Year End Recap with Ryan, Nick, and Chase (Full Podcast)

The boys are ending this year with their final internal episode for 2024! Join Ryan, Nick, and Chase as they recap their goals, achievements, and milestones this year and how they're setting the bar higher in 2025. 

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Everyday Millionaire Show with
Ryan Greenberg and Nick Kalkas.
Alright guys, welcome back toanother episode of the Everyday
Millionaire Show.
We're here doing anotherinternal podcast with Chase and
Nick our annual year-end review.
Nick had to check somelast-minute stats on what this

(00:23):
year looked like, I guess yeah,exactly so um, we have a couple
come in here with misinformationthat's true, that's true.
And then we'd be, uh, like allthe news networks, um.
So one of the things I guesswe'll talk about is, I think
last year we had set some goalsto like hit some numbers.

(00:44):
I missed my revenue goal.
This year we wanted to do $10million in construction.
We did miss that by a littlebit, but not much.
So I think that probably thatnumber for me will stay the same
for this year coming and I'lltry to hit that this fucking
year, but I did not hit it,unfortunately, uh, 2024.

Speaker 2 (01:07):
So well, what about?
You say so 10 million, but whatabout?
Are you focusing more on on thegross number or bringing things
, tightening things up to get ahigher net at the end of the day
?

Speaker 1 (01:18):
I think a little bit of both, but the 10 million
number was just like in my head,like that's.
I wanted to hit eight figures.
That's a gross number, rightyeah, it's a gross revenue
number.
Um in my head I just wanted tohit that.
Like we knew profits were what,like I didn't really care about
the profits.
Like obviously we care aboutprofits, but like for me that
number was just like.
I just want to hit it.

(01:38):
Now I'm more focused on likecan I get to that number and fix
some nuts and bolts, I guess,of the business?
Um, I did.
We did have a lot of growththis year.
Um, I think one of the bigthings is like finding people
like chase to put in positionswhere I can like refocus my
energies on things.
Um, like not being a realestate agent anymore.

(02:01):
Um, not that I'm not a realestate agent, but Chase has
taken that over, so I can focusmore on construction and that
business.
But I do think it's importantto have a gross revenue number.

Speaker 2 (02:15):
No, I agree.
I mean, the more you're grossultimately, the more you're
going to net, hopefully in mostcases, hopefully.

Speaker 1 (02:22):
There is obviously some risks, some like risks, you
know, and just talking aboutgross revenue, but we do feel
like there is room forefficiency improvements, like
just within the company.
We have some like managementchanges going on currently, so
I'm actually excited for thenext couple of months.
We're like stacked withbusiness right now, like with

(02:44):
with home remodeling stuffthat's good, especially going
through the winter.

Speaker 2 (02:47):
That's definitely, yeah, usually this is like your
off season yeah take a break.

Speaker 3 (02:50):
You're like.
I want to relax and like today.

Speaker 1 (02:53):
I just I had another basement remodel in my
neighborhood, um, and it's likechrist, it's about to be
christmas and he's like I'mready to get started like right
away.
I'm like dude, you have achristmas tree up, like you
don't want us in here right now,like give me a couple weeks at
least.
But I'm doing kitchens,bathrooms, like normally right
now we would be very dead, andwe buy a couple houses we're

(03:15):
flipping, um, flipping one rightnow under contract, another.
This is when we typically buyour houses to flip, and then the
summertime is usually like thebusy time to, you know, build
for people, but it has been justoff the fucking wall yeah,
that's a good problem to haveand I know you probably buy
those houses around this timejust to kind of keep your guys
busy.
But it's good to have that umhomeowner client, you know, to

(03:38):
keep the guys busy as well yeah,I think most people know, like
investor work is typicallycheaper, you're not going to get
um the same margins but youwill get the volume, so that you
know you get to supplement kindof um the high margin stuff
with the volume stuff.
And chase and I were talkingthe other day and we were just

(04:00):
talking about it like ourcompany trip this year for 2025
was, uh, going to be to thailandand like the amount of money
that we're spending, our pointspay for like so much of that
trip and so it's.

Speaker 3 (04:12):
It's actually crazy the more money you make, the
more stuff you get for free yeah, yeah, yeah you grow your
audience.
You get free stuff.
You get free products.
You know you.
You spend more money at homedepot.

Speaker 2 (04:24):
You get a percent back I know it's funny because,
like, when you're poor it's likeyou need the money to buy it.
When you have money, it's likeyou get the free stuff.
So it's like backwards it is sobackwards.

Speaker 1 (04:35):
It is so backwards and I was saying um about the
points the other day.
Like you know, we're we have tospend money on our credit card
to buy materials.
We're getting like a half amillion points or more because
Amex gets one and a half pointsper.
That's why you need to switchback from Southwest Okay.
That's why you need to switchback from Southwest.
Once you get your companionpass, you need to go back to

(04:57):
Amex because for anyconstruction materials you get
1.5x points.
Dude, I'm accumulating like ahalf a million points a month.
Yeah, that's 1.5 x points, dude, I'm accumulating like a half a
million points a month.
Yeah, that's insane.
Like the first class lay downseat trip to um, thailand, is
like 700 000 points.
I can literally pay for a firstclass ticket.
It's like eight thousanddollars in one month of just
spending and you get it back,and then home depot gives you

(05:21):
the two percent rebate yeah,that's nice, so we're getting
three and a half percent back.
You spend a million dollarsateyeah, that's nice.
So we're getting 3.5% back.
You spend a million dollars.
It's $35,000 that they're justgiving it to you.
And then, of course, you getyour Pro Rewards perks, so
you're getting all those giftcards that they give you.

Speaker 2 (05:36):
Yeah, so I mean originally when I had the
Southwest card it was nice, verynice for the flights.
They didn't have hotel youcouldn't buy, you couldn't book
a hotel with the points, but nowyou can.
So that kind of made me switchto like want to just stay with
southwest.
But you know, you mentionedearlier that you can convert
your amex points to and to likehilton points and like they
double um, so that's definitelythe amex is go to the only.

Speaker 3 (05:59):
The only other card that I would say is probably
closely competitive is like thechase sapphire.
But the amex is go to the amexlounge yeah, have you been?
Oh yeah, have you been?
I've never been.

Speaker 1 (06:10):
No I'll have to go.
The problem is we don't haveone here at bwi?
Um, but they they have them insome of the bigger airports and
they're really nice.
Um, the problem with amex isthat they're they don't accept
amex everywhere, which isannoying.

Speaker 2 (06:24):
So, like certain vendors, is it still that way?
Because I remember like back inthe day, like costco wouldn't
accept.
They still don't, they don'tamex charges the highest uh
transaction fee.

Speaker 1 (06:33):
So some vendors are like no, I'm not gonna pay that
transaction fee I know thatcostco doesn't because when we
were stocking our office, whenpeople were like a lot of people
were working in our office, wewould try to go go to Costco and
get stuff, but our company cardis Amex.
I had to pay with my personalcard at Costco for you know
stuff, because they only acceptVisa.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
One of our old sign guys wasn't taking Amex, so I'd
have to pay out of my personalVisa.
It was so annoying.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
But I will say, if you're doing construction stuff
specifically, amex is the way togo because you get 1.5x for
every dollar you spend and whenyou're spending like a lot of
money, it just makes sense.
Man, like I can switch to DeltaPoints, I can switch to

(07:18):
Hawaiian Airlines, I can switchto Hilton and get two for one.
I mean, there's like there'sjust so many benefits.
You get the lounge access andlike some people think it's
crazy that we pay, like I pay700 bucks, I think, or something
, 650 or something a year forthe Amex, but like I feel like I
get that plus.

Speaker 3 (07:37):
Dude.
It was funny because when I wasin the Air Force this this is
the only reason I have an Amexwhen I was in the Air Force, the
big hack was you'd get the Amex, the Platinum, to start off.
They waive the annual fee, soyou get the opening bonus of
like 150,000 points.
You spend that or whatever.
Then you get the additionaluser, which is another 10,000.
And then you rinse and repeatthat with the gold card and now

(07:58):
you're just stacking points.
Then I did it with my flip andI was like dude, I'm the man,
like I just accumulate all.
But this is like such a small.
I like spend a hundred thousanddollars and I'm thinking I'm
the man, but I mean you do, youaccumulate a lot.
And then they run those specialoffers where you get extra
points on these airlines or thehotels and it's still like if
you have a business, you're abusiness owner and you're not

(08:20):
utilizing these cards.
I'll drop my referral links inthe chat.

