

This week on the program, we welcomed Poet, Scholar, Educator, and Author of the poetry collection "What Had Happened Was" -  Dr. Therí Pickens . Dr. Pickens is a Professor of English at Bates College, where she teaches courses in African American and Arab American literature, disability studies, philosophy, and literary theory. In our conversation, we explore the intersections of Blackness, disability, poetry, and presen...

In the premiere Chapter of Volume Six, we welcomed Chicago-born and based Educator, Poet, Writer, Spoken Word Artist, and Dancer, Sunshine  Lombré . 

From her early start in ballet at the age of three to her decision to pursue dance and poetry professionally, Sunshine walks us through her artistic evolution—how physics gave way to poetry, how Craigslist led to one of her first choreography gigs, and how an unexpected injury became a...

In Volume Five: Chapter Twenty, we welcomed Ajanae Dawkins.

Ajanaé is a poet, conceptual artist and theologian. She works through poetry, visual art, performance, and audio to explore the politics of faith, grief, and intimate relationships between Black women. As a theologian, she blends cultural criticism, memoir, and theology as autotheory to consider the relationship between Black church history, spirituality, and creation. Her ...

In Volume Five: Chapter Nineteen, we welcomed Educator, Poet, Writer, Spoken Word Artist, host of the Chasing After Wind podcast, and Author of the chapbook How Much We Must Have Looked Like Stars To Stars, Dr. Alysia Nicole Harris.

Alysia has dedicated her life to studying words in their spiritual, social, linguistic and creative capacities. Renowned internationally as a spoken word artist, Alysia has had a professional career as a...

In Volume Five: Chapter Eighteen, we welcomed Writer, Poet, Editor, and Author of the forthcoming poetry collection "Ajar", Margo LaPierre.

Margo edits fiction and creative non-fiction. She completed an undergraduate degree in philosophy at Toronto Metropolitan University in Toronto, and graduated from the Toronto Metropolitan Chang School’s Publishing Program. She is currently completing a Master of Fine Arts in Creative ...

In Volume Five: Chapter Seventeen, we welcomed Educator, Writer, Poet, Playwright, and Author of the poetry collection "Here in the (Middle) of Nowhere", Anastacia-Reneé.

(From anastacia-renee.com):

Anastacia-Reneé (She/They) is a queer writer, educator, interdisciplinary artist, playwright, former radio host, TEDX speaker, and podcaster. She is the author of (v.) (Gramma/Black Ocean), Forget It (Black Radish); Sidenotes fr...

In Volume Five, Chapter Sixteen, we welcomed Poet, Artist, Writer, and Author Dre Hill.

Dre is a Black literary and visual artist. Hill tags himself as an artist, writer, and storyteller. He is a published fiction writer, poet, photographer, painter, and more.

He graduated from Trimble Tech High School in 2017, then earned his B.A. in Animation and Writing from Drury University in 2021. While at Drury, he had two pieces published in ...

In Volume Five: Chapter Fifteen, we welcome Poet, Writer, and Spoke Word Artist Asia Samson.

(From theasiaproject.com):

 Since 2009, The Asia Project has toured over 2000 colleges with an acoustic music poetry act that has amazed audiences all over the country. On the microphone is Asia Samson: writer, poet and part-time ninja. He has been seen on HBO Def Poetry Jam and has shared the stage with such artists as Janelle Monae, Jill Sc...

 In Volume Five, Chapter Fourteen, we sit down with Baltimore-based artist Dream—an educator, poet, writer, photographer, and meditation guide. In our conversation, Dream discusses her creative journey, releasing her spoken word pieces on streaming platforms, and talks about the influence that her family’s creativity has had on her. We dive into poetry, writing, the benefits of meditation, and the beauty of helping others. A conver...