Speaker 2 (08:23):
Yeah, I mean it's you know you got to take advantage
of it.
You're spending a lot of money.
If you have a business, you'rebuying materials, you're, you
know, paying for different costsand you get these points and
you can use these points to takeflights and book hotels.

Speaker 1 (08:35):
The other thing too.
You got to leverage yourvendors too.
I feel like a lot of peopledon't leverage their vendors
Like I use and abuse my vendors,not in a bad way, but like that
I have a value to my cabinetpeople.
I have a value to home depot,like I will.
I want to use that relationshipas much as possible, like the
doctors that get taken out bythe medical sales people, like

(08:56):
they do the same stuff for forus, like they're gonna take us
to their golf foursomes withnational lumber and stuff like
that, and I I take advantage ofevery situation.
I could get a free meal or like, seriously like I do.

Speaker 2 (09:10):
What are you doing now with home depot?
So we both have managedaccounts at home depot and the
rep was, you know, back in theday it was um matt carney and I
think he quit or got fired.
And then it was luke waters andhe kind of just fell off the
planet.
I think he quit or got fired.
And then it was Luke Waters andhe kind of just fell off the
planet.
I think he quit or got firedalso.
And now I'm like stuck withnothing, like I don't have a rep
now and I try to contact themand they say that they don't

(09:33):
have one for the area.

Speaker 1 (09:35):
Yeah, so I have, I got a new.
This is a funny story and Idon't drop names.
So I contacted Jordan's boss,who came to me on a flip that
I'm doing for somebody ActuallyChase is about to list this
property and it was so funnybecause the rep so it was Jordan

(09:59):
, his boss, and then theregional manager from Philly to
Norfolk, virginia, like big boss, like he was like in charge of
all the pro accounts for fromPhilly to I think it was Philly
to Norfolk or something likethat and while we were there,
home Depot screwed up a deliveryto that address.
Like it was literally happeningin real time and I was like

(10:23):
this is why I took my account toNational Lumber, because
they've been trying to get me togo all back with Home Depot.
But I switched to NationalLumber because their deliveries
are just better.
They have in-house deliveries.
Home Depot subs out everything.
We just were at a flip, our flipyesterday, and Home Depot

(10:43):
subbed out their delivery to us.
Luckily I was there.
They delivered all the wrongdoors, so we wanted two panel
doors.
They delivered six panel doors.
I was an idiot and the guy cameinside and I just signed for it
real quick because I wasrunning around the house and we
came outside and I was likethese are the wrong doors and
the guy tried to refuse to takethem back.
So I literally did.
It was was the funniest thing.
I had my phone in one hand withmy home depot rep on speaker

(11:07):
and then that guy gave me hisphone with his boss, who's
another company that does thedeliveries, and I was like this
is talk to them.
And I put the phones next toeach other and they ended up
taking it back.
But I was like this is why Ihate home depot, because of that
reason.
So this guy um, matt, I can, Ican link you up with him.

(11:28):
Uh, he's the regional manager.
He got me with a good rep.
Now I have a good rep um, we'llsee how long she lasts.
She's been with home depot fora long time, but that's, that's
like the the uh part that peopledon't see, like dealing with
these people.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
Yeah, vendors and especially if you order
something.

Speaker 3 (11:47):
I saw you.
You were so frustrated and he'slike yelling with his, his head
honcho in the house.
He's like I hate these HomeDepot refs.
He's like cussing.

Speaker 2 (11:55):
He's like and then he tells the lady like.

Speaker 3 (12:02):
I know it's not your fault and then she was like yes,
it is, it's their fault andlike it's just not a great
system.

Speaker 1 (12:07):
Yeah, it's, it's, it's not good.
The problem is is that and Itell them, I'm like I'm your
easiest sale I'm in I'mfinancially incentivized to use
Home Depot because I get my 2%,I get the pro perks.
So once we hit that million,you know a million dollars,
we've gotten at least $10,000 ingift cards back for the year.
We've gotten $20,000 in rebatesand cash rebates.

(12:30):
I'm incentivized to use you andI'm not using you.
And I'm spending more moneygoing to capital building supply
for drywall, going to nationallumber for wood, because they're
just way better at.

Speaker 2 (12:44):
Yeah, and that's one less stress aspect of the
business that you don't have toworry about.
Yes, you do have to pay alittle bit more, but people are
willing business owners arewilling to pay that extra dollar
to get things done right thefirst time and not have to take
an order back, go through thattrouble and headache when that's
just time wasted out of theirday.

Speaker 1 (13:10):
I told her the other day, I think.
I was on the phone at the houseand I was like you have to
pitch this to Home Depot.
I said I know myself and twoother people that would spend
that, spend $3 million a year.
Hire us two guys and a boxtruck for three accounts and
that person is just running fromjob to job.
Those two people are justrunning from Home Depot to job
site, home Depot to job site forall of us at the same time.
Three million dollars inrevenue can't support two guys

(13:30):
in a truck.
No way they're just I don'tknow, I don't.
I don't want to say they'relazy, but they're like testing
out their own drivers in atlanta, apparently right now, to see
if that works.
But I'm like it's not workingthis way.
Yeah, why can't?

Speaker 3 (13:45):
you start an independent contracting moving
company and just have home depotdo that it's just, it's another
, it's another idea.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
Let's say no, no, I mean, I just I think that there
are um limitations to those big,um big box stores versus small
mom and pop shops.
That's why I keep currentcabinetry.
Shout out to them.
They always sponsor our events,they sponsor anything we ever
throw at them.
They nobody can beat them forcabinets because they they have
them on stock.

(14:13):
Do you use them?
Yeah, yeah, I mean, they'rethere, they're in the warehouse.
Other companies, like I don'twant to say bad things about,
but like other companies thatI've used, they're two weeks out
.
And then, if one cabinet comeswrong, you're like, oh, I gotta
reorder, and now I can't get mycountertops for two weeks
because the stupid basecabinet's not in stock.
That holds up a lot of thingslike no way, I'm gonna just

(14:34):
stick with my, my people thatthat's what they do.
They just do cabinets.
You know, they're really reallygood at it, um, so yeah, so I
guess the next, uh, next, thingI wanted to talk about was this
hilarious video that I can'tbelieve you didn't see that we
are now transitioned to vibe um,who was on the podcast recently

(14:56):
, before that episode.
We did that's when we startednegotiations with them, um, here
at my house and things you knowcame together and, um, we moved
the team over there.
It feels really good justhaving some like, some support,
some back office support.
Instead of building from theground, we, like I feel like

(15:18):
we're building from thefoundation yeah, yeah, they.

Speaker 3 (15:20):
I mean they already have a lot, so it's it's
allowing us to focus on themoney making activities and like
building the agents that areunder us right now.
So it does feel really good.

Speaker 1 (15:30):
So that's one big thing that I think this year is
going to be nice to let Chasekind of spearhead that venture
of just getting other agents onboard that will drive revenue to
the other businesses toobviously to his own pocket, but
also just like the recognitionof being with a group of 100 and

(15:51):
something agents that now allknow that we're there and the
off the stuff that we do like.
Probably different than someother people like, we're
investor based, we're very heavyon, you know, flips and
acquiring properties where someof these agents might have deals
, they might have leads theymight not know who to get rid of
a house to.
That's shitty, you know.

Speaker 3 (16:12):
Yeah, I know a lot of the Vibe agents actually are on
at Vibe because of theirservices that Vibe provides, but
they're mainly just there towholesale and they just got
their license because they werescared of the the sanctions that
were maybe coming in Maryland,yeah, so I think there's a lot
of opportunity.

Speaker 2 (16:30):
That's good that they did that, because you never
knew I guess we still don't know, or I guess it's not happening,
but potentially them not beingable to wholesale, so it was
good for them to get theirlicense for those, I think.
I think that eventually iscoming.

Speaker 1 (16:46):
I think it's just hard to put like.
I think it's just hard to putlike real laws on it.
Like we're going through thisshort sale process right now and
it's like a really weird clunkyprocess and if you were just
able to assign it it would be alot easier.
Um, but there I think there isregulation.
I think it's just hard toregulate.

Speaker 3 (17:01):
That's I, I, I don't really know I don't think it
matters what they do to regulateit.
Like there's I mean we'vetalked about it before like you
can sell the loc, like there'sways around all of these
restrictions, but, um, at theend of the day, like that's.
That's why I love what we'rekind of still building here is
like we're investor focused,like all of our agents are
investor friendly, like we'redoing the wholesale innovations,

(17:22):
like everything.
So we're kind of touching allof that pie and being able to
teach these kids how to do it.

Speaker 1 (17:28):
I think it's really hard right now for and I was
just with TJ Kane the other daywe were talking about, you know,
just that life like the retailrealtor life and it's just so
saturated and it's so tough.
Like you get your SOI deals,like your sphere, you know your
friends and family, whateverthat's cool.

(17:49):
But like to really make aliving, you need to be selling a
lot of houses to retail peopleand that's a grind, Like that's
a serious grind.

Speaker 2 (17:58):
It's like all the time you have to be selling.

Speaker 1 (18:00):
Yeah, all throughout the year through the slow season
, like our slow season's notslow because invest investors
are buying in the winter, likethat's.
That's what we do, that's whenI buy houses.
So I I think it's just alsolike most agents are terrible.
We found that out recently acouple of times with working

(18:21):
with buyers agents um, god, dude, they're so bad, like the one
house that we're selling theytheir clients got.
So I don't want to say theaddress or anything just yet
because it hasn't closed.
It's funny a cabinet supplierjust called me um about
sponsoring our event I have totell them no, because current

(18:43):
will be there.
But they screwed their clientsover so badly that they ended up
losing a point.

Speaker 3 (18:54):
So let me, let me just backtrack a little bit.
To backtrack we got undercontract with this.
This agent Communication wasgreat right up front.
You know, of course it is.
When you get an offer they wantto know if it's been accepted.
Then it gets accepted.
Then they're so excited andthen they just disappeared and
like we would talk.
And then I was like, hey,where's the EMD?

(19:14):
It's been like four or fivedays.
Oh, the client had their EMDwithheld on another property red
flag, all right, well, youdidn't tell me that when you put
the offer in.
So now it's been seven days andthere's no EMD yet.
And now we're getting to the endof the inspection contingency.
I haven't gotten that either,but they've had the inspection.

(19:35):
So the clients have walked thehouse with the inspector, seen
all the problems and I'm surewanted Brian to fix some things.
Or you know, typically FHAmight have requirements too.
Nothing, no inspection report.
So she missed her inspectioncontingency period, missed her
EMD period.
And then Ryan's like, hey, I'm,I'm ready to go back to the

(19:57):
market.
So I text her.
I'm like, hey, we're going backto the market and all of a
sudden she is the mostresponsive agent in all of
Maryland.

Speaker 1 (20:04):
Well, first she gets snippy, like she gets snippy,
and I'm sitting there listeningin and I'm like I just want to
jump through the phone at thislady and of course I'm letting
Chase represent me, it'swhatever but she's getting
snippy at him and I'm like, dude, you're people, you are
responsible for their actions.
Like they're, they're done.

(20:28):
Like they have a drop dead datewhere they the contract is null
and void so we can go back tomarket.
We went this.
It gets even better, though.
So she starts responding andgetting snippy.
We basically just say, hey, wedon't have a deposit.

Speaker 3 (20:42):
In like an hour we're going back to market the best
is, she texts me right after Isay that and she says well, does
your seller even want to sell?

Speaker 1 (20:49):
And I'm just thinking the whole time what are you
talking about?
I've been holding this mortgage.
Now the house is vacant.
I'm paying a mortgage Like ofcourse I want to sell, Like,
what are you asking?

Speaker 3 (21:00):
We're on market.
We accepted a contract.
We're performing on our side.
I'm begging you to perform onyour side and you're still not
performing so she still doesn'tdo anything at this point.

Speaker 1 (21:09):
The lender calls chase.

Speaker 3 (21:11):
The lender they were eating chick-fil-a.
The lender calls me and is likehey, like I know this has been
a long day, but like, what can Ido to salvage this?
And I look at ryan.
I'm like you want to dosomething, because at this point
it's just like we don't evenwant to deal with these people
anymore.

Speaker 1 (21:31):
So their seller concessions were 5.5%.
I said 4% and EMD.
In an hour and they got it done.

Speaker 3 (21:41):
So I basically got it , done man.

Speaker 1 (21:44):
I got an extra point and a half on a $350 house,
which is a lot of moneythousands of dollars, right?
What's more sad is that thosepeople got screwed out of
thousands of dollars because oftheir agent being bad.

Speaker 3 (21:59):
And there's no way she's getting paid in this deal,
because they needed theconcessions to make this, this
closing, happen, because theyneed to cash the close.
And then the lenders thelenders, the one that's
basically representing them theagent's not getting paid.
They lost that on likethousands of dollars and it's
just it's it is.
It's sad, you know when, when.
That's the type of agents youhave representing um these

(22:19):
first-time home buyers yeah, no,that's, and it is unfortunate.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
I've had that happen a couple times on a few houses
that I've sold, where it's a newagent and you can see that
they've only sold maybe one ortwo deals and they don't do.
They do the inspection but thenthey don't even send in, um,
you know, an inspection dude.

Speaker 1 (22:38):
The inspection that this girl sent was literally a
document list of just thingsnothing.
There was no like.
You know how it's supposed tolink to inspection 1.1?
There's a 100-page inspectionreport and then just a Word
document with a list of thingsto fix.
I'm like I refuse to look atthis without it being okay.

(22:59):
Every agent and their motherknows inspection.

Speaker 2 (23:01):
Like how to find it in the inspection report?

Speaker 1 (23:03):
Yeah, like you put section 2.1.1 roof.
Okay, I'll fix the roof.
Then I can look at theinspection.
I can look at the list.
It makes sense.
This lady just freaking put alist of things, like she wrote a
novel and wanted me to likeread her novel and then go
through the 100 page inspectionreport and just pick through it.
I'm like you are insane.

(23:25):
So I was nice and we arefinishing up some.
There were a couple ofstructural things with the
basement stairs and a couple ofrandom stupid things.
I was nice and did it and itcost me a couple grand to fix it
, just because I knew it was theright thing to do.
But really I didn't have to doanything.

Speaker 3 (23:50):
Yeah, once you got the EMD and that's happened,
like you said, after you getthat EMD and you know they have
that inspection contingency andthey miss it, I mean you don't
have to do anything and that'sunfortunate for the buyer.
Man like you're really gettingscrewed in that situation.

Speaker 1 (24:00):
That's the problem when you're cheaping out on an
agent or you're using somebodythat really doesn't have
experience because, but at thesame, time.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
They don't know either.
The buyer doesn't know, Right.
So the buyer doesn't know whatto experience.
Because if they're a first timehome buyer, they certainly
don't know what to experience.
They've never dealt with itbefore.

Speaker 1 (24:15):
I think that's why you have to interview your agent
, right, like, and I thinkthere's just, it's a dime, a
dozen.
And if you're not interviewingthree or four people and you're
just going with your aunt oryour uncle or whatever, because
they're a realtor, you you'regoing to it's.

Speaker 2 (24:28):
it could be a very costly mistake, but it's tough.
I know it's gotta be tough forpeople who have a family member
to shop them around.
It's going to be hard for themto be like hey aunt, I you know,
I know that you're a licensedrealtor, but I want to go see if
I can find someone better thanyou.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
This is the biggest.
But this is like for mostpeople, right, like we do this
for a living.
Most people, this is thebiggest thing, the biggest
transaction of their entire life.
Sometimes it's one and onlysometimes.
it's their one and only biggestby far transaction, yeah, that
they've ever done right couldliterally cost them thousands of

(25:05):
dollars these people, they,they didn't have any money to
begin with and because theiragent was poor like bad at their
job, they lost a point and ahalf just off the off the rip.
And I don't feel bad at allbecause I had to sit off market,
right, and in my head I'm notonly am I sitting off market,

(25:27):
but if we come back to marketthere's red flags everywhere.
Right, why we have to put inthe description buyer didn't
perform.
But people have to read that.

Speaker 2 (25:36):
Yeah, that's a negative for to you, that's a
negative.

Speaker 1 (25:39):
First I just paid my mortgage.
There's like 2,400 bucks amonth.
I paid for two weeks ofmortgage and 2,400 bucks a month
, I paid for two weeks ofmortgage.
And then I have to come back tothis market where people are
going to say, oh, there must bean inspection thing or there
must be something wrong with itor something, and that just you
know.
I was in a kind of a losesituation.
So I was like either I'm goingto make more money here or we're

(26:00):
going back to market.
That's what it is.
So shop your agents, interviewyour agents and ask them how
many deals have you done?
Like, if this is your firstdeal, I would just suggest don't
do it.
And then, if they're investors,if you're an investor, how many
houses have you bought foryourself?
How many flips have you done?
Because I don't want you to bemy realtor if you haven't got

(26:23):
experience of your own.

Speaker 2 (26:24):
Yeah, and I guess the most important part here is,
like, the buyers want to choosewho they're going to choose.
So any buyers out therelistening, just make sure that
when you do get that inspectiondone, well, first and foremost,
make sure you get an inspectiondone.
That is something that has tocome out of your pocket.
Hire an inspector.
You're going to want thatinspection done, get it done and
then you have typically a sevento 10 day period, whatever it's
.
However, it's outlined in yourin your contract to get that

(26:47):
inspection done, to send a listof items to the listing agent so
that they can give it to theseller, so that you can
determine which items you wantthem to fix and they can choose
on whether or not they're goingto fix items or not.

Speaker 1 (27:00):
Really, really important that.
That's super important.
So, off the agent thing we'reat, vibe Kinser Group is taking
over the sales department.
If you're looking for a home asan agent and looking for some
guidance, both in the realm oflike, I think I'm going to start
trying to do some constructionmanagement education for agents.

(27:23):
I think that's a thing thatmost agents don't know about.
When they go to a kitchenseeing how much you think it's
going to cost, somebody mightsay it's $5,000.
Some people might say it's$50,000.
I want to do some moreeducation in that sense.
Chase is taking on new agentsunder him that are investors or
want to be investors and kind ofto learn collaboratively from

(27:46):
from the group and nick istaking any new deals.

Speaker 2 (27:50):
If you guys have any good deals out there, send them
my way yeah, well, we're allbuying good deals.

Speaker 1 (27:55):
speaking of good deals, I chase and I just locked
up a deal here in myneighborhood and this I want to
just touch on this because Ithink it's important for like
relationships in general.
So there's this deal that cameup for sale on the Maryland
Investor Network and I knewwhere it was.
It's literally like right thereoutside, like outside my

(28:17):
neighbor, it's like so closethat I knew exactly where it was
.
I knew that I wanted it.
Yeah, like it's right there.
So Acre Lot, smyr, savannahpark schools, like it's a very
nice deal.
there were people on the groupon the comments bidding on it
big investors that we know thatall were wanting this house.

(28:40):
I called so many people.
I called personally and I waslike, hey, this is in my
neighborhood, can I please havethis one?
We're just bidding against eachother right now.
We're gonna either bid it upand somebody's gonna pay more
and get screwed.
I'm gonna pay for this deal,can I please have it?
I made that call to three orfour people that I knew were

(29:04):
real players that were gonna buythat house.

Speaker 2 (29:06):
I know I even saw you comment on the Facebook post
and said, hey, let me get thisdeal Like this is in my
neighborhood.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
So I called in chits to a bunch of people title
attorneys, agents.
I don't even want to tell youthe favors that I owe but, like,
people now have all backed downand I got the contract, but
that's only because, like one ofthe guys we play pickleball
with every week, he was gonnabuy that house.
But I was like, hey, can I?

(29:33):
You know, you've done so manydeals, this is my hood.
Can I just do this?
Can I have this one?
Yes, and Dave Shannon, I'llcall him out.
I called, called him and hisgirlfriend, melissa, and I was
like, hey, guys, I stay with youin the wintertime in Florida.
I take you on my boat.
Can you please back off of thisdeal so we don't bid each other

(29:58):
up?
And they all backed down andthose relationships go a long
way because that deal could haveeasily gotten bid up and they
had offers higher than ours andwe got the deal because of the
relationships.
So I definitely wanted to touch.

Speaker 3 (30:15):
Yeah, that definitely opened my eyes when Ryan came
to me and was like, hey, dude,we're going to get this deal,
but it's because I pulled a lotof IOUs.
Yeah, I did.

Speaker 1 (30:24):
I pulled a lot of chits.
I'm doing renovation things,fixing things for people,
helping people with theircertain things, like there were
so many things that I did, butthey knew that I was going to
come through in the end to do it.
And now the person who'sselling it, they said like next,
you know, if this one goessmooth, we'll contact you first
on the next one.

Speaker 3 (30:44):
So there's two things right here that I kind of want
to touch on.
The first one was relationships.
But the second one is aseasoned investor like you and
someone that owns a contractingcompany.
You got creative with how youoffered other services outside
of just money to thesewholesalers to be able to get
this deal done.
And just a newbie investorprobably wouldn't think like

(31:06):
that.
But there are so many differentcreative ways that you can get
a deal done and offer otherservices Like some.
Like one time I, on a wholesaledeal that I did, I wasn't
getting my whole um assignmentfee that I wanted, so I offered
hey.
I was like hey, um, you knowthe investor wanted to pay 20,
you know a 20 K assignment feeand I wanted 25.
And I was like, listen, dude, Iwill do the 20 K assignment fee

(31:28):
, um, but you're going to pay me5k on the backend to list it.
And so, like we got creativeand made the numbers work.
But like sometimes that's whatyou have to do.

Speaker 2 (31:37):
Um, are you focusing now just on more, uh, real
estate sales and also still thewholesaling, or what is your
main focus right now?

Speaker 3 (31:45):
Yeah, so, like right now, our main focus is first
getting the systems and theprocesses in place to kind of
streamline from the wholesalecompany to the real estate team.
So we're honing in on our leads, making sure that those are
quality leads and trying toproduce more leads too.

(32:05):
Those are quality leads, andtrying to produce more leads too
.
Right, so the ultimate goal isto create this funnel where the
wholesale company is at the topand it can feed the real estate
team, and then it can feed ourinvestors and it can also feed
our personal flips and whateverelse we want to do.

Speaker 2 (32:20):
Yeah, I think that's good to have the wholesaling and
the real estate team, becauseyou can basically cater to any
seller, whereas a lot of timeswell I guess sometimes when a
wholesaler is going after aseller, maybe they can only
offer them that one service ofwholesaling their house, but
maybe not all sellers want toobviously do it that way, so

(32:40):
they don't have that backupoption as to taking it to market
, letting the seller know thatthey can list it on the market
and get you know whatever offerscome in that way and to get the
most exposure.

Speaker 3 (32:50):
Yeah, I mean, that's that's what our team is based
around, right, it's likedelivering the most efficient
and um, tailoring differentsolutions to these sellers,
right, cause there's so many outthere.
And uh, it's funny that youkind of mentioned this, because
we sold this house over here inPiping Rock.
It was a $900,000 house andwhen I first called that lead he
was like, oh, you're justtrying to steal my house.

(33:11):
And I said, randy, you don'tknow what I'm trying to do.
I was like I haven't told youwhat I'm trying to do yet and I
said you know, what I'm tryingto do is understand your problem
.
And then he kind of opened upfrom there and then I was like,
listen, we have this slew ofoptions here.
We could list your house.
We have this equity protectionprogram.
We can pay for your house incash.

(33:31):
We can come in and do some workwith you and JV on the deal,
because my business partner is acontractor, so we get
contracting at cost streams anddifferent avenues that our
agents can go down now when theyhave someone like Ryan who is a

(33:53):
partner of the Kintu Group andis able to benefit off of the
construction piece of it andhelp the seller in that way.
So I mean, that's kind of whatwe're focused on right now is
like how we can efficientlyweave those companies together.

Speaker 2 (34:06):
Yeah, I mean they go hand in hand essentially, so
it's definitely good to haveboth of those, yeah.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
Yeah, I think this wholesaling thing has opened my
eyes a little bit too, because Igot on some calls the other day
and just working that muscle,that sales muscle, and how to
solve problems for people.
It's hard, it's not easy totalk to people and get them to
solve problems for people.
It's hard, it's not easy to totalk to people and get them to
open up.
And that's been um a fun newlearning thing because I've

(34:32):
never had done wholesaling rightlike I've done everything but
and usually people I guess a lotof people start with
wholesaling yeah, that's what wealways hear too.

Speaker 2 (34:40):
It's like you want to start in real estate and start
with wholesaling, but, like yousaid, you and I haven't.

Speaker 3 (34:44):
That's the lowest barrier of cost to get into.
So, like wholesaling, you caneffectively, you know, go scan
the, the zillows and the redfins of the world and find deals
that have been sitting for 60days plus, and call the the
agents and do it that way yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:03):
So, ryan, tell, tell us about why you're not.
You mentioned earlier thatyou're not doing DSCR loans
anymore.
Dscr loans, so they were builtfor people that want to buy

(35:24):
these gray hairs in their headto not have to go through a full
doc loan and submitting allthese documents and get asked a
million questions on why youdeposited a certain amount of
money into your bank accountright.

Speaker 1 (35:35):
So once you have hit a point where your books are
clean, you're showing money, youhave income and you have
somebody that handles countingyour money properly, it's much
easier to go to the bank and askfor money.

(35:56):
I found that out today.
I met with Merrill Lynch andgot a big line of credit that
will be able to fund an entirehouse or more at a time, and
then I can refinance into mysmall bank.
Who sees how much money we'remaking and how much money we
have based on our tax returns,and they don't charge points.

(36:19):
There's no fees.
How?

Speaker 2 (36:21):
many a year.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
So they do 25-year amortizations Over a five-year
calls.
Instead of 30.
But their fees are typically,like the rate's, going, to be at
least a point less Usually apoint or more A five-year call,
listen, listen, so listen.

(36:42):
I've thought this through.
I want to help you think itthrough more.
So some of them have 10-yearadjustable rates.
Some of them have five years.
Five years you get a morefavorable rate.
But when it does adjust it canonly go up by one point, so it's
a 5-1, meaning like every fiveyears you can adjust it.

(37:04):
What's really cool is that it'sadjustable on the fly so you
don't have to refinance toadjust.
So if it goes down, like in thissituation, I don't see our
rates especially with thischange in administration.
I don't see our rates going upthat much higher, right?
So over the next five years, ifI, for example, our Benfield

(37:27):
property, we have a 5-4-3-2-1prepayment penalty.
That's a five-year 5% fee.
Let's say the rates droppedthrough the floor today and it
went back down to three, thatwould change our mortgage
significantly and change ourcashflow significantly.
But we'd have to pay fivepercent of the loan.

(37:47):
That would be thirty somethingthousand dollars in fees where
the bank doesn't have any ofthose fees.
So if you're making money,you're actually making money,
show the bank that you're makingmoney and they will give you
loans so I mean, I didn't knowthat it would only go up a
percent.

Speaker 2 (38:04):
And it is a good time now with the higher interest
rates, but I would say back in2021, when we had those you know
four percent on dscr loans,that probably wouldn't have been
a good time because then itcould only basically go up from
there in five years when youhave to refinance.
But at the same time, if, if,if it only goes up by a percent,
regardless of how high theinterest rates go, that's pretty
good, yeah and I think theother thing too.

Speaker 1 (38:25):
Man is like when you're, when you're actually
showing the right amount ofincome, the, the banks are very,
very easy to work with when youhave everything in line, like I
.
I don't want to sit here andsay that, like I have always had
perfect books, because I thinkI've admitted many times that
that was one of our biggestissues was like the books and I

(38:48):
tell Chase this all the time.
I'm like we have to, like Ispend so much money on
bookkeeping, consulting, taxaccounting, because I went
through the woes of like therewas one year I think I probably
mentioned on the podcast thatthere was like over, well over a
million dollars in income andthen well over a million dollars
in expenses.
That was like unaccounted for.

(39:10):
That we didn't know where itwas coming from or where it was
going to, and it tookbookkeepers, people that had to
pay hours and hours and hours tofind and sift through these
things and then realizesomething was categorized in
QuickBooks wrong and it wasreally something that was an

(39:30):
expense or a liability that wasput as an income and vice versa.
I don't even know what the hellit was, but I spent an
exorbitant amount of moneycleaning it up.
Because what happened to me acouple years ago?
This was probably right duringCOVID, when we really blew up
beginning of COVID, when thingsstarted going like crazy, crazy,
my accountant tried to fire me.
He was like you're a liabilityto me, like you're, basically,

(39:54):
your books are so fucked up thatit's going to cause me to get
audited.
So I was like, okay, we had tomake a change.
So we hired.
He's like I will only work withyou if you hire a full-time
bookkeeper, not a bookkeeperthat works for other businesses
Like these.
This person needs to be in yourbooks every single day,
counting every single penny.

(40:14):
And that's what we.
That's what we did.
We hired her and then we hired aconsultant that reconciles her.
So there's levels.
So there can't be somebody.
That somebody because, like mybookkeeper, can technically take
everything from me today, likeshe's got control of all the
money, so we have somebody thatwatches over her and then the

(40:36):
cpa has like ultimate, you know,he's got the ultimate say in
the last word, basically, so,unless all three of those people
that are different entitiescolluded with each other, my
book should be straight becauseI have I actually have four
people because I have APM thatdoes the accounting and
reconciliation for Appfolio,specifically their accounting

(40:58):
business.
Then I have our full-timebookkeeper, karen, and then I
have Cindy, who's the consultant, and then I have Brian, the cpa
.
So there's literally fourpeople that I pay to count the
money.
But now that it's good, itopens up a lot of doors, like a
lot of doors where I'm gonnahave lines of credit I'm gonna
be able to go, not do thesenon-dscr loans like I'm just

(41:18):
thinking about this benfield one.
If we had held off and I wasable to go with our bank, we'd
be probably making an an extrafour or 500 bucks a month in
cashflow.

Speaker 2 (41:28):
Yeah, it's a whole, nother rental property.

Speaker 1 (41:30):
It's a whole nother rental property right and and I
wouldn't have a five yearprepayment, which right now
we're stuck with this loan forfive years.
Luckily that deal.
Glad we didn't take your advice.

Speaker 2 (41:42):
Are you sure you're glad that you didn't take my
advice?

Speaker 1 (41:44):
I'm absolutely sure, because I also still have a tax
problem, like I still have toomuch income.
We're trying to figure that outright now and starting a 401k
well, that's a differentstrategy.

Speaker 2 (41:55):
When we were first discussing it, we weren't really
discussing strategies.

Speaker 1 (41:58):
No, no, no, but I'm saying like had I sold that, we
would have had four hundredthousand dollars in realized
gains.
The the government would havehad $400,000 in realized gains.
The government would have camefor 35% of that.
So instead we took $150,000cash out tax-free in our refi.
We own the asset.
It's about to be like we're notcash flowing right now.

(42:21):
We're cash flowing negative foranother until March the one
unit and then April the otherunit.
The leases go and I've alreadylet them know that the rents are
going up.
They're both staying as of now.
They want me to send a newlease so we'll be cash flow
positive starting april 1st andlet's have a stabilized.

Speaker 3 (42:43):
I mean we have a stabilized asset in one of the
best communities oh, dude, wedrove past another day and they
had the leaves all done up andyou didn't have to call Nick to
do them, so it was great.

Speaker 1 (42:52):
Like they were, yeah, like literally outside, like
raking their own leaves and likeit's just.
It's such a night I am I tellpeople this all the time Like if
you need to get into thebarrier of entry, go the low end
route.
If you want to go the sectioneight route, I think that's, you
know, a way to get into thegame.
But after you've been in it, Iwell prefer the high end, lower

(43:13):
what you think is lower margin,but it's really not.
Because they don't misspayments, they don't turn over.
When they do, you can movesomebody in right away because
they didn't destroy your entirehouse.
So what you think is likeyou're getting these six hundred
thousand dollar a month cashflows on these section a
properties.
Every time you turn it over itcosts you five grand.

(43:33):
I don't care who you are.
So I'm in the mindset where Ilike having these higher end
assets that are long-term legacyassets that will pay the bills.
They're always going to pay thebills.
The communities are strong.
They're getting stronger, notweaker.
That's just my personalphilosophy on the whole rental

(43:53):
game.
Right now, After managinghundreds of houses, owning
houses, I think I'm a high-endguy.
Now that's it.
Management, for example.
Dude, this is what I toldsomebody the other day.
I just recently pulled off ofthe Maryland Investor Network
Preferred Vendors for PropertyManagement and because all of

(44:16):
those leads are all lower-endleads, they all come with
problems.
I just got a house undercontract here in the
neighborhood for management,rented in a couple of weeks
$4,000 a month.
The guy's an FBI agent, so Imade my $4,000, and I placed
them myself.
Made $4,000.

(44:37):
Placement he's an FBI agent,signed a two-year lease.
8% of $4,000 is whatever, atwo-year lease.
Eight percent of four thousandis whatever.
But it would take literallyfour section eight or four lower
end houses to make to meet thatone.
As far as income goes like whywould I focus on something

(44:59):
that's fifteen hundred dollars amonth when I can focus on?
Instead of having ten of these,I can have two of these and
it's the same net.
So my whole.
I think I also just have likebeen interested.
I'm so jaded I was tellingjace's that it was like I'm just
so jaded, like I was being notso nice to the, to the lender,
not even not so nice, I was justbeing stern.
I was like I literally said ifyou don't give me these terms,

(45:21):
I'm going somewhere else andthat's it.
Like I hate to sound like sucha dick, but like I'm, that's it
that's, but it's business.

Speaker 3 (45:30):
You know what I mean and I think people understand.

Speaker 1 (45:33):
It's another day yeah , I think that is um if, if
anything.
When it comes to money yougotta be business, business
minded, and sometimes it takes alittle bit of I'm an a county
boy too, though, when it likecomes to rentals.

Speaker 3 (45:49):
So, like I, I definitely agree, I, I do.
I tell ryan, though I do wantlike one or two in in the city,
um, but I'd like to stick to thea county if I can yeah, I'm
just not familiar with thesedifferent areas, other than you
know where I grew up inbaltimore county and then
baltimore city, because it'sright there.

Speaker 2 (46:08):
Yeah, for you, I mean , it makes and you're.

Speaker 1 (46:10):
you're in a situation , too, where you self-manage
everything.
You do things for yourself, notfor other people.
I'm managing like of course,we're buying our own rentals and
stuff, but like I'm managingassets for other people, that
becomes a whole.
Nother headache like yourproblems are just your.
For other people that becomes awhole.
Nother headache Like yourproblems are just your problems.
Other people's problems becomemy problems.
So I'm signing up to solve allof their problems.

(46:34):
You know what you're signing upfor.
But a lot of times and this isand I'm doing some coaching and
my coaching client is using meto do the renovation on his
house that I sold I assigned tohim, but I said that he should
manage it and he was like youknow, gonna obviously probably

(46:56):
use me for property management,and I was like no, I think every
investor should start bymanaging their own rental,
because then you truly know thevalue of what a property manager
does, because you understand it.
But if you hired me and younever managed a property before
and I was charging you for aservice call or charging you for
something, you'd be like oh, Ifeel like I'm getting
overcharged for that, whenreally the property management

(47:18):
business literally nets usnegative money per year.

Speaker 2 (47:24):
In the grand scheme of things You've mentioned that
plenty of times like the onlyreason you keep that is because
it helps feed your constructionbusiness, where most of the
profit is made.
And I mean I I can't see howyou still hang on to it, but I
know that you say you have tobecause of you know you got to
take care of I think chase canattest that the property
management company producesleads.

Speaker 3 (47:44):
Yeah, and that's what I was telling the other day in
the truck.
I was like dude.
This is why I wanted to start,because he was like, oh, another
lead for him on the oh, that'sfrom the property management
company.
And I was like, oh, here we goagain.

Speaker 2 (47:54):
Like this is like the third one this month which and
and I guess it's it also is goodfor people that you manage the
properties, for if they want toget out of the business, then
you're the first one that theywould probably right ask if you
knew anyone looking.

Speaker 1 (48:06):
That's our next wholesale deal is a client that
went through a bad experiencewith another property manager.
They hired us.
The house is torn apart and nowwe're gonna assign it to
somebody and those leads aregood and the problem is I think
that why you say like, why doyou hang on to it?
I haven't done a true and Ithink this year is one of the
goals is like to really dig intothe crm thing and like figure

(48:28):
out how to track that properly.
Like, for example, like I nevertracked anything that came from
the podcast.
Right, like people contact mebecause they've heard the
podcast so I've never tracked,like the kpis on what comes from
the podcast.
What leads come from propertymanagement, because I bet you if
I did that from the podcast.
What leads come from propertymanagement, because I bet you if
I did that.
Like the podcast costs us money, like we're negative money, we

(48:51):
have to pay producer, you know,editor, blah, blah, blah,
whatever the money that comes inthrough sponsorships and stuff
basically just covers what we'vespent on all this stupid
equipment and everything likethat.
But it has brought me asignificant amount of business
and has given us a local namethat people know and they come

(49:11):
to our events and deals happen,but I have never tracked it.
So I have no idea how much thecompany.
If you look at my P&L onproperty management it looks
like shit, but if you reallylook at what has come from it
it's a lot.
So I can't really put a numberon it, but I think that's a goal
of mine Try to figure out a CRMthing that we can track, and I

(49:34):
think part of it will be like inthe real estate CRM or the
wholesaling CRM that we have islike tagging.
This one came from propertymanagement, this one came from
this place and I think that'sgoing to be really important for
me too.
So I don't want to jump off abridge every week owning this
property management company.
Because we went through thisyear I don't even know if we

(49:54):
officially announced it Like wewere going to merge with another
company, we were going to sellthe company to another local
company.
We did all these differentthings and then we decided to
not, and for a lot of personalreasons I decided to step away.
I thought part of the reasonthat Chase is now the Kinster
group is because I really thinkI need to focus on building

(50:17):
relationships, the constructioncompany, the building of things,
and that's where we're makingall of our money.
So I was doing 80% here, 80%there, never 100% at something.
So now we have a good systemwhere I feel like Chase can
handle the sales, I can handleconstruction and property
management, tyler's handling thecommercial construction big

(50:38):
stuff that he's doing.
So, yeah, it's an exciting timeright now.
I'm excited for what, um, whatwe have coming down the pipeline
Next.
We got um Nick, your, yourportfolio.
This year you've made someadjustments, I've noticed.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
Yeah, thanks for noticing Um, I have been
probably 50, 50 with the rentalsor the properties that I've
bought this year have been 50percent holds 50 flips whereas
like last year on this podcast.

Speaker 1 (51:11):
You're like I'm holding everything I'm never
selling.

Speaker 2 (51:14):
I would say that was at the end of 2022, 2023.
I did also do something similarbecause of the higher interest
rates.
I I'm like you know if I canjust sell this property, and
that's what I started to do lastyear and then more leading into
this year doing that as well.
Heading towards the end of thisyear, I've been about 50, 50 on
properties and it's it's basedon the deal too.

(51:36):
I mean, I don't like to holdsingle family houses as rentals,
I prefer townhouses.
So if there were a good dealthat came across my desk and it
was a single family house andthe numbers made sense to do it
as a flip, I would do that, andthat's another reason why I've
done a little bit more.
But the primary reason was thehigher interest rates.
I couldn't see myself justgetting into these.

(51:57):
Like you mentioned earlierprepayment penalties on some of
these loans at a high rate,five-year prepayment penalty and
then, as rates start dropping.
I know I checked some numbers acouple of months ago or so or
back in November, where one year, in November of 2023, rates
were a percent and a half or apercent lower than they were in

(52:21):
2024 to where, like you, couldrefinance and it made sense.
Maybe it was like a percent anda half.
It would have made sense torefinance a year later, but then
you gotta pay four percentprepayment penalty just to
refinance.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
So and then a point and a half origination fee with
the dsr lender and all thesefees, dude.
That's why, when you start toaccumulate money and start to
show money on your tax returns,that's what's really, really
important is you have to,unfortunately.
You have to pay to play.
You have to pay your taxes.
You got to get the IRS whatthey deserve or not deserve.
I shouldn't say that what?

(52:52):
They want what they want.
Once you do that and you showthat track record, the banks
want you.
They want to give you money.

Speaker 2 (52:59):
Well, they want your money too.
They want you like stash yourmoney into their account so they
can make money off of you.

Speaker 3 (53:06):
Of course that they're giving you the best deal
right, and when you weretalking about going to local
banks, um, you know for forthese loans.
Now they do still need dti,right?
It's still like a full-on docright.

Speaker 1 (53:17):
Yeah, yeah, they still check your debt to income
ratio.
Um, they do take intoconsideration your rental income
as, like, I think it's like a75% gross rental income counts
towards your actual income.
As long as you are claiming itproperly and have proper profit
and loss statements and taxreturns, you should qualify for

(53:38):
anything you want.
That's kind of and credit score.
Of course, yeah, credit scoreis big.
I mean that's DSCR credit score.
Of course, yeah, credit scoreis big.
I mean that's dscr too.
Yeah, it's like credit score.
You have to have a good creditscore, but if you're making
money, there's no reason to dodscr loans.
That's in my opinion I thinkyou should be doing just going
to the bank and even if theyoffer a 20 year am and um you

(54:02):
and no fees, no, nothing.
You really have to do the math,because I think you're going to
save a lot of money.

Speaker 2 (54:09):
I prefer.
I mean I don't not like, I likethe 20 and 25 year, because
then you're just paying it offfaster If your cashflow is still
pretty decent.
I mean you're going to cashflowa little bit less if it's not a
30 year, but if it's still good, if it's good in your opinion
and good, it's going to pay offfaster anyway, right, as long as
you don't continue to just likerefinance into a new.

Speaker 1 (54:31):
Yeah, I agree, and I think that people the players
that I've talked to, the bigplayers that I've talked to are
all going local banks, lines ofcredit, cash management accounts
, where I'm putting my moneyinto an account, borrowing
against it while it grows,they're investing it.
Merrill lynch has it.
They, you know, invested inwhatever they think is right at

(54:51):
that time.
They have data that we don'thave right and I let them handle
that.
I borrow my own money and youbecome your own bank and it's,
it's a strategy that it sounds alot.
I I don't want to make it soundlike you know, everybody could
just go ahead and do this, butonce you start establishing

(55:13):
these businesses and they'remaking real money, then you, you
need to take those stepsbecause if you just get stuck
doing like for you man, you'redoing, you're doing a lot of
deals like you should bebuilding a relationship with a
local bank, not paying theseprepayment bills, not paying a
point and a half origination feeon all your refinances, that's
crazy?

Speaker 2 (55:31):
I think so.
I mean, I have a relationship,like my first five ever
properties that I refinancedwere with the Columbia Bank.
Now it's Fulton Bank and Istill have a bank relationship
with them.
It's Fulton Bank and I stillhave a bank relationship with
them.
But I think what happened wasthere was a time where DSCR
loans were at least Well, no, no, at the beginning, when I
started refinancing stuff, thebanks were about 1% cheaper.

(55:55):
And then, when everything hitthe low like around 2021, 2022,
I did notice that they startedto equal, equal out to where the
banks were basically just aboutthe same as the dscr.

Speaker 1 (56:08):
This is what you have to think about.
Okay, how many, how much volumedo you think you bought this
year in real estate refinanced?
How many, how many millions ofdollars do you think you
refinanced?
Okay, so let's just say it was$2 million that you refinanced
this year.
You paid $30,000 in fees for noreason.

(56:28):
That's a lot of money.
That's $30,000.
You paid $30,000 in fees wherethe bank would be zero, right,
yeah, so that's just my take onit.
I could be wrong, I don't thinkI am, um, but that's just
that's.
Yeah, I mean, it's math, right,it makes sense.

(56:50):
You're paying a point.

Speaker 2 (56:51):
Yeah, yeah but, like you said earlier, your books got
to be clean not to say my booksaren't clean, but they're not
as clean as I'd like them to beand it's certainly a headache.
And, like we mentioned earlier,in regards to like paying for
um, you know, when we weretalking about Home Depot and
National Lumber and how youchoose to go with National
Lumber, even though a little bitmore, just because of how good

(57:13):
they are with the deliveries,I'm like DSCR because it's just
like a breeze in the park,whereas when I do a full dock
loan it's like like that's atask and that's another job for
me just to tackle.
But I understand your point aswell.

Speaker 1 (57:27):
So here's my thought right, $30,000 is more than half
of what I pay my full-timebookkeeper to make my book
straight.
That's a salary.
That's somebody's salary thatcould be literally doing your
books for you every year.
And now you have clean booksand you have somebody that's
actually there, like I havesomebody that literally counts

(57:48):
every single dollar in and outof my account.

Speaker 2 (57:51):
Yeah, I still think the ease of it, like when you
get a DSR loan.
When I get a DSCR loan, it'slike sending my information, the
appraisal is scheduled withinthat next one to three days and
then it's taken place and thenwe're refinancing.
Within three weeks you go to abank.
It may take 45 days for them togo through.

Speaker 1 (58:11):
That's when things are a mess, though.
So if you have an up-to-datethis is another thing to do go
find a template of a personalfinancial statement, build it
and keep it up to date.
So that means having yourassets, having your liabilities,
having your actual cash on hand, having all your houses, your
cash flow, everything in aspreadsheet that stays updated

(58:33):
every couple months, and as longas you have that, the banks can
move quick, and I proved todaythat like I literally went on
one Zoom meeting with our newbank, with Merrill Lynch.
I'm still using the local bankand I got a line of credit.

Speaker 2 (58:52):
From what I remember, I had to submit all mortgage
statements for all propertieswhen I was doing full doc loans.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
So just to put it in perspective for you, my
bookkeeper requires me to sendher every single mortgage
statement from every singleproperty every single month
because she tracks taxes,principal interest, all on my
balance sheet in QuickBooks.
So when I go to QuickBooks Isee a balance sheet of actual

(59:21):
money.
So when I go to the bank andI'm like, hey, here's my balance
sheet, it's got this manydollars in it.
That's a real number that's upto date, because my bookkeeper
goes into each mortgagestatement separates every single
month how much more I've paidtowards that principal.
So every single property onlineI could just go to my balance

(59:42):
sheet and I see my equity.
So that's the value of payingsomebody.
It's expensive, you have tohave somebody.
You have to have somebodythat's good at it.

Speaker 3 (59:51):
Yeah, we just talked about that.
I definitely need to hire abookkeeper and start getting my
stuff straightened out,especially with this team,
because we talked about thewhole money transition.
Usually the commission goes tothe brokerage and then the
brokerage pays out the agent.
Well, now, with the team, wetalked about, hey, okay, well,
the brokerage will get paid outat the table, the team will get
paid out and then from there I'mgonna have to pay out the

(01:00:12):
agents.
And ryan was like dude, that'sgonna be a big pain.
You should just let vibe handleit.
Um, and to a sense I'm probablygonna have, but we still have,
like I'm still doing likerecruitment percentages, like if
you bring on a team member andyou get a 2% up to 5K of their
production paid by the team.
So like, in a way, I'm stillgoing to have to track that

(01:00:32):
somehow and I'm going to yeah, Ineed a bookkeeper.
But I think to your point, likethat is a really cool thing to
think about with these localbanks, but someone like me, I
can't do that.
I mean making money, but my dtiis all screwed up because I've
been avoiding tax.
You know not avoiding taxes butI've been, you know, not
claiming as much, yeah,depreciating and doing all the

(01:00:55):
things.
So for someone new dscr isgotta do it.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
Yeah, that's why I try to.
I'm not trying to say like poo-for anybody doing DSCR.
I'm just trying to open uppeople's eyes that are doing
like that, are doing significantamount of money, that there is
another route, there's anotheralternative.
So last thing that I have on mylittle thing here that we
didn't talk about is, like our,our training, that Nick still

(01:01:20):
hasn't joined our triathlons,chase and I are still hacking
away at at we have a coach.
Um, that's been helping metremendously.

Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
Coach Tim is a G dude .

Speaker 1 (01:01:31):
Yeah, so like we literally have a guy that every
week meets with us, I'd redo adifferent event each week.
So this past week was swimmingand I had my PR for like a lot,
a lot of PRS in the pool.
Um, the week before that, wewent and we did a running
session with him and I chased,chased around a track for an

(01:01:52):
hour.
Um and the the training hasbeen super fun.
Man, I'd need you to get on our, on our team.
I will eventually, I don'tthink you will.
No I will, but we had our lastrace.
Have we had a podcast since thelast race?

Speaker 3 (01:02:08):
No, no, not an internal podcast, not an
internal.

Speaker 1 (01:02:11):
So we had a race in Miami.
Super cool race, open waterswim.
They advertise it as alligatorfree, but when we?
Well, no, I didn't see any.
But when we got there I wasimagining being in like in a
cave it was gated like eightfoot gates or something.
Yeah, no it was an open fuckinglike lake.

(01:02:33):
So there was definitely likepeople say like how do you know
if there's an alligator in?

Speaker 3 (01:02:39):
Florida, you just, it's wet.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
So we swam and it was dark in the beginning of the
swim.
It's like just getting lightout and that was really scary.

Speaker 3 (01:02:50):
Dude, we took a picture beside a sign that said
no swimming.

Speaker 1 (01:02:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:02:54):
There's a sign outside the lake right there
where we were entering, and itsaid no swimming or fishing.

Speaker 1 (01:03:01):
So that was cool.
It was in the Miami Zoo, so weswam in this lake at the zoo and
then biked out on the road.

Speaker 3 (01:03:10):
Which was crazy, Never did that before.
And I come around the firstturn and all of a sudden I'm on
a main street.
There's big box trucks flyingpast me.
I'm like dude, what am I doing?
I'm weaving in and out oftraffic yeah, you're literally
in traffic, which was that waskind of crazy, um oh, they
didn't have it blocked off forthe they had certain places
blocked off, but in other placesyou're literally just on the

(01:03:31):
side of like a main road likethe lights were blocked off and
the cops were waving you on, butyou're like weaving in and out
of traffic that stopped yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:03:39):
So that was.
That was kind of wild.
But so the the swim I didn't doso good.
Um, I did really well mentallybecause the race before I like
lost my.
I thought I was drowning.
Um, I got dragged underwaterand I freaked out this race.
I purposely went out.
I was like I'm going to swimslow, just keep steady pace, I'm
going to stay on the outside ofthe pack, I'm not going to try

(01:04:00):
to do anything crazy.
Came out of the water.
I was like feeling good, I washappy.
My wife says I'm three minutesbehind this guy.
We came into the waterbasically at the same time.
He was just ahead of me.
It was a time trial start, sohe probably had like 10 second
maybe head start.
But he put three minutes on meon the swim.
So head start, um, but he, heput three minutes on me on the
swim.
So I was like, okay, I'm gonnaget his ass on the bike.

(01:04:21):
We literally 21.9 miles an hour.
We both biked the same exactmiles per hour, so I didn't put
any time on him.
Somehow.
My wife I think she was justmaking numbers up she said at
the third transition I was twominutes back.
Um, so I maybe gained a minuteback on him and then I pr'd my

(01:04:42):
10k run at like seven minute,seven, 14 minute mile pace,
which I was like stoked about,and this guy was your other pace
was like seven, twenties younormally like seven low sevens.
He was struggling this race.
He low sixes like a minute off.
A mile is insane.
So I had to pass the crown.

(01:05:03):
Not that I ever had the crown,because he beat me in the other
fucking race too, but I felt, asif I had the crown because I'm
older.
But um, we both got fifth in ourage group so that was cool.
It was a couple hundred peoplein our division.
Um, I got fifth in my age groupbut I was 20 out of 26 on the
swim, so now my focus is gettingbetter on that swim, dude the

(01:05:27):
expo there, like all the vendorssuper cool.

Speaker 3 (01:05:29):
Like we tried on some glasses like running and biking
, glasses that were likesunglasses, kind of like pit
vipers if you will, but they hadthe speakers right in the ear
Like, oh, it was so great andthey sounded so good.
You got a ton of free gear.
All the free gear was supercool.
And then after the race dude,the metal was so sick.
If you did the international itwas like a little zoo cage.

Speaker 1 (01:05:52):
It almost reminded me of Madagascar, the movie where
you like opened it up and yousee all the the tigers yeah,
zebras and stuff so that's cooland I just like really enjoy
like the race culture and likethe people that are there and
the vibes are always good andlike just everybody's like
challenging themselves andeverybody, like dave shannon did
his first race and he was superstoked.
Um, jesse flew down from afterjust having a baby and he did

(01:06:15):
the race and like we had thiscool airbnb that was a really
like.

Speaker 3 (01:06:19):
Just that trip in general was super fun, like
being there around the guystalking real estate but still
able to, you know, go train.
We're running in the morningand I'm beating ryan and chess
later that night.
You know it was a good time,dude, seriously yeah, so anybody
that is trying to get involved.

Speaker 1 (01:06:36):
I know I've talked to some people at the last meetup
that we just went to brenton'smeetup.
Um, we have a run club onwednesdays, pasadena, la fitness
, 6 am every wednesday.
So if you're local, if you wantto drive down and then
saturdays we've been doing longruns um the last two weeks and
this week we have another oneeight to ten miles.
Um, this week we had sevenpeople my coaching client, jet,

(01:06:59):
um he came.
We had seven people.
My coaching client, jet, hecame.
We had our normal group of guys.
Sean's friend Todd came I thinkit's Todd.
So that was really cool thatthat group is like growing and
our gym like Perry just textedme today and asked to join our
LA group.
So now we have like weliterally have a group of like

(01:07:20):
banditos at the gym.
Every morning there's likeseven or eight people that show
up at the gym and we're allworking.

Speaker 3 (01:07:25):
My wife was like it's kind of embarrassing how many
people there is working with youguys, because you guys just
like go around and take up likethree machines at a time.

Speaker 1 (01:07:34):
But it's cool.
So if you're like tryingseriously, like trying to
mastermind, trying to get likein the game, like I tell people,
like I'm literally there, I'mrunning, I'm, you know, come to,
come, run with us and we'll,we'll talk the cool part is like
if you're not there, I'm there.

Speaker 3 (01:07:51):
If, then vice versa, and like the group is always
working, it doesn't matter whatday of the week it is, like
there's somebody there, so likeyou could always just come
through and like, if you'retrying to have that
accountability partner, that'sit and then when you're not
there and you're not there ontime, there's a group chat.

Speaker 1 (01:08:06):
You can't be in it because you don't have an iphone
, but if you did have an iphoneyou could be in it and you could
be also held accountable and wewould make fun of you for
missing.
And it's, it's really good.
It's mostly positive.
Some obviously joking aroundgoes on, but like it is
something that if I'm likefeeling a certain way in the
morning, I'm like shit, I haveto do this because they're

(01:08:27):
they're gonna talk so much shit.
If I miss that, I need to justget there and just get it done.
So trying to run 6 am, lafitness, pasadena, saturdays, we
do long runs.
Contact us, get involved,that's it.
We have an event coming up onJanuary 16th CBP, same spot,

(01:08:48):
same stuff.
Should be a good one.
That's it.
That's a wrap, boys.
That's a wrap.

Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
Should we do goals for 2024?
, 2025?

Speaker 1 (01:09:04):
Quickly goals, boys.
Right, it's a wrap.
Should we do goals for 2024?
Oh shit, 2025.
God damn quickly goals.
I already said mine I'm 10million in revenue.
I'll fix the.
I'll figure out kpis on certainleads.
That's, that's it.
That's I need a.
I just I don't want, that's it.
I don't over complicate thingsI'll go real quick.

Speaker 3 (01:09:17):
um, our wholesaling goal for next year is 200K in
assignments.
We did 68,000 our first year.
It was really only like eightmonths, so not even a full year.
That was five transactions, butthat's not including some of
the ones that we took down asflips.
And then we did 20 transactionsretail-wise, whether that's for
investors after they flip it orjust regular retail,

(01:09:40):
retail-wise, whether that's forinvestors after they flip it or
just regular retail.

Speaker 1 (01:09:48):
So for that metric, we're looking at like $15
million on the real estateretail side.

Speaker 3 (01:09:51):
That's a big year for you this year.
Yeah, this was a good year 20transactions is pretty good.
It's doubling year over yearand actually we doubled every
quarter too.
So first quarter, secondquarter, we doubled.
Quarter we doubled.
And fourth, fourth quarter wasthe best quarter.

Speaker 1 (01:10:04):
And Chase has only really officially been like
working with us for a year, likenot even a year.
Yeah, so huge things are comingthis year.
Um, we're really going to focuson on that stuff.
Chase has taken lead on thesales stuff, so, um, that's,
that's that goal and oh and thelast.

Speaker 3 (01:10:22):
The last goal is for the cancer group.
Obviously we want to grow that.
So we're looking, I'm, I'mlooking, to grow to at least 10
agents and really develop these,these killers yeah, nice, all
right nick um, so 2024 has beenmy best year so far.

Speaker 2 (01:10:35):
2025.
I want to, um, not focus onproperty management.
I want to basically have it towhere, like, I agree with what
you say and I'm kind of similarin that, like I don't want to
deal with property management, Ijust want to handle the
construction of my properties,basically, um, I feel like
that's what I'm better at doingother than you know, aside from

(01:10:57):
just trying to get onto a deviceand manage these tenants.
It's kind of not something thatI want to do and definitely
grow the rental portfolio.
I want to get to $20 million inreal estate owned by the end of
next year and I'd like to havean in-ground pool built at my
house and definitely get a boatfor the boat lift club.

Speaker 1 (01:11:21):
You already have a boat for the house now uh, so
you're gonna keep one boat inocean city, living very modestly
.
I see it's funny.
You say that, though, because Idid toy with the idea, but this
this summer basically told meI'm not gonna go to florida
enough, because I didn't go toflorida at all.
But I did toy with the idea ofhaving a boat in florida and a
boat up here, but I'm not goingto do that because I am humble.

(01:11:42):
I'm humble.

Speaker 3 (01:11:46):
Until PE Property Management needs a boat for tax
credits.
Yeah, no, I've already askedour accountant about writing off
a boat.

Speaker 1 (01:11:54):
He said no, but I did recently buy a BMW that I'm
taking to the track specificallytaking to the track, if you're
listening IRS to meet high networth clients and network with
people.
Seriously, went to the trackonce, met a bunch of rich people
that were all there drivingtheir race cars, so I bought a
race car and taxed right off.

(01:12:15):
So there you go.
All right, that's a wrap untilnext time, thank you